The Shintaro Higashi Show - Cardio Judo

Episode Date: February 20, 2023

Most people, when they say they do boxing, do what they call "cardio boxing"-- using boxing as a means of exercise, not as a combat sport. This is massively more popular thanks to its safety and approachability. Would this model work for Judo? How would this "Cardio Judo" look like? In this episode, Shintaro and Peter go in depth about Cardio Judo and how it could be implemented. Join our Discord server and start chatting with us and other grapplers by supporting us on Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/shintaro_higashi_show. Any amount helps!

Hey guys, welcome back to the Shintaro Higashi Show with Peter Yu. Today we're going to talk about cardio judo. And this video is sponsored by ShintaroHigashi.com. Please go check it out. We have three instructionals out right now. The most concise instructional ever made. Uchimata, Tomonage, and Seiragi. Okay, so let's check that out.

ShintaroHigashi.com. And today we're going to talk about cardio judo. Yeah, cardio judo. This was actually a suggestion from our patrons there was actually a huge discussion thread about what this is so basically um think of you know boxing but cardio boxing you know you're not really sparring but you're like there to get some workout so yeah ricard started the whole thread and then you know alice there roger jd all chimed in how they would teach this time yeah you know like kind of it's like yeah so people who just want to get a

workout but not necessarily want to spar kind of like how they do it at cardio boxing so how how would how would you structure that class? Okay. So first and foremost, all the haters are going to be like, oh, no, everyone should do Rondori. That's the heart of judo. No, seriously, look at boxing, kickboxing, rumble boxing, all these different boxing gyms out there.

What percentage of people actually spar? I went to those. It's fun. You don't have to spar. You don't have to spar. Yes, if you're like a hardcore boxing gym, yes, right? And that's what you're known for and that's what you're doing. But majority of gyms that you go to, kickboxing gyms, a lot of those places don't spar.

Even hardcore gyms, you can have a separate class for people who don't want to spar. And you know what? If you want to have a Tuesday, thursday hard sparring class right the people who are coming in to just like oh i just want to get working out and hanging out and hit pads and break a sweat like those people are going to pay the bills those people keep the lights on because majority of people fall into that category right why shouldn't judo have the same right i mean so this is the idea okay so how yeah how do you call me is a cardio exercise. Yeah. Okay. Osorogari is a great exercise, right? You pull, you're balancing on one leg, you have to tighten your core.

And even uke has to engage his core the whole time. Right, right. But the intensity levels are varied. And when you're actually doing it, it's a little bit more in terms of like output for energy than when you're taking it. So you go 10 and then 10, the opponent goes 10, that's your rest time. Yeah, yeah. So you have to kind of cater the drills towards this. If you go Osoto, when you swing your leg up really, really high, right, it could be like

a two-for-one sort of exercise where you're doing a hamstring dynamic stretching exercise. Right, right. See what I mean? So you're, yeah. Nice, nice. It's like no different than leg swings when you're doing it in ballet and dance right right right so you go 10 the other person goes 10 we switch right left with 10 and the other person goes 10 right and then when you come out of those sotogari you can put your

hands out and then get a nice shoulder stretch a lat stretch okay so that's another element right shoulder stretch lat stretch come back up otodogari swing your leg hamstring stretch right and then you repeat this yeah and that's kind of the beginning start with osotogari maybe you can start with osotogari right and then you could go into other drills like double leg into a lifting sort of a thing but it could be like a body lock into a lift oh instead of going all the all the way yeah so it's like a much more shallower like lunge into a lifting yeah right like a lunge into a split squat lunge into a split squat right but the range of motion is a little bit more limited yeah you see what i mean right so like you could make that a little bit more of an intensive

exercise and you could vary those between like footwork drills. Right? Like quick ochi, turn throw. Quick ochi, turn throw. You see what I mean? Now you're doing a very, very drill focused judo thing that's sort of core. So to me, I don't know, maybe I'm biased, but it kind of sounds

boring to me. What cardio isn't boring though? I guess. But, but how do they... I'm trying to think of how cardio boxing classes are structured. To me, I was huffing and puffing. That's why I didn't have time to feel bored, I guess. Oh, you will be huffing and puffing if you keep the body moving, doing these kinds of drills.

Right. The most egregious offense a lot of the times you're going to do, which you kill me when you're trying to get cardio workout, is when the other person's like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. You're gripping the key wrong. Let me show you where your pinky goes. No, no, no, no focus on the toe. Let me show you. Let me show you. You got to do it like this.

That's the most egregious offense, right? So there's no talking. You know when you go into like a cardio fitness class like in the gym and I told you guys I do this classes all the time

market research yeah there's one voice in the room just the instructor no one no one else is talking

right and the drill is guided it's guided right and then it's the energy of the room

from the leader that's the key if the sensei is like walking back and forth sit down hangs out check his phone like taking attendance which i'm at fault to do him because i'm running a bit by myself solo not by myself but like you know a lot of times you know all the guys who were working earlier sometimes gone right right right but like if you're the leader in the room and you're like, hey guys, okay, let's go now. So did you call me? Let's go. Keep it going. Very nice, Johnny. Very nice, Peter.

That kind of a thing, right? And a very encouraging, positive atmosphere, right? And then it's like you throw in these cues like, hey guys, encourage your partner. Let's go. Push. Okay, we're going speed drills. Like when you're running your feet really fast, right? You know, like when you're doing football? Yeah, yeah.

Chop your feet. Chop your feet. Five, six, eight, boom. Right? And then your partner's like, come on, let's go. You got too much. You're breathing. I can't breathe.

Down for 10 push-ups, go. And, like, encourage your partner. Come on, buddy. You can do it. Oh, I see. Yeah. And then now, all of a sudden, you have a partner. You're in it with them.

Right. And you're pushing each other. Right. You can do the body push-ups, whatever, like slapping the hand together. Yeah, and you throw some competitive elements to it. Okay, look at your partner. Want to do push-ups, touch hands. Push-ups, touch hands.

Cross hands. Cross hands, right? That kind of a drill. Right. You know what I mean? So now you got upper body, right? You got some like cardio stuff, footwork stuff. Right. Hamstring stretching stuff and then

you could do even like partner rows yeah where you're sort of standing in a deadlift position you grab each other's sleeves and then you do a row oh yeah you've seen me do those those are great yeah right and then you kind of superset all. All right, guys, we're doing, you know, Ippon Senagi, lift, down to a deep squat, five to each side. That's 10 bodyweight squats, essentially, with a partner on your back. Right, right. Right?

And then you go, okay, we're doing partner pushups together, 10, bang, all right, rows, boom. Leg raises, get down, and then it's a constant motion sort of a thing. You know, but this is the thing. If you're gonna run classes like that yeah you have to take classes like that to see how it's structured right right because you can't be like all right guys bring it in let's see this new technique that we're gonna

do right you have to be able to keep the people moving right takes up you know it takes practice and a bit of talent too can't just like just like, wow, do you run these things? You know, do you have this? No? Not really. No, sometimes I could. I've done it for like. I remember, yeah, you did it with the beginners.

Like you used to. I don't know if you still split this class between beginner class and then advanced. Somewhat. It depends on like how many people are in the room i saw a lot of the times i do these kinds of exercises at the end of five minutes at the very end right because you want them leaving like breathing hard doing this right and you kind of want to like after they're fully warm you want to like yeah you know make them leave like oh man i gotta go to exercise right so i make them do like ipon sanagi burpee ipon sanagi burpee that's a great drill.

Yeah. Coming hot off the floor, you're training explosivity. You give him a little bit of reasoning too. Like why are we doing this drill? Yeah. Right. Because you know, you gotta- Exploding off the bottom.

Yeah. Exploding off the bottom from pushup position, right up to your feet, diving in, turning real fast, come back out, go back down. Right. That's really hard do 10 very difficult right other person goes 10 all right catch your breath catch your breath you know right three person uchi kame that's a good one so you do you ever like is it just a time constraint like that you can't dedicate classes like uh to cardio judo or what do you recommend to other dojos do you think they they should do it they should have this type of cardio judo really i think what they should do

is have a beginner class where you need all the elements and if i were to ever like really consider franchising something like this and like making an actual system. Yeah. You would have to need to like lay it out minute by minute and then create sort of structure in the classroom, you know? Right. And you can't give the instructor, whoever it is at the dojo, freedom to sit there and talk 40 minutes about their shitty Ujigari. No, seriously, I've been in those classes. Many, many times it's like, Jesus Christ, dude.

Yeah. You know, they can't answer any questions. You know, when you ask a good question, they're like, you're just not doing it hard enough. Because they don't fundamentally have the understanding either a lot of the time. I'm not trying to shit on every judo teacher out there. There's good teachers out there, for sure.

But, like, some people aren't there for that. Right. You need to pepper in all these different things, right. That cater to majority of why the people are there. So you can't, I mean, it's not a good idea to just throw in a cardio judo class. Cause you got, it needs to be systemized and. It does need to be systemized, but if you get good enough at running it, you could roll out of bed and do it.

Yeah. So there's this boxing teacher at Equinox who like i like peek into her class every now and then she's great is she a boxer not by any means oh she's not even a boxer she's like a fitness instructor yeah she's a cardio boxing coach oh yeah she kind of has the look right she's like in shape she has the hand wraps and all this stuff yeah and when she's like doing hey one two uppercut like it looks like boxing she's not a boxer right right right i mean but she's done it so long and she's so good at it that she can just come in and make it up like there's no planning no nothing she just like looks at the room reads the room see how many people are there and she has her core group okay let's pump the music okay this is what we're gonna do forward two steps back two steps jab jab

jab cross jab side step lunge move to the side like all this stuff and she's good she can do this in her sleep dude right but that's like very dependent on her skill uh-huh if i were to roll out like a national judo curriculum you can't be dependent on how much judo they know, because everyone knows judo at a different level. You see what I mean? So if I were to package like a judo cardio class, obviously anyone could reach out to me, you know,

through shintarohigashi.com, you know, you know, we're all in a very niche sport, right? I'm available. It's like, Oh,

let me try to ask my homes you know after winning the quarterback like how do i throw a football he's not even accessible but we're doing judo here right he's very accessible so you guys can reach out to me on the website chintorygosh.com you know uh but yeah that's what i would do man i would sort of see what the needs of the class are and pepper in maybe like a 10 minute warm-up specific to judo that's the biggest thing right and sometimes it's like what i'm greeting people talking to people i'm kind of lazy about it i'm like all right hey you run warmups you run warmups and let them do whatever they want it's 10 minutes anyway who gives yeah right but in a perfect world if everyone

rolled in five minutes before class you can't expect this in new york city because everyone has very very difficult work schedules yeah you know I just don't expect it at all. I don't require it at all. Yeah. But if you live in the suburbs, you have a class that starts at 7 p.m., everyone drives, everyone gets off at 5, then you should expect people to come in early. In a timely fashion, right? Yeah.

But if I had a room full of 20 people that were there all on time, we all do the lineup, everyone stays for an hour, that's what they're there for, they know exactly what they're going to get, that first 10 minutes is going to be a sports specific workout, right? Stretch that leg dynamic stretching, right? Maybe you can like taking double legs down the middle, but like going really slow to stretch that calf, stretch that hip flexor, that kind of a thing. I mean, so now you're constantly moving. The first 10 minutes, not hard cardio, it's low intensity cardio,

but it's dedicated more so for mobility. Right, right. That'll be the first 10 minutes, right? That'll be the first 10 minutes. Maybe some break fall drills. Okay, down, get back up to your feet technical setup. Down, get back up to your feet technical setup. You have another five to 10 minutes of that.

Okay? And then you do some slightly acrobatic stuff like rolling cartwheels, because that's cardio heavy too the issue with zempo a lot of the time it's like all right guys we're going to go down the middle and then half the class is standing on the sideline right right because it takes yeah yeah and you know it's partially a safety thing too yeah but you can do it the shorter length of the dojo too right so like managing that space using that space properly efficiently that kind of thing you can no downtime so that everyone can no downtime yeah moving yeah and

you know i like the idea like uh gary at kano he does a lot of that like when you're doing randori and then not everyone can do randori at once you're standing on the sidelines doing push-ups and jumping jacks you know i kind of don't like it because it's distracting. Right, right. Right? And you don't want anyone doing push-ups on the sideline. I mean, they have, like, sort of an outer area. Yeah, yeah. And I kind of want those guys to be focused on watching, you know?

Because, yeah, that could be educational, too. But when I'm doing on-door, this is a judo fit, judo cardio situation. Yeah. Okay? So then we do literally maybe two minutes of quick instruction, but the instruction can't be like, all right, guys, circle in here. All right. All right.

This is what we're going to do. We're going to start off in this grip. We're going to do this, do that. No. Right. You're just showing. All right, guys, keep your feet moving. This is what we're going to do.

Right foot goes first. Left hand goes there. Bang. Right. Hand on hand to move. Squat. The side. Go. Right. So it's like looking real quick

looking real quick let's go keep the body moving keep your legs running it's not about getting the techniques done really just like getting showing people what to do just yeah yeah yeah then you make small corrections because everyone's doing the same drills okay yeah it's like uh you know like when you're boxing you do a combination right yeah it's like a you know, like when you're boxing, you do a combination, right? Yeah. It's like a one-two hook, right? Yeah. A duck-duck, flip-flip, right? Right, yeah.

You know, when you're doing the ducking, you're like squatting down and getting a leg burn, right? Right, right. So maybe you're exaggerating that duck because you're getting a leg workout. Yeah, yeah. You want to burn more calories, right? So like you're doing these kinds of things. It's like, look inside. Look, this is how you want to do it. You want to make a U with your is how you want to do it.

You want to make a U with your head. You want to go really low. Feel that burn in your quads and your glutes. Go ahead. Okay guys. Like, and then you make it for more corrections. Hey, go a little bit lower, Johnny. Hey Sally, very nice work.

Let's keep the legs working. Let's keep the legs moving. All right. Switch side. Like that kind of thing. What would you, what would be the equivalent in Judo? That's kind of like quick combination and dog. I mean,

I feel like boxing, in a way, it's easier to conceptualize. Yeah, I mean, fake turn, ochi, right?

Or when you lock in ochi, you hop two or three, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, okay?

Now you're getting a balancing leg workout on the one side. And this is the thing, when you're doing judo, you develop a huge asymmetry and imbalance. Right, right,

right. Because you're balancing on one leg all the time asymmetry and imbalance right right right because you're bouncing on one leg all the time yeah my hip mobility on right and left very very different yeah the way both of those legs move very very different at least with tons of back issues yeah okay but if these guys don't have to develop one side skewed to turn the other side and if it's a judo card it's both sides yeah oh you never do both sides in judo like okay wife right you you know you can't really you know whatever right but it's like no but what if these guys are here to learn judo and do cardio right right why wouldn't

you be able to yeah so maybe ochi both sides and then yeah but it's like a quick fake turn ochi bang okay okay that kind of thing right how about this one you know you uh push the person Ouchi both sides and then hop, hop, hop. Yeah, but it's like a quick fake turn ouchi. Bang, bang, bang. Okay, okay. That kind of a thing. Right? How about this one? You know, you push the person literally with two hands. Two hands back to the wall. Once they get to the wall, you turn around, lift them, say, nagi.

And then you walk over all the way to the other side. You do a squat. Oh, okay, okay. That's a great exercise to bond. Like even the Ippon Seinage style. Then you turn and then you do it again, right? Push, push, push, okay. That's a great exercise to bond. Like even the Ippon Seienage style. Then you turn, and then you do it again, right? Push, push, push, push. All right, guys, give your opponent a little bit of resistance.

And then, you know, some people give too much resistance. And like, George, come on, man. Like, the guy can't even move. Like, give him a little bit less. And then, you know, somebody just like flying across the dojo. Like, no, give him a little bit more. You're giving those feedback, right? So then you go push the person back.

You're getting leg workout. Or you can do the, like, lift. The uke kind of squats down, and then the tori pulls him up to standing, like, to get the back workout and stuff. Okay, I see. I get the idea. Yeah, that's the idea, man.

And then you could bring it down to nirwaza. Nirwaza cardio. How, how would that work? Make some very funny sexual jokes, but I'm not going to hurt. You set me up for that. You darted off.

You darted off. I know. Yeah. No, basic stuff, you know, quick passing drills, all that stuff.

But those are a little bit more, you know. I guess you could do, like, the swinging, you know, bottom, you know, what's it called? Like, bottom armbar drill. Like, you go back and forth swinging around. A little bit technical, though, you know. Oh, is it? A little bit technical for a lot of these guys.

But, like, spinning drills. All right, guys, get in referee stance today. Oh, like from wrestling. Yeah, and this is the thing. You can go a little bit more technical. The issue with a lot of that stuff is like really looking at the room and seeing who needs help, right? If you're a bunch of new white belts who've never

done any of this stuff, you're going to spend too much time learning it. Right, right. You got to teach a very, very, very basic version of it. Right. Okay, guys, you know, we're sitting on an opponent on their chest. Hand comes up, you push down, you turn, and you sit. That's juji for you, right?

Yeah. It's not. It's juji so much more than that. But that's a drill, right? How about this one? Udagarami from bottom and closed guard. Right, right. You have to do a sit-up.

You have to sit up, the other side, and the person on top just has his hands on the floor. Right. You have to do a sit up. Uh huh. You gotta do a sit up, other side, and then the person on top just has his hands on the floor. Now you're getting an ab workout. You know, when you put a bunch of these together, do little exercises, like that's easy to coordinate. You know, most people can't even do a sit up, right? Like I don't want to say that, but like a lot of people can't do a sit up. And then this is a great exercise for them.

And then we're not talking about finishing mechanics or like how to scoot your hips out. Yeah. We're not really, we're just working on finishing mechanics or like how to scoot your hips out. Yeah. We're not really. We're just working on the first piece of the movement. You know, that's a good exercise. You get up to do that, you're good. So you think this type of class can be used as a funnel to the more traditional judo class, I guess?

It could be. And it could be geared towards like, all right, a separate sort of, it could be and it could be geared towards like all right a separate sort of it could be doing that or you know guys who are in the room who are advanced guys who need to lose weight enough weight management you know we have a couple guys now we're trying to lose weight and make weight yeah it's such a big piece of the puzzle you know right right if they're doing judo three four times a week and then they'll need to make weight because they're competing in a certain weight class or they want to get down to a certain weight class. Like, why shouldn't you have days where you're working on skills and drills while also working on cardio, burning calories?

It's a two for one. Right. Right. You know what I mean? But like, it's really for everybody. Like, well, who wouldn't benefit from that? Judo guys. You know, can you do hard Judo Vandori six days a week?

99% of the people cannot. I can't anymore. I was old. You know, I can't. I just don't. I do maybe two days a week now of heartworm burying. That's plenty for me. You know, and still I'm in pain all the time.

I see. I see. It could be a good addition to your dojo's program. It's type of. Good for the program. Good for the moms. Good for the dads who are, you know, a little bit out of shape. Right.

There's things you can do, modify it. If your knee's hurt, you don't have to drop to a knee for any of those drills. You can go a little bit more shallow. You can grab a lighter person. You could do lots of different stuff with this. The important thing is that you can't just run it. You have to really do your research and think about the drills and the movements and then develop your skills. I got to tell all the judo coaches out there who are out there who are running judo classes, take a soul cycle class.

Seriously. Take a yoga class. Take a ballet class. Take a dance class. Take a hip-hop class. See how they interact. See what the energy is like in the front row. Take a class and then say, you know what?

Maybe this guy sucked. Maybe this guy is good. Let's see what the average is right right you can't just judge yeah from one instructor I guess you gotta

try to maybe that instructor is hungover that day and having a bad day you never know right but once you take enough of these classes you're like wow

there's you know I take these dance classes right like jazz dance or whatever it is yeah it's 90 minutes long oh wow really 90 minutes's 90 minutes long.

Oh, wow. Really? 90 minutes. Yeah. 90 minutes, dude. Yeah. They keep your attention for 90 minutes. 90 minutes. Doing these movements.

Most of it is drills and skills and, you know, cardio. Right. Right? That's right. Well, that's a feat. Like 90 minutes is not a short time. 90 minutes, dude. I mean, I'm sometimes bored, but then there's always something interesting, right?

Because you're teaching it and you're moving it and there's beautiful people, chicks in there. It's great. You know, you like develop a little bit of friendship, you know? Yeah. Hey, can I follow you? You know, like, I don't know. Is that smart? No, but it's a good time, man.

It's a good time. We got to go do it. Seriously. Then how would you know if you've only had one judo instructor your whole life or two judo instructors or maybe a jiu-jitsu teacher? Like, that's the norm. You know, you got to pull from all these other things that are very successful. You go to a cardio kickboxing class in the morning on Tuesdays, you know, right after

drop-off for kids at 9 30 at equinox there's 47 people in there oh wow you know what i mean yeah and then the class rolls out and there's like 54 it's not so dude 11 a.m right noon and then it dies off maybe noon's not so much but there's like three classes back to back you know three classes in one day back to back yeah more than most of these dojos you know their entire membership roster seriously that's nuts you know on the 9 a.m to 11 a.m like you can't even find parking at some of these places and this is how you know it's that's kind of gives the financial foundation for your real real quote-unquote sparring classes i guess like if you want to really run that yeah yeah i'm a big idea person when it comes to this and then

yeah run day really isn't for everybody you know they right it is and it's this toxic stuff masculinity stuff or even like this survivor bias combat athlete nonsense of like everyone needs to do it you know and i used to think like that too no right now the older i get you know i'm thinking to myself like wow if more people did judo it would be good for the sport for all of us all of us yeah that's right develop an industry behind it yeah think of it this way guys if you have a dojo for 100 people right and now you're on a successful side, let's say even 50 people, right. You had 200 more new members doing judo cardio. Think of what you can do. Right. In terms of like infrastructure for the gym, hiring new good people to drive more business. You could pay for ads. You could upgrade your mats. You could even like sponsor a competition team with that money.

Right. I think that's the key. Like it's, you know. Yeah, we need to drive judo forward by doing things like this. Yeah. Yeah.

All right. Well, guys, I think, yeah, I think the big thing here is that we shouldn't look down on these things, you know, like, oh, it's not like, oh, it's not hard judo, it's not hard judo. It's not real judo.

Yeah, but there's a reason why this is so popular. Like, make sure, go and take these classes. I've taken them. They're really fun. You can at least get a workout if you don't like them. But yeah, cardio judo, guys. Give it a serious thought. Anything else, Shintaro?

Nope, that is it. Thanko, guys. Give it a serious thought. Anything else, Shintaro? Nope, that is it. Thank you, guys. ShintaroHigashiro.com, please check it out. Yeah, oh, and then if you guys want to chat with us, the best way is to sponsor us on Patreon and join us on our Discord server. All right, thanks for your support, thanks for listening,

and we'll see you guys in the next episode.