The Shintaro Higashi Show - Judo Blues

Episode Date: March 15, 2022

Many, if not all, Judokas experience the "Judo Blues" once the initial enthusiasm inevitably subsides-- feeling stuck and frustrated for a variety of reasons. This is one of the major reasons why people quit Judo. In this episode, Shintaro and Peter discuss what we can do to combat the Judo Blues so we can truly enjoy Judo. Please support us on Patreon if you can: https://www.patreon.com/shintaro_higashi_show. Any amount helps!

hello everyone welcome back to the shintaro higashi show with peter you we're going to talk about the judo blues today what is a judo blues judo blues it's like it's just sadness and frustration and being disappointed and discouraged it's not just specific to judo but like you know a lot of people have like seasonal affective disorder in the winter when there's not enough sun and vitamin d right but the thing about judo is that you'll never get enough vitamin D because you're indoors. You're in the dojo. It's not like playing outside. Right.

Playing soccer or something. You're always outside. Right. So now you're in a basement, usually in a basement or a second floor or some kind of room. It's an indoor sport. Spend a lot of time indoors. Should we just do judo outside? Is the cure that is the cure we're gonna go hit all the public parks from now on i'm gonna do a hybrid model right where sometimes it's remote

sometimes it's outside never in the oh we did this already in 2020 well in all seriousness i think the judo blues like everyone goes through it i i went through it a lot of people i think it happens a lot as you say like uh when when you start you're like so pumped up you're so enthusiastic yeah everything is new everything is fun but you hit this wall yeah of progression like because it's a judo has such a steep learning curve yeah a lot of these movements are not natural it's not right simple as take the ball and throw it in the hoop and there's lots of successes in early sports you play basketball you're gonna make one of the shots at least right right but to take down someone that doesn't want to get taken down who's been

there longer than you very very difficult very hard yeah very hard because then yeah and then you don't see that immediate you don't get the immediate feedback so a lot of time a lot of people quit around that time right like uh yellow belt green belt i'll say yellow belt green belt i definitely for sure uh i'll give you an example of why sort of jududo is very very difficult First technique you learn is Osorogari This is how you throw somebody with this outside trip You go like this, you go like that You're doing it wrong, you're doing it wrong Your pinky's not in the right position

You have to hold past them, do it like this, do it like that Okay now go try it, it doesn't work Never works Never works Because there's taken so much out of context there's hand positioning, there's timing there's momentum, does the person see it coming all these different things

very very very difficult to do especially to a resisting opponent resisting opponent, resisting opponent and the one time it does work, it feels effortless you don't know if they gave it to you or not that's the worst and generally if they're a higher belt they'll go down and say hey man that was you did a great job but next time pull the sleeve a little bit harder to decredit to discredit or devalue

your accomplishment patronizing patronizing patronizing right i gave it to you right so it's very very frustrating because the winds are very so small and far in between. And you don't know if you're making progression because it's very difficult. People who you're coming up with within your cohort, those people are also training very hard. Right. So it's not an easy thing to know. Yeah. And not only their baseline, it's very a lot of the movements are very

foreign to people very foreign you know yeah and the actual technique is such a small piece of it it's all the movements around the contextual stuff yeah that's why the clear path to black belt is the key in retention they need a clear path to black belt hey this is how many classes you need this is how many classes you need this is how many times you show up and then you'll get the stripe and then you'll get the yellow belt and then you do this many things and then there's a checklist and they say oh as long as i follow this progression i'm making progress that's sort of right the key to retention but we don't do any of that at my dojo why not because it's not we've talked about a little

yeah because i don't want it to be that thing of like this systemized curricularized thing right curricularized thing curriculum yeah yeah and i don't want it to be that you know and of course people make that argument if you want to scale you have to have a curriculum you have to have a clear yeah you have to take attendance and all this stuff but i don't want it to be that thing and it kind of takes away the fun for me to teach to the room and then people are coming to learn from me right it's a little bit of a different story i don't want people coming because they check in a box and get in the belt right i would have to come because they genuinely want to learn from me and they love the community right so without that checklist the how do you, how do you ensure that people,

like, how do you retain people? Yeah. It's a very, very good question, Peter. I don't. Yeah, you do. There's enough retention. So this is the thing, right? There's some people who are very intrinsically motivated.

Some people who need a very strong leader in the room. Those people are going to come. They want to learn judo. They figure I'm a very good person to learn judo from. They like me. They want to be around and listen to what I have to say about the sport. They're going to come no matter what. It's the people who are extrinsically motivated.

They need the reward system. They need those stripes in between the ranks. They need the pad on the back and the check on the ranks they need the pad on the back and the check on the box and then the stamp on their booklet those people we're going to lose those people majority of the time i see and you mentioned that the if you're doing the judo program at my school by the way it's specific to judo program because i also don't want those people oh yeah you want yeah intrinsically i don't want so i guess yeah yeah i don't want those people. Oh, you want intrinsically motivated people. So I guess, yeah.

Yeah, I don't want to have to motivate you and be like, hey, buddy, let's go, man. And I do that, right? But that's not my job to be a professional cheerleader in order to get you through the door. Come through the door, but I want to do it in a different way. Because you're drawn to the place. Not because I'm meticulously reaching out and checking your box. And then, you know, I don't want that. Right.

So I guess the one thing to help with your judo blues is kind of look into yourself and kind of look for that intrinsic motivation. Could be. You do have to know yourself. What kind of learner you are. And people who already have mastered something they learn something really well and they like it and they yeah and then they could sort of follow a similar path similar sort of yeah reward system or feedback loop that's going to help them keep going right because longevity really is the key to learning any skill right

longevity you have to do it for a long time yeah yeah so those people who have mastered something also always has an easier time trying to get things what they want right so it's a little bit different yeah you have to kind of know yourself that's always sort of yeah fallback thing and then going kind of outward um you did mention this i touched on it briefly but the you know the community aspect too. I think a lot of times this is such a new sport, not a lot of people do it. So if you have trouble making friends in that community, that could also bring you the blues. Yes, definitely.

Because it's a very isolating sport. My colleagues from, I don't know my mba or my masters or whatever it is like those people have no clue what i'm talking about what i'm talking in-depth judo stuff i'm interested in no i i thought it would be better than like bjj and whatnot because it's an olympic sport but it's not it's not really i guess even it's not really yeah because it's not sophisticated in the way we communicate about judo for instance if i said something uh here so this is a good test okay you'll know exactly what i'm talking about i watched this video that triple a he's a german guy who's competing now uh showing right first

right tricep grip cuts that sleeve because he's, and then he ducks down for a one-handed kataguruma, right, with the leg that would be grabbing the leg, posted on the person's hip. Yeah. Pretty cool. Yeah. Most people who are listening probably have no clue what I'm talking about, especially the people who don't do judo.

So it's a very, very sort of isolating thing because we're speaking a language that no one else speaks first of all yeah in that thing right first right i said right first right i didn't say ayotsu if i said ayotsu yeah it would have been different tricep grip what the hell does that mean right you grab the tricep but it's a very specific type of tricep grip where you loop over the top yeah right because you can't just grab from underneath because then they'll be able to post yeah right yeah and when you think of kataguma you're going to this back angle you're cutting the sleeve and then you dive it in and then you're posted on the hip you can visualize this if you're a jiroka right okay yeah so now all of a sudden the only people you could

talk to about this stuff is the people in the class but if you don't have a lot of class in the dojo who are you going to talk about this stuff nobody yeah it's even more isolating and it'll only shine the light on the fact that you don't have a lot of friends which is very very depressing oh yeah it kind of exacerbates the icy yeah yeah so then that kind of goes back to i think we talked about in the last episode like kind of fostering the right culture in the dojo so that people feel welcome and you know they have someone to talk to about this new hobby they just started yes and that's why you need higher belt mentors who are going to be nice yeah because with the obvious belt coloring situation, your attitude gets exacerbated. If you're nice, amplifies by 10.

If you're mean, amplifies by 10. Something as small, you know, and I say microaggressions and people laugh at me. But if you were in the dojo and you're brand new and you don't know anybody, and then the sensei walks up, you say, actually, that was pretty good, you know, coming from an unathletic person like you, you know, maybe leaving out the unathletic person like you part. But actually, that's pretty good.

The intention or the inference that can be made is I don't expect good things from you. Seems like a very, very meaningless thing. But based on the fact that you're wearing a belt you're gonna amplify that it's no longer micro it's no longer micro it's a very very aggressive comment and people don't feel people get to see that you know right right i'm getting riled up even thinking about it i know yeah that's bad yeah and then so the blues like the the yeah like the community is so important the culture that helps you with the blues and then yeah yeah so clear path what else felt right having a bad teacher yeah you know not getting the proper feedback you're going in day in and day out you

have no clue when you're going to get a yellow belt right a hard time making friends you know you're young person you're like hey mom dad whoever you're closest to like i learned this new technique called osorogari they're gonna be like what do you no idea what it even makes you can't even show it to them yeah it's like i'm gonna go join a dojo to make friends it becomes even more isolating you know so i try to be empathetic about this stuff you know if you have a very commonsensical demeanor i will try to push you sort of hey work with this person this person's very friendly this person's kind peter will smile at you he won't say you know mean things to you and some people need that more than others right and i think uh this is just not specific to judo i mean as you could you guys could probably say i i read a lot on like bjj

subreddit people joke about like how long blue belts last yeah like a long time i think that's uh there's a huge drop off after blue belt yeah yeah yeah it's tough man not a lot of people make it to a purple belt yeah yeah so what else well what else can you get about the judo blues all the sad things about judo going out out there and never winning a match. Oh, yeah. That's actually, I think, you mentioned that you don't push people to compete.

It could be a big cause for the blues if you get crushed. You think you're doing well and then you go out and you just get crushed. It's the worst. Or you get crushed. Yeah, it's the worst. You go out there thinking... Or you get injured.

Yeah, get injured. You can't beat this person at the dojo and they're just relentlessly beating on you every day. Yeah. All the rivalry, judo rivalry. You can see your rival just go leaps and bounds ahead of you and you're feeling bad about yourself. And I think... It could go both ways. It could help with your blues

or it could cause the i think most people it'll cause it right senior rival oh yeah head you know and i think that's why it's important to have a uh teacher who's at least somewhat sensitive to these things and say hey you know you're not competing with that guy right you're everybody's on a different path people start at different stages of life. People can give different amounts of time to the sport. That's really important. Some people are bored. They got nothing to do. They work a nine to three or whatever it is

and they can come in and do judo five days a week. Those people can also lift. Some people don't have crazily demanding careers that eats up all their time. Some people have a physical job during the day that they can't be, they're exhausted by the time they get to the dojo some people have kids right right so it's not a fair apple to apples comparison so it's important to remind people this

yeah i'm actually i kind of got the blues i think when i first moved to michigan when i thought my judo was a little stagnant but it just you're right like it's a time i was too busy with yeah man did you doing judo three four days a week religiously and working out playing soccer tuesday thursday you were in amazing shape you were lifting weights you know you're doing all the right things you're competing at nationals you took seventh you know all these things right now all of a sudden you know you're in michigan away from all your judo buddies can't talk about judo anymore you know my wife gets i don't even talk to her about that because you know yeah it's honey i hit a tile today she's like yeah i know she's a good sport about it though i'll say sometimes i joke around and try to show her

some moves but it's besides the point. But yeah, you're right. Wives and husbands who don't do judo, that's another reason to have the judo blues. Here's a good one. I've competed in one time. I had girls I was dating or whatever it is come in to watch, and I go against someone who's much better than me,

and they beat me. Example in Japan. I fought in the world championships in Japan. I lost first round. Right. That was a grand slam, yeah. But even then, I had a lady friend comment. She was like, did you win? Did you do good? And I was like, no.

You saw me. The guy went like this to the other guy. Is it bad when that person slammed you on your back? And it's like, yeah, it's bad. Do you you want to go hang out and i'm kind of like yeah i'll go hang out but like i'm kind of sad right now like you know not i don't really feel up to like hanging out and entertaining you right so yeah i totally get that and i had to change my mindset i just had to accept that you know i'm not gonna be as i just that, you know, I'm not going to be as... I just don't have enough time for judo to be as good as I used to be in New York City.

Yeah, just can't do it. Specific to that thing with Anai, now I'm thinking about Anai. He foot swept me, right? He did? I thought it was Uchimata. You would think it's Uchimata or Harai. So I was trying to explain to her

while we were hanging out and eating dinner, this girl. I was like, you know, this guy's known for his Uchimata or Harai so I was trying to explain to her while we were hanging out and eating dinner I was like you know this guy is known for his Uchimata and Harai he's throwing everybody's number one in the world and she's like what the hell is that I'm like well it's when you turn and you stick the leg out anyway I was anticipating that so I was getting it all the way

and I was trying to hip check with my leg and then he took that lead leg. He made me believe he was going for a third. And she's like, man, you're boring the shit out of me. And I was just like, man, this is really. Right. This is the worst.

That's the judo blues right there. You got the blues right there? Yeah. That's right. At least basketball, it's like, yeah, I'm trying to put the ball in that hole over there. Yeah. And it will reach soccer soccer too it's easier yeah i'm sure there's nuances too so yes that's partially judo blues right losing is part of any

sport really but you know i try to tell my guys like hey it's not about winning or losing it's about personal growth right you're using judo as a means to improve yourself so you have to look at it that way it's about the mindset yeah mindset community you know inter intra dojo romance how they that's a part of the community i guess i i mean that that could really make people sad yes because depending on how it goes you know it's definitely a unique breakup in the demographics it's usually 90 something percent men you can see that from our podcast data too demographics data 91 percent or something yeah that's a lot better than my youtube channel. My YouTube channel, you wouldn't even believe, at some point, right, it was like 97.6% male.

Between like, could you even design a channel specifically for that demographic? Like, no, you couldn't even do it. It's like that joke where, like, when men start working out at the gym and they get big, they usually think all the women at the gym and they get big they would think they usually think all the women at the gym will come and talk to them it's the other dudes are like oh dude you're sick tricep

what's your workout routine i was at the gym today i spoke to like four dudes they gave me like uh something man arms today i'm like i'm like yeah yeah yeah have a good workout bro interacted with literally same story with the judo too and and another thing is it's like a delicate thing because not everyone comes for romance that's true when you could be yeah when you come to judo you know that could be a source of the blues definitely you have a when you get intra-dojo crush right and that's that's a tough one you know he and she is not yeah yeah just the nature of the sport is very touchy-feely right so this is grappling it's like lots of yeah you know hugging on the ground and stuff essentially right so you know there's human contact and feelings involved and it's very very easy especially you know the

belt system really kind of exacerbates like we talked about these little micro moments yeah it's very very natural for a beginner male or female to develop a crush on a higher ranking male or female. You know, people get pregnant, unfortunately. Well, fortunately, sometimes. In my case, it's very fortunate. Yumi is such a good girl. Now she's part of the dojo, kind of. Oh, yeah. She did a little practice right the other weekend yeah she goes to two dojos my buddy's dojo and my dojo oh yeah

chester feels so nice yeah he gives so much attention to her it's kind of unfair to all the kids but i'm not complaining yeah right i mean hopefully that'll you know they'll help her you know love judo as much as you do that the community and all well so we covered a lot about the blue yeah there's definitely judo blues i don't know why we decided to talk about was it someone that on patreon that suggested the judo blues it might have been i i forget i wrote it down i don't think so because i must i would have written down if it was uh if had been uh we should give some kind of solutions to this stuff though some solutions i think we kind of did i i think the community aspect like building a you know small micro culture with within the dojo with respect and healthy boundaries.

Seek out good mentors, man. I think that's my best advice for a lot of this stuff. When you're stuck technically in this place of judo and you don't see the progression and you're getting beaten by your rivals and you really want to break through it takes another perspective maybe you're trying the new thing you're spamming all the time you need to be able to break through right and you need somebody to deliberately watch you point it out like going after the fact the sensei and say hey sensei uh what can i work on it's like sensei wasn't watching it he was watching 30 other people making sure no one blew out an ACL today. So it's like, I wasn't specifically watching you

thinking about your personal growth here. You know, thank you for being part of the community. But if you have an open dialogue with the teacher and express some of these ideas in a very respectful way and that person wants to help you,

now all of a sudden, okay, I'm watching this person. Why is this person not breaking through? Why is he getting beat by people of similar rank? Right. And then I think for me, the kind of going inwards,

I think depending on your current life situation, you got to change the mindset a little. We're not all going to be like star professional athletes, you know, and it's really for fun, you know, to be healthy and to make good friends. And,

you know, that's all there is. Yeah. Judo blues, break through, be innovative, look inside yourself. I was getting a little preachy we're all getting preachy

we gotta talk about that the sensei syndrome getting preachy we gotta check our privilege alright anything else? thank you everyone for listening and join us on patreon to give us suggestions and

ideas and feedback yeah and thanks for your support as always and stay tuned for the next episode