The Shintaro Higashi Show - Natsumi Tsunoda Breakdown: Tomoe Nage | The Shintaro Higashi Show

Episode Date: May 19, 2025

In this episode of the Shintaro Higashi Show, Shintaro and David Kim break down the unique judo techniques of Natsumi Tsunoda, a gold medalist at the Paris Olympics. The discussion highlights Tsunoda's mastery of the straight back tomoe nage, her innovative use of the secondary leg, and how she seamlessly blends tachiwaza and newaza.Join my Patreon for:✅ 1-on-1 video call coaching✅ Exclusive technique breakdowns✅ Direct Q&A access✅ Behind-the-scenes training footage🔗 Subscribe & Support Here: https://www.patreon.com/shintaro_higashi_show Links:🇯🇵 Kokushi Budo Institute (The Dojo) Class Schedule in New York, NY 🗽: https://www.kokushibudo.com/schedule🇯🇵 Higashi Brand Merch & Instructionals: https://www.higashibrand.com📚 Shintari Higashi x BJJ Fanatics Judo Courses & Instructionals Collection: https://bjjfanatics.com/collections/shintaro-higashi/David Kim Instagram/YT:  @midjitsu ​

There's a stigma attached to dropping techniques and then Cut a good show. Hey, this is not show his game. That is that Judo, but judo the walls is beautiful its own way the Japanese judo girls are known for having good new walls overall Hello everyone, welcome back to the Shintaro Higashi show with David Kim not Peter you David Kim. How are you? What's going on? Doing great man. It's a beautiful day. We have a champion, right? That we're going to talk about today. It's going to be a very special episode. We're going to take a look at Natsumi Tsunoda. She was the gold medalist in the last Paris Olympics and her claim to fame is the Tomo Enage and the the armbar and given

sort of the mixed audience we have here, you know, primarily Judo, but also Jiu-Jitsu, I thought it might be a very interesting case study because she pulls those techniques off when you don't really think she should be able to do it. And I think everyone, regardless of whether you're a Judo person or a Jiu-Jitsu person, could learn something from what she's doing. So Tamanage, very special move, great for Judo and BJJ.

What's unique about her Tamanage is that she goes straight back, straight back Tamanage, which is very difficult to hit, really easy to stuff if you're only doing that initial attack. And majority of people use it as a way to get out of a bad position. That's what's really cool, right? I'm losing, I'm losing, I go for Tomonage, knowing that it's probably not gonna work, it's a straight back Tomonage, they see it coming, because it's right in front of them,

they stuff it, it goes to Nihwaza, at least I didn't get thrown with their favorite throw. And is that why people tend to favor sort of going left or right when they throw the Tomonage traditionally? I mean so it's a little bit more tricky right because you're like diving on the knee spinning you're using momentum you could hide it with Kochi-Ochi you go to the sleeve side the lapel side straight back Tomonage is just straight back. Yeah. And then so the people who are real good at

Tomonage for throwing tend to have great Yoko Tomonage off like an inside trip or a feint Uchimata or something like this. So a person that just goes for a direct straight back Tomonage, that is extremely rare. Right. Extremely rare. And that's why it doesn't look like when you watch her do it, unless they're standing straight up, you know, it just seems like it shouldn't work. I mean, that's the weird thing about it. Yeah, it shouldn't work.

It seems like it shouldn't work. They sit down, face down, and there's a lot of different components to it that makes it very successful for her. It's actually the secondary leg that's doing a lot of the work. And then the way she uses her arms concurrently with her legs,

that kind of make this thing all work together. And now everyone in the world knows that she does it, but she still has a lot of success with it. So it's a really, really interesting thing. Right. So now maybe we can start from the bottom up. So you talk about everything working together, and we can get to that.

But when you talk about that straight on, I mean, it almost looks like a guard pole, to be honest with you. And so what between her two, you know, just using her legs, what's the dynamic going on there? So she has a posting leg, which is the primary leg doing the Tomonage. And majority of the time when it's taught, you're taught to pull the person onto the bottom of your foot. And if it's completely horizontal to the floor, it's parallel to the floor, that's a great

guard pull because you want to create that separation in the frame before you actually sit down. So Judo is a little bit different with Tomonage where you're kind of pulling the foot and then pulling the person on top and you want to almost load him onto your leg so your leg is a little bit more of an angle coming down, right? And majority of the people just only focus on that primary leg. The posting leg. Yes. She'll place that foot there, but as she sits down, she'll bend the knee and then she'll use that secondary leg as a butterfly hook underneath the foot, underneath the hip,

underneath the butt. And then she uses it to pull the person onto that leg or lift the hips. It's like using those two feet together very well. You know, that's what she does so good. Yeah. Okay. And so now maybe we can talk about the arms and then we can talk about the specific situations, you know, when people are sprawling out how she still thinks it works. So on the arm side, what's the dynamic there? What you're doing with her hands? So usually it's a lapel sleeve, and she's, you know, we're gonna see these clips

and she goes lapel sleeve, and she goes lapel armpit, and then sometimes she goes to sort of the opposite side also, she goes to both directions. But the key with her lapel side hand, the sleeve side hand, she tucks that elbow hand behind the elbow, so she sort of like pulls the person forward as opposed to like flaring her elbows up and then trying to pull using sort of like this

face pull motion. She likes to keep her elbows a little bit tucked and then pull the elbow right behind the elbow so you see the hand placement behind the elbow which is sort of the key component and it creates a little bit more of a better forward pull and then that combined with the butterfly hook together and then the leg and now when they're over the foot then she kind of creates that lift using both legs right so it's like she's like has a post foot in the butterfly hook and then she uses it together like sort of sandwich the person there and then kind of like load them up you know so she's sort of behind the knee and the elbow.

So she's almost controlling those two joints in a way, right? Like they're both kind of hooking on her joints and pulling. Okay. And I don't know if we saw this in the clips that we're going to watch today, but I've seen sort of like the person sitting back and then she uses that momentum when they're sitting back to kind of pull her upper body up off the floor and then she uses that negative space behind her shoulders to like rock back into that while she's using her arms and then pulling it forward, right? And obviously the lapel hand sleeve or the armpit sleeve you'll see in the second clip, she sort of almost doing like a hammer curl or like sometimes she flirts elbows out too but she's pulling the person forward. So just the upper body pull is not enough, just the primary leg is

not enough. It really is the magic of all three of those components kind of working together equally. If she can't quite sit up fully and then go back right away, she'll fall to the side a little bit, right? And then she'll use, and then that shifts the opponent's weight slightly to one side, which makes it easier to elevate that other side because the weight shifts away from that side, you know, I mean Just out of curiosity. Let's say it almost turned into a butterfly sweep, you know, cuz I could see that happening She's going on one side. Yeah, would you would she get a score for that or no? Yeah, she will I mean because the opponent has to be grounded with knees and elbows touching for it to be considered naiwa. Ah I see yeah I see but if they sat down onto their knees and there was zero action for like you know

four seconds maybe they might not call it but they can. Yeah I mean you see Sumigayashi you know is butterfly sweep and then you know Sumi could go to both corners. Yeah. So that's an interesting one. The big difference between Sumi Geishi and Tomohinage is Sumi Geishi requires grip fighting into better position for your hands. So Tomohinage is a little bit better because you can be in losing position and you can just sit down and go.

That's why it's frequently spammed as like a get out of jail free card. That has been a criticism of her, I think, is that. Yes. Especially in the last Olympics, people felt like she was spamming this Tomohinage. But I sort of figure they're spraw criticism of her. I think is that yes Yes, especially in the last Olympic people felt like she was spamming this to Monaca, but I sort of figure she's they're sprawling on her So yeah, it's sort of dangerous Yes, yeah

if there's zero off balance and then you just drop and they keep their chest upright and then there's Separation of the chest and it's not it doesn't look like a real attack Then they'll get penalized for a false attack because they want to penalize people doing just bad attacks, bad attacks, to kind of like play that shot clock or play that game of like, look, I'm attacking but this person's not. Oh my God, I'm about to get thrown. Let me just drop back to my back. So they try to penalize all sorts of negative judo.

And that is definitely a criticism of her. But if the person has to sprawl out, the person has to cartwheel out, it's very- very, yeah, it's a real attack. Yeah. Yeah, you can't. Yeah, you can't. So now this is interesting because, because she's got maybe the lapel and like an elbow or something like that, that does leave some arm to do something like, you you know to post for the person getting thrown to do something. So How does that play into her strategy? So a lot of the times there's like early stage Tomonaga defense mid-stage late phase and the late phase is like oh my god I'm getting loaded onto this leg. This person's gonna take me over and Usually most judos played lapel sleeve

So if the person has my lapel on this side, my left side, my arm is free. So as I'm about to get loaded onto that foot, this is late stage defense, I'm gonna dive to my hand, that's free, and then try to cartwheel out. Right. So what Sonoda, and you know, it's not just specific to her, some of these experts in Tomonage will try to attack that arm going down to the floor. Because if it's going to the floor, they're trying to base, you could sort of underhook it for Ure Gatame or wrap up the arm for Jujji as they're trying to spin out. So that's kind of a really cool maneuver that takes a very long time to develop, obviously.

And then sometimes you're elevating and you kind of helicopter the person into a juji. That's another option. That's a very jujitsu thing to do. Yeah, so that's the amazing thing. You could helicopter that juji to the arm that you're controlling, which is a sleeve. And then if they're diving toward that free arm,

which is they're trying to pose it to your lapel side, attacking that arm. So you could theoretically attack both arms. And the beauty of Tanota, and you'll see in these clips, that she has a pulsing primary leg with the right leg, and then also the left leg. So she could reverse it to both sides. So now you have multiple ways.

What is the word? Permutation, combination. You know? Yeah, give me the math. You're the Harvard guy. Yeah. What is the word? All the corners. Permutation, combination. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know? Yeah. Give me the math. You're the Harvard guy. Yeah.

What is the... So many ways into this thing. Imagine if she was able to do this with sort of the Yoko Tomonage with the Kanto choke to one side, the Yoko Tomonage with the Jujutsu to the other side. Now all of a sudden, it's over. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe she needs to purchase my Tomonage video that's on Higashi.

Maybe she could learn something. Yeah, maybe she could learn some Bob again. Yeah, probably can set her up for the next quad. So that's interesting. So we've basically covered this lesser utilized style of Tomo Nage her setups. It's not really a failed I guess throw. I mean, she does get them to the ground, but maybe it's not a scoring like up no to the back and when they post she has options right now to either arm to sort of transition to naiwaza like right away

yeah and you too can learn this everyone can learn this you know the best way to learn this is the best way to drill it is a three person at chikomi and I think you've seen me teach this. Yes. When the third person is holding the belt. So they're essentially keeping the person's core tight to their body so the person's suspended for longer. And you're not structurally lifting with your legs,

but there's a lift, there's like an upward lift, right? And then I probably made a video about this before. That way you can sort of take your time and it's not taxing on your legs and it's a little bit more controlled. And you could slowly see where the reaction goes and then kind of develop your own feel for the technique, having that third person support.

So you could literally go in there and say, okay, I'm going yoko tomanage to this side, elevating with my butterfly hook. And then I'm going for the juji on this sleeve side arm, and then next time you're gonna go, okay, I'm gonna go straight back to manage, can you go to your free arm to the opposite side, and then as you're doing it, underhook it

and trying to go for a juji like this. But it's controlled, and then you can go slowly. Yeah. And then gravity doesn't take over because the person who's standing is physically lifting the person upwards So that's a good because that that's true I would have gotten that wrong even after my physician's answer because I would not have thought of the three-person

Drill there, but but it can be scary even when you like balloon sweep somebody Yeah, like I did it the other day and I'm looking I'm like I hope this guy tucks his head, you know I think that's he's going straight over but you know Sometimes you know you change directions in the air and Tomonage and you think you're going one direction They guide you in the other direction you go straight down onto your head So having that third person there kind of gives you a very good feel for the technique And then it's actually really good for the person taking it because of proprioception the technique and then it's actually really good for the person taking it because of propria-ception.

You just pulled out all the vocabulary today, my friend. You like that? Yeah, I'm impressed. I'm duly impressed. So let me ask you this question because she's obviously had a lot of success with this at the highest levels of Judo. Obviously, we think that Jiu-Jitsu folks can learn from this as well, but how do you think ... It may look the same when you see it, but how might this change given the different reactions you typically get from a Judo guy versus a Jiu-Jitsu guy? Do you think there would be any difference in how they react or is this something that really truly is just universal between the two rulesets? I think there's more overlap here than most things in Judo and Jiu Jitsu. I think Judo

with Sonoda, she probably has a much better Ochi Kochi game than the average Jiu Jitsu practitioner. So having that threat of, oh my God, if I'm a little bit more upright or if I lean back on my heel or if I anticipate on Tomonaga too much, this person's going to sweep me straight to my back. Having that makes it a little bit more of a different thing. It adds complexity. It adds a little bit more like a sophisticated game, right? And then also with BJJ, you have the option of, oh, the foot's coming up. I could just stuff it with my hands. As opposed to in Judo, leg grabbing is still illegal.

So that person timing a Tomonage to a leg pick is a little bit more of a thing, obviously. So now, without the threat of a backward Ochi Kochi, you take that out, and then all you're doing is trying to time that initial Tomonage where you just reach out and grab a leg, it looks a little bit different. So like, faking that Tomonage, faking that foot coming up, that becomes sort of the important part to kind of stagger the timing.

And then Sunoda, if she goes right foot on the hip first, left foot butterfly, she could pump fake that foot and then go with the other foot on the hip and then butterfly that side foot So like that stuff kind of matters and a lot of the jujitsu practitioners have a certain open guard preference Having my right foot on the hip and then doing delaheeva with my left leg So if they have sort of that preference and not able to do it to one side over the other side Because if you put your left foot on the hip now, right It's sort of a different position. Yeah, it kind of messes you up. So jujitsu person people usually tend to pull guard one way

Or two ways. It's not that sophisticated. I think you know, so then if they do that you could anticipate a little bit more Obviously not talking about like the JT's of Marcus's, I'm talking like the general population, you know, Jiu Jitsu guys. Yeah, people like me. Yeah, I get it. And I think also one of the big things too, I think in Jiu Jitsu, when you pull, you're used to sort of the reason you want to maintain that distance, right? You're not used to pulling people up onto the foot, which we've talked about before in any Tomohinage and that can feel weird too because it almost feels like... It can.

I guess maybe you could think about pulling X kind of but just not really. But this is the thing, right? If you post that right foot on the hip and then you put the left foot in as the butterfly for that Tomohinage thing that Tanota does but you're a De La Higa player with the other person leading with their left leg You have to undo that butterfly hook and swing it over, right? Yeah, then you got a pulse on that thigh and then push out and then yeah Yeah, it's like it adds another extra step and your thing is not as smooth. You know what I mean?

Or you do it on that side and it's perfect Yeah, so it's got to fit with your thing. Obviously, she's sort of figured out a thing here and then you know the common judo practitioner will just drop their hips and yeah they might cartwheel out. But they've got to know that that arm is hanging out too. I mean they're not. Yeah, it's a very good, she's very very good at it. Yeah, so let me let's take a step back maybe. I mean, they're not. Yeah, it's very good. She's very, very good at it. Yeah. So let me let's take a step back Maybe I mean she's a great example of sort of a Japanese athlete who is good at Nawa's, you know picking up the arm bar that sort of thing and I guess when you look at

Uta Abe or some of the other girls that have come through, or women, I should say, have come through the Japanese team. Has this been something you've noticed as a theme, just generally for the Japanese women, concentrating on this type of stuff, Nawaasa type stuff, or is this really more like a matter of independent, sort of idiosyncratic skill among the, like every generation has somebody like this kind of thing yeah so straight back to monogatou juji

straight back to monogatou with a lot of success with secondary effort I think that's pretty unique to Sonoda and you know you haven't seen that much there's actually one judoka on the world scene Sima Niska from Sima Niska from Poland oh and she's unbelievable you gotta pull her up, man. She's another one that does kind of like her. She's probably, she's not like an Olympic champion yet, but she has a spectacular Judo style, all Tomonage, all Jujutsu, but a little bit more variety in the way she enters. So she's a little bit more exciting because she goes for different stuff and she kind

of angles off. I'm going to guess it's Jujutsu influence. I don't want to say that, you know, because Judo, Nihwaza by itself. How dare you? Yeah. But Judo, Nihwaza is beautiful in its own way, but it's a lot of turnovers. The Japanese Judo girls are known for having good Nihwaza overall compared to some of these other countries, but someone that has to know the style I think it's a little bit rare. I wonder how she came up with it I'm very curious. I mean traditionally Tomonage is not the most popular move. Yeah that's what I mean you know like so somebody like she she figured it out somehow. It's tough to get

good at Tomonage especially in Japan because when you're spamming that thing, people are like, come on, man, are you kidding me? They get annoyed because you have done so many shots on goal to get good at it. Then if you've repped it a thousand times, that's a thousand times where your opponent's like, Jesus, what are you doing? Get off of me. Get off your back. Stop flopping over. I'm certain coaches were like, come on, just stand up and, you know, what are you

doing that? You know, it's not, there's a stigma attached to dropping techniques and then kind of- I'm sure Shohei, this is not Shohei's game. This is Judo. He loves the upper body lockup. This is Judo. Yes. And historically, most people use Tomonage

as a way to get out of a bad position. So there's definitely sort of a stigma. If I'm in the Dojo and if I see someone dropping Tomonage two or three times, I'm gonna wonder, right? Like, does your gripping suck? Are you doing it to bail out of a bad position? What's going on here?

And then maybe they're truly trying to develop that throw and they're trying to be offensive, but nine times out of 10, my Tomonage when I was competing was purely just for that reason. Bail out. What I'm going with, yeah, bail out. I used to fight hundreds, a lot of tall guys, guys who were 6'2", 6'3", they'd come down the back and they would, right, I would drop in for a shot and if that wouldn't work I would fake that shot and then I would drop back for a Tomonage. I don't think I throw one person with Tomonage. But it just gives you that reset, I guess, right?

It gives you a reset, it takes you out of a bad position and you have to cycle through these bailout throws because if you do it every single time, they're going to capitalize and then they're going exploit that right you know unpredictable yeah exactly so you do Tomonage once and the next time you're in a bad position you fake Tomonage and go for drops in a you know and then the third time you try to go for a bad sumi-gaeshi you know and you cycle for a good one or a good one if you're confident and throwing but you know yeah a lot of people use it as a tool to just get out of a bad situation on the feet thank you very much for sponsors drew Jason Levan judo TV

higashi brand calm thank you very much if you have business you have business churn ha queen that AI you could check out that ha queen that AI thank you very much you too can be a sponsor go to the patreon link down below and thank you very much thank you very much