The Skinny Confidential Him & Her Podcast - #89: PureWow With MaryKate McGrath -Productivity Hacks, Building a Media Company, Scheduling Time For Yourself, Self-Awareness, and Skyscraping

Episode Date: November 21, 2017

On this episode we are joined by PureWow's Editor in Chief, MaryKate McGrath to discuss what it takes to build a media company in the digital age, scheduling time for yourself, productivity hacks, the Instagram algorithm, self-awareness, and skyscraping.  PureWow is on of the largest media companies providing women's lifestyle content on a weekly basis and reaching millions of women around the globe. To learn more about PureWow click HERE To connect with MaryKate click HERE To connect with Lauryn click HERE To connect with Michael click HERE This episode is brought to you by FABFITFUN FABFITFUN is a seasonal subscription box with FULL-SIZE beauty, fitness, fashion, and lifestyle products. Their Winter box is amazing! It has products like Hollywood's 2-minute facial from Kate Somerville, a cozy BB Dakota poncho, an eye shadow palette, aloe infused socks, a chic choker necklace, and thats just the beginning. Check out www.FABFITFUN.com and enter code "SKINNY" at checkout to save $10 off your first box making it only $39.99. Each box always has a value of over $200 inside!

The following podcast is a Bostik Media production. This episode is brought to you by FabFitFun. So FabFitFun just sent me their seasonal subscription box last week, which was so fun, kind of a play on words, because instead of the travel-sized typical subscription situation, it has full-sized everything. This includes beauty, fitness, fashion, and lifestyle. All things you guys, T, fashion, and lifestyle. All things you guys TSC readers will love. The box retails for $49.99 a month and has a value of $200 worth of full

sized products. You guys know I love a steal. You guys will love this too. And you guys can enter the code SKINNY, all caps, for $10 off your first box at www.fabfitfun.com. Enjoy. She's a lifestyle blogger extraordinaire. Fantastic. And he's a serial entrepreneur. A very smart cookie. And now Lauren Everts and Michael Bostic are bringing you along for the ride. Get ready for some major realness. Welcome to The Skinny Confidential, him and her. Aha! Welcome to The Skinny Confidential, him and her show. Today we are interviewing Mary-Kate McGrath, the editor-in-chief of PureWow,

which is a huge American media company that publishes women's lifestyle content and which was recently acquired by Gary Vaynerchuk, aka Gary V, who has also been on this show, I believe episode number 51. On this episode, we discuss how to build a media company, the Instagram algorithm, scheduling time for yourself, skyscraping, and how to develop self-awareness. For those of you who don't know us, I am Lauren Everett, the creator of The Skinny Confidential, which is a YouTube channel, brand, book, and podcast. Sorry, my throat's bothering me. No, no, no. You need to introduce yourself as the fake coffer. And I am Michael Bostic, entrepreneur, businessman, podcaster. Fake coffer. You guys see fake coughs. No, tell everyone what

you do. No no i don't fake cough and you know it's funny in this interview mary kate and who you guys are all going to meet pretty soon and lauren both make fun of me but i have this weird tick and i don't know if anybody else has this tick um it happens to me you know every time i wake up in the morning or if i've been out drinking or if i've been partying or if i'm just tired i feel like i have to like clear the pipes i know that sounds kind of gross but but I got to like cough and I got to like, you know, like just do this cough for a minute to like get like my lungs going again. I'm going to go throw up on myself, but you do it every morning of every day in the shower. Um, when you're brushing your teeth, it's a fake cough. And

I actually forgot that we discussed the fake cough with Mary Kate. She evaluated it and she is really weirded out. So if any of you guys' boyfriends or husbands fake cough. Or if any of you fake, I feel like I can't be the only one. Like I feel like it's not, but here's the thing. It's not a fake cough guys. Maybe it's like a tick, but I have to, you know, I have to like, when I get up in the morning, I feel like there's almost like dust in my lungs. No, no, no. That's probably not good. It's a fake cough. No, it's not fake. It's the boy that cried wolf cough. It's not fake. It's just not one of those, like, it's not, I don't have a symptom, right? Like I'm not like, I don't have like a cold or anything. It's just like hard for me as your wife, because when you

actually are sick, it's hard to like know, are you fake? I feel like I have like smokers lungs, even though I'm not a smoker. Does that make sense? Yeah, but we got to stop. Like the tic's out. Anyway. Okay. All right. Well, speaking, I guess this doesn't have to do with fake coughs, but you probably will be fake coughing on Thanksgiving. It's Thursday.

Thanksgiving. Thanksgiving. Talk to everyone about your favorite holiday. You know what? I'm going to, again, I'm probably going to get shit on again. I was saying the other day, I was working out with Kim and Lauren and I was saying, I'm not even that big of a fan of year. Your favorite holiday. You know what? I'm going to, again, I'm probably going to get shit on again. I was saying the other day, I was working out with Kim and Lauren and I was saying, I'm not even that big of a fan of Thanksgiving. Be honest what you were really saying though. I'm not that into it. Nitty gritty. No, I'm not that into it. I don't really, I've

never really gotten that off on the food. Like, you know, I get everybody like, you know, they love the turkey and they do the stuffing and the cranberry and all that stuff. I actually love the spicy cornbread. Yeah. The cornbread. And then everyone does like the leftovers. Let me tell you something. During the year, I'm not eating this stuff. I'm not looking for a big spicy cornbread. I'm not looking for the stuffing. I'm not drizzling gravy everywhere.

I don't want a turkey. You don't want a green bean casserole? No, and I definitely don't want day-old food. I mean, I know that's like an American tragedy that i'm not into thanksgiving leftovers or thanksgiving i appreciate be honest why you're really not into thanksgiving though i feel like it has nothing i appreciate the sentiment and obviously there's a lot to be thankful for and i like that part of it except when your dad makes me hold um your little brother's hands at the dinner table miles i'm sorry i love you but i don't like holding your hands uh especially when you're yeah he does we bow our heads and i'm like

holding your little brother's hands it's super creepy creepy. Um, Brad, at least maybe sit me next to some of the girls in the family. I don't mind doing that, but you know, there's me and little brother miles holding hands and bowing our heads. And so, you know, I do that because you got to respect whoever's like your dad's hosting that dinner. So it's his dinner table, Brad. I love you. I'm respecting the table, but I don't want to hold Miles' hands. Michael, the reason that you don't like Thanksgiving has nothing to do with the food. Tell the real reason. No, that is the real reason. You hate a family dynamic. No, I don't hate a family dynamic. First of all, you're going to get me in trouble again. I love

my family. I love everybody involved, but there's just so many stops and so many different like things going on and there's people in the kitchen and you know they're all high-fiving that they're cooking and I can't contribute there and I'm just I end up just drinking like wine or champagne or tequila or beer or all the above in the corner and we do uber with the dogs no listen I I think I would like it more if I could just go to one location and not have to run around. We have to go to like three locations every time with the dogs in Ubers because we're not going to drink and drive. You shouldn't drink and drive on Thanksgiving. No, don't drink and drive. You shouldn't drink

and drive ever. Drinking and driving is so out. No, I mean, listen, we have Uber now. That's what we don't need to do that. We don't need your whole life story. What we really want to know is what is your highlight of Thanksgiving? And I hope it includes my pumpkin roll. Well, it's definitely not holding Miles hands. Um, I keep going on that, but, uh, is it my pumpkin roll? Yeah. The pumpkin rolls good. One time a year that I really, you know what, Julie, if you're listening to this, Lauren, step-mom, Julie, the, the dessert she makes, those are, those are fire. All her desserts are on burlap and crystal.com. I gotta be honest. Everyone makes great food. I'm not complaining. Like your dad's great. My parents are great. The food's great. I hate the word great. It's not like my go-to. You know what I

mean? Well, you know, I'd like to see you cook Thanksgiving. Maybe one day we could have like an Italian dinner. We could have something like pasta, get some pizza, get up steaks instead of having to do like the big Thanksgiving. You know what i always feel too like what are we stuffing this bird with michael that's kind of gross if you think about it okay well i just want to shout out julie my stepmom for one second all her recipes that she cooks on thanksgiving can be found on her blog which is www.brillapandcrystal.com she did our entire house she's doing our house in la she's adding some touches to it. So she's fab. We are doing Thanksgiving with both families this year. And we do the whole usual. And my sister's fiance's family too. So we're adding another family. And listen, I love that family too. But like there's a lot of families merging together here. I think you've said the word family too

much this episode already. Anyways. We hope you guys are going to have a nice Thanksgiving. You should make my pumpkin roll. It's on the blog. It's insane. It's a real hit. It's kind of hard to make, but I do it every year. And you love it. So I don't know why you're acting like it's not a big deal. I love it. I'm not complaining about the food. I'm just saying it's not my favorite type of cuisine.

Like people get super fired up about Thanksgiving. Thanksgiving is not a cuisine. I think because I guess it's not like Italian, right? It's not like Japanese food. Pilgrim cuisine. Yeah. But yeah, but you know, I just Italian, right? It's not like Japanese food. Pilgrim cuisine. Yeah, but, yeah, but it, you know, I just. All right. I could leave it.

Everyone has had enough of this. Let's go. Let's get into. It slops the cranberry juice on the turkey and whatever it is. Let's get into him and her tip. You can go first. Okay. Speaking of tryptophan, is that how you say it?

Tryptophan? Tryptophan? Tryptophan. That's from the turkey, right? So originally my tip this week was going to be about naps. I'm a big believer lately in a quick 20, 30 minute power nap, but I'm actually not going to do that this tip because I thought it was a little bit boring and I thought it's like not so great.

It wasn't so titillizing, right? Is that how you say that? So my new tip this week is one that I actually use every single day that's practical. It pisses Lauren off, but it's a really good tip for those of you- I hate this tip. That have a difficult time getting up early in the morning, but want to, and you're digging deep trying to find that discipline and you got to get up from under the covers. So my tip, I've been doing this for the pretty much six months this year, the last six months, I first, I sleep with my cell phone away

from my bed so that I can't use it when I get into bed. Like I charge it completely away from the, from myself. And I put that on a charger or somewhere else in the corner of the room. So I don't have access to my cell phone. And I put an alarm on there for, let's just say, 635. We'll just use that 635 number. And then to make it even more annoying and this is the part lauren really hates i actually have an old school alarm clock you know the ones that we had back when we were kids you know when you didn't have cell phones yeah i you know what it is i use that and i put that um it's a little digital with a battery i put that away from my bed so that it's i have to physically get out of my bed to reach it and turn off the alarm. And I put

that for 630. So what happens is I'm forced in the morning when that alarm goes up to get out of the bed to turn it off. Then to double down on that, once that's done about five minutes later, my cell phone starts going off in another part of the room. So I physically have to walk to one place, then another place to turn these alarms off. And I find by the time I've done that, I'm either so fired up or frustrated that I got ripped out of bed that way that I'm up and I'm ready to go. But once you do that for a few weeks in a row, then it just becomes habit. And now I find myself getting up naturally at that time every day, not 630. But sometimes I think I'm up mostly around like six, but still use 630 as an example. So you can do that too. And it'll help

you get up early in the morning and also not having the bed by or not having your phone by the bed is really helpful okay michael so get up and get adam all right so my tip is a little bit different if you guys follow me on instagram you know that i found a new gem of a book it's such a good one this one was recommended to me in the Skinny Confidential secret Facebook group by a reader named Cammie who owns Shopsy Doll. I'm actually wearing one of her necklaces now. It's the little round gold one. They're super cute. Anyway, this book, okay, it's the shit. Basically, it's this book that's all about preventative skincare, which is something that I've been talking about every single day for the last seven years. And the book is called The Little

Book of Skincare by Charlotte Cho. I hope I'm saying her name right. And she's a beauty guru, super into Korean beauty. All the details will be included in the show notes on this book and on the blog. But basically, this book is something that everyone should read, especially if you're under 30 and you're a woman. It breaks down all the treatments, procedures, sheet mask info, the importance of sunscreen, which you know I love, and gives you some major realness when it comes to getting that glowy, dewy skin that we all want. There's even a whole chapter that's dedicated to sunscreen visors and

staying out of the sun. So you know, can you blame me? I'm pretty excited. So I feel like I needed to share that with everyone and spread the word. And the book is super Instagrammy. It's pink and white and cute and chic. So go check it out. Okay, speaking of skin, let's talk about Kate Somerville's two minute facial that's included in this season's subscription FabFitFun box. There's kind of nothing better. First of all, the goodies that are included in their winter box are full sized products. The box also includes a BB Dakota poncho, aloe infusedinfused socks, which I cannot wait to wear during travel, especially to New York, a super cute choker that I wore in Cabo. You might have seen it on my Snapchat and much, much more.

So I've been wanting to try this box for a while. I saw it on Kourtney and Khloe Kardashian's Instagram, and I was like, what is in that? And then Bethany Frankel and Ashley Tisdale showcased it. So I was even more intrigued. I feel like I need to like be the spy for you guys. Anyway, I, I just feel like the previous brands that they've had in the box speak for itself. I mean, they've had, you know, Dr. Brandt, Tarte Cosmetics, Juice Beauty, Millie, Zola, Michael Starr, Moroccan Oil. I mean, tons and tons of brands, all the brands that I've used a million times. So it's kind of like having your ideal beauty and fashion situation delivered

straight to your door. Also for the holidays, I think that you could get the box and you could take a couple items for yourself and then you could gift the items to friends and family, wrap them up really cute and kind of have like a makeshift box that you gift separately. Does that make sense? You could also just give it all to yourself if you want. Anyways, when the box came to my door, I wasn't expecting full-size products, which was really badass and they're all full-size. They're not travel size. It feels really fulfilled. I feel like I need to go back for a second and talk about Kate Somerville. So this is the standout star in the box because it's her ExfoliKate Intensive Exfoliating Treatment. You guys know I love,

love, love skin and this product does not disappoint. It's just fabulous for removing blackheads and dead skin. You mix this with the aloe socks and you're in business. Anyway, if you're like me, you prefer treats delivered straight to your door instead of having to go buy them separately online or go to the mall. What's a mall? It's so annoying to go to the mall. Anyway, the FabFitFun box retails for $49.99 a month but has a value of $200 worth of product that's $200 worth of product for $49.99 a month you guys know I love a steal you do too so apparently they sell out super quickly so all you have to do is enter the code skinny for $10 off your first box at www.fabfitfun.com. I hope you guys love this box. It's perfect for winter. It's perfect for the holidays. I know you guys will love it as much as I do.

Enjoy. Today we have Mary Kate McGrath, editor-in-chief of PureWow, who spent more than a decade in print publishing at InStyle, Food Network Magazine, and Real Simple before a friend suggested she meet with Ryan Harwood, PureWow's CEO. She had a blowout and she wanted to meet with him. That's the story. You'll hear it. Anyway, she was instantly convinced of Ryan's mission to become one of the best online publishers of women's lifestyle content, and she jumped to join the company. PureWow has recently partnered with VaynerMedia and entrepreneur Gary Vanderchuck. Between their 15 seconds of blink beauty and their social media presence, they're kind of killing the game. It's so inspiring and was so inspiring

to sit down with someone who represents their brand in all the right ways. Mary Kate is someone you want to go have rosé with on a Sunday. You guys know what I mean? With that, let's welcome Mary-Kate to the show. This is the Skinny Confidential, him and her. Okay, Mary-Kate, tell us how PureWow came about. Okay, so I can't take any credit for it. I can take all the credit for it after a certain point, but I like to joke that our CEO and founder, Ryan Harwood, grew up as a little boy who just wanted to talk about women's smoky eyes and like perfect red lipsticks. Although that's not really the case either. It's a good story because it is what's driven the company for years. We're about seven years old now. So Ryan was out of school working at Goldman Sachs as the banking financial

world and had been a tennis player growing up and had been pro for about a year before he joined Goldman and went there and say what you will about Goldman, he just found it to be a place of like no passion. And he really missed like the day-to-day passion, which is definitely like the number one thing that drives us every single day. We find people with passion at PureWow. And so he did some research, held some focus groups

and thought he would join media in the media space, had some friends there, but thought he would start like a men's brand. Like who was he to start a women's brand? But after holding his focus groups, it was very clear to him that women, this is about seven years ago, were predominantly the shares on social. So like that force was there. Advertisers definitely put, you definitely put more money behind efforts to target women. But then when he did even more research defining like, all right, so what would their value prop be? Like what would PureWow actually be in this space? The themes that resonated then still resonate now that there wasn't a digital media property that talked to an upper millennial or lower Gen X woman. So at that point,

think like, and friends of ours are there, like Refinery or PopSugar, like those were properties that were really vying for an 18 to 24 year old. And then when this woman gets older and has like such purchasing power and more disposable income, she was kind of left on her own. And so this, the scene at that point was kind of like web 1.0 and 2.0. So if you're like a woman in your like upper 20s or lower 30s, you're almost faced with like either mommy blogs or like really, really, really crappy cooking recipes and like lists and lists and lists of what you're doing bad to your chicken or something like that. Like it just was not good content. And so I met Ryan two years into it. He didn't have an editor-in-chief at that point. He had amazing content creators, but just not someone who's kind of like the face and leading the charge on the content

side. And we met two years into it it and I laughed because the person who connected us said you got to talk to this guy Ryan Harwood he works at Pure Wow and I was like what's Pure Wow and I thought she said Purell and I was like I don't want to go to a hand sanitizer company and um you know when you have like a good blowout and you don't want to waste meetings. I had a good blowout that day. I was like, fine, I'll meet Ryan. I do not like to waste meetings if I have a good blowout. I know exactly what you're talking about.

If you're home at 8 o'clock and you have a good blowout, you should just pick up the phone and figure out plans. If Michael doesn't see me after a blowout, what is the point? Zero. It didn't happen. If a blowout happens in the woods and no one's there to see it it didn't happen so I took the meeting because you know my hair was looking fly and um within two minutes he he basically told me that pitch like the what do women read online past a certain age and you know it wasn't like it was exactly me like he's like what do you read in print?

And I must have mentioned every single magazine in the world. And he's like, what do you read online? I was like, Facebook. I didn't know what that meant. And he's like, yeah, we're going to answer that. We're going to figure that out. And so from the jump, Pure Wow was going to be and is a destination for women to make their world more beautiful, more manageable and easier. And we cover all of lifestyle.

So like you can come to Pure Wow if you want new fashion tips. You can come to Pure Wow to figure out what you should read next. You can come to Pure Wow to figure out what you should make for dinner that night. You can come to Pure Wow to figure out what the latest is with, you know, Kristen Bell and Dax Shepard. Like we kind of hit every single passion point a woman might have. In a cool way. In a cool way. Like we're not judgy.

We're not preachy. And we're like, yeah, we're in on it together. Like we're all kind of going through this journey together. So like we don't hold anything in too high regard. We're like, what do you do when you spill your entire lunch on your lap and you're at work? Like those are real problems that real men need to know. Just go home. Go home. Give in.

So I have a question. When you guys first started and you cover so many things now, how difficult was it to capture an audience? Did you have to start with one thing or did you guys kind of cover everything? Like how did you build from the beginning and capture a readership? Sure. Ryan was really smart in the beginning. We started really organically through email. So, you know, emails are really active platform. Like if you allow someone into your inbox, you really, that trust is there. So it was from the early days, the email audience was incredible, super captivated and super sharing. So like they, they got the content, they spread it like wildfire. And pardon me, it wasn't until years later, not years later, maybe two years after I started that we gave enough due attention to the platforms.

But in the beginning, it was email and on-site. But the good thing about that is, is that once you have that audience, once you have the really captivated audience on your own and operated site and email, no matter what happens to the platforms like if Facebook was to like go up in flames tomorrow we would still have our core audience so for a lot of publishers I've had to ride the waves of Facebook algorithms Instagram algorithms snapchat coming in and out of vogue coming back in vogue now we think like we've always had this core audience that has been so reliant that we can rely on that's been amazing Iiant that we can rely on. That's been

amazing. I want to talk about the Instagram algorithms. Yeah. So tell me how you guys have had to evolve your strategy on Instagram from when you started to now. Cause I feel like you have a lot of insight with that. Sure. So Facebook, I guess. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, Facebook is, Facebook is a behemoth. Like, I don't think we even have enough time, right? Facebook is so big. Remember Facebook Live? You know what I mean? Months ago, we were producing a daily Facebook Live. And that's because the algorithm was asking for it. And now it's completely deprioritized it. And now Facebook Watch. And so, like, obviously, we have a team of super savvy and super smart audience development and marketing people who are completely clued in to what's going on. But I think it's actually interesting what's happened with Instagram because that was, like, a mix of art and science that came to play there.

So when we, you know, we've been on Instagram from the beginning and from the beginning we thought of it as like almost a cover page for PureWow. So you would come to the, to PureWow and be like, oh, they write about fashion. They write about books. They write about home. They write about food. They write about wellness. They write about money. Like the list goes on and on. And just as maybe your audience is glazing over, so is Instagram. Instagram wants to send super clear signals to their audience. Their algorithm is very different than Facebook in the sense that they want you to live in your lane and to compare apples to apples. So Instagram kind of didn't know what to do with us.

So what's an example of that, like living in your lane and comparing apples to apples? Okay. Let's say like an influencer or somebody building a brand on Instagram. Perfect. So let's say you're a beauty influencer. You can have hair videos, you can have lip tutorials, but if you all of a sudden throw up a recipe, A, your followers might not know what to do with it. So you might be dinged a little bit just from comments or likes. But B, the algorithm doesn't classify it in the same lane. So you almost lose brand equity or credibility. Like you've all this stock in beauty. If you throw in food, Instagram for some reason, and I get it, and we can talk a little bit about that,

but like doesn't know what to do with you. So they won't necessarily send that to Explore. But if you're a beauty blogger and you have this insane hair tutorial, like you might be on Explore. It's because they protect their users and they want the user to the user come there and say, I'm here for beauty. And all of a sudden there's a recipe. And it's like, that's not what this person came here for. A thousand percent. Which I like totally respect. Right.

Like you want. That's the thing about. They niche down. I respect it, and it's like that's not what this person came here for a thousand percent and which i like totally respect right like you want that's the thing about niche down i respect it but it's difficult i think it's it's great for brands and companies because they like that's their thing and they do that one thing but like as an individual it can be difficult because if you want to talk one day about beauty and and health and then the next day you're like okay but here's my recipe i don't think it's hard i think it's definitely hard i mean sure content is hard and i think that it's i think that um i get it though like i mean i think it's hard but like i understand and i've had this experience where there'll be a blogger that i love and all of a sudden she's like here's my nut bread recipe that's made with like sunflower butter. And you're like, no, no, no, no, no.

You're like my braid girl. Like, you teach me how to braid my hair. Like, I don't, you're in the kitchen now? Like, while we understand that in life, for some reason, you know, at first it's an aesthetic platform. So, like, if it falls out of the aesthetics you're used to, I understand that that's kind of like a red flag. I mean, I get it. I don't love it because it's

hard because you want to be everything to everyone. How can a user that's an influencer get their Instagram seen more? Do you recommend hashtags, location? What are some of your tips that you guys use at PureWow to get your content seen? A thousand percent. So it's hashtags, location, knowing that the algo scrapes, I think it's like three times a day now. I love the word algo. I'm going to steal that from you. Like I want to name my first child algo.

Oh my gosh. We should do a story on like Instagram names. Imagine Kate Middleton's like, world, the next royal baby is Algo. Algovastic. It's also doubling down and skyscrapering, which is the best marketing word ever. Skyscraping what you know does well. So for us, that's a good example.

I don't know what that means. So for us, Kate Middleton does really well in our entertainment vertical. Like people just love her. She's kind of easy to love. She's smart. She's beautiful. She has this amazing life, but she, you know, is like a sneakers girl at the same time. So like we kind of all fancy ourselves a little Kate Middleton once in a while. So if we know Kate Middleton's doing well for us, which we'll see from our data, then we will skyscraper it or mean build more stories upon it. So Kate Middleton here, Kate Middleton, best looks, Kate Middleton's. Oh, there's like this like funny thing about

what they won't let their kids watch, like all these little things that we find out. And then we just keep building on that and then referencing other stories. So cross-referencing your own content, it's okay to be pretty self-referential there. And the same thing applies on Insta. So, like, if you know that nail art does well for you. Like, we have this new channel called Blink Beauty. Which I'm going to do tomorrow. Yes, you are.

And we're so excited. So we know, like, hair and nail art does really well for tutorials. And the idea behind Blink Beauty, it's that it's beauty in the blink of an eye. So it's the fastest tutorials on the entire world wide web. We hope. Someone's going to come in with like Insta Blink Beauty or like Algo Blink Beauty and like best us. But so we know that like hair does really well. So I think you might be doing a hair video.

So then it's like having we know that like hair does really well. So I think you might be doing a hair video. So then it's like having, we know hair does well. So dive, dive, dive deep into that and kind of keep doing that until the audience wanes. But usually they don't like you're giving the audience what they want. And when you skyscraper it, you just give them more of what they want and you're sending all the right signals to the algo. And then the other thing I love is like sharing content within like-minded bloggers and influencers. Like, so find your sphere and share and tag and create together. And sharing audiences is a great way to build audiences. I mean, it's like marketing 101 stuff. It's so funny. Like the platform might've changed, but the techniques have stayed the same. And what about Snapchat and Twitter?

Thoughts? Totally. So Twitter, it's funny. I'm just not personally a huge Twitter user, and people always think that I would love it because I love quick copy and I love the news. But I think that I'm just such a voice person right now. Like podcasting, I think, is just the jam. And I'm way more interested in that right now than Twitter, even though I know that Twitter probably seeds

tons of great ideas for podcasts and voice. It's a little dated, huh? I mean, it's like a revamp. It's just not enough for me. Maybe I just need too much stimulation. I think everyone needs that simulation it's like right right so they just it's kind of fallen by the wayside because everyone's very much more excited about like videos and voice and pictures and it's like it's hard to just keep up

with I don't know how many words they can like 18 words or whatever the hell it is yeah I don't know and then they were playing with like giving people more and I just I don't I I just don't use it as much. But a lot of the, like I was listening to Pod Save America yesterday, which is amazing. Those are the guys from the Obama administration and they're obviously discussing Twitter left and right. So I'll let them read it for me. And then Snap,

what was better than Snap a couple months ago, right? Like the best. Instagram doesn't, like I use it. I use the stories, but I like Snapchat stories better. It's more fun. Yeah. And I like, I like using it. The camera's better.

And I think honestly, I mean, maybe this is not for any of our demographic, but for, you know, 18, 16 to, you know, 22, that's where they still are. Like that's where they're communicating still. And that's where I'm sending nude photos to Michael on, you know? Exactly. It's not over text anymore. No, of course. That's where I'm sending nude photos to Michael on, you know? Exactly. It's not over text anymore. No, of course. That's where I'm sending nude photos of the world.

Because I'm so nervous with all these things with like Harvey and stuff that like all the nude photos, someone's going to come up with some like new app that's like, here are all the bad pictures that everyone has sent the entire world. Oh, let's not put that. No, I'm scared. No, sorry. I don't need to see what I was doing at 18 I know that's unfortunate no I love snap the most and I think that you know in January we joined Gary Vaynerchuk over here at VaynerX and I think that he's so great about charting audience and charting attention. And I think that right now Snapchat and attention is super interesting.

Like there's a lot of obviously spotlights on Insta as they iterate and take things that are very Snapchat looking. But I think, you know, it's his whole thing a lot of times is when everyone looks left, that's when you buy right. And honestly, we still have large audiences on Snap. So it's like, why would you stop? Just because everybody's talking about how great Instagram is. Like you don't abandon a demographic. If anyone wants to get a hold of me, like my audience, they go to Snapchat because it's like texting your audience. It's a lot easier to use than Instagram DM.

My Instagram DMs are all over the place. And right now the metrics, right? Like you're seeing exactly what people are seeing. So it's not at all like, you know, um, a little muted or muffled from like Insta. The most beautiful thing about it in the world is this. You can see what your audience is screenshotting. So what I like to do is literally build my brand by these screenshots. When I see that these girls are screenshotting probiotics, I know that I need to do a post for my readers on probiotics. You skyscraper it, baby. And I don't understand why anyone would move off the platform. Even if they have two followers, like you have those two people's attention,

you should still be creating content on there. Totally. But people get lazy. And so they just want to put all their eggs in one basket. Yeah. When sometimes it's good to kind of do both. Well, it's so funny. Like when you say what should influencers do to grow, it's that, right? It's hustle.

It's so much work, right? Like it's constantly finding content. Like my husband always jokes. He's like content, content, content. And, but like, who knows what will stick? Like this morning I took video of Charlie who's three wearing his like swim floaties and breakfast. And like the amount of girls in my office that were like, Charlie, oh my gosh, he kills me like you know you just you don't know what's gonna like make someone happy or delight them and um while Charlie's cute you know probably till what age four or five till I'm like a child model um I'll just keep using them and I'll just keep finding that content I want to talk about content creation now that we're speaking on content so

what does that look like on a day-to-day basis for PureWow? Sure. So we have editors in every single one of our beats. Everything from pop culture. We call our pop culture arm The Gist because it's supposed to be quick pop culture. And the tag is pop culture for smart girls. So we have kind of beats and desks for each vertical. So beauty has their own desk podcast. I mean, um, entertainment has their own desk books, wellness, food. Um, so it's kind of always

happening. And then the coolest thing now is the multidimensional ancillary content. So like we just see so much opportunity. Like if you're, if I'm here talking to you, maybe this should be a video and maybe this video should be sliced up and become its own Insta series. Or maybe we should swipe up for like, you know, the two of us would do like an interview separately on like how we start our day or,

you know, it's just kind of finding the, the arms and the, and the ways to really leverage, um, content and then different angles. Always looking always, because if you're going to do one thing, understanding the arms and the ways to really leverage content. Different angles, always looking for that. Always. Because if you're going to do one thing, if you're in the room,

if your brain is directed towards that idea. If you have mascara on and a good blowout. I mean, seriously. Let's do it. How critical is like, I don't know, maybe this is the wrong way to say it, but like the chopping block. Because if you guys have so much content and so many editors and writers, and then it comes through your desk, what. What is like, what gets stopped?

What gets, you know, what gets through? Sure. We, anything that's snarky. Like we don't, I don't want to be snarky. Like I don't want to, I don't want to pretend that we know more than the consumer. Like we don't. We're in it too. Like one of my favorite recent beauty tricks that we had is that called the smush and

pull for mascara and it's where you take your mascara wand and you smush your eyelashes all the way inside to the corner of your eye which looks and feels so weird it sounds very painful yep and then you feather them out and you get no clumps and like that's a really fun thing that we've discovered when someone's getting their makeup done. But like, I don't want to like the, we never deliver that to our audience. Like we know how to never get, you know, clumps on your mascara. Instead it's like, you guys, seriously, we just found the best trick for mascara or like you're talking to a friend over happy hour a thousand percent. And I think that's where media companies, I think there's two ways that you lose that voice and authority. One is by not having your own stable of people.

So, like, we don't have a big network of freelancers. Like, we have trained editors who know that voice, who know that, like, really value prop that we give to our audience. We've never had really luck with using. We have some amazing, we have, like, like some freelancers but it's more like a small stable and not like a huge network we're not like a place for people to like rent our space and rent our audience like we really are a space that like holds our audience dear and makes sure that like that we never lose their trust so we can really never deliver any content that doesn't really delight them and make them smile and make

them think that their day just got better. So it's anything that might be snarky doesn't get through my desk. Anything that doesn't have the like, oh my gosh, I didn't know that before. And that's subjective, right? Like I've been working in women's lifestyle for a while now. Like I've seen and read and written a lot of stuff. But the best is when we deliver it in a way that it's like, oh, my gosh, I didn't know that. And that's awesome. And holy smokes, they are going to go nuts. And then.

It's like you're sharing with a friend like an inside secret. A thousand percent. And then what we do now that's so fun that we've like built up the company this way is I jump up from my desk and I say like okay video we need to make this a video as well like hold the story until the video is ready and audience we need to make sure that like we put this front and center on Facebook and oh wait isn't one of the um influencers in the coterie which is our influencer network like Lauren like maybe she would actually want to you you know, be part of this. Maybe we could shoot her doing it. Like that's when it just is like organically like rises upon itself. When you're, when you find a good idea, you want to like shout it from the rooftops.

You guys did the nicest interview. I loved that interview. Yes. That was very, very nice. It was fun to talk to her on the phone. She interfaced me for I think like like I want to say like an hour oh my gosh yeah we have some really good really good people here like the thing that I think I'm most proud of after five whatever years here is that we've built this team we've built the audience like we reach hundreds of millions of women and that's amazing and you know it's we have new things coming out all the time. We have this like episodic series coming out wonderfully real. We just shot Gwyneth Paltrow for it. Like we have innovation coming on spades. We have good ideas coming on spades. That's not like unique to a content company. But what I think is unique is that we really like

each other and we, we hire people and Ryan and I still interview almost every single person who comes on staff that's amazing and like they're good people and like going back to passion like we hire people who we always say like what's your passion outside work like tell us what you do and then when someone's like oh I break dance competitively like that changes the game you're like okay tell me everything about that and also now you have to break dance for me. I love it. Yeah. I want to talk about your Gary V story. Give us all the details on that. Um, first I just love him. Don't you love him? I can't believe you are like one of his favorite people. I love him. He was, um, I think you were actually one of my first, like, he was like, you have to meet. So I had known Gary for a while.

Ryan had known him longer. And he, it's funny, I always say to people, like, if you're a follower, if you're one of the two million people that follow him on Insta, you might think that he's, like, crazy, which he is. Like, he does not sleep. Like, he is just the most energetic person. But what I think is the most unique about him is that it's not smoke and mirrors he is a practitioner of social like he is fully vested in

our lives through social and when you're that type of person it's not smoke and mirrors like you believe it you live it and like his ideas first of all his ideas are like you remember in the wizard of oz when it turns to technicolor like that's how gary thinks like you'll be in a meeting and everything's like black and white black and white black and white and get then gary will be like or what if we switch it turn it on its head and actually have them pay us to do that and and everyone's like, oh, yeah, that's the idea. Oh, my gosh, I didn't think about it that way. Like, he just sees things in, like, at max volume,

and all of us are, like, on mute. It's incredible. And I feel bad for the people who are, like, constantly getting ideas okayed by him because you'll bring him an idea, and he's just like, okay, here's 19 ways to make it a thousand percent better um thankfully still to date he likes my ideas but I'm sure that day is coming um so the reason why we joined Gary is a for that social prowess like he has brought Pure

Wow into a new realm in social like we are going so hard after Instagram right now. We're launching all these different verticals. So it kind of backs back to what we were talking about before. Like, you know, it was really hard for us to be lifestyle and try to be everything to everyone on Instagram. So now we're really building out these passion points for our women. Like we right now have the biggest bridal instagram account um pure weddings and we are like building out beauty for blank beauty and like we know that that our consumer wants to see that content grouped in like content and not as a kind of

hodgepodge plate um and like the way that he adds social into like editorial components that we are already doing or like temples that we look to do like it's just incredible so both his brain was attractive to joining him and then what he's built like he's quietly built this amazing agency here and they are some of the best in class in knowing how to find attention through social like they're kind of like the beginning of social marketing and it's incredible to have those people like kind of fighting for your content too now like fighting to make your content better and the two companies PureWow and Vayner and we've started this holding company called VaynerX now, but the two companies under VaynerX, PureWow and VaynerMedia, had that one thing in common that this keeps tying back to is just passion. Like, they hire really nice people at VaynerMedia. And so when we joined, it was like this really warm welcome.

Like, that's a tough moment, right? To bring two companies together like that. And it's amazing how hard they've worked to make us feel so welcome. I love it. Okay, so tell me some books and resources that you recommend. And while you do this, I'm going to Snapchat you. Oh my gosh.

Wait, okay, books. Or it could just, not even not even just books, but it could be anything that you use for like productivity or inspiration or something that you think to maybe that you give to people. It could be an acupressure mat like I use. That was one of my resources. I want to think, I want to give you like the craziest ones now. Okay. First for quality of content, I sometimes look outside my fields. Like I don't always want to listen to or watch or read women's lifestyle content. Cause I like, I know that like that's like running through my veins, but I love kind of tricking my brain and looking at content through different lenses. So

I'm wholeheartedly obsessed with the daily podcast from the New York times. Like, I think it's just the epitome of like excellence in audio. Like the host is Michael Barbaro and they call his followers Barbies because people are like obsessed with him. And I don't know if it's his voice. I don't know if it's like the music queuing. I don't know what it is, but he makes like the hardest news sound so good. So I start my day with that. I've gotten actually really into acupuncture recently and I've been going to, um, this woman, Shelly Goldstein here in New York. Um, and she does an

acupuncture facial, which is amazing. That's like Botox kind of too. Oh, she can sculpt your face. It's bonkers. She finds my jawline in like 20 minutes. I find my jawline from acupuncture too. Yeah. She's like totally changed my thoughts about this. Like it's awesome. You should go. I'll intro you guys. So I love her.

I love sticking my face with needles. I know. I know. Don't be such a baby. The pictures are kind of crazy. She also has this new mask that she does that's this um like french clay it's blue clay that hardens into like basically slime and you know i was saying before i have like a six and three year old i brought some of it home and they're like mommy what is this it's the most

fun i didn't tell them it was on my face like three hours before um where else do i find inspiration i am really overbooked and overcommitted so i i do this silly thing where i schedule time for myself and if it's not two minutes i don't think that's i do the same thing i think that's really smart what do you guys do i'll literally schedule time like in the middle of the day in the office, just like, like just 30 minutes for myself. Right. Do you walk outside or what do you do? A lot of time I'll be like outside or I'll go like if I need to like decompress.

It just, it doesn't. He has a game he plays. He likes to read. It depends what I, what I've got going on. But at the same thing, like I think if you don't make time for yourself and you're just doing things with other people all the time, it's like, it's hard to come to kind of like figure out your own thoughts and get in your own head and be like okay let me think this through and problem solve because you're constantly around other people which is great and it's stimulating in another way but if you don't take that time to

like reflect you can get i should probably do that so what do you do when you take time for yourself so i i i it changes either i go um there's this new massage place near my house that's like the least fancy massage place. It's one of those like that you're in between beds or like a cheap thin curtain. Like you can completely like it's it looks like a hooker house. But these women, they stand on the bed and like grind into your back. And I honestly feel like if I didn't do that, I would get sick. Like I don't get sick often. I would, I think I get so much more sick and be like, it just gives me like that moment of just like what goes through my head. It's like a brain dump. Like I, I think about, I think about work. I think about my kids. I kind

of think about like what I need to just do to get myself to the next massage, if that makes sense. Like, I'm like, okay, it's Sunday. Where am I going to be next Sunday? Like what has to happen this week to make it like a successful week? You are literally creating a compelling future by design for the week. Do you know you're doing that? Dying. You're, you're creating your future and you're figuring out systems on how to get there while you get a massage. And then you're doing it. That is honestly, it's genius what you're doing. It's so funny. Like, I think that we write like thousands of stories at PureWow. And yet when I, I don't know if I don't take my own advice or something, but like when someone's like, oh, you're doing that. I'm like, am I? You think? That's so crazy.

You should write about that on PureWow. What you just said I mean that's that's a huge tip I think um I got this amazing tip yesterday from this this I met Bobby Brown the makeup guru and she was telling me that she's in the same place like a lot of times she doesn't have the time to like look at her own house or like her house was kind of giving her like bad juju and she just was like I don't know what to do about it like I'm so miz like what do I like I don't have time to like make my living room better or whatever. And so she met with a life coach, which I've never met with, but I've got this guy's number and we should definitely talk about this next time. We'll see my journey. But his idea, which is I think excellent, is you take pictures of your life. And so she was taking pictures of her

living room and then print the pictures out that's the important part in our digital age like i would never do this but that's the important step so you print the picture out and then you look at your space it could be your desk could be your closet it could be your living room and you circle the areas that give you like anxiety odd job whatever that would be michael's shoes that are on my carpet. And the fake cough. It would just be a picture of me.

The fake cough. He does a fake cough every year. It would just be one picture of me. No, there's a fake cough. In all circles? Yeah.

No, just a circle around my entire body. The trash can that he doesn't take out. The shoes that are on my carpet that belong out. You know you guys

have to do the trash. We can't deal with the trash. I try to do it. Sometimes I forget but I try to do it. I literally do everything. I fold his underwear. I don't want her to do that. Like I have time to do that, right? I tell her not to do the trash we can't deal with the trash i try to do it sometimes i forget but i literally do everything i fold his underwear i don't want her to do like i have time to do that right i tell her not to do that but isn't it nicer that's folded it is wait what's your sign gemini oh it depends you see i don't know which lauren i'm talking to you know it could be there's there's about 40 yeah there's it's a different one each time you know so i'm a virgo okay and i'm

like a virgo true and true like i need my like i need my house in complete order like my poor nanny i'm like thank you so much for cleaning the kitchen she's like do you want to hear about the kids i'm like no no it's okay the kitchen's so clean i love you and she's like do you want to about their day and i'm like it doesn't matter i love the kitchen they're hanging upside down it's either like everything dumped in the closet all over the place or nothing completely clean but that's but that's me like everything dumped in the closet all over the place or nothing completely clean. But that's me through Monday through Friday.

It's the dump. And then Saturday and Sunday, I want nine hours of uninterpreted time to like play dress up in my closet. Yep. I love it. Anyway, so you're supposed to take this picture, circle the parts that give you Aajita. And the idea is even if you don't get to it that day or that month, you at least do what you just said.

Totally. It's so funny. Like you at least plot at least do what you just said. Totally. It's so funny. Like you at least plot the plan for what you're going to do. Or like, you're like, okay, that part of my desk or that part of my living room gives me like anxiety, but like, I know that there's a plan behind it. And so it starts giving you less anxiety. And I just thought that was so genius. I'm going to do that with your man cave. I can't stand the books on the floor. That's a great idea. The man cave was made so that I would have a man cave, a place to go. No, she's going to make it better now.

I know. I wanted to ask you, it's kind of a two-part question. You, at this point, manage a lot of people. And there's a lot of young people that, I don't want to say too young, but there's young people that listen to this show that are working with companies or looking to work with a company. One, what would you say your advice would be to managers managing big teams? And two, what would you tell people that are working with big teams within that team? Like, how do you, how do you stand out? How do you grow? How do you do a good job? And then other side, how do you do the other side, which is how do you like help that team grow? Totally. Okay. So I think there's two kind of tenants that I've always lived by.

And one is you can't manage everyone, like, which is tough. Like there are some people on staff that are like my girls, like we've like been together for so many years and I have like real opinions on their career and I have real kind of ideas for how they can grow, but I physically don't have the time to manage everyone. So I try to limit myself to five direct reports. Because think like we try to do one-on-ones like more than five, like where's your date? Where's the time to, you know, put out all the fires that happen during the day and plan for growth. I mean, that just, there is no time. So five tends to be a manageable number. I'm a little bit over it right now.

When you say five, do you mean five people? Five people, and they have teams behind them. Got it. You have to instill that kind of middle management layer. We have several layers at this point. Because how many people are here, even just at Vayner, like over? Oh, VaynerX is, I don't know, 800? I don't know the full numbers.

PureWow is about 100. Still 100 people. Yeah, and then content creators are probably like 60% of that. But then being an executive, you obviously touch and are brought into different departments even if you don't oversee them. So I only have five direct reports but again more than that right now but either or I try to get five um and then you have to teach them to be managers and like it isn't it the truest thing that like some people just aren't managers like I have some

people on staff who would rather do anything else than sit in a room and have a one-on-one with somebody like that's just not their jam Lauren's pointing at herself because you're like the creative i'd rather stab my eyeballs out and like i don't know no but i get but that's okay though yes you're the manager yeah of course yeah of course but like i think that's okay so like my number two um our vp content is amazing like it would be a waste of time to have her kind of like fumble through she manages people because we have so many people and like sorry jill you got to manage but like she is a content genius and she can whip anyone's story into like absolute gold so she better to like talk to somebody about like their time off approvals or she better to like be making really

good content like I think we know the answer yeah so it's like write that down exactly write that down but I think it's but at the same time like you said she can't just completely check out and not pay attention to her team or a startup of course we're a startup like even though we're seven years old like we're a startup like we don't have institutional like management and like I don't think well no matter how big we get we'll probably never get to that point um so yeah sorry you've got to manage some people but like it's it's it's knowing where people's strengths are then the opposite side

I have this woman who is like a baller manager and like takes like such care and time with people and like really can then tell me the issue and like really succinct terms. So like, it's just knowing where people's like, are you EQ? Are you more like operation, like figuring out? Gary V taught me that with your employees, how important it is to tune into what they need and what, what they want. So would you say the first part of that then is that as if you want to be a manager, you kind of have to be self-aware enough to say, Hey, this is what I, this is what my strengths are. This is what I can do. And I like connecting with people. Self-awareness on both sides, right? Like manager or not, like I can't believe how,

I think that's the number one thing. If you're not succeeding in your career, I think it's because you're not self-aware because you're not reading the cues. There are definitely signs on the wall that are telling you which way to go. And if you're not reading those, if you're not picking up from your teammates what they need, and then the same to answer your question, like what your manager needs. So like managing up is so important. Like even if it's people like you don't see all the time, just being like, hey, this is what I'm working on. And I just wanted you to have insight into my day. And I don't need anything back from you being like clear, like, all I want you to do on this is to read this. Like, we also adopted this super ridiculous, but like amazing thing. It's military terms,

BLUF. Do you guys know this? Bluff. So you put at the top of your email, it's bottom line up front. And you just say like, bottom line up front, we're in a good place with launching our influencer network, The Coterie. We have 100 amazing women on board and we're X, Y, and Zing. Like that could be a bottom, a bluff. And then the email itself would have like, okay, so the 100 women are this, this, this, and this. They do this.

We're super excited about these recruits. Like it's, that can be like the meat of it, but like giving the person who's super, super duper busy, like myself, something very tangible, very quick is so important. Just to like, let them stand out and remind them what's going on, what they, what they need to know. Like don't hide back in the shadows. Of course. And just manage up like we are constantly giving people opportunity here and we're constantly not micromanaging. So the people who do well, and I would think this would be in other areas and business and other like fields and other companies and whatnot. But if you're, if you're given lots of opportunity and you don't have a micromanager, then it's up to you to tell your team what you're

doing. I like it. I want to know how someone can be more self-aware. Do you have any tips? Because some people just aren't self-aware. I think people, I don't, you know, I'm not a doctor, but like I would wager. That's the million dollar question. Yeah, that is the million dollar question. I don't know. What do you guys think think like i would wager from my humble experience it's people who go to the same people for either um like reaffirming their life or like their problems right like if you go to the same three people with your problems you're probably gonna get like some sort of the same answer that's a great answer right so like i think it's people who don't go out of their comfort zone and somebody be like, oh my gosh, but you do that. Like,

isn't that strange that you always leave every meeting or you stand up in every meeting or you like start the day with a random cough? Like maybe someone doesn't like that. I think my, I think to touch on that and kind of build on what you just said, I think that's really good advice. But I also think that it's the people that, you know, if something's not going the way they want it to be going in their life and it continues to happen and they're continuing to look for external things. That's the time when you got to kind of look inward and say, wait a minute, maybe something I'm doing is not working. And then you got to audit what those things are. I mean, right. Like this, people who are not self-aware are constantly in the same predicament.

I don't know if it's like they should journal, they should look back at their Instagram. I don't know what they should do to find the trends, but like I would somewhat. You said something yesterday. Say what you were telling me about who you should hang out with. No, there was somebody I was listening to

and I like what they said. They said, I can't remember who it was, but it was, and it's been sticking with me. It's like, you want to hang out with three different kinds of people in your life. You want to hang out with people that are below you, not below you in terms of like you're better than them, but like maybe they're not as far along in their career. Like they need a mentor. Mentor them because one, it'll make you feel good to help them. And two, it'll make you kind of, in a narcissistic way, make you feel better about yourself because I'm further along the path. And then you want to hang out with people that are on the same level, like equal to

your career, equal in relation, whatever it is, because those people become your peers and your friends and you kind of like grow with them and bounce. And then you want to have people that are much further ahead of you because those are the people that you can, that can teach you and that you can look up to and have a, you know, like a set point for a goal and i think this is good i think the people that have the most success kind of do a variation then i think a lot of the time the people that don't it's maybe they're only doing one of those things where it's like they're with the same peers or they're only look hanging out people below them or they're only looking at people above them and

you can do this with podcasts by the way too you, like you can listen to a podcast that's super gossipy and you know, it's like just like a boozy brunch. And then you could also listen to a podcast that maybe you feel like you could have a conversation with the person. And then you listen to something that's like really highly intelligent. You mix it up. I do it with books too. I love that. Some people get overwhelmed when you like, like let's take someone like Gary. Like if you're a young guy like me, you're 30 years old and you're looking at someone like Gary and you're,

and if you're only looking at him and comparing yourself to that, you might feel bad about yourself. But you've got to kind of also look at, you know, where you are and then look at where you, where you used to be. And it kind of puts in perspective, like,

okay, I got 10, 20 years to get there. I have a really good set point here with the people I'm hanging out with. And then I can also help hanging out with. And then I can also help people below me. And so it kind of gives you a well-rounded picture of everything that is going on in your life. Whereas if you're just looking at one of those three types of people, you get in trouble. I love that. I love thinking about like buckets of people that support you,

because also like if you're not getting what you need from one bucket, like go get something from somebody else, like get fulfilled from something else. I love that so, so, so much. And I'm trying to think of like, which one of my buckets isn't really filled with things right now. I'm sure you're good. You seem like you're good. I need to go find like an old mentor. Before we go, I want you to give your number one tip for aspiring businesswomen. My number one tip for aspiring businesswomen.

Or men. Or men. Don't forget about us. I know. Okay, sorry. Men too. I know women are taking over the world. Yeah, we are.

But don't forget about us. Watch out. Okay. So I think one thing that worked well in my favor was always the follow-up. Like my dad taught me like the benefits of a handwritten note early in my life. Like, we, for every single thing in our life, we had to write someone a note. And a lot of my success has been due to the fact that I forged relationships with people after the fact. So it was never like, oh, I just needed you for this. And then nothing

happened afterwards. It was, I needed you for this. We have a relationship now. And oh, hey, I just read an article that you might like. And here it is. Hope you're doing well. Or oh, hey, I saw on LinkedIn that you moved places. Like congrats. I hope that move went well. Or hey, saw on Facebook that you had a kid. Here's some flowers or a pure wild onesie. Like, and it's not with any, it's not like a give with any ask attached to it. It's just like business can be humanized. And I think that when you do that, A, it's more fun because if you work around the clock, then you're at least doing it with friends and people that you really like. But B, that's the difference between like doing it and people like supporting you, right? Like if you have a network, that's like that's the legitimate networking.

Like people go to networking events and it's so formalized and it's so austere. And like they're handing you, right? And it's like I started this breakfast series called No Agenda where I get a bunch of women together and we just have breakfast and they're like from all different fields. I love that. And you're not allowed to bring like any kind of, like we might do a work ask like, oh, you guys, like I'm having a staffing issue or something like that.

But usually we just talk about like where we are, like what we're looking forward to and stuff like that. And the fact that it's people across different fields is what makes it so fun. And that is just like, that's networking, right? Like people think you have to go to these like fancy formal things. But like, if you meet someone in a meeting, following up with them with a handwritten note or, I mean, no one does that anymore, but like some kind of, some kind of sentiment that's legit is gold. That is great. It's, but that's the same thing as like in your DMs. Great advice. Answer all, like who knows who will be like, you think, oh, they're just the assistant or whatever now. Like who knows

they could be running whatever next. And when they need someone who's exactly your jam, who are they going to think of? I love it. Thank you so much for coming on. Where can everyone find you, follow you guys, give us everything. Yes.

So PureWow is wherever you are. We are on Insta, Snap, Facebook, PureWow.com. I'm MKMcGrath212 on Insta, where you can find the most adorable pictures of Charlie and Jackson. Jackson is going to be a sand trooper for Halloween, which is a real thing. I didn't really know. Tuscan Raider sand trooper.

Oh, God, Michael. Ridiculous. Don't get me started on that. And Charlie is going to be, I don't know, it's like a cat in a, I don't know, it's some Disney character. Those are different. Super different.

But Disney owns all of it now. Disney owns everything. It's amazing. Like I just write them a check every day at Amazon. You guys, I love you. This was so fun. Thank you. We love you.

Thank you so much for coming on. My pleasure. Okay, let's do a fun giveaway, shall we? Last week I picked a winner, but let's start new here. So this week, all you have to do is leave your number one beauty tip on my latest Instagram post to win five very TSC beauty products. And of course, make sure you're subscribed to the podcast to win. It's super simple. I'll also include a TSC pop socket. They're so cute and pink and fun and flirty. So go ahead and leave your favorite beauty trick on my latest

Instagram to win this week. And if you guys want my five favorite beauty tips straight to your inbox, all you have to do is review the podcast on iTunes and screenshot your review and email it to asklauren at theskinnyconfidential.com. That's asklauren, Lauren with a Y, at theskinnyconfidential.com. Thank you guys always for the support. Tell your friends, your family about the show so we can continue to grow the skinny confidential community. We love you guys and see you next week. This episode was brought to you by Fab Fit Fun. Their winter box is available now and it's filled with so many of my favorite brands like Tarte Cosmetics,

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