The Skinny Confidential Him & Her Podcast - Chelsea Clinton On Growing Up In The White House, Thick Skin, & Carving Your Own Path Forward

Episode Date: April 10, 2023

#559: On today's episode we are joined by Chelsea Clinton. Chelsea is a #1 New York Times bestselling author, advocate and public healthexpert. Chelsea holds a Bachelor of Arts from Stanford, a Master of Public Health fromColumbia's Mailman School of Public Health, and both a Master of Philosophy and a Doctorate in international relations from Oxford University. She joins the show to discuss what it was like at a young age to move into the white house and have her father as President Of The United States, we then discuss how she was able to carve her own path and create her own identity.   To connect with Chelsea Clinton click HERE To connect with Lauryn Evarts click HERE To connect with Michael Bosstick click HERE Read More on The Skinny Confidential HERE To subscribe to our YouTube Channel click HERE For Detailed Show Notes visit TSCPODCAST.COM To Call the Him & Her Hotline call: 1-833-SKINNYS (754-6697) This episode is brought to you by The Skinny Confidential. The Skinny Confidential is 2 years old! Use code PINKBASH on April 7th to celebrate our Two Year Bash Sale.   This episode is brought to you by Ritual Ritual knows it’s basically impossible to get all the nutrients you need from your diet 100% of the time, so they made a multivitamin that helps you focus on what’s important. Like filling key nutrient gaps to support foundational health. Go to ritual.com/skinny to receive 10% off your first 3 months. This episode is brought to you by Zoc Doc Zocdoc is the only FREE app that lets you find AND book doctors who are patient-reviewed, take your insurance, are available when you need them and treat almost every condition under the sun. Go to zocdoc.com/skinny to download the app & book with a top-rated doctor today. This episode is brought to you by Squarespace From websites and online stores to marketing tools and analytics, Squarespace is the all-in-one platform to build a beautiful online presence and run your business. Go to squarespace.com/skinny for a free trial & use code SKINNY for 10% off your first purchase of a website domain. This episode is brought to you by Sundays for Dogs Sundays is air-dried dog food made from a short list of human-grade ingredients. Unlike other fresh dog food brands, Sundays is zero prep, zero mess, and zero stress. Get 35% off your first order by going to SundaysForDogs.com/SKINNY or use code SKINNY at checkout. This episode is brought to you by Living Proof Living Proof understands that there’s no ‘one-size-fits-all’ solution for all hair types and textures. Visit livingproof.com/skinny and use code SKINNY for a free travel sized dry shampoo with a purchase of $45 or more Produced by Dear Media

The following podcast is a Dear Media production. and you can shop the entire site, get everything, get gifts. This excludes kits and gift cards, but shop the rest of the site with code PINKBASH. are bringing you along for the ride. Get ready for some major realness. Welcome to the skinny confidential, him and her. It is really important for all of us to really know who our friends are, who will be there to help us celebrate our wins and to help us mourn our losses, but also pick ourselves up and go forward. Because I think there are a lot of people in life who are there in the good times, but not in the bad times. A lot of people in life were there in the bad times, but not in the good times. And you want, or at least I want for myself, for my kids to have friendships that are about us as whole people that can

support us when we need it and celebrate us when we've earned it, are there throughout every experience that life brings. Hello, everybody. Welcome back to the Skinny Confidential Him and Her Show. That clip was from our guest of the show today, Chelsea Clinton. Chelsea Clinton's on the show. If I had told you in high school when we were going to high school together that you would be interviewing Chelsea Clinton, you would have laughed. I would have said for sure that makes sense. Absolutely. She, I do want to say, was absolutely lovely. She came in so cool, calm, collected, didn't have a big to-do around her.

She didn't even have secret service. And she was very down to earth. I think when I said this on the show to Chelsea, when we were interviewing her, people will read a title and see Chelsea Clinton on the show. And for how politicized and polarizing this country is now, and for how divided we all are, everyone's going to make instant assumptions right away, just based on the person. What Lauren and I try to do, what we continue to do is have all walks of life on this show to share a different perspective. What we found personally fascinating, which I think anyone would find fascinating is, what is it like to be a young girl and have your father become the president of the United States

and move into the White House when you're a young child and have that kind of attention? That is the experience that Chelsea Clinton had and since many other wild experiences as well. So this episode isn't about politics. I know that that's a wild concept to have someone who is in politics or has been in politics and not actually go deep in politics. It's a new thing. Sorry for those of you that were hoping we were going that way. We're not going anyway. We're just having a conversation. With that, Chelsea Clinton is a number one New York Times bestselling author, advocate, mother, wife, and she also has a foundation. She's the vice chair of the Clinton Foundation. In addition to her foundation work, Chelsea teaches at Columbia University. She's an author of multiple children's books. Chelsea Clinton,

welcome to the Skinny Confidential Him and Her Show. This is the Skinny Confidential Him and Her. It's funny you do this show and you meet all sorts of different walks of life. And I was just thinking as you were telling this story about, you know, unfortunately seeing someone get hit by a car and then Chelsea Clinton picks up the phone and calls 911 and the person on the other end is like on the line with Chelsea Clinton. That must be a trip not only for them, but for you, right? No, I just was grateful that someone answered so quickly and it was such an affirmative moment for our city. They're like, 911, New York City dispatch, how can I help you? And truly within minutes, like the fire department was there and then an ambulance was there and the police were there and the police called me later

to take a statement. And I just felt like, oh gosh, our city really worked today. And more profoundly, just how many people stopped when we saw this happen. And the driver stopped too. And everyone was like, oh my gosh, what's happening? How do we help this person who's just gotten hurt? Like, oh wait, like looking at me, like you're already on the phone with 911. Like, well, does he need water? What can we do? I mean, we are a real community in New York. And I think so often if you live outside New York City and you just watch the way we're depicted, like even in the superhero movies, it's often like quite dystopian and dark and nobody even looks up and looks anyone in the eye much less asks, how are you or can I help

with anything big like being hit by a car, unfortunately, or small like help hold a door for you or give you a seat on the subway. We're a real community here. It seems like you rally. You're selling me on New York City. I've been trying to sell her on New York for years. Let me know how I can help.

I think you're helping. Keep it going. I love New York. I've now been lucky enough to run the New York City Mar I've been trying to sell her on New York for years. So let me know how I can help. I think you're helping. Keep it going. I love New York. And now I've been lucky enough to run the New York City Marathon a couple of times and running through the city and just seeing all of the different neighborhoods and the different neighborhood pride and the energy, which is so out in force on Marathon Day, isn't just created on that day. It's maybe super amplified on that day. but that's who we are. We are a city of more than 8 million people and also a city of hundreds of different neighborhoods, but really also a very real community. I think that's cool. Michael, take note, put it in your notes app to convince me later. I'm working on it. So what we like to do on this

show is we both believe that our childhoods really kind of like shape a lot of who we are as adults. And I would argue that you have one of the more unique childhoods. How old were you when your father became president and you actually moved into the White House? And what was that experience like? I think it's so novel to so many people that obviously have not had that experience. I was 12. I was 11 when my father announced his candidacy. Way back in the 90s, people ran for president over a year, maybe a little bit more. Now people seem to run for president over years or just perpetually for some people. You never know. It's a mixed bag. Way back in the 90s, I was 11 when my dad announced in October of 1991. And then the election, it was in November

of the next year, 92. I was 12 when he won. And then I was 12 when we moved into the White House. And I give my parents so much credit. I mean, Michael, you're kind of asking the question around trying to ensure that it was as normal as possible while also helping me be aware of like how extraordinary a privilege and responsibility it was, you know, to live in the White House. A few of my friends came with me, thankfully, and were there during the inauguration. And they're the first few nights that I was kind of sleeping in this new room, in this new home that also happened to be the White House and i think thankfully kind of that that sensibility my parents gave me of like this is your home like you also need to be respectful

because like we are living in the white house also it is your home really helped me feel like i could i could bring my friends over i mean we weren't gonna be wild and crazy we were gonna be respectful but it also was my home they could come over for sleepovers or to watch movies or do our homework or study for exams. And so it very much was ordinary and also extraordinary. Before you moved into the White House, was your childhood fairly normal? My dad was governor of Arkansas. And so certainly in Arkansas, people knew who my parents were. And when we would go out to dinner or we'd go to church, be it my softball or soccer games or at a ballet recital,

people would come up to my parents and share what they were thinking about what was happening in the state, offer suggestions, feedback across the whole range of positive to negative or nasty. When we left Arkansas, though, when we would go on family trips to see my grandparents when I was little who lived in Chicago, my mom's parents, or when we would take road trips elsewhere in the South, or when my dad would go to governor's meetings and we'd then take a few days for a family vacation, say in the Mountain West, no one knew who we were. So if we were in Arkansas, everyone knew who we were. But if we weren't in Arkansas, no one knew who we were. And that dynamic, of course, changed. And did you like being an only child? I was going to ask you that off air because we were talking about how your husband has 11 siblings or 10. He has 10 siblings. He's one of 11. Got it. So did you like being an

only child I really wanted a sibling I first really wanted an older brother or an older sister I think partly if I'm being totally honest because I read the Sweet Valley Twins books as a child and I love those books and Elizabeth and Jessica have an older brother and I was like well I want one of those that seems kind of great and then I realized Jessica have an older brother. And I was like, well, I want one of those. That seems kind of great. And then I realized that having an older brother and older sister was probably not in the card. So then I really wanted a younger sibling. And my parents have spoken about this openly.

They tried to have more children and were not able to have more children. And so I think at some point, I didn't understand the biology of that, but I got the sense that it was hard when I would ask for my mom to have to keep having the same conversation with me. And so at some point I just thought, you know what? Like, I love my parents, I'm close to my parents.

I have great friends. Like this is more than okay. You do get all the attention. I got all of the attention. I mean, I will say it is- Although not any longer. Now You do get all the attention. I got all of the attention. I mean, I will say it is. Although not any longer. Now my kids get all the attention. Now your kids get all the attention.

Once you have kids, the grandparents, they don't care about what happens to you anymore. No, no, no. I have this vivid memory of like a couple weeks after my first child, our daughter Charlotte was born. I remember I'd like hung up the phone. I talked to my mom and I'm very close to my mom, but I realized like she hadn't asked a single question about me. And they're also like when babies are

two weeks old, you know, your parents, like there's not much to say about them. Right. There's just like, but we had talked for like, you know, 15 minutes about this is like beautiful, precious, but still kind of like blob of a person. And she hadn't once been like, so how are you? Like, what what's are you reading anything or listening to anything while you're breastfeeding or like what what's going on nothing it was all just about it so what more can you tell me about her I'm like well she's gained a little weight in some ways I like it because I'm like I got these these two off my back a bit but in the other ways I'm like hey I'm still I'm still here like you know it's not just about them like hello

yeah your parents just pushed you to the gutter. Listen, I might as well be a piece of paper on the wall. They can't even see me anymore. You really fell down the leaderboard. I might be ahead of you. She's for sure ahead of me. My dad calls like, hey, how's the kids? Oh, Lauren's my favorite.

Okay, got to go. I'm like, all right, dad. I was thinking about our upbringing, my upbringing, and the supervision that existed there. And as you become a teenager, obviously there's parental supervision. But for you, is there like a whole other level now where there's other people watching and everything you're doing is being scrutinized not only from the people in that circle, but also the public? I imagine that's somewhat challenging for a young kid to navigate because

you have the world watching your behavior. I think in some ways, Michael, I was really fortunate to have grown up as the daughter of the governor of Arkansas because I grew up thinking, not even thinking, just being aware in a really deep cellular level. People are always watching me and not in a sense to be paranoid, just an awareness. And, you know, I have memories of being a kid and people commenting on, you know, what I was wearing or what I looked like. And remember thinking like, that's so weird. Like, why are you commenting on like what a six or seven year old is doing? I think, though, that that really did prepare me for just the huge

onslaught of attention and scrutiny when I was living in the White House. When I first was listening to your question, I thought you were going to ask about the Secret Service. Well, I was kind of like alluding to a little bit of that. And it was an odd dynamic in some ways to always have people around. But of course, if I were in a friend's home, they weren't in the home with me. Or if we were in the White House, they weren't on the same floor as we were studying or talking about boys or whatever we were doing. So it's not like they're watching right there and they're watching you go in the bathroom. It's not that. No. And many of

the agents that I was really privileged to grow up around, your parents themselves, were kind of deeply, not just, I think, sympathetic, but empathetic to kind of this dynamic. And I always understood that they had a job to do. And I never ran away from them. I lost them once inadvertently. I was in a friend's car and we went through a light and they didn't make it through the light. And we pulled over even just like that brief period of time. I was like, oh no, I'm so sorry.

I was like, should I get out? Like walk back. And my friend was like, we're in the middle of traffic. No, like that's definitely not the same choice. Because that's someone's job on the line, right? Well, also just like I've, it was not purpose. Yeah, it was their job on the line. It was before I had a cell phone.

I didn't get a cell phone until I was, gosh, I think 20. So I couldn't even like call anyone to be like, I'm so sorry. I promise I'm still here. Pager. Was there a pager? A pager. My friends had pagers. Yeah, we had pagers.

You had pagers? I didn't have a pager. Back when you had to get a pager and then you would have to get on the pay phone. Oh my gosh, yes. Not to date ourselves too much. No, no, no. But I remember thinking my friends who had pagers were like the coolest. And there was a payphone outside our school, our high school.

And I remember after school when everybody's pagers were going off, the line outside the payphone to call back whomever had paged them to make plans. And I was like, I'm just not the school. In some ways, I kind of miss those days. In high school, what is that like to go to school are you amongst like a bunch of different celebrities politicians kids so it's not weird or was it is is people like coming up to you and giving you their opinion I went to a public school in Little Rock I went to maybe the strangest school experience I actually had was in kindergarten where I went to I think there was only only one, maybe there were two, but I think there was one kindergarten class in a

high school because the school district had grown so much that they were like finding just spaces and places for particularly like the youngest kids in the district. And I remember thinking how strange it was to be like this very little kid with like all these very big people in high school. But when we moved to DC, I went to a wonderful school called Sidwell Friends, which is a private Quaker school. And I think, Laura, the honest answer is like the first week there was lots of curiosity. But after that, in the best sense, most kids are focused on their own lives. And so people got back to their kind of regularly scheduled programming, as it were. You know, it's interesting when you tell me that people were commenting on the way you look or what you're

wearing when you're so young, because now that's what this generation is getting through social media, right? They can post a picture and they get all these opinions, whether you're a celebrity or in high school. Well, Lauren, I think like, you know, kids these days in many ways, their experience is far more like my experience as a kid than like my peers experiences were when we were kids. And I think that is because, you know, for so many young people who are on social media, they're all effectively celebrities, right, to one another. And they're connected to not only the people they go to school with, but like their friends, friends, friends, friends, friends. And so maybe it's not the hundreds of millions of people who at some time were aware of me or watching me or had opinions on me as a kid, but it's the thousands of people that feel just as weighty, maybe even more weighty than all the people who were watching me as a child because they can see the real-time comments. So I was aware that other people had lots of opinions

about my family or even me as a kid, even though I don't think adults really should have opinions on kids, but they did. But I didn't have to see them or hear them except when someone would come up to me. And I think what's different now for kids, for adolescents is unless they put their phone down, they're seeing all of these. Often people, they're only remotely like seven degrees separated from pontificating about what they did or espousing kind of why they think they made a mistake or putting them down or even giving them a compliment is still just an odd, I think, psychological dynamic for kids if it's not like your friend or your parent or your teacher, your coach. That's kind of what I was saying is there's a lot of parallels between what you went

through and what kids are going through now, obviously your experience was way bigger. But if you had to give advice to someone who's listening, who maybe has a following on social media and is getting a lot of negative comments and positive comments, what would that advice be? Say even your child came to you and said, I'm getting feedback. What is your advice? I think that it is really important for all of us, whatever age, particularly for kids and adolescents to really know who our friends are, like who will be there to help us celebrate our wins and to help us mourn our losses, but also pick ourselves up and go forward. Because I think there are a lot of people in life who are there in the good times, but not in I think there are a lot of people in life who are there in the good times,

but not in the bad times. A lot of people in life were there in the bad times, but not in the good times. And you want, or at least I want for myself, for my kids to have friendships that are about us as whole people that can support us when we need it and celebrate us when we've earned it

and are there kind of throughout kind of every experience that life brings. And I think what is hard with social media is like everything is so kind of Polaroid moment, right? It's like just a snapshot of life. And I think it's hard to build relationships over Snapchats or Snapchats or kind of these bite-sized moments. And so I would just urge young people to spend more time with the people they hope to be their friends and then nurturing those friendships over time. Because for me, certainly, it's always been my friends who've helped keep me grounded

when I needed it, like giving, give me hugs when I've needed them and celebrated me when something great has happened. You mentioned off air about you don't want to live in a bubble. Can you elaborate on what you meant? Yeah, I don't, I don't want to live in a bubble. I want to live in this amazing city that I'm lucky enough to call home. I want to really kind of be in places when I'm lucky enough to visit them. I run outside. I run in new neighborhoods. I run at different times of the day because I love seeing the different rhythms of the city. I ride on the subway. I was about to say I walk my dog outside, our dog just passed away so it has been a terrible I'm so sorry thank you and I just and I keep forgetting like it almost just rolled off my

tongue I'm like and I walk my dog in different places in the city like I would take sometimes my dog on the subway so we could go for like a walk in a different part of the city together and I don't want to live in a hermetically sealed bubble when I could live in New York City. How great is it that I get to live here? For me, I thought that you would have come here with Secret Service. And Michael's going to make fun of me. I'm asking a question. I'll make myself look stupid. It's okay. Your spouse is supposed to make fun of you. Yeah, I'll look stupid here. I didn't know. It sounds like the Secret Service stops when you're out of the White House.

Is that right? So it is different. You probably can't stop for your parents, right? So it's different based on who you're asking the question about. Got it. My parents and all former presidents and first ladies, or hopefully at some point presidents and first gentlemen, will have Secret Service forever. Forever.

Forever, for their lives. And I so strongly support that. I think it would be a national tragedy if anything were to have happened to anyone who had served as president, even people that I vehemently disagree with. I think it is important that we provide protection to our former presidents and their spouses. Often their spouses have similarly served, not always, but often similarly served and certainly have been quite visible. And then we just have to be honest about kind of what that visibility and that service often leads to. I was about to say invites, but there's service that invites something that leads to. Especially if you have signed up for that for your life and your family. It's basically a

contract to say for the rest of my life, I'm going to be a very known public person with scrutiny and attention and not just in this country, but other countries. I think people need to acknowledge that these people are, whether you agree, disagree, whatever side, they're sacrificing a significant part of their life. Yes, for obviously a very prominent office, but also their life is forever altered, as you know. If you are looking for a multivitamin, I have you covered. I have been taking the most incredible multivitamin for the last three years, and that is Ritual Vitamin. They have this specific one. It's the Essential for Women 18+. It is the best women's vitamin. First of all, every single thing in it is traceable. So you can go on their site and see where every single ingredient comes from.

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I think this is still true, but the last time I looked at the data, thankfully overwhelmingly Americans of both parties across the country, you strongly support that this is, you know, the right thing to do to continue to, you know, support and provide Secret Service protection, former presidents and their spouses. You know, for children, it is somewhat situational. So for younger children, when their fathers have left the White House, Secret Service protection sometimes has continued for longer duration. For much older children, it generally ends as soon as the next president is inaugurated. For me, I had Secret Service through just past my graduation from Stanford, because I was so associated with Stanford and so well-known and I had had, you know,

a number of different characters show up at different times to Stanford campus looking for me. And so that kind of led the Secret Service and thankfully something that President Bush supported to extend my Secret Service, which I very much have always had this view of like, whatever the Secret Service thinks, like they're the experts. Like it is not for me to candidly

really have an opinion here. It's for me to listen to them when they tell me or tell our family kind of what they're concerned about or hopefully what they're not concerned about. When you say characters, do you mean people stalking you, like trying to date you, people coming to give their opinion, people dangerous? Oh gosh, all sorts of things, like people showing up to give me things, people showing up to

share their opinions, people, White Plaza is kind of the big central area of Stanford. I remember there was this one gentleman who would truly come with like an old-fashioned crate, like soapbox, and like stand on it and, and you know shout all sorts of things at me and so just different different characters do you just ignore it generally yeah that's what I would just I would just act like it's not there generally the the people that you know are nice and want to share even their opinions but often stories about a time they met one of my parents or how the Family Medical Leave Act changed their lives or my father leading NATO's effort to help protect Kosovar Albanians, saved their family and enabled them to immigrate to the United States,

or how my mom's work on protecting and elevating women's voices around the world inspired them to become a playwright in Japan. All sorts of stories have been shared with me over the course of my life. And those I always want to hear and want to listen to. But when people are just wanting to talk to me because they want to say something mean or nasty or when people say actually quite horrific things, I try to have a spidey sense, as my husband would call it, to hopefully avoid those conversations in the first place if possible or to just extract myself as quickly as I can. You almost have to dissociate from it and just act like it's not in your ether. Or when people say things to me like, oh, don't you in your ether yeah or when people you know say things to

me like oh like don't you wish your mother would have aborted you and i'm like no i don't oh my god or like you know are people say that to your face sure or like you should have died in benghazi i'm like actually the tragedy is that anyone died in benghazi or you know i hope that your children die so that like your family's evil like isn't perpetuated. I'm like, I'm so sorry. I hope my children all live to be a hundred and have healthy, like healthy, happy, thriving lives. It's like, what do you say when people say things to you like that? You're like, oh, I'm, I'm so sorry you have that much like pain and anger inside you, but I'm not going to dwell in that. And if you're standing right in front of me, I can't quite ignore you. So I'm just

going to actually share what I authentically feel, which is like, I don't agree with that. And like, have a nice day. It's, it is projection. Oh, completely. Yeah. And I think this actually goes back in some ways to the earlier conversation in that I actually think as, as perverse and absurd and even bonkers as it sounds, that I was lucky as a kid to have to navigate this stuff. Because as a kid, it was thankfully easy for me to think like, why are these adults saying these like wackadoodle things to me as a kid? Like, this is just so wacky. Like, why do you think you can have an opinion on like my hairstyle? Because to your point, that didn't happen to,

like to, I guess, civilians. That does not happen. Like I don't remember any of my parents' friends or any parental strangers. Some of them might've thought it, Michael. Yeah, I mean, listen, who knows? But we didn't deal with that level of scrutiny or criticism as a child.

And also without the context of like, I mean, I'm sure you were aware of some of the things going on, but you're sitting there as a child being like, what is all this? Yeah, no. And then, and when my dad ran and then after he was inaugurated, Rush Limbaugh and others, but notably Rush Limbaugh, and I think this is now somewhat well-known, was quite vicious to me. Said terrible things about my parents and called me the White House dog repeatedly. And how old were you at this point?

I was 12, 13. And I remember thinking like, this is just so at best odd and at worst just wrong. Like, why is this old man like obsessed with me? Like, this is so weird and creepy. And do you have your, I guess like you go to your parents

for this and like are they giving you the context and like trying to explain like i mean my my parents were just like furious and wanted to protect me sure i think thankfully my friends like had no idea who rush limbaugh was so i had to try to explain who he was 13 year old girls and then thankfully like there was no there was no dissonance in opinion everyone was like that's weird yeah that's just so weird it doesn't play on any political spectrum no right you're like that's just weird when you're making friends at any age and you're you do you feel like you have a guard up and you're able to open up easy or do you feel like you have a guard up or are you able to open up easy and what is that like like you mentioned a spidey sense do you have that about friends I do you know I of course haven't always been right there's you know

I think for me like for any of us there are a couple of people I've trusted that I certainly wish that I hadn't. But overall, thankfully, I have very good friends from every phase of life. And I don't want to live behind walls. And I have truly friends from the parents of my kids' friends who are now good friends that I've only met in the last few years to my oldest friend in the world whose mother was with my mother in Lamaze class. Wow. And she's six weeks older than I am. We've been friends, you know, my entire life. And so I think like, I don't, I don't want to live behind walls. I don't open myself up to everyone I meet because who does? Even last night, I was at a reception for my son's three-year-old class and one of the moms is

quite pregnant and has been told that she might have to have a C-section and she didn't have a C-section with her first. She was like, I don't know anyone inside a C-section. I was like, I had a C-section. What do you want to know? Truly, I'm like, what do you want to know? Like, there shouldn't be like stigma or shadows around something as fundamental as like bringing a child into the world and whatever that kind of health way to do that is. Like, we don't know each other that well, but like our kids really like each other. Like we have this like circle of trust and community because we've now been in the same preschool class for the last couple of years. I'm like, what? I truly, I like, she's like, really? I was like, yeah. What do you want to know?

I have a question in a different realm. When you have parents that are this accomplished in life and you're the child and you're looking at that as an example, I think for many children that have accomplished parents, it can be extremely overwhelming. You're overwhelming. You yourself have done so many different things. You know, you've gone to great schools, you're an author, you've been part of charities. Like how do you find the drive and how did you think about kind of stepping out of what I would say is that shadow in order to find kind of your own identity and your own success? I think, Michael, in some ways, again, since I know you're both so interested in how our childhoods have shaped us, I think that's even how you started the conversation. I think, again, I am lucky in some ways because some of my earliest memories

are people asking me like, so are you going to grow up and run for governor of Arkansas one day? Or do you want to go into politics? And I remember being like three, four, or five and being like, I don't think so. Maybe, who knows? I'm like, I haven't even gone to kindergarten yet. I don't know how to read. I don't know. I thought I was going to be like an astronaut or a superhero. So I thankfully had many dreams as a kid. I was interested in being an aerospace engineer for a while because I was obsessed with satellites or I wanted to be a research scientist because I wanted to understand cancer. I wanted to be a teacher because I loved my teachers. I had great teachers as a kid. I'm still in touch with my first grade teacher. Shout out to Mrs. Mitchell,

if you're listening right now. Good listener. Yeah. Dr. Mitchell. Actually, Dr. Mitchell. She got her PhD later in life. So I think, thankfully, I had many different dreams as a kid. I never felt like I had to go into politics or that only through politics could one make a difference. Although, of course, I think who runs for office and hold office has enormous importance in everything I do care about. And so then when I decided I might want to be a doctor, and then I realized, no, I was more interested in public health, and I was more interested in health systems and trying to work in nonprofits or as an advocate, it just felt great.

Like I was like, my parents just want me to always work as hard as I can. Like, what I was aware of as a kid, Michael, was like, if I got a B in a subject that my parents knew I could have gotten an A in, like that's what disappointed them. Where they're like, you didn't work hard enough. You weren't focused enough.

You weren't sufficiently curious to ask the questions to help you learn what you needed to learn to be able to get that A. Who's more strict? Oh, my mom, for sure. Your mom? For sure. So your dad's more laid back?

For sure. I feel like as a grandpa too, I could see him just being like really laid back and cool and chill. I also loathe ever like to candidly recognize gender dynamics, but I see this in our, I don't know what it's like in your house, but in my house, in so many of my friends' homes where it's the mom who's like, all right, no, we do have to go to bed. It's bedtime now. And the kids look at their dad and they're like, four more stories. And he's

like, okay, three more stories. I'm like, that's not a compromise. What? No, it's bedtime. They need to brush their teeth. They need to go to bed well especially with little girl and again i think i would say that you're more like that than me well the thing is in this i will like i can do no wrong in my three-year-old daughter's eyes where like she will get sassy with her right and i think that you know yeah the girl dad thing it's real it's real it's real i'm not aware of it like reflecting back on my childhood with my parents. And I am, again, like really close with both my parents. But I see it also with my daughter and my husband.

And then I see admittedly how like my sons like ride in her wake. Because like it's so hard for Mark to say no to Charlotte. And then Aiden and Jasper are like, well, I'm getting on that train. I'm getting on that train to stay up a little bit later. It is true about sons and moms though. That is true too. My son looks at me like I'm the best thing to ever happen on the planet earth. No, you are. So you never felt compelled to kind of walk the same path. I mean, because I always go back and forth on this. You hear stories of people that struggle

and come up the hard way and under difficult circumstances, and they have this kind of drive to kind of like pull themselves up and really go far in life. And then on the flip side is sometimes you hear about kids that grew up with like either maybe a little more privileged or more accomplished parents, and they really struggle because they're following in such huge footsteps. You never kind of felt that pressure? I felt enormous pressure to, again, work hard. And I felt enormous pressure to make a contribution to the world. I'm sure there are things that I could have chosen to do with my life that my parents would have loved me no less for, but would have kind of raised their eyebrows at. I think because in my 20s,

I was so focused on just trying to get like bluntly smarter. I worked in consulting. I then worked in finance. I then got my PhD. And so then like in my 30s, when I was really oriented on, you know, here's the nonprofit work I want to do. Here's I want to redirect the inevitable attention that comes my way into highlighting, you know, people and organizations that I think are really important. Like I am going to be an active citizen. You know, I campaigned for my mom. I campaigned for President Obama. I've campaigned now for lots of people. And so I think, Michael, thankfully for me, I probably was always going to wind up here of trying to think like how many different ways can I make a difference with the privilege I absolutely have also with the education and the experience that I've earned

and how can I be in service to others? But I never felt like the answer to that question had to look like what my parents have chosen to do. What was the difference between when your father was running and your mother was running obviously you were older and campaigning but when your mother was running there was a little bit more contention in the in the country a little bit more um it was their social media maybe not as a polite political spectrum you know lauren it's probably not like the sexiest answer but i think the biggest and like difference really was just my age like i was was so, I was a kid, right? And when my mom ran for the first time, I was 28 and applying to PhD programs, right?

It's like a very different, just like I was at a wildly different place in life. Do you like campaigning? It seems like a lot of work. I love campaigning because since I'm a terrible actress, like I don't campaign for candidates or causes that I don't deeply, passionately believe in. I love sharing why I so strongly support my mom or why I so strongly support ending child marriage, which is one of the

causes I am determined that we will see through in my lifetime. Ending child marriage under 18? Oh, yes. Child marriage is legal in 43 states in the United States. How young? So in some states, there's actually no age limit. But we most recently got child marriage banned in Massachusetts, and it was effectively 12 was the minimum age. How is this not like, I mean, I guess you're talking about, but how is this not a more known issue?

I think because it makes people really uncomfortable. Yes. Makes people really uncomfortable. I mean, in- Why does that law even exist? So since 2000, we've had more than 200,000 kids married in our country. And this is often framed by the people who don't think the law should change. It's like, well, most of them are 16 and 17 year olds.

I'm like, but 16 and 17-olds should not be getting married. They should be in school. And overwhelmingly, it's girls who are effectively being trafficked into marriage either by their parents for religious reasons or cultural reasons or their daughter got pregnant and they don't think- Or maybe money. Sometimes money, sometimes immigration. I mean, there's a whole host of reasons. And I imagine this is what you're depicting is not like a 16-year-old marrying a 16-year-old sweetheart. Every once in a while, but frequently not. More frequently, it's underage girls marrying older men. Hold on. So you're telling me that you can't have, like a 35-year-old man can't have sex with a 12-year-old, let's say.

Unless you're married. Legally. Unless you're married. But if you're married legally unless you're married but if you're married you can't yes oh my god and also make any sense and so okay and part of what's so pernicious about this is if you're say you're 16 you get married you realize you don't want to be married or you more often is the case like you are being abused and you leave your home, most shelters won't take you because you're not old enough to be in an adult shelter where you have to be over 18 and you're considered a runaway. And so most family shelters won't take you. So you get reported to social services or the police or both and often taken back to your abusive household or taken back to your parents who then take you often back to your abusive household. You also can't enter into a contract under 18. So you can't legally hire a lawyer to help try to extract you from.

I don't get how some of these things are even possible. So until less than a decade ago, child marriage was legal in every state. And now, thankfully, due to this amazing woman, Freddie Rice, who I just think the world of and would like run through fire for her. She was forced into marriage. She got herself out and now she's dedicated her life to ending child marriage across the United States. So essentially, a 35-year-old can sleep with a 12-year-old if they're married. Yes, in some states. In some states, the minimum age is 15. In some states, it's 16. In many states, you do often have to have the parents' consent and a local judge consent,

but often the local judges are from the same culture, the same religious group, the same zeitgeist as the parents. And so often, very rarely do judges turn down an application for a child marriage. If someone's listening and they want to support this, because I'm sure a lot of people are passionate about what you're talking about. And surprised. I'm shocked. We've done almost 600 of these. I'm shocked. This is the first time. I try to consider myself somewhat well-read and aware of what's going on in the world.

I think this is the first time I've ever heard of this depicted this way. And it's the very first time we've ever talked about the show. So I think a lot of people like myself are like, whoa. What I love about living in this modern age, and I say this all the time, it has never been easier to make a living online, to get discovered, to share your ideas, to connect with people. And one of the best ways to do that is on Squarespace. Squarespace is your one-stop shop to build your online presence, to build your online store, your blog, your newsletter, your analytics all in one place. Something that you own, anything you put on the Squarespace platform is completely yours. You own 100% of it. Unlike these third-party platforms,

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chalky feel that a lot of dry shampoos feel like. I shake it up and then I spray it right on my roots. And then I'll wait 30 seconds and I'll just shake my hair out. You just really don't have to wash your hair all the time is what I've realized. And then I'll just brush it back into like a tight bun or I'll put it up in a claw clip. But the point is you need a good dry shampoo and you need one that doesn't leave white residue behind and takes care of your scalp. Living Proof always formulates without silicones, harsh sulfates, or parabens. This is one of the

reasons why I use it. It's also PETA certified, cruelty-free, color safe, and safe for chemically treated hair. Visit livingproof.com slash skinny and use code skinny to get a free travel size dry shampoo with your purchase of $45 or more. That's livingproof.com slash skinny code skinny to get a free travel size dry shampoo. That's livingproof.com slash skinny code skinny to get a free travel size So Unchained at Last, started by Freddie Rice, is the leading organization going state by state because marriage is a state authority here under the Constitution. It's not a federal authority. It's a state authority going state by state. And I do want to give credit to the media broadly because while this, I think, so often has been ignored because it is shameful and people are uncomfortable with collective shame,

certainly, is that even, like earlier this week, I saw a story on CNN about a woman who'd been married at 13 in Florida and married because she'd been groomed and seems as if probably this older man had paid her parents for her. You know, she had two children by the time she was 16 and then she escaped and now also is trying to raise awareness about the human rights violation that child

marriage is. And so I hope that this is becoming more well-known because I think hopefully the more we bring this out of the shadows, the more girls and women in particular, whose lives we can quite literally save. I think one of the frustrating things for many civilians in this country is that, to me, I hear this and I'm like, this is a real issue. This is serious. This is affecting kids. And we get distracted by so many things that are not as consequential or maybe don't have as much of an impact on the citizens of this country. And not to point blame on anyone, but I think you look at something like this and this is shameful and everyone knows, much of an impact on the citizens of this country. And not to point blame on anybody, I think you look at something like this and this is shameful and everyone knows,

and most people listening are like, hey, this is effed up. But then we get distracted by some headline about what's going on in the banking sector or what's going on with this celebrity or this. And I imagine for someone like you that's trying to bring awareness, that's got to be somewhat frustrating because this is an issue everybody should be paying attention to. Yeah. And it also, you asked earlier about how divided we are. Truly, this is an issue everybody should be paying attention to. Yeah. And it also, you asked earlier about how divided we are. Truly, this is an issue where we have some incredible supporters and champions who are quite on the right and some who are quite on the left. I did an event last year with a very Republican... This is not about a fiscal policy. This is about kids. No. A very conservative Republican

state senator from South Carolina, someone who's a democratic socialist like here in New York state. And these two women could not have been clearer. Like if we can't come together on this issue, what hope do we have? And also how can we not come together on this issue to try to help protect girls everywhere,

whether they're going to grow up and be one political party or the other, or even political at all. Everyone deserves the chance to be a kid and not a bride. Yeah. I mean, we typically don't get so into politics or just because we're not the best people to speak to it, but I feel like- But they shouldn't be political. No, sure. But I also feel like, let's talk about your father and Bush and Obama. I feel like there is a shared kind of respect and camaraderie and willing to kind of come to the table and work together. And I feel like what,

what I think concerns a lot of people now is we're getting further away from that. Like your father and Bush may disagree on certain policies, but there's a mutual understanding that they're working together to, you know, enhance the same country. And I feel like we're getting to a place where that's getting further and further apart. I think that, Michael, I share those concerns. And certainly, I think about my father and President Bush who actually worked together

now year-round through something called the Presidential Leadership Scholars Program, where they bring people. They seem like they're buddies. Yeah, they're friends. And my father had a very warm, deep relationship with President Bush's father, President Bush Sr. And they do a lot of work, not only with President Obama, but many of the presidential libraries for people who are no longer with us, but who steward those legacies, whether for President Johnson or President Ford. And I think what has shifted now, I mean, we've always had nasty people who have platforms in politics or kind of in media or kind of in culture that are kind of weighing in on and trying to shape political discourse and debate. I do think, though, what is different about social media is that the extremes are so often the most rewarded,

rewarded by the algorithms, which then put kind of that content and those voices higher up in people's feed. And so people then get acculturated to kind of that anger and that venom and that vitriol. And I am very concerned about that because I do think about that great quote from President John Adams,

we're all entitled to our own opinions, but not our own set of facts, which then the great Daniel Patrick Moynihan here in New York, our Senator over decades here, really spoke a lot about and always tried to help, you know, not only his colleagues, but the public understand, like, here, here's what is actually true. And then here are all the things you can have different opinions on. And I think we've, we've lost that. We've lost that partly because

the social media companies, but also many of the people who are newly in politics don't want us to gain it back because they have built kind of enormous profits or kind of profitable careers off of kind of being able to optimize around the algorithms. You know what I think just as I'm not, I don't know a ton about politics, but just seeing the whole picture, I think more people like you and politicians need to come on outlets similar to this, like podcasts, where it's just a conversation and it's not so politically charged. It's like, I'm scared to turn on the news because everyone has an agenda. But if you just listen to people talk in a neutral atmosphere

like this and when i hear what you're telling me about about child brides in a way that's like this it's so much more digestible than than some of these outlets screaming extremes well because i think if more politicians came on like and i'm not saying i'm not saying this podcast i'm just saying it was no it was a different atmosphere i think you're right for me this is like this is making sense to me very easily as opposed to being yelled at or screamed at or trolls on social media or even fox news cnn whatever it is it's it's it's become too much we're taking very complex issues that require real thought and dialogue and condensing them down into a five minute bite or 180 characters, and then letting people form their

opinion off of whatever that bite looks like, right? Like there's things you could pull out of this hour or so long conversation that would be 30 seconds that could maybe completely actually warp what you're actually saying, right? And I think why we're attracted to this is we've had all sorts of different people, different backgrounds, different beliefs, whatever. And at the end of the day, people are people. And I believe the majority of people have good intentions and are just trying to do their best in life. Of course, you have some bad actors here and there. But Lauren and I really try to bring this audience along to understand why someone comes to the beliefs that they come to or why they have the perspective. It gives context.

Yeah. And I think people may read a headline, Chelsea Clinton on the show, and they're immediately going to be having a bias just from your name in a title. They're going to come and think, oh, she only thinks this certain way. I can predict everything she's going to say. I really think it's important for people in any media landscape to try to really share a greater picture and a greater understanding and a greater perspective because it helps people be like, oh, okay, I get that. Maybe I disagree with this a little bit, but I understand the perspective and I can respect it. And you're right. The issue that you just brought up isn't political. So why can't you have just a conversation like this? Well, Michael, what you're saying too, I so agree

with that. Yes, i do believe there are there are bad actors who are trying to do bad things i also so fundamentally that most people most americans are decent good people who want to do the right thing who want to be you know supporting kind of good things to happen and to stop bad things from happening and i i do like so deeply believe that's true i also though think about one of your earlier comments around how the stories are always shifting. So Lauren, to your point, they're so explosive. They're often being treated with, everything is treated as existential.

And whatever that existential thing is shifting every day. And so then it, I think, also is hard for people to understand the long-haul issues like tackling child marriage or the long haul issues also like tackling climate change, whatever it is you think we all should do. And everyone I know has different views about what we should do, but it's hard to hold those threads together when you're like, oh my gosh, now I'm worried about kind of this financial issue. Or now I'm worried about this thing in my neighborhood, or now I'm worried about something happening around the

world. Or now I'm worried about what type of stove I have in my apartment or my home. I get why it's hard to hold that attention that we need to hold for these longer hall issues that do deserve our attention. You wrote a book. You wrote a lot of books. I have written a lot of books. Tell us about why you decided to do this and who needs these books. I'm going to give them to my kids. Oh gosh, thank you. I'm going to read them. A bedtime story. So I see on top, we actually have the Welcome to the Big Kids Club,

which hopefully will be great for your three-year-old. It's something I wrote really in response to the questions that Charlotte and Aiden were asking when I was pregnant with, and then after their baby brother, Jasper, arrived in the world.

Give us an example of a question. Like, you know, why do babies poop so much? Oh. Right? Or when, like, when will my babies poop so much? Oh, right. Or, or when, like, when will my baby talk to me? And actually there's a whole range of times, right? Or why does my baby need to burp? Like, I don't need to burp. Like, why does my baby need to burp? And I framed it as my baby because that's how Charlotte really spoke about Jasper, which I was

really struck by. And initially I was like, it's my baby. Like you didn't give birth to this baby. But then I thought, how, how wonderful and loving is that that she's really loving because Zaza doesn't look at my my son that's really loving I'm sorry like Charlotte she just started giving him a little finger touch at month eight so okay just a finger touch so well that's really nice somewhere we all start somewhere and but all of my books have stories that are candidly out of my experience in some ways. I wrote Don't Let Them Disappear, which I see down there because we were talking about what we wanted to be when we grew up, when we were little. And while I never kind of saw myself as the next Jane Goodall, maybe because I was just so in awe of her as a kid and

still am as an adult, I've always loved animals. I've always wanted to know as much as I can about the animals that I feel connected to, elephants, giraffes, dogs. I've loved learning about them. I've loved being able to be around them. And being around lots of kids, my nieces and nephews, I have 20 nieces and nephews and their friends and my kids and their friends, I realized, I'm sure not totally universal, but fairly universal it is for kids to love animals and to want to know more about them, whether they're own pets or animals around the world. So I wrote Don't Let Them Disappear to help kids know that some of these animals are really in danger, but they can help save them. Really cute. And she persisted. Yes,

she persisted. Thank you, Lauren. It is now a series really about first women who inspired me. So the first books are very personal. And now is a chapter book series where I've been really lucky to work with dozens of women authors and illustrators as they're telling stories of women who inspire them for young readers because still the vast majority of books published any given year, picture book or chapter books have main characters that are boys. And while that's important, look at you, Michael, we need to do a better job of telling more stories about women, by women, and for girls and boys. Where can everyone find your books, support you? Do you have an Instagram account? Don't have an Instagram account. I'm happy to talk an instagram account don't have an instagram account i'm happy to talk about why i don't have an instagram account if that's interesting to you i would love to know yes so my kids are the most important part of my life and i do not show their images on social media and i actually try really hard to protect them and we go through lots of links

to protect them at their schools and kind of other places where they do activities so that their images hopefully don't show up on social media. Because while I do believe overwhelmingly people are good and want good for all kids everywhere, I also know that there's some people who really hate my family, including the youngest members of it. And so that is important to us. And it would just feel disingenuous to me. And Lauren, I may make a different choice at some point. And all the people I work with would, of course, love for me to make a different choice. But for me right now, it just would feel disingenuous to

have like a visual look into things that I care about and find compelling and to not include the most important part of my life that I care about and find compelling and to not include the most important part of my life that I care about and find compelling, which are my kids. Yeah. I don't think any parent listening would fault you, especially you for that decision, right? Like that makes complete sense. So how do we support what you're doing and find everything? So thank you. So I do, um, I have a Twitter account and a Facebook account because those are generally words. You can always find out kind of substantively what we were up to through the Clinton foundation. And for my books, you can find them hopefully in your local bookstore, words. You can always find out kind of substantively what we're up to through the Clinton

Foundation. And for my books, you can find them hopefully in your local bookstore, but certainly I have a wonderful, long partnership with Barnes and Noble. And so my books are thankfully always there and on Amazon and wherever you get your books. We will link your books. I can't wait to read these to my kids. Chelsea, thank you so much for coming on. I have to say you're such a breath of fresh air. And I want to say this because I think it's important. You didn't come with like all these things we couldn't talk about. You were an open book. Oh, there's a red dot on my shirt. It's refreshing. So thank you very much for coming. Thank you so much for having me. This episode was brought to you by The Skinny Confidential. Today is the last day to shop our sale.

We rarely do sales. So go on shopskinnyconfidential.com today and use code PINKBASH for 20% off. This excludes kits and gift cards. Use code PINKBASH for 20% off. Chelsea is giving away a signed book. You can gift it to your toddler like I did. I gave Zaza her book. She was so excited.

All you have to do is tell us your favorite takeaway from this episode with Chelsea on my latest post at Lauren Bostic. And then make sure you've rated and reviewed the podcast on iTunes. Thank you guys for listening. Be sure to check out our YouTube page. We just started putting up full length videos. So for people that are interested in the video version of this show, they're all going to start living there from now and then the future moving forward. We're also going to start taking our most popular episodes from the

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