The Skinny Confidential Him & Her Podcast - Tim Grover On How To Win In Life With The Right Mindset & How To Keep On Winning Over & Over Again

Episode Date: May 17, 2021

#357: On today's episode we are joined for a second time by our friend Tim Grover. Tim is an elite performance coach who authored one of our favorite books and international bestseller: Relentless. Some of Tim's former clients include Michael Jordan, Kobe Bryant, and Dwayne Wade. Today Tim is on the show to discuss his new book W1NNING, The Unforgiving Race To Greatness.  To connect with Lauryn Evarts click HERE To connect with Michael Bosstick click HERE Read More on The Skinny Confidential HERE For Detailed Show Notes visit TSCPODCAST.COM To Call the Him & Her Hotline call: 1-833-SKINNYS (754-6697) This episode is brought to you by The Skinny Confidential  The Hot Mess Ice Roller is here to help you contour, tighten, and de-puff your facial skin and It's paired alongside the Ice Queen Facial Oil which is packed with anti-oxidants that penetrates quickly to help hydrate, firm, and reduce the appearance of fine lines and wrinkles, leaving skin soft and supple. To check them out visit www.shopskinnyconfidential.com now.  This episode is brought to you by MANSCAPED Father's day is around the corner and nobody wants a pair of dusty socks. So turn them on to MANSCAPED. Manscaped's Lawn Mower 4.0 is the perfect gift and it's a gift for everyone if you catch our drift... Get 20% off and free shipping with code SKINNY at www.mascaped.com   This episode is brought to you by No Days Wasted Their hero product is called DHM Detox, which is the vitamin for people who like to enjoy their drinks. It’s designed to help you bounce back the next day. Get 20% off your order and free shipping in the US. Just head over to www.NoDaysWasted.CO/SKINNY and use promo code "SKINNY” at checkout This episode is brought to you by Policy Genius  Spring is springing as we speak, and it’s the perfect reminder to tidy up and get your life in order. Why not start by protec6ng your family with life insurance? Policy Genius makes it easy to compare policies from as little as 15 dollars a month. You might even be eligible to skip the in-person medical exam. Go to www.policygenius.com to get started! Produced by Dear Media 

The following podcast is a Dear Media production. She's a lifestyle blogger extraordinaire. Fantastic. And he's a serial entrepreneur. A very smart cookie. And now Lauren Everts and Michael Bostic are bringing you along for the ride. Get ready for some major realness. Welcome to The Skinny Confidential.

Him and her. Aha! The confidence comes from the consistency of losing. That's what happens. As you know, there's these old adages out there that if you get knocked down, if you fall down, or you lose, you need to jump right back up. I totally disagree with that. 100%.

If you lose and you get knocked down, stay down there for a little bit. Why'd you get knocked down? Why if you lose and you get knocked down stay down there for a little bit why'd you get knocked down why'd you lose once you figure that out then you stand back up because if you stand back up the same way you're gonna get knocked down again do you feel like winning welcome back to the show taylor cue the music hopefully it's a lot of energy it's kind of like coming in. Remember that movie, guys, Heavyweights, when Uncle Tony comes running in and he's high-fiving everybody? Taylor, I hope you cued the music and didn't just make me sound like a complete freak just saying winning in a weird voice. Anyways, welcome back to the Skinny Confidential Him and Her Show, guys. That clip was from our guest of the show today, Tim

Grover. This is Tim's second appearance on the show. His first was way back in the beginning of 2019, man time flies. And that was episode 172 when he joined us to discuss his first book, Relentless. It still continues to be one of the highest listened episodes that we've done. So if you're new to the show and haven't heard that yet, I highly suggest checking it out. Relentless, the book Relentless by Tim Grover, who's our guest today, is one of those books that you read and light bulb just goes off. It's a book when you read it, you remember where you are, what you were doing. I read it back in 2016 and shared it with Lauren because I loved it so much. She read it and then we spent two years

trying to convince Tim to come on the show and finally got him. It's a book for people who want to have a relentless pursuit of greatness. It's how to be relentless in life. And that could be in any area of parenting, business, athletics, just wanting to learn more. It's just about being a better person and pursuing life with a relentless mentality. So again, highly suggest reading that book. I suggest checking out that old episode after listening to this one. And now Tim is back on the show to share his next book called Winning, The Unforgiving Race to Greatness. Lauren and I both love Tim's delivery.

He cuts through the BS. It's not woo-woo. It's not like feel-good nonsense. It's practical and straightforward advice on how to achieve the results you want in life. And again, it's not just about business. It could be in any area of life. So for anyone that wants to win, this episode's for you. For those of you that are unfamiliar with Tim,

here is a quick bio. Tim Grover is an elite performance coach whose clients include Michael Jordan, Kobe Bryant, and Dwayne Wade. No big deal, to name a few. Of course, those are not just any clients. We're talking about some of the highest performers in the world. So Tim not only knows what he's talking about from his own experience, but the experience he's been able to participate in working with some of the highest achievers in the world, including Michael Jordan and Kobe Bryant. And he knows what it means to be relentless and win. So with that, Tim Grover, welcome back to the Skinny Confidential Him and Her Show.

This is the Skinny Confidential, him and her. Top three athlete, all time, any sport might be Wayne Gretzky. Like you said, he's quiet, but you think of like the Kobe's, LeBron's, Michael, the Jordan's very loud, but people sleep on Wayne Gretzky. I feel like. Oh, Wayne is, Wayne and MJ are extremely close throughout the years. I've been fortunate enough where I've gotten a chance to sit and talk to both of them and hear them in private conversation when there's no cameras around, no anything. And the mindset of those two individuals, it's identical. It's identical. I mean, you look at all the things that both of them have done in their sport, which is

constantly win over and over again. But now both of them are really out their sport, which is constantly win over and over again. But now both of them are really out of the limelight. You know, you don't hear much about MJ. You don't hear much about Wayne. But they still win over and over and over again. So they show you that there's different ways of winning. There's winning where you're in front of everybody. And then there's a silent wins that nobody hears about until it's just too late.

And those have a tendency to be more exciting and more gratifying for the individuals because they did it without anybody seeing it. What are the similarities of their mindset? Their similarities in their mindset is once they focus in on something, that becomes priority number one. It's just like, this is what I'm going to win at right now. And nothing's going to change my mind about it. Nothing's going to derail my focus. But when they make the shift from that thing to the next thing, now that thing is just as important. So for them, it was winning in sports

was extremely important. But when they focus on winning with family, that's just as important. Winning in financing, that's important. They don't try to mix everything at once. They don't try to balance all of that stuff. They don't try to mix everything at once. They don't try to balance all of that stuff. They don't try to say, okay, listen, I'm going to be the best athlete in my sport. And I'm also going to try to be the best family person. And I'm also going to be doing all these other stuff. They understand that in order to own a particular space

and in order to win in that arena, I got to be a little bit unbalanced. I really do have to be a little unbalanced because if you try to balance everything, what are you going to end up getting? You're going to be good at a lot of things. One of the things I talk about in the winning book all the time is you don't find balance. You create it and your balance is different for everybody. Your balance is different you create it. And your balance is different for everybody. Your balance is different than mine. My balance is different. It just is.

But when people say you don't have enough balance in your life, so what everyone ends up doing, and this is gonna be very relatable to the listeners, you try to add more by balance. You're like, all right, all right. Someone says, well, you're not spending enough time with your family. You need to hang out with your friends more or whatever it is. All right. And you start to add all these things. And now you're trying to balance even more, even more, even more. Well, how do you create balance? It's not by the addition. It's by the subtraction.

Delete the unessentials. If you delete the unessentials, you'll become so closer to balance. And we all have so much unessentials in our lives that we're usually carrying on or we're trying to do for others and trying to make their balance our balance. And it's not about that.

And I tell people, look at a perfectly balanced scale. I ask this question when I do my speaking all the time. I said, who wants zero success? Obviously, nobody raises their hand. I said, who wants zero happiness? Nobody raises their hand. Who wants zero love? Nobody raises their hands. Who wants zero financial security? Nobody raises their hand. Who wants a zero life? Nobody raises their hand. What's the number on a perfectly balanced scale? Zero. Whoa. It's a zero. So if you're literally trying to balance all those things, that's what you're going to get. You just brought up something that I'm so curious about that we didn't talk about in the first podcast episode. First of all, I told you off air, I'm a huge fan of Wayne Gretzky. I think what he's

done with his career and his focus, but also with his family is so amazing. Family with athletes. It almost to me seems like they can go two ways. They end up cheating and sabotaging that area. I'm not talking about their athletic game. I'm talking about their family or they end up being a fucking amazing family man that, that has a family like Wayne Gretzky with five kids travels the world with his wife. Do you think the athletes that end up neglecting that area i don't want to say fail but don't win as hard i won't say they don't win as hard they make their they make certain decisions they're like hey this is more important at this particular time you know if you look at wayne's history as exceptional as he is and was as an athlete, he goes through the same issues that we went through.

Nothing was perfect. So they have to understand your support system has to be extremely strong when you're trying to be that person in a particular space. And the other individual usually ends up sometimes putting their dreams or their thoughts and their different things on hold, or they slow the pace down a little bit, but they know that right now they need to invest in your success, in your business, in what you do. And that individual has to understand that if they're going to invest in them when this is over, and it is going to be over, how much are you willing to invest in me and everything I gave up and I sacrificed in order to allow you to win in that endeavor. So when that happens, everybody wins together.

So if you ask, if you're a professional athlete or you're a entrepreneur or you're a business individual and you ask your significant other or whoever it is and say, hey, listen, I need two years. You better deliver in those two years. There better be measurable results in those two years. There better be measurable results in those two years if you're asking an individual to deal with whatever you're dealing, whatever your mindset is, to get whatever you want in those two years.

And everybody's got to win. Everyone's got to win. So if an athlete, let's say, cheats on his wife, do you think that the cheating takes away from the performance? And I could mean like an entrepreneurial performance or a professional athlete performance. You know what? I can't say if cheating enhances a person's performance or takes away. Obviously, there is going to be a level of stress of trying to do something that doesn't fit with what you're trying to win at. Now, are you continuing to add those distractions? And

is it something that you have to deal with? Is it a problem? Is there something that's an issue with you? Or is there an issue in the family structure that has to be dealt with? Because if it's not dealt with, it's going to continue to add, it's going to continue to add, it's going to continue to add. So what happens is, what happens when you continue to add, add, add, you get the relationship gets out of even more balance. So what do you have to delete? What's causing you to do this action? And what do you have to do to delete from yourself, delete from others, delete from the people you hang around with

in order to make that thing work the way you want it to work? What are some things that blocks us from winning? Well, the main thing that blocks us from winning is us. That's it. People want to overcomplicate this thing, but they're looking for such the, everyone's looking for the easiest way to win. I get this question all the time.

What's the one thing? I wish it was that easy. I wish it was the one, I wish there was just one thing. And people write books and they talk about this all the time. There says, you know, 10 easy steps to success. All right. Five great ways to be a champion. Well, I tell you, if it was only that easy, those steps are infinite. They are infinite. They're constantly shifting. They're constantly changing. Sometimes

you don't even know if they're there. And you got to trust yourself to know that they're there and understand that when you climb those steps, it's hard. It's hard. I don't care what kind of shape you're in. I've worked with some of the most exceptional athletes out there. When we have to do stair training, I don't care what level they're in. That thing is difficult. So every time you take a step, know how difficult it is. Know that it's going to shift. Know those steps are infinite. And know once you complete those steps, there's so many more that you can't even see. And that's how people win on a regular basis over and over and over again. There is no five easy steps. There's no 10 steps. There's no one way of doing this. Those steps are constantly changing. They're constantly shifting.

Sometimes you get to run up those steps. Sometimes you get to run up those steps. Sometimes you got to crawl up those steps. And when you get to the top, sometimes winning still doesn't even know who you are. Can you feel it? I can feel it. I can feel it, guys. The world is healing. Things are opening up. I was out and about last night. The drinks were flowing, in particular tequila. Speaking from experience last night, not Sunday night, because I'm doing this on a Sunday, Saturday. This is going to release Monday. And just listen how sharp I sound. I don't see them. I'm skipping a beat. I actually know what day it is. I'm on point. And you know why? It's not because I was responsible with my orders last night. It's not

because I limited my quality. Quite the contrary, actually. Let's just say I had a good time. It's because when I got home, right next to my bedside table, pre-planned, because I'm a planner, was my no-days-wasted DHM Detox Vitamin Pack. And today, I am on fire. I feel great. Woke up, made the baby some French toast, actually even made a stew that I'm going to have right after I do these spots. Nice, great stew. No way I would have been able to do that with this energy without DHM Detox. I would have been done all day.

I would have been laying around feeling sorry for myself. We have been talking about this product on the show for a few months now, and that's because it's a game changer. DHM Detox uses research science to help boost your body's natural response and alcohol and break down those toxins. No brain fog the next day, no gross feeling, and it's so easy. Just take two capsules after your first couple of drinks and it goes to work. I did it with a little bit of coconut water right before bed and boom, game changer. We love this partner so much and they have an incredible offer. It's a completely risk-free purchase. So if you don't love it, they'll refund you on your first box. No questions asked. Easy, easy decision. We talk about time being our

greatest asset. So why waste days feeling awful after a few drinks? And of course, we've got 20% off your order and free shipping in the US. Just head over to nodayswasted.co slash skinny and use promo code skinny at checkout. Again, that's no days wasted.co slash skinny for 20% off your order. Enjoy. I was telling you off air that there's some books that you read and yours being one. I remember the exact place. I remember the exact mindset I was in when I first read Relentless and what I love about your message and your approach and the way that you deliver that message, it is a no fluff, no BS. Like this is what, how it really is. This is what it really means. This is how you actually get

their approach to delivering a message. And like you said, there's all these books and they have these fluff pieces, like you could do this and if you're mine and if you feel good and like people. And I think like when you start talking about the level of performance that you talk about and the performers that you highlight in your book, and in this one, you cut out all that. You're like, this is what it really takes. And I think that that's such an important message because we live in a time where maybe people feel guilty for celebrating a win, or maybe they think they don't deserve a win, or maybe they think they're not supposed to pursue that because of whatever norm that we live in now. But you're like, listen, if you want to be relentless and

you want to win, this is what you got to do. And this is what it takes. No BS. This is what it is. You know, listen, this book winning, it's about the grit. It's not about the glamour. All right. That's what winning is. It's about the grit. It's not about the glamour. It's not about the glory and the payday. That's not what winning is about. Winning isn't about the glory and the payday. It's about all the obstacles and the challenges and the pain that you go through in order to get to that win. Just think about how long it takes you to get that win. And then when you get that win, you're on the podium for what?

30 seconds, maybe a minute. You get to celebrate for a day. I think that's like in anything, right? Even in business, you get a check, you're big, like you get to go buy. The win is not actually, like I have never experienced a win in any arena in my life that's actually satisfied me nearly as much as the climb. That's exactly. But that's what nobody wants to talk about what the climb is all about, because that's not where all, that's not where all the rainbows and the sprinkles, and that's not where all the unicorns are at. All right. It's, it's at the end. Nobody wants to talk about the path that you have to take and the pain and all the different things and the obstacles. That's what winning is about. That's how you win over and over again. Cause every win

you're going after, there's going to be difficulty. There's how you win over and over again. Because every win you're going after, there's going to be difficulty. There's going to be obstacles. There's going to be challenges. But there's also winning. And without those, you never know what the win really meant, what it really, really meant. Yeah. When I look back on anything that I consider to be successful or a win in my life, I don't think about the win in the moment. I think my mind immediately goes like, oh, that was a really difficult time where I was struggling at this point. And somehow you...

That's the win, right? It's like getting over that hurdle and being like, oh, I defeated that thing that was holding me back. Yes, exactly. And you have to constantly do those things because those are going to be constantly coming at you. You're going to have to deal with that more than the actual winning itself. Otherwise, the book is called The Unforgiving Race because that's what winning is.

Winning is unforgiving. It doesn't know who you are. It doesn't recognize you. And here's the crazy part. When you do win, it's so brief. It's briefly because now winning is paid its focus and its attention to somebody else just like you have to say okay now what's next for me to do because if you celebrate too long i'm not telling you not to enjoy it all right i'm not telling you not to enjoy it this is

what i always say i say celebrate hard don't celebrate long and I've had individuals who have won championships 10, 12 years ago that haven't stopped celebrating. One of the best advice I've ever gotten, and this is so similar to what you're saying, is from Ryan Holiday. He said, the second I'm done with my book and it's turned in and it's on Amazon, I think of what's my next book. He said, I don't sit around and like lavish in this book. I go immediately for the next book. He said, I don't sit around and like lavish in this book. I go immediately for the next book proposal. It's why I think about you. And then I think about a guy like Tom Brady and

like, it's so incredible what he's done as an athlete, but even more this last year, moving different teams and everyone was doubting him thinking he was done and winning again. Like that's a different thing. And at this point it's like, it's probably, it's obviously not motivated by the, just the, the win. It's motivated by like, oh, I'm going to go and show everybody what the fuck is up. It's motivated by the obstacles. It's made by the challenges that other people put in front of you that you put in front of yourself. When you asked like, what do stop people from winning? And the reason I said it's ourselves, is we already know what everybody else is feeling about your wins. We already know how many people are going to support your wins. I have this thing where most of the

times people aren't clapping for you. Okay. They're clapping because they have to. Whoa. Talk about that. Please, please, please go on a tangent. So when you complete something, all right, you have a very select people that actually, when they clap, they genuinely mean it. All right. And, and the only reason everyone else is clapping for you is because those people are clapping, but they're not clapping because they're happy. They're clapping because everybody else is, and they're actually clapping because they want to see what your demise. They want to see, they want to see, they're like, yeah, because you know why? They decided not to get in this unforgiving race.

They was just like, they can't take that one race. They can't take that one step. They can't take that risk. They can't take that chance. They can't take that gamble on themselves to say, hey, I'm going to go do this. Everybody knows what you have to deal with. You hear these podcasts all the time over and over again. People talk about your haters that are going to be out there. You got to block the noise out. You know, you got to stay focused. We already know that.

We already know that. How many times do you have to continue to hear that over that you're going to have naysayers? You're going to have people that don't want you to win. You're going to have people that aren't rooting for you. The people that are going to stab you in the back. Do you know that your family's not going to support you? Do you know that your friends are going to support you? Yes, they're not. They're not. All right. They're not going to help you with your, there are very few people are actually going to help you with your dreams. You know why? They have their own dreams of winning. They have their own dreams of winning. So the few people that are genuinely clapping for your success, know who those individuals are and continue to use those other individuals that are only

clapping for you because they have to. Don't worry about proving them wrong. Continue to prove yourself right. I'm reading this book about palliative care and hospice. And one of the things that they say that people say when they're dying is that, I wish I would have done this. I'm reading this book about palliative care and hospice. And one of the things that they say that people say when they're dying is that I wish I would have done this. I wish I would have done that. How many people do you think get to that point in their life when they're dying and say, fuck, I didn't pursue my dreams. And what would you say to those people, obviously that aren't dead yet? Listen, we're all going to get to that. We're all going to get to that point. All right. You can deal with a lot of things.

Regret is one of the worst things because regret means that's all on you. That's all on you. If you have your choice to decide what's important to you, what your wins are, where you want to go after. And regret is just something where you just run out of, you run out of time. I always say this, and I said this at the end of the book, do everything, do everything because that way you know what you are great at, what elevates you, what brings you the most joy, and where you can get the most wins. And the wins isn't just about the financial aspect of it. Listen, there's wins in raising your kids. There's win in charity work. There's wins every single day. There's wins in school teachers.

There's wins in waiters. There's wins in school teachers. There's wins in waiters. There's wins in waitresses. There's bus drivers. Whatever it is, community workers, there's constantly wins out there. And you don't want to have those regrets at the end of when things are just like, I ran out of time. I should have done this. I should have done that. More people end up feeling those regrets later when they actually had the opportunity to do those things,

but they were too afraid and they let fear stop them. And one of the things I always say is you need fear. You need fear. Fear is one of the greatest tools you can ever use. Every athlete I've ever dealt with, every business person, every CEO, every person I've ever coached, they've all had fear. They've all had fear. The one thing they didn't have is they didn't have doubt. You know, there was, we were at dinner with one of my business partners last night and we love her. And she was, she said something to me that I think like it wasn't meant to be a dig, but it was meant to, you know, point. She's like, well, you pride yourself on being different and being contrarian and like not putting yourself in a box that people, you know, like, especially now, especially

if you talk about politics, like there's this real need in the country left, right. I'm, I identify this way or that way. Like my whole life I've gotten in trouble because it's like, I'm the guy that's like, why, why, why? Every teacher hated me. I was like, why, why, why? If you give me the answer 18 times, like, oh, okay. Then maybe I make a decision. But I always try to point out to people, the people we admire the most in life and throughout history are these different characters that stood out. Not saying I'm one of them, but just, I don't understand this need to be like everybody else. I really don't get why people wear that as a badge of honor. Like it's just, to me, it doesn't make any sense.

Let's take a quick break to talk about something that offers a win for everyone. Father's Day is just around the corner and none of us fathers, husbands, dads, fathers of dogs, whatever you want to call it, want a pair of dusty socks. We're done with the dusty socks. We want a lawnmower. Yes, a lawnmower. And not just any lawnmower, but Manscaped's Lawnmower 4.0. That's right. It's not an actual lawnmower. I'm not telling you to go and buy an actual mower for the yard. It's for our sensitive parts. They need some attention too every once in a while. And Manscaped's lawnmower trimmer is the best one. Trust me, guys, I am speaking from experience. Imagine surprising the man in your life with a sleek, well-designed hair trimmer that just screams,

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Yes, ball toner. Can't believe I'm talking about ball toner, but here we are. Deodorant, and let's not forget the weed whacker, nose and ear trimmer. Guys, as we get older, us men get pretty disgusting, pretty gross. Ears, nose, ladies, you know what I'm talking about. And it needs to be maintained if we want to maintain the relationships that we're all working so hard to build. And right before Father's Day, of course, we have a code for you. Get 20% off and free shipping with code skinny at we have a code for you. Get 20% off

and free shipping with code SKINNY at manscaped.com. That's 20% off with free shipping at manscaped.com and use code SKINNY. Get the men in your life a gift they know that will use this Father's Day with Manscaped. Skip the dusty stocks and get the Lawn Mower 4.0. That means one of the chapters in the book is winning makes you different and difference scares people. Oh yeah. Yeah. Different scares people and people don't want to be different for that reason because they're so worried about fitting in. Your whole life, we worry about fitting in. We worry about fitting in. Hey, make sure we go to the right school. You hang out with the right group of friends. You're a part of the right fraternity, the right sorority. Your kid has to play on the right team and all this other stuff.

And then who are the individuals we admire the most? Are the winners? And what do the winners do? They stand out. How do they stand out? They know they're going to be different. They know they're going to be intimidating. They know they're not worried about scaring individuals because that's who they are. That's who they are. Everyone knows how to compete, but not everyone knows how to win. And that's the difference between being different and being a individual, being different just to be different or being different because it's going to scare people because that gives the individual the ability to win. Different always wins. It always wins. When you try to be the same as if I look at those, like you're, you're setting up for

a predefined, predetermined life, right? Like if I, if you follow like the path of somebody who's done something the same way as everybody else, if you follow like the path of somebody who's done something the same way as everybody else, like you can pretty accurately depict and figure out like where that person's life is going to end up. But I never understood that. Right. And also I, I think that my job isn't to make other people comfortable. If I'm triggering for you or you're uncomfortable, that's something that you need to look at inside yourself. It's not my job. Exactly. It's not your job. But everybody wants to make it everybody else's job. Well, here's what happens. With all the content and information that people put out there on a regular basis,

we're all taught at an early age, when your kids go to school, when you're educated, when we were all educated at a entry level, everybody told us what to think. They told us what to think. This is how you act. This is what the books say. This is what you do. All right. Well, who are the people that win consistently? The ones that throw the fucking book out. Exactly. They know how to think. And that's what a lot of people are forgetting is how to think. They're so structured into know and somebody else telling you what to think and how to do things. And it's like, this is the only way. Your winners know what to think and also how to think.

They know the difference. And they know when to use when and when not to use it. When I started my training with my professional athletes, this was back in the late 80s. There was no Fitbits or any of that stuff out there. I was counting all the steps of my athletes while they were running. So I needed to know what side was being used more, how tired they were, how fatigued, how many jumps they did. There's no book that told me that's what you're supposed to do. I did not learn that in my six years of college. All right. But to me, it was just like more, all right, this is how to think.

This is what I need to do. And I know the greatest champions of all time. All right. You were talking about Wayne earlier. When Wayne played hockey, it wasn't always about what to think. What made him so great is he knew how to think during certain moments of the game and how opponents act and everything. And he continued that in life. And your greatest winners always know how to think. Look at everything that's going on in the world now with all the changes and everything that's going on in the world now with all the changes and everything that's going on with technology and so forth. That's all about how to think. It's all about how to think. Well, I think people are so scared about feeling alone and so fearful of being wrong that it's just easier for someone to be like, you know what,

I'm just going to do what everyone else is doing and think what everyone else thinks because it's, you find that comfort there. But I do agree with you. Like at that point, you just become robotic and you're just, you're not even, you're, you're not thinking anymore. You're just doing what everyone else. And I think you get into a lot of dangerous places as a society when people start to behave and think that way, because you don't have individuals breaking up and be like, wait a minute, why, why? And if there's anything I can teach my daughter as a parent, I always want her to question, even me, like why? Why? Because if you don't question the status quo and you don't question why you're doing things, you can never find better ways to do them.

No, go ahead. Well, here's the thing. Everybody wants to make, very few people want to make decisions. Very few people want to make decisions. They like to make suggestions because suggestions gives them an out. Suggestion, when you make a suggestion, it always gives you an out. You say, well, it was just a suggestion.

All right. And people that win, people that are not worried about the status quo, they make decisions. Winning requires you to make decisions. And what stops people from winning? A lot of times they can't make this simple decision to say, this is where my wins are. This is what I need to do. This is what I need to give up. These are the people I need to surround myself with and let's go take some action. You've been doing what you do for so long and you're a very powerful speaker. What are some things that you see in people that you can spot immediately that makes them relentless and winning? Confidence. You can see it in individuals, the confidence. But you know what the confidence comes from? The confidence comes from the consistency of losing. That's what happens. As you know, there's these old adages out there that if you get knocked down, if you fall down or you lose,

you need to jump right back up. I totally disagree with that. 100%. If you lose and you get knocked down, stay down there for a little bit. Why'd you get knocked down? Why'd you lose? All right. Once you figure that out, then you stand back up. Because if you stand back up the same way, you're going to get knocked down again. When you stand up again after a loss, after you get knocked down, you have to stand up differently. Remember I said different scares people? So when you stand up after that loss, you have to be stronger. You're going to get knocked down. You're going to lose again.

You stand up again. You have to be smarter. You get knocked down and you stand up again. You have to be more resilient. You get knocked down and you have to stand up again. What's the next thing that you have to add? You have to become more obsessive. Otherwise, you just keep standing up the same person and you keep getting knocked down again.

Confidence. After each loss, after each trial and tribulation, you can just see that in an individual. And then when you have that confidence, this is where I say, I said, confidence is the ultimate drug. It's the ultimate drug. And the dealer is winning. The dealer is winning. Because think about every time you win, you get a little bit more confidence. As small as the win may be, you get a little more confidence. You get a little bit more confidence. So you see these individuals, and that's the one thing, listen, you cannot, you can fake a lot of things, but true confidence is the one thing you cannot fake. You cannot fake. You, I believe, do not think that waking up at 4 a.m. to exercise is a good thing. Why? No, I didn't say it's not a good thing. Here's the thing. People always ask me,

when's the best time to exercise? I would say when you can exercise. Okay. Okay. All right. So here's the thing. Are there some advantages of getting up before the sun, if that's the only time you can work out. Yeah. Are the benefits, there are some benefits to getting up early and doing the workouts, but they're so minute. They are so small that you would have to be consistent for years and years and years to see that benefit. We've gotten into a society now where we think sleep deprivation is a sign of success. And it's not. It's not. People just say, because somebody else says, beat the sun up. All right, I'm going to beat the sun. But what are you doing during that time? If you're not productive when

the sun isn't up, don't do it. I completely agree with you. This whole not sleeping thing is so weird to me. I like eight to nine hours of sleep. I completely agree with you. This whole like not sleeping thing is so weird to me. If I like eight to nine hours of sleep, I'm so much more effective. So much more effective. Have you ever spoken with him? I have not. You should meet him at some point. He's an interesting guy, but he came on this show and basically pointed out that there's

different types of people that have different types of circadian rhythms and certain people operate and work out in the afternoon much better than somewhere morning. And like really pointed out, like trying to take this blanket approach and to say, Hey, 5am workout for everybody. When biologically, some people are better to do it in the evening or the afternoon. It makes no sense. It makes no sense whatsoever. Unless you're a professional bodybuilder or you're in, you're in the fitness game at fitness competition or so forth. And that's your life during that time. That's what you have to do, then you're on a regimented schedule. For me, I enjoy working out in the morning just because it's a thing that I need to get done. I need to get it out of the way because once I start work

and I start into other things, then the workout gets pushed later and later and later. It's part of my routine. It's a part of who I am. I used to be that 4 a.m. workout, but that was out of necessity because I started work at 5.30. That's when my clients started to roll in. All right, did I enjoy it? Hell no, I didn't enjoy it. Did I want to stay in bed and get some extra sleep? Yeah, I did. Now my workouts are much later. All right, still same effectiveness, same results, just what do you want to do and where does it fit into your schedule and what are the benefits from it? All right. Quick break, cutting in on Tim to tell you, it's actually a true story.

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What are some tools in your toolbox that you use? For instance, meditation, breath work, cold showers. Is there any little tools that you go to when you want to reframe your day? Well, I spent so many years with my clients in cold tubs because if they had to go in them, I had to go in them. So I really enjoy a nice, warm, long shower now. I really, really do. I'm not going to lie. All right. Do I know the benefits of, do I know the benefits of a, of a cold shower and what it does to the body and to the mind? Yes, I do. All right. But I feel like I don't need to have that stimulus anymore. I can create that, I can create that stimulus. I can create that stimulus on my own. I'm an individual. I kind of go with what I want to do it's you know everybody tells you when you

get up in the when you get up in the morning don't check your phone right away I have to check my phone because I have clients overseas that are on a completely different time completely different time zone so I got to know what's going on I got to see the results of different of different businesses I got to see the results of different sports things so I can go, okay, oh, well, this, this player, he played poorly today. This is what's going on with the team. So I can get moving over there. So what's in my toolbox is what's successful to me. It's the tools that I need. What not, what not, not what somebody else, not what somebody else is telling me I need to do. Sometimes I get up at five o'clock in the morning. Sometimes I get up at 6.30.

Sometimes every now and then I get to stay in until seven. But this is unique to me. The first thing, my daughter's no longer, she's off at school right now. So I don't see her as much. So I literally have a five pound mini Megalodon dog. All right. And just to see him in the morning, it just kind of relaxes me. It kind of, it just kinds of put me at peace because you know why? When I, he is so excited to see me. He's so excited for his walks. He's so excited to go after other dogs. He's just like, it's just like, that's how I want to, that's how I want to live

my life. Every, all those little small things to him, when he gets to eat, that's a win. When he gets to sleep, he gets to win. When he gets to go for a walk, it's a win. So he sees all the wins. And I want to be just like him in that part where I get to see every little step is a win because there are, those are wins for us. I want to take a little plot twist here. You've coached and worked with some of the highest performers, undoubtedly some of the highest performers in the world. And doing this show once in a while, I'm sure you i find is a lot of the people that approach they start they start off with i want to do this but these are my circumstances this is what i was born or this and and i'm not taking away from those people's circumstances people call it a position of privilege of these days like you say your privilege like there's there's people that

are born with sets of circumstances i was always raised with the yeah and now And now what? Right. Cause my, my dad, I remember my dad was a kid. Yeah. Now what? So like it was, I'd complain, oh, I did this, or I didn't get this or I hurt my knee. And I think a lot of the time, this advice is not applicable because you can give yourself every reason why you can't get ahead and why it's not supposed to happen for you, but the world doesn't care and the circumstances around you have no feelings. And so my advice is always like, okay, throw all the excuses out and now what? And I want you to talk about it because I'm probably not the right person to coach you, but I just don't see any other route but forward and move forward and stop with the excuses because I don't think they serve

you in any kind of way. Listen, you have two. And it's not to say people aren't, it's not, no, their circumstances aren't real. It's I'm acknowledging that. I'm just saying like, but now what? Right. Those circumstances are real. And a lot of successful individuals have had dealt same circumstances. If not, if not worse. So you can look at either be a victim or you can turn that

victim mentality into a victory mentality. So you get to choose which one you want to go, which one you want to go with. All right. And the people that are constantly victims and then talk about their circumstances all the time of what's going on. I just tell them one thing. I said, your mind has to be stronger than your feelings. Think about every poor decision that you've made going through your life. Your feelings were stronger than your mind. So now what happens is when you start to think that way and you continue to use your circumstances, as tough as they may be, as tough as they may be,

but if you're constantly fueling your feelings with those things instead of fueling your mindset with them, you're going to stay in that situation. All right? Your mind tells you to get up in the morning. Your mind gets you out of bed. Your feelings tell you to stay in there. Your mind makes decisions. Your feelings overthink everything.

And when you talk about these individuals, what that's going on, there's a lot of overthinking that's going on, right? Your mind can handle disappointment and failure. Your mind can handle disappointment and failure. Your feelings hold on to it. And that's what these people are doing. Remember what I said, the key to getting in this race

is you got to come in with less. You got to come in with less baggage. You got to come in with less things in your mind that have been holding you back. Because once you're going to find out is once you get in this chase, once you get in this race to win, you're going to learn that there is no key. It's a rusty combination lock. It is so rusty. You can't see the numbers. The dials don't turn. And are you that individual that just says, I'm not even going to try to turn this dial? Or are you that individual that's going to be constantly turning it no matter how hard it is to figure out that last combination,

figure out that last number that's going to get you that win? And that's the mentality that you have to have. Yeah. Well, I think like that is the answer I was looking for because people like maybe they think, oh, well that approach is cold or it's heartless. But my response to that is someone that is offering, like if I'm offering someone advice, I can't begin to help an individual until they toss away the victim mentality because they're never going to do the work to get themselves beyond the point where they're at to get to that next level if they don't toss that out the window. It's like we can acknowledge, hey, that's true. Those feelings are right. I get why you have them. I empathize. But again, now what? How are you changing it?

Exactly. Listen, one of the chapters in the book is winning isn't heartless, but you learn to use your heart less. So what happens is in those circumstances, people want you to use your heart more because they want you to feel sorry for them. They want you to say, hey, it's okay. I understand. But you can't help them that way. You can't help them that way. And then that's why I tell it exactly like it is. I'm not going to sugarcoat anything. All right. Because I know what these ultimate winners do. All right. Winning isn't heartless, but you got to learn to use your heart less. What is it like being Tim Grover's daughter? Like what's Thanksgiving like? I can't even imagine being at a Thanksgiving table and I bring up what I want to do for a living.

Like what is the conversation here? I need to know. So are you relentless? Are you winning? Yeah. It's the most relaxed time ever. Okay. It is.

I can see that. I don't put any, I don't put, listen, I'm fortunate enough that my daughter knows what it takes, what she has to do. She's seen me, she's seen me go through it. So when she goes out for her volleyball tryouts or everything, she was just like, she'd always like, dad, do not put your email down. Do not sign your name. I want to earn this.

I want to earn this on my own. I want to know I did this, not because somebody knows you. All right. So there's enough pressure on there. But when I'm at Thanksgiving or I'm Christmas during any of those times, any of the holidays, it's sit back, relax. What do you want to do? Because I know her mind is just like mine. So this is not that this is her time to be like, you don't have to get

dressed up. We don't have to go out to it. What do you want to do? You want to order pizza? Do you want turkey? Do you want to? It's so relaxing. And that's our time to bring ourselves back because we know there's another race that we're all going to have to go in. It's not always tense, tense, tense, tense, tense, tense. Now, if I see... You have a smile on your face. What's the now? Now what? If I see your lack of focus, you're being distracted, you don't have the same competitive fire, you're not continuing to gamble on yourself

and you start to make excuses now it's time for a conversation what's the conversation the conversation usually sits down and this is how it starts i I can't wait. Sipping my teeth. I said, I need to talk to you. And then when I sit down before I even start, she goes, I already know. I already know. That's how you know you did your job as a parent. I was going to say, that's very inspirational as someone that just had a kid. Melissa Rivers was just in here discussing her mom. And she said the same thing you said about being a parent. She said Joan Rivers, when she was at home, it wasn't Joan Rivers that you saw.

No. And this is very, it's literally paralleling exactly what you just said. And she grew up obviously to be a beautiful, smart, savvy woman. So I think that's really good advice. You can't, so many people, so many parents, they take their failures and try to live them through their kids, whatever their dreams are, their, their things that we do a whole chapter in the book about competition and, you know, winning and losing and participation and all that stuff and different things with kids and so forth. It's important because winning matters.

It does matter, all right? Competing matters. But also, let your children compete for what they want to win at, not what you want them to win at. And then you'll find an individual that says, well, you know, they're not working hard enough. They're not taking this serious. The reason they're not taking this serious is because the thing that you want them to win at is what you want them to win at. You want to find out how competitive they are, how they excel. Let them find something that they want to win at.

And it may be completely different than what you do. My daughter's big into art, creativity, TikTok, all that stuff. That's not me. That's not me. That's not me. I have no artistic ability. I cannot draw a stick figure. All right? But that's the avenue that she's chosen at this particular time.

Working out. Don't want to play basketball. I want to do CrossFit training. Go do CrossFit. I would say though, that's funny that you say that, that you're incredibly creative in a different way. I'm creative in a different way. Right. You know, but I'm not, I don't expect her to be creative in that same way. She's creative in the artistic way, you know, like you are with a different, you know, understanding the lighting and the pictures. And, you know, you take it always looks like you get the perfect baby shot.

Everything. Now, you may have taken 50 shots to get there. You know, Sherry's daughter always does that with her grandchild. It's just like every time it's like the perfect picture. It's like the literally the perfect picture. And every time I like I take a selfie of myself, I'm like,, I'm like, you need to take your phone and put the phone, the back of the phone against the window. So the lights coming in on you, like we would never take a picture and I'll show you after this, this way, like we would always take it this way, if that makes sense. Okay. I'll show you. We're going to take the perfect selfie. I would love to talk about the three C's and maybe you can talk about how the three C's

in Relentless, but also talk about how you brought that into the book winning. Sure. So in Relentless, we talk about three types of individuals. We talk about the coolers, the closers, and the cleaners. All right. A cooler is an individual and we all know these people. All right. They read every single self-help book out there.

They follow every social media individuals, and they love to tell you those people's ideas. I said, I'm reading this book this week. Now I'm following this person. I'm doing this. I'm doing that. They are the individuals of what I talked about earlier about what to think, what to think, what to think, what to think. Their results are average, good. They never do anything exceptional. Then you have the individual who's a closer. A closer loves to tell the stories. They love to

tell you the stories of how successful they are, all the things they've done, all the good, but they never want to talk to you about their failures and the stuff that have the ability to change the story. And that's what you were talking about earlier, Mike. Everybody has ability to change the story. But a lot of individuals, they're letting other people write their stories for them. They're letting basically everyone else dictate their thoughts, their ideas, what's going to be in the story. Winners love to write their own stories. They love to change their own stories. They love to change their own stories. They like to choose their own path because they understand that it's

their story, not somebody else's story. That doesn't mean other individuals can't star in your own story. Doesn't mean it's all about you. And that's where I want everybody to be able to do because winning requires you to change your story numerous times. With each win, it has to change. Now, with winning, I came up with, and this is not in the book, I actually came up with it after the book. I also find three different

characteristics in individuals. One is people know how to compete. Everyone knows how to compete at some level. Everybody can compete at something. All right. So these are the competitors. They love to compete. And a lot of times they finish what they're doing. For them, finishing something is their win. That's all. They just want to finish. Their finish is their win. All right? Then you have people that win, but they only win once.

They only win once. All right? They finish, but they also place extremely high. They've won, they've won, they've won at something. Then you have the other individuals who win at winning. They continue to win over and over and over again in many facets of life, in many, many, many facets of life. And how do you do that? You continue to change your story. You continue to change. We are waiting so often for somebody else to change our story for them. Well, you actually have the tools every single day, every single morning to change your story. When does a new day start? When does a new day start? In the morning. When you decide. When you

decide. Oh, okay. You guys are getting a trick question. A new day starts at 12 a.m. That's when a new day starts. True. All right. Is it light or is it dark at 12 a.m.? That's when a new day starts. True. All right. Is it light or is it dark at 12 a.m.? Dark. It's dark. All right. Why are people always looking for the light when something, every single day, something new starts when it's dark out there.

I don't know. Tell us. So we're always looking for the ray of light when it's the darkest times, it's the darkest thoughts, it's the darkest emotions that are telling us what we need to change the most, what we need to write differently in our story. It's the power inside of us that very few individuals want to use, very few individuals want to touch. But that's where all the initial change comes from. When you, I've known every single athlete I've ever worked with, every single business person I've ever, I've ever dealt with, when they tap into all of themselves, the light, the dark, the good, the bad, the up, the down, the stuff they like about themselves, the stuff they don't like about themselves, and they embrace all of it, they embrace all of them and understand how to use all of those things,

that's when you start to win, that's when you start to really, really change your story. I think it's like, it's such a hard thing for the majority of people to realize that everything in life really is on you right the way you perceive things the choices you make the decision that what you pursue what who you surround yourself with like and i think that's a very hard concept because like you said earlier it's innate in most people to say okay it's not me like it can't be me it can't be i can't be the reason that i'm not

where i want to be it has to be something. It has to be some external thing or some circumstance that I didn't cause. And what I try to point out in this, when my small sphere of this company is whenever something goes wrong, I always say, well, that's my fuck up. Even if I'm 10 layers away from where it happened, I'm going to remind you of this conversation when you do something annoying

to me. But I always, but I think, but likewise, I think even like what, what that's done, at least in the culture of this small company is everyone else like, you know what? No, that's my fault. Everyone takes accountability. And when they take

accountability, everybody helps. They band around each other. And we all know those cultures where there's individuals and they're always passing the blame to someone else. And what happens to those individuals? Nobody ever wants to help them because they go, okay, well, but the reverse of that, when you start taking accountability, everybody wants to help you because you're like, all right, like we get it, you acknowledge a fuck up. Now let's all see if we can band around and help you get out of that and move forward.

It may not be your fault, but it's your responsibility. Yes. I would like to know who you think needs this book. Everyone. Everyone. Even if you're at the top of the food chain,

Michael Jordan needs it. Everybody. He gave me the quote on the cover. Can I read it? Sure. Tim Grover was by my side for 15 years and knows more than anyone about building winners. This book is essential for those who want to be the best at whatever they do and are willing to pay the price to get there. Michael Jordan. It's a hell of an endorsement. Wow. That's a winning quote on the book of winning. That's big.

So listen, winning is inside all of us. Let it shine. Let it show. It gives you a feeling like nothing else. Like nothing else. All right. I give you guys a great example. All right. How do you feel when she wins? I feel great. I feel proud. I love it. All right. Especially when it has to do with me. I'm just kidding. No. It's a feeling you just can't How do you feel together when Zaza wins? Amazing. All right.

How do you guys feel when family members win? Amazing. We love it. How do you guys feel when this company wins? I like it when everyone wins. I'm going to be honest because- I was going to say, when I see you win, when I see the book, I'm like, I love to see people win.

Anybody. It opens up space for more people to win too. What a feeling. What a feeling. And you can have that feeling all the time. You can have the feeling all the time. Kobe Bryant, when I asked all these people, all my athletes, and I do this to my business people and everything, I said, describe winning in one word.

Describe winning in one word, describe winning in one word. And the answers that I get from these individuals, it's hard. It's nasty. It's unpolished. It's unapologetic. It's lonely. It's lonely. All right. And then Kobe's answer was, it's everything. Of course, of course. It's everything. All right. It's everything for you. It's everything for your kids.

The feeling that it gets, the chemicals that are released from the brain, the stress that it relieves, the excitement that you get. Just think, you spend so much of your life rooting for everybody else. How about rooting for yourself? How about rooting for yourself? Which is not selfish, and we'd love you to speak on that. It is not selfish.

It is not selfish. All right, why is it selfish to take care of yourself? Why is that a bad thing? I've never understood that. I've never understood why being selfish, when you take care, the more you take care of yourself, the more you can take care of others. But people love to give the word selfish a bad name, but they like to put their own little spin on it. All right. Me time. I think that women have been conditioned for so long to think selfish is a bad thing, but I think we need to take accountability for us being conditioned and own it and be like, no, it's fine to be selfish. It's necessary. It's not only fine, it's necessary to be selfish.

All right. It's extremely important. There's nothing wrong with investing in yourself. There's absolutely nothing wrong about that. There's nothing wrong with taking care of yourself. The better you take care of yourself, the more you'll be able to take care of others. All right. It's a necessity.

It's self is a necessity. It's funny. Okay. I'll be sitting here and you asked me about meditation early. All right. I don't meditate. All right. I'm not a person that likes to sit down and meditate. If I need time alone, I said, I need time alone. All right. You tell somebody, hey, this is my meditation time. Oh, that's great. You need it. You tell somebody, Hey, not right now. Now all of a sudden you're selfish. It's the same thing. It's the exact, it's the exact same thing. My thing is the foot spa. Okay. I go to the foot spa for two hours and I do two hours of uninterrupted email and it's heaven because I walk out with a foot massage and two hours of emails done and I feel so much better. And how many people would say, oh, that's selfish. That's so, how can she possibly do that? All right.

Well, in order for you to continue to put out this information, in order to put out this podcast, in order to allow other people to win, in order to get back to all those individuals for two hours worth of emails, I got to take care of self first. I got to take care of self first. The more I take care of myself, the more I will be able to give to others. The more I will be able to provide them, the more I give them the opportunity to win. Selfish is necessary. It's a requirement. Well, I also think like speaking of selfish, I think like when I think about who this show can impact and as you're on the show speaking to these people, I want to speak to people that are interested in winning and

growing and improving their life and getting better and being better providers for their family and their friends. I am very, very uninterested in speaking to people that have no interest in changing or improving. I get it. And maybe that's a very rude, cold thing to say. But if you're somebody that's tuning in to something, there's like, I hate that. I don't like this.

I want to stay where I am. Then maybe it's not the right message for you. I'm really interested in the person that's like, I need that next thing or to hear that next thing so that I can actually start taking accountability and making change. That's why we started the show. Exactly.

So winning is a test with no correct answers. Everyone's looking for a correct answer. There is no correct answer. What winning does, it puts a permanent knot in your stomach. And these people have a permanent knot in their stomach. All right? They have a permanent knot in their stomach that they have so much doubt that they're never going to be able to untie it. So every time you give them a way to untie it,

they push back because it's comfortable for them. And they've surrounded themselves with a bunch of individuals that think just like they think. So they make excuses for it. They make excuses for, well, this is why I'm not winning. This is not why you're winning, dah, dah, dah, so forth. And they can all, they can all toast to that. Or they'll say, you know, like we have those individuals that'll like, maybe you're pursuing, you know, you're trying to take that next level and you're pursuing that next goal.

And we all know there's people in your life that'll start to say, well, you know, like, that's not really important. Or like, you know, if you're chasing those things, like that's immaterial or like, Hey, you know, that's really not what happiness is. But I always say to those people, like, who are you to define what happiness is and what's important, what's not important. And to me, it's fine if you want to get off the bus at the second stop. But if I want to keep going, like, I don't want to hear why you say it's not important. I want to keep going. You do you, but I got to do me. Does that make sense? It makes a whole lot of sense. You know what? Wait till you dive in. Wait till you like- I'm going to devour the thing on

the way back to Texas. All right. So we talk about winning wages, war on the battlefield in your mind. And that's exactly what you said. There's a battlefield that's going on here all the time that deals with fear, that deals with anger, that deals with anxiety, that are just waiting to go off. They're just waiting to go off. And other people, bombs that they like to put in the battlefield of your own mind is, you can't win. That's a terrible idea. That's going to cost too much. You already have everything. When is enough enough? And I was like, oh, maybe never. I don't know. It may never be. How about the other bombs? I love this one that people love to say this. You should take a day off. You work too hard.

Okay. You have no chance. All right. And those things are constantly, those things you have to, in your mind, you got to constantly deal with that battlefield. You got to know which ones to explode, which ones to go this. And then there's also the other individuals that tell you everything is going to be positive all the time. All right. You got to know which ones to explode, which ones to go this. And then there's also the other individuals that tell you everything is going to be positive all the time. All right, you got this.

What do you got? For me, it was the two ones that I got was, how are you going to monetize that? Which I just ignored. You have to just ignore it. How are you going to monetize that? And the other one I got is, are you sure you want to create content online and not be a television broadcaster and i look back on that and i'm like me reading a script that someone else wrote are you fucking kidding me that would have never worked right but see how people try to attack the battlefield in your own mind how they try to

place the minds in there and the different things and they tried and they tried to explode them and try to get you distracted. So that's what they're doing. They're constantly, they have all these knots tied up. They want to tie up more knots in your area over and they're just like, they want to get you out of your success routine. And if we look at everything that the pandemic did in the past, all right, the pandemic, one of the best things it did, it forced new routines. It got people out of the people that were able to continue to forge forward and continue to have success. A lot of the routines that people had, they were just routines for comfort. They actually didn't do any things. Now you have a chance to

change. Now those cha- you have a chance to change. Now you have a chance to change things. You have a chance to adapt into this, whatever this new normal is going to be. And that's a battlefield that's going to be constantly evolving in your head. And you got to choose which one you want to do. You want to go to the old routine that didn't work before the pandemic, and it's not going to work during the pandemic, and it's You want to go to the old routine that didn't work before the pandemic,

and it's not going to work during the pandemic, and it's not going to work after the pandemic, or do you want to take a chance and say, hey, this is the best time for me to do something different, to do something new, to do something that I wanted to do. I also saw when this started happening and I was real postpartum, really feeling depressed and low. And I said, I literally remember saying to myself, okay, I can take this as a moment to kick back and relax, or I can go harder than I ever have. I think- Let me guess what you did. I read a book in lunch product, but I'm saying that because I think anyone can have that mindset. I don't think I'm unique. I don't think I'm special. I think it's truly waking up in the

morning and making a decision of which way you want to go. This is a time when everyone could have fucked off. And I think that there's a choice and it is a choice. And it's really that simple to make the choice in the mindset. Yes. Listen, no one's going to give you your wins. And this is what you said about your mindset. Nobody's going to give you that mindset. Winning always belongs to somebody else. And it's your job to literally take it from those individuals because winning has no loyalty to you. This world has no loyalty to you. All right. Listen, how many individuals do you know who are a champion and in one instant they became a loser? Just like that. It's the mindset that created that takes you from a loser to a champion or from a champion back into a loser again. It's your decision. It's your life. What are you going to do with it? I always say this. If you're blessed enough to open your eyes and put your feet on the ground, it's a great day. The rest is up to you. The rest is up to you. Do we need to read Relentless first before we

read Winning or can we read them in different orders? How does that work? You can read them in different orders. There's some concepts that, you know, we do talk about the coolers, closers, and cleaners in the book Winning. So if you do read Relentless, it'll give you a better idea. Winning is a continuing conversation of Relentless. I really think people should read both. And back when I used to do book postings on Lauren's site, I put that one as one of the top ones. I really do love your book.

Thank you. But I think they should start with it because I think it gives a very strong introduction to you, to your mindset. And then I think, you know, I haven't read this yet, but following up, I think is a good follow through. Right. I think something that's extremely important when you move forward with these things, and this is one of the most important things. There's a lot of important things here.

Moving forward, everybody needs to stop managing time and start managing focus. If you start managing focus, time is on your side. When you start managing time, time is against you. Ooh, that's a gem. That's good. I need that one. That's a good one. Everybody from now starting forward, stop managing time and start managing focus. Think about all the times where you're extremely focused. You'll be in a task. You'll be in something. You don't recognize what time.

You don't know how long you've been doing it. All right, the air, your foot massages. Those two hours go like that. Yep, it's just like this podcast with you. They go just- Because you're focused. I mean, really. You're focused on...

I have no idea how long, if we've been talking for 10 minutes or we've been talking for 90 minutes. I gotta get a clock. I don't know.

How long we going? All right. Time creates distractions. That's what time creates distraction. Focus blocks them out. And we have so many distractions out there.

And if you just focus and start managing your focus, and you can work on managing your focus. That's what I always said. You can work on managing your focus. You can't focus for an hour straight if you can't focus for 15 seconds. Work on focusing for a minute, unfocus, then go focus again. And you'll see that how you've earned so much more time in that particular day. I want to say that I harassed Tim to come on the show the first time because Michael and I were so obsessed with his book, Relentless. This is something where we reached out and pursued him to come on. We're so glad he came on this episode. And this is another one of

these books I can tell that is going to be a manual that I live by. So I definitely think you guys should check out his book. It's called Winning by Tim S. Grover. He's the bestselling author of Relentless. Also a very eloquent speaker. Where can everyone find you on Instagram? Pimp your book out. Instagram is at Tim Grover. Very simple website is timgrover.com. Listen, go get the book. Go get the book. All right. I would agree.

Ours is bookmarked dog-eared. I have a feeling this is going to be the same way. Well, thank you. It's always honestly a pleasure. Love having you on. Sherry, thanks for sitting in. Sherry's my co-author. That's my business partner, my agent.

Keeps me in line most of the time. And there's no way I could have written this book without... Actually, if you look at one of the pages in here... All right. What does that say? Oh, sorry. It says, for Sherry Wink. Yes, Wink.

Wink, my co-writer and collaborator who understood. So Sherry's a winner. Yes. Thank you guys for coming on. That was awesome. You guys, go get his book. Come back anytime. Thank you so much.

Continued success. Thanks, Tim. Continue to win. Thank you, brother. All right. Wait, don't go. I have a fun giveaway. This is one of the most fun giveaways. I am giving away an ice queen facial oil to one of you. All you have to do is tag a friend on my latest Instagram at Lauren Bostic. Tell him to listen to the Skinny Confidential, him and her podcast.

We want to grow the community. Super easy. I hope you love this episode.