The Squeeze - Alec Benjamin: I Just Want To Be Understood

Episode Date: December 13, 2023

Tay & Taylor have been long-time fans of today’s guest, so they’re excited to hear from the musician himself as he opens up about his mental health, his songwriting process, and his daily life with OCD and ADHD. Alec Benjamin didn’t find music until high school, but once he did his life was forever changed. He shares several stories of how he first discovered that his brain worked a little differently and how as a result, trying to fit into the system that society has setup has not come easy. Once he learned to open up through his music, a whole new set of mental health struggles came about: navigating life on tour, dealing with immediate audience feedback, and constantly facing the pressure of success. The Lautners and Alec talk about how exercise and therapy are two tools that they all turn to in order to manage their mental health. Plus, the Lautners hear how OCD affects Alec’s day to day, the surprising cover song you won’t be able to find online, and how he came up with his new song: I Sent My Therapist To Therapy.  Be sure to follow @alecbenjamin and check out the music video for I Sent My Therapist To Therapy  Thanks to our awesome sponsors for supporting this episode:  Article —Go to ARTICLE.COM/THESQUEEZE for $50 off your first purchase of $100 or more  SKIMS — The Fits Everybody collection and more perfect-fit essentials are available now at SKIMS.com. Plus, get free shipping on orders over $75! After you place your order, be sure to let them know we sent you! Select "podcast" in the survey and be sure to select our show in the dropdown menu that follows. And if you are looking for the perfect gifts for the whole family - SKIMS just launched their biggest Holiday Gift Shop ever - also available at SKIMS.com  Jenni Kayne — Find your forever pieces @jennikayne and get 15% off with promo code THESQUEEZE at jennikayne.com/THESQUEEZE! #jennikaynepartner  Ritual — Ritual is offering our listeners 30% off during your first month. Visit ritual.com/THESQUEEZE to start Ritual or add Essential For Women 18+ to your subscription today  To email us your questions or share your story, you can reach out to [e-mail]. Be sure to rate, review, and follow the podcast so you don't miss an episode! Plus, follow us on Instagram, @thesqueeze and personally @taylautner and @taylorlautner + on TikTok @thesqueezepodcast  To learn more from The Lemons Foundation, follow @lemonsbytay on Instagram and visit lemonsbytay.com  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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would auto-hue without your reis-soddviseur or sonikars. combe. So you can take these words or whatever, take these ideas, take this music and be like, okay, well, you haven't heard our music in this genre, like, with this kind of voice.

You know, you're just sort of like moving things around and then presenting it to people. And they're like, oh, I haven't seen something like that in that light. In order to do that, you have to be, like, really aware of, like, the palette that you're painting with. You know, you have to be as self-aware as possible, especially like when, you know, like, one of the colors that you're painting with is, like, you're the artist and, like, it's your voice. So if you put something out and you have this perception of, like, how it's going to be received and then it isn't perceived that way, then you have to sort of, like, reassess. whether or not you're actually like, maybe I got it all wrong. Like maybe I don't fit into the world in the way that I thought that I did. And having to reconcile what your perception is versus reality, it's like a really scary thing to do.

And sometimes that sort of is what keeps me from putting my music out. Because I'm like, well, if I got this wrong, then that means that the way I've been thinking about this is totally wrong. And that means that I have to reassess my entire worldview. When life gives you lemons, what do you do with them? Over here at the squeeze, we talk about it. It is. Oh, my goodness. Ready for the holidays.

Hello, everyone. What an intro. We have both dogs in the studio today if you're listening. If you're watching on YouTube, you are seeing the girls in their Christmas sweaters. Remy is in a cute little knitted rainbow sweater. And Lily is in a beautiful red sweater. Yeah, I think they look great. And they're both sitting on these little chairs.

But we are thankful you are here. Yes. Happy, more energy, more passion, more passion, More passion. That's been like your go-to. Yeah, it's good. One-liner fill in. I feel like the past couple weeks here,

a little late to the trip, but it's okay. Oh, we are coming close. Yeah. To the end of the year here. Yeah. Pretty. Which means I got to put this Christmas tree away.

Try saying Christmas tree three times. Christmas tree away here soon. No, we still got a couple more weeks. Yeah. I'm going to milk it as long as we can. Yeah. We got a fun episode today. Yeah. Another person that I have been a big fan of.

Yeah, both of us. We're honored to have Alec Benjamin in the studio. And we just kind of dove into like a lot of different topics with him. He was kind of on the same mission as us of wanting to end the stigma around mental health. Talk about it more. You know, we need to be training our brain like we do any other organ in our body. and he firmly believes that as well but we just kind of dove into you know about his music about him

he struggles with AD and OCD and we just kind of talked about what that looks like on the day to day for him how it can help him how it doesn't help him in his career but it was just a really interesting conversation I think it's the first time we've dove

like really into OCD yeah right we kind of talked about it with Charlie when she was here but we didn't dive into it like we did. Yeah. I mean,

it's a real thing for him. Yeah. On a daily basis. Yeah. It really affects his life. Yeah. And I mean, he openly talks about that.

And we were super excited because when our team was talking to his before this, they were like he's very excited to come on. He loves the show. And he wants to talk about, you know, this stuff that he, about his life, what he deals with on an everyday basis.

So it was, it was cool to have him come on. and it opened my eyes to things that I didn't even know. Yeah. And such an inspiration, you know, if you're listening and you do struggle with OCD or, you know, ADD, whatever, he's just very relatable. And it's really encouraging to see someone that, you know, has built this amazing career and, you know, has done so well for himself. And, you know, these things still, he still struggles with these things. And I feel like that's an inspiration in people like to not let that define you and let that hold you back in what you want to do.

because he has truly been able to accomplish a lot. He's so talented. Oh, my goodness. If you haven't listened to his music, you need to. He has a new song out that we dove into. This song's very cool. Yeah. I mean, I love a lot of his music.

But yeah, his song that came out a couple days ago. I sent my therapist to therapy. Yep. So good. So check it out. But before you do that, let's hop into this conversation. Yeah. Okay.

Thank you for being here on the squeeze today. we are very excited. Thank you for having me. I appreciate it. I'm happy to be here. Okay. We kick off each episode with a segment called citrus got real. Okay.

And it's a fun little segment where there are random questions, very random, in that lemon jar. So if you wouldn't mind pulling one. Let's see. Pancakes or waffles. I like pancakes better than waffles, but I suppose it depends on, it depends on, it depends on like where I'm going for them who's making them but I'd be happy with you but she'll disagree you have a preference I don't know if I would disagree really you're a waffle girl I just feel like when you're out somewhere that you don't know a waffle is a safer bed than a pancake really yeah oh susy's not

because she agrees she agrees I feel like it's hard to mess up a pancake no but a waffle you can just put like cream and syrup on and that's fine and like add a couple berries on it I feel like a pancake You can just douse a freaking pancake and maple syrup. It won't be great. We can agree to disagree on that. Okay. Okay. Anyways, this isn't about us.

It's about you. No, I feel like I'm cool with either. Yeah. Okay. I'm not like a breakfast. I'm not a big breakfast. I'm not a big breakfast person. Same.

But sometimes I am. Yeah, Taylor's. It's very rare for me. Taylor doesn't like breakfast. That was hard when I first started dating because I like wake up hungry. Yeah. I'm like ready to eat when I wake up. And Taylor is the complete opposite.

I don't start feeling hungry. So if she's wanting to go somewhere for breakfast, I'm like, what time does your lunch menu start? Yeah. I'm that guy. You're like a good brunch place where there's a happy medium. Yeah. Should I grab another question or how does it work? Sure.

Is that not how it works? That's going to be how it works today. If you could be any organ in the body, which one would you be in why? Oh, man. Wow. That's a lot of. Which one would I be? Well, I feel like I kind of am my brain, you know?

Yeah. I feel like that's the organ that is like where I personally reside. You could replace like a lot of different parts of me, but it wouldn't like really change who I am fundamentally. But the one thing, you can't like do a brain transplant and be the same person. So I guess I would be my brain. But sometimes I'm not, sometimes I don't like my brain. But yeah, that's I guess what I would be. you guys. I know I wouldn't be my stomach because I have gut issues. So I would not be anything in that

region. That is true. Maybe my brain. Actually, I don't think I would want to be my brain. Probably my heart. What? Because your brain's like this? Yeah. Yeah. It hurts me sometimes. All over the place. It hurts you. Okay. Well, yeah, I was going to say heart. But yeah, you're a heart guy. Okay. You get that vibe. From the, you know, minimal amount I know about you, I would definitely say that brain suits you. Oh, I appreciate it. Thank you. Well, that makes sense.

I think it does. I think it does suit me. Yeah. Yeah, sometimes. I love it. We'll go with that. Pancakes and brains. Pancake.

Oh, gosh. Okay. Well, anyways, let's dive in. Obviously, we were kind of talking before that we are excited to have you because we have been fans of your music truly for a long time. So when the email came in and I had your name at the top, we were like, oh my gosh, this is fun. Yeah. Sweet.

And we've been, we've just like been realisting. all your stuff. Yeah. And even like this morning, I was sending Taylor screenshots and I was like, oh my gosh, I forgot about. Like Jesus in LA. All right. Love that song. Oh, glad you like it.

So many of yours over the years that we've just loved. Oh, well, that's, that's nice of you to say. It's cool. Makes me feel good. It makes me feel really good. I appreciate that. You should. But we're also excited because I feel like we have the same, you know, love for mental health

and just kind of like eliminating the stigma that. surrounds it, which you share a lot in your music, which we can like dive into a little later. But before all of that, you know, as fans of your work and of your artistry, like, we'd love to just kind of know, like, where your, like, love for music began. Like, how long have you been doing it, just, you know, kind of where it started? I think it started in high school. Okay. Yeah.

I didn't really have anything that, like, defined me and kind of like looking for something. and started listening to, I don't know, I was listening to a lot of heavy metal at the time. A lot of my friends were, all of a sudden I've become like very aware of like my hands. And then like, I'm like, man, maybe I need to drink water. Like maybe my mouth is dry. Where did I fall in love with music? I don't know.

I, oh, well, there's, I think it was a culmination of a lot of different things. But it was like, I didn't have anything that really defined me. I started listening. I started going from like the heavy metal music. I was listening to listening to like Jason Maraz and John Mayer and kind of listening to like those lyrics and and that really resonated with me. And then there was a girl that I liked who she was like, oh, it's like, isn't it so like hot with like guys play guitar? And I was like, mom, I need a guitar. And then and then I went to summer camp and they all played music there.

And so I was like, okay, well maybe I should learn how to play music. And then I kind of just fell into it. And when I look back in my life, I'm like, oh, all those things like, I guess, It was kind of obvious that that's where I was headed, but it wasn't obvious to me at the time. There was never, I was never like, I do remember one of my teachers being like, oh, you know, well, maybe Alec over here one day we'll decide like he wants to be a musician. I was like, nah, dude, there's no way, you know. I don't remember what the question was, but I'm like so nervous right now. And then before you were like, oh, you're pretty funny. And then I was like, no, now I have to be funny.

I was like, oh, no. And then this question came up and it was like pancakes or waffles. I'm like, say, think of something funny. Think of something funny. You're going to let everyone down if you're not funny. We're so letting down. And in my head, I'm like, your mouth is dry. You need to drink water.

So something, as you guys know, that has been a huge part of my mental health journey, Taylor's mental health journey journeys as individuals. And as a couple has been therapy. Amen. And that is why I am so excited to share our next sponsor with you guys, which is cerebral. Serrebral is here to help you achieve your mental wellness goals with professional therapy and medication management support 100% online. You'll experience the all new cerebral way, an innovative approach to mental wellness designed around you. You'll get a personalized

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It's convenient and they have great therapists. Yeah. And it'll just keep you accountable too. So we highly, highly encourage that you guys check out cerebral because therapy is just then wonders for us. and we know it'll do the same for you. To get started on your path towards better mental health, Cerebral is giving our listeners 15% off their first month of online therapy,

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I am fascinated by this, though. You didn't start playing music before high school? Well, my parents tried to get me to play music when I was like, well, three or four, when I lived in New York, we had a piano and they were like, oh, you have to like learn how to play an instrument. I remember my sister was learning how to play violin. How could I forget? Oh, my gosh. It haunts my dreams.

Sorry. But if anyone kind of like, I feel like the only reason why I'll learn how to do something is if they're, I have to start like with a purpose. And so when they were like telling me to play piano, even though it was like a cool thing to learn how to play piano, I was like, why? Yeah. Yeah. And I didn't really have like a reason to learn how to do music. I have to start with a goal. Yeah.

I suppose like I had a few different goals. But the one at the time was like, improve. this girl, you know? It's like, okay, how do I do that? I was like, well, I guess I'm going to have to like learn how to play guitar, you know? And she also was like, oh, isn't it like so cool when guys were like, you know, Dickie shorts and vans? And I was like, mom, I need to go to the store.

I need those. And I need a guitarist that. Quick learner. But I was lucky enough to have parents who were supportive of that endeavor. And we're like, yeah, like, let's go. Let's get a guitar. Did they come from music? No.

Okay. But my grandma didn't play music either, but she had a piano. And that would like stay to my family. Yeah. But I found out that on my mom's side, one of my like great uncles or something was like a famous like poet of some sort. Yeah. So maybe that. That's on brand.

Yeah. Maybe that has. And I read his poetry and some of the meter. I'm like, that's like kind of the same way I think about things. And I don't think that that's a coincidence. Yeah. So shouts out, you know. Say great uncle.

Yeah. Yeah. So maybe that has something to do with it. But, you know, I don't know if music runs in my family, but yeah. It's been going okay for you. But probably some of the other things that I've inherited have run in my family. So, yeah. I mean, we love having artists and musicians on because I think mental health isn't

something that is talked about enough in that world yet in my brain from so many different aspects of your life it just makes so much sense it's like from you know spilling your heart out songwriting to what life looks like touring on the daily and just what that lifestyle looks like I would think that mental health would be you know a huge component to their your lives So we love just, we love, we've had, you know, a few artists on before. And it's, we've always had, you know, incredible conversations. So we're super excited to have you for that as well. Yeah.

I guess it plays a big part of my life. Um, but I think sometimes like mental on health plays like a big part of my life. Like the touring is like definitely like a strain on, on my brain. Yeah. And also I think like one of the biggest struggles for me in terms of like one of one of the biggest struggles is just like being on social media and constantly like being connected to the world and and all that stuff and and i feel like one of the i guess like what what you are at least like what i feel like i am and like what my life is is like the story i tell myself that it is and that's like always constantly

being tested by the sensory input that you're getting from social media and you constantly have to like reassess like who you are in relation to the world around you and the world around you changes so rapidly. And I think that like that's always very oh, you know, you have this perception in your head of like, this is the person that I am and this is how I feel about the world. And then you get so much information coming in and you all the time. You're like, you have to constantly reassess me like, is this who I am? Am I who I think I am? And do I really feel this way? And that, that makes it hard to focus on the things that I feel like, yes, mental health is, it's everything, right? It's just like part of your health. It is just, it is health. Your brain is a part of your body.

I personally kind of think that like, you know, I don't know, I think people think about like mental health as like a separate thing and that your brain is an organ just like all the other organs in your body. Yeah. And so I suppose like your consciousness is just like an emergent property of like whatever functions your brain is performing. And, you know, all of those things are impacted by like you're just your general health. So yeah. I guess like mental health is like it's always, it's very important. It's important. Guys is important.

But you're right. It's normal. Like we care about our general health, you know, on the daily. Our gun health, our heart health. Our physical health. Like that's just normal aspects of life. So why is your mental health any different than, you know, making sure you get your run in in the morning or, you know. Take your cholesterol pill. I don't know. I think it's a hard thing for people to grapple with because they want to feel like they have agency over the way that they feel. And so like accepting the fact that like their mental health is sort of the same thing as their physical health. is as hard for them because then they have to also accept the fact that like, you know,

the way that they feel is not always necessarily like they can't control it. But I suppose there are conscious things that you can do to like, you know, you can eating better and like having better habits and stuff like that. But I think it's like it is, it's hard. There's this like taboo around it because like people think that like your feelings are separate from everything else and I feel like they're a part of everything. Yeah. But suppose it's more of like an existential thing.

Yeah. Was there like a moment in time, you know, or generally that you can remember, where you became aware of your mental health and was like, I need to like prioritize this? Like, I feel like I'm still trying to prioritize it. For sure. Yeah. With, yeah. Was there a moment in time where there was a moment in time where I realized that like the way that I felt,

I didn't really have as much control over like the way that I felt as I thought. as I thought I did and I had like this whole existential crisis like I made an I made after my first album I made another album and that album was a lot about like my mental health and realizing like wait

I don't control any of these things like where is my free will but maybe that was like where I started to realize like oh I need to start like taking care of myself I didn't I thought that I guess like a lot of my pursuits and music and stuff is like a lot of that was to try and fill whole or whatever and maybe I always felt inadequate or I wanted to like achieve a certain thing or like have a hit song or whatever and then I would feel better and then I kind of had

some of that stuff and then I think a lot of my struggles were complicated by that I think it made it worse yeah were you like did you I guess struggle like for me I never personally struggled with my mental health until like COVID like we talked about was your mental health something that was addressed prior to you having a music career like Like growing up, did you encounter that at a young age? Is it always been a part of your life or when did it kind of first make its appearance? Yeah. I guess when I was like little, I couldn't like focus in school.

So I remember I had like in kindergarten like first grade. I like was I think I was held back or I was in like this special class. And I came home and I told my mom was like, mom like I'm in the special class. And my sister goes, that class is for dummies. Oh my gosh. I was like, no, it's not. Yeah, I guess like I couldn't really focus. And so that was like an issue for me early on.

I don't know, maybe those are like the first sort of, that's like the first experience I had with that. I don't know. I don't know how to answer the question. I made my sister look bad though. Not I feel bad. She's going to be like, first you talk about my violin playing. My sister's amazing.

She's the best. And actually one of the people that helps me most with like, I don't know, my mental health struggles, I suppose. Yeah. Yeah. I suppose that I don't know if like my first like experience, that was like my first experience with mental health. And I don't know if that's like means that like my like the way that I see the world or like the way that I focus and stuff is like indicative of like mental unhealth. But I think that like the way that my brain is was structured is not necessarily like set up for the way that society. is set up in terms of like.

So I guess like, you know. It's wired differently. Yeah, I guess having to deal with like having to reconcile like the fact that my brain works like slightly differently than like the way that things were set up was like a source of mental on health because like having to go to school in the mornings and like wake up at a certain time and like follow the routine that was like given to me was not necessarily like how I function. And so that was a source of a lot of like depression because I had to wake up every day

and do things that didn't necessarily feel natural to me and learn in a way that wasn't natural to me. Like, I'm an auditory person. I'm not a visual person. And so having to, like, read to get all of my information. Like, I like to listen to podcasts, and I like to listen to music. Yeah.

And so I think music was actually the first thing that I could do that allowed me to, gave me the freedom and the autonomy to learn the way that I wanted to learn. And so I think that, like, I don't know, although, like, my pursuits and music has also been, like, a source of a lot of, like, mental health struggles.

I think it was like the first time where I could like sort of take control and learn the way that I wanted to learn. But I guess like, I guess my first struggles weren't in school because I was like, oh, my brain like doesn't work this way. And trying to fit like, trying to like structure my life around that

was really, really hard. And I still find, I still struggle with a lot of that stuff. But yeah, that was like my first big like, uh-oh, like this is not, this doesn't work. What's going on here? Yeah.

Yeah. We kind of touched on it earlier how like your like your second album and like your songwriting is kind of like your outlet to like, you know, explaining your brain and you're just so vulnerable and like honest with your lyrics. Was that like scary at all for you to do or was it like like what was that like process of you like, you know, sharing that side of yourself like with the world? I don't really know how to like be any other way like with my words. Well, I'm trying to relate it to what I was saying before. Let me think. I would be terrified. I mean, I've always been like a very private person.

And, you know, in the last few years, I've started opening up more and felt more comfortable, you know, letting people into, you know, the deeper side of me, you know, win so much of your life. like is in the spotlight, I would just like automatically go like this and just try and always, you know, put on the happy face and, you know, I want life to come across like, you know, it's perfect. And your vulnerability and your songwriting from the very beginning is just commendable because it's like, I wouldn't be able to do that, but it's super cool. Well, I think I felt like misunderstood, I suppose like because when I was trying to, I guess a lot of it started with school where I was like, it didn't work for me. And like the way that I,

the way that I'm oriented, it's just obviously like it didn't really jive with the way that things were set up. And then I thought like my teachers or maybe like they were like, oh, he, maybe he's stupid or maybe he's like, he's lazy or maybe he can't focus. Maybe he doesn't care. He has this apathetic attitude.

And I think like my music was like the first place where I could be like, no, like that's not who I am. Like, this is who I really am. And so like getting to put. like my the way that I feel into like my songs it makes me feel good makes me feel understood so when people hear the words and like oh I relate to that or oh I get it I feel like it's my chance to like explain to people like no no that's not you thought this about me but like this is who I this is who I actually am I love that so I like I like doing it I like I like being honest and and I actually

feel more I feel most uncomfortable when I you know am maybe singing words that aren't necessarily like true to me one of the the one of the things that I started doing when I was learning how to play music, because I learned how to play music off of YouTube. So at the time, like, you know, YouTube covers were big and stuff. And people were, like, getting, like, making big YouTube channels off of singing other people's songs, which is awesome. And I tried that.

And it just didn't feel right for me because I was like, I didn't write these words, you know. So because I didn't start out writing songs. I started out, like, singing at first. And then I was like, well, I feel like it would feel more natural if I were singing something that I wrote. I think that, by the way, those like YouTube videos is what my brother-in-law started sending me of you. Okay. Okay. Yeah, it was a while ago. Okay. Then that's a long time ago. I started out. I remember like I posted in high school, this never made it to YouTube. It was just Facebook video. I was saying like I-as, you know, that melody. Shadis, like a melody. And I did that on my,

yeah, I deleted that like a long time ago. That was like so embarrassing. Let's pull it up. but you could find it somewhere on the internet I'm sure it's somewhere yeah no it's not I'm not anywhere you won't be able to find every Google search possible no it's gone it's gone dang it that's so funny that's such a like unique outlook I love like I love that you just like feel comfortable doing that

I will I just don't think that I guess like music for me is like I just I guess like that's just now I'm like unearthing all of these like feelings inside me that I haven't thought about. But I guess I just feel like people didn't really understand me. I always kind of felt like I needed to prove myself, like, oh, you don't get it, you know? And so I'm trying to write songs and do all that stuff so that I can put that out in the world so that I feel like people understand me, you know? Yeah. And maybe that's unhealthy because maybe I should just be content, you know? Maybe people do understand this well. Maybe I don't understand myself, but it's like my attempt of being like,

hey, like, this is like, this is who I am. I just want people to know who I am. Yeah. So that's why, I think like, that's why I like to write lyrics. Lyrics are like the most important part for me. Yeah. Yeah. I was going to say that I've kind of answered it, but, you know, songwriting definitely seems like a good, like, outlet for you just to like write your brain. Yeah, it can be. It also can be painful too It's like make songs Because also they also have to be like commercially viable as well

And like that can be like a whole other thing Finding that like balance. Yeah but I don't know Have you ever have you guys ever written songs? No no no no no songwriting When you're when you're acting does that Does that feel like does it kind of give you the same Release like yeah it

Yeah sometimes I mean yeah Depending on the role. But yeah, definitely there's times where playing a certain role allows me to, you know, explore areas of myself that maybe I wouldn't be comfortable doing otherwise. And, you know, teaches myself something about me that I didn't even know. So maybe that's, yeah. But musically, I am as untalented as it comes. I don't take and probably

attest to that. Do you make music? I don't make music. I danced my whole life, so I love music. But yeah, Taylor can't count and they count to save his life. But that was that was a story. I never know.

I used to ask her when we started dating, I used to ask her like, what do you want for Christmas? What do you want for your birthday? And you know what her answer always was? She hasn't said it in a while. But for like the first three years of us dating, it was I want singing lessons.

I'm like, what? Did you ever do them? No, he never got me, though. I was mad at him for a couple years. I always thought she was kidding. And I just decided to let it go. I mean, no, I'm not looking to become the next frickin' pop star, but I just

love music. Like, music is like definitely, I mean, music and dance has been such a way for me to express myself and an outlet like all like my life growing up. What's your, like, what's your favorite kind of music to listen to? Oh gosh. Who's your favorite artist?

I don't even know. I'm kind of all over the. the place. It just depends on my mood. Okay. Like what I'm... Yeah, but you, yeah, you love like a moody somewhat sad song that you can like, you'd be doing like a little bit of a guy. I know a guy.

You just want to crawl and, you know, a hole in a dark room and just... But I can listen to those and be like, wow, like, it could go either way. It could be like some people like hear like emotional like depth songs or like honest songs and are like, wow, like, you know, this is like not really. breakup music, but like the sad, rainy music. And that's like something I'm like sitting in the car, like, that I like just enjoy listening to like in a, in a mid, like in my normal life. Yeah.

But, um, but now I'm not looking to to become a pop star. I was just, it was just, it was just something that I wanted to. Because I was going to say up with a singing coach here. I could, I, I could teach you how to sing if you want. Probably wouldn't end well. I have, I have surprised myself sometimes. I'll like sing words into this mic and we'll hear it back and we're like oh you're like oh damn that's pretty good we'll be in the car and you'll hit a note there we'll be in the car and you'll hit a note and I'm like

I did see her as a kid it's fine no I went away when I hit puberty I feel like that still changes something in girls and it went out the window I can stop talking about by singing I'm sweating now you have publicly shared about having OCD and struggling with it what what does that look on a day-to-day basis for you? Well, I think that it's hard for me sometimes to let things go. So that could be difficult, especially like, or if I like, I fixate on things too. And sometimes I find that it's actually like a great tool for me because when I'm learning how to play, when I learned how to play guitar, I got like super.

obsessed with it, you know? So I was just like locked myself in my room for three months, you know, and just like, I was like, I have to learn how to play, you know, and everyone was like, oh, you can't, you shouldn't, you should get a teacher, you should like, no, I'm going to, this is what I want to do. So I'm going to figure out a way to do it. Then there are times where there are things that, mistakes that I've made and I persevereate and I try to play over my head like, oh, I could have done this differently, I could have done that differently. And that's not very helpful. Yeah. And then I have like weird. like habits, you know, like sometimes I have to check to make sure I lock the door like a certain

way, you know, I'll wake up in the middle. I'm like, oh, I didn't do it, you know? And it's like, yeah. Yeah, so that can be challenging. I just think I overthink things and, yeah, I just play through different scenarios in my head over and over and over again. Yeah. And it's not helpful. So that can be challenging for me. So I'm trying to figure out ways I can move past that. Would you say there's any common misconceptions, um, about OCD that people assume? Well, I don't really have like a super deep understanding of OCD like in the broader sense and how it impacts different people. So yeah, just I can't really say.

So I can't answer that. Yeah, I don't know for your life. Also, I'm not like an expert on any of these things either. So like I just say, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We definitely.

I mean, that's that's our biggest thing. It's like, obviously, you know, we're not doctors. we don't know, you know, the actual science behind these things, but, you know, we've, all three of us are just sharing our personal experiences. And I feel like that goes a long way for people, you know, people who have OCD, like hearing your experience with it is a lot more relatable and people feel heard. Hearing that, then, you know, an explanation of the science behind it from a doctor that doesn't like make them feel heard. I know. It never does anything for me. Like, I barely understand what they're saying. I'm like, give it to me in layman's terms. Yeah.

how what it looks like in your life so I can find out how it relates to me. Yeah. So your, your input at all the above is great and is very appreciated because I know our, I know our listeners are loving this episode. Yeah. Already. Something I do know that has been important to you, I believe.

Correct me if I'm wrong and has definitely been important to me on my mental health journey is exercise. Like I, you know, I, it's just super simple. Like sometimes if I don't start my day or don't incorporate that into my day for, you know, a week because I get lazy and it's not, you know, the thought of doing it isn't fun. I will notice that I'm having a rougher week. Yeah. Is that the same for you? Yeah.

And it's hard for me to like, I'm not like a very regimented person. Yeah. So it's really difficult for me to like keep those routines. but I feel like trying to force myself to have a routine and to exercise and to like make my bed and brush my teeth and do all of those just like basic maintenance things are like really, really important for me to like keep my brain and check. I think one of the things that like my OCD will do is that like, you know, when I find one thing to fix it on, it becomes like the most important thing. And so then like all of the other things kind of fall to the wayside. Yeah. And that that has like a sort of the downstream effect of like impacting my.

routine which ultimately impacts like just sort of like my my mood and everything like that so yeah that is it does help like exercising and stuff and like eating right but I struggle with keeping keeping that in check it's like a pretty hard thing for me to do same yeah he definitely keeps me like in line with that because I mean obviously as we talked about dancing like working out that was my outlet for so long and then when I stopped dancing um it's been it's been hard for me to find that love of like exercise again. I don't know if there's like a wall up there. Can you not dance anymore?

I mean, I can, but it's definitely harder. I'm a terrible dancer. It's been hard for me to get back into like enjoying exercise. And Taylor is really good at it. I wouldn't say I enjoy it. I enjoy how I feel afterwards. But you're really good at giving me accountable because I would just like sit like on my computer and work or like sit and organize something all day if I could and like not move.

Taylor's very good at being like, okay, we're going to go now. What do you mean like, sit and like organize? What do you mean? And you're saying? She does love organizing. I have a lot of things that need organizing. Organizing brings me a lot of joy. Yeah, no, we'll like wake up in the morning.

She's like, okay, we're gonna, we got a lot of things to tidy up today. I'm like, what? The house looks perfect. Like, well, I'll make a list. I'm like, okay. Meanwhile, I wake up like an hour before Taylor ish, maybe. a little more, but I'm like, oh, this needs to be done this. I'm like a list person because that's just how I've trained my brain to be because I'll

forget about things. So I have to make a list and he'll wake up. And he's like, morning. I'm like, we have this, this, this, this and this to do. He's like, can I breathe for two seconds? Let me open my eyes before I get your list for the day. I've gotten better. Yeah.

But I will admit a list helps me. Yeah. Yeah, a list helps you. So that's why I make him a list. But anyways, back to what we were talking about. about exercise. Have, has that been like a part of your,

I mean, routine, so to say, like with touring? Like, how do you incorporate that? It's really, really hard to do.

Yeah. It's home traveling. It's, yeah. I just like give up on it. I tried on this last tour. We bought some weights and stuff. And then I used those for like two weeks,

week and a half. And then it kind of like fell apart. But for the first two weeks, it was really nice. Yeah. Yeah. Living on a bus, it's really hard to do that. I'm trying to eat better.

So, like, putting, like, we change the riders so that, like, in the green room, there's, like, better stuff. But I know that, like, moving forward, I have to, like, at least over this last year, I've put, like, there's, like, an hour in my schedule around 10 a.m. Where, like, I have to exercise, you know? And I've actually been pretty good at sticking to that. But I've kind of fallen apart in these last few weeks. Yeah.

But, yeah. It's hard with, like, holiday season. I feel like, too. Yeah. That's like, and then, like, I feel like that's like. A lot of it is momentum-based as well. So if you can, like, stay in check. For sure.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I've kind of like lost a little bit of steam. But yeah. I know. I'm the same way. As soon as I get out of that routine, it's so difficult to get back into it.

I kind of feel like that's where we're at right now. We haven't worked out of it. Yeah. We've been traveling a lot. It's true. Travel really does mess it up. I mean, I was more disciplined than I guess when we're,

when we were in every different hotel. If I just woke up. earlier to do that. Yeah. Then we don't bring our running shoes and then it's... And then I get sweaty. I do want to ask this because I was thinking about it, if you're comfortable with answering. I feel like with OCD, you need a schedule and ADD it's hard to have a schedule.

How, like, a routine? How does that, like, work for you? It doesn't. It doesn't work for me really well at all, actually. Yeah. Yeah, I don't know. I struggle with it a lot. But I've been, this last year I haven't really toured so much. So I've been at home, which has been really helpful for me.

And I've had like a decently consistent schedule, which is good for my songwriting. Because I find it's like, it's actually, I write, even though some of my songs are a little bit like more melancholy. I actually write better songs. I feel when I'm happy. And I feel like I'm happier when I have a routine and I'm at home. So that's been good. So this year I just kind of been sticking to like I centered most things around my session schedule. So I set up like songwriting sessions and then I was like I have to, you know, that have to be there at one.

So I got to get all these things done before that. And that was really good for me. Yeah. So how often do you like write like how often is that like incorporated? I wrote like 120 songs, 130 songs this last year. So like every day almost if I can. But not every day because then that would be like 365 songs. I could do math a little bit. But like almost. But yeah, I pretty much like every day I would be in the studio. some days I'm just like recording or whatever. Yeah. But yeah, I try to like keep a schedule on that. And it's funny because like, yeah, I don't know. I guess I'm not sure. But yeah, I wrote a lot of songs.

So that was good for me. And now, yeah, I guess like the mental health struggle now is like sort of like I have to release those songs and then, you know, I have to sort of like post them online and see how they do. And that can be challenging because you have this person. in your head of like, oh, you're hoping the song will be received a certain way or hoping people will feel like you have, you know, you're like, oh, this is what I think the music is, but you don't really know what it is until it like has a chance to be out there in the

universe. And then having to sort of like see that come to life is like a really challenging thing. Yeah. That's like, it's pretty scary. So I have a lot of anxiety about releasing music. Interesting. Which I'm currently dealing with like right now. In my head, I'm like freaking out about it but because you know you work so hard on this thing and then you have to like put it out and then you have people judge it and it's like oh yeah yeah and then you have to like market it online and yeah do all that stuff and it's just like the whole thing I this is just a curiosity question is it I would think that it would be super challenging if you write that you know many songs and your songs you clearly care about like you you you

each and every one of them, I'm sure. Is it incredibly challenging narrowing that down to the, you know, the small amount compared to that, you know, what's going to be released? Yeah, it is really hard because it's hard to, I want to pick the ones that are the best, you know, and the ones that resonate with people the most. I think that's like why I'm making the music. And it's hard for me to sort of like, it's hard for me to be objective about the songs. So, yeah, it's quite difficult, and I don't always get it right.

But I think, like, just sort of, like, I have a few people that I play them for, and then I kind of just sort of see what the consensus is. And then I just, you know, yeah, it's hard. And I don't know if I made the right choices either. You know? So I'm like, now I'm like, as we're sitting here, I'm like, and maybe I should have picked a different one for the first single I should have done. Like, that's where a lot, like, my struggles are really sort of like,

yeah. Yeah. Because I just want, like I said, like I just want to be understood, you know, and then like the fear in my head of like not being understood and having picked the wrong thing or having done the wrong thing and then wishing I could have done it a different way. It's just like, ugh. Yeah. And now I'm on like album number four.

I guess my first one was like a mixtape, but like, you know, but I guess album number three, four, but it's just like, oh, I'm doing it again. Like, oh, no. Oh, no. I think people are enjoying this. Not again. Yeah. Well, you're passionate about it.

And it's like your baby. So, you know, it's hard to share, you know, something that you've worked so hard on, something you love with the world, like just to maybe have them be like, oh, no, we don't like the song. And that's like a part of you. Sometimes I don't know if I, like, love it or not until like I know how other people feel about it, which I think is not necessarily like a healthy thing. Yeah. Yeah.

No, I'm, I'm similar in that way. Yeah. We have a friend that has been, he's a singer-songwriter and he's been sitting on. album of his for a long time that he wrote that he hasn't released so because of this same thing so we definitely why won't you release it? I think it's a good question. Yeah, that's what we're trying to figure out. But I imagine it's just fear of how it will be perceived or I don't know because every person he shows the stuff to every person is like, this is unbelievable. Like what are you doing? And he's just like so

particular about, you know, letting it out to the world. So there must be something that's just like I think the thing for me that's like the most challenging. I think like for me like making art is like when you make art, you're not really like making something. I think like what artists like really are doing is like they're sort of like shifting. They're taking something and they're sort of like changing the context around it so that they can present it to people in a different way. So you can take like these words or whatever, take these ideas, take this music and be able to. like, okay, well, you know, you haven't heard a genre, like our music in this genre, like, with this kind of voice or like, you know, with this, you know, you're just sort of like moving

things around and then presenting it to people. And they're like, oh, I haven't seen something like that in that light. And in order to do that, you have to be like really aware of like the palette that you're painting with. You know, you have to be like pretty like, you have to be as self-aware as possible, especially like when, you know, like one of the colors that you're, you're painting with is like you, you're the artist and like it's your voice. So, if you put something out and you have this perception of like how it's going to be received and then it isn't perceived that way then you have to sort of like reassess whether or not you're actually like maybe like maybe I've maybe I got it all wrong like maybe the way that I was looking at the world maybe I don't fit into the world in the way that I thought that I did and having to sort of like shift like having to reconcile like what your perception is versus reality is like a it's like a really scary thing to do and sometimes that sort of is what keeps me from putting my music out because I'm like well if I got this wrong and that means that the way I've been thinking about this is.

is totally wrong and that means that I have to reassess my entire worldview and that is like a lot to do you know and so it's like if I you know because like I have this view of myself and like where I fit into like sort of like the cultural pantheon you know which is like and it's like you know I can you know as a person like I think if you're a comedian it's like certain comedians like they make jokes or whatever and it's like they're aware of like who they are and some people like they make fun of themselves but in order to make fun of yourself and have it make sense and be funny you have to be a of like who you are and what things about you are funny. And if you get up on stage and what you think about you is funny,

it's not funny to the audience, then you're like, you have to be like, damn, the way I've been thinking about this for the last like two years and like writing this stand-up set is not right. And like I don't actually like, maybe I'm not living in the world I thought I was living in, you know?

And the way that you put those things to the test is by like putting your art out in the world and seeing how it's received and seeing how it lives. And if it doesn't live the way that you thought that it was going to, then you've made a serious error. And it's like, that's like earth shattering. You know, that's like, that's like, oh, oh, can I curse? Yeah. Oh, shit.

Like, I was wrong. Like the thing, like, my voice doesn't sound the way that I wanted to sound. Like, for example, I don't know if I'm explaining it the right way, but like, like, Willie Nelson, like, doesn't traditionally, like, have the best voice ever. And if you would have heard, I mean, even like when Neil Young started out, like, you know, they told them that, like, you're never going to be, you're never going to be successful on your own. You don't have the right kind of voice.

But it doesn't matter, like, how your voice sounds. It matters. for example, like Mark Hoppice is not like, you know, he's not going to sing an Adele song, but in Blink 182, his voice makes sense. Like in that genre, the voice makes sense. So, yeah, I don't remember what I was going to say, but. No, that's fascinating. Well, I was saying something.

But, uh, yeah, anyways. Just how, like, you're perceived. Yeah, you just have to be like, you're like, man, maybe I'm not self-aware as I thought I was. And then you're like, damn, are all those things I was doing? Like, man, that was pretty embarrassing. Like, oh, shit. Like I thought people thought this about me And I thought that I was this, but I guess I'm not this.

And then when you put out the music and you find out, and then it's like I'm afraid to find out, like if I was right or if I was wrong. Yeah. I mean, rightfully so. Tough in the world that we're in today, you know, social media and just the access to seeing everybody's opinions. Right. That's like what I think is like the most challenging thing about it. It's like you're always kind of like, you know, and also sometimes it's not,

always healthy to like kind of see those things happen in real time because sometimes those things have to develop over time and so like you you know in the past maybe you were sort of you didn't have a choice but to sort of like give yourself a minute to find out like how your things were perceived but now you kind of like get everything in real time and yeah sometimes getting that feedback immediately is not always necessary like the most healthy thing and also sometimes people it takes people a minute to sort of like discover things and live with it and for the art to like make its way in the world but yeah No, very true.

Something that is important to us, and I know that it's also important to you, is therapy. And I'm just curious, like, when did you start going or how long have you been going and what kind of impact has it had on you? I've been going to therapy for, when did I start? Like, when I was, like, 23, and it's been really helpful for me. And I've made it, like, a part of my routine. And when I miss, like, sessions and I miss a week or whatever, like, it really has an impact on me. But making sure I found the right person was really important. Was that easy for you?

Finding the right person? Yeah. Or did you have to go through? I met a few different people, but my dad is a physician, which is great. And so he was able to help me find someone who was really good pretty relatively quickly. So for that, I'm really grateful and I'm pretty lucky. So it didn't take me too long, but it's been helpful for me to, like, talk to somebody and kind of like work through my problems with someone and have some.

someone like sometimes, you know, people will point out things to you that you can't necessarily see when you're so deep in something. So to like tell someone how you're feeling and have them and be like, oh, you don't see the connection between these two things. Yeah. That's good. If someone is like, if there's someone listening right now that is like hesitant about going to therapy, like what advice or like encouragement would you give for them like to try it?

Well, I think that, you know, if you have the means to go and you are afraid and there's something holding you back and I don't know, I would say just try it and see what happens. You know, I also am aware of the fact that like having the means to go is like it's like a luxury to be able to do these things. So I think that it's not even necessarily just, you know, like talking to a professional. I think like if you are just afraid, if you're feeling sort of like anything and you are afraid of just sort of like telling someone or finding a friend or trusted like adult or whatever, like, I don't know. I feel like it's good to tell people things. Yeah. Talk about your feelings. Yeah.

Yeah. It's important. It doesn't have to be in a professional setting. Like, you know, I've been talking to a couple friends recently that have started going to therapy and they, you know, they. you know, feel like it's, they feel like ashamed because they feel like that means they've failed. Like what has gone so wrong that I, you know, have to go do this now. And I just try and encourage them and say, therapy and not doesn't even have to be in the professional sense. It can be with your friends, your family, whoever, just, you know, openly

talking about your feelings. Therapy and talking about your feelings should be a proactive thing. Like it doesn't, it doesn't mean you failed. It doesn't mean, you know, that something's gone wrong. Your life is in shambles. Like, it could be the case. Maybe. We all feel like that sometimes. But it really is just, it's, it's, you should be doing that proactively when everything's going right as well.

Yeah. So, yeah. Yeah. Go see a therapist. Do it. Well, speaking of, you have a new song out. Yeah. That we love.

called I sent my therapist to therapy. Yes, yeah, yeah. So good. So catchy. Thank you. Where did that idea come from? So this song, I wrote it about, I was feeling like pretty messed up

and feeling like pretty, I don't know, I just felt like, you know, this is not to discourage anyone from going to therapy, but also the therapists are people too. And I was like, man, I wonder what my therapist thinks about these things that I'm telling him. Like, maybe I'm, like, pretty, if I'm, like, pretty messed up.

And I was like, man, I wonder if, I don't know, I started to get this idea of, like, what if I wrote a song about, like, sort of like a tongue-in-cheek, kind of, like, funny song, but, like, serious in a way about going to therapy. And maybe, like, in the story that I'm telling, like, I'm actually so messed up that I send my therapist to therapy. Yeah. And that's kind of, like, how it came about.

It started with a title that I had written down. And I was like, oh, that's kind of a clever thing to say. I wonder what that could be about. And so then I kind of just like, I was like, well, what's my experience with this? And then I thought it would be cool at the end to have your therapist go to therapy and then have that therapist tell him like, actually, now I have to go to therapy. And now it's just sort of this like endless line of people who are going to therapy because of the problems that I have.

And so, yeah, that's where the song came from. but I was just trying to talk about things that were relevant to me in my life. And like going to my therapist weekly was one of the things that I tried to, you know, I made a part of my routine. And so I was like, well, I should talk about that in some way. So, yeah. It's a good one. I love it.

You have many good ones, but it's fantastic. Thanks. Go give it a listen right now. The irony is is now like having to put it out and figuring out how I'm going to market it. And it's going to send me back to therapy. A whole new line of people are going to end. It will never end. Yeah.

And so it's, you know, such is life, you know. Yeah, that's how, that's what life is. I love it. That's so great. Hopefully it's well received. Go check out the song. Yeah. And thank you for being here with us today.

And I mean, thank you for just being like the vulnerable artist that you are in sharing your, you know, life story with everyone. Because I know it helps. a lot of people listening. I mean, I even myself took snippets from you today. Then I'm like, wow, I do that same thing. I was literally writing notes down here when you were talking. I remember any of the things that I said. Well, I do.

So I got you. Thank you, bud. So nice meeting you. Appreciate it. Of course. Thank you so much for squeezing us into your day. Please be sure to rate, review, and follow our pod and check out full episodes on YouTube. You can follow me at Taylor Lautner.

my lovely wife at Tay Lautner. Check out the squeeze on Instagram at The Squeeze. And also give a little glance and a follow to Lemons by Tay. That's at Lemonsbytee on Instagram and lemonsbytea.com. And also be sure to email us,lautner.com.com. If you guys have any questions, any guests you'd like to see you. But most importantly, please continue to talk about your journey with those around you and sent our show to a friend that you think could use a little extra squeeze in their life. Absolutely. Tootles-McGoodles, everyone. This podcast has been brought to you by Podcast Nation.