The Startup Ideas Podcast - He's built multiple $1M+ funnels, Here's What Works In 2025

Episode Date: April 21, 2025

Join me as I chat with Niels Klement, CMO of Perspective, we discuss how agencies are building highly profitable productized services using AI. He explains that the most successful approach involves focusing on a specific industry niche, creating a repeatable funnel template that delivers consistent results, and using AI to automate fulfillment. The discussion covers funnel optimization techniques, the importance of mobile-first design, and how interactive elements like quizzes significantly improve conversion rates.Timestamps:00:00 - Intro01:44 - Overview of productized services and funnel building03:21 - How to build a niche-focused service07:59 - Implementation of funnel templates and ads11:10 -  Funnel Strategies in 202514:43 - How to make a great VSL18:54 -  Funnel Strategies in 2025 pt221:05 - Where to use funnels23:51 - Demonstration of Perspective funnel building29:48 - Using funnels to validate startup ideasBuild your next sales funnel: https://try.perspective.co/4i8i3dkviavyKey Points:• Agencies are building highly profitable productized services ($10K-100K/month) by focusing on specific niches and using AI and funnel tools like Perspective• The most successful agencies target industries that aren't tech-savvy and focus on business-critical services like recruiting and lead generation• High-converting funnels use interactive elements, personalization, and quiz formats to achieve 26-28% conversion rates on cold traffic• AI can automate much of the service delivery, allowing small teams or solo founders to scale to significant revenue1) The Productized Service RevolutionAgencies are shifting from service-heavy to product-heavy models using AI + automation.Some are scaling to $1M/MONTH with 80% profit margins by:• Targeting specific niches (bakeries, lawyers, etc)• Delivering business-critical results• Using ONE killer funnel templateThe best part? You can run this with just 1-2 freelancers + AI agents.2) The Two Most Profitable Service ModelsAcross thousands of agencies using Perspective, two business models consistently outperform:A) RECRUITING FUNNELSHelp businesses find talent through automated systemsB) LEAD GENERATION FUNNELSDeliver qualified prospects to businesses3) The "One Funnel, Sell Twice" StrategyThe most successful agencies:• Pick ONE industry (preferably not tech-savvy)• Create ONE funnel template that delivers results• Use AI to customize it for each client• Automate fulfillment with AI agentsTop agencies in Perspective convert at 26-28% on COLD traffic! 4) What Makes High-Converting Funnels Work?The best performing funnels focus on:• SPEED: Pages loading less than 1 second convert 2.5X better• INTERACTIVITY: Quiz elements that create engagement• PERSONALIZATION: Tailoring content based on responses• CONSISTENCY: Matching ad messaging to landing pageThese elements create a "dopamine hit" similar to social feeds.5) The VSL (Video Sales Letter) FrameworkFor creating high-converting video content:• Focus intensely on the HOOK (first 5 seconds)• Provide genuine EDUCATION and value• Show PROOF that builds credibility• Create a natural progression to the OFFER6) How To Build Your First FunnelThe process is simpler than you think:1. Start with a mobile-first approach (95% of paid social traffic is mobile)2. Use quiz elements to qualify leads3. Personalize follow-up based on responses4. A/B test continuously (Perspective makes this easy)7) The Startup Validation Strategy1. Build an audience on social2. Create a funnel to test messaging3. Send organic traffic to validate4. Collect quiz data to understand pain points5. THEN build your productKEY TAKEAWAY:The future of services is PRODUCTIZED.With tools like Perspective + AI, you can build a highly profitable, low-overhead business by:• Focusing on one niche• Delivering one critical result• Using one killer funnel• Automating with AILCA helps Fortune 500s and fast-growing startups build their future - from Warner Music to Fortnite to Dropbox. We turn 'what if' into reality with AI, apps, and next-gen products https://latecheckout.agency/BoringAds — ads agency that will build you profitable ad campaigns http://boringads.com/BoringMarketing — SEO agency and tools to get your organic customers http://boringmarketing.com/Startup Empire - a membership for builders who want to build cash-flowing businesses https://www.startupempire.coFIND ME ON SOCIALX/Twitter: https://twitter.com/gregisenbergInstagram: https://instagram.com/gregisenberg/LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gisenberg/FIND NIELS ON SOCIALInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/nielsklementLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nielsklement/

This episode is with Nils. He's the CEO Perspective, which is a funnel building software. He shows us how he's spending $250,000 a month to drive people to funnels, how to design funnels that work, how to use AI to automate a lot of it. And I thought this was a really fascinating episode. I've been meaning to go deeper on funnels. It's such a boring topic. But I haven't had the time.

Brought on Nils. He shows me. He shows you. You'll learn a lot. Hope you enjoy the episode. Nils, welcome to the Startup Ideas podcast. If people stick through the entire episode, what are they going to learn?

Dude, first of all, very, very excited to be here. I prepared a little something because I know you guys are all up for business opportunities and we run Perspective, a funnel building tool for primarily agencies and some of these agencies are doing exceptionally well, building super profitable product-type services on the back of AI and

perspective essentially. And so I thought I'll share a little bit about how that works, how to build a funnel, how that service, what that service looks like from a high level perspective and how some of these are even scaling to, you know, 50, 100 grand a month quite quickly. So that will be that. Cool. So in other words, you're going to spill the sauce on productized services, funnel building, AI, using a new tool called perspective, which by the way, I haven't, I've only seen the landing page. I haven't used it. So I'm looking forward to seeing how it works. Dude, we'll definitely get you set up with an account right after, if you like that 100%.

All right. Let's rock. Yeah, so let's jump out in. So first of all, I just want to share one of the most successful funnel templates that we have. That's a prospective recruiting funnel. And this one is a prospective appointment funnel. And so as I said before, we literally have, so we have over 6,000 active customers. And amongst this customer base, we have hundreds of.

of agencies doing anywhere from 10 to 100 grand a month, basically running these funnels as a product-type service. And I've even seen agencies scale with a service like that to a million a month. And they do that by super specifically generating results, business critical results in a specific niche. So one of these crazy agencies that does almost a million a month is basically doing recruiting for bakeries. We have another agency that is most. than 50 people that is doing lead generation for lawyers. Right. And so why am I telling this essentially because I think now with AI more than ever,

there's this super unique opportunity to build very productized services that are almost more on a product side rather than the service site, especially with AI and tools like perspective because it just can go like that, where you as the founder, for example, can literally build a site business that does 400 grand, 500 grand a month. 80% profit and you're basically the only team maybe one or two freelancers and a bunch of agents. That's like the main idea and I think that's the huge opportunity. And so basically I've prepared this little fig jam for one of our masterminds coming up. And so how these agencies are usually doing that, I already shared that a little bit, right?

But the most successful agencies are usually picking one industry. And it's ideally an industry that it's not too tax savvy, right? Not that they would go ahead and build out the funnels themselves. so run the entire marketing themselves. It's usually one of those industries that don't want anything to do with it. So we've seen some agencies in insurance, manufacturing law. I mentioned that before. Medical, solar, like you name it.

We have hundreds and hundreds of different industries being represented by these agencies. And then they just go ahead and basically choose a business critical service or a business critical results because that is literally the only thing that will still get you low churn in the agency business nowadays, right? And across our customer base, the two predominant things are recruiting a DGEN. So what does every business need essentially, right? It's new people if you want to scale up

or it's new customers if you want to scale up. Some are even doing both, depending on what the customer asks for. And so then, of course, if you have that figured out, if you know what you want to focus on, you can go ahead and build out the entire service, especially if you have that niche focus, right? It's when you can build one sell twice

and now with AI more than ever, and then the prospective agencies or the agencies that are running the service are first and foremost doing when they set up their account is essentially figure out this one funnel, right? Figure out exactly what type of offer would work for this industry. So for example, this lawyer agency that I mentioned before. So they have figured out a quiz funnel approach that basically gets the lawyers that they work with, like claimants like it's clockwork. And these are like the guys are literally on top of our high scores list every single week with funnels that are 40, 50% conversion. which is unheard of if you're running cold paid traffic, right? And so that is essentially what they're doing.

They're figuring out this one concept. And then from there on, the entire service can, of course, be optimized and built around that where you have GPT create the new copy on the basis of the onboarding survey or whatever it really is. And so that is what I want to talk about a little bit more now because, as I said, I think now with tools like perspective or especially like AI, this is just going to get even better. where you can run this entire service as a single founder with a very small team or no team at all. And so what we've seen work, and by the way, we have, like, yeah, go ahead.

You've peaked my interest. Let's just put it up with that lightly. What you're saying is basically there are people out there that are creating productized services that are more products than services that are using automation, AI, and one killer funnel to focus on a niche. And there are people out there making hundreds of thousands. of dollars a month doing it. It's very interesting to me.

I have a friend. He's a friend of the pod, a very close friend of the pod, Gice Cream. People in the comment section will know. He always is in my ear about how important a funnel is and how you can create a funnel

that can generate many, many, many, seven, eight, nine, ten figures. And if you look at popular, even popular products today, like AG1 from athletic greens, is a funnel. Like I was actually looking

today. I saw an ad from AG1. You cold traffic, get on a landing page, go straight to subscribe, and then you get three free gifts. Yeah. So what I hope to get out of this episode today is just learning about how people are doing this with respect to product and services. So I'm interested. Happy to hear, dude. And to that point, man, I think like we're also an amazing case study, right? We have taken perspective to more than 10 million in ARR primarily through funnels and pay performance marketing. Like we have a, I have a friend that his business does nine figures a year and basically their main channel is meta ads, right? Towards simple funnels and they maybe have like three to four funnels and that's it. It's nine figures, man. And so yeah, the power of these are immense.

And so I'll definitely spill the source on some of our most successful funnels if that's what you're also interested in. But what I wanted to say originally is we have another friend. He's running an agency consulting business. Basically what they're doing is their main product is they're coming into existing agencies. They're basically deploying AI systems to automate that entire fulfillment. And so we're more heavy on the funnel side of things and, you know, the actual, the thing that you'll put behind the ad. But I think that's just like such an interesting thought process because all of a sudden

this super only people leveraged business model will turn into something that is very eye leveraged and or technology leveraged. Exactly. And so what most of these agencies are doing, they're basically, like first of all, they already set up a funnel just to onboard the clients, right? So it's more or less like a survey in this case. And I'll get to why they use perspective for that a lot as well in the bit. Quick break in the pod to tell you a little bit about startup empire.

So startup empire is my private membership where it's a bunch of people like me, like you, who want to build out their startup ideas. Now they're looking for content to help accelerate that. They're looking for potential co-founders. They're looking for tutorials from people like me to come in and tell them, how do you do email marketing? How do you build an audience? How do you go viral on Twitter? All these different things.

That's exactly what startup empire is. And it's for people who want to start a startup but are looking for ideas or it's for people who have a startup, but just they're not seeing the traction that they need. So you can check out the link to startup empire.com in the description. But then from there on, once you have that data, you can literally go ahead. And once you have that one funnel figured out, you know exactly what the structure is. You only need to basically apply the new copy that is on the basis of the business, right? You have to apply the new colors, the branding, all that good stuff.

And then it's ready to launch. Ideally, even, depending on what type of offer you have, you could even go ahead with GPT and generate the ad creators. Although, like, for example, for lead gen businesses, the outputs vary in terms of quality. I'd maybe still be a little bit careful with that. But at the same time, like having the copy already done is, of course, something that's definitely a use case. Next to, of course, having the entire operations sourced out to AI agents, right, the entire invoicing, the CRM updates.

And we've seen all of that work super, super well. And so what you would have to do from there on is essentially just apply that to the funnel, that one funnel template that you have figured out for that specific industry because you know it will get results. because that is essentially the only thing that you should care about as an agency, right, is getting your customer's results because then it's when they'll stick around, well, they'll have huge LTVs, and that's when you are actually able to scale an agency business. And so, yeah, that is basically then the next step,

implement the funnel template and emails. And of course, the ads, I would also suggest to go with static ads. That's usually for simple leaching campaigns or simple recruiting campaigns. That's what you need to do. You can always start with static ads, so much lower cost to just do that, right? especially as an agency service and then having that copy generated and just put into templates again, basically makes that service very, very easy to run. And so some of the things why perspective funnel specifically, and we'll go and build out a funnel

a little bit, but going back to, for example, that Lichen example, right? So this is one of our appointment funnel templates. I'm not sure. Like, have you recently clicked on any ads, Greg? Dude, that AG1 ad got me this morning. And you have been sold? Yeah? I wasn't sold.

First of all, I used to be a customer. I thought about clicking subscribe. I definitely thought about it. Got it, got it, got it. Yeah, dude, so good job with or for AG1 then. That's exciting to hear. But essentially, like, the main problem that we've been seeing out there is that funnels really, or websites, as a matter of fact,

didn't really evolve for such a long time, right? So the concept funnels came around back in 2014, maybe 2013. And essentially, there's a huge disconnect that's happening when you're clicking on an ad and then when you're led to the funnel. Where, for example, right, we're in the ages of TikTok, in the ages of Instagram, reals, like people are left with hit with dopamine hits left and right. And then you click on an ad and boom, there's this huge text. It's very hard to navigate. It's not beautiful, right? And this is exactly where perspective comes in.

And this is where the idea stem from because what we are very much optimizing for is this delightful experience. is the speed of use. So, for example, I've shared this on the pot with Cody as well, but like loading speeds, right? Just this one tweak that I think everybody is aware of. Most people don't really know how important that actually is in driving conversions. Like there are studies that say, you know, pages loading longer than five seconds versus pages that load faster than one second, the pages with one second loading speeds convert up to 2.5x more. And I mean, if you have one of these businesses that is mostly relying on pay performance marketing, right?

If you just let that sync in, that essentially means more than double the revenue just from this loading speed. And so that's like a minor thing, but you just need to make sure that your funnels are always optimized for speed and that they're loading fast. And so that is always coming with perspective out of the box, no matter the content that you put on there. The next thing is that essentially like you'll see that most of our templates have these quiz elements. And this is very similar to, you know, the thing I've mentioned before is like, you've been scrolling, you've been doom scrolling, it's been very interactive, you've like get these dopamine hits all the time. You know, I want something that's fun. Because if you can make that experience fun to the visitor, they'll actually convert, are more likely to convert in the back end. And so you'll see a lot of the best performing perspective funnels actually using using a lot of this interactivity, right? And then I'm not entirely sure what type of funnel, the AG1 funnel was. that you clicked on this morning, was it just ad straight to like a landing page with an offer or what was it like? Exactly.

Okay, cool. So then that's an ad that's more or less targeting people that are more deeper inside the funnel, I would say, right, people that are ready to purchase. But in this case, it's more, especially for Leachan, we're more on the B2B side of things. So if you're purchasing like a product that's 10 grand, it's usually not, you know, landing page straight to the offer, subscribe for 10 grand, like to this agency service. And so this is more about the lead gen. And what we see working as well a lot is that on the basis of these quiz questions

that in and of themselves already help with conversion, right? You would then lead these people through multiple questions. You, of course, A, can qualify the lead because that's super important for your sales team to just not waste their time. But at the same time, especially with ad algorithms, what we enable you to do is basically on the answer of these questions, the sent back only the qualified leads to the platforms. And as these AI algorithms are super, super strong, right? You want to make sure that you're only feeding them the right data so that they can optimize for you and actually know which people to show the out to for you to have more conversions, right?

And so on the basis of these questions, then we do the same thing here. We have a qualified and an unqualified page. And we're sending that traffic then or that conversion event back to meta, only if it's qualified for the algorithm to optimize more for that. I have a tactical question. So I've seen my friend Jice cream have a similar type of funnel. I think it's called the VSL, right? Video Sales letter. Correct.

And I see these videos that you guys do and they're like, it's art. Like you guys know exactly what to say, how to say it. Like when you had the idea to create this video, for example, how did you take it from I want to create a video to this video is super dope and awesome and is working? That's such a good question. man. So we have basically two modes. One mode is what you just said is basically where you have this idea, you have an idea for an angle, an ad or like a VSL, and you go ahead, you script it and you try to optimize every single word, right? And you make like really specific editing remarks so that it's a masterpiece.

I've done many of these. I've spent 24 hours in that time on a video that will be 20 minutes long, if like 10 minutes long, right? And it flopped. And so by now, when we do VSLs, I actually have a way different approach. I only focus very much on the hook, right? So it's really, really important that like first five seconds, people are like, oh, shit, like I really need to watch this. That's the first thing. Then I focus a lot on education actually providing value.

And that's also very, very important, especially in B2B, right, we're selling a software product. Like, it is no use to us if you're coming in into the software and you're like, okay, I'll just try it out or maybe click a bunch of buttons. You need to use the product. You need to convert on your trial. You need to ideally stay with us. for years to come, right? And so we really focus on that educational part. Third part is a lot of

proof. You just want to make sure that people know you're real, right? That's super important. And then a natural progression into the offer. These are like the four things that I focus on by now. And so the process for VSLs for me personally is, as I said, like I script the hook. I make sure that's banger. And then I really dive into content and just make that a little bit more fast pace, maybe, you know, after in the post editing, make that super engaging to retain the people, the visitors or the viewers throughout the video and then from there on just focus on the content. That's been the process so far. So I think a lot of people understand how they would actually, you know, record a loom style type of video and show their product, show their service and why it's great. But I think where people struggle is on the hook.

So you basically were like, yeah, you just come up with a hook. That's really, really good. Yeah. Are you looking for inspiration somewhere or how do you, how do you, how do you, create a hook that works. So by now, I primarily look into like previous VSLs that that we've done, right? So basically I just look at our data because that is of course, especially if you're also running an agency and that ties back into that service. Like if you have 10 clients in the same industry, you know exactly, oh, that one client drastically outperformed. Why was it? You need to analyze that. You need to know that. So that the 11th client that you're on board gets even better results and he retains for longer. And so that's basically where I personally start now. But back in the

I just started to like with mimicking people that have done it super well where I know, hey, that video. Like it got a million views on YouTube. People must have been hooked, right? And so I learned from that. And then I wrote the first couple of hooks. And at some point it's more intuition, but at first I was literally just copying. So I think that's a good way to start as well.

Cool. How do you do your hooks for your podcast? Because I'm listening to them and I'm like, damn, okay, you got to watch that. I start most of the podcast by being like, what are people going to get? out of this video. I'm a meat and potato simple guy. And maybe that's what people could do, right, for their own VSLs. It's be like, hey, my name is Greg

and I mean, exactly what you said here. Watch this 12 minute video to learn exactly how we did it. Yeah, exactly. And that is also a super important piece because that also helps us have an easier time in our marketing, right? Because at the end of the day, people sign up to perspective to deliver results. They want to get their clients to a new level. They want to grow their business to a new level. And so what am I

leading with? I'm always leading with the desired results, right? So, I'm always saying, hey, this funnel got X, Y, and Z result for that cost or within these days, like this is always the first pitch. Any ad that you'll see from myself out there will basically be that. And so one further thing that I wanted to show here, so within perspective, and this also comes down to, you know, the actual process that you'll have. But one of the bigger pieces in performance marketing is, first of all, you always want to

make sure that the entire experience is super consistent, right? So similar that you just came from a super engaging feed, you want to make sure that the funnel also super engaging is there within with a milliseconds ideally the experience can go on. One other thing, of course, is that also the consistency of the content needs to be there. So what you're saying in the ad needs to be backed up by what is set on your funnel. And so that's why we also use a lot of personalization within perspective. That's one of the other bigger pieces that that we see drive more conversions. So for example, in this case, I'm using this headline variable.

And so what I could do in the ad account, I could just spin up five ads. All of these five ads have five different headlines, for example. I would put that as a variable into the link and it would be shown here on the funnel, which is actually proven to also help with conversion. So these are these bits and pieces, right? The interactivity, the delightful experience, the consistency, the personalization that actually drive way more conversion. And we've seen this like a top 20% of customers have an average conversion of like 26%,

28% on cold traffic, like cold meta traffic, right? People that have never heard of you before. And so then from there on this personalization thought also continues. Because on the basis of these questions that we're asking here, right, you're not only able to pre-qualify the lead, but you're also able to personalize the offer. So in this case, for example, I have this goal question here, and it's leading to a specific result.

So on the basis of that, I'm showing them a different VSL after they've opted in for that quiz funnel because then I, of course, have a higher chance to convert them if I, like, directly speak to their pain point, directly speak to the desire. If you say, hey, my goal is to grow my audience, then the headline, of course, is how to add XYZ followers within 30 days, right? If the goal is to post more consistently, is how to post seven times a week while only investing two hours per month,

whatever. Like this type of personalization, keeping that consistency to what a user really wants, what actually helps us grow the business and, of course, also agencies get insane results for the clients. And then from there on, dude, I've mentioned that before, right? But I'm not sure how many, how many, like, what funnel software do you use or like what landing page software do you use personally?

Dude, you're going to actually make fun of me. Go ahead. We'll talk about B2B. I'm a co-founder in a business called LCA. It's literally like one of the, if not the leading design firm for the AI age, like all the top or a lot of the top AI companies hire LCA to like design their product, build their brand, stuff like that.

It's like a landing page with like a little bit of copy. Most of our clients just come from word of mouth. So we have like no, no ads, no funnel. just like, you know, Guy was VP of product at this company, now moves over to this company and hires us again, you know? Yeah, yeah, makes sense. And I think especially like for like the enterprise level, I'm not entirely sure what your average deal size would be,

but I'm guessing it's quite decent, you know? Yes. And I think like at that point, there's like acquisition channels might not be Facebook ads anymore. I agree. I agree. Well, maybe. I don't know.

It's like that's why we haven't done it, right? Like we haven't done it is because, but you know, I'm open to trying it. Yeah, yeah. Dude, we have customers that are in the higher five-figure ARR ranges, right? And so these are also coming from Facebook ads. We literally primarily focus on Facebook ads. Of course, you'd be most likely a way higher than that.

But can work, can definitely work. But as you have like such a narrow audience, I would not think that Facebook is the best channel to start investing your money or maybe be linked in ads at that point. But yeah, we can also be able to... I mean, realistically, what I should be doing is using something like use this product, create a funnel, and just use organic social traffic to the funnel.

Dude, 100%. And I think like, let me just quickly spin up another example because we use funnels everywhere, right? So we use funnels for customer feedback. We use funnels for organic marketing. We use funnels primarily in paid, but essentially it works for anything because of these funnels just convert so much better.

So we just want to use them everywhere. And so one of the recent examples is I did like a lead magnet post a couple days ago on LinkedIn. I'm not sure if you've ever done these yourselves. Like, you know, hey, if you want to get access to this, then like and reply, stuff like that. Yeah. And so that works super, super well. And we, of course, then send out a funnel, right?

In this case, it's a more simplistic funnel, but it's basically then through our opt-in leading to a VSL, in this case, asking you to download a, or if you want to copy a prospective template, a funnel template instantly into your account, you get the free trial there. And so, like, this one is also doing super well so far, 38% conversion, you know, 22,000. for conversions to total. And then once this is validated, this is like a super nice playground for us. Of course, we'll put paid traffic behind it, right?

Once we know there are conversions coming through, we just scale the heck out of it. That's basically the process. So I would build a funnel with the product, but the problem is I feel like I need a nils next to me. You know, like I don't know if I can do it on my own. Am I wrong there?

So I think you are. Of course, one thing that's super important to point out is that the entire creative, question is very, very big, right? So with perspective, you can make sure that the entire technical questions are solved for, you know, that the funnel in and of itself is great as it is. But if you put a weak headline on there, that's going to be trouble, right? And so, of course, like, you can, you can have AI help you build that out. And I think there's some improvement

that you can, that you can create with that. But at the end of the day, like really, really strong copy usually only comes from knowing your audience, knowing your customer similar to what you said before, right? You want to make sure that, like, what's, you know, what's, in it for them when they're clicking on my video for the pot and I'm focusing on that. And so that really comes from inside. But let me let me just quickly spin up a new blank funnel and we have like a lot of templates here. But the beautiful thing and this is what I've mentioned before, right, the importance or what

we focus on with respect of is speed and performance. Because like if you can spin up these funnels in an hour and it doesn't take you, you know, weeks and weeks to build a funnel for a client before launching, then you can a launch way more clients and you also have just an easier time in general. So like the idea of, hey, we want to make the visitors experience delightful applies to our customers as well. We just want to make sure that building funnels is like finally fun and easy. And so let's just quickly start completely blank what you can do here. So in this case, we have a starting page. We have one result page. Right. So simple concept is always, hey, we have multi pages either through a quiz,

through quiz elements or like with a different opt-in page. And then from there on, we have a result page or multiple thank you pages depends on what we're trying to build out. And so I would just start out with this perspective funnel, taking some of these section templates, right? And these are then taken from the most successful funnel. So in this case, we have a bunch of hero sections in here. We have a bunch of product-specific sections in here, call to actions about us, yada, yada,

yada, yada, and so I would just start out, for example, all right. This is my hero. In this case, just need to remove the divider. but everything is like super super fast. Of course, everything also is instantly responsive, right? And so one other thing that you might have just noticed, where we're always starting out of this mobile canvas.

Why is that? Because especially if you're running traffic from paid social, it's like 95% mobile. And so you always want to make sure that it's mobile first. And most of the other solutions out there are usually like, they always start out with desktop. It's, I think, just something that has been retained for like over 10 years. and we think like mobile first, always starting mobile first is the way to go.

And so then you would of course go ahead and adjust this thing. You can also adjust the theming, the fonts and everything with the design tap here. And then we would just go ahead and build out our base funnel structure. So next step, we would want to have like something specific on the product, for example, maybe these three benefits right there. Nice. Of course, also sweet column layout in here. And so we would just go ahead, build it out like that.

Right. And then from there on, let's just consider we have built out this funnel. Of course, it will take some time. But we have built out this funnel. Then some of the cool things that you also can do within perspective is you can also set up the emails directly from here. So for example, for the email builder,

we have the exact same experiences with the funnel builder. So you can just basically breeze through, especially once you have the copy done, maybe with the help of AI and have the images done with the help of AI, they can just literally breeze through and implement it like that. Yeah. And dude, that's essentially the process. And we have like so many customization opportunities as well with the different blocks, right?

So if we just quickly, quickly click here on the plus sign, you can literally like build anything here. Right. So we have images, of course. We have the videos for the famous VSLs that you've mentioned before, testimonial slide is a webinar block countdown. Like anything that you would need to drive more conversions, that's in here. And of course, also like HTML customization opportunities if you want to build something more advanced, collect payments have calently directly integrated with the calendar

popping up in a very nice intuitive way to not create too much friction between pages and so that would be essentially a process so we could also go ahead and just replace this with a quiz element for example really quickly there we go and so you would just breeze through

maybe create a second page and one other thing man if you're not too deep into performance marketing this might not be something that will deeply resonate with you, but have you ever used Google Optimize before? Yeah, for sure. Yeah. Any problems that came up with it? I mean, dude, this was years ago. Years and years. It also doesn't exist anymore. I think the last time I used it was 2000 and like 12 maybe. Yeah, yeah. And you know, the thing is with a B testing software usually, what you'll have

is first of all, it slows down the page and we've learned before, right? It's like, that's a like a safe way to kill your funnel performance, slowing down the page. And then the entire setup was also like quite tedious. You would have to create both pages and all that stuff. And so with perspective, we also make sure that the like entire optimization is super, super simple, right? So just click on the three dots, create a B test. It would duplicate the page.

We could adjust it here in any way we wanted to. Then hit publish. And basically that will automatically split the traffic 50-50. And if we were to have some data then on the funnel and we would end the AB test. it would also suggest statistical significance and all that good stuff. So you can literally have that generated by GPT, the B variant of your funnel, literally launch that B variant already with the setup of your kind.

And from there on, it's like you just spin it up over and over again with new B test that you'll figure out through GPT and or through what has performed before. But like the whole technical side is finally taking care of, man. It's like, it's simple and fun. And you hear that I'm excited about it. Here's what's cool about this. I think, you know, this is the startup ideas podcast.

So a lot of people listening, have startup ideas. And, you know, if you have a startup idea, I always say the first thing you should do is like register a social account, like build an audience, learn the messaging, understand the community. That's the first thing you should do. Once you've done that, then before writing a line of code even, go and build a landing page like this, set up a quiz funnel, basically.

Try to even further understand your potential customer, your user, and you're sending traffic, I would start with free traffic personally, send that free traffic from organic social into your funnel. Iterate on the messaging, iterate on the messaging on the funnel, iterate on the messaging social. And then while that's happening, then you're vibe coding your software product or then you're vibe coding productized agency service. That's what the mistake I think a lot of people make is they go straight. I spoke to someone yesterday who's like straight building the product, doesn't have an audience, hasn't figured out a good name. The beauty about this is it's a forcing function of getting really good at building traffic

and then getting really good at converting and understanding who that traffic is. 100% man. And I think like a quiz funnel or at least like even if you have a lead magnet funnel or whatever it is, right? Let's say you're building a community. I think that was also one of your approaches. So first of all, starting building that community. Like just like simply putting that quiz in there already gets you so many insights that

you can then start also used to also start optimizing that entire messaging one more time and also know what pain points to talk to. And so that's also like within our marketing man, we run these quiz funnels, right? We spend like up to 200 grand, 250 grand a month on these and we're crushing with them. And so we constantly also look at the quiz results, right? We just want to make sure, okay, what are people clicking? We're asking, okay, how would you define yourself? Are you like the ad agency, marketing agency, content marketing agency? Are we grabbing the right traffic, right? All of these things, like these qualitative insights, they're super helpful to then go and optimize. And so, like, that's also why we, for example, build out this entire

metric section where we're just making sure that there's like all the analytics that you need are in here. And then there's also this entire other part because, as I said, right, we're very focused on agencies that are doing lead gen B2B or recruiting, where we have built on an entire CRM that is super, super easy to use where you have the entire data collected. And from there on, you can also automate the messages essentially similar to what I've shown before with the emails. But yeah, it's collecting all the data here, right? You can go and optimize that traffic, optimize that funnel going forward with the AB testing and all that stuff.

And then hopefully scale your business quite heavily. That's the idea. This has been great, Nils. I appreciate it. What people say in the comment section about funnels, about perspective. And I appreciate you coming on and sharing the sauce with us. Of course, sir. Thank you so much for having me.

I'll include where to find NILS on social in the show notes. And I want to bring on more people who don't have big followings, small followings, who I think are super dialed. When I go to the prospective website, I said this when I met with Cody. I was like, wow, the prospective website is super dialed. The product looks really simple, dialed. And so I'm looking for more Nils is out there if they exist. Let me know because it's great.

I'll make one or two intros if you like, 100%. All right. Sounds good. Thanks for having me, Greg. Appreciate it.