The Startup Ideas Podcast - How The Rideshare Guy Turned Uber, Lyft Drivers into a Media Empire

Episode Date: May 25, 2023

Today Greg is joined by Harry Campbell, the founder of The Rideshare Guy. In this episode, Greg finds out how Harry turned a blog into a media company that was built to sell. ►►Subscribe to Greg's weekly newsletter for insights on community,creators and commerce.You'll also find out when new and exclusiveepisodes come out from Where it Happens. And it's totally free.https://latecheckout.substack.comFIND ME ON SOCIAL:Twitter: https://twitter.com/gregisenbergInstagram: https://instagram.com/gregisenberg/TikTok: https://tiktok.com/@gregisenbergLINKS FOR THIS EPISODE:Production Team:https://www.bigoceanpodcasting.comHarry Campbell:https://twitter.com/TheRideshareGuyhttps://www.youtube.com/channel/UCCwyU2RqlalzpKIrUhYWHfwSHOW NOTES:0:00 - Intro2:55 - Branding and The Guy Mafia9:52 - The Rideshare Guy business model13:30 - Media businesses built to sell27:06 - Harry's wisest words

All right. So welcome, Harry. Harry Campbell, the ride chair guy. Thanks for having me on. Greg. How are you? So I remember hearing your story 2015, 2016. I had heard that there was this guy named the ride chair guy who was an Uber driver, I think, who started a blog that was getting a ton of traction. and for people who don't know about you, can you give a little background about, you know, I'll call it a media empire around the gig economy. And what's the scale today? Definitely. Yeah, no, and I appreciate that term because it is a little bit tough to describe what I do. And, I mean, really kind of what it boils down to, though, is, you know, I started driving for both Uber and Lyft all the way back in 2014 on the side, you know, just to try it out, make some money. I had a full-time day job as an aerospace engineer working for Boeing.

So kind of the opposite of what I do now. But obviously during that time period, the companies started exploding, raising crazy amounts of money, hiring hundreds of thousands of drivers. And, you know, I was really just like a leech on this rocket, this rocket chip. And so the companies exploded. And, you know, I think really because there were so many people out there, and this job was new, too, right? Like people had driven taxi. People had driven cars. But driving for hire in this kind of fashion was so.

new, there was just so much interest and excitement around it. And so I kind of latched on to that. I started my blog. I started doing three or four articles a week myself. And, you know, I started a YouTube channel. I started a podcast, the ride share guy podcast, which I still run to this day. So it's sort of a weekly podcast, a little bit more focused on ride share and gig delivery industry topics these days than kind of like I started off. It was like nitty gritty. I went out and drove, Friday, Saturday, Sunday night. Here's how much I made. You know, this person puked in my car. here's how to avoid a puker, you know, and I will say there is like no shortage of content and topics that you can kind of cover. You would think like how hard is it to be a driver?

But really it is kind of a lot harder than it looks. And it's not rocket science. But I think I kind of just took advantage of the fact that there are so many people doing it. It was growing so fast. And people didn't really know what they were doing. And it's a little harder than it looks. And so over the years, I've built out a team of contributors. You know, we've got the blog podcast.

We've got a couple different podcasts. YouTube is probably our fastest growing platform right now. I think we have about 150,000, 160,000 subscribers, which is, you know, not huge, but a pretty good size. You can make a full-time living off of that. We've got the courses for drivers. We've got audio books, Kind of I usually joke like any box on the internet. If you type in something related to Uber, Lyft, gig economy will probably pop up. So right now, a lot of the last.

12 months, there's been this trend on, you know, for these anonymous accounts. People are calling it the guy mafia. Oh, yeah, they totally, uh, are, I'm totally on board with the guy mafia. Yeah. So what they mean by that is like the strip mall guy, the self-storage guy, the designer guy. And, uh, you know, you really pioneered that concept, I think. Um, how do you, how important do you think the name, the right? share guy was to unlocking a lot of the success in the early days. Yeah. So I will say I totally

ripped it off from one of my idols, the points guy. So I was a big, before I's ever started the ride share guy, you know, I've always been dabbling in online businesses. You know, I started three personal finance, finance, travel writing, just kind of covering topics that I was interested in. And I, you know, I wasn't an expert from all of those, you know, businesses or gigs that I, that I did. But, you know, learned a lot and kind of like got my feet wet, I guess you would say. And so I totally love the points guy. I was like the only travel blog I read. And, you know, so when I kind of started brainstorming ideas and name for my site, the ride share guy kind of rose to the top of the list. And I wouldn't say that it, you know, like when you introduced me, you said the ride sure guy. Like I walked into rooms at

Lyft and Uber and they're like, oh, it's the ride sure guy. So it definitely, there's something there with the branding. But I think that like a great brand on top of a great community or on top of a great platform is like the key to success, right? If you just have a great name, it, you know, not like, you know, any revelation or anything, like a great name on its own doesn't do much. But I think like that kind of in tandem, I think has, uh, you know, helped me a bit, made me a bit more memorable. So I'd say it's in like that 10 to 20 percent range that it's given me like a little bit of boost. Like if I would have picked a shittier name, maybe I would have got 10 or 20 percent less revenue or deals or connections. I think it did have an impact, but maybe not a huge one.

you know, my take on that is I think it had more than a 10 or 20% lift. I think like naming in general is just really underrated, especially when you were coming up with this name. Like the points guy was pretty massive. But like, you know, it wasn't as ubiquitous as it is now. I actually think what's going to happen with the guy mafia is there's almost like a saturation of guys now. When you're coming up with a name for a business, do you have any naming frameworks or? How do you come up with names for companies, products, podcasts, communities? I feel like in general, I either let someone else smarter than me or more creative than me, come up with a name and work with them. So my co-founder from my conference, Jonah, he came up with a name called Curbivore, because it's sort of at the intersection of last mile delivery and policy and restaurants and retail, everything that's happening at the curve. You know, right hill pick up and drop off.

So we do an in-person event in L.A. and everybody loves the name, Curbivore, you know, sort of like playoff of herbivore, but, you know, eating the curb. And other than that, though, like when I've came up with the ride share guy name and want to be angels with my co-host Colin for that podcast, I think we just wrote down, like, for ride share guy, I specifically remember writing down like a list of 50 different names. And I think the key that I've discovered with naming is you kind of want to be niche, but you don't want to be too niche. You don't want to be too broad. Like the, I knew for sure that I didn't want to be like the Uber guy because I was like, well, what if there's another company beyond Uber, right? And so, you know, I think

ride share guy was sort of like a little bit lucky that I picked the right niche. But, you know, for a while in 2018 and 19, our most popular content on both the blog and YouTube was actually scooter content when Bird and Lyme and all these companies were exploding. And so I was sort of like, oh man, everyone thinks of me as the ride share guy, but like our most popular content is all about scooters now and charging scooters. And in the last two, three years, honestly, we've had a lot, it's probably 50-50 now, but like we have a ton of interest in delivery. And so, you know, people still think of me as the rideshare guy, but like half of our revenue and traffic probably comes from, you know,

last mile delivery now. So Uber eats, Instacart, DoorDash, you know, those types of topics. So I think to me, I think about it like, hey, I don't want to be an expert in every one of these domains. I want people to think of me as the rideshare guy. Anything, any Uber or Lyft question come to me. I'm the guy to talk to. But, you know, we also dabble.

We know enough to be dangerous in some other areas like food delivery. And even though, you know, I might know quite a. bit about food delivery. I'm not really trying to like actively market myself as like the food delivery guy. If that makes sense. Would you ever consider sort of unbundling the ride chair guy into multiple account slash businesses? Yeah. So I thought about it when the scooter craze was happening because it was, you know, it was still gig work. But I mean, we were doing YouTube reviews of scooters and posting it on the ride share guy YouTube channel. So you have like a video about how to drive for Uber. And then the next video was like a scooter review, right? Pretty.

random, but our scooter reviews were getting hundreds of thousands of views. So I was like, all right, well, I kind of have to do this. And I think what I've learned over the years is you, to segment audience, you really have to have a big following. I think it sounds great in online marketing. You know, if you've got an email provider, they're like, hey, you should take your ride share people. You should take your delivery people. You should take your full time. Who likes videos, who like articles and create all these different segments. And in order to do that, you have to have like a massive following. I would say like in the millions of people and the hundreds of thousands maybe to really start segmenting.

Like the only segment we do is like ride share and delivery. Right. So we have like two really high level segments. And I've experimented with a lot of different others. And it's just so much work that goes into like managing those different segments. Like if you launch a brand new account, unless you've got like, unless I had a million subscribers on YouTube, I think that it would be really difficult to kind of get those economies of scale from launching a second channel.

I think you see like Mr. Beast. He's got his main channel and he's got his philanthropy channel. And that works out really well. but he's the biggest and best creator on all of YouTube, right? Like, I'm way below Mr. P. So I think that would be kind of my personal experience and caution is that it sounds so good on paper or on a PDF or, you know, when you're ticking the online course, like, oh, segment this and that.

But in reality, it's a lot of work. And I don't really recommend it unless you have a huge, huge following. Quick interruption from me. If you're listening to this on Apple Podcast or Spotify, you're getting any value. you need to come to YouTube and subscribe to the Where It Happens podcast YouTube channel. I promise you the experience is richer, more interesting. So if you're getting any value, just stop what you're doing, open up the YouTube app, go to the website, and press subscribe at where it happens on YouTube.

And if you're watching this on YouTube and you haven't subscribed, what are you doing? Go press subscribe. Thank you. Enjoy the rest of the show. Could you talk more about the business model of the whole of the whole company? Sure. So you've got all these content, you know, properties. And, and, you know, you mentioned courses. I'm sure there's ad revenue. Like, how do you, how you think about business model? And when did you think about business model? I wasn't really expecting to make much money at the start in general with content. I always tell people like, do it for a year, pick something you like, pick something that has a good business opportunity and see what happens.

But at the end of that year, I think you should sort of be happy with the journey and the results. And if you made money along the way, great. If it exploded into a huge business, even better. And so that was kind of my initial framework going into the ride share guy. And within about three to six months, I did start making some money. And that was more off of driver referrals. So Uber and Lyft kind of have famously paid thousands of dollars for driver acquisition over the years. And now it's kind of come down maybe more normal acquisition prices, hundreds of dollars.

for a driver. And so over the years, we kind of started off monetizing by mainly driver referrals, some affiliate stuff, which would be, you know, a gas app, like Get Upside is one of our top affiliate partners. You know, they help you save on gas. So pretty good fit, obviously, for Uber and Lyft drivers who put a thousand to two thousand miles a week on their car. And so today, we have three or four main revenue sources. Probably the biggest one would be affiliate. So that would be, you know, either signing people up, I kind of call it affiliate, you know, signing people up to drive for Uber, Uber Eats, Instacart, DoorDash, and, you know, really any kind of platform, signing them up to be a driver that kind of falls under affiliate. And then we also

have other affiliates like, you know, Get Upside is a good example because they were sort of VC funded, had a lot of money at a certain point. And I think they were paying us like $5, you know, acquisition for a free app download for like a perfect product for our audience, right? And I think at one point, we probably did 50,000 referrals in a single month for them at like the heyday, two, three years ago when they were spending a lot on marketing. And, you know, kind of we were ranking number one for every code around get upside, get upside, you know, download, get upside, referral, promo code, all of that. And, you know, so the affiliate stuff is definitely temperamental and kind of goes up and down and they can pull the plug at any time. But affiliate is

probably our main one. And then we also do a lot of direct advertising. And so over the past two, three years, we've done a lot of direct campaigns with, you know, the platforms themselves. So some companies, we might be an affiliate and they're like, hey, you're doing great as an affiliate. Let's do some extra work with you. On the affiliate side of things, what does like an Uber pay for a referral to, you know, for a driver? Just to give people a sense of like, you know. So probably one to $200.

I mean, in the heyday, they were paying $500 to $1,000. And that's sort of where like I kind of feel like I had a little bit of a cheat code in the first few years. Like I shouldn't have been making, I ended up quitting my day job within about nine months of starting the ride share guy. And in a normal situation, I probably should. shouldn't have been able to do that. Uber was kind of like a once in a generation kind of company where they were growing so fast and raising so much money that they were just paying, you know, literally

$500 to $1,000 for driver referrals. And they were double-sided. It's like the new driver signing up was getting money. I was getting a lot of money. And so we kind of monetized off of that. So these days, it's come down quite a bit and maybe more in the $1 to $200 range for delivery services. It might be 25 to 100, maybe up to 200 and some of the top markets, but sort of ride share delivery. And then, you know, all of our other affiliates might be more in like the $5 to $50 range. You know, if it's a free mileage tracking app, you know, that might be $2 to $5 per download. If it's more of a bank account, you know, that might be more than the $50 to $100 kind of range. So the point guy is an interesting story.

So Point Guy started very similar to you. I think it was he worked at Brian Kelly. He worked at investment banker. Yeah, investment banker at, you know, JP Morris. Morgan or something like that. Morgan Stanley, actually. And, you know, he just started blogging about, you know, points on different credit cards. Yeah.

Right after the great financial crisis. So there was a lot of demand for, you know, saving money and points. And he ended up taking a different path than you did. Although he did monetize via affiliates like you did. But the different path that he took is he sold his business to bank rate in 2012, which I think got acquired again in 2017. Have you ever thought about... My red ventures, right?

Yeah, exactly. Have you ever thought about, and I'm sure you have, but like, when is the right time to sell or how are you thinking about it? Until recently, I guess you would say, I've always thought about my business as like I probably value it a lot more than someone is willing to pay. Like, hey, if Uber came and offered me, I don't know, $10, $20, $50 million for it tomorrow,

I'd probably sell it, but I doubt that they value it in the same way that I do, right? Because I put so much time and energy and, you know, like I also like what I do. You know, like every like I only work on parts of the business that, you know, I've kind of transition and done a lot of different roles and hired people and all of that. So like I wake up every Monday morning like pretty refreshed. You know, I just went on vacation last week and I was pretty excited, you know, to come back to work and check all my emails, right? Because I knew it would be like kind of fun stuff. You know, Greg emailing me about coming on the podcast, you know, fun stuff to do. So. So I think like when it comes to selling the business, I've never, you know, it's never been a goal of mine by any stretch. But I've definitely over the past two to four years built the business to sell. And really what that means for me personally is, you know, there's the brand, the ride your guy, people know me. That's how they think of me. But if you go and look at our videos, our content, I've got a number of contributors. It's really not me anymore doing the content. I'm still, you know, not even the face, but I'm still involved.

you know, people still know me, but I think that like if someone did want to come in and buy the ride share guy tomorrow, it wouldn't be like they're buying me. I think they're buying a brand. You know, most of the time, if we get a media inquiry, you know, I've been quoted like over 3,000 times in the media, you know, as a ride share, gig economy expert. But these days, you know, when we get a media inquiry, I send it to one of my top contributors. I don't even take those unless I I have some preexisting relationship with the reporter. You know, I want and actually like kind of stealing from the points guy, I remember I heard this NPR interview once and they were like, we're going to bring in, you know, senior contributor at the points guy, Kelly, something,

you know, Kelly, whoever, and she's going to talk about points. And I was like, that's awesome. Like the points guy is getting mentioned in this NPR story and Brian, the CEO or, you know, founder doesn't even have to be on the interview. Like that is really cool to me. And so that's kind of how, you know, I think I've done a pretty good job of that over the past few years. And I actually ended up bringing on a business partner earlier this year. They're called MMG Media. They've bought and sold a bunch of properties and they've exited. businesses and their five-person team that I've been really enjoying working with. And really it's to kind of take, have them take over a lot of the back end. I think the things that would be

even more attractive to a potential acquire, right? Like, they're going to care a lot more about affiliate revenue than upfront sponsored, you know, like advertising deals, right? So this is the first time I've heard about MMG media and they look awesome. I'm just on their website. On their website, it says, we are obsessed with building notable brands that meet people where they are in their financial journey. They basically have three services. They either, number one, they build or buy. Number two, they scale. And number three, they sell.

So sell meaning they've got strong relationships with the network of buyers. Scaling is basically, I think, similar in your boat, where we grow revenue in traffic with a heavy emphasis on SEO and affiliate partnerships. and then the build and buy. And they've got a portfolio. It looks like bankbonus.com, millennial money, financial residency, and of course, the ride chair guy. Can you talk us through your relationship with them and what they handle and how it's going? Yeah, definitely.

So Grant, the CEO, I've known for a while since I sort of got my bearings in the personal finance world. And you can sort of tell from the sites they listed off, They've got, you know, they've been kind of more focused on the finance side of things. And they've got a lot of experience and are good at some of the things that I'm not good at. And so I sort of feel like it was like kind of fitting two good pieces of a puzzle. And so at a high level, that's kind of what interested me in the first place in working with them. And I mean, we've got an official partnership agreement and all that. And they're kind of my official business partners.

But I will say that, you know, kind of like integrating a business like mine that's been doing something, you know, in all our different ways for 10 years almost is like, you know, There's a lot of moving pieces, right? And so basically we're kind of at the stage where they're really focused on the website and SEO. And we've kind of actually completely redesigned the site, backend architecture, redone hundreds, if not probably close to 2,000 pages on the website and optimized for SEO. You know, we're starting, I'm about to record a bunch of, you know, like really high quality videos with a videographer for our top seven SEO affiliate type pages. So we're really just trying at this point to like build up the traffic.

You know, it was kind of like, hey, we've got this ship. we're kind of writing it in the correct direction. Not that we were doing a bad job before, but if you look at like how much money can you make driving for DoorDash, that's probably like a top keyword for DoorDash affiliates. And there's a lot of sites with lower domain authority, less credibility than us outranking because the SEO side of things has never been my area of expertise, focus or something that frankly I even enjoyed. And so it's sort of like, hey, I knew we were always leaving some money on the table, but I like working on things that I enjoy and that I'm good at. They're basically like a 50-50 partner, I guess you would say. And so they have a lot of

upside in the business if we do really well, if we exit, whatever it might be. And so that's kind of, you know, what they're handling for me. I feel like this is a model that's going to happen a ton in a bunch of other niches. So what I really like about the deal that I set up with Grant and his team is that I'm really, I'm paying them nothing up front. Like they are really putting their money where their mouth is and they have a lot of upside. But if, you know, things don't work out, they're not going to make any money. And so it's sort of like combining, right?

Like, I think a good example, like I do a lot of stuff with the media. And I usually kind of like workhorse it myself and, you know, like work with the startups and companies to like get them featured or whatever it might be. And there's a million PR services out there you can hire for thousands or tens of thousands of dollars. And none of them will guarantee anything. Right. So it's like you could pay someone a lot of money with no guarantee of results. And to me, like, that's like a space where there are definitely some good people. But I feel like a majority are just going to, you know, kind of like talk a big game and it'll sound really good and you'll end up wasting your money. And I think in the deal that I set up with them with MM media, they have a lot of upside, you know, sort of like they've got that social proof. But then they're putting their money where their mouth is. And to me, I think the biggest, you know, reason why it's a good fit is because like what they bring to the table and what I bring to the table. And what I bring to. to the table are two really good skills, but different. Like, I'm good on the content and creative

and relationship and marketing and they're kind of good on the more boring stuff. Like, you can't hire the best SEO person in the world for $100,000 a year. You probably can't hire them for a million dollars a year, to be perfectly honest. Like, you almost have to get the best people, you know, incentivized, upside, equity, you know, that kind of partnership. But it can be really, you know, complex structuring a deal where, you know, you kind of connect on a personal, level and you know like you should almost like agree on a handshake basis and then you obviously have to like legalize it all up but you know it's like you kind of almost have to like agree on like bigger picture level you know before you go into anything i'd a call earlier this morning with a entrepreneur

who has a partnership opportunity on the table he's got you know a pretty good business and he doesn't know if he should bring them on as equity partners and he's got this big fear that but, well, what if, you know, what they say they're going to do is not exactly what they're going to do? And what advice do you have to someone like that? I mean, I think that that is a very reasonable fear. I feel like most partnerships don't work out, to be perfectly honest, you know, like whether it's like a personal relationship or a business partnership, like business. I mean, literally, you know, anytime you bring two people together, right, or two groups together, it's like tough. I feel like there was like 10 different things that happened in my life in order to get me to say yes to this partnership with MMG media.

You know, the first thing would be like, hey, I've done a good job building something up on my own. But I think to get it to that next level, I've tried and I haven't quite, you know, been able to do it on my own, hiring the people that, you know, I've been hiring. Number two, I've done a lot of business partnerships, you know, sort of like starting my first course that I started like eight, nine years ago, you know, we started off with another. guy and it ended up like after two, three years, we sort of broke up and it was somewhat amicable. And I think I kind of paid him out of the business. But, you know, it was like, I don't even think we had an actual agreement for that. Like my Kervivore conference co-founder, we usually at the end of every year, we like decide how we want to divvy up the money. You know what I mean? It's like not the best way of doing it. And then, you know, maybe third or fourth, like I've seen MMG in action, right? Like, again, with that

PR example, like there are one or two PR firms that I actually recommend. to startups because I've seen them work with companies of mine. It's like, yeah, they'll charge $10,000 or $7,000 a month. But I've seen them, you know, with a good company and with a good pitch, get great writeups and do good work. So it's like they've got that social proof. And then, you know, with the MMG, it's like, all right, now they're putting where the deal we structure, they have a lot of upside, but they're putting their money where

their mouth is. They're not taking anything up front. So I think like I would kind of look at it like combining two, three, four, five, six things anytime you're looking to bring someone on as a partner. Like it can't just be one thing that sounds good. It sort of has to be like, wow, there's a multitude of factors that all lead me to saying yes. And then I think the other thing, too, is like my business is quite different than, you know, like a bootstrap. I would call my business bootstrap. I've never raised money or anything like that. You know, a bootstrap type of business. I think like giving up equity is a lot different than,

you know, I think I'm sure taking on like a 50-50 partnership as like a VC funded startup is like crazy. But in bootstrapped world, you know, it's like completely different. I think, you know, different situations. So I think that's the other sort of caveat. The advice I gave to this entrepreneur was create a timeline of all the interactions that you've had with this potential partner. Just like get a piece of paper, write down all the interactions that you've had. Okay, how many years has it been? One, two, five, ten.

Okay. How did they make you feel when they did this? Did they under promise and over deliver? Did they say they were going to do this thing and it didn't happen? And just all the things that you can possibly remember, just like write it on a timeline. And most importantly, write the outcome of how you felt in that moment. Because if you're getting into business with someone, like you want to have fun and you want to smile and you want to have a good time too.

So you want to, you know, you want to basically have records of how you're feeling about all these situations. And I asked this guy to come back with me with this timeline and he texted me actually today. And he said like, you know what? There's been a few interactions with this person. Yeah. That have been pretty negative. But they are the best. They are the best. And insert social proof here. And I was just like, it's not worth it. It's not it's not worth partnering with someone where you're going to have, you know, 10, 20% negative outcomes. Because it's very, hard to undo these relationships. Yeah. Yeah, I like that framework and I think that, you know, I haven't thought about it too much. So it's kind of fun that you're asking me about this. But I

imagine that like if everything isn't aligned, like I feel like most often in business partnerships, things like diverge, then get better. You know what I mean? Like you almost have to be like 1,000% on the same page because you're going to, it's going to be tough. You're going to have some ups and downs and people's personal lives or situations change. And that adds, you know, a wrench. Like, oh, I can't spend as much time because I have a kid now or I moved or whatever, right? So it's like, it can only add more to the mix. So if you're not like super aligned, I mean, even one thing I considered in working with Grant and MMG, it'll be funny if he listens to this interview is like, I liked him as a person. I would much rather work with people that I like hanging out with. And I know this sounds a little bit

weird, but like it's really hard for me to be friends with people that I work with if they're not good at their job. Like, if they don't excel at their job, like, I can't shoot the shit on the phone with them. Like, hey, how was your week? I'm like, no, let's not talk about your weekend. Like, why isn't this done. What's going on? My first priority is business and working together. And if we can crush it on that, then let's go have some fun together. Let's hang out. Let's talk. Let's vacation together. Whatever it might be. Last question, because I got to run. If you were to summarize a decade of your knowledge in building content-based, niche businesses, what comes top of mind? What is the most powerful advice you can give to people who are interested in becoming the future ride chair guy of

their own spaces. Pick something that you're interested in. Pick something that has some or a lot of business opportunity. And, you know, I think it feels good to help people. So, you know, if you're, you know, can find something that's, you know, more helpful to, you know, drivers making 15 to $20 an hour. I think you'll get more personal satisfaction out of that than helping, you know, hedge fund guys. So, you know, if you can kind of gravitate towards that. And then on the actual sort of tactical side, I think content and working online, I am such a huge proponent of it because the amount of work that goes into one piece of content and the potential reach is infinite, right? I mean, you can literally put out a blog post or a video that reaches five people, 10 people, 100 people or 100 million people.

And obviously, the higher you go up in that stack, you know, it's a little bit, it's a lot tougher to reach 100 million than five or 10 people. But I mean, our most popular video on YouTube has five million views and it's all about truck driving, super random. But you know, it's like you can kind of do that. I love the kind of short form platforms right now. We're investing a lot in short form content, TikTok, YouTube shorts, Instagram reels because discoverability is so high. You know, you put something out there and it can go viral a lot easier. I would almost say it's impossible. Not impossible, but it's very difficult for a blog post, you know, on a brand new site to go viral relative to a lot of the short form video platforms are out there since

they're more kind of algorithmic discovery based now. So I think kind of leaning into video and, you know, really just kind of creating consistent content for a long period of time, like be a cockroach, never die. That's why I say if you pick a topic that you love and you just like doing, you know, one podcast a week for 10 years, like good opportunity. I guarantee you know, if you do one podcast a week for 10 years, good opportunities are going to come your way and that might be more of the extreme. But, you know, I always say like one year, you know, one year when it comes to content, try to be consistent for one year. Don't even worry about monetizing for the first year. If something falls in your lap, great. But, you know, I like that kind of one year threshold. Be a cockroach. All right, where could

people find you on the internet? And thank you for letting us crawl inside your brain for an hour. Yeah, no, that was fun. I think you asked some good, challenging and new questions. I haven't done an interview like this in quite a while, so it was fun. I would say if they're interested in anything, ride share, gig economy, just type it into a box on the internet and we should pop up. And if not, let me know if there's some box that we're not popping up on. I'll take that as a personal challenge. But we've got the ride share guy.com, our YouTube channel, the ride share guy is growing pretty quickly. I kind of share my personal, you know, sort of thoughts on the ride share and gig economy industries on my weekly podcast, the ride share guy. And then on the content,

inside sort of the, I'm probably most active on Twitter at the ride share guy. And then I've got my new podcast that's more focused on investing in startups and things like that called wannabe Angels. And we're doing a weekly live show there. It's a new show, but getting a lot of traction and been a lot of fun so far. There you have it. The ride share guy. Awesome. Love it. Thank you.