The Steve Dangle Podcast - All or Nothing | August 11, 2021

Episode Date: August 11, 2021

On this episode of the Steve Dangle Podcast, Amazon releases the trailer for the Leafs "All or Nothing" Documentary (00:00), Dusty Imoo will not join Marlies as goalie coach (28:00), Evander Kane is under investigation by the NHL for gambling on games (50:00), NHL players owe NHL owners a lot of money (1:23:00), and the top 6 Stanley Cup Champions since the 04-05 lockout (1:38:00). Originally aired: August 11, 2021 Watch the full episode here: https://youtu.be/T6psVkNgNEY Visit https://sdpn.ca for merch and more. We've joined The Athletic and you can too! Hit the link to subscribe: https://theathletic.com/sdp Visit this episode's sponsors: https://www.betterhelp.com/sdp https://ca.nba.com/ https://www.brooklinen.com/ https://www.indochino.com/ https://www.risescience.com/sdp https://betmgm.com/dangle Follow us on Twitter:@Steve_Dangle, @AdamWylde, & @JesseBlake Follow us on Instagram:@SteveDangle, @AdamWylde, & @Jesse.Blake Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

the steve dangle podcast with your host steve dangle adam wild and jesse blake well hello there steve dangle back from vacation jesse and i about to be on vacation it's our last episode until the week of august 30th in fact our next episode will be september 1st can you imagine august 31st august 31st it will not be it will be september it will not be it will be the day before there you go um but you know listen it's uh it's gonna be it's gonna be great because uh people have been asking what the schedule is after that so in september after that first week back uh we will go to two episodes a week and then as soon as the season starts or maybe just before we will go to three per week and i'm just gonna ask you to reserve in your calendar

the first Saturday where there is Toronto Maple Leafs hockey, where there is NHL hockey. Tell us why! Tell us why now! I can't. But, let's just say we would like to get

together. Let's go hang out. Let's go on a date. It'll be sexy. Let's have some fun. Okay, well now I don't want to. No? Did date scare you? It's the you used the sex word and it made me uncomfortable. did it yeah well it's tough it's good thing you've never had it you know wow remember when people used to call you a virgin and you were married

like this steve dangle virgin it's like we're like okay we're like 28 yeah next level up like religious like we know we wait like for 50 years of marriage that's right you got to earn it also we've had kids before we did it so there you go uh now uh we've got a few things to cover in the show some are fun some are tough we've got the um the leafs all or nothing amazon preview came out it will come out october 1st by the way everybody's kind of wondering about that um we're going to talk about the leafs and the hiring and firing of dusty emo um evander kane situation which is very interesting and a very interesting breakdown uh about the salary cap and where it's going over the next few years, you might've heard that it's going up

and that might be sort of true, but it's sort of also not true. And you didn't, I didn't realize until I read this, and this is from Frank Cervalli of Daily Faceoff, didn't realize how deep in debt with the owners, the players are. This is crazy. And the way that this is set up is unbelievable to me. And it just goes to show that during that 2004 lockout, the star players that got together and allowed for this particular cba to be signed let down every single generation afterwards and every player that plays hockey now should be asking those guys what the hell they were thinking it's it's insane we got to talk about it it's crazy but we're going to start with the leafs all or nothing so um this is an amazon documentary and the whole idea was this year i think that um

the leafs were going for it they were going for it they were going to spend firsts at the deadline And potentially two-fourths as well. I had such a nice vacation. I know. And so, you know, so now we're going to watch it together and sort of live react to it. Is that cool? Should we do that?

Jesse, are you good to do it? Let's do it. Let me share my screen with you guys on the Zoom call, and let's have some fun. Okay. I feel our team slipping. That's all we want to be about. We're a lot better than that collectively.

Let's go win a game. Come on! 54 years since the Leafs' last championship. I think we're starting to see them grow up as a team. And yeah, we lost again. But what happened behind closed doors is a story you'll want to see. I don't know what the is going to happen.

My patience is running thin. We have to live the success that we all aspire to. Communication off the ice is very important. So this is where it starts. Sculling balls into the neighbor's yard. this is the raw uncut version of our family sometimes you're like this is tough oh you've got to find that belief to continue fighting his game's great his mall it's even better

so as steve you said off camera there's a lot of justin hall in that yeah welcome to justin hall or justin hall the documentary about justin hall on the justin halls and friends i think we know now why they protected him in the expansion draft because he's half the duck he is he is the key he's the host man he's yep pretty much and there's there's so many interesting little micro decisions like in that trailer because you're you're trying to sell this thing right so number one i think the release date of october 1st a lot of people are pissed it took so long i think it's brilliant it's perfect it's perfect because the season starts something like 15 16 days later a little over two weeks so you're gonna get people hype here's the herculean

task they have you have to get leaf fans hype and you're gonna use it by highlighting zach bogosian twice um zach hyman a lot of people were talking about that he's in this and that's going to be horrible to watch the first save we saw in that trailer is frederick anderson that's going to be interesting we're going to have to we're going to watch the leaf slowly come to the realization they're never going to have freddy in their net again um and not one of the stars spoke a word in that promo no marner no matthews no nylander no tavaris yeah you saw Tavares. Well, Tavares doesn't say much anyway. I don't remember seeing Riley's face.

That's a good question. Was he in it? I didn't see Brody. There was a millisecond of Simmons. I don't think I saw Spets' face. Can I tell you right now, I... You're a little hot, my friend. A little hot again? Still hot.

Is it better now? No. It's just way hot. I'm turning down. That's a little better. All right. Can I tell you right now that I think we might be disappointed by this because police management might have put the kibosh on anything actually interesting? Can they? I wonder why not. I have no idea.

If I'm the NHL and if I'm MLSE, I write in there that I get decisions on final cut. Well, I mean, I want to see Kyle Dubas. you know i my patience is running thin like the the thin thread on my cardigan like i want to i want to see him actually get mad and i wonder can they do they have that ability because i feel like if you're going to do a documentary like this you have to get that unfiltered you have to have the randy toaster moments and you got to have the angry moments and the good moments and i wonder i i'm if i am the broadcasting side of this if i'm amazon prime i say okay then we just won't We have the money to nuke this.

How many episodes is this going to be? Six or seven, right? I think we go six episodes and we don't hear an interesting word from Mitch Martin or Auston Matthews. Really? What are they going to say? What are they going to allow Matthew's parents are in it.

Matthew's parents are in the trailer. So he'll be talking. Tavares had a lot of face time. He'll be talking. he'll be facing talking about kale mitch is interesting i don't know i think they'll have mitch in there yeah he'll be in there but will he be interesting i think obviously they want their stars portrayed in the best light possible um i think you're gonna see two two matthews and

marners uh neil andrews doesn't say much so i i don't expect him to be in it much to be honest with you uh but um you know i think you're gonna see happy mitch and happy austin because let's be honest during the regular season the two of them just kicked ass they were amazing um and they're going to be glowing and fun and you're gonna you're gonna feel that fuck i love these guys a little bit and then the playoffs are gonna hit and you're gonna hear that i think anyway if they were able to do this you're gonna hear that post-season interview um where they're absolutely the most disappointed you've ever seen in your life because you know that's coming this is the funny thing it's like um it's a little like a tarantino movie you know the ending it's you're

you're working backwards from the ending and it's the most interesting part of any story is not the ending it's how you got there the trailer the trailer had what the title should be yeah we lost again that's why i think you're actually going to see a lot more that's why i have a lot of faith in what this is going to be because you know a lot of people be like oh they'll never allow that they acknowledge it right off the top in the trailer and if they weren't going to allow that no no you did you did have a choice you could just say it's all or nothing leafs promo promo promo you have they're gonna acknowledge that they lost but are the individual characters that we want to hear from going to be very interesting are we gonna come away from this being like yo

mitch marner like i didn't know that guy and now i know him i don't think we are you don't think so no i do i i feel like we're gonna see a little bit more of a three-dimensional look at these guys personalities i think you're gonna be mad upset about losing two guys zach hyman and zach Bogosian um I think Zach Bogosian's the character guy that you're gonna be like man I really love this guy and you saw him on FaceTime with his family you know one of the reasons he wouldn't sign in Toronto again is because of the way our government handled the pandemic and he wants he didn't want to be in lockdown and he couldn't see his family it's hard you know for those guys like you know we can criticize him and everything but like to be away from your family is brutal

I don't think there's anything to criticize Bogosian for right I mean he came in he played great got his three-year contract in tampa and wants to be with his family who play who can blame him and and and then of course with um you know with with hyman money but you're going to be mad about losing zach hyman because he's a great person and i think you're going to hear from a lot you're going to be mad about losing zach bogosian because what great value and everybody probably loved him and i think what is going to be interesting for me and i think what leaf fans have been desiring and i almost wonder in seeing this trailer if we've if this is why we haven't seen it yet what i think leaf fans want more than anything is an acknowledgement from the star

players about what happened in the playoffs not excuses not maybe it could have gone differently we weren't good enough we weren't there it didn't happen and there's no fucking excuse if i heard that for matthews and marner i'd be super fine like i'd be i'd be like okay well you have the talent so you might as well try you know try again next year i wonder if we're going to see that if we're going to see an acknowledgement that guys we disappeared our line disappeared i want to see i want to see what sheldon keith said after the first intermission of game five the habs come out and steamroll them after getting dominated for like three straight games and i just i just want like a good old-fashioned like is is it what the fuck was that or is it sheldon when he first joined

the leafs where pathetically they had like a three nothing lead then it's three two or even three one and he's calling timeouts to be like calm down everybody everything's okay he came in and he had to be positive guy remember the beginning of sheldon remember those covid sheldon the leafs are like up two goals and he's taking timeouts that's how fragile this team is and then we thought they were past that i i think the story of the season you don't even try to create one you focus on moments because there were some really cool moments interesting moments moments involving conflict um and like perseverance and then make the team look good your first game against Montreal you're down 3-1 please please someone punch me in the face as hard as you can

and then you come back and win that game and uh the Simmons fight with Ben Chirot when they're down 3-1 so you can go long with the first game I want to see that I want to see the reaction to Campbell getting hurt in that first game against Calgary I want to see the aftermath of Muzzin flip in the pocket matthew kachuk which i think was a different game against calgary i want to see them blowing the 5-1 lead to the sense and again all their massive collapses i want locker room access i want to know what the hell was said i want to know what they're thinking i want to know the look on their face i want to know what the reaction was when edler hit hyman i want that um you're asking a lot from this doc no i'm i'm this is how i would attack it if i was creating

it i'd be like okay what were the most compelling moments of the regular season and then for the playoffs i i i have no idea what you do but i i tell you this is what i would want if i was the leafs i don't if i was the production team i probably wouldn't want this but if i was the leafs what i would want is the final episode has nothing to do with last season it's just previewing this upcoming season here's nick ritchie here's peter marazic andre kasha here's andre cut no i'm dead i'm still filming i'm dead uh you know you that's it's what i would do it's what i would do you can't be you can't be camera locked this is this is what i would do or at very least the end

of the second last episode is like heading into game six or heading into game seven or something. Then they blow it and then the most of the episode is about this upcoming year, which is about to happen in like a week. I wish you

executive produced the series. I would watch that. I think you would do the you would do a better job than the executive producer on this. We don't know that. I have no idea. I'm willing to bet. No. yeah exactly we don't know i'm guessing i'm literally guessing because we haven't seen it yet but that sounds great yeah like it sounds like you would do a great job i'm trying to

think of like the big fights or like the big here's my like my problem with that steve is that i don't know that anybody's going to take that seriously if you were going to have if you spend a good chunk of that last episode going well how about this season then every league fans gonna go fuck you nobody's in the mood to hear that nobody nobody is in the mood to hear that it needs to be structured like a horror movie like you know what hey everyone we're having a fun time and a fun trip and then the first creepy guy shows up like standing in the courtyard i'm picturing us the the jordan peele thing yeah like i'm picturing that and you know austin and mitch willy see just a different version of themselves but wearing the old shitty leaf logo and they're

like who are they like in the driveway it's what it needs to do the first few episodes need to do is it needs to remind you how good the team was it needs to remind you how much how much you believed in them how much you thought this year was different i sure as hell did and how that was warranted and how it was warranted and it needs to i need to it's got to be agony i'm sorry i'm this is this is about the leafs and design for lease fans i i'm going to feel shitty so you're going to go into that how much stuff you watch how much media do you consume where you feel shitty you're going to feel shitty probably it'll be like this is us if it was terrible yeah like if there was one sad moment rather than one every episode it needs to it needs to remind

you and it needs to set up the Leafs being up 3-1 with an air of even though you know they lost you're like there's no way they're gonna lose yes because there was people were texting me after they lost game five and they're like are you nervous and truthfully and earnestly I'm like no no I'm not that was that was a one-off game it was the Habs best game of the series and they still blew a three a three nothing lead and nearly lost it was a stupid mistake that cost them i was nervous i mean deep down yeah probably probably i was but it the the the mission of every episode leading up to them getting eliminated is to make you forget that they lost and then they got to clobber you with they lost it needs to be heart-wrenching it's it's got to be awful and

then i don't i don't think it makes any sense to end it to end this show about last season with last season you have to end it with this one you have to you got to show me the new faces you got to show me the guys who have no idea what they're in for you you gotta you gotta show me I want a funny interview with Peter Marazic. Like, hey, you have some history in that building, eh there, Peter? Remember the role you played in the whole David Ayers game? Maybe did Kasha ever score at Scotiabank? Did Nick Ritchie?

I mean, talk to him about the Bruins. Drive the knife in. Show me Nick Ritchie and the Bruins eliminating the Leafs in 2019. Just drive it in. Was he on that team? I don't know. It has to. It has to, has to, has to.

set up this season you can't just end it with how shitty last season ended and oh you know but we're stronger now like that that the the one thing in that trailer where i was like oh don't go down that road is growing as a team no one's ever tell me that i don't care do not care no i don't they were great they've been growing as a team for half a decade don't don't give me that shit i want to it they lost it sucks here's this year the perfect ending for me will be are we growing can we do this we got one more shot like that will be the perfect ending because that's reality the reality is everybody's gone i mean there's going to be not major major major changes forget about uh you know i mean you're gonna have mega players gone and you're gonna have

management gone oh i want this year yeah yeah i wish it was this year's when they i wish they started filming after at like three one and then it ends next playoffs because this is truly the all or nothing year yeah this is all or nothing not last year well and maybe they'll continue like if the least part don't let it lend end here right just like season two yeah do season two just keep going because honestly if they end here and even if the Leafs won the cup next year it's a pretty unsatisfying way to end just like the season was and it's hard for anyone to get up and get pumped about I don't even know if we're going to be able to do it our team is objectively worse next year because they are they are you keep saying that like it matters

you keep saying that like it matters it's hockey it doesn't matter that they're worse on paper you keep saying that like it matters it's why doesn't it matter tell me i know what you're i think i know where you're going but still explain the regulars so the nhl is one of the only uh leagues where it's um you win a championship by playing two different sports so uh the regular season they play regular season hockey and that's cute and it's fun and then the playoffs come around and it's this entirely different sport with different officiating and different feel and different intensity and everything other sports have different intensity this has an entirely different rule book and the leafs were this isn't an excuse it's not incoming don't

don't yell at me yeah i hear you i i hear you yelling at me um it needs to i need to be left going what the fuck like that's that's the feeling we all had and there it's Either they need to lean into the what the fuck, or it has to be the fuck. Explain it. You know what I mean? Sorry, I'm talking about two different things. You asked me to explain what I mean.

The Leafs could be better next year and have a better group because they'll be better equipped for the playoffs, and we're going to have absolutely no indication of that until the playoffs begin. Sure. We're going to have no indication. you're going to see them you're going to see them bang and crash one night and they're going to out hit some team 62 to 17 and they're going to win 5-1 and they're going to get in five fights and

they're going to have uppercut knockouts like video game style and all of them Tyson's punch out oh yes yeah little Mac just getting in there and you're going to be knocking out uh who is it King Hippo and uh Mr. Sandman and all those other ones from video games that are long gone in the past glass joe gonna knock out joe last horse oh yeah you're gonna knock out piston honda and you're gonna be like video games used to be pretty racist and then you know all those things so and but it's not gonna matter it's you're gonna be like that's a playoff style win and it's a lie it's playoff style sure it's like a louisiana style sandwich in oshawa it's louisiana style but you got to go to louisiana for the real thing ah you know what

i mean yeah the playoffs in this particular comparable the playoffs are louisiana okay and the leafs don't do so well in louisiana well so i i am curious about the note that they ended on and and and and that's that is going to be the thing because you got to have when you're doing a documentary series like this, you got to have a reason for people to watch to the end. The reason I will watch to the end is I want to know the mentality of the team at the end of this documentary. I want to know how they see themselves and I want to know how the documentary illustrates it. I'm really interested in how they do that because here's the thing. You guys talk about what the lease will allow. The production company and Amazon Prime themselves would all pride

themselves on doing documentaries that are accurate not documentaries that are what the subject wants because that's just promotion right and and and amazon doesn't amazon doesn't need to spend money on a documentary that's just promotion for a major league sports team they don't need to do that so you got to keep that in mind right like you know all the leafs are worth a billion dollars amazon's worth like a trillion like it's it's they're just it's not even in the same ballpark so for amazon to agree to do this for the production company to to agree to do this and have the Amazon funding behind it, I really think that they're going to make this

as accurate as possible. That's what I'm holding out hope for. And I am very, very curious to see what this does. And the only thing that is really going to suck as a Leaf fan- Is it them losing? Well, I think you have to accept this as Leaf fans, is the fact that we'll be the butt of everybody's joke

again this season. Like every time the Leafs fuck up, there's going to be quotes in there that people are going to take and they're going to use on Twitter. There will be infamous Randy Carlisle, Phil Kessel, and the toaster moment. There will be many, many, many of those. And I just hope everybody's ready for it because yet again, here we are cheering for the most hated team.

And boy, are they easy to make fun of. For everyone on Leafs Twitter who is on Twitter all the time, what if you didn't? What if you just sort of stopped that for a while? is not good for you it's horrible oh you don't want to be the butt of the jokes stay off where everyone makes the jokes you cheer for the i don't know deluxe buffalo sabers like it's it's really all those sabers with money yeah and like deluxe for now like we might switch might have to switch entire teams peter pocklington you know back in the day styles uh but the where it ends

off adam i think you're gonna get half of what you want okay what do you think it's gonna be it's not gonna be the stars it's gonna be the decision makers okay so dubas is more than happy enough and more than willing to be the dartboard it's going to be a lot of him going what the fuck it's going to be a lot of keef going what the fuck shanahan you know he might come in with a you know a more subtle kind of wandering the room back and forth you know what mumble what the fuck like like it's going to be it's going to be different degrees of what the fuck but you're not gonna it won't be i don't think you're gonna see any of the big guys no and i think it's at a certain point it would be really nice if this toronto maple leafs team

as much as we've you know you sometimes laugh at at the the amount of uh amount of reverence given to mark messier it would be really nice to have a leader like that who just said fuck it it's our fault now we'll exclude the vancouver years from that but yes yes but but i you know what i mean like i would be really great to have a leader strong enough to do that and what's the best predictor of uh future results it's your past it's your past so what have we seen from this team not that let's run and hide so i'm not gonna i don't anticipate those things i will be pleasantly surprised if it happens i mean if i was one of those stars i would i would want to be in this as much as possible oh yeah it's an opportunity to tell your story everyone's just been shitting

on you for months after you played the best season of your lives and then you played like three bad games seriously and you know you now your entire reputation is is based on like screw the rocket screw finishing top five in nhl scoring it's three bad games that is professional sports though yes it is oh i'm not saying woe is them but i don't know you have an opportunity to do some extracurricular work here get in get into it lean into it that's what we're hoping well we'll see that uh we'll see what happens with this um i am i i'm gonna watch everything i'm all the way in and uh oh nothing you know what i'm excited about is it gives us content to talk about i'm not sure if they're releasing it on a week by week basis or if it's

just a total binge i hope it's all at once i hope it's not so that way we don't have to hit it all in the same episode oh yeah yeah i agree i hope it's weekly just so somebody doesn't watch it all in eight hours and then it's all over twitter they've clipped it all and it's ruined for you wasn't wasn't the last dance two episodes a week oh god you're asking me to remember the beginning yeah yeah they did it i think it was four weeks and it was two episodes they did like hour they did an hour of the show and it was two half an hour episodes okay well because they can't the one one thing i said in the car like i literally got in from ottawa and sat down in this chair is i don't want to be watching a documentary about last season this season i want it to be

done when the season begins exhibition fine who cares about exhibition but yeah once the games that count start i want i would like this to be done two and five canadians will hear the words you have cancer that's why every step and dollar raised matters on september 19th join thousands in toronto for the princess margaret cancer foundation walk challenge yourself friends and family to walk 21 kilometers in support of life-saving research together we can carry the fire and help create a world free from the fear of cancer register today at pmcfwalk.ca you gotta try breakfast at A&W. You gotta try breakfast at A&W. And what better way than with a delicious

Pret Organic Coffee, starting with just $1 all day, every day, now until December 31st. You gotta try breakfast at A&W. At participating A&W locations in Ontario. um now let's move on to another uh quiet fuck by uh brendan shanahan and the organization quiet oh fuck moment oh okay i understand now i understand sorry i could have i could have worded that better but that's what this is you know you could have you could have um so does milkshake duck experience what do you mean well like i was on well first of all for everyone who doesn't understand the meme there was a tweet that was basically like you know a newscaster going everyone look at the

milkshake duck everyone loves this duck who drinks milkshakes and then two weeks later we were got to inform you the milkshake duck is racist yes like kind of like the ken ken something the the guy that ken bone ken bone that's right and they found out that he had said some really terrible shit on reddit and and like i don't remember everybody was in love with ken bone for a bit and they're like oh they found his reddit account and he said some terrible shit um i was like at lunch saw they hired dusty emo and i was like i know that person i've heard of that name uh cool good great and then i like finished the meal paid for it and got back to the hotel and we regret to inform you now i i have to i have to specify this uh and steve i know you

wanted to jump right into the story but i have to i have to headline the story dusty emo was hired by the toronto marlies to be the goaltending coach and this is a guy that was at uh he was in la for a while um he's a bc native he was playing he was coaching for cundlin red star as well um and is a well-renowned goalie coach like great friends with jack campbell yeah that's where he worked with him with the kings um however um it it came out not minutes later that dusty emo had a personal twitter account and people went through his likes as one does and what you what you saw were were transphobic anti-black pro-trump and anti-vaxxer sentiments and adam you can't why can't you just have political opinions you know what i mean guys like high five guys like here's the thing what's the

matter if you're pro-trump the leafs would still hire you but if you're anti-black and transphobic like even if you're anti-vaxxer the leafs might still hire you but he went anti-black yeah he nailed them all he went ham on january 6th as well like just like just just loved it just just ate it up and like he was like this is a sandwich i'm gonna i'm gonna eat the capital riots it's delicious we're doing embarrassed that they didn't do their due diligence well and so let me read the statement from brendan shanahan because a couple of days later it took 48 hours and i'm gonna i have a theory as to why but we'll get to that in a second sure it said just emo will not be joining uh the toronto maple or sorry the toronto marlies uh we made a mistake by not thoroughly following

our organizational protocols when considering this candidate for the position of goaltending coach for the toronto marlies so they make this announcement the twitter stuff comes out and management needs like they make it in the afternoon right and that's a couple of days ago so then they have to look at the the fallout the social media person for the Marley's like what the fuck like you do feel bad for the person who had to issue the tweet and then compile the responses and run it up the chain to management like it's because they're going to run it up the chain to the Leafs assistant general manager who is the manager of the Toronto Marley's and then and then they're gonna and then that has to get to Kyle Dubas and Kyle Dubas has to

transfer that to Brandon Shanahan. And then it's, what do we do? And then it's, okay, well, we can't have this guy in here, but he's already signed a contract. So we got to pay him out to get rid of him. And that's probably what happened by the way. He signed a contract. The Leafs probably had to go through a bunch of legal loopholes to say, how do we not have him now? And I would not be surprised if he, if this guy signed a one or two or three year deal coaches, when they get fired under contract get paid anyway right so mike babcock still being paid by the toronto maple leafs and so i would not be i would not shock me if dusty emo is being paid by the leafs for whatever length of term he agreed to work with them i'd love to know the answer to that question

that's fascinating me i'd love to know who made the final decision to bring him in and to also let him go well it had to be shanning well because i was uh ryan hardy the toronto may police announced today that ryan hardy is joining the organization as senior director of minor league operations in his role oh no oh yeah hardy named general manager this is ahl.com so it was lawrence gilman i think most recently i think he's still with the organization um oh here it is lawrence gilman who has served as gm of the marley since 2018 will be elevated to the role of senior vice president of the marley's while maintaining his roles as assistant gm of the maple leafson governor of the ahl club so i don't know whose final decision it was but like that is that is like i i how many

people listening to the show locked their twitter account before a job interview right like i've i've heard and by the way i'm not saying oh man he should have done that i mean the better thing to do would be to not believe those terrible things but like the reason they tell you to lock is because companies look and it's it's just the most basic oversight that's why that's why i think they should be really embarrassed by whatever hr person or recruiter whoever's job that is you're a billion dollar company. You have enough staff where you should be paying somebody to go through your recent hires and vet them and see if they're a good hire for your company. And no one did this and random Twitter users had to be the one to go and do this and figure out who Dusty is as a

person. So my question on that is, how do we know? How do we know what? How do we know they didn't know oh nowhere in brendan shanahan's statement say said where nowhere in that statement did it say we didn't know and you know that there are varying views in any organization of uh uh of people who you know have different people call that political i don't call those those some of those issues political they're not like anti-black is not a political being racist isn't a political issue it means you're racist being transphobic is not a political issue uh vaccinations believe it or not not a political that's science yeah like they fought not ah yes so so i know you're frustrated but guys you ever feel we've had this conversation 500 times nowhere in that statement

did the leafs say we didn't know and i that's the part that freaks me out you know if you if you if you, I have no problem with people like, it's like, well, what do you expect them to never hire a conservative? That is not conservatism. That's very different. And I have no issues with conservatives being hired and left-leaning people and senators being hired. My issue is anti-vax, anti-black, anti, or transphobic, if you want to say. I have an issue with that. And my concern is that you think this organization doesn't know that you think that they didn't look into that because here's the thing neither answer is good neither answer is good because because either way it makes you look terrible especially with the involvement that the Leafs have in the community

obviously there was the Morgan Riley situation a few years ago and Dubas was out with Riley at the pride parade saying listen this was not what he said and this is but we're still going to support the community and i have no doubt that that was earnest oh man forgot about that one but i but we have to recognize here that that statement was very short we didn't follow protocols what are the protocols and they'll never tell us we didn't check his goddamn twitter now i don't think that's i think i think that somebody let that through and i don't think that's what the leafs stand for i don't think it's what the leafs want to stand for i can tell you the owners of the Leafs, Rogers, Bell, Larry Tannenbaum are not fucking happy. They're not

happy about this because they're, remember, two major telecoms and a major leader in the business community. Are you kidding me? They have no interest in being associated with a person like this. None. However, somebody in the organization absolutely knew and either chose to say nothing or said, you know what? People have different views. And there are people that are like that. that's a fascinating theory i think i think you have to consider that i think you have to consider that how is it possible you're it's just to me it doesn't seem probable that an organization doesn't go through your twitter account and if and if they didn't holy shit that looks terrible too i think the answer is often the most mundane and uh like i have a one word answer august

august is is uh tumbleweed month in hockey and i think they made a decision and i think there was an oversight and it just sort of happened and now they got to clean up a mess and all these dudes are at their cottage all of them they you know how fucking do you know how furious everyone involved must have been. They must have been pissed. I can almost guarantee none of them are at home. The only reason they might be is

because of COVID restrictions. These are all very well-to-do. There's no COVID restrictions for rich people. Let's also make that clear. There haven't been since 2020. They're not at home. They're at a cabin somewhere. You might even be...

You're on a boat. You're enjoying time with your family after maybe the most difficult season of your career and you're having marshmallows by the fire and you literally someone texts you a tweet from an account called hockey nuisance is that what it is is that his name it was a few accounts no no no no no sorry sorry hockey nuisance had the screen the screen grabs yeah like i'm just i'm just imagining i would love to know the shade shanahan turned like i wish oh yeah i wish he's not gonna be okay with this oh god i wish so bad i wish so bad we could have taken it before and after like just yeah i'm i adam i'm i'm i'm with

you it could be all that but uh when it comes to hockey august is a tumbleweed month i think the answer is is very mundane they just fucked up well sure but who fucked up and why who made that call it's the new guy to the organization most likely and what it's well yes and he probably needed another meeting to say hey uh this is what the leafs stand for this is what the leafs stand for i'm not sure how serious you took this in the past this is what the leafs stand for right well and he's it's also interesting that the leafs are marching to the beat of their own drum where because they could have just um handed him we'll try to rehab him yeah they could have handed him a million dollars and then done an interview where he's like actually i never supported the

insurrection and then had him play defense they could have done that that would have been rough 51 year old man who made a bad choice he's just uh hey listen listen there's i mean we all know exactly who I'm talking about. And the Hurricanes just sort of rode it out and turned it into a PR win and didn't give a shit. Dude was on Parler! Are you kidding?

Are you kidding? And he's going to play right D for them next year. I wasn't even talking about him. But this guy's fired. I wasn't talking about him. I was talking about the Montreal Canadiens. Oh, great. Take your pick.

Young man who made a decision. Oh, to every social media person in the NHL, good luck not personal yeah good luck good luck it isn't personal though thank god i feel so bad for the the ones who got to manage that brand because they don't make a choice in that hurry the hurricanes twitter person i was just like oh you don't deserve this personally but uh if you're gonna have a little while the hurricanes twitter person is fucking amazing it's just a shame that they have to put up with this imagine being the blackhawks twitter person right now oh they're they're they're scratching they're putting like little ticks in the wall

counting down the days till that contract expires they can't wait they can't wait till that contract's done i love mike stevens we love our boy mike stevens uh which one specify there's 19 it's our boy mikey who who basically is mikey who i actually i was gonna have beer with tomorrow but i had to cancel um i know i know bad friend i know we're gonna see each other at the end of the month though i love mikey but he tweeted this and i'll be there either it was important he said it's important to remember that dusty emo did this to himself if he didn't have a twitter account he would be employed by the marlies right now but he had to go around liking heinous shit and publicly outing himself as a bigot this isn't quote cancel culture this is consequences it's

not even if he had a twitter account it's like if he just made it private on sunday yeah you know well what a bad move what wait what a bad who had screen caps of dusty emo's twitter likes prior to that announcement someone i also want to say if you're him if you're him do you need to like the tweets right like like i mean like these racists are really bad at being that like it's you don't want to come out and be like i'm a super racist dude it's like it's it's crazy when i say what a bad move i mean by the organization as a whole for having that as an oversight no you weren't saying like hey dusty be better at racism sneakier at your racism you know no the Leafs need to be better at identifying the people they're hiring and recognizing that

hey all of this stuff is public i did i did speak to someone who has known him for a long time and they're like i never had any inkling of any of this and i think there's a lot of stories like that i think there's a lot of stories like that that have cropped up especially over the last five six years um that the past five six years have have rotted and potentially permanently ruined some brains um at least in some respect i like even in my family there are people who have known each other for over half a century they'll never speak to each other again and i i think there's a lot of people in the same boat there's a lot of people in the same boat and it came out they never new came out of nowhere um and it just is what it is i'm fascinated to see what the next move is here

and in all of those arguments the transphobic racists are on the wrong side yes yes yes yeah but i think you're right we've all had that thank you that thing with art you know uh or maybe not all of us but some of us um as steve said there are members of my family where you go okay all right i'm not even talking about the argument jesse i'm talking about the i had no idea you even thought that way or based on our past conversations you don't think that way where where did this change from yeah yep and do you guys remember we were in this very room uh it was it was it was us three and a friend of ours and he was he's like oh well you know the media just lies about everything we all three of us at the same time looked at each other and

then looked at him and we're like dude we're in the media we are in the media i mean well not all of them then like so but he read that enough times that he believed it without even thinking about oh some of my best friends are in the i had friends with that person jesse do you want to hear a funny story what okay so back in the day this is probably 2011 okay uh i was reading some tweets in calgary sitting on my couch which was a futon and reading some tweets and doing some things and oh i see steve underscore dangle come up i think i know where you're going you remember this and i don't even remember what it was about but he said the hockey media will tell you dot dot dot and i had to tweet at him and say hey man you're in the hockey media are you aware of that

sean fitzgerald did as well bless him really he he did well because i probably did it more than once right because i was an outsider man you're in there you're the nation's network bro yeah they don't get it only i get it with my shitty youtube channel and camera that has me in a weird shade of red because i don't know how to fix it and it's old why me my opinion matters and there they just don't get it the media also listen i have had some very stupid opinions like you know some of them might have been on this episode i'm not sure yet um boy have we traveled the journey there we have in this conversation i just think that's a funny steve story you know we were like 22 like oh yeah you know what i mean uh but a little bit different i'm like

this guy thinks fighting affects the outcome of a game what a moron versus all the stuff that he was fired for but it's it is uh it's a i'm sure there's a lot of people listening right now who know that person yep they know someone they've known their whole life here's the hard love that person love that person love that person and how do you how do you unlove someone right like you it's tough but you you you try and go what what happened here what happened here and and there's so many people in that position and there's so many people who are never going to get an answer yep yep and and at the end of all this pertaining to the hockey conversation um yeah the Marley still need a goalie guy so yeah there's an opening well don't announce this one you don't

have to like it's the no one I don't know whatever I also good to know that no one announced it screw it for everybody out there with that conversation uh Ruth Bader Ginsburg and Antonin Scalia so both opposite ends of the justice uh in the United States right they were both Supreme Court judges both on this he was supreme right she was maybe a little bit left and uh and also pro-women's rights and abortion and things like that which i guess are considered left issues um they were good friends and complete political and legal opposites and you know it's funny you know that they were good friends so it's a it's a bizarre world that we're living in everything it seems to be exasperated right now the end of the day with the leafs and with dusty

emo you can't if the leafs say they're going to be this thing you can't have a guy like that as a part of your coaching staff and you know you look at a guy like jack campbell who loved this guy from what we understand um like we said with your family maybe they feel one way you feel the way the other but you still love them and and i think what i saw a little bit of on twitter that i think we need to caution ourselves against here is well jack campbell loved this guy what does it say about him i don't think it's anything about jack campbell don't do that don't go there it's not that's not how this works you love your grandpa your grandpa says some things like yeah that doesn't say anything about you the fact that you love your grandpa blind guess that is a this

is blind wild outrageous guess don't but i i just want to caution people against doing that um the least made the right call here after making the wrong call they corrected it good for them let's not go down this path again if you're high if if the least are hiring anyone make sure you check their social media and we move on um and they can find there are other goaltending coaches out there there are other people that they could they can do this job and not be all of those things the Leafs have said we are an inclusive environment they have to keep to that if they hadn't said that maybe they don't care so um you know like honestly I mean there's other teams that haven't made that pledge well it was other teams that have and still don't care you could have gone

D'Angelo for a million dollars if you did yeah it was just interesting to see something happen Because that was The theme of this offseason has just been Ah, just do it Are they good? Ah, bring them in And then you take the Brad Pitt from Inglourious Bastards

Stance of, nah, I'm gonna get chewed out I've been chewed out before You just ride it out He's still on the canes He's still on the habs, and it's fine But no, they actually did something So that brings us to another tough subject in Evander Kane Evander Kane who um it is Kevin

we haven't touched this one eh not really so he has been he has been accused of because we had the Blackhawks episode last week and we wanted to rightly wanted to focus on that Evander Kane was accused on social media by his now I guess soon to be ex-wife separated uh that he gambles on nhl games and not only that but games that he's playing it and against himself too against himself yeah so that he would now the idea that a single play this is different right pete rose is the is the the guy that everybody's talked about when it comes to this i don't know that evander kane is enough of an impact player to throw a game on his own i really don't oh buddy get out of here yes i don't know yes he absolutely is he's one of the highest paid sharks he makes

seven million bucks he was he's probably their best forward or one of their best maybe their best winger anyway oh yeah he can have an impact is the debate can a single hockey player throw a game for his entire team i've been watching the leafs my whole life yes they can okay they can do it not even trying to okay i wanted to raise the question because i think you watch game five you watch game six you here's the thing you can't be one of these people who says the the the nhl is not like the nba uh it's a full team game you need everybody on and then in the same breath go this guy um this guy can uh can throw a game on his own you can't so you're one side or you're the other on that it's either the stars matter disproportionately or they don't what about the

over under what about the over under a player can affect the over or under sure what what i'm saying is i think my point is i think the stars really fucking matter in the nhl more than people give them credit for that's what i'm saying that's my that's my point so if you're saying evander kane can uh can affect the outcome of a game then i'm saying then what i've been saying the entire fucking time is the stars have to show up for teams to win which brings me back to the least but anyway i gotta i really gotta let adam talk because i was gearing up for an argument and turns out you agreed the whole time i did but i have to bring that alternate view up because i think it's something that people say but you cannot say the stars don't matter as much in the nhl

and then say guy can throw game on his own. You can't. What if both could be probably true? I think both could be true. Yeah, I think there's... He's not the only guy that plays for them. Eric Carlson's there. Brent Burns is there.

Mark Edward Vlasic is there. They have the shittiest goaltending in the history of man last year. Yeah, but I think it takes a team to win and also, oh, a single guy could throw the game if he's trying to do it on purpose. I suppose. I think both things are true, Adam.

Honestly, I don't see them. I see them as links. that's how i see them you could have one bad shift and oh that was the difference yeah but it's also a team game you would be able to understand i think you'd be able to see a player doing that and this is where it becomes really interesting because um when evander kane was traded to san jose they put on a full promo tour about how they were going to reform evander kane now we didn't really know what the issues were with evander kane except for a couple of things number one him like randomly buying a billboard to say sorry to his girlfriend for something which

was on sunset boulevard i don't know if you guys remember that tmz story but that man and then of course there was you know people people were on him about having like stacks of money in vegas and like making a phone call with the stack of money which you know i remember talking about that at the time i'm like well like a guy's a millionaire like who cares he can do what he wants but the big issue was what happened with dustin bufflin and the winnipeg jets when Evander Kane was playing there. If you remember, he showed up late. The word is that Dustin Bufflin threw his track suit. He showed up late in a track suit. Dustin Bufflin threw his track suit in the shower and turned on the water because A, you don't show up late. B, you're supposed to

show up in a suit. That's what they said. Now, when Evander Kane showed up in San Jose after the trade um one of the big stories i read at the time and this was like a huge push and i can remember this vividly because i thought this seems suspect to me joe thornton showed up at the airport pick out of my have the article pulled up oh please read it steven and just are we gonna get to the uh kevin kerr's article in the athletic today that's what i'm at yeah okay i'm going with this yeah so i'm gonna read one paragraph it's from august 11th oh never mind this is the kevin Kerr's article so you want me to get into it sorry I thought this was an old one no no so so this is the one you do this is why I'm bringing this up yes um uh so I guess at the um exit interviews

which they do every single uh every single year in the NHL with every team several key players in foreign team brass that if Evander Kane was going to be a part of the Sharks going forward they didn't want to be that's how bad it got that is a direct quote from the article um and the quote is guys were going into doug's office as in doug wilson all year long according to one source saying kane had to go all doug would say is all teams have locker room issues which just isn't true not the teams that win anyway the sharks ignored everything and the team turned a blind eye so obviously i've talked to you about the accusation and um on previous sharks teams kane had to answer to older respected veterans like pavelski ward martin joe thornton the latter of

whom memorably picked up Kane at the airport after a mid-season trade from Buffalo in February 26, 2018, all have since departed, including Thornton, who signed with the Leafs. He's not having to answer to anyone, said one league source. Nobody in the room is a fan of him. Bugner likes him because he's a good player, because he genuinely is. But off the ice, it's just too much at this point. And, like, he had a fantastic season, numerically.

like i'm looking 56 games so he was healthy played the whole thing 22 goals 27 assists for 49 points so i would have put him on like a quick math like at least a 70 point pace or something like that for a full season his penalties he only had 42 penalty minutes after 122 and 153 in the previous two seasons so those were way down so like a 70 point pace like a 30 goal pace this guy was great he was great last season and the and his teammates were still like nah get him off nah that's enough i don't where did he rank i just gotta say he led the team in scoring by a wide margin he had 49 points logan couture at 43 only player to score uh over 20 goals thomas hurtle at 19 he had 22 led the team and assist for god's sake he led them in everything and they

still were like no gone now she's saying he's his ex-wife by the way has made this accusation along with saying that he's not supporting her or the couple's daughter while she's pregnant with their second child and this is a this is a major obviously personal issue uh on tuesday kane posted an image on his twitter account of him wearing shark's gear before presumably going on the ice. Now, beyond all of this, we know and we've heard reports of that he is somewhere in the neighborhood of $20 million in debt to multiple casinos. That's what we've heard. Or if it's not directly related to debt with the casinos, debt with third parties in order to finance betting at casinos. And remember, his contract was worth $49 million. So what was

going to happen here, what has happened is he borrowed against future earnings on his contract. I'm not sure if you know you can do this, but you can go to a third-party lender, somebody who has a lot of money, and you could say to them, listen, I have a $49 million contract, and that contract goes over the next seven years. I would like access to that money now. It's almost like if you have a house and you take out a line of credit against your house. Essentially, under the right circumstances, it could be the right thing to do. It's always a risk. You always run a risk, but what some guys will do is they'll bet against their own contract. They'll borrow against their own contract and they'll invest the money in things like real estate. So what you can then do

is let's say you have a commercial building and you rent to McDonald's and you rent to a bank and you got a bunch of office space upstairs. You can take that money and start to pay off the loan and write off the interest. Now I'm getting into the weeds with the business thing here, but the idea is to get away from, um, to get more of that money up front. That's why NHL players are obsessed with the good ones anyway, obsessed with getting their money as much upfront as they can, because the longer that you have the money, the more years you have to build interest on that money. So when Tavares signed in Toronto, you know, those $10 million bonuses or whatever, that's a huge deal because you hand that to an investor, somebody that can work on your behalf

and you've got $20 million in the first 12 months. That's a lot better than $20 million over say three years or something like that. And I'm just looking at his contract. It's actually kind of weird. So it's seven years. There's two years in the seven where he has no signing bonus for some reason. And this year is one of them. I don't know. I don't know if that's relevant, but if you're in debt, no signing bonus is tough. So what the Sharks and Kane were apparently looking at a couple of months ago, and I don't know where this story went, was voiding the contract on both sides. Because what he's doing is he's right now in debtor's court. And what that means is he can basically say, if he voids the contract, he can declare

bankruptcy and it will absolve him of having to pay that off. And that's a huge deal. So that means the sharks on their end say, yep, we're voiding the contract. Evander Kane says, yep, we're voiding the contract. He can declare bankruptcy or insolvency, whatever you want to call it. And then I guess, and I don't, I'm not fully sure on the legality of how all this works. I don't think that lenders ever made whole. I don't know how that works, but basically you're able to get out of paying that off. And he would have to, he would have terrible, he would have bad credit for the next five to seven years, never be able to take out a loan. But when you can make millions of dollars, who cares? It's one of those things that at the end of the day to get

into this kind of trouble, there is at minimum a serious gambling addiction here. I mean, that's what we've been led to believe. If these are all gambling debts, if you can run up $20 million in gambling debts, you got a problem. Now on that issue, on that issue, I don't know what Evander is like as a person on that particular issue the nhl has to treat this like they treat alcohol and drugs because you have to treat it like an addiction because that's what it is if people could stop gambling they would simply stop if people could stop smoking they would simply stop and then so i had when i tweeted that i tweeted at the beginning of the summer people were like well you could just what if you just didn't well if that was the case he fucking can't right that's

the thing he's got to want to seek treatment or just stop drinking or just stop yeah well oh we well then yeah you're right you know what wow how do we never think of that yeah oh thanks on that particular issue the nhl has to treat this like you treat uh addiction to alcohol and drugs now my question and i don't have an answer to this guys is what happens when you find out that this guy's been betting on nhl games because i still believe that you as the nhl have to support him on addiction counseling but if you can prove that he has gambled on games that the sharks have been in and that he was playing in is a ban for life really the right option so i'm gonna take a wild guess but i think i'm right in that the language is definitely in the cba that you can't bet on

on the NHL if you're a player in the NHL. So I think there's a rule there that outlines that, hey, he's probably kicked out of the league in some regard. He's probably suspended for whatever the suspension is. It's probably a lifetime ban. But then I think as

the NHL, there's also a human being here who seems like he's destroying his own life because of an addiction. And the NHL PA, in whatever form they take care of that for people with drug abuse or alcohol addiction, they take care of that for Kane as well. So you help them on both fronts. You take them out of the league if you did bet on the game,

and then you give them the treatment that would be afforded to a player with the same addiction in terms of alcohol or drugs. Now, let me ask you this. People are calling for a lifetime ban. At least they were when the story broke. You banned this guy for life. What reason, A, does the NHL have to support him? B, does he have to get better? You know, you could say, oh, he wants to get better for his family. Well, if that were the case, he probably would have been in gambling addiction before, right? He's deep into this guys. And if you've never dealt with addiction up close, it's hard for you to understand, but I would suggest you do some research on it because

it's far harder than you can even imagine. And what I would say to that is if you don't give somebody motivation to get back the life and the career that they want, that they worked so hard for, as in if you ban him for life, what is, it's the carrot and stick approach. We're going to punish you now, but if you take the punishment and you do the treatment and you're better, you can come back. If they take the stick part or sorry, the carrot part away from this, what's the reason that he has to get better and what responsibility would the NHL then bear? it's a player that'll never play again anyway so what do they care that's a that's an interesting debate on what responsibility does an employer have over someone's personal addiction you know

is the is the employer because that's what the nhl are it's not they don't they're not responsible in a sense for vanderkeen's addiction like they didn't cause it so uh what's their role in rehabbing him i don't know i don't know what the question is if he's they weren't responsible they wouldn't have like theo flurry wouldn't have been through the substance abuse program three or four times and we understand why that happened but the reality was he was the most public person to go through it right but there isn't language in the cba that says hey if you abuse alcohol you're banned for life so what's the responsibility for the nhl if somebody breaks the rules and they also have the and they also have an addiction problem which what takes precedence as an employer is it the guy

who's breaking the rules of your employment or is it just treating they're helping this guy as a person you know i don't know that's up to them to decide whatever legal hole there is adam is thinking about this compassionately and then there's also the the business side of it like for example if a player were to have a cocaine problem the league is not sponsored by cocaine exactly there there are no cocaine sponsors going hey this is really ruining cocaine's image right but sports betting is about to be a very large thing a in this country in canada and it's also going to be a growing and much larger thing in the national hockey league tomorrow actually the fact that you bring that up tomorrow the ontario government is announcing their plans for single

game betting so you'll be able to find out tomorrow when you'll be able to bet on a blue jays game so i i didn't i i actually didn't know this until i was talking to someone on the phone today so all the ways that we bet on like sports and everything none of them are hosted in canada that's right exactly yes we've got wow because whenever i hear about like oh yeah i'm making sports betting legal i'm like isn't it not single game and the reason for that is we had we're a very especially the east part of this country very puritanical in that way like up until like 30 years ago you couldn't shop on a sunday you couldn't you still can you buy alcohol on a sunday you can buy yes yes that's within the last 15 to 20 years yeah when we were

to the bank walmart wasn't open on sundays when we were kids you can't go to the yeah yeah the bank wasn't open past 4 p.m we have very we had very regressive puritanical laws when it came to alcohol and gambling and you said to line up out the door like everyone else you couldn't even you couldn't drink at the airport before noon like it's insane and that's the best part about the well why can't you get a fucking drink if you treat me like an adult i'm an adult and and so at the end of the day here um we are we're we're you know we're looking at gambling and sports books is which is what they call it as a they are a fun way to spend your time like jesse especially you love doing that stuff right yeah yeah i do but it's managed and

it's within reason which is what 99.999999% of people do it for it's a little bit of fun little spice on your on your dinner you know what i mean it makes games more interesting is what i like you know when there's no dog in the fight it gives you a dog in the fight but just like anything you can't abuse it i hope the nhl treats this like and like every other addiction and steve i think you make a really good point sports gambling sports books are going to fund not only the nhl but the nhl and sports media you know have a look at this this business guys is about to change. And I don't think people realize how much sports books are going to fund some of the things that we've always loved, which advertising used to fund it, but advertising

isn't meeting that demand anymore. Um, and because there's crowded marketplaces, like, you know, it used to be, well, you would, you buy either newspaper billboard radio or television. Now it's like internet, internet, what app, you know, like there's so much crowding that gambling is very important for the i think it's the toronto star their whole bet is that they're going to be able to save the newspaper based on their sports book so they're going to fund journalism from gambling do you guys remember when uh disney bought fox and then one of the deals within fox was that they had to they got to control all of those local sports networks i remember the like fox sports southeast and fox sports florida and like all the little fox stations that host the like local

panthers games or whatever and then bally which is a sports gambling um organization they came in and they bought all of the tv networks now that hosts all of these local regional games and now all of these fox sports networks are called bally sports which is just a gambling company and that's it so they've already taken over tv in a large part of america it's now this gambling book that owns the regional rights to whatever team you watch i think that's that's definitely the direction like you're saying adam that sports is going absolutely that's where the business is going so it's it's a very complex issue for the nhl but on a human level this is an addiction now as far as showing up late for practice and all of the things kevin curse you i

encourage you to read the article i you know i always want to make sure that we're fair to the journalists here and don't read the whole damn thing there's there's connections to timo meyer here because that seems to be evander kane's only friend in the dressing room um there is uh there's a lot of stuff you go uh culture i guess and this has been been really really bad in in the uh sharks organization here for the last few years um you know they i guess here's what they said kane uh sharks displeasure with kane stemmed from a general disrespect for team rules including routinely being late for games and practices not adhering to dress code and poor practice habits At one point in the season, according to a source, Kane nearly came to blows with coach assistant coach Rocky Thompson in a meeting after arguing where he was supposed to be positioned on the power play. So, you know, it's it's that stuff. I can't speak to that stuff. No one can. We don't know. We're not there. This is an addiction problem. And the NHL is going to have to figure this out because this gambling is going to be a huge part of the NHL going forward as it as it would be in any sport.

how are you going to deal with problematic gamblers you're going to have problematic gamblers if you run an organization with thousands of people employed it won't just be the players it'll be team it could be management could be anybody you're gonna have to figure out a policy for that and i'm curious how they're gonna handle it what side do you guys land on do if you have a guy who ruins the integrity of the game of your sport by betting on it do you have a zero tolerance policy or is there some leeway for a rehab what do you guys think i i'm having i'm having a hard time not looking at it the way adam looks at it but at the same time like if you're i don't know x company you're gonna want something done here

you have to do is that something a timeout like it's a it's a timeout you got to take x amount of the season off as part of the rehabilitation process and then you got to go through whatever amount of hoops to i guess satisfy them that i don't know you're better i don't know like adam you sound closer to this than like i've never really experienced addiction right like in in or around me um so like i don't know how do you decide someone is uh for lack of a better term uh better you know what i mean like oh this isn't a problem anymore so you got to be able to satisfy the league that this is no longer a problem and then he can resume games um what i would say to that jesse is there's never been a point in history where zero tolerance

policies work zero tolerance policies on any issue ever never work they're a nice idea but deterrence work to a point but they don't work like you're not going to just be like well we've solved the problem now if that were the case no one would ever kill anybody right there's a zero tolerance for murder all right there adam you know what i mean yeah zero tolerance for for for doing bad shit for robbing banks people will still do it uh it's so my point is let's constrict you know it's it's so fun and easy to say well just fucking ban him and move on sorry guys that's just not unfortunately in life problems are far more complex than that and yes i have dealt with addiction up close it's ugly and uh you know i have to tell you um there's no fancy good answer

for this that the public is going to like if the nhl helps this guy there's going to be people who like why the fuck would you help him um and then the spread adam i bet there would be three and a half goals that game yeah well exactly yeah i'm not gonna trust it anymore you know if i think the instances of players that are going to be in this position are probably pretty rare but you got to be very careful if you're the nhl about all of this um and i think they already know that and they're probably drafting policy on that um but yeah the idea that you know like in the states the death penalty is still legal in like half the states. Does that stop people from getting the death penalty for killing people? Never. They continue to have people on death row.

So I guess the zero tolerance policy doesn't work. And so my thing is, let's actively try to solve the problem rather than what I think a zero tolerance policy is, which is now I'm just going to write you off. Like, fuck you. And I understand why some people feel that way. I get it. But like, there's the three strike law. There's a few three strike laws in like California and stuff like that. I remember reading a book on this and like, it doesn't help anyone. You just end up, you just end up fucking a bunch of people over where you could help them. And, you know, I think a hundred years ago when we didn't have the tools, the way we do now, maybe that made more sense. Just pull them off the street, pull them out of society. And, you know, pull Evander

Kane out of hockey. Okay. But what have you really done? And I think the NHL has the opportunity here to help a human being out. Whether or not you think they deserve it, the point is they would help him out if he had a drug problem. They would help him out if he had an alcohol problem. They have to help him here. I don't know if you think that if you want to run an NHL that doesn't have take any active part in substance abuse or gambling issues fine you go be commissioner then and when you're there can't wait for that announcement but in the meantime sorry go ahead this is cold he's an extraordinarily unpopular player yes oh yeah yeah he's really unpopular player everywhere he's gone yeah yeah has been for a long time he's an unpopular player

so i think that adds to people's willingness to be like yeah just get rid of him he's unpopular you don't even like him so of course just get rid of him and then he's gone imagine it happened to a player that you like you know what i mean your favorite your your favorite player imagine it happened to your favorite player because not everyone uh wears wears this on their sleeve you know what i mean yeah people tend not to wear their addictions on their sleeve and anybody that has dealt with addiction up close will tell you that people who are addicted could be normally great people who act like absolute fucking monsters you know whether it's alcohol or drugs or something else they act they act like absolute monsters that's the problem with

addiction it isn't just the addiction itself it's how you act around the addiction so he might be unpopular or and and whatever else you want to call him because of this addiction and if you don't go down the road of trying to help him what have you done well and just because he's unpopular doesn't mean he doesn't deserve help bingo there you go so uh uh you know i think i think that the nhl is in a tough spot here but they have a real opportunity to to at least give this person an opportunity listen if evander kane fucks this up then that's on evander kane right if he doesn't show the receipts if he doesn't go get help he can't play this year guys i don't think he can play this year like really i mean i know he's warming up or whatever but like we're like 20

million dollars in debt doesn't lie like it sounds like we'll get an answer pretty soon sounds like it yeah it sounds like it and uh and so it'd be very very interesting to watch i don't think evander kane plays this year if he comes back with the receipts the treatment the i was wrong and I was in a bad place and this and that I'd be willing to listen to that I think he's a I think he's probably a shark throughout that process and then he's dealt

interesting fresh to who I wonder we also we spent this entire segment on Kane but like thoughts and prayers to his wife and their child because they're going through something if she's taking it public and all that

you know we don't know the details obviously and in the full story but yeah there's a lot of trouble there so yeah thoughts i'm not i'm not surprised that that she felt like there was nowhere to go based on what we know about the blackhawk situation it's not like the nhl's got a really good um i read a book about um it's gonna sound weird but i read a book about ford and the the car manufacturer yeah okay yeah the car not wrong one of the things not rob ford no or doug uh this what what they did was they stole an idea from japan which was on the assembly lines if something was going wrong the person everybody on the assembly line was empowered to shut the assembly line down if there was a problem right to to hey there's a problem you know the other the american

motor car companies didn't have that so if there was a problem it just continued to perpetuate and the guys would be like oh fuck it someone else's problem and then the problem never gets solved It sounds like in the NHL, there's no way to shut this down and go, there's a problem here. Imagine where you got to be in your life to post something like that about your husband, the father of your two children on Instagram. You got to be desperate. You got to be brutally upset. Your life has got to be hell to be able to do that. You married this person. You committed your life to this person. And as somebody who's been through a divorce, I know what that's like too where you're like not not publicly posting anything but we're talking about a split here

it's brutal so i i also feel tremendous empathy towards her because like holy shit the i think the way a league is supposed to run is the way a bowling alley is supposed to run the there's a line you can't cross when you throw the ball there's two gutters that prevent the ball from going here there and everywhere there's some pins at the end and then the ball and the pins go into this nice little opening at the back and it just feels like the nhl is just playing bowl it's it's bowling in a parking lot there's there's no restrictions there's no order to anything how many conversations have we had recently about a variety of different topics and we're just like they don't have a policy for that yeah they don't have a they don't have a plan for that they don't

have a fail safe for that but i'm supposed to take you seriously you're a big time league come on it's not good enough it's not good enough this this summer if nothing else for the nhl has been a great learning experience yeah absolutely and that's the players association too they wear this too oh yes there are not enough fail safes in this league yes that's the word fail safe i couldn't find it exactly that steve well done um i do want to say i want to point out one funny tweet here just to completely change the subject um guys do it it's a big day in buffalo did you know that no have you seen this tweet no it's a big day in buffalo why would it be jesse don't look it up why would it be a big day for the buffalo sabers in buffalo not even in buffalo

sorry not even in the Sabres organization it's a big day for Buffalo Bill's news well the Sabres tweeted it out but it's a big day in Buffalo not just in the Sabres organization I saw Owen Powers probably not gonna

he's gonna go back to school that's not good news oh really I think it is good news good for Owen Power yeah it's good for him no they're gonna be bad man yeah they're gonna suck um i have no idea adam it's coach don granato's birthday guys hey big day in buffalo big day

well all things considered the responses to it are pretty amazing i thought he was actually popular in buffalo yeah but people are like it's a big day in buffalo like what do you mean that's what the tweet says the tweet says it's a big day in buffalo happy birthday donnie g i thought you were being a jerk no that's what they tweeted okay big day i didn't bless that twitter person too what are you supposed to do i love the first response it's a big day in buffalo wishes the coach a happy birthday so you guys are just trolling us at this point right oh man that's tough and then somebody stuff somebody posted a picture with jack or jack eichel said and said this guy doesn't care boy that's me one of one of the best

hockey not actually hockey podcasts i've listened to recently was 31 thoughts american frege had the surgeon who eichel wants to do surgery on him fascinating okay can you sum it up in a tweet what would you say about it without giving it away he explains the procedure exactly and any concerns around it and why timing is so important here very interesting that was under 280 characters go check out 31 thoughts we love those boys they've been so good to us um and uh short listen to it's like half an hour it's a it's it's an interesting time in buffalo isn't it just great It's a great day in Buffalo. It's a great,

it's a huge day in Buffalo. Now I want to quickly do Sarah Volley and then we're going to do Jesse's list. It's the return of Jesse's list. But we're not getting to that quite yet. I'm going to, I'm going to take five minutes on Frank Sir, Volley,

and then we're going to get to Jesse's list and Jesse, your list is what? The top six Stanley cup winners since the Oh four Oh five lockout. Okay. This is great. I like it. I like that. He chose top six.

Now. Okay. So here's the interesting part here. So when the NHL signed, when they had a collective bargaining agreement that was signed after the 2003-2004 lockout or whatever it was, or 04-05, whatever it was, I don't think enough has been made. And there needs to be an entire podcast series on just how badly the stars of that era screwed the players that we're going to play 10, 15, 20 years from now. I don't think we understand. Like, we had players making $10 to $12 million in 2004 who are making $3 and $4 after that lockout. We just now have players making over $10, and we think that's crazy in most cases, except for Connor McDade. conor mcdavid in the nhl if the nhl continued the way it was going conor mcdavid would have

been like a 20 million dollar player and he would have been worth it and it's crazy because i'm not sure if you're aware the nhl players are in debt to the owners right now 1.3 billion dollars i i don't know what that means yeah remember kipper came on and he explained escrow and I was like, yeah, man, I get it. I didn't get it. So basically what they agreed to was a 50-50 split. And what that means is 50% of the revenue goes to the players, 50% of the revenue goes to the owners. That was the 50-50 split. The escrow is on top of taxes, something that is skimmed off of your paycheck every month. And the escrow can be 10%, it can be 20%, it can be 30%. It's agreed on beforehand skimmed off your paycheck that they hold on to until the end of the season

to see how much money they have to pay the owners back to even out the 50 50 split so they have to make sure because you know you might be playing paying the players a certain amount of money right if at the end of the season it's not a 50 50 split the owners have haven't gotten their fair share of the 50 50 then they need to claw back money from the players so the escrow in essence keeps the money in a third pot that the owners can then draw upon if the 50 50 revenue split hasn't been hit and what happened this year and last year during the bubbles and you know all the other restrictions with covid is that the owners took a huge loss huge loss millions and millions and millions and millions and millions now we can debate whether or not that's actually

a good thing for them because they can they're billionaires and they can hide assets in a money losing team which they can huge tax write-offs losing money just means you have to pay less taxes hint hint it's a good thing you want to lose money like the owners made out like bandits and that makes sense in the last two collective bargaining agreements it's actually ridiculous It's crazy. No one gets into this, but it's fucking crazy. So now the players got paid their salaries, but the owners lost a pile of money on paper, right? On paper, they lost a pile of money. So the players have to pay the owners back. And this is why the salary cap, which every time I bring this up, people get mad at me. The hard salary cap will remain basically the same for

the next five to seven years. Now I'm going to read a quote from Frank's article. It's on Daily Faceoff, Frank Cervalli. Please check this out. It was published August 5th and it's called NHL salary cap projected to rise to 82.5 million in 2022, 2023. A rise in 2022, 2023 would likely trigger the start of a lag formula as agreed upon by the collective bargaining agreement negotiations between the NHL and the NHLPA in 2020. That could see the salary climbed $1 million each offseason until the escrow balance to the owners is paid off, meaning that the owners take a loss in the interim. The players pay them off with their salaries over the course of five to seven years. According to league sources, the NHL is projecting a hockey-related revenue of $4.8

billion for the upcoming season, given that figure includes increased revenue generated from two new us rights deal tnt and warner uh sorry tnt warner and of course walt disney with espn plus the juice from a new cat kraken club uh that would likely be in the top part of the revenue so the pre-pandemic pace by the way guys was 4.9 billion so they're not expecting to make what they were making in 2019 and the new ones what 4.4.8 so that's what they're they're expecting a rebound to 2019 levels but we're now three seasons away from that right they were expected to be much higher at this point that's why the cap can't go up. In addition, sources say that the escrow balance owed by players to the owners is in the ballpark of a billion following last season, though the exact

figure is still being computed following the final 2020 and 2021 accounting. According to a calculation run by Daily Faceoff, NHL players are projected to increase the balance owed to owners in the 21-22 season, not even begin to pay it off because the $4.8 billion in revenue in their projected salaries are likely to be significantly exceeding the allotment of 50-50. So here's the thing. I know that was a lot of technical jargon, but here's the number you need to know. For this to be a 50-50 split, like they agreed upon, NHL player salaries are projected to be 2.9 billion in total this next season. Their 50-50 allotted share is 2.4 billion. You're like, well 2.9 2.4 that's 500 million dollars it's a lot of money a lot of money so that means and

frank put together an incredible chart here i highly suggest you check this out 2021 22 which is what we're heading into projected revenue is 4.8 billion the ending escrow balance would be 1.3 billion dollars that's what you owe and the players will have to pay this off probably until the 2024-25 season. In that time, you're going to see the salary cap raise a million dollars. So it'll be 81.5 this year, 82.5 the next, 83.5 the next, 84.5 in 24-25. And at that point, in that point only, according to the daily face-off calculator, only then will there be a chance that this is paid off. And what that means is salary cap can't go up until that's paid off. which means that each team that you see,

like this is why Ron Francis is pretty smart, built his team around a lot of cap space because it ain't going anywhere now ever. Well, okay. So here's the frustrating part as a fan, you want to see the salary cap go up. You want to see movement. The only reason we see movement each off season,

most of the time is because you're seeing, you know, you're seeing increased value in clubs and they can spend more money and move people around. with the hard cap the way it is the nhl uh general manager not going to be able to do that the same way you're going to see a lot more like now this person's bought out and here's an obscenely ridiculous mathematical calculation to get it done the the next time we expect the cup or the the balance to go up by a million or two million or three million is 26 27 move whoever this is complete hindsight obviously but whoever negotiated the last deal to have this

as the structure it's it's not looking great this deal was negotiated in 2020 this deal and beyond before that the the the foundation of this deal happened in the 0405 lockout right gary betman said we are not playing hockey until we get this deal the owner's one the owner's one yeah the nhlp is it's the worst union in sports well no the nhl the the nflpa is pretty pretty yeah at least yeah because you could go you could go get a concussion your career is over and they're like all right we're paying you zero dollars oh yeah oh yeah they do have guaranteed oh yeah no you're they can just cut you um uh but that is pretty big eh the nfl broke the players union in the 80s they broke them they got them to split and that was what was going to happen in 0405

had they not come to an agreement the players basically as much as people don't like bob good now they basically turned on they turned on their own guy and fucked themselves and it's the players that were making big, big money that did it, you know, rookies in the NHL used to get two or $3 million contracts. Now you have to wait three years to get anything more than, you know, you got rookie bonuses and stuff like that, but to get guaranteed money over a million bucks, you got to wait three years. That's you're going to play 160 something, get 180 games or more 210 games or whatever it is. It's insane. And so I just want to throw this out there that this, this hard cap, as much as it works great for the owners, who, by the way, are going to see their product value

and equity rise enormously in the next five years. Enormously. Because of these TV deals, because of people coming back to stadiums, entertainment being more important than ever, the billionaires are winning here. The players are getting completely screwed. And it's the hard cap that's doing it. Don't tell me that these guys in small market situations aren't making a fucking killing off this because they are if you're looking at a balance sheet season to season who cares unless you're a billionaire that can't afford this anymore i.e eugene melnick really allegedly there you go most of these guys oh i was just in ottawa let me tell you popular guy no i'm sure most of these guys are making an absolute killing off of

covid because they're able to hide assets they don't all that money that would have gone to the tax treasury well no it's well we're gonna write this off we're gonna write that off guys this is criminal and i don't know i i think it's bad for the game i think the hard cap is one of the worst things that's ever happened in the nhl and so what if we would have lost a couple franchises oh but who cares like honestly it's like well we would have lost two to three franchises who fucking cares not a problem anymore well all the fans in those markets well okay so we would have lost the coyotes why hey that's who we would have lost we probably would have lost the panthers i mean where these are not markets and and also we're not in that we're not in that place anymore

That's the other thing that people don't understand is that was 20 years ago. We are now expanding. This is going to be 32 NHL teams. And they're all, yes, they're going to lose money, but they're all gaining. They're all gaining. Equity is huge. Don't underestimate it. And it's ridiculous that the players, like, you know, that we get mad at Matthews and

Marner for making 11 million bucks against, oh, they're selfish. Who's the selfish one in this equation? Really? Really? oh like i understand the argument and and this believe me i got this yelled at me a lot throughout the mitch marner negotiations is why are you cheering for mlsc i'm not i'm not like keep your money yeah let's go bell and rogers and let's let's go if only they had something break their way come on larry larry tenenbaum it's i'm gonna take out toronto maple leafs and

i'm gonna get a custom-made leaf that says tenenbaum because that's who i'm really cheering for it's not about that i'd rather the individual get the money than the massive organization but the reality is there's a salary cap and if a guy eats up too much of it it makes the team i cheer for a bad so i that was the logic that was the logic but you're right you are right but if you had a luxury tax this wouldn't change the thing that matters the most to the owners which is equity it wouldn't make the league worse it would make it better it would make it has to be a reason they're doing this though because they have control they can artificially control this is it greed yes of course it's greed and if you look at the nba owners uh they none of them seem

hurting they're okay yeah because they make like tenfold the nhl owners right and the nhl has listen gary betman's done great for the nhl owners there's no question you might hate him but he's done great for them but they have missed the boat on a lot of big things and the excitement of trade deadline and free agency being a fucking dud every year although this free agency was pretty spectacular this was ridiculous yes but you know how many trade deadlines in a row do we go well we got 14 moves and a lot of them are for seventh round picks oh many many many i remember the trade deadline just before covid a big move of the day i want to say was like kevin hayes or something like that and we were like whoo kasha moved for a first

andre kasha this is what i'm saying so uh i think it would be better for the owners and better for the players players make a little bit more money a lot more money changes hands and i don't know if you know how capitalism works but uh the more money moves the better it gets that's the whole point so it's a it's a shame that uh it's a shame that we're in this position because what we're just going to end up seeing is players losing money they're going to get bought out and if you're pro player in your pro union you should be pro luxury tax to hard cap if you are pro player and you are pro union that's what you should be pro so whereas there's if you're pro hard cap then you are pro owner that's what it is and there needs to be a luxury tax that kicks in and

and then there needs to be a hard cap on top of that and and that's what you say and all the decision makers and richest people involved go, nope, and they move on. And that's the end of the conversation. Yeah. Buck stops there. Yeah. This is a good cardio exercise for you, Adam. It's good cardiovascular,

you know, but it means dick all. Right. Nothing. Yeah, I know. I know. Oh, it's frustrating, though. I know. Believe me, I yell about how I would make the Leafs better every year i i know a fruitless argument when i see one you do it after every game now here's what they need to do two and five canadians will hear the words you have cancer

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It's Pret Organic Coffee, starting at just $1 all day, every day, now until December 31st. You gotta try Pret first at A&W. At participating A&W locations in Ontario. Now let's get into some fun. Jesse has what he believes to be the top Stanley Cup winning teams since the, interestingly enough, since the 0405 lockout. Okay. here can i can i just here are the candidates right in case you forgot who won all the cups you're gonna read okay so there's 16 stanley cup champions you're gonna go through them all

2006 hurricanes 2007 ducks 2008 red wings 2009 penguins 2010 blackhawks 2011 bruins 2012 kings 2013 blackhawks 2014 kings 2015 blackhawks 2016 pens 2017 pens 2018 capitals 2019 blues 2020 bolts in 2021 bolts that is a nice shirt jesse okay jesse those are the candidates give us your list all right top six stanley cup chain i landed on top six because i ranked like the top 10 ish and i landed on a definitive top six in that i don't think the seventh team could squeak in and i think this is the definitive top bunch of teams so it's in order we'll start at the very top or do you want to go six to one go six to one six to one okay okay let's do it then let's do it that way pittsburgh penguins 15 16 interesting they land at number six a lot of um

there's you'll you'll see some consistent criteria amongst these teams some of it is uh regular season success played a huge factor in my list playoff dominance huge factor those i think those are the two things i built this like a month ago when we talked about it so i'm trying to remember all of the uh the notes i made here but um the 15 16 penguins if you remember correctly uh they had a 15 10 and 3 record on december 12th they fire their head coach mike johnston they replace him with the other Mike Sullivan. I'm surprised their record was that good. I thought it was worse.

I thought it was worse, too. And remember, our hot take at the time was Jim Rutherford needs to go. Yep. Yep. I remember. I remember. So they land at six on this list

because they didn't steamroll their opponents in the playoffs, but they only had to play one game seven, and that was versus Tampa in the second round. These were the Matt Murray rookie playoffs, if you remember. Yep. He started more games in the playoffs

than he did in the entire regular season. He had a 923 save percentage. This is the Phil Kessel Stanley Cups when he was robbed of a Conn Smythe trophy because he had to give it to Zidney Crosby. 10 goals, 12 assists, 22 points. That compares to Crosby's 19 points. Notable names from those teams,

Crosby, Malkin, Kessel, Letang, Kunitz, Sheery, Rust, Bonino, Hagelin. It was the HBK year as well. Benino, Benino, Benino. Benino in game one. Yep. Oh, that was great. It was a fun run.

You know what else I remember about that? I believe it was ESPN. Not a single analyst picked the Penguins. Wow. They all picked the Sharks. Yeah, but I mean, we'd had to have ESPN had to be covering hockey at that time, which they decidedly were not. Fair.

So when you compare this team at number six to the other teams, remember that their third line was their best line. Like that HBK line was their best line in that playoffs. So imagine having a team so stacked that your third line is your best offensive line. So that's the 15, 16 Penguins coming in at number six. Now, number five, I'm not going to spend a lot of time in the description of the team because you remember them very well, because at number five is the 2020-2021 Tampa Bay Lightning. The ability to be the best offensive team on the ice or the best shutdown team on the

ice at any moment depending on whatever you needed on that very night is why they land at number number five here they could have a 6-4 victory or they could have a 1-0 victory 1-0 victories which they did very often surprisingly throughout this last playoffs um they didn't have a dominant run i'd say as compared to like the top uh four teams that that we're going to get to but that's why they come in at number five because they were such a strong team but they they had a lot of trouble versus the islanders who i had ranked as the second best team in the playoffs when we did those other rankings um they played in the best division in hockey during the regular season they finished in third behind carolina carolina and florida if you remember that and then um notable

names you you all know them kucherov point stamkos headman mcdonough basilewski we could run them all down the list that's number five number four 2011 2012 los angeles kings interesting they a lot of similarities to pittsburgh they fire their head coach on december 12th the exact same day that pittsburgh a couple years later fired their head coach um they fired terry murray they named john stevens interim head coach and then on the 20th they hired daryl sutter to be their head coach uh replacing stevens that the final month of their season in the top three teams you'll see this trend as well it starts here with the uh kings the final month of the season they go 12 four and three dominance carter with jeff carter leaving the way um they have the most dominant

playoff run uh in the cap era but a regular they were a regular season team that lost more games than they won so so i think they went they went 40 27 and 15 which is 40 and 42 if you're counting the overtime losses as losses uh they were hurt during the regular season they had no scoring And at the trade deadline, if you remember, or just before the trade line, they trade for Jeff Carter. Greatest mid-season trade of the cap era. That's what I put here. Without question.

I think, like, there's no, I don't know how you debate it if the team goes on to win the Stanley Cup and then this guy becomes your best player on the ice. They lost four. They were like 11th place team in the conference. They were terrible. Yeah, it was crazy. They lose four games in total in the playoffs.

And two of the games were after they took a 3-0 lead. So of the four games, they were already up 3-0 in the series and they lose another. Noble names from those teams, Carter, Quick, Dowdy, Dustin Brown, Dustin Penner, Kopitar, Mike Richards, Voinov, Rob Scuderi. You run down the list, these Kings teams were amazing. I wrote this final note. At 10-10 of the first period of the finals, New Jersey's Steve Bernier was assessed a major boarding penalty and a game misconduct on a hit for Rob Scuderi. the kings then put the game out of reach by scoring three goals on the ensuing five minute power play so the power play it's just there's as soon as you score like it doesn't cancel so

they scored three goals on the full five minute uh penalty and if i'm mistaken the devils had won back-to-back games too yeah there was a chance they were gonna do the reverse sweep yeah that was that was game six and that wrote it off and the five the five minute major penalty ended the whole run by the Devils, and the Kings went on to win the Cup. Kovalchuk was unbelievable during that playoff run for the Devils. So was David Clarkson. So, yes, he was.

Yes, he was. Then the next year, yeah. Number three, 06-07 Anaheim Ducks. Shout out Brian Burke. Set an NHL record by earning at least one point in each of their first 16 games

in the regular season they started off 12 0 and 4 nhl record notable names on those teams gets left perry salani chris pronger nita meyer jaguar bruce goloff chris kunitz dustin penner two names that were on the list previously as well uh this reason this team's at three is because no team except the two teams above them on the list were as dominant as them in the cap era in terms of regular season um it was extremely boring cup run to the finals for them if you remember the ducks went four one versus minnesota four one versus vancouver four two versus detroit there was the only kind of challenge and then four one versus ottawa it was like it was boring because the ducks literally just went through the playoffs without a challenge they get every

series nothing goes to the limit and then in the finals uh they and then the three one goal games in the in the finals what i was looking for so three one goal games in the finals is super close for ottawa but it was never really close for the ducks because they ended up just winning as they did every other series and that's when eugene was a hero in ottawa because he'd save them right people forget changes stuff there's a few names on this list already where time changes stuff significantly yeah number two the 12 13 chicago blackhawks they won the president's trophy the only team besides the top team on this list to win the president's trophy and then win the stanley cup when i was doing the research for this for this little list here i i realized how

rare it was for the best regular season team to also go on to win the stanley cup so the two teams at the top of this list did that very thing the blackhawks went 21 oh and three do you know how ridiculous that is to do that in a hockey season it was ridiculous like because it was it was we were all just happy to be watching hockey again and i remember like so it sort of flew under the radar because everyone was so obsessed with their own team and then every now and then you check the standings and be like sorry the blackhawks haven't lost yeah didn't lose until the 25th game of the season it was ridiculous so uh their road to the stanley cup they they took care of business uh the wild they beat them in the first round then they went down 3-1 to the red wings in the second

round they almost lost and they came back to win the series then they beat the kings in five and the kings they beat in the finals that year do you if you remember the kings won the cup in 12 and 14 so i think the out of anybody on this uh on this list that's that's probably the the toughest opponent opponent that any stanley cup champion has had the blackhawks facing the kings in the semifinals. I think I said the finals of the semifinals of the Western Conference.

Will the Western Conference finals be in the Kings there who were the Stanley Cup champions in the sandwich two years before there? And then they go on to beat the Bruins in the final

who won the Cup two years prior. So the last three Stanley Cups, they beat the two teams who won those last three Stanley Cups. Well, and 17 seconds. 17.

Do you remember that about? So it was game six. The Bruins were on the verge of forcing game seven in that series brian bickle scores with like a minute and a half or something like that to go to tie it and then dave boland scores 17 seconds later they win the cup unbelievable it's amazing like how many cups were scored like with less than two minutes to go in the game obviously alec martinez was overtime there was this by dave boland and there was also patrick hornquist in

2017. It was a 0-0 game with like a minute left in scores. And the Leafs were also obsessed with getting third line pieces off of Stanley Cup winners. Adam, I was having fun. I don't know. It started

with, what was his name, Versteeg. And it was also Bolin and Clarkson. Same year? Yeah, they got them the same year. No, it was one a year. You gotta get one every year. it was great i know bolin and clarkson was same year same year yeah you're right so at six it was the 15 16 penguins at five the 2021 lightning at four the 11 12 kings at three the 0607 ducks

at two the 12 13 blackhawks can you guys tell me who's number one i think you're gonna say last year's lightning um i i don't know how you can't say last year's lightning um so i'm gonna also say steve last year's lightning you're both incorrect oh the number one team on this list of the post lockout stanley cup champions is the 0708 detroit red wings oh let me tell you about this damn team interesting besides the black ox they're the only other team to win the president's trophy and then win the stanley cup notable names on this roster setterberg datsu cronwall lindstrom phil pula chris draper osgood backed up by old man hasik chris chelios played 14 playoff games but not in the finals from this would have been like no yeah no you can't do that from

From November 24th to February 5th, they went 26-4-3. The regular season dominance is there. They outshot Pittsburgh in every game of the Stanley Cup Finals. And I bring up the shots because they had 58 in Game 5. Did it go to overtime? That was a triple OT game. Okay. That Marc-Andre Fleury stole by standing on his head.

Pittsburgh won a triple OT game where they had 58 shots. The Red Wings did the wings never faced elimination. So unlike the Blackhawks where they were down three, one in the box, that's come the wings. They dance to the finals. They dance all the way to a victory, never facing elimination.

More impressively in the Stanley Cup finals, they never trailed. They never trailed in the games. Like it was, it was just lost to overtime games. uh yeah they lost they lost the two overtime games the triple ot one and then the other one i don't have it in front of me which which is the other game but yeah they never trail there and then uh this is the icing on the cake they almost repeated the next year but lost in

game seven to pittsburgh this is my this is the best team i think of the post lockout interesting very very interesting now i'm i could run through my list super quick here steve do you have your list ready i sure do okay do you want to go sure you go okay so i have the 2007 ducks as number six they were a really influential team um that team i mean people wanted brian burke because of that team beliefs um yes and randy carl there was a conditional pick in the chris pronger trade from edmonton to anaheim and i remember the conversation i wish i could find the interview somewhere but it was basically kevin low with the oilers uh just having a frank conversation with burke this was pre them wanting to fight in a barn and he was like you know i'm just handing you a trip to

the stanley cup final right he goes yeah so they put a conditional pick in there that was if they made the stanley cup final you get another first and that first ended up being i believe jordan emberley oh wow i want to say yes so but uh they were unbelievable for all the reasons that jesse said number five i have the 2009 penguins um because the mark recce penguins oh yeah people forget that's where he got his third tattoo i believe because he has a tattoo for every with every team he's won with who's he got he's got the hurricanes he's got the penguins i don't remember did he win with the habs in 93 i think he might have when he was really young maybe yeah i don't i don't remember anyway um so yeah 2009 penguins watching it live was such a great passing of the

torch moment and you know you talk about having to overcome someone the penguins had to overcome the red wings but they didn't just have to overcome the red wings they had to overcome the red wings who had stolen one of their best pieces from the previous year in marion hosa which marion hosa after losing him back-to-back stanley cup finals decided i'm never doing that again and then he signed for a dozen years in chicago or ended up winning three cups number four i have this year's lightning um so regular season success far less of a factor for me in my list i just looked at the run but the lightning this year while they didn't dominate teams when push came to shove in elimination games they weren't losing there's no shot of it there's no

shot of it bless the islanders they were wonderful maybe even the second best team in hockey there was no shot uh andre vasilevsky in elimination games is simply the best goalie in the sport right now number uh three sorry the 2012 la kings um they were unbeatable uh for like three months it was the lead up to the playoffs was wild um they barely lost they they speed wobbled a bit in the stanley cup final but they ended up shutting it down number two 2013 blackhawks jesse set that up extremely well they were just dominant and number one the reason i called the 2019 penguins a passing of the torch moment and the part of the reason the ducks are on this list is because of the 2008 Detroit Red Wings.

They were the standard. The standard for a really long time. And you look at the Kings teams that eventually developed. You looked at the Blues teams that did so well for so long and never quite made it. You look at the Sharks teams that did so well for so long and didn't really quite make it. The Red Wings' fingerprints are all over that.

If you wanted to win the Stanley Cup, especially in the West, you had to go through them. And Jesse, you read that roster. Yeah. She's crazy. What on earth? Like, how many Hall of Famers?

Five? What on earth do you do? Yeah, five so far. Like, Chris Osgood's probably getting it. No, it's way more than five. I think it's that seven. Seven now? There you go.

I'd be surprised. Hold on. and like how many olympians how many gold medalists how many like chris draper and kirk maltby were olympians people people forget that right as like shutdown guys because well they knew it worked you know they didn't have to be the most skilled guys but they're like well we need a fourth line and we know they can do it against the best yep so they had them so i mean the goalie for the best team of the cap era was chris osgood go figure you know but they were an unbelievable team this was a really hard list um one of the teams i

badly wanted to add to this list was the 2011 bruins just because they were one of my favorite stories of the cap era but and and not just for what they were but for what they influenced yes they ruined teams mentally for a long time they ruined they tore the canucks dynasty down from from the foundation even though they went on to win the president's trophy the next year what happened they ran into the big western bruins the the even bigger western version of the bruins in the la kings and got steamrolled um and then they never recovered to this day they haven't recovered they've they've never re-achieved yeah that stanley cup final was just devastating for the canucks organization and the mindset in there yeah and it's so weird the games it was a tight

series but the games that they lost they weren't in they didn't they lose one like eighth two or something like that they lost game seven four nothing on home ice it was it was a very very strange series but i feel like that team was influenced by the 20 the 2007 ducks team kind of so anyway that's that's my very long list i like the 2011 blue and bruins edition i think that's a really good one um so it's is it the 12 13 hawks is that how i was is that how i refer to the lockout hawks the lock house um i'm gonna give them monsters i'm gonna give them the number six on my spot obviously they're monsters obviously like just an incredible hockey team um but i think you also have to remember the the insane stress that that lockout caused

so to come in and to win and to be as dominant as they were right off the top and all the way through the season um it's almost like what the new england patriots were where they didn't lose a game until the super bowl right they were just that good and this in this case the hawks won so that's why they get number six on my list number six sorry number five is the 16 pens and i think you know for all the reasons jesse outlined you're talking about firing a coach you're talking about underachieving you're talking about um you know getting phil kessel and it not working out all that great and then all of a sudden bang this team explodes in january right and never look back uh uh you know nobody expected it like this and then they've got some some random goalie coming

out of nowhere named matt murray who's this guy you know uh yeah because remember they replaced their number one goalie because he got injured right like that's nuts and mark andre flurry is going to be in the hall of fame guys uh at least oh yeah oh yeah so like think about what happened with that team that the insane amount of things that had to go right and they all did and they did for two seasons that's pretty sweet that's that's why i give that that team the edge over the the team that won the next year because um that team was the blueprint and then of course they just repeated against nashville uh absolutely loved uh that series and being there by the way um oh wait detroit or is it oh nine uh oh wait oh wait you know for all the for all the reasons that

jesse and steve gave all the hall of famers and that sort of thing but the reason i have them not ranked in my top three is because of all those players there are teams that had insane runs with players. Like, I think you got to give Detroit's development system. I don't know how they had this direct line into Sweden where they were drafting guys out of the sixth and seventh round for so long that turned out to be super, super good. But that was sort of the last hurrah for that team. The teams in my top three, I believe were teams that were put together by at least some pretty intelligent GM ship, shall we say, and kind of made the most of their weaknesses. That Detroit team is one of the last teams

that I can remember that literally didn't have a weakness. Like even Chris Osgood, people give him a hard time. Chris Osgood wasn't a bad goalie. He was an average goal. But that Detroit team did not have a weakness. They were not weak anywhere.

And that's almost impossible to accomplish in the salary cap era. So they're not going to get into the top four for that reason, but also they just, sorry, the top three for that reason, but they also deserve a huge mention because everybody after that

for the next five six years tried to emulate it um my favorite team on the list by far is the 07 ducks i loved that so fun they were really fun loved love that team it was such a shame the next and a bunch of assholes and a bunch of assholes but like you know even guys like travis moan remember travis moan travis moan bastard he was to play against rob niedermeyer sammy paulson yes yeah great penalty kill um and and what was interesting about that team for me was that like they should have repeated that team should have repeated i think if you were to ask scott niedermeyer but no they should have they should have red wings but the red wings but also let's be honest scott niedermeyer retired and then came back and wasn't the same right like that's

what it was he shouldn't have retired i know you want to retire on top but if you're going to retire on top commit to that but you didn't and you came back and you weren't the same and the sun was setting on js jaguar's dominance yes yeah but boy the team below them on your list beat them yeah that's true i just have to say i i love that 07 duxton i really genuinely i watched every game of that run because the leafs were missed the playoffs by i think a point that year um with jso van and i think uh or was that the year before um anyway they did miss by one point i don't remember if it was like a new jersey didn't start broder and then the leafs couldn't get in and everybody get mad at new jersey i'm like no this is the this is the leafs fault this

is the leafs fault i should have won another fucking game it's not new jersey's fault it's the leafs fault but anyway that that team was just fun to watch they were dominant everywhere and man chris pronger was unreal to watch uh half the shit he did then would be illegal now but still fun to watch uh i did i looked up a stat just just so stupid how good the 2013 black Hawks were so they had two goalies um well they had one goalie who played one game and lost it was Carter Hutton I do not remember him ever being a Blackhawk their starter and backup goalie had an identical goals against average which to me helps tell you if it's the team as good as the goaltenders were it's the team uh they both had a 194 goals against average under two it's two guys

combining for 51 was that niemi or crawford that year that the starter was cory crawford with a 926 save percentage and their backup with a 922 i forgot all about this ray emery right with a record this is your backup remember the leafs couldn't get a point out of their backup oh i remember ray emery in 21 games had a record of 17 and one that's crazy that's their backup 17 and 1 with a record uh 17 and 1 with a 194 goals against average and a 922 save percentage three shutouts um you just simply don't have a chance you don't have a chance number two on my list if i can that's okay yep no i'm surprised nobody mentioned this the 2020 tampa bay lightning guys oh wait no you didn't no you didn't i thought

you're going 21 yeah 2020 tampa bay lightning deserved the second place on this list not because not because they weren't special they were and are you know that core is pretty special and we're going to look back and then go wow that was pretty great um there were a couple stories that emerged out of this i i think people had this bullshit line last fall when the cup was you know cup run was happening that this cup was an asterisk cup by people you mean mr cox oh yeah who cares well there were people about that there were people that that you're right jesse i forgot that was him that sort of created that but there were uh there was a undercurrent of people like this this cup doesn't count it's bullshit um this was the hardest stanley cup personally to win

uh and you saw teams you not me not for me no but like on a personal level imagine like the further you get the less time like the longer you're away from your family yeah uh the longer you don't get to see the people in your life that you love and we saw teams like the washington capitals go fuck it we don't care remember that yes allegedly say fuck it we don't care you teams literally fold the leafs folded probably against their will you had what we think in the caps was just a laissez-faire sort of attitude they don't want to hang out at hotel x for more than a week right and hotel x is pretty nice i don't know what their problem is but no but seriously it's like you know you don't want to be away from your family i get it i get it

The thing was, the fact that this cup even happened is a miracle. It's an absolute miracle. The fact that they did not have one positive COVID test throughout the entire situation, another miracle. The fact that Stephen Stamko stepped on the ice at all in game three and scored. Five shifts. Miracle.

And the fact that you could keep 22, 23 guys that focused for that long and against a really tough Dallas team defensively. they were great i think you got to give kudos to that nothing about 2020 was easy and these guys were expected to perform at the top level yes i know you play shinny with your buddies and that's cool but playing hockey at an elite level isn't easy i know that you like to play road hockey and you think that it's fun and you're going well these guys are just playing hockey uh why are you shitting on people who play shinny i ain't no problem people say play shinny but it's the same people who will be like i play shin but they'll be like well i like playing hockey so it's easier

give me a fucking break on this yeah like give me a you shinny playing dick yeah shitty dick so here's what i would say here's what i'd say the 2020 cup was on a off ice level the hardest stanley cup ever won that's my opinion it was in the middle of a pandemic i don't think anybody's gonna argue with that and that's why that team deserves to be that now um by that logic they should be the number one team on the list but i'm gonna go with my favorite team and my favorite team the 1967 toronto sorry the 2012 los angeles kings they were great they were just spectacular to watch what a fun run all the way through and right jesse you nailed it jeff carter baby what a trade so good oh and and and i think a couple years later when they wanted 14 didn't

they get marion gabrick too and yeah yeah and that was another great trade but that 2012 team was there was just something about them you knew we were going into a lockout at that point too like we knew it wasn't it was we wasn't gonna be hockey for a while not me i was pretty sad about it so enjoy this moment while you have it and they played they played hockey that advanced stats guys would love and hockey that the old school peeps would love to it's just it was the perfect balance they were tough they were mean they could score the games were grinding but they were also fun and exciting jonathan quick stood on his head head i think andrew berkshire always says it perfectly about jonathan quick he has about one good month a year uh or at least back then he did

and it's mad and it was hey yeah it was the month that mattered and he was unbelievable unbelievable so uh the the 2012 kings absolutely my favorite run um and the ducks of course in that too so maybe my list is a bit biased but fuck it it's my list yeah and you can you can go look at Jeff Carter's individual stats from that run and they're not like mind-blowing but if you look at the split, the pre

Jeff Carter Kings and the after, they're not the same team. They're not. They're not even close. They were the first or second in the league in possession behind the Canucks and then they took the Canucks in the first round and put their head in the toilet.

Wasn't close. It got Vino fired. Didn't it? i think it did yeah yeah i still remember this shot of him walking off the ice and i'm like there goes a fired guy he's done they just won the president's trophy for the second consecutive year he's done it was interesting looking at the list of stanley cup champions since 0506 because i don't none of them stand out as oh that team probably like the best team didn't really win that year there's like a couple cases where you're like how did that really happen st louis i think when you look back you're like oh that was a little a quirky victory you know

i'm surprised they didn't make your list because because of how because of how you valued the regular season like yes they were last when the calendar rolled over but then it was like it was like 2019 hit and you couldn't beat them yeah because they were i forget how far out of the playoffs they were but no team had come back yeah no team had come from last uh making the playoffs to win the Stanley Cup like St. Louis did. But I just look at the other teams, I look at them as more dominant. And I don't know, I guess you look back now

and you're like, okay, if they were the best team since that January run, their Stanley Cup victory makes a little more sense in that context. So yeah, I agree with you on that. Probably flipped my mind on that. And like the Washington year, Washington probably definitely deserved it. No, they all deserved it.

They all, I mean, they all deserve it. But when you look, okay, the best team that regular season or that season overall did they actually win the stanley cup in most cases they did i think the caps would have been on all of our lists had they followed it up in 18 uh sorry not in 18 uh yeah within 18 with a better a better run in 19 yeah sorry 19 19 yeah um the the i was talking to berkshire about this a long time ago if you look at the list of cup champs like since like 2000 or whatever and and again you see some of the dynasty teams that we went through the one team that sticks out like a sore thumb and they deserved

it. They deserved it. But the one team that sticks out, you look at Carolina and you're like, what are you doing? That's what I was about to bring up. Oh, there you go. But the reason I like I'll be like, okay, Carolina is probably the one team that sticks out, but it was coming out of the lockout. Nobody really

had an idea of what anything is, right? They, okay, they straight up weren't good. They bought a second in the east. They bought have no on paper though i'm saying they were like some teams you know how they know they they a lot of their best players from that run i'm trying to find it uh did

ottawa win the president's trophy that year um they did i want to say they did in 2007 when they played the ducks they were first or second but like cory i'm trying to think of who was who were their acquisitions because there's cory stillman i don't remember if he was an acquisition of that team oh you know what no sorry it was recce and wait they're two most like two of their most important guys were acquisitions and they began they began those playoffs not just down to nothing in the first round to the montreal canadians but with their starter as martin gerber it was because he stunk that they switched to cam ward who went on to win the consmith like nothing

like yeah they won and everything they didn't they didn't know they were going to win like that not certainly not when the season began they had no idea do you remember that year the Hart Trophy winner was also traded midseason Joe Thornton was traded

from the Bruins to the Sharks in the middle of the season and then he won the Hart Trophy you look at his stats and you can see the logic of the Bruins going okay so he struggled before the lockout and now he's shit hot to start the season with these new rules so we're gonna we're gonna sell high and he went to the sharks and got better and i remember chichu the the rocket race was chichu yogger and i remember making wow i remember making a bet

with someone at high school i remember making a bet chichu was like 10 goals behind yogger or something like that i was like he's gonna catch him but no you're nuts but he was scoring at such a monstrous let me go find this. He was unstoppable. Unstoppable because all he had to do, hey Jonathan

you know how you skate around the ice and everything? Alright, well when you do that, I need you to do me a favor and make sure your stick is also on the ice because the best passer in the sport is going to find you and he's going to

make professional hockey look easy. oh my oh my this is stupid looking up his stats yeah i'm looking at okay it's fun reminiscing about 20 years ago we do we do have to rap very soon though yeah no no i'll do it i'll do it so this is one two three four five six seven so these are the seven games this is probably where this conversation started with my friend the final seven games of the season chichu who i believe ended with 56 goals so he wasn't even at 50 yet two goals one goal two goals zero goals two goals hat trick zero goals the end of the season

slightly hot slightly hot he was pretty good Jonathan Chichu and that was all Thornton that second last game of the season by the way five points

can I say two things before we go okay because we really got to go before everyone yells at me I read my stat about the Red Wings they didn't trail

they trailed in the series with Pittsburgh they never trailed in a series in the playoffs I just, I miss said that they never trailed in a series and, um, twitch.tv slash SDP and live is a new thing we got going. We are now on Twitch search SDP and live. I think you guys, I'm going to tell you right now on the show, four 30 on Friday, four 30 PM Eastern every Friday for the next four Fridays till the, till the end of the summer. we're gonna do 4 30 p.m eastern on fridays can you gentlemen join me this week i don't know how but sure i don't i don't know i think so maybe i don't we'll have to check i don't know i'll have to check all right all right

my answer to that is so if you want to see live uh sdpn content uh i'll be there at least i don't know if my friends are gonna join me oh i think this will play depending on what games uh the people are there but uh on yesterday we did our first ever twitch stream i played gta 5 for the first time ever i i've never played gta oh it's going yeah it came out in 20 yeah you can tell i didn't know how to shoot so it's first time ever playing gta it's fun you can watch back the live stream on our youtube channel every time we do a live stream on fridays going forward you'll be able to watch it on the youtube channel like a couple hours afterwards after the live stream is done so can i just kick off a uh a stream from my like ps5 anytime so no

you i don't think you can right now if we hook you up with some technology and stuff we can probably get it going for you but on friday i'll show you how to join me and uh we'll play some games if you guys are free sick because i want to do some f1 because i'm bought f1 and i'm getting my ps5 back and i'm really excited f1 with a guy who doesn't give one f it's adam wilde all right can we wrap it up gentlemen no twitch.tv slash sdpn live go there jonathan chichu in 2005 2006 all right we'll see you in three weeks you know we really love you we'll see you august 31st have a fantastic rest of your summer and when we come back it's back to business it'll be a one episode and then every week after that two episodes

two episodes that week oh it is two episodes that week then i'm an idiot then we're back to two episodes a week so there you go i have to excuse my friend adam it's his first week okay we're the 31st and the second we go tuesday thursday when we come back all right it's been a great break for three fucking seconds let's go let's fucking go all the way through to the july 1st next year yeah all right here we go ladies and gentlemen we will see you for our first two a week episode and the 30th of August, 31st of August. Love you.

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