The Steve Dangle Podcast - Honour. Pride. Courage. | October 20, 2025

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Starting point is 00:01:10 download that taskrabbit.ca code dangle the steve dangle podcast with your host steve dangle adam wild and jesse blake let's go hi um all right so uh sports i guess um i want to start with this a reminder that easter seals uh we're taking the donations and that sort of thing jesse you set a nice little goal last night during your stream for easter seals did you not yeah the goal was donate money and people did it was awesome that's great yeah you're in that no we're uh we're still raising money for easter seals ontario because those kids with physical disabilities need all the help they can get and yeah we had a donation blitz during the stream and a whole bunch of people donated

Starting point is 00:01:55 i hit my goal um i was trying to raise a thousand dollars and i passed it so maybe i'll up my goal uh tonight on the stream can you wait until i've uh my goal all the money's going to the same place who cares i know i know well i just know the way steve will look at me the rest of the year if i don't first of all skill issue get good yeah get good but also everyone on our team has to raise a thousand bucks and there are currently two of us that have raised a thousand dollars or more so please go on over to the rachel's raiders page you can donate to me you can donate to jesse or you can donate to anybody on rachel's raiders yes maddie you can donate to maddie get maddie over a thousand before adam no yep no yeah donate to maddie no you can't do that thank you to these

Starting point is 00:02:44 strangers in my emails i get them every other day and it's like 50 bucks and i'm like all right sweet let's go let's go and it and that's like have you been asking for it or like no there you go now we're asking for it team maddie versus team adam i'm at like 500 bucks it's not bad let's freaking go out of what you have uh skill issue don't know donate to anybody on rachel's raiders and again any donation to anybody how about me first on anybody it could could be anybody anybody when adam ends up in the last anybody on rachel's no okay we don't want that that or do we you know what like what if it's because everybody else just has so much and he has a lot but not as much as long as everyone on rachel's raiders passes a thousand good i i

Starting point is 00:03:30 actually don't give a damn everyone who donates to anybody on rachel's raiders is automatically entered into a raffle to get a pair of tickets to leafs sends december 27th get in there all i do is love all i do is love i bring love i share love i love the people in this room oh yeah i don't get that love back what if that person's a penguins fan don't you feel bad you don't love them i i went to their arena jesse i went to their house i went to their house i paid so much money for what if that person's lane hudson's dad uh 371 dollars 371 dollars is what adam has raised so far you are uh just uh you're behind maddie and you are just ahead of producer hayden let's go i don't feel like i feel like you're back here you know yeah get out there and raise

Starting point is 00:04:22 money yeah skill issue okay now let's talk a little bit about this so if you happen to listen to this episode before the game tonight because there's an 8 o'clock game tonight. Game 7. Jay's Yankees. Jay's Mariners. You know, the Leafs have a game 7 of their own on Tuesday, Adam. Let's talk about that. They do. That's funny. But yes, Jay's

Starting point is 00:04:43 Mariners tonight. Jesse will be streaming yet again. I will be doing I think I'm doing New Jersey, Toronto. Am I not? No, your stream's on Friday. Oh, it's Buffalo. Yeah. Okay, great. Buffalo's slow. More like it. Anyway, Vladimir Guerrero Jr. is third

Starting point is 00:04:58 the third player in MLB postseason history to manage a 1.5 or a 1500 OPS, depending upon how you say that, in at least 45 plate appearances in a single playoff run. The other two people to do it. In 2004, Carlos Beltran. In 2002, Barry Bontz. And let me let me do this one. This is also a crazy stat um there are five players ever with six plus home runs in a postseason run and less than 10 strikeouts overall jeez their names are barry bonds okay albert pooh holes okay carlos beltran ken griffey jr wow pablo pablo sandoval vladimir guerrero jr currently has six home runs and only two strikeouts in the 2025 postseason wow isn't that crazy wow isn't that crazy that's awesome that's that's so listen this is a guy that had a relatively

Starting point is 00:05:59 by his standards weak regular season 23 home runs 24 home runs 80 something rbis he went weeks at a time without getting home runs and and here's where i think and by the way we're having ken read on so we're going to talk to him about this a little bit later too ken reads got got a new book coming out that's called the next one it's gonna be sick maddie um yeah maddie come on pay attention you're mad you go yeah that was a skill issue she was she was looking at something um thank you my thing is when you get your best players being your best players forget the regular season if you cannot be the team's best players in the postseason then you should not be on that team for more than a couple of seasons when the team figures out ah this person's not a postseason

Starting point is 00:06:51 player bye-bye like the the raptors run was such a good blueprint uh like kawaii was the best player the entire time but there were moments from other guys like so he was the rock he was the foundation there was the pascal siakam game there was there were kyle lowry moments there were danny green moments there were sergio baca moments there were you need everybody but at the end of the day he had to be their best player basically the whole time jesse you've watched a lot of leafs post season in person yeah right you want to take back a lot of those moments you've watched a lot of jay's postseason this year and in fact you watch least postseason and jay's postseason in the same year which is rare because the jays rarely make it very far in the postseason what is it about this

Starting point is 00:07:45 what is this jay's postseason run thus far and again it could be over tonight we don't know what does it taught you i i don't know if this is going to make your blood boil steve but the toronto blue jays are a lot like the florida panthers in the way that they're all there for each other i i don't remember a jay's team that i've loved so much for the people that they are and i don't remember a jay's team that's loved each other as much as this the florida panthers just to just to illustrate what i mean steve the the way the florida panthers all post season were like we go to lunch together we go to Dairy Queen together we're all fighting for each other that's what this Jays team feels like when Brendan Little was put out there in a position

Starting point is 00:08:38 where he shouldn't have been everybody was completely fine with it in that Jays locker room because they were all like I'm just going out we got game six on Sunday it's every day we're fighting next day we wake up we're gonna go fight for the next guy next to me in that dugout they're such a good team in the real sense of the word. And I think truly you need that to be a great team. You need to be a cohesive unit on the field and off the field. And I think this Jays team has got it. And they've illustrated throughout the entire regular season with the great performances from like Springer and his bounce back year and how everybody's been so hyped with him off the field. And then during this postseason with Vladdy leading the way, everybody's there fighting for

Starting point is 00:09:20 each other more than even the jersey the the crest on the front they just want it's the people in the room for the next guy next to him and that's what the florida panthers were the florida panthers were the exact same way and brad marshand went into that locker room and doubled down on it he made that even more apparent i thought i thought this florida team from last year was better than the year before and a large part of that is brad marshand's presence and what he brought out of that room and they were a tight-knit group and they got even tighter because of him in there and that's what i've learned a lot from these these guys in terms of just relating it back to a hockey example here's here's here's all i'm gonna say because i'm trying to hold it together

Starting point is 00:10:04 because i'm very upset jesse told no lies great that's all i'm gonna say jesse i've sent you two videos okay let me know because i want you to i'm gonna lose it i want you to queue them both up okay because i think it's important perspective is always important and listen i can't just make this about the playoffs it's game for the nhl i mean it's game six right like for the leafs anyway um i can tell you that i am i lost to one of my friends in the first week of the hockey pool that i'm in or a second week because evan bouchard who was pre-season ranked top 25 in all of yahoo fantasy is now ranked 677th that's psych because the oilers cannot score oilers cannot score man crazy their brand is chiseled into the side of the shitty october the rest of it's great like

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Starting point is 00:12:05 Code DANGLE. Now, I want to give you two examples here. This is what teams do. Jesse mentioned teams. This is what teams do in hockey. And you go, oh, it's early in the season. Okay, so you didn't watch Buffalo, Florida. I also know that you didn't watch New York-Montreal.

Starting point is 00:12:28 Let's have a look. Oh, yeah. Yeah, if you want to pull that one up, or you can pull the other one up. No, go ahead. New York-Montreal. There's a guy named Sam Carrick. He used to play for the Leafs. And he...

Starting point is 00:12:38 Cannot believe you stole him. What's Sam Carrick known for, Steve? Being a big old bowling ball. Yeah. So Sam Carrick absolutely laid out Lane Hudson. Oh, my God. He went Arbor Jack-eye? And then...

Starting point is 00:12:51 Well, here's the hit. Okay, here's what he did. Ready? Oh, bang. That's boarding. And he got him. Got him good. You see him there on the top left.

Starting point is 00:12:59 Yeah, top left behind the goalie. You have to imagine he is behind his own goalie. Sam Carrick catches him kind of mid-play, mid-pass. And it's a boarding call. But Sam Carrick absolutely crunches him. Sam Carrick's not doing that because he wants to take Lane Hudson off the puck in that scenario. He's doing that so he can intimidate Lane Hudson for later. He doesn't even care if he takes a penalty.

Starting point is 00:13:21 And what happens? there's this big guy next to lane hudson number 72 named arbor jackai and he arbor jacked sam carrick's face up okay now i gotta i gotta say this if you're arbor jackai and you don't fight in that situation you shouldn't be in the lineup take your shit off and go home buddy but take your shit off and go home but steve why are you yelling at him he did it yes he did adam now let's go to number two um let's go to number two hey team steve what do we what do we know about the san jose sharks this season not great hey isn't it great when your coach is like i would give up one of my children for a win that's a real quote he's been clocked on camera banging his head against

Starting point is 00:14:07 the glass publicly okay have they won yet no yeah it's tough no they have not but what happens when you touch Macklin Celebrini you should be dead or close to it okay so let's have a look at this if we can so this doesn't have the play on Celebrini so celebrate look he's lying down that's all I need to know I don't need to know what happened to him all I need to know is the franchise is on the ice right now and what happens just show me show me the aftermath okay let's not get it bogged down in the details and here comes day or nay on Cooley and and and it's uh uh there's look at that Confetti gloves. There you go.

Starting point is 00:14:45 Even J.J. Paterka's in there. And he's not known for that. But he's in there protecting the Utah guy, the San Jose guys are protecting the San Jose guys. I have to be honest, I'm not a fan of the San Jose third jersey, gentlemen. I just have to be straight with you. It's okay.

Starting point is 00:14:59 But Celebrini, when he does get touched, It's a problem. Stop playing hockey. The game's over. Why are we playing? The game is on hold. There's 13 minutes to go in the game in this particular instance.

Starting point is 00:15:12 Utah's up 5-2 on San Jose. but you touch Macklin Celebrini so we're not playing hockey anymore. Now, I want to show you for anybody that might have missed it. I want to show you what happens. Jesse, I'm just sending this over to you now.

Starting point is 00:15:28 Sorry. A live view of Anthony Stallers. Anthony Stallers, who for two straight years, even though he hasn't played enough games really to register, he has played over 25,

Starting point is 00:15:41 but you got to be, he's led the league or been close to it in save percentage. He was a 925 in Florida. We all said he's not going to be able to do that here, and he put up a 926. If Anthony Stollers plays 40 or 50 games this year, he will get Vezna votes if he continues.

Starting point is 00:15:55 They make the playoffs, no problem. Of course. So Anthony Stollers, and I think there's a pretty good, and I think Jesse mentioned it last week, pretty good sample size to tell you that the Toronto Maple Leafs, one of their newer parts of their identity is having a great goaltender.

Starting point is 00:16:11 Yeah, that was at the live show. And I think you nailed it, Jess. And so what do you do when you've got a top asset? Hey, listen, you're a hedge fund manager and your hedge fund is invested in this company and this company is getting you 10x returns. What do you do? Do you let another company blow that company up? Do you let another company come in and raid all their IP? Or do you fight like mad to protect everything about that company so i'm shaking i'm just i'm waiting for my opportunity you're just waiting uh hang on there kujo i know you're coming now it's important to understand the context about what you're about

Starting point is 00:16:55 to see because brandon and by the way bruins fans you're gonna freaking laugh at this actually anybody that's played the leafs of the playoffs gonna laugh at this anyone is going to laugh brandon carlo had already pushed a player into anthony stallers earlier this year which i believe anthony solar's got hurt last year was somebody doing that i don't remember and a goal that went in and it was the leaf's fault earlier this game earlier this game yeah you said years sorry i meant earlier this game it was like five minutes prior yeah so mason marchman of of the seattle kraken who by the way refused to come to toronto if the rumors are to be believed because he didn't want to pay the taxes here that's fine but you should you got to use every edge that you can to

Starting point is 00:17:33 hate a guy right you're playing seattle there's not a lot of animosity here make it up like who And the Seattle Kraken walk into the Leafs arena with the Mariners jerseys on. They walk in with the Mariners jerseys on. Carlo has already pushed a Seattle Kraken player into Stallers and it's led to a goal. And so what Mason Marchment does is what Mason Marchment always does,

Starting point is 00:17:55 which is why he's such a valuable player on any team he plays on. He doesn't give a shit. And he runs torpedoes Anthony Stallers. and i want you to watch the number 25 of brandon carlo look at marchment that is an elbow to the head and then he falls on stallers now we already know they're not going to call a penalty on this and by the way this podcast is past that we don't care we know the refs are not going to do anything they did call a penalty oh they okay it was goal interference they called the penalty oh that's

Starting point is 00:18:22 great yeah that's they went to the power and also like that's what carlo gives a shit you know who gives a shit also who gives a shit so what is carlo doing look at the straight knees of brandon carlo here marchman runs in there's less than a minute to go straight knees and that's my that's the worst thing if you're a defenseman straight friggin knees they're both in the back of the net and carlo's just standing there and so you're gonna see anthony stoller's get up infuriated berube should have snatched the jersey off his back and then he pushes the net over look at this pushes the net over and then brandon carlo's like oh i guess i better get involved I'm going to get him.

Starting point is 00:19:03 And Stoller's is fuming. And he skates away into the corner after that. And who cares what the penalties are? Anthony Stoller should have left the bench. Carlo does. What are they going to do? They're going to suspend all your 10 games? Bullshit.

Starting point is 00:19:17 We'll get to his answer in a second. It's fucking awful. I need everybody to understand the concept. And by the way, the Jays and Mariners are playing in the playoffs. The Mariners at this point are up three games to two. thank god the jays came back and showed some pride last night the least watch them walk into the arena with mariners jerseys on and then watch them walk all over them and after the game i want you to i'm going to give you the the anthony staller's post game video here it's okay you

Starting point is 00:19:43 can you pull it yeah it's we're good i want you to watch this it's the most watched non-blue jays thing in the country it's a new thing the leafs are doing they post their post game pressers directly to twitter great good idea now people they do read the quotes you can hear the guys say it they do not post their starting goalie saying this shit last year let me let me say this oh they their starting goalie would have been in trouble for saying this last year yes let me tell let me tell you this with each successive answer anthony stollers gets angrier you're gonna hear it in his answers every single time he has to answer a question here he's talking about it so jesse go ahead and play the clip it's two minutes and 30 seconds from tonight's game um it's a good third

Starting point is 00:20:26 period i just want to say side note uh the one time i'm not there is the one time there's quotes damn live show it was a lot of fun but damn it we should have just let you go here we go but first two periods you know we kind of let them walk all over us and um you know we just didn't play our game they all worked us in front of the net um blocked they blocked shots they beat us up and down the ice and um you know the score was indicative of that you know they just outworked playing simple. Are you getting a little frustrated with guys taking runs in? I mean it's just playing hard I mean maybe we can take a page out of their book and start getting to the net I mean for us it's uh you know we like to go a little high and shoot but um you know it's for their goal it's

Starting point is 00:21:05 like playing catch in the yard you're seeing everything and um we're not making it difficult we made it difficult in the third and look what happened you know we came out uh you know tied the game got a point out of it almost scored with five seconds left but uh it's a little too little too late and I think um you know even though we're six games into the season it's uh you know enough's enough and we kind of got to start picking it up here what are you seeing and feeling when Marchment crushes into you there I mean I'm not happy you know guys are gonna run me and you know I'm gonna try to stand up for myself and um you know I heard the ref say we got a power play and it's really not much I can do to him on the ground but um you know kudos to the guys who were

Starting point is 00:21:41 there and got down with him but um you know like I said I think we got to start going in the cage a little harder make it harder for their goalies um you know it's not fun i don't like having 225 pound guys landing on me so um you know hopefully uh learn a lesson here this is just early season i mean a lot of guys have been here for a while you know over time you can't let someone beat up the ice there and um that's the overtime he's talking about clear cut breakaway i mean minute left you know you want to be on the ice in that situation you gotta work really really work back and cost us a point there. So, I mean, at the end of the day, it's like I said, it's early.

Starting point is 00:22:17 We do have, you know, some time to gel. But, I mean, at the end of the day, too, it's more or less just about working hard. And, you know, just when we work hard, the results come. You saw it in the third period. And, you know, we can't play for 20 minutes, 30 minutes. We've got to do it for a complete 60. So, was it overtime play that left you frustrated to smash your stick? I mean, it's just overall.

Starting point is 00:22:38 I mean, you know, how many time points are we going to leave out there? uh you know being here last year and um you know seeing the team we had and seeing how far we were able to go and uh the potential like the potentials there like we have the skill we have the grit we have the grind and um you know it's just frustrating that uh you know we just can't put together right now all right now just i i'm split as a host just say when because i feel like we should let steve go a little here and then we should hear from brandon carlo or should we do carlo first no i can let steve talk give me carlo no i want you want carlo i want carlo because i want carlo we're all here because of you brandon it's all let's hear it get yeah what kind of what

Starting point is 00:23:16 what are you what do you got to say there brandon and now i want to say i want to tell you that brandon carlo cut his teeth with the boston bruins do you know anything about boston bruins hockey yeah it's uh what you do when you want to beat up a i do too much need shitty team like the Can I ask you just to please stop rocking? I can't. The chair is creaky. We already recorded with Ken. I'm on my second cup of coffee. I'm trying.

Starting point is 00:23:43 By the way, Brandon Carlo is 6'5", 225 pounds. Bullshit. Jesse, go ahead. See, as I saw the referee call the penalty, you don't want to do too much to retaliate, but yeah, there's a certain extent once you

Starting point is 00:23:58 see kind of slowly get up and be angry too. um you want to try and give him a shot but overall um you want to go on the power play as well so it's a it's a weird area to be in um but overall i think uh the power play is a useful thing in that situation that's the worst thing you could have said the worst answer it was the worst day i'm so sorry he's such a nice guy yeah no which is irrelevant i don't fucking care which is irrelevant to this is my next words um nice guy he says he says the complete wrong thing you should say there before steve goes off i want to say nobody's giving bobby mcmahon credit nobody's

Starting point is 00:24:40 giving bobby mcmahon credit do you know what i'm saying no i have no idea what you're talking about bobby mcmahon took a penalty and stood up for nick robertson when nick robertson got hit into the board well i told him like nick robertson got crushed the play was still going on and bobby mcmahon ran over and defended the player yep yeah like what nobody everybody's forgot that happened too there's a there's a guy on this team that stood up for a player on this team it was great and bobby whose stock continually rises because we wanted him to evolve his game and so far through six games uh out of everyone who was here from last year i think you can point at bobby and say there's been an evolution to his game he's mucking it up in front he's winning board battles he's

Starting point is 00:25:23 elusive he's not just speed and a shot uh and he's and he's sticking up for his teammates he took a penalty i i wanted to say that it's because that's going to get lost in this whole thing because you're going to go off for 20 minutes just to get that out there before i forgot i just wanted to credit bobby man for doing that because everybody lost that steve go ahead ken brought up something and you're going to hear it later in the show and it was a phenomenon that used to it was it was like during the sundin era i think is when this term was coined it's called blue and white disease and i never really believed it um basically brendan shanahan's job um was to and lou lamorello's job was to eradicate blue and white disease i'm starting to think there is you know

Starting point is 00:26:11 blue and white disease was like an entitlement i don't know if that exists here but let me tell you the disease that is permeating the organization when mike babcock was the head coach of this team uh their payback or our toughness is our power play that was the word yeah our toughness is our power play and that was from shanning our toughness is our power play and how did it work it didn't and they showed up every april got their little bottoms padded and sent on their merry way and they talked about the lessons they learned before going into their summer going into the next season going through the next season showing up in april getting their little bottoms padded and going on their merry way 2021 shows up it's a different world

Starting point is 00:27:04 covid happens we all know about all that is mike babcock there anymore no it's not mike babcock anymore saying our toughness is our power play it's Sheldon Kaif it's a different head coach and Ben Sherratt grabs Austin Matthews by the collar and he drags him around and nothing happens now there are other things from that series you know I I talked about this a little bit on Twitter yesterday you can retaliate however you want as long as you don't use your stick that is unless you're Joel Edmondson and Ben Sherratt cross-checking Wayne simon in the head and neck at the same time i didn't enjoy that very much but the leafs were like we're a better team we're more skilled than montreal we are not going to retaliate

Starting point is 00:27:53 and what happened montreal went to the finals montreal patted them on their little bottoms and sent them on their way that was 2021 now craig berube is the head coach of the toronto Maple Leafs I don't know if you know this about Craig Berube but he played in the NHL and Craig Berube his job was to beat the shit out of people he was good at it too he was very good at beating the shit a thousand games a thousand games beating the shit out of people if Craig Berube was on the ice stuff like this didn't happen and if it did happen he was either the doing it or he was beating the shit out of people in 93 94 he had 305 penalty minutes for the capitals jesse go ahead and give me his career high in goals and points uh career high in goals

Starting point is 00:28:48 is eight uh career high in points uh 18 18 games played please uh 1054 points please 159 that's impressive considering penalty minutes please 3149 the toronto maple leafs head coach his job was to beat the shit out of people that's what he did that's how he made a living that's how he put food on the table for his family that's why he's a head coach in the nhl right now is because he spent two decades beating the shit out of people 89 playoff games too it's not like they just how many penalty minutes in those playoff games 211 wow that's a lot it's a lot yeah babcock's not there anymore keith isn't there anymore lou isn't there anymore

Starting point is 00:29:48 dubas isn't there anymore tim lewicky isn't there anymore brennan shanahan isn't there anymore it's a new coach it's a new gm it's a new roster it's a new philosophy and they are still getting the shit beat out of them by the seattle crack by the sea you mother fucker are you joking me the team the soda crackers of the nhl we called them identity lists yeah and and what did i say and people didn't like it people didn't necessarily agree and by people i mean i think adam and jesse probably when the kraken went out and got mason marchman i'm like oh well he might make their games a little interesting at least and they're off to an amazing start i don't even know how many points he has i don't give a shit if he has any he makes them relevant what is on the inside

Starting point is 00:30:45 erroneously of the collar of every Leafs jersey. Honor, pride, courage? Fuck you. Honor, pride, courage? Who are you saying fuck you to? Toronto Maple Leafs.

Starting point is 00:31:02 I think there's a little too much honor. Honor, pride, courage. No grit, no grind, no greatness with periods. And now this year, no grit, no grind, no greatness two commas and a period the grammar needs to work here and yeah how about just throw that one out and go back to the marketing department why not a blue wall yeah here i i got

Starting point is 00:31:24 this here i got one unless your name is anthony stolars and you know what bonus points to bobby mcmahon you get a hall pass today if you're anthony stolars or bobby mcmahon and you're a member of the Toronto Maple Leafs this doesn't apply to you the rest of you shut the fuck up no one wants to hear from you no one wants an excuse no one wants to know why you're not doing something just do it you know Dion Phaneuf gets a lot of shit for his time as a Leaf and his time as Leaf captain. Listen, it didn't go great. The team around him was also not great. I'm not here to defend his time as a leaf, but I am going to tell you that team sucked ass and he gets traded to the Leafs and he plays in his first game. And it was ironically against the New Jersey Devils who the

Starting point is 00:32:29 Leafs have on Tuesday what did Dion Phaneuf do because he's in a new market on a new team trying to make a good impression he grabbed the first guy who agreed and he beat the shit out of him in Toronto on home ice tale as old as time song as old as rhyme and that's you know one of those stage fights i don't really remember if there was anything that led to it there are very few situations in life that are carte blanche one of them is in hockey if someone runs your goalie you beat the shit out of them it's like the default hey here here here i'll give you another one you have the puck you're at the offensive blue line okay you're you're jesse blake you have the puck you're at the offensive line go he's still crazy and you turn it over there's an odd

Starting point is 00:33:27 man rush going the other way there's an odd man rush going the other way who should be skating the fastest to go and get the thing me who turned it over you i gotta turn around let's apply that to another situation oh okay you're brandon carlo you knock a player onto your goalie and they score it's your fault we know it's your fault they didn't challenge it for goalie interference even though there was a player lying on top of your goalie not because the rule sucks and is poorly enforced although the it's your fault you knock the player on top of your goalie don't do that don't do that even the leafs video room agreed they're like yeah that was our fault that he was on the goalie yeah five minutes later maybe yeah if that a guy crashes your

Starting point is 00:34:21 goalie and you are the closest human being next to him and you don't do anything william neilander skates by with his hands on his knees i'm sick to my stomach Anthony Stolarz just signed an extension thank god because it's the closest I've felt to the Leafs having a captain in at least half a decade and and I want to say that towards people may not remember this but if you if you listen to the end of it he is calling out William Nylander too because he's calling Nylander uh blew uh well tried to try to score off an Austin Matthews pass in overtime and didn't get back in time isn't that right yes yes and he got he got blown he he got back it's just he got blown by on that he talked about getting out worked yeah

Starting point is 00:35:18 what's he talking about him he's not referring to himself he's calling out the damn team yeah the team that didn't defend him when he got run over concussed so bad he was throwing up on the ice and sent to the hospital and then they lost the series while he was watching because he was recovering from a head injury the most basic thing in the world should be protecting this human being you have two opportunities to do it in one game on home ice on hockey night in goddamn canada and you don't do it every player on the ice should have that jersey torn off their back honor pride honor pride courage my jake mccabe credit he did jump in and he was he was late back so it wasn't like he had an opportunity jake mccabe was right in

Starting point is 00:36:14 there fine it takes a team it takes a whole team carter verhage will will mix it up that guy's a beanpole he's six two i think a buck 80 maybe like i i had to look it up yesterday the panthers are not full of like huge guys like big imposing like i don't know they're big enough they're big enough they're psychotic no one's they're psychos they're out of their mind adam no one's asking you to be actually big just be tough if carlo is not going to do anything if if you're not i would jesse i tell you this all the time i would love to be six foot five if carlo wants a few pounds of mine he can he can have them like he's 225 i'm already there and then some so don't worry about that brandon but can i have can i have a few

Starting point is 00:37:17 inches of height can i have some of those i mean well you're not using them so can can can i have them that'd be great if you could just like exchange stats like in a video game but in real life i don't know you're six foot five give a few of them to us you're not fucking using them can i give and it's not just him can i give you stallers nylander and craig berube on stallers yesterday and then get your reaction on that did okay did they speak today yes they did if he walks it back i'm leaving the room okay let's not go that far if he walks it back they ask if he walks it back lfr might be over like i don't i don't what what go ahead they ask anthony about william nylander you know calling him out and we referenced that for his play in ot and and getting beat there and

Starting point is 00:38:05 he says it's all good look we're teammates he's a great guy there's nothing that we need to you know talk about here yeah he talked to me after and it's all good it's been no issue since i pulled willie aside and we had a conversation this is anthony yeah i'm continuing yeah uh oh yeah sorry Anthony now on on Nylander I pulled Willie aside and we had a conversation he's someone I admire and someone I respect deeply there's a reason he's been in this league league for so long he's a hell of a player he pushes me and I push him good that's Anthony good good one's good great okay the show can continue okay yeah right it's good Berube says about Anthony Stallers's comments it's frustration we all prefer to stay in the room but it happens but we've moved on from it

Starting point is 00:38:54 Good, great, good. Apologize to apologize to no one. If anyone, you know, you talked about Brandon Carlo cutting his teeth with the Boston Bruins and taking apparently absolutely nothing from that experience. Like I could have swore he was there like all those times that the Bruins beat the Leafs. I could have swore he was there on the ice for at least a couple of them. I think at least 2024 and 2019 i think maybe i'm mistaken maybe he was in the press box maybe i don't know you know yeah i know they have marshan and like chara might have been retired by them but no no not in 2019 he was hanging around maybe he's just along for the ride maybe they just gave him a jersey with the number on it stallers take some things from winning a stanley cup with the florida

Starting point is 00:39:42 i think you're absolutely right i don't think it's it's a coincidence that stallers was on that panthers team uh he didn't play but i think it's significant that he has this mentality about this leafs team because he knows what it takes to get it done because he saw it and he was there for it he they talked about dna change and this is one of the things that i forgot to mention leading into telling the leafs to shut the fuck up because it's just another it's just another incident of lip service from this team where nothing ever changes nothing changes ever okay we can't all be brutes and beat the shit out of each other all the time this is a cry for help from your goalie who who said in different words straight up their goalie had an easier job tonight than me

Starting point is 00:40:35 you go out and get dakota joshua you you who should have had a goal i'm yeah like oh yeah basically scored and hit the post himself no no i'm not criticizing him but like i just want to add that you you become a different team you become a bigger team your coach talks about wanting to play north south and in a dna change and you're six games into the season and your goalie is like help oh my god they're in trouble oh my god they're in so much trouble unless they turn it around immediately and the way they turn it around isn't like so often you hear the answer is inside the room the answer is in the room all it is is you have to play differently like i i talk about travis connecting all the time because you hear that teams want a certain kind

Starting point is 00:41:28 of player and they want to bring something to their team and it usually means a big person what if you're just an asshole what if you're just a bastard marshan's not that big he's built he's built a little like a like a teapot like he's i don't know five ten in shoes maybe and maybe 200 pounds like that's an asshole and look what he did to rasmus look what he did to raspist allene raspist allene who's fucking huge and he got a five thousand dollar fine for unsportsmanlike conduct i said this years ago fines should not apply to brad marchand he's been fined and suspended so many times fines are what leads up to a suspension suspend the guy what are you doing did you call him 5 10 uh in shoes yeah he's 5 7 wow he's listed

Starting point is 00:42:22 five seven yeah he's listed five seven yeah brad marsh if you and that's your father on your birth certificate that's your fucking father are you kidding yeah i'm begging any of you to give a fuck you you like tower over marsh and i don't know if you know this but that's how he heard your mighty might roar yeah like i was in scrums with him last year and he's like way down there now william me lander i think has the physical capability to dog walk somebody like the the forearms the he he is he's dogless like he has a gear in the playoffs he can play better he can do things that help your team win but he's not that he's dogless austin matthews he is his wrists and if he injures them then the season is in peril

Starting point is 00:43:23 he's not gonna do it we already know him is that a problem yeah yeah yeah um yes uh nize you want on the ice it's good that he'll beat the shit out of you max domey is lost out there at center like he's been he by the way he's been moved he's been moved he's in the he's on the top line now first line wing okay so give me that oh okay so the the uh lineup i'm just i have to look down through my staller's notes uh here it's up it's up on screen there you go so you got nice matthews domi michelli tavaris kneelander joshua wah mcmahon robertson lorenz and yarn croak on the fourth line that's okay i would say oh cowan scratched yeah i think that's probably time yeah i would uh probably replace robertson with blay

Starting point is 00:44:15 just i don't know florence is gonna play center you might as well just go all heavy he can't put domey at center yeah i i tell you what um here's all i give a shit about next game who's uh who's toughest leaf in a fight right now that's a hard stallers like okay i'm looking at i'm looking at nize i'm looking at joshua i'm looking at mccabe maybe benny probably not benny it's just he'll do it benny's hurt though okay so one of the names i just mentioned you grab brendan dylan on tuesday the rest of you grab everyone else i don't give a fuck what your name is i have no desire to watch a hockey game on

Starting point is 00:45:04 tuesday all it and like points in the standings matter you need these october points you you're obviously not that desperate for them i saw you play against seattle i saw you play against detroit play play the first one one period of hockey against detroit and then fuck it in the last minute so i know you're not all that worked up about the points so don't give me that shit there will be no hockey game on tuesday if you care about the crest there will be no hockey game on tuesday i cannot wait to watch 60 minutes of one power play each hockey and not a fight to be had that's how the devils play too great you outside of brendan dylan they might be the softest team in the league meyers meyer can be tough uh they're a great team they're a very very

Starting point is 00:46:02 good team might win the division could win the conference could contend honestly i think they're a very good team but they have had a problem for many years and that is they're soft and keith's their coach and he'll be like no there are our toughnesses our power play or whatever i know that was babcock but keith was almost a worst version of that at times the the one of the softest but best teams in the conference is going to walk into your building and this is the impression you're going to leave your fans with before you go on the road there can't be a hockey game tuesday i'm not interested in it the jays are so likable right now because they're never out of a game ever they get performances from everybody including their big guys i went

Starting point is 00:46:58 thermonuclear on the leafs on saturday night lfr numbers have been doing well in the five games leading up to that and i said oh this one's 100k guaranteed nope no one gives a fuck about this team why on god's green earth would they who care the Leafs are far more interesting to people who hate the Leafs than Leafs fans that's true yeah the Leafs are far more interesting to people who hate the Leafs than Leafs fans what is there to cheer about one thing you said uh I think you texted it the other day you said early returns on this team aren't good and they're horrified I think it was such a it's such a fair assessment because i'm usually very bullish on things take time you know i believe in craig berube and the system he's implementing but he just might not

Starting point is 00:47:54 have the people based on the roster that's being constructed and i think it's fair to say that early on through six games small sample size but through those six games there isn't a lot of things to point at and say this thing is really working because you go through the individual points in this lineup that they've constructed and everybody's kind of been amiss in the things we want out of them you the worst teams in the league are the teams where you point at them and you go i don't know what they are so for years the leafs have been a top six heavy team and you know you can talk about the flaws in that we talked about the mid-nauseum but at least you knew what they were and you knew they could get through the regular season like that and every

Starting point is 00:48:42 trade deadline you would try to address those concerns that's the tact the organization took that's the strategy they took at very least you knew what they were you knew they were good enough and then every trade deadline you try to push them over that hump and it didn't work okay whatever but you know you can make the playoffs like that then there's the tough outs there's this there's the skilled teams there's the skating teams there's the what are they we thought they were going to be a heavy team that leans on you crashes the net gets in your face and they're going to get some goals because they still have a lot of skill nope nope you you got dog walked by the seattle kraken

Starting point is 00:49:39 go away forever like i'm at the point like yeah mitch is gone like the the addition by subtraction was never going to be a thing you have to as they said for months change the dna and all you are is a less skilled version of last year's leaves like of course you suck of course you suck and now i find out you're even more meek than before ew there's i don't think a player i truly miss like if they were traded like what what attachment should i have or any leafs fan have to this team you are utterly like the opposite of the toronto blue jays you are utterly truly at the core of your soul unlikable are you worried about them being a playoff team this year um they're probably a playoff team but like what

Starting point is 00:50:48 okay if they miss the playoffs then you gotta change things up well you don't have a first round pick either so i do think they're a playoff team i do think they get it together i do think it's october right if you're if you're looking at if you're the senators right now you've just sent down yet levy marilinen and you're looking to mad so guard because lena solmark's not pulling it together and you can't kill a penalty uh the oilers can't score uh there are so many teams out there that are ripping it right now i don't trust the detroit red wings october hot streak i saw this movie in 2021 um but yeah they've had a great start Emmett Finney I am I am what I am going to say is that I've been really surprised by the lack of toughness from guys who are tough

Starting point is 00:51:29 and if they miss the playoffs and blow up the roster what are we preserving well we're not going there let's talk about what's here okay because that's this is game six yeah so who cares about if they fucking miss the playoffs right now what i'm looking at is what's the what's what's this team okay you brought in all these guys they're supposed to be mean like today sammy blay is not in the lineup you know what sammy blay is fucking mean why don't you put sammy blay in see what he does if i know that nick robertson can score sometimes but like i and and and full respect to nick robertson the way he plays mcmahon for standing up for him or whatever but like i'm not interested in seeing nick robertson and steven lorenz get pinned in their own zone

Starting point is 00:52:13 i'd like to see something else if the devils interpret um dakota joshua nick waugh and bobby mcmahon that line that we saw on paper if the devils interpret that line as anything less than hell on earth i i don't i'm not interested in the team i'm just not have you ever gotten your partner a gift and you're like i think they'll love this and then they open the gift and then you get the hell oh that's cool all the time does that actually happen to you a lot she's a terrible liar yeah okay can you remember anything that you got your wife steve and you guys have been married over 15 years um that that specifically she was like did she come out and tell you or does she lie first and then tell you later she used to lie first and tell me later and we know

Starting point is 00:53:03 each other well enough that she'll just tell me jesse does that happen to you too you're a good gift no i'm generally a good gifter because i lean on things like this place yeah it's jenny bird uh jenny bird's awesome because it's the gift that she probably won't return which is great and this is great because i love birds it's modern elevated and guaranteed style that is awesome i got my wife actually some earrings uh recently from jenny bird and she absolutely loves them it ships fast it's perfect for gifting and especially if you need like a last minute better grab that and remember that that you know with the holidays coming up it's not just about the 25th of december it's also about all the gifts that you have to give along the way from

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Starting point is 00:54:10 Now, I mentioned Ottawa's struggling and the Oilers not scoring. I just want to say, frigging Jake Sanderson and Evan Bouchard are just tanking my fantasy team right now. At least Jake Sanderson has gotten some points though. Travis Green was asked about Ottawa's diamond PK formation. He said, right now we're sticking with the diamond.

Starting point is 00:54:27 we've made some mistakes and we haven't been aggressive uh we haven't done the simple things well enough it's a work in progress and it's fair to say early in the season that it can be not a great start for the ottawa senators oh no so i don't know what all the stages of grief are but isn't one of them uh it's pleading or bargaining right yeah this is bargaining oh no we're bad because of the diamond well that that's not what he's saying though no no no no no but the reason it's a talking point is because people are going if only they fix this one thing ottawa has a 60.9 pk percentage kill rate meaning that that's out of every 10 opportunities the opponent's getting four goals and there's one team worse than them name them please not the leaf no uh the sharks

Starting point is 00:55:16 nope jesse name the team with worst pk percentage the sabers uh no the columbus blue jackets oh and By the way, Columbus has also the worst power play percentage in the league. Actually, second worst, 7.7% conversion rate. Wow. That's pretty bad, too. That is... It's good to see Columbus and Calgary sink back to where we kind of thought they were. No, it isn't.

Starting point is 00:55:38 Now, I want to see... I want to know, in terms of Ottawa and this... I feel like this is something you iron out. This is why you have a long, serious season. Yeah, it's something you've got to manage, though, because the season didn't get off to a hot start like just with all the all mark stuff and there's some doubts there as well yeah man him starting camp and saying i've i've hated my camp so far yeah and injuries i mean brady kachuk that's a huge it's not just a skill issue like losing that

Starting point is 00:56:14 skill from your lineup it's an identity issue right like you are a lot less of what you are without brady kachuk you just are the panthers don't have that problem nearly as much because they're missing a kachuk brother too um but their identity is they're insane the sense i don't know they're kind of pesky right but it's easier to be pesky when you basically have frankenstein out there who's willing to fight and hit anybody um now he's not there and you're losing those goals and you're losing those shots and you're losing those hits and you're losing that factor i i can't remember who it was on detroit huge guy ed vinson um who challenged someone on the sends and kachuk comes in there like a bat out of hell and it's just like go me asshole

Starting point is 00:57:07 losing that from your lineup is a big deal but the reason i say the sends have to manage this situation is we've in recent memory seen a season get away from them in october and they never got it back remember ubergate yep with duchesne with duchesne i think formington was in and and uh yes he was there he was one of uh uh chris weidman and they were complaining about their assistant coach yep um they had several octobers like that where it got away from them they're not i mean they might miss the playoffs i don't think they're a guaranteed playoff team uh odds are i would have them as a playoff team i think they'll probably end up being okay but every year there's at least a few teams who ought to be in the fight and they just put it in the ditch for whatever reason

Starting point is 00:58:05 and they're on watch the oilers are in the ditch as well mark specter tweeted out a quote from connor mcdavid saying he was pissed off that he doesn't score more goals yeah they're all wheel drive though um they put it in the ditch and drive out of it all the time and then connor mcdavid um has not had the greatest start in connor mcdavid's history zero goals through six games has not scored yet well there's no motivation he's got a contract let me read you this too joke evan bouchard in his in his games this season i couldn't believe zero goals yeah zero assists zero points negative three rating and 11 giveaways so far that's fourth among nhl defensemen i can't believe he hasn't fluked into a point not one not one that's insane well i think the

Starting point is 00:58:53 thing is if mcdavid and dry sidle aren't scoring then neither is evan uh fair enough yeah shorthanded goal from connor uh connor mcdavid damn it uh connor brown so leon dry sidle four goals this year okay so between the three of them the top three guys on that team there was four goals between evan bouchard connor mcdavid and and leon dry david doesn't have a goal i just told you that i said he's got seven i don't think my brain registered yeah seven assists six games that's it the seven assists help you ignore that but really no it doesn't No, it's also just not that crazy of an accomplishment for Connor McDavid. No, it was also supposed to be his emphasis this year was I want to show

Starting point is 00:59:37 everybody I can score 60 goals again. I talking gets you into trouble a lot of the time, but we love someone who says they're going to do something and then they go out and do it again. I keep going back to Morgan Riley. I wasn't good enough last year. I'm going to be better and he's the best player on the ice in game one. we got mad at him when he wasn't as good after that because we're like what the hell he had he was one of very small group of players you could say probably had a good game against

Starting point is 01:00:06 seattle when you plant your flag and you say i want to score more goals and you're over it's a tough look i want to also mention that um i have fought with sabers fans for years about the Jack Eichel trade and they keep telling me actually it was good and you don't know what the hell you're talking about. Guys, I live two hours away from you.

Starting point is 01:00:29 I'm aware of the stories. Jack Eichel has started this season with 15 points in six games. And people are saying, oh, it's Mitch Marner. Mitch Marner doesn't play on Jack Eichel's line. He plays with Thomas Hurdle

Starting point is 01:00:41 and Pavel Dorofeev. I don't remember if I said this before the season, but I knew he was going to end up with Dorofeev. It makes sense. Dorofeev's a great goal scorer. Pure playmaker, pure goal scorer.

Starting point is 01:00:52 What are you doing? Alex Tuck, who is one of the main pieces that came back in the Buffalo deal, Buffalo-Vegas deal, has had a pretty good start. One goal, three assists, four points. They're now talking that there's a Buffalo tax. It's not just a tax in New York State, but there's a Buffalo tax. And yes, he's from the area. But they're talking about Alex Tuck, who's never hit 80 points in a season,

Starting point is 01:01:19 making $11 million. dollars what what's his point total again and in how many games uh four in five and you want what he wanted six he had 67 in 82 last year including 36 goals i'm sorry that's a trade request that's you're out of your mind i don't think buffalo can trade him you're an insane person though i don't know you should maybe trade insane people because what are you talking about you want what to do what what are you speaking about where did you get that number from who's giving you advice that's a trade request or you're certifiable well i mean there are hockey players yeah but the the i see two options there because i don't know who told you you deserve that

Starting point is 01:02:08 it has been and i'm just going to move i'm just moving around here because we got to get through these things pretty quickly he's a great player he's very good anything you guys want to add into these that i bring up but i'm just going to move on here let me let me give you some stats and then you tell me who it is it's a goalie oh i like this first five games of the season 930 937 save percentages and a 196 goals against average who am i talking about can i have their record no damn oh who am i talking about jeremy swayman okay jesse who am i talking about igor shostakovich spencer knight chicago yeah it's been unreal spencer knight chicago blackhawk damn blackhawks beat the ducks in ot yesterday um and how mad were you i you know what i was big mad but i also have

Starting point is 01:02:50 bedard in fantasy so i wasn't that big mad it has been over 700 days since the blackhawks were over 500 wow uh i got a tweet last night from someone saying can you guys please come back to san jose that was the last time the sharks won in regulation are you serious i don't think they've won a regulation since we were there yeah we did march remember no i don't yeah but we did that like a month or two ago yeah it hasn't changed and it hasn't changed and they've continued to play yeah it's been more than half a year since i mean they didn't play games most of the time yeah the the the win they had against the leafs there and that ot game was their last victory and even in that game they had a two goal lead in the final minute that they blew

Starting point is 01:03:36 like yeah you ended up winning but yeah it's tough uh in philadelphia brutal jet lukchenko is going to play tonight they hadn't played him yet and they were kind of guelph's kind of wondering like hey are you gonna play our guy or can we have him back they got caved in a couple early season games well and so here's the deal rick tocket has been shortening the bench uh Mishkoff, Ablos, DeLaurier, and DeLaurier, I think, and Ablos are out. And that's why Lushenko is getting in. But Mishkoff had his last shift at 11.48 to go in the third this weekend. So that means he had 12 minutes left to play in the game.

Starting point is 01:04:14 And Talkett said no. And there are rumors out of Philly that he showed up out of shape this year. There are James Harden-like pictures that have been sent to me of... of uh it's it's difficult right because uh i look in the mirror every day and i go i'm aware of how i look yeah and then i look at him and i'm like go on that's a regular man um but he is looking a little he looks heavy and for an nhl player he looks and listen tortorella did this to him a bunch of times last year and everybody was hard on tortorella maybe torts had a point well different reasons i think yeah this is the thing right like uh everyone wants to see the kid the the new hope

Starting point is 01:04:59 and the you got crotchety old school guy in torts and torts is never going to win that battle ever new guy comes in and he's a team legend by the way rick talking there's there's a reason philly legend there's a there's a reason guys when they get injured and it's not good news they go and they look for a second opinion uh rick tocket is the second opinion and early returns are not great listen that guy's gonna be insane but can you when you start the season out of shape i mean you're more prone to injuries but also can you get in shape during the season yes i think you can but you're not doing it by playing 20 minutes a night you're doing it on the bike don't be surprised if he gets healthy i'm not i'm not kidding i don't think they're

Starting point is 01:05:53 gonna do it but they might did you guys see this weekend matthew olivier at 6-1 taking down curtis douglas who is 6-9 uh fight no i have not is man why wasn't he just like because matthew olivier is the undisputed champion of of hockey right he is the heavyweight champion but like no like big beat up small why didn't he just go because he's matthew olivier oh because he's matthew olivier yeah and the club and columbus is having a bit of a tough start so he's getting the boys going can you think of any team that could use something like that yeah i can't i actually think there's a few we've mentioned um and the last thing i wanted to bring up before we bring ken read on jesse you asked me to put this in the show rundown i'm not

Starting point is 01:06:36 sure if you want to do it today or wednesday but you wanted to talk yahoo fantasy for a second and how much time do i we get to talk how much time do you need because we can save it for wednesday but i know you got a gripe and i think it's a legitimate one save it if you want i don't want to just start the conversation and it's got to end because we gotta cut it off so we can save it then wednesday we will do it because jesse's got a really and it's a legitimate one and a lot of people are complaining about it and i don't think it's getting enough play interesting it's bs so shall we bring ken reid on let's do it hey today's episode is brought to you by fabletics when you live in activewear and we do uh you can never get enough but the good stuff usually costs

Starting point is 01:07:15 a fortune which is why we love fabletics and we introduced steve and changed his life uh and i thought it was fable text fable how how impressed was your wife with your fashion sense when you told her i was like oh yeah we got a new sponsorship it's with the fable text she's like oh okay and then i showed her the website and she was just like you idiot now here's the deal you can get pieces that feel premium perform premium but without the crazy price tag and when you sign up as a vip you get 80 off everything there's a monthly fee that gives you exclusive membership benefits including credit that you can use towards a full outfit bundle up to 100 which is pretty cool and jesse let's talk about the quality here because that's important yeah it feels like the

Starting point is 01:07:57 same thing as the other guys except it's like a quarter of the price yeah it's awesome i like i like that yep also you know what i like too uh the fit and feel kind of being dialed in no waistbands rolling down joggers that actually keep their shape that's a major problem especially when you get big thick hockey legs like what um and it's also kind of cool because uh they're not just about good deals this is eco-friendly stuff half of their fabrics are made with recycled materials and the company has been carbon neutral since 2021 which i think is pretty great if you want to treat yourself and we want you to uh to gear that looks good feels good and doesn't break the bank you should go with fabletics and by the way i i don't want to mention it before american

Starting point is 01:08:36 thanksgiving and halloween but there is a big holiday where you you know could buy some presents up for grabs and that vip membership might help you uh go to fabletics.com slash sdp sign up as a vip and get 80 off everything everything that's fabletics.com slash sdp to sign up as a vip and get 80 off everything fabletics.com slash sdp the book is the next one ken reed hockey scouts remote rinks and hidden talent uh and a longtime friend of the show and so great to have him back mr ken reed is in studio uh so ken listen i i you know we've whenever we come up with like weird niche ideas that we would totally read a book for we're like you know what ken would write that Yep. You know, like you're some of your previous books, your one night only books.

Starting point is 01:09:22 I do think there's room for a two night only one goal only whatever it is. But this one is a kind of a departure for you. And I want it for anybody that hasn't heard about it yet. What is what are they getting into when they read this? Full disclosure, not my idea. That idea was from Kevin Hansen from Simon and Schuster. And he said, I think cocky scouts would have great stories. I said, yeah, I think you're right.

Starting point is 01:09:45 He goes, why don't you do a book about it? So I said, OK. So I didn't want to do a book about, you know, this is what I look for in a player in the analytical breakdown and all this. I want to do an analytical breakdown. No, no, I mean, I want it. You know me, guys. I love to sit around and talk hockey stories. Yeah. Right. But if we're having a beer, having a coffee and that's what this is. So scouts, they're they're kind of the they would be the audio camera operator. They'd be the Maddie of the of the Steve Dangle podcast. Not enough credit. Right. never enough credit never enough you're welcome thank you appreciate that ken no problem these scouts do so much work they go to all these places and when you're traveling around and you're going

Starting point is 01:10:26 remote rink to remote rink or big rinks you're going to have some stories and these guys have some stories and what i also wanted to do was not just tell the stories that they've encountered but i wanted to know who they are because everybody just assumes a a scout say just a hockey an old player and he's assigned a scout sure people probably don't know that some of the scouts in this book one guy's a musician and i'm sure you guys are all familiar with the story 30 the song 38 years old by the tragic yes absolutely well broke loose in 73 from millhaven maximum security well to be honest it was 15 men who broke loose one came back because of the flies 14 escaped and i know that because one of the scouts in this book was the psychologist at

Starting point is 01:11:10 Millhaven maximum security during the breakout what yes 12 was done for poetic license because 12 is easier to say than 14 and one came back because of the flies the scouts name is Paul Henry I call him the Dos Equis man of scouts he's the most interesting scout in the world and he was a psychologist at Millhaven max and he went on to a scouting career that would blow your mind he was responsible for putting the 94 Canadian Olympic team together he scouted for the New York Rangers he scouted for uh the St. Louis Blues as well but for me I discovered him because when I went to do this book I said well one thing I want to know if I'm going to do a book on hockey scouts is I want to know how the Halifax Mooseheads have this pipeline to Europe like they just get

Starting point is 01:11:55 European stud after European stud every year no matter where they're drafting in the European draft so Cam Russell their GM said Paul Henry I said who he said you have to talk to Paul Henry and paul henry's the guy i said okay and he goes now i'll give you paul henry's number don't call paul henry you have to meet paul henry in person oh he is the the coolest dude ever he's he's just ooze oozes positivity so one day i walk into a hockey alumni luncheon at scotia bank pond that paul patsku hockey historian puts on and this guy comes up to me he goes i gotta tell you you didn't do george palawa justice in your last book and i did a story on george palawa in my last book about how he's a draft pick of the flames high school hockey stud out of minnesota he's

Starting point is 01:12:41 unfortunately passed away right before his freshman year at north dakota and the guy's like he was the most beautiful player i've ever seen he was he was a man the guy that kind of cost me about that was paul henry oh no way yeah so later that after the luncheon i sat and talked with paul for four hours and that's the story in the book and yeah like i didn't think i'd be talking to a guy that uh played uh prisoner hockey and was a psychologist uh lived and worked in a halfway house had a gun pulled on him and uh ended up being one of the best hockey scouts in the world so that's that's that's some of the stories you're gonna get yeah that's the book crazy that's the book yeah wow storytelling how do you how do you scout the scouts like how did you how did you

Starting point is 01:13:23 narrow it down that's a great question uh how do you scout the scouts well there's a few guys i knew obviously and then there's okay well where'd this guy come from and you know I wonder how did you know you look at a player and you wonder how did he end up here and you kind of trace it backwards and you find the scout that found him um and and also what I wanted to do was we can all look at a game ago Connor McDavid's really good but how do you know who the fourth line guy is so I kind of went from that and yeah I guess how do you scout the scouts you do it backwards you start and you trace it back you look at results and then um yeah you look at results but you also what in doing this book a lot of the scouts would say well you got to call this guy too

Starting point is 01:14:03 so there was a lot of that um and then there's just guys that i knew of i kind of knew of their legend and i'm like i'd really like to talk to this guy um archie henderson was a longtime scout uh he was kind of one of the first pro scouts in the game and he basically tells me look if you wanted to pro scout a game before say like 1990 and you wanted to know about a guy who was is playing in Toronto you'd just call up your buddy you know from Penetang you'd say hey I'll give you a room at the Royal York and you can buy your wife a steak go look at this player for me we maybe we'll trade for him and um Craig Button's dad hired Archie as one of the first pro scouts for the Washington Capitals so you know that was kind of cool and then you start talking to Archie

Starting point is 01:14:43 and Archie's a character and he was a former AHL tough guy which I obviously love and and you find out that when he was drafted by the the capitals uh he got a he was working all night in a in a flower plant in a bakery uh working overnight got home went to bed woke up and his mom said there's a call from general mcnab in washington he's like general mcnab now archie will be the first to admit he wasn't probably the most guy up on current events in the 70s uh he thought he was drafted to the vietnam war and i'm going well archie you're canadian and it was 1977 but that's the story and then his first his first year pro he's in an incident that ends up on in the pages of sports illustrated for its outright goonery and in port huron i think it

Starting point is 01:15:29 was and you know all these stories lead to and now i'm a hockey scout and now you know and then there's a guy like brad davis whose dad was lauren davis who's this amazing scout legendary hockey scout and he grew up at his father's table in regina and whenever a hockey scout would come through town they'd sit and they'd have dinner and little brad would stay there and the next thing he knows his dad's scouting for the the edmonton oilers and it's 1982 or whatever and there's an exhibition game in saskatchewan and he's practicing with the oilers and then he ends up being the guy that drafts andrew cogliano for the oilers because he does all these european trips but that's the lockout year he's not doing all the traveling because they're

Starting point is 01:16:11 cut back on costs he says well i might as well go scout junior a you know who scouts the oj for nhl perspective not many guys he finds cogliano so it's yeah there was a lot of detective work putting it all around which was fun i'd love to know how many guys in junior a like all around the country just go unnoticed purely for the tag of being junior a because what one of the funniest uh stories i've heard in recent uh like hockey memory just based on how it worked out the the colorado avalanche pick kale mccarr fourth overall and nathan mckinnon admitted he was upset about it yeah because he's picked from the brooks bandits right from the from the ajhl is is that is that how well i guess the store the the book well one of these guys from all over the well one

Starting point is 01:16:57 of the cool things in the book is there's a scout named bill heffernan and i call him the singing scout because bill's a musician as well and his bread and butter was finding guys in junior a finding the passed over guys because that don't get the major finding the late bloomers right now that's all blown up now because of the ncaa rule where major junior guys can play so i think junior a i don't know what's going to happen it's going to become a lot more local but i just saw bill again last week actually and he said i don't know i don't know what what the future junior a was that was my bread and butter was getting these late bloomers and he scouted for cornell university and from cornell he worked his way up to scout for the winnipeg

Starting point is 01:17:34 Jets and even when he was scouting for the Winnipeg Jets his bread and butter was scouting Junior A and looking for these guys who were going to try to get NCAA and maybe I can get them earlier so yeah guys sneaking through Junior A was a thing I don't know what's going to happen with that now but yeah that was uh that was kind of a cool thing about doing the book too because you talk to Bill Heffernan who's this Junior A scout but the next thing I know he's a musician and he ends up singing this song at the same luncheon where I met Paul Henry about a scouting trip with glenn hall and it's called glenn and the geese it's actually a pretty good song too it's actually a really it's actually a really good song and bill says he's going to sing it

Starting point is 01:18:11 at my book launch by the way there you go november 3rd 5 to 7 p.m at the bottom line 22 front street west toronto ontario and glenn hall yes for the youngins has probably the most unbreakable record in nhl history 504 502 consecutive starts as a goaltender um will never be broken and threw up before every one of them and glenn scouted for years for the calgary flames so another guy yeah yes after doing the book do you find that you lean to more towards like the draft as a crap shoot or that there's an actual science to picking players well one lesson i learned from the book there's no such thing as a bad scout they're only bad coaches that's what the scouts all told me i think they all nailed it yeah i think the first one or two picks are pretty much

Starting point is 01:19:00 consensus and then i think you get into a bit of a crapshoot and then i think in the later rounds you just see something in a guy and you're like that's my huckleberry there's another scout in the book rick knickle greenwood nova scotia rick came to fame and i i was like i have to talk to rick knickle because in 1993 rick knickle was playing for the san diego gulls he was 31 years old he was drafted in 79 he'd never played a game in the nhl and all of a sudden he's signed by the la kings because wayne's brother keith's playing in san diego he's like you gotta check this goalie out and rick goes on a run with the la kings and the run was quickly done it lasted a few games and then four more the following season but rick goes into scouting and rick's thing when he was

Starting point is 01:19:46 scouting he was scouting for nashville and his set and he his thing was my bread and butter is that third fourth round pick that's where i can identify a guy and so that's where that's so crazy that it gets to that sort of specialization yeah and that's what makes a scout right that what that makes the scout when you can find that third round guy so one of his most famous third round picks and he fought for it and nashville ended up trading so they could get the pick to select them was jordan tutu wow and rick first saw jordan tutu rick played his junior so this is how it works right it's just so random rick played his junior hockey and brandon played for the brand of wheat kings he's back in the summer and he's helping out you know at wheat

Starting point is 01:20:22 kings camp and he's working the door and he's coaching teams in their inner squad games and there's this 14 year old kid and he's just smashing everybody and the 14 year old kid comes back to the bench and he looks up at rick he goes are we are we allowed to fight and he's like well i guess if you want to this 14 year old kid goes out and beats the living tar out of some other kid and this 14 year old kid's on his radar where's this kid from he's from rank and headlight no he's not it's jordan tutu so even from seeing with 14 he's like there's something in this within this kid so nashville ends up drafting him successful pick so yeah uh there's definitely an art to finding a guy there's another scout in the book who found antoine roussel uh not drafted to

Starting point is 01:21:06 the quebec rats yes just an absolute rat not drafted to the quebec league not drafted to dallas um ends up being a guy that's you know just begging for ice time with the chicago wolves but a scout saw something in him and yeah a lot of the the talent is identifying those those rats those third fourth line guys that can do something and add something to your team which all awesome championship neat teams need as we've seen with your guys toronto you you run you run anthony stolars and rusell and tutu are on the ice they'll do something on like your super soft team yes yeah yeah so scouts will find guys that take care of anthony stolars uh ken you walked in today and and congratulated steve on finally converting to

Starting point is 01:21:55 your side of thinking well i want to congratulate all three of you to be honest you're all coming around i mean i mean you were right look at this old gray beard now i know i don't you know what was i uh a young mistake that i made yes is i thought growth was linear and i thought growth went in one direction um it seemed like hockey was heading in a certain direction and the leafs were building in that direction and i thought good you're going with the times things are changing not only is is uh let's just say straight up violence always going to be part of hockey i think it's slowly and i'm very curious to know what you think i think it's getting more violent like i think compared to like five years ago let's say it's a way more tough violent sport

Starting point is 01:22:49 than it used to be well first off if we could entitle this segment validation with ken reed i think you're right it's always going to ebb and flow right there's going to be certain errors where certain things happen but i think and i've said this when you get to the final four teams those are the four teams that play different than the other 28 and maybe back in the day it was the four that play different from the other 20 the other 17 when it was a 21 team league uh i think with the way uh it's a copycat league when you see the way the florida panthers have won pack mentality hockey all four lines play the same i think you're going to see teams try to copy that and i think your leafs i totally see why you bought into that because you had a gm i think

Starting point is 01:23:29 that was thinking that as well in dubis and i don't blame him for thinking that it didn't work um at the end of the day it has to be a team you have to stand up for each other uh in a game six if somebody runs your goalie and you're not willing to do something because you're going on a power play that is a gift for a team to send a message to go this is we're not going to be messed with we're a new team i don't know what happens to players when they put on that sweater but is it more violent now than it was say five years ago uh I don't know that's hard to say I think there's you know there's scraps around there's hits around I think it's just so fast that the speed lends itself to the violence there's going to be super collisions they hit

Starting point is 01:24:07 the other night Tom Wilson was that was that a late hit on Hedl last night yeah yeah um was it late probably can you blame Wilson no his job's to check the guy does he know he's going to dish the puck off in that second does he have time to pull off so yeah a penalty on the ice there wasn't a penalty on the ice there's going to be no supplementary discipline so and by the way he got placed on retroactive ir right he's really he smoked them um there's things that the game can do to uh to cut back on that you can let a guy throw a pick like they used to do back in the day on say an icing call before it was hybrid icing but is it more violent i don't know if it's more violent but it's a sport that just it's it just lends itself to physicality and whenever people try

Starting point is 01:24:48 to change the script it it can work to a certain extent but it'll never get you over the top i don't think it'll ever get you over the top like you look at the edmonton oilers man of 84 super super super skilled team but what else they were also tough violent you didn't touch wayne um i name drop interviewed somebody the other day they told me they walked into the edmonton oilers dressing room one time and ken lacusta former canadian heavyweight champ was in there with a heavy bag showing three of the guys how to box you know so wow it's a it's a tough game you guys know i bet all three of you guys i bet you've all snapped on the ice you've been pissed off you didn't think you would be and imagine doing that where i'm myself for not being able

Starting point is 01:25:34 to skate yeah but is it i think it's violence is always going to be part of it i don't think it's violent now i think it's just it's tough and stuff happens if you want to say violent i think that was unnecessary crap in the 70s where if you hit one guy in the Boston Bruins four guys would jump you at least there's honor in it now and it's one-on-one and you're you're gonna go and speaking of scraps can I give a shout out to Summerside PEI's very own Alex Gallant of the Calgary Wranglers the best fighter in pro hockey if you haven't seen it last night he had another goal in the American League it was a thing of beauty I was uh sent that by multiple people yes yesterday it was gorgeous yeah uh Ken uh I want to ask you about the Blue Jays um because

Starting point is 01:26:15 obviously when the blue jay games end or even mid game i mean i saw last night um and a lot of people will not catch this until after game seven i'm so i'm sorry but i saw you pull out all the candy wrappers that ivanka was stressing yes you're the first person we see after a blue yeah you and ivanka a lot of men tell me i'm the last person they see before they go to bed so how has that gone for you guys how does that change your schedule yeah when you're when you're doing you know the late night highlight show as i told you guys uh before we came on uh my sleep schedule is screwed up even more than it's usually screwed up if the blue jays win it makes my life exciting if the blue jays lose it makes my life easier so what do i want do i want excitement or

Starting point is 01:26:58 ease you guys know the grind when the leafs go on a run you're going but it's fun when's that happening yeah yeah i don't know um but it's fun and that's adrenaline that's why we do the job it's a blast to sit there and watch the games game 7 you guys listen when you're listening to this you'll know what happened I will just say they have the ability to win I would also say from the other night I think it is

Starting point is 01:27:20 they have the most ability to win when the people up top get off their computers and judge the humans in front of them please in a one game situation it's not a math equation well they did it they did it in game 6 Hoffman came out he did two innings

Starting point is 01:27:36 Yeah, Hoffman, I can't believe he pitched too. But in game five, it was Brio's 2.0. I blame Brendan Little in no way whatsoever. That was not his fault. He was put in a situation where he couldn't succeed. So I find it hard. And this is, I will say this, win or lose for the Blue Jays. I find it hard. I can imagine their fan base. And I'm sure you guys can relate to this in a way. a fan pours his heart his or her heart into a team they give them their heart and that critical moment when something is judged based on a predetermined math equation instead of the human you see in front of it i find that heartbreaking i think you got to judge it by what you see in front of you not by a plan you came up with from some dork at 4 p.m on his computer yeah there were people online making the argument well they did make the right call it just didn't work out yeah thanks hey you know what's crazy those are the same people that tweet me yeah i think the thing about it is that over 162 games in a regular season or 82 in a hockey

Starting point is 01:28:36 season that can work out more in your favor than not but when the only thing matters that that matters is the result if the result is not favorable then you made the wrong call best stat in the world is wins man when you run a marathon okay let's say there's a marathon that The Toronto Marathon was in my neighborhood the other day. By the way, props to the city of Toronto for not getting the pylons off my street. I'm trying to drive to work. I'm trying to drive to work at 9 p.m.

Starting point is 01:29:03 and there's pylons all over my street. This city's a mess. Okay, a whole other time. Ken and I live in roughly the same area and I know exactly what you're talking about. Listen, the way you guys are coming around right now on tough hockey and responsibility, the next time I come in here, it's going to be awesome

Starting point is 01:29:16 because you're going to be yelling abolish bike lanes. I can't wait. It's going to be awesome. what was it what was i being asked we're talking about we're talking about the wins being the best stat yeah it's the best stat but yeah when you're running a marathon okay you gotta pace yourself but at some point but at some point that marathon you gotta up it you gotta sprint you gotta judge when same with same with baseball season it's long and i told i totally get that oh well on an average day blah blah blah blah that's for the season yes on a day-to-day it's different maybe

Starting point is 01:29:44 your pitcher has a cold maybe he's getting an argument with his wife maybe he's not feeling not good you got to judge that day to day so let the human element breathe in a one game situation and i think the jays have the ability to let it breathe but you got to shut out a lot outside can i the numbers are made up of performances from people in the right situation correct yeah i mean we can twist numbers all we want right that's well and and sometimes the best stories from sports come from people in the wrong situation who get it done absolutely and i i think that's part of it as well but i wanted to ask you specifically because what i've been so impressed by is the freedom that you guys have to cover the jays the way you want to because the team

Starting point is 01:30:25 owner also owns sportsnet yep and joe siddle went off after game five i'm curious about um is there any sort of hesitation on your side going oh joe like i wouldn't say that people ask us that all of time you guys have seen me on tv yeah we have um joe no i think i think what viewers want is honesty and i think a lot of people say oh we don't get this from you guys because you're on the team well i didn't see any of you tweeting at us the other night you know that was honest and here's the thing we came on last night and we talked about how after game five everybody was all over john schneider and i said deservedly so and i said tonight it's all praise for john Schneider deservedly so I think as long as you're honest with your audience and in baseball it's a

Starting point is 01:31:13 long season and you can't lose it after every game it's like what do they say about a hockey coach he has about two two bullets a year to just go off on his players in his room you can't freak out after every loss you can't but when something's on a plate for you and it's clearly not the right decision and you're a baseball guy like joe who the break before said you got to go with hoffman and then you got to go with sir anthony and then little comes out that's a night where you got to go and everybody was on it we were all being honest and then after game six we were all being honest as well because they deserve their flowers after game six right and i think john schneider bringing out hoffman was an admission that he was wrong in game five because it was the exact

Starting point is 01:31:59 three batters yeah brendan little face in the exact same inning and he didn't go to brendan little there so why would you go to him in game five he was wrong yeah perhaps he learned his lesson but this there's one thing i would love to take from baseball players and baseball people that i wish i could bring into my own life is after game five on the day off on saturday schneider said you know i don't care what people say i just have to live with my decision and it's on to the next game baseball has a beautiful way of moving on to the next game much like a good goalie in hockey does you just forget it you forget about that goal and you move on i think we would all be a lot stronger in our lives if we could do that and twitter would be a much nicer

Starting point is 01:32:36 place right just just but you'd also be out of a job but the art i often say on on on the tv uh as fans and as broadcasters it's our jobs to freak out as the athletes it's their jobs to remain calm right yeah um and one last question for you um we've asked this about a couple of people when the leafs went out in in in the spring uh the florida panthers did a masterful job trolling everybody and saying well it's the pressure from the media in toronto how mean do you think and you're not a leafs fan uh you did not grow up watching the leafs being like go leafs and anything like that so you moving here coming here and integrating here still not being a Leafs fan what do you think of the Leafs media coverage in Toronto being too hard and the spotlight being

Starting point is 01:33:31 too bright for certain players I think that's an absolute joke of a take the media here is not hard on them they're they're honest in any way they might be too too nice I think um the pom-poms do come out go to montreal okay go to edmonton i worked in edmonton that was a harsh media market toronto's not even top five toronto is not tough at all i've i've been in the room i've been the beat beat guy i did some beat work here uh no it's not tough also after every game you're carting two guys out open the room up on seriously on behalf of all reporters can nhl teams please open the room again and and and have the players sit there so that we can talk to them and get actual stories like in in this book the next one you know because you're hiding guys you're bringing them out you're

Starting point is 01:34:20 there it is you're scrumming them all the questions are you know what happened in this game what do you think of tomorrow's game there's no real stories it's hard for reporters to get real stories you guys just had kevin mcgrannon here kevin's old school he can probably relate to that as well the media in this town is not hard on players players in this town if you're not top four or five guys you can walk anywhere people don't know you without your number on your back or your helmet on your head there's a player that lives in our neighborhood yep we see him walking up and down the street my kid says hi to him he says hi back to our kid he's super nice nobody bothers him i've seen him oh really the player doesn't go ah no exactly he's fine he's fine

Starting point is 01:34:59 So you're saying Luke Fox isn't the devil? No, Luke Fox is not the devil. Is that Elliot Friedman calling you so scary? That whole pressure of playing in Toronto thing, that's a crock. And I don't know what it is about this organization. There's been books written about it. Brian Burke is famous, blue and white disease. But I don't know what it is about a team that when somebody runs your goalie,

Starting point is 01:35:27 you just stand there. I would not do that in men's league. My child is 12 years old. He's a goalie. That would not happen on his team. There's a couple of twins on his team that would take care of business. But the pressure of playing in Toronto, no, not, not, no, no, no, not at all. I do not buy that in the least bit.

Starting point is 01:35:47 I love that answer. I love that answer. The book is called The Next One. Ken Reed, bestselling author of Hometown Hockey Heroes as well. Oh, can I show you one more thing? One more thing. Give it to us. i brought this especially for you guys okay amazing as you guys know hometown hockey heroes

Starting point is 01:36:05 was based on my childhood hero yes teapot right oh yeah the one of the teapot story so i got this picture of t the other day t is a man as you guys know right oh yeah t is as man as you can get like teapot is my childhood junior c hero for those of you who don't know teapot scored more goals than anyone and i just want you guys to look at that picture of t we'll put this up on the incredible yeah so there's t right there he's got his those are those uh for fishing okay here's the best part okay i'm gonna zoom out guys you ready is everybody looking at this and can we we'll put this up later right yeah okay watch as i zoom out oh wow is that a tuna that's a tuna and that's my cousin tyler tyler and t t and t caught the tuna now there's a rumor going around picto

Starting point is 01:36:55 that the fish wasn't caught the teapot established eye contact with the fish while it was in the water and wheeled it into the boat we love that but that's what t caught my cousin for anyone listening that is a 12 to 15 foot long tuna that's nasty looking any idea of the weight uh you know what i think that was around probably 750 i'd say now my cousin tyler shit my cousin ty uh who's good who was a good hockey player back in the day he caught a 1200 pounder one wow a 1200 pound tuna what does one do with a 1200 sell it so here's what happens where here's what i'll tell you what happens dangle this is what's crazy so they they catch it on a rod and a rod and reel like it's you're getting the seat it's just like jaws you get in the seat and you reel

Starting point is 01:37:42 it in now when when ty caught the 1200 pounder it took him 45 minutes as i mentioned t just wheeled it into the boat so i don't know how long it took but when you catch this tuna back home and pick the county you come off you get to the wharf right here they're weighing it and there's some dude who buys it right there they chuck it on ice they truck it to halifax from halifax it's flown usually to tokyo and it's sold within 24 hour at auction yep oh my god it's cut up into sushi i think i want to say i i don't know what you're getting a pound but they got a thing they spike get in it they see how much is fat how much is meat and uh yeah so some you catch that and somebody within like 24 hours is eating it uh it's being chopped up it's sold at auction yeah they sell

Starting point is 01:38:26 the whole thing and then they start they start sushiing it they uh i have a friend my dad my friend's dad before he passed uh suddenly he was a an executive at one of the big lobster fisheries in guinea uh and uh he was he brought home lobsters when we would go out there that had claws that were the size of your head they were enormous enormous beastly lobsters uh and he said you know you can't buy this stuff and we were like why can't you buy this stuff and he's like because we catch it all the a-grade stuff goes to china uh all the b-grade stuff goes somewhere else and canada gets the c-grade really yeah yeah so all the stuff you see in the grocery store is considered c-grade lobster see that's why you gotta know me boys when we go home we just go

Starting point is 01:39:08 right back down to the wharf we'll bite off my buddies off the boat exactly we gotta do an east coast trip with kenry brought you by blood alcohol kenry thanks so much thanks boys here we go pucks in deep quick start the steve dangle podcast follow the guys on twitter at steve underscore dangle at adam w y l d e and at jesse blake connection complete

The Steve Dangle Podcast - Honour. Pride. Courage. | October 20, 2025

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