The Steve Dangle Podcast - How's That? | October 23, 2019

Episode Date: October 24, 2019

On this episode of The Steve Dangle Podcast, who wears the crown for the struggling Leafs? (00:00), is Mike Babcock the problem or is Frederik Andersen the problem? (05:30), Elliotte Friedman asks if it's time to unleash Toronto's star players (16:30), if you fire Babcock who do you replace him with? (24:00), let's talk about Easter Seals! (49:00), Winnipeg Jets claim Luca Sbisa off waivers (54:00), we try to talk about Darnell Nurse but end up talking about when Babcock will be fired (57:00), Joe Rogan, Joker, and losing equipment (1:18:00), SDP Trivia! (1:32:00). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Is it time to admit that the Leafs just aren't very good? Oh! Oh! Ah! Ah! Hi, welcome to the Panago Pizza Steve Dangle Podcast. Oh, great, man. I'm Jesse Blake.

Panago Pizza presents S.S.D.P.P. The Steve Dangle Podcast. with your hosts, Steve Dangle, Adam Wylde, and Jesse Blake. Let's go! If you live generously, life will treat you royally. Well, at least life will. Maybe sports won't. Why not put yourself in a friend of Crown Royal? Because we're going to talk about who wore the crown,

where we, with the help of you, recognize One Leaf player each game, each show, who gives it their all for the blue and white, because it's our town, it's our crown, and it's not about what you have, but what you have to give. It's Crown of Leaf that lives generously by giving it all for the team. Brought to you by our friends at Crown Royal. Live generously and life will treat you royally. Let's get into it.

And I have to tell you, that would be a lot easier to say if they were winning. Now, there are bright spots on this team. Yes. And there are players that are improving over the first 10 games. Yes. With that said, last night. And, yeah, I think this is our... No, we've had two games.

Columbus and last night against Boston There are two games to pick from There are Based on those two performances Who are you picking? I want you to go first Well my pick is going to be Kasperi Kapanen That's why I asked you to go first

I was picking between two guys and he was one of them He's got 8 points in 7 games I believe this season And this is a guy that did not start well If I'm not mistaken Or wait, since the switch He's played in more than 7 games I am wrong He has three goals though

He scored his first even strength goal last night I think it's since the switch His first even strength goal Because his first two were short-handed Which also gives him the league lead in short-handed goals It hasn't been seven games since the switch But the guy's got eight points in eleven games For a guy that supposedly struggled

And did not score an even strength goal until last night There you go This is a guy that was taken out of a role That he was not meant to be playing anyway Sorry, taken out of a role that he was great at put in a role he was not meant to be playing in people crapped on him he made two of the biggest paid stars on the team frustrated they put him back in his normal role and oh wow he's pretty good he he earned the right to fail though yeah you know what i mean he earned i thought he

deserved that spot and it didn't work oh well and now he's on the third line and on the penalty kill he looks fantastic that's where he should be yep that's where he should be we know he can fill in on the top six, probably shouldn't be there full-time. But he's fourth in team scoring. Hilarious. Like, he's got one more point than Nylander. He's not the most versatile player in the world, but he's

good. If Kasperi Kapanen continued to score at this rate, he'd have like 67 points. His contract would be a hell of a bargain. Absolute steal. Absolute steal. Scoring's not the problem. No, it's not. And you know what? Same could be said for Andreas Janssen, another guy that signed a good contract

based on his skill this year. He's got seven points in 11 games. He's not bad. He's playing real well. I want to dump on him for the penalties, which have been an issue going back to his Marlies days. That roughing call was shocking. So who would you give the crown to and why?

Man, he was a throw-in piece. There's no way he's going to fill the shoes he's meant to fill. He's not even a full-time center. And guess what? He's second in the Leafs in goal scoring. Alex Kerfoot, Alexander Kerfoot. He's got four goals. Isn't that amazing? That's second on the Leafs in goals. Matthew says eight. Yep, yep.

But Kasperi Kapanen, when he scored the first goal of the game last night, this is from Statsman Stan Narodka from Ice Surfing, when Kapanen scored his third, which was before Kerfoot's fourth, that put Kapanen into a seven-man tie for second on the team in goals yeah seven different people had three um but uh Kerfoot holy smokes that guy can skate uh he can forecheck he's a gritty little bastard and he can put the puck in the net for a guy who's not supposed to really be a shooter I'd like him to be better at the other end of the ice uh he's a guy who maybe needs to work on discipline a bit but what a pleasant surprise, Alexander Kerfoot.

Don't Don Cherry. I had to do it. Don Cherry your sentences. And now we go to Jesse Blake. Jesse, go ahead. I think Willie would tell you he's feeling way better than he was at this time

last year. Probably is. I think he was on a beach in Sweden at this time last year. So just being at the rink is a step in the right direction. Did you write that down? I think that quote is from Mike Babcock. Who still talks.

Who still talks. Yeah, it's good. I'm always like, oh, good, he's talking. Let's give Willie the crown this week for being here on this continent. Because last year, we couldn't say that. One of the seven guys tied with three goals. One of the seven guys tied with three goals. That's a good point.

Okay, well, that is Who Wore the Crown for this week. Brought to you by our friends at Crown Royal. Next time the puck drops, why not live generously and treat your Leafs crew royally with a Crown Royal old-fashioned. Now let me ask you this. Is it why not? Is that the question? What is the biggest issue in Toronto right now? I'm going to give you two options.

What is the bigger issue? Is the bigger issue Mike Babcock? Or is the bigger issue Freddie Anderson? Or traffic? Oh, that one. Yeah. In Toronto, it's probably traffic. Traffic's a rough thing.

I'm more speaking about the Leafs, but I mean, yeah, traffic's an issue we can get into later. Super exciting topic as it is. Yeah, but they're closing another exit at the Gardner. Yeah, exactly. Listen, people don't need to get places here. No. So here's what I'm asking. Is Mike Babcock the problem, or is Freddie Anderson the problem?

What's the bigger problem? The Leafs' PDO is extremely bad. PDO being the sort of luck stat it's 9-8-3 that should turn around they don't look good let me talk about

let me just talk about a couple teams sorry I'm defensive this morning this afternoon we've already crossed over and you know what that's okay

second straight day I've done that to someone here's a couple other teams that are struggling wobbly out of the gates uh huh sure Washington Capitals

been a bit wobbly they don't look great They've been trying a new system, and it's a lot more—evidently, it's a lot more offense-based, and I guess it's led to just—according to Elliott Freeman in his 31 Thoughts, which came out like an hour ago, like, it's led to just some spectacular goals against, because they've allowed—they're just— Oh, yeah. It's a system they're adjusting to.

They seem to be working it out, but they're not quite there, so they— And four. Huh? Did they win? I don't know. Last night? Yeah, they're also first in their division. Sure.

Totally. Really? Yeah. However, Braden Holtby and another team that sort of wobbled out of the gate, Tampa Bay, with Andre Vasilevsky, are both worse off than what Freddie Anderson's seen. Now, there's a goals saved above expectation chart from chartinghockey.ca.

You should check it out. Sean Tierney's site. I'm going to talk to you about just a couple of guys that are doing really, really well right now. And thank God Steve made me drop one of them in my fan tracks. Corsi Hockey League. You know what? I don't know a lot, but I did get this one right.

The most relative to shots face. Basically, it's a look at how goalies are performing relative to shot quality face, not quantity. Darcy Kemper, third in the league based on shot quality. Who knew? Who knew? Like two years ago, I was like, who is this guy? Well, I knew, but I was like, he's not a very good goalie. Markstrom in Vancouver.

He's fourth. Mike Smith in Edmonton. Get out. I know. You know why? I warned you, Pittsburgh, because we made fun of Mike Smith on the first Saturday of the season. And look at him. You're right.

He is second in goals saved above expectation. And this is several weeks in now. Wow. Number one. Who is the... Guys, based on relative shot quality, face, saves, that whole thing. Based on that, who do you think is the top performing goalie on this team? chart i'm gonna say carter hutton carter hutton jesse take it well it doesn't matter wild stab

in the dark in out of every goalie in national hockey yeah most like starters tukarask amazing that you both said those names because carter hutton is fifth and tukarask is sixth okay not too bad doing great doing really great okay number one is mark andre flurry oh And it's by an almost 20% chunk. The guy's doing really, really well. So you look at how Vegas has done, and usually you look at how a team has done, and a lot of it can be pointed at, and it's not necessarily because of, but a lot of it can be pointed to goaltending.

Now, we are obviously, there's a frustration with Mike Babcock that we're going to talk about. And there's been a frustration with Mike Babcock, I would argue, going back to the first Boston series in recent memory, not the 2013 one. but with Freddie Anderson not standing on his head all the time and the Leafs

allowing more goals than technically speaking they should they should if that evens out a lot of those problems are solved yeah

yep sure don't give up three goal leads to Montreal two goal leads to Washington but that's a Michael Hutchinson thing that was Michael Hutchinson

he was in net for sure so okay so then Then talk to me. Because here's the thing. They're capable of playing in front of them. Sure.

They've given them multi-goal leads in two of the three games he started. They're capable of playing in front of them. What was it about the Montreal game that caused him to give up four goals in a very short amount of time? And what was it about the Washington game that caused him to give up four goals in a very short amount of time? like all the only sin i've really seen michael hutchison commit besides that second goal last night in boston um is he's not a starting goaltender but for what was expected of him for the low bar expected of him i think he's been okay yeah and i'm not i i am not going to blame it all on him.

I'm not going to blame it on him for being put in the worst position possible. He's played well enough, honestly. Who knows? Maybe the Leafs pick up 6 of 6 in the three back-to-backs so far on the front half. He hasn't been bad.

Well, that Tyson Berry missed cue last night. That was terrible. Horrible. And also, he's one of the worst puck-handling goalies I think I've ever seen. He knows he is. He's also had some rebound control. Yeah, most.

There are situations where Boston got, like, four shots off of one shot because he couldn't control the puck. Including one that got called back because the offside rule is really good. Right. Where that should have definitely been a goal. It's a goal. Yeah. Exactly.

It was a Boston goal. And that was on Hutchison there, I would have said. Yep. Listen, he's not great. No. But I think he's been okay. Yeah. I think he's been okay.

Okay, so, like, okay, here's what I'm wrestling with, because today I featured that tweet from Dom LeCision about the Leafs PDO. And it says it's a 983. 983. What does that mean for those of us who are... Well, you're supposed to be around 1,000. Okay. Maybe a little, I feel like it, well, actually, no, I was going to say I feel like it's gone

up because goal scoring went up last year, but that's not true. Shooting percentage, I think, went up and save percentage went down. Right. So that would still make it about even. Am I allowed to believe in analytics and magic at the same time? Sure. Hockey is a chaotic game. I don't understand or I don't see why that wouldn't be a problem.

Well, it's just... Because here's the thing. You look at Buffalo, for instance. We mentioned them earlier. Toronto and Florida are both among the worst teams in the league right now in goals against per 60 minutes. Toronto is averaging 3.2 goals against. Florida is 3.

So Bobrovsky's just had a brutal start. You look at a team like Buffalo, they're allowing goals against per 60 right now 1.6 now i know it's early but that's enough that's to me that's where the issue lies now you could say it's freddie anderson you can say it's michael hutchinson you can say it's team defense whatever but there's an issue there on the defense sure totally um well and here's what i mean about magic you could watch buffalo last year in november and go this is a pdo bender this is not well seven of those 10 games were overtime wins yeah you could look at it definitively and go this is a hot streak this is not magic this will

come to an end i didn't think it would come to as abrupt of an end i thought they were in the playoffs for sure i mean it looked like it for a while i thought they'd be able to at least ride that to a playoff spot i didn't think they'd be one of the bottom three teams in the league after they won 10 straight games right the islanders were magic last year people kept calling for the regression to come it's going to happen and after a while i watched that team and i said no it isn't no and you can go well they got swept yeah in round two of the playoffs like and i and I would say it was actually a closer series than the four games suggested. So, magic can work in reverse.

Poison. It's poison. It was the St. Louis Blues of last year. The team seemed poisoned. And they found the antidote. There is something that feels that way with the Leafs. There is something that feels... It's poisoned.

Why do you say it's poisoned? What do you think the cause of that is? Where is it coming from? It's like a car running on the type of gas it shouldn't be. You know what I mean? I just see a team, the puck, when it gets in their end, is there to stay. They're constantly blowing assignments. They don't look like, the Boston Bruins, when they hit the ice,

look like they just broke out of Arkham Asylum. They are vicious. They try their hardest every shift And they look like they want to be there They look like they're excited They love being Boston Bruins I just don't see that with the Leafs Now, here, I want to clear up something I said real quick

The Blues found the antidote Yeah, the antidote was a new coach But it was also Jordan Bennington League average goaltending And slightly above league average goaltending I mean, anybody on paper could have seen and the St. Louis Blues were a three-line deep team up front

and at least two deep on defense. Like, you knew. You can make an album of my greatest hits of screw-ups on this show, but one thing I said that summer was the Blues had the best summer of anyone, and they were, I think, my pick for the Stanley Cup. But then you look at the Leafs, and you say, anybody who looks at the Leafs on paper sees they have a top-six core that can compete with anybody in the NHL.

What's happening? And then maybe they just get together. It's 11 games. The problem is that, I mean, thank God they're about 500. I don't know if they're Bettman 500 or what. 5-4-2, I don't know what that means. So it's just a little under. Well, one game under literal 500.

It's like being a 5-for-5. Wait, no, they have six wins, don't they? I don't know. No, 5-4-2. Oh. I don't know what that means. Elliot Friedman in his column today. 31 thoughts.

Number three was the point. And, by the way, of course the headline had to do with Toronto because that's clicks, baby. Cool, cool. It is tense in Toronto. You could see the organization was curious how things would transpire with an injured John Tavares and his calming influence. They are 1-1-1, but it simply doesn't look right. In last year's playoffs, during the three games in Toronto, Patrice Bergeron had 35 even-strength minutes and saw Tavares 31 of them. Coach Mike Babcock gave us something fun last Saturday at home against the Bruins.

A solid taste of Mitch Marner and Austin Matthews' combo, the second most ice time of Matthews' career, and 11-24 against Bergeron at even strength. Bracket, in a rematch Tuesday in Boston, Bruins coach Bruce Cassidy showed he wasn't afraid of keeping it that way. I love that Mike Babcock made the challenge, but you can see he's not ready to trust this full time, especially when riddled with the kinds of mistakes that came Monday against Columbus.

As of Wednesday, Matthews has taken just 17 defensive zone draws, winning 29% of them, one of which led directly to a Blue Jackets goal on Monday night. The improving Freddy Gauthier has taken 66, Nick Short 62, and both are at about 60% win rate. You can understand why Babcock is doing it this way. He's got to win games in a much tighter division, and he believes prime time is earned, not given. That's not wrong. But I wonder if these times call for something different. In Winnipeg, Patrick Laine clamored for more responsibility,

and the Jets made him a deal. Fine, but we'll take it away if you don't compete hard enough to make it work. Laine got the message, and the early season difference is noticeable. In Edmonton, the ice time for Leon Dreisaitl and Connor McDavid is probably unsustainable, but the two have accepted the challenge, and it is a big reason for the start of the season, which feels much more promising than last. Toronto's cap situation means their top players have to be the drivers.

as both Babcock and Matthews indicated after the Boston loss, is it time to fully unleash them and challenge them to make the necessary improvements without sheltering? There was a long lead up to that but that last question I think is really important and I'd like to kind of get into that.

Here's the thing. I know I'm not being very helpful. How will Mike Babcock keeps bringing up Jonathan Tays as an example for Austin Matthews And I'm sorry, I don't see that. I don't see that.

And I've never seen that. Like, it's a nice idea, but first off, Matthews is a, like, an incredible goal scorer. That's what he does. He's the touch of death. Yeah, Jonathan Tays is not that guy, and I don't think that's an insult. It's just he's a different player. Jonathan Tays has so many great qualities. Great defensively, great on face-offs, you know, Stanley Cup winner three times.

Like, there's so many things great you can say about Jonathan Tays. But if you're trying to take Auston Matthews and put him in the Jonathan Tays box, are you asking a fish to climb a tree? I mean, maybe. I think they're trying to develop him into something it'd be awesome for him to develop into, which is a... What's wrong with having Patrice Bergeron? You know what I mean? It'd be great. Patrice Bergeron, but a better goal scorer.

Like, that sounds like the best damn player in the league. But if the player... It's fun to dream is what I'm saying Berkey's right when he says Offense is inspiration, defense is perspiration And you can see that in the way Matthews plays defense He's not very good And you know what? He blows assignments all the time

Doesn't try And the spin around pass Through the center Was it Pasternak who Baited Matthews around the boards And then just a spin around pass Right through the middle That was embarrassing

and that was replayed a thousand times in the last 12 hours so what is it, like, we look at, okay, Leafs can't beat the Bruins or whatever the Bruins are, like, they're not even just in the Leafs' heads, they're a part of their souls oh my god, Mike Babcock cannot beat Bruce Cassidy

no, Bruce Cassidy's got his number so, like that's what it is no, but beyond that, forget the Bruins for a second because, like, listen, the Bruins game is the Bruins game those same issues existed in the columbus game and i'm not talking just about matthews that marner giveaway that led to the riley nash goal was so unbelievably unacceptable and i could see he was responsible for two of the

four goals yes he was because the other one was the penalty shot which was the end of the game yep um you know mitch marner has a bad game austin matthews has a bad game often when players sign big contracts they come back and they squeeze the stick too tight i'm thinking the last two prime examples i can think of are goudreau and monaghan and calgary they had a really rough next season because of the pressure that's on you however is there at what point do you just go these are my stars and i'm gonna ride or die with them never absolutely never tell me how it benefits the leafs to have nick shore and freddie goche taking defensive zone face-offs when you're trying to develop austin matthews into quote-unquote jonathan tase tell me you gotta let him do it

Tell me how it benefits the Leafs to continue to employ a coach that has shown zero growth over half a decade. So that's my question to you now. No growth. He doesn't change. He does what he does. And listen, tactics are a huge part of it. This team doesn't look thrilled playing for Mike Babcock.

And everyone goes, oh, well, Ken Hitchcock was like that. People didn't like playing for him. People didn't like playing for Scotty Bowman. How dare you? We're not talking about the same people. Scotty Bowman's the winningest coach of all time. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Like, do we think Craig Berube is the most brilliant coach in the entire National Hockey League? Or do we think he got one of the best teams on paper to play like it? Just make him feel good. Look at Rob Rendemore. Make him feel good. Make him excited to show up to the rink every day. Make them want to impress you.

Make them want to impress you. not be afraid of letting you down you know what i mean well yeah it's it's there there's two management styles in the world right or no no no no leave it stay there stay on that for a second no no i almost had it it's the there are i actually researched this there are management styles that inspire and there are management styles that scare the scare style can get people to 80 or 90 percent but it will actually over time erode down to like further and further down because the message loses its value. And the effort, their roster is getting better

and the effort is getting worse. If you inspire humans, it's just the way we work. If you're an inspirational leader, harder to do, you can actually get more out of people. That's a proven fact. I misspoke.

Look at Rod Brindamore. Yeah. Craig Berube, Rod Brindamore. Those players are afraid of letting them down. Mike Babcock, they're afraid of fucking up. If you mess up, you're done. I'm going to be taken away from the guy Who I want to play with

If you're Jason Spezza you're out of the lineup Your career's over For God's sake Babcock is a career ender For guys at the end of their career Unless your name is Patrick Marlowe Then you get sent to San Jose And your career is rejuvenated anyway You contemplated this during your LFR

What was it The Columbus one I'm so sore by the way from the plumber bit I like tore my body apart right and the question when people think about firing Mike Babcock is always okay but what do you replace

him with because all of your all of the answers to that question aren't ideal it's not Keefe it's not any of the assistants it's not anywhere from the outside so why are you changing him if there's no if there's no better resolution well what I said in the previous

video is well what are you going to do you're going to risk screwing up the development system and the nhl team by throwing sheldon keith into that rule and i was talking to jason york about it um and i go you know i said the same thing i go i go how how are you gonna screw up your ahl team and your nhl team like when was the last time a team called up their ahl coach mid-season and had any kind of success and he goes pittsburgh yeah and i go oh yeah yeah so i mean maybe if it's obvious it's obvious maybe if it's if the path is clear the path is clear dude april we knew kyle dubas didn't want this coach anymore what are we are we sure about that yeah we are yeah come on but the story from

the inside the organization from what i've heard anyway is that kyle and carlton told you this Carlton the Bear that's right I gave up sorry we can't give up we'll edit it out the story

that we were told that this is not by the way this is not a not published rumor the story was we saw the video

Dubas went to management in some sort of capacity upper management and said we gotta make a change here and they said no

this guy's got four years left on his deal. He is a winning coach. We've made the playoffs the last three years. We gotta give it one more. Oh, so that's the bar. So the bar is finally what we always accused the Leafs of wanting

years ago. Making the playoffs is fine. I think what they thought was, what the argument could have been on the other side is, listen, it's two game sevens. They lost two game sevens. A puck bounces another way. you play a little harder

for 20 minutes it's a different story it's a different story Jake Gardner doesn't lose his fucking mind Nazem Kadri doesn't be a fucking idiot yeah

think about all the things that had to go wrong for the Leafs to lose those series it's hockey Freddie Anderson forgets how to goaltend in the first round

it's hockey it's hockey if you want the perfect scenario you're never gonna get it I get that I get that but I can see how from a Leafs management perspective

if you're looking at this and you're going okay hold on a second I know everyone's hot but two game sevens, I can understand that point of view. And that's why you have

upper management. Yes. To temper things. Sure. Yes. And I don't disagree with it. It hasn't stopped Bruce Boudreaux from getting fired. I don't disagree with it. But I think at the 20 game mark, if this continues, by the way, I believe the Leafs in 2019, and I think I might have said this last episode, are about 500.

Something like 25-22 and something? January through right now. In terms of... To me, that's fireable. That's 100% fireable. And you can go like, I'm sorry, no like Gardner got hurt

and Dermott got hurt like holy shit, should Dermott be asking for 10 million dollars? Because apparently this guy is the most valuable player on the team like, for real they're not good enough Adam they're not good enough and they're

eroding over time, like you said I look at it like this Nick Shore is probably not going to be a Leaf next year, right? Might not be a Leaf next week. Why is Nick Shore taking 60 defensive zone face-offs? To me, it's still a development. There's still development. And I know Mike Babcock's probably trying to win games and that sort of thing,

but if I'm looking at the division, by the time Matthews is the same age as Marchand and Bergeron, those guys are going to be probably on the real back end of their careers. Marchand wasn't Marchand until he was in his mid to late 20s. Right. So these guys, like Matthews, until this season, Matthews was the youngest player on the team for three years. Marchand's breakout year was 2016-17.

It was the World Cup. One of the best things about Sidney Crosby is that every offseason, he takes something different. He focuses on that, and he comes back the next year and he nails it. Sidney Crosby had like 12 offseasons to focus on different things. Matthews has had like two. Yeah. You've got to give these guys time to develop.

And I think it's a huge mistake to take them out of situations where they're going to fail, because sometimes you need to fail until you succeed. And I, like, when you skate, when you first start skating, Steve, you first started playing, what happened to you when you first started skating regularly? I fell down and hurt myself a lot, and then I realized the importance of shin and elbow pads. Greed. Okay, so you put your shin and elbow pads on, you kept skating, what happened? He put them on the wrong way, and then a professional hockey player had to tell him they were on the wrong way. That's a thing that literally happened.

Very few NHL players will tell you, but Marc Savard did. I wonder how many saw it first and went, look at this fucking moron. I think Savvy's one of those guys who's really weird about equipment, too. He is. He has a YouTube channel about it. He's weird about that, yeah. Used to. Now he's an assistant coach, you see.

Yes, yes, yes. Sorry. But I think my point in this is that at a certain point, your stars are who they are you've signed them now it's time to just go this is the role do it

get better at it and why are we line matching on when it's the choice is Austin Matthews and Nick Shore who am I giving the defensive zone are you talking about overtime? no well why is Nick Shore getting

a defensive zone face off when Austin Matthews could be in there learning it Because Babcock's in charge. He's in charge. And why are we, for that record, since Jesse brings it up, why are we line matching in overtime? Oh, fuck. Why are we allowing...

Oh, my God. Like, three on three is hockey. Why are we allowing another team to put their best players out, especially Columbus, and we're going to... Literally letting them dictate the play. We're not going to try to defend... We're going to try to defend that, something we're bad at, instead of just going, Matthews, Marner, Riley,

and then following it up with Nylander, Berry, Kapanen. Like you can't Columbus can't touch that The Leafs have burners We can talk about like blown defensive assignments Sure And responsible Three on three is weee

Yes And the Leafs have God knows how many lines of three on three we You can throw on four forwards It's not the same fucking thing It's ridiculous silly fun time It is a hair above the shootout If you're making a case to fire Mike Babcock

You probably put that at the top And then you probably put Matthews' Game 7 ice time next to that. I put in Mike Babcock's entire Game 7. It was the worst game. Sid Sixero made such a good point. He got fed by Cassidy again. He said Mike Babcock has coached his last game in Toronto. And he should have.

That should have been probably it. Because when you get outcoached like that, when you get outcoached like that, and Boston fans, you guys know, you saw it. you guys walked all over like it was just it was not even fair and i just look at it and think how can you possibly like i get that the leafs have a bad pdo i get that freddie anderson hasn't been up to snuff i get that they've had back-to-backs i get all that you know what good teams do they win you know what tampa bay does or did last season they fucking won at least in the regular

season let's start with that forget the playoffs how about we how about we just jockey ourselves into winning two out of three of every game you know that's that's the problem the problem i have and if if we get to game 20 and if there's like if this if this continues which it can't and they're five they're 500 at game 20 there has to be a change but then the question becomes who what how yeah who are you gonna change well who's gonna take over sometimes i think like we've talked about this before we've mocked this before i'm not totally sure it matters that much i think it just can't be this guy anymore change for the sake of change change for the sake of change but like that's what every coach hiring and firing has been forever it's a reset you

hopefully get someone in there who the players actually want to play for and i bet that would be sheldon keith my marlies are friends uh pat quinn they won for him pat quinn was a was a Vancouver Canucks coach in the early 90s when they were very good. And he was a Leafs coach in the late 90s when they were very good. Pat Quinn was one of the worst line-matching coaches ever. He wasn't a brilliant tactician. In fact, they used to say his assistant, Rick Lee, knew that people around him, and this is just what I've heard, have said, and I know people that were a part of that staff. And they said there were very few people we knew that knew less about hockey than Rick Lee.

that's aggressive super aggressive statement but rickley and mike or my rickley and pat quinn were friends and rickley obviously knew something about hockey was an assistant coach obviously but mike but pat quinn didn't want young guys all the young guys were shipped out brought in these veteran guys are already fully developed and that was a problem however what he did was here are my stars i'm gonna let them play and my job is to motivate them who won best uh remember the they did that player poll who's best assistant coach in the nhl and they said dj smith dj smith did he who was extraordinarily not the best assistant coach no he's just the popular they they liked him you don't think that was a shot across the bow we're gonna pick this right we're gonna pick

this. DJ Smith makes his players feel good. They like him. They don't like this guy. They don't. You're never going to get the best out of your team with Mike Babcock as your head coach. Not in 2019. That was 10 years ago. His last cup was 10 years ago. Detroit fans

are going, oh, we told you. And there were things that Mike Babcock did at the beginning to help change the culture that were great. He played his role. He played his role. We're done. Is the role played out? Yeah, it's like It's like old John Tortorella, where he used to be three years and done. And then he evolved.

Look at John Tortorella, still in the game. And his players will die for him. They love him. It's changed. It's different. He's evolved. Babcock, it's just not the same. But you wouldn't make the firing today.

True. I think you better... Listen, if you're going to pitch that to Brendan Shanahan, you better be sure. Right. and so this is where he already has I get it it's Brendan's mistake

so here's where it all falls on Kyle because Kyle had the the Wunderkin label the second they hired him he had a great draft

in 2015 with Mark Hunter you can debate who had control of what but they did it together and they did a great job he's had great great picks with

I mean I think Dave Morrison deserves some credit for that for sure there's like you know the sanding pick was great the Muzzin trade has turned out to be

awesome yeah really truly The Barry trade I still think will work out It's just you gotta use the guy properly He's not on the fucking power play I know, I know

But beyond all that There's been two bad negotiations Yeah, two really rough negotiations I think with Matthews they paid him what they should've I think with Marner they absolutely I think the agent won And I think he did I think he just did

But the reality of the situation is if this is a thing that that kyle dubas wants to do the clock starts ticking on him the second mike babcock goes i don't think he cares he shouldn't but i'm just saying if he doesn't have success this year and doesn't have success next year dubas will also be gone yeah you got to stake your career on something that's fine and and if he brings in a coach that works out he's bought himself God knows how many more years. Yeah, 100%. And if they win the cup, he gets a statue.

He bought it for the rest of his life. Yeah. But I am saying those are the stakes here, right? That's fine. But the power structure is all fucked. The power structure is all fucked. Like, I don't... Like, John Tavares is the captain,

and that's wonderful. Who's in charge of the Boston Bruins? Who's their leader? Patrice Bergeron. Patrice Bergeron, Daniel Chara, that whole top line. That's who runs the Boston Bruins. and what Babcock does

night in night out he is in charge he's still the captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs John Tavares wears that C it's

it's like a it's a letter bin jacket like Mike Babcock is the captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs the C is for show the A's are for show

Dubas wanted to fire that coach wasn't allowed to so what is he special assistant to the president

The power structure's fucked Let the GM GM Let the captain captain And get them a coach they want to play for That's what it is right Like when I am out of shit To say you're fucked When I'm out of stuff to say

It's obvious It's been obvious Make a change Make a change Unless none of us know anything about hockey and this roster actually sucks on paper or something? You know, it's interesting. The first time I felt the way I feel now watching the Leafs

was January 2017. And if you remember, that was going into, I believe, was it 2018? Going into the first Boston series, whenever that would have been. 2018. 2018. They had played, you know,

they had gotten into the playoffs the year before against Washington. They were kind of everybody's favorite young team. Like, everybody's like, hey, go Leafs. That's great. Good for you. And then, you know, they had come out and, you know, had bizarre games against New York when it was like 8-5 or whatever.

It was the home opener. And, yeah, craziness. And then all of a sudden in January, there was this lockdown thing. And I can remember doing our show. Yeah, was it December? Oh, I don't know. How could I forget? We started watching.

We're like, this is fucking boring. Yeah, because the captain told him. Yeah. Yeah, because the captain said the puck only goes through Roman Polak and he only slap passes it up the ice for an icing that's what captain mike said and then last year they start on fire again it's like whoa look at this this is fun and then again they they go from january to march in that first year boring as shit then they got to play boston and they got to pull themselves out of that funk last year same thing january to march april boring as shit not looking

particularly strong oh they're missing jake gardner well i you're right steve maybe they should have paid jake gardner mitch money mitch marner money well dude like if you want an excuse you'll always find one that's fair you know what i mean yeah yeah like there's always going to be injuries the schedule is always going to suck uh you know you're always going to have back-to-backs you're always going to have tough months like this i'm sorry like travis dermot being out of the lineup should not yard sale your season uh yeah gardner was hurt too well you know it's tight And it was, oh, fucking I don't care. I don't care.

They had a playoff spot lacked up in January. It wasn't that tough. No. Don't care. The same playoff spot they're in right now, by the way. Oh, are they still in third? Yeah. Somehow.

Still in third. Behind Boston. They'd play Boston in the first round. They wouldn't have home eyes. Same thing. And they'd lose again. Well, at this point, yeah. 100%.

They'd get outcoached again. Yeah. Bruce Cassidy fucking knows. He does. Full marks. I'm just at the point now. We haven't even complained about officiating. I'm trying to think about other things.

I'm trying to look about it. I don't want to complain about officiating. I'm done complaining about officiating. Who cares? Play around that. Yeah. I want to talk about what... We know it's going to be bad.

You want an excuse? You'll always find one. Yeah. And Boston, forget the Boston game. Look at the Columbus game. Terrible. Terrible. Yeah.

Against a not good team. It was two goals on two shots, was it not? Yeah. Yes. And they're big games. What was Freddie supposed to do on either of them? But then that's the defense in front of them. Yes.

You know? It's ridiculous. That's why I'm not worried about Freddie. Freddie's letting a couple stinkers, but like... But goalies do. Goalies do, sometimes. You can't have a zero save percentage. No, no.

But like, what on earth was Mitch doing? What on earth was Austin doing? And also Martin Marincin. How are you getting bullied by a guy half your size, Martin? Do you see the... What, a Yakovot tweet? Oh, with him standing on the red line? What happened?

Cam Atkinson skated across the crease, and what he did was he sorta grabbed Marincin by the hip and dragged him backwards. Marincin applies no resistance whatsoever, so he's just in the net. He's the goalie now. And Freddie can't do anything.

Can you show me this? I'm not pulling it up right now. Everyone was talking about Matthews blowing his assignment on Dubois, which he did, but he's playing against a guy with no goalie pads and it made matters much easier. Look at that! Look at that!

And there's Matthews not catching up with Dubois, but like... What's Anderson supposed to do there? He can't move. If Marincin was wearing another jersey, it'd be goalie interference. Yeah. And you could argue it was because, I don't know, Atkinson's the one who pulled him in. For God's sake, apply some resistance with your skates. Yeah, I think that we gotta turn the page on Martin Marincin.

Yeah, that's a dubious one. Yeah, it is. I don't care how cheap he is and how useful he is at certain things. Stop it. Knock it out. Kevin Gravel played one game in a loss, and I was like, yeah, no, better. For sure. You know?

Yeah, it was great. And I've been a Marty apologist since he got here. When they finished last. Yeah. Was he second longest tenured Leaf? Yeah, probably. It's unbelievable. It's unbelievable.

Yeah. It's unbelievable. Or in the Leafs organization. That's the, like, there's so much not going right. But here's the question, then. So the Leafs fire Mike Babcock and they bring in a coach. Is that coach going to be able to coach? I think so.

I think so. Won't allow the GM to GM. Will the coach coach? God, I hope so. I hope so. I don't know. We'll see. Like, no.

Like, no. Is Kyle Dubas going to step in and go, no, find a use for Marty Marincin? Oh, good point. Well, see, if it's Keefe, right, who they bring in, I think he would because I think He likes Marty because he won a championship with Marty. So maybe he will be able to use him differently. Maybe Marty doesn't feel as fucking under pressure as he... Like, Martin Marincin was dominant in the AHL.

He scored a goal. He should be at least okay in the NHL. Yeah. Like, I know it's the minors and it's not the same. TJ Brennan put up, like, 75 points. Sure. Or something like that. I know it's not the same.

But there were fundamental things about Marincin's game. You were like, I could see that working in the NHL level. But it feels like when he's up there, he's like, I am afraid to make a mistake. He can't handle the puck. Like, you talk about gripping your stick. He's like Goro from Mortal Kombat. Four hands on the stick and just crushing the thing into splinters. Martin Marincin handling the puck is shocking.

It's really bad. And, I mean, that just can't happen. That was the funniest thing I've seen in a long time. It's pretty funny. And Cam Atkinson was on a roll because he did that, and he also, when the net came off, he put it back on. Yeah. And I saw a few people tweeting, like, is that allowed?

I don't think that's allowed And I'm like That should be allowed It is allowed Is it? Good That should 100% be allowed If the net comes off

And it doesn't disrupt play And it's put back on Play doesn't have to stop That's hilarious A referee can put it back on A player can put it back on As long as it's not affecting the play It can be readjusted

And put back on And Atkinson's taking himself Out of the play To do it Yeah It was awesome Yeah that's pretty good The pair by the way

For Keefe Was Marinch and Hall so I mean another pair we know he likes very much is Lilligren Sandin yep you know what it's been one

video and I've already changed my mind like make it Keef make it Keef like you always meant to life's too short follow your gut but I think at game 20 you gotta make that call you're 25%

the end of the way through the season, you've got to figure out where you're going to be. I want to know what the excuse will be at game 20. But we're also— What, they're going to look different in nine games? They haven't looked different the entire calendar year. I agree. I think they're going to look the same. Two years!

Three! They're not going to look different in nine games! But then you can still say, well, listen, they're still in the playoff spot. Great. Then they'll make the playoffs again. Good. Now what if I said to you The Caps lost a lot of

A lot of playoff series that they should have won Game 7 Yeah a lot of second rounds A lot of learning experiences That would kill for that opportunity Well if they played Pittsburgh in the first round They'd have lost the first round Well if they didn't

Five wheels it'd be a wagon Yeah five wings it'd be a bird You want to find You want to find an excuse You'll always find one Let's spin the wheel Leafs Fucking you can afford it Let's go, let's make a big wheel

Hand out replica wheels at your games Because you're not handing out fucking rings Just spin the wheel And we'll find something I agree with you, this team does not look like they're having fun And they are sure not fun to watch If the game is for the fans This is not a fun team to watch

No, so you know what you do You give them 7 out of 13 Saturdays between the beginning of the season and New Year's Eve. Only seven you give to the starter. The other six, National TV Hockey Night in Canada, you give to the backup. Is that what we have on back-to-back?

Yep. That's not the schedule. Nope. The strategy is backup plays second half of the back-to-back when the team is most vulnerable. They're putting their most vulnerable player. Michael Hutchison is the most vulnerable player the Leafs have on their roster. And 14 times this season They're fucking him

What if They're completely screwing him I understand the reasoning behind 28 points They're yard sailing I understand 27 because he managed to get one Against Montreal

Blowing a three goal lead But I understand what I understand the point of view Where it's like Just secure the two points However How'd that go? The issue I'm having

We're back to 28 They surrendered a point The issue I have with that Is that it seems like on their second night off it sort of gives them like a well we got the two points

it's sort of like it's a loser's attitude yeah it's sort of like and if you had Freddie Anderson and Nett maybe the mental tired or maybe the physical

tiredness that you feel at least with Freddie making some big saves makes you go okay you know what I can bring it up for 20 more minutes

how much do you blame Dubas for not just getting a better backup goalie where you have confidence in it how why didn't he address

this issue in July well I mean you could say the same for Ray Shiro as a starter I don't think there are a lot of good goalies I don't think there are. I just don't know.

I mean, listen, he tried with Michael Neuwirth, right? He didn't bring him in. They've got some guys in the minors that are looking better and better. Wohl and Kaskiswo apparently is looking good as well. I mean, I would give him a shot, but they don't want to crater his confidence. I just, yeah, I mean, yeah, you can blame them for that, for sure. I just don't know what the options were. They don't have any money.

They signed Mitch Marder to, like, the dollar of what they could afford. Yeah, that's insane. I had to go to that room. You do your thing. No, they had to build the roster around his fucking junior number. It's absolutely insane. Steve. No, the, like, Columbus went out and got Elvis, whatever his name is.

Stoico. Stoico. They went out and got Elvis Stoico. They could have gone to Europe and probably gotten someone. You can't attract a solid European goaltender for league minimum. So, I'm not, it would have been great if you went out and got another backup. How much money have you raised for you, Cecile, so far? Are we doing this?

How much money have you raised so far? $31,600, I think. And what's the goal? $50,000. Everybody who's been donating so far, they've been getting video shout-outs. That's pretty cool. Yeah. Has it spiked donations?

Hugely. Yeah? Bigly. Big time. I can't remember what I was at, but it was ironically when Mitch Marner, or I thought Mitch Marner scored the overtime winner against Boston on Saturday I said everyone who donates $16

I'll shout out in the video because previously it was $100 because I just wanted some big donations. It's a lot. And people donated but it is a lot, right? So you're sort of limiting the amount of people who can be included but I got

I woke up to 140 emails the next morning. Which is a lot of people. Well and it was like people donated $16 1669 44 because it was Riley 100 A couple people have donated $108.93

That's awesome Because Leaf fans are petty as shit It's No it's been amazing And we're The team I think is at 38,000 So my personal goal is 50,000 And the team's is 50

I'm hoping I hit 50 and I can change the team's To something bigger than that Yes, so yeah, you have the same goal as the team, but we could reach the team goal and you not reach 50 I should probably change it to 60 We'll probably get both Yeah, I hope Or 50, 690 I don't know, well, Adam's over 1,000 now, and you're over 2,000

Yeah, I'm at 2-something TJ's doing well Rachel's Raiders coming through Right? Yeah And if you are the top donator, you get like a trophy or something, right? Yes, it's a replica Stanley the cup is it really yeah that's awesome and i want to i want to have like a day with the cup

but i gotta win it first yeah so you get you get one for yourself it's not the same one as like the same like no it's the same one it's the same one okay you get it every year yeah i don't know i mean i'd probably literally just have to be like can i borrow it for a video but i want to win it i want to earn it um easter seals one last thing for the eric lindros celebrity Hockey Classic, so that's in Whitby, that November 14th is the draft party. November 15th is the day of the tournament.

So that is Thursday, Friday. We still need one team. We need a team. You and your friends register. It's a $1,500 registration, and you all have to raise a minimum of $400. Get 15

of your friends and raise $7,500. hundred bucks. That's all you got to do. Between 15 of you, you can do it. We need one team, one team. Can you be that team? Get your friends together, your coworkers, talk to your company, do whatever you got to do. But we need one more team for the Eric Lindros Celebrity Hockey

Classic coming up in a few weeks. I just want to shout out the person that donated $420 and 69 cents. Anonymously have no idea who you are, but thank you. Thank you very much. Really appreciate that. Mike Babcock. I am at, I'm officially at 25% of my goal, so, um, 1888 or something like that, but basically I'm trying

to reach 69, 69.69. Oh, you're almost at 2,000. Almost at 2,000, which is what I raised last year total, so that's awesome. Let's keep it going if we can. Just want to, you know, obviously these, Steve talks about it all the time, but these go to families that cannot

afford this stuff, and as you know, this stuff is not an easy expenditure for most housewives. And I think I've been wrong, and I need to look up the actual prices of wheelchairs, because someone contacted me that their wheelchair cost $22,000. Whoa, I thought it was like $3,000. That must be like... I did too, so I've made a mistake.

There's lots of different kinds of wheelchairs, right? So maybe theirs is more high-end. For what they need. Or something. Yeah, higher need is what I should have said. It's extraordinarily expensive. expensive and the camp experiences and all that. And I will say this, the team

that raises the most money gets the first pick. The first pick is always Eric Lindros. I want Eric Lindros on my team and even though I'm the top donor right now, the highest fundraising team last year raised $50,000. So we gotta get there. We gotta get there. We gotta have Lindros.

He always wears the Flyers jersey. I wanna see if I can get him in blue and white. Oh, let's get him in a Leafs jersey. Let's get him in a Leafs jersey, damn it! Yeah, Leafs great, Eric Lindros. Let's do it! Second best 88 ever. He'll have to call Neylander for permission to wear it. Right after William Neylander. He's the second highest scoring 88.

Yeah. And let's also mention this while we're on fun subjects. If you want to play in a fun tournament, leovegas.net. You can sign up and play hockey with Matt Sundin as well. There you go. And Steve. Steve's playing that weekend too. I hope.

So the Lindros tournament with Easter Seals is the Friday. The Matt Sundin one is that weekend. So, Steve, you might be playing with Eric Enmetz. If I am physically able, I will play. So, LeoVegas.net. I might not be. LeoVegas.net. It's on the home page.

There's a rotator on the home page. Just click the Matt Sandin link. You can sign yourself up there. It's easy. Easy, easy, easy. Now, the Jets are so desperate for defense. Ooh. How desperate, Adam?

I'll tell you. How desperate? Lucas Spiza was claimed on waivers off the Ducks by the Jets today. The Swister Mister. Don't tell me that the Jets wouldn't be interested in Cody Ceci. That was the first thing I thought because it is always, always, always about the Toronto Maple Leafs. We are kind of a Leaf-focused podcast.

I don't remember who tweeted it, but imagine thinking you're about to play in Anaheim and you get claimed by Winnipeg. At least he's going to play. Yeah, he was going to play in Anaheim. Oh, was he? That's why they signed him. So this, to my knowledge, so he was a free agent. Is that what it was?

Yeah, so he was signed and had to clear waivers. Why do they have to do that? I don't know. Can't you just sign with the team? I know Nabokov had to do that a few years ago. He wanted to be in Detroit and end up with the Islanders. Islanders, yes. That's bullshit.

I don't know what that rule is, but it's stupid. That's a stupid-ass rule. It's probably to prevent certain types of shenanigans. I can't think of what exactly. Like I don't know Like with all the shenaniganery In the NHL They're worried about

That Fringe guys Fucking fringe guys Nabokov was a fringe guy At that point Yeah and he wasn't great Spiza is a fringe guy And they're worried about

Shenanigans from guys That make 700k Come on Spiza a right handed Is he a right handed shot I can't remember Like Corbinian Holzer Is still on that team

I know Right One of their longest On the Ducks Yeah He's been there for time Leafs great Did Brian Boyle

have to clear waivers for Florida? Why? I don't know. I don't get it. I'm sure there's some reason that when you look at it in the vacuum, you go, okay, I guess that makes sense. But, you know... Maybe. There's also rules in the NHL where you look at it in the vacuum and you're like, oh, that also doesn't

make sense. Yeah, that's true. Spiza, though, went from Vancouver to Vegas, and now Anaheim, you know, you have to think his life is on the West Coast. That just kind of sucks. Well, yeah, and he previously played in Anaheim, I'm pretty sure. I want to say he was drafted by them. Oh, okay.

From the Lethbridge Hurricanes. So this is a guy that's literally probably set up his whole life out there, signed with the Ducks for that reason, probably put off other people, and now you've got to... Now you're going to the Jets. Well, listen... I'm sure the Jets called. Jets were probably, like, signed with us.

Oops. He's going to be second-line pairing Luke Spiezen. He will get his time. What if he just doesn't report? No, I didn't want to play for you in the first place. Then he can't play. Well, then maybe he won't. I don't think he's going to do that.

I don't know. Listen, the Jets, if they can just cobble together a defense, are a great team. They are. Well, and I'm sure, you know, Bufflin comes back. They'll throw him back on waivers. Then he can go to Anaheim if they still want him. Oh, man. Just sucks.

That's a desperate situation, man. Given how Edmonton is, they struggle with depth. Their good players are very good. Their depth players are not. Haven't they been shut out two straight games? They have. Darnell Nurse is due up. And apparently Edmonton's going to start talking to him very soon.

And it's been him and it's been like Clefbaum, Nurse. Apparently Koskinen and Mike Smith have been great. And obviously Drysaddle and McDavid playing 80 million minutes a night. But with Darnell Nurse, he's seen, you know, I know it's forwards and defense. But you saw what Drysaddle and McDavid got. You saw what Marner got. Even what Nylander got. Darnell Nurse is a pretty good hockey player for them.

That's going to be a tough negotiation for Edmonton. Those are the Leafs. Everyone else is signing for three years and cheap. That is what he will do. You think so? Yep. Yep. Our reality is not everyone else's.

Everyone else gets to enjoy things, Adam. Do you think that, and I was thinking this in the bathroom, literally as I'm paying. do you think that some of the negotiations this summer and last summer went the way they did if the players

I love that you were taking a pee and you were still thinking show things always think you know I think best when I'm in the bathroom either in the shower

or going 100% I feel that do you think that there's a possibility and this is really far out there tinfoil hat

just bear with me on this one do you think if the players loved playing here do you think negotiations would have gone

a little differently You mean Marner and Nylander and Matthews Let's say they loved their coach the way that St. Louis loves Berube

the way that Carolina loves Brendamore Babcock tax I mean I think there's a Toronto tax for sure for young guys

I think you're going well yeah let's see how Leaf fans react when I'm not here Stop playing sports Stop playing sports Like if you

don't want the pressure stop playing sports NBA stars No matter what market They play in Have to deal with With this national Way more

Yeah Way more Giannis plays in Milwaukee And he has to deal with Damon Lillard Nationally Portland Because

He This poor guy See the thing about Giannis This poor guy It's awful Do you know what's wrong with him? What is it? He's really fucking good

And people like him And they pay attention to him Oh it's the worst I hope he writes a book one day But I mean and talks about how awful it is to be good and talked about. My point is, could the coach thing, could that play an angle? If Sheldon Keefe was the coach, would Mitch Marner sign for a million dollars less?

Yes! Maybe not a million dollars less, but maybe the negotiations aren't as contentious. I don't know. Maybe. Maybe it's like, you know what, I've got to be a part of this now, rather than, eh, I am the part of this, which seemed to be the attitude. Just an ask. Just a question. Maybe not. Steve, what is, Adam's is, Adam, your number's 20 games in is where you truly assess you're hired for the rest of the season or you're fired?

I think so. I think you have to. 20 games, you better know something. If something's wrong, you better know it by game 20, right? Right. It's like, now it's like, I have a feeling something's wrong. By game 20, 25% into anything, you should probably, if you're 25%, if you are five weeks into dating someone, you probably have either red flags or not, right? Five, six weeks into dating someone?

How far into the Korean War do you have to be to know? You have to be in Pyongyang and China enters, and then you're like, damn, we better back it off and bring it back down to the parallel that existed before, which is what happened. Which Franco-Prussian war battle? The French knew they were in trouble when they got surrounded twice by the Prussians in 1871. Are you fucked? It happened.

Holy shit. A lot of people say it led to the... A lot of people? Well, the tensions existed. 50 years, and then World War I started, and the Germans almost did it again. Are the French still like, oh, those Prussians. I don't know. I don't think so. I think they've

maybe given up on that. There's other issues at hand. Oh, those Prussians. I don't know. There's one guy who's still like, I haven't forgiven the Prussians. They were very upset about losing Alsace and Lorraine. Right. So at that point, at the 20-game mark, from that point on, you're kind of on the, okay, if it goes south

here, you're gone. If it keeps going in the right direction, we're keeping you on. Wouldn't you? It sounds right. I mean, that's all I have to go on. Right. I mean, when you see most coaches fired, it's either like, oh, we saw it coming and we kind of thought they'd be fired going into this season,

which, honestly, was somewhat what we thought with Babs, right? Or it's like, here's a surprise firing right before playoffs, like New Jersey's done a couple times, and Lou Amarello's like, I will coach. That is another crazy power structure. Yeah, crazy, crazy, crazy. But I look at this and I think, at 20 games, I would want to know. If I'm the manager, I would want to know.

And I expect that the Leafs would know. And if you go through, they continue to play like this by game 40, and you still haven't made a change, now it's not Mike Babcock's fault. Let's say they go halfway through the season. Let's go to 50% of the season. If they continue to play like this and you haven't made a change, that's no longer Mike Babcock's fault. It's yours.

Well, it's all, yes, exactly. It's all perception. So the second Dubas fires Babcock, oh, it's on him. And now we're talking about if he doesn't fire Babcock, it's on him. Dude, fire the guy. All roads lead to fire the guy. We're done here. We're done. Stop. Stop doing compressions. There's no more breath. So darn Elnurse. We're done here. Darnell Nurse

I want to know Steve's timeline Well what is Steve's timeline? April, last April April 2019 Yeah, what is it right now? Today Fire him today, we're done We're done

It's over It's over folks Thank you for your service We're done Oh well he did this And he did that That's great That's great

I like history too We're done Right? No You want this in blue? Not quite We're not quite done We're done

No who's I'm not saying we're done Yeah We're done with this situation If you're firing Babcock right now You better believe that the roster can turn it around with the new head coach. I do.

Yeah? You're 100% confident that with a new head coach this lineup performs better? Yes. If that's what you believe, then yes, you better fire Mike Babcock. I don't know if I believe in the roster enough for that to be true. Okay. Interesting.

Why not? I could see a situation where you fire Mike Babcock and nothing changes. That they play at the same level because they just don't have it right now. because they're not old enough and not mature enough, and there's no one in there who's truly won and knows what it takes to win.

Not even your captain, John Tavares, has won anything. It's true. Not even one playoff series. One playoff. There you go. So I don't know at this point. That's why I'm saying right now isn't the solution because you don't know that it's his fault.

It could be the guys. Here's what we got. But they have potential. That's for sure. Might be a success. Might be a failure. That's if you fire him. Might be a success.

might be a failure if you keep him will fail you don't know that yeah we do if we're going evidence-based you will fail that's the path we can keep walking down the path to failure just because it's well lit and shit or we could go down the slightly creepy one that who knows maybe it leads to like a gingerbread house or something maybe it leads to a championship maybe it leads to there's a bear in the house and you get eaten I hate when that happens I don't know

I just think we're done here Darnell Nurse though I wonder if, because they've often said there's an Edmonton tax, you gotta love it here even Freed says it in his thing if you love it in Edmonton, great because they have a hard time attracting free agents, do they pay an Edmonton tax

on Darnell Nurse? Probably What's that contract look like? If it's three years, and if it's seven years, what are you paying Darnell Nurse? Wierenski just got five times three, and I know who I would rather have out of Wierenski and Nurse, but... Are you saying Wierenski? Yes. Wierenski can't defend.

Objectively cannot defend. Well, and Nurse is not where this game is going, though. True. You know what I mean? And he's a guy I'd be worried about signing him to a long contract because I just worry about how he ages. You know he will, though. They'll sign him to a long-term deal.

Well, yeah, it's Edmonton, right? So probably. I mean, who knows? They have a hard time keeping guys, so maybe it's even in their best interest. But just because he has a different skill set than Wierenski, I could see him getting something similar to that. Truth be told. Okay.

Three times five. All right. All right. I like this little piece, and this is the last thing for 31 Thoughts I'm going to pull. Point 19 on 31 Thoughts. One scout that has seen Dallas a few times said, the way they grind you, they're built for the playoffs. That's why they gave St. Louis so much trouble.

The problem is, you have to get there. The regular season is not like that. Does Dallas get there? I think they're better than, what are they, 2-7-1? Something like that. That might have changed a little bit since the last episode, but it's not going to be much better than 2-7-1, because that's what they were. They're better than that, for God's sake.

They need to score. 3-7-1. 3-7-1. They're on a heater. I think they've won two straight. They have. No, they're better than the record suggests. I just think they need a little bit more offense.

And also, I don't know, they did get kind of old. yeah they did maybe need a little like Pavelski yeah yeah yep well

I wonder too then is there is there an opportunity then to make it a little switcheroo well they

he's getting in for Gravel well they they seem to need like Pavelski is like in San Jose they just fucking

love Pavelski right they loved him and I know he's a forward I get that and I know he's declining I get that and I know people are going to go

no but if Joe Pavelski is three years younger are you upset if there's a trade if you could find Pavelski is what

35 so I think he's aged out he's not where the Leafs want to go no way if you could find a 31 year old leader like that I don't even know if it's a leader thing

You think it's a coach thing. Okay, fair enough. Yeah, I know. I'm sorry. I'm not picking on him. They're saying Bruce Boudreaux might be on the block. If Bruce Boudreaux comes out. Picking on him is if I'm like, na-na-na-boo-boo, get fired, you suck.

You kind of are. No, I'm just, my genuine heart of hearts, this team has gone as far as they can go with this guy. Bruce Boudreaux, if he came up, would that be a guy that you'd be like, hey, all right. Neither of us can win a game seven. It's a match made in heaven. Let's do it together. He's great in the regular season as a coach. You're picking on him.

No! Not Babcock! I'm making fun of the Leafs. It's just, it's one Leaf fan making fun of another. Bruce Boudreaux's an enormous Leaf fan. Yeah. I think the Leafs would jump at the opportunity. Who knows?

Maybe that's what they're waiting on. He seems to be a coach that people like, at least. And he's, like, a little bit older, too. So, like, what if the plan is Minnesota fires Bruce? Bring him in for the rest of the season? Bring him in for the rest of the season and next, maybe. And then it's Sheldon. I was about to say, if you're Sheldon Keefe and Babcock gets fired and you don't get the job,

do you walk out the door? Probably. I don't think so. You don't think so? Yeah. No, but if I'm him, I'm looking at that. That's my job. As soon as there's an empty seat there and he hasn't won, I'm stepping in.

What else does Sheldon Keefe need to do? Right. He's won the championship. He's done it. Final four last year. If anything, he's stuck around too long. Yeah. He could have worked.

Oh, he's done Dubas a huge solid. And I was like, oh, you're disrupting the minor league system. Like, who do you get to replace him then? I don't know. The Growlers won the Kelly Cup. Like, there's clearly nothing wrong with the Leafs development system. You know, they keep churning out excellent graduates that do. I mean, the guys we're ranting about right now are the only guys who didn't really have to go through the system, actually.

Matthews didn't have to go through the development system. Riley. Not Riley. Marner didn't have to go through the development system yeah maybe that's

the answer I don't know I think it was the answer in April I think it's what Dubas won there's a clip that I didn't retweet

I don't know Adam what's so funny what what what's so funny no please continue no no there's a clip from April

please continue the point please continue the point we circle everything back to the Leafs in this episode if you're a fan of any other team it's going to be

the most annoying thing you've ever seen in your life oh yeah I know what's happening What a weird episode I've been laughing about something For a few minutes

I'm sorry Continue though please Tic Tac Omar Man what a great follow Thank you for telling me So good Love Flintor still But Tic Tac Omar is really really good

So there was a flash Of Dubas talking to Shanahan Really animatedly I think it was right before the overtime Does Flinter have it? The Columbus game. No, Tic Tac Omer does. Oh.

And I think the clip, and the timing of the clip is important, and I want to make sure I have this right, and I'm not sure. So I'm throwing that out there right now. Sure. The clip is from, I think, between when Matthews and Marner and Riley are on the ice to start overtime. Against Columbus. Against Columbus.

And then Babcock takes them off to line match. Okay. Because he's Mike Babcock. I'm going to just. Then the camera goes up to Dubas and Shanahan. And I don't think this was an intentional thing from the broadcast crew. I just think they went up there and they happened to catch that. I hope it was.

Isn't that their job? Well, no, they weren't like, oh, look, he's pissed off. I think they just went up there. Why would they? I don't know. But if you read Dubas' lips. What's he say? I can't catch the end of the sentence, but it seems clear as day to me.

He's going, he has to know they figured out. You got to look at the clip. He has to know they figured out. He's pointing animatedly at the ice and he's talking to Shani and he's going, he has to know they figured out. It's a little ways back. What would the context of that be? I'm looking. Here it is.

Have you found it? Send it to Jesse so we can put it on the screen. I can see it. I can see it. I can see it. I got it. Yeah. He has to know they figured out.

Figured out what? That he wants the line match? I don't know. I don't know. Okay, sent to you, Jesse. That's a frustrated general manager. If that's animated, man. He has to know they figured out.

So you're implying that in this situation, Dubas is upset at Babcock for not realizing that they figured something out? Could be. Is that what's happening? Could be, might not be. Where did you send this, Adam? I sent it to your Gmail, I thought. Oh, my Gmail.

I thought you sent it to my Facebook. Sorry, sorry. That's okay. Darn owners. Well, not anymore. I know. I know. Here, can I put him on the list?

There's something I do want to bring up, too, while we're waiting for this to pop up on the screen. Allison L. Hey. Who is a great follow. She's a Columbus Blue Jacket writer. and she interviewed John Tortorella, who's a big fan of overtime,

and he said that overtime's dynamite. They should just, I don't know what we're waiting for. Get rid of the shootout stuff. I know they're worried about the time limit. It's just not going to last that long. If it goes past five minutes, it's not going to be many more minutes after five.

I think it's just dynamite. 100%. God love John Tortorella. Can I be honest with you? I think the reason overtime is dynamite is because it's five minutes. The three-on-three isn't exciting. But I have to tell you, if you had a 20-minute overtime period, teams would start to line

match. Teams would start to play defense, and they would start to play conservatively. I guarantee it. Okay, five minutes or one second, you throw a second puck out. You know what? You want to get people pumped? What? Make the overtime 10 minutes max, and if you lose, you don't get anything.

Whoa. So there's no overtime point. There is no... No. if you you can even keep the overtime point but if you tie a game

zero points that'll get the players motivated hell yeah that's what you should do might be taking fewer risks though huh

might be taking fewer risks because if you get the one point better than no fucking risks in a 20 minute period they'd be like Mike Backhawk would be like

alright get Gravel and Shore and Goat out there just in case we gotta make sure we win these faceoffs contain the possession and uh

and we'll let them cycle in our zone for five fucking minutes. It was like Babcock throwing out Polak in overtime when they had to kill a penalty.

I'm like, oh my god, I want to strangle you. It's like Bill Pierce who again threw out Milan Lucic as the sixth man. Last night.

Unbelievable. Listen, the NHL is the NHL. Take the fucking points away from them. Just say, listen, sorry,

if you guys tie, you're fucked. I at least understand Lucic as the sixth man because they're six and you just want your biggest guy out in front.

I don't think he's a good offensive player. He cannot tip. He is only big. So if his job is to stand in front of the net, then he better learn to tip, which he doesn't. Well, here's the thing. Milan Lucic is coached by a hockey coach.

Ah. So he will always have a job. Yes, true. Anyway, I think the true overtime, three on three, ten minutes, if there is no goal at the end of it, zero points, F you. You wasted our time. And I think at least the fans would go, ha, thank you. Can I give you the correct solution?

Please. We eliminate points. We say, hey, you either win the game or you lose the game. And then we just play three-on-three overtime until someone scores. I think you've got to have a time limit on it. No. I really do. I think you do.

I think you've got to leave people. If you don't put a time limit on it, people will be afraid to make mistakes. Play forever. They can't do that with the broadcast, though. They really can't. No, they can't. It's called basketball and it's called baseball. They're not making money like basketball and baseball.

NBC will not do it. Six minute and 54 second overtimes. It's 6.9 minutes. It's nice. You'll get more wins out of it. And maybe the second overtime period is four minutes and 20 seconds. Adam Wilde with the answer! Almost 10 minutes.

There it is! There it is! Guys, I'm telling you, it's like a good radio break. If it's shorter, it leaves people wanting more. No, you play the game until someone wins the game. In overtime, illegal curves are legal. People are just walking out there with friggin' banana curves. And steroids are okay!

Yeah! They just hand out syringes before overtime. And energy drinks and drink this smelling salt. Is it Friedman who said he'd like to one day see a steroid sport where it's just like, hey, go do your thing and just see what the human body is capable of. That is... It was extraordinarily...

No, I'm pretty sure that was Bill Burr. That doesn't sound like a free-to-think thing to say. Yeah! Can you imagine him going to a hockey night in Kansas? You know what? I just want to see them do steroids. No, it was Bill Burr, man. Bill Burr said that.

Bill Burr. It was 100% Bill Burr. Was it Bill Burr? Bill Burr said steroids should be legal in baseball. It would be interesting To see what humans could do Because all of it's human creation The steroid is made by people

You're not wrong And for anybody that says For anybody that says it's a bit problematic You telling me that football is not problematic And hockey is not problematic Like come on the way the concussion issues And all that stuff they're problematic You still watch

UFC people beating the crap out of each other You think that's not long term damage there It's problematic but we like sports because guess what? They're a bit problematic. Well, they are. So I'm with you, Jesse. I, too, would for a while at least

want to see a bunch of jack dudes with Joe Rogan in their ears going, Hey, what's with HGH in your ass? Let's go! No, by the way, be a bunch of, no, we could call it No one's listening to this podcast because we're all listening to what he just released.

Yo, David Goggins. Did you see who he got? Yeah, Edward Snowden. When? Today? You got Edward Snowden. I actually really like this tweet. It's like, Joe Rogan smokes weed. Joe Rogan. So, like,

is the government actually corrupt? Edward Snowden. Edward Snowden's response. Yes. Guy powerlifting at a Planet Fitness. Damn, bro, that's fucked. Damn, bro, that's fucked. and then a bunch of people are responding like powerlifting is not allowed at planet fitness no don't bother saving your money we got 30 years tops just enjoy your life holy shit no but if you

had if you had an all steroid league david goggins got to be the commissioner right because he had to weed out the soft motherfuckers you know not that he does steroids i'm not suggesting that i don't think he does the top headline when you search edward snowden and his joe rogan interview out of a two hour i think it's two hour and 56 minutes or something interview that was just released today the top headline on google news is edward snowden doesn't think the government is hiding aliens oh my god oh that's disappointing actually i would have hoped it because i want to believe that they are at least that's some fun in the world you know this is like when we sent dennis rodman in north korea

I'm going to listen to it Oh wow he's talking Oh that's the one I do kind of want to hear it Oh I absolutely want to hear it Cause Joe's a good interview I didn't say I agree with all the subjects I just said he's a good interview

He is a good interview You can't say he's not a good interview That's ridiculous to say he's not No no I just don't think he pushes back very hard Very often Sometimes he does He chooses his spots I think he just sort of

lets his subject talk, which I guess it's a style, but like he doesn't there's no pushback, right? He just sort of lets everyone have their advertorial or whatever for two hours Sure

If you have Edward Snowden, you let him talk The point of an interview is to let people tell their story, right? And challenge them a little bit, but just kind of go okay, but people will say this and people will say this and people will say that I mean, listen, yeah, listen If you want a highly

Interruptive Style, then you can watch Piers Morgan Who is one of I don't understand how that guy is so popular But anyway Because you hate him? Yeah, fuck me, man But Joe Rogan, I think

Whatever you want to say about some issues in the past Or whatever, I think he's a fucking brilliant Interviewer He's led a fascinating life Yes, he has So anyway, this will be this will be great and it just be great and interesting, but yeah Huh? Total aside a book worth reading is catch-and-kill and it's by

It's by Ronan Farrow, and I've been raving about this book because it's about how the Harvey Weinstein scandal was it was was reported on Released why why NBC wouldn't release it why the New Yorker would and the short story here is that But it's it's NBC wouldn't do it because there was mega connections to Miramax and personal connections. Miramax, that's Harvey Weinstein's company, Weinstein Company and Miramax. Right. It's a movie company. Yes. Yeah. So anyway, long story short, he goes into afterwards after the story comes out about how because Ronan Farrow was tailed by ex Mossad agents, guys from israel who have who have retired from the secret service and are now contracted to

surveillance and and that sort of thing and he goes into how he found out about it and it's pretty unbelievable one of the things that they've developed now that apparently i don't know if iphones would probably count in this too but i thought everything on iphones was encrypted i don't know anyway they have a they have a technology now that can go into your phone and strip it and i think it's called pegasus and it literally just strips it for for all the information that it has, and they can find out everything you've ever done. Where you go, what you do, everything. Cool.

And it's like, I was like, holy fuck, that exists? Oh my god. Damn, bro, that's fucked. Yeah, damn, bro, that's fucked as I powerlifted Planet Fitness. Anyway, total random aside, Darnell Nurse. No, we're talking about overtime. We were talking about overtime. Every time we get off topic, we should just go, Darnell

Nurse. Anyway, Darnell Nurse's contract. I like overtime, but I think you've got to have a time limit on it, because you've got to force teams to make mistakes. Oh, John Tortorella, the Columbus game, had a big old cut on his forehead

and a black eye. Why? Well, I tweeted, what's up with his face, LOL? Something like that. He had skin cancer removed a week ago. That sucks.

It wasn't life-threatening or anything, they said. No, but... But all the same. Yeah, yeah. I'm just saying that. When people hear cancer, they immediately react.

It's a high-button word, for sure. It's a tough word. Yeah, October 16th, and I somehow completely missed it, and everyone showed it to me right away. And, I mean, typical John Tortorella. Just right back behind the bench. You wouldn't expect anything less. There are several comments on your video, Steve.

You put the video up a couple hours ago. Oh, I haven't even had a chance to look. Jesse and I listened to it. We watched some of it, but we were listening to it as we were prepping and setting up and everything. And the top comment on it This is it He's finally lost it

We have witnessed The total collapse Of this man's sanity I get that comment Like 30 times a year Yeah Another person Steve is going off the edge

Nice and early this season A guy named Ryan Steve's got that Joker laugh Going on Pure agony I haven't seen it Oh Yeah and then someone said

Steve must have seen The new Joker movie Nope I have not seen it Is he a baddie? I think he's a baddie I haven't seen it Have you seen it?

No. Don't care to. My dad saw it. He dances on some stairs. Yeah. Also, people going to those stairs don't. It's one of the worst parts of New York. Oh, is it?

Like, you don't want to be in that area at all. What part of New York is it in? Just a crime-riddled area. Really? Yeah, yeah. And then there's just a bunch of people going there and dancing on it like the Joker, and they definitely shouldn't just be hanging out there, even in broad daylight. Getting robbed with a sharpened knife.

Well, especially when you've got an iPhone and you're taking pictures. Right. Yeah. It's just the heavy crime areas you probably just don't want to be hanging out in. We have a friend that's on the force, and one of his favorite stories to tell. On the force. He's actually, he's a cantankerous dog with a badge. That's right.

His name is Ruff. Ruff and Hux. God, I love you, too. One of the things that he talks about is he's like, you wouldn't believe how many people do really dumb things with equipment, camera equipment. So I guess these Ryerson kids, which is a local school, I don't know if you've heard about, kind of inferior. No, I'm kidding. What? The graduates are really stupid.

Hey. No, so these guys, I guess, wanted to shoot a documentary, and they had thousands of dollars worth of camera equipment because that's not easy. I mean, our rig was really expensive, and we don't even have a top-notch rig. We've got, it's a good rig, but it's not like, you know, studio quality. But schools. It's no ice surfing rig, that's for sure. I have a story when you're done. Schools consistently have the best equipment.

They do! Ryerson, we had the first HD camera ever in Canada. That was the thing they always brusseled about when we got it. Didn't we have the first Phantom cam? I don't know what that is. Or a RED cam. We had the first RED, that's my next point. And then we had the first red camera ever in Canada.

So those two things were pretty cool. And that camera's, I don't even know how much money. Oh my God, no idea. $50,000 or something. So these guys decide, and this is my neighborhood, so I can attest to how bad it is. I live in an area called Moss Park, and there are some particularly bad streets, but Sherburn, Girard, Sherburn, Dundas, you don't want to be walking through there with visible camera equipment at 2 a.m.

You don't want to go there and dance on a couple of stairs like you're the Joker and be like, hey, I'm just hanging out with my friends. So these guys were trying to shoot a documentary at night and in a high crime area because they wanted to interview people that hang out in that area at night. And you know what? So they went up to interview the guys and the guys said, we'll take the equipment. Thanks. And they said, what? And they said, no, no, you're not walking away without giving us the equipment. I applaud them for being like, we're going to do journalism, man.

Like, we're serious about this. And I get it. I get it. But, oh, honey. And then they go to the cops and the cops are like, okay, obviously we'll file the report. We'll do the thing that we can. Meanwhile, they know that there's nothing that they can do because guess what? It's been sold already.

Oh, that's gone. It's half an hour, it's gone. It's gone. You'll never see it again. So, don't go to high crime areas with expensive things. Oh my God. It's a bad idea. There, um, there was, so for practicum, did you have to do practicum?

We did, yeah. Yeah, okay. So, you had to pitch your practicum project. Practicum is just your final project. Yeah, your big final project. And one key thing that a lot of students, myself included, struggled with was pitching a believable practical budget. And we pitched a sports idea where we would go to Montreal and it'd be like seven of us and we thought we could do it for like three grand. And we got turned down and I was bitter about it for a long time.

And now that I know what I know, I'm like, we could have absolutely never done that for three grand. We ended up doing that reality show at a used car dealership. But there was You say that like people know what you're talking about We've talked about it before You guys are always like you've told that before Okay keep going Anyway so there was

There was a practicum That was approved with a budget of I want to say You know we have first time listeners but keep going There was a practicum that was approved with a budget of like It was something like Either $25,000 or like $40,000 But they said

we can afford it here's how we're going to pay for it here's how we're going to do it and the school goes okay and they're like we're going to rent equipment and we're going to bring it to vancouver and all that shit there was another practicum uh that was it was basically the group was just the rich kids and there was one guy who was in the program and he was a great guy really liked him but i don't think he was terribly interested in the program but he i think was previously like a professional snowboarder and the practicum sounded an awful lot like, we're just going to go film

him snowboarding. Yeah. And then when they showed it, it was beautiful, but it was just him snowboarding. It was Sean White, by the way. It was Sean White. Whatever became of him. What happened? I said, whatever became of him anyway. He'll never amount to anything.

Nothing. You should cut his hair too. Yeah. So get a real job. There's a haircut you can wind your watch to There's a long way to a story Cause I keep getting fucking interrupted Oh man It's crazy

That's fucking true I wanted to strangle myself I listened to the final segment last show You're being way too hard You would have been totally justified strangling me last show Anyway Still telling the story What time is it?

The extremely high budget project that went to Vancouver, they left all their equipment alone for like 15 minutes in an unlocked car. 15 seconds is too much. Goodbye. Gone. All of it gone. And I think they had insurance for it, but the school tore a strip off them. As they should. The rich kids, they're driving down the West Coast and they're partying the entire time.

They rented an RV. They had all their equipment in the RV And like I said they were partying They got a little messed up They slept outside of the RV Or like passed out outside of the RV They left all the doors wide open And they discovered it the next morning

Not a thing touched Not a thing Oh my god Not a thing touched That's amazing Well Kids be careful with your freaking equipment That's fucking awesome

That sucks man What a shitty lesson to learn Yeah Let's do the press conference Jesse have we any questions For today's press conference We are going to do Some trivia courtesy of our friend

At crawdaddy222 Who slid into my DMs And passed along this great Piece of history You guys are going to combine your brains the Adam Wilde and Steve Dangle brains which will combine to make one super hockey brain

and you are going to tell me the 10 players that the Leafs have drafted in their franchise history, it's only been 10 that have played at least 1,000 NHL games if you get a minimum of

3 guys on this list, all I want is 3 guys out of this 10 You will win today's SDP Trivia Challenge Okay By the way I just want to throw this out there

Nesson has released a video Oh And I guess they went around With Leaf fans in town Asking them for their reaction To the Brad Marchand For Austin Matthews trade And Leaf fans

Absolutely lost their minds What? And I think that's really funny Don't do that I thought I had to bring that up How dare you And also that That Kyle Dubas clip

According to Jeff Jeff Veyette The thing that Kyle Dubas mouth was, he had to know that Kerfoot would be lining up with Jenner. That seems to be what people are saying. I don't know. Anyway, it doesn't matter. Let's do this. Jesse, hit us.

Hit us with it. Let's go. I didn't see anything. I swear to God. Steve, cough, cough. It's messed up, bro. It's messed up, bro. There are 10 players on this list. The amount of players, or the player that Lisa's drafted

that have played at least 1,000 NHL games. Is it only 10? There's only 10 guys in the history of the franchise. All I need you to do is get three correct. You get 10 guesses. Did I play 10,000? Sorry. 1,000 games.

For the Leafs. And they're Leafs draft picks. No, no. They're just Leafs draft picks. Oh, my God. 1,000 NHL games, period. It doesn't have to be for the Leafs. Okay.

Vincent Domfuss. One. You get 10 guesses combined. Borya Salmi. No That's two guesses That was a good guess though That was an okay guess

One correct No Eight guesses left Obviously you've got Gotta put our heads together here You got like Guys that have had long careers After being drafted by the Leafs

So you gotta think like Oh Like we can We can toss around ideas Like Wendell Clark Maybe I don't I don't think so

I think Wendell Clark did Daryl Sittler Maybe Lanny McDonald Maybe See Okay this is ignorant Like

because those guys were so long long ago I don't know I think they were playing in the 70s they were playing like 70 games a year

yeah but like were they drafted even were they drafted yeah of course yeah yeah like Sittler was drafted Landon McDonald was drafted

but I think Sittler was drafted so long ago all he got was a phone call from the team hey you've been drafted he got a letter in the mail yeah honestly

that's what they used to get it's weird um Did the Leafs draft Kenny Janssen? Yes. Good pick. He played a long time. He did.

He was the Islanders captain. Are you filing it in? Kenny Janssen? Incorrect. That's two wrong. One right. One right. Finney Danfuss was a good pick.

You got seven to go. Wait, six to go. Six to go. Six to go. Can't be a goalie, right? No way. No. Well, like, Tuka Rask has been playing forever, and he just played 500.

Wow, yeah. Okay. It's a long time. It takes a long time. 1,000 games. 1,000 games. I think it's all got to be somewhat modern era. And I say modern era from, like, the start of the 80s, because I don't...

Unless... Like, Lanny played, like, 20 years. Do we not try Lanny McDonald? Let's try Lanny McDonald. Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding! There you go. Lanny McDonald! Like, they drafted him in the early 70s.

He was playing until 89. Like, he had to have been. You got five guesses left. Thomas Caberle? Did he play that long? Well, he played, his first season was 98-99. And he won the Cup of the Bruins in 2011, and then I think he still kept playing. I think it's possible.

He was rarely injured. I'll say Thomas Caberle. Incorrect. Thomas Caberle is not on the list. Thomas Caberle, I'll Google it quickly. How many games did he play? How many games has Thomas Cavalier played in his career? 999.

And then he got lined up with Mike Babcock, and Mike Babcock would not let him get a third 1,000. 984. Yeah, not 1,000. Come on. Not 1,000. Whenever he signed the next season, I think he just lost it. He's one of those guys that had it until he didn't.

And then he just didn't have it. He was a Hab, wasn't he? I thought he was in Carolina with Francis. I think it was both. Okay. Thomas Cavalier played for the Carolina Hurricane. and the Montreal Canadiens and the Boston Bruins

in the 2011 season. It's got to be somebody that's drafted before like 2004 as well, right? Ty Domi was drafted by the Rangers, right? No. Or was he drafted by the Leafs?

No, he was drafted by the Leafs by Gord Stelic. And I think he like he went straight to the Jets. Went to the Jets then the Rangers then Toronto. And he played for a very long time.

And he played every game. I don't mind it. Ty Domi. Ding, ding, ding, ding. Hey! Three correct. Let's keep going. Let's keep going.

Let's keep going. Let's see how many more you can get. Ty Domi is on that list. Like, Russ Cortnall comes to mind. Like, he played forever. But... And he was a draft pick. Yeah.

And like... There's a couple guys... Because that was the kid line. It was Dan Foose, Wendell Clark, and Russ Cortnall. Rick Vibe's another guy that I go, eh, maybe. Oh, maybe. We'll say Cortnall. Russ Cortnall.

Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. Ross Gardner. Rick Five, he got injured, though. What about, because he was a Leaf a couple times. I don't know who he was drafted by. Steve Thomas. Yeah. You know, interesting, because, yeah, he did, what did he do?

New Jersey. He did Chicago. Anaheim. Anaheim. Chicago, yeah. Yeah, his last few years were in Anaheim with Mike Babcock. Stumpy? Let's try Stumpy.

Stumpy. Not Stumpy. He is not on the list. That's four wrong, four correct. Is it possible that someone in the 50s, when they were playing like 50, 60 games a year, just played for like 25 years? Well, like George Armstrong, but like was he drafted? I don't know if he was drafted.

That's a problem. And he would have been drafted. His first season was 49. I don't know if they did draft back then. They just sort of had systems. Let's try it. George Armstrong? Why not?

George Armstrong. No draft. Five wrong. Four, correct. You've already done better than I thought you would. You got four. I've done better than I thought we would. Russ Cortnall.

So you had, let's look at the 70s teams. You got Lanny, Sittler. Have we even tried Sittler? We haven't tried Sittler. Uh-uh. Could. Borea, we tried. We tried Borea.

Not going to be Mike Palm. It's here. No. Not going to be Norm Oldman, is it? I don't think so. Dave Keelan. Fucking Dave. Like, I don't know if he was picked.

Yeah. Right? A draft pick. Didn't he miss, like, with injuries? Yeah, I think he did. And then you've got Who did they even draft in the 80s Like Drake Barahowski

Well he was in the 90s They had Dom Foose who we got Ross Cortnall who we got No Wendell Clark Like I'm trying to think of someone Who was a Leaf for a hot minute Did Nick Andropov No he was injured all the time

He played for a long time but he was injured all the time Like could have maybe if he hadn't been injured I'm just trying to think of who else they drafted through the 90s because they fired so many draft picks into the sun. And it's not,

these are not draft picks that were traded to other teams that were drafted by those teams, right? It would be like a Roberto Luongo, Scott Niedermeyer situation.

No, no, it has to be a Leaf pick. Leaf pick. Yeah, Scott Niedermeyer would be a lock. Yeah, yeah, but that doesn't count. You would think this game

would be easier because the Leafs made so few good picks but there were so few picks they had. Right. Like Steve Sullivan, who they lost away,

I don't think he played long enough. There's just so many guys in the history that weren't picks, you know? Yeah. Like, it was rare that you ever... Like, I remember Brad Boyce cracked the lineup

for a couple games. I was like, whoa, an actual Leaf draft pick. You think? Maybe Brad Boyce. Well, dude, he was drafted, I want to say, 2002, and he finished playing 2015? With the Leafs. With the Leafs.

It's possible. He did score 40 goals once. Ah. No. No, I don't think so. There aren't many other choices based on our criteria, right? Brad Boyce. Brad Boyce is not on the list.

That's ten yeses. If you guys want to keep going, we can keep going. Any defense besides Kenny Johnson? Dimitri Yuskevich? Okay, so Larry Murphy was a... Danny Markov? Larry Murphy was not a Leafs pick. No, he was a Penn, wasn't he?

He was a Minnesota pick. Minnesota. North Stars. Like a Jamie McCowan. Yeah, Demetrius Gavish, but he missed a bunch of time. I don't even think McCowan was a Leaf pick. I think he was a Flames pick that was traded with the Gilmore trade. That's right.

That's right. We could do this forever. Yeah. Should we punch out at four? Let's punch out. All right. You guys did better than I thought. I thought your cap would have been three was the challenge.

You got four. I wouldn't have guessed Russ Cordell. I need to know when the draft started. I should look that up. I should know that. I don't know when that started. I want to say like 40s, 50s, something like that, maybe 50s. So, we'll start from the bottom.

Matt Stajan. Oh! Matt Stajan played a career 1,003 games. Wow. Leafs draft pick. That one we should have probably had. Yeah. Yeah.

Second rounder, 2,000? I don't know. 2,000? I don't have it in front of me. Okay. I went and sat next to him at a Raptors game. Very nice. Oh, wow.

Fun. Very nice game. Mississauga boy. Yep. Todd Gill, number nine. Oh! Yep. 1,007 games.

I didn't know he was a Leaf pick, to be honest. Okay. Lori Boshman. I would have never. Don't know who that is. 1,009 games drafted in 79. I looked that one up. Ty Domi, you got?

Yep. 1,020 games. Russ Cortnall, you got? 1,029 games. Number five. Randy Carlisle. Oh, no way. Really?

1,055 games. Leafs draft pick. Former Leafs captain. Was he? No. He won the Norris. I know that. With Pittsburgh.

Is he a captain? I'm pretty sure. I don't think he was. Hold on, hold on. I don't think he was. Yeah, before we move on, we are going to figure out. Because this picture would be everywhere at Scotiabank Arena, and it's not. If you're a captain.

Rick Vives isn't. You can find it. You can find it. It wasn't a very celebrated era. There's not a lot of Rob Ramage. Maybe not, maybe not. Okay, maybe I'm wrong. I have the full list here.

Is Randy on it? Randy is not on it. Okay. Nope. I'm wrong. Put him in Daryl through that era. Yeah. Number four, 1,096 games, Daryl Siller.

Did we not guess him? We didn't say him. You threw out his name a couple of times and you never guessed him. That's my fault. You wanted to. You did. That's my fault. Lanny McDonald, that you got, 1,111 games.

Vincent D'Amfus, 1,378 games. And number one. Underrated good career for D'Amfus. He was amazing in Montreal. Big time. Yeah, yeah. Number one, the Leafs draft pick with the most games played, Luke Richardson. Oh!

14-17. Wow. He was one of those. They had like three first rounders in like 94 or something like that. And they missed some huge names. But he put together a really good career. He did. He just wasn't like a superstar.

Like Drake Barahowski. Yeah, Drake Barahowski I think was the same draft. That's when they were drafting, like, tough guys. And Rob Pearson. Rob Pearson. Out of Oshawa, and they could have had, like, the names are brutal. Played from 87 is when his first year with the Leafs, drafted in 87. I think he finished with the Senators, didn't he?

Finished with the Senators. 2008 was his last full season, played 76 games, and the next year tried to come back, played two games, and then retired. But he was with the Leafs somewhere back in there, too. Like, the Leafs reacquired him. 0-5, 0-6. They reacquired him, played 21 games. Just can't get enough.

that Luke Richardson. Isn't he a coach? No, Drake Barahowski. Oh, Drake Barahowski. Richardson is. I don't know. Richardson is, but I think Barahowski is too.

I want to say he's a coach in League Junior. Okay, fine, fine, fine. Well, listen, I hope that we come back on Sunday after with a new coach. A Leafs back-to-back,

San Jose and Montreal. Drake Barahowski. And I hope we have better news and I hope that we have more news on Darnell Nurse's contract. I'm glad we got so deep with it. Right? Yeah.

So... Zach Wierenski? Yeah. anyway we will see you then uh oh don't forget too we're live at regulars we're going uh live next uh next thursday at regulars bar uh november 7th oh my god is that next uh that's next week that's already next week no it's not that's two weeks from now two weeks yeah again next week is halloween right thank you uh november 2nd i still can't announce it yet but we got something big cooking and i want to shout someone out just as i checked my phone i want to shout out brian again

for that wonderful trivia thank you there's a guy that's unbelievable there's a guy who donated two thousand dollars to me to rachel's raiders then he donated fifteen hundred and something or some odd dollars separately to get me to thirty thousand wow and to get me to Oh my god To get me to 40 To get our team to 40,000 Nick Gould Just gave me another grand

Gave you Jesse $458.30 And gave you Adam $458.30 To get us to $40,000 So we have 10 grand to go 10 grand to go That's unbelievable

That's just unbelievable Thank you Nick Gould Heart of Gould That is ridiculous I'm sure he's not the first person Who said that to him though Sorry it's almost Halloween

Nick Gould That's better I like that one Alright we'll see you guys on Sunday Thanks so much for listening We love you Like if you really like it Subscribe Tell all your friends

And then can we start? Can we end how we started? Which is. Oh. I don't know. Ah! The Steve Dangle Podcast. Follow the guys on Twitter at Steve underscore Dangle at Adam W-Y-L-D-E and at Jesse Blake.

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