The Steve Dangle Podcast - Made Up Guy | March 8, 2020

Episode Date: March 9, 2020

We have an announcement! (00:00), who wore the crown? (01:00), Leafs get 1 of 6 points on the Cali road trip (09:30), Mitch Marner (31:30), Steve is upset at people thinking players don’t want to play in Toronto (58:00), Adam’s thoughts on the Ottoman empire (1:21:30), Florida retires Luongo’s number (1:26:30), the NHL is closing dressing rooms to reporters (1:28:00), a Eugene Melnyk VS Jim Little update (1:38:00), remembering Henri Richard (1:44:30), and Kristen Rutherford’s Dani Rylan piece (1:51:00). Originally aired: March 8, 2020 Watch the full episode here: https://youtu.be/vXbtfzqbq2o Merch: https://teespring.com/en-GB/stores/fancydangleshirts Follow us on Twitter: @Steve_Dangle, @AdamWylde, & @JesseBlake Follow us on Instagram: @SteveDangle, @AdamWylde, & @Jesse.Blake Subscribe to us on iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/ca/podcast/steve-dangle-podcast/id669828195?mt=2 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey, just a heads up, our tickets sold out for Kingston, yay, thank you so much for selling out the show, we're so honored, I honestly didn't, I didn't know, I was like, how would we do, how would we do in Kingston? How do we do it? So we have sold out the first block, there is a second block coming out tonight, it is not tickets, it's standing, sorry, it's not tickets, it's not sitting, it's standing room only, but there are limited amounts, like very small, that's at 9pm Eastern Standard Time, we'll tweet out the link, you can come see the podcast in Kingston, And just a heads up for anybody that If you miss out on the tickets or whatever We obviously want you there for the live show But the bar does open up to the general public Because obviously the game is going on that night as well

We'll be hanging out for the game So if we can't see you during the show We'll see you after What did I tell you? Uh, to stuff your face with deliciousness. No, well, yes. You should. You should.

Because Panago pizza is delicious. And it's 11 degrees outside, and it's like a delicious pizza night, I think. Right? Yeah. That's what I'm saying. It's warm. It's cheesy. I told you not to have faith in this Toronto Maple Leafs hockey team.

And, uh, boy, gosh. I hate being right all the time. But yet again, I'm correct. You got a pretty good, like, seven-year streak going. Of being correct all the time? All the time. Every time I mean, me too

They call me Can't Miss Wild I sit there at night And I think of the Jeff Petrie move That the Canadians made That Adam Wild guaranteed they would make And I sit there and I say, wow, it was so great that that happened Because he's always right It's true

And even if it didn't happen, it would have been right to have happened It actually would have It would have The Montreal Canadiens are no better than they were And are not in the playoffs and they're going to keep them next year so they can just miss the playoffs again. Say something else.

I'm excited. No, I can't wait. Hold me to that, Habs fans. Unless Cary Price plays 920, they're not going. It's the internet. They've already forgotten. Yeah, that's true. That's true.

Well, listen, let's get into it. Somehow we're going to do this. Who wore the crown? Woo! Guys, as you know, live generously and life will treat you royally. Why not pour yourself in a friend a crown roll? Why not?

A crown roll because we're going to talk about who wore the crown where we, with the help of you, Recognize a Leaf player each show Who gives it their all for the blue and white Because it's our town It is our crown And it's not about what you have

But what you have to give Let's crown a Leaf that lives generously By giving it all for their team Brought to you by your friends at Crown Royal Live generously Life will treat you royally Let's get into it Steven Dangle

You know Leafs have been We'll obviously get into this I do not think the sky is falling In quite the way that people are saying Hmm. However, they did lose three consecutive games to teams in hockey that are not good at hockey. So, we gotta look for who performed the best. Who performed the best over the California road trip? A team scored three goals in those three games. Pretty sad. Pretty sad. I think two since our

last show. Or no, one goal since our last show in two games. That's right. Who scored it? Don't care What do you mean you don't care? I don't care because it's the it's the play of the team that sucks the play of the team that sucks But who scored the one goal? I don't know Steve tell me William damn Nylander. I'm giving it to William Nylander He's been

arguably their best player mm-hmm who without a mask and He is exactly the kind of player who Will succeed and thrive in Toronto for years to come And we'll get into that later in the show But I'm giving it to William Nylander I'm just making a note here It's your turn to crown someone, Adam What's that note, Adam?

I'm just saying, I wrote Steve is mad about guy who said he won't come here That's what I wrote down Oh, was that not in your prep? Yeah I'm just making sure that we have that in there Oh, do we want to talk about that? We should talk about how you got cancelled on Twitter

Cancelled? Yeah Someone actually tweeted, Adam and I, and we're like, check in on Steve after his take about you get endorsements and can't play anymore in Toronto. Yeah. I only know one language, and I know what I said. Oh, we'll get into it later. Oh, we'll get into it. We'll get it.

We'll get into it. Guys, I'm hard-pressed on this one, but I'm going to give it to Austin Matthews. Oh. I think Austin Matthews has played great, too. And you say William Nylander, arguably their best player. And I know that I'm going to be the minority on this because you've already claimed it. Jesse, we already know how he feels about William Nylander. To me, Austin Matthews is by far the best player and has played the best on the team.

Yeah, there's Nylander, arguably the best player. Matthews is. Is. And has been. And has been. And doesn't matter who you are. Everyone's just like, that guy's a bull in a china shop. Yes.

Do we forgive him for the second Anaheim goal? Well, that was... Where he just passed the puck to the front of the net. It was horrible. It was horrible. Yeah. Here's the thing. When you've scored 47 goals, I give you a pass.

He's going to be on the ice. That's what Matthews did to the Ducks. He gave them a pass. Ah! Jesse, he's on. He's on. The coffee kicked in. Is it good?

It's good. It's good. Austin Matthews is probably the best hockey player we've seen play on this team in our lifetime. We don't even know it yet. and I think that there is, yeah, I mean, I think I know it from seeing it, but I don't think people realize he's worth every penny. There are players who make near him that are not,

but he is absolutely worth every penny, and I think there is a, it's unfortunate that this season has been such a Jekyll and Hyde, Wax Show craziness, you know, Babcock getting fired and this team not being consistent and everything else that's going on, Because it's overshadowing what is And what probably will be If things keep going the way they are

A historic performance by a Leaf player I don't think it's got anything to do with him No, I know that, but it's still overshadowing it And I think if he beats Rick 5's record Which is very much within his grasp to do People are going to be like Yeah, so what, you guys didn't win And rightfully so

Which I would say the same thing I'm still going to be Austin Matthews' biggest supporter But I have to tell you But it's a shame that it's not getting more press. What should be the story this year, and if this team was playing up to what it should be, what should have been the story is Austin Matthews' season. What unfortunately is the story is the garbage

that they keep putting out on the ice for us. Jesse, go ahead. Saturday night. Saturday. Whole world of possibilities. What kind of loser plays on a Saturday anyway? Leafs this week. Friday night, one guy showed up with three minutes left to go in the game.

Tried to weld them back into it It was William Nylander Only goal of the game Only goal in What was the time? It was like a couple hundred minutes They almost were the first team ever Or something like that

To get shut out back-to-back games In Southern California Insane Anyways, William Nylander Scored a goal to break that streak And on that goal It was all him He literally caused that turnover

At the blue line He took the puck around the edge And he shot it and went right in It's even better Well it's even better if you word it differently William Nylander with an amazing Defensive play To convert it into offense

Right which so many people It's so nice To see all the William Nylander Crap go away It's so Nice now there's a lot of other crap to take It's place but it is so Great to have

Like anybody that I know that is $10 million because he made the $10 million prorated last year. Anybody that I know that used to say that stuff cannot say a thing. William Nylander has single-handedly shut every boomer take up. And I don't want to paint all the...

Guys, we're starting to look stupid! I don't want to paint all the boomers with one brush because that's not fair. But for those who are like, oh, he doesn't play a Canadian way. He doesn't do this. He doesn't do that. William Nylander has done everything

anybody has asked for. He scored like the most goals in tight with the goalie. There's nothing else William Nylander can do. He is a phenomenal hockey player. He's playing to his level. He's over playing his contract It's a beautiful thing and he did it by a he turned the tide with his play You know he could have done it and he could have tried to do in any other way being nice to the media and all That but he just he just shut up and scored a bunch of goal and that was goal number 30 And it's undeniable at this point. What's your favorite William Nylander quote?

Yeah, there is not there's none. It doesn't exist my never you're never gonna get a good quote out of him Literally my favorite William Nylander quote Prosciutto It's from his Instagram Cause he was eating prosciutto I've interviewed a guy I don't remember

What his voice sounds like Like He just scores goals He's a hockey player Yes Let him play hockey Yes Prosciutto

That's who gets my crown With that That's who wore the crown For this episode Brought to you as always By Crown Royal Next time the puck drops Why not

Nylander Live generously And treat your Leafs crew To a Crown Royal Old fashioned Now before Excuse me Before we keep going

I want to say a very happy International Women's Day to all the women and female-identifying people that listen to this show. Thank you so much for listening to us. Thank you so much for being a part of our experience. And obviously, there's a lot of work to do when it comes to women's hockey. But we just wanted to say a shout-out to you. Thank you for everything that you do. And obviously, there's an article that I want to point to towards the end of the show. Christina Rutherford wrote something on Danny Ryland.

We'll get into that. But it's fitting that it came out today. Christina is one of the most talented writers in the sport. And this profile that she does, it's a Sportsnet big read. It's really, really, really good. Another really good big read. I believe it's the top 25 women in the sport. That's from Emily Sadler at Sportsnet.

And it's enormous. I lost count of how many scrolls it is But it's really, really good And she's a She's an up and comer Emily Sadler She's not She's not one of the biggest names yet

She will be And she kicked someone's ass In a charity boxing match Did she? She did Damn Kicked their ass I would not do a charity boxing match

No, it's one of those things I like to dream about And never do Yeah You know Even with the You know, because they put face protectors on you And stuff like that

Even with that I have no interest in the neck pain associated No thanks Or brain Or brain Well I doubt that they hit that hard In a charity thing Do they?

I don't know I don't intend on finding out Yeah I will never know Emily knows I'll ask Emily Adam and I have a close friend Who boxes

Jack's From our morning show Right She boxes? Yeah she boxes all the time Because apparently It's one of the best ways To get cardio

It is It is It's the best high intensity The thing is though She doesn't get hit back Like she hits a mannequin Right She doesn't

She hits the bags Or a mannequin Yeah The Yeah In the very few times that I did any MMA classes or Muay Thai or boxing, they get you exhausted, then the class starts. Yeah.

So, yeah, it's unreal. Yeah, absolutely. Now, we're going to get into the Leafs and how they blew it in California. One out of a possible six points. Seems bad. Well, it would be bad if Florida hadn't packed it in now. Florida did win last night. I believe the point spread now is three points, so well within striking distance.

It's like Florida and the Leafs both don't want to go to the playoffs. But rather convincing win for Florida against Montreal last night on Roberto Luongo night. We'll talk about that a little bit later. But for now, I mean, listen. I said a couple of weeks ago that you should not have faith in this team. I certainly don't. But I didn't think that playing the three worst teams in the West

would lead to not just losses. Losses are one thing. stagnation of offense, which is the one thing they're good at. The Leafs are a top three offense in the sport. They're also a bottom three when it comes to goals against average. And it's shocking

to me that the one thing that they're good at, I mean, these three teams cannot score, so it's not surprising that the games were low scoring. How is it possible? How is it possible? And Scott Wheeler put something in The Athletic today, and he's gone through the last 17 games. It seems like the Leafs have been figured out.

And I'm going to point specifically to the power play again. Oh, boy. I don't understand. Explain to me this. Explain to me why it has to be passed 40 times before we hit the blue line. All backwards. I would rather them just go to dump and chase. They're faster than anyone anyway.

And I'm not a dump and chase guy. I'm a possession guy. But it's fairly clear that all you have to do is if you are on a penalty kill against the Leafs, Stand your four guys on the blue line And they're going to back pass it Until they're running out of people to back pass it to And then they're going to try to charge through you Which doesn't work

I'm not a dump and chase guy I'm a try literally anything different guy And this is I think mostly Mitch Marner's challenge Because you see He's battling out there We're going to spend some time on him today A few weeks ago The team looked like they didn't care

And they're not trying That poor guy is trying so damn hard And it's to his detriment He took that Stupid penalty I can't remember Which game that was Was that Anaheim?

I don't remember Yes It was one of the California It was the one Where he was trying To get the puck And he got frustrated

The trip It was It was a guy I've never heard of Sheldon something That happened Friday Creative player Yeah

Kiefer Sherwood I think Anyway He's a stick But I knew The game was going poorly Or the power play Was going poorly

When Matthews and Marner Switched spots And the broadcast went away! Oh! They changed spots! Remember all we yelled about

when the power play switched up and it actually started working? I'm like, it took you two years to just try Matthews and Marner switching sides? And now the power play has been, has not been very good

for a while now. It's been two years since it's been good. And they switched it up. Well, you know what, I think the other, it's, it's,

it's percentage is good. Sure. It's percentage isn't bad, But over the last little while, it's completely stagnated. I think part of the problem is that you have one guy who can shoot on the entire power play. Austin Matthews. Two guys. Yeah, Willie's got a shot, but it always whistles wide.

Willie's goals are in tight, right? They are. Marner cannot shoot. Tyson Berry shoots it to your knees. And who else is out there? Well, Tavares is there for deflections. He doesn't have a lot of space to shoot where he is. And Nylander, I mean, he's usually looking for the pass, right?

He can shoot, but he's rarely in a position to on the power play, I find. And why not? It's completely stagnant. Why not? And it's always the same five guys, though. Like, you can't switch it up a little once? Who are you going to switch it up with? Yeah, who do you take off that?

Anybody for anything. You're literally putting your five best offensive players out there, or four best, plus Tyson Berry. See, I agree that they should do that. Right. I don't disagree with the lineup at all. I disagree with what they're doing. Exactly.

That's probably, I mean, they are the five most capable guys. Just have them do something different. Right. Which, yeah, I don't have a problem with. That's true. And looking at the numbers, over the course of the entire season, they rank seventh in power play percentage. That's crazy, isn't it?

And goals for, they're second. Are they really? Going into California, they were first overall, and then Tampa passed them over the weekend. But they're second in goals for on the entire season. I've got to tell you, I'm curious to know where they are in terms of, so they're seventh in percentage. What are they in terms of power play goals for?

I bet they're way down Can I just throw this out there? 7th in percentage is not good enough That's 40, they have Forget Tyson Berry, they have 40 million dollars out there Right Half the salary of the team is out there Sorry, you should be number 1 or number 2

On everything You take a penalty against the Leafs, it should be a death sentence Yes, and it isn't Yeah, it should be the same feeling you get When Tampa Goes on the power play And you can go, well Steve Just a few games ago

William Nylander scored a I think it was a highlight Real power play Oh my god it was amazing And they went I think it was 3 for 3 Against Tampa Great

There's one game Do it again That's the shitty thing About this season man Keep it going No one's That's the shitty thing About this Leafs team

Over the season Red Wings have won Like 16 times Doesn't mean they're good Yeah 4 times against Montreal You know if they had just If they had just lost

Those games Think of where Montreal might be Anyway Think of where Man So I said they sit 7th in power play percentage. They sit 10th in total goals scored on the power play.

It doesn't surprise me that that's lower. It's not as much lower as I thought. Okay. Yeah, interesting. So yeah, what do you take away from that, though? What I think is that... Well, they're just not getting as many opportunities. Sure, yeah, that's true.

That's true, but the opportunities they do get, they should be No. 1 or No. 2 in percentage. There's no excuse. There's absolutely no excuse. It's not just the money paid. It's the skill there. Show me a team with more skill on that. And show me a power play

That wastes more time Getting set up than the Leafs That's the biggest problem They can execute once they're in But how many power plays do we see That they can't even gain a zone entry They're like, okay, Sharks played a good game And the Leafs got goalied a bit

Yeah, oh yeah Yeah, Martin Jones had his good game this year And that happens, but This is more than that happening No, but now, moving on to So Sharks, I even said in the video I'm fully willing to forgive this loss It's a loss, it's just a regular loss

You're not going to win every game, that's fine LA and Anaheim Anaheim didn't even look like they Had any interest in winning No And they lost their goalie, they lost Gibson And they were having a laugh The whole game

They were having a laugh The Ducks are playing pond hockey Because their games don't matter David Backus can barely skate Man, is he cooked. Yeah. He could have cracked Boston's lineup. I'm really glad, though, that he was traded from Boston

because they wanted him to take on a fighter's role, and I thought, dude, don't do that. He should not be taking any more hits to the head. Who was it who crushed him? Clifford? And then I saw him hit the ice, and I was worried his head hit the ice. You've had a great career. You're young.

Because, really, 35 or whatever he is is young. It's in the grand scheme of things. It's quite young. I mean, I'm three years away from 35. double your age and you'll still probably have 20 years left but his body looks done

like playing at an NHL level yeah he may just be LTIR next year although Anaheim can't really afford that I don't know

anyway regardless sorry yeah sorry he does look cooked you're absolutely right I just think it's I'm so glad he's not

in Boston because I didn't when I saw those quotes come out a couple years ago before the playoffs with you know we had a conversation with Bruce Cassidy

and then he like said he's going to be the tough guy I'm so glad that he doesn't have to do that now in Anaheim he just has to be guy whose career is over

after this next season. He's got one more year left. That'll be it. It's not an insult. It's just, it's time. It comes for everybody. Play it out on this team is going to be bottom 10,

you know? There will be a time when we are too crotchety and old man-ish to do this. And I hope... And that time was two years ago. I hope our family

are smart enough to pull us off the show and go, okay, guys, you're done now. Wrap it up. That's enough. Yeah. I don't want to be 85

and doing this, guys. I love you, but not that late. And what if you got into a podcast management role? What if you were a scout? Potentially, yes. Yeah.

Exactly. Mike Stevens guy. I don't know. His takes aren't hot enough. Can I just be the guy? Does he have what it takes? Can I be the guy who's just paid to show up at public events? I want to be that guy.

Just like an alumni guy. I don't want to do any work. You want to step out and put the jacket around the fans. Right. I just want to come out for the troops things. Yeah. You want to go to Clark. Yeah.

I don't want to actually work. And here's Leafs alumni Christian Hansen. Right. That has happened multiple times. And they get paid for that. That is bananas. Christian Hansen was a fourth-line lead for five seconds. He's an alumni.

So I want to be a podcast alumni. I like that. I like that. I'm sure this burgeoning podcast industry of ours is going to definitely have a budget for that, Jesse. Right. Full salary and benefits. How teary is that ceremony, that podcast hall of fame ceremony, when they raise your banner up to the end? It's not even a banner.

It's just a giant phone case with your face on it or something like that. You know what I mean? What year is it? 2060? No, it's like 20... 22. Oh my god, what? Come on, what? No, because we're gonna be finished. What? No, not by then.

Oh, yeah. We're not, no, no, no, we, the great thing about broadcasting is you can go for 30, 40 years. But then you got to cut it off. My goal is to go until well beyond me being good at it. Mmm. It seems to happen a lot in this industry. I'm gonna be, I'm gonna be honest with you, I'm going to be on a golf course in Florida or something.

I'm going to be well out of here. Not that I don't love doing this, but everything's got a time limit, and all good things come to an end. It'll be like Louisiana, because Florida's going to sink away. Right. Yes. Rising water levels, people. That's true. I'll be in tropical Denver at that point.

Jesus. I'll be at a beach in Denver, 1,000 feet above sea level. Well, at that point, it'll be 50 feet. Not anymore. We're actually at sea level. No, we're just talking about Dave Baggis. I'm sorry. This was not, yeah.

Anyway, the issue here. So they couldn't score. They can't score. The Kings didn't cross center ice for, like, the second and third period. That's because the Kings don't know how to play offense. Right. But they played this, like, just simple, dumb defensive style, and it stifled the Leafs entirely.

It's crazy. If the Leafs also did that, they could stifle teams, too. If they did, well, and, like, they got, it's crazy. Like three straight games Of pretty good goaltending Pretty good defense I like the way Freddie looked I like the way Freddie looked

I like the way Jambal was amazing Three losses So that's where I don't get They're going to score Sure Oh the Leafs have been found out All it took was friggin what 69 games Come on now

No this is what they've been This is what they are At 69 games we know what this team is Guys they're a win three lose three team That's what they are the whole way. And I hate to say it, but that's all they've shown us all year. When people show you

who they are, believe them. But depending on the order they do it in, they could win the cup that way. Sure. And listen, I am good with that. But until such time as they actually prove that they can win something, which they haven't, because here's what

I see, guys. They're going to go to the first round. Let's say they make it, because that's still very much up in the air. It seems like just by default, Florida's not going to get it. Yeah. The worst thing Florida could do, which is what they've done, is they've given up on Bobrovsky. That's the worst. Already. Well, yeah,

because that's horrible for the Leafs because they had a goalie who couldn't play goalie. And so the Leafs, now Florida's got a goalie. Because there's actually, I don't even know who it is, but it's not Bobrovsky. His name is not Bobrovsky. There's Montembeau, and I don't remember who else. Doesn't matter.

Doesn't matter. The fact is, they might make it, but. Yeah, so if, okay, so if the Leafs don't make it, Oh my god, but if they if they do make it what's gonna happen? What do we know what's gonna happen guys? They're gonna play Tampa in the first round assuming that Tampa doesn't overtake Boston Which is very much a possibility because they're coming on strong and that Boston Tampa game by the way was so much fun So much they played like two teams who know they're gonna play each other. Yes Yes, but my my problem here guys is that we know that if the Leafs get into the playoffs if they get into the playoffs

They're gonna play one of those two teams and what it what's gonna happen Nothing nice. Here is your ass on a plate They don't have the courtesy to give it on a plate a Bowl seems more practical people sit there and they tell you they beat Tampa a week and a half ago And they looked incredible once and no they didn't like they looked all right. They weathered the storm Yeah, they beat them and that's all they need to do Yeah, listen, I think I'm not as down on the Leafs as people may think because of the David Ayers video But

They don't look like World beaters But I'm also I'm having a really hard time I just look at the Six defensemen They ice And oh

We bring back Cody Cece And I still looked at And I'm like There's no combination Of these six names I like Chris Dredger Oh Drieger

Drieger Who's been around for He's He's the youngest goalie To have ever been in the league For 40 years He He's 5-2-1

With a 2-9-9 goals Against average and a 9.32 save percentage. Wow! The best thing Florida can do is give up on Bobrovsky, and that's bad news for the Leafs. It's $10 million. Yep.

No, Drieger's been around for a long time. But he is... He's better than Bobrovsky right now. He's done well. That is unbelievable that Sergey Bobrovsky's losing his job to... What's his first name? Chris. Chris Drieger.

Drafted 2012, third round, by the Ottawa Senators. Yeah, he was in their system for a long time. Wow. Like, what are his numbers in the minors this year? This year, he was a 9.32 in the minors. Oh, wow. That's really good, yeah. He's having a good year.

All right, well, there you go. But I just, I have a hard time. This is going to sound like letting them off the hook, which I am very not going to do later in the show, but if the Leafs turn in efforts like they did against San Jose, LA, and Anaheim, I think it's fixable enough that when they get Riley and Muzzin back, they should be rolling. They were not.

That's fair. They did things defensively, at least, that I didn't think they were capable of, especially for consecutive games. And it's not surprising to me that they had trouble scoring because they're clearly putting an emphasis on that. Counterpoint. They're clearly putting an emphasis on not being garbage defensively.

Counterpoint. They played the three worst teams in the West who all can't score goals. Absolutely true. Absolutely true. There's nothing I can say that would make it good. There's nothing I can say that would make it good. And I'm not being negative about the Leafs. I think I'm being realistic.

This is not a great team. It might be a good team. Even with Riley and Muzzin back, yes, it stabilizes the defense. But let's not pretend it looked good when they were playing. We don't have to be over the moon about an 8th place team. No, I'm not. If you just look at the standings, it's the 8th place team in the conference. Why would we ever be super excited about that?

No, it's realistic to be like, okay, they're mediocre. And last year, we called for the 1-8 playoff format. We're still calling for it. I would take it. And everyone's just like, oh, it's just because it hurts the Leafs. There is a chance that by the end of the season, the Leafs will have the 9th best record in the Eastern Conference and make it. They could have the 11th best.

They could. The Metro is better. Yeah. Which is wrong. That should not happen. No. That shouldn't happen. The Leafs shouldn't make the playoffs if they don't deserve to make the playoffs.

It's a joke. It is a joke. It's a joke. A joke. A joke. The, the, the, and I don't know what you, when, when it is you want to go in on the Leafs. I'm, I'm actually surprised at how measured you are. Yeah, me too.

Because ultimately, you freaked out over way less than this. They just lost three fucking games in a row, man. I know. No, but, like, I've seen this team at its worst this season, and I just don't feel like I saw that the last three games. Well, great. Against the three worst teams in the West. No, I know.

I know. I'm struggling. Three goals in three games. I'm struggling with how to feel. I really am. I don't know. I don't know. Like, at what point is the process just not good?

Well, you know, eventually we're going to get results. Right. Really? When's that? Game 70? Game 71? Oh, that's... You know what, guys?

The process... We knew by game 70 we'd have it. We'd have it. No. Process kicks in game 20. No, and the fact of the matter is they need... It doesn't matter who's in the lineup. They need better performances out of who they've got.

Justin Holl is finally playing probably his best hockey under his new contract, or since he signed that new contract. Pierre, where the fu... Where'd you go? Where did you go? Engvall, right? Pierre Engvall. Dude, you're finally in the show. You had to wait a while, you're playing in the Swedish league. You got your extension. You got your extension and you disappeared.

And people, I kept hearing people go, he hasn't scored in this amount of time, he hasn't scored, he hasn't scored. And I kept going, I feel like he has. What are you talking about? Like, hasn't he, he scored recently, hasn't he? Yeah, it was against David Ayers. Like he's got like one goal in the last 20 or something like that. It was against a Zamboni driver, who won, by the way. They're undefeated. But he's disappeared, and they give him the shot of a lifetime with Tavares and Nylander. And whiffed on the puck, I want to say that was in the Kings game, or it might have been in the Sharks game.

And other than that, he's guy. Like, he's floaty, lanky guy. Even, like, Molgan has zero points. Mulligan is He's just a placeholder Right handed Nick Patan Come on Yeah he is

He's right handed Nick Patan Where I bet if you looked At his numbers They'd be alright He's feisty He's fast And a big bunch of Nothing happens

When he's on the ice That's Nick Patan In a nutshell People go Look at his numbers And I'm like Look at the team not scoring When he's there

Right Nothing bad happens But nothing good either Right It's just If you need someone To cancel out the play Which you do need

That's your guy You know how I feel about cancel culture, Steve. Well, Nick Patan, Dennis Mulligan, cancel culture. They should be on the same line. Cancel culture. That's what we'll call the whole thing. Them and, like, who's, and I guess Engvall. Because I wouldn't say he does anything bad.

We have the cancel culture line. Pierre Engvall, Dennis Mulligan, Nick Patan. All three can play center. All three can play wing because it does not matter. Doesn't matter. We need more. I called for, in the pregame, I think it was before the Kings game. We need more to Travis Dermott. Damn it. We got it. So like we're getting we're getting above

Average or like we're getting next-level performances out of certain guys Yep, you just need more you just need more like you won three playoff games last year You got to win 16 to get a championship The it's not the difference between my math this guy and trade it. Yeah. Yeah three of 16, baby That was a regular man That's like 50%, right? That's 50% of what I was expecting. Yeah.

Anyway. No, and then so. You need more. Right. And so let's talk about Mitch Marner for a second. Yeah, you've talked about all the defensive guys and all the secondary players on the, all the secondary skaters, but what about Mitch Marner? I, again, I'm not going to hammer him like everyone else has.

I feel like, listen, with your star player, here's the long and short of it. people go he's young he's got this many points i'm not even gonna get into the money which the money is very much a factor they just need more what gives me pause and what gives me reason for optimism is he clearly understands that i'm i'm fine with mitch and austin and whoever else Being pissed off now I'm okay with that now People, when I was in Peterborough yesterday The Peterborough-Pete's game

Everyone's going, what's going on with those Leafs? You know, lost three straight, what's going on with them? I'm like, you know what, they've gone into the playoffs fat and happy Too many times Yeah, they basically take off from January to March Yeah, and what was What, the Leafs have made the playoffs Four straight years

Or is it four? Three And this would be four They've been in the playoffs three straight years three straight first round exits. What's the one that we always look back on with fondness? Washington. Washington! Which they lost in six! Not seven. Boston! They at least took them to seven both times!

We look back on Washington because they overachieved. The Leafs should have lost in three. And that was the narrative going into it. They should have lost in three. They should have got swept by Washington. But they had to fight tooth and nail to get into that stupid thing. And they barely

got into that stupid thing. And they did not waste that opportunity They ended up losing, the best team won What do you want? Boston both years now Consecutively They've had a nice little nap for the last Two months heading into the playoffs

If the Leafs end up making it Which again is still up in the air I actually kind of like their chances A little bit more this year than last Because at least they'll be frigging They understand what it took to get here They'll appreciate what a pain in the ass the two months leading up to the playoffs was, right?

It'd be nice if they played like that. Yeah, but they're losing along the way. I agree. And that's, listen, there's nothing, at the end of the day, I'm never going to come to the conclusion that the last three games were good. Okay.

Okay? But I am going to be optimistic about the process here that Marner is playing like he gives the biggest shit Scored the sexiest goal of his entire career Against San Jose And like so many highlights With the Leafs Wasted in a game that they lost

The Matthews point goal Lost The Matthews ear thing They ended up winning that in overtime After Patrick Kane scored like 20 seconds later Because Garrett Sparks was in that He just wanted a chance There's so many

Highlight reel goals Of this era We'll call it the Matthews-Marner era That are wasted to losses And poor Mitch had his way Yeah, and that's pro sports Especially with a young hockey team I think

Sorry, I'm saying all these beautiful things About him You're a star You're supposed to be the star of the team And more is expected of you And it's not fair And life's not fair Oh no, it's fair

I mean, yeah. Oh, it's 1,000% fair. No, no, no. Mitch Marner... If you score 90 points a season, people want you to score 100. That's how it goes. Well, when you get paid... He's paid to score 100 points a season.

He's not paid to score 90. No, no. I'm signing with you. I'm just wording it weird. Okay. Like, I know. Austin. Austin is going to snore his way to, like, 55 goals, and the discussion will be, why

didn't he hit 60? And it's not a criticism It is, you're great You're great So when the Leafs lose They look at you John Tavares, I think, has been playing great recently And he's been taking a lot of flack

I don't know why I think he's the one guy you can rely on Just because he put up 45 last year And now he's at like 29 47 47 Yeah, well, he broke his finger Anyway

I think he's been playing absolutely great And Matthews has been playing absolutely great And the Leafs are going to have three guys with over 30 goals. Absolutely great. At least. Zach Hyman might even have something to say about that. It's unbelievable. And he's another guy where I look at that whole top line and I go,

I'm sorry, what am I supposed to be criticizing here other than Matthew's brutal giveaway? They lost. Okay. They lost. But what I want to say about Mitch, because I was extra hard on Mitch. I was extra hard on him. Yeah, the effort's there. It's great.

That's what I want to see. Yes. And the undisciplined penalty I want him taking those penalties now Yeah, that's fine I don't mind that That shit happens Yeah, it's hockey

Yeah, it's a trick And you get frustrated And you take undisciplined It happens Mitch Marner The thing that I had The issue I had Is the effort thing

Can never not be there That's the point Totally You want to wear an A You want to make 11 million dollars Sorry, but that's what it's going to be But You're right

But I feel like we've beat that horse You know what I mean? He will continue to beat that horse. No, but the effort's there now. Yeah, that's what I'm saying, but I'm giving him that. Oh, right. I'm saying, great, the effort's there. But that, it's like, Jesse, what do you always say when I say someone's really nice?

That should be the bare minimum. That's the bare minimum. So she needs to get in the door. Game breaker money. You're not always going to be the game breaker. You're not always going to play like the game breaker. You know, Taze has had some off seasons. Kane is not, you know, Kane is not always the best player on the ice.

But you mostly should be. Cindy Crosby too the disrespect that guy takes I get it but my point is it's nice to see Mitch come back to where Mitch should be effort wise the execution will come

we know he's going to score points that goal was amazing to watch I'm rooting for this guy but the point here is that that is bare minimum stuff Mitch Marner used to there used to be a joy to Mitch Marner's game that this season has not existed it's

it he didn't have it at first he found it and he lost it he's lost it and i kind of mitch has he's gotta find this that is the next evolution in him he's a star do we all agree he's a star sure yeah he's a star the next evolution is in him it seems like he can only put up two three four points a game when he's in a kid who just ate a bunch of pixie sticks mode And he's super happy And it's the next generation game And we win 8-6 Man, the playoffs, if you're lucky

Are two months long We gotta see some We gotta see His next evolution is you need to give us A struggling A game where you cannot find it Angry, pissed off Performance where you succeed

Nothing is going right for you And you still, yes And that doesn't mean hitting or fighting or whatever else you want to call it. That doesn't mean he has to fight somebody. No, I would never call for Mitch Marner to fight. My complaint, though, is that I don't think his game lends to being a game breaker. Like, I don't think the way he plays right now, he's going to dominate a game. Because it's more about getting the other guys the puck.

And I feel like he's got to find a way to take over the game on his own without relying on his teammates. And be the game-making playmaker. I don't really shoot more. I think it's that simple. Yeah, it's probably that simple He's become a better goal scorer But he's never going to be the one guy He always seems like the 1A

Or the 1B He's the Robin to Batman Who's Austin I'd say he's more like the Vegeta to Goku Right? Vegeta was more useful to Batman than Robin was, no sorry, fuck

Vegeta was more useful to Goku Than Robin was to Batman And that is going to be the entire comment section for the show now is the war over what I just said there. I hope this team gets to a point

where you've got three guys who can take over the game because right now it seems like it's JT and it's Austin who could really, okay, I'm the star,

I'm getting paid the $11 million, I'm going to win this game for us. And I feel like, and I want Mitch to get into that category where it's the three of them.

It feels like right now he's kind of just this little step below. I hope he can change his game to where it's that. But there's room. There is room. And he has the skill.

Yeah, 100%. The one thing that has given me pause because I mean when you talk about hockey you know you try to solve

all the world's issues and okay we gotta do this we gotta do that do you gotta blow up the core the difference with the Leafs core

is it's younger than yours right so on Mario Lemieux didn't make the playoffs till whatever whatever this is what I keep hearing from people

Mitch is going to get better Austin is going to get better Willie's gonna get better Willie's gonna get better Dermott's gonna get better like it may simply just not be their time it might just be

yeah It may simply just not be their time, which is super unfortunate, and it's frustrating, and it's the least sexy thing you could possibly say. What if they simply grew up, Steve? Immediately. What if they simply grew up this week? You know what, Steve? I think you're bang on on that one.

Yeah. And that's the thing. You know, we, a couple weeks ago, got pretty bent out of shape about that Carolina game, as one does. But that was like the third time we did it this year. Yeah. Remember the game before the All-Star break? Where they just took off the game?

Come on. They had a very bad run of games They deserved to be screamed at Which is why We've seen them at their shittiest And I looked at these three games and I went Well there's no situation where getting one out of six points In California is acceptable

But I at least saw Some give a shit You know what I mean? That's all I ask I was the one that was saying If you gotta trade someone, trade Mitch Marner And I stand by that If you do have to trade someone

Mitch Marner. Sorry. 100%. But I think that it would be better, and I don't want this, it would be better if they were able to hang on to these guys, and they were able to grow together as Kyle Dubas expects them to be, and it would be great if they could mature together and start to

perform. But the thing that bothers me with this streakiness is that this team is capable of more. We know that they don't have to be this streaky. We know that. And that's the part that frustrates the hell out of me Is that

It's probably mental maturity Yes, for sure, for sure, for sure But we know They've exhibited at an NHL level before That they don't need to play like this Now, so let me ask you guys something Because this goes back to something I was previously saying

They scored three goals in California Who scored? Austin, Willie, Mitch Those are the three So the three guys that were chewing out We're not chewing them out No, I know But Sheldon Keefe wants more out of the bottom six

And I guess middle six The Leafs were getting so much of that They were getting so much depth scoring And it's frigging disappeared Well, because Johnson and McKay have are gone Yeah Those guys were both on track for 40-50 points That's still a great bottom six

And he screwed his head back on And he put Kerfoot at center Which strengthens the bottom six Engvall is there, Kapanen is there Clifford is a bull in a china shop Love him Gauthier's been playing better recently Spezza's, I mean, fallen off offensively a bit

But like, for crying out loud It's 36-year-old Jason Spezza Like, I know the season he's been having But you did not sign him To relying on you money You know what I mean? Yeah, you signed him to, you can play in the lineup So if we get more out of the bottom six

I mean, those games were all so tight I know the San Jose one ended 5-2 But empty netter and the game got away from them Off a shitty bounce If they get any kind of production Out of their bottom six, there's no reason to Believe they'd get any less than four Points out of six

So is it as simple as The stars are actually Showing up And they just need more out of guys Like, I think back to Washington When they won the cup Ovechkin wins the Kahn-Smythe. Kuznetsov hits another level.

Backstrom is Backstrom. Carlson is Carlson. Holtby ends up being Holtby. But he wasn't going in. Grubauer was the guy that was holding them together. But who scored half his playoff goals in the Stanley Cup Final? Devontae Smith-Pelly. And I think it was Brett Connolly had another unreal Stanley Cup Final.

And Jay Beagle. Jay Beagle. Who got a big fat contract after that final. And Tom Wilson was great throughout those playoffs. Which that's what got him the contract and he's continued to earn it like you need the whole damn team to show up and maybe that's the Leafs issue is teams in the NHL are Good enough that you only have one line or even two they can shut you down

Because they don't have to worry about the other right. They don't even have to worry about the other two lines So and what probably aided I bet their bottom six was having defensemen who can move the puck and blast it. Jake Muzzin, we've joked about, is a fourth forward whenever he wants to be. And so is Riley. And Barry doesn't even have the option to pinch with who he's playing with right now. No, he doesn't. He's either playing with the 19-year-old or Martin Marincin.

So what if things, because of all the reasons I just mentioned, aren't actually that bad? I know this is a really weird angle for me to take. I'm sure I'm catching a lot of people off guard here But what if the sky's not falling I can't wait for you to set yourself up for more disappointment I'm watching it unfold right now Do you think they stand a chance in the first round It's the NHL yes

Oh yeah they stand a chance But they're not going to win Like I'm sorry You can't tell me right now There's no one I'm putting money down right now There's not a single team in the Eastern Conference I would put money down right now and saying the Leafs would beat them.

The argument... I don't know if the Leafs would win a seven-game series against the Rangers. The argument that it's sports and anything can happen isn't an argument. No. You can put that towards anything. That's a false flag. I know. That's not confidence in a team.

That's like going, well, it's NASCAR. Any car can win. I know. Adam, no, the two cars at the front probably have a better shot than the four guys 40 rows back, right? I think Adam and I agree on what reality is. I think we agree on what reality is with this team. We're just choosing to look at it differently.

I don't think that is... You're probably more right. What is happening? That was passive-aggressive. No, it wasn't. No, no. I don't think you guys... I'm calling you the realist.

I'm calling myself the sweet summer child fool. Here's the thing. I've got to pick you up off the floor when you're inevitably disappointed again. You know your role in this relationship, Adam. I'm just saying, am I right? I don't... What is your logic? I'm a little confused.

My logic is they have more to give, and they will give it. So you don't agree with Adam at all? No, no. No, no. We're agreeing with how they're playing, what their performances are. Yes, I think we're all looking at these games, and we're seeing what's happening. The disagreement is Adam says this is just what they are flatly, and I am saying they can ascend. I think.

No, the frustration is they can. And they're not. That's the frustration. But you're saying they won't. And I'm saying they will. You saying they can ascend, that's just how it works. You know, that's not. Steve, I can ascend to the NBA.

Right. I can. No. Even like a realistic scenario, you can say I can ascend. Say you run a mile in five minutes. I can ascend to four minutes and 30 seconds. Yes, you can ascend to that. And if you work hard and you do it and you get there, then you did.

But saying that can happen doesn't mean that it's going to happen. So you believe that it's going to happen in these next three weeks? Yes. You believe that they're going to reach a new level in the next three weeks? You think they're going to hit a new gear? That's a completely different argument. I believe they can. Will they?

Yes. And I'm saying the team that you see before you, even with Morgan Rielly healthy and Jake Muzzin back in the lineup, is the team that they are. I'm saying I'm in People have been asking me for a long time now I am in Let me just throw this out there I want to be I don't want to think this way

But I'm a big believer in when people And when things show you what they are Believe them I believe you Leafs I've just hit this weird spot Where I'm Screaming for more out of these guys Who like

Some of them are barely older than I was when I graduated university. And I'm starting to feel... Them's the brakes, baby. I know them's the brakes, but I'm starting to feel stupid. If anything, it's... No, no, I don't feel bad for them.

But it's management... You're starting to feel stupid now? Oh, for this reason. They lost to a damn Audi driver. We're all stupid. Oh, yeah. We chose this. I know.

Why would we cheer for them? We could have cheered for anybody else or any other sport. All right. This management group has one of the best young course In the sport Sure

They've chosen to invest in it And The only thing that's going to make them better is time And maybe them's the breaks But I would like to see them surprise me Does this not strike you as a leafy thing That they would lose to a Zamboni driver And look like garbage heading into the playoffs

And then go all the way to the third round Yeah Doesn't that strike you as the leafiest thing ever? Don't think that I haven't thought that in my positioning on this show. Because I know that I'm taking a risk. And the one thing I don't want to get lumped into is there are pundits in this market

that they default to negative because it's easy. If you default to negative, you basically can't lose because most of the time in any sport, on any team, most of the time, unless you're the New England Patriots, you lose. And when you take a negative stance in sports too, you're going to get the most reaction. And then if the team outperforms it,

It doesn't matter because the fans are happy Exactly And then you get to write the article like They surprised us all and we're all thrilled about it And then you're like but they changed And they played different and now they're on top It's such a terrible take to stick negative So I'm trying to stay away from that

It's lazy I am trying to look at this objectively as What have we seen so far I in years past Am all the way in on them And this year More than most years The expectations are higher

The results have been even lower And I just can't I know that there are people out of the lineup I know that there are big pieces But better teams Sorry, worse teams have done better Yeah I go back to

And this is going too far back now But the Leafs team I can't remember what year it was I want to say 2002 The year where they lost 7 of 8 to Ottawa And then played them in the first round I believe they swept them It's the leafiest thing of all time

And nothing was expected of that team And I want to say they made it to the conference final that year I'm not totally sure I think that was the Carolina conference year Right, and there was no reason to believe in that team Heading into the playoffs And then they got me thinking I remember, oh, they're going to play Carolina

And they just won two rounds Without Matt Sundin Holy shit, this team might win the cup Now, thank goodness they didn't make the final that year Detroit would have murdered them But, you know It comes out of nowhere sometimes But you shouldn't be banking on out of nowhere

The team so far In 69 games In 69 games they haven't proven anything They're an 8C I'm going to the bathroom Can I put it on I have a funny feeling If that's the stance you want to take Then I'm not going to argue that

I hope you're right Yes we're all hoping That crazy thing that might happen Might happen We're all banking on hey maybe they just get lucky And this is then all of a sudden they start playing But they haven't shown that That's going to happen

So we can't sit here and be like We think luck's going to happen I'm just, I'm seeing I'm seeing a lot of things I like, I'm just not seeing Them put together all at once And that's what champions do Right

Is they're able to take it all at the same time Which the Leafs just Haven't been able to do But I'm watching them do things where I'm like This is a step in the right direction The struggle has been getting them All to do it on the same night Now is it fair, which I think is Adam's stance

I'm not going to believe in them Until we see that moment where it's all put together That's totally fair I just feel like the playoffs are stupid And sometimes it comes together game one Sure But they gotta make it to game one Yeah, they gotta make it to game one

And then you have to hope the magic thing happens Yeah You know, it's they there are not a team like Tampa will not be caught off guard in the playoffs this year. They know what happened last year and they're a veteran team. And I know a lot of those guys are kind of looking at their driver's license going, oh, shit, like I'm about to be on the wrong side of 30. Like, and this team's really good. How many more kicks at the can am I going to have? The Leafs, at their age, have got to be looking at absolutely every team they play and going,

they're the favorite. Like, I'm just, I just got here in this league, no matter what amount of money I'm making. Maybe they should believe in themselves. No, but then they have two months off just sleeping, heading into the playoffs. This year, battling, I think is a great thing for them. So when do they start battling? They battled the last three games, they just lost. They did.

Okay. They did. Okay. All right. I'm not doubting you. I am choosing to hope with you. Now, this is me being nice to them. Do you want me to be mean to them?

Not mean. No, not needlessly. No, well, I'm a big meanie. Okay. Why are you a big meanie? Because of the Toronto thing from yesterday. Oh, yeah. Okay, so this comes from, is it The Athletic?

Yeah. So there's an article, you can always tell the font from The Athletic. there's an article that basically said player X who doesn't want to be named put Toronto on his no trade list because again it's the same narrative

about the media scrutiny they write about when you miss a pass in practice have you ever heard of that ever once no I think you don't need to be literal about that what the player is saying is I don't want to be there because the media scrutiny is too much And my stance on that has always been, good, don't play here.

100%. You need guys. And the one thing I'll say about Cappy, Nylander, Matthews, Marner, less so about Tavares. Tavares is not this type of personality. Can you bring up the tweets that I put? Thank you. I got them in front of me whenever you're ready. Sure.

You need players here who want to be stars and want to be in the spotlight. And I can say that about Cappy. I can say that about Nylander. I can say that about Matthews. And I can say that about Marner. None of them mind it, right? Those guys have personalities, and they're brash, and they're young, and I think they're where the NHL is going.

There's a lot of guys in other teams that I'm not naming that are just the same. Totally. The old hockey thing about, oh, guys don't want to play here because the media scrutiny is too much. No, I think the real reason here is the Leafs haven't won. If the Leafs were in this media heavy market Which we are And were perennial winners

If the Leafs had that New England Patriots Amount of championships in the last 20 years That's not even a conversation And what I was saying on the way in What little market do you go to hide in In the NFL Oh you can hide San Diego

The Leafs draw more fans than the San Diego Chargers The Los Angeles Chargers Sorry it's not even San Diego anymore Well, there you go. The LA Chargers. Yeah. They went to a bigger city. And I mean, like, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers haven't been good for years.

There's lots of teams that just don't make the playoffs. Jacksonville had, like, one flash in the pan, and they're not great. And star players flock there for a quiet life, right? No. No. They go to the big... Yes. They want to be on the big stage.

NBA. Same thing. Yeah. I gotta tell you... You gotta draft a guy like Giannis. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, in the NBA.

You're not getting him as a free agent. Well, and they may not keep him, right? That's the thing. What's interesting about that in hockey is that if I'm a general manager and I find out my player doesn't want to be under the most pressure in the biggest spotlight, I'm a little concerned about that player. The guys that I want are the people that are the most competitive. And that's not to say that players in a smaller market will use Florida,

will use Arizona. It doesn't mean they're not competitive. What I'm trying to say is I want somebody who wants to be on the biggest stage Because I want somebody who wants to perform for the Stanley Cup A lot of NHL teams Will intentionally antagonize you At the draft combine To see how you respond

And you might go Well, you know, it's a bunch of adults Picking on a 17 or 18 year old And it is Life's hard, man That's what it's going to be And if they draft you and you're Swedish You could be playing against grown men

A few months from now Who are going to antagonize you They are going to say things That you did not know were in the English language At you That you're just learning Can I give some context to the quote That went viral on Twitter

Because there's a little bit of misinformation there So it's from An article in The Athletic And I did something that I hate doing Which is responding to a blurb Yes, so Craig Custance Shame on me for that He polled 22 NHL agents, and he asked them, one of the final questions he asked them was,

which two teams are most likely to land on a client's no-trade clause? And then he lists the numbers. Number one was Winnipeg. Number two was Ottawa. Number three was Edmonton. Number four was Buffalo. Weather, owner, weather. Number five was Columbus.

What was four, sorry? Four is Buffalo. Weather, owner, weather, city. What was five? columbus i'm not sure actually and when we get to columbus only two people voted for only said columbus toronto landed on the list at the very bottom with one with one so the quote that goes so i'm talking about one guy makes it look like oh toronto's mostly least likely uh or most likely to have a no trade clause on it when in reality one guy it's the last place in the poll and the

top ones are all small cold weather places if i if i could do it all over i just wouldn't have said anything, but I would still believe what I'm saying, so now that I've said it... What did you say? Let's get into what you said. So the quote from the one... Here, you want me to read it? I'll say it in my voice? Hold on, hold on. Oh, that? Hold on. So the quote from the one agent who

said Toronto's most likely is Toronto, the impression is you can't miss a pass in practice without being questioned about it afterwards. So this doesn't even come from a player. This is an anonymous agent who was polled, and he was the only one who said Toronto, and he's the one

who said this quote. This is why you don't do what I did, kids, which is respond to a blurb. So Steve saw this one quote and he said... And I was just in a bad mood in general

and just thought, I'm going to take this out on 145,000 people. So you can read it in your own voice. So, and poor... Can I issue an apology

to Jacqueline Taylor whose mentions I'm sure I just bombed by a friggin' quote tweeting you because you had the blurb there. So, I said,

Toronto, where the fourth line right winger, being Frederic Gauthier, is in a national ad campaign and statues are built for guys who never even won a championship, is hard to play in. Next tweet. Ilya Mikheyev was a Leaf for literally 45 seconds, scored one goal, said I like soup into a microphone, and got a soup sponsorship! Sometimes I wonder how hard some NHL players would buckle in any other major sports league. Sorry people watch you play.

What people are missing here, I think, is there's good and bad. There are bad things about playing in Toronto, absolutely. But so many guys here are embraced immediately and beloved forever for accomplishing practically nothing. It's a big market. There's good, there's bad. So one thing I saw was, well what do you mean, there's something about resentment with accomplishing actually nothing?

Yeah. What do you mean? Like, what do they play the games for? I'm sorry. You play to win. Isn't that it? My question. You play to win, you try to score more goals than the other team.

Goals, wins, championships, those are all accomplishments. What are you talking about? But, Steve. In absence of them, what am I supposed to do? Be happy? Who said they didn't want to play here? Who? One agent.

Thank you. Yes. No, but I didn't know that. Oh, Jesse, we've established I was wrong to go down this path. Who said they didn't want to play in Toronto? One agent. Thank you. Yes.

No, I know that now. I know that now. But no, but then, so here's what it is. An agent! Anonymously! An article! From those tweets, my mentions, and now this podcast, We're all arguing over one potentially fictional person.

But a lot of people got mad, so let's talk about it. Let's talk about it then. What do I mean by players would buckle in any other sports league? In any other sports league, stardom is embraced. NBA players are stars. They go to cities, big cities, to win championships. with big fan bases where they get tons of scrutiny. LeBron James retiring to a quiet life in Los Angeles. Like are you joking? Kawhi Leonard went to LA! I know he's from

there but the guy seems quiet and like he wants to be left alone so he went to LA! And the reason he went to LA, I might as well be at home because there's nowhere to hide in the NBA. There's nowhere to hide in the NFL. In the NHL, you can go to a city where next to nobody gives a shit about who you are. That is the

fact, because the NHL is not nearly as popular as those places. But you don't want to be a star for the New York Rangers? Like, forget the Leafs. You don't want to be a star for the Montreal Canadiens? Boston Bruins? Boston Bruins? Dude, I'd want to be a star for the

Boston Bruins. It'd be amazing. Bruins love being Bruins. But the great thing about the Canucks, Oilers, Flames, any Canadian team, Bruins, Rangers, Flyers, is that their fans are happy when you lose? Stop it! Like Toronto's unique in that category! Well, Leaf fans did. What about the April Reimer thing? And what about this, and what about that? Are we really gonna do this? Are we we gonna play this game every fan we're gonna play this game i'm not even gonna i'm not gonna insult other fan bases by going down that path because if you want we can go through every fan base has shitheads toronto is going to have more examples because there's more of us

we're the most well-traveled fan base in the sport in the sport bar none montreal 24 not even close Nobody's even close. Of course there are going to be more examples. Ask EPL fans if they like Manchester United fans. Probably not. Ask any fan of any other team if they like Manchester United fans. Ask any fan of any team if they like Real Madrid fans that are not Real Madrid people. Ask in Italian League if Juventus or Inter Milan fans are well-liked.

The point is That every fan group And every sport Yeah, it's the Death Star Again, Leaf fans You're the big evil empire You are the stormtroopers, man You are Darth Vader

That's what you are But we're only focusing on And this is what I don't like this player Now that I know it's one player But this one player agent It's not a player This one player agent's attitude

No, no, no, no, no But no, no, a player clearly said this to the agent. No agent is saying to avoid Toronto. Toronto makes agents money. He didn't say that a player said this to him. He said the perception is. He made up this quote. From a player.

What, did he just make it up? He did. Yeah, you know what? It's probably based on a conversation. Can I throw this out there? It's probably based on a conversation. This is getting under Steve's skin for a couple of reasons. One of the things when the Leafs could not sign players,

and this is not your fault, by the way. This is something that we all grew up with. Nor has anything ever been. I'm glad that I've had 24 hours to think about my tweets and how right they are. The Leafs used to be able to buy teams. And when the salary cap was instituted, they all of a sudden couldn't. And Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment didn't understand the concept for about 12 years. Hang on, hang on.

They emptied their wallets right when the cap was implemented. It literally screwed them for a decade. Yes. Well, no. Mismanagement screwed them for a decade. It should have screwed them for a year. They started on the wrong foot And then they

Continually did bad stuff Grew five feet And went on the wrong one And they should have had A potato in charge Instead of their G 100% they would have done better Yes

That was funny Now Beyond that Beyond that There was For years Players Massive players

Big Big name guys Who would Who would come up Oh a local Toronto kid Maybe would come to Toronto And spend the whole year Speculating

You know Brad Richards comes to mind Stephen Stamkos was one But that's a little bit Of a different situation But all these These guys Brad Richards especially

And every single time And this is so funny Because at the time There were people Who went on television Here And I don't think It happened in the states

Because no one Pays attention this closely In the states Unless you have NBC You know Whatever It's behind volleyball

Yeah no one cares No one cares And people got mad at that Oh you care That's fine So do I Most people don't Most people do not

Care about hockey Okay got it There it is One People And I remember this Said Straight faced

into a camera that the reason that Brad Richards did not want to sign here was because the media scrutiny was too hardcore. And he went to New York! Manhattan! I think he just wanted to live in New York, man. And they gave him

$8.5 million per year! And it was a bad contract. It was a horrible contract. But the Leafs were bad, too. Why would he have wanted to come here? Why would Sam Coates have agreed to join the last place Leafs? It would have been Brad Richards and Tim Brent. And Stephen Stamkos could not

have known. And also, he had a great thing going in Florida. Tampa's an amazing place to live. Like, why would you leave? I get it. It's kind of funny how when the team got good and then they had great management, they signed the biggest free agent in NHL history. Crazy how that happens, right? Funny. Maybe it had nothing to do with the market at all.

Yeah. And, but they signed a superstar who loves the spot like John Tavares. Yeah. You know what I mean? I just hated the, listen, so you keep going to who said this. No one did. It was an agent. At the time, I thought this player was real.

Yes. And so did everyone else by the sounds of it. Yeah, and it's also I can't hammer this point enough. Enough. Toronto was last on the list. Yes. Of teams that were mentioned. Which is hilarious. And this is why you... Yeah, screw you, Boston. We finally got one over on you. Don't do what I did.

You do your research. Yes. I... Listen, I went on Twitter today on my desktop. I deleted it from my phone. Sometimes I need to We go through this

Every few months I have to delete it Off my phone Because I get crazy That's fine Fair But at the time Like okay

So I went at this Potentially fictional person But then everyone Started to defend This potentially fictional person And it's a loser attitude It hasn't been helped By the other Toronto sports

Like Toronto's seen Vince Carter leave They've seen Chris Bosh leave So there is this perception Throughout the mid 2000s That nobody wants To come to Toronto And the Jays

Couldn't sign anyone American NBA players and American baseball players Did not want to come to Canada The reason they didn't want to come to Canada Was because they were poorly run teams Guys, hold on Let me talk here, let me say this For a second, do you know that

In the early 90s The Jays had the biggest payroll in all of baseball Do you know that? In 1991 and 1992 and 1993 It was like $45 million That's a lot of money back then Now, hang on, when they got off the plane to come to Toronto, trade our free agent. Do you know

what used to happen? The Jays would hand them the keys to a brand new Honda Civic. Every single player that came in. Every brand new player. They would just hand them a Honda. Just give them a car. Give them a car. They wanted to be here. The thing is that players do not sign up for teams that are shitty. They do not want to go to teams that suck.

Hang on. Hang on. Hang on. I gotta say this. Just one little blip. One little blip. The Jays, it was 45 million bucks? Yeah. That's what the cap was when it was implemented in 2005. Oh, I agree. And we're talking about the early 90s Jays. Yes, because baseball

makes a lot more money and has more games and everything. Because people give more of a shit. Well, less so now. Less so now. But the baseball

will always outrate hockey in the States until, I guess, the older guys die off. But the point I'm trying to make and what I was trying to say earlier

with Brad Richards as the example is there was a media, and I know this, it was a media-driven narrative at a time where there really was no social media

about playing in Toronto And how harsh the spotlight is And that was driven by members of the media And it goes back to something that we've talked about a couple years ago And this is something We're all guilty of becoming a little too self-important And what happened was It was sort of like

What's the name of the show? They sort of said it No, no, that's fine They sort of said it as like We're just too damn tough on them It was sort of like They look at the camera and go, you know So the Toronto media thing is a Toronto media driven thing

Because the Toronto media love love love don't kid yourself love to know that i played a factor here i'm mad it's self-importance man and it's something we heard all the way growing up now is it also though because people go well the hot dog thing and i'm like that's one guy that's a steve simmons article in the toronto sun i wish you understood patient zero what yes that's the guy like him and fast chicken and there's names that you can put up there. No, literally one guy,

patient zero, Toronto. That's what everyone's saying. But yeah, that's what people do. It's like the Amber Weimers. Yeah, it's wrong, right?

Yeah. It's wrong to do that, right? Yes. I'm just overcome with how right I am in this situation. I think, Steve,

it was the reason that you went off on it is because you've heard it so much and it's such a load of crap. And it's nonsense! It's crap. It's crap. It's potentially literally made up.

And it's never been true. No. It's literally been a media-driven narrative by the media about the media. No, the reason players didn't want to come here is the team flippin' sucks. Exactly. Teams don't want to go to Montreal because of the scrutiny. Or the taxes are bonkers and the team hasn't made the playoffs in two years, potentially three. Right.

Yeah, the taxes are a major factor in Quebec. If you're the best team in the league, who cares where you are? You ask most people in hockey media, they will tell you Vancouver is actually probably the worst one. Yeah, I've heard that many times. And every summer, oh, they can't give away enough money in free agency. They cannot give it away fast enough. Well, they're going to have trouble this year because they don't have any left to spend. Well, that's because of the cap.

If there wasn't any, they'd give away more. People still go there. The best thing that's happened to Jim Benning is he's already spent all of his money, so he can't sign another bad contract. It's great. It's great for Vancouver. it's there are and and this isn't i've been bullish on the canucks all year i think they're better than people give them credit they are especially with marksman in the lineup but um

that like jim benning is is a is a great example of why the salary cap is there because gms are stupid gm and you might go well the leafs and kyle do yeah the leafs too the leafs too like The salary cap is there so that the Leafs can't spend, like, $40 million more than the Jets or something like that. Or the Jets were even around when the cap was implemented. It would be more than that. It would be way more than that. The Leafs would be $100, $150 million at this point. Don't kid yourself.

The salary cap, and I'm not 100% sure on this, but I believe the salary cap, the actual cap, the ceiling of it, is still not at where the Leafs were spending in 2004. The last year Where there wasn't one 88 million dollar team I believe that year I think I think you're right Or 90

Or it was Something And there were three I want to say The top four teams In terms of spending Were the Leafs, Canucks Rangers and Flyers

Yeah And they were all Like somewhere in the Oh and Detroit Was probably in there too They were all somewhere In the 70s and 80s And we just

Got back to that now It took 15 years Well to give you An example too Gretzky was making About as much money In 1993 as Leon Dreisaitl makes now.

Matt Sundin was making the same amount as Leon Dreisaitl makes now in 2001 when he signed his extension with the Leafs. Didn't Joe Sackick make like 15 million bucks? Forsberg did. I don't know about Sackick, but I think Forsberg did.

It was wild. We're getting into a completely different conversation. The key is, like, let's just drop that. People want to come to Toronto when they're good. Yeah. And if you can play three years here and be like a decent player, you're set for the rest of your life.

You're set forever. Sign autographs forever. You're going to be at every charity tournament. You're going to have a little commercial here and again, and you're good. Who wouldn't want to do that? Connor Brown, at the end of his career, let's say he plays until he's 40 years old, which he might. Connor Brown, at the end of his career. And he plays for the Panthers for the rest of it.

Yeah, he can play somewhere incomplete, wherever, for the rest of his career. But you know what? He was a Leaf for three. Connor Brown's good. And scored a big goal. And scored an enormous goal. and if he wanted to signings everything for the rest

of his life it's just the idea that we now know is potentially baloney but a lot of people do believe that is a thing it takes no account for all the fucking amazing shit that comes with being a leaf

amazing shit that comes with being things you can't get anywhere else yes and do you take shit sometimes of course you do Of course you do if you go to a market where no one gives you any shit ever You're in a garbage market for sports tree falls in the woods. Yeah Like it is what it is. Oh, well you're so you're saying that like death threat. No stupid. I'm not I think you are no Stupid like you are so I think Steve is encouraging death threats. Yeah

Is right. So what you're saying is Babcock was right to do what he did to murder Nobody said that What cereal box maze did you complete to get there Who tweeted you that I don't know Did someone actually come close to that And I don't have a problem with them But like what cereal box

Crazy maze, snakes and ladders Did you take to get there What are you talking about Takes are garbage And I teased this at the beginning of the show Yeah You know, what about all the shit that William Nylander takes? What about all the garbage that William Nylander takes in this market?

First of all, I think that is now out of date. There are far more people who def- He is beloved. He is beloved. Leaf fans, love. We have a huge Stan community. Yes. It's going very strong.

Now, part of the reason- You are leading that charge. I am, and I'm very- Absolutely. But part of the reason is they had to fight against the criticism of him. Right. But we're also pretending like the criticism when he scored seven goals wasn't valid like come on, but You know who doesn't mind

You know who doesn't seem to mind at all all the shit that people still say about him despite the fact that he scored 30 goals this year William Frigging Nylander, that's why he should he should be playing here. He's the he's the right person doesn't give a shit. He smiles Scores goals and loves it. Mm-hmm win or lose. He's he's one of the only blonde beards I've ever seen that looks really good. It's hard to pull off a blonde beard. Underrated Joey Crabb back in the day.

I wonder why no one wanted to sign to play with Joey Crabb. I don't know. Top line right winger Joey Crabb. That was a thing. As a fan, that's what you want, right? Because you think if you were in that position, if you were playing in the NHL, you'd be like, I'm living the freaking dream.

NHL. I'm playing for this Toronto Maple Leafs team who's the biggest hockey team in the universe, And I get to score goals and play hockey And his dad played in the NHL He's exactly the sort of guy who could take it for granted And does not He does not

William Nylander I'm saying this into an actual microphone Is perfect for Toronto He's perfect for the market Does not Flinch at a thing Does not care what people say about him He smiles

Puts his hair in a ponytail Grabs his coffee, shows up to the rink Scores a goal Nice tailored suits too Nice tailored suits Right They all All the Leafs got

Pretty nice suits Yeah They got a lot of money That's one thing Don Cherry got away from Was the suit shout outs That he used to do And it was always

Well whenever he did It was like Oh it's Brad Marchand I'm like All the Leafs show up And they throw it up On Instagram And they look amazing

Oh it's Brad Marchand With his Here's us Matthew's walking in With his purple suit And his dark wing duck hat And he He does wear a dark wing duck hat

Every show Or every walk in None of the Leafs I would say Like listen Some of it goes To a place where it shouldn't Okay

But stop acting like It's unique to Toronto Well with this example This example This There are more Yeah Pay attention to

Literally any other sport Edmonton in the last Like two years Yeah Dude Edmonton still They're still eating Each other alive Ben Scrivens

Picked up a jersey That was thrown onto the ice And threw it back at the fan who threw it there It was legendary It was so good Like we can't think of too many Vicious Instances with Florida Panthers fans

I wonder why And this is insulting Now there are Florida Panthers fans Who are going to take that the wrong way I'm not talking about you If you give a shit It's not about you Your face is getting so red

I would also like to throw out there I shouldn't have to explain this It's unbelievable Yeah you should You're expecting a bunch of people to just know You have 10 years of experience with this man I need to channel my William Nylander and not give a shit No but there's a reason you got all this response

Is because people don't understand Yeah And that's human That's human to not understand There's lots of people out there who have ignorant viewpoints That's okay That's sort of part of being a human I'm one of them

From time to time, I comment on shit that I'm like, maybe I should have found out more about that. And I'll get a DM from somebody who politely says, hey, Adam, just a heads up. And I'll be like, oh, I learned something. I appreciate those. And then I hear, hey, fucker. Your mom must be embarrassed. You redeemable piece of shit who has not learned and will never learn. Actually, I don't mind getting, hey, fucker, because that's at least funny.

But if it's like, hey, you're a piece of shit, and I hope your daughter hates you, which people have come close to, it's sort of like, whoa, all right, let's do down. words that I'm super stoked on because I took an elective last minute. Shut up! Adam, what's your opinion on the Ottoman Empire? Which side were you on? Was it correct? Was it always correct, or did you voice your opinion and then somebody had to change it for you?

The opinion on the Ottoman Empire is that it, like most empires, had a really great start and fired up and came, you know, tribal people from the steppe and from, you know, These Turks come in and they conquer and they fight a completely different way. The Byzantines are not ready for them. But by the 19th century, their form of government, their lack of control on their own lands, and frankly, corruption completely frayed what was left. Although they did put up a bigger fight in World War I than any world power expected that they could. However, that didn't stop them from following suit.

Did you think people wanted to join the Ottoman Empire? I think that they were all definitely brought under the Ottoman thing against their will. That's historically correct Nobody was like please sign me up for this So they started pretty strong Never quite achieved their goal And then fell off They were the biggest empire on earth for a while

Damn I was trying to make a San Jose Sharks Well yeah They sort of were because they really wanted to take Vienna And they were that close And then the Austrians stood their ground That is a thing People were freaked right out about them How do you know this shit

We went to the same high school They were one of the first empires that used cannons Wow And that's how they took what's now Istanbul This is like fairly recently too Well 1400s is when they took Istanbul No it was 2000 years ago I learned that from Everyone rode rhinos into battle

I learned that from 300 They dissolved about 100 years ago What was his name? Who did 300? Who's the director? Not Michael Bay Zack Snyder There you go Yeah the empire dissolved about 100 years ago

They lasted for about 500 years, which is pretty good Oh my god, that's crazy America existed Yeah, oh yeah Like I actually, okay, this is how Deep down the rabbit hole I went I'm like, okay, so America existed So I actually went into a

This is really super nerdy But I looked it up and it exists On Wikipedia A list of American ambassadors to the Ottoman Empire And I actually started looking At the names of them and trying to figure out As much as I could, because what I was trying to figure out is if they had ambassadors there what was the relationship between america and the ottomans

and the only thing that i could really find on it was uh because canada did most of their stuff through england at that point so there's not a lot of you know there are different sides of the world so you america was its own entity america went to war against a ottoman subsidiary which are barbary pirates they were pirates that existed in the 1800s that were off the coast uh and uh went in and basically, because there was an open harbor, and they basically blew up a bunch of these guys that kept raiding American shipping.

So it was like, I don't know, 1850s or something. So anyway, here's a random boring-ass story that'll... Anyway, so that's how I spent one afternoon. I'm going to make it more boring. What? Is there ever an Ottoman Empire-born NHL player? A Turk? It'd be a Turkish player, or

someone from Palestine, someone from Israel, someone from Egypt. They were Turkey, Israel, Syria, Egypt, Palestine I think they went all the way over to like Saudi Arabia Oman, Jordan

like all of the Middle East I asked because, and some of the youngins might not know this, but I remember getting hockey cards of who I thought were Russian players and for birthplace it just said Soviet Union but they weren't

like Evgeny Nabokov is Kazakhstani Right Which is Kazakhstan Not Russia But it was part of the Soviet Union That's right And Dinah Zubris Yeah

Who I think is Lithuanian Wasn't part of Russia Anyway It'd just be cool to get Like a 19- Like a 1917 hockey card Of someone born in the Ottoman Empire No doubt

I don't think anybody has I don't know if there's been A Middle Eastern Middle Eastern descent Or even Balkan Like I don't even know If there's anybody in the Like I mean

How many Austrian players Born when it was called that Born when it was called that No Yeah No There would be nobody That was also

So that area was, after World War I, thrown into complete disarray. So there would have been, not only would there have not been hockey arenas, where it's 50 degrees Celsius during the day. I just wish. There's also a lot of war. So I don't think that would have happened. We're not talking, you know, what about Nazim Qadri in Lebanon? No.

I want a guy who on his birth certificate it says Ottoman Empire. Let's move on. Why? It's not going to happen. Panthers retire Roberto Longos. I don't mean gonna. there's no more empire. Anyway.

Real quick. Panthers retire Roberto Luongo's jersey. Yep. Are the Canucks going to as well? And should they? Arguably,

he had a bigger effect on the Canucks and they were far more successful than he was with the Panthers. Although, with the Panthers,

he was one of their only stars. He played six playoff games with the Florida Panthers. So tell me this. I know that Vancouver's upset

about the Capra capture so they can't go spend it on someone else who's mediocre. But that's what Jim Benning does. I'm sorry. Where's the lie there? He buys mediocre players. That's what he buys.

But tell me with Roberto Luongo, how come it hasn't happened yet? It doesn't make sense to me. I think you've got to give him a little bit more time. Do you? He just retired. Florida just did it. This year is about the Sedins, I think, in Vancouver.

Oh, yeah, of course. You give it maybe next season, season after, and then you bring back Luongo. It's a little more nostalgic. The Canucks have to deal with the same sort of delicate dance that the Leafs do, whereas they have these genuinely great players, these Hall of Fame-worthy players, who didn't win with them. Yeah.

Right? That's the other point. The automatic to get your jersey up there, and there's no debate, no one even talks about it, is a championship. Sorry, you've got to be that player and win a championship. They don't just hand it to everybody. They were four goals away. I know.

But it's not a win. It's not a win. Okay, fair enough. But the Sedins deserve it, and Luongo deserves it in Vancouver as well. There are a lot of reporters in this. I'm just moving on here because we spent a lot of time on stuff I did not expect to. The NHL is closing. Some teams have closed their dressing rooms to reporters because of the coronavirus fears.

Now, not all teams are doing this yet, but Chris Johnson speculated yesterday on headlines on Hockey Night in Canada that he thinks that most teams will move to this within the next 48 hours, which means 24 hours for us. And a lot of reporters are upset about this because the relationship that you develop when you're a beat reporter for the team is usually like once a year

you might get that golden, amazing quote from somebody or a couple times a year. Most of the time you're going to get boring stuff and reporters will tell you that. Most of the time it's like, oh, pucks in deep and whatever. But every once in a while you get something amazing Because this person trusts you

Honest question Once we get past The coronavirus wave Yes And by the way, I hope everybody stays safe out there Wash your friggin' hands Well, okay, yeah, duh, wash your hands anyway Yeah, why wasn't everybody washing their hands?

It makes me so upset I remember there was a time before When I used to wipe my butt and not wash my hands It was great The best time to start washing your hands was 20 years ago The second best time is now Yeah. So, do you think the NHL reopens the dressing rooms ever again if they close them? Yes, because enough people are going to shit their pants.

Because in soccer, what they do is they have them one reporter in front of a podium with a bunch of sponsors in the back, which is what the NHL is going to do. They're going to bring players out to the podium, but it will be a press conference rather than like a scrum, which is everybody gathered around a guy. press conferences there's like a there's a distance so nobody can spread any germs now here's the interesting thing um the so i don't i have some locker room reporting experience very little okay marley's yes marley's and leafs i've done uh not post game but morning skate okay so i've gotten to do home dressing room and visiting dressing room and i did a little for the as well um so you know i would err to people who you know i saw lots of people who do this for a living and they do it all the time so i would respect their opinion on it way more than mine

i've always felt strange about it um players they hate it they hate it all of them in every sport they hate it they don't want you to come into their personal space like there's a story in my book about uh a's pitcher houston street and the athletics had lost seven or eight straight games threw up like three runs and they blow it and it was him he blew it and like we were all in a circle around this guy like a dozen of us and he's on the verge of tears which is why we stopped the interview like 30 45 seconds in and then if that guy wants to go have a cry because like he's about to have a breakdown like an actual breakdown and i'm you know nothing against the guy i get it you're emotional where's he supposed to go we're all we're in it's just standing in his fucking

locker the shower we're right in his face there was a player on the marlies who jokingly and this was years and years ago um and it was all men i will say this all the reporters were men um he just burst through our semi-circle of people butt naked just joking going whoa let's hit the shower boys? Woo! And like, he was just having fun with it. Right? But he walked through it. A circle of people butt naked. You know, you can see how that might have gone the wrong way.

We're in... I've always viewed the locker room as their space. And I've gotten to go into the Marley's locker room and I've also gotten to cover them in the playoffs where they bring out the wallpaper you know, one at a

time. Step and repeat. Step and repeat. And they also do the podium. Yep. And I've always thought that was better. And why do you think that was better? It's just neater. It's just more neat. Beat reporters will say, I can't develop a personal relationship with this player if I'm not in that dressing room.

Yeah, you can. It might be harder. And this is the thing. I haven't developed a ton of close relationships with professional athletes. They have and they have to for their job. I get that. There are other ways to do it. Yeah.

And if you ask for one-on-one time with a player, you won't always get a yes, but you'll get it. There was one time I had to wait like 40, I had a few questions for Sheldon Keefe when he was head coach of the Marlies. I had to wait like half an hour, 45 minutes to get it. I got it. Like they were surprised, they walked out and they're like, you're still here? You'll get it. And it made my job harder because I had to wait that amount of time. You'll get it.

So, but it goes back to, and this is the reason they're doing it, right? What did I say when Travis Dermott missed time because he was sick? And this was long before everyone started freaking out about the coronavirus. What did you say? Locker rooms are disgusting. Like, hockey teams are 20 disgusting boys, and all the people who work for the team, and then, especially in Toronto, you're going to have, like, 15 reporters, and how many camera people, and maybe they're bringing an intern with them that day,

and maybe there's a couple of players' kids there and the three or four media people walking. There's like 40, 50 people in that room standing like this and half of them are naked. It's a great place to be if you're a virus. Now, apparently the nakedness is, especially in NHL dressing rooms,

apparently that's happening far less. Yeah, it's quite a lot. One of the reporters I read, they're already dressed by the time you get in. In some regard. But beyond the naked part, because forget that. Jesus, if you're Joe Thornton, you're already out the door. Yeah, yeah.

He, one time when I was there for Leafs Morning Skate, I was there to talk to the Sharks. People were walking in, and I believe he and another player had left Morning Skate early so they could get dressed and fuck off. Right. And not talk to anybody. But beyond the naked part, that's the question I have, is that if a reporter's sick. Yeah. Yes.

And it's not coronavirus. What if they just have a cold? Right. And that's, if you're a team, that's your asset. You need your asset to be playing at their top level. I have interviewed players dog sick. I talked to Jerome McGimla, and I was, it's one of the top five sickest I've ever been. And I interviewed him, it was like five weeks before the Olympics.

And I remember as a fan. Who let you do that? I know! I remember as a fan being like, I'm about to affect the Calgary Flames season. and Steam Canada, potentially. And look, I didn't not shake his hand. And it wasn't even just Jerome McGinley. I shook Jennifer Botterill's hand that day.

I shook Jaina Hefford's hand that day. I shook Jillian Apps' hand that day. Those were all key members of the Canadian women's team. They're training to go up against Team USA and everybody else, of course, on the biggest possible stage, a stage they've been working to get through their entire lives, And they might blow it because I had the sniffles.

You know what I mean? So I've always found it strange, the proximity that we're given to players. So I wonder if this isn't a convenient excuse. A hundred percent. And for the NHL to just never open the dressing rooms again. Well, this is what reporters are worried about. And I understand that. But I completely understand the NHL side on this.

Completely understand it. Have you seen reporters getting mad at this? Because I've seen a couple, and they're getting mad at, like, the World Health Organization, the CDC. You can't get mad. You can't objectively get mad at this. I don't think the reporters are mad they're doing it now. I think they're mad that they're probably going to try to do it going forward. Right, because I think the reporters knew.

And I think those fears are based in fact. I think the NHL will try to do that. They're going to do it this way for the next couple months, and we're going to discover that, hey, you can do your job without being in the locker room, and it's better this way. The Marlies did it their way, and there was one reporter who never friggin' went who had anything to say about it. None of the regulars had any problem with it.

Haven't you mentioned him on the show before? I don't even know if you have. It was Damien Cox. And he was really mean about it, too. He tweeted about it, so it's not a secret. Yeah, we don't need to get into it. But, yeah, he wanted Kyle Dubas at intermission during a playoff game. What? And then he wanted to go in a locker room, because that's how the Marlies did it a few years ago,

and I guess he hadn't been for several years. And then he comes back, and you're not allowed in the locker room, and he got mad about it. It was one guy. One guy. Like, I did the World Juniors. They didn't let us in the locker room. No. We had the mixed zone.

No one complains in those situations. And no matter what situation you're in You're in this cramped friggin environment I don't think I've seen a lot of interviews from the KHL But the ones I have seen have not been in the dressing room No, in Europe I don't think they do it English soccer survives, you know

Boy, it's too bad they don't have enough people covering that Right And no stories ever come out about players People hate change, I get it But you can It can be done a different way Maybe it's outdated, maybe it's antiquated Maybe.

We're asking somebody who's done it for 30 years to change their way. I understand why there's pushback. I don't think anyone's wrong. Is that a weak take? I don't know. Maybe. But, like, I've never depended on it, but I've also never seen the necessity of it. Moving on.

From Hockey Night Canada headlines, Elliot Friedman dropped a bomb last night about Jim Little and Eugene Melnick. Now, if you don't know who Jim Little is, he is the former, now former CEO of the Ottawa Senators. And you're asking yourself, why would anybody want that job? Well, based on this, I don't think Jim Little wanted the job. Jim Little and Eugene Melnick got into a humdinger of a conversation, a real fight. Pretty good one. And this happened on Valentine's Day. For some reason, we know what date it happened on.

It was on Valentine's Day. And it was so bad, in fact, and this was over the phone, that employees heard it. Lots of people heard and it's funny at the time that it did not leak and that might be because there aren't a lot of People working for the Senators But those who were are there and they're working hard the people that are still working for the sense everything I've heard there. They're doing three and four jobs like it's it's they're trying to keep that place moving They're they're operating like an OHLT. Yeah, it's crazy. It's crazy So the people that are working there in some ways busting their cans that their social is so good. Mm-hmm with so little now

Now, apparently what Jim Little said after using a bunch of expletive words that we have not had a direct quote on. He apparently said a bunch of bad words and then said to Eugene Melnick, the best thing that could happen to the Ottawa senators is if you disappeared for 12 months. Now, the Ottawa senators have said we didn't have necessarily an issue with that. We have an issue with the way Jim Little spoke before that. Meaning you can't speak like that in a workplace It is not a part of our guidelines But I believe that that is technically true

I believe that is technically true as well But Jim Little was fired Because he simultaneously told the truth Number one, because he's not incorrect And number two He bit the hand that fed him A good CEO

Knows when the owner And they usually are, is a little crazy and or a little crazy is the wrong word, I won't use crazy erratic is a fairer word I think erratic is more accurate Jim Little knew when he took this job that Eugene Melnick is erratic to say the least

that's Eugene Melnick's resume, erratic and he knew what he was stepping into when I read this quote, the best thing that could happen to Ottawa, the Ottawa Senators if you disappeared for 12 months, Jim Little didn't want that job anymore

Jim Little was looking for a way out But if Jim Little leaves, I bet there's something in his contract that says, eh. You can't go anywhere? No, no, you can't get as much. Because Jim is not, you're the CEO of the Ottawa Senators, even though nobody wants that job. You're still probably pretty good at business. And you're smart enough to know that if you are let go before your contract's up, they have to pay you. And what did I say?

Like the Sens were having a pretty normal season compared to last year. Now what's going to happen? Well, I think that they're going to go. The senators are saying also that he wasn't even let go for that. They're saying that Jim Little's wife's blog post may have had something. Where does this exist? I want to know what the blog post says. No one's told me what this blog post said, but apparently it was bad enough to get him let go.

Here's the thing. Elliott Friedman then went on to say, look for litigation on that one. Yeah, I didn't understand that one. Also, it was his ex-wife. Oh, his ex-wife. Yeah, which is even stranger. This is so bizarre, I don't even know. But this is so very Ottawa.

And it's not the Senators' players. And it's not the Senators' fans. And it never is. It never is. The employees there are great. The players there have put in a season that's really admirable. They're bringing people back around. Bobby Ryan coming back from rehab, scoring a hat-trick.

People chanting Bobby in there. That's just one example of a young team that's busting their can every night. There's no lack of effort from the Senators And you might point to the Uber video That was an Uber driver being a complete creep And also that was last year That was a different team, different mindset But I'm taking it away from the players

Sure, this team this year Has put in an unbelievable performance Based on their talent level, let's be honest And Jim Little is not incorrect When he says the best thing that Eugene Melnick can do is disappear for 12 months And it's unfortunate that Eugene didn't

Because we were almost there When was the last time we heard from Eugene Melnick? Well, context is important. Is that him going, you get lost for the next 12 months? Or was that him going, you've basically been out of the spotlight for 12 months and everything's gone so well? I think it's a little column A, a little column B. It was him saying, the more you are involved with this, the worse that it gets. And he is not incorrect.

What's gone wrong for the Sens this season? This. This. But everything else has been great. They've done well. Yeah, on the hockey side, it's been great. On the hockey side, it's been absolutely great. But here's the problem, guys.

Owners own. Yeah. They can do whatever they want. Yeah, they can waste their money however they please. For sure. Which this guy is hell-bent on doing. Yep, and it's a shame. But Jim Little, I don't, listen, I wasn't there for the conversation.

If what he screamed was abusive language, yeah, you can let people go for that. That just does not, you cannot do that anymore. You never should have been able to But you can't anymore So if it was abusive language Yeah, you're going to be fired for that But Two things can be right

It could be the right thing to let him go And it's also true That Eugene Melnick needs to disappear And continue disappearing And also I don't think Jim Little wanted that job anymore I just don't think you say that to an owner If you really like your job

If you want to keep your gig Nah, you're not saying something like that. I, I, you know, I've covered hockey for a few years now. February is the hardest month. It really is. I think it's a hard month on anybody that lives in a winter climate. It's, well, well, there's that. But it's, there's the trade deadline, which I'm sure has everyone losing their mind.

And the games, like, before or after the trade deadline, like, just are so hard to get through. Yep. All-star game? All-star game And you're in a groove And you just fall right out of it And these conversations It doesn't surprise me that this conversation

Happened when it did You know what I mean It's a volatile time of year And if you're in a bad mood Which you probably are Because it's February and you're in hockey You're going to say some things That might get you fired

It doesn't surprise me Henri Richard passed away 11 Stanley Cups with one guy. Unbelievable. And if he'd played a couple extra years, he would have been in the second time the Habs won five Cups in a row. He retired just before the late 70s Habs. This is a guy that could have kept playing.

If he was a hockey team, I believe he'd be third all-time in Cups. He has as many Cups as the Leafs organization in his career. He has as many Cups as the Leafs have ever had. It's unbelievable. Unbelievable. But Jack Todd hates him. What? No.

No! Yeah, he does. No! Jack Todd hates Henri Richard. Now, I hate to bring that up, but I'd really rather focus on Henri Richard, but we got to talk about the Jack Todd thing because... I didn't see that! So basically what he...

No, it's probably good that you didn't, but he tweeted that Henri Richard was not a good guy. Oh. Which is great to do when someone dies. But Henri Richard did lots for the community, and like any person, is a person and imperfect. But what he referenced as the reason that Henri Richard was not a good guy was an incident with Al McNeil. Al McNeil, Calgarians will know Al McNeil because he was the assistant general manager when you won the Stanley Cup.

Al McNeil was the coach. And in 70-72, I think, sorry, 71-72, they win the Cup. But Al McNeil famously did not have a great relationship with the Francophone players in Montreal. Now, I'm oversimplifying this. This led to Henri Richard speaking up and saying, this guy should probably not be the coach anymore, even though we won. And Henri Richard was a guy that Al McNeil had been benching. He had been playing him.

Henri Richard scores the tying and the winning Stanley Cup goal that year. So he's got the power back. And he's also a Richard, right? Yes. You're a Richard. You're a god. You're pocket rock. Yes.

And you won your 11th cup. You've been there. And he was probably speaking for other members of his team who felt, and at the time this was far more acceptable. I don't think people realize how big the divide between English and French was in this country and how accepted it was that they just hated each other for no reason other than they spoke a different language. Quebec almost left Canada, like, in our lifetime. Yeah, 100%.

Because of stupid stuff like this. Now, I don't know Al McNeil personally. I don't know what his relationship was. But obviously, it was bad enough with the Francophone players that Henri Richard had to speak up. Al McNeil loses his job. And people think that's unfair. But Al McNeil, unfortunately, got out of the way for some little-known guy named Scotty Bowman. Dude, that was like 40, 50 years ago.

So, Jack Todd is holding on to something about Montreal that happened in the early 70s, like you said, 50 years ago. Wait, that's the thing? That's the thing. That is not where I thought you were going. And not only did they fire Al McNeil, which was just a tragedy for Montreal, because they ended up with all-time winningest coach, Scotty Bowman. Are you kidding me, dude? That worked out for them. Like, I mean, sorry, Al, but it did.

And anyway, Henri Richard deserves more than some stupid comment from a guy who's actively trying to court hate online. But Henri Richard was a guy that, and I can relate to this on a little bit of a level. It's funny, when he came out of junior, they basically said, his coach said, he was like 150-something pounds, and his coach in junior, who was a former Montreal Canadian, said, you're not supposed to be in the NHL, you're not good enough. And the only reason that you're going to even get an invite to Habs camp is because Maurice said, yeah, give him an invite. Well, and this was back when, like, a heavyweight in the NHL was, like, 175. Yeah, and they still thought he was not big enough, not tall enough, whatever.

Maurice Richard is 15 years older than Henri Richard. Henri Richard was sitting on his dad's lap when Maurice started playing for the Habs. When he was, like, six years old, watching his big brother. He only wanted to be like Maurice. And what I love about this, and there's been a lot of amazing tributes, and I suggest you check them all out. The best part about this is Maurice was going to retire, and he stayed in there one more year to play with Henri. That's cool. And then Henri, so you had a Richard on the Canadians for like 25 years.

Wow. That's really special. And I think, and I think they won the cup together too, I think that it is one of the most special stories in the NHL. I love the crossover part, and I love the fact that there's a player out there. Henri Richard, to me, is the ultimate second, third line center in the NHL's history. He was constantly a great leader. He was never the flashiest.

He was never the biggest point getter. he was never a big goal scorer or whatever but that guy was steady as they came in hockey at that time when there was only

six teams in the league got to talk to Serge Savard and Yvain Cournoy and they always said you know we had like 13 captains yeah

in the locker room and Henri would have been first among captains he was a captain he was a captain of the Montreal Canadiens so anyway our best to the Richard family

11 Stanley Cups don't think that's ever going to be equaled again not a chance well said Adam anyway and lastly And I'm sad about this

But you know what I was talking to Christina Earlier today I'd like to have Christina On Wednesday if we can She's covering the Briar today So I'm not going to Bug her too much

She gave me Like we were going to Connect because I wanted To bring her on to talk About this Danny Ryland story I'm going to ask you To read it Because

Here's the thing I don't think I'm speaking out of term When I say that The PWHPA NWHL NHL Women's hockey

Situation right now Is a bit contentious And when you start to talk about it Like we did at the beginning of the season You have people that are hardcore pro-NWHL And you have people that are hardcore pro-PWHPA And there doesn't seem to be a lot of people Who are like

Hey, you're okay to be in the middle And that's why we had Anya Packer on And that's why we had Liz Knox on We had them on Because we wanted to better understand Both sides of the story And our position here is always

Let's cut through the bullshit And what's the best, most viable league option? There's one side that says the NHL's got to support it The other side says, no, we need a league founded by a woman Hockey player who is a serial entrepreneur And we need to do it that way Or even at baseline, well, no, let's play Let's actually play

Right, which the PWHPA tour is doing Is doing, yes, but it's not a league Right. And I think this was supposed to be just the year-long thing. Anyway, a lot of the criticism, and I call it criticism, but it's really vitriol. It's personal attacks. When it comes to what's happening right now, it's been leveled at Danny Ryland. A lot of that had to do with the fact that there's a few things at play, but Danny Ryland had to reduce salaries that they had promised the players because they just didn't bring in the revenue that they needed to bring in. But what I find interesting is when you get a bigger perspective on somebody who mostly has, at least within the online Twitter hockey community, a bad reputation. Danny Ryland, if you ask a lot of people online, is not going to get favorable reviews. We've talked about it for years. But I still think it's interesting to know more about that person.

And I have to tell you, Christina Rutherford does an incredible job. I have my opinions on it, but I'm going to save that until Wednesday because I think what Christina will have to offer, because she talked to Danny regularly and face-to-face, I think Christina's insight on it will be very, very interesting. So that's something we're going to get to next episode because I think Christina always has that insight into the human side of people. And I think that

I think you'll gain a lot As a hockey fan After reading this article One way or the other And something Like I don't know What there is to say On this other than

It's just It's a complete tragedy And friggin sucks The whole women's World hockey championship Yes In Nova Scotia Cancelled

And it would have been A banger Like I saw I saw some players Rightfully go It's not just That the tournament's cancelled Dude

Nova Scotia man Well they're gonna do it In Nova Scotia next year Yeah and That's next year Listen Dude I know

But I'm just saying Like the coronavirus thing You can't have the tournament Right You can't And they're not Refunding tickets They're saying

Everybody's tickets Are valid for next year They should refund The damn thing Which is Yeah That's crap A lot of people

Are complaining about this Uh yeah So yeah I think That's a bullshit move They should fix that I feel like This shouldn't be legal

I think you can do Whatever you want Once you sell a ticket Right Wow But yeah Wow Yeah you should be able

To refund the ticket But yeah anyway It's a shame It really is But at least when it does come back, when this stuff subsides, it will be in Nova Scotia. It's not like it's going to move on. You know what I mean? That was my point.

It's not like the Raptors exhibition game in Newfoundland. You ever hear about that? No, what happened? It was canceled because of the moisture on the floor. Oh. And they're like, oh, yeah, it's okay. We'll be back. And the crowd goes, yeah, in five years or something like that.

And they go, what? Boom. Yeah. Oh, man, that's brutal. Anyway, let's do the press conference. I think we're all good. Okay, let's not oh screw that screw that hey if you had a question screw your question So yeah next episode we're gonna try to book Christina Rutherford. We've gotten to oh

I'm gonna say this now But I'm also gonna ask because I forgot to say this at the beginning of the show that we reinsert this Into the beginning of the show. Okay, we never make edits, but I want to make an edit on this one guys We sold out in Kingston Sold out Kingston It sold out in 48 hours Wait why does it have to go at the beginning It has to go at the beginning because I have an announcement

Oh what So we have an announcement There you go 100 tickets sold At 9 o'clock tonight At what time 9pm eastern standard time This episode will be up

Hopefully If you don't hurry up If you keep talking I can't put it up Spit it out There will be a new block of tickets released. Talk about it. No, no, seriously. I got it.

There will be a new block of tickets released. Not a lot. Standing room only. And they will be available. You will not be able to obviously get a table. The tables have sold out. But if you would like to still come, you still can. New block of tickets, 9 p.m. Eastern Standard Time tonight.

Steve and I and Jesse will all tweet out the link at that time. And so, you know, it's first come, first serve. And the other thing that you should know is that if you cannot, Let's say you missed out on the first set of tickets. You miss out on the second set of tickets. Guess what? We're sticking around for the game, and they're opening up the bar to everyone as soon as the game starts. So if you don't get into the event.

You can still come hang. Oh. Yeah. There you go. All right. All right. And each ticket comes with a free hug from Steve. Man.

Coronavirus. Yeah, maybe not. Sorry. Is Corona available? Maybe. Maybe. I don't know I didn't check their beer list

Yeah I know Listen We'll do a lot We'll do a lot of that What's the forearm bumps That they're doing now The elbow Yeah the elbow thing

We're gonna do that Elbow five Some of you weren't raised In Scarborough And it shows What Shut What

Shut up It's a thing It's a thing Sometimes I sit here And I always forget How cool you are And then you remind me

Cool Then you remind me How damn cool Coolest guy in the universe Steve Dangle Ladies and gentlemen You're all blessed Steve Dangle

The Steve Dangle Podcast Follow the guys on Twitter At Steve underscore Dangle At Adam W-Y-L-D-E And at Jesse Blake Brought to you by Panago Pizza Order at Panago.com And stuff your face with deliciousness

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