The Steve Dangle Podcast - Midway with CJ | February 1, 2018

Episode Date: February 1, 2018

On this episode, Chris Johnston is on the show! (00:00), Mike Fisher is un-retired (3:00), does Calle Rosen stick around (13:00), Leafs v Islanders (22:00), Matt Martin, JVR, and the Leafs' future (38:00), quick notes on the Oilers and Canucks (54:00), and a little more Leafs (58:00). Originally aired: February 1, 2018 Watch the full episode here: https://youtu.be/BC7XBaYMyzk Follow us on Twitter: @Steve_Dangle, @AdamWylde, & @JesseBlake Follow us on Instagram: @SteveDangle, @AdamWylde, & @Jesse.Blake Subscribe to us on iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/ca/podcast/steve-dangle-podcast/id669828195?mt=2 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Panago Pizza presents S.T.P. The Steve Dangle Podcast with your hosts, Steve Dangle and Adam Wilde. Well, you know, today, I think, I'm going to address Jesse first. Oh, God. Jesse, I think today is going to be a chapter in Steve's book. Today? Today is going to be a chapter in Steve's book. February 1st, 2018.

You watch for this chapter. It might be four or five chapters in. It may not be the lead chapter, but this is a chapter of huge drama. Do you know why? Please stop adding chapters. I'm so far behind. Do you know why? Why?

Why? Well, first off, we've got CJ on the show. Chris Johnson! Second, Chris is here to witness the drama that is Steve's life. You see, because Steve had to get up early this morning after working late last night. And boy He might have told us Six times already

What? This is life Next time When you come And get me in my car I'm just going to sit in silence I'm not going to confide in my friends I had to do my YouTube video

And then I had to get up early to hang out with my friends Say YouTube with a little more stank Adam Go ahead YouTube Say it like you picked the word off the bottom of your shoe How dare you Did you know that if it was up to Steve We would be doing this on Friday night

Instead of him having to wake up early In Oshawa Once in his life As opposed to do a podcast with three other guys Now Jesse, that seems obscene to you But to the three married guys in the room That doesn't seem all that bad Because that's a pretty cool Friday night, Chris, right?

I can't get down with that Maybe it's just that I've been married long enough that I'm still looking forward to Friday night. It's a green light night. That's like go hang out with some friends night.

We record in Nashville. Yeah, that would be nice. All right. That's what we do. We were saying before. We might not be able to set up the equipment in Nashville.

No. No. We'd be in rough shape in Nashville. We'd be a little banged up. That city is way too much fun. Coffee beer. Coffee beer.

Absolutely. We might be there in June again. Honestly. I think we might be. So, okay, well, let's start with that, because Mike Fisher comes out of retirement yesterday. As one does. And that's the great thing about the Predators.

It's like, you know, we don't have to make a deadline deal now. We've got our center. Now, is he fourth-line center? Is that what he's going to be? Maybe even a winger. I mean, look at what they had last year in the final. You have Ryan Johansson, hopefully healthy this time. You've got Kyle Torres acquired.

You've got Nick Bonino signed as a free agent. Who was on the other team. Who was on the other team. and they had Colton Sissons was their number one center in the Stanley Cup final last year. It's either him or Mike Fisher as a fourth-line center and then one of them on the wing. And is Jaron Kroka center as well, or has he been mostly wing?

That's amazing. Yeah, they got options. That's what Mike Babcock loves. Yes. Which he's made, no, well, options, but he loves centers that play the wing. Oh. He's so used to coaching Team Canada.

He wants 10 centers for 12 forward spots. Yeah. That's true. That's why he signed Patrick Marleau. We didn't get him to play center, sure he didn't like. He's a center like two weeks into the season. And he was amazing, too. But, again, we'll talk about Leafs in a sec because I don't want to get there yet.

But, okay, let's have a look at this. So if Nashville goes into last year's Stanley Cup Finals, Johansson's out still, but they have a guy like Kyle Turris. Different series, right? They'd probably win. I mean, that Pittsburgh defense should not have won a Stanley Cup. With due respect to the guys there. But, I mean, it was patchwork.

Ron Hainsey, Trevor Daly. Fisher, he was injured, wasn't he? He played a little bit, though. He came back. Oh, he did? But probably not 100%. No, I think he had a concussion at the end of the Western Conference final and then came back during the Stanley Cup final.

I'm sure he came back, you know. Well, I mean, there's a long history of that in our sport. Yes, absolutely. So we'd be unwise to just say just him is the problem or that he did something that isn't normal practice. Oh, of course, of course, of course. But, yeah, they win the Stanley Cup. I mean, I'm still a little surprised they didn't.

Like, I think back to game one where they had a goal called back that was on one of those questionable reviews. I mean, maybe if they win that game, it's hard to say the butterfly effect, what changes, but they were not off very much last year, and they're way better now than they were last year. And they just got Ryan Ellis back as well. Right. But you know what?

Crazy. Maybe they'll, like, run into the magic show that's Vegas and can't get through it. Right. Like, who knows? I was like, the playoffs, this is why we get jacked up for the playoffs. I mean, on paper, I would be picking the Predators out of the Western Conference, but something crazy could happen.

I feel like it's got to be Predators lightning. Something crazy is currently happening. Vegas is first in the West. Yeah, it's insane. And with that, it felt like for a couple years there, Pecorine wasn't Pecorine. And it just seems like he is again. Or at least he's somewhat of the goalie that they thought he was when they signed him to that enormous contract.

What year was it when he was, like, Vesna-worthy? That was... 2013? Oh, I'm trying to... I don't remember. I will look it up. I don't remember. He's had a couple...

He's one of those... It's been an odyssey. Yeah. Great season, terrible season. Great season, terrible season. He has this... He's having a great season, though. I mean, this year.

Yeah, so 14-15, he was 41-17. So that's a Vesna-caliber season, I would think. He's got this wacky, floppy style. He's an adventurer when he plays the puck. He looks like one of those walking tree guys from Lord of the Rings. Like, he's just, he's a weird goalie. And he's an eight-round pick, which doesn't even exist anymore. Nope.

So, that's kind of cool. I think that's pretty amazing that he's done that. But, yeah, I just, you know, from the team that we saw last year when we were all down there, Chris, it was perfect timing with you coming on the show today. Mike Fisher getting signed and that sort of thing. But that gives them depth option. But is Mike, like his skill set, Mike Fisher's skill set, he's taken six months off. Do you think that it's going to take some time to get back up?

Or is that one of those things that it's just the conditioning? It gives me concern. I mean, at his age to not play really seven months, it sounds as though he's just started skating again. And often when players retire, like the last thing they ever want to do is put on skates again. They put on skates 2,000 times a year for 18, 17-year career, whatever he's at.

I mean, the one thing they do not want to do is skate, even though for those of us that don't get to play in the NHL, it's so great to go out for a little skate, but they just get tired of that act. I mean, I'm not saying he can't do it, and it's good that they only need him in a limited role, but I don't know if anyone knows what he could be. I mean, there's no risk because personality-wise, they love him.

I don't think it's going to cause any rift in the dressing room, even though someone just found out they're losing their job, essentially, yesterday, although we don't know how soon it'll be. But, I mean, if you think about the team dynamic, I mean, it's great he's coming back and everyone's making the big deals. There goes the ice time for somebody. Well, does he take on the Matt Martin role of, like, team dad? where, you know, he plays sometimes, doesn't play other times,

but is always a positive influence? Yeah, but I mean, I don't know. There's still human dynamics at play. I mean, I'm not in everyone's mind, but someone, I guarantee one or maybe two guys were in that dressing room going, this isn't so great. I like Mike Fisher, but I like them in the alumni box a little bit better than sitting beside me about to take my cookie.

I also wonder if maybe the Preds are smart enough to be like, well, we lost half our team last year. and had we not, we might have won a cup. So maybe it's not so bad to have a couple extra guys around. Right, and the other issue is this. If you look at the trade deadline market and we just focus in on the rental guys because that's most of who gets traded,

there's almost no centers. No. Like Mark Letestu, with due respect to him, he had a great season last year with Edmonton, but he'll be like a commodity as a fourth-line center option at the deadline. There's not... This year's Antoine Vermette.

And so you haven't given up anything for him, right? Except for the cap space that he's going to end up eating up, and I don't see any risk from the personal side. It's just we don't know what he's going to be as a player. He looked pretty good yesterday. He's got those pearly whites, and I think he's been living the good life. I'm sure he kept

himself in some modicum of shape, but they were very clear they don't really care if he plays until the playoffs. I mean, he has to sign by the deadline February 26th to be eligible to play in the playoffs, but it might not be until March until we see him play a game. So that's interesting. Is he actually signed?

No. Right now? So he's not even signed yet? No. Why wouldn't you wait, right? Because he would go on their cap right now if he was signed. That's right. Wow.

So if he's not ready to play, let's say he's not ready to play until March, just for argument's sake, he's signing February 25th or February 26th. I'd put money on it. They'll go right to the deadline. I mean, if in a week's time they say he's ready to play, then it could come sooner. But you might as well hold off. Is there anyone at the NHL that has a bit of a problem with that? I mean there's like a rumor that

well it's a pretty wide publicized rumor that like the Leafs have like a handshake deal with Igor Ozhiganov over in the KHL I don't really see how this is much different right if anything this is I don't think Ozhiganov offends anybody because he's not under contract to any

other NHL team the Leafs aren't going to be able to use him this season so there's nothing untoward there I mean maybe the other NHL teams are pissed off that the Leafs have maybe the KHL is pissed off that the Leafs have done it

but I don't think the NHL would have any issue with that okay Oja Ganup by the way was not named to the Russian Olympic team and I've been asking around

it's not a bad year hasn't it apparently it hasn't gone so well so I wonder what that's about can that be as political like cause

cause the KHL can be extremely political right there can be there is that's a polite way of putting it it's the wild west

yeah yeah and that's why a lot of players like him sometimes want to get out of there cause you can

fall out of favor literally owned by gas companies of the government and mobsters. Yeah, and so if you don't go their way, you can have your ice time cut, and it can seem like you have a bad, and you can be diminished,

but he may have the skill set. Well, he plays for a team, CSKA Moscow, Red Army, which is at least one of the historical strong teams. Like, you're getting paid there. You're not sure you're getting paid in, like, 20 other teams. Like, it could or couldn't happen. A lot of Togliatti.

But Red Army is carrying the equivalent of two teams right now. Like, apparently they show shots in the stands, and, like, there's, like, a whole team of the healthy scratches. Because they're carrying an insane number of players because roster size is not limited. So imagine, I mean, we're talking about the sort of human dynamic and that.

I mean, no one knows who's playing. Literally an army. It does not sound like that much fun to me. You'd rather know you're playing, right? Yeah. And so I don't know what this guy is. I mean, I don't see any harm in at least getting him, assuming that is what happens.

Do you think a guy like Callie Rosen takes this season and goes, Okay, I'm going back to Sweden Or do you think he sticks around And goes, you know Maybe there's a chance here I just needed to get it adjusted Because it seems like Borgman stepped in right away

And yeah, he's had his blemishes But he's looked like an NHL defenseman From the get-go Just to check We're full-blown diving in Yeah, we're diving in What the heck, yeah No more, no more

Tippy-toe If Nashville's in last place Do you think Mike Fisher comes back? No chance No way, yeah Of course I don't even Like, the funny thing

With the press conference I didn't get the impression That he really it's not that he didn't want to come back but like they had to talk him into it this wasn't like a case of a guy who was like you know what i really miss hockey i got the sense it was like the other side going like we really miss you and sort of talking him into it and you know i'm not questioning his desire but he even said like i used to hate when guys came out of retirement here i am coming out of retirement he was like chuckling while saying it um you know i i really

feel like the organization put this in his mind and kept on him i mean there's this like lunch date with Roman Yossi it was like came in tears you know like subtle phone calls that advanced to like just text in the middle of the night we're thinking of you you know what I mean you up BB so

there's no way I think the Preds honestly thought he'd come back in general when they got that close to the cup and then he didn't come back it's hard to retire when you get two wins from the Stanley Cup and the team's still going to be good and the city's on fire

But he wanted to spend more time with Carrie Underwood I wonder too And I mean who could blame him She apparently took a real nasty fall On some icy steps At their house Because it's been unseasonably cold in Nashville And she said she got 40 stitches on her face

Yeah crazy Just a random crazy story But she's like I won't look the same She's like I have Has she not been out in public? Not really no wow yeah it's been crazy

it's been crazy I'm sure it'll be fine but it's one of those things you're just like random stories of wow that is crazy that's nuts

happens anyway so I wonder if this deal even happens if Kyle Turris isn't in the picture because to me it's like okay

you know like okay do they look as dominant without Johansson and Turris up the middle and it's like okay are we going back to the finals

with the like because they have I mean we thought they were going to the finals last year at least I did

they did but then you've got this other Kyle Turris is just another great addition and it's like I'm even more convinced yeah in the summer

I was like oh Bonino I mean that's good but I mean now Bonino as your third guy yeah that's that's getting ridiculous

I know a team who won a cup with Nick Bonino as their third guy ah yeah okay several actually

so okay so let's I want to quickly I want to pivot to the Leafs because we were talking about the international signings and stuff like that do you think a guy

like Callie Rosen sticks around? I do. I could see him sticking around. Just because you make this commitment, I'm not sure you want to turn your back on it so quickly. And, you know, I haven't talked to Callie, so I'm going on feel, like I haven't talked to him specifically recently about, hey, are you ready to go home?

But I could see him sticking this out. I mean, the Leafs are going to need some, there's going to be turnover. I think like what you're seeing, like after a game like last night, even where Justin Hall comes up and, you know, I don't expect him to stay around too long. But you want to have guys that can fill in, right? And you need that push up.

And they're still going to need that. So I would be surprised if he didn't give it one more year. Just because it's a big decision to come over here and you get this close to your NHL dream. Did he play one game or two games? He played a few. He played a couple games. Like, you get a taste of it.

I think it's hard to give up on that until you're sure. And maybe you go to Cap Friendly and you're like, Hey, Jake Gardner. Not signed forever. You know, maybe there's a hole coming up on the left side. I mean, and injuries. I mean, I just think that, and the Marlies are great, too. I mean, keep in mind, it's not a death sentence to be in the HL.

I mean, I think sometimes it's portrayed that way. But the Marlies have won, I think it was 128-56-12 their last three seasons. They're pretty good. Like, when you play for the Marlies, you basically win, like, three-quarters of your games the last three years. And you got a chance to, like, go in a playoff. Like, it's a fun place to be. I think if you're living in a really crappy town in the AHL

and your team's getting its teeth kicked in, it can be miserable, and you might ask those existential what-am-I-doing-here questions. But, you know, if you're playing down the street from the Leafs and you're one call up away from being on this young, exciting team and your team's winning, I mean, it's not the worst life. No. Plus, I love Toronto, and you get to live in Toronto, so that's pretty cool. Yeah, and, I mean, Justin Holl just played his first game,

scored his first NHL goal, and that guy's 26. So, I mean, there are worse places to be. The Leafs have also shown a willingness to overpay Marlies. Like, there's guys like Vincent Laverde is making really good money. He's on an NHL one-way deal, $700,000 or so to play in the NHL. Ben Smith, I think, is being paid handsomely. You know, and he's done well. He's done extremely well, Ben Smith.

Absolutely. I don't begrudge these guys. My point is that there's a future in at least earning good money here while keeping that light and that possibility going. So, you know, I don't see them bailing. I don't know what the limit is. How many more European guys are they going to sign? I would suggest it'll probably be a lot

because if you're the Leafs, it's a free lottery ticket and they already have a few in the lineup. You said last time you were here, it was a market inefficiency. It was one of those things that they can, that's a way to jump ahead that nobody's really doing, right? Yeah. I mean, look, you have Borgman and Zaitsev

in their top six this season, basically the whole year when they were healthy. Right. And those are just from the last two years, guys that were signed that way. So I actually think it's funny. there's been so much focus on the Leafs' defense. I mean, they've done a pretty sneaky job

of having it not be quite as bad as everyone sort of portrays. It's, yeah. It's not great. The top-end quality might not be there, but the depth we're starting to see is sort of there. Right, but Morgan Rielly's been a number one this year, like a legit number one.

So that already makes everything better because that wasn't, well, we'll see if he can do it again. I mean, I'm not doubting him, but the dangerous spot, I think, why all GMs never get comfortable is because just as soon as you're like alright I got number one

don't have to worry about that and then something changes shoulder injury sorry go ahead Dowdy him could fix that you know

yeah if you brought in Dowdy do you think Dowdy wants to come that was very good obviously there's the Austin Matthews question

from the all-star game which I'm sure was just a joke and Austin didn't want to answer questions about it afterwards right well it's just so peculiar because players never talk about their plans

yeah right with each other especially Drew Dowdy never talks about his plans to the athletic Yeah, publicly to reporters. Chris? Does he want to come?

I think it's in his mind. I mean, how could it not be? Local boy. If he watched the game against the Islanders? Do you think it's in Tavares' mind? Oh, that's a harder one. Oh, my God. Because, I mean, you think about it.

They were saying on Hockey Central yesterday that there's no way that... It's occurred to him that it might not be the worst thing. I'm comfortable saying that. I mean, come on. Yeah. Well, it was Doug McClain said. You've probably looked at other radio stations and been like, hey, that might not be so bad. Never.

Never. No, but John Tavares, I think Doug McLean said he's like, well, he wouldn't want to come in and be the third line center. I'm like, well, he wouldn't be. That'd be very obviously Nazem Khadri. And I don't think Khadri would have any issues with that. Montreal is going to offer him the world. They would roll out two number one lines, not to mention. I mean, basically you have Marner and Nylander split up on the right side.

and you have Matthews and Tavares on the set, you basically would have two number one lines and you figure out the power play. And look, they're already doing power play by sort of a communism system. Everyone's equal anyway. So, I mean, that could work. They might have to trade Kadri if they do that.

I mean, that would be... Money-wise? Random question. When are we going to see five forwards on a power play? I don't know. I think maybe when the stats folks get more power in organizations. But I don't know how long that'll be.

Someone should try it. I mean, it took a while for four forwards, one D, to be commonly accepted. Now most teams do it. So someone's going to do it. I'd like to see it. I feel like it took a while for one team to adopt it, but then 31 teams jumped on it pretty quickly after that. Right.

The thing is we have so many teams where their D is almost like a forward anyway. Yeah. So maybe we kind of have it in a weird way. I wonder when we're going to get out of, like, positionally being so concerned about everything. Like, if everyone will just sort of be equal and have different strengths. Yeah, well, we were talking about that last show. Like, oh, the Leafs don't really have any defenders that they're comfortable killing penalties, or at least with all the injuries that they had a couple games ago.

And it's like, okay, just throw out three forwards. I mean, it's not the same as five-on-five hockey. throw out three forwards who you trust and know what they're doing. I don't know, Komarov, Brown, Hyman, whatever. Kapanen? Polak. Yeah.

Or whoever it was a couple games ago. I don't know. I just think the rules are changing. I mean, you have coaches like in Columbus. Zakarensky and Seth Jones have full license to go anywhere on the ice. Yeah. They should.

And the expectation is that the forwards cover up for them when they go deep in the offensive zone. I mean, we saw it on Travis Dermott's first goal. he was like in on the four check basically lost the puck, steals it back I mean, I don't know he's a defenseman but he's basically playing forward

at that point. He's a skilled player it's a nice thing to have. You're wearing a Golden State hoodie right now and that reminds me of how Golden State kind of runs out there because like Kevin Duran will be your biggest man on the floor and he's this skinny dude who's normally a guard and I

feel like that's the way hockey should go where you just run out your best players and they kind of just go and they float and they find their own way. And if you're a good team, that's the key, right? Because not every team can do that. Yeah. Right.

And that's the thing where the teams that probably need the most structure are the ones with the least talent. Yes. Right? That's like getting back to like the 95 New Jersey Devils. Not that they had the least talent, but... They were rigid.

They played cynically. Yes. But whereas I think you could argue there might be a few teams, the Leafs potentially being one of them, that they can stretch the boundaries of how we think about the game. And I think what's great, if you're a Leafs fan, is that Mike Babcock, while I know he's driven people batty lately, is open to changing.

I mean, he's constantly evolved throughout his career. Lately, he's my best friend. This past week or so. Yeah, but lately he's three games. Yeah, that's fine. And they've won them all. So we record this, the next three games you might be like, That son of a gun!

Yelling into a YouTube camera at midnight. Which I was, but we won't get into that. Um, what did you see from last night's game, Chris, that, is there, I guess I'm going to rephrase the question. Did you see last night's game as the team they want to be like going forward? For sure. I mean, look, the Islanders kind of stink and they were playing back to back and Leafs were coming out of the all-star break, but I think you can't take away style points.

I mean, the Leafs had 50 shots on goal. They were ahead the whole night, you know, which normally when you go ahead, the other teams really pushes and then the shots end up wonky i mean the leafs is dominated other than a stretch in the second where the islanders had some chances but um it's been fascinating like there's been a noticeable change i was on the road last week when they played in chicago and dallas from the day babcock switched up the lines and i'm not saying this is like in revision now knowing what happened in the game since there's like an urgency around the team like i think all of a sudden guys realize like this is getting real and and the stretch drive is coming if matt martin had

a job with no questions asked for a year and a half straight and all of a sudden he's out i mean i think there starts to get this feeling that stuff is up for grabs you bring up capitan you know the the defense situation is just weird because you lose two two more guys to a flu that you didn't see coming um but man like we're seeing the talent the speed i mean how could you not like that i mean you'd have to be i guess if you're an islanders fan you hated that game but i just feel like if you just turn on that game and you don't care about either team that was exciting i mean the least were it was like the harlem globetrotters and and we saw that last year in in bits and in october i think the least played a few games like that but we haven't seen it and i'm i'm just

wondering what happens next because it seems like mad mike has got and i say that with reverence not I'm not saying he's crazy but like it just feels like he's really pulling the levers now and like that he's I don't know he's gone into the next phase of so this was a phase this last you know 25-30 game stretch that drove everybody nuts

that was do you think that was a phase was that an intentional learning curve development piece and now okay now it's real we got 30 games left let's go I do and I know everyone's going crazy I saw my buddy James Myrtle had like a sarcastic remark about this in his story on the athletic today but i honestly believe he was hammering

into them about playing the way you have to play for success in the playoffs and think about it you want to you always want to be ahead you you know you guys we're now videotaping the podcast you guys are constantly looking for new ways to expand the things you do i mean you if the leafs are just playing loosey-goosey and then you've got a switch in april i don't think it works and I believe that he believes that this was the best way to do it, to kind of grind on everyone, to maybe build up a little hunger. I think the mental side of what happens is always overlooked. People will look at one game and Mitch Marner will be dropped to the fourth line

and everyone freaks out. It's not an indication that the coach thinks he's a fourth line player. It's him coaching the player. And it's him keeping that fire on inside Mitch. It's probably him trying to piss Mitch off and be like, I'm going to show you. I mean, there's all kinds of that stuff that I don't think even me, who's pretty close to the team, truly understands because we're not in those meetings.

But I just trust this guy's track record that he knows what he's doing. And that was what was most amusing to me, this idea that the wins don't really matter in December when you're where the Leafs are, right? So it's how you get your players ready for when the games matter that matters. And, you know, I think a lot of people lost sight of that because it wasn't always fun to watch.

I mean, let's face it. No, it was terrible. 24 minutes of Leo Komarov. I bet Steve was just pounding a pillow. We love Leo. I know. I like Leo, but, like, people are like, man, boy, he stinks in this role.

I'm like, that's not his fault. It's not his role. Coach, I think I deserve to play half an hour a night. And I'm just a... I'm Eric Carlson. Yeah, do you know I was an all-star one time? And weirdly, they put him on the fourth line, and that fourth line looks as good as it has all season.

Right, and most teams won't have anywhere near that fourth line or even third line, so they're going to keep scoring goals and doing positive things. Well, and that's what happened in the playoffs last year when Boyle and Kapanen were together, and with Martin. Because you saw some, Martin, as we've said before, seems like a guy that really knows the game, but just doesn't have the skill to necessarily keep up in the same way.

And that's not, I'm not trying to, I don't hate Matt Martin. I think he plays a role that they expected and wanted and they signed him to this contract and they, you know, but it was one of those things where like that overtime winner that Kapanen had from the assist from Boyle, right, from behind the net. That was kind of like our fourth line was better than everybody else. And last night when they threw out Zizekas and whoever he's playing with right now, is Clutterbuck still there?

I don't even know. Yeah, he wasn't on the team yet. Oh, he's on that line? No, I don't know who's on their fourth line off. But when they threw that line out against Dominic Moore and Kapanen and Komarov, there was no contest. It was a better, they're a better line, period. Well, they're fast, right?

Yeah. Like, even Moore can skate pretty well for his age. He's being optimized. So it's, hockey's hard when it's coming at you. The way, like, Kasperi Kapanen, like, would scare you if you're on the ice. Not because he's not Auston Matthews with his skill, but he can make you look dumb. Like, if you make one mistake, he's gone. I mean, he can be like Michael Grabner with a little bit more upside, I think.

There was a play in the third period last night where the puck got chipped in and Kapanen chased it. The Islander defender turned their back to him, and they had no idea he was already there. Right. Because there are, like, no regular human skates that fast. Right. And he was right there in their face.

And look, he's killing penalties, too. Yep. Yeah. To me, that's interesting because that's a guy that, you know, really when he came here, it was all offense, right? It was all... That's the interesting thing. In every stint he's had with the Leafs, he's had to kill penalties.

Yeah. And it's kind of nice how they've changed it. But his dad was like that too, right? He killed penalties. The Flyers had him play defense in the playoffs one year because they had so many injuries. Against the Leafs, I'm pretty sure. That's funny. They were ahead of their time.

They were ahead of their time. What if that was Roger Nielsen era Flyers? If it was Roger Nielsen, it wouldn't surprise me. I want to say Laviolette. Maybe. When they had Roman Cechmanic, the Chick Magnet, that's what they called him. Dermott and Hall scored their first goals last night.

Is there anything better than the look on Travis Dermott's face when he scores? No, I mean, that guy just loves life, and he's loving his life right now, naturally. I mean, he's living his dream. I mean, he's got an infectious everything to him. I think his teammates love him. I can sense the fans are gravitating towards him.

Clearly, the coach likes him. He played him almost 20 minutes in that game, and good for him. He's making the most of this chance to, you know, really that's the, sometimes a positive side for the injuries is he's gotten this chance. We've seen that he can handle, I think the beliefs were very high on him, but no one could be sure he'd be this good. Like he's making plays.

Like he's not just surviving in the NHL. He's driving the play. Well, and the other night when he was, right before the All-Star break, where he came in and then like, okay, I'm coming back now. Like he was in the offensive zone, waves him in the air, like, okay, you can come in now cause I'm going to, you know, to the forward, whoever the forward was, that is confidence. That's sure. I am sure this is going to work rather than I'm going to guess at it.

Half a life is confidence. I mean, yeah. Anyone who's anywhere close to that HL has worked incredibly hard, has probably had a lot of good breaks like they, but not everybody has. Like I think sometimes Connor Carrick, for example, at times, I think he's in his own mind a little bit too much. And it's really easy for me to say, because what he's doing is under, every day his job is under the spotlight.

It's not easy to have that confidence. But it's, yeah, Travis Dermott, I mean, it looks like he's got no doubt in his mind. Like, he's just like, it's an extension of that joy. Like, he's just having fun and, you know, ride it, kid. Because, I mean, sadly, at some point, people will be ripping on him. Of course.

This will turn. This too shall pass. What are you going to write about Dermott? Are you going to piss him off? Is that your next article? No, but I just, I've seen it. When will you Mark Spector him? Travis Dermott has quit.

We make fun of Mark all the time, but we love Mark. We're just saying. That's not my style. And I just, it's going to happen. Do you know what's funny? So someone recently told me, someone who won a Stanley Cup, a player, former player, he said that you're most excited when you win the Cup because you're like, it's finally over. It's like you go through the playoffs, every mistake is like hyper-analyzed

And, like, there's just so much pressure to builds and builds and builds. So, like, something could happen. You know, I think Travis Dermott's staying, for one. I think he's a Maple Leaf now, right? I mean, there's no way you could send that guy back. Maybe scratch him once or twice, but that's it. I don't even know how you—for who? No, for Polak.

No, Polak on the left side. It's got to be Borgman, odd man out. Yeah, I mean, they're in a roster jam, which we can get into because it extends to forwards, too. but the thing I just I don't think you can send him back I mean he's been too good

this isn't this isn't normal Toronto where like the old days where anyone who showed anything he can skate and everybody is like

buying his jersey right Nathan Dempsey Mason Raymond go out and get that jersey you know like this

he's a player like look at Austin Matthews quote from last night I don't have it with me Austin Matthews quote he listed all the things that Dermott's good at

and they were all the things you want a DDB good at sportsnet.ca Yeah, it's a league quote. And then he's like, this is the kind of guy you want to play with. I will find that. And he wasn't just being nice.

Like, the Leafs, there's no way he's going back. I mean, I'd be stunned. So he's going to play a playoff game. He might make a mistake. Like, I'm just saying, you know, no one has a career. A perfect career. Right. So it's funny you should say that because I remember, like,

there were obviously Martin Marincin supporters, and there were people who didn't like him much, but they tolerated him. And in one fell swoop, we are done with this player forever and ever, amen. No one liked him ever again. Everyone remembers Game 6. Exactly. There's one thing. Here's what Austin Matthews said from your article.

What do you mean, according to? According to his mouth. If the fake news media is to be trusted. According to my ability to listen to something and transcribe it. It came out wrong. It's early. He's got a lot of confidence Adam was up late last night

He had a YouTube video According to Austin Matthews He's got a lot of confidence He's not afraid to carry the puck He's skilled He can play both ways with the puck Good skater Sees the ice wall

Makes guys around him better So it's always fun going out there With guys who can play like that That's big praise Is that good? From the best guy on the team? It sounds pretty good Whoa, whoa

I think Dermott's now the best guy Oh, he might be He might be He might be the new Austin Matthews on defense. So, so then we're in the skill generation of the NHL. Like it's starting to seep up, right? And Austin Matthews is a skilled player and he wants to play with that guy. Austin probably loves Roman Polak as a dude because Roman is honestly, he would be the,

he would be your low key favorite guy in every office situation. Like he's the best. He's always cracking jokes and like, he's awesome as a person. But, like, Austin's probably looking and being like, I want to be on ice with him. Because he could make a play. Right. And, you know, Austin wants to score 100 goals. Like, you know what I mean?

Yeah. Speaking of skill and all that, so I was happy for Justin Holl and everything, and obviously he got his goal. Where's the butt coming here? Well, no, but it didn't occur to me until I was making the video. I go, wait a sec, Renat Valiev was up like a second ago. Why didn't they go with him for the call-up? Because he's a right-hand shot. That's it, eh?

Well, it matters. I guess it does. Because Rowan Polak couldn't play, right? Yeah. Okay. Good for Hull for being right-handed. And Hainsey is left-handed but plays the right side. So they lost two right-handed Ds.

That's simple. Well, and my sense is that the Marlies have liked Hull for quite a while. I mean, I started hearing buzz about him from the organization even before he was on an NHL deal. Like when he first came in and then he got his NHL deal. Who knows? I don't know where we could say this guy's future is. I don't know if he'll play for them.

He's 6'3", he can move, and he shoots right. So it's not impossible we'll see him still in the NHL. But even if he's your 9th D. He's the exact kind of guy Pittsburgh had to use last year. You know what I mean? Depth guy, no, he's not the best, but can he be adequate? Can he get you through a game? Can he play the minutes Roman Polak's been playing this season

more effectively than Roman Polak's been playing them? What would you say to that? Probably. You know, Roman's taken a ton of penalties. Yes, he has. I'm sure you guys have noticed. No. We might have talked about it a few times.

He had like a, like Gardner's on a six game point streak right now. Polak had like a penalty streak for a while. It was getting on my nerves. Can you tell? Can you tell? Yeah. Sorry, go ahead. Go ahead.

So, I just think the Leafs are, Babcock actually started saying it about two, three weeks ago. And I thought, because sometimes coaches feed you a line when you're in the media, right? He's trying to shape the conversation. And he kept just, like, apropos of nothing, throwing out, you know, there's actually competition for defense spots on this team now. And, like, I was thinking, yeah, kind of. And now that you see these guys in the NHL, maybe he wasn't just blowing smoke. So, okay.

Because I like Borgman, but I assume he's the odd man out when the bodies get healthy. The more time passes, you know, so many rare and unrealistic things happened last season. There was so much like magic about last season. But what I'm starting to see is the most unrealistic thing was how unbelievably healthy the team was. So are all these little moves that we've seen in the last week or two, is that just necessity because of injuries or whatever? Or is Mike Babcock or the Leafs organization as a whole, like, are they fidgeting? I get the impression they're fidgeting.

They're kicking it up a notch, man. They're trying stuff, which is interesting to me. They had to. Like, the Kadri line was useless for a month. A whole damn month. I mean, they were useful in a sense. They weren't getting scored on a lot, which is, you know, one of their primary jobs. I guess.

But, you know, Nazem's playing 18, 19, sometimes 20 minutes a game and doesn't score for a month. even if that's a cold streak at some point you have to do something and then you put Mitch Marner there and all they've done is produce shots and points

for three games and they were so close last night so fun they could have had a couple last night I mean Patrick Marleau on his own

walked in and dangled a couple guys and Mitch Marner looks like he's having fun again and that's when like you know it seemed like from the beginning

of the season that Bozak, JVR, Marner line didn't have the magic they had last year a couple games and then a couple games you know

so that's been fun to watch And, you know, with regards to that, because you talked about it a little bit, and we have to hit on this because you mentioned it, Chris, but there is a roster jam here, right, on both forwards and forwards and defense. Yeah. We've got three unrestricted free agents who are arguably key members of the team right now. Nikita Sashnikov is alive. Yeah. And, yeah, so what do you see playing out in the last 30 games here? Like, they're not going to do anything obnoxious.

Well, not obnoxious. I actually wouldn't even mind this, but they're not going to go trade JVR for assets and let someone else in the lineup. They might. Maybe. I mean, why not? Do you think they might? I mean, I think that's a good idea, but he scored 20 goals this year,

but he does that one thing. They might do that. They might do that. You know, I can tell you in speaking with JVR that he's at least, he's not turning his phone off. I mean, he's thinking this is a possibility. Really?

I mean, I think it's natural. He doesn't have a contract. Unless something's changed in the last few days, they haven't talked about a contract. guys get traded at the deadline who don't have contracts he's probably looking around at the 15 forwards that are at practice and going like hey they got some options here who are under contract right i mean it's not impossible i wouldn't be so quick to do it myself i mean look you you have this one season where he's going to be on your roster at a pretty manageable number

and he has scored 20 goals and he's great on the power play and you might need the one goal he scores in the first round to get you to the second round. He scores playoff-type goals, too. Right. When nothing's going in, he just gets that stupid bang in one, or puts it between his legs. But, it's not impossible, because

they have what he does, but not anyone as good at it as he is. So, and I don't see them resigning him. I mean, that to me, the question is really can they get enough for him that it makes them decide that trade is worth it versus just keeping him in whatever production he'd provide

over the last month and a half. What would that be, though? What does that look like? Well, I mean, it might get you a defenseman. The defenseman you're looking for or, like, Ian Cole? No, not Ian Cole. Because we've heard Ian Cole's name flashed around, and I don't get it. They don't need it.

Well, that's nothing more. Look, I'm sure they've done due diligence on him because he's available and, you know, you have to. But, you know, Ian Cole shoots left. Yeah. Like, we've got Dermott, Borgman, Gardner, and Riley right now, and I think that the Leafs are comfortable playing any four of those guys on their left side for three spots.

A few weeks ago, I looked at Ian Cole, and I was like, oh, maybe, and then Dermott gets called up, and I'm like, nah, no, no. He's good. I don't see them making a trade. Like, this is the weird thing. Like, maybe something very minor, but there isn't even a Brian Boyle, unless you think Mark Letestuuk or something is that. But there's not even that type of figure out there.

And, you know, a lot of the most intriguing names that might get moved, like an Evander Kane, the Leafs don't need a scoring winger. So I just don't see them being that active, even though Mike Babcock wants them to be. Unless they do something totally out of the clear blue sky. Like bringing in a big top-four defenseman or something like that. Or a centerman. They might need a centerman. That would be ideal, but there's not a rental centerman.

So then we're talking about a different kind of trade, right? And that maybe is the trade where you have to trade James Van Riemsdyk I don't see them trading Bozak Because they need Centerman I also don't see them resigning him What about, and this might sound nuts But what about doing a deal with Ottawa To get Matt Duchesne's contract off their books

Can they do it? I'm just throwing it out there I don't think Ottawa will do that No, that's career Keep in mind, if you're Pierre Dorian And it's not been a good year on this front You're worried about optics Yeah

Like in general To keep Duchesne Yeah and like Having that work out Like I mean You're gonna You're gonna exhaust You're gonna try to spin this

Any positive way That like this year Was a disaster But that trade Still made sense And He's been better Since we last talked about it

On the show When he had like Six points In 23 games But he's been He has been a lot better And I'm not saying That he's not a great player

I think he just had a bad 20 game stretch And that made it even worse Because Ottawa's having A bad season But He happens to be a great player On a bad team

Even often those players get moved. I'm just wondering, what does that look like? Or do you just wait? Because we know that they were in on Thornton last summer and desperately wanted him. Is that a guy they chase in the summertime? Do they make this move? They've got Bozak already.

Why make a move now? I mean, Tavares would be the number one guy they're chasing if he hits free agency. Just because they're the same as 25 teams. You're going after him. You're shooting the shot. More or less every team is at least seeing. Even the Penguins should.

Like, screw it. Yeah, who cares? Crosby, Malkin, Tavares. It'd be pretty good. Well, but like if you're the Penguins, you do that, and if he wants to sign, you might trade Malkin. Like, let's not blare a headline, but I'm just saying. That'll be the headline of this show.

And they probably won't. At this point, I don't think they will trade Malkin. But, like, you have to explore the crazy options on July 1st. Because think about it. You've just finished a season. You're still removed from the next season. It's still a bit fantasy land. Right.

And so that's why I think the Leafs would be on him huge. After that, who knows? I mean, Thornton maybe, but look, he just had another serious knee injury. Yeah. And he was having a really good year. I'm sure they'll kick around, but center's going to be a problem next year, probably. Come next September, is Komarov, JVR, and Bozak on the team? No.

None of them? None of them, eh? No. All gone? That's my feeling. Really? Okay. That's interesting.

What about Matt Martin? Because I think you said something about him last night on the broadcast. And I missed it, and I'm dying to hear it. It's Kay. He's got to be careful because media blows this out of proportion. No, well, and the problem with live TV, you don't know quite, because I saw people saying things on Twitter that I didn't actually say or mean to say. But anyway.

I got a tweet. What do you think about the rumors that Matt Martin is being shopped? And I went, ex-pardon me? Here's what I know. the Leafs have gauged interest on Matt Martin with other teams. So I don't know what the level of interest is, but they're at least open to the idea of considering trading him. And, you know, you'd be crazy not to if you're them,

because there's clearly, I mean, look at Mike Babcock. I don't want to start on any story I have, but look at Mike Babcock's quote about him before the Islanders game. He's basically like, you want to play, you want to make a player feel important, but you can only do that with ice time. And how can I give him ice time, essentially? Wow.

I mean, that is a big, that's a big shift. Yeah, what changed? That's crazy. Like, that's a, he keeps the flies off, and, well, I can't put him in the lineup. That's ridiculous. This is the most important quote that Mike Babcock has said repeatedly. The truth today isn't the truth tomorrow. It's one of his favorite ones.

And I, so, he was. I would argue the truth has always been Kapanen was a better option, but, yeah, fine. So, in Mike's mind, he was an essential everyday player until he wasn't. Wow. That's how it should be, right? It's pro sports. I mean, it's awful. It's a terrible business, honestly.

I feel for Matt Martin. You get wooed in free agency. You sign a $10 million deal. You're part of it, and then you're bag skating by yourself, not playing, watching that game from the press box. Against your old team. Islanders, too. That's the most fun game of all.

Those kind of games, everyone's getting points, lots of hugs, chin strap celebrations and like Matt Martin that was crazy think about it though if you're Matt Martin you're like watch that going like

ugh I'm not ever playing again good job guys but wouldn't it be worse if Babcock was sitting there saying Polak and Martin are essential to the lineup which he was doing

a week ago yeah and it was a worse situation so we should be happy that he's changing his mind so constantly my fear is when does he change it back

like I don't want it to I want this to stay right and that's my question is I don't think he does does this Well, it doesn't make sense that he would. But, again, we've seen it.

So, you know, and Mike sees the team a lot closer than we do. He sees the game itself a lot different than we do. But it doesn't make sense that it would go back to the way it was because the team is so much better. I know Roman Polak's going to play again. I know Matt Martin's going to play again. But, you know, Freddie Gauthier and Matt Martin playing together, it was, they were outplayed.

It was bad. It was bad. And I feel bad for Freddie because he seemed last year like he was coming on strong, and it just doesn't seem like he can keep up. Busted his leg, man. I mean, look, the book hasn't been written on him. No, not yet.

Maybe he's able to do things, and he can be a fourth-line center for them in the future, but not right now, not based on what we saw in that stretch of games. Well, he's the size of a fourth-line center. So to answer your Matt Martin question, here's the issue. He makes $2.5 million each of the next two years. He still has, he can't get in the lineup right now

on this team today. it would be beneficial for the Leafs cap wise if they have determined they have 12 better options or 14 better options to move them but the problem is other teams you know I'm not sure how easy

that contract is to move well I wonder if a team like Calgary where you've got you know an organization that probably could use a personality like him and you know has the they still have that little bit of we want to be tough as nails as well right I mean I know

Brian Burke is not the general manager there Edmonton Edmonton would be great hell yeah hell yeah

you think so no no no sorry that was I should I should differentiate for what I'm like kind of goofing around telling you things

I know he's joking I don't have any knowledge that Edmonton's interested but like they do seem to fixate on toughness and

the sorts of things Matt Martin does well do you know what's funny Matt Martin's having a better season this year than last year yeah more productive

oh yeah underlying numbers more productive counting stats he's been a more effective player that's probably why it hurts the most for him because he's played better he's on pace for like roughly his career high which by the way is 19 points right but it's not even a case my point is this he's not a case where he's done anything wrong he they signed him to be himself and he's been the best self he can probably be this year honestly i mean josh legal's done nothing right it's a hard team to make yeah and that's and

that's kind of the reality i think he's getting used to it i imagine he's pretty bitter you know i spoke with him in carolina november you got scratched for one game there was his first career scratch and he was almost fighting off tears i mean as emotional i mean look this is a guy that gives his body and gives he's trying to be you know often the the tough players are they're giving everything of themselves for the the benefit of the team they don't get a lot of ice time they don't get a lot of glory especially with with fighting no longer celebrated like it once was and i'm sure it feels like a betrayal for him and i think they're open to moving him i just don't know if that can happen you know sashnikov's another name that's out there

that the leafs have looked at trading you know it has to be they can't lose them on they're not going to put them on waivers no he's not going to go to the marley he might go to the marley's on a conditioning stint which could only be five games or two weeks so it's not but you know not because he's been injured for two months but he's not going back there permanently and you know There are teams I think that he could definitely play in their top 12, would have interest. But from what I understand, the Leafs aren't giving him away. They're not saying, we need rid of this guy,

give us a six-round pick. Josh Levo as well, right? I don't know where Levo stands. I'm concerned he's in Frank Corrado territory somewhat in that he just has played so few games. But he signed, they just signed him. That's crazy. Right, but they signed him to have options.

They signed him for three, if there's three entries, you're in. I'm sure they can trade him I just don't know what his value is because they apparently had offers on him last year yeah for sure

they did I believe we heard that from one CJ oh was it you and I know there are teams very interested in Sashnikov

but I don't think the Leafs are inclined to trade him I mean they'd like to keep if you looked at Lou Lamarillo's history here he hasn't given away anybody

including Frank Corrado like that thing got to a poisonous point and he still would not give him away for nothing he traded him And so, you know, I don't think that they want rid of Sasha Koff, but they have a crutch.

They have 15 forwards with him, if you count him healthy, which for all intents and purposes, he's healthy now. Which is why it kind of makes sense not to sign guys like Bozak and, well, I mean, Bozak, to me, of all those guys, and I know this sounds crazy, he makes the most sense to re-sign because he's a center. For sure. Like, that's the guy, that's a third-line center.

That's not, you know, and he's got huge blemishes defensively sometimes, like crazy. but you've got wingers. You've got Grunstrom and Andreas Johnson and those guys who can come up and obviously Kasperi Kapanen. Igor Korshkov, down the line. Right.

Jeremy Bracco. Steve, are you struggling over there? Yeah, I'm struggling. I knew that once an episode, I'd friggin' hit the switch. So then, last 30 games. Chris, are we going to go back to the Matt Martin-Polak thing

where we played Dumb and Chasing Boring or is this going to stick? Do you think this sticks? I think this sticks. Okay, good. I mean, Mike Babcock doesn't have a cold, dark heart. I mean, how could he watch these games, especially the Dallas game and the Islanders game,

and want to go back? I mean, it might not work. I mean, look, those are two-week teams. They haven't faced Tampa with that lineup, and let's see what it looks like when they do. Tampa's actually scuffling a little bit compared to where they were lately. Are they here next week or two weeks? Anyway, they're coming soon.

I don't know. Well, they get them, what is it, three more times? Yeah, and they're in Toronto soon in February. We haven't even played the Sabres yet, too. Fun, fun. Not that I'm... But that's the weird schedule. I believe there's four March games against the Sabres.

They're going to hate it. It's like a playoff series. They're going to hate them. Awesome, unless it's not. Unless it's not. And they got Boston on Saturday, which is all of a sudden a huge game. I like to chide a buddy of mine who works at the other network, because all four of those Sabres-Leafs games are on the other network.

Oh, no! Those will be must-viewing, the best of four between the Leafs and Sabres in March. Oh, my God. Watch them be pivotal for the playoff picture. Oh, my God. Yeah. Okay, all right. And hey, Curtis McElhinney.

I feel like we've had no focus here. Has this been an okay podcast? Is it okay? No, hey, listen, you're used to being on radio shows with focus. I ask myself that question every show. We also have to wrap soon. We do? It's near 11.

Oh, it's near 11, okay. I have to get to my job. Yeah, you've got stuff to do. Quickly, Curtis McElhinney, are these his last four games in Toronto, these last four back-to-backs? This is his last season as a Leaf, I would think. What I'm curious to see is if Mike Babcock

starts to rest Freddie Anderson a little bit more down the stretch not play him every single game that isn't a back-to-back just because he has

played the most minutes in the league faced the most shots and you know but he there's no indication that they're inclined

to do that but it could happen I mean the Leafs they what 15-16 points up in the playoffs it's crazy I mean they're

they're moonwalking into the playoffs right now so there's not necessarily a need to play him. So yeah, Curtis is on borrowed time a little bit, but he's under contract next season.

I'd be surprised if Garrett Sparks or perhaps Calvin Pickard wasn't the Leafs' backup next year, but we'll see. It's a long way off. What are the odds they trade one of those two? Possible. Yeah? God. I mean, the problem with goalie

trades is you never get great value. No. Well, look what the Leafs gave up for Pickard. Six-round pick, was it? And Tobias Lindbergh who was probably going to spend most of this season as a healthy scratch in the minors So Tobias Lindbergh is a contract slot. Yeah, that's what it was. That's it and they're at 50 right now And it's currently 15 points. They're up on a playoff spot. There you go. Oh my god. We're good Wow, I never in my life thought that that would ever happen leaves 15 points up on a playoff spot

I never thought they'd be 15 points up on a playoff spot and still third. Yeah By the way, I do think we're gonna see a change in the playoff for that Okay good It's time What? That was the Third thing to just Throw in there

What do you think? This Well I don't I'm not sure If anything It's back to one to eight In the conferences But the league

Last year when there was Some wonky stuff The league was like Eh One year blip This year when you have The top three teams In the Atlantic

Being three of the Seven best teams in the league And the bottom five teams Being five of the Bottom seven teams In the league And the Metro's a mess I

There's gonna be a push To change this And I think the league is now starting to go, hey, maybe this isn't just a one-off. And so the Atlantic will be key. It wouldn't be the quality of teams that they'd change it for, though, right?

It would just be the way... You're just looking for fair, man. Yeah. You know, at the end of the day, Washington and Pittsburgh were two of the best teams in the league, and that should have been the conference final. It's just not working the way it was designed.

Fair enough. Quickly on a couple other teams. Oilers, do they start building now for next year, or do they try to make the playoffs? Build now for next year, but they only have limited pieces to sell. I mean, Patrick Maroon, Letestua, we've mentioned a few times.

But I think that they're going to try to stay the course. I don't see any Ryan Nugent-Hopkins deal. I don't think they're going to chase bad money with bad money. You know, that hasn't worked for them. I do sense that in the last few weeks, Peter Shirelli's got a vote of confidence from his bosses and everyone there is like, all right, we need some stability.

Let's not make a panic move. So I could see them selling some assets, but they still have Connor McDavid, Leon Dreisaitl. Clefbom's probably going to have a better year next year. Larson's struggled this year. I mean, they couldn't get a save from Talbot. A lot's gone wrong. I actually don't think they're nearly as bad as it looks.

A full year of Sequeira. And they have an offseason to consider some other moves. Yeah, absolutely. Good Branson in Vancouver. Trade it or sell it? What are you looking at me for? What are you smiling and looking at me for? Well, because I would have said traded, but then now the GM's like, we're signing him.

So, I mean, I guess you lose some leverage if you're Jim Benning when you come out and say that. And so maybe Goodbranson's agents are like, hey, let's say no, no, no, no, no, because he's kind of painting himself in his corner. Poor Bim. Mr. Jim, he does this. Poor Bim. I'd say signed because I'm not sure that his value, even as a rental commodity, is enough to justify the trade.

It might look bad. They gave up, what, a first-round pick to get him? What happens if they flip him for a fourth or something? They gave up a first-round pick. I think it was a second-round actual draft pick, but they got Jared McCann, who was a recent first-round pick. Okay, there you go. Which is more than what you said.

My point is if you get back less and he's still only 25, it might look better if you're the GM to sign him and try to convince everyone it was a good trade. And lastly— And Jim Benning doesn't have a contract, so we should remember he's not— Ooh. he's not in the business much like Pierre Dorian of pointing out his failings.

I mean, it's in his best interest to just make it seem like he's made good moves. And look, that team is, I think, on the right direction in the big picture. Last question, and I forgot to ask this, but I have to ask this. We're going back to the Leafs because we're unfocused and it's my last show before honeymoon.

You mentioned on the- Congrats on the wedding, man. Thank you very much. I appreciate it. Why are you still working? I'm leaving tomorrow morning. I went straight from my wedding to the airport to California to wine country man

like I was like we maybe should have but we just were like you know what we'll take a couple days you're way too practical with your 10 jobs exactly you mentioned on a broadcast a couple weeks ago and this is why I desperately wanted you on the show you talked about the new leadership in the Leafs room versus

the old guard how much can you extrapolate on that what does that look like and are there agendas that are different in that room there's different agendas in every room I don't think that there's infighting, but I see that Frederick Anderson blow up in Philadelphia as like a seminal moment for the new guard in the Leafs' room. Look, you had him, Austin Matthews, and Morgan Riley go on vacation together.

They went straight from that game where they blew against Ottawa, which ironically was on a Morgan Riley mistake. They went straight from the dressing room that night to a private plane and flew to the Bahamas together and spent the bye week together. You don't think they're talking about work much the same way we would talk about work? You know, if we were in Nashville right now and what's going on. So they come back from the break. They play one game and blow it. They play another game and blow it. And Frederick Anderson blows up and makes a veiled remark about certain guys not playing the power play and this and that.

There's definitely, I mean, look, these guys want to win. And that's not to say the older guys don't want to win. But if you're Austin Matthews and even Morgan Riley and especially Freddie Anderson and you come into that room and you look at some of the older players and you're like, what have these guys done? They were on the 30th place team that got Austin Matthews. And I know Riley was on that team, but he wasn't as key a part of it as he is now. So we were talking about the future captain, the current and future number one defenseman who's going to wear an A and the current and future number one goaltender for the years to come. I mean, that's those guys. It's great that those guys get along.

And I think that they they were tired of it. They don't want to sleepwalk through the season. I mean, that was so out of character for Frederick Anderson to do that. And I think it was a huge moment for the team. Again, I'm not saying that there's like a big turf war here, but they want urgency. They want to win. They don't want to just be like, hey, we're blowing games, no big deal.

And is that how the older guard was taking it? Well, yeah, those guys have done a lot of losing. And look, they've been through this so many times that they probably don't overreact to things. Right. Oh, fair enough. I was about to say, I wonder if someone said like, You guys don't know losing You've met Peter Horachin

Slow your roll We've seen worse than this But JVR just sitting in the corner But you don't want that You don't want to get Comfortable with that No and these guys

Are the leaders of the team I mean You could put the Captaincy on Matthews now I mean I know they're not But you could I mean he's He's the man

Did you see him At the All-Star game Like everyone's mimicking His celebrations Like he's like the guy Like he walks around Like he owns the place And he's what

He does 23 goals Oh 20 Yeah 23 goals He's 20 years old 42 games I thought it was great that the two first goals, they gave the pucks to grizzled vets. Austin Matthews, while they didn't give it to him, he went and got it,

and the ref handed it to Zach Hyman. You know, he'd been there forever, Zach Hyman. Well, and the other thing, too, is, like, Matthews got this goaltender interference review goal changed. His celebration literally forced the meeting at the All-Star game. It was mentioned in the memo that went to officials this week that the Austin Matthews goal should have counted. Wow. This guy is the guy, man. Wow.

So I'm just saying, I'm not saying that Austin went to Freddie like, hey, it wasn't that planned. No. But what we're seeing here is a shift in dynamics in the room and power and who's really driving the bus. And Austin Matthews is clearly driving the bus on the ice, I think far more off the ice than last year because he knows his place. Freddie Anderson is now in his second year and he's a top 10 goaltender in the league now. He's bordering on elite. And Morgan Rielly has stepped into his own. He's a number one D.

I mean the key to sports we used to think that oh you slap a letter on a guy and that's what it is the key is if you're really good you can do whatever

you want in the dressing room like that's it's that simple it's so true it's that simple if you're LeBron James you can run a whole franchise this is what hurt

David Clarkson like he meant well but he wasn't that good and so like you couldn't just like say oh he's now a leader and he's gonna lead no

the leaders are the guys that do it right not to borrow Mike's phrase and that are really really good and no one's gonna mess with them And right now, Austin Matthews, Morgan Riley, Freddie Anderson,

who just happened to go to the Bahamas two days before Freddie Bahamas. Freddie, you know, went crazy in Philly. Those guys are the best players on the team or among the best players on the team. And they want to see this thing go to another direction. That was a turning point in the season. Mike Babcock switching the lines before Chicago. Dallas was a turning point in the season. And if I'm a Leafs fan right now, I'd be incredibly optimistic

for what's to come down the stretch because they have an easy schedule. They are finding their way And they're They're trying to win a Stanley Cup right now And they get slaughtered by the Rangers Oh, what? I just had to do it You're always looking for a Satan

What was that? That was me just throwing a stick bomb I thought you were going to be Mr. Positive Thought And I'm not going to think Sometimes you just got to fart in the elevator It's just funny Chris went on the LFR and said,

Steve, take a deep breath. It's going to be okay. I think that was the turning point of the season. When you told me to take a deep breath. I was like, quick sides there. I'm not afraid of anyone who saw that. I had to tape that in the corner of an airport. And it took a couple takes because I'm like setting up my own system.

Anyway, I get on the plane. You know, we fly somewhere. It lands. The guy goes, Sounded like you were talking to your buddy off a ledge there. You were. So some guy like saw me record that, sat beside me for 90 minutes. And it's weird.

Always when you're landing, that's when people feel it's safe to talk to the person next to them on the plane. Because at least they're not going to be stuck with you for very long. Exactly. He was like, what a good friend. He's basically like, what's your buddy worried about? I said, oh, it's a hockey thing. He's like, oh, I don't know hockey. Oh, my God.

That's funny. Well, Chris, thank you so much for coming on. One thing. Can you give me a moment to go get my backpack? I have something I got to give CJ. It's from for you coming on the show so many times. Oh, sure. Oh.

Oh, my goodness. No, but they're back. This is weird. So, Chris, yeah, sorry we were unfocused today, man. This is just kind of how we are. It's okay. I'm just extending my parking because I don't want to get a ticket. Oh, our apologies.

No, thank goodness the city of Toronto has gone to mobile parking. Isn't that the best? It's actually really smart. It is great. So, Chris, you've been on the show many times. So, the guys don't know I got you this, but... Wow. But you're welcome.

I wanted to thank you for being a guest so often. So, this is from myself, Tim, and Sid for coming on our show. Oh, wow. You're an official Tim and Citizen. Yes, I finally made it. Thanks, Tim. Thanks, Sid. Wow, I'm not a citizen of this show.

Tango and Wild have never given me squat. We thought about that. Yeah. We're like, give it to Tim and Sid. Hey, Chris, thanks so much for being on. How's the new gig? Oh, my God, it's a lot of fun. That's good.

No complaints, yeah. Are you following the social channels? He's having fun with it. I'm having a lot of fun. I do follow the social channels. Yeah, man. The other day I was like, oh, Jesse, I saw this hilarious picture. He's like, I did that.

Yeah, that was, I did that. I don't even remember what it was now. It was the... McDavid and his, uh, the two... Oh, the couple at the airport. The Filipino couple, yes. Yes! Oh, it was hilarious.

Yeah, it was hilarious. We gotta let Jesse go to his new job. We gotta wrap up. Chris, thanks so much for coming on. We hope we can get you on before the playoffs, too, to just kind of do a prep for that. We should. Yeah, if you can, if you can make time for us. Maybe right towards the playoff time when everything's in focus.

Let's do it. Beautiful. And you've got a good head start on the playoff beard, so it'll be perfect. I know. It's because we were on the road last week, so I didn't trim it. Oh, it's good. It's good. I'm starting to get notes on Twitter.

I think I've got to tame it. No, Twitter's the worst. Do you want to comment on your appearance on the air? Oh, my God. It's amazing how many people know I'm short and have a raspy voice and have whatever. Thank you for pointing out what I am. that I had no control over, by the way. Well, because I take so many pictures next to Jesse now,

everyone thinks I'm four feet tall. So, yeah, I'll join you on that trip. It's okay. Anyway, it's fine. There's more good than bad on Twitter. Thanks so much. We'll see you in like a month and a half. Yeah.

Follow the guys on Twitter, at Steve underscore Dangle, at Adam W-Y-L-D-E, and at Jesse Blake. the steve dangle podcast brought to you by panago pizza order at panago.com and stuff your face with deliciousness