The Steve Dangle Podcast - Picktionary | May 8, 2026

Starting point is 00:00:00 We're in the dog days of the playoffs, and that's why you need a truck to get you through the dog days of life. The Toyota Tacoma, Steve Dangle. All right, right, right, right. That's right. The I-Force engine boasts an impressive towing capacity of 6,400 pounds. You've heard us talk about it. You know it.

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Starting point is 00:00:27 When it's time to load up, There's the available power liftgate, makes loading gear in and out really easy. And of course, you've got the 10 speaker JBL premium audio system, where I hope you're listening to the Steve Dangle podcast, where Steve makes many noises that might wreck a stereo, but they're not the JBL one, not the JBL one. There's also the 14 inch touchscreen, Apple CarPlay, Android Auto, and you've got Toyota Safety Sense as well. So it's one of the safer cars that you can get.

Starting point is 00:00:54 Experience power capability and convenience with the Toyota Tacoma. visit shop toyota.ca or your local ontario toyota dealer because red tag days are on through now right now through the end of may sometimes life throws your curveballs and you don't have time to get to them and that's where task rabbit comes in and i think you should check this out because here's the deal one of the things one of the weird quirks about my condo building is that they use my floor to repel down and clean all the windows but they never clean my windows oh and they're way around on that it's like well it's a patio window you can do that yourself and i'm like well Hang on a second.

Starting point is 00:01:28 What if I don't want to? I don't have the stuff. Because you've got to have that scraper thing and the washer thing. The chemicals. You've got to have the right chemicals. See, that's what I'm saying. That's why I used TaskRabbit, and I employed a tasker. Here's the thing.

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Starting point is 00:02:15 You should download that, TaskRabbit.ca, code DANGLE. Two in five Canadians will hear the words, you have cancer. That's why every step and dollar raised matters. On September 19th, join thousands in Toronto for the Princess Margaret Cancer Foundation Walk. Challenge yourself, friends, and family to walk 21 kilometers in support of life-saving research. Together, we can carry the fire and help create a world free from the fear of cancer. Register today at pmcfwalk.ca. Pete, the Steve Dangle podcast with your host, Steve Dangle, Adam Wilde and Jesse Blake.

Starting point is 00:03:00 Let's go. All right. Let's get going, baby. Let's get going. We've got a show on a Friday and no Jesse Blake. And we're just going to talk about it right off the top. Jesse, our good friend, is not feeling very well, which is very rare. Right. Extremely. That doesn't happen very often. So a well wishes to Mr. Jesse Blake. But he'll be back, don't you? It was just one of those things where it's like He got so sick

Starting point is 00:03:25 And so ill that he couldn't make it So we're doing this early in the morning Steve, you've got a Medical procedure later today Life's good, we're healthy It's the playoffs, everybody's fighting something We're all feeling very youthful Yeah, you know what, it is the playoffs

Starting point is 00:03:40 You just gotta friggin' do it I'm literally doing a podcast Then going under They're putting me out And then I'm going to stream tonight. What are they going to put you under for? Do you want to talk about it? Yeah, they're putting a camera down my throat to be like,

Starting point is 00:03:58 why is this fat piece of crap? I have a tummy ache all the time. So, yeah, that's what they're going to do. Man, just more boiled chicken and carrots for you, sir. I can't wait. I'm frigging miserable. i want man last show because it was the first uh game of the saber series we were talking about like best wings flavors and which is to say it was mostly drew and justin were talking about

Starting point is 00:04:27 best wings flavors in the chat in my head the whole time it was just like f you both i'm not I'm not allowed to eat those. I haven't eaten them in months. And I'm very upset. But. But. But. First overall pick.

Starting point is 00:04:45 That's right. That's right. And really, I mean, it's our first show since the first overall pick. But I was, you know, Steve, I wasn't sure what to do here. Because I feel like we got to talk like playoffs first, don't we? Yeah. Or, yeah. Like, I feel like that's that.

Starting point is 00:05:01 There is some Leafs talk. there's actually a lot to kind of sift through because there's been, you know, since the conversation shifted like Monday, I have to be honest with you Monday and Tuesday. I can't believe it's Friday already because Wednesday and Thursday passed. Like I was just a, I was a zombie,

Starting point is 00:05:18 right? Like we've been doing a lot of streams at night and we've been, you know, then you're like, you get the first overall pick after that insane press conference, right? You get the first overall pick, you wake up Wednesday morning.

Starting point is 00:05:30 You're like, okay, hey, I guess I better learn about the top five guys in the draft as much as possible. And, you know, I've been listening to podcasts and, you know, this and that. And, you know, obviously Scott Wheeler was on Leaf Report. Highly recommend that.

Starting point is 00:05:42 Or just read Scott's article in The Athletic. Or just wait until he's on our show. Yeah, because he's probably going to come on our show. Did you already ask him? Here, let me. You just text him. I was already texting with him earlier this week. So there's just, it was sort of, it's been like fire hose.

Starting point is 00:05:58 And then, of course, we've had some incredible playoff series in there. But if we want to start with last night, you know, when we talk about the Carolina Hurricanes, like people were joking at the beginning of this Philadelphia series going, imagine Carolina goes all the way to the Eastern Conference Final and doesn't lose a game. Their one went away from doing it. And, you know, in game two, Philadelphia was looking like a team that could win a game. maybe not win a series what a game maybe push it to five maybe push it to six and then last night steve they start strong again had a really good first couple periods and then it's fun it's like

Starting point is 00:06:40 it just the canes just broke them open and the thing i want to talk to you about specifically was did you see the freddie anderson sticking his toe out of the crease and then exploding backwards and i thought you know what good on you freddie i it's weird flyers fans are going to absolutely hate this reaction but like this is an important lesson to learn for a young team especially one that you know is the flyers and claims to play a certain way and wants to play a certain way best teams cheat that is what it is yep you know uh best teams flop best teams get in your face best teams find a way to get away with stuff away from the whistle uh like look who's getting punished look at who's starting the season suspended it's two players on teams that went

Starting point is 00:07:36 out in the first round that's a good point sorry fellas it's a skill you got caught you got caught try not to do that next time best teams don't the florida we all know the florida panthers to be bar none the dirtiest team in the nhl back-to-back cup champs no one cares cry about it i hate cry about it guy and i would absolutely be cry about it guy if i was a panthers fan i think you should go cry about it like what what are they are you gonna start next game on the power play no because freddie anderson stuck his toe out no no you're not no so i don't know man it sucks i don't know what else to tell you it's a flop it's an enormous flop and a bad call and it happened and it happens every year and carolina might be figuring it out in front of

Starting point is 00:08:33 our eyes and this is the thing right like we kept asking ourselves for years and years and years When are they, when are the Canes going to figure it out and get to the next level? And I think having the Panthers not in the playoffs, because the Panthers, the Panthers are like, they have a doctorate in this dirty and not like they've got, they've done multiple multiple dissertations. They've, uh, they, they, they dug up the, the, uh, uh, the remains of the 1970s flyers 72 and 74 when they won the cup. Those are the teams, like the Broad Street Bullies, the original ones, Bobby Clark and

Starting point is 00:09:10 company, they're the ones, if you go back and you watch those series, they're goons, all of them, legal, what is it, legal murder. And I remember talking to you, Steve, remember we had Dennis Marouk on? Yeah. Dennis Marouk, by the way, Ken Reed wrote a book about him. Dennis is great. And he's the like forgotten 60 goal scorer. He scored it in Washington.

Starting point is 00:09:30 And we asked Dennis about Philadelphia and he said it was very real that players would get Flyers flu, meaning that they would just pretend to be hurt or injured or not good to go against the Philadelphia Flyers, even in the regular season. And the Flyers, I mean, again, different game, different rules, different way of covering it, and obviously no instant replay back then. But the core of what those Flyers were remains the same today. And there are teams that take pieces of that, and there are teams that take that and make at their whole identity, which, you know, the Boston Bruins since 2010 up until recently,

Starting point is 00:10:07 that was, that was their thing. And the, and I think the Panthers do it even better than the Bruins of the 2010s. Like I say, like, you know, you've got your boy checks and your Lou cheaches and all the other guys that were amazing. Chara Bergeron was dirty at times. McAvoy is a dirty player. I don't care what anyone says, but he's great at it. Like I say that as a term of respect, the Panthers were able to teach some of that.

Starting point is 00:10:33 to the Carolina Hurricanes, I think. And the Canes aren't dirty, but the Canes know how to get you, right? Well, Taylor Hall's averaging a questionable hit per round now. Yeah, that's very true. And he's already got his one in. They're gritty. They compete.

Starting point is 00:10:52 They're not necessarily going to win any straight-up wars. You know, if you really drag them into the muck, you're not going to... It's just not going to happen, I don't think. But who's left in the East that's going to do that? Who's left in the playoffs that's going to do that? That's going to drag them in a muck? I'm starting to really believe in the Hurricanes, man.

Starting point is 00:11:22 Yeah, me too. I'm starting to. I've always been like a, yeah, but getting over the hump. Okay, Buffalo had an incredible. like let's not start eliminating teams that aren't eliminated but buffalo was very convincing in game one is it a florida type game we'll know but they got some guys who can do it like that series i think would be electricity the you think buffalo carolina you mean yeah if you just go by the teams that are currently leading by the way one's leading one nothing the other's leading three

Starting point is 00:11:57 nothing at a boy gear um uh and then you look out west uh who's the closest thing to the carnival team vegas no if vegas i mean if i and we'll talk about the anaheim vegas series i haven't seen that from vegas at all not even a little bit and they should be doing that to anaheim by the way then And Mini? And they're down 2-0. I know. And they're not. Mini's not dirty, right?

Starting point is 00:12:28 Like, they've got guys. Like, Hartman's insane. They can. Trennan can kill you. But, like, are they dragging you in? Like, you know, what's the thing you always say about Matthew and Brady Kachuk? They love dropping punches and complaining to the ref at the same time? Yeah.

Starting point is 00:12:43 The old Stamkos. It's so silly. No one's doing that. I mean, Colorado maybe could if they decided to play that type of game. But is that their game? Not really. Like, this is their. You don't always win the Stanley Cup with your best team.

Starting point is 00:13:03 Like, I can't tell you if this is Carolina's best team over the Bryndamore era. I can't. What I can tell you is I think this is their best shot. Yeah. I don't know if they're going to have a better one than this. and i don't think that should be controversial on account of their one win away from sweeping their way to the eastern sweeping their way to the conference final so they'll be the freshest team

Starting point is 00:13:30 in the eastern conference final in what 50 years like they're gonna have who else has done this i saw something i think it's since like it was either 85 or 95 like this just doesn't this doesn't happen right there there there are some guys who by the end of the series could be fresher than they were in like february or something when the olympic break came yeah it's it's rod brendamore's money is going to be made off the ice potentially but again again you got to win the series they haven't won the series you lose game four to philly you're not going to feel happy about it then all of a sudden game five and oh you can't take your foot off the gas you can't take your foot off the gas you have an opportunity here they don't strike me as a team that will i

Starting point is 00:14:21 think the thing though and the other side of this steve is that like the pittsburgh penguins were a 98 point team so were the flyers so the route to this is a heck of a lot easier for the carolina hurricanes if you want to play the other side of that and i don't i don't think that that's a very popular thing to say let's be honest i haven't heard many people talk about it that way and i know canes fans are not going to like this but we have to look at that you know like look at look at who um look at who buffalo played in the first round it doesn't matter really what the what the the point total was but i think boston still i'm pretty sure they had more points than pittsburgh and philadelphia okay so and i would say that boston's season was on par with pittsburgh's at

Starting point is 00:15:06 very least philadelphia charged at the end right got past columbus got past the islanders but but boston is sort of in a retool rebuild they still have a little bit of that old identity left over although if you ask bruins fans it's all over and they need to blow it up uh and we'll talk about that too yeah i'm i'm kind of like i feel like buffalo had a really tough task in in boston boston is a very good playoff team there are players on that team that are so strong you know You guys, like, you know, Zdorov in a playoff series, that's a guy you don't want to get locked in a cell with, right? McAvoy, obviously, the season he had,

Starting point is 00:15:42 that poor guy had his jaw blown up more than anybody else. Like, he looked like a marshmallow at points this year, played hard. Pasternak is Pasternak in the playoffs. You know, you've got guys that were very injured as well for Boston. And there were games, the two games that I think Buffalo lost, like, didn't Boston kind of dominate them? And then the other side of that, the other first round series that I kind of point to is is Tampa Montreal which was at which was a murder fest right yeah it was

Starting point is 00:16:09 crazy yeah and so you you you know those teams really went through the furnace to even get to the second round and I think I mean I don't know what to expect from Montreal tonight we can get it get to it next but you know I do think that we gotta give a little room for well hey wait a second here. The Pittsburgh Penguins had an injured Crosby, an old Gino, a, I think washed LeTang, although LeTang looked a little better later in the series.

Starting point is 00:16:36 You know, and Stuart Skinner and that, like it's not, and then we got, you know, the Rick Tockett Flyers who play stingy defense going up against the kings of stingy defense. Right. You know, the team that is the best, probably defensive team, team-wise

Starting point is 00:16:52 in the league, you know, systems-wise? Is that fair? Year in, year out. they're consistently that so you know we got to leave a little room for hey somebody could surprise us and i you know is it is the only way to beat them the the panthers way steve or is it you know you can beat them some other way uh it's the best way to beat them it's the most effective way to beat them but you know i i will say this you you go out and look at uh the first round series between the stars and the wild and we all great series great series but we all looked at the standings and the fact that one of them was going to be out and we're like well this is bs

Starting point is 00:17:32 this is crap they shouldn't be playing each other and you look out east carolina's getting the path they deserve right um they earned this path this is they did this is what we've been asking for if you are one of the top teams you should be playing a weaker opponent that being said and i'm going to repeat this like we've said in past shows heading into the playoffs we were like oh you don't want to play the sends right now the other team was philly and they're killing them both yeah right yep so this is more and more i'm like it's their year i know sends fans aren't gonna love this but let's let's just be honest about how that senator series went they embarrassed them wiped the floor with them senators senators didn't lead the whole series like i so insane

Starting point is 00:18:22 like like imagine okay imagine i had said at the beginning of the playoffs and i had the senators winning that series by the way moron um but imagine i said to you i don't even think the senators are going to lead once in this series you guys would have laughed me out of the room well you'd be a leafs homer hater right whatever oh yeah it's just your bias against the sense like listen no one on this show had more pressure for this series than me because i said canes and four and i got insider j money friggin in my walls that guy is all over my mentions i've seen him more than some family members over this past week he's a big flyers guy and carolina goes up one nothing i'm like okay good

Starting point is 00:19:07 that's good keep going and they go they go up to nothing and i'm like it's not enough i still hate this flyer score i'm oh fiddle six right you know but who knows maybe it's flyers and seven although i seem to recall jay money saying flyers and six last night yeah yeah yeah yeah okay well listen i mean that it's it's the the senators the um uh the the the pittsburgh penguins out in the first round philadelphia not playing the defense that i think we're accustomed to and i also listen the thing is with the flyers and and flyers fans got to remember this too you're you're playing with house money nobody picked you to make the playoffs this year nobody um they're not treating it that way though they're not they're treating it like

Starting point is 00:19:52 we should win today but that's philadelphia isn't it yeah it is it is and they beat pittsburgh in the first round and gritty's throwing the penguin off the top deck like they got amped up man yeah i don't know if you're there you might as well win like i i like that attitude i don't i don't love the oh we're just happy to be here approach it's a much easier time uh it's a happier time but like That's how we started this Leafs era off. Oh, we're just happy to be here. And, you know, by the end of it, we weren't even happy to be there because we knew what to expect.

Starting point is 00:20:31 Yeah. If you're there, you might as well win. Yeah, I agree. I agree. Steve Dangle, Mother's Day this weekend. Sure is. Are you, like, I know you got Mother's Day plans on Saturday and Sunday. Here's the problem, Adam.

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Starting point is 00:21:18 gift box and and you share these these effortlessly and by the way it was so popular at christmas that the aura frame app reached number one on the app store on christmas day first overall that's right there it is now check out the best-selling carver matt frame we want to get you 25 off that with the code sdp it's aura frames a u r a frames dot ca promo code sdp support the show by mentioning us at checkout terms and conditions apply sometimes life throws your curveballs and you don't have time to get to them and that's where task rabbit comes in and i think you should check this out because here's the deal one of the things one of the weird quirks about my condo building is that they use my floor to repel down and clean all the windows but they never clean

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Starting point is 00:22:43 the promo code DANGLE. Taskers across Canada book up fast, especially for same-day tasks. Get $15 off your first task right now with the promo code DANGLE at TaskRabbit.ca or the TaskRabbit app. You should download that. TaskRabbit.ca. Code DANGLE. Two in five Canadians will hear the words, you have cancer. That's why every step and dollar raised matters. On September 19th, join thousands in Toronto for the Princess Margaret Cancer Foundation Walk. Challenge yourself, friends, and family to walk 21 kilometers in support of life-saving research. Together, we can carry the fire and help create a world free from the fear of cancer. Register today at pmcfwalk.ca. Now let's talk about that Montreal Buffalo game,

Starting point is 00:23:30 because honestly, man, I was really surprised. I was really, really surprised. So if anybody missed this one um buffalo didn't just win they beat up on him and that was something that you know maybe maybe i'm wrong and i can't it's seven games and there was so much going on in the first run i can't remember tampa beating up on montreal no there were stretches where they dominated them but they didn't dominate them seven they dominated them well so that was weird like if like watching just every minute of that series or rather of that game of that series and of that game it didn't feel like tampa ran montreal through a wall it just felt like tampa had a pretty average normal amount of offense and just prevented montreal from getting anything done

Starting point is 00:24:24 tampa plays a lot east west um montreal had a way easier time stifling them at the offensive blue line in the neutral zone at their own blue line those passes in the high slot in the habs defensive zone they weren't there uh habs were able to break it up the sabers are just a torpedo that goes straight to the heart of the problem and very early on in the game it was obvious montreal didn't have an answer for it like uh i didn't love goal three and four that dobish allowed um but that in itself is a crazy sentence the habs had not allowed four goals in a game in the first round which is nuts they lost three of those games they could have allowed four they didn't um but the first two goals they're tap-ins because the sabers carved through montreal's

Starting point is 00:25:28 defenses like butter um i didn't like strubel and jack eye in the in the first round but then you know you get noah dobson back and i'm like okay that's a huge leg up for montreal i didn't think he had a particularly good game seven against tampa and i didn't think he was particularly effective in game one against buffalo i based on game one i'm not sure what the answer is there i mean all all eyes have turned to one line that's there was actually a problem the whole first round okay but because montreal was competitive the entire time and these guys were actually they looked okay and they were getting their power play cookies but the even strength scoring of caulfield suzuki slavkovsky or rather the lack thereof you cannot go deep in the playoffs with

Starting point is 00:26:29 that you can't caulfield has i believe it's nine shots in eight games no it just is just an even strength no goals no assists no points suzuki has a goal that was scored in game seven which i guess that's a pretty good time to do it and one assist um i don't remember what his shots are but he plays a solid two-way game i don't have too many complaints about his game but he scored a lot aren't there and the points need to be there yeah and slath one game one on his own he had a hat trick but not a single even strength point that has to change it has to so how do you do that like what what is it that they're doing it because here's the thing like let's just call it what it is slap is huge right yep but suzuki's normal size and caulfield's a

Starting point is 00:27:22 little bit undersized is it a size thing that the sabers are enormous yeah like they're they're very tall and it's not just tage right there are there are some big defense back there uh they i had somebody say to me a couple years ago when the sabers were trashed they're like how many towering defensemen are they going to draft before they're good again and it seems like you can't have too many because look at what they're able to do to teams now caulfield visually uh like there were a few times he was out there against logan stanley page thompson and sometimes both it looked ridiculous now he had actually i thought in game one against buffalo more open ice and more time with the puck in the offensive zone than most periods uh against tampa so that

Starting point is 00:28:13 was encouraging um but i think you have to break that line up um one really oh yeah i like i was surprised by saint louis in game one against buffalo he didn't get the blender out at all um there were times in the tampa series where he used josh anderson up on that top line with i think it was with suzuki and caulfield and then slavkovsky dropped down to evans and i think it was even a rotating cast up there um i you have to break them up if all three guys are not able to get it done at once i isn't the logical solution break them up and not just keep throwing them at the problem until it fixes itself i i think you got to break them but then okay so then then

Starting point is 00:29:04 if you're gonna say that you got to give me line combinations like who do you go with that's what i'm struggling with right like like i mean that line steve that line worked all year are you telling me you break up your process at the first sign of trouble like they it was great all year long so it gets late early in the playoffs right so this isn't the first sign of trouble this is eight games right heading into nine they beat tampa they did they did it was a problem the whole series the whole series and you can be like well tampa shut them down okay great because you did some of that to them as well well now it's continued into the buffalo series i'd probably break him up but who knows maybe saint louis chooses not to do that and he proves him right

Starting point is 00:29:54 like he did try some things so it was i think jack eye was scratched for dobson in game seven against tampa he changed that to be strubel um gallagher i i was very surprised because i liked him um at the end of the tampa series he was taken out for joe valeno who i don't believe played a single game in that series and say Louie is clearly like okay we need legs here I almost wonder if you go with your most annoying most plodding lineup against Buffalo because if you try to

Starting point is 00:30:32 just be a different version of them they're going to kill you right there they have some guys I had no idea they had the motor that they did and i'm like like you're almost watching some players for the first time for the second time like ryan mcleod i've watched ryan mcleod play before sure yeah where do you get those wheels jack quinn yeah he can move hey if you gave him enough ice time i think he could lead the league in shots if you gave him crazy i didn't say goals but he could lead the league in shots that guy loves to shoot it do you know so adam yeah how would you categorize that

Starting point is 00:31:15 performance for buffalo would you categorize it as fine good great dominant dominant dominant dominant what did alex tuck and tage thompson combine for statistically off offhand i don't know but i'm going to assume not much because you're telling me that they didn't okay so it It was the Zach Benson game. Yeah. Oh, that little ball of hate. Yeah. No goals, no assists, no points.

Starting point is 00:31:42 One shot combined. Whoa. One hit combined. That's it. So is it time to break them up, too? Not even a block. Well, this is the thing, right? Like, they've been getting their cookies,

Starting point is 00:31:57 but Buffalo dominated them with nothing. Mm-hmm. out of arguably their most important duo of forwards montreal was able to kind of beat tampa that way it just doesn't appear to be an available option right in this series and uh to be totally honest i'm scrambling for answers myself uh i'm fascinated to see what saint louis uh what saint louis does well you know i look at the the um the depth on both teams at four If we're just talking forward here, right? Like, you know, I know Newhook had that big goal in Game 7.

Starting point is 00:32:35 But, you know, when you look at what the Sabres have on a third line, you've got a 52-point player in Josh Doan playing third line right wing. You've got Josh Norris, who was a top-six guy in Ottawa forever. Finally healthy, by the way. Cross our fingers, right? And so that Benson-Norris-Doan line, that for a lot of teams is their second line. And a lot of playoff teams, right?

Starting point is 00:32:58 that's a that's a pretty damn good skilled mean uh third line and they're going up against guys and with the canadians if you're just comparing third line to third line these are not bad players to know great shutdown guy josh anderson been in the league forever uh really good against teams with the color blue specifically blue and white but hey blue and yellow too uh and then texier who's had a couple of big moments in these playoffs already i would even take them and put them up against new hook evans and demidoff and it's not because it's not again like if we're talking regular season maybe it's a different thing because i think ivan demidoff uh is going to be a great player i don't know if it's elite player but he seems like he's going to be great

Starting point is 00:33:40 um but when you're in the playoffs josh doan has a little bit of that mean streak josh norris maybe not so much benson absolutely does yeah and then you hear him after the game talking about and i loved this for Sabres fans. I loved this because it was, you know, 18 months ago, we got Kevin Adams going, well, we don't have pantries. And now, you know, Benson has the game that he had and he's, you know, talking to the microphone going, I love playing here. I love being a Buffalo Sabre. This is amazing. And it's something we've talked about forever. If the Sabres ever win again, that arena is going to be insane because it always was. It was a good place to play when the team wasn't a disaster team's not a disaster and you're starting to see it like

Starting point is 00:34:27 instantly i don't know that the montreal depth like if we're talking about breaking up that first line we're gonna take demidoff off for slavkovsky make it smaller uh like is it is it you know josh anderson is like the older less talented slavkovsky um okay on the other side are you gonna take caulfield and put him with jake evans like that's that's the thing i think there are less options available to marty st louis than there would be to maybe lindy ruff you know what i'm saying yeah yeah so like i don't know demidov suzuki anderson i could see that i could see that potentially like it's the playoffs uh if these are your three best players you're gonna have to double shift them you're gonna have to find time for them like i'd love to know i i think he's

Starting point is 00:35:14 been playing really well is I don't know is that a great solution I don't know I well we know Danone can score yes he can he went to LA and he scored 27 goals so he can score you can move him up you can play him in a role where he's expected to do that a little more I wonder if Oliver Kapanen gets back in yeah so he's tell me a little bit about him because he's had not the he had not the best playoffs against the the lightning and he had a great season like he was a guy I'll be straight up i was like you're gonna have you're gonna go through the whole season with oliver cappin and it's your second line center i don't know about that you're gonna have to make a trade and he he filled him pretty damn well and he's a young player right you expect him to be growing

Starting point is 00:35:53 he's only 22 decently big uh he only got in four games uh in that tampa series um had a penalty and no points but like barely played this kid got no ice time um he had 22 goals though 37 points that's what i'm saying like you need some offense right you do and like it's not like you were able to score it well against tampa either you weren't even able to shoot it well right um but does that mean taking valeno out is there a way to put both of them in it's tricky happening is the center right like so you keep him you find the winger that's gonna gotta be not playing right uh this is i'm really struggling here yeah i uh like that that was the kind of game like what a goal by doc holy crap but it only cut the lead to four two that was the kind of game

Starting point is 00:36:52 every single game of the first round in that series you were able to go here was the little margin between victory and defeat and defeat and victory sabers whooped them yep right so i get maybe i haven't seen enough to even come up with a solution because all i have is 60 minutes of them kicking you up and down the ice And a third period where, yeah, you outshot them. They just parked the bus. Oh, yeah. It worked.

Starting point is 00:37:30 You didn't score, did you? No. Yeah. Well, streaming tonight will be Steve Dangle. So we'll see how it all goes. The Choo Choo series goes to game two. So Vegas and Anaheim. Listen, you know, we're talking about teams that have surprised this postseason.

Starting point is 00:37:48 I think Buffalo, you know, running over Montreal in game one. I get that it's just a game one. It's still a big deal. It's notable, right? I got to tell you, I'm watching this series, and I'm watching every minute of this series, and I've watched every minute of Ducks playoff. They've dominated both games of this series.

Starting point is 00:38:06 And, you know, we know they should have won game one. Jackson Lacombe should have shot. They should have played the icing whistle, which they didn't. You know, the waved-off icing. Those are the two minutes, or the two pieces, both of them Jackson Lacombe, by the way, And he also contributed to their lone goal in the first thing. So he, you know, he's, he giveth and taketh away in game one.

Starting point is 00:38:27 But if those two little moments go right, the Ducks win that game. And after that game, you know, Marner, Tortorella, you know, everybody else came out and said, we didn't play our game. We won, but we didn't play our game. And you said, Steve, on Tuesday morning, when we did the show, you find ways to win, right? You're not going to dominate every game. You find ways to win.

Starting point is 00:38:47 You have to win game two. game two they want it and they want it convincingly and you know like i'm looking at um one of the things that they didn't do in game one was get cutter goche enough ice i mean 14 minutes and he yeah it's and he's a trigger man right like he needs to be that that guy i think i think joel quinville loves his fourth line very much uh and you know washi more and uh bl have been they have been great like for a fourth line they are constantly in the offensive zone which is incredible but you can't overplay that their their scoring chances are going to be limited their ability to finish is going to be limited you've got to get guys like goche guys like

Starting point is 00:39:29 seneca um you know outside of that first line you got to get them a little bit more time steve like they won the game convincingly and played the same game as they played in game one and took the crowd right out of it, I have to continue to pump the tires of Leo Carlson. People laughed at me for saying... I was going to give you the floor, man. This guy, I think it was Jay Fresh that had... I think he's created, at least of a couple games ago,

Starting point is 00:39:57 created the most offensive zone opportunities of anyone in the playoffs. I'll believe it. Sure. Why not? When I tell you that he will be... Bedard is a great player. there's a lot of other great players in the league it's going to be celebrity carlson

Starting point is 00:40:11 man that's the that's the future um and and i think with leo carlson it's fascinating you know he's he's he's you know you got uh troy terry with him who can rip it and then he's got um uh chris crider who is a you know former playoff god i don't think he's fully healthy but he still contributes he still makes smart plays yeah um there's a there's just something about the way that the ducks are doing to the vegas golden knights what i was thinking utah could do to them do you know what i mean like vegas are older and slower they they got some guys that can skate rasmus anderson's been an awkward fit and i still think he's an awkward fit and i don't know if they resign him but there is there is a um there's an ability that the ducks have up and down the

Starting point is 00:41:01 lineup to literally just skate you into the ground i don't know like you saw most of the game right uh part of it sorry yesterday was a challenging day oh that's okay that's all right we're all involved but um it's an interesting stylistic matchup and that's sort of what we were talking about um in the preview but you know it's oh this team's fast this team's slow and we sort of look at one thing good one thing bad well there are teams that kick ass at playing slow like the blues won a cup with it i mean it's not like the the golden knights in 23 were speed demons like it's basically which team is able to play the game that they want to play. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:41:49 And from what I've seen so far, and you can confirm, uh, Anaheim's getting to play their game and Vegas isn't, which is tough because Vegas was at home. Well, I want to, I want to talk about Tortorella hockey in the playoffs because we've seen a

Starting point is 00:42:05 lot of it. And I want to, you know, and with the leaf specifically, we saw, we saw the leafs wilt, uh, uh,

Starting point is 00:42:10 to the golden, or no golden nights, to the Columbus Blue Jackets in the play-in round in 2020. No, to the Golden Knights during the regular season anyway. Oh yeah, that too, that too. Wasn't Torts, but still. With Torts' hockey,

Starting point is 00:42:24 it feels a little bit Berube-ish in that in this series, I feel like he expects to be outshot. They're going to be outshot if they continue to play this way. The one thing that was going for them in game one is that Anaheim's going to get the initial shot, but Vegas were amazing at clearing

Starting point is 00:42:40 the puck. When you see them, Like Vegas is still, Steve, there was no power plays goal scored in this game either way. Both teams had like five. Vegas is like 96, 97% on the PK this offseason or this postseason, which is an insane number, right? Usually the team, usually teams with the best special teams go all the way. So I'm looking at that. I'm going, okay, well, so they're really good on the PK. They're very good when they get the lead of parking the bus.

Starting point is 00:43:07 But what happened was once Anaheim got that first goal, you're then making Vegas play a game they're uncomfortable with because now they've got to stretch out. Now they've got to move the puck a little bit more. They can't just, oh, we stop you at our zone entry and then flip it back to your blue line, which is what they did in game one. I don't know what adjustments Torts makes,

Starting point is 00:43:30 especially on the road, to deal with the depth that Anaheim has through the lineup. Like, I don't know, what do you do here? Because it's not that Vegas doesn't, but they're a little bit older and they are a little bit slower. yeah it oh boy you need saves for road wins and those have been difficult for Vegas to come by you're playing against a team that scores at like a really efficient rate and like you said with guys like Cutter Gauthier like the Ducks aren't even necessarily deploying uh the way that they

Starting point is 00:44:05 want to um you know this seems like a crutch but it just works every playoff why don't you see if you can bully him a little or is that just not what vegas is anymore at all well they've got they've still got barbachev howden's been throwing some monster hits uh carlson is back so that's allowed herbal to move to the wing and by the way carlson's been great since he's come back you have some bodies that colas are i i feel like keegan colas are didn't really get into the game because i don't know if you remember i don't know if you saw this but in the first 10 minutes of that game on wednesday night you had one puck over glass penalty uh and a couple of high sticking penalties and one of them was a double minor so essentially in the first 10 minutes the

Starting point is 00:44:51 ducks had four power plays including one five on three that was a minute and a half long and they didn't score and and so you know like you've got and then he took a penalty later yeah well and how are you going to get a colton sissons a cole smith and nick dowd uh colas are in in those scenarios right like it's just not i mean i know dowd and stuff kills penalties but you know what i'm saying like a five on five get the flow going colas are seem to at the end of the game you know be getting into people's faces and and that sort of thing but you can't it's hard to get your your depth guys in it who are there to uh to quote paul maurice uh what is it what does he say slam their d crush their d they're fucking d that's right that's right game seven comes i got nothing

Starting point is 00:45:40 left that's that's where i think you know because barbachev and dorofeev have got to score houghton's got to finish off what you know mitch and and mark stone are doing together right it's it it's a it's a tricky sort of balance to strike and you're getting william carlson back you know getting his sea legs after being out since november you can you can actually see like just looking at the box score you can actually see how little vegas had the puck yeah like there are well there are some stats you see and you're like that's good good on that guy and but then you're like oh what was anything good happening while you were out there though so the the two that stand out to me are mitch marner and brett howden marner played 1631 which as a leaf fan is

Starting point is 00:46:32 i can't wrap my head around him only playing that much brett howden played 1505 they were both minus three Marner two shots Howden also two shots but when I look at how many guys had this many hits Colasar had three in less than nine minutes Mark Stone had four in less than 18 minutes Cole Smith had four in less than 14 minutes Howden had five and the craziest one where you could just tell this is a wild stat line Ivan Barbashev had eight hits and I was about to say so that means Vegas never had the puck when he was on the ice he had five shots yeah he did he was he was he's a monster in the playoffs he's a monster so I mean if anyone's gonna know how to play a smart game where you can be a jerk but stay out of the box you would think it would be John Tortorella

Starting point is 00:47:38 right that has to be the conversation heading into a pivotal road game here because like like you said um that yeah the ducks dominated the game but you set yourselves up for failure with the start you had you're lucky you know you weren't losing until deep into the second period uh with the way that's going man like yeah you gotta you gotta you gotta i know like our team's calling more here's a question uh our refs calling more in these playoffs because the standard has changed or we got excited heading into these playoffs with all the turnover like there's all these new teams in the playoffs now buffalo is one of them the ducks are another utah's another i'm sure there's others i'm forgetting but these are teams that haven't necessarily been there before

Starting point is 00:48:44 oh well yeah but steve the team that they're playing against should have the advantage well no because that's not how the nhl works right they gotta even it up yep so you got these new teams coming in going insane right like the ducks um they're taking calls and then the refs feel like they got to even it up but that's also not what happened in this game because it was three consecutive penalties from vegas maybe they were just undisciplined man maybe they just couldn't keep up with the pace well i i i it didn't feel that way like it's so interesting like they they i mean obviously you know some high sticking penalties and stuff like that but if Vegas were undisciplined then so were Anaheim I mean that like they were they were even in

Starting point is 00:49:31 penalties taken I think and even if it's not even then it was like one one leans the one way and one leans the other it's not that much of a difference you know I I feel like like Vegas is doing an incredible job of clearing rebounds and uh and clogging up space especially on the power play there was there they're basically keeping the ducks to the outside they're doing what teams used to do the Leafs when Mitch Marner was you know with the Leafs and they were making the playoffs which is keep them to the outside uh don't let them go in but here's the thing with the Ducks they've got guys that like going in deep right they got they got your Chris Criders um I don't think Leo Carlson's afraid of anybody um Alex Killorn's not afraid Ryan Hailing's not

Starting point is 00:50:13 afraid so they'll go right they'll get to the front of the net you'll have your bumper guy you'll have your guy in front of the net. The, the thing is, is that when Vegas falters and it's rare, the ducks are able to capitalize. And when I look at the other end of the rink, and I think this is where goaltending is so important. Carter Hart, if you get that second shot, you've got a really good shot at scoring, right? Everybody, you know, everybody knows rebound chances are always a higher percentage, but especially if the goalie's out of it, but do stall on the other end. And part of this is team defense. Part of it's just him. He's the better goalie game set match. And when you talk about like, you look at how Vegas is trying to

Starting point is 00:50:54 score on him. Cause I think what we've seen in the playoffs so far is that when he gives up a rebound and he does give up a couple of juicy ones you know, usually he tries to redirect it into the corner, but that's not always possible. He gets the second shot. He's able to make that save and so now if you're Vegas you've got to do and Marner had a beautiful assist in game one absolutely like classic amazing assist you've got to get him moving side to side whether that's direct side to side like a cross crease or it's on an angle from you cross the blue line you've got a forward charging at the net which Marner did and you find them mid stride and shoot and And I don't know for Vegas' offense how many of the guys that they have that can do that.

Starting point is 00:51:39 I know Eichel can do that. I know Marner can do that. I know Stone can do that. But, you know, and, you know, Dorofeyev can do that but hasn't done it. You know, that's where I think this is going to be a real challenge for them because you've got to catch Dostal in motion to score, or at least you've had to in Game 1 and Game 2. How the heck do you beat this team on the road?

Starting point is 00:52:02 The Ducks? no the the yeah yeah how does vegas beat the ducks like everything that you're setting up so it's funny the playoffs man the damn playoffs vegas does not look good in game one whatever they win and i was adamant i'm like you have to win game two yep you have to well you do and now i'm looking at vegas the series is tied yep it's early and i'm like they're screwed here right it feels like i mean how could you look at it any other way though the ducks have dominated play the first two games oh they're not like it feels like like vegas came out flying at the beginning of game two but i think about game one i think the ducks were up 9-1 in shots like midway through the first

Starting point is 00:52:54 period it's very likely very likely after game four this series heads back to vegas tied 2-2 yeah and i can see that based on what we've seen out of the first two games the team that should be feeling best about that is vegas does that make sense no why should vegas feel good about that because is that because they got away with one or because you're going back away or you're going back home you you you retook home ice advantage so like i hate when people oh you know the ducks stole home ice advantage yeah for now for now it rarely ever stays that way but yeah the the ducks have home ice advantage for the next two games but if vegas steals it back i don't know the way the wind is blowing in this series just reminds me

Starting point is 00:53:55 somewhat it's almost like an inverse of the first two games between boston and buffalo yep um it's sort of like how you were asking me hey steve how the hell do the habs improve on what they did in game one and win and i couldn't really come up with an answer i'm struggling here i'm struggling you got to be efficient with your chances you gotta try to drag the ducks into the muck but like you know it's it's funny we've done a lot of talking over the last few days about how consequential what gutis did to matthews was and that helped get the leafs the first pick but i think it was also somewhat of a baptism for the ducks like it was preparation for

Starting point is 00:54:52 what was to come and they didn't do very well like in in the weeks that followed that but the team that's come out of it is a team that doesn't take any crap yep and can still do all the things that got them in this position i had vegas winning in six i'm not gonna bail every year i i i'm very my opinions are malleable when it comes to the playoffs and by the way they should be you should look at the evidence in front of you and go man i guess i gotta change my initial thought this year i'm being stubborn i did my second chance bracket yeah late on on spark i did it late but i still did it according to the picks i made on the show okay for example mini was down two nothing i still picked them because i said they

Starting point is 00:55:46 were going to win in seven right so i still have vegas in six i think the team that's been here the most often the most recently finds a way i just don't know what that way is against anaheim yeah and one last thing one note on anaheim and this had specifically canucks uh media in a bit of a tizzy and I don't blame them. Um, so, so Joel Quinville takes Mason McTavish out Mason McTavish, who makes $7 million a year, who is a center or hasn't been playing center, but can play center. Uh, and, uh, you know, is a player that had, you know, 40 something points for them. I know it wasn't, you know, this was a season where he was scratched during the season as well. this is a 41 point player he had 52 last year and has four points in these playoffs and he'd

Starting point is 00:56:36 rather play jeffrey vl on the third line with ross johnston ross johnston steve i know on the fourth line and jansen harkins on the fourth line than getting you know then then bring in a guy like mason mctavish i find that fascinating now do you sit him down to reset him he's 23 years old He was a third overall pick four years ago. You just sitting him down to reset him? Or is this the beginning of the end for Mason McTavish in Anaheim, which is what Vancouver media, and rightly so, they're looking for rebuild pieces, are asking.

Starting point is 00:57:14 Well, as a fan of a team about to pick first overall, I certainly hope it is. He might be the center that we need in Toronto. Dude, him and Olin Zellweger. Yeah. Yes, please. Both of them. yeah i'll order the the appetizer and the main yeah absolutely um but i my guess is mctavish plays in anaheim um you can line match a little better there yeah i would say game one so yeah

Starting point is 00:57:43 i'd say probably probably both games but i'm not totally sure but you know the players you're talking about that they put in that's the ducks going oh you're gonna push us around oh that's funny oh that's anyway good joke here's a little ross for you yeah here's a little jansen for you like those guys are too awful the two different versions of the same awful outcome which is a long night for you which is weird because that's exactly the kind of player i thought mason mctavish was supposed to be but he's got a little bit of the sam gagne uh syndrome okay where uh yeah he turned 23 in january like i thought this man was 30 years old like oh because he feels like he's been around forever yeah yeah because he has been his first uh nhl hockey god his stats are all

Starting point is 00:58:46 messed up because this is a kid from the 2021 draft yep in 2020 2021 he played for two teams olton in the swiss league and the ducks what yeah you know how many games he's he's played well actually 21 22 is when he started with the ducks oh sorry sorry sorry yeah you're right what on earth is this sorry so his draft year gets cut short the uh he played 13 games in his draft year though that's notable oh okay the year before his draft year gets cut short his draft year he plays 13 bloody games how did this guy go third then in 22 he plays five games in the oh i see i see i see i see he played for four different teams yeah 24 games with the hamilton bulldogs five games with the peterborough peets three games with the san diego

Starting point is 00:59:47 goals nine games with the ducks yep and produce pretty well for all of them yes but like also no wonder oh yeah and then he's full time with greg cronin oh like oh yeah no wonder we got some warts to figure out here i don't think the duck should move on from this player i think that's a mistake um long term especially when you got him signed to seven million the upside there is huge yeah like i i think that's a mistake but your only mission is to win the next game right that's the that's the damn thing with with the playoffs and like if the ducks did dominate vegas the way you said they did you obviously watched the game much closer than i did dominating is not fair maybe outplayed outplayed is better they're controlling it good enough

Starting point is 01:00:38 good enough and now you're going back home with a lineup that controlled the game on the road Yeah, twice, twice. Wasn't a freak thing. Did it twice. Mason might want to bring some flavor shakers to the arena because he's going to be having some popcorn. Two in five Canadians will hear the words, you have cancer.

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Starting point is 01:01:26 This episode is brought to you by BetterHelp. And let's say that you've had an up and down week, Steve Dangle. Let's just say. Yes, and downs and ups. Ups and downs. Ups and downs. And life just feels a bit like waves. It's up and down too much.

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Starting point is 01:03:03 life-saving research together we can carry the fire and help create a world free from the fear of cancer register today at pmcfwalk.ca now i think the series of the playoffs steve has been the wild and and uh uh abs or at least the series of the second round maybe the series of the playoffs thus far has been montreal tampa but uh this second round series and i producer hayden is recording us right now so i know he's not thrilled about how the first couple of games have gone we He had a 15 goal game, which is tied for fifth most ever in the playoffs ever in the ever. The wild have have eight goals through two games. You should be happy.

Starting point is 01:03:43 Right. The problem is that six of them came in the first game and the I don't know how much of the Colorado Minnesota game sticks out to you because it was on flipping Tuesday. Such a bizarre schedule, by the way. Like, why are we going Sunday, Tuesday, Saturday? Nobody understands it, but that's what we're doing. um how did the wild get back in this series it's going back home uh it's you know a uh it's a very friendly environment you know the fans are going to be behind them i know the wild can do this i just haven't seen them do it yet you know what i mean it's it's

Starting point is 01:04:19 funny and this is going to be more angering to hayden than talking about the scores um the series is going exactly the way drew predicted which is if the wild try to run and gun with the avalanche they're going to lose that that is what happened in game one yeah and the wild led i want to say as late in that game as five four like that's kind of nuts but there were six goals after that yeah yeah like yeah that's that's completely insane or maybe more it doesn't matter there were a lot of goals after that and then game two you're still not really able to contain colorado at all colorado is dictating the pace here they're dictating the physical play which is not what i would have predicted like remember with trennan and hartman and those guys

Starting point is 01:05:22 on the other side right yeah remember at the olympics when mcdavid just started hitting guys yeah and we were like i didn't know he could do that and but like he chooses to hit for the first time in his career and he's just murdering everyone nathan mckinnon yeah like yeah he doesn't usually hit because he usually has the puck right but he's running guys over and it's funny uh you know yeah of course you try to hit quinn hughes who's gonna catch it hard to do i mean quinn caught quinn yeah nate's the only one that could nate quinn caught nate a couple of times on some opportunities that nate had like people people give quinn hughes shit for his defense sometimes um i thought he was actually very strong defensively in game two he was he

Starting point is 01:06:15 was the only guy who could catch nate on that you know what i mean but you're right steve if you're talking about mobile defense which is really i mean between warinski and quinn hughes that's how us the usa team won the gold medal is their their mobility on the back end was so unbelievable that the canadian forwards who had some speed but not like that uh at least not throughout the lineup, weren't able to kind of take advantage. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, and this isn't the Olympics. The Olympics are two weeks, adrenaline, wee, fun.

Starting point is 01:06:49 This is the Olympics times four. It's a war of attrition. There's a lot more meat, I think, in the Stanley Cup playoffs. and but but i i would have thought the team dictating that would be minnesota maybe that's exactly what they do in minnesota matt boldy activates he's had a rough first two games like at least in terms of getting rocked um like they're not out of it i mean they gotta lose three in order to win in seven like i predicted yeah uh they would because i'm a super genius as you know um but i i think they got to slow this series the hell down can i talk about or can i

Starting point is 01:07:43 ask you about the goaltending thing because in game one um you know it was wedgwood wallstead wallstead had a great first round wedgwood had a great first round i mean wedgwood didn't lose a game um that's pretty good but but you know we didn't expect him to either like if colorado hadn't have swept the Kings, we'd have been like, what's wrong with Colorado? Wallstead was unbelievable in the first round and they had an unbelievably tough first round opponent. I know there were some injuries, no Ruppe, and it's come out that Miko tore an ACL during the Olympics and he's not going to need surgery, but he wasn't himself, which is why we didn't see the production that we normally are used to. I'm looking at the

Starting point is 01:08:20 goaltending stats from game one. You could see why both coaches could have changed their goalies. to me it felt like John Hines blink because Phil Gustafson has not played in these playoffs and frankly there was a couple of goals where I'm like you need to save there and I don't know to me making a goaltending switch for either team after game one just feels like I don't know if it's a pit I wouldn't call it a panic move but it seems like a an unforced error Wallstead's got to play game three, he's better and I didn't even think he or Wedgewood were that bad

Starting point is 01:08:56 in game one, it was just a shootout like sometimes you're looking at goaltenders and you're like, oh well, like that goaltender stunk, sometimes it's just a weird game and the team defense isn't there and the goals go in it doesn't mean that the goalies are necessarily that bad, I thought Walsted

Starting point is 01:09:12 was good and when you flip a goalie put a cold goalie in especially against the Avs, are you not asking for trouble and that's what they got here's the problem though you have a rookie goalie who allows nine goals in the first game and you have a goalie the quality of philip gustafson sitting there as his backup you know let's say it's 5-2 again yeah wow what's he thinking you know leaving the rookie in there to rot and now it's game three and you're down to nothing like i i agree with you um

Starting point is 01:09:48 Wohlstadt should be the guy. I didn't have a problem with Gustafson getting in there for game two, but I think Wohlstadt's got to be your guy going forward unless he, well, if he proves to not be the guy, there's not a whole lot of going forward left, is there? So I think he's your ride or die for the rest of this thing. Yeah, yeah. And of note, Joe Smith tweeted out yesterday

Starting point is 01:10:17 that both eric sinek and brodeen have not skated since their injuries so they didn't accompany the team to denver it doesn't look like they're gonna play and i know you know they got jeff petrie they got zach zach bogosian but like it's that one nobody goes to the playoffs healthy steve like nobody but you do sort of wonder how game one and game two would have been um and and i think the the one thing we came away from the trade deadline thinking with the minnesota wild was yeah but you didn't get that center yeah i know you got hartman i know you got eric's neck but one of those guys goes down you know you have michael mccarron who's actually looked really really good man like he's but he's not that he's not top six right guy so that that i think has

Starting point is 01:11:04 hurt them and i think that's something they're you know no matter what happens now they're going to have to address that in the offseason now compare that to colorado you have nathan mckinnon who have they announced the heart nominees yet i don't think they have i don't think they have no so mckinnon's probably going to be nominated for the heart yeah and you go down you have brock nelson who's nominated for the selkie yep then your big acquisition is cadre but also nick wa who can play center and scored by the way again because he's great and i told drew he'd be great No. Shut up.

Starting point is 01:11:38 You're forgetting one name, by the way. Who am I forgetting? Jack Drury. Jack Drury. Ah! So you got, Steve, you got Nelson, Kadri, Waugh, and Drury all in the last 18 months via trade. All of them.

Starting point is 01:11:55 And an entirely new goalie tandem. Yeah. And Marty Nietzsche. By the way, Marty Nietzsche is who is a 100-point player now. And I like he was he Marty Nietzsche's skating is so good that there was a point where he was driving into the Minnesota, Minnesota ice like their their offense. So he was going into the offensive zone and he was skating backwards with the puck looking for someone to pass to. So like he's the first one in and he's skating ass first. Right.

Starting point is 01:12:28 This is it. Seven points. Yeah. Like there's a little bit of Harlem Globetrotter ask going on here. and you know we talk about Carolina not having lost the game Colorado hasn't either well Adam I mentioned Marty Nietzsche's having seven points who else has seven points who else in this series there's there's two guys both of them to me are very unexpected not not in this series just in the playoffs in the playoffs seven points I know Marner has nine

Starting point is 01:13:01 so it's not Marner yeah no no no Avs just Avs that's how good they are uh I don't know and then there's three guys tied with seven Landis Gog Gabriel friggin Landis

Starting point is 01:13:16 Gog back from the dead he's been good man he's been real great goals forces seven points and Devon Taves well four of those came in game one whatever you should say that He got four points in game one.

Starting point is 01:13:32 That's insane. He scored in back-to-back games. He scored in game four against LA and then game one against Mini, which is just... Again, I didn't know he knew how to do that. And his running shots in his last four games. One, two, one, one.

Starting point is 01:13:53 Like, it's still not an offensive dynamo. um i don't know how to shut this team down like valerina chushkin who's been such a playoff performing mainstay for them has three points only one goal right brock nelson's only got two points what's what are leckanen stats i'm curious he's been great uh he's at three and three uh three you've got guys there that are basically ready to to break out if the guys who've been doing really well falter leckanen leads the team in plus minus plus 10 wow they've played six games that's crazy playoffs that's crazy talking about like i know producer hayden's absolutely hating this hating this he's hating this listen i've said it and it's a cop out

Starting point is 01:14:47 but i mean it the hardest with this one minnesota needs to just start beating the crap out of them and they can they just they can they got to just start throwing hands soften them up yeah well we'll look for trennan and mccarran and all the guys that are on the team that can do that heartman listen if bogosian gets back in i don't think he will but if he does get back in uh he could do that you know the one thing i gotta say the minnesota the felino brothers thing is working it is working they look great they look great together they're playing the role perfectly i hope they keep that together next season because it's kind of fun to see 17 and 71 out there throwing hits and stuff and nico stern is perfect match with that um it's just it's just it's further

Starting point is 01:15:33 up the lineup is you know i feel bad danilla europe is a young young young player tough for him to step into an erickson ekroll right really tough really tough uh i don't know i don't i thought they would use him in some sort of deal because it seemed like they were just like ah youth be damned yeah um i wonder if that's an off-season thing but again who cares game three that's your only focus this is uh this is the find a way time of year right someone who we're not expecting needs to show up your stars need to show up like if kaprizov doesn't have a big game three you're boned if quinn hughes doesn't have a big game three you're boned if matt boldy doesn't have the big game three you're both yeah that's it that's all so we'll switch gears here to teams

Starting point is 01:16:28 that are not good enough to be playing this time of year and boy has it been evident uh like you know when i watch there's a lot of people that that do kind of they they pay attention but they're not watching playoff hockey if their team's out and i get that because you have a life you probably have to share a tv with somebody in your house maybe that doesn't like hockey as much as you do uh you're missing some incredible hockey you're missing some great series but it's abundantly clear that you know in the top five of the draft and obviously toronto's at the top of that there are a lot of teams that don't have the pressures that toronto does and i don't mean media and fans i mean the pressures to turn it around like that click turn it around toronto's

Starting point is 01:17:13 under pressure to do that i don't think they're going to be able to do that i i do not think that that's possible in an off season given what's available this year and i hope i'm wrong but to play to this level uh the way that some of these great teams are playing i think it's going to take a couple of off seasons it doesn't mean they don't make the playoffs next year i just don't know that they're you know we're talking about stanley cup favorite you know conversations which is what Matthews and Nylander ultimately want. 100% Clutch Canadians presented by Moosehead Canadian Lager. Remember, Moosehead is the last major brewery in Canada

Starting point is 01:17:49 still owned by Canadians. Touching on Canadian patriotism in this segment. And you know what? We like to do stars sometimes, but sometimes we like to do unsung heroes. So here's our 100% Clutch Canadian segment, but this one are the unsung guys. If you're not watching closely, you might miss them,

Starting point is 01:18:06 but they're playing big, big games. Steve Dangle, who you got? brandon manitoba's own jordan martinuk of the carolina hurricanes this is a guy who at times has been on waivers and he picked up two points uh against philly in game two the reason it is big that he picked up two points both assist in game two is that brought his point total for the playoffs up to three the only point he had in the ottawa senator series was an over time winner yes he did miss the penalty shot but he made up for it by picking up the overtime winner in that very same game and adam that's the very definition of clutch i i agree now i'm going to

Starting point is 01:18:58 give you somebody who's really unsung jeffrey vl ramuski quebec home of the ramuski oceanic uh now jeffrey vl is interesting signed with the san jose sharks when he was in his mid-20s in 2019 mid-20s back then okay uh he played a couple of seasons with them one one season in 21 22 remember they were not very good he had five points in 34 games then 22 23 happens he only gets four games in the show zero points then he is signed by the boston bruins in 24 and he gets five games in the show zero points and then he played 10 games with the boston bruins to start off this season nobody remembers it 10 games zero goals zero assists steve had some penalty minutes fought some guys then he goes to the ducks 35 games 10 points so those

Starting point is 01:19:50 are his first points since 21 22 okay wow then this offseason or so well i guess this postseason not off season. He's played eight games. He scored two mega goals, three points, 15 penalty minutes, and has been upgraded to the third line to play alongside paling and Beckett Seneca. And this is a guy who was traded for a fourth round draft pick January of this year. Boston could have used them if they'd known how to, but the ducks figured it out. And man, Jeffrey VL, you are my 100% clutch Canadian this, this week. You've been phenomenal all playoffs that fourth line for the Ducks man I'm telling you dangerous dangerous that's making the NHL the hard way absolutely so here's what we want this weekend and going into next week

Starting point is 01:20:36 we want your suggestions leave them in the comments who is your 100% clutch Canadian it's presented by Moosehead Canadian Lager check it out two and five Canadians will hear the words you have cancer that's why every step and dollar raised matters on september 19th join thousands in toronto for the princess margaret cancer foundation walk challenge yourself friends and family to walk 21 kilometers in support of life-saving research together we can carry the fire and help create a world free from the fear of cancer register today at pmcfwalk.ca You've got to try breakfast at A&W You've got to try breakfast at A&W

Starting point is 01:21:26 And what better way than with a delicious Pret Organic Coffee Starting at just $1 all day, every day, now until December 31st You've got to try breakfast at A&W At participating A&W locations in Ontario and earlier this week chris johnson posted an article about the fact that austin matthews hasn't made up his mind yet on whether he's going to come back and followed it up and confirmed that even after getting the first overall pick that hasn't changed and who else you know who else backed them up was elliot friedman now you've had other people in the sports say well

Starting point is 01:22:09 I talked to so-and-so and they think this and whatever. And I know it wasn't what leaf fans wanted to hear, but you've got the two top insiders in the game telling you Austin Matthews hasn't made up his mind yet. And we had a report a couple of days ago, or was it yesterday? I can't even tell anymore. I don't know what day it is that John Chayka and Austin Matthews are due to

Starting point is 01:22:30 meet sometime. I think in the next week in Arizona, right where Austin spends his off seasons, you know, i i understand the negative reaction in the sense that you don't want to hear it nobody wants to hear that their best player hasn't made up their mind on coming back but i think whether or not you want to hear it you need to because the toronto maple leafs are facing a definitive fork in the road here and they need to get real clarity on this very very quickly everything they

Starting point is 01:23:06 do in the next eight weeks is going to determine, I think, the next half decade. Because if Austin is saying to them, okay, well, because this is what Freed said, this is what CJ said, they're literally telling you what Austin's camp, I think, wants, which is, okay, we want to see a plan, but then we want to see you execute that plan. And if the Leafs have a plan and they execute that plan and it's not to Austin Matthews' satisfaction he can still say yeah i don't want to play for you next year and people are going well he's under contract and he's got a no trade and whatever um i i don't know if people are new with new at this or whatever but there are plenty of players with no trades that request trades and

Starting point is 01:23:49 get them granted plenty um i know again nobody wants to hear that because i don't want to hear it either i don't want us to be in the position that we're in but the fact of the or the fact of the matter with the organization is that it fell significantly this year and i don't know if that's totally sunk into people yet they without this mckenna pick steve they were facing a pretty bleak next 24 months i think oh there's a reason i posted that clip of me going boys were fucked um but okay here's here's a way to look at this that i don't think anyone is really done let's say matthew's ass out yeah that's actually better than the monitor situation the martyr situation was martyr or mitch we're trading you

Starting point is 01:24:43 and he goes no and they go what and he goes yeah like i negotiated it in my deal so that I couldn't be traded. I'm going to have a child very soon. I don't want to be traded. It's my negotiated right to not be traded. I don't want to be traded. And they go, oh. What about now?

Starting point is 01:25:08 Still no. And then guess what you get for him? Nick Waugh, and you were lucky to get that because what Vegas could have done is just given you nothing. Right? You were lucky to even get that, and then you parlayed Nick Waugh. if a player asks out you're probably going to get more than nick wah right that's good now

Starting point is 01:25:34 you know it'd be better is if a really really really good player who was also your captain who is also the greatest goal scorer in franchise history just wanted to stay that'd be great i'd prefer that i think a lot of emotions are really raw and fresh and i think we all need to take a beat here i know the off season is coming up and we don't actually have much time but we need to take a beat so there's something that I said and then Adam you backed it up and you and I have different sources on this but I said

Starting point is 01:26:23 there are general managers in the NHL who will not take John Chayka's phone call right and that opinion of him that negative opinion of him isn't just the media it's not just Steve Simmons it permeates its general managers it's uh agents it's players matthews has probably heard a lot of really negative things and that's got him thinking about the future but i said there are gms in the nhl who won't

Starting point is 01:26:57 trade with this player you said that also i believe it to be true and i was thinking about it That's really stupid. It's extremely stupid. And by the way, if Matthews is available, everybody's picking up the phone. So I don't know what they're fucking going on about. Like, yeah, that's the caveat, right? Like if you, oh, I want to trade a third round pick for Matthias Michelli. I'm not picking up John Jacob's call.

Starting point is 01:27:23 If Austin Matthews is on the table, they're picking up the call. Of course, they're picking up the call. Adam, you, you're better at negotiating than I am. Someone calls you. Mm-hmm. is that not advantage you yes always so so a g there's only 32 gms one of them calls you and you're not answering the phone because you think he's a prick what do you make millions of dollars for yep yeah you're not doing your job right so this is all the conversations i expanding a little

Starting point is 01:28:03 bit from what you were talking about but people hate this chica guy i am not totally stoked that he's the guy who was picked but alas he's the guy who was picked he was somewhat charming although elusive uh at his press conference that video of him celebrating the first overall pick i was like well that's at minimum that's a passion haver and yeah the guy grew up a leaf fan yeah i'll take that and and we said it on on monday's show or tuesday's show whenever we broke down the press conference um we're open to this we're rooting for him yes we want him to do well but there there are gms who behind the scenes are like i will not take his call and you're admitting that out loud and proud of it or is that just macho posturing i think it's macho posture well he was

Starting point is 01:28:54 mean to a friend like it's one thing if Paul Bissonnette and like this I completely understand it's one thing if Paul Bissonnette is like you did something shitty to Shane Doan and that's my friend so f you yeah I get that that's really easy to understand but like biz doesn't have to negotiate with him this isn't trying to assemble a stanley cup winning team he's he's doing what you and i are doing he's just bullshitting right and if that's not his guy that's not his guy and that's fine but if you're a gm in the nhl it's your job to make your team better and if the new guy is calling you with something he wants to to do that can potentially make your team better why on earth would you not answer the phone add to that if it's austin matthews

Starting point is 01:29:52 i i've i you've made a liar out of yourself yeah it's austin matthews i don't yes i don't know if there's probably not a ton of teams that could fit necessarily a 13.25 million dollar player there's steve every team can fit that player exactly all 31 exploding all 31 other teams are taking that phone call yeah you'll find a way and the cap's going up have you lost your mind yeah right so like listen i'm not trying to trade this guy i don't want to trade this guy i don't think a full-blown rebuild is the way to go because you really gotta thread a needle here you have unprotected first that you've given up in the conference for the next two years yeah that's not exactly when you should be trading your number one center

Starting point is 01:30:43 right it's better if it it's better if you keep the generational goal score is what you're saying what a take yeah yeah i know and everybody wants him to stay everybody wants him to stay yeah like this like you if you were to trade him you need significant pieces that help you now as well as moving forward like again you have to protect yourself you don't have your first for the next two years two years and asking gavin mckenna to step in and be a savior immediately is unreasonable even when matthew scored 40 goals his rookie year he did most of it as the third line center yeah with hyman and nylander and all rookie line teams with an all rookie line generally don't get into the playoffs right like no we need to appreciate how special 2017 was

Starting point is 01:31:39 but uh there's so listen we always make fun of the i just got here thing there's a lot going on there's a lot being speculated and i'm just like how could you possibly know that berube staying or going how could you possibly know that i feel like that's got to be coming from not the Leafs yes now because I don't think the Leafs are saying I don't think the Leafs are telegraphing to anybody that that what they're going to do I genuinely don't think John Chayka and Matt Sundin know I think they are legitimately open to open to him staying should they hear what they want to hear but I think they're also legitimately open

Starting point is 01:32:28 to him going and i saw that to me when when when because i've heard lebron and dragger say it and i'm not doubting their sources at all they're both extraordinarily connected people in within the hockey circles but like to me that strikes me as somebody that's not a leaf that's uh a uh somebody in the berube camp no and now let me be biased here um anyone doubting cj's reporting on the matthews thing is cataclysmic cult yeah listen i'll be honest with you get a great i know it sounds weird coming from us but like even even like you you have he obviously we're friends with cj he works here like all that stuff but like you got to be kidding me right chris johnston chris chris johnson all right okay listen do whatever you say whatever you want and what's hilarious

Starting point is 01:33:22 is like I don't want to believe Chris's opinion I'm going to believe this guy's opinion because it tells me what I want to hear the reality is the Matthews thing is up in the air you don't have to believe it you don't have to want it I don't want it either but it is it is

Starting point is 01:33:38 Elliot and CJ have both said it I don't know what else you need the cognitive dissonance that I've seen out there the last few days I do think media literacy is a crisis but like okay tsn was negative about chayka's hiring yep right yeah and keith pelly and they were very negative

Starting point is 01:34:01 about it and people were like well tsn is going to be negative because they because bell doesn't own the team anymore and rogers does and that was the end of their thought i'm like how did you come to that conclusion about tsn and not immediately look at sports net and go oh well it's oh it's gonna be sunshine and rainbows and gumdrops because they own the freaking team no it's tsn that is evil and what's the matter with you can i tell you where that are you serious where does that come from that comes from the fact that sports net has bent over backwards to be not pro toronto for the last 10 years and you you know that you worked there yes they're very much a thing but now that i work there don't tell me it's not a thing it's a thing i heard it i was told it

Starting point is 01:34:54 it's a thing stop but here but here's what's changed now rogers owns it full-time yep and there have been changes in the coverage yep there have yep and i'll give you an example if you want a prime example day of the press conference elliot friedman gets the interview with john that everybody's raving about. And I thought it was a really good interview. It was a really good interview. It's very interesting answers there. Sure. Got a lot more out of it than I did at the press conference. Um, uh, uh, but that interview occurred, we think pretty sure like 99% before the press conference happened because it was in the Leafs dressing room. Right. And so, okay. So sports nets got the in there. Why? Cause Rogers owns both. Right. Makes sense. Okay.

Starting point is 01:35:38 then you do the press conference and then later that afternoon john chayka who and and sid six zero even pointed this out when you have a new general manager or when you have a general manager at all if they're going to make an appearance they do two radio hits so sports net and tsn got them every time it would be it would be kipper and born or bob mccowan yeah uh and you know depending upon how far back we're going here and it would be overdrive on tsn with you know jeff O'Neal and noodles and you know that sort of thing so Sportsnet gets the interview with John Chayka that afternoon it's a good interview you guys know how we feel about Kipper and Bourne great guys good people that sort of thing love those guys two days later we get a TSN interview

Starting point is 01:36:27 yep with O-Dog wearing a wig and to their credit they went at John Chayka pretty hard and put his feet to the flames a little bit. And I give him credit for that. Here's the other thing. TSN is still a media rights holder for the Toronto Maple Leafs. They have, I think they've got 20 local games every year. So it's not like, you know, so-

Starting point is 01:36:51 And they're not free. I want you to be prepared for the fact that Sportsnet coverage of the Leafs is going to be a lot more pro-Leaf in the future. Yep. And that's good. I want that. That's fantastic.

Starting point is 01:37:02 But it can't be that you go, tsn's mad because they don't have the national rights well and then they show the the the live coverage of the draft lottery with brian hayes odog and noodles they're literally celebrating yeah odog is losing his mind so two days prior or no the day prior tsn's negative and the leafs aren't going to get a fair shake the next day literally celebrating in the studio nothing nothing guys that's cope that's coping it's it's beneath you and it's embarrassing that's i want please stop i know everybody wants john chayka to work out i want john chayka to work out badly want john chayka to work out desperate but to say that you can't have questions about it beforehand

Starting point is 01:37:49 because here's the thing people are already saying like and i i get this too there are some people um that that that basically have made up their mind on john chayka and and to be honest with you i haven't um uh and i hadn't i do think the process was very strange and you know some of the sourcing that i have which admittedly is not to the level of what freed or cj or dregs or any of those guys would have john shake remember how many times i said to you on this show steve john shake his name is continually out there and i'm finding it strange even when it would look like doug armstrong's the guy no not him mike gillis the guy no not him and i kept telling you john chayka's name keeps getting fed to me there are people out there that believe and somebody

Starting point is 01:38:31 told me this yesterday that that john was the favorite from the beginning and that the the whole thing was a you know they had to interview people but i think that there was a there was a they they were warm to john chayka early and i don't know what the reasons for that might have been i don't even know if that's totally true but clearly they like this guy clearly they think he's going to be the guy and i'll tell you um you know people close to to um to sundin so a couple of things i've heard on that okay so first off matt's really believes in this guy and i think matt's being in the organization i would hope so uh well yeah but you know sometimes in these scenarios like trevor linden i don't know how much trevor linden believed in uh what was his name the guy

Starting point is 01:39:16 that ran the canucks uh bim jenning oh yeah jim benning i don't know i'd love to sit down with trevor trevor linden and give him some like truth serum and say trevor did you believe in jim or do you love the canucks and you wanted to do right by the canucks because he was sidelined and punted in the worst way and i think everybody in toronto is worried about the same thing happened to matt sundin i think was it rosie no it wasn't rosie that asked about sundin's legacy somebody else asked hey are you putting your legacy on the line here and matt's was like no i'm not worried about that yeah i don't know just information that i've received is that number one uh matt's is going to bring and i talked to you guys about this a couple of weeks ago matt's is going to bring standards to

Starting point is 01:40:01 the organization that they have not internally had and when we talk about remember when um steve remember when matthew signed the extension his first time and then it came out that he had mooned security guard and was going to be potentially brought up on charges yeah and and and judd moldaver and austin matthews did not tell the leafs that that was pending completely by that completely insane and and that and steve's like listen like dubas has gone i remember at the time you're like dubas has gone to the wall for you guys we can and we will he's given you the contracts that you need and this is how you repay him not in a million trillion lifetimes would you dream of pulling that shit with Lou Lamorello?

Starting point is 01:40:45 Never. Never. Never, but you're like, new executive. Lou would have known anyway. Yeah, Lou would have been. He would have found out. He would have rolled down the window of the car and been sitting in it,

Starting point is 01:40:55 and you'd be like, what the fuck? This is. Oh, my God. And from what I've understood, the way the Marner situation played out, not just with Matt's, but with a lot of the alumni who all still talk, right? You're talking about the big names from the Sundin era.

Starting point is 01:41:15 They all still talk. And they were pissed, by the way, that they were not involved for the last 10 years. They're pissed. And now Matz is in, which is where he should be. I think that a scenario like that wouldn't have played out the same way if Matz had been there. And I don't mean to make Marner the villain here. Like, I think a lot of what happened with Mitch Marner rests on the shoulders of the Leafs organization and Mitch Marner. I wish I wish he had more mentors. I wish he had to. I think I think I wish they all did. We're in a different world, I think, if and I think, Steve, you know, we talked about this many, many times on the show as well. They kept underperforming the playoffs and nothing happened. There was no trades. There was no like they, you know, we're talking about the core guys here. There was no changes. There was no accountability. It was, you know, it just felt and Leaf fans, I think, do feel that. Right.

Starting point is 01:42:10 Like, nobody, as much as people may be mad at Chris for writing the article or whatever, I don't think there's a member of Leafs Nation that goes, you know what, I'm sure glad they did nothing after the Montreal and Tampa series. In fact, I'm sure glad they did nothing after Columbus, Montreal, Tampa three years in a row. Being blindly optimistic doesn't make you smart. Yeah, yeah. Like, it's, I admire it. Part of me wishes I could be that.

Starting point is 01:42:40 it in not just hockey like imagine just heading into everything going this is going to work you know but guys it's not a strategy at all here like let's let's scrutinize the guys uh draft history and trade history and no no no no no don't just oh that was a different owner okay like and it was okay sure and and that's not and by the way barrel not a good owner but again for the love of god we just did this with brad yep the owner of the avalanche the flames is cheap he's meddling those are the two worst things to be probably and we said you know what though he did this this and this his hands were tied on the kentuck trade and i bet he's going to be good a lot of people like

Starting point is 01:43:40 him then he comes here does the job that he does and we are where we are and then there's chica who you could describe in almost the exact same way except no one likes him well but maybe that that's about to change right this is you know he's he's a lot older now that's a whole decade has passed like i again we're open to that if this guy's such a dumbass why won't you answer his call yeah if this guy does it right all these gms oh i'm not even gonna answer his call okay but you think he sucks though if he sucks he should probably take his call yeah that's a good point it's a really good point the 2026 chevrolet tracks is the stylish suv for those on the move and with the standard chevy safety assist package you have the backup to handle every turn with

Starting point is 01:44:28 confidence the 2026 tracks start your build at chevrolet.ca when west jet first took flight in 1996 the vibes were a bit different people thought denim on denim was peak fashion inline skates were everywhere and two out of three women rocked the rachel while those things stayed in the 90s one thing that hasn't is that fuzzy feeling you get when west jet welcomes you on board here's to west jetting since 96 travel back in time with us and actually travel with us at westjet.com slash 30 years the other thing i want to tell you i've heard about sundine is that you know remember the rosie domano question uh what's the hierarchy basically yeah it just starts with i'm confused i'm i'm rosie domano and i'm confused which is what a ringtone vintage her vintage rosie

Starting point is 01:45:20 but um uh so a couple of things with rosie actually yeah she said i'm confused what's managerial structure and keith pelly just wouldn't answer the question we know that right i i am told that matt's has an enormous amount of power in this scenario like like a lot more than that is being alluded to and i think there's a reason why matt's was the guy on the laptop for the draft lottery and not john and i think it's no no i'm i'm serious i think i mean i'd rather i'd rather it be him i'd rather be mats too but like i think there's a significance to mats that they're not really telling us about and mats is it's going to be mats's job to set the culture up and down the organization but i think when they talk about players player personnel

Starting point is 01:46:09 data is going to be really important everybody knows that but one of the issues i always thought the leafs had with dubas under with data was are okay but like what are they like what are what are their what's their compete level what are their standards right and matt's is going to be the guy that's like are you good like the now we're gonna now i'm holding you to your feet to the flames on the crest here your toronto maple leaf this is what a toronto maple leaf does right he was a captain for 11 years and never held the organization hostage no matter how bad they got no ever never once no the first time they missed the playoffs he was like i want out never did that nope never did that so the so that that part I think is interesting now when it comes

Starting point is 01:46:51 to Gavin McKenna who I think the Leafs are going to pick and you're going to get I mean you got to have the conversation of what about Ivar Stenberg and what about Chase Reed we know they like Chase Reed Ivar Stenberg might be ready next season faster than Gavin McKenna is I was listening to a really good and yeah I think we're probably gonna have Scott on but I had Scott we Scott I texted him and I go, Hey man, do you like podcasts? What'd he say? He said, I haven't done enough of them this week. What's one more.

Starting point is 01:47:22 So we'll get them on. I haven't responded. He has some great, um, I was texting him too, but I did, I hadn't invited him on yet. Cause I'm like, this guy's going to get just slammed with requests. Um, but you know, it was interesting because he said, you know, this draft isn't like the celebrini draft right where you had carlson and celebrini and that sort of thing uh or those those two draft years i guess with bedard and celebrini and carlson um but you know mckenna is a left winger who is a perimeter vision playmaker he's too skinny right now just let's just call it what

Starting point is 01:48:00 it is he's too skinny he's put on a little bit of weight at penn state he's tall needs to put on more muscle but you know they're 18 and they can eat 40 hamburgers a day and never gain a pound like that's just the you know that's being 18 beyond that there are

Starting point is 01:48:13 questions about compete level there are questions about you know he's got some bad habits I think that they're going to have to iron out and I want to temporarily fans expectations on this guy

Starting point is 01:48:26 and if he blows us away that's great yeah but if you're expecting him to come in and be what Austin was uh when he came in don't like you gotta remember 40 goals guys like yeah like like mitch mitch marner only had 60 something points i think 67 points his first season that would be an incredible outcome and mitch was a great player out of junior when he didn't have the puck still

Starting point is 01:48:54 a very strong defensive player gavin is not so you're seeing elite potentially elite level so You're seeing comparisons to Patrick Kane and Kucherov and stuff like that. First off, it would be a long time before he gets there. We're talking about wingers who can control a power play, dominate the ice when they're on it, find guys, make everybody better. Gavin, when he's feeling it, can do that. But if you're expecting him to come in and explode and become amazing, listen, I hope he does.

Starting point is 01:49:24 But even Macklin Celebrini didn't have the best rookie season. No. It was good. It was good. and so we're expecting you need to have that expectation of if gavin mckenna's the guy and i think he will be you got to make sure that you understand that he's not going to come in and be nylander or matthews in their prime those guys took a long time to get to where they are 50 points would be i think a pretty incredible outcome exactly and you got to see in lashes of

Starting point is 01:49:54 that eliteness right jack uh one thing that scott brought up was jack hughes's first season was good wasn't great was good you could see it though and it starts to come together in year two and year three it's so rare that a guy well and so there have been criticisms of mckenna and his defensive play in his compete level and i'm like man if 129 points in 56 games in the whl at age 16 is him not trying and like the medicine hat tigers won that year he had 38 points in 16 playoff games mm-hmm yeah all right like okay 51 points in 35 games at uh penn state and like something else like that people are forgetting about mckenna a little bit

Starting point is 01:50:51 is he's sort of a canary in a coal mine here in what way he was an elite definitely number one overall pick in his year before draft year and at this that by the way comparable numbers in his his year before draft year is conor mcdavid awesome great compare comp like comp numbers crazy insane uh he had 26 points more than the next closest teammate of his so he had 129 ozzy weisblatt had 103 the next closest guy the medicine had tigers had 61 he had more than double the guy at third wow do you understand at 16 yep at 16 yep right but but so he's the number one consensus guy then he

Starting point is 01:51:52 goes to university mm-hmm no one else I can't think of anyone else who has ever done that on account of it was illegal it was against the rules and Steve he's going to play in university before you get to the stats guys that could be as old as 23 or 24 yes and he did struggle the first half of the season but what happened in the second half he didn't struggle he had 51

Starting point is 01:52:17 points the next closest guy had 42 in ncaa 51 points and that's with the first half of his season struggling yes and just like going through the other top scorers on his team 21 20 21 21 20 uh jackson smith was 18 luke me says 19 the 23 23 23 23 these guys are grown men yep right so yep if his development in his draft year seemed a little wonky i would absolutely believe it because he's taking a path like austin matthews that hasn't really been done before matthews went through the american developmental program and then was like i'm gonna give switzerland on a shot because i don't know why the hell not mckenna is the first high profile draft year uh guy to do this because it was previously not allowed so i'm not surprised that he

Starting point is 01:53:20 struggled at first i'm not surprised he got better and that's maybe maybe we can look at his ncaa season and go that's kind of how we think maybe the nhl might go for him which is you struggle just a little bit at first and then you start to get it yeah you know like in in in the back half of the year so what what that does though with the leafs timeline is okay so you got mckenna you're going to bring him in your top six looks something like this mckenna matthews nice right cowan tavaris kneelander all right that's not bad now you do have to and jonah siegel wrote this in his article you got to get a second line center you have to get like no no disrespect to John Tavares you've got to find a second line center and you got to do it like now and the

Starting point is 01:54:08 other thing they have to do is they got to remake the defense I think Tanev's going to come back and he's going to be fine but you can't play him 26 minutes a night in the regular season he's got to be more like 18 to 19 right he's going to be 37 man I go back and forth on OEL I don't know I I love the way he plays so much, but maybe it's the best move to move him. You could get a King's ransom. I think Morgan Riley, so I've heard a couple of things in the last couple of days. One person who I very much trust said, this is the window to trade him, and he'd be willing to accept it. Another person who I really trust said, well, okay, but if you fire Berube and you see what Morgan Riley is under another coach.

Starting point is 01:54:55 What are we doing? so you say no because his because i think it is notable and i've been number one morgan riley gotta go guy for a couple of years now yeah right i in fact i go all the way back to their series against florida in the second round in 2023 and i go like he's gotta go but steve matthews two worst offensive seasons have happened under craig berube morgan riley's two worst overall seasons have happened under Craig Berube. I'm not saying that Morgan Riley's ever going to live up to that contract here in Toronto.

Starting point is 01:55:28 But if you have him playing third-line minutes or second-line minutes... I'm already out, based on your description. You're already out? I'm already out. He makes $7.5 million. What are we talking about third pair? No!

Starting point is 01:55:43 Okay, okay, okay. He's still a very capable offensive player. He always elevates in the playoffs. He does. He does. like last year it's four goals seven points in 13 games it's amazing yet uh the the other year that they actually won around he had 12 points in 11 games year before that he had six points in seven games career playoffs for mo in 70 games 15 goals 32 assists 47 points you would never know that

Starting point is 01:56:16 that guy's on a team that can never win just based on his individual stats right uh he does elevate and that's great but it's 82 games and i know the cap is going up i just think you got to spend that a little more cleverly what did you think of the uh what did you think of the report that uh came out of edmonton that the uh uh at the trade deadline for oel and mcmahon or something like that darnell nurse was going to be the return yo yo i don't know if that's edmonton trying to offload him in toronto saying no or if there was legitimate interest there but i'm terrified of what that possibly imagine we're living in a world i simply i simply don't believe that um that doesn't make any sense like how is it first round pick for dickinson and then a very

Starting point is 01:57:13 comparable package from the leafs is somehow nurse i yeah i wouldn't be surprised if nurse was discussed but like that doesn't make any sense to me yeah it might have been a part of the deal the other thing that keeps popping up and i think people should keep an open mind with is you know matthew nize's name has now been connected to new jersey i think that was around simon nemich who you know remember defenseman like simon nemich as much as he had a tougher year than i think people expected him to in new jersey this guy's like 22 he was a top five pick i think he was third or second overall second and he uh is 22 i just want to keep going i want to repeat the fact that he's 22 yeah jackson lacombe who's having his coming out party nationally now

Starting point is 01:57:56 is like 24 25 it takes a long long long time if you have a top six already steve of let's say matthews wants to stay and neil andrews good and whatever you've already got the top six worked out do you move a guy like nice to chicago is the name that keeps coming up montreal came up before the trade deadline new jersey came up before the trade done is it a nemish or a levshinov or you know uh there was a montreal prospect out of russia who's apparently i keep forgetting his name oh starts with a zed yeah zharkov zharkov i think well maybe we're sounding like keith pelly now not knowing the prospects names off by our yeah but we don't claim to yeah that's fair that's fair my point is like and and jonas and james were talking about this and i'm like ah i find it

Starting point is 01:58:48 hard they do need to make the remake the defense and one of the things john shake has said is we got to rebuild from the from the back end right we got to build from the back end i don't know how you do that without parting with something great and i do think ben danford's going to play nhl games this year but i don't know that he's a full timer and so is he you know are you not trying to get him as many minutes as possible with the marlies um and then you know get him to mentor under chris tana perhaps because you want to turn him into that like i don't know how i don't think by the way zharovsky thank you i don't think you can go to arizona and have this meeting with austin matthews and go we're going to be a contender in october i think you have to

Starting point is 01:59:29 say austin if you want to stay we want you here because we would never want you to go but the idea that we're going to be able to do this in a summer is probably impossible right because ultimately steve it makes way more sense to keep a guy like matthew nice to me unless you're getting is i don't know like a rowinsky level adam fox simon nemich on the younger end like you got to get a name that's like a number one guy and i don't know like is cowan a guy that they move like you know this is this is where it gets like you know i it's it's your it's your ice cream analogy i want the ice cream that's a dollar 50 but no matter how many times i rearrange my quarters i've only got a dollar 25 right right and the good news is they got the first overall pick and you have more

Starting point is 02:00:15 options than you did uh a week ago i just you look at every criticism of the leafs from last year uh i just don't come away with the conclusion that matthew nyes is the guy that you need to move i understand he's got a lot of value i do yeah but i i think that's such a key part of your team going forward what about a defenseman who shoots right is from toronto ontario is 30 years old and had 70 points this year damn that's crazy how many assets do i got to trade for him none hmm his name's darren radish oh and up until a couple of days ago i would have been like yeah i don't know i don't think he i mean you know why would he step into this but now with mckenna i'm like well that could really solve some things and he in his press conference with tampa uh at the

Starting point is 02:01:05 end he said you know i want to thank the organization they've been so great he didn't leave it wasn't like um with the panthers where it's like i'm not after leaving you know what i mean like bennett and uh like it feels like this might be a parting of the ways and tampa being tampa you know jj moser or somebody will step up darren radish could fill a lot of that and i know that he's 30 and i know that he had a crazy year where his points jumped from 37 to 70 but let's say you're getting darren radish and you're expecting 50 to 55 points that would still be an enormous improvement over what they have and you can have an Oliver Ekman Larson Chris Tanev in there and then you can move a guy like Brandon Carlo who despite his play last year has a lot of

Starting point is 02:01:53 value low cap hit six foot whatever I think it's six foot seven right shot defenseman six five who cares he plays like he's five nine I don't know like he I'm just trying to like how do you work the pieces right no i know i know and this is great because you have a gm who i have no idea what the hell this guy's gonna do no we don't have any like that's the other thing i like that though it's it's a it's a wild card right it's fun it's not to the point with dubas we're like guys like kevin pipetti online could be like like six months out i wonder about this guy he was crazy he was like a seer with dubas right and i gotta say it's terrible content because because you being good at content would be like steve what if he does this and i didn't have it in me

Starting point is 02:02:45 to be like yes maybe i would just be like adam he's not gonna do that adam he's not gonna do that he's not gonna do that we know what he's gonna do you could be like what if jacob did this i don't know adam what if he did do that yeah because we don't know that sounds so fun yeah i enjoy that um yeah this has definitely been the last couple weeks has been an interesting intersection of my content creator life and my i love the leafs life yeah right it's been it's been really hard and also amazing there's something fun about the dark there is i don't know i don't know what's going on but there's something fun about the dark okay we'll leave it there steve uh thank you so much uh we're wishing wishing jesse the best of health hopefully

Starting point is 02:03:35 get him back monday uh love you all and we will see you on the stream so steve you got a stream tonight i've got a stream tonight yeah right and then i've got a stream tomorrow night and then you've got a stream on sunday and so do i we so we'll see you all weekend long you're not getting away from us we'll see you later the steve dangle podcast follow the guys on twitter at steve underscore dangle at Adam W Y L D E and at Jesse Blake.

The Steve Dangle Podcast - Picktionary | May 8, 2026

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