The Steve Dangle Podcast - The Steve Dangle Podcast - Jan 12, 2017 - REAL All-Stars

Episode Date: January 13, 2017

On this episode, the guys point and laugh at Adam for being wrong, talk actual All-Stars, Kasperi Kapanen, Paul Maurice and the Winnipeg Jets, and more. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha I want to know, I want to know, are you going to go with the Michael Froelich jersey or the JVR jersey? Froelich scored last night. Hey, there you go. You know. That's why he's an all-star, Jesse. Full credit to the NHL staff writers. A lot of the names ended up being right.

Considering Adam was literally blindly walking into the night with his pants around his ankles, He only got eight or nine wrong That's not bad That's not bad Considering he read literally a fabricated list To thousands of listeners online And on the radio waves I'd say that's pretty good

All right Now, Jesse Can you pull up the all-star list? Oh, I don't know if I can Pull up the NHL all-star rosters Because I'm going to read you the real NHL all-star rosters Even though you've all seen them Let me just have this, okay

Here's how you know it's right If Goudreau is on it Do you want me to read off the real names? No, no, let me do it Can you let me have this one? Okay Just in case you skipped last show Adam starts the show with

We have breaking news They announced the all-star rosters Which they did But Adam somehow read the wrong list Well, can I explain what happened? I thought I just did Well, it's not I want to tell you how it happened

Okay Oh, I want you to justify your mistake Okay No, I'm not justifying it I'm not justifying it In fact, I'm ranking myself over the Coles because what do I always say? What do I always say? Steve, you're an idiot.

Put down your phone. Read the article before you pass the article on, right? Read the article. What did I do? I searched NHL All-Star Rosters, the first link that came up, NHL All-Star Rosters, NHL.com. That is because it was six minutes old. The news was six minutes old at that time. and the top article on google was the nhl all-star picks by the nhl.com staff so it was a

predictions article this is very key what was the date on the article you didn't check the date didn't check the date well if you're not gonna read the thing at least read the date always always should have done that that's okay though we like to lecture broadcasting students often on the show and we're better than me that's what i'm saying be better than me yeah but you retroactively at the same time made the show way better people once people realized what was wrong I think it was just half

an hour ago what a loser what's great is the people who figured it out for themselves did you get bombarded with Seth Jones made the all star yeah yeah and people are like no but Zach Lewinsky should have made it he should have but then I think if you

found out what you did wrong and then listen to the show there's all kinds of really really unintentionally funny things that we left behind. Johnny Goudreau's not an All-Star?

Why didn't they have Johnny Goudreau in the All-Star game? Hey, at least we were in line with the NHL's thinking, which is you want to see Johnny Goudreau

do goofy things, right? Which we said. I mean, I was right. You were right. I want to see for a league, whatever. I want to see a grinding grinder.

I want to see a guy who's more goals than Goudreau. He does. Would you say he's in a goo drought? No, I would not I knew that was going to be bad

I knew that was going to be bad Alright here's the To that joke I say Michael No Leak Alright Atlantic Division Choo choo

Keep chugging Atlantic Division Yeah I really like That Adam made that mistake Because it covered up Choo choo Which was brutal It was brutal

Nikita Kucherov Tampa Bay Lightning Atlantic Division Brad Marchand Boston Bruins Oh Choo choo Austin Matthews Toronto Maple Leafs

Franz Nielsen Detroit Kyle Ocpozo, Buffalo. That's still weird. Kyle Ocpozo, Buffalo. Yeah, that's one of those free agent signings I haven't gotten used to yet because Buffalo hasn't really been newsworthy. You know what I mean?

They haven't been particularly good. But not bad either. They're bad, but they're not bad enough to make fun of, so they're just kind of there. Vincent Trocek, Florida. Defense, Victor Hedman, Eric Carlson, Shea Weber. Goaltenders, Carey Price, Tuca Rask. Metropolitan Division, we got Sidney, Crosby, Taylor Hall.

another one where it's like wow yeah that's right he's a devil yeah Evgeny Malkin Pittsburgh Penguins Alex Ovechkin Washington Capitals

Wayne Simmons a boy so he did make it Wayne Simmons he did make it which we're very happy about he did make it yeah

yeah because we were applauding it last episode can you imagine what a story what a story Wayne Simmons grows up in Scarborough

tends Joseph Howe and now he's in the All-Star game and oh it's Claude Giroux John Tavares New York Islanders

then we've got Justin Falk from Carolina not Jeff Skinner Seth Jones from Columbus Ryan McDonough from New York sorry back up Jeff Skinner was one where you were like

what a story he had all these concussion troubles and man he showed the world and then I think you even read his stats and I remember being like that's

good but like I mean he was great in NHL 2012 but Sergey Borovsky And Brayden Holpe Are the goaltenders

And then Central Central Blackhawks Have Kane Patrick Laine From the Jets Nathan McKinnon From the Avs

Tyler Sagan From the Stars Tara Sanka From the Blues Taze from the Blackhawks Subban from Nashville Who is the Capitan Yes

Duncan Keith From Chicago Ryan Suter From Minnesota And Corey Crawford And Devin Dubnik I remember being like How is Corey Crawford

Yeah Like the best goalie In the division And all the Blackhawks fans Tweeted me Were like You have a hint on For Corey Crawford

And you need to stop You need to stop I'm like I'm sorry Oh poor Adam Poor Adam Hey Connor and David

Jesse Approximately how happy were you When you found out That's what Adam did I was more happy When I saw your video Yeah the video was great Oh my god

It was so funny You know what Shout out to Mrs. Dangle For the camera work Going down to E Yeah yeah At the right times And Kenny Burley's art

In the background People were asking About the poster Absolutely Carter McDavid is the captain of the Pacific Division. I believe that. Jeff Carter, who is having a ridiculous season. Ridiculous in L.A.

He's number two. Johnny Goudreau in Calgary. Bo Horvat in Vancouver, because who else? Ryan Kessler in Anaheim. Joe Pavelski. Then Brent Burns, Drew Dowdy, Cam Fowler on defense. That's interesting. Cam Fowler.

Is that the guy you'd have picked from Anaheim? Who is the guy that we're like, well, maybe they'll trade him because he seems like the odd man out. He has had a good start to the season. Martin Jones and Mike Smith. Mike Smith. Now, who else do you pick from Arizona? Oliver Ekman-Larsen.

Oh, there you go. That's actually a really good answer. Probably Max Domi if he doesn't get hurt. Yeah. And Mike Smith, I mean, he's been a decent goalie on a really bad team. If you ask the players on the team, they think he's one of the best goalies in the league because, of course, they're his teammates. Yeah, no team's going to be like, you know what?

Our real weakness is a net. Can you bring up Arizona's stats? Jesse, bring up Arizona's stats. Oh, we got some goalie stats for this show. Oh, do we? Oh, we got some goalie stats. Why would we need to talk about it? We'll bring it up later.

Because I want to talk about a certain gasket-blowing coach. We will get to that. A former Leafs coach. Because who isn't a former Leafs coach at this point? There's a lot of them. When did the Leafs rebuild begin? We're going to get to that next. We got to talk about Chris Johnson's article on Kapanen

and why he can't watch Leaf games. Mark Spector said something, and we will, if you haven't read it, you'll disagree with it, but, you know, what's new? Mark's a good guy, but we rarely agree on things. And that's okay. It's funny. Okay, so I don't think I've ever told this on the show,

but Mark is a guy who regularly we will read his things and be like, oh, Spector. Balderdash. Stupid. And then this year at the World Cup of Hockey, I don't remember who I was saying hi to initially, but they were sitting right next to Mark Spector, who was writing something.

And they introduced me and he looks over his shoulder and he goes, Dangle! And I was like so happy and so warm. And I was just like, he's just a nice man. Let's let him have his opinions.

When you hear this article, I mean, I can understand where his premise comes from. I soundly, roundly, soundly, whateverly disagree with this. Oh, you can disagree with someone. That's okay. Stephen Birch did a

matthews versus marner versus rookie seasons great rookie seasons in history in context so it talks about like all the nhl all-time best rookies all-time and they're among both of them the top 30 which is amazing interested to see what stats he used because i mean the like really advanced ones not even really advanced like coursey basically i think didn't exist well it's not that you'd have to go back and to my knowledge they only have it back to like 2007 well yeah Yeah, you're not going to get Corsi on Gay Stewart in his first season. I don't know who that is.

As a Toronto Maple Leaf. Oh. What was still abscessed Corsi Rowe? Exactly, right? Exactly. And then, of course, we've got to talk about some other news outside of the NHL,

specifically pertaining to the NFL, which is becoming goofier and goofier by the second. That silly, silly NFL. But firstly, What would you like to know about the Arizona Coyotes? How many people on the Arizona Coyotes have over 10 goals?

How many people? How many players? Zero. Wait, really? Yes. Verbata and Hansel are both at nine. Verbata would have ten if he scored on Freddie Anderson in overtime of the Peter Holland game. Oh, my God.

Oh, my God. I just thought that was a crazy stat. Not one of them. Habs, I believe, have five players with at least ten goals. Wow. Which is pretty damn good. Someone tweeted me something today. so we well we I specifically have been wrong about many a thing and this summer I didn't have a good

summer or at least so far I'm not um particularly pertaining to the Habs and one was um uh the Habs traded Lars Eller in order to get Philippe Deneau or some something along those lines and I said that's like trading a drill so you can buy a screwdriver dude I don't I think Eller has like what, three goals or something like that and Deneau had an amazing two goal performance yesterday. He's been a fantastic

contributor for them. Mark Bergevin with every single move he's made so far is making me He's on fire. Making me grow, man. Hey, props.

I don't need to validate you. The standings do. He also has stylish glasses. Point that out. And suits. Yeah, he looks good. He's a beautiful man. He is, but you know what?

In Montreal, there's no excuse. There's too many good looking places to be good looking. They've got great tailors there. You have to have good fashion in Montreal Tell us more about your hometown Yeah

It's not my hometown You clearly know so much about it Actually I have a really funny story about Talk about how much better it is than Toronto I don't know Keep going Can I tell you I actually have a

Later on We won't do it now Can I tell you about my Francophone roots That I had no idea about I was born there I need to hear this Okay

Alright So Steve He was born Gaston Wild Gaston Benoit Wild Benoit, I know, I know When did the Leafs rebuild begin? Steve, this is your article on Sportsnet.ca And it kind of goes through

Some of the seminal moments that we've seen In the last five years That really kind of Could each of them be On their own terms, turning points They are turning points But what's the actual You go through them all and go

What is the actual moment when this all started? Yeah, and I tried to dig that up About a month ago, I made a video when Randy Carlisle was visiting town, and I said the moment he was fired was the moment the Leafs rebuild began. And I've gone back and forth with that, and I kind of disagree with it now. I think there's an argument to be made. I think there are some good points, but I don't think that was it. So I went back, and I've had discussions with many people who all feel differently about this, trying to figure out exactly when the Leafs rebuild began. Jeff Viet has a particularly unique angle that I went through in the blog

so I did an argument for and against for all of them and he his argument is this is year four of the rebuild meaning I guess it began somewhere around the 2012 draft when Morgan Riley was drafted when the Leafs drafted Morgan Riley fifth overall and they also got Connor Brown um I get it I get the points but I just disagree like do you okay now by by when the rebuild started do you might mean by when when the intention was there well this is what i tried to figure out right so you can make an argument that the rebuild started prior to brendan shanahan because the leafs the current leafs are littered

with players from previous regimes leo kamarov is a john ferguson jr pick like that's how far back this goes. And we learned from someone on Twitter that the Leafs got the pick that drafted Leo Komarov because they traded Nathan Parrott to the Dallas Stars. Yeah, thank you for that tweet. Because I brought up Nathan Parrott having somebody having their jersey. I was like, Nathan Parrott,

who has that jersey? And then a couple years later, the Stars made another late round trade with someone else and they drafted some bum with a fifth round pick. I think his name is Jamie Benn. Never heard of him. Never heard of him. So you could definitely make the argument it started before shanahan then there's shanahan i mean he

created the shana plan like that's it's called that for a reason lou lamorello is the gm but he doesn't call all the shots mike babcock is the highest paid coach in the sport but he doesn't call all the shots it ultimately all goes up to brendan shanahan the argument i have against that is one of his first actions as Leafs president was to extend Randy Carlisle. In the summer of 2014, he wanted to extend Dave Boland at nearly, if not exactly, $5 million a year for five years. And it's funny, I remember the first interview back

at training camp, the reporters asked him, you know, how do you feel about this summer? Well, I was there. We feel really good about it. And he said, sure, we would have liked to retain Dave Boland. Yep. Something along those lines, yeah. Now, I think at that point, Shanahan's view of the franchise and view of hockey would be 1,000% different than it is now.

It's a disputed moment. It's funny. This is a terrible comparison, but I've been listening to Dan Carlin's Hardcore History. Which is the best. Recently. Are you listening to the Armageddon episodes? Yes. So he's talking about the beginning of World War I.

Oh, my God. obviously completely different from running a hockey team but but not all different management's management but he goes through everything very slowly and he goes this is a key moment like everything is a key moment because uh you have a decision to make and even though it seems like an insignificant one if you go through the door on your left you head to war if you go through the door on your right you might avoid it so that moment where the Leafs don't get Dave Boland I I it's hard to tell if he like maybe he still regrets that maybe he thinks he would have been a good leader and and he could be helping this current rebuild or did his ideology change or

Or did not getting him make him decide? Like, was that the final straw where he goes, without Dave Bolin, this team sucks, we need to rebuild? That can't be the case. It might be. It might be. I don't think so. You know what I think it is?

I think it's a change in, a deepening. I wouldn't say a change, a deepening in how he and the rest of us are understanding the game. And I'm not saying that I am on any level close to where Brandon Shanahan or the Leafs brain trust is because I'm not, and I know that. Sure. But I can tell you that in my time,

I think that's pretty evident, actually. I don't think I need to say that. But I think in my time since then, and even then, we were pro fancy stats. We were looking at them. We were watching them. What are they saying? What are they saying?

What are they saying? Even at that point, anybody who was a math nerd in the hockey community would have told you it's a bad signing. Or watch the Leafs play. There was one game in particular where the Leafs won. They won in overtime. I believe the game-tying goal was scored by Trevor Smith.

So that's where we're going back to. But the Leafs were outshot something like 50-20 by the Dallas Stars. Leafs won that game. Now you could look at the outcome and be like, they won! What else do you want? They got outshot, they got almost, no, more than doubled up in the shot column. That can't sustain. It can't.

I think the Kyle Dubas, for Brendan Shanahan, a huge moment was hiring Kyle Dubas. Well, I want to get to that last. So, there were a few other moments, and I'll go through them a little quicker. There was the firing of Randy Carlisle, obviously. June, no, January 6th, 2015. That's how recent it was. We just passed the two-year anniversary. Wow.

Last week. Hey, we haven't even passed the one-year anniversary of Phaneuf getting traded. Can you believe that? No. No, because I hadn't even thought of it that way. It feels a lot longer ago. I forgot he was traded last season entirely. When I saw the 2016, I was like, wait,

Phaneuf was on the last place Leafs for the majority of the season? I don't remember that. As captain. As captain. Which means less than a year ago, the Leafs had a captain. Yeah. It feels like it's been four years. Yeah.

It's bizarre. David Clarkson getting traded is the cap day or cap era equivalent of the Gretzky trade. in a completely different light you know Wayne Gretzky got traded so anybody can get traded okay David Clarkson got traded so anybody anybody can be traded Nathan Horton Mark Savard Chris Pronger Pavel Datsuk have all been traded those are contracts you can move because um well there's actually a variety of reasons I think Datsuk is a little different they all have cap hits but some of them you can uh alleviate with LTIR some of them I think Datsuk

involves no real money it just takes up the cap space so those are all unique yeah I don't know if you can put Datsuk on LTIR no Clarkson when he was traded had a similar cap hit to Nathan Horton except he was a healthy player you had to have him on the roster the reason that deal was made to my understanding was the Blue Jackets could afford to have a bad player

making about that much money what they couldn't afford was to have no player making that much money so it wasn't just about the cap hit it was about the fact

that they had five and a half million dollars something like that just sitting there well and also beyond that they were paying Nathan Horton and that contract

wasn't insured that's part of the problem was the my understanding of that deal and part of the reason why it worked so well was because

Nathan Horton The Leafs can pay Nathan Horton themselves But a lot of the time There is insurance on these contracts And if I'm totally wrong on this I believe I read it in 30 Thoughts But if I'm totally wrong on this Call me on it, I'm fine with that

My understanding of it was Chances are That Nathan Horton for some reason That contract was not insured And David Clarkson's I believe is So Columbus can't afford to put him on LTIR Because there's insurance money coming back for that So they're not actually paying it

I don't know how far the insurance money would go. But to me, that makes a lot more sense. Point being, the contract was, you couldn't buy it out. And Clarkson was healthy. You couldn't buy it out. He wasn't producing well. It was buyout proof. It was good proof.

There was no way that contract was ever going to prove itself to be good. It was an unmovable albatross. And the Leafs moved it. When they freed all that up, it freed them to do other things. So, they fired Carlisle, they traded Clarkson. There was a day, Jesse, help me out. I want to say April 2015. Am I right?

When they fired literally everybody. Oh, let me bring it up. Yeah, sure. On this day, whatever day it ends up being, the Leafs fired Dave Nonas, head coach Peter Horacek, Chris Dennis, who was an assistant coach, Steve Spott, who was an assistant coach, Rick St. Croix, who's the goalie coach, Jim Hughes, who I think was the director of player development,

and Steve Kasper, I can't remember exactly what his role, as well as, according to Damien Cox, 18 scouts. Which is insane. They fired over 20 people in one day. I mean, in order to rebuild, you've got to de-build. And that day, I mean, what else do you want? It was the 12th. April 12th, 2015.

Before the draft, too. Horton's contract is uninsured. Interesting. Yeah. So that's a different thing. I just wanted to confirm that. Different conversation for a different day. But I just wanted to say it is uninsured, and that's part of the problem with Columbus.

Columbus is part of their problem with it. For sure. Anyway, sorry. But that to me, that to me is the moment. You think that's when they fired 25 people? To me, a plan is only a plan. Like, when you're planning something, it doesn't become actionable until you actually take action, right? And I know that seems weird, but it seemed like on that day, they had been planning something for somewhere like four to five months.

And it's funny you say that because a small, funny-to-me note about that trade. Just months prior, Brandon Pridham was hired. Do you know what his role is? He's a capologist, is he not? Right, but what's his official title? Assistant General Manager? No. Kyle Dubas is an Assistant General Manager.

Mark Hunter is an Assistant General Manager. Brandon Pridham's title is assistant to the general manager. He's Dwight Schrute. Yeah, kind of. Wow. And he was assistant to, well, who's the general manager? At the time, it was Dave Nonas. So he was assistant to a lame duck GM.

So, okay, why do you think that was the moment? I think that was the moment because the plan became action. So when did the Leafs rebuild begin? It began when they cleared house. They knew they sucked. So to you, that's just rock bottom. It couldn't possibly get worse. Well, it did get worse.

And that was the point. See, the point was that they knew the next season that when Babcock was hired, that was part of that plan. But that was later on. That was May 20th, I believe, right? Yeah, around there. May 20th. So I think when Horchak and Spot and all those guys were let go,

that's the moment, bingo. I don't know any other moment that the franchise literally turned on its heel and said, okay, we're done. I think the rebuild started, and this is why we skipped it earlier, with the hiring of Kyle Dubas. On the same day, I want to say July 22, 2014. Oh, and the reason I remember this day is the move happened while I was in the air. I was on the way to my honeymoon.

And I landed to great news. The Leafs had hired Kyle Dubas. And fired Dave Pullen, who I think was VP of Hockey Ops, and Claude Lozelle, who was assistant GM, and at the time, their Brandon Pridham, the guy in charge of watching their cap. And he did a terrible job of that. And that is well documented in dozens of podcasts that we did at the time. That was the moment where you start to see a theme to their moves. They signed Kyle Dubas. Jake Gardner gets extended

to a very reasonable surprising contract when we thought he was gone and a lot of people were like oh it's because of Dubas because he was only there for a week as if

they hire a 28 year old and within a week they're like what should we do and he's like offer this guy 20 million dollars and they're like

okay Kyle yeah no we'll do it yeah 21 million dollars whatever it ended up being but it had a theme Kyle Dubas gets hired Jake Gardner gets extended

for five years about a month later they hire Brandon Pridham and the analytics department so they bring on an entire department that they didn't have before in October so just two months after that they hire Mark Hunter and then a couple months later Carlisle gets fired and a couple months later everyone gets fired and the David Clarkson trade is in the middle of that so to me it's Dubas's hiring because that's when things finally start going linearly there were good moves you know interspersed uh you know and even in the john

ferguson era in the brian burke era dave notice made some fine moves we we praised his ability to sign restricted free agents to to team friendly deals but the moment i started agreeing with almost everything the leafs were doing was when they hired kyle dubas so to me that's when the rebuild began but i i mean the what i basically came up with at the end of it was there is no exact moment the rebuild began that's definitely the moment where everything started to head in one direction but none of that happens without shanahan and you can't you can't uh you know rebuild your team without scorching the earth so you could argue that it's the day where they You could argue it's any of them.

I think the argument is, hooray, they're good now. I don't think it 100% matters. Just going through that, it brought me back to how we felt in those years. It was bad. It was really bad. Now having hope for about, I don't know, the last five months, it's been really great. It's erased all the bad memories. I heard someone make the argument that the Leafs haven't been good since Twitter's been invented.

Like, we haven't gone through a stretch of good Leafs. That's a fair argument. My argument is that's not harsh enough. Twitter was invented in 2007. They were bad long before that. They were bad before Facebook. Yep. Yep.

The last time the Leafs made the playoffs... MySpace was the king of social media. Yeah, not the Bruins one, because that doesn't count. The last time the Leafs made the playoffs in a full season... Uh-huh. Yeah, Mark Zuckerberg was in a dorm. For real. Yeah.

He was, like, ripping off the Winklevoss twins when Jeremy Roenick scored on Ed Balfour. That's how long ago it was. He had time to become a billionaire, and there is a movie about it, and that movie is now, like, half a decade old. Since the last time the Leafs were good. There you go. What have you done with your life? I know!

Seriously. It has been a long ride. A long ride And I mean The fact that There are some players Where you just have to go Kudos

I can't believe you're still here Who was playing The last time the Leafs were good That is still playing now Besides Jager I'm trying to remember Shane Doan Joe Thornton

Brian McCabe I remember Wasn't great In that series against the Flyers I just interviewed him At an alumni game So there's that Yeah Belfort regularly

Shows up to things to get honored In like a jean jacket So there's There's another retired guy Sundin is long retired No no I'm talking about players In the league

That have been around since then Jager Aginle Jager, Doan Aginle, Thornton Marlo Marlo The list

Hossa Is shorter than it is long Yeah Well of course Put it that way We gotta wrap it up For this part We're gonna come back

And we're gonna talk about the fact that I almost said Sammy Kapanen Kisperi Kapanen Yeah So the Leafs get eliminated from the 2004 playoffs then the 2004 draft

comes around the first overall pick was Alex Ovechkin who just scored his thousandth point Wow That's how long ago it was Bingo

That's it That's it Alright Kisperi Kapanen can't watch Leaf games If you haven't seen it at Sportsnet.ca we're going to tell you why

and I think I'm very interested I think I understand it I think I understand it We'll talk about that next on Sportsnet 590 The Fan Kasperi Kapanen has not got a call-up this year. How dare the Leafs.

Chris Johnson wrote an amazing article, you can see it at sportsnet.ca, on just his mindset right now. And one of the most interesting passages, and it's so interesting, of course, they use it in the title, is he can't watch Leaf games. That is interesting. Because, one, I don't believe it. I think he's lying. It's like when Darcy Tucker used to say he didn't read the paper.

And then Steve Simmons comes on our podcast and he goes, Darcy Tucker knew where the commas were. Right. I have a hard time believing that a city full of writers has bad things to say about you and you haven't read a single one of them. Well, I don't think they have bad things to say about Kasperi Kapanen. Well, I'm talking about Tucker. Oh, okay. So, Kapanen, your goal is to make the Leafs. And you don't watch the Leafs?

I get this one. I mean, you're either lying or going about it the wrong way. I'm going to read the quote to you. Okay. He said, now I'm a Marley, and to be honest, I don't watch Leafs games or anything. I don't really follow them. Obviously, I'll ask Willie how he played after a game. That's about it.

If they're playing well, they can do whatever they want. Now, the way Chris Johnson writes articles, he's not salacious, and he's not sensational, and this is why I really appreciate the next sentence. Chris is a great combination of journalistic integrity, but also storytelling. Yes. He really gets a story. So he said this approach is best understood as a coping mechanism. Say that again.

This approach, as in not watching the Leafs, is best understood as a coping mechanism. And this is where I get it. I'm going to tell you how weak I am. there were times in my career where i have been on the outside of the big thing happening i'm going to try to be general here because i don't want to insult anyone sure but there's there's times where you feel like you should be in a position and you know you should be in that position and you're good enough to be in that position but you're not in that position because you're not in control of everything in your life right and so at a certain point i had to for my

own health, step back and go, I can't think about that thing right now. Because that thing, even though I should be there, even though I should be a part of that thing, I'm not. So I need to focus on my thing and make sure it's as great as possible

so I can eventually make it to that thing. I feel like Kisperi's in that same spot. You're 20 years old. You know you're good enough to be in the NHL. Everybody knows you're good enough to be in the NHL. He is going to be, I think, a pretty good player um however i think all young people go through what you just said by the way

i think so too and i think this is just textbook right everybody has this i think that he's like if i pay attention to what the leafs are doing it will drive me mad even worse if you watch a game and their third or fourth line winger has a bad game oh you'll just stew about how that could have been you they got shut out you know who might have scored a goal me the guy who's scoring all kinds of goals in the AHL right now. Me. This guy. Can you bring up the Marley stats, by the way, Jesse, just so we can get a sense of it? Yeah. And by the way, still

have not been great. No, they're not been great. They've had just a carousel in net, so maybe some stability will help that. Chris Johnson also said that, he said, you know, he talked to some scouts in the article and in quotes, and you should read it at sportsnet.ca, but one of the things, the scouts are like, I don't see any reason why he's not in the NHL

already. Like, it's one of those things that he has the speed, he's got, He said there's no deficiencies in Kapanen's game right now that are keeping him out of the NHL. It is a decision by management. Kapanen's leading the team in goals and points. Now that's not... Wow, he passed Brendan Leipzig.

They're tied at 32. And 32 is not bad either. Leipzig has slowed down. Yeah. Kapanen has not really. He didn't start as fast as Leipzig, but he's basically been on a steady pace. Now, before everybody gets frustrated and upset with the Leafs

for not bringing him up right away, let's just remember that this is still a rebuild. Yeah. This was the Red Wings' quote-unquote problem for a long time, is they had players good enough to be in the NHL who were not. What was them? 30 years in the playoffs in a row or whatever it was. Yeah, which still has technically not ended.

Yeah, technically speaking, their streak is still alive. No, and that's the thing, is that when you read this article, you're going to go, man, I feel bad for him. But damn, good on the Leafs for being patient. There's a lot of people that disagree with the fact that he's in the minors. And I mean, I don't think you can argue the fact that he's probably better than some players in the starting lineup on Saturday night. When we're in London, for Hockey Night in Cinema, Saturday night.

Oh, I can't wait. There will be players in the lineup that are less good than Kasperi Kapanen. However, for the role that he is supposed to play, which I know they're turning him into a penalty killer, among other things they don't need that right at the moment and

who's to say exactly and who's to say he doesn't get the shot towards the end of the season when they're making a playoff push who's to say

who knows what happens at the deadline even if nothing happens you can't keep him down forever so here's why I wouldn't watch Leafs if I were him okay

I've heard some things but I don't know I have played 58 AHL games. In those games, I had 19 goals and 12 assists for 31 points in 58 AHL games. I have played 40 NHL games. I have scored three goals in those games, six assists for nine points. This season, I have played 29 NHL games, scored one goal and three assists for four points in those 29 NHL games. Who am I?

Nikita Sashnikov. Nikita Sashnikov. That would drive me up a wall. Kapanen's a different player. Yeah, 100%. And I'm not saying Sashnikov shouldn't be in that spot. I am saying it's a little weird that he only has four points and no one's cared.

No one's cared or said anything about it. Well, here's what I'm thinking. Matt Martin, you expect it. Yeah. Sashnikov. You expect more. I mean, you remember the first game he played. It was the McDavid game.

Bad out of hell. his first week and it really looked like he had some offensive flair. He played up in the lineup a little bit. What are you saying, Adam? What? What? What? I think he's I think he's going to be traded. Sash? He's so young. He is young. He is so young. I think he's being traded. But

what have I been saying for months now is they have too many forwards. I think if you're trading anyone it's him. You know You know You know You know I've thought this for a while now Every player who is currently on the Leafs

And in the Leafs system I want to succeed on the Leafs That being said I've looked at Sashnikov and I go Boy oh boy If I am the Chicago Blackhawks I would love this player Him or Leo Komarov

He makes Leo makes too much money Sashnikov makes What Jesse? 600 or 700 grand this year and next kills penalties he has played on the power play vicious you can play him be vicious play him wherever you want in the lineup 736 this year 736 next year and then an rfa give it to me boys give it to me and someone someone tweeted me and they okay you're all gonna think this is really

stupid but i get where they're coming from they said is it possible the leafs could get trevor van reams like from the blackhawks for frank corrado and a pick sure i mean yeah it's possible david clarkson was traded it's possible yeah everything is possible um and i get where you're coming from the blackhawks may need to trade that player or may feel like they need to trade that player they need to replace him with a defenseman it's obviously not enough so might have to be a pick included. I wonder if instead of pick, or to go along with the pick, Karato Sashnikov.

For Trevor? For TBR? Yeah. Is TBR the guy they need? I don't know. I'm just saying, a team that wants wingers, want offense, they want someone who can play with paves. And they need them cheap. For example. And they need them cheap.

They should be calling the Leafs every day and seeing what the price is. um Van Riemsdyk seems like a similar player to Shrashnikov though Trevor?

he's a defenseman though oh well yeah but he's making only 825 you know he's only 25 oh is he only making 825? yeah that's what I mean

I thought he was making twosome maybe was he extended next year or something? oh that doesn't make sense I don't know that doesn't make sense

and I also think we're a little bit in love with the name Van Riemsdyk yeah yeah everyone needs to let go of that whole the brother

yeah I don't I don't know he's not his brother and expecting him to be his brother is the same stuff that got us into trouble with other players, Dave Boland, in the past. You can't expect a player to be...

Who they were on the Blackhawks? Yeah, or expect a player to be what your sky-high expectations are. What is Trevor Van Riemsdyk? He's a third-pairing guy, mostly. And that's not to say he can't be better, but I mean, we got to remember here that Trevor and James are not the same people.

It's funny, this started with a conversation about Kasperi Kapanen doing well in the AHL. And I turned it into, we need Trevor Van Riems. Here's what, we do need a defenseman. However, I don't know that we need them now. Because if they're pushing for the playoffs now, just push for the playoffs. Yeah.

Because you're not, listen, if you're trying to win the cup this year, you're crazy. You're trying to push for the playoffs. And yes, the players are trying to win the cup. Yes, the coach is trying to win the cup. But are you gearing up and adding all your Power Ranger pieces? combining all the cars and Power Rangers. No, you're not.

You're not pulling out the big laser. You're not making the Megazord sword thing right now. Let's trade everyone for Taveras and let's make this run. Yeah, exactly. Hold on. Here's what I think. You got Van Riemsdyk up in a year and a half, right?

JVR. If he goes from the Leafs right now, that is a real big kick in the gut. It's a hole. It's a huge hole. You can get more for him now than next year, but you need him now. Maybe.

But that brings us into the Mark Spector article, which is interesting. It's a good tie-in. The reason I'm thinking that I think the Leafs are going to hang on to JVR until his contract's up. I don't think there's any reason to trade him unless you get a great deal. You don't think they even trade him. I disagree.

Here's why. But I'll explain why I disagree. You've got Kisberry Kapanen, who will be in a year and a half if he's developed properly and he's got the right attitude, which it sounds like he does. He's focused on what he's doing. Obviously, the results are showing in the AHL, which is a hard league to score points in.

Really, really hard. Kasperi Kapanen will come in, and I'm not saying he will be James Van Riemsdyk, but if you're looking for a guy to score 20 goals out of your system, Kasperi Kapanen is your best hope. And potentially Brendan Leipzig. In the American League? No, Leipzig is

He puts up points But he's more of a A little bit more of a playmaker So if JVR is a 25 to 30 goal scorer If you're looking for a 20 goal scorer Hopefully to make up for that When he goes A potential 30 goal scorer

A potential 30 goal scorer I know that But I'm just saying You know JVR is In the past Scored between I'm talking

Kapanen ceiling Oh Kapanen ceiling 30 goals eventually Maybe Looks like it Then that's the guy That replaces JVR's production I'm not saying

He replaces his style of play So you've got to look at it in this situation. Like, okay, so if you're the Leafs, what's the benefit to trading James Van Riemsdyk? Right now, I don't think there is one, unless you're bringing in a Jacob Truba or Brandon Carlo. And if you're the Jets, why the hell would you need him? Why would you do that? You don't need him.

So unless there is valid return, which brings me to the Mark Spector article, which is how the, and it's titled this, how the Hall-Larsen deal shifted the market. And in it, Mark Spector talks about the fact that, he mentions JVR specifically and I'm actually going to pull up a quote if you don't mind Stop talking about

Toronto! Oh wait, he's from Alberta? Yeah Okay, give me give me a sec I've been getting that a lot recently If Leafs fans thought Shirely got fleeced on the Hall deal, at least one scout we spoke with said Toronto won't get a player as good as Larson in return for the

older Van Riemsdijk who has a modified no trade clause and is one season away from becoming an unrestricted free agent the comparison between Hall and JVR said the scout who thinks the Leafs will have to sweeten the pot

you're not trading Mitch Marner so William Nylander has got to be the guy he's skilled but how good and he says the Leafs are exactly

where Edmonton was a year ago stocked with young talent up front but blue line core needs at least two quality NHL defensemen

I don't know if I believe that no that's that is not I don't think that's a fair comparison at all however

however and I'm not I don't agree with Mark Spector at all either. I think Edmonton got fleeced, and I think they could have got more. I see a point. But I see a point. It's an exaggeration. Yes.

Does JVR net you and Adam Larson? Well, I sure hope not. No. I sure hope you can do better. Because at this point, hard to do worse. I honestly, I think Edmonton got fleeced, and I stand by that. And Mark is obviously telling the truth. I'm not saying he's lying.

But I often hear reporters go, I spoke to a scout. again in april of two years ago the leafs fired 18 scouts and that wasn't even all of them do you know how many scouts there are in the national hockey league one scout's opinion isn't that important right well and so at least when it comes to this i think in this particular situation If I'm Leafs management, the worst that can happen is James Van Riemsdyk walks for nothing, which is poor asset management. I'll agree with you on that. However, if you're trying to win, if you're trying to win, tell me how the team's better

without JVR. You got to replace him. Exactly. So Kasperi Kapanen is probably waiting in the wings of, they're probably hoping, okay, next year at the very, very latest, Kapanen's in the lineup all the time playing probably beside Kadri and Komarov, right? That seems to be where the hole in the lineup is because that's where Sascha's playing.

It's Nylander now. Oh, it's Nylander now. Yeah, recently it's been Will. And I guess Sascha's been back on the fourth line, right? Yes, which, I mean, why isn't he scoring points? Well, that's why. And Connor Brown is obviously playing well as well. I think the only way that you can trade James Van Riemsdyk

is that if you're sure Kasperi Kapanen can at least score 15 to 20 goals. And you need a full season to make that assessment. You do. And I think next year is that full season. Kapanen, last year, he was kind of buried on the Marlies, granted, but wasn't mind-blowing. No. He was a healthy scratch to start the playoffs

and then ended up being very good. But this isn't a guy they're 100% sold on. But he still looks pretty good now. And JVR's output is 30 goals. Yeah, maximum, I think. I'd say he's averaged it. Well, he's only scored 30 goals once in his career. He was on pace for it last year, I think.

He was 14 in 40 games. I have it up here. And remember, he's 14 in 30 now. And remember, he is hitting his peak now. He hit 30. He's at his peak now. Yes. So he's a 30-goal, 65-point player, I think, at his peak.

And there's nothing wrong with that. Oh, and you're saying later he'll tell us. And I'm not saying that's a bad thing either. I think the room he creates, he's usually a pretty healthy guy. He's a hell of a player. He's amazing. And I don't think Kapanen replaces his size or his physicality or any of that stuff.

But, I feel like the Leafs can't intelligently let a guy like that go, a top-line guy like that go, without first making sure that there is someone in the system to replace that production. And this is the funny, frustrating thing. Do we agree that Leipzig is a future NHL player? I gotta see him play more. I think so.

Okay, let's... Like, TJ Brennan was the Leafs' leading scorer, or the Marlies' leading scorer, right? Yeah, but he was essentially a rover. Can't even really call him a defender. Right. I mean, jeez. you see him score goals

and you see him on the power play you're like why isn't this guy in the NHL and then the second the putt gets into his end you're like oh that's why yeah if we assume

Leipzig is a future NHL player and if we assume Kapanen is a future NHL player and if we assume the team that they make the NHL with is the Leafs two guys gotta go

who are those two guys? Connor Brown? don't think so no I think I hate to say this Zach Hyman? don't think so I think it's

and I don't think you can't say Sosh because that's a fourth line. Roll. So you've got to look at the top three lines. And Babcock loves him. Matt Martin?

No. Not at the moment. Sticking around. No, I think the names are Van Riemsdyk and Komarov. I have a question. I don't know. Unless you can keep Komarov

at the same price or less. Next year, if we're in a similar position where we're like on the verge of a playoff spot and you still have JVR, do you trade him for draft picks only

so then you still have that roster spot? Or do you try for the playoffs with him? I think you try for the playoffs with them. You give your chance, especially next year, when the team will be expected to be good. This is fascinating.

Now it's like, wow, that's unexpected. They're doing pretty good. Next year, it's like, no, you are expected to be pretty good or better. So that little playoff run is worth more than future players. I don't think they think that way. I don't think so either. And I think that you've got to look at what you can get back in terms of if there's a prospect that's NHL-ready next year.

That's what I'd be looking to get for him. Like, I keep going back to Mark O'Daniel. What they thought Mark O'Daniel would be. Anthony Mantha, a year ago. Okay, that's a good, yeah, I think that's a good comparison. This is fascinating. If you're a fan of another NHL team and you listen to the show, this part of the show probably gets pretty exhausting for you.

Because we get really into the, oh, I'm going to say it, I'm going to say it, here it comes, minutiae of the Leafs. But you have the opportunity to learn about our minutiae. we're talking about trades as Leafs fans in a way that we haven't for years, which is selling is easy. Like you just trade players and you get picks and prospects and you pat yourself on the back because at least you got some, you're not trying to be good.

So like, it doesn't even matter if you necessarily got fair value. If you, if fair value is a second round pick and you got a fourth, whatever, you didn't want that player and you got a fourth round pick. Yeah. Congrats.

Yep. um but now we're talking about like hockey trades and does this hurt the team we haven't actually considered if a Leafs trade hurts the team for like years because we wanted it to hurt the team because we wanted to tank because we wanted a guy like Matthews the reason I think that they may hang on to JVR next year and this might be a bad example so call me on it is PA Parenteau. Oh, so you're saying... They let P.A. Parenteau walk.

Now, I think they tried to re-sign him. I think they did. But they let P.A. Parenteau walk, and at this point, even if you got a seventh for P.A. Parenteau, it would have been better than what they got for him. Than what the Islanders got. Yeah, the Islanders got nothing, too. But the Leafs got nothing for P.A. Parenteau. How did two

teams get nothing for Parenteau in, like, three months? A guy who scored 20 goals last year and will again this year. How? How did he not get traded? so that's why I think well he got injured right before the deadline oh okay

well still you could have got something he got injured I want to say you can't trade an injured player no you can't yeah you can't

and even if they're like oh he's okay he's just a little banged up yeah there's so little time before the playoffs start teams go eh

because we want someone who can play right away yeah no it's 100% because I remember I was at I was at a Montreal Canadiens game

in Montreal actually that was the day they traded James Reimer but it was prior to the trade deadline and I think Parenteau if I remember correct I wanted to see him

play one last game against the Habs and stick it to him and I think what ended up happening was he got hurt or he might not have even started the game I don't remember

jeez I can't even remember who was in the Leafs lineup that night yeah yeah it's crazy because it was a different team Michael Grabner we gotta go on

Sportsnet 590 The Fan it's nice to be able to talk about this stuff isn't it so great So in the online portion, which you can get at sportsnet.ca, we're going to talk about Winnipeg. And we're going to talk about how bad is it going to get?

How bad is it going to get? And also, Matthews and Marner in context. How great are the rookie seasons so far as compared to everyone else in history? In a segment we call Birch, Please. Oh, man, that's terrible. How has he not thought of that? Steven Birch. Yeah, you're right.

All right. So the podcast brought to you by Panago Pizza. It's what's on the inside that counts. We will see you online. What do you want to say, Steven? Actually, I tweeted a long time ago that I think Steve Birch's article should be called Take Me to Birch. Uh-huh.

But I still think... Because it's like Take Me to Church. I know. I think Birch pleases way better. Because Take Me to Church was a passing song. Birch slapped. Just take everything they say for Ben Bishop and just put Birch instead of Bish. Just put Birch.

I like that. I like that. Birch tree. Steve, can we talk about Winnipeg? Who wants to do that? Okay, fine. Let's talk about the Winnipeg Jets, who currently sit 11th. In the NHL?

No. In the West. In the West, yeah. They are 20, 21, and 3. Only one point out of the wild card as it stands. Really? Yeah. Wow.

Three-point games. Keep everyone in it. What? Parody. They only have three pity points. Parody. They only have three pity points. Yeah, but the other way as well.

Oh, okay. Now, wait. How many games in hand are involved with the team they have the wild card? I do not have that in front of me. Jesse, you want to have a look at that? They have 44 games, and LA has 41 games. Yeah, the Jets had a very heavy front half. They kind of had the opposite of the league.

So they're really, they could be three or four points out. Yeah. depending upon how L.A. does, which I think they're doing better. They're coming out strong. But maybe part of their poor play is they've played so damn much. That could be it.

Hold on, hold on. There aren't really any teams close to Winnipeg, too, so they've got to travel a lot. Before you get there, before you get there, I want to know about this tweet last night. Before you talk about poor potential play. Okay?

Steve, you tweeted last night, genuine question, is Paul Maurice actually not good, that good of a coach, or does he pretty much always have a bad team bad goalie or both

what prompted you to say that okay Paul Maurice's record as an NHL coach I don't have it in front of me but I'm pretty sure

it's abysmal Jesse are you able to oh no that's the wrong Paul Maurice no it's not no is this Paul Maurice

yeah that's Paul Maurice sorry that's Maurice Paul Maurice Paul he's a little baby in that picture his first head coaching job he was like 28 yeah

something like that so let's read his stats from the OHL where he played for the Windsor CompuAir Spitfires and they had to be

called CompuAir back then so Paul Maurice's first head coaching job in the NHL was with the Hartford Whalers

so even though he is 49 he's only 49 he's not even 50 yet his NHL head coaching career began in 1995

wow 22 years it also says he was an assistant during the 95-96 season, so I can only assume someone got fired and then he got promoted to head coach sometime during 95-96.

His team has missed the playoffs 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11 times. They've lost in the first round 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 times. How many times have they gone past the first round? won in 2002 they lost in the

Stanley Cup final in they beat the Leafs to get there by the way yeah with the Carolina Hurricanes so he he was yeah head coach

of the Carolina team that beat the Leafs with Jeff O'Neill and in 2009 the Hurricanes lost in the conference final did I forget that?

I forgot that too hey they won a cup so weird and he's been the coach there twice yeah in 2000

What year did the Hurricanes win the Stanley Cup? That was 2006, right? He was head coach of the Toronto Marlies at the time. Who, by the way, lost in round one. So his record as a head coach is terrible. But I'm like, okay, he keeps getting hired. And we always joke about like Randy Carlisle, for example. How he won a cup and he can just ride that for the rest of his career.

That's not necessarily true. The Ducks are doing fine this year, but whatever. John Tortorella, prior to this season, shut up. None of you agreed that he was a good coach. Stop. None of you agreed with that, especially after the World Cup. None of you agreed. I still don't know that he is.

I think he's got a great goaltending. I know he's the coach of the first place team. I mean, it doesn't matter. He's the coach of the first place team. But prior to this year, you would have agreed with me that, yeah, you won a Stanley Cup in 2004, and he's been riding that ever since, basically. The formula has been there. Start well, peter off, blow up, get fired.

With the Canucks They didn't even have The get good part No they started bad And ended bad Yeah Got mad The Canucks

Here's how high The standard for the Canucks Used to be They fired They fired Alain Vigneault After a first round Playoff loss

And I believe Almost a president's trophy Not almost Yeah they had it That year A president's trophy It was a president's trophy Yeah

Yeah that was so stupid Cause they won like Two in a row Or three in a row Yeah something crazy Something crazy yeah And hiring Alan Vigneault. Man, never bet against him.

The Rangers are good again. I know. It's unbelievable. But now, Paul Maurice doesn't have that. He doesn't have that crazy track record. And people were like, oh, he's been riding the 2002 run

for his whole career. He's riding a loss in the Stanley Cup final? Are you sure? I don't think so. Now, but then I started to think, okay, what are all the teams that Paul Maurice had? Okay, he had the Hartford Whalers. Brutal.

I'm struggling to remember who any of the players on those teams were. Rod Brindamore. He might have coached Nick Kiprios. I'm not sure. I don't think so. I think that was much earlier in Nick's career. I don't remember who his goalies were. Maybe Sean Burke.

Not totally sure. With the Hurricanes, he had post-good Cam Ward. So he had decent Cam Ward who evolved into not really good Cam Ward. He also had Archer's Herbe early on. Archer's Herbe, I want to say, was the goalie who beat the Leafs. Might have been. And again, you weren't getting prime Archer's Herbe. You were getting, his pads are pretty black now.

Archer's Herbe. Yeah. You were getting pads started white, didn't change them for a decade, and that's how they looked. Mom's couch cushions are Archer's Herbe. With the Leafs, he had Vestas. No, he had Andrew Berkshire. Andrew Berkshire.

Andrew Raycroft. I hope he did. He put Andrew Berkshire in net. No, he had Andrew Raycroft. And Vesa Toskala. Who was horrendous. Then he had Vesa Toskala, who was horrendous. And then I think he got fired.

Then he goes to Winnipeg, and he's got Andre frickin' Pavlik forever. And then... Who is not an NHL goaltender. I can finally confidently say You know what's amazing I saw Jets fans on Twitter last night Okay the Jets lost 7-4 to the Montreal Canadiens That's what caused this whole conversation

I saw Jets fans last night Going you know what Paul Murray should be fired Because Pavlik is in the minors right now And he's playing well Like they didn't watch him play poorly for half a decade Yeah but he had that one good streak After I said he was bad Holy shit he had a 20 game streak

You want to talk about riding a good performance for a while Pavlik having 20 decent games Justified his whole brutal career Justified the whole damn thing Do you want me to play the 25 second press conference that he did? I would love it Because Paul Maurice got mad It was the whole **** game

From the goaltender to every guy up front We're not walking away going Our goalie's got to play better We didn't play well enough to win that game They didn't play well enough to win that game But they're no different than everybody else in that room We were horse s*** from the start, from the drop of that first puck right to the very end of it.

And then he walks off because there's nothing else to say. No, Paul Maurice has a history of getting pretty mad and yelling on the benches. You know, it's not the first time we saw that. We saw that with the Leafs. There was one notoriously poorly officiated game. The Leafs got completely jobbed. And I think they were down five on three in overtime

against the Hurricanes, ironically. And after the game, you know, you get Paul Hendrick, who's just trying to be everybody's friend and he timidly kind of walks up to Paul Maurice and he's like so what happened there and there was like the longest three seconds I've ever experienced where Paul Maurice is just angry face staring at the ground figuring out how to not be fined $25,000 just sitting there and he goes you know there's a good story here and and you just see him shaking with rage and he starts to try to talk

as calmly as he can about the two penalties that were called I think that was the game where Nick Antropov got suspended for throwing a stick at a ref after the game anyway there's a history here but name a good goalie Paul Maurice has ever had like Connor Hellebuck who shouldn't be to blame for

that loss shouldn't even be to blame for how poorly the Jets are doing he's been like roughly NHL average and that's pretty much as good as it gets That's not just top half of the goalies that Paul Maurice has had. He's probably a top five, top three goalie that Paul Maurice has ever had. So I tweeted.

I said that tweet that you read. I got a DM from someone who I didn't expect to get a DM from. Sportsnet stats. And they said, they said, you know, you can always just ask the stats department. And it's funny. Sometimes I forget that I can do these things. I love that the Sportsnet Stats Department has a great sense of humor, too. Oh, they do.

That is my favorite follow. I'm not 100% sure, because it was just the Sportsnet Stats Twitter. I know a few people within the Sportsnet Stats Department. I'm not sure who I was speaking to. They have one guy in particular who works there, Steve Fallon, who is, they're all wizards there. They're all, I send them requests, and they, in record time, I'm like, how did you even find this? Where did you start your research? Do you just think of these questions on your own, research them, and then have them ready?

How on earth do you do it? So my question was, what is the career save percentage of Paul Maurice's goalies? What do you think? Here, Jesse, can you bring up the save percentage leaders in the NHL right now? I will do that. Because I want to give you an idea of how Like Paul Maurice might actually be a decent coach

I'm going to say I'm going to say it's not good Just based on the Leafs You won't believe How not good When you hear How ungood they are You'll blow out your fucking knees

It's just Sometimes stats are hard to find because we've discussed why. This is not Jesse's fault. Yeah, I told Jesse to look something up on NHL.com. I'm sorry. Who is the top save percentage right now? Dubnik with 939.

Wow, that's really good. Incredible. So that's the best of the best, though. Who's number 10 and what's their save percentage? Number 10... Don't say Freddie Anderson. Don't say Freddie Anderson. Don't say Freddie Anderson.

It might be. He was top 10 for a bit. 923 Luongo, depending on how many people are counting games played-wise. No, we're not worrying about that. It's around like 925 Scott Darling. Okay, that's very good. Okay, so top 10.

If you have a top 10 goalie in the league, that's a good goalie. Let's go down to 20. 20? Let's go down to 20. What is the save percentage of the 20th best goalie in the NHL right now? You're looking at Markstrom at a 912. What's around there? 912?

Okay, that's probably around... Is that around where Connor Hellebuck is right now? Yeah, Connor Hellebuck's at a 910. Okay, so he's not even top 20. No. No. But they found their answer in net. Overall goalies, he's 42nd in terms of all goalies played at a 9-10.

Also, he's 42nd. Yeah. At 9-10. Who is number 50? At 50, Steve Mason, 9-0-3. Wow, really? Played 35 games. Whoa.

Wow, I thought he... When did that happen? Yeah. Because I thought he had this resurgence. So, he is the 50th best goalie. How many goalies have played? 77. Wow.

Who's the worst? Let me jump to page two. I want to know what the worst is. Oh, it's on page two. That's not good. It's never good when you're on page two. George Alves with a zero? Oh, that's okay.

So now we're talking about essentially fictional goalies. Yeah. That was the equipment manager. How amazing is that? I'm taking, I would take a screen cap of that if I were him. Oh, totally. So who was 72nd? Or whatever.

Second last, whatever the number was. Chris Drager? He played a... Oh, Dredger. Dredger from the Sens. 7.33. Played 40 minutes, allowed six goals. Oh my god, okay.

Malcolm Subban. He had one bad game. 75. But he probably had one bad game. 8.13. Okay, so let's go back to Steve Mason. He was what, 50th? 50th.

50th. So Steve Mason is having a bad year. Really bad. a bad putting my finger up one year. He has had

previous bad years. But he's also had good years. He's had good years. Paul Maurice's head coaching career

which again started in 1995-1996. The collective save percentage of the goalies he's had unless I wasn't

clear enough with the stat to look up. I think they figured it out. This is crazy. It's like a 6 No It's not as crazy

As you think it's gonna be But they tweeted me .904 .9035 To be exact Who's got a .904 Who's Well no .9035

Steve Mason is 903 Yeah so who is like 904 Vasilevsky 904 Yeah well that doesn't surprise me Tampa's been brutal What

Is that a 904 As well Yeah and he got waived So Paul Maurice's Average goalie Throughout his career Is a waver goalie That's insane

I can understand Why he walked out Of that press conference Now I wanted to be fair Okay Oh oh oh And here's even better

These are the numbers They used So again And I said You know Are you sure Like the shots And goals

Of like empty net goals Like are those Counted in there because they technically shouldn't be if we're talking about save percentage. And they said empty netters not included. The save percentage was, his goalies have only stopped 35,126 shots out of a possible 38,877. So I tried to go even deeper with it, right?

Because the hockey in 1995-96 was not the same as the hockey today. When did hockey really, really, really change? I would say 2005-2006 After the lockout I said, what's the save percentage Since the 05-06 lockout? And the answer is We spoke about certain things

And then he goes, by the way, since 2005 It's also 904 9037 So it is Ever, so yeah It's like .002 Better Do you want some

Paul Maurice has never Had a good goalie No Never once Do you want some of the League average save percentage This is the save percentage Across the entire NHL

What were you getting this from Hockey reference Oh okay So last year 15-16 9-15 Was the league average Save percentage

9-15 So 10 points below that Or more than 10 points Sure do wish Andre Pavlik would come back Here's the Here's what I I want to know

This poor fucking guy. And what he was upset about wasn't even the goalie's performance. No. It was his team played like shit. First off, we know the most important position is always going to be goaltender. That we know. When I was thinking about it this morning, do the Winnipeg Jets seem a bit stale to you?

In what way? Well, there's a lot of guys who have been there a long time. When they have line A, they're very exciting. Yes, they are. But I feel like there are players that have been there a long time. Like Bufflin? Sure. Tons of players that have been there a long time.

I'll let you make your point. I'm sorry. Yeah. Players that have been there a long time because we all know that the general manager does not make trades. Except for when he does. Except for when he does, which is twice. It took him five years to make his first trade. That's insane.

Now, he has developed good players. He's developed a good core. at what point is it on the GM in a soft goalie market to say ah here's our chance

but now so having said all this about Paul Maurice and his goalies is it Connor Hellebuck I think it is I think you need a better goalie than Connor Hellebuck

I think you if you've got a team that is supposed to make the playoffs Connor Hellebuck no matter how great he could be right now is not the guy you're like yup

we're placing all our hopes on him Here's maybe a more fair question. Are they putting too much on Connor Hellebuck too soon? Yes. Yes. Absolutely. And I think they thought they could make up for it with Tyler Myers, Dustin Bufflin, and Jacob Trubin now. But damn, that's not a bad score.

Is Myers hurt? Yes, he is. He's been out for a while. Part of it, and they're missing line A too. But he's one player. And yeah, line A being out hurts too. Marco Dano's out. Yeah, those are some significant injuries.

I don't know, man. I still think they missed an opportunity this summer in even a James Reimer. I really think they did. Ottawa, I'm sure, would give you Andrew Hammond. Curtis McElhinney was on waivers, or, well, Gustafson, maybe those guys aren't. Well, McElhinney's not. Maybe those guys aren't wonderful examples, but goalies have been available. You know what the Leafs did? You know what they had? No goaltending.

What did they do? They went out and they traded spare parts for Freddie freaking Anderson. Here's what I would like to know. Who have the other Jets goalies been? like just Hellebuck and Hutchinson they got Hutchinson Hellebuck and then Pavlik

buried in the minus how has Hutchinson been I would love to know I just if the market is soft you've got a great team

Mark Shifley is looking like amazing Dustin Bufflin's always been Dustin Bufflin why have you not got a goaltender how have you not

solved this problem if I remember correct Brian Littles had a little bit of a resurgence yeah 17 games played 890 save percentage

God So not only do you Have So it's not even That it's Connor Hellebuck It's That's all you got Yeah

Oh call it Pavlik Okay But you knew this How much better than Michael Hutchinson Do you think he's gonna be The point is You knew this

You knew this Going into the season You knew this Going into the last season And the season before You knew Andre Pavlik Wasn't good enough But you stuck with him

Stuck with him Stuck with him You did it again last year And now you're doing it again To Connor Hellebuck And Mike It's Mike Hutchinson right Hutchison yeah

I think you're preaching to the choir Adam because Jets fans what they scream about half the time is that Chevy get a goalie well not even get a goalie

he won't he doesn't do anything this offseason seems like the year they should go get the goalie because Pavlik's up and that frees up 2.9 and then they're only paying

Hutchison 1.1 and Hellebuck 600 grand it doesn't matter who cares with Pavlik's money the 2.9 million dollars is nothing

They could have absolutely For Winnipeg, that's something To be buried in the minors They could have James Reimer for less than 3.4 I'm sure And that's what he signed for in Florida I'm sure James would have loved to go back And be the guy

But then is James Reimer your starting goaltender? Are you doing that? Or do you have him splitting games with Connor Hellebuck? League average goaltending You just need league average goaltending People are going to get caught up Yes it is, first of all I don't know if that's true.

People are going to get caught up in the names that you're bringing up. Just get league average. Yeah. I don't think league average goaltending is that hard to find. No. We've got a glut of goaltenders. Maybe I'm wrong. I don't know.

Marco Andrzej Flurry. What? That? Then you're talking Winnipeg Jets. Wow. Potential playoff team. Not potential playoff team. Potential second, third round, maybe Stanley Cup if they get hot.

Here's the question. Am I choosing the wrong time to bring this up? No. Because the Jets have been playing poorly. That's what Paul Maurice got so upset about. Also, I think they need a trade because I think the dressing room is stale. I think they need to shock some people. It's not goaltending.

It's not coaching. People have been there too long. Well, yeah. And I think they've lost a lot. They've made the playoffs once or twice. And I think that they've... Once. One time.

They haven't won a game yet. Yeah. So I think that there have been a lot of people that have been there that whole time. And I think that sometimes you get used to... Well, oh well. I guess I'll be I'll still be here next year It's not like they're

Going to move me out No Because they don't Move anyone out But then you start To get into things That we've criticized In the past

Bufflin's been there A long time Do you get rid of him I'm not saying Bufflin No no no I know but This is

I'm going through Players who have been There a long time Bufflin Well you're not Going to move him No I think you keep him Blake Wheeler

He's been fantastic You're not going to Move him Shifley Why would you do that Brian Little Maybe I don't really think

Evander Kane Well he's gone So this is the thing Yeah, who do you move? If I'm a Jets fan, they got prospects. Like, it's not bleak. It's not as bleak as what we were saying in the summer. Then again, the teams we were criticizing in the summer ended up doing pretty good.

Goalie. Goalie. I just can't help but feel like Paul Maurice is going to get fired soon. And it's the Bruce Boudreaux thing, in a way. It's It's I'm not calling Paul Murray's

Bruce Boudreaux By the way But They fired him Just Cause Is it Tortorella

How he comes into Columbus And then now They have Actual goaltending And he looks like A good coach And next year

When Bobrovsky Falls off again Because Because Bobrovsky Seems like one of those guys He might Maybe he stabilizes But Bobrovsky

Won a Vesna And then was awful And got Todd Richards Fired And now he's back To winning a Vesna Yeah! And that's not to say,

that's not, again, I love Borowski. It's great when he's great. But, man, there are some goalies that have good years and bad years. Pecorine had a bad year last year. Bad!

But he's back to being somewhat Pecorine. You know how much Jets fans have to be loving that we're actually talking about the Jets for a change? I don't know. Even though it's this way?

I don't know. I'd love to know from Jets fans what they think. I think it's the goaltending. And I think they knew. I think the fans knew. I think management knows. And I think they've got a guy

who's slow on the trigger. I saw a tweet a few years ago about Mike Gillis when he was still the guy in Vancouver, still the GM. And they're like, well, somewhere Mike Gillis is writing down plans for a sandwich he's going to make three years from now. Because you're too slow. You've got to move. You've got to move.

And the Leafs, what they traded for Freddie Anderson, don't tell me Winnipeg couldn't have done the same thing. You know what, though? I said it's so easy to get league average goaltending. It didn't look like the Leafs were getting too much better than that with Freddie at the time. And they gave up a first and a second for him. Granted, it was essentially two seconds, but that's kind of a lot. Kind of.

That could get you a Roman Polak at the trade deadline. So I want to show you guys something because we've got to blaze through here. Steven Birch wrote an article about the best rookie seasons of all time in context. Birch slapped! And I think it's really, really interesting. I'm going to run it down. I'm not going to blow the article for you, but I think you should check it out because at the top

of the list Sidney Crosby with his 122 point rookie season which is obnoxious no he didn't at 19 apparently he did

2006-2007 no that was his sophomore year yeah that second year oh okay well alright I was about to say Ovi led

all rookie scoring that year with I think 120 points Crosby by the way as a rookie had over 100 yeah

but Ovi definitely won the Calder and led in points yeah his rookie year okay maybe I'm Misunderstanding to this then Maybe this is

Score adjusted Like points per game But it's not His rookie season Yeah 06-07 wasn't his rookie Yeah Huh

Wow Alright in recent years We've used score adjusted Are you guys sure? Yeah 100% Alright Here read Read it out loud

The whole thing? No But the part you don't understand Uh Sidney Crosby is an all star Well We can put aside the argument Of which rookie

was most impressive at this early stage. I won't be spending too much time on sustainability of shooting percentages or on-ice percentage. What I want to touch about is the insane group of historical comparables this year's crop of teams are among. One of the challenges in historical comparison is era adjustment. Different NHL eras have

been very, very different. In recent years, we've used score-adjusted numbers to analyze historical impacts of Alexander Ovechkin's insane goal scoring, Eric Carlson's amazing point production. Now we can compare rookie scoring rates of matthews line a martyr to historical great years in the past oh so these are just historically great years oh it's not oh i'm not sure well and also matthews

is 19 when crosby was a rookie he was 18 no so it was a month's thing yeah i don't know i'm not really sure but the fact of the matter is so it's not necessarily rookie season yeah it's just why you're getting it are we sure oh yeah sure yeah yes crosby came into league are you saying I think Steve Birch's writing is hard to understand. Well, I'm misunderstanding this then because... We're dumb. I'm dumb. But Connor McDavid is on this list.

He had the sixth best year. Okay, so Sidney Crosby's on it twice. I don't understand how this chart works. I love you, Steven, but I don't get this. Yeah, why is Sidney on this list twice? Because Sidney Crosby is number five and number one. Yeah, so he included a sophomore and rookie. Okay, so that's what he's comparing then.

Sophomore and rookie years. Fair enough. My bad. But I just want to say, and you'll understand the article when you read it more. I read this last night. I must have been really tired. Austin Matthews scoring at eight points per game played,

one flat. That puts him 13th ever on this rookie, sophomore, 13th ever. Who's below him? Who's below him? Yeah. Patrick Laine. Eric Lindros, Ted Kennedy, Patrick Kane, Riel

I don't know Dale Howarchuk Ron Francis Dale Howarchuk again So yeah it is rookie sophomore Oh my god Pierre Turgeon Mitch Marner at 23

Bep Godin Who is a Boston player Are McDavid's two years above Austin's? Well yeah Connor McDavid this year Last year is above But I don't see him again this year Which is so strange

Maybe it's too low No it doesn't make sense That doesn't make sense either Is that a better year than Matthews? No, I'm pretty sure Matthews' points per game is actually above Connor McDavid's. I might be wrong. Might be. But it's not on here.

Because, again, the Leafs— Because McDavid leads the league in points right now. Yeah, but the Leafs haven't, like, played any games. Anyway, it's a drink. Matthews is top 10. Yeah. It's an interesting article. Check it out.

Who cares? God. I'm going to read through this again. It's okay. No, you know why I think he might have done that? Because, if I'm not mistaken, Matthews has either a late September or an early October birthday. Yeah. mcdavid has i want to say an august birthday so even though mcdavid was the draft year before

matthews matthews is only like two calendar months younger than him he's one day off of being drafted in mcdavid's draft oh there you go yeah a lot of the number one picks are born kind of august september john taveras too i think crosby yeah definitely is it's funny how that works well he's Going with teenagers. That's what it is. That's what I missed. Teenagers. My bad.

That's my bad. That is not Stephen's bad. That is my bad. Which, I mean, teenagers are rookies and sophomores. Yeah. Whatever. Anyway, 18, 19-year-olds. Among teenagers all time,

Austin Matthews and Mitch Marner are both, not just top 30, but top 23. In the history of the NHL. In the history. That's cool. History of the NHL. And when no one can score. And Sidney Crosby's on there twice.

When no one can score. When no one can score. And it's points per game. Yeah. That is incredible I think that's really cool So check out the rest of the article I'm sorry that was so painful

To get through There's a lot of information I have to absorb in the day I apologize But when When you consider So Matthews was 13 Marner was 23

Now You can't be two people Like just because you did something Two seasons in a row I mean that's good for you Personally But If we're talking about

Like you can't have two Matthews On a team You can't have two Crosbys On a team So if you take out the players Who are above Matthews twice He's even higher than that Yeah, he is.

I mean, Crosby's there twice, so we know he's at least 12th. That's crazy. Yeah, it's ridiculous to think about. We have some all-time players. Well, yeah, that's pretty amazing. And I want to say Sidney Crosby's the only one I think that's on there twice, to be honest with you. But Sidney Crosby, like, honestly, in his rookie season,

Connor McDavid's at one, Sidney Crosby's at a 1.22. He's crazy. He's still, I want to say, Tom. David's at 1.20. Crosby, I want to say, is top 5 or 6 all-time in points per game right now. All-time. I have a question off of that. I mean, it's going to dip.

Did you read 30 Thoughts on Tuesday? No, I heard it was a very good one, though. It was really good. Friedman posted that. Oh, wait. Was that the one with all the Canadian stuff? All the Habs stuff? Yes.

You know what? I did read that. So he said there's going to be 6 NHLers on the top 100 list of all-time. 6 current. Current NHLists. Oh, yeah, yeah. Crosby, Yager, Kane, Ovechkin, Taves. Taves.

Who's six? Oh. Joe Thornton. You think? I don't know. Oh, no, they haven't named it yet. Yeah, he's speculating. Joe Thornton.

Those five are going to be in for sure, right? No arguments. Jerome McGinley. He's got over 600 goals. Yeah, Jerome McGinley or Joe Thornton? Carey Price? Not yet. Duncan Keith?

Listen. Henrik Lundqvist. Lundqvist? Roberto Luongo. Listen, do I think Terry Price will deserve it? Do I think Luongo, Lundqvist? Sure. I just don't know which of them they'll pick.

Ooh, Luongo. For sure. He's a Hall of Famer. Luongo's a Hall of Famer. No question. Don't even argue it. So is he top 100 over Joe Thornton? I think so.

We only have one more spot? Oh, man. I don't know. I don't know. You know what? I could care less about that list, by the way. It's causing so many arguments online, and I really don't care. but those are like

fun barstool arguments are they fun arguments I'm so tired of having them I think that's what it is I don't care oh if you put Jonathan Tays

at 57 that really bugs me that grinds me because Syllaps was proud of you

oh yeah here wait I want to get into something that's a little ridiculous really quickly before we go so there was there was an argument

I got another thing to get to so we need to move oh damn it okay so this was started by Dave Stubbs who I don't mind obviously I've never

met him I'm not incredibly passionate for or against his opinions, but he had a tweet a couple years ago that came to light because Ovechkin tied Maurice Rocca-Richard, and basically he goes, you know, you can't mention Ovechkin and Richard

in the same sentence. Now, there were a lot of people critical of that, and I would be critical of that too. Berkshire, I think, had the best response. You're right, Ovechkin is better. Which was snarky and wonderful. But...

Coming from a Canadiens fan, or formerly A rehabbing Canadiens fan like Andrew Berkshire is. That's a big thing to say. If I remember correctly, I'm trying to remember this. Okay, Maurice Richard hit 50 goals once. He did it in 50 games, didn't he? Yep, 50 goals in 50 games, because that's how long the season was. And he did it once, and it was in the middle of the Second World War,

if I remember correctly. You know what? It was during the 1945-46 season. He scored 50 goals in 50 games During the Battle of Berlin You would have to be In your 70s It'd be 44-45 then

Bob Cole called that game Did he? It's his first game No I wouldn't be surprised No, no, no I wouldn't be shocked at all Or no, sorry

You would need to be In your mid to late 70s To have seen Maurice Richard In his prime With your own eyes live, and you would have had to have been a child at the time. And also, don't forget that at that point, a lot of the

NHLers who were the best NHLers were in Europe. Yeah, and we make fun of names like Syllaps and stuff like that because it was so long ago that you can barely remember it. Dude, same thing with Maurice Richard. Except he, the tail end of his career, like, oh, there's some stuff on television.

Syllaps? Former Army veteran. He went, I believe he left the Leafs, went to Europe, and then came back and won Cups. I believe that's The only reason Maurice Richard wasn't in World War II is because he failed an Army physical more than once due to injuries. Wow, crazy.

Well, when you think about it, how could you... It was a weird time. You've got to be a professional athlete, so you've got to be in top athletic form, but you also are not fit enough for the Army. And you also need to work in the summer. And you also need to work in the summer. It was crazy, anyway.

We're going to quickly talk about the fact that... Have you guys seen the... Because the Chargers have officially left San Diego. in the NFL. Yes, which I kind of forgot about. Yeah, because I guess the owner, there have been, okay, it's interesting. The ESPN take on this is that,

well, the owner's been trying for 16 years to get a new stadium. And the Deadspin take is, well, the NFL offered him $300 million to keep them there for his new stadium, but because the public won't pay for it, which is true, San Diego City Council said, uh-uh,

he's moving into L.A. Now, what's interesting about this is, first off, have you seen their new logo? Oh yeah it's the Dodgers logo It's the Dodgers slash Tampa Bay Lightning logo They took the Dodgers logo And they took the Tampa Bay Lightning logo And they combined them

And they got the LA Chargers Oh man you know what The second you said Tampa Bay Wait That is literally the same color Oh because is it like Is it like It's the LA

Electrical charge Yeah Oh Because they have lightning bolts on their jerseys You know I never actually knew That's why they were called the Chargers Oh really I just thought it was like

Charged I didn't get it I'm such an idiot no it's alright I couldn't figure out Steven Burch's article even though it was written for me

there you go wow do they also just have a plain white stripe at the bottom of their jerseys I wonder so now it can be the lightning leafs

and them basically wow funny so that I found funny but I also think it's funny and this is where

I thought it might be fun to revisit this because we talk about draft picks and we talk about trades and we talk the San Diego

Chargers are not good and Phillip Rivers is a couple years from being from retiring you know he's their star quarterback. He's been their star quarterback for a long time. He's almost done.

And they're mediocre at best. And they're going to have to try to replace him. So that means they're going to a Los Angeles market that already has the terrible Rams. And now they're going to have the terrible Chargers too. Wait, they're getting two NFL teams? Yeah, they're getting a second NFL team. That's why they're moving

now because he's like, if the Rams take over, then I won't have any market left. Dean Spano, I believe is his name, was like, if the Rams take over, then I won't have any market left in LA, so LA will be split with two NFL teams, which is big enough to support. How much people make money? How many times are we going to have this

conversation? I don't get it. However... It seems like the second they make it, they're like, take it! I don't get it. They're all arrested development when they throw the paper into the water. Well, I feel bad for LA, because first off, San Diego, in their last home game

ever, none of the fans showed up. Good. Because they knew. Good. The Rams are terrible Because they traded all the draft picks last year For Jared Goff Who was not even dressed the first game of the season I want to run this through you one more time The Titans, for trading that first overall pick

They got the First round 15th overall pick From that year From 2016 They also got a second round pick Which is 43rd overall Another second round pick which was 45th overall and a third-round pick, 76th overall,

plus the next year, which is this year, they get a first and a third round. And by the way, St. Louis was terrible, so that's a top-five pick. Oh, baby. And a third-round pick, which would be, I would say, I don't know, there's 30... That was their Scott Niedermeyer.

Yeah, so that would be another probably 45, 50... No, not 50, 60-something. Huh. And the Rams got the first, a fourth, and a sixth. so they got a first overall 113th and 177th damn what a brutal trade for a guy who might not be a great quarterback might not i don't know but chance is not looking good and then so la has to choose from terrible and soon to be terrible that sucks that that really sucks and it's la if they're bad and new there's a lot of stuff to do in la yeah they won't go

There's a ridiculous amount to do in LA And the other thing is So they move the team Do I want to go to Universal Studios Or do I want to see a team lose by 30 points Do you want to know the answer Or do you want to see Mark McGuire hit some dingers Do I want to see this basketball team

This basketball team Or one of three baseball teams I believe You can see the Giants too Do I want to see Leonardo DiCaprio At a random Starbucks Like there's just all kinds of shit to do there Oh my god

And what's awesome is that they're not even quite sure Where they're going to play their home games next year Although they think maybe they'll play In the MLS stadium Which is about half the size Of an NFL stadium How do people make money? The Steelers for instance have like

55,000 people that can fit into Heinz 55 to 60,000 The MLS stadium, which is I believe a Galaxy stadium is 27,000 can be extended to 30,000 if you add so it's not even

as big as BMO no no BMO is less than 30 on like the soccer days oh it is they added the they added the extra seating

but those fake stands that explains why they were building them the demand is such the week before thank you the demand is such that they could actually

sell those seats to probably a BMO yeah that's how big the demand for soccer is here yeah so

so they're gonna move a team They're going to make half the money on ticket sales. And they're terrible. And they're not going to have a new stadium until 2019 at the very earliest. What? Why don't they just play with the Rams in the same stadium? Well, there was a deal in place for that. What do the Riders get?

No, no, hold on, hold on. There was a deal in place for the Raiders and the Chargers to come to L.A. last year, which was next. So the Raiders are going to leave Oakland. San Diego was going to have their team leave. But St. Louis beat them both to the punch. So there will be two terrible NFL teams Building stadiums in the Los Angeles area Potentially three because that's not been fully

Al Davis still might move the Raiders To Los Angeles as well Can you imagine Entering or leaving An NFL game In Los Angeles Traffic Fuck that

I drove from Anaheim to LA A few times and almost ruined my honeymoon What a miserable fucking drive but it just goes to show oh man and by the way the Chargers are extraordinarily profitable

they're already profitable so what's the problem because they can make more money and the Spano family but it sounds like they can't well they can because land

and because value over 10 years and because and the thing is it's so funny because the the like I said

the NFL was like willing to give the Chargers money 300 million dollars towards their new stadium To give you an idea, Dallas, which way overpaid and went obnoxiously expensive with their stadium, cost them a billion bucks. So you've already, basically, they've said, here's one third of the money that you need. If you can just come up with $600 million, Dean Spano, who's worth $30 billion.

He said, no, no, I'm going to pay the relocation fee. Money bazooka, giving it back. Do you know what the relocation fee is? $300 million? Are you ready for this? I don't know. I'm going by. $650 million.

Wow. So he could have had $300 million given to him. He'd prefer to pay $650 million and build a new stadium without the NFL's money. The presser. This first one comes from Steve Dangle. It's fucking crazy. Sports management students, because I get a lot of people going, yeah, I'm taking sports management. Okay, so I don't know what the fuck that means.

Can you explain what you learned in that course? And is one of those things how this shit works? Because I don't get it. I think it's probably national TV deal rights. LA is the number two market. New York's number one. So that part is part of it. Potential licensing deals.

The San Diego Chargers would be a local NFL team. In LA, they can become an international brand, which is what they want. But they have to win. Everybody looks at the New York Yankees and goes, Well, they're an international brand And they're in New York Well, yeah

Because they win Yeah, Mets International No Yeah You're laughing Why? Oh, because they're a joke

Yeah You know why the You know why the Lakers Are an international brand? They won a bunch of times Yeah Because are the Clippers Who have played in LA

For the last 30 years No I don't believe they are Are the Boston Celtics International? Yes And they've won a bunch But it's Boston

Boston's only like 100,000 more people Than Winnipeg oh because they won also Boston the greater Boston area is huge that's Boston

yes but Boston proper is under a million people it's hilarious Boston proper is under it's fewer people

than Saskatchewan yep economics are hilarious aren't they I don't get it well it must make sense on some spreadsheet somewhere and maybe someone

can explain it to us I would love that if you know if you can explain it I know like because the TV rights deals and all that stuff I'm sure you bring in more money if you're in LA

but also who gets the Super Bowl because both teams are going to want it are you going to do just LA two years in a row like here's the LA Rams because the Super Bowl moves no we have a series Super Bowl series

between four teams and then the winner of this game plays the winner of this game but then where do you have the championship game well then you have it in a parking lot midway between both fields. I don't fucking get this shit. It's times like this

where I'm glad the NHL in comparison is small ball because you can't do dumb stuff. Well. You can do dumb stuff but that is

that is dumb. The stakes are lower? Yeah. That is dumb on a whole new level. Like if you're listen you're Dean Spanel. What?

How much more money do you need at 30 billion dollars? Well here's how I think you know you're fucking up as an owner. Think of the Winnipeg Jets last game

in 1996 the fans attended and they stood and they cheered and they applauded and they cried and they bought season tickets through the freaking roof

that year and they mourned the loss of their beloved team San Diego Chargers fans said fuck you and KC was in town the stadium was red Kansas City Chiefs

because they're red jerseys the stadium was red that day that's rough pretty bad anyway you could have been a hero could have been a hero

could have been a hero The guy that kept the team in San Diego Whatever it is that made him rich I'm sure San Diego fans would be like I'm going to buy whatever he's selling because he's the owner I want to go back to LA This is such a cartoony place I started playing GTA 5 again

So I miss LA LA's a fun place It's a great time You know what's crazy? Visiting LA for the first time after beating GTA 5 Because everything's the same They basically remade the city We were in a cab driving down a street And I'm like, this street is in the game

yeah I've killed people on the street I drove over that sidewalk and killed like 30 people let's do the

press conference oh I didn't know we'd have time we do we're making it sure the Presser S

D P the Steve Dangle Press Conference I got a long podcast to listen to on the way

home so it's fine Florida is currently having their dad trip how many dads are younger than Yager

oh my god I did third period Third period suits Actually posted a picture It's like oh the Florida dad looked great And there was like half of them were computers I thought that was great So now wait how old is Jager 45?

Uh yes Do we have an actual answer here is this trivia? No But though Aaron Eckblad is what 20? 44 Jager I don't know if many of them are because Not a lot of them

I mean, some people have kids at 20, but very few. So you'd have to have your kid at like 20, 21 for that to be possible. Well, for Ekblad's dad to be the same age as Jager, he would have had to have been 24 when Ekblad was born. It's possible. Listen, it's possible. I just don't know how. I think my mom was younger than that when I was born.

Really? I think so. Jared McCann's 20. Ekblad's 20. Barkov is 21. It's possible. Oh, my God. That's crazy, man.

Jager is, especially today. But again, so there was a little insight on this. Last year, I don't remember if it was myself or Sofia Drusovic who asked Jerome McGinley this when the Avalanche were in town, but, you know, he basically said, do you see yourself playing as long as Jager? Or do you feel like you could? And he didn't really answer it.

He wasn't talking about himself physically, but his answer was basically like, well, I have a wife and children. and again he's like a pretty pretty quiet guy in the summer he disappears he goes to the mountains

literally the mountains and Yager's single Yager's single he's having fun with 18 year olds have you heard that story? oh yeah

we talked about it on the show oh we have okay that's a great story oh my god you know no wife no kids no obligations

other than to be the Panthers leading scorer how much would it be a travesty if Ovechkin doesn't win a Stanley Cup? Well, it's a travesty whenever any great doesn't win a Stanley Cup.

It was a travesty that Dion never won one. Not Dion Phaneuf, Marcel Dion. It's a travesty that Sandin never won one. It's a travesty that Joe Thornton has not won one. Can I? I mean, it'll just... What'll make it a travesty is that people, once Ovechkin retires, will use it against him. Yes.

I don't know that not winning a championship makes any single player less good but there seems to be this prevailing thought out there that because

you know when LeBron hadn't won a championship yet people were like well he'll never be great until he wins a championship and then he won one he'll never be great until he wins more

than Michael Jordan and it's like no no no no no no is he a great player yes or no do his stats line up with all these other great players that maybe

have or have not won cups yes are they better than those players yes then he's a better player but the issue is we're discussing

the greatest players of all time so you're taking no matter what you're talking about one of the greatest players of all time so you need to

almost get that petty that stupid you know but it's out of their control yeah it's a team game especially in hockey

but again like I'm not saying it needs to be logical like how many how many rings does LeBron have this is why I hate the NHL 100 list

because of this crap it does need to be logical I hate this crap can't we just be like Here's a hundred NHL players that were great And these are the hundred greatest But let's not rank them all Because we all know Gretzky's number one

And people are like Well actually Bobby Orr Gordie Howe Like Here's how it's going to work Here's how it's going to work How many rings does LeBron have?

Three? I think it's three Two in Miami One in Cleveland Seven times But he's won three And he's won three Until that number is six

No one's going to say he's better than Jordan What was Kobe? Five? Five So, okay, five, you can start the conversation. You can maybe make the argument. Three? Man, Jordan won twice as many rings as LeBron.

Yeah, but look what Jordan had. When LeBron went to the finals with the Cavaliers the first time, he had Shaq. I'm not trying to actually have this debate, by the way. I'm just saying, when you're talking about the top group of players of all time, you start to get into that stupid shit. I just feel bad because no one really says this shit about Marcel Dion. Did he at some point?

Well, I hope not. But I think part of Marcel Dien's problem is he played in L.A. before Gretzky got there. I think a little bit of a xenophobia. What? Really? And I mean, some people will be upset about that. With Eddie's French-Canadian? No, no, Ovechkin. Sorry. Oh, was it Marcel Dien?

I mean, possibly. I don't know. No, I think he played on the West Coast. And the reason I say that is because it's the same vibe to Matt Sundin. You know, people talk about how Sundin was never that great and he never won a cup. I'm like, what did Matt Sundin ever do to anybody? other than just... Dominate. Well, and try his best,

but again, who's the Swede and why is he captaining the Leafs? That is how he used to be perceived. Absolutely. How can you take it away from a North American like Wendell Clark and give it to Sundin? That's what they said.

And you can roll your eyes, but that's what people said. That was in the newspaper. I remember reading it the day it came out. Who said those sort of things? Oh, I'll give you a guess. Come on. Fancy pants sweets.

But, as much as I love Matt Sandin, Ovechkin's even better than that. After Borya Salming was in the NHL, how is it that Swedish players got labeled with that? Yeah, but the Broad Street Bullies, they beat him up. You ever see that picture of Borya? Couldn't even recognize him. When Gerard Gallant stepped on his face with a skate? That one? Is that who it was?

On Borya Salming's face? Yeah, it's Gerard Gallant. Oh, shit. Yeah. No, there was another one where like three flyers jumped him. Well, three flyers jumped him! Yeah, but you can do that in hockey because it used to just be called ice assault. I love that conversation Brendan Gallagher had with some retired NHL player.

And that guy was like, okay, here's how different hockey used to be. Maurice Richard in a game broke his more than one stick. So not just one stick, more than one stick over the head of an opposing player. He did it once And then he did it again And then he got suspended For doing that The whole playoffs

And people were so mad about it That there was a riot Yeah If that happens today Who is Like He shouldn't be in jail How could you put him in jail

It was a hockey game Everyone's like Yeah you should definitely Throw that person to jail That's how different it used to be Anyway I don't know how we got to that Last

Or next question Is it the last one I don't know I'm out of questions Are you out completely so yeah Brendan Gallagher wouldn't have survived

back in the day yes because you were legally allowed to murder people back in the day and if you had a headache or a severe concussion you were supposed

to suck it up and be tougher yeah to be fair I think the reason that it was so tough back then is because all of them

had just come back from war so anything that was happening on the ice didn't compare in the 70s? some of them but those people

were raised by the people that had come back from war right? The world's a place, man. Everyone's got a story. You come back from a world war. One or two.

Tell me you're not a little bit less sensitized to violence. I guess. Right? Yeah, I guess. And again, that's something we can't relate to. Exactly. Which is why now things have changed. That's interesting.

You think if a war breaks out, like hockey will randomly, then like all sports will become more violent? I think war now would be a lot different than war back then. War back then They were like Let's just throw A bunch of people At each other

And shell the shit Out of each other And hopefully But now it'd be like Well we get these drone strikes And we got these It's a whole different ball game Now you're making me

Want to listen to Dan Carlin In my car On the way home For the very long drive I'm going to have Because we went so over Here's what kills me About the Dan Carlin episode

That you're talking about Episodes That you're talking about Yes He calls the front The western front The meat grinder See I haven't gotten that far

he calls it the meat grinder and he's talking about humans I haven't gotten that far but he has this really soothing voice where he talks about everything with such

intrigue quiet excitement yeah oh sorry you listen to someone's voice for three or four hours

and you get good at imitating I imagine him in a room somewhere drinking like an herbal tea dark except for this one like you know

remember those musical stands that we had in high school a little black musical stand yeah and then like a desk light on that and then just

this piece of paper that he's potentially reading off of from notes and just by himself and he's just got all his notes

yeah and he talks about he butchers all these French words but it's okay you still know that he knows what he's talking about

and he gives you the heads up I just realized I do a really good Dan Carlin impression he gives you the heads up go listen to that shit

go look him up right now and tell me how good I am my brand is self-congratulation well it is Steve it is damn It's a good thing

You've never earned Anything you've done It's true And God forbid Anybody be happy for you I hope you're both Miserable Hockey Night in Cinema

In London We will see you At Western Are there still tickets? I don't know I have no idea I think there might be You know what?

Check it out Again Look Hockey Night in Cinema Up on Twitter People always back out At the last minute Yep I want to see you there

Dammit I want to see you there We love you We're excited to party With the Western University crew We're doing some interviews People are videotaping this Apparently

It's going to be cool. It's going to be cool. Hockey Night in Cinema, London, Ontario. It's a pivotal moment. Follow the guys on Twitter, at Steve underscore Dangle, at Adam W-Y-L-D-E, and at Jesse Blake.

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