The Steve Dangle Podcast - Torts & Trades | January 31, 2025

Episode Date: January 31, 2025

Come see The Steve Dangle Podcast live in at Boston Pizza in Stouffville: https://www.eventbrite.ca/e/steve-dangle-podcast-live-tickets-1205603405239?aff=oddtdtcreator On this episode of The Steve Dangle podcast, the salary cap is going UP (00:00), the Leafs lose to Minnesota (22:00), Philly and Calgary make a trade (50:00), Torts and Michkov (1:02:00), Bandt Clarke's healthy scratching (1:06:00), revisiting Zadorov and the Canucks (1:11:00), reevaluating Rantanen (1:21:00), will big spending teams take over the league? (1:27:00), and Utah's names (1:59:00). Visit this episode's sponsors: Discover the new uniform of choice for those who want strength, flexibility, and versatility from their everyday apparel. Visit https://shopduer.com/sdp to get 20% off your first purchase! Don’t fumble your grooming game this playoff season. Head over to Manscaped.com to get The Beard & Balls Bundle today and join over 11 million men worldwide who trust MANSCAPED® by using code DANGLE for 20% off + free shipping. Whether you’re chasing the Lombardi or just trying to look sharp for date night, MANSCAPED® has you covered. For all the odds and to learn more visit https://betmgm.com/DANGLE Any opinion expressed is not advice, a promise or suggestion that increases the chance of winning. Gambling can be addictive, please play responsibly. To learn more, visit: https://igamingontario.ca/en/player/responsible-gambling Or if you have concerns about a gambling problem, call ConnexOntario 1-866-531-2600. Must be 19+ or older to play. Subscribe to the sdpn YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/@sdpn?sub_confirmation=1 Join SDP VIP: YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC0a0z05HiddEn7k6OGnDprg/join Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/thestevedanglepodcast Spotify: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/sdpvip/subscribe Follow us on Twitter: @Steve_Dangle, @AdamWylde, & @JesseBlake Follow us on Instagram: @SteveDangle, @AdamWylde, & @Jesse.Blake Join us on Discord: https://discord.com/invite/MtTmw9rrz7 For general inquiries email: [e-mail] Reach out to https://www.sdpn.ca/sales to connect with our sales team and discuss the opportunity to integrate your brand within our content! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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with your host steve dangle adam wild and jesse blake maddie booed me boo for maddie here All right. I deserved it. So the salary cap is going up, up, up. And we'll get to that in just a second. But first, I must tell you about BP Stouffville, Molson Canadian, Boston Pizza, SDPN teaming up for the first live show of the first game between Canada and Sweden at the Four Nations Faceoff. Doors at 530. We're doing a live show at 630.

Canada plays at 8. And we're going to be hanging out to watch along with you, which we're very excited about. If you want tickets, and they are actually going very quickly, you can buy them. right now in the link to the description of this video or audio program whatever it is that you use it's in the description whatever the frig yeah and by the way Molson Canadian is the official beer for hockey and a partner of the Toronto Maple Leafs and PWHL you can play call the shot every time you order a Molson Canadian as Steve mentioned last episode you get to drink it which is cool yes but you also get to make predictions and you can score points to win VIP trips game

tickets gift cards and more well that adam you mentioned the pwhl like who even who even watches that well i would who even streams that i would i would on saturday afternoon but yeah but who would do it i there's only one man there's only one oh yeah i'm streaming the scepters game he forgot no i didn't you didn't forget well because the leafs are out of town right so you can you got a bit of a saturday where you don't have to go down to the arena right which is nice yeah no uh shootout loss uh last night not great um but bounce back victory on saturday you know what when you're right that's what we're all anticipating when you lose to mpp in the in the in the shootout on the last shot you're like okay fine no i'm not good like i'm not surprised by it

it's not fair i know i know it was a great it was a great dig too uh let's talk about this salary cap let's talk about the salary cap so the estimates and this is the key word here estimates are out. If you've been listening to Agent Provocateur, Alan believes 97 million is the actual number, but the estimates have come out. And the estimates, which were supposed to wait until the four nations face off, but were leaking because the NHL, the walls talk. Estimates are next season, the salary cap will be $95.5 million. That's up about 8.5%. It's 26, 27. The estimate is 104 million and then 27 28 the estimate is 103 113.5 million dollars so that's an eight percent jump and then an eight percent jump on that and then like a nine and a half percent jump it's a

major major jump 26 sorry 27 to 28 but we have to remember that the actual numbers are still not set in place this could though trigger some extensions because now teams finally know hey here's what we'll have and players go here's how much we can ask well and the first thing i thought with some really big names is maybe sign a one-year deal maybe sign a one-year deal and then when uh the real kick kicks in uh sign your big one you know who's looking like the smartest player in the nhl right now uh mitch marner no gavrikov if you remember oh he was first off trade deadline deadline acquisition you know big free agent you know defenseman that sort of thing and everybody's like wait he signed in la for 5.8 for two years yeah for two years and he saw this coming it's uh

i mean it's the smart thing to do right if the cap has been garbage and it has been like i don't know you always run the risk of blowing out your knees but if you're confident that's not going to happen and you're confident in your abilities keep it low or keep the amount of years low wait and see hold hold hold and this is the reward right now this is when you call your agent and go pick up your phone right right now uh anybody that signs a a contract this offseason i feel like if they go long term is basically like any team that signs a guy at the the 95.5 million dollar number let's say it's static at that and it's again these teams look at it these players look at it these agents look at it as percentage against the cap they don't look at it in the

actual full number for for how do you calculate value it's percentage against the cap if you are signing a long-term deal this summer like eight years seven years six years unless you are super young you are potentially robbing yourself if you don't go short well this that i was going to cut you off as i often do um no no like if you sign an eight-year contract this summer you got bad advice why why are you signing an eight-year deal mitch don't listen um like what matthew don't Listen, like, why are you signing an eight-year deal if the cap is going up this aggressively? Like, Matthews was ahead of the game in this regard

with the five-year and the four-year. What's the point of signing eight years when this is the reality ahead of you? Nylander? At 11 and a half? That becomes a steal pretty soon. All of a sudden, looks real good. There was a time where I went, oh, God, wow, okay, that's a lot.

Now, like, he's still one of the best goal scorers in the league. If you have anyone locked up to eight, you're doing all right. I don't see a reason for a star player to do it. Well, some guys, you know what? It was interesting. If you watch the Amazon documentary specific to Nylander, he doesn't want to move anymore. He moved as a kid so much because his dad was an NHL player.

obviously he's like this is the city i've spent the most time and i wanted to stay yeah that's a good reason that's pretty cool good reason to sign for eight yeah i mean you know what you could do is what what have you just uh signed a shorter deal and then didn't move you could do that too you could also do that um uh now i here's what i you brought it up a little bit on the last show jesse and steve has anyone been more screwed by the long-term deals they've signed than nathan mckinnon he by the end of his career he will have left 50 million dollars on the table he won't care i mean crosby did crosby left 50 million bucks on the table yeah but crosby did in a way that feels on purpose you don't think nate did on purpose no he's i mean his original deal when

he was younger he was coming off a rough year yeah he signed uh he signed a long-term deal i want to say it was six years coming off of like a down year he had like 40 points or something like that um and then he had probably the greatest contract in the nhl for a number of years now he's making 12.6 yeah in an economy where this summer we're probably going to see a player sign for 15 right you think mcdavid's signing for a dime less than that no shot and if he does that just build the statue now pre-cup dude it's uh i mean hey good for the abs jesse i think what steve was saying there is the most interesting name in the in the salary cap discussion because the 2026 off season when the cap is supposed to be 104 million dollars connor mcdavid is a free

agent he's going to be eligible to sign an extension coming this off season because that's The contract is expiring the next following season. And now that we know the salary cap number is going to be that high, I wonder where those negotiations go. Because there's no price that's too high for Connor McDavid. So how high do you go, knowing that the cap's going to be $113 a year later? The best player in the league always gives you a discount when you think about it. McDavid should be making $20.

Oh, he can't. but yeah but in a couple years whatever what what's the upper limit for a player's contract is 2018 something i think so i forget the actual in like two years i forget the actual percent but whatever that number max is is what he should make next off season yeah and then it's still a discount come the 113 20 jesse 20 yeah right so whatever 20 of 104 million dollars is that should be his cap number and then it's even less once uh the cap goes up the fall i get i believe that would be 20.04 million dollars i think that would be his number the way more interesting number with mcdavid isn't the cap hit like we know it's going to be the upper limit um it's the amount of years

yep i mean i think if he signs anything longer than three or four it's an act of charity no seriously why would he sign eight well with the cap going up this aggressively why would any star player do that so i mean steve what if you were to predict what connor mcdavid's next contract looks like who is it with how long for how much money it can well okay this is you're not going to enjoy this answer but it totally depends on his priorities if it's eight years it's what the literal maximum number is times eight because that's the most he can sign for on that day i think if he was smart he'd sign for the literal max number maybe even a hair less like as like a as a little bone to throw the oilers but i'm doing three or four years so let

me ask you yet what do you think conor mcdavid's next contract is years team dollars oilers four years and then whatever the max is. I don't know the number. It would be $104 million so that $20.4 million. I'm going to say Leafs $18 million seven years.

God bless you, Adam Wild. God bless you. I don't think so, but bless you. Greg Wyshynski just tweeted, kind of amazing that Leon Dreisaitl's cap hit, which is $14 million, will only be 12.3% of the Oilers' cap come 27-28. yeah dude like that's great he signed eight years right yeah geez uh we're looking at mckinnon

that's crazy any of these deals uh i'll give you another one shisterkin oh yeah deal hell of a deal right it looked it looked a little rich how does it look now all right follow-up question that we did the mcdavid next up mitch marner did the toronto maple leafs make a mistake by not signing mitch marner early in this season to a long-term contract the word on the street is not uh neither side were ready for that i think it's a very unique situation where the team will not even begrudgingly let a player walk if there's failure and if there isn't failure i think he's just going to stay like he wants to be here right so what's the number so what's uh hmm okay if you want to stay there's incentive to sign for eight but it would be a total act of charity on his part yeah

there is no reason for him to do it now if he did that the the anger and and and it's not entirely his fault uh he wanted the maximum number maximum term last time and he got it and the cap stayed flat right like we should be at about 120 million now um i start the negotiations at leon's number if you're mitch yep and it's important to know he sits between leon and connor mcdavid right now in points yep leon's third leon's first in goals yes but in points yeah i'm just talking about points sure don't think i mentioned goals i i mentioned goals Those are more valuable. Dreisaitl, Marner, McDavid.

3-4-5 in points. Damn. I don't think you're wrong. And here's the question, though. Is it, do you guys think he would go, and I have no idea, I have no insight on this. Do you think he'd go a full eight? Or do you think he's going to be like,

you know what, I'm doing what Matty's doing. I'm doing four years, and then I'm going to see where we're at at the end of this. I was surprised Willie signed for eight. Right? Jess? These guys is all copies. You said neither side were willing to do it,

But I feel like at any price, somebody is willing to sign the line. Do they offer Mitch that? Like, hey, I can't refuse this number at this point number earlier in the season. Is that beneficial for if they give him Leon Dreisaitl's contract? One hundred and twelve million. I think he's probably considering you think you would have taken it. But don't you think that would tip their hand? And it's like, well, once we offer him this, we can't come back.

Like, we can't come back and be like, you know what, Mitch? Sorry about that offer. It's now 13 and a half later on. Like, that is a negotiating wise. it's not a great strategy because if you're the Leafs you're just going this is what we're willing to go to and then you leave put them in a take it or leave it position and he's got no trade protection so maybe they didn't go there because it wasn't the best to go but he holds the cards here he really does he's gonna sign in an eight-year 16 million dollar contract and then

we're gonna find out there's about a thousand cases of bird flu and uh then we're all gonna be it's gonna be bad i think let's not do that if the leafs don't perform and mitch doesn't perform i feel like the leafs then get all the all of the power because i think everybody'd be willing to walk away and you're talking about playoffs right yeah what is it so i don't know if he holds any power if he doesn't show up can i ask you well can i ask you there is that yeah yep yep um you know mitch has been about a point of game player in his career on you know the least in the power play and a power play playoffs and i understand that those came in bunches right uh sometimes like you look at the tampa series like wow he got a whole bunch of points in that he actually scored

them all in the first yeah showing showing marner's points per game in the playoffs is deliberately misleading you know what we're talking about and you're being obtuse yes so So, if you're Brad Treliving, Jesse and Steve, and let's say $14 million is on the table, whether it's four years, five years, eight years, three years, doesn't matter. $14 million is on the table. What do you need to see? Because that's what Steve suggested. You start at the dry saddle number, right?

What do you need to see? And let's say the Leafs, because this is their brand, get one round in the playoffs. What does Mitch need to show you is points, play, whatever-wise, to know that, you know what? I'm safe. i feel safe committing to him at that number for x amount of years like what do you need to see to be like okay he's put the playoff demons behind him uh be the number one two or three reason why this team had playoff success uh get them over the hump pot a couple goals set up a couple up some points don't take a puck over the glass penalty because you're nervous

um like i don't i don't think what's being asked of him is anything other than and it's also not something that's easy to accomplish right but that's what the money's for that is what the money's for it's hard jesse it's hard yeah no that that's it like you need to you need to see what he does in the regular season in the playoffs like it needs to be proven that that game translates to the playoffs because right now you see it in spurts you see it a little bit but it hasn't been consistent, hasn't resulted in any sort of significant run for the Toronto Maple Leafs. The games get harder, you get better.

That's what the greatest players do. Do you guys feel like, do you honestly think, and I don't want to do this too much, but I think we're midway through the season, and what you've seen is a career year for Mitch Marner. It's very quietly a career year. This is the best overall hockey we've ever seen him play. I think specifically you really saw him shine

when Matthews wasn't playing. I'm thinking specifically of November, the way him and Nylander really carried things. And we will get into the Leafs wild game a little bit later because I do want to get back to the trade and all the stuff that happened last night. But with Marner's play so far, do you think the way he's playing now

will translate to the playoffs in more success for him? Are you seeing differences in his game that you're like, he's doing it different this year in comparison to last year? He's more physical. He's more willing to go to the net. Plays angry. Plays angry, but like productive angry,

not like, you know, I'm just completely thrown off my game. And I would say anything that is in Mitch's game that isn't great for the playoffs is more a symptom of all the Leafs are doing it, and it's not just him. Like, he's still kind of a perimeter player, and it's still too much of a perimeter team. Especially, man, with Nyes and Tavares out of the lineup, it's not that they lost their production. It's the type of production they provide.

The Leafs don't have it. Yeah, there's no dirty area guys right now. No, like a play that I hated late in the wild game, I think it was Mitch, I'm not totally sure, set up Austin for the side of the net one-timer. and it's you're that's a play you can make at any time right um but you have a six on five you have the numbers advantage the man advantage you're not trusting the guys in front of the net like matthews isn't shooting for the rebound he's shooting to put that thing through the back of the net yeah uh you're just not trusting i think it was mcmahon and patch ready to get the job done

there um so that you know but any anyway we're really getting into the weeds there this is the best he's ever looked best he's ever played um feistiest he's ever played uh Craig Berube's rubbing off on him the Leafs were I was gonna say right not to bail on him uh because that is a complicated conversation uh and you have to go back to well then there's no movement blah blah blah put it this way i've been over it for many a year the results haven't been there for many a year this year if it doesn't work can we all get on with our lives okay now i do want to say that you know mitch has done something uh that you know plenty of players don't or player plenty of players don't do which is like you look at like elias patterson is making 11 and a half

and the 40 points in 65 games since he signed it making 700 g's more than mitch right mitch has never done that he's never listened you can complain about his playoff performance is all you want uh and i have but uh there is a consistency in the regular season with this guy and that has a significant amount of value yeah and like his slumps are very particular it's like oh he hasn't scored in a while what's a while two games well well oh but he's got nine assists in his last seven oh right yeah you know stuff like that yeah um no he's he's a very consistent player sometimes life throws your curveballs and you don't have time to get to them and that's where task rabbit comes in and i think you should check this out because here's

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get when WestJet welcomes you on board. Here's to WestJetting since 96. Travel back in time with us and actually travel with us at westjet.com slash 30 years. Jesse, question for you. We're going to go right into the Wild Leaps game. We'll save the trade for the next segment. You're at the game Wednesday night. And first off, Marc-Andre Fleury's last appearance in Toronto, it looks like. We'll talk about his game with Montreal.

What did you see out of him in warm-up? Yeah. Fantastic. I believe the best part of warm-ups was he was chatting with Matt Murray. It was fun to see Flurry and Murray rekindle their Penguins relationship. Noted Asian Alan Walsh was in attendance both nights, Leafs and Montreal. Yes. Did you run into Alan at all?

I did. He was talking to Patrick Reddy, though. Oh. I could just say, hi, Alan, and go back to your business. Flurry didn't allow a goal in either game. That's crazy. What? Thanks, Steve.

jesse what was your sense of how the team felt about things after the loss because this is the thing i know how i felt i know how steve felt i saw the lfr how do you think the team felt it's it's i think i think sometimes it's important to take a step back and look at the the day-to-day of the team and how things have been going the last week or so because it's it's a team that played saturday then they played wednesday and then they play saturday again And there's so much time in between those games, it's hard to get in a rhythm. And I look at what happened in between the Sens game and the Wild game and the Columbus game. So you got a Rogers Gala.

Yeah, they were pretty busy. There's an Easterseals skate at Ford Performance. They have their outdoor skate on the Monday. And it just feels like they weren't in hockey mode, the team as a whole, as a core. And I was talking to Alter. I was like, I think the road trip is going to be really good for the Leafs because they haven't been playing consistent hockey as of late and they haven't been consistently practicing. And there's been so much so many extracurricular activities with the Leafs going on in this week because you can't put them in the beginning of the season. It's they're busy. They're focused. They're getting into the groove of the season. Can't put that towards the end of the season.

And so, unfortunately, because they are also a business around the Leafs, you have to schedule at some point and hear this little gap with one game in seven days with the Wild game in the middle of the week. That's when you get all of these extra activities falling on this one week. And since there's not a lot of practice time, I don't fault them for the performance against the Wild. There's concerning stuff, like they need three more forwards on this team. but i feel like that's a that's a different conversation than just the individual performance

of i don't want to deem it a schedule loss and give the guys a whole bunch of slack on that but like one of the goals matthews tipped in himself yes yes wrong play to do berube said when you're blocking a shot you don't block it with your stick yes i don't know why he did that he called out matthews for doing that but it's also it's an own goal and then the other one it's a goal but you also scored a goal so it's one one plus an own goal so it's not as bad as of a loss when you take the whole context of what the least are doing here and i said the the road trip is going to be good for them because now it's just hockey you go you go you're they flew out thursday it was a off day so i assume that was their travel day you go to you go to the west coast you know

central i guess canada you go to edmonton you go to alberta then you're just doing hockey you go on the whole road trip you do seattle you do vancouver you do calgary all hockey all practice get focused you're going a long break for four nations it feels like it's good and right now this is kind of a lull in the schedule and you get these losses against minnesota the star players of this team are basically not going to see their home base for like two months good it might be good for them um because they got the canadian road trip like you just said they then have four nations they this affects you honey hockinpah as well then they have a road trip immediately after four nations they have one game against the hurricanes then they head into a four-game

road trip they're home for one day against the sharks then they go do the vegas colorado utah road trip then they're home for a little bit they alternate between home and away then at the end of february they go on the california road trip the oh that's march yeah the stretch the stretch in march is the is that's like the important part of the season yes like that's where you're gonna find out if the leafs are free those are the games where i'm gonna start getting like a little concerned or a little a little excited yeah about what i'm seeing at least can they start to peak and get it together exactly this is the important part of the schedule where you need to be peaking and a wild loss there you can take some

good things you can take a lot of bad things from the performance and hopefully at that point in that long stretch in march you have the depth scoring that you desperately need and you get some new bodies in there you're a little healthier or if you're injured can you perform without those players and you have scorers four and five out yeah you know in tavaris and nice i think that matters it does and you yes i know the games keep coming in the schedule whatever minnesota's a good team uh without caprizo without without caprizo now listen when you know when a team is coming into toronto without their star player you know the leafs are about to get pumped that is a that is a guarantee every time gonna happen but the other side of it is they have looked guys a little

discombobulated and and that's been for a couple of games wasn't great against the senators again i'm acknowledging that they've had a lot of injuries patch ready back for his first game like you just nice playing up or nice uh mcmahon playing up on the uh on the first line um and i like him but he's not nice well of course not they don't play the same yeah and i and i i then i want to talk about too like earlier on in the in january had trouble scoring then too right they won tight games against philly where they look like crap if if you want a rosy rosy glasses uh way to look at it the leafs have allowed what is it five goals over the last two games two of them have been goals from the sticks of their opponents against a goalie wool has allowed two shots one was one

was off a knee and one was off of their own stick one was off a knee one was off their stick and another was an empty netter yeah like i don't know like i think the defense is doing pretty good i think the goaltending is doing pretty good the problem here is the offense and they can't score i don't think on on many teams if if you walk into the the rink and and mcmahon and holmberg are like top six forwards like you're not you're not you're not gonna win a lot you're not looking at that team being like ah they got enough nylander's playing nylander's line mates have five goals combined that's that's the real concern yeah it's i don't think it's the like the the microscope on on each individual game it's the overview of the team and how they have a lot of

work to do for the deadline hey the fact that nylander still scored despite the fact still scored good good assists and he can drive a line and it is worth the money obviously to have him But, yeah, I think you have probably some things that you could switch out. And, Jesse, you said they need three forwards. Two of them are Tavares and Nyes, I think. But you need at least one more impactful forward. Don't be such a disappointment. Yeah, I'm finally ready to admit I'm very disappointed.

Because I thought we saw the best of him last year. He hasn't been good enough. And, like, talk about can't drive a line, right? And there were times where you see that third line with him, McMahon, and Robertson, and you're like, yeah, they got it. They lit up lesser opponents, and any time they took on a contender,

they got run over. The Leafs need it forward, I think, is why Brandon Saad is going to be a Leaf by the time this show is up. So you think he will, eh? Yeah. I don't know that he's that good, though. I didn't say that.

Is he not more of what they have in the bottom six, which is takes up space and can't score? like he's the guy that they'll give a shot to but he's apparently looking for big money because he gave up five million bucks or whatever's left and so apparently he's not he's not coming into town for a match patch no what max dealers what he wants more than even like a big payday is the next year's contract so he wants a two-year deal this year prorated plus next year and apparently there's a bunch of teams offering him that really yeah so they're gonna sign him for the rest of this year and then next year this because for him to give up five million dollars is crazy but

it's because there's on the table a contract for next year he has 16 points in 43 games guys i just doing it in the playoffs is so important you can ride that for so frigging long when was his last like i i know he's got the uh two last time he was in the playoffs was 21 22 with the blues he five points in 12 games what are we doing well i don't think the leafs are i know that the least are rumored to be in but i don't think they're the front runner and i just don't see how unless you're moving bodies out like where does he fit well i think you probably wave guys um because like listen do you want to give up draft capital not really do you want to give up your prospects not really all right well if a guy becomes available to sign as a free agent who's been

playing in the nhl all year it actually makes a lot of sense but giving up cap this time of year can be devastating to well he's not going to get you he's a winger i don't sign him to an amount that's not variable well but that but that just he just went through that yeah he just said i'm not doing that yeah well if he's not doing that then i think that's unreasonable and you're out well yeah and that's why i don't think the least are going to get them they have two million dollars in cap space though they're projected because of the ltir they will have two million by the deadline i don't know man everyone seems to have itchy thumbs right now and they're all making trades are rumored to be i'm not gonna yell it brad brad where you at man bradley where you at

like okay well they're in first place god we used the shit out of that didn't we well they're not anymore, are they? They're second place, and the Sens are four points behind them. Well, actually, sorry, that doesn't matter. Oh, yeah, it doesn't matter? It doesn't matter. Oh, okay. I was told that that's... That's good. Well, thank you. I'm

new to the sport, so it's always good to have it talked at me. Like, what are we doing here? The other thing I want to mention is that Cali Yarncroke, and people laughed at me for this, and I don't give a shit. Cali Yarncroke scored two years ago, 20 goals. Cali Yarncroke is exactly the kind of player they could use right now. Yarncroke would be great. He'd be great.

And I don't know how, like, they expect him back before the playoffs. That is for sure. That's surprising to me. It's good news. It's great news. So this guy who had, you know, he had, what is it, 10 goals, 11 assists in 54 games last year. That is exactly the type of thing that you need in the bottom six right now. He is such a consistent goal scorer.

Go look at his career. Every year, like, it's not a high pocket, but there's this pocket that he finds every damn year. Yep. he's gonna be somewhere between like i don't know 13 and 20 goals perfect great that's 13 goals makes him a sniper on this team in the bottom six holy crap i'm also easy there maurice i'm also looking at it's it's been funny oh people uh like on the stream like well what if the leafs uh you know there's the that we mentioned it i think in the last show that kiprios um morgan riley for jt miller first off jt miller wants to go to the eastern united states although toronto is close

to the eastern united states um second northeastern united states apparently where he wants to be second people are like why kipper was like well why not morgan riley no movement clause just had a baby wife's entire business is based out of toronto i don't think so um uh sidebar you know what's going to be highly entertaining what when jt miller and elias petterson are both traded to rival teams in the east and they got to play each other hell yeah i like that i'm into that i'm into that jt miller to the rangers carolina gets uh peterson or something like that jt miller also has a 15 team no trade yeah so i believe like all the canadian teams are probably on that oh that's exactly what i mean like he's not waiting because morgan also has one so yeah i don't i

don't know how that's gonna work it's not going anywhere yeah yeah stop everyone yep i and then so beyond that um people are like wow why don't you just whoa you could be morgan riley nick robertson like guys guys what do you think nick robertson's trade values what are we doing knock it off knock it off oh yeah yeah he's just got people there you go chomping at the bit for nick robertson no disrespect to nick robertson but he's had a down year he needed to have a great year it's been he's been trying he's been pretty good at times it's been really dry i think riley in a first round pick gets it done of course not like they're they're big game hunting here yeah they want a player back yeah uh so and i don't think the leafs have that i think the he's also not a

center yeah that's also a problem uh pedersen is uh but long story short with the leafs it does seem like there needs to be some sort of trade again if you look at the the the jonas and and jonas siegel and chris johnston list every single player on that list i'm like okay oh that's expensive oh that's expensive oh that's really expensive and so i'm hoping that yeah but you're trying to win who cares what the prices are well apparently the leafs do they don't want to give up another first so which is it man yeah what is it it's like okay so you don't want to win you're gonna go into the playoffs with a team that's not as good like cool do you see the problem with this being built into your every season every season you go in with a top heavy

flawed team which means you need to spend and every year we go oh you don't want to spend and then they either don't and lose or they do and lose at least you tried but at least you tried yes you know what hell i'm on your side on that one at least you tried i know go out swinging with with um jake mccabe who they still have and ryan o'reilly uh you won a round oh yeah you didn't do so hot in the second round but you took a big swing you won a round you ended up losing around two at least you tried right uh they don't you can't go into the playoffs with this team yeah i don't think like casual fans i don't think they sit there when it's there they start to really tune into the leafs this late season and the playoffs are all around and the leafs are like

on the news now you know yes it's not just in the sports part of it they're actually the lead story on the six o'clock news and i don't think anybody's sitting there being like you know what that 2027 first it's not this all this all this playoff partying and and that first round victory it's not it's not worth it no what about that guy we're gonna draft in 2027 well i was i was joking in a in a video i shot today for the flames flyers trade it's i'm just envisioning danny briere on the phone craig if you're freaking serious about this you're going to include a seventh round pick four drafts from now which is something that actually sort of happened um listen get it done get it done it's considering how totally flawed this team is

it's pretty admirable how well they've done even though they're not in first anymore and you know other teams are starting to catch them um but like i'm at the point where i'd like to see them start making these moves because the the the gaps on the roster are painful yeah they're pain and i honestly don't think any of them are on defense outside of morgan riley struggling i think they have so much good d depth you know that's adequate that they can probably survive with the decor they have like if they went to playoffs with the eight guys that they have i think i'd be fine because i'm i'm including hawk and paw on that because he's gonna be healthy come playoff time he's a bit of a monkey wrench in the situation like if he plays and he's the guy he's been throughout his

career like i think that's basically yep nailed it great uh then you have hawk and paw riley like you wanted you can reunite Tanev uh McCabe and then you have oh geez Riley's on your third pair with OEL oh wait no no no I'm wrong you already said Riley no no so OEL and then you could you could have him on the right of Benoit or Timmons or Timmons or you know you maybe add maybe add one I'm not I'm not I don't care to spend the assets to kick out maybe Timmons or Benoit like i feel like those guys have earned your it's your sixth defenseman on this team isn't gonna be the make or break for this we're really nitpicking well and people do nitpick those guys and i want to remind you i want to remind you that chemo team and won a championship with the chicago

blackhawks playing four and a half minutes a night now i know they had they had three defense i know that yeah it was keith seabrook and shalmerson that was it now i know that the leafs don't have duncan keith but i feel like they've got a shalmerson uh in in tan of i think oel is pretty good i think the cave's pretty good like i do think i think jesse's got a point i'm not worried about i'm asking i'm asking the sixth defenseman on this team to be one of benoit myers or timmons i think that's okay even their minor league depth like they'll live they'll live or marshall refi Marshall Refai friggin Dakota Mermis like like we're

pretty solid if Hawk and Bob comes back and it is good okay who's your third line center oh that's a question friggin Dick Blinken well it's and by the way it's so I think we know I think we know it's not Fraser Minton he's too young I know

but I told you guys that earlier this year and you guys like no well no but you had to see yeah I know you got it now seen it twice he's not there yet he's not there yet organization loves him he will be one day based on what i've seen i'm very confident he'll get there of course he ain't there right so let's go out also gonna get a good little run here on the road trip who knows what he what he can do yeah i think there's there's chance here for minton to step up but still i think you

need depth pieces i am definitely getting to the point where i'm like all right like it's been obvious for months let's do something here start of the season obvious and i'm sure craig berube has had the brad conversation like brad listen i've i've reworked this this lineup as best i can but i need a third line i need a second line center who plays third line they've used so many guys i i uh like was just looking at like the leaf stats page like just randomly because that's what i do in my spare time and i was like oh yeah alex kneelander yeah he's there oh yeah uh yanni hockenpah playing at the four nations we're gonna get to see if this guy can play anymore uh especially especially with high skin and out he got assigned a number today yeah yeah he's

playing he's playing we've all this is the weirdest thing it's the best conditioning stint he could get i don't even care i know like no non-leaf fan gives a shit about this story but it's fascinating to me that a guy who has not played like this isn't even drew dowdy he did play he played a game well maybe two two games actually yeah yeah and when was that that was like american thanksgiving and he had arthroscopic knee surgery after that yeah drew doughty just played like 50 minutes over two nights yep where's yanni where is this guy i don't get it if we're just last note on the forward depth i don't ryan reeves played five playoff games for the toronto maple leafs last year yeah i don't know if we all remember that

he was in the first five games against the boston bruins i don't think that's probably the plan again i can't this year no i can't imagine so there's like we're talking about there's i think three forwards you got to get here yeah because well do you need connor doer healthy because he's injured right so young croak healthy hopefully because you're you're looking what are you looking at for your four i can scratch doer what are you looking at for your fourth line lorenz doer conf looked good yeah fine which if you're gonna have a metapod fourth line which is what that is your third line needs to have some ability to score and they don't it's domey blank blank right well it's not good i don't think it's going to be robertson i think

it's going to be mcmahon and i think it's going to be mcmahon center domey right or patcher ready depending upon who's injured you don't have domey on the you have domey on the wing yeah you're still getting a center yeah you have to get a center i think patcher ready uh i don't know what what you're doing in terms of the second line you i i love tavaris patch ready i thought that worked great with kneelander kneelander yeah when they played together you have mcmahon grumpy old men line i love it man center domey yeah so nice matthews marner mc uh sorry patch ready tavaris kneelander mcmahon center domey i mean robertson i assume is in this deal yeah and then metapod yeah okay i don't you don't hate that where's where's yarn croak

oh well yarn croak uh can sub in and play hey listen here's a here's an idea you're trying to win in the playoffs you need more defense yarn croaks your guy he's a good he's a good third line center he's a good third line winger he's he can do both okay here's here's so we're getting there we're getting there if yarn croak plays um they i now this might be holding it up you might have you might have a really good point here if yarn croak gets in then you probably try mcmahon domey in the middle yarn croak you could try mcmahon yarn croak in the middle domey and you try that for however many games to see if it works

or doesn't if it doesn't that is the drop dead you have to make a move because you've tried literally everything everything there are no more options to try that's enough I don't hate

moving off of David Conf I don't either for an upgrade I don't hate having Connor Dewar in the press box I think there's a lot of little tweaks you could make Can I offer one little tweak I'd like to see them make? What do the Leafs struggle to do? Score.

Score depth. Depth. Score. Yeah. They have the top goal scorer in the American League. Alex Steeves. Oh, Alex. Yeah, he's got like 23, 24 goals.

Yeah, throw him in and don't put him on the damn fourth line. Like, give him a run. Give him an actual run that's worth having. I think it's because you guys share a name that you're advocating for this. I don't think you really mean it. It is. he what he did not play great when he was up no but i also don't think he was like if you're gonna call him up i'm serious like i would look at if tavaris is healthy like putting him in the

top six probably put him on the second power play unit you need goals you need goals man and if you're uh determined to do it on a shoestring budget all right i don't know if they are i think they're they'll take a swing just a question of what and our leaf taking their time are leaf fans prepared for a potential easton cowan or ben danford or fraser mitten to go no they're not they're not i i have a very hard time seeing them moving i do too but i if you want to swing i don't danford's an interesting one because like that wasn't a sexy pick and i don't know if that's like a tantalizing prospect i think he's just like solid yeah you know what i mean so like i don't know if teams are clamoring for that so like how much value is there

you basically have cowan and he as exciting as he is what does he project to be as an nhl player a lot of leaf fans have some pretty outrageous expectations for this kid you know we often talk about not missing kyle dubas he was exciting he gave us those little piddly trades as a moose bush and he's and he's doing it in pittsburgh yeah it's like hey nibbling we traded four and uh and we we traded to and from two players you've never heard of and i get to go and i miss being able to do that on my channel steve yes on february 27th 2023 the toronto maple leafs acquired jake mccabe sam lafferty a 2024 conditional fifth round pick and a 2025 conditional fifth round pick from the chicago blackhawks for 2025 conditional first round pick

2026 conditional second or second round pick not conditional joey anderson and paddle pavel gogolov oh pavel gogolov what a name would you do that trade again what the yes 100 who cares about trading away first round picks yeah the future yep second round but there's a first and a second in there and joey anderson and where'd they get nice second round right well i i would much rather have jake mccabe and that little sam lafferty run and the fifths in there then and they didn't have to give away lafferty for free but they just did yeah they did half retained on mccabe and for multiple years yeah that's worth a first it's worth a what would that where was that first it's this year's first oh right that's the one they traded just it's this

year's first it's so it's gonna be even if they were to get knocked off in the first round again it's going to be like 20 in the yeah high 20s like what do we the projected salary cap uh just so you know if the the leafs of cap space coming into this offseason will be 28.7 million dollars so they got enough room to sign tavaris nyes marner and at nope we're playing we're playing steve's game what's the number 28.75 and that's that's if you don't move out conf if you don't Oh, no, no, no, no, no. Don't give me any of that shit. Don't give me any of that shit.

Give me something solid. Okay. So you have 28 and a half. We just did this math like three episodes. Yeah, but now we have a number. Marner, 14. And the number's smaller than the number we were working with. Marner, that's half.

So Marner, 14. Half. Gone. Gone. Gone. Oh, so this just takes out... The 28 and a half number takes Marner out entirely? I think it does, yeah.

Okay. 14. So now you have... at six 14 and a half left all right let's say Tavares is six Marner and Nye's at five and a half oh geez now you're moving too quick for me so it's all right so that's three million bucks and wool and wool is getting a raise getting a raise but that which is basically three million bucks that counts that counts the wool raise counts against the cap free that they have including the mckay raise and all that stuff and the mckay's they're already signed got it talking

about projected cap space so marner's half of that nice add on to that oh jesus someone else anyway this is too hard to do i said it's about two three million bucks um yeah anyway uh i just did that to bug you you know sometimes in the studio gets hot which is why we like to wear doer doer jeans uh you know these are the the usual thing about doer jeans they're great they're breathable they're made with renewable fabrics where possible uh a lot of plant-based fibers and they breathe they breathe your legs can breathe but they also wear they also have nice stuff that you can wear other than on your legs i have a doer toque that i really love i have your doer flannel that i really love they have a lot of great clothes they're built for

doing with options for everyone and doer stands out they make their clothes sustainably like i said ethically and that's something that's real hard to find these days when you buy it it should last you guys are throwing out so many details it makes my butt look good oh do you get complimented on it not enough okay okay you'll find us in our doers this year and if you haven't ordered your doers yet now is the time to update your wardrobe check doers flagship store in canada or the united states or shop online shop doer.com slash sdp right now our listeners will get 20 off your first purchase when you use our exclusive url it's shop doer d-u-e-r dot com slash sdp really great deal 20 off do not wait shop doer.com slash sdp all right let's talk about the uh the the

flyers last night uh and and and specifically matt bay mitch koff scoring and the the the goal being called back because one morgan frost breathes in the wrong direction i don't know if you guys saw this goaltender interference it was to me it's egregious i'm like if a goalie comes up and bumps you it's the goalie's fault and that's what it felt like with morgan frost that that mitch kauf goal should have counted right but what's important about that is morgan frost didn't finish the game because he got traded and hurt and and hurt but the the deal was still went through so frost gets pulled somewhat hurt supposedly farabee is traded going the other way is kuzmenko pelletier and then a second and a seventh from the calgary flames it seems like both teams won out

here um but let's start with the philadelphia flyers who on paper talent wise current talent wise you go what did they really gain your penalty he's got a he's he's got an okay ceiling kuzmenko's a ufa tortorella if he's mad at mitch koff like he was last night and we'll play that press conference in a second they screamed at each other on the bench i want to know what was said on account of the biggest strain in their relationship is the language barrier right but i i'm trying to figure out what torts is going to do with andre kuzmenko um um that's a fascinating one because everything i've learned about andre kuzmenko is he is exactly the kind of player torts will hate yes um i think he's going to play with mitch kov which is going to be fascinating because they can

go in and out of the doghouse together um they they have a communication issue with this kid and we've tried to talk about this because torts has actually been i think very uh in depth and forthright with what's going on with mitchkov and when he's scratched and when he's benched he is a young player in this league he's still learning and there's a language barrier there and it's a huge problem they tried to recruit igor zamula who's a defenseman of theirs to help with that language barrier and torts felt it uh cratered zamula's game so they're like okay we can't just have him do that you're not going to bug the goalies with it you're not going to beg uh bug uh kolosov or fedotov fedotov um with all that you you need a guy it's important

what one of the reasons jesse pulley or if he didn't work out in edmonton is he had no one to talk to because he had a language barrier too it's not a problem that's just limited to russians you know this poor finnish kid comes over as a teenager has no idea what the hell's going on and no one will talk to him because they can't right so kuzmenko played with him in the khl they didn't just go let's go get some random russian guy they got an ex-teammate of mitchkov they know they can play well together and kuzmenko when he's on scores a lot when he arrives at a team he almost scored 40 goals as a rookie with the Canucks like sometimes when you see a player who's not doing well and you see their cap number is big I always like to go back to when they signed

it because I'm like okay there must be some crazy outlier here and oh 39 goals yeah the next year which was last year it doesn't work out in Vancouver so he goes to Calgary what does he do freaking goes off and then this year arrives and he can't hit the broad side of a barn and he still can't play defense so this is a perfect change of scenery deal for the flames to get him out of there for the flyers you get him in order to get rid of joel farabee's contract he's making five million dollars a year to be 11th on your team in scoring this year forget it um frost is doing all right but you know he's been in Shea Bow Wow well well Wyshynski tweeted congrats to Morgan Frost for getting out from under torts yeah there are some players that hate playing for him there's

some players that love him yeah and now and two buddies got traded to Calgary and I'm sure they're going to be over the moon Calgary gets better today the Flyers I think get better down the road Peltier is starting to hit his stride in the NHL Kuzmenko who knows like if this doesn't work out He probably goes back to the KHL next year, honestly. And you get a second-round pick out of it. The Flames want to be better sooner, I think, because they are better sooner. And they get two players who are young

but probably not at their peak yet. The Flyers, who are probably still a year away, get guys who will be able to help them when they're no longer a year away. And Kuzmako is expiring. Yes. The salary is expiring. Well, that's what I'm saying.

like either they either he works out and they keep him or he doesn't work out and he might end up in the khl again worth mentioning too gentlemen that the flyers have seven picks in the first two rounds this year and wow projected cap space uh next season uh it's a lot are they a dark horse for one of the vancouver guys oh i think so they have the assets yeah yeah and by one of the Vancouver guys I mean JT Miller I mean why not I think John Tortorella might actually like kill JT Miller no um Elias Patterson because because here's the thing flyers have 25 million dollars to spend assuming everything stays the same this summer the next year it would be 57 million dollars yeah there's I'm sure they're gonna they're gonna assign somebody onto a ridiculous

yeah the flyers are a big money team this is i uh i don't think they're done i think they're going to be either it's either it's this year or at the draft in or in free agency they're about to have a real noisy six months jesse for the flames morgan frost and joel farabee have had down seasons and when i kept hearing from like craig conroy and all the players everybody's like he's got therapy brings jam it's jam i like him i like that player i like joel farabee too do you think 25 year old morgan frost turns out to be like the best pickup the flames because you think 25 year old center guy was a first round pick late first round pick but still first round pick is this exactly what the flames need yeah i like the move from conroy because you're giving

your team a shot here because they've positioned themselves in a in a spot where i don't think they even expected themselves to be in which is in a playoff spot come late early february so he's giving the team a bump here in hopes that kuzmenko has given you nothing so you're upgrading kuzmenko with farabee and frost and you're saying okay we're trying to get goal scoring because we struggle to score goals despite winning all of these games or bringing in two individuals who are going to hopefully have that goal scoring bump for our team and continue to push for the playoffs And we have a shot here to get some playoff dates. So I think it's a fantastic move.

And it's just whether or not Frost and Farabee can generate goal scoring. And if they can, then wonderful move. Because you weren't getting it out of the guys you had there. I think something applies with the Flyers that we used to say about the Arizona Coyotes when they were not even a team. they were just sort of a money laundering scheme um it's great to have all these picks you're not actually going to use the ball you can't even have that many prospects in your system there were i remember years ago the sabers i think were in the same position as the flyers are now where it's like you pick seven or eight times before you even hit the end of the second

round they're still bad you know it it doesn't always work so uh what i'm interested with the Flyers is I don't think they're hanging on to these picks now I think with the Sabres you saw them actually make all of those picks and what's ended up happening is they have a bunch of young guys and nobody else they have they've all of these great young players and they don't ought to play NHL hockey because they've nobody surrounding them and I think the Flyers with those three three first round draft picks coming up this year yeah they're perfectly positioned to be really good maybe not next year but the year after like this Flyers team is going to be a really good team for a long while once they get to that point where they have all of these nhlers

that they're using their assets to get like okay here i'm just isolating uh 2013 and 2014 for the sabers you get you have two first round picks and you use them on rasmus ristelainen and nikita zadorov uh jt comfer uh connor hurley and justin bailey are your second rounders okay womp womp and womp um i don't know how much jt con for accomplished as a buffalo saber then you have four second round picks the next year you get sam reinhardt second overall you managed to screw that up then your third your second round picks are brendan lemieux eric cornell vaclav karabacek and uh you end up getting uh jonas johansson in the third round like your odds of hitting on all those picks i mean maybe you have more confidence

in your scouting department than the sabers do which you'd probably be right yeah but i i don't think the flyers are going to hold on to those picks i you know maybe use four or five of them but they're going to trade some of them i think the flyers have aspirations to be better than when those picks would mature like those picks aren't gonna like one of the picks is the edmonton oilers pick like that's you're gonna pick 30th that's it that sounds like a trade deadline move right yeah It's like, okay, so you pick that player, and then three years from now, he's good. I think the Flyers' window is next season and the year after in terms of building this up to a competitive team.

Like, look at, you know, Matthew Nise, I think, is the second rounder that has worked out exceptionally well. Like, better than is reasonable to expect a second rounder to work out. This is his breakout season. He was drafted three years ago. So you make a pick this summer, you're not going to, they're not going to make a real impact in your roster until 2028? Yeah, Joseph Wall was the Austin Matthews draft.

That was nine years ago. This is his first year as a full-time starter. Yeah, they should send out these picks and get better quicker because they got a good little core going. And Torts might turn this team into a championship team. And Adam's going to be upset. Jesse might have nailed it. He hates Torts.

He does. I donate to him. And Dubas. And Dubas. Oh, yeah. Freedom. By the way, that Ovechkin question from last episode, People were very upset that I even asked it.

Pittsburgh, all of Pittsburgh were pissed. All of Washington seemed to appreciate it. I don't know why. So weird. Yeah, but you know, we're a split nation. Yeah. It's just so funny that you would needle the Penguins. It's never happened on this show before.

I think Penguins fans are being needled in the eye right now by the way the Penguins are playing. I told you this was coming. I was just the one that told you. Here, last thing on the Flyers. Jesse, it's funny you bring up Joseph Wall because you know what the Flyers could spend those picks on? A goalie.

and not drafting one because, no, that's going to take the better part of a decade. Trade them for a real, living, breathing human goalie. As of this morning, it looks like the Capitals are close to locking up their other goalie, Charlie Lindgren, 31 years old, breakout year last year, still pretty good this year, $3.5 to $4 million. You don't want to play torts?

Oh, I guess we play torts. Yeah, yeah, let's play torts. This is, okay, well, now you know about the Washington thing, but whatever. Did you forget about the thing you were doing? I did, I did. And this is after, remember, Torts and Mitchkoff had a screaming match with each other on the bench. But I actually really appreciated this because I think Torts kind of nails it here.

Whether or not he's the guy to do it, he kind of nails why he's doing it. Here you go. Like I said, I've said all along here with him, we are so far ahead of the process. They show the footage in this. Oh, sorry. So pull it off, and we'll just listen to the audio. There you go. Stupid in here this year.

And that continues, even tonight, tonight's process. It needs to be we're trying to teach them how things are done, how things are done here, the things of understanding conduct of a pro, all the things you do to play. uh so yeah i'm not going to get involved in the situation i i someone on the bench tonight i'm not going to give you specifics but you may not believe it but it's for the right reason because we care about him i care about him and where he is in the process how far along he is in the process and i'm not going to fail him uh by uh carling away from situations that people may second guess

or whatever it may be. We're going to do it the right way with this kid because we think he's that special. So it's my job to do that, no matter what happens. And he's right. Great answer. Great answer. No, like, what, is this the first time we've ever seen a coach

have a screaming match with a player? In Toronto, that'd be like, oh, nothing happened. I don't know what you're talking about. That's never happened ever. Coaches and players hold hands and go to each other's Christmas parties. No, like, this is his boss going, hey, man, that sucked. and i expect more but he's also saying he's way ahead in the process as in he's better than we even expected him to be of course well and like think of how frustrating it must be for both

people to matt vey obviously has something he's trying to convey and he can't or he's struggling to and torts same thing and he can't and he's struggling to think of how difficult it must be to learn in that environment or to teach in that environment that's a big reason why they made the kuzmenko deal uh so i mentioned i'm gonna move on from that charlie lingren obviously three to three and a half to four million bucks seems a great reward for a guy that really it took him a little bit longer to break out and he seems to have found a really good home in in washington and that will be those two goalie contracts six million and four million in a couple of years the caps are going to spend like eight percent of their cap against goaltending like that's that's

good planning man that's the first contract that we've heard of since this announcement and my first instinct was well Lindgren's your backup now and that's kind of a lot for your backup oh wait a minute no it's not and a lot of teams do not have two good goalies and you need it and you need it the days of goalies playing 70 games are over so you're gonna pay nine and a half between nine and nine and a half percent of your cap for your goalies which seems reasonable as long as they're good and they are so go for it no it's no problem there the caps don't make a ton of bad decisions lately eh interesting that it coincides with them getting the folks at cap friendly yeah interesting interesting uh kevin weeks uh listen brant

Clark being scratched for two games in Los Angeles would not have been huge news outside of Los Angeles. And you have to remember, Brant Clark, 21-year-old defenseman, leading LA defense in scoring this year. He started hot. He's been not as hot. And that is what a 21-year-old is in the NHL, frankly. That's every 21-year-old unless you're generational. But it wouldn't have become a story if Kevin Weeks hadn't speculated that maybe they might be moving him to which everybody said that would be insane you would have to be on every drug to move that player so is that Kevin Weeks just stirring it up a little bit you think I don't well what on because Rob Blake has has told insiders he's not moving what on earth could the Kings possibly get that would help them

now for brant clark but i don't no no no no no the whole uh allure and you know that we talked about at the beginning of the season is like well now these young guys are are gonna have to carry the team because drew dowdy's out but the whole uh allure of having this young decor is they get to now learn hockey under drew dowdy that learn hockey at the nhl level under drew dowdy and the second he gets back you're gonna move one of them nah it doesn't make any sense to me this is i think they're only gonna get better now that dowdy's back it's really annoying isn't it it's extremely good team missing one of their best players ever franchise icon for the most of the year still has good season comes better than every everybody thinks and then he

comes back and is playing 25 minutes a night doesn't look like he's missed a stride like get out of here uh john clingberg guys with with grant clark um i think it's it's a lot less nefarious than uh anybody's trying to make it out to me it's a kid who's in his first year of the nhl and he's been playing a shit ton of minutes uh to start his career he was not great defensively the last couple weeks and really throughout the entire season he's been great offensively but defensively he needs to work on his game and i think you have a head coach who's pointing at the rookie saying this isn't acceptable for nhl hockey i'm gonna sit you down for a little bit and we'll get things going on a lot of uh you know teams that are at the bottom of the standings

you might expect to see a young player play every night and okay whatever you just have to play through it uh that ain't the kings right they don't need to do they're trying to win games they've been back-to-back uh back-to-back uh shutouts uh they've been shut out back-to-back games which is the first time in like a couple of years that's happened they've gone eight straight periods without a goal like they're clearly reeling and they're they're looking for for something they had some success running 11 and 7 so i think there is an argument amongst king's fans to keep clark in the lineup and you take out a forward because uh i think there's a there's a couple forwards you could probably sit down for a little bit over clark but i don't i'm no i don't

think anybody's looking at creating another brock faber situation with the los angeles kings which for for those that don't know context brock faber was a a draft pick of the los angeles kings i yeah he his pick drafted trade they drafted him and then they traded him wasn't like they traded the draft pick and then he was drafted no he was a prospect in their system he got traded to minnesota and now he's brock faber and i don't think they want that again they have that was the fiala deal right yeah yeah they have they have uh they have turned out some pretty good defensemen like i know everybody's like well the leafs drafted jersey yeah but who developed them la developed them brock look at what he's doing utah brock faber and a first round pick that the wild used to select

liam ogren for kevin fiala now kevin has been he's been fantastic for the kings yeah i'm there yes but you look at brock faber and you say what's the what's the upside yeah the long they're like the new ducks right the ducks were like a factory for good defenseman for a long long time um boy that's a spicy meatball that's that's an expensive trade that's rough um did you guys read the zadorov story for whatever reason the zadorov contract extension was talked about in that globe and mail article and i i kind of well the one that they couldn't get done okay because because you know the Canucks defense is thinner this year much thinner than it was and I I left it out and then it and then Dan Milstein tweet or put an Instagram up about it because he's like why are

we still talking about this six months later so here's what happened uh uh at the end Zdorov this is a quote from um uh Rutherford at the end Zdorov was talking close with Talkit uh while Patrick Albine was talking to his agent Talkit would ask him what's it going to take to keep you here and Zdorov said he would have to get his contract to $5 million annually. Then he'd be set. So we got him to $5 million. Then we were told there was no deal. So Rick said to him, what's going on? And then he said, well, if we can get up to six years, then I'll stay. Same process. So we said, okay. So twice in that process, he said he'd give me that one more thing and I'll stay. And then we gave it to him and then he goes off to Boston. So I can understand why Milstein's like,

what are we still talking about that's the joys of negotiation and also and if you want to you can do this on pugpedia there are tax implications where he will save more money going to massachusetts i just don't the the quotes don't make zadorov look great but the president like isn't that negotiating well it is negotiating and and negotiating as you know is always uh very polite and everyone's happy by the end right like i i it doesn't look awesome on rutherford to be airing that dirty laundry yeah also uh months ago the report was that they weren't willing to go to that sixth year and that they offered him the correct amount of money and that they couldn't agree to the terms on the years and because boston went to the sixth he went with boston right like

So somebody's not telling the truth because they said, like, Zdorov said he wanted to stay in Vancouver and he wanted the sixth year. And Vancouver, I think, only came up to four years. And I don't know, maybe they came up to that fifth, but he wanted that sixth. I have a thought. Trade for him. Boston might be selling. Oh, you mean right now? Hey, you could trade for him.

That's so fascinating. Get one of Pedersen or Miller and Zdorov is one of the guys going back. You don't even have to get. No, don't give Boston Pedersen or Miller. If you're Canucks, do not help Boston. Get Zdorov and Lindholm back. Oh, God. Make the money work.

No, I... Listen, I don't want to be critical of an exec actually giving us something spicy there. No, it's good. That's a great quote, but I just... I don't think that... I don't understand how that helps you at all. like other than you distract your fans from what's going on what i i don't understand it

what's the motivation there how does that help you down the line it just makes you look better i think doesn't it it might or maybe he's just responding to a question that was asked and being open because one thing cj said on the podcast on the cj show yesterday he's like i have to respect that uh rutherford felt like okay i owe even though everybody knows that miller and pedersen are um are at each other's throats i owe fans like a statement after all this crap and i do respect that most markets they don't feel like they owe you uh and they won't talk about it yeah okay goodbye yeah yeah see you later yeah so that'll be that'll be interesting by the way i thought it was interesting them talking about pedersen to buffalo

you know just it does make a ton of sense yeah well if you're buffalo like i know petterson has struggled but like yeah that would really tie the room together it'd be nice if buffalo did anything like i think they just do the this petterson deal for the sake of switching anything up because what they have hasn't worked for the last decade why not just try something might they consider planting some palm trees yeah their gm thinks that'll help um yeah dog shit organized well yeah right now yeah no it's bad no it is bad it's bad uh but it could be a lot better and if pedersen does go there i don't know if that makes them a playoff contender instantly but if you can get him back and you could get tage thompson you get tage thompson

back to 40 goals and pedersen back to 100 points uh they are instantly competing for a wild card instantly how close is cousins byram to getting the job done it's it it's been hiding in plain sight we kept thinking contenders yep um but no it doesn't need to be columbus is another name that's come up for both of those players peterson more than miller and i think man if they do that in season they might wait till the offseason but they did that in season uh that would be a heck of a reward for that group of guys yes i guess my question uh when it comes to miller and petterson it's always been articulated that uh the canucks need to get a center back and you're not giving that up if you're columbus because that's where you're strongest what you

need is a great winger okay are you giving up monahan no oh okay are you giving up your captain jenner like maybe i got like oh well then fan tilly right or her coal cylinder you know one of your is there a prospect you can dangle hey they got a deep they had a deeper system why not i think yeah but vancouver's trying to win now yeah right they're not in a position to take on prospect i wonder though guys if that if that changes towards the trade deadline where they go okay well because like okay and i'm gonna i'm gonna go to i want to talk about ranting in a second here and how these cap changes affect colorado and ranting and and caroline and all that stuff but if ranting in who is an animal and never has a down a down spell

like ever so good is gonna get you niches and uh uh jack jack drury right yeah uh i mean what can petterson get you have to remember he's on an extended cold streak he makes more money they're not even kind of in the same conversation in my opinion that's cool like like but i think we got to talk about no no i know but like ranting and i'm gonna i'm gonna say exactly what you just said but i'm gonna put them in more blunt terms pedersen makes more than two million dollars more than ranting in for uh seven more years like nearly a point per game less production um maybe not nearly a point per game but like half a point per game 0.75 points per game less production he's close to double like Pedersen's production uh Pedersen has been

a poor playoff performer Rantanen is one of the greatest in the entire league um there have been no perceived like attitude or work ethic issues other than that time he screamed i'll fucking kill you at alexander georgiev um which was crazy and didn't get talked about nearly enough it's a real thing look it up um i think if jim calls me up and he goes well you know they got that i cut him off right there and i go jim are you okay you feeling all right you got a fever like what's you think you think i'm giving you a comparable to martin niches and jack drury for a leas petterson what year do you think it is this isn't a couple years ago where that would have made a lot of sense you know a couple years ago we were talking about petterson like he was getting

ready to take over the league and it's gone in the complete opposite direction it's a fascinating they might trade both guys like cj even said it he's like they're open to trading both you're probably getting your ass kicked in a pedersen trade because you're not going to get near what colorado got for ranton and simultaneously he probably bounces back with the team that you trade him could you get some magic beans though with a couple of first round picks from the philadelphia flyers yeah i'll give you some magic beans patterson with torts though i don't know i think torts might kill him with like some sort of blunt object okay by by christmas of next season and my my next question segueing to that that trade um is is this gentleman

with the cap going up as much as it is and remember these are estimates right these are estimates so um there is a very very good chance that that cap goes up okay that even for the 95 and a half i'll believe you when i see it evan stop it you told me 97 you liar well you got 95 and a half that's not 97 so it's not 97 yet so he was right to be skeptical did miko it's an estimate yeah all right currently right now steve dangle is in the driver's seat i'm fine with boom i'm still nailed it i'm sticking i'm sticking with alan he's on position adam that's that's fine i'm gonna race is on sunday steve's and steve's on pole yeah but he drives he drives a a steak f1 car when it comes to this issue i'm gonna laugh his ass are you ready 97 is happening

whoa now it's happening and mcdavid will be a leaf all right uh no but that's my other hot take from this episode mcdavid will be a leaf um uh did colorado screw up yep because eat it drew because like ranted in okay again his cap percentage if he signs at 14 million dollars and the cap is between 95 and 97 million dollars right between steve and myself in terms of cap projections that is the same percentage the nhl released a number that's a lot closer to steve that no it isn't 95 and a half is not closer to 92 and a half no steve's number is just not 97 no his number was 92 i'm giving my number wasn't 92 i'm giving it wasn't going anywhere i'm giving Steve the benefit of the doubt that

he didn't believe it was 97. The system's rigged. And it's not 97 right now. So go ahead. Okay. Did the Colorado Avalanche, if the cap is, if the estimate is $110 million in two seasons, why

trade Rantanen? You could sign Mikhail Makar. You could sign Rantanen. Mikhail Makar is going to get so much money. He is, but think about that. You got Nathan McKinnon on a steal of a deal. if ranted its number was really 13 or 13 and a half are you really serious seriously telling me you couldn't get to that here's what everyone's losing sight of though um you can't just light

next season on fire and they wouldn't be all right how would they be lighting next season a car still in her contract now wait wait what's the cap 92 and a half no it's 95 and a half no no no he means this year right now yes it is yes 92 and a half yes so next year it goes up three mil and ranting in is asking you that is correct there you go so ranting in i'm usually sorry guys the the actual cap this year is 88 million that's the cap oh sorry yes yeah oh so the s 92 and a half was the four million dollar okay yeah start of the season price for next oh you're right about yeah okay well ranton and getting the raise he wants eats up most of that okay you're still the abs you're still the yeah and the abs have a lot of the same issues that the leafs do

where they really struggle to get depth scoring the difference is kel macar has like three times as many goals as the leafs entire decor um so true that's the big leg up they have um that advantage this is a little bit a little bit they they've struggled in net and they've had to make not one but two moves there right but they're looking at themselves going gosh every year we got to plug all these holes because we're really top heavy we're gonna make efforts to be a little less top heavy we're gonna see if they're right because niches helps them next season like they can go out and do some big game hunting yep in the office they might even sign ranting might even yeah a boat's a boat but the mystery box can be anything that's right um like

ranting it like bless marty niches who's a great great player people don't appreciate how fucking good miko ranting it is so i'm so again i ask i know it's no i i think the what they're doing here their strategy and not building a top heavy team that's loaded up with a bunch of high salary contracts i think it's a smart strategy i think with the the opening of the salary cap is probably even more beneficial to that because they have more even more room to work within that salary cap number like they're they're positioning themselves to add pieces because in hockey it's it's less effective that one man can can create a whole winning team right so you're at you're getting more opportunity to add more high level players and i i think it's a right strategy

to build your team either landis god comes back or i think they take a real healthy swing at jt miller yeah also the colorado front office isn't dumb they knew where the salary gap was going and they made this decision knowing that yeah i mean alan went on a podcast and was like here's the number i think if booger mcfarland with his calculators can can calculate everything he knows where the salary cap is going and it wasn't like he was in the dark on hey this thing might be 113 million in two years which is the estimate and and he made this decision knowing that also that blackwood contract kicks in next year like next year if they kept renting and next year was going to be very difficult

for the colorado avalanche and you know oh well then the cap goes okay well kel macar is going to eat up like six mil of that yep going from nine to like 15 in two seasons that's not till 2027 okay well there you go like it's they're making a they're making a conscious decision to limit how top heavy they are this team gets to be a stanley cup contender for many more years and i think you're limiting your window if you sign rancid and for a whole bunch of 14 million dollars do you think okay hey do you leafs go to july 1st okay marner's still a free agent randon's available i'd rather have miko rancid in the mitch marner and that's not even a decent mitch marner it's just acknowledging the truth of how cracked miko randon is as a club mitch

Mark Marner, fourth in league scoring right now, ahead of Connor McDavid. That's cool. Okay. Kills penalties. Yeah. Great on the power play. He sure is. Loves Toronto.

Cool. My evidence is watching Miko Rantanen play. Can I pose something that I think some fans out there are concerned with when we're talking about this cap? Hit me. Yep. 113.5 million dollars is the upper limit of the salary cap in two seasons right now yep three are we okay three seasons because this season's yeah it's three season yeah okay no because it's gonna

next season three seasons 104 and then 113 three seasons yeah small market teams who can't reach that limit are they being squeezed here and we are creating a system of haves and haves nots like in the old nhl when we didn't have a um a cap at all well this comes down to one thing but i'll you guys go ahead people forget that most of the haves were idiots and spent their money poorly and did poorly anyway like the rangers just going yeah we're gonna spend on every free agent forgetting that there's only one puck um and then not making the playoffs the leafs are like we're just gonna sign every old guy under the sun and you know they won some playoff rounds they didn't win though they didn't end up getting a cup like who really bought a cup like are we

really just talking about detroit here did colorado buy a cup like did new jersey buy a cup did the did the who won in 2003 that was the devils yeah the devils definitely didn't buy a cup sure they're broke like did the lightning buy a cup i'm trying to think of all the ones leading into the lockout um and then i don't know if you noticed this but detroit kept winning after they implemented a salary cap like i i don't i'm not worried about it there will be internal caps but there's internal caps right now anaheim's operating under one the coyotes always operated under one and it was called the cap floor um the the issue with the cap and i have said this many many times and no one fucking believes me is that the revenue sharing among nhl teams is not high enough

right you think that revenue sharing is like crazy good in the nhl people like well without the cap they couldn't survive no what's going to help the smaller market teams is actually the owners getting together and going we need to share a little bit more of this hrr and guess what the owners don't want to do that the coyotes when they were like the coyotes when they existed when they were breathing um their their their check from like the rich nhl nhl teams would be like five million bucks a year that is not even close to enough no and when you and this is why i've been an advocate of a luxury to hard tax system where if teams are going to spend in the luxury the nba what is it jesse it's like three times you get taxed two dollars for every one yeah but the

nba has ruined the the cap where they've created too many limits on player movements where it's essentially a hard cap now right yeah so i think there's a scenario where and this is this i think also works for the nhl as an entertainment product because if you have a cap system that's too hard you're essentially creating a situation where a lot of really good players are sitting the playoffs out if you could have some sort of luxury tax threshold and then a hard tax or a hard cap where teams who are really going for it that year spend into the luxury tax load up on talent and then all of that luxury tax money goes to the teams that lost money right goes to the teams that are the smaller market right goes to the winnipegs goes to the anaheims i don't know

who else like regularly loses money but those teams year over year lose money on their balance sheet while getting richer if you could create a system like that there's a great way to force the rich owners to spend money and then by the way what would be great is when winnipeg or or anaheim's good again or any of these other teams that balance sheet wise it doesn't quite work out and remember these teams are a tax write-off for rich people so please don't feel too bad for them The reality of the situation then becomes, okay, I'm forcing these guys to spend, but they're spending on players.

They're not writing a check to a team just because it's poor. They're writing a check to a player so they could bring them on. You get more star players into the playoffs for a better entertainment product. And the teams feel like, okay, well, I spend in the luxury tax.

And yes, that goes to the cheaper teams. But at least I got something for my money. Adam, I think we're avoiding the most important question. What is it? How do you take your coffee? uh two creams two creams okay i'm asking because you could always go back to radio you actually have talent i'm just some weird guy who like watches hockey and rants about it i need a job for when there's a lockout because these guys are idiots and they're not going to adam adam

please learn from history you're a history buff remember all those lockouts that's why i think there might be lockouts so i need something to do and i will go and get your coffee so i mentioned the upper limit of 113.5 million the lower limit is 83.9 million which is getting really close to our current salary cap is insane um i think fans hearing the news of the 113 there's some small market fans out there who look at like what the los angeles dodgers are doing in oh my god if looking at it like that get a fucking grit and i think and i think holy moly it could spook some good you know what you know what a cap going up for sure feel anxiety about it don't enjoy it don't get excited for player movement you know what i want the league to go back to when we did

shit all let's not put anything on these general managers to be creative to go out and sign good content no let's just fucking leave it the way it i can't wait for a dead deadline july 1st i want a bunch of fucking league men deals i'm so pumped adam are you fucking serious guys i i just i just wanted to say that some fans might be feeling that way and yeah if you wanted to if you wanted if you don't have to what will the owners do you don't have to mock them what will be cheap and have a lockout again out of the owners do i can't imagine oh what were the owners before broke they didn't give a shit they had a lockout anyway than they've ever made before do you not understand And guess what you can do with a lockout?

Even more. Instead of yelling at those fans, why don't you use it? I'm yelling at the sentiment, Jesse. Yes, use the opportunity to dispel their fears. Guys, when the cap goes up, it's 50% owner, 50% player. If the cap goes up to record levels, that means that the owners are making more money than they've ever made before. which means that the players therefore should share in making more money than they've ever made before that's the system so you can't you can't you can't give me this when the cap goes up

so what i'm a i'm a proponent of a luxury to hard tax i've always said that that's the way i feel and i know it would work better because it forces the rich or it forces rich guys to spend more money on actual things he's ramping up let's go what bothers me is that bothers that you'll so easily buy the billionaire line of oh we're poor guys i don't this is hold on steve hold on let me talk okay go nuts get after it this is a fucking tax write-off if my nhl team i own a corporation multiple corporations in some cases and i buy an nhl team because that's fun that's cool i get to show off to my friends. It's a great business thing. Oh man, I lost 25 million bucks on my team. I lost 50 million bucks on my team. Damn, what am I going to do? I could do what Fenway

Sports and Entertainment's doing and entertain another buyer coming in and buying a piece of the Pittsburgh Penguins. I can sell the team, capitalize on my gains and make an absolute fortune. Or I can run a bunch of expenses through taxes and go, you know what guys, i'm not actually gonna have to pay the amount of this corporation made money but my nhl corporation didn't so i don't have to pay any taxes this year was it a tax write-off in 1994 oh steve different economic was it a tax write-off in 2000 that's a totally different that's a tax write-off in 2012 steve stop why why it's a valid point that is when families owned teams and they'd own them for generations this is a completely different business climate so if you want to have a

discussion let's have a real discussion yeah that's not a real discussion why is that not a real because it's i'm using history as a precedent you're talking about teams when they were worth 50 million dollars uh you're talking about ownership groups that had no business other than owning those teams what ownership group in the nhl other than the wurtz family other than them bruins doesn't know they have fucking jeremy jacobs food empire behind and they've always had it that's my point steve you're not understanding when you have a bunch of billionaires they didn't make their money in hockey they made their money in something else and then bought into hockey right in 1994 that wasn't the case 1994 you had a bunch of family-owned businesses and they made

their money in hockey and if they lost money they lost it in hockey right the team the league was not well run that this is this is a completely different league you have a hard cap you have billionaires billionaires you're talking about expansion fees for the nhl in excess of 1.5 billion american dollars for the next two markets and it might even be higher than that and that's before an arena gets built guys adam this is a completely different set of and you're and you're arguing with me over a team spending an extra 10 million a season you're getting what are we talking about you're getting into the first of all rich people are cheap yeah this is like a get mad at your cheap ass okay okay so so if we're in 27 28 and terry pakula says i'm i don't

want to spend more than 90 million dollars on my players for this season which is what josh allen is going to be making that year which is more than the current salary gap but in he definitely has the money to spend 113 but he's choosing these like 90 millions enough for my team you know we're gonna spend that and the buffalo sabers are dog shit and they're losing let's say all of that scenario i don't know if this is gonna happen you guys might be good then and then the other teams the toronto maple leafs of the world are spending 113 million on their on their salaries and the fans there are upset that the nhl's created this economic reality where billionaires are being cheap and do we get to a scenario where the players and owners are fighting and we get to

a lockout like is that's not that's not possible i don't think so okay i think i think i think buffalo listen if buffalo continues to act if we're using buffalo as an example if they continue to act like that and they continue to not spend money they'll continue to fucking lose and their fans will continue to fucking revolt but and but the the value of that that franchise that he owns is still going up no matter how much money he loses year over year no matter how much losing the team does he's making money yes so no that's that's that's what i'm saying to my point is that if they continue to lose he's okay with it so that might be a reality where he continues to and that is where as fans you need to organize a little bit and you you need like like pirates

games that owner is the cheapest owner in all of professional sports and there is no cap zero cap in baseball i mean there's a luxury tax but it's it that baseball needs to fix their shit right the dodgers doing what they're doing is insane i'm not advocating for a scenario like that and i've been very clear about that but when you have like if a if terry pagula does that and i don't think i have a feeling that if buffalo starts to win he won't i this is this is literally hypothetical i don't i don't think his motives are in that realm at all because what he's done with buffalo you see like when there's an opportunity for a winning team like he'll be there then you're stuck to the building then you're stuck like the leafs were with a shitty

owner for a couple decades and you can't control that as a fan so you're asking so that would be taking an owner's poor decision making and applying it to the cap an owner who doesn't see that spending an extra 20 million dollars might get him a hundred million dollars in actualized value for his franchise if you have a winning franchise it's worth hundreds of millions of dollars more you guys get that an owner's poor decision making is what got us a cap in the first yeah but that they couldn't control themselves so betman had to put guard rails you're talking about yeah some owners couldn't control themselves some enough that it yard sealed a whole season okay but adam that was 20 years ago steve that is that's so not relevant to what we're talking

about because you're talking about an owner in the system that the owners wanted going i'm not gonna i'm just not simply gonna do that and if you do that fine that's your that's your prerogative as an owner but to take that and blame that on the cap system that the owners through a season away over is insane that's insane they broke the players union in 2004 they broke them yeah they broke them there are 30 players i can't even believe some of the names that are on this list that that absolutely torched the nhlpa destroyed it for an entire generation sold out a generation the nhlpa has not been the same until this year with marty walsh honestly yeah it's never been the same so we're gonna so we're gonna let the owners we're gonna let the owners go oh

it's 10 million dollars what am i 20 million dollars what are we fucking talking about here guys it means that here's the thing if the cap's going to that that means that television revenues are up that means that the new canadian deal is going to be signed that we expect between 1.2 and point point five billion it means that espn's deal is probably due and is going to go up tnt same thing these owners are going to be just fine and if it's if they choose if they choose not to spend that's their prerogative they own the team they will they will do that at every turn to blame it on the cap system that they implemented oh it's a problem for me now it's not about that it's bullshit it's their it's their problem it's their fucking problem and the place he owns is just

threatened to move the caps well yeah but that was never well yeah the flames uh interfere in every election imaginable yes they do and have uh you know the soft oh we might have to move the team they do that every so often every few months oilers same thing for a while there these guys at every turn will try to save a buck cool it's 50 50 what's it going to be then Is H.R.R. going to go 60% owners, 40% players? Is that what we're, like, if we're going to strike, or sorry, not strike, if we're going to lock out, what are we locking out over? I don't know.

I don't know. Well, you're the one making the argument, Steve. What is it? The cap is climbing, and it's climbing, and it's climbing, and it's climbing. It passed an imaginary line, and we're making more money than ever. Let's fuck it up and sit out a season. Adam, you're just not looking at this realistically. you're you know how much that season devastated the nhl they lost a hundred million dollar espn

deal in the nhl and they were not the same again for 20 years people are making the same money now that they were making in 2004 players are players are and by the way the team values went they saw the senators man the senators were purchased for like 80 million bucks so like this is this i'm serious like this is the owners if an owner chooses to do that it's not the cap's fault is my point i know that and if you think that the owners but i'm telling you they'll use it if you think the owners are going to go go to war over when they're making this much money there's no way there's no way i'm telling you that there's no way they're going to be like billionaires will not fight to be bigger billionaires i think you're missing i think i think you're wrong in the sense

that the better way to fight to be more billionaires is not to divide the pie even more it's to grow the pie it's to grow and and i agree the growth of the pie is spectacular yeah why would you why would you lock it why would you shut the league down by the way it's i think it's interesting that you guys are saying this and that you're worried about this when all these owners had to take money out of their own pockets and put it into their teams during covid i'm not i'm not worried about a striker lockout that's not i'm i'm i'm worried about just the have-nots and the and the halves you create with the giant gap in the salary cap we'll see if teams choose to create their own internal caps like more of them now that it's going so high because i know

owners are stingy at spending money on player salaries even though that's the whole reason you have this business is the guys on the ice i worry about the the competitiveness on the ice i think that the negotiations when the betman news came out about him retiring i i was outlining like okay the the retirement thing makes so much sense with batman because he's gonna finish out his tenure as negotiating the cba which is the negotiations are going to begin in they said hopefully in next month in february that's when they outlined in the fall when they would begin i think that's so much runway to complete them by the end of the 26th season when it expires and i think that's going to be his ushering away from the game you know he finishes the cba

negotiations he says look how happy those negotiations were here is the next era of the nhl and then he hands it off to the next commissioner and he sticks around for that last year the 26 27 season and that's his farewell tour with the next commissioner learning by his side which is probably going to be bill daly but hopefully not and i think that's how it's going to go and that prediction from me uh would it hinges on a happy cba negotiations and i think because of the economic reality of the nhl you're going to get a very good negotiation because everybody wants the money to keep flowing so i lock out or strike doesn't make sense in this reality you got to remember too here that the nhl in the united states is exploding it's growing

rapidly that was the point the whole time that's why they put hockey in california that's why they put hockey in nashville that's why they put hockey in florida that's why they put hockey in carolina like all those places and part of what happened in the late 80s and early 90s was no cap uh family run businesses in a lot of cases so they couldn't lose money right where it's different now and you've got a situation where uh there is a very i mean listen it's a very exclusive club to own a team you got two more franchise tags coming in the next couple years right we know it's likely to be houston and it's likely to be atlanta and then once they build that arena in arizona they're going to come back to and then that leaves they'll probably need a fourth right to even out the

conferences okay so you've got that happening and you've got so so imagine imagine you're in high school again there's about 30 kids in your class but all of them are billionaires all of them all of them are egomaniacs yeah all of them are braggarts yeah all of them think they invented money good word all of them all of them think like raggart you know what one of the things i loved from agent provocateur we we talked to keith olbermann once and he said because he talked about billionaires i said what is it like talking to these guys these team owners he's like they think that they invented money when in actuality they were just right place right time and the only billionaire i've ever seen back that up is mark cuban who said uh because they asked

him on a podcast once like how do you plan to be a billionaire he's like you can't he's like you're right place right time you grew up in the right era you grew up in the right location it's so many things have to go right there's no way that you could plan for it so all these guys don't think that they fucking did it or they their their dads did it and they inherited it therefore they did and so and maybe terry pagula doesn't care but there's going to be a lot of owners that are fucking bragging about how great their team is you think bill foley walks into an nhl meeting and doesn't brag about winning a cup bill foley is wearing he's tattooing that on his forehead i would they are these guys are competitive i would make my championship ring like a clock necklace

that I wear like fucking Flava Flav. What do you think Jeremy Jacobs was like when the Bruins won in 2011? You think he was a fun guy to be around if you're another billionaire? No. Good Lord, no. I think that, remember,

you have to remember that these owners are just as human as everybody else and are just as competitive as everybody else. So I think it's, you know, maybe the Samuelis in Anaheim are waiting for the team to be good again. But when that team was good, they spent a lot of money, right?

Compared to the cap. They were a cap team. I don't remember. It's been a while. It has been a while. I think that if you're worried about that, you shouldn't be. I understand why you are. Totally different economics.

And barring a bird flu pandemic, which, you know, once every hundred years, why not twice? I think that we're looking at a situation here where most teams are pretty comfortable within about $10 million of the cap. And I think that puts them on pretty even playing fields. Right? also your cap floor would be what at at at uh i i had they released it what was the cap floor if at 110 million what's the cap floor it's not 110 you keep saying that it's 113.5 oh is the 27 28 so i'm sorry that's the upper limit and the lower limit is 83.9 okay that's a big that's a big gap yeah that's a big gap i you can't this is why it's good not to have the coyote

You started the conversation. No, Jesse, that's not what I'm saying. I know, it's just funny. Okay, well, stop taking it out of context then. Guys, I'm trying to tell you, there's nobody in this league that's spending it the floor anymore. Nobody.

Nobody. Just wait till they do. Even the Ducks got Truba and his entire $8 million contract. Right? And the Columbus Blue Jackets were let off the hook because of the Goudreau situation and they had to kind of climb their way back to the cap.

Remember when the Ducks deferred on Vetrano? no reason I can point out. I think the reasons to defer are obvious. It's lower cap hit, man, and no penalty for it. I don't know why nobody's doing this. The Ducks. The Leafs did it with McCabe. I was like, defer more.

That makes sense. The Leafs are a cap team. Listen, I'm telling you, I'm telling you, don't feel worried about this. The NHL and its owners want to make more money. Do they make more money by stopping the product, or do they make more money by continually growing the product

by doing what they're doing right now and getting a couple new franchises, which they don't have to share. Those franchise tags get split up with all the other owners and none of the players. That is 0% goes to the players. I just want the league to go 20 years

without a work stoppage. I agree with you. Which is something they haven't done. That would be really bad for our business. I'm with you on that. Adam, if you threw a Molotov cocktail at my face i wouldn't i think it'd be reasonable for me to not trust you to not do that

for what if i did it i'm gonna say 20 years what if i did it twice in 15 years oh well then i'm done with you i think most people would be like you know what that old adam wilde's a real molotov cocktail face thrower listen i know i don't care for it i know i get heated about this and i know it annoys people not bullshit but i'll tell you this there's a reason it's because it's not happening stop worrying about it um the upper limit right now 88 million the lower limit right now is 65 million that's a 23 million dollar gap by 26 27 the gap between the upper limit and the lower limit increases to 30 million dollars that's where i started this conversation there's a they're increasing it by seven million dollars

on where the lower teams can spend to uh in comparison to where the upper teams well then maybe it's on the owners to go guys uh we gotta we gotta spend more to create parity to create parity you gotta spend more adam i think your your gut reaction when i read the lower limit was oh that's a big gap i think that's it's a bigger gap than should be allowed i think that's a failure on the nhlpa side how could they have allowed that that percentage that's ridiculous that's where i started this conversation that's a that's a that's a pa negotiating problem i think and that's when you have poor leadership and uh a group of guys who fucking walk out on you when things get tough like they did in 04 and 05 uh yeah that's what

happens so i think there is i think the feelings are valid for a team like calgary who's spending i think like 70 million currently on yeah but they're a cap team and they're good they are they are but they're they're sometimes when teams like that from around the league i'm just throwing out examples uh might choose to be 30 million below the other teams and then we might get into some epic tanks in the future of these uh here's what i got for you on though the capitals are spending 100 million this year the abs are spending 93 the islanders are spending 91 leaf spending 91 canadian spending 91 hurricane spending 89 the canadians 91 is carry price still they still have to pay them that's true it's true they still have to pay them yeah i guess

i mean what's the capitals one they've got some sort of they've obviously have a lot of money on ltir um backstrom blues senators are spending over the cap right now now there's ltir in there but my point is my point stands there's already teams spent into 100 million bucks and a lot of them eight to be exact not eight sorry to a 90 million and the cap's 88 i think we're gonna be okay kids we'll be fine i hope so oh stop what i hope so okay fine i've said my piece i leave it for now i will i will approach this again next january listen all i have been taught over like you're looking at this like this is great there's reason for unbridled optimism and i just do not have the bravery or strength to have that to look at anything the nhl does

and go this is gonna be great forever like that's fair i don't have it i don't have it because they've scarred me when i plug in to google.ca 113.5 million dollars usd to cad you get 164 million holy shit the the canadian dollar being absolutely atrocious right now isn't helping any of these canadian teams so every time they announce the cap is going up i i think the jets shed a tear yeah like a team like the jets where it's like hey you want to be a cap team chess you're you got to pay your player salaries in usd but you're making all of your local revenue in cad quick question quick question uh now do 1.2 billion american dollars into canadian is this my salary no what is this this is the new tv rights deal 1.7

$1.7 billion Canadian dollars. So divide that by seven teams. Right. And then take 20% off or whatever. All right. That's too many steps. I'm talking about just the... That's too many steps.

What I'm telling you is TV revenue is going to follow with this. Yeah, it's $248 million. The 1.7 divide by seven. I'm talking about the year-to-year, I should say, reality of those NHL teams is going to suck a little. Especially if you're a team like Winnipeg, where we've got to pay everybody in USD. They're also getting their TV revenue in USD.

Yeah, but our local ticket revenue and the sales. Yeah, okay. And again, I go, how much is the NHL a gay-driven league anymore? It's a suites-driven league, and it's a TV rights-driven league. The suites are in CAD. They are. The suites and the advertising. And the suites in Ottawa, Winnipeg are always going to be low.

They just are. And the advertising you've got to sell during the commercial breaks for for rogers and all that that's cad right but amazon doesn't really care no and your regional rights holders rogers and uh rogers and bell they're gonna make what they're gonna make amazon's not in the business of making money for this no they have other ways of making they just want you on prime god yeah yeah they're looking for so with all this news it's currently illegal I think it's important to state that, but I think it should be legal whenever your billionaire owner asks for tax dollars to build a new stadium.

I agree with that. To kick them in the balls. It's not, I want to state that's an illegal thing to do. Because what is that? You can't do it. What is that? Illegal. Corporate socialism.

Oh, yes. But I want to live in a world where it's legal to kick them in the balls for even suggesting it. I agree with you. I think that should be the penalty. Like a running windup. I am 100% on board with that. That is so stupid.

I cannot believe that. Like a goal kick. Yeah, or they get 50 years of tax breaks. How about that, huh? 50 years. Kick in the balls. How about that? 50 years, 50 kicks in the balls.

One for every year. That's what you should get. Well, so do you get the kick in the balls for suggesting it, or do you get the kick in the balls, but they get the deal? Oh, no. You get the kick in the balls as a lesson to not ask me anymore. Oh, okay. Because you're wrong for asking.

you're an asshole for asking you're a piece of shit just lining up the Calgary management group kicking them all in the balls just all the citizens of Alberta like Rinaldo just right in the nuts what they deserve

love it it is illegal currently should we start building that arena in Calgary I don't know have they broken ground on it I think I saw I was trying to Google it here. They had some.

Oh, yeah. They have a time lapse shows first month of construction. So I guess they are doing something good for them. That's great. Yeah. It's about freaking time, man. Calgary needs it. I wish it had been funded by the Flames completely.

But hey, July decided. It's tough when you vote to get kicked in the balls. July 22nd, 2024, they broke rounds. That's good. adam do you want to be called out by the internet oh i'm ready let's give it to me okay let me call me out i know i'm gonna get the presser s d p the steve dangle press conference i know i'm gonna get it from certain fans of small market teams but you guys don't need to worry i'm telling you just telling you worry about other things state of the world this is the

steve dangle podcast from a couple days ago i tried to bring something up and adam wilde had a rebuttal and this is what went down uh-oh the steve dangle press conference um big stretch and you shouldn't leave things up to me oh okay next time i'll just be like jesse hit the button yeah smack it yeah no uh give it a good spanking you made the topics for the show include the press conference if you want it i do want it do you guys care that the utah hockey club got rejected for using the name yeti yes i had this story but i read up on it and they just have to challenge it because it was rejected because there was it the patent office said it might cause confusion which is such a bureaucratic bullshit way of going why i'm i don't have the authority

to say yes or no because yeti uh is also a uh like you know they have the yeti cooler mugs and they you know i listen i know well that's why they can challenge it my nose is i said they can by the way every day i read some sort of story about a politician or a judge and i'm like where the fuck do we find these people hey steve you understand now a little bit why people are listen maybe it's misdirected but people can be a little upset with the government for stupid shit someone's gonna show up to a utah yetis game and they're gonna look down at the ice and be like why aren't there a bunch of mugs on the ice the yeti brand what are you fucking stupid the risk that you would take if you're the yeti brand and you and you have the the traveling mugs is if something

bad happens with the utah hc or vice versa let's say the yeti mugs um they have a they have a a compound in them that turns your face gray or purple um then then the worry for both brands would be could their brand negligence affect my brand is that reasonable not at all but that is the kind of stuff they get into google stanley cup and see what comes i know i know it's not going to be the stanley cup i know it's going to be does anyone get a say in that pink glittery cup that holds way too much water like more water than you need in a day anyway we spend money on the dumbest fucking shit jesse how do we interpret it a little differently as a species jesus christ i think you they run i got very upset about this yeti the brand the mug brand sells things like

t-shirts that simply say yeti and it's hard to go to market in a world with copyright when there's already a brand with that copyright on a t-shirt so like it's hard for the utah yetis to sell a t-shirt that says yeti on it when that already exists in the land so who is a yeti t-shirt i can buy it they they make clothes and stuff yeah you wear a shirt what did i do wrong our our discussion about the utah yeti uh i think should have been taken a little bit more seriously no oh because it it happened yeah it's ed the thing of an alarming lack of time the thing that uh i think was a little bit dismissed by our panel here uh steven adam uh actually came to fruition and the utah the the yeti brand the cooler brand did stand up for their right to protect their

copyright and now utah must choose between mammoth and outlaws or hockey club and yeti is off the table forever yes and it's because they chose not to challenge it but i was right they could challenge it i think they they did didn't bother they they they went and they tried to get the copyright and they shot down and they they felt that they didn't have enough lawyers and backing to reverse it i mean there is a time issue here too yeah like if they don't get this name hammered down in the next i don't know a couple months like they they probably don't get it you got to go with hc another season yeah and jerseys in time and they what did the conversation start with the coyotes like when did it really it was like wasn't it marty walsh at all-star last year

we're getting awfully close to like the year anniversary of that and then it moved very quickly from there in our eyes because it had been 20 years of are the coyotes going or are they not and then then they couldn't get the jerseys done right because where didn't they fly the coyotes players into utah like right after game 82 it was very shortly it was like in april it was surprising and they still could yeah so you're right they got to figure it out so jesse you were correct there you go does he i don't know if i was correct golf claps or you were just wrong like golf claps no that counts okay that counts too good all right there you go we're done that's that's the press conference yeah i think uh we're out of time oh okay all right well wait here think

of a good question is it outlaws is it mammoth oh yeah which one you're picking mammoth mammoth right mammoth yeah we're all in agreement stanley cup mammoth gram the steve dangle podcast follow the guys on twitter at steve underscore dangle at adam w y l d e and at jessie blake connection complete don't you wish you could just hit skip on the worst parts of your life you know the same way you can skip an ad i get it i'm siaya and i live in ice cove i've made some questionable decisions that didn't end up the way i planned and today i'm still figuring it out somehow things usually get worse before they get better apparently that's how i roll. So bundle up and come along for the bumpy ride. Don't miss the new season of

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