The Team House - Little Bird pilot Greg Coker on being shot down in Iraq, Ep. 74

Episode Date: December 25, 2020

Greg Coker was a AH-6 Little Bird pilot with the Nightstalkers and saw action in Iraq and Afghanistan. This was one wild episode as Greg tells us about how he joined the Infantry and then become a helicopter pilot flying Cobras and Apaches before assessing for the 160th SOAR. After 9/11 he deployed to Afghanistan as a fire support officer and had some hair raising experiences. Then came the invasion of Iraq, where he saw serious action at Haditha dam conducting gun runs for nearly a week straight. Then Greg tells us about how he was shot down in 2004 by a surface to air missile. He recalls every microscopic detail of the 8 second crash. After a Delta operator pulled him out of the crash site, he helped them raid the compound where the missile came from and continued to engage the enemy. Get access to bonus segments with our guests: https://www.patreon.com/m/TheTeamHouse NEW! Team House merch: https://teespring.com/stores/my-store-10474963 Team House Discord: https://discord.gg/wHFHYM6 SubReddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/TheTeamHouse/ Jack Murphy's memoir "Murphy's Law" can be found here: https://www.amazon.com/Murphys-Law-Journey-Investigative-Journalist/dp/1501191241 The Team Room Reading Room (Amazon Affiliate links): https://jackmurphywrites.com/the-team-room-reading-room/Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-team-house--5960890/support.

Being a parent can be really challenging. Child and Family Resource Network focuses on connecting pregnant parents and those with kids under the age of five with free support services to help them on their parenting journey. Everyone deserves someone they can turn to for help with parenting. Visit child and family resource network.org today. Being a parent can be really challenging. It's normal to feel uncertain about whether you're doing the right things

to raise healthy and happy children. That's why Child and Family Resource Network focuses on connecting pregnant parents, and those with kids under the age of five, with free support services to help them build confidence in their parenting journey. Everyone deserves to have someone they can turn to for support with parenting. Visit child and family resource network.org today. Hey, everyone, welcome to episode 74 of the Team House. I'm Jack Murphy, here with co-host Dave Park.

This is a little bit of a different episode. We normally live streamed. This one is pre-recorded since it falls on Christmas Eve, and all three of us have other things. things to be doing on that particular evening. But we wanted to be committed to getting out an episode this Friday for you nonetheless, so we approve recording this one with our guest here, Greg Koker. Dave, you actually read Greg's book.

Yes. It was a phenomenal book. So the book is Death Wates in the Darkness, right? Six guns don't miss. Correct. And when you say six guns don't miss, what is a six gun, Greg? Well, there's a bit of a story about the six guns, and that's, I was in B company, first, the 160th. There's A, B, Charlie Delta, and First Battalion.

Well, back when they had reconfigured after the desert mishap in 1980, and the 160th was formed, and they were training to go back with all Army helicopter pilots and gun pilots. The gun guys were flying AHs. They were in the desert. Pardon me. And a couple of AHs landed, and Colonel Beckwith was standing there. Well, they carried two. We carried two mini guns, one on each side of the aircraft.

And Colonel Beckwith, the pilots got out, and they were all dusty and dirty. And he says, man, you got to. look like old gunfighters from the old west. So from now on, you're going to be known as the six guns, just like the two pistols that they carry back in the gunfighter

days. Right, six chambers and the little birds have their guns have their guns have. Six barrels? Yeah. Six barrels. Yeah, six barrels. So, great, well, to put it

very mildly, you were a pilot, with the 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment. And that's the small of it. But, Greg, before we get into all that, something you may not know about Jack and I, as we are big comic book geeks. And to us, you are the real-life heroes. Like, you are the superheroes.

And so every hero has an origin story. And we would love to hear your origin story. Who were you growing up? what drew you to the military, you know, just anything that you want to share with us? Sure. Yeah, I think we all, we all have a story and it's pretty interesting in our organizations and specifically Army Special Operations. And I always said that, you know, somebody should just study this because you have all these men from all over the country that come to one very small, very small, very, specialized units. And it interested me as to, okay, why did we all, you know, this is where God put us.

That's why. And, you know, I tell everybody, and I talk to guys later, I just hit me like a rock one day that, you know, this is God's path for every man here. And when we are being knitted in our mother's womb, says in the Bible that our path is laid out. And that is one of a warrior's path. And that's how these warriors come together. I grew up, you know, just like pretty much everybody else, chasing critters into the woods. And I worked on my uncle's farm and ranch and cowboy and rode courses and, you know, horse hunted and fished. I was a child of the 60s, so to speak, and the Vietnam War was going on at that time.

My father was in the military. he retired after 30 years but you know that was the television war and I can remember that was also the helicopter war so I always had this inspiration or calling to fly helicopters I mean they just

I wanted to be in the military and be in the army and again that was you know that was my calling to go do go forth and do so and so that was that was your path now did you did you go into the

Army as a pilot was there a pilot program at the time did you go in enlisted how did that work? Yeah, good question at the time, well, for a very long time the Army has had from high school to flight school for the Warren Officer program for the United States Army to fly helicopters

and I went in, I enlisted first and I just my father, you know, told me, this is probably the best path for you. This is what I recommend. So I enlisted and I was in the 101st and the 3-27th Infantry. There at Fort Campbell, Kentucky for almost three years when I applied for flight school. And I had an old, our brigade commander was Colonel Ralph Hagler.

You may remember that name. And so he was very, he was a very integral part. and, you know, helping my path. I looked at going to 275 Rangers because Colonel Hagler had been the 275 commander when they jumped into Grenada. So he was pulling me kind of that way. Yeah.

And, but he knew I really, really wanted to fly. So that was, yeah, that's what it did. And got accepted to flight school. Okay. And how long was flight school for a warrant? I mean, I'm sure it's probably the same for a Nosser, But when you go into flight school and it's helicopters, like, how long is it? And what's the basic course there?

Yes, sir. There were three tracks that back then in 1989, 1990. There was a scout track. So those guys flew 58s. And there was a lift track. So they were Huey's. Black Hawk was coming on. It was online.

And then there was Chinooks. And then there was a gun track. Well, I wanted to be a gun guy. I like shooting stuff and blowing shit up. So that was just a natural fit for me. And I tracked in the cobras during flight school for the gun guys. We had the longest period. It was exactly one year from the day I started to the day I graduated and left.

It was a little bit shorter for the lift guys because they don't have to learn ballistics and shooting and range operations and things like that. And so you went through flight school for the gun. ships and then where did you go from there? What was your first duty station? My first duty station was in South Korea in the 517 cab. And we were at the time for the deployed aviation unit and MEC unit, we were right up by the border and that was our mission was to fly the 37 parallel, I believe, the North-South Korean border. And yeah, it was a really good tour for a brand new junior

aviator. And we flew mountains. Of course, it snowed. So we got cold weather ops. We got overwater ops. And put a lot of night vision goggles. And we had a real world mission then. So yeah, it was pretty serious. It was a good tour for

a young gun pilot. Yeah. Now, were you aware of the 160th at that point in time? When did that come? Yes, sir. Yeah, I I can recall, and I'd see the little loaches. Now, Zach Campbell, and we'd just come out of the field, the 327th. We'd just come out of the field one time.

And we were sitting back there. I was cleaning weapons or doing whatever. And these four little birds fly by. The route was right there by our, you know, where our headquarters was. And I said, hey, check out those little black helicopters. And Optuars looked over at it. He's like, shut up. Those don't exist, you know.

Like, well, I said, I think I'm going to fly one one day. He's like, shut up, Coker. Come back to work. You're too stupid or something like. I can remember his name and find him now. So for our viewers, most of our viewers are aware of the different types of platforms. But for our viewers or not, can you describe what a little bird is? because it's very, it's very unique.

Yeah, yeah. I'd be very interested to hear from an actual little bird pilot. Like the, here's your little bird familiarization class. Yes. Yeah, good. And people get confused because I say, well, I flew little birds. They're like, oh, the 0858. I'm like, no, it's, I don't know what that is.

But it's a civilian helicopter. And it grew out of the old Hughes, McDonnell Douglas Loach, the 086 from Vietnam there. in great, great helicopters. And, of course, they have their history flying in Vietnam. And that's what the unit, when they first formed in 81, that's what they selected. Some of the guys were, we're still Vietnam guys around, you know, flying Army helicopters.

And a lot of the, you know, everybody came out of 1001st and very aviation heavy at the time. Just great, great pilots and leaders and commanders. But what it is today, it is a civilian MD 530 helicopter. And we buy them from, I think it's Boeing, Hughes, McDonald's, Douglas, whoever owns them now. But that's the old, Mr. Hughes, engineer developed,

put that helicopter together, and he wanted a survivable airframe. And that's where it got its egg-shaped from is what we call it. He knocked the tail boom on. off, it looks like an egg. And then the way it's engineered, the different areas of airframe in it, and it just forms of protective capsule around the pilots if it rolls.

And I'm here today to tell you that it works. So we'll talk about it later. We definitely will. Yeah, and I mean, so when they say it a little bird, it really is little. Like people who have listened before, there's room for the pilots and room for your ammo and pretty much that's it. That's it, right.

And there's another version in a company 160th, the MH6s, the MH, their mission helicopters. They have the plants on the side or customers, you know, get on the side of them. They can take three on each side and then a dog or, you know, something that they need for the mission. And that's how those are configured. So there's two little bird companies in the 160th, and they're at that point in. Yeah. And you were on one of the gun platforms. Could you talk about the armaments that can be loaded up on one of these aircraft?

Sure. And kind of back to where the aircraft comes from, they purchase them commercially. And then they go up to Bluegrass, Kentucky. They get reconfigured with mill standard radios, our armament systems. and now I flew the J model. Now we have the M model and the difference is the J had a five-bladed rotor system. The M has a six-bladed rotor system

and a four-bladed tail rotor system which gives us more lift. So we can carry more ammo and gas or people. So it was a and we have a glass cockpit. So aircraft really been up here a bunch since I've left. But I did fly the M on a couple of tours before I retired.

Arment-wise, they get an armament system put in them. And then our standard configuration are dual Dylan M-134 minigons. They fire 4,000 rounds from in each, and then two seven-shot rocket pods. We generally carry 10 or 17-pound mark 66 rockets. That's our standard configuration. So that's about 132 bullets a second when you pull a trailer at 762. And we'll get into all the advanced technology that you guys use for as we get into it.

So tell us about applying to the one. Did you just do the one duty station or did you do another sort of conventional side and then go to 160th or how did that work for you? yeah when i got back from flying cobras i had tracked into apaches and went right just as desert storm was starting is when i got home so i hauled tailed a fort rucker and started to go through the apache transition because i thought you know there was there was going to be a need for apache pilots and i was assigned to the 101st and then you know the thing was over in like I don't know, six, seven days.

So they kind of throttled back, regrouped, and they had a short course for us that were there. Then they just, we went back to the standard. And I flew 864 as a first and 101st. At the time, Lieutenant Colonel Cody was commander later to become Gerald Cody. And, yeah, I was there for about two and a half years, and then I assessed for the 160th and 93. What's the difference or the primary difference

for whether it's the mission or the setup between a cobra and an Apache? Well, the cobra is just, it's an older airplane frame. It's, you know, 60s technology. A single engine has a 20 millimeter cannon on the nose, and it carried tow missiles, and then 219 shot record plots. The Apache, of course, was advanced technology. It's two engines, 30-millimeter chain gun, still 219 shot rocket pilots

health fire missiles so those those were the big changes that both are great great helicopters and the folks that fly them they're just they're awesome gun pilots so up to some ground forces that have worked for them yeah so what was the process then for

applying to the 160th and how did that go for you pretty much your resume for what you've done up until that point and I was I was somewhat of a junior aviator. I was a pretty young W-2 and at the time the standards to apply to the unit

was 1,000 hours of flight time and 100 hours of goggles. I only had like, I think 600, maybe 50 hours of flight time, but I had over 200 hours of night vision goggles. We flew NVGs a bunch in Korea

and then we flew them a bunch in 101st. So, So, you know, I think they weighed it, and I had a couple good friends of mine there, unit and B company. And, you know, so, yeah, I sent them my packet, my resume, so to speak, and they look at your flight time, what you've done up to that point in your career. And, you know, I think, hey, they said, let's take a chance on this guy. He's got double, you know, the night vision, you know, the night vision,

got all the time as most guys do when they come here. So I got picked up for a number. assessment and went and assessed the week long. Oh, man, it's pretty tough. It's pretty tough. Was the assessment flying? Was it physical? Was it mental?

What can, if you can tell us anything about that? Yeah, let me, let me think without giving too much way. It was extremely physical and it tested you, it tested you physically, emotionally and mentally. And it lasts a week. Yeah, you come in and UPT and a bunch of other things. And then your final, for the pilots, our final day is our check ride. We're giving a target, depending on what company you're going to that are little birds, hawks, Chinooks.

And then you're given a target and you have 0.4 hours, I think, to plan it. Yeah, then you go out and fly with your IP that doesn't say a word to you, the whole fly almost two and a half hours and, you know, you're like, well, then the next morning you have a formal board and they, you know, they watch you the whole week and all the different things

that you do during that week. And, yeah, the Reginald Commanders there, the unit sites there, your IP, other IPs, more officers, senior warrants from the unit. And I think Randy Jones was there at mine if I remember correctly.

It's very intimidating, so to speak, and walk in. Of course, you're in your Class A's, and you knock on the door, and they yell at you enter, and walk in, present, and then let the beatings begin. You must have been Well, though, because you got in.

And so you've flown Cobras, you've flown Apaches. So you're fully mission qualified. They just give you an airframe and go, okay, you're good? No. Oh, no. No. You start all over again in the unit. I mean, it's a process.

And you have to work with, you know, all the different customers, and you have to learn their ground scheme maneuver. And we had several guys that were, you know, former infantry guys, rangers. So, you know, we have a good background on what's going on on the ground. Well, that's something that you have to teach everybody. You have to work with different colors at the time. And it's for the AH guys, it's about two years to get up to FMQ to fully mission qualified pilot.

So you're in, you know, you're a BMQ when you get there, based mission qualified pilot. And then he spent the next 18 to 24 months training to attain that FMQ status and then you're a combat ready attack helicopter pilot. So what's teaching the guys to shoot to the standard in which we shoot? Right, which, so

so when you went in, you went straight to Littlebirds, can you, you can go that route straight to the 86s? Yes, sir, well, I was, a gun guy, so that's the natural progression. You know, the lift guys, the scout guys, they may go to Aco or they may have a guy, you know, they'll ask you, you know, what you'd like to go fly. And I told them, I'll go fly hot air balloons if you want me to. You know, just give me some hair grenades.

I can drop on the bad guys and I'll just float over them. So, yeah, that, back then, that was a natural progression. And for Cobra, most of the guys were Cobra Apache guys in B company, because you already had that background and ballistic and, you know, shooting. And it's, it's, it just takes a lot, a lot of training and practice to, you know, to shoot to the high standard which we shoot. And so what's the difference in terms of your function between basic mission qualified and fully mission qualified?

Are you right number two? Are you not, if there were a war? Are you still, are you the co-pilot? How does that work? Yes, sir, you're usually in dash two, what we call it, or the wingman in the left seat. Or we'll fly both seats because you've got to train in both seats and fly from both seats. So you get, you get about equal time in both. And you'll, you know, they say that the hardest job in the Army is flying dash two in B company

because your whole mission in life is to protect lead. lead will always have two season senior fnqs in the front aircraft because their job is to positively identify that target and engage that target so dash two you're setting back and of course every pilot has their technique and how they want to skin it but your whole mission in life is to protect the lead so they can get in there and shoot that target plus or minus 30 seconds Now, you said that when you went to the Apache, that it was, you know, modern technology. And I imagine there are all kinds of gizmos and gadgets. Then you go to the world's, you know, prestige aviation unit, top, you know, top of the top and into the little bird.

And tell us what that technological leap was like then, going into the little bit. Well, it's going back About 50 years There's not a whole lot of technology In that helicopter And that's You know, the more technology you get, the more they break It is what it is with helicopters

More electronics, things like that We still, you know, the aircraft still had the old We call them steam gauges We had gauges to look at, not LEDs And screens and glass and, you know, those aircraft just weren't. They work all the time. We have the best crew chiefs on the planet

and the best armor personnel on the planet. And, I mean, I wouldn't have to pre-flight an aircraft. I'd go out, jump in it, strap it in, crank it up, fly away. Not ever worry about it because they're just, their professionals dedicated to their jobs. And, you know, they care about us. So now you talk about Being able to shoot to standard and I think that

Anybody in the special operations community who's who's ever worked with age six knows how precise You guys are on target What a feat that is But isn't that just a matter of letting the little Moving markers line up you know the lasers and the digital things line up? Like you got a lot Yeah, you're a whole And you're, no.

How do you aim in a little bird? He's a grease pencil. I'm not kidding. And every gun pilot has their spot on the wind screen. We take a grease pencil, Army issue, one each. And you put a little dot up there. And some of them have pretty intricate. You know, they'll have stadia on it.

And actually, it's ghosted in the cover on my book. And if you guys have picked it up, they're like, Hey, man, that's a pepper. We call it a pepper. So that's another thing in the learning to shoot is placing that pepper at the same exact place every time. So you know when you pull the trigger, you send a rocket, it's going to go where that pepper is. And that takes, you know, again, is compounded in shooting this helicopter, you know, at the standards in which we shoot. And we shoot pretty close to friendlies.

and they have great trust in our abilities that, you know, they know that if they get in trouble, that we're coming in and get pretty close to them if you have to. Very close. Yeah, it's a great, pencil marks. That's it. I mean, we've tried all kind of gizmos and huds and sites and red dots and braces. But, you know, Fred Horsley, I think, said he was a former B company gun guy that, you know, the mind's the fastest computer on the park.

planet. And, you know, it's, we're good using the grease punch of mark. That's amazing. That's amazing. Yeah. I mean, are there guys who go to 160, especially, especially in the assault side where, you know, you have to have that kind of precision that just, they don't have the hands of a surgeon. They just can't quite line it all up and get it. Sure. sure in my tenure in beko probably saw

I don't know eight seven eight nine guys you know make it to the company but they just they just couldn't shoot I mean some of them you know were sent on to flash nooks or the Aco or you know good good

officer soldiers aviators that when we when we get on in the terminal area on the objective it looks like a fur ball if you've ever seen a shoot I mean, we're breaking and shooting and yanking and banking, and it, you know, how it potentially get a person sick if they're, you know, they're just not used to it. Well, that was one of the things that is unique about your book, I think,

is that it reads, many parts of it read, like a literal action movie firefight, that two guys, that opposing forces would have on the ground. You know, but you are every, bit as active and in the mix as the ground forces are? Yes, sir. And, you know, the AH guys, we have to know every element of the ground force. So if it's the Rangers maneuvering or the SMU maneuvering or whatever, but we have to know because we have to know where every soldier is on the battlefield before we can pull

a trigger. Right. You have to. So that's another thing that, you know, takes time for. for guys to learn is, you know, hey, you know, we're going to maneuver this side or that side and this team's going here and that team's going there and that company or that fire team. And so, man, it's, yeah, it gets a little bit busy up there on the objective. Greg, I, we're watching out for them.

I got a question real quick. I'm just curious, how did you see that grease pencil mark at night under night vision goggles? It's pretty easy. It will make it a little bit bigger, you know, at night. I mean, it's probably, mine was about the size of a quarter. And, you know, you put it up there. And it was, mine was 21 rivets up. And then over the inside of the left pedal.

And I knew that every time, I mean, you check it and check it and check it. So when all the aircraft were pretty close to the same. And yeah, so that some guys use a tape measure or a string or get that pepper right there at the same place every time. That's amazing. Yeah, the guys, the guys really shoot. It's incredible to watch them. So you're at the 160th. About what year is this when you get there?

93. 93? Okay. Yes, sure. Yeah, the guys were in Somalia. Okay. And that all went down. And?

I was in Green Platoon. Okay. Was that the training platoon? Yes, sir. Okay. Yeah, then you spend another, the gun guys about eight to ten months again because you're teaching you're teaching us how to the new guys how to shoot to their standards which takes time so well and is it just a shooting

are they teaching you how to fly in ways that maybe the the the conventional army frowned upon absolutely and the airframe's completely different there's You know, there's no hydraulics in the helicopter, whereas every helicopter you come from, the controls are hydraulically assisted. So, you know, you have, it's a hard airframe to fly. It's all fly by way. No, it's just levers and bell housings and, you know, you say, here's my hydraulics. So no power stream is what you're saying. Yeah.

That's awesome. Yeah. But it's an extremely. difficult aircraft to fly and learn. It's just very, very responsive. I always try to explain it to folks. This is the Lamborghini

of, you know, the Ferrari of helicopters. I mean, it's very, very maneuverable and that's small. Rutter diameter's 27 feet. So, you know, we can kind of calculate, okay, yeah, like, fellas landed to pick up

those guys in small you that battle of a lot soon that day. If I had three, four inches on each side of the Durham main road, you know, they're incredible. They're just great, great helicopter pilot. So between 93 when you were in Green Platoon and then 2001, what was your life like at the 160th? The opt-tempo is extremely, and you're always training. You've got three Ranger battalions that, you know, you're constantly, training with and then the other

special operations mostly you work with the Army Special Operations units and so yeah you're I think I average like 290 days a year KDY yeah that's a long long time up until oh one

yeah we're always learning and developing and a lot of you know the things that go out to the regular army or to the Marine Corps to anybody that flies helicopters we you know we've done research and development and General Upmacher talked about

a bit on his visit that, you know, we, yes, we do those things and we want to make better cockpits or better gear, better whatever to help survivability you know, everybody out there. So, you know, it's

cost a lot of lives in early days of the unit when, you know, they were trying to figure all this stuff out. Thank God. They, you know, they made us better. I was pretty much the second gen, I guess, the end of the second generation. And it wasn't just you're flying, but because I know, and we'll get into this when we get into, like, your first deployment to Afghanistan, but you learn fires, like, you learned the full gamut of it, correct? Oh, yes, yes, sir. You know, you're an expert in fire support, because, again, you have to.

to learn. And you're just a close-knit family because you work with all the fire supporters and all the different colors, green, red, and whoever. And yeah, I mean, you're, they're like brothers and then you get to know the ground

force and other units because once you're there, you never leave and you stay there. So you build these relationships and this trust, so to speak. And of course, you hack on each other and we make mistakes. things that aren't so right

but not only do we not only shooting but it's learning the standard for navigation in that aircraft and that's where the map encompasses the clock that's it no GPS no electronic devices and you have

to you have to become an expert at that because our standards plus or minus 30 seconds on time on target every time and I've seen guys back in the old days, guys had crashed helicopters to make that plus or minus 30 seconds. I was like, oh, Lord, what are we doing? You know, but hey, we got, I got to the target.

You know, the deep brain. Like, man, you're almost late. Like, no, I made it. Okay. Let's get those tree branches out of the skins or the wheels or, you know, whatever. But, yeah, they're very dedicated to that mission and to the ground force. Yeah. Why does depend on it.

Yeah. It's funny because you mentioned when you talk about the fire support, you mentioned green and red, we get to talk about the fire support from blue too here when we get to your first deployment. Sure. Yeah, that didn't turn it out so well. Yeah, so your first deployment, can we, can we, unless there's anything in that, in that time, any notable things that you'd like to talk about, we can either talk about those. we can fast forward to Afghanistan.

Being a parent can be really challenging. Child and Family Resource Network focuses on connecting pregnant parents and those with kids under the age of five with free support services to help them on their parenting journey. Everyone deserves someone they can turn to for help with parenting. Visit child and family resource network.org today. Being a parent can be really challenging. It's normal to feel uncertain about whether you're doing the right things

to raise healthy and happy children. That's why Child and Family Resource Network focuses on connecting pregnant parents and those with kids under the age of five with free support services to help them build confidence in their parenting journey. Everyone deserves to have someone they can turn to for support with parenting. Visit child and family resource network.org today. Sure, no, that was, I mean, our time was spent staying razor sharp and being prepared to, you know, font, anything that might come up. And, of course, there were many times we were, you know, we were like, come on, man, this is it, this is it, we're going.

I mean, guys would not take leave because they were afraid they might miss something. Yeah, the beep would go off. You're like, oh, man, no, I can't, I can't do that. Especially when you've been there. Yeah, very. Plus years and, you know, you've been training all this time and you're waiting, waiting, waiting, I want to do my job. Yeah, and I always told guys, be careful what you wish for.

And then 9-11 came. Yeah. And we were busy. We were extremely busy. It was good. It was good. You were with your brother? You got to go out and kill bad guys every night.

So what's better than that? So tell us what happened on 9-11, not on 9-11, but what happened with the 160th after the events of 9-11? Yes, sir. We had, I was at Fort Campbell. I believe we had a range that day. So Range 2-9 is our other home. That's our exclusive use-only range there at Fort Campbell, where we do all of our shooting and customers come out,

and we train there for, you know, three to five days at a time. But when we're home, we're shooting probably two to three days a week to maintain those standards. And, you know, I always said that shooting is one of the most perishable skills a human has. Now put in there flying a helicopter, hopping on the radio, listen to the radio, and putting the bullets where they're supposed to be, every time.

So we had two groups out. One was O'Connes. One was on the East Coast. And I was in the gym that morning. I went in a little late because we work at night and we're not on the regular Army schedule, so to speak. So we're going to get a workout in. And I was on a treadmill.

And the guy that ran the gym there at Campbell is a Homer Seal. and really, really good dude. But he walked in and all the TVs were off. He said, hey, I think you need to see this. He turned the TV on in front of my treadmill. And I see, you know, this tower, clear blue 22 and burning. And I'm like, what in the world happening? He goes, I think an airplane flew into it like a small fixling.

And I go, well, as an aviator, you know, I'm thinking, how in the family do you do that? One of the biggest buildings in the world, and it was just a few seconds later, man, here come the second one. And my beeper went off. And so, yeah, I hauled butt out to the airfield. And we started, you know, getting kicked together in our load out. And we didn't know what was going on.

We had no other than what was being reported on TV. Then we did get word of another plane hitting a Pentagon. and then another plane going down in Pennsylvania. And so we just, yeah, we just started our routine, getting the package ready to go wherever we were ordered to go. We kind of had an idea, I think, you know, it was going to be Afghanistan area. And so we completed our planning,

went out to Fort Bragg a couple of times to do planning out there and then came back and we had our mission and we were going to Afghanistan, so we put the task force together. And I was out at Fort Bragg, our last planning meeting, and the fire support officer from Delta had just left from B-squatter was the Ups quarter, so we were all going together. And Colonel Switter was a Delta Force commander at the time and approached me, and he says, hey Greg, he says, I'd really like for me to come over as a fire support officer for the passports. And I was like, I was like, sir, I'm an A-H guy. You know, I want to go shoot people. And he understood and I understood it.

I was, I was honored and, you know, for him to ask me to do that. So I'm a good friend, Leon Hanson, was the FSNCO, Fire Sport, National Commissioned officer from B Squadron. and we've been buddies for a long, long time. It was a, yeah, it was a good crew. I mean, it was, of course, the guys that didn't want to chose to go. They were a pokey face because everybody wants to go get it on. Right.

I mean, you just do. That's who we are. That's what we do. So that's got to. So you are going to Afghanistan as a, as a fire support officer, as a fire coordinator, and not as an H. Sixth pilot at this time. That's correct.

I was, and my commander told me that I would assess and, you know, given going on missions with the AHAs. Also, I was an FNQ. And, uh, but yeah, he's, he's like, hey, man, he's the right guy for the right job at the right time at the right place. So guess what?

You're at. Yeah, you had been there eight years at that point in time. Is that sort of middle of the road or is that kind of a senior position at that point in time? For the fires. Well, no, just for you, I don't know how long pilots, what their longevity there is. So with you being there eight years, were you one of the more, more solid season guys? Yes, true. Yeah.

One more senior guys. So. Yeah, I mean, you, guys, been 12, 15, 16 years there. Yeah. So, yeah, that's your home. And I'm not, I mean, a lot of people probably don't know this. but being a helicopter pilot, especially sort of in the types of airframes you guys were in and flying the types of missions, it's hard on the body.

A lot of hard landings, a lot of compressed spines. I mean, it's as hard on the body as being on the ground, being in the infantry or whatever. Yes, sir, I'd say so. I mean, my kit weighed 60 pounds that I wore in combat. We always flew with our kit and our plates and best. And any time we live fire, you had to wear it. Yeah, it's good training. And especially the new guy, it'll teach you more to put stuff.

Of course, we have SOPs. You know, this goes here, that goes there, so I can reach over when it's dark. And I know there's a magazine or a turnic or a radio or whatever the case. And so, yeah, especially wearing night vision goggles on a, you know, in a helmet all those years. Everybody gets the knife stop of neck, so to speak. And, yeah, it's hard on backs and knees and shoulders. And one more thing before we move forward is when you talk about going to the range and shooting, and then you mentioned, you know where the magazines are,

you guys would carry your M4s actually engage with M4 sometimes if need be, correct? Yes. Oh, yes. Yeah, we might have dropped a grenade or two out of the cockpit also. Yeah. Yeah, for those of you have seen a little bird, kind of just look one up, but they're open inside. There's no doors. There's nothing. It's just, yeah, wide open. So you deploy as the fire support coordinator. And where did you guys go? And what did you spin up for? Yeah, we went to Massera Island. It's a small island there off Oman. And it was ironic. I think I'd said to the battle. staff there one evening that hey you know what it was I don't know 20 years earlier

when Colonel Beckwith then the Delta guys departed from the same airfield go do Desert 1 and we were departing to go into Afghanistan and some terrorists so we stayed there

I'm sorry was there a specific terrorist that you were going after at that point in time I've been Laden and his crew Okay. Yeah, Jerkawi, or not Zarqawi, but Omar and, yeah, Ben Laden. And, yeah, just whoever was out there looking for a fight, that's who we went and got it wrong with.

So very clear, very clear mission statement. And what was the first mission that you guys flew out there? Well, my first mission as the fires guy was to go and, Reki the route that the Chinooks were going to take. They were going to launch off a ship with Delta for our mission.

We'd been conducting missions for some time prior to 19 October 2001. It was Rhino, Gecko, 375 Rangers did an airborne combat assault on the Rhino to secure that landing area

and then of course, Kecko or B squadron went in We had thought that Omar may be there and maybe bin Laden. So that was our first target there west of Kandahar. And, but I had flown several missions to reconnaissance the route that the Chinooks and the Daps would take to the target. And cleared them and picked a route for those guys. And, of course, went to the ship with it and made sure they were all. all good with it.

They were. So yeah, cleared it, cleared drought all the way into the objective area on both, both objectives. And, yeah, so we just planned off that and went from there.

And I, I did several more missions just to set the conditions in the battle space and engage targets, you know, any targets that we could find, all just all over that southern desert in the Kandahar over all

the way west to Alaska Gargau Do you mind Do you mind tell us a little bit about Gecko because that was quite a read

in your book and I mean from the briefing your unwelcome guest if you want to tell us about that and we don't mind throwing shade

at blue here at all we do it all time yeah oh goodness and really sort of some of some of what happened on target what what you did like if you don't mind walking us through it yeah that

well there's always mr murphy he always raises his ugly head and it yeah burp but i mean we we did our brief we did our plan we did her brief went a couple trips to the ship you know final stuff with leon and and the guys out there and then i came back and So we took three five AC130 U mall gunships. Three were going to, having tasks organized, three going to get-go, two going to Rhino to cover the rangers.

And then we could use fares and backups, you know, somebody broke. So we had to get fuel and to do the mission set. So we had some airfield. force tankers were to meet us over a point over the ocean at this very specific time and it was all time driven mission is so there were no we get on station there's no tankers

and I'm like oh crap there's no tankers and there's no tankers and we're like you know this is a national strategic mission and you cannot we can't afford to be late because the schnooks were taken off from the ship. A lot of pieces. I had like, I don't know, 80-some aircraft that were going to be overhead, bombers from B-1s to tornadoes and F-16s and B-2s and B-52s. And I just, oh, I was just beside myself.

So we all get on the radios. We're calling, we're calling. And so they were late. And they finally showed up. and we were like we were behind i think it was close to 35 40 minutes that's a long time but we had several hundred miles to make it up and i finally got i was talking to the aircraft commander on the on the lead tanker and she wanted me to verify who we were through challenges and The hash words, I'm like, look, ladies, what are the chances of five AC130s are going to show up at the same place and you're late?

You better give us gas or we're going to shoot you down. I ain't can. So we back and forth, so we finally got our gas. And the nav, I mean, everybody on that AC 130, we were doing calculations. And I was at an E6B, Bill Wizz wheeled it. Pilots used to figure fuel and burn rates and times and, of course, the nav. He was on his computer. I think the Foco, the fire guy, he was on his, and I was nugging numbers because I got to a point where I'd have to call the flight and tell them to drop kicks.

You know, I didn't want them holding over Indian territory, you know, bad guy country in Afghanistan. So there were a lot of things. There was a lot of stress. And of course, you know, we're calling back to the jock and giving them updates. And they were calling quite a bit. And I was like, hey, let's just give us a few minutes to, you know, work through this. And I believe we either got a, I was praying for a tailwind. So we could gain some time, gain some airspeed along that route.

And sure enough, the aircraft commander, we were lead AC 130. and he says, hey, man, I'm going to put the pedal to the metal, you know. He hammered those engines, and I swear he was running in the red for a long time. But we made up our time. And, you know, I got to a decision point where I was going to have to call the flight of Chinooks. And tell him, hey, you're going to have to hold, you know, in route or whatever the case. And then drop kick to TOT, time on target there to the objective. Plus the Rangers would have to, you know, drop kick and hold.

I mean, it was... You also had an unwelcome guest, right? Or a surprise guest, I would say, on this way. Yes, or somewhat. He was a fighter pilot. He was the T.F. Blue, the SEAL team, the fires guy. Nobody had ever seen him. We hadn't been to any planning missions or the briefs or he just showed up at the AC 130.

going on Michigan night and of course I was giving him a hard time and the guys on the aircraft were an aircraft commander old Swede and he was he got the name from being a big big dude

you know and he told him hey you're just sitting that corner over there and don't say anything and so yeah that was you know we were we were kind of concerned about that and another strap hanger so to speak I'll just say it and yeah and we later on that night though it we almost had an extremely serious incident because he jumped in on the radio didn't have any situation awareness as to what was going on you know he hadn't been following the battle and uh yeah i'll just tell you he called in some i think it's four f-18s to drop bombs on a target reference point that was right on the route and uh, you know, I'll just tell you he called in some, I think it's four f-18s to drop bombs on a, on a target reference point that was right on the route.

of the Chinooks, and the Chinooks were coming out of the target. And I heard something. I was talking and listening, and they were exfilling at that time, and it had been a very successful mission so far that night, other than the aircraft having multiple bullet holes in them. Being a parent can be really challenging. Child and Family Resource Network focuses on connecting pregnant parents and those with kids under the age of five,

with free support services to help them on their children. parenting journey. Everyone deserves someone they can turn to for help with parenting. Visit child and family resource network.org today. Being a parent can be really challenging. It's normal to feel uncertain about whether you're doing the right things to raise healthy and happy children. That's why Child and Family Resource Network focuses on connecting pregnant parents and those with kids under the age of five with free support services to help them build confidence in their parenting journey. Everyone deserves to have someone they can turn to for support with parenting.

Visit child and family resource network.org today. And I'd heard something, you know, cleared hot or I can't remember the exact burbage, but, you know, for sure one was a fire pilot. I kind of looked over to the right and I could see this guy's mouth moving. Oh, man. And I said, hey, who's on the, who's that on the net? And the guy said, shut up. I'm working.

I said, the Chinooks are coming out. And I glanced at my, and I knew that TRP, I glanced down at my map, and I just, I jumped up, and I said, knock it off, knock it off, ceasefire, ceasefire, ceasefire. I put out on all the nets. And I heard the lead fire bomb pilot say, Roger that, knock it off. But yeah, the guy was working a bombing mission, and the bombs would have dropped on those six nooks full of Delta operators. And you had a friendly chat with him at that point?

Pardon? You had a friendly chat with him at that point? Yes, it was a very two-sided friendly chat that I had with that young man. Yes. True enough. Read the book if you'd like to read the real story. Yeah. Read the book.

Yeah. That wasn't very friendly at all. I wasn't a kind chief. Yeah. So, and also definitely read the book because the detail that you go into about that whole operation, the level of air, the ground force movement. I mean, it is staggering what's going on and how much area you're controlling and how much scunnion there, like how much ordinance was dropped on that objective that night. It was unbelievable.

It really was. I was just, I had a, you know, a couple moments or a combat pause, so to speak. And, of course, said prayers for the guys going in on the objective and the guys flying in that, in that nasty, nasty environment. It's, you know, one of the most dangerous things we do is take off. and land. It was always browned out. And we've had incidents and accidents. It's just, it's hard. And, but yeah, I was, you know, I was very honored to be there.

It was the longest aerosol ever conducted in the history. Guys flew over a thousand miles at night. And just to the target, not to conclude, follow on and getting back to the ship. That was a long day. Yeah, were your brother age six pilots? Were they up in the air and flying that up? No, sir. They just, we didn't have the legs, you know, to get us there.

Of course, we tried. We came over. They were contended, you're like, hey, we can land on C-130s, you know, and push out and be on target and preparatory fires, and we can take the outer perimeter. Yeah, the boss said, no, we're not going to do it. So you were the first one amongst your peers who actually got some got into the action then? Oh, yes, sir. Yeah, I had a good friend of mine, Jim Hose, he was an A.H pilot there in B Company,

and I told him when we came back from Bragg on that last trip, I said, man, he goes, what's up? And I said, well, I've been tasked as, you know, the T.F. Sword, one of the fire support officers. And he was like, dude, I'm telling you, you're going to be in the middle of that stuff before any of us see anything. I'm like, no, I don't believe so. Well, he was right. He was right. So what was the rest of Iraq like for you? Are there any notable operations that you want to talk about?

In Iraq? I mean, Afghanistan, I'm sorry. Because the second operation was in Lashkar, Guy, correct? Or the second operation? Yes, correct. Yeah, sorry. Yeah, the big. Yeah, Major Drew. our major

and they didn't our focus we had been lying on the run and had some locations for him and we the AHAs got into the fight

after that and they were going out pretty much every night and I flew submissions on that and we picked up I guess notable

we picked up Mr. Karzai first time and brought him back and and took him back to do his thing with the Northern Alliance. And, you know, of course, from the North, we were in the South. You know, fifth group was up there kicking ass and taking names.

And, man, those guys, you know, they just did an incredible job. And now we pretty much went into the battle space and killed the bad guys. That was our mission that had been given to us. And it was 22nd SAS and the task force forward and then the task force to the north with the fifth group. And I tell folks that I even made the statement, I said, you know, we did in nine weeks what the Russians couldn't do in eight years. Yeah. Literally. We did.

A very small, specialized group of men. Yeah. There were nights when between the ground force and your air assets, I mean, hundreds of Taliban fighters and AQ. fighters, like, just swacking them. Yes, sir. Yes, absolutely. It was a good time.

Bad people. Yeah. And there was an incident, was it last year, where everybody was assigned an officer as a supervisor, or was that that particular operation? No, no, that wasn't that. It wasn't that one.

No, it was that one. No, sir. I think it might have been. It might have been. Yeah, the opt-in last regard. That's correct. Yeah, that's true. And how did that come down?

What happened there? Because people who are not familiar with the military won't really like this, but people who have been in the military will completely understand the lack of logic that went into this decision. Well, and you have to understand at that level, the commander puts full-phase of confidence in the warrant officers. We are the subject matter experts. flying and planning and working with the ground force and whatever the case and there aren't very many commission officers

so we're kind of under the old H series where a major is a company commander not a captain like in the regular army the platoon leader is a captain in the 160th not a lieutenant but then there's two captains and then a major company commander and the rest are a war officer so

and the other thing is to put it in perspective is that I think at that time I'd have to go back and look, but there are probably only about 18 or 20 FMQ pilots combat ready pilots per company. That's not

very many, dude, man. You know, it's really not. If a guy gets heard or something happens, then, you know, we just really have to double up and make sure things get done. So,

we, our first mission out was out to, like you said, out to Lascahagha. There was a bunch of mechanized and there were tanks and there were Taliban, there were Al Qaeda, training camps. I mean, it was target-rich environment. And again, I was out in the AC, you know, several times a week and engaging targets and setting conditions for follow-on missions. But so we had, we had planned an attack mission. we had

the location of some forces out there between Kandahar and Lasharga Lashargaas to the best and so at the last minute the commander decided to put a platoon leader in the team

so it booted a warrant I mean and our guys were I don't think I think one was FMQ yeah he was an FMQ with the others were

BMQ. So Ed didn't sit real well with the warrants. You know, this is serious business and we're the subject matter experts and we're the professionals and we're the ones that need to be flying these missions. They're dangerous.

Sort of like when the S3 is in the chalk for the jump, for the airfield seizure. Oh yeah, you know. Yeah. They're the Intel guys sitting in the jump seat of the Chinook or whoever. nothing bad on the intel guys.

Was it last regard where you won the air medal with the V? That was, no, that was Canterhaar when I was with Jamie Weeks. Okay. That was my first combat mission that I flew with Jamie. Yeah, we ran into, it must have been a, I don't know if it was like a remain overnight site for Cali Kong, as we call them, man there was there were several in there

I'd gone down like a little draw and look you know we're out hunting we were just west of Kandahar and it just looked like a good place tactically to me where dudes would be hanging out or vehicles and yeah if we found them probably 60 to 80 guys so yeah we and then our

we'd split just to cover more terrain and the other a h went coming to the north of us and they were They ran into a bunch of guys up there. Yeah, and Jamie and I ran into several. I think they fired probably, I know at least three or four RPGs at us before we kind of figured out what that wishing sound was

because one of us had been out there doing the deed and then a 12-7 opened up and a 14 opened up. And then we were like, uh-oh. Time to go to work, boys. Yeah, so, yeah, we killed all around. Shot some of them with their rifles. So they have anti-aircraft. That's what you're talking about when you're talking about like 12, 714, right?

They have anti-aircraft opening up on you. And instead of saying, okay, we need to get out of here, you say it's time to go to work. Yes, yeah. It's time to go find them and kill them. And you did that. That's what we do. That's what we do. Yes, sir.

Yep. Yeah, we did. So what, I'm not sure how much longer your deployment in Afghanistan. in was or if there are any notable moments you want to talk about or tell us about? No, sir, it was, I mean, for us, and we had pretty much gotten word that, you know, our next priority would be Iraq. Okay. So we're going to, you know, jump out of there and then start the planning process for our

next mission, which was, you know, Saddam's realm and his hierarchy and then WMD, or you know whatever the case was so we knew we we got home and yeah immediately started the planning process for that that next operation okay so you start that planning process you find yourself moving out in in February March sometime around there of 2003 yes yeah yeah we went out south Southwest where the terrain was very much like Iraq or that part of the world is we had mountains. We had desert. We had, you know, all sorts of nasty terrain out there to operate and train in.

So, yeah, we continued that for several months and, you know, I had a good plan put together. And it was all, of course, we operate at night and all under the cover of darkness and away from, you know, prying out. so to speak, or whatever it may be. Yep, we prepare for deployment in February of 03. Okay. And then where did you deploy to? We deployed to R.R. Saudi Arabia and up there northern,

kind of north-central Saudi Arabia, right on not far from the Iraqi border, from the berm there. And that was us. I think we took eight, we took only, AHs to OEF for Afghanistan and we took eight AHs to Iraq just so we could cover all the three Ranger battalions, Delta and all the others that we'd work some with fifth group for that

planning process so we wanted to be able to provide enough fire support for those forces that needed us at that time and RR was probably an oasis right a Oh man, yeah, it was swimming pools. It was on call breakfast. It was, ah! Yes! Yeah, indoor gym, you know, great cow hall. No, it was none of that.

It was, we got on the ground, of course, you know, we're Army guys, so nothing's there. And we find some old ratty tent that was roll up in a ball and started setting it up. And, you know, it was, of course, it was dark. We landed and put the aircraft to bed and prepared everything PCI, pre-combat inspection to make sure the aircraft are locked and cocked are loaded weapons are good to go

and that's always our priority and we'll finish our part crew chiefs armate dogs they're still going over the aircraft making sure the weapons systems are all good to go. We had Gal 19s the 3-Berl-50 Cal also so that's just another tool

for a toolbox or a kickback that we can deploy. And, yeah, so we started making a home with the Rangers and everybody else that was camped out there at RR. and started our planning processes and we had to have a planning area and a briefing area. So those were first to go up. So, yeah, it was a good time. So it was Iraq where you earned the... the title as the world's greatest counterpuncher.

Yeah, I'm sure it was. It was. I earned a lot of, yeah. Go ahead, Dave. No, so, so was your first big op there? Was that Haditha Dam? Or had you done things prior to that? Yes, for our first, our first big operation,

it was pretty much just the AHs. We had Our D-Day was 19 March where the rest of the force was 21 March So we went out We hit Vizobs So visual observation post, radar sites

Open those corridors For fast movers And the main force That was, you know, getting ready to attack on the 21st So we spent those first two 19th and 20th We were out every night

Four teams, two AHS each and then other special operations forces were moving north and just all over looking for scuds or any of those potential targets that could hurt us or hurt the attacking force when it started.

When you're... I'm sorry. When you're out in a little bird, I mean, you're very exposed, right? And you're out there, two birds or four birds by yourselves deep behind enemy lines. Do you feel vulnerable or do you feel like, do you feel like you're fast and low and hard to hit?

Like, what's the sensation that you have? Well, it's dark. That's the first thing. I mean, we're our night and stockers, not day stalkers. So bad things happen to us will we go stalking in the day? But no, it's, you know, we use the terrain. We use our speed. We use our training.

and whatever we can to make sure we're successful. And in our teams that went out, we configured. So we had an MH with us, little bird, and he had a flare pod on his bird. So we went back in time. Being a parent can be really challenging. Child and Family Resource Network focuses on connecting pregnant parents and those with kids under the age of five, with free support services to help them on their parenting journey.

Everyone deserves someone they can turn to for help with parenting. Visit child and family resource network.org today. Kind of. And the old pink team is from Vietnam. So a scout and a gun. So, you know, a roach and a cobra, or two covers. He would go out front and use the flare to, you know, positively identify hotspots and targets.

And, of course, we were on our maps and everything was checked and double-checked and triple-checked. And then we had some, we had some A10s overhead. So how we configured them. And I, I love the concept. But so we weren't, you know, really by ourselves. I mean, we had other folks there. That was the other reason for the MH little bird that, you know,

something did happen to one of the eights and they can land pick us up and take us back to our art. so we would shoot the target and gauge the target and then when dash two would break off the trail ah the a 10s would be tipped in their gun run and as soon as we were clear and they'd start hammer out with 30 or drop a bomb

because that's when we're most vulnerable is our brakes trying to get back around and they're pretty quick I mean they're only a few seconds but still there were some very large compounds that we hit. And here that gun go off, it was just warm and fuzzy. And I'll never forget their call sign was Shina. They were from a Texas guard unit. And, yeah, so they were very great guys.

We were just glad to all be a part of the team. And that was our first two nights. We were in the 21st. We sat down. And then we started, you know, started going deeper and deeper for more visual observations. And our intent was to take by out back then at an international airport. So we're in Baghdad, Saddam International, it was called. And we had to get the force there and then start hunting the deck of 55 and any other emerging targets that we come.

Yeah. It's busy. Yeah. And so then, but so Haditha, because I know that was a huge op that you wrote in your book. Yeah, that's the biggest chapter in the books, not Haditha. Yeah, can you tell us a little bit about that? We got, we got the mission to go, to go up north with 375 to camp out with the Rangers for a few days. And there were some other missions going on.

So I was taking it to leave it, we got bumped off of it. It is what it is. And so we went up to H1 where 375 to an airborne combat assault. There was an airfield up there, and that's west of Aditha Dam, which is one of the largest dam structures in the world. I think it's three miles, I think three to five miles wide and about 300 feet tall. I mean, it's a very big structure. It's hydroelectric, so they provide electricity. everything down, you know, the Euphrates and the tigers all the way to Baghdad.

And it was the most key piece of terrain in Iraq. So the mission was pay, hold the dam, clear the dam, and then I think it was an armor force was supposed to come to leave us in place that next day. And so we got up there and did some short planning with 375. and they went over, they jumped in, secured the airfield. We came in on C-17,

offloaded, and the Rangers drove. They went over by land, and then we linked up with them when they got there. And it was, it was quite a sight. That's all I can say. When I had,

I pulled up the radios, and I could hear the FSNCO, Farsport Sergeant for 375 on the dam. They were in a west blocking position. I think there were five or six rangers there. And every time he keyed the mic, I could hear the gunfire, automatic gunfire, machine gunfire, every time you just get more intense,

more intense, more intense. I noticed particular FSNCOs, you know, we were close and good friends. known each other for a long time. Well, you know, his voice started going up in the octaves. And you just know of working with the guys all the time, same time. Okay, shit's going down. And we've got to get there.

It's about a 17-minute flight from the airfield to the dam. And I was so, so, so angry at the radios. I couldn't talk to anybody. And, you know, I could hear them. finally, you know, I looked at the guy I was flying with, and I said, I just had all I could take. And I said, a man standing on the moon in 1968 can talk to Houston, Texas. And I can't talk to my fire supporter, you know, 10 miles away. And I finally got on the, I got on the satellite radio and I pushed all traffic aside.

I said, this is an emergency. And I could hear Mo, you know, asking where the AHs, where the AHs? They were about to get overrun. by a very large force. It's about a company-sized element. And, you know, finally I got in touch with him. We were about three minutes out. And I said, hey, we're less than three minutes, you know.

And he's like, you know, I'm afraid this is going to be over in three minutes. And, I mean, it was very, very intense. And there's a huge lake north of the dam. I can remember we hit the lake, got right on the water, and then bumped up. and when we bumped up it was just one of the most incredible sites I'd ever seen

there were just tracers just everywhere of course company arrangers and a few of the Delta guys were on the dam and then they had folks going through it breaching and

clearing that dam it was a huge huge structure and well we saw a very large size element attacking that west blocking position and when we shot we shot a

approximately 12 meters in front of that friendly, front of that major blocking position. That's how, I mean, it was just about to be a knife fight for that time. So God watched over us and gave us some tailwind to get us there a lot faster. And, yeah, so we killed that. I don't know, there's probably 70-80 enemy troops coming up to that walking position. and then immediately got a call for fire from the east block of position. Another ranger.

And it's, I remember chuckling because it's, you know, these rangers, we, and us too, we, we beat into everybody's head that standard call for fire. Hey, you, this is me for my position, you know, 3.6, 0 degrees, 400 meters, marked by, you know, that's what he was, you know, under stress. Same thing, a very large force was attacking there. their side and and flanking, you know, standard culver fire and I just, I was like, okay,

I'm just going to let him spit it out. I said, I saw him, we saw him. And I'm like, hey, brother, I have your position, just mark the target. And he's like, oh yeah, okay, so here come lasers. And, you know, we went

over there and serviced those knuckleheads trying to, trying to kill our rangers on the east side. And then it was this, it was constant. for the next little sun started coming up. I think we shot nine, ten loads there at the dam that night. You'd go bingo or Winchester and then you'd have to go back and reload and then. Yes, sir.

We had had a little, we'd had the rangers put in a small park, not too far from the dam. It was just a couple of minute turnaround. There were four loads there, and we'd burn it up, I mean, quick. and I can remember getting on the sat, calling back to the talk to see if we could get another aircraft. Because we have to manage that ammo, and we have to forecast and, you know, kind of figure out what we're going through at the time

and what we're going to need for the next few hours or several hours. And I was going to see if somebody could bring some more ammo because we went through that forload fart pretty quick. We had gas there. and some G-bags. So we land, pilots jump out. You know, we load up to rockets and guns and then go get back in the fight. Then the other loads, we had to fly all the way back to H-1.

They had a FARP set up there for us. I swear, man, those guys look like an India-Nascar pit crew, man. So as you land, it's going. We're in now there under three minutes, probably. Full load, full gas. and back to the fight. I just want to point out to the viewers out there. I really encourage them to read Greg's book about all of this

from the one-the-th perspective. And just go and do some research on Haditha Dam in that operation. In general, to understand it, that was a very significant battle that took place there. And I missed it because I was actually in the Ranger Indoctrination program during the invasion. I was a little bit behind.

I wasn't there. But when I did get there, I got to hear all the stories firsthand from the Rangers who were there on the ground. And like one guy I know who was a medic, leapfrogging forward with his platoon sergeant as the Rangers, the squads were bounding forward. And they were right behind him.

And so this guy is a Ranger medic with a platoon sergeant, looping deck cord around the barrels of the anti-aircraft guns. And then like popping the time fuse, bounding to the next position as it blows up behind them. It felt like doing some commando shit out there. And they were. Yeah. It was crazy.

it was a craziest thing I'd ever seen and I had ever even imagined it was, yeah, it was a busy night. And, you know, we, nobody was killed. We had, I think, three injured, I think three rangers were injured, where it all was over with and smoke cleared and got them out and got them to the cash.

We escorted one of our schnooks in there a couple months later and dropped off food and ammo water for guys on the dam. But, yeah, I think we wound up being there for weeks. Our additional vision was 24 hours, you know. But, yeah, it is what it is. When you're in the thick of things like that

in such a target-rich environment, how long does it take you to go through the armament that you're carrying? Yeah, that's a very good question. We manage it. I mean, I can average 12 to 1.5. 14 engagements, you know, managing my mini-gun, managing, because we carry 14 rockets. And not every target will need a rocket. Not every target will need minigone or Dow, you know, the 50-Cal. So it's up to that each individual attack pilot flying, you know, at that time

as to how they, you know, that's what we're trying to do is to look at that target. What can we use to destroy that target? You know, there's troops in the open. Is it light armor, you know, things like that? So generally, yeah, I'd say 14, 15 engagements if you, you know, if you're managing right, plus our M4s. And we were dropping hangar-nays on groups of folks, too. So it's very, very effective. Yeah. So in a very thick fight like that, I mean, 14 engagements really is not a whole, it's not a whole time on target.

You go through that like an hour maybe in a heavy firefight? No, you'd go through that in a heavy, like the dam, 15 minutes. That's amazing. Ten minutes? I mean, you're turning and, you know, you go from one side to the other side. And the thing that struck me were the amount of wires. Because I guess somebody forgot to tell us about all the electrical wires that it looked like a fire web. So, you know, we had to make sure we were up high.

higher than, you know, we kind of planned on being. And then they, they would start to get ordered. Well, in that, in that river bottom, you know, that river will wash and it'll, it'll make, like, I guess, little sand dunes. Well, those guys would sneak in there with a mortar crew and, you know, start a lot of mortars at the Rangers. So I got the looking downriver, and I could see the flash coming out of two. So I'd say, hey, we all carry little commanders, pointers, you know, little lasers, because it's really fast.

We carry more at best. You know, whoever's flying, another guy, it's like, there's a flash, dude. You know, okay, I got it. So we just fly down the river. Sure enough, there would be. And we, you know, engage with many. And go the next one, you know, we see another flash and another flash. Yeah, so it was a busy time.

It was a busy night. every night. I imagine that in addition just to the battle stress, the stress of combat, it sounds like you had a real sense of responsibility for the troops on the ground. So, I mean, did that, how much pressure did that add to you when you were doing your turnarounds, when you were going back to the FARP and things like that? Yeah, man, it's, again, you know, we have these very, very close relationships with all the guys. and Jack, you know, Dave, you know.

And I mean, our, you know, to me, for me, my job was to protect those guys. We were the archangels or however you want to look at or call it. But, you know, my whole mission in life was to protect those. Those were my brothers. Those were my buddies. And, you know, one time we were hitting a bunch of targets in pollution. The Delta commander asked us, asked me, if we would please not kill. all the guys at the target so the guys would have somebody to shoot at when they

got there and I was like I'm like sure my job is to protect my brothers so that's what we're doing but yeah that that was me personally is I had I was very driven to to support them and

protect them yeah every time every time yeah I you the battle is in the book is phenomenal, it's significant. And then there's

Oh, good. Yeah, and then there are a couple other, you know, things that happen. But can we go to Amaria? Amaria. Oh, that was another walk in the park day.

I remember that one. Yeah, so that was 19 March 2004. That's a specific date were recurring to? Yes, sir. Yeah, we, oh man, it was, you know, we were hitting

Ramadi Fallujah, Amaria, it was a triangle out west of Baghdad. And, oh, three, oh, four, five, oh, six, you guys, it was wild, wild west out there. It was a lot of Al-Qaeda, and they were having foreign fighters

just by the droves come into that area. And we had hit a target in Fallujah, the night of 18th, through that period of darkness and got some information off that target that there was another guy that we were looking for that would be at a house in Fallujah at 10 that morning.

So, you know, we're like, uh, daytime. We've done no day mission since three October 93 in the Battle of the Black Sea. And so Sergeant Major just told us that you guys just, you know, go out there and land. We're going to drive to this house. get this guy or you know look for him and you know something comes up we'll just call you so

you know it's just a couple minute response to if they needed us we can get there but he didn't want to expose us for daytime so I hit that target got the guy so they came back and they told us hey go back to buyout go back to Baghdad International Airport and go down

for a while so we did and it was It was just after 12, we got a call that there was, and then off of that target, they got infill that there was another guy we were looking for in Amaria, which was south of Fallujah. So over the previous weeks, there have been like seven helicopters shot down in that triangle between Ramadi Fallujah and Amaria. and I don't think there were any survivors there's been a couple of Chinooks and 58s and Whitehawks so bad bad place and so there was a tick

with that record team so we jumped in the aircraft to you know go help them and they're like hey they're in trouble troops in contact was a call and we just assumed they'd been ambushed coming out for that target so we got on station It was 1315 local 1.15 p.m.

There in Iraq, course, it was daylight. And, I mean, every one of us, the hair was standing up on her necks. But we're like, hey, we're going. So, well, if they need us, then we're going to be there for them. And got on station, and long story short, we're getting ready to X-Fill,

and I got hit with a missile that I never. saw and it was it came to be it was an SA 16 system so that's a pretty highly advanced system for that time of period and they didn't even think there were any in the country SA7s and you know things like that but I have a theory about all that I talked about it in the book but yeah I was in a climbing right hand turn and when the missiles hit and it has a proximity fuse. So

what a proximity fuse does for those of you that don't know is they'll set it to a distance so like three feet or 10 feet or whatever and then that fuse will detonate so they get maximum shrapnel into the engine or into the aircraft

whatever they're shooting at shooting the missile at. It's pretty advanced. It's a heat seeker so it goes for the engine when it's shot. Actually two of the guys they saw the shot from a two-story building on the very west side of the bill there, and it hit, and it was just,

it was a huge explosion. I mean, it sounded like, you know, big breach in charge or, you know, a mortar pretty close proximity. And this,

I remember out of the corner of my eye, I saw this, you know, this flame went by me and my co-pilot. So the west seat said, yeah, this, like this meter long white hot rod went right by my head. So it kind of got shot at an angle and then hit the end, detonated, it hit the aircraft. And, of course, the big explosion, so that was a clue right there. I was like, oh, oh, and things got real quiet, you know, the engine quit running.

and we have warnings in the aircraft. So if you get a low engine RPM or low rotor, they start beeping. And I was just thinking to myself, I was like, man, I wish those things shut the heck up. I know I'm hit. I know the agent quit.

I know I'm in an auto rotation. And I've got this. I'm good. But at that second, and the best way I can explain this it was like a movie that went frame by frame by frame. I mean, and I understand the physiological effects under stress, and we start dumping adrenaline,

and all these things start going, you guys have been there. But yeah, it was, and my biggest concern was, there's nothing to judge or hype out there for, you know, an airplane guy or a helicopter pilot, especially doing an emergency procedure, as an auto rotation. You know, you need to use those things to start your decal

because there's very particular things that we have to do as a pilot to get that aircraft safely on the ground. So at 75 feet, you start a progressive decel to bleed off that air speed, and you hold that until 15 feet. You pull initial with a collective, so that puts a little bit of pitch in the rotor blade to kind of cushion you to soften that approach down. And then I do remember, you know, I said to myself,

I want a real aggressive D-cell because I want very little ground run. I don't, you know, I didn't know what was down there. I didn't know what the ground was like. And again, I was, I was watching the radar altimeter. And my rotor, I remember my rotor getting real, real high, like 105 point something. So I put a little more collective. and, you know, to get in under control.

Because if you don't control it, it can just spin off the helicopter, and then you don't have anything. Yeah, so I kept glancing at the radar altimeter. And the whole time, I could, you know, I heard a few radio calls. But you just so focused at a task at hand, and, you know, of course, when that hit a big explosion,

I was like, okay, it's time to go to work. So get it in trim, you know, step on that pedal, control my rotor, watch my altitude, 75 feet. I started my D-cell and then 15 feet. I leveled it

because I think of myself, I was real heavy. I was full of gas, full ammo, and I had a tailwind. I had the worst conditions I could have to conduct an auto-rotation

that helicopter. And that particular helicopter falls like a grease crowbar when you're not loaded. I mean, they just don't, I mean, they just, they sink at 2,700 feet per minute. I was about 165 feet above the ground when the missile hit.

When a climbing right-hand turn, I was headed southwest. I remember because I just swooped the boys, you know, and kind of did the wave. We're like, we're out of here, you know. And, you know, I said, I'm just going to, I'm going to pull everything I have right before I touched down. That's what I did. And we touched down.

And the other aircraft said, man, it was the prettiest auto rotation he had ever seen. So I was like, okay, that's good. We touched down and we slid probably about 35 meters. And the skids went down a bit of a slope. Of course, I'm thinking myself, oh, yes, we got this. I'm going to get this thing stopped. As soon as we touched down, though, it, you know, that duff. some dirt, just filled the cockpit

you can't see. And the skid stuck and some soft dirt. So we started to roll in over in. We rolled multiple times. And I think at some point I was knocked out for a short time.

And the co-pilot was. And I came to and of course, you know, we came to rest, inverted. So upside. by down. And the helicopter was on fire. And again, two of the guys had seen the missile shot.

So they immediately started to suppress that building. One was a ranger and other was one of the Delta guys. And then the other A.H went to work, you know, shooting, trying to suppress stuff back on that side. Because it just kind of stirred a hornet's nest at that time. And, you know, anytime we have an event like, that, you know, parachute or fast roper or in a helicopter. You're going to go through those checks. Okay, I can move my toes.

I can move my feet. My legs are kind of working. Checking my package. Okay, it's good. My arms. And so I'm just going through these, you know, and it's all slow motion. And I look over at a co-pilot. He's got blood all over his face.

So, you know, I think to myself, well, did he get hit? did he, and the little bird was somewhat infamous for the shoulder harness not locking in a crash sequence, especially in a roll. So I thought, okay, well, he did the old cyclic kiss. What happens, the guy will hit the cyclic with his mouth in the crash sequence. So then my priority was, okay, you know, here we are, little black helicopter shot down 300 meters from the bad guys. so I got to get out. I got to get out and make sure we're secure. And I knew the guys were there.

So there was five vehicles in the reccy team. And I looked at my co-pot. I put my hand on the shoulder. I said, hey, man, get out. And I said, meet me over here because you don't want to get in front of an armed aircraft because you don't know if a rocket might go off. And I didn't know any of the condition until I got out. The whole back cargo area was on fire.

And when I came to you, I was kind of hanging there in the straps. And I was like, what is all that popping sound? You know, it was telling like popcorn. Well, that was ammo cooking off in the ammo cans behind me. I mean, they're right behind me. And I was like, oh, that's not good. And then I had 17-pound rockets on board.

So I'm like, what's going to happen when these rockets heat up or catch on fire? or they explode or, you know, what are they going to do? So I crawled out of the helicopter. I grabbed my rifle. I tried to stand up. My right leg wouldn't work. I tried to take a step and I just hit the ground.

And then at the same time, the other A-H was coming to check on us. They had flown over us, I think, two or three times. And they said, they told me later, they said, man, if we hadn't seen you crawling out, we were, that turn, we were landing and we thought you guys were dead and the ground force said the same thing. So they saw me crawling out and get up and I'd fall and get up. He said, let's see it,

he said, I looked like a circus clown. I'd get up and fall down, get up and fall down. But my right leg wasn't, and they told me later I'd gotten a stinger to that L spine on that right side. And I did I did finally get up and I sat back down

and I thought well maybe my leg's broken so I pulled my pant leg up ticked both legs checked myself again and got my rifle got up did 360 degrees security around the aircraft

to make sure nobody was coming and I could hear the guys to the east of me you know they were getting it on I mean everybody was shooting at this point and they were on the radio and trying to get some help in there. And then I went back to the aircraft to, in my, we carry our little rucksacks right behind us.

So in there, you know, water, hand grenades or night vision goggles. And, you know, just stuff that you need. Well, it was fully engulfed in fire. So I'm like, I'm not reaching my arm in there to get that out. And then I went back. I checked on the co-pilot again. And he was hanging there just kind of dazed and confused. I was like, hey, you okay?

And he's like, this shook his head. And I said, all right. I said, you got to get out. The helicopter's on fire. I'm kidding. So I went kind of crawled back out, went back out. And I kind of took a knee. I was looking to the east.

And then I looked back and I said, where in the world is he? So I crawled back. I crawled in the helicopter and I pulled his latch on his seatbelt. and he fell, you know, he fell down. When he hit his head and he kind of looked up, and I guess it, you know, it kind of brought him back to what the heck was going on. So I just grabbed, I mean, fire was, fire was just licking at his arm when I got in there.

And I said, man, I got to get him out of here right now. So I just, I was grabbing and pull him up on top of me and just push. I just pushed with my legs out of the aircraft to get him out. Kind of rolled him over and then, you know, did a quick assessment on him and what had happened, he's bitten through his tongue in the crash sequence and that's where all the blood came

from, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, he'd had hellspine injuries and we're all pretty beat up pretty bad. I had I had over a total like 34, 35, 36 surgeries and I have over 40 people of titanium in my body.

Yeah, another day at the office for a six gun. You describe your actions during the crash with such clarity. How you were at 165 feet? How long did it take you to fall to plummet from all these actions you're describing, all these thoughts that are going on? How long did it take you to go from 165 feet to the ground? Probably three point four seconds.

Yeah, they, They took all the data and sent it down to Fort Rucker and they put it to, you know, replay it. And one of the guys told me that the machine couldn't successfully land the helicopter with all the wind, the tailwinds, the air speeds, the height, the data. But it was impossible to land, successfully land the helicopter. It is absolutely amazing to me that you sat there and spent five minutes going into detail of each of your actions. of your awareness of the auto-rotate, of all the things you were doing, and that was within a four-second period of time.

Yes, sir. The whole sequence is about eight seconds. The time we stopped rolling, we got on and slid and came to rest as about eight seconds. What do you attribute all that to, Greg, that you were able to successfully survive that? I mean, is that your training? Is that the man upstairs over your shoulder?

That's training in the good Lord. Saying, okay, I'm not done with you yet, Mr. I have a purpose for you. Yeah, absolutely. Our guardian angels were, golly. Well, I wrote about a bunch of them in the book. So, again, I was in, he had put me, the good Lord put me in so many places that,

at so many times that, you know, it's like Kyle Lamb and George, and they're like, hey, you have got to write possible. this crazy stuff that you've done. And Kyle always told me that he'd say, Gravy, if it ain't written, it never happened. So I really took that to heart. My wife was my biggest inspiration for writing me stories because I didn't want to do it.

I'll tell you, quite frankly, I was scared to do it. I didn't want to be that guy. Nobody had really written about the 160th way that I you know we put this into these stories and they're just stories they're just stories it's it's about our tribe and it's about our team and it's you know very faithful Christian men you know doing their their jobs and and I and I you know I want to help vets that maybe are having problems getting through some tough times and man we've all been through it and you know and to let

I dedicated the book to our children because I hope and pray that it will shine some light on our absence for all those years and to help them understand. And they may be in their 30s now. You know, my kids are. So that's, you know, they're late 20s, 30s. I've met some, you know, they're in early 30s.

And, hey, what do my dad do? Right. So, and I try to convey. that to them and the public and you know and and to help future warriors you know our next generation hey what am i going to get myself into if i want to go you know fly for the 160th or be a ranger you know be whatever and uh yeah it's so that's important though it's it's not um it's not being that guy it is it's recording history yeah and and and greg you're absolutely spot on i mean it unfortunately

Unfortunately, if it's not written, it didn't happen. I mean, I remember talking to somebody once about the explorer, Magellan, the famous explorer. He wasn't the only one to make these huge cross-trans-Pacific sort of expeditions, but he was the one who had a historian with him on his ship. So that was the expedition that got written on time. Yeah, I'm sorry. So we don't want to keep you too long, but I really... Oh, no, you're fine.

Okay, because there's more to this crash. So it's daytime. The balloon goes up. You're at biop. You fly during the day to help out your brothers. And of course, now that you're down, the Air Force is going to do the same, correct? They're coming to get you. Now they're not.

They refuse to come get us. Yeah, theater dedicated combat search and rescue, Air Force Special Operations Helicon. Now, I'm not saying the pilot, I don't know, but the truth commander says, hey, Greg, come here, you need to hear this. They said, we're not coming to get you as too risky. Wow. And I was like, what? And simultaneously, back at Biop, so the word gets there, well, they've got every, helicopter, every little bird,

every black hawk, and to listen to the guys tell the story, it was kind of funny. They had woke everybody up, you know, green, red, brown, said it looked like a clamping. Dudes were hanging off the hell because they were coming to gets.

Yeah. And I got on, I finally got on the radio and I called a talk, our talk. And I said, hey, sir, don't, we're secure. Okay, docs. You know, The medic was there, I mean, working on us. And I said, I do not want any more helicopters coming in here.

Of course, you know, we have a procedure of a process. When that happens, you know, we get fixed wing overhead. We clear an air for, you know, five miles or three miles or whatever, 10 miles. And to ensure, you know, the safety of those aircraft that are, you know, that always really kind of made me angry because I told those. guys. Let me tell you something. I would have come and got you, man. I would have.

Who did come? I don't care what they said. No. Who did come and get you ultimately? Well, we, so I kind of go back. So, well, it was one of the 160 of Blackhawks. We finally got to Ramadi

up to the MSS up there on the northeast side of Ramadi to that that staging area and yeah they landed you guys ex-filled with the assault with the ground forces all the way back to the

SS. Yeah we MSS is the mission support site so ultimately nobody came and got you until you were back back behind the wire in secure area. Yeah yeah so the boys got you out who were on the ground for that mission so it was the the boys who were out on the

ground for that operation were the ones that that pulled you off target oh yes sir yeah yeah we were you know I got my co-pilot out and I've set up in just a bit of a defilade and I put him in the prone facing north and I was on a knee facing east for security and I told him I said hey if

you hear something or see something because we were both pretty jacked up and and I said just sing out so let's put both sets of eyes, we'll put both gun barrels on them. Yeah, it is rifle. I had my rifle. And, you know, we'll assess this before we start shooting at anyone.

And about then, a few minutes later, I heard a truck engine and then I heard the vehicle stop. Then I saw this ball cap, you know, kind of going up and down. Then I saw face and I go, oh, that's Chaz. Okay.

I said, hey, we're good to go. Okay. Good guy. are here and Caz came running up to us but I was talking to a few months or sometime later he I asked as well you know what did you

think you know when you came running up there and he's like that helicopter was burnt to the ground and Emma was cooking off he said you know we we kind of gave a look to each other when I left that they would have had perished

and he said like when I came running over that, you know, and I saw, he says, how did those two Rangers get there so fast? He fucked because we were one Northwood, you know, and he was like, because we were in desert, you know, BDUs and looked like everybody else. But he was like, oh, God, that's gravy. Okay, man, let's go. Well, he ran up and hugged us and he asked me, he says, what do you want to do? And I said, I want to go find that guy. I said, I at least want to check that building to see if they're already done itage or we can get anything to.

And the both guys that had seen the shot, every service fair missile leaves a signature, a smoke trail signature. You know, it's dark gray smoke, gray smoke or white smoke. And, you know, they've seen the quartz screw and it's, and everyone has a signature cord screw smoke trail. And they, you know, they said, man, it was a 16, I guarantee. you know, but they had done forensics on what they scooped up and they found a small piece of metal that came from an SA-16. Wow. That's what got us. So, Chaz said, what did you?

And you say, I want to go get that guy. And so what happens? Well, we load up. And we got two panders, so it's an armored vehicle, six-wheel vehicle. We have three gun trucks, up armored. I'll be gun trucks. One's got a 50. I jumped in the truck with the Sergeant Major

and Ranger Smith. He's on dual 240s and the next gun trucks got a 50. So we assault this bill by Amerang. We're going to go get some. Of course, Doc was poking us and pushing

and kind of looked to the left and I'll age myself that baby, you may remember the first thing that entered my mind. and was those crazy bricks and their jeeps and north the house. I was like, man, this guy's cool. It reminds me in the Rat Patrol, you know. Anyway, so we hit the building and we get, two of the trucks get stuck in the mud,

with this gunfight. So we're suppressing, and the pander maneuvers, he backs up to one truck, and a guy jumps out of the back, you know, with a strap. to the hub be under fire and pulls that truck out and then maneuvers over to us and hooks the strap up and we're suppressing and pulls us out we get turned around we go around and we attacked these buildings in the front and ranger smith had engaged the big tent or some guys run around there with a caves and then we had deployed out

we had deployed out when on the stuck when the truck was stuck I'd gone to the left corner and dude came out with a he had a black man dress on on the phone and I'm like okay this guy's calling his buddies

you know a lot of the Americans were here and were stuck we just shot their helicopter down so I popped him twice and some 75 grain love and then and then Ranger Smith joined in and engaged with the dual

240s and then we saw a couple guys running one had an RPG one had an AKA so I engaged both of them and then yeah I mean everybody were just ever engaging targets of opportunity and then we finally

got to the building and cleared it and went on the roof and cleared it there was nothing there so yeah so we got back in and we fought away back out of there and all the way through Fallujah

and between Fallujah to Ramadi and farther away through Ramadi and then to the MS. We got there at about it was probably 930, 20, 30 hours. That's the night. And I just want to say that you're no slouts with a long gun either.

Like you're a helicopter pilot, but you're also a three gun, you know, a three gun competitor and, uh, yes, like you, you shoot a lot. Yes, sir. Yeah. Yeah, I was an instructor for BAT with Kyle after I retired.

Yeah, that was by far the best post-Arming job I ever had. I love to train. I love to cheat three gun. I shot with the Army Marchmanship Unit for a while. Yeah, I got to train with the best shooters in the world, man. So, heck, yeah. I love to shoot. I can hold my own pistol rifle, long gun.

A.H. Yeah, I just, I just wanted to kind of throw that out there for the people watching and listening that it's like, okay, here's this, you know, helicopter pilot running alongside, you know, Rangers and Delta, but you do, you know what you're doing. Like, you are, you're not a strap hanger, you're not like, you know, the attachment at this point. Yeah. Yeah, you bet. How were your injuries at that point, though?

How were you able to keep, you know, were you just gutting it, cutting through it? adrenaline. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, adrenaline is the best drug on the planet, man. Yeah. For sure. And I'm pretty sure Doc had wanted to, you know, do something,

but I was like, hey, I don't want any morphine or anything like that. You know, I'm good. I just had this terrible headache. When I hit the doorframe in the crash sequence and it cracked my helmet. Wow. I hit it so hard. Jesus. I just had this terrible headache.

My head hurt for like nine months. Finally, it went away. I had a brain bruise. So, yeah, it's all good. With the headache and the physical injuries, so you get back to the MSS, they fly you back, or from Ramadi, and they fly you back.

Do you keep operating? Is that the end? Like, where do you go from here? No, they took us both to the cash there in Baghdad and then cash to back home. Our docks at Fort Campbell wanted us home at Fort Campbell. So they're very protective of us. So we did that. And then I started a process of getting shoulder.

I had both shoulders, worked on both knees. I'd broken a vertebrae in C3, vertebrae L3 through L5. and, you know, so with the docs, I sat down with them, we prioritized and started a plan. So I'd get stuff worked on and take, you know, 30, 60, 45, 60 days to, then I'd go back to the box. And I'd go do that for 90 to 100 days. But right, yeah, then I came back and had some more surgeries and physical therapy. and then, you know, I start back flying again and going back flying rotations

until I retired. Yeah, that's what I do. Yeah. And so we're talking about the physical toll of the job. Is there a mental toll? Better believe there is. Hey, fellas, can I take a break for a minute?

Absolutely. Okay, I have to hit the head. Yeah, yeah, go ahead. Yeah, go for it, man. Yeah, absolutely. please. This is in line. No, it's not.

We're good. Yeah, folks. So we'll see if I can try out my editing skills. But if not, this is just an apropos time to remind you to subscribe to the channel if you're not already. And I'll put it up. Make some comments down in the description. Oh, yeah. There's also the link down in the description to our Patreon page.

Yeah. Also, Greg's book, we'll talk about it again when he comes. back or near the end of the show. But Greg's book right now is out on Amazon Kindle. We'll find out it's not in print on Amazon yet, but I believe it will be. But if you have Amazon Prime, it's free. And he does get paid if you read it or if you thumb all the way through it. And he is donating all the proceeds of the book to different charities. The Knit Stocker Foundation, I think it's the foundation, the foundation that the foundation for the Delta guys and then

Three Rangers Foundation. Yes. So please. We should also point out the book is co-authored with our friend George Hand. And George is a retired Delta Force operator.

And if you go back, he was a guest on this show, episode 36. We did like a two and a half hour interview with him, like real in depth about his career. So he was the co-author of Greg's book

that we're talking about today. Yeah, yeah. Guests coming up? We're going to do a quick video for New Year's. That's just going to lay out some future guests. And then the week after that, January, our first guest in January will be Jeff DePetsey, who is a JTF2 operator, Canadian counterterrorism unit. No one is.

I still have that little bird bladder. So, what, final? Oh, so we're just asking about the mental. Because, you know, I think that for all of us, you know, this, the job is the job. Everybody loves the job. We wouldn't do anything but the job. But we've had many people on who talk about the consequences of the job and what life is like after the job. And you do write about it in your book.

And so I was hoping that maybe you could share some of your experiences with us. And maybe not just for the personal part and the history part, but maybe for any other soldiers out there or any person out there who may be struggling or going through hard times to hear that they're not alone. You bet. And that's one of the purposes of this book is to, you know, if a bet picks it up and reads this young or old, I don't care that, hey, you're not sharing your pain alone, brother, or sister.

And you have a network that will help you. And, oh, by the way, God loves you. I'm a very faithful Christian man. That's the only thing that got me through the peaks and valleys that I went through the last 15 years, so to speak. and I go into great depth and detail in my struggles, in my failures, and my victories. And,

you know, again, I pray that when a vet reads this, it will flip a switch for him or it will, it will motivate him to seek help or go talk to somebody. Go talk to your brothers. Go talk to your past. go talk to a therapist

and they're done that. I've been in therapy since 2005 and I was I guess officially what's the word it? It was I was diagnosed with PTSD in 2005 so

the unit went the 160th they went you know above and beyond and we have our own sites there at the compound and for the unit and it's the help families, it's to help soldiers, just to help kids,

just to help everybody. And, you know, I even say in the book, I talk about spouses and kids and family members that, you know, they suffer from PTSD. I mean, dad's gone, you know, special operator, ranger, whatever, and, you know, no communication, worry about him every night for three months,

six months a year, whatever case. So, but now there is, you know, there is a focus on that family member. and that spouse and those kids. But, yeah, I hit some, you know, the demons come. I mean, I'd go days and days. No sleep. And, you know, there's a good old ambion.

You know, you get to that wall. You get to that point. Your body has to rest. Your mind has to rest. So, you know, alcohol, prescription drugs, did it all, man. And it was all to crush that pain, that pain. So everybody suffers from it. Unfortunately, some of my very close friends have succumbed to that pain and taken their life.

I start the book out talking about Leon. He was one of my best friends on the planet, and it just broke my heart to, you know, one of I questioned, well, how is it that a highly intelligent human being gets to the pinnacle of a profession and a career? and live through all these horrible things and then succumb to the demons and the pain and take their life. Well, they lose hope. This is my theory, my study that I've done for many years now,

but they lose hope and they don't have loving God. So God got me through these trials and tribulations over the years as I was going through this. and it just sucks and I went to in 2013 I went to Carrick Brain Center there in Dallas

and they were they're a center it was a two-week inpatient and they would take four vets out of time but their expertise was on TBI for football players right brain injury

for football players for years so they started up a program for vets and I was fortunate to attend that for two weeks. That was a big turning point in my life to help me mentally and physically.

They use a whole main concept and now though there are just, there's so many opportunities for vets and you know nothing else. I try to tell several vets every week, hey, I'll call them or text them or whatever and just tell them that I love

them. And that's all they want to hear. That's all they need to hear. And, you know, hey, man, call me. I mean, I've had calls at 2 in the morning, three in the morning, four in the morning. At noon, you know, hey, I got an empty bottle of Irish whiskey and a load of 45 and I've just had all I can take.

Well, no. No, it's not. Let's just, let's talk about this for a little bit. You know, I've taken vets into my home, that we're sleeping in their truck and no job. Mama left and kids are gone. Take all their money

and I get it, man. Then they're done that after 32-year marriage failed. But, you know, God loves you and we love you and there's a way out. But you just have to go talk to somebody. And that's what I tell every man that I meet or, I mean, even Vietnam vets. I talk to every veteran. I can because that's God's mission for me. That's his purpose for Barry Coker.

is go help my brothers and help them get through these tough times. There are good times to be had. And there always will be, but you can't quit. You know, nightstoppers don't quit. And you just can't give up. Yeah, faith, your faith will get you through this.

God loves you. You know, and brothers love you and your parents or whomever that we need you here. Yeah. For sure. Yeah, they, what you wrote about Leon was, was, I mean, because we've all, at this point, I think, lost people close to us. Yeah. Yeah.

You know, and it's challenging because from what you wrote about Leon, you didn't, there was no indication. There was no sign. There was, there was nothing. and that's when it becomes challenging is when there's that front and there's that, you know, that wall, that shield, that, you know, persona. But there's so much going on behind that that they just don't let us sin on. Yes, sir. Yeah, you're absolutely right.

And that's, and I see that a lot in our community. Yeah. Because, you know, there's no signs, there's no symbols. They go and execute. They've made up their mind. Yeah. And they, yeah, doggone. And it's, you know, and I, like I say in a book, it's, I did read some data last year where,

it was closer to 26 a day now that veterans take their lives. And, you know, in any other country, it'd be an epidemic. I mean, we're looking at 10,000 humans that sacrifice and service, this great nation, they gave up what they gave up. And we're not helping. We're not doing the job that we need to be doing to help these fellas.

And the other thing I saw, too, that was interesting was that the mean age was 50 years old. So you're looking at the Vietnam vet. Right. Pick of their lives. So, yeah, it's, you know, it's just, it'll never go away.

And a lot of guys, you know, PTSD, and I never did like that, you know, that symbol or that stigma with that. I always felt that it should have been called post-combat stress because anybody can suffer from PTSD, post-traumatic stress disorder or post-traumatic stress. I mean, a rape victim, somebody that's been in a car wreck, somebody that was abused or, you know, whatever the case, every human is different. and I think to better serve veterans that should be post-combat stress because that's what it is. And you know, you guys know,

especially the opt-temple, which we caps and are still keeping today 20 years later throughout the world is leadership, and they've done a good job, but we have to stay on top of this stuff. The opt-tempo, it just killed. that's 0-1-08. Yeah, and I think you're absolutely right.

I've never thought of it that way before, but post-combat stress is very different than post-traumatic stress in the sense that it's not just the psyche, the traumatic. Like, Jack wrote an article on blast injuries and TBI. Yeah. And how those read the article. And then I also think that there's just the idea

that these people who were at the top of the game, the top and living their dream, and then that ends. And there's nothing like that for them in that life afterwards and trying to find purpose after that, trying to find meaning after that. And so all those things mixed together and create this very, very challenging scenario. They go from being like a Formula One racer to being like a dude with both your legs broken, paralyzed in bed. And that's psychologically traumatic in of itself. Right. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We don't quite, you know, we haven't quite broken the code on, you know, how to help them and how to, you know, seek medical care or, you know, their mental stability to, you know, help them advance into a good life for themselves and those that are around them, the loved ones. Right. Yeah.

While you were gone, we were telling everybody that the proceeds of your books, you've been donated to different charities. Yes. And that the book is out on Amazon, Kindle right now. When will the book be out in print? Okay. I just talked to the printer last week, and I will be getting deliveries of the special edition Hardback Color Books 15 January.

that we're selling, you can go on the website, death weights and dark.com. And there's about, oh, 250 of those left. The first 500 edition, those books, I, so I numbered the books,

and then I designed a coin, a challenge coin, which we all are familiar with. And each coin is numbered to match that book number. Cool. Those sold out in 20 days. I swear, I was like, Lord, if I can just sell 50 books, I'll be good.

Boy, they, I mean, they went fast. So I had a couple other, they're like, because I wasn't going to do anymore. So I had several people tell me and text me and message me that, hey, I really want one of those hardbacked books with a coin. I don't care about it being numbered. So I did work. I got another 500 of those with a coin. And they can get those on your site? They can get those on your site?

Yes, sir. They can go to the website and instructions on how to order. I've been handling all this myself. I'm going to go order one. It's pretty easy. So we put it on our bookshelf back here. Yes. I'll get you.

Well, I had to. So this is the cover. You know if you can see it. Yep. Looks more. Yeah, the cover, it's a pretty cool story. Cover. That's a Rob Wintz print.

I don't know if you ever heard of Rob at Witt's Art Gallery. He's a former Black Hawk pilot from the 160. Oh, really? And just, yes. And I mean, this guy, he's phenomenal.

But, so I called him and he did the latest I was probably three or four or five years ago. He did the latest six gun print. So for B Company, it's got the eight. He's got the eight. That's his print that he did for us for B

company. That's super cool. And so we were war game in the cover. You know, the writing was done. I was like, okay, man, we need to come up with a really cool cover. And I'd thrown some stuff at GEO and a couple other folks. Well, that print's hanging in my office at home, I look at it every day.

And I was just like, duh. You know, I'm not the smarter of a ranger in the truth. But right there it is. So I called Rob. and told him, you know, I was like, hey, man, he's writing a book, too, that's going to be phenomenal. And I said, look, man, I'm, I need a cover for my book. And the words, you didn't get out of my mouth. And he goes, yes.

And he gave me the copyright to that print to use his book cover. That's amazing. So it was. That's nice of it. Yeah, it was really, really cool. But, you know, here it is, again, you know, guy from the community, of course, GEO, been from Delta and I was just so blessed

to have him going on this journey with me that you know if it'd been another editor with no military background or experience you know

you spend a lot of time explain things or Gio knew it I mean he's lived it he's been there he's I was just blessed and his style of writing

is quite entertaining so yeah he's a hoot Yeah. And then the way the book cover came together. I promise you if you read that you will, you have not read anything like this book before. And I mean,

and I say that in the best way. And we cover a lot of special operations books around here on this podcast. It's such a novel and unique tale because we just, I mean, you're really, I think one of the first pilots really come out and really like, shh. like right there in, you know, in the cockpit.

And it was amazing. Yeah. And, you know, I was blessed that Kyle Lamb wrote the introduction for Sarbanator Lamb, wrote to God, I've been good friends for many, many years. And he's seen no good and the bad with me for those times. And, you know, he and Melinda have helped me get through some tough times. And we just, you know, because we love each other. You know, back when he was operating and hiding under a bush,

scared like a bunny rabbit calling for the AHAs to come help him. You know, I mean, what can I say? No, don't print that. But, yeah, I was just very honored that Kyle did that for him. Yeah, he told me, he was like, dude, I cried when I read this. Yeah. And that was powerful. I mean, that was pretty powerful.

Greg, thank you so much for joining us on the show for what will be our Christmas Eve edition of the show. I hope everyone enjoyed it. And we will be back. We'll have kind of a New Year's message for you guys on the first. And then we'll be back live again on the 8th, potentially in studio with Jeff DePatsy. Yeah.

The one disadvantage of having approved recording this is that we don't have like the audience input. So we're going to have to have you back on at some point. Maybe not to go through the whole thing, but even if it's shorter segment so that people can ask, sure, sure. After they watch this, that they can ask the question that they want to ask you. Oh, awesome. Well, thank you so much, fellas. It's an honor and a privilege.

And I really appreciate you doing this. I just want to help some guys. Yeah. It is our honor. We deeply appreciate you spending your time with us. It means a lot to us. Thank you. God bless you and have a Merry Christmas.

You too, great. You too. Stay healthy. Right. Bye, everybody. See you.