The Team House - Special Forces 1st Sergeant for 3rd SF Group | Jay Dorleus | Ep. 262

Episode Date: February 26, 2024

Jay Dorleus joined the military in 2003 as a 12B combat engineer and completed basic training and AIT in July 2003. In 2003, Jay deployed in support of Iraqi freedom and redeployed in 2004. After his second Iraq deployment, Jay applied to attend Special Forces Assessment and Selection (SFAS) and was selected to attend the qualification course. Once he graduated the qualification course, Jay was assigned to 3rd Special Forces Group where he deployed 4 additional times in support of operations enduring freedom.Susbscirbe to Jay’s Youtube channel here:⬇️https://youtube.com/@GreenBeretChronicles?si=TYhaI8E1atVgN1RA-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------To help support the show and for all bonus content including:https://www.patreon.com/TheTeamHouse-AD FREE AUDIO-AD FREE VIDEO-Access to ALL bonus segments with our guestsSubscribe to our Patreon! ⬇️https://www.patreon.com/TheTeamHouseOr make a one time donation at: ⬇️https://ko-fi.com/theteamhouseTeam House merch: ⬇️https://teespring.com/stores/my-store-10474963Social Media: ⬇️The Team House Instagram:https://instagram.com/the.team.house?utm_medium=copy_linkThe Team House Twitter:https://twitter.com/TheTeamHousePodJack’s Instagram:https://instagram.com/jackmcmurph?utm_medium=copy_linkJack’s Twitter:https://twitter.com/jackmurphyrgr?s=21Dave’s Twitter: https://twitter.com/dave_parke?s=21Team House Discord: ⬇️https://discord.gg/wHFHYM6SubReddit: ⬇️https://www.reddit.com/r/TheTeamHouse/Jack Murphy's memoir "Murphy's Law" can be found here:⬇️https://www.amazon.com/Murphys-Law-Journey-Investigative-Journalist/dp/1501191241The Team Room Reading Room (Amazon Affiliate links):⬇️https://jackmurphywrites.com/the-team-room-reading-room/Intro music by https://www.youtube.com/user/RemixSampleWant to sponsor the show?Email: ⬇️[e-mail]#specialforces #greenberetsBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-team-house--5960890/support.

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Murphy here with Dave Park. Our guest on today's show is Jay Dorlius. He served in third special forces group before that was a conventional engineer, served as a special forces engineer, and then a team sergeant in third group with deployments to Afghanistan and Iraq. Jay also runs a YouTube channel, called the Green Beret Chronicles. Go take a look at that.

And Jay, thanks for coming in studio, man. Of course, man. Of course. I appreciate you guys having me. All right, so I'm looking forward to this. You guys are one of the few Green Beret podcasts out there. You know what I mean? So I'm really happy to be on here.

And you're originally from Brooklyn, right? Yeah. So I was originally born in Haiti. But when I was 10, we moved here, right? So I grew up Crown Heights area, moved out of there, went towards Brownsville, spent some time down there, and then Canarsie prior to joining the military in 2003. So what inspired you to join the military? As you know, there's not too many people from, you know, where we're from in New York, either of us are from that end up joining the military. So for me, so I was one out of eight kids, right? So, you know, growing up in New York City, man, like, there wasn't a lot of opportunities.

I was a horrible student. And to me, it was a way out, right? I can sit here and say, hey, I was patriotic. I wanted to go do, you know, my part for, you know, guided country. But for me, it was just, hey, like, mom and dad has seven other kids to worry about. I'm of age. I'm becoming my own man. I need to go find something else to do.

And after high school, high school was was easy but college was a different beast right so i got good grades in high school my god and counselor was like hey you're you're really smart why don't you go to college so i was like fine i went to city college in Harlem and then dude that was horrible teachers didn't really the teachers don't care in college right they get up there they give you their lecture and you either listen or you don't they're getting paid out of the way as opposed to high school my teachers were getting after me. They were like, hey, get your homework done, turn it in. I'm going to call your mom. I'm going to do this. College, he was like, hey, man, you want to come here and slept?

Sure, go ahead. Like, I don't care. And that's what I did. Like, I showed up the English 101, and I just fell asleep. And the professor would wake me up just in time to leave. So horrible grades, but I was small enough to realize out of very early age, like, hey, college isn't going to work. So instead of doing what most kids nowadays do and just change majors and just keep forcing it down in death throat to try to make it work. I just left. I was like, you know what, college isn't going to work? I need to do something else.

And my first option was NYPD. Like, I wanted to be a New York City cop. And the reason why I chose public service was because, hey, we're from Haiti. This country's taking us in my family. And I was like, how can I repay this debt, right? Like, how can I give back to this country for what it's done for my family? So I wanted to be a New York City cop. So I went in there.

I spoke with the recruiter. He was like, hey, in order to be a New York City cop, you have to either have two years of college or military experience. College wasn't going to work. So I was like, you know what? Fine, I'll do military. So that's what drove me to joining the military. So I went in there, spoke with the recruiter.

And I'm like, hey, man, like, I want to join. I took the ASVAP and then ended up watching one of those high-speed videos that they show every single one of them. us. Mine was an engineer blowing stuff up, right? Snow crawling, landmines, and then building the bridges and blowing them up. And I was like, yep, I want to be a combat engineer. And I signed my contract, man. In 2003, I shipped off to basic training from out of Fort Leonardwood, Missouri. So, yep. And so how did you take the military life from Brooklyn to Fort Leonardwood and going through all of your training to become a combat engineer? And it was rough, man, because you, you

know like you guys know being from the city you weren't like a badge of honor right like there was five of us that that joined out of new york and we were all in the same basic training class so we rolled in there like yo we're from brooklyn like we're tough right you know like we we were like our own little gang within basic training and so i had a rough time breaking out of that because drill song would get in my face and you know I had this one drill song specifically like till this day he's he's all right now because he ended up um he was the post song major for fort hood not too long ago and every time I see him I just have PTSD like when he spoke he got right up in your face and he purposely spit and I'm like oh my God I'm like dude don't you know like he

would do it on purpose and I'm like don't spit in my face but he would do it and I'm like God if I ever see this dude I'll beat his ass and I've seen him a couple of times but I didn't get a chance to because he was E7 at the time I was still at E3 and I'm like I'm gonna get you and then once I got to

SF and I'm this big badass now he's in four like he's in charge of Fort Hood so I'm like I'm not gonna go mess with that dude but it took a while but eventually like I started to wrap my head around why they were doing what they were doing They were breaking us down so they can build us back up. They were showing us the right way to be a soldier, how to follow orders, how to do all these basic soldier tasks that we didn't want to conform to.

And eventually, I got in line and the rest was history, man. What is training for a combat engineer? Like, do you remember how long the training is and what the different topics are? Yeah, so it was one station unit training at Fort Land, Wood, Missouri. Basic training was nine weeks. and then the remainder eight weeks we went over landmines, so identifying them and properly disposing of them. We learned how to build the Bailey Bridge,

which is a big metal bridge that we haul around and throw up whenever folks need to cross rivers and such. And then we learned basic demolitions in AIT. and that was basically it. Yeah. I didn't get to do any of the cool stuff that I saw in that video. Especially when I got to my unit. It was a completely different mission than what I thought I was going to be doing.

So when you arrive at you, what was your first unit? And I mean, this is getting pretty hot into the war at this point. I mean, I imagine. Yeah. So Iraq kicked off. So March 2003, I left for basic training. June, July, 2003, I think, is when. the second war kicked off when Iraq kicked off, right?

And I remember this vividly because we would be, like, in our bays, because it was open bay. I'm sure it's the same when you guys went through. But we would be in the bays just, you know, doing, you know, activities, like folding socks or whatever. And a drill song would come in and they would be like, hey, we just got the call. Everybody, pack up your shit.

You guys are going to Iraq. And, dude, they would have us load our entire locker. We would go outside. And they would have buses there, as if we were going to load them. Right. And I'm talking about guys are fucking crying. Like, we had, you know, other privates. Like, I figured out it was just a ploy.

But guys were, like, crying and just fucking want having it. They were like, oh, I need to call my mom. I need to do this. Like, oh, we really going? And then they have us go back inside. But it's weird, because they would do it multiple times. They got the same reaction. Right.

I'm like, you guys going on to this? Yeah. Yeah. So, finished in July, 2003. and then I got to my first duty station, Fort Riley, Kansas, Big Red One, in August of 2003 after coming back to New York for hometown recruiting. And then as soon as I got there, man, I got to my unit, I checked in. And then my squad leader, he was like, hey, don't unpack your bags.

I'm like, oh, motherfucker, I've heard this before. You're doing the same. You know my recruiter? Like, what's going on, right? I mean, my drill song? So I thought he was running the same ploy. So I was like, why not? He was like, oh, we're going to Iraq in September.

I was like, yeah, whatever. You've been hanging out with Saw and First Class Davis over at Recruiting Command. I mean, over at a drill song command. So I went upstairs on pack on my stuff. And then a month later, I was in Kuwait, waiting to go into Iraq. So got thrown into the fire there pretty quick. And then what was your, how was it set up for combat engineers? Were you, so you were with Bigger Ed One?

Yeah. So were you attached basically to an infantry? Were you, you? So the entire brigade got deployed. Okay. All right. So first brigade, first infantry division deployed. Within that, you had 116 infantry, one three-four armor, first engineer battalion.

But when we got there, everybody had their, different mission that support each other. The infantry guys will go out and conduct patrols and raids. I won three-four armor. They were out there just shooting their big ass tanks. And then our mission was to clear the route, because this is 2003. Like, I was there for OEF one. Oh, I caught the telling of OEF one.

I stayed for OEF2. And then I left during the beginning of OEF3. So we were, our main mission was to come. clear routes for supply to actually come into the country. Because IED was still at its infancy, but they were still putting out shells on the side of the road. I mean, it was amateur hour, but they were still doing it. So our mission was clearing the routes

so the supply line could flow into Iraq. So how would you guys interact with EOD? Because that's their job, but you guys had a big part of that too then. Yeah, yeah. So what we would do, we would go, when I say this, this is amateur hour. Like we had the 113's tracks.

They're like an APC for combat engineers. That's what we deploy with because there was no RG-31s. There was none of that high speed up-armor stuff. So we deployed with our vehicles that we had at Fort Riley Kansas and we put sandbags at the bottom of it as if that was going to stop

an IED blast. So we conducted rock clearance on those and then we conducted them dismounted. Like we were like I remember I remember walking up and then I saw a bag there and I kicked it. And I was like, oh, hey, Sergeant, there's a route. Like, that's how we were conducting route clearance. So what we would do, we would go out, we would find them.

And then we would sit on it for hours waiting for EOD to come out. It was painful. Like, we would go out early in the morning, like 9 o'clock in the morning, find a 9ED. And then 2 p.m. EOD would come rolling up and then they'd take it every. So we actually, because of that, the engineer school of Fort Lenderwood, they created a program called EOCA, IOKA, which allowed us as come by engineers to identify and also dispose of IEDs. But that didn't come online until like

2007, 2008 timeframe. Yeah. I mean, it makes sense because, you know, EOD, like, they do a lot of stuff outside of IEDs. You don't need that depth of training for everything EOD does. But just handling or handling an IED doesn't seem. No, it's not. It's not. And at that point, like, they were so spread out. Like, it's not like they were sitting back at base camp hanging out. They were on other calls.

Right. Because there was IEDs being, you know, spread out everywhere within the AO. And we had, like, two or three EOD teams. So they were running out to a bunch of different calls. And by the time they got to us, they had already been on, like, 15 to 20 other missions, you know? So, yeah. But, yeah, man, that, that. was the early part of my stay over at the first ID. And what I mean there's a second part

you're alluding to? Yeah dude so there's because I ended up doing two deployment with first infantry division so 2003 2004 I did 12 months and of course doing that stay man it was like the wow wow west we lost just from that deployment along we lost like 11 dudes Wow. IEDs. The company commander got blown up. The first sergeant got blown up. The supply guy, the mechanic.

So we lost 11 dudes to that. And of course, you know, I'm PFC at that point. And I'm out there, you know, picking up body parts and putting it in the fucking bag. So I was like, Jesus fucking Christ. Like, there's got to be something else, right? So I got back and I just spire out of control. Like, I was just a menace to society from Brooklyn. I went back to my hoodby.

just causing havoc everywhere, man. But it wasn't just me. It was all the other lower enlisted guys that... Because you figure I'm 19, man. I shouldn't be, you know, like, on the side of the riverbed picking up, you know, body parts of my squad mates. Right, yeah, right.

You're letting off all that steam when you get home. Yeah, and we didn't know how to cope with it. Right, yeah, yeah. Our way of coping with it was going down to Aggieville and beating up on the football players. Right, yeah. Like, that's what we did. So we got back.

We started partying, drinking. Every weekend we were getting in fights, getting thrown in jail. And I remember this because I had a squad leader, and his entire, like, he came, he was an outsider. He, like, he PCS from a third ACR out of Fort Carson, and he showed up, and we were just running amok. Like, nobody could tell us nothing. Like, leadership was just fed up.

They were like, we don't know what to do with these dudes. Just put them in headquarters. And his squad leader, he came in, he was like, hey, I want all these guys in my squad. And his plan was to build enough paperwork to pretty much chapter of. He was like, I'm, you know, God's great gift to the army. I'm cleaning house. We're getting rid of all these dudes. So he comes in and he pretty much started doing paperwork.

Like we kept messing up. He kept doing paperwork. And his plan was to chapter me out. I didn't find this out until like four years. like a go, right? Because he and I are best friends now. But in the midst of this, we had a platoon sergeant that also came in

and he saw potential. He was like, hey, like, you weren't here for the deployment. You don't know what these guys went through. Like, they went through some traumatic shit. So instead of trying to give them the boot, let's find a way to help them. Because if you kick them out now,

all they're going to do is all the stuff they're doing right now, they're just going to go do it. Right. And now we're going to have it. We broke them. Yeah. at the least you can do is fix it. Yeah, exactly.

So that was his mindset. So they started to just find ways to help us, man. They got us into the site. We started talking. We started unpackaging a bunch of stuff. And I slowly started to get my shit together. Got married. Realized that I do like this Army stuff.

It's pretty easy. I show up. I work out. They tell me what to do. They tell me how to do it. They tell me what to wear. I have everything that I need. I need its structure.

and the Army gave me that. And I started to flourish, got promoted, made he six within four years, and then we deployed again in 2007, this time, to Crete Iraq. More of the same conducting rock clearance, but this time it's a little bit more advanced. We have the RG33s, we have the Buffaloes,

we have the robots. So that deployment wasn't as bad as the first one, but I was still losing buddies left and right. Guys were still getting blown up this time with the covert bomb, this time with the EFPs. It's like as soon as we found a way to defeat one tactic, they came up with another one, right? So it was that constant chess match.

And this deployment was 15 months because stop loss kicked in around that time. Wow. So after that, man, I had, you know, like I went through the deployment and I had enough and I was like, there's got to be something else out there. You know, and that's when I started looking at Ranger Bat, and then that's when I discovered SF. So, real quick, because you were a combat engineer, we, you know, we have to bring this up. SF tab, Ranger tab, Sapper tab.

Yeah, I think it should be the other way around. It should be SF tab, Sapper tab, and Ranger Tab. Okay. So tell us about, tell us, for people who don't know, tell us what a Sapper is and, you know, and, you know, what the school is like and everything. So the Sapper tab didn't become an actual, it's always been a tab, but it wasn't authorized to be a warrant until like 2005, right?

So Sapper tab is what Rangers tab is for infantry guys, right? Doing Sapper school, you learn a bunch of 12 Bravo combat engineer tasks, right? So demo is a big one, right? Claring minefields, watercraft operations, And then we also have patrolling, right? Another way to describe it is, hey, sapper school is the last two weeks of 18 Charlie FTX. That's exactly what it is.

You're going on demo-related missions. Only this time after the ambush, you know, your PL tells you, hey, grab all this stuff and bring it to the top of the hood. Right. Now, once it gets to the top of the hood, now as a sapper, I'm actually blowing that stuff up. I'm doing all the demolition. I'm doing the time fuse, and I'm actually blowing it up. Because in real life, that's what we would do. We wouldn't just leave it there for the enemy to take.

Somebody has to blow it up, right? So we actually blow that stuff up. But yeah, that's exactly what it is, man. It's a specialized school for 12 bravos, right? They teach leadership there along with all the demolitions. So hopefully that made sense. Yeah. And you made sure to wear that sapper tab everywhere you went once you're in the South.

I did, man. Makes some days here. Because it was one of those things. Like, growing up as a combat engineer, all my leaders had sapper tabs. Just like a guy going up. I get it. Just like a guy going up in the infantry, his leaders had ranger tab. Right, right.

So when I wore it down my hallway back to group, guys would look, they were like, man, what is that? I've never seen that before, right? Touching it. Like a foreign hour. I'm like, no, man, it's a sabot. Like. And then once I got to group and eventually, they used. 18 Charlie course, I told everybody, like, hey, as a, you know, 18 Charlie, you need to go to

Sapper's school because there's a lot of similarities with the 18 Charlie course and the engineer school that afford Lennwood because a lot of the tasks that we conduct an ancient Charlie course comes from the engineer school. Yeah. That's the big army component of it. Like UXO, we get from, like, my UXO instructors when I was an instructor in 18 Charlie course, I would have to send them to Ioka, that course that I was talking about that allows us to blow IEDs. I would have to send them there so they can get certified

to teach UXO in the schoolhouse, right? So there's a lot of tie-in to the engineer school back in Portland, in the woods. So what year did you go to SFAAS and then the Q course? So 2008, after that last

deployment to Iraq, again, I was fed up with losing buddies left and right. And I think the real reason why I went towards SF was, Because being in big army and doing that mission, like we were being reactive. Like, it was like Groundhog Day. We go out, we get blown up, and then we go through a battle drill. Like, there was no pursuing.

There was no hunting. We were sitting ducks, man. It was annoying. So I'm like, man, how do we, like, who's taking the fight to the enemy? Like, how do I get after it? Like, how do I get these guys that are killing my buddies left and right? So I did some research. Ringerbat came up.

And then that squad leader, that same squad leader. that same squad leader that I was trying to get rid of me. He went to selection, right? And he didn't make it. I was like, ooh, this is a way to show him that I'm better than him, right? So I was like, he didn't make it. And he squared away, right? He was trying to fire me.

So I was like, I'm going to go to selection, right? So I went in 2008 to answer your question, and I got picked up. And then I started clearing Fort Riley and I PCS and started the Q course early 2009. Awesome. What was your relationship with him? I know you said, you guys are really good friends now. What was your relationship with him like when you came back from SFAS having been successful? Like, we joked around it.

Like I would tell him, hey, man, like, what happened? You know, he was like, I don't know. I made it all over to the end. I didn't get selected. I was like, yeah, that's because they won't look for your strict military, you know, dress right, dress standards, you know. But by that point, he and I had like a better relationship, right? because he saw in me what that platoon saw and initially saw, right?

Because I became a squad leader with him. So he had first squad, I had second squad, right? So we were pairs at that point whenever I went. Yeah. That's awesome. And then the 18 Charlie course, I mean, do you have any stories or anything you want to tell about that? And what was it like going through as a combat engineer? Yeah, so going in as a combat engineer, because at that point, I didn't have a sapper tab. Like, I didn't go to Sapper school until I got to, like, my first team.

Oh, okay. That's when I went. So going there as a 12 Bravo, yeah, I understood some of the tasks, but not as deep as we went into it in the 18 Charlie course, right? It was big army, hey, these are landmines. These are how you put them in the ground, as opposed to 18 Charlie course. It was like, oh, these are landmines. here are five safeties that goes with that landmine. These are five ways that it can kill you essentially is what they're telling me.

And this is how to properly dispose of them. So the 18 Charlie course was very eye-opening. Growing up in New York City, I didn't know how to build a house. I didn't know how to lay foundation. I didn't know how to do any of that. But you get six weeks of it in the 18-Charlie course, right? Special operations construction. And then the demolition part, learning.

I've always been good at math. So that part of it was easy. So learning how to calculate to take down trees, how to blow up bridges, like all that math that goes into that. So I thrive there. Then we did UXO, which is essentially learning how to do EOD's job

is exactly what it is because on a team, like Agent Charlie has to do that, especially if we don't have any EOD attachments, right? So I learned that and then target analysis, knock that out. and in the FTX, that's where I had a little bit of trouble because it was cold, man. Was it still out in the woods where they had that big tower in the center?

Yeah, yeah, that was one of the missions, man. And for whatever reason, I couldn't get the time fuse to cooperate. So we'd go out on our mission and I was the senior Charlie and we had to take down, I think it was a bridge mission that we had to take down. So we went through just like we were supposed to, and I had time fuse set up, and then I just couldn't make the time. So I failed my mission, right, went back through it. And that was a defeat for me that I wasn't looking forward to

because we're at this point, phase, this is phase three, right? I have language and then I have Robin Sage, and I'm done. So I was worried about failing So I got in my head And it really fucked with me And I didn't know how to calm my mind Like I was worried about failing and failing and failing And the next mission I went out

And I felled it again Right So it's like So when you fell it the second time Time fuse Now the The umcadry Has to you know

Build a time system And make sure that It's not the actual batch Right right Because you're being graded And what does it have to be Within 30 seconds Or 60?

No, it's It's not, I think it's three seconds, man. Oh, is it? Yeah. 30 seconds a long time. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

It's plus or minus three seconds. Okay. Okay. So Cadre then goes out after I fell my second time, and he built a time system off of that same batch that was using. Yeah. So he goes out and he builds it and he's fucked up also. Oh, good.

So I was like, yes. Yeah. So the time fuse itself was bad. Yeah. So that lot was bad. It's like a slow burning fuse or whatever. And it's because the weather has a way of affecting the time fuse systems, especially the shit we get, man. It's like from like Vietnam.

Right. Like it's old. Stuff they're planning. Yeah. Out of storage. So he goes through. He built his and he is also misfires. So I'm like, yes, I'm not getting recycled, right?

Because he can't make it work. Like, how does he expect me to make it work? I'm a student. You're the expert. You're teaching me this stuff, right? So because the lot was bad, I ended up, you know, getting a third mission. And this time, we didn't do time fuse. We just did command debt, I mean, which is pretty self-explanatory. So I end up, you know, getting through the 18 Charlie course. But for a moment there, like, I was worried that I was going to get recycled. And at that point in time, if you get recycled and you fell like one other thing, then you'll kick out the Q course, right? Never to return.

So that all played in my head. I'm learning it from it now as far as how I should have dealt with it as for as, hey, you know the information, you pass all the exam, you've done all the work, like reassuring myself, you know what I mean, but at that point in time, like, I was a mess, man. I was like, man. I'm a hell. You mentioned Special Operations Construction, and this is something I don't think we've really gone into depth on the show.

But can you talk a little bit about the 18 Charlie, not just like the wartime 18 Charlie, all the unexplained. When we say UXO, we mean unexploded ordinance and demolition and stuff like that, which I think people often think about with Charlie's. But like building a house, like what is the role of the 18 Charlie on a team? So the 18 Charlie is responsible for, because the best with that I explain it, and it goes for all of our MOSs is the 18 Charlie MOS is eight separate. jobs packed in one, right? So you have your big Army component, which is the 12 Bravo. Then you have your supply guy,

right? Like, so when I was on a team, not only was I responsible for, you know, the IED, the demo, I was also responsible for building my base camp, right? At which the 18 Charlie, like, that's one of your

functions. You acquire building materials and you build this base camp. We did And that's exactly what I did. Village Stability Operations in 2010. I, you know, had my little workforce. I ordered, you know, all the building materials. And then we build a shit ton of bee huts, right? We laid foundations, right?

I also ran that base camp as the camp mayor, right? Responsible for getting to cook all the supplies he needed, responsible for getting the dudes, whatever they needed, right? Essentially a glorified supply guy, right? I did all of that. And also base defense, too. Base defense is the Bravo. Okay.

But whatever the Bravo needs, Constantino Wire, HESCO's, like, that would fall on my shoulders to get home, right? So in a nutshell, man, so jack of all trades when it comes to the 18 Charlie. Because all the other guys, like the 18 Bravo has his base defense and all of that, the echoes, comms, the Delta has his clinic. Everybody has that little part, but I always joke, like, if you have a shitty 18 Charlie, you're going to feel it. Yeah.

If you have a shitty echo, you might notice something once you're out on a mission, right? If your Delta sucks and you get shot, yeah, you're going to know it then. But if you don't have an 18 Charlie, you're going to fill it right away because your quality of your life is going to be shit. You won't be able to get anything that you need. Your property book will be all messed up, right? So I always joke Jack of Fortrade and probably one of the, I'm not going to say the most important MOS, but definitely one of the most important MOS is that needs to be solid when it comes to the team. team group.

Yeah. And so you talked about going back to the Q course. I mean, you get your language, you get, go to Robin Sage, and then did you know you were going to third group? No. So I'm a French speaker. Right. So when I got to language, I already had like a...

You grew up speaking French. Yeah. Yeah. So I already had like a DLPT score. But like throughout that, you know, years. long process like I grew pretty tight with the dudes so I didn't want to jump ahead language was six months at that point so I was like man I don't want to leave these group of dudes so I opted to go back through language so I can stay with the dudes but what that did was it it decreased my chance of

getting third group right so when I graduated I had orders to go to 10th group right but I wasn't trying to have that I was like I can't go to 10th group Europe I was like no I'm a little I'm lose my mind, right? So I went to the battalion CSM, I think it was Bobby Sinkle at that point. And I was like, hey, like, my wife is going to ECU. Like, I just moved her out of K-State so she could come here. Like, I can't move my family again. And he was like, I don't want to tell you, man.

Like, you got orders for 10 school. I was like, shit. So I found a classmate that, right? was also an 18 Charlie and who also had fringe and he had orders third group and he didn't want to go to third group he wanted to go out to Fort Carson so he and I did a one for one yeah so he ended up I was going to say that your desires pretty are pretty much counter to typical so I imagine that it wouldn't have been too hard to find you know somebody to swap with people would have been like lining up you can like auctioned it off yeah auctioned the spot off yeah because at that

point, a third group had just switched its A.O. from its area of operations from Africa to just Afghanistan. They were like, yep, that's what the fight is. Like, we're going straight there. I didn't know that at the point. I just didn't want to go to Fort Carson. Yeah. You know what I mean? So, but it all worked out. Yeah. So tell us about, like, landing on your first ODA, what that experience was like. Oh, man. So, so I got done with the Q-course, and I took about two weeks worth of leave. And when I showed up to a third group, there was the group headquarters was for deploy.

So the group CSM and the group commander, they were both at Camp Vans down at a siege of soda because third group had the siege of Soto at that point. So I showed up. Group headquarters is empty. You know what I mean? So staff duty takes me to the back. And they were like, hey, nobody's here. I was like, well, I'm here.

Like, what do you? Like, you guys got to do something with me, right? So they, so I deployed right away. So within two weeks, I was en route to Afghanistan to go to camp-ins and make a link up with third group. So I go over there in process, group headquarters, got a chance to speak with the battalion commander, Colonel Bulldog, or General Bulldoch. and then the battalion CSM, or group CSM, and I told him, hey, I just got out the Q-course.

I'm ready to go to whatever team you want me to go to. And they're like, nope, you're not going anywhere. We need you here at the B-Doc. I'm like, base defense, whatever the acronym is. I'm like, so you're keeping me here at Bagram as opposed to me going to Kanahar or whatever and link up with the dudes. So I ended up staying at the bath for

four months. It's a depressing place. Dude, it was horrible, man. It was fucking horrible. But I was like, hey, since I'm going to be here, I'm going to make the best out of it, right? Because now I'm the camp mayor. You know, I became the guy on camp fans.

Everybody knew me. So I was like, oh, man, this S.F guy stuff is awesome. Right? So I'm just, I'm living too good, right? As a new guy, I'm living like way too good to where I started to piss some people off. Dude, I can't make this shit up, man. Like I was, like we were throwing parties. Like, we were inviting like chicks from like big army to come on a camp van.

And we were like every Thursday, dude. We had a little B hut by the B dock, and we were just pointing it up every Thursday, like clockwork. We're having parties in there. And finally, somebody, I'm not going to say his name, but somebody went to the group CSM,

and they were like, hey, for a new guy, Jay shouldn't be having this much fun. Those were his exact words. Right, right. Because I was sitting at one of those parties and the S-1 and C-O-IC came in. And he was like, Jay, like, what did you do? I was like, what did you mean?

And he was like, yo, such and such just went to group CSM and he told him that you are having too good enough a time. You need to go grunt it out like all the other SF guys and earn your keep to have this much fun. And I'm like, I showed up ready to go to a team. I didn't choose this. But if you're going to give it to me, I'm not just going to suck and be miserable. Like, I'm going to have a good time, right?

Come to find out later on, that guy was upset because there was a certain girl that he was pursuing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That was hanging out with me. Yeah. And I'm like, man, this dude is supposed to be like a senior leader. Like, I'm just an E6. This dude is like an E9. Like, why is he worried about me?

But he wanted the girl. Yeah. He couldn't have it because I had him. So he had to get, he had to remove me from the picture. Bro, like within two days, I was on a C-130. Like, literally en route to fucking, sort of south. I was like, I didn't even get a chance to say goodbye or anything. So I get to Kenneux, and that's where First Battalion was, right?

So First Battalion was down there. Leading up to that point, like, throughout my entire four months, there. I had buddies that I graduated the Q course with that was, you know, doing work and sort of south. So I was talking to him on the regular like, hey, do you guys need a Charlie? Like, I'm over here. If I get a chance to leave, like, can I come to your team? So I was already politic and in networking. So whenever I got to boot, I went straight to sort of south and I was able to get on the team right away. But once I got there, man, I was like, I wasn't ready for the new guys shenanigans because I didn't know anything about it, right? So I showed up

And for the first four months, no one called me by my name. I think they called me Daryl. And I was like, my shit, man, just call me token. Like, what the fuck, right? But, you know, they called me Daryl. I had a little box that they made me build to keep all my clothes in. But throughout all of this, like, I was still, you know, like building the Firebase. Because this was the era of, I think it was McChrystal, his coin.

Yeah, yeah. You know, village stability operations stuff, right? It was like 2010, 2011. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So this is 2010. So doing, you know, all that stuff. Like, I'm building, like, the Firebase with my senior, you know, managing the base camp, running the workforce, training the ALP, managing the NSF.

So, but as a new guy, man, like, even though all that shit was going on, like, I just did my job. Right. You know what I mean? like I earned my keeps, you know what I mean? Because I knew why they were doing it. And I'm like, dude, I grew up in New York City. Like, you're not going to get under my skin by talking. If you put hands on me, it's different.

But eventually, once they realized it was just talking, it wasn't affecting me. Then everything kind of started to switch. And I started to integrate myself into the actual team. Now, in 2010, a lot of the guys had probably had quite a bit of experience in Afghanistan. What was that like for you coming in? Not only a brand new Charlie, but also brand new to this combat environment. Oh, no, but you had already been. I'm sorry.

So I thought, right? So we're in Kandahar and my, Kent Brown, and my team comes to pick me up. And my team's heart goes, you know, hey, I need you to get on the gun trucks. And he starts telling me what I need to do, right? And I look at him, I'm like, hey, something. like I've deployed before. I know what I'm doing. Dude, he looks at me.

And we all know, like, that's something you don't do, right? Especially your team son. He doesn't even know me. He looks at me. He was like, this ain't that type of war. This isn't Iraq. This is the Wild Wild West, right? I'm like, oh, shit.

He didn't talk me for like two weeks just because of that statement. But to your point, it was completely different because, like I mentioned earlier, Iraq, I was, you know, reactive. Something happens, and then we react. to it. Now we're being proactive. We're going out on missions every day and we're creating white space. Right. So I was loving it, man. It was exactly what I was looking for to answer your question. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Sorry, for some reason, my mind blanked out on that on your first two deployments. And what, like, what was it, how did the team treat you, like knowing that

you sort of already had, you know, this experience as it called Bravo? It didn't matter, man. Okay. No, it didn't matter at all. I was still the new guy because, and I tell guys this now, whenever they reach out to me for guidance, I'm like, you got to understand. You're going from a conventional space to a unconventional space now. Just because you've deployed before, you know, with Big Army, your missions were probably different than what you're going to do in SF. Right. Right. So, and it was. What I was doing when I was a Big Army was, even the way we cleared IEDs were completely different than how I used to do it. Yeah. It was, hey, there's an idea over there. Like, where's the robot? You know, like, where's, and my senior Charlie's like, robot, what you're talking about, man? Like, just go over there. I'm like, I'm not going over there.

He's like, I'm not going. You're the junior. Go over there, right? But it was different. Like, we, you know, walked around, look for command wire. You know, we cut it if we found it. If there was no command wire, we had the backpack jammers. Like, and if it was something that wasn't saved, we just walked in my pocket.

At the big army, there is no marking bypass. We have to get rid of it. So even, you know, it was different from that aspect. So everything that we were doing was completely different. And it really opened my eyes. I'm like, man, like, I wish I had done it earlier. But I didn't know about it until that point in my career. When you were with Bigger, were you guys involved in any ticks?

No, no. It was all, I guess you can call. We weren't involved. We were just getting shot at. Right. Right, like that. I wouldn't call that involved because I would, when I think of involved, I'm thinking off a two-way range.

Like, they're shooting, we're shooting back. It was more, hey, you know, we're conducting rod clearance, IED goes off, and they shoot at us. And we just stand there like, oh, God, like, shoot back. We'll shoot back in it, but we stayed on the hardball. Like, there was no maneuvering. There was no giving chase. Yeah, command was just a risk-adverse at that point.

You know, that's what, like, looking back at it now, I'm like, man, we never stood a chance. Yeah. I mean, because you put our idea over there, like, dudes get blown up and all we do is shoot back. We can't chase after them because they won't let us. Right. It was just a, yeah, it was just a mess, man. I mean, you said that you went to SF largely for that reason, looking to take the fight to the enemy. I mean, did you find that when you got there?

Yeah, so that first deployment, again, it was VSO, so we were kind of like stuck to our little village there. Right. But just within that, we were able to, you know, create white space. and take it to the Taliban. But then the consecutive trips, I was able to, like, we were a lot more kinetic. We were running commandos

like two rotations in a row, and we had a chance to go all over the country. The Kandak commandos? Yeah, yeah. I had second Kandak out of Jabad, and they were the national response force for Afghanistan. So whenever something jumped off, they were the first to go.

Yeah. So running those guys, we had a chance to go all over Afghanistan. and just take it to the end of them. What was that like for you personally? You know, because everybody has this, you know, first sort of combat experience or this first sort of target prosecution experience.

But you, like, you went to SF because you were tired of being on the receiving end of that. So what was it like for you personally the first time you, like, went at it? Like, prosecuted the target as opposed to react it. Yeah. It was good, man, because I felt like I was getting revenge. Yeah.

Like, I was getting payback. for all the dudes that I had lost prior to and couldn't do anything about. Yeah. Right. So it was awesome, man. I think I got to the point where, like most of us, I enjoyed it too much. Yeah. To the point where once I got to that point in my career, it was hard to turn it off.

You know what I mean? Like, I found myself, like, wanting more and more of it, even though there wasn't any to be had. So I would say that was a byproduct of, you know, that first initial experience. Now, I wasn't cutting off ears and wearing it and, you know, anything of my head. along those lines. But for normal people, when you take a life, you feel some sort of sadness or whatever. For me, it was like, you had it come and like, who's next, right? And that just, you know, over the span of, you know, 12, 13 years, it just got worse

and worse over the time, right, to where I didn't feel any remorse at all. Yeah. You know what I mean? So that's the, I guess, the blowback that could come from, you know, having that type you know, hatred that most of us have when we lose somebody. Yeah. So from that first trip, are there any, like, really, like, notable

stories that stand out to you? Yeah, so from that first trip doing VSO, the first one, that was, like, the first time I got shot at, I think, is what stood out the most, because it was just a regular patrol. And we were, you know,

pushing that a little bit further away from the VSO site at that point because we had enough white space within the site to be comfortable. But we're like, yeah, we still got a village that we're responsible for, but it's a little, like, it's further out. So we had to push out towards that village.

So we did. And we went into the village, did our key leader's engagement, Kelly. And once that was done, we're coming back. And then we got engaged. And I remember this because, like, we're on the other side of the wadi, now heading back towards the VSO site and we had

an element that was still coming out of the bodies and they started engaging while they were not in there. So we turned around and we start shooting back. And of course, like your typical firefight, they're not like right up on you. Right. There's some standoff. So we're shooting at, you know,

muzzle flashes and windows and all that stuff. But their fires were pretty effective. Like they were, like we can see them. And I remember I was standing there and, you know, rounds were hitting around my feet and I just stopped and I'm like oh man this is what it feels like to get shot at you know not ducking for five like not taking cover none of that stuff I was just standing there like oh like I'm like I was amazed by it you know because meeting up to this point all I saw was what's on television right oh you get you get shot at it's supposed to sound like this

it's something like this is nothing like it at all it's just dirt coming right it's just kicking up dirt right and I got yelled at by my you know senior bravo he's like hey idiot get me on cover You know what I mean? But I almost got shot in the leg that day. So that would be the most memorable thing that came out of that deployment because all the other ones were like pretty similar, right? We would, there's some standoff. They shoot at us.

We shoot at them. If it lasted a certain amount of time, we called for air support. Right. Right. And that's how it was until I got to like the more kinetic stuff. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, good times. So let's jump into that working with the Kandak commandos.

Yeah. You guys, I imagine, had like, CH-47 support get you guys where you needed to go. Yeah, so that one was, so 2012, we went, so that first one was 13 months for me because I had my time of the B-Doc, and then I did 10 months with the team. Go back, went through all that crazy admin stuff, and then we redeployed in 2012. This time we're running commandos out of J-Bad. And that was, we had, at that point, we had 10 dudes on the team because you never have a full SF team. It's because, yeah, it is what it is. And then we were running a Kandak that had three companies.

And then each companies had about 150 dudes, right? Three platoon of 50 plus dudes, right? And we would do 24 on, 48 off. right so we would go out for 24 hours we would clear a village and then we would strong point a building wait for the sun to come up because that's when they typically fight us

and we would fight and then we'd ex-fill the next day so we did that because how we rotated was so there'll be a candac on green cycle there'll be one on amber and there'll be one on red just like we have ours

right so whichever one was on green cycle we did missions with them and then whenever we were back, we would train the other ones. We would go check out their training. So that 48 off wasn't really off because we were still go train the other guys. But that one was good, man, because one, we had a chance to, you know, be in helicopters everywhere we went and we had all the air support whenever we went out, right, which made it that much more better, my father-in-law would say, right?

So, yeah, we had a ball. One of the, probably one of the best missions that I did during that rotation was we got a chance to go back to cockcating. Right. So in April of 2012, and for those that don't know about cockating, that was where that entire fob got overran, right? And nursed and they had it at the bottom of the bowl and they got over there. I remember this. Several guys got metal honors out of that. trip. But after that incident, the U.S. pulled, the coalition pulled everybody out of that area.

There was no U.S. presence at all. The only thing that was left was the militia that was, you know, guarding that area or that lived in that area. So in 2012, the militia was getting ready to get overran. And then the district, the district center was next. So we, since we were a national asset, we got spun up to go down to Camdash, NERS then, and actually go take, take, take, take, take, go take the fight to those dudes. So we spun up four CH47s with all sorts of air assets because, again, since we're a national asset, the president at a cause I literally called down to see just soda things. He was like, hey, I need commandos in there, like now. So we spun up, went down in there, commandos, and it was, dude, it was 48 hours of just dukeing it out with those dudes.

It was ridiculous. And I mean, that's, I've never been to Neurostand, but I've been told by many people that's like the most challenging terrain you can possibly imagine. Oh, man. There was one, one HLZ that we had to use. That was usable. The other one was on Camder. It was on Katie. Uh-huh.

So we either land at that one HLZ that everyone in the area knew was serviceable or the pilots, they wanted to put us down to Copcady. And then we would have to fight uphill to get to our position. We're literally going through the Taliban as we were trying to get to the high ground. We were like, no, we're not doing that, man. Put us on the serviceable HLZ and just have air, just have them prep the area. Yeah. And then once we're on the ground, then we can maneuver and get where we need to. to go.

Was that serviceable HLZ? Was that at a higher elevation? Oh yeah. It was literally because the way

it's set up, you know, all the collats and all that stuff. So we had upper cam dash and then you had lower cam dash.

All the bad dudes were at lower cam dash. You know what I mean? So they ended up putting us up here. We linked up with the militia and then we did 150 commandos.

We just let them loose, man. And I remember this because we linked up with the commander of the militia and they told us straight up, he was like,

hey, all the women and children are gone. Yeah. Everybody that's down there, they're all Taliban. And my captain, he actually was with the 173rd a couple of years prior to, and he used to be in that same area. Oh, wow.

Yeah, so it worked out because he still knew some of the militia dudes. And he looked at him and was like, okay, that's all we need to know. Yeah. Like that night, like we got into our positions, and then we just waited. And it's like clockwork, man. day breaks, because they knew we were there. Yeah. Like day breaks, and it was just,

oh, man, it was on. Like, they, they, they, uh, put up, they put up a pretty good fight because the way they were set up, like inside those mud huts, they cut out like firing holes. So, and then they backed off all them to where we, we didn't see the muzzle flash. Right.

So the sun comes up and we're taking like, effective fire. Like, I'm talking about like, you can hear the round. going by your head, but we didn't know where it was coming from. Right. Because they were like inside the buildings, but they had it set up to where the rounds were still like a loophole. Yeah. Yeah. So we're like, Jesus, man, like what is going on? Like we don't like, we hear it. Like it's coming in, but we don't see who we're shooting at. And finally, we're just like, you know, fuck it. Like gun runs. Yeah. Right. Like, so we just called in cast, man. It was like, hey, all of this, we're taking fire from right here. And it's a face. like to get the freaking Apaches down here and just fucking like level all this stuff, right? And that's what they, so as soon as the Apache's started doing that, they started to run.

Right. And at that point, you got commandos with the 240s up top. Like, we got our freaking Gustavs and it was just like open season, man. 48 hours later, like 68, EKIA. Wow. That was the first two days. How are you guys getting, I mean, I assume that over 48 hours, you have to get some combat resupply. Yeah.

How are you guys getting that? So prior to leaving, as the 18th Charlie, I had bundles, speed bundles planned. Uh-huh. Right. So we had air resupply schedule. And then we also had, like, we also went in heavy. Since we had the CH-47s, we loaded that thing down. And when we came off the helicopters, we just threw everything off and we left it on the H-H-H-7s.

LZ, right? So throughout the entire days, we had, like, the locals were on Upper Kandesh with us, and they had donkeys. So my team, my team son had them doing runs back and forth, grabbing supply off HLZ and bringing it down to us up an upper Kambesh. So food, water, more ammo and all that's. And we had commandos, man, 150 commandos. Yeah.

Like, we gave each of them, like, a thing of Gustav round to carry because, you know how there's two rounds in each. Yeah. We just handed it to him, be like, hey, Kemp, carry this, carry that, carry that. Right? So we had like our own little freaking resupply going. And on top of that, we had those bundles that, and we ended up using them later on because we ended up staying out there for seven days.

Wow. Yeah. Imagine that many Gustav rounds, like shooting that many Gustav rounds, like shooting that many Gustavs really rang some bells. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. That's, dude. I fired three, and, you know, the max is two.

I fired three. And then, of course, you're not keeping count. Right. And the heat of the one. We're just sending them. so my bravo had to pull me off of it and then he got on it and then we just kind of swapped out like that but yeah it was wild man because we can we're shooting from upper camdesh into lower camdesh right and then you can see them like going through like their kazevac plan right so as dudes get

injured like there there there was a bridge down the road because pakistan is like i would say about 10 minutes also down the road. So they have like a pickup come. They load up their wounded and then they haul butt, you know, and then they'll go do whatever. And then they'll throughout the entire days, they just repeat that same process. But it was nice, man,

because after everything was done, we had a chance to go down to copcating and actually walk those same ground. Yeah. And it was like, man, they left a bunch of shit behind. Like, what the fuck? Like connexes full of stuff. You can tell like the Taliban have been living in there.

just pillaging all that crazy stuff down there. So, yeah, that was a pretty good experience going back there and actually fighting off the same guys. That probably had a lot to do with copcating. Yeah. Yeah. So that was actually pretty cool. That's wild, man. Yeah.

Good times. All of these, like, there's so many stories about Afghanistan that, like, unless you talk to the guy who was there, like, I don't think, did this ever come out in the papers or anything? Probably not. Yeah. Yeah, so there was like a short snippet on it about, you know, ODAs going back into that area and doing work and killing like 72 plus dudes. And then there's a book out called The Outposts by the guy from CNN, Jake Tapper. Yeah, yeah. There's a verbiage on there about, you know, us being the first Americans to go back there since Cady fell.

But again, to your point, there's a lot of history that isn't being talked about. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think we do ourselves a disservice. And until this day, similar to you guys, like, I'm trying to do podcasts. I'm trying to get our community out to talk more, right? Because it's like, I get it. There's a difference between being a quiet professional. Sure.

Like, I got it, man. But there's just, when the realm of podcasting and social media, it's not going to go away, right? We can be like the dinosaurs and kind of fade away, right? Because if we don't tell the youth who we are and what we do, even, dude, till this day, man, I still get questions from some of these younger guys that reach out to me through Instagram and YouTube. What's a Green Beret, man?

Like, what do you guys do? Are you guys, like Navy SEALs? I'm like, no, man, like, we're a completely different entity. Yeah. These are the missions that we conduct, right? Yeah. Uncommission of warfare. Not a lot of people can do that.

Yeah. I'm having to explain to them what it is when other units have done a really good job at selling themselves. Yeah, right. And that's something that we don't really do a lot of them. Yeah. And there's a substantial difference, you know, because you talk about the quiet professional,

and there's a substantial difference between beating your chest and relaying, like, personal history. And while you're relaying personal history, you're relaying history itself, right? Yeah, as you tell me the story, I mean, it sounds so much like the Mike Force mission in Vietnam or hatchet force that the SAG had, you know, going in heavy. Direct action, but working with indigenous personnel.

It's really cool. Yeah, yeah. And there's a lot more of these type of stories out there, right? We just don't know about them, right? Right. Dude, like, we have medal of honor winners. We have dudes that's done incredible things. Right.

And sometimes it breaks my heart knowing that, hey, that story is going to die with that dude. Right. Or some of these history, it's just going to go away. Right. you know the folks that are going to you know backfill us are going to have to relive some of the same pitfalls right when it could easily be mitigated by

them getting on YouTube and watching a podcast and saying oh wow jay this mistake or jackman like let's not do that again right like that's what it's all about is better in the next generation well how many like Vietnam lessons from Vietnam did we have to relearn you know you know like the heritage is in is not continued it's not kept on yeah unfortunately so

After that one, you went back and did another deployment with Kandak? Yeah, so this one was with second Kandak out of Jabad. The trip after that, 2014, we did third Kandak out of Gordez. We did a rotation with them, and that was a really kinetic operation, too. Like, that one itself was, you know, like 2015, like we're done in Iraq, right? Like this was the era where we closed everything down. Right. And then we went back in and opened everything up, right?

So that one, out of Gordez, was more area-focused. So we didn't have the entire country at that point. We just had our little slice of the pie. And that one was just more the same, just kinetic. But the only different there was, hey, like, they already told us that we're leaving. Like, after this, like, this is the last hurrah. Right, right, right. We're closing, like we were going out and conducting ops,

and then we were retrofitting base camp at the same time. Yeah. So that one was a different beast because I don't know how the Taliban found out that we were supposed to leave. So it was sporadic here and there because we would go out, you know, have an awesome mission, get into some firefight, and then we'd go out the next day and it'd be dead because at that point, they're just waiting us out.

Right. They're like, hey, you guys are leaving. Right. And a couple of months. then we can have all this shit right but that one I remember I got one takeaway from that and that was

a lot of people call it your happy to be a live day or whatever you know what I mean so I remember when I got shot at and I also remember when I almost died you know what I mean and this one in particular

we had hit this village it wasn't even our it was the first group team that that needed support. Because since we had commandos, if other teams want us to come in and help them, since we had like 150 dudes, we can easily go in and support them. So they requested us to go in. So we went in there and we cleared this entire village.

And I remember we got done with the clearing operation. We strong point. And then we just kind of hung out. But the day prior to, there was no move. Like, there was no intel saying that there was bad dudes there. We didn't have any issues while we were clearing through the village. So we're like, oh, this is another dead spot. Like, whatever, man.

Like, we're just going to hang out. So I told him, we had the American flag. We had the Texas flag under that. One of my buddies was sun tanning. Like, it was like, okay, this is what we're doing, right? So I was on one of the rooftops with my buddy. we were just talking. And at that point, we,

every time we go out, we always rolled in heavy. Like, that's something that we've always done. So my bravos were genius in that way that they brought it, they brought out the, the grenade launcher. Mark 19, right? So, yeah.

Okay. So we had the Mark 19. We also had the Mark 14, the handheld one. Oh, no, no, no. This is like the Mark 19. Gotcha. The vehicle mountain. The vehicle.

Yeah. Yeah. Because we have the command of us. We're like, yo, like, wherever we went, we always rolled heavy. Worst case scenario, right? So we had the Mark 19s. We had the mini gun. We had all that stuff.

And every time we were strongpoint, because we would always roll with the razors also. Every time we strong point, we took them off the vehicles, the razors, and then we put them on top of the buildings, and we built fortified fighting positions, right? We had all the command. We always had all the commandos fill sandbags. And we set it up as if we're expecting to fight. So we had it set up, you know, identical to how we've done it like hundreds of time. But this time, instead of manning it and, you know, like, we're just hanging out because we're not expecting a fight.

So we're up there talking and then, like, I remember it vividly. Like, he and I were talking face to face, and I heard the rounds going between him and I. That's how close they were. And it was like, and then I watched it hit. There was a first group dude with us. He had a scar heavy. The rounds hit his scar and ricochet into his biceps. Oh, no shit.

Yeah. So he got hit. And then I just jumped off because I, like, I didn't have my kid on. I didn't have my gun on. Like, I didn't have anything. I was just up there just playing around, right? So I dove off the roof. and my buddy did the same

and then that entire morning was just us going back and forth with them called G's the Mark 19 I was like oh shit the first group dude like his bicycle was all like tore up his score heavy was all messed up

and I was like man I credited it to my lucky hat that's why I wear this thing all the time and I'm like oh man this hat has saved my life more time than I can remember but yeah so that was was the, because just an inch over and my whole jaw line

would have been gone, not my entire head, you know what I mean? Like, that's how close I came to not even having a freaking face. Yeah. So, how, how easy was it for you guys, being Kandak, how easy was it for you guys to get Aaron Station and

could stack it, yeah? Pretty easy. Pretty easy. Because running commandos, man, you get everything that you asked for. So we had two J-TACs, two combat controllers that that were attached. And everything we want on were level ones, right? So that's just the level of the con up for the audience,

if you guys don't know what we're talking about. So with the level ones, we had the ability to, you know, gunships, Apaches, like we had all of that. But they weren't, they were there for infill and Xville. Right. And then on, like, doing the actual engagements, we would still have to call and ask for it. But often time.

So you didn't have a ton of stuff on stage. during an operation. No, no, no. Just they cover infill and ex-field, because we both know, like, that's the most dangerous time. But during the day, since it's a 24-hour op, they push off and go support wherever. But if we did get into a firefight and we call for support,

they normally show up because we were still priority. Yeah. So, yeah. And so as time goes on, I mean, you're doing these deployments, and when was it about that you took a team sergeant? position so 2014 into 2015 we get back from that rotation and at that point I'm like man we just closed down a base camp like this there's no more fight to be had right so I I go to SWIC and I go to the agent Charlie committee I was a UXO instructor then I was the op sergeant over there and then I became

the committee chief. And then I got promoted out of SWIC. And then went back to third group and took over my team in 2019. Awesome. And then from there, probably the best job in the regiment. You know what I mean? Because at that point, man, like I'm, you know, I had like, I had a really young group of dudes, right? But my most senior guys had two years in.

It was all 18 x-rays. Yeah, pretty much. To where I had to go outside and recruit some senior guys just to help mentor those dudes. Yeah. But it was awesome, man, because now I had a chance to, you know, coach, teach and mentor and develop all those guys. Until this day, man, like, I'll hit him up and be like, hey, man, I'm going to New York for the team house podcast. Give me two coins, right? Yeah.

They give me two coins, right? So some of the best dudes that I've ever worked with That's cool Yeah It's pretty awesome So what was it like being a team sergeant I mean aside from what you described I mean like operationally

At that time 2019 2020 Yeah so 2019 I always joke that I had my hardest deployment in 2019 Because when you're in Iraq I mean when you're in Iraq or Afghanistan

Like you know You know Hey I'm gonna wake up I'm gonna do this I'm inside of the wire. Once I go outside the wire, it's game on. Enemy shooting at me, I'm shooting back to that.

2019, I took my team to Jordan for seven months. And I, like, so you're sending me to Jordan, permissive area of operation. Guys can go drink.

Guys can go party. Guys can essentially hang themselves if they wanted to, right? Just through all the... Lots of ways of getting to do. Yeah, not literally hanged themselves. Yeah.

But tons of ways. You're given a lot of rope. Yeah, tons of way to get in trouble. But I've always been that leader to where, like, I'm a demand, not necessarily demand, but I treat my guys in a matter as if they were my own kids, right? Like, I invest in them, I took care of them to where when it's time for them to do the same for me, they'll do that, right? So when we hit Jordan and we're, you know, working with Jordanian Special Forces guys, like, we train them from, to about one o'clock and then guys off right spread to the four wings to go do whatever they want

to do but at no point in time did any of my guys ever get in trouble because I had you know instilled that discipline and they gave a shit about me and they knew hey if I go drinking and I get myself in trouble then jay's going to get fired and then who knows who are going to get in here he's going to fuck shit up right so um I say it was the hardest deployment because for me it was hard because just like, man, I have no control over my dudes. I'm not going to, you know, restrict them to, you know, casatic or the base that we were at. I want to let them go do all that stuff, right?

Like, and I want to trust that they're going to do the right thing. But at night, I was still like, oh, my God. You know, he's like, oh, shit. It's 2 o'clock in the morning. Like, such and such is still missing. Like, what's going on, right? So that kept me up at night. And I'm like, I don't want to be that guy.

That's like, hey, man, where you're at? It's 2 o'clock. like you push me I'm like nope these are grown men like go like if I can't trust you here then how am I going to trust you in combat?

Yeah yeah I should be able to give you your your left and right limits hey you guys can go out do whatever but you know don't fight with the locals

or don't drive drunk like I should be able to give you simple guidance and you follow them in a permissive country and be okay right if you can't do that then you don't belong on this team and it worked out perfectly man

Like we did seven months down there working with the Jordanians, and then we came back and no incident at all. Out of curiosity, why did third group go to Jordan? Because fifth group couldn't hold their own. But no. So at this point, fifth group was heavy in Syria. They were doing a lot of work in Syria. And our dwell time as far as head the pillow was getting out of whack for fifth group, right? So so come so it fit for us to step in.

and rotate in Syria and also Jordan and also Lebanon to give him a break. Okay. And we did just that. We had a team in Lebanon. My team was in Jordan. We had guys at Tower 22, ATG, Kobani and all those other places. TANF. Yeah.

Yeah. But, yeah, it was just to give them like a quick break so they can get back on a cycle. Because a lot of folks, like when they hear, you know, SF guys, they don't realize that were a line based on language. And so Fib group had, like, they've been in the Middle East for so long. And, you know, your first groupers are probably doing sit in Thailand. And they don't rotate over there as much, right? So these guys are stuck, like, going back to back to back.

Yeah. And it's up to the leadership of a Tzucom to say, hey, man, like, let's rotate some of these guys. Yeah. So these guys don't get burned out. So they did that. We went in. I was like, man, the Jordan is awesome. You know what I mean? So it was a good trip overall. That's cool. And so how did you came back home and then how did you sort of like wind down your career in the Army? So I got back and I was supposed to do a third year as a team sergeant.

And at this point, like I finally got my captain to get a shit together. Like we're just jelling as a team, right? And we go to Safawik. We go to Safawik. And, like, team is closed. Like, I'm happy. I'm having a good old time. And, of course, that's when the universe has a way of humbling you, right? Like, that's when adversity kicks in. So we're at Safawik.

And I'm just having one of those days. Like, I'm on the range. Like, my team, because all we did in Jordan was, like, we trained the heck out of it. So we were, like, probably the best shooting team in the company, right? We go to Safowik, like, I had, like, five guys in the top 10 stress shoot, right? So we're just crushing it. And I remember that day, like, we're doing breaching procedures, right? So we had our guns loaded, but we weren't doing anything with them, right?

So I get a couple of phone calls, so I step away. The guys go to the bay and they clear their stuff because it's time to leave. I clear my lone gun, but I completely forgot to clear my pistol. So my pistol was still alive. So I go in the bay, and I have an indeed inside the bay, right? So that took place and I'm like, God, man. So that was defeating for me because I'm the team sergeant. Right, right.

There's nobody around. It's just me and my team. And I'm fucking defeated. Like, I am just pissed. Yeah. Right. So I go outside. I'm like, God, what the fuck just happened?

Of course, we look around. We find a hole, make sure nobody's hurt. But I go outside and my guys come out there like, hey, yeah, Jay, like, nobody heard anything. Like, nobody saw it. or anything like like we can call this good and be be done right but of course we know like that's not how that works right especially when I as the stand-a-beared told my guys when doing counseling hey this happens this is the consequence right now I can't now turn back and say hey it's me you're right you know what I mean yeah do what I do what I do exactly exactly so I had

three months left so I called my company so I'm major I was like hey man like this just happened. My Fox is going to be in charge of the team. In the meantime, like, I'm, I'm just going to go to SWIC because at that point, I had already lined up a first-on-job at SWIC, right? So I was like, hey, if it's cool with you, like, I can't stay on the team and have double standards going on. That's pretty hardcore that you fired yourself from the team because you didn't meet your own standards. That's hard-core, man. I didn't fucking like it. You know what I mean? I didn't like it. My guys didn't. I didn't. I didn't like it. My guys didn't like it but at the end of the day though

like I couldn't honestly yeah yeah like not I wasn't gonna kill myself but I couldn't look at my guys the same way right yeah because at the end like in the back of their minds even though they didn't have a problem with it it would still be like oh like

he had an incident he still or at least in the back of my mind it gets harder to instill discipline at that point once like you've you sort of laid down a law or standards yeah and then you know and then, you know, they're human error. Yeah.

And yeah. Yeah. So it sucks. So I, you know, told my son-major, hey, this is what my plan is. Fox took the team, finished it off, and I went to SWIC, right? But when I got to SWIC, since I had already, like, laid out the job and I had the NCOERs, and I was honest with them, then it wasn't a big deal. Because I went to the CSM.

I was like, hey, like, I had to leave three months early. This is what happened. Like, do with that information, whatever you see fit, right? And that's when he was like, hey, man, like, I've known dudes over the unit that blew their leg off. Or I've known guys that's done X, Y, and Z. So the fact that I was open and owned it went a long way, which is why I try to tell these kids nowadays, shit happens to all of us. Right. We all have bad days.

But what you do about it, that's what really matters. like holding yourself accountable. I didn't have to fire myself. I could have let my team covered for me, but at the end of the day, that wasn't the right thing to do. And I knew, like, that would fuck with me. And in case and point,

the following month, another sister team had a similar incident and the warrant try covering it. And then battalion find out, and then group find out. And it's like a whole, whole fucking shit show.

It's the cover-up that becomes the problem. Right. Yeah, exactly. So I'm like, I'm sitting back like, I'm glad I did what I did. You know what I mean? But yeah, so I go to SWIC and but at that point,

you know, I'm behind the desk as a first son. I'm like, man, this is fucking horrible. Yeah. What is this? Dude, it is not. I was like, God, Lee. So I'm sitting there,

fucking working on TPT reports and telling guys what to do. I'm like, Jesus Christ, man. Like, I need to do something else, right? So I jump on CIA.gov and I'm like, hey, like, put me a coach. Yeah. I go through that process. I fill out a packet. They send me all the paperwork. And then then I had to sit back and just kind of think about it. I mean, I'm like, man, like, this is, like I'm 19 years in, like, like, what am I doing? You know what I mean? Because I was chasing

that high. Yeah. And I was being selfish because I was. And I was being selfish because I I had two kids. Like I have a six-year-old and a three-year-old. So I'm like, man, like, I spent, you know, 19 years doing this. Doing what you wanted to do. Yeah. Yeah. Now I have, I finally have a chance to make a decision that's going to be my own.

And I'm choosing to keep going down on this path and ignoring what matters. Yeah. You know what I mean? So, so yeah, then I was like, you know what? I'm done. And I felt comfortable saying that because we didn't have anything going on. Yeah. Iraq was dying down.

Afghanistan is dying down. Syria wasn't a thing anymore. So I'm like, I could comfortable, like, I comfortably say, hey, I've had enough. Like, let me go focus on, you know, like my family. Right. And that's what I did, man. It's still sucked. Right.

I got out and I was like, fuck, man. Like, this is worse than being a first sergeant. So I had to find something to fill that void. Yeah. Find something to do. And that's when I got on YouTube. And I was like, I like, like, the most fun I've had. aside from, you know, BNAN range was when I had my team and I would help those guys problem

solve. I would give advice and watch it play out, right? So I'm like, I like to mentor. Yeah. So I started YouTube, man. Now it's like, how do I help the younger generation of SF guys get to where we were? Yeah. Like, how do we, how do I help them become successful? Like, avoid all the pitfalls that we went through. You don't have to go to three divorces, right? You don't have to do that. You can't if you want to, but you don't have to, and this is how that can play out.

When you're back home, instead of spending eight hours in a team room, drinking beer, go home. Right, right, right. You know what I mean? Like, you don't have to go to jail for, you know, selling fucking fuel or whatever like these are things that I've seen like play out you can do a different this is what it should look like just coaching and mentoring the next generation your your channel is the Green Beret Chronicles and is that sort of like the theme overall that

it takes that you're you're trying to impart some of this information to a younger generation yep like all the because you you mentioned Vietnam earlier yeah could you imagine what it would look like for us doing the global war of terrorism if we had Vietnam Air Green Berets shedding their stories and what they went through, Mike Force and all that stuff. Could you imagine? Like some of the mistakes we made in Afghanistan, we probably would not have

made them. Right. So it's like now we're at that road to where like you have three separate war better. Like we have Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan. Yeah. Like three separate countries that we were involved in

and so many lessons learned that we can share with this next generation we're no longer in it that information it's just gonna die with us if we don't do anything about it so why not share it with the next generation so they can learn from it right and make better decisions so uh you know i want to hear you you know sell the channel to our viewers out there yeah sure what are like you're you're like if you had to pick like your top two or three favorite videos that you've done that you'd like people to go check out on there all right so the first one's gonna be right so i have one on there that talks about

what you should do as a new guy when you first show up to a group. Because we all know everybody shows up. Hey, you saw a major. I want to go on a halo team. Don't do that. Go watch that video. It'll be very insightful for you.

And that's a greenberry chronicles.com. Another one I had is women in special forces, right? That's a sensitive one for some folks. On there, I share my thoughts. Is it spicy? It's very spicy because it goes along something like this.

Don't put them in there. They're going to destroy my team room, right? Because we're men and we want to put our stuff and stuff. So that's the second one. And then the third one that I have on there that's gained a lot of traction, believe it or not, is minorities in special forces. And on there, I just elaborate on exposure. Yeah. Because growing up in this very town, like even, you know, going from GFK and, you know, driving to Lower Manhattan. All I saw was, you know, basketball courts and all of that.

I'm like, man, like, I didn't... I went and I linked up with a buddy of mine that's currently recruiting. I couldn't even find the recruiting office. It was, like, tucked in, like, behind a wall somewhere. And I'm like, dude, like, exposure would have went a long way when I was growing up. If I knew, like, Green Berets existed. If I knew Navy Seals were a thing, if I knew about comeback controllers, Morsock. Like, I probably would have just...

There is a perception out there that, I mean, I don't want to hear your opinion, but I think mostly it's wrong that there's a perception on some that special operations as a whole is like a white boys club. No, no, not at all, man, especially over a third group and I'm sure fifth group, seven, no, not at all. But again, that's the exposure that. That's the exposure because, like, once we find it, just, I found it. Yeah, it was five years within my career.

But once I found it, I couldn't get it out of my head. Right. So I went and I tried it out. And that could be said with any race, right? Seven group is full of Hispanics. Fifth group has their majority of black dudes. Third group is, you know, dude, I was on a team with three black dudes, right? My team, my team, when I was a team song, I had three Hispanics dude in there.

So it's definitely a melting pot of dudes, right? And when you think of the missions that we do, it's beneficial. Right. But again, it comes down to exposure. And now that social media is throwing to come on thing, it makes exposure a lot easier. Yeah. Do you think there's also, because wasn't it Jason when we had him on the show,

he was on a college campus and talked to a CIA recruiter who was also, who was, I think the recruiter was also black. And Jason said, well, they don't want somebody like me. And the recruiters like, don't self-select. Yeah. Like, they'll tell you if they want you, But don't self-select based on some false premise you have. Do you think that's also an issue with...

Yeah, I think it is, man, because a lot of folks see it and they don't see themselves, right? Because we're not out here like that. And the folks that are, they don't look like them. So they're automatically thinking, oh, man, I don't belong out here. Oh, I shouldn't be out here, right? That's not the case at all. If you self-select, regardless of how good you are, you're not going to make it. Right.

Right. Show up and let them tell you whether or not you're good enough. Right. right but yeah I just wanted to break that mold by coming on there and saying hey check it out man yeah that's not the case at all we're not there because

the exposure just isn't there right no fault of the regiments on fault like no fault of the regiment like the exposure is just not there right I didn't find out about it until I was five years in right and the other services they do a really good job like recruiting like the Navy they go to

the NFL combines and they recruit out of there. They're in the colleges. I don't know why the Army doesn't, but exposure, man, that's what it comes down to. And now with social media, like, I try to do as much as I can to expose everybody that, hey, SF is for you. Like, if you don't like math and you don't like all this other stuff and, like, if you want to go towards the military and do this type of work, it's okay, right? Yeah.

We're not all supposed to be normal, right? It's all right to want to go jump out of planes and, you know, shoot dudes in the phase. Yeah. It's okay. Yeah. It's all right to, you know, to not fit the norm. You mentioned, like, mentoring the younger generation, but you also sort of, you know, you touched on both when you came back as a 12 Bravo having seen this stuff and then also, you know, your misery as a first sergeant and a civilian. You know, we see things like with SF groups now getting in trouble. The guys who were like, who were at that 100 mile an hour limit and now it's not there and finding a difficult ways or finding it difficult to

to fix that and to deal with that what do you think aside from the younger generation what do you think of like your generation of guys how are they managing what services and help do they need and what personally do you think

what helped you like manage that so um two things right so idle hands like we just had a big incident over a third group I read your article It was awesome The boys Yeah

So yeah We just had that big incident And it's idle hands man Like guys came in to go Kick in doors and do work And now it's no longer a thing And guys just don't know how to You know conform to anything else

They don't know how to get back on the right ass miff Right So they're going to find ways to entertain themselves And what I would say to the leaders, and I say this all the time on my channel, is you've got to keep those guys engaged. You've got to give them something to do. Because if you don't, they're going to find things to do, and you're not going to like it. So get creative. As a team sign, as a team leader, get creative.

Make sure that training calendars is full. No white space. If guys don't have that time available, they're not going to get in trouble. But you've got to keep them busy. And for the guys that are getting out, you've got to find that purpose. Right. you gotta because you're going from you know doing something that was incredibly like rewarding and now you're you know just at home and you're just babysitting kids you know like you don't

have anything else going on you you are you went from 100 miles an hour to just complete stop right so what is that next purpose like what is your entire mission of life and a lot of guys don't have that second identity they don't like they think they're just a green beret and that's it. Right. So they come out and like, I used to be Tom, the Green Beret,

and now I'm just Tom. It's like, dude, it's, like you can do other things. Yeah. The Green Beret is not who you were. It was just a section of you, it was just something that you did.

It was just a job, right? You're still a father, a son, you know, a pastor, like whatever. Like, look towards those other qualities and start tapping into that, right?

Like, find ways to, give purpose to your life because if you don't then like dudes are killing themselves over the shit man because they don't have another identity outside of the job

that they used to do what has that been for you like what shape has your life taken after retiring from the military I mean it sounds like being a dad big part of your life yeah so since I've been out man like enjoying my

kids more you know what I mean just watching them you know wake up and coaching T-ball taking them to Jiu-Jitsu and then My purpose have been, you know, like I said, through the YouTube channel, I've been able to find my purpose and my voice. You know what I mean?

On top of, you know, becoming a better dad and realizing, holy shit, if I had gun this other ride, I was going to miss all this stuff. Right. Like, there's a lot of people that we probably know that, you know, they're out of point now where their kids don't even want anything to do with them. Right. Like, they call their kids and the kids are not picking up. Right. You know what I mean? They don't even want you to be a dad.

Like, I wouldn't want to put that on anybody. you know, dealing with my kids now, you know what I mean? But that's what it's going to get to if guys don't find ways to kind of horn in into like their secondary life. Right, right. It's a small chapter in what you're meant to do. Yeah. You just have to find what that next purpose is.

And we do a lot, like we sell ourselves short a lot. As SF guys, like not realizing what we're worth. And the Army does a good fucking job. But how can you think that? Right. Reinforcing that. Yeah. This is all you're meant to do.

But then you come out here in the civilian sector and there's, dude, there's so much stuff that we learn as SF guys that is valuable out here. Right. Like, there's a ton of shit. And the more I get out and I talk to people and I, you know, network, I see it. I'm like, dude, you used to be in soft. Like, look at what you, like, there's a lot more out there. Yeah. Guys just sell themselves short.

Yeah. I mean, it's like a really important message, I think. because you're absolutely right that there are so many guys are like, I'm just a big, dumb ranger, I can't do anything. It's like, no, man, no, you can go do anything. And, you know, those guys can go out and they can get a business degree or they can do something that I could never do. And so, yeah, I mean, especially I feel like a lot of the younger guys

get down on themselves like that. And it's really important to like make sure they know that, like, you can have an entire second life and career. Yeah, like if you can do like special operations, whether it's Rangers, Seal, Morsock, SF, like, there's nothing that you can't do. And that's the mindset that I've adapted. It's like, dude, I go to other countries

and I double governments if I need to. So you're telling me, like, creating an LLC and starting a business in the United States is difficult. No fucking way. I'm a crush this. And that's the mindset that I've just taken on. It's like, dude, I go overseas and I do the impossible. You're telling me I can't start a YouTube channel

and grow that bitch? No. Right. And that's the way guys need to think. Yeah. There's nothing that you, if you can do what the top 1% of the 1% is doing, just like we've done. Right.

There's nothing you can't do. You know what I mean? And that's how guys need to approach you. So where can people find you if they want to find you on YouTube or they want to find your other endeavors out there? Where can they go find Jay? Sure, man. So Instagram, Greenberry Chronicles, and then YouTube, Greenberg Chronicles.

and the website, Greenbury Chronicles.com. We offer mentorship. We also offer Ruck programs and also training programs also on there. And we'll have links

to all of those down the description for you guys. And also I'll take two seconds to plug the Teamhouse Patreon. If you guys get on there for $5 a month, you get all these episodes

ad-free and you keep the channel running. We really appreciate all of you guys. Jay, Dave, final thoughts? Anything I failed to cover here? No, man. Everything was perfect.

And again, man, I appreciate you guys giving me the opportunity to come on and speak to you guys. Anytime. Yeah, you're welcome. If you decided to move back to Brooklyn. You can come on anytime you want? My wife would kill me. Yeah, man, I appreciate it, guys. Awesome.

All right, so we will see you guys next time.