The Therapy Edit - One Thing with Ashley James on navigating all the parenting advice

Episode Date: July 8, 2022

In this episode of One Thing, Anna chats with Ashley James about how to filter out unhelpful and unsolicited advice. Ashley James is a mum of one, podcaster, presenter, DJ and Dating and Empowerment Coach. You can follow Ashley on Instagram at @ashleylouisejamesYou can listen to Ashley's podcast 'Mum's The Word' here https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/mums-the-word-the-parenting-podcast-with-ashley-james/id1579670515

Hello and welcome to The Therapy Edit with me, psychotherapist's mum of three and author Anna Martha. Every Friday, I invite one guest to tell me the one thing they would most like to share with moms everywhere. So join with me as we hear this dose of wisdom. I hope you enjoy it. Hello and welcome to today's episode. It's a guest episode today of the Therapy Edit. And today I have with me, Ashley James. Ashley is a presenter, a DJ, and she, I think she describes herself as an empowerment coach.

And I think this is exactly what I get through the words that she says on social media and her honesty and her podcast with moms the words and her courage and bravery. And I do think it is bravery to kind of dive into topics that either we shy from or we don't necessarily know how to articulate. So I love following you, Ashley. I love all of the wisdom and the thoughts that you bring. And so welcome. How are you today? Thank you. The feeling is very mutual, by the way.

And yeah, I'm very happy to be on here. And I'm good. Apart from the everyday struggles and struggles that I feel like I'm not coping with very well at the moment. I am happy and that's the most important thing. Yeah. It goes up and down, doesn't it? Sometimes I think I'm just about holding on in there. And then some curveball comes along and everything, the balance just tips again.

and you kind of find yourself floundering. I'm just very good at doing one thing. So like when I'm really, really busy with work, that's all I want to do. And then I'm like, wait, I need to look after this child. And then vice versa when I'm with the child, I'm like, why are people bothering me with work stuff? I'm with my child. So, yeah, it's a juggling act. And obviously some weeks are crazier than others.

But, no, it's good. I'm kind of like really enjoying this stage of motherhood. Yeah. Well, thank you for all that you share about it. So, actually, if you could share one thing with all the mums, what would that one thing be? My thing would be for, I guess, reasons that have evolved throughout from pregnancy to now is not to give or take on unsolicited advice. So you don't ask, so advice that you haven't asked for or someone hasn't asked for. Yeah, I think as humans, we all do it naturally because.

some to different extents, but often we want to be helpful or we want to kind of fix things for people sometimes even to reduce our own anxiety, it's nice to feel like we're helping others. But for some reason, from the moment a person gets pregnant,

it feels like you're almost an infant again. Like people don't trust you to walk through life and to figure out what's right for you and to solve your own problems. and I found it. I actually really struggled with it in my own pregnancy because I felt like people were almost stamping on my joy. I call them the Just You Wait Mums.

And, you know, I'd be like, I can't wait for this. Insert, naive, optimistic comment about having a baby. And then people would like creep out, be like, just you wait. Or, you know, it could be anything, me packing my hospital bag. And they're like, ha, ha, you think you need that. I didn't need that. you won't need that. And I remember just feeling like, why are people trying to like

steal my joy, but also treat me like I'm suddenly a child again? And I always say it's a little bit like you deciding to go on holiday. Let's say solo traveling because it's something I love to do for this chapter of my life. And it would be a little bit like you're on your way to the airport. You're feeling nervous. You're feeling excited. You're feeling all the the fields. You're wondering if you've made a terrible mistake. Probably deep down, you're wondering if you're going to get murdered. And then on the way there, people are like, just to let you know, I had a friend who went solo travelling and she died.

Or just to let you know, my friend was on a plane crash, or just to let you know, or like, oh, you're going to Mexico. There's really bad drug problems there. Actually, someone just got shot yesterday. And by the time you get to the airport, you're like, oh, my goodness, I don't want to go anymore. What you really want is people to be like, you'll be great. Don't worry, stay safe.

If you need me, like, I've got you a lonely, planet guide to help you through the best bits or whatever it might be. But I feel like with motherhood, now that I am a mum, I understand why you want to do it. And I think it's because it's hard, especially when you're witnessing people go through pregnancy and they say sometimes quite jarring things, which I was guilty of being like, moms are so negative. I'm not going to be like those moms. And so you do kind of want to be like, how well, just you wait to see how you really feel or I understand now from the other side of why we want to do it and especially because for example if we really struggle with breastfeeding or sleepless nights we kind of wish

in hindsight that we were maybe warned or told about those things however when you have advice on every single aspect of motherhood and a lot of it you might not come across it's actually really really daunting and I think it's kind of disrespectful and presumptive to insert your opinions and ideas where they're not wanted and it kind of communicates an area of superiority. I actually saw Olivia Buckland and someone else I love following on Instagram, X Love Island. She did a post saying what she'd put in her hospital bag and the comments under it, they're just patronising. Like you won't need it. You don't need an eye mask.

You've packed earplugs. Yeah, good luck eating snacks in labour. and I just thought she might need those things, but also she might not. I packed 10,000 things I didn't need in my hospital bag, but also I love the process of packing, and I also love knowing that I pack for every eventuality. And ultimately, none of us know what people's pregnancies and labours

and how long they'll stay in hospital. So just let them figure it out. So, yeah, I just think I understand why people, want to give it sometimes and I think usually it's kindness or to be helpful but it's often not received like that and I think we can all remember you know being a new mum or pregnant and just feeling like can everyone just leave me alone and let me be an adult and let me figure out for myself and if anyone is feeling by the way like I'm speaking to them like yes I want people to just shut up with the unsolicited advice is really really good TED talk it's quite short

I think 15 minutes called Mind Your Own Pregnancy by a physician called Leslie Walters. And yeah. Oh, that sounds good. I love a little recommendation. I think you're so right. And also it was reminded me of these moments. You know, I don't know, when you see kids like trying to do something, like trying to solve something or trying to put blocks in one of those little shape sort of things.

And there's a bit of you that just kind of wants to go and help them or just like turn the shape sort of. like the other way so that they can get access to the bit that they need. And the advice is to kind of like hold back and just let them find their own way with it. And that's how they'll learn and that's how they'll experience it themselves. And I don't know it's just making me think of that of how tempting it is kind of just like leap in. And what are we actually taking away from people's experiences? And what, you know, if you think about the, you know, that birth, the hospital bag, what are we taking away from her experience when we? we kind of like jump in and start trying to manipulate it somehow?

Yeah, and I also think it does kind of show a lack of self-awareness that just because your experience was the way it was that you can't recognize that other peoples might be different. And you're right, like it's exactly like that. When it's a child, we want to fix, we want to do it, but they won't learn. But why is it that with press, pregnancy or new mums, we sort of treat them like children again, that why don't we respect them as adults or, you know, there's no, I can't think of another comparison in life where people sort of patronise your decisions and judgments to the extent. And I do think there are different ways to give advice, because this isn't saying, I don't want anyone to tell me anything ever. Like, you know, it's not my ears are closed. It's the way in which, it's been my mind. It's being my. mindful of the, I guess, considering when you're going to give advice, why am I giving this?

Am I giving this to make me feel better because I find it triggering that they're so excited about their pregnancy or because they said mums are negative or whatever it might be. Am I giving it because I want to be helpful or am I giving it because I wish I'd known from my experience? And also, can I accept that maybe my idea isn't the only good idea or, because, you know, there's good examples of things that advice I was given that I didn't ask for that was potentially useful. For example, I had no idea that bumpers in Cots weren't a good idea. I mean, lo and behold, my child slept with me for a year, so it didn't matter anyway. But it's the way in which I think we also communicate that, because if it's like, you're going to kill your child,

bumpers are dangerous, how dare you, you're a terrible mom? Like, how do you think that would be received, especially if the mum is feeling, maybe like insecure about their abilities. Like we need to uplift people because we all know. And also we're all so different, you know. I might be brilliant at following my intuition and knowing like feeling safe in my choices for my baby. But I'm also absolutely terrible at being able to juggle work and motherhood but also have meals on the table. So if I'm feeding him a pouch, that might be like my coping mechanism for the day.

And I really don't need to hear that, you know, I'm killing my child by giving him a pat. I call them the pouch police. I feel like every time there's a pouch and social media, you just hear the sirens like in the background. Neen-no, nin-no, nin-no. And ultimately, like, I'm sorry, it's fruit and veg. Like, of course we know that cooking fresh meals is better.

But honestly, if it saves you an extra 10 minutes and that's the only 10 minutes you get to yourself and that's what will keep your sanity and allow you to stay calm or allow you to like feel a bit more connected to yourself. And I'm sorry, like, we got to do what we got to do because we can't do everything. Yeah, yeah. So you're so right, and it's about having confidence in the decisions that you're making.

So you know that if someone comments or if someone gives you some advice, you can just go back to that sense of, you know what, this is right for me and I know that. And this is the best thing that I can do in this moment or I'm preserving something of myself by doing this. So it's having that confidence in the decisions that you're making. So how do you, how do you give advice then and how and how, yeah. And when you receive unsolicited advice, like what, how do you respond to it? What's a good way, kind of arm ourselves?

Well, so I think the first thing would be when you want to give unsolicited advice. And often, like I said, it comes from a really friendly place. So let's say, I don't know, I have some friends at the moment who are pregnant or who are new mums. And if they're talking to me about their problems or, you know, their difficulty to breastfeed or whatever it might be, rather than me jumping and being like, oh, this help me or this help me. Like, because often we talk about things, not necessarily because we want a solution, but because we want to feel heard. And so we, it's like, we could say, are you open to suggestions? Or I've got some ideas.

Would you like to hear them? They might be helpful. Or I've been through something similar. Would you like me to tell you my experience? And I think that's just a really nice way to allow people to be like, actually, yeah, I would really like this advice. Or actually, do you know what? I've had so much advice recently.

I just feel like I need to vent. and so you're empowering that person, and if they want the advice, they'll take it. And then I think the second thing is when you receive advice you don't want, you know, is let's say it's someone close to you that you love, whether it's like a friend, your mother-in-law, your mum, you could say, I know that you mean well, but I'm really not looking for advice at the moment, or do mind just listening, or it actually makes me feel inadequate when you tell me what to do. I know that you really care about me and I know you're trying to help,

but it doesn't feel like the right approach for me or you know you can say it however you want but often I think we feel rude to stand up for ourselves or to create boundaries but it's not rude because that's the only way people know and learn because it's all very well you know for us to be like these people make me feel awful about myself or I feel like they undermine my parenting every time they see me but they might not have any idea that they're doing it and also if you put out boundaries and people still disrespect and then that's obviously when you realise like maybe they're not a good person for you to be around, especially in those vulnerable moments of pregnancy and like, well, I was going to say early motherhood, but I think all motherhood is a bit

vulnerable, isn't it? Yeah, that's so helpful. And I think in not, in a certain those boundaries, it can feel quite, you know, it might feel like a real step out. It might feel like you're kind of almost pushing your own comfort zone in stating those things. But actually, if we don't do that, we're less likely to go to that. person. We might think I'm not going to talk to them because they just give me loads of advice and I just want them to listen. You know, we might end up kind of caught, it might end up causing separation. So it's almost like in a way better for that relationship to say, actually that's so kind of you. But I would just love it if I could just rant and vent to you every now and again

about this. That's what's helpful to me because then you're giving them that opportunity to carry on being the person that you go to rather than just kind of stepping back because you're not getting what's helpful? Yeah, 100%, 100%. Well, this is, no, so it's so helpful. And I think, you know, there are times when I kind of like almost metaphorically sit on my hands and think, oh, no, don't say anything because it's like that, that mum sitting watching the child on the blocks, thinking that this is a process for them. This is a journey for them. And do we need to kind of fast forward it for them sometimes? You know, do I need to fast forward that experience and suddenly, like, give them a short call? Or is that actually,

real value in, you know, going to the hospital with your sleep mask and your ear plugs and thinking, yeah, I might need these. And maybe you do. And maybe one day you kind of have a little giggle at yourself. And isn't that okay? Like, does it matter? Does it actually matter sometimes? I also think as well that our experience and circumstances and everything that makes up, you know, my relationship with my son and everything that we went through, it might not be right or the same. for someone else. In fact, it probably isn't because let's be honest, we're all juggling a very unique puzzle between us and our babies and our circumstances, be it financial or anything else. So I think, you know, for us to presume that what worked for us, we need to give to other

people who might be completely different, you know, like think how different probably, you know, we are and then take our children. And it's all so unique. And a good example of when I really wanted to be heard was when I was really struggling with Alf and, you know, he was waking up every hour of the night. I was feeding on demand. And when I would say how like tired and overwhelmed and exhausted I was like trying to function, I didn't want to be told you need to let him cry out. And I didn't want to be told give him a bottle, just give up. Because, you know, those were two things that were important for me. And what I wanted was for someone just to be like, I know it's hard. wow, you must be exhausted.

I'm here, if you like. Would you like me to tell you what we did? Or would you like me to tell you how I we need, like, whatever it might be. But I think it's offering up, like just feeling heard makes you feel so much more empowered. And, you know, you don't, just because you're finding something difficult, it doesn't mean that because you want to like change it. You just want to feel like not alone or not like you're just like suffering by yourself. And yeah, I think, you know, there's ways in which people can offer their help and be a supportive friend or person on the internet or whatever it might be without almost like patronising that mother's decision.

Yeah, so, no, you're so right because I think it's those emotions, isn't it? It's that you're expressing something because you feel something about it. You feel alone or you feel hopeless or you feel like you want some support, not necessarily advice. but maybe just reminding ourselves that to connect with the emotion, you know, that is actually being communicated. And then if we're wanting to give advice to ask whether that person would like it, but to make sure that we're responding to invalidating and connect with that emotion, because even if it's a different situation, we've all felt exhaustion. We've all felt overwhelm. We've all felt, you know, so we can connect with the emotion even if our circumstances are

different. So yeah, connecting with that emotion, then asking if you, want advice or offering advice if you have it to give. So thank you so much for that. We end with some quick five questions. So I've got some short questions for you. What's a motherhood high for you? Motherhood high, getting to watch someone experience life for the first time. Wow. Yeah. And what's a motherhood low? The relentlessness of it, the fact that you just don't get a day off and I guess the lack of understanding about what it is to be a mother in society as a whole. Yeah. And what's one thing that makes you feel really good? In terms of motherhood? In anything. What makes you feel good? What makes me feel good being completely on my own.

thing else switch off and recharge in my own company. And this is something that I felt was taken away from me at the very beginning, especially when I was breastfeeding on demand. But if you're listening and you feel like that, it comes back. Yeah. Yeah, that's really helpful. And finally, how would you describe motherhood in three words? Relentless, joyful and consuming.

Oh, so true. relentless, joyful, consuming. Definitely. Well, thank you so much. Thank you for your lovely words. There's so much to think about. I'm definitely going to be thinking and reminding myself to connect with the emotion that's being communicated, I think, when I hear someone talking their experience and I feel like I'm having to sit on my hands because I've got some tips that are just kind of like just wanting to bubble out. So, no, really helpful and ways to kind of accept and process and maybe even reject some of that solicited advice in a way that kind of protects the relationship and places those boundaries there. So thank you so much.

Thank you for having me. Thank you so much for listening to today's episode of The Therapy Edit. If you enjoyed it, please do share, subscribe and review. It really makes a massive difference as to how many people this podcast can help. You can find more from me on Instagram at Anna Martha. You might like to check out my books called Mind Over Mother and Know Your Worth and my brand new book called The Little Book of Calm for New Mums, grounding words for the highs, the lows and the moments in between. It's a little book you don't read it from front to back. You just dip in according to what emotion you're feeling where you'll find a mantra, a short passage and a tip

to help give you some comfort and guidance in that emotion. I'm also the founder of the mother mind way. This is a platform packed with guides, resources and videos with a sole focus on supporting mothers mental health and emotional well-being. Have a good week.