The Therapy Edit - One Thing with Daisy Upton on why 5 minutes really is enough

Episode Date: June 2, 2023

In this Friday episode of The Therapy Edit, Anna chats to Daisy Upton, aka Five Minute Mum about her One Thing which is that 5 minutes really is enough! Daisy is a mum of two and an ex primary school teaching assistant. She's come up with easy games and activities for little kids aged 1 and up, that take five minutes to set up (which means they also take five minute to clear away again - hurrah)!Daisy's little and often approach is demonstrated on her amazing Instagram account which you'll find here. Daisy's brand new book will be published with Ladybird in June- Starting School: is a gentle, funny guide aimed at children all around taking the big step to big school. You can pre-order it here.Daisy has also written: Five Minute Mum: Give Me Five: Five minute, easy, fun games for busy people to do with little kids Five Minute Mum: Time For School: Easy, fun five-minute games to support Reception and Key Stage 1 children through their first years at schoolFive Minute Mum: On the Go: From long journeys to family gatherings, easy, fun five-minute games to entertain children whenever you're out and about

Hello and welcome to The Therapy Edit with me, psychotherapist's mum of three and author Anna Martha. Every Friday, I invite one guest to tell me the one thing they would most like to share with mums everywhere. So join with me as we hear this dose of wisdom. I hope you enjoy it. Hi everyone, welcome to today's guest episode of The Therapy Edit. I am so excited to have with me today, Daisy Upton of Five Minute Mum. I can credit Daisy with, I mean, she was part, she was basically in our house in, in lockdown. Her book was such a fixture of our, it was always kind of on the kitchen table because just picking up her book and getting lots of different ideas for what to do with the kids that didn't take too much time and effort because we were all juggling so much.

So, Daisy, you have just, yeah, thank you for everything that you do. Daisy is super busy. She's a mum of two, six and eight, same age as my older two. She is author and creator of five-minute mom on Instagram. She was a teaching assistant and now she is an author and she's at home more with a kid. She started sharing lots of games, activities and ideas that this is what I absolutely love about everything that she does. They take no more than five minutes to set up and clear away. She's got three books out.

give me five ages one to five that's for ages one to five the next one is time for school ages four to eight lots of ideas little things to start yeah just tapping into the curriculum and preparing your children as well on the go and that is for all ages want to whip out on the train want to take with you on the plane take away with you and then amazingly it's like she's timed it perfectly for me just in time for florence starting school in September she has written starting school, the ultimate guide for new school starters, a funny and informative book. And this is the first one that she's written for children. It has lots of games and it's also got this gentle guide showing them around the school, literally in the most beautiful kind of

images, really colourful, giving them those little glimpses of the learning that they'll do there. So you've just been so busy, haven't you, Daisy? And yeah, so it's great to spend some time with you. It is great to be here. That makes me sound really, really busy. But believe or not. I literally live by my five minutes at a time rule. It makes me sound like I'll go, go, in that, doesn't it? Thank you very much. That's all right. I just, I think sometimes just breaking it down into those five minute things. I think we can put so much pressure on ourselves. Can't we just to be kind of entertaining the children and creating these amazing games and making memories when actually sometimes it's a real gift just to set something up and just walk away and go and do our thing

and let them play, let them direct it. And that was the epiphany I had when I first asked this. I'd had like horrendous proper flu. And I was trying to go on Pinterest and find these activities for the kids. And they were three and one at the time. And I decided to do hot air balloons, paper mashet. I mean, what would be? That's been really delirious.

And like you say, we see these things online and I think, oh, that's what I should be doing with my toddler. And I set up all this stuff, it took me about 45 minutes. minute, I'm like trying not to pass out because I felt so unwell. And then the kids did the activity for what 30 seconds before they were bored and walked off. And I had all this like glue and paper and newspaper ripped up to try and contend with. And I just thought, oh my God, there's got to be a better way. And that was when I started doing the stuff that I had learned in schools. So the stuff that I had done in nursery classrooms in reception classrooms was all I was

like no one's setting this kind of stuff up with that age. It was all just put out short, sweet activities for them to engage with. And I started thinking, okay, there's a way I can do this at home, even though I haven't got a classroom and all the stuff. There's definitely a way of doing that. And that was when I started doing five-minute mum games before I even started the blog posts and all the rest of it. Yeah. And I'm so, I'm so grateful for it. And actually it takes, it doesn't only take the pressure off us. It takes the pressure off the kids. Because I feel like the more time we spend kind of creating and setting something up, the more pressure they feel to enjoy it and concentrate and focus, even if there's other stuff they'd rather do. And I remember

the first time I put one of your ideas into action and it was to just grab some toys, just set them up like a little hospital. So I just got some cushions, put some dolls and some teddies out, found some bandages and, you know, fake plaster and just left it on the floor. And then I found them later on. And they, you know, they were enjoying and engaging it. And I hadn't even realized that that's what they were doing. They'd just gone a bit quiet for a while. Exactly. So takes the pressure off them and us. Exactly. And that's so important, isn't it? Because it takes, it gives them the control. And that's what's so important about like the golden rule, which I always say, just leave it out. Don't say anything. Because if you do that,

you know, your best Oscar worthy, guess what I've done kid? This is an amazing activity. We're all going have such fun today, then you can guarantee there's a direct correlation. I mean, I've drawn a graph on it before where it's like the longer you spend setting something up, the directly, the less amount of time the child will play with it and enjoy it. So if you can do something like you said with a, you know, chuck out a few things and leave it, don't say a word, they will find it and engage with it. And they feel like it takes the pressure of them because they're like, I have found this. I've decided to play this. It's got nothing to do with mommy or daddy or whoever it's it's my choice and so therefore they're they feel in control and they're much more

likely to engage and play with it and then the pressure's off you because you're like great they're playing click the capital on oh and this is actually reminding me of a hen party i went on funnly enough it's a it's a segue but i'll explain it was so well organized down to the minute with an it that it was every moment was planned that it was almost quite stifling of the fun itself because you felt like you you felt like you had to show that you were so appreciative so constantly and that you were having fun and it was all worth the precision planning that actually it yeah it stifled it a little bit it was it was pressure and we all feel that and it's the same as that in education if you say to you know we're going to learn this today and even as an adult you know

If you go to a conference and it's like, right, we're going to sit and learn this, you kind of go, oh, God, and switch off. Whereas if someone says, oh, we're going to play this game or we're going to, you know, let you guys explore this at your own pace, then you kind of feel a lot more inclined to do it. So, and it's exactly the same for our kids, so that we just have to, I just have to hack it and find quick and simple ways around it so that we can make them feel that way. And then before you know it, they're learning stuff by stealth and you feel absolutely amazing. Yeah, absolutely. Well, thank you for inspiring that in us and sharing that with us. So I don't want to encroach on your one thing too much. I'm going to get it in there now. If you could share one thing with all the mums, Daisy, what would that one thing be? One thing would be that five minutes is enough. It's enough. We feel like as parents, especially when it comes to learning things with our children or teaching them something new or sort of doing something that, boost their development in all these different early years stages that it has to be something big something long and it doesn't five minutes a day is enough to do with your child so to give you an

example I think quite often what I get lots of DMs about is a parent has heard from somebody in education and either the nursery or the school that their child is perhaps finding something a bit tricky perhaps they you know they might say they're struggling with this or they're not really getting it and and we're going to put some support in place at the setting and perhaps you might want to do some support at home. And the first thing that a parent will feel is usually shock and sadness and they'll probably start to blame themselves. And this happens a lot because I get these DMs where I say,

I feel like I've failed them, I feel terrible. And the first thing today is like absolutely not. Like the education system is quite rigid really and it's set for these certain milestones at certain times and people aren't like that. People don't all fit into those little boxes. And actually, you know, when we say they're struggling, they're just doing something not at the time that the school wants them to do it. And it doesn't mean they won't do it in their own time at their own pace.

And so I think the tendency then is to want to just go into panic mode and feel like, right, we're going to sit down every night. My child's been told that they're, you know, they're struggling with their spelling. We're going to sit down every night and we're going to write out the spellings 100 times and we're going to do this, that and the other. And it feels overwhelming for you as a parent because you're kind of like out of control. I don't know how to do this. and it feels then overwhelming for the child because, like you said, before, what we said before, if you put that pressure on, their immediate reaction is to say, I don't want to do that. And so instead, what I want to say to people is five minutes is enough.

And doing something very little every day will bring them on very quickly. And it can be for absolutely anything, you know, learning to tie their shoes, supporting them with their masks, or, you know, teaching them how to tell them, the time or teaching them something as simple as how to get themselves ready for bed at night, you know, following that routine. Just doing one little thing a day, five minutes, is adding to those little blocks all the time. And I think the thing is as well that people don't necessarily see the progress at the time. And so it does feel like we're not getting anywhere with this. You know, we've been doing this five minute games every day for two weeks. And my child hasn't learned

how to spell the word watch yet. They're still writing out W-O-T. And you kind of think, oh, it's not going in. But it is. And all those little things are gradually building, building, building, building. And suddenly, you know, they will get it and it will be like, boom. And you'll see the progress suddenly and it will happen very quickly. And I think it's just about reminding ourselves that just doing it for a tiny amount of time, doing one little thing is a building block, you've banked that, you've stacked that, the child has got something out of it, you've got something out of it, you know, there is no need to do any more if they don't want to.

If they want to, if they're loving it and having a great time and you're enjoying it, then go for gold, you can play as long as you like. But if after five minutes they've had enough and walk away, then that is still counts. All of the stuff that happened in that five minutes counts, you've banked it, it's blocked, and then you can build on that tomorrow and the next day and the next day just with those five minutes. That's such a relief. I literally feel my shoulders dropping as you're talking and I know that so many other people listening will feel the same. And why do you think it is that we place so much pressure on ourselves often and our children to go, go, go, go, you know, just go hard or go home. Let's just smash it out. Let's just sit down and, you know, that pressure that we kind of load on to those moments and those targets.

because we have no guidance I think it's really hard and it's important to remember that when you go into you know birth and childbirth in those first few years you get kind of quite a bit of guidance you know you have NCT classes

and antenatal classes that talk you through the pregnancy and birth in quite a lot of detail actually and you feel like you have lots of control and power because you understand the choices and you have the knowledge and then it's like you get given this baby and then the first few months you kind of have that support and then all of a sudden, that's just gone and we're left and to figure the rest out ourselves.

And I think that when it comes to child development, those first few years are really important. And I think lots of parents feel really lost as to what am I supposed to be doing. And you kind of might look to something bigger for advice or guidance, like a teacher or like an educational setting. And they're doing this in a professional capacity and you sort of feel like, oh, I can emulate that. at a home with like you know some lessons or some learning and of course you do that's natural you're going to look to those professionals but actually you know they're fully trained in that and they've got a classroom full of resources you're at home with your little ones trying to do all the other things you've got to do feeding them cleaning up your house looking after other siblings looking

after yourself and your family and whatever it is doing a job all those things you might be doing and also try and help your child with their development um it's a lot it's a lot to take on and So we feel like we're not doing enough when actually, you know, five minutes is enough. And it does. And I think also we think if it's not achieved something specific, like a goal, then it's not worth doing. But I think we forget sometimes with children that it's such a slow process. And it's all like there's that great analogy about children. You know, if you put popcorn in a pot, they all pop at different moments despite being under the exact same heat.

And that analogy is great because that's how children are. You know, some of the kernels won't pop for ages. And when they do, it's like, boom, as they jump out of the pan, you know, it's like brilliant. And we sort of all comparing and feeling like it should be set at this certain time and achieving this amount. But actually, we're all still human beings and you know your children best. You're with them all the time. You understand them and their little quirks and their nuances

and any things that they might want to do in order to learn. know them better than anybody and it's about understanding that and knowing that it's okay to just do a little bit of time and little and often is often the best way with kids because that's where it comes in like it's it's perfect at the moment because my my youngest florence she's struggling with maths and so we're doing lots of maths games now she doesn't know she's struggling with maths she doesn't know that i've spoken to the teacher about it she doesn't know that mummy's focusing on maths particularly at the moment she just knows we play games after school and sometimes those games last very short period of time because she's not really that interested because she doesn't like it and that's fine

because even if I've set up the game and it's always a five minutes up never longer sometimes a one minute one and she comes in and she sees it and we do one sum she just one some with me and then she goes I don't want to do this this is boring and walks off and I think for some parents you'd think oh well that that was a bust that was a fail you know she didn't do that but you did one sum with her and you probably modeled how to do that and she probably listened and maybe thought about it and she recognized it was too challenging so you have learned that that sum that you did with her was probably a bit too challenging so then like tomorrow you do one slightly easier all of those things have come out of that perhaps one minute interaction that you've

had with them and it's all beneficial it doesn't even matter that she didn't do the some or that she found it rubbish and walked off something happened there there was a conversation there was a little learning moment that you attempted to do and you can tick that off for the day we did that we attempted to do that yeah it didn't go perfectly really it doesn't matter push that to the one side tomorrow we'll try again with something else such relief such relief and an encouragement and an encouragement for us to recognize perhaps where we are, as you say, turning towards kind of educators. I follow loads on social media. We're, you know, we're kind of going to websites and we're getting all this information. But actually these are professionals.

These are educators. And we're at home juggling all these different things. And it's great if we just take one little bit of that and implement it and try it out. And thanks to Daisy. She has got three books, nearly four, but three specifically with just packed full of, in total hundreds of these ideas. So you don't even have to put the pressure on yourself to think, think, think about how could you do this differently? Because she has done this for you, kind of bringing together all of her experience as a teaching assistant and a mum and talking to loads of teachers and carers and bringing those together. So they are there for you. So thank you so much for that, Daisy, and taking the pressure off and for letting our shoulders drop a little bit.

And to finish off, I've got some quick-fire questions for you. Yeah. In a couple of words, what's a motherhood high for you? A high for me, actually, has happened recently. And you and my eldest is now eight. And I know that my time is short of him coming to me for cuddles and hand-holding. And the other day, we were out in town. I'd taken into the library and he'd chosen some great books.

And we were walking across the road. and he grabbed my hand across the road and as we got to the other side he kissed my hand and said I love you mummy and I just froze on the street and I was like nothing like that's it

but nothing else matters like that's how he just felt that way in that moment I have taught him to just say if he feels that surge is love sometimes we all get for somebody you really care about

and he said it and I just was like yeah do you know what that is that's an awesome me. I can live on that high forever. Oh, I call those women as parenting caffeine and they just give you so much more, don't they? Like a shot of something incredible. And what would you say as a motherhood low for you? Oh, God, there have been so many. I mean, yeah, like I said at the beginning, the flu time was a low. I remember Ewan really resisted putting on clothes and he just

used to hate getting dressed and even like, you know, I travel different things to support him and encouraging and it was just this massive like he wouldn't do it and i remember once he got in the car completely nude and i took drove to playgroup with the clothes in my bag and i just remember thinking oh my god what is everyone going to think if they see this child just sitting nude in this car like and then when we got there he was like all upset and we were getting him dressed in the car park i was like see we're here now do you want to go he's like i want to go but i don't want to get dressed we're like we need to wear clothes we're going in a leisure center and like yeah i think that was one of those days where I was like file it in the bucket it's not a good one let's try

getting tomorrow yeah yeah there have been yeah many of those moments I definitely relate and yeah sadly wearing clothes is kind of one of those rights of passage you know about being a human out and about in life oh that's a tricky one to negotiate and what's one thing that makes you feel really good gardening oh gardening I didn't know I wasn't expecting that. Yeah, it's a relatively new passion. And fascinating, it's something I talk about quite a lot in, it's something I have found since having children.

And as they've gotten older, I've got more and more time to do it. So I sort of started getting interested when they were little like four and two, but I didn't, couldn't do anything because the garden was a sunpit and a play area and a plastic toy heaven. And I started just planting up little bits and bulbs here. and there and I just had this immense feeling of well-being and gratitude and complete mindful space from everything. And I think because I spend a lot of time on social media, it was something where I was completely off social media and my phone would just be down, put down and I would

just have this lovely hour of just complete absorption in something. And at the end of it, you get pretty flowers and things to eat and it's just the nicest feeling. So I have recently invested in my garden. I've bought a greenhouse. I've bought, um, had my garden landscape so that I can turn it into this like miniature growing space, miniature allotment growing space. And that is my happy place. And kids started trying to sort of join me a little bit. They see me doing it and they want to come out. But mostly it's when I get some time to myself, that's where I'll spend my five minutes a day, just getting a bit of headspace. And I absolutely love it. I love it. I can see light as you talk about it. And I think

it's a real encouragement to the mum's listening who are very much kind of in the thick of those early years and feeling like they're never going to get to do anything for themselves that brings them joy ever again beyond looking after the kids and juggling and actually you're you've reclaimed some of that space that was overtaken with all the plastic and the you know the sand and I totally reclaimed it and it's a real it was a really not it was a nice gradual process as well because it was like as gradually I got a bit of time you know I'd set up five in the activities in the garden for them to keep them busy so I could grab a few minutes here and there but as they've got an older you know they play for longer they go out with their feelings.

friends out the front and I can hear them so I potter about in the garden and it's just sort of gradually built as they've gotten older which and I and I say that to people like your time will come you get that back again you get yourself back again and it's not quite the same as before because I was never into gardening before I was absolutely hopeless but it's a little version of you it's a little bit of my creative spark has come back in that and it's it's really nice to sort of feel like gradually you can you can you can yeah claim some like you say claims some space for yourself that's wonderful to hear well thank you so much thank you for all your words of encouragement and yeah that that encouragement to relieve some of the pressure off ourselves and maybe use

some of those five minutes to grab some time for yourself yeah leave the dishwasher what would you like to do that maybe engages in something that brings you joy so thank you so much daisy and i can't wait to get hold of your new book um in perfect time for foreign starting school so thank you thank you for talking with us today thank you very much for having me it's been lovely Thank you so much for listening. Please do take a moment to subscribe, rate and review as it really helps get these words out to benefit more juggling parents like us. And head to annamartha.com to find my resources on everything from health anxiety to people pleasing, starting at only £20. And finally, don't forget to pre-order my new book, Raising a Happier Mother, How to Find

Balance, Feel Good and See Your Children Flourish as a result. I can't wait for you to have that take care and we'll chat soon