The Therapy Edit - One Thing with Harriet Frew on how motherhood impacts our relationship with food

Episode Date: August 4, 2023

In this Friday guest episode of The Therapy Edit, Anna chats to Eating Disorder Therapist Harriet Frew on her One Thing; how the loss of control that goes hand in hand with motherhood can impact our relationship with food.Harriet is an experienced BACP accredited counsellor who specialises in supporting people with eating disorders and body image issues. She has worked in an Adult Eating Disorder NHS Service and privately since 2003. and is host of the eating disorder podcast - The Eating Disorder Therapist and trainer in eating disorders and body image.Harriet offers individual therapy, online courses, training and Breakthrough Days and a psychological approach to helping someone understand their eating disorder as a coping strategy, and then to empower them with skills and tools for change. Harriet is passionate about the therapy relationship and instilling hope that recovery is possible and is also an expert through experience having made a full recovery from bulimia nervosa.You can follow Harriet at the following links: InstagramThe Eating Disorder Therapist on all major platforms.And further support can be found here:Eating Disorder Prevention Event: https://www.eventbrite.com/e/inspiring-prevention-of-eating-disorders-and-body-image-issues-tickets-601388086957Harriet's website: https://www.theeatingdisordertherapist.co.uk/BEAT The UK's Eating Disorder Charity

Hello and welcome to The Therapy Edit with me, psychotherapist's mum of three and author Anna Martha. Every Friday, I invite one guest to tell me the one thing they would most like to share with mums everywhere. So join with me as we hear this dose of wisdom. I hope you enjoy it. Hi, everyone. Welcome to today's guest episode of the Therapy Edit. I have, joining me today, Harriet Frue, Harriet is an eating disorder therapist. She has a podcast called the Eating Disorder Therapist

podcast. She does one-to-one therapy. She also trains therapists on supporting patients and clients with eating disorders. And she has an online membership called the Bight Size Eating Disorder Therapy Group. So she is passionate about equipping us and getting us to think a little bit more about our relationship with food and how it might be impacting our lives in the day to day, sometimes even in ways that we do not realize. So Harriet, hi, it's wonderful, wonderful to have you with me today. Oh, thank you, Anna. Thanks so much for having me. And how are you today? It's very sunny here where I am. I'm recording my kids are currently at school and at nursery. So the house is quiet and it's beautifully sunny. So I'm going to go for a walk later, speak to my own therapist. But how are

you? What's your plan today? Yeah, no, I am hot actually. That is my main theme of the day. I'm rather than going anything deeper. Yeah, I'm really a bit sticky and I was going to put the fan on. I thought, can't put the fan on. It would be so noisy. That's all right. That's all right.

No, I completely, I absolutely relate. Whenever I mention the heat on social media, I often get messages about saying, what about the aircon? We don't, in the UK, we just do not tend to have aircon. I'm envious of anyone who does. But over here, it's just kind of sheets

and trying to keep the window open. That was about it at night. Absolutely. Sticky Brits. Sticky Brits over here. So the question that I ask all our guests, Harriet, is if you could share one thing with all the mum's listening, what would the one thing be that you would love to share and impart? Okay. So what I wouldn't like to share for my one thing is for people just to really think about how motherhood can really feel like a loss of control and how that can really impact your relationship with food. So that's something I'm really passionate about. And I think I'm sure something that many people will relate to. Yeah. Yeah. So just that that question of

in motherhood, oh my gosh, yeah, being faced with that sense of I have little, I have less control in life than I ever thought I would. And I think we all have ideas, don't we, of how we'd like to be as a mum. And the reality is often that that is so challenged and turned upside down. So that realisation and that sense of not having control, which I know that some people, including myself, really struggled with in the past. So how, once we've thought about that and recognise that, what do we do next? I guess I think for many people, perhaps even pre-children, they may have had some issues with food or body image because I think in our culture, we do idealise in bodies.

we often equate a lot of our self-worth with how we look and the size we are. So I think many people, even if they haven't had a full-blown eating disorder in the past, may have struggled with some form of disordered eating, like being restrictive, maybe binge eating or emotional eating. So I think then when a baby comes into that mix and, you know, you may be having some sleepless nights, your world is turned upside down in many joyful ways, but also chaotic and unpredictable and anxiety-provoking ways as well. I think many people can be vulnerable to really feeling that loss of control

and then really wanting to turn towards something where they can feel more in control. And that might be leaning on perhaps old coping strategies, where it's either controlling food, controlling their body, as something that feels safe and perhaps can help, you know, numb emotions, distract from some of the other difficult things that are going going on and it can feel like a sort of life raft to cling to. Yeah, definitely. So how do we recognise then that that might be going on for us?

Well, I guess if you are noticing perhaps that you're starting to be quite preoccupied with food, maybe you are counting calories, being overly restrictive, maybe you're worrying a lot about how much exercise you're doing, maybe there's a lot of anxiety about fitting it all in. maybe you sort of sit back into binge eating or using food to soothes because there's not much time to self-care and look after yourself. So I guess, you know, it could be any of those things. I think it's quite individual for different people. So you're really just observing and thinking what what place does food have in my life might I be noticing a need to control perhaps

just to get that feeling of control or perhaps just leaning back. into those old ways of coping with stuff that you know actually really as a whole didn't serve you and you might not like them but sometimes it's that familiarity isn't it it's the familiarity of what happens in our minds or for me I just remember so I've spoken very a very small amount about my history with kind of challenges around eating and eating disorders but for me my brain was very much preoccupied with numbers so everything I counted air. everything from steps that I took to minutes that I exercised to. I need the calorie content of absolutely everything. And in a way that work to fill my mind and perhaps drive out other

things that perhaps I didn't want to think or feel about. And I guess motherhood is such a massive transition, isn't it? Where we're navigating such huge change and maybe even grief as well for parts of our identity that maybe we don't, we feel like we've lost or parts of of our lives that perhaps we miss or a yearning for. So it's understandable, I guess, that with all of that flux going on, that it might be easy just to reach and grab the thing that you know has historically filled all that space in your head. So you don't have to feel that sadness, maybe.

You don't have to feel some of those transitional emotions that pop up. Yeah, and I think it's really understandable. isn't it, that people can gravitate back towards that. And maybe it's difficult, isn't it, to give yourself permission sometimes to have all the feelings and to be able to express that grief or to feel that, oh, you might feel there's something wrong with me because I'm not loving motherhood because I've wanted this for so long. Or, you know, I guess it's just very natural, isn't it? You can feel the joy and the happiness and the contentment and excitement and all those lovely feelings from a new baby.

But it also comes with probably a lot of stress, sometimes anxiety. and grief and all the things. Yeah, so if someone's listening and they're thinking, oh my gosh, that's absolutely happening for me. Maybe in a way that I've never experienced before, perhaps I'm just constantly reaching for certain foods that I know aren't serving me well, but as a part of it, I just can't stop,

or it's just an emotional response to every emotion that feels slightly undesirable or a lot to feel. if someone is listening and recognizing that now, what words would you have for them besides it's understandable? It makes sense that you find yourself in this place. How might they move forward? I think one of the most helpful things is to say it out loud to someone that you trust and has to be open to a good friend, partner, someone in your life who can listen and accept what you're going to say and in a sort of non-judgmental way because I think sometimes we can almost be in denial or just not wanting to face that we might have a problem with food and body image

or it might have just become so normalised that has just felt like this is the way I live my life. So I think, you know, I guess firstly it's just being able to admit it to yourself but then taking it to that next stage and speaking to someone and possibly like in your close network to begin with and then to maybe have a look as well on something like the beat the National Association for Eating Disorders website, just to start to get a bit of education and understanding and perhaps just acknowledging a bit more where you sort of fit into this, because I guess it's all a spectrum between full-blown eating disorder

and fully flourishing, healthy relationship with food. And I guess many of us are somewhere in the middle, and we might be struggling with disordered eating, even if it's not a full-blown eating disorder. But I think even just acknowledging that can be really powerful. yeah absolutely and what about those for whom kind of just bumble along thinking actually this is so socially acceptable the way that I think and the way that I eat because that's what my friends are doing and there's a part of me that knows that it's maybe not quite right

but I haven't perhaps got the energy to address it what would you what would you want to say to that person I think everyone's on their own journey aren't they and I think someone has to come to that place themselves where they're ready for change, you know, and that's, you know, really something that we need to respect. But I think perhaps it's just being honest with yourself, even looking at actually what is this costing me, even though, you know, maybe you're acknowledging actually I'm getting these things from it, it's making me feel safe, helping me deal with my feelings, it's a distraction, maybe I feel a sense of achievement or it's part of my identity, but maybe as well just to start

to sort of gently reflect on some of the costs because it probably is having a lot of costs when you really tune in and you look maybe on your physical health, your mental health, your ability to socialise and go out for meals. So I say that's the first step, really, almost just to explore that ambivalence about change. Yeah.

And think about perhaps what headspace it's consuming that I remember so many lovely moments, so Christmas, for example, a wonderful family Christmas and all I was thinking about is when the heck am I going to get out for a walk when the heck am I going to be able to do a workout to even try and address the amount of food

that I've consumed that felt too much for me and it just really I just felt I started to realise how robbed I was of being present in moments that meant a lot to me and I think in motherhood we know so well that we are so privileged to have our children

so it might be perhaps that recognition that in some of those, moments that you so want to enjoy, these thoughts are just creeping in and you feel a little bit robbed by them. Yeah, absolutely. And what about the mum perhaps that is feeling a sense of shame or guilt because they really flippin thought they'd address this? And now in motherhood, when they put pressure on themselves with all this kind of extra responsibility and wanting to be a role model for their children, these feelings are surging back up and these behaviours are resurfacing. Yeah, I think it's so important to be compassionate to yourself, because, you know,

we do live in this culture, don't we, where thinness is idealized. You're praised for being thin and losing weight, even if you have a raging eating disorder. You know, we do live in a toxic culture. We have many people in the media who we put on pedestals, who are role-modeling, certain aesthetics. And I guess we've been indoctrinated with this way of thinking from birth. So I think it's really helpful just to have that background perspective and to realize actually, you know, of course, in a way I'm struggling with these issues. I've been brought up in this culture where it's been very conditioned in this way.

And in a way, of course now, when this big stress there has come along, it's probably triggered some things for me again. So I think, again, it's just being really compassionate with yourself. And you're not alone. There's a lot of people struggling with this. You know, I think for many, many people they've just never really talked about. it. Thankfully, starting to acknowledge now that many more people are struggling. And yeah, I guess reducing shame by speaking to someone is always really, really helpful because of once we open up,

you realise you're not alone and there'll be other moms that are struggling with exactly the same thing or something very similar. Yeah, absolutely. And I think a metaphor or a little sentence that often use the clients of mine in lots of different situations, which also really, really works when it comes to our relationship with food and our eating habits as well, that sometimes when we feel like we've addressed something, we feel like we're in a good place of it. And then life, we have to step up in life some way, but or step out perhaps, you know, the pressure is on.

We've just become parents. There's a whole new level of responsibility or maybe we're entering into a season of parenting that feels particularly hard or challenged. And we can feel like we've taken a step back when we see these things resurfaced. and I often encourage people, you know, you've not taken a step back, you've taken a step up, and you're just being more challenged, and you haven't yet grown into that space yet.

So, of course, it's going to feel uncomfortable, and of course you may well find yourself reaching for those coping mechanisms, but you've not gone backwards. You've just stepped up, and it takes a while, doesn't it, to kind of recalibrate and find our ways of coping in new challenging areas of our lives. So I think there's just a real theme here, isn't there, of just having compassion for ourselves, because I think when we start being able to be compassionate to us ourselves, then it starts chipping away at that shame that keeps us quiet and stuck. And what about the mom listening that's thinking, oh, it's not, my issue is not that bad

because I know someone who's got really, really challenged issues with food, and she's the one that deserves the help. she's the one that needs the support. I'm not that bad. What would you say to the mum, perhaps, that is comparing herself to that, like, archetype picture maybe as someone with an eating disorder? I think it's a very common idea with eating disorders

that people never feel that they're sick enough. You know, you always think, oh, when I get to this weight, then I kind of got there, but people are always looking sideways and comparing. I mean, I think as well we know, like the statistic, but 85% of people with eating disorders are not underweight. So a lot of eating disorders aren't visible. So yes, you might be seeing that very emaciated person walking past,

and they may look very unwell, but actually there are probably numerous people that you're walking past on a daily basis that might be struggling with eating disorders. So I think the thing is, if you are genuinely yourself struggling, if you're preoccupied with food, if you are starving yourself,

if you're using food to soothe, if you feel out of control with food, if you're having to count all the numbers, count all the steps, you're in distress and actually you need to validate that, actually, that, you know, that is, it doesn't matter if you don't fit into a box of diagnosis. You know, if you're struggling, you're struggling. So I think that's the important bit to be looking at. Yeah, so don't compare just, I think, if this is taking over any part of my life or my mind and it's preoccupying me, I am deserving of finding ways to get that headspace back on ways to get that enjoyment of those moments back that perhaps are

being robbed a little bit. That's so incredibly helpful. Thank you. And I'd love to touch just as we've been talking about this and I know there will be people having these light board moments thinking, oh gosh, that's me and I hadn't realized and what do I do now with this information? I'm going to have a chat. I'm going to dare to take that risk of opening up to someone that cares about me. I just really want to direct people towards your website and the course that you have, the 10 Steps to Intuitive Eating. Can you tell us a little bit more about that? Yes. My website is the eating disorder therapists.com.com. UK. And then my course 10 steps towards intuitive eating is a course really for anyone who's struggling with an eating disorder or

disordered eating who's wanting to develop a healthier relationship with food. So it really sort of takes you sort of gently through the 10 steps of intuitive eating, but it also brings in a sort of a lot of psychology, looking at the deeper issues, really exploring emotions in mindset, mindset, body image, all of that and a lot more depth as well. So, yeah. That's a really approachable, and accessible way for people to get some more information, even perhaps before they think they have, before they feel brave enough to have those conversations with, with people around them. So I think sometimes understanding, having a little bit more understanding of what we're going through enables us to perhaps find the words to talk to other people sometimes. Maybe it's good

to do it that way around occasionally. But what I love when I was looking on your website and reading about this course that you're doing is that you've got a 50% off code. But I love it even more so what you've called the code, which is freedom is possible. Now, if you'd have told, I'm just trying to think what age, 20-something year old me, that I, I wouldn't have believed that freedom from the way that I thought and felt and behaved around food was at all possible. I think I just accepted it as part of who I was and the way that I responded to emotion and this is just who I am now. This is just something I'm going to have to deal with. So I absolutely love that little code. Even freedom is possible to get 50% off that insuredive eating course. But with that little term, freedom is possible. I'd love. I'd love to hear you say that to the mums. I'd love to hear you expand on that a little bit to those that are thinking maybe is the way that I was thinking a number of years ago. Sure. Well, I guess when I think about a healthy relationship with food, I really think about

living your best life, being spontaneous, being able to go out with friends, eat the foods that you really enjoy, not thinking about food, going with the flow of life. That's what freedom, my guess means to me and very much, you know, I'm recovered from an eating disorder myself, fully recovered out the other side. And yeah, it just gives me so much joy today to be able to have a peaceful, free relationship with food. And for that just to be something that's in the background and I can just get on and do all the things I want to do without having to be thinking about that. Yeah. Yeah. And I will testify to that as well that I just feel so grateful that it's not a part of, it's not a stressful part of my life anymore. It's something that

doesn't take up a lot of my thoughts beyond, oh, what am I going to cook for dinner? What do we fancy? And going out for meals with friends is a, is a real privilege and an enjoyable experience rather than one that is secretly, totally and utterly fraught. So freedom is possible. So if you are listening to this and thinking that you, yeah, it's hard to believe and you want some of it, then go and explore Harrett's resources. And, yeah, we'll link them in the show notes as well for you. So Harriet, to finish off, I've got some super quickfire questions for you. What's a motherhood high at the moment?

So I've got twin boys and a girl who are all teenagers. And one of my motherhood highs is just actually thinking back and having my twins, one on each knee and reading to them when they used to wake up at five in the morning. But really all those like Julia Donaldson books and they used to just love it and it was just like magic times really yeah. Oh even though it probably felt

exhausting at the time and you were pining after you know a day way you wouldn't be woken up at five. How wonderful to think that that is a high for you now looking back a real encouragement for those in the thick of it just to maybe revel in those moments just a little bit more when you've got the energy too and what is a low for you?

So interesting one. I think for me I thought, oh, as I'm a therapist, my teenagers are going to want to talk to me about all their feelings. And, you know, I'm going to be able to just protect them with their mental health. And, you know, I think I really pretty quite arrogantly in a way, really thought I would be the one, the central person in their life to kind of guide them. And I think I've had to really acknowledge actually that they don't always want to talk to me. They want to talk to their friends, maybe other family members. and although I'm an important person to them, actually the fantasy that I heard

that they were going to be talking to me about all the things that were going on hasn't really sort of pared fruit. Yeah, I'm getting little tasters of that already with my six-year-old and my eight-year-old so I know that there is more grief, more grieving to be done in that process for me.

I definitely relate. So thank you so much for joining us, Harry. It has been an absolute pleasure to pick your brains. And here's some really compassionate words that will be reaching into moms listening, just encouraging us to just think about our relationship with food and think about actually do we deserve and need more freedom

in how much headspace it is taking up. So head to Harriet's website, everything will be linked in the bio and there you will find lots of resources and courses, including some events that are upcoming, that Harriet does. Do you want to tell us a little tiny thing about that before we... Yeah, so I'm running a face-to-face event in Camden,

the holiday in in Camden, September the 30th, Saturday. It's inspiring prevention of eating disorders and body image issues because I'm just so passionate about really getting the messages out to the wider culture and supporting parents and really going to the roots of the problem because by the time people end up in therapy or services, the seeds have been sown. So I'm so passionate about prevention.

And that's all going to be about that. Amazing. Good. Well, thank you so much for all the work that you do, helping us also support our children. Yeah, because I think for many people that will be a worry of theirs in today's culture, whether it's something they've been through themselves and they're worried about their own children kind of battling these things

or whether they just want to find ways to help prevent our children from walking those paths and struggling in these single. So thank you so much, Harry. It's been an absolute pleasure and a privilege to chat with you today. Oh, thanks for having me, Anna. Thank you so much for listening. Please do take a moment to subscribe, rate and review as it really helps get these words out to benefit more juggling parents like us.

And head to Anna Martha.com to find my resources on everything from health anxiety to people pleasing, starting at only £20. And finally, don't forget to pre-order my new book, Raising a Happy Hour. mother, how to find balance, feel good and see your children flourish as a result. I can't wait for you to have that. Take care and we'll chat soon.