The Three Questions with Andy Richter - Matt Rogers

Episode Date: November 25, 2025

Matt Rogers from the Las Culturistas podcast joins Andy Richter to discuss their shared status as prom kings, growing up a “jock” in Long Island, maintaining personal integrity and voice in show business, and much more. Visit mattrogersofficial.com to see the "Matt Rogers: Christmas in December" tour in a city near you!Do you want to talk to Andy live on SiriusXM’s Conan O’Brien Radio? Tell us your favorite dinner party story (about anything!) or ask a question - leave a voicemail at 855-266-2604 or fill out our Google Form at BIT.LY/CALLANDYRICHTER. Listen to "The Andy Richter Call-In Show" every Wednesday at 1pm Pacific on SiriusXM's Conan O'Brien Channel. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey, everybody. Welcome back to the three questions. I'm your host, Andy Richter, and today I am talking to the very funny Matt Rogers. He's an actor, writer, singer, television personality, and co-host of the Pop Culture Podcast, Las Culturistas, with Bowen Yang. You can get tickets for his Christmas in December musical tour now at Matt Rogers Official.com. Here's my fantastic conversation with Matt Rogers. Hey Matt Rogers. Hey, Andy Richter. What's up? A lot is up. I'm really,

really happy to be here as a long-time fan of yours. Oh, thank you so much. I mean, who's not, though? Well, no, but an eyeball. You're very, very funny, and I've been enjoying your work for a long, long time. Thank you so much. I see you got your sheet with my stuff.

I do, I do. I mean, they print this up. Well, and also, too, to be a full ex... Full disclosure. Come on now. I had, I just recorded with my Dancing with the Stars partner, Emma Slater, she was in and we recorded with her.

And then afterwards, they had like a little surprise spread for us, charcutory and cake with champagne, which we, this is the first three questions I've ever done. Shall we cheers to your tenure on the show. It's our, and to me being here on the day where there's champagne.

Clastic, class. Chin chin. Yes, this is my first champagne show. So, about to get Buck Wild. I'm obsessed. So, yeah.

I mean, I know of your work, but that, you know, but they give me sort of all the details, like named prom king. Yeah, that is usually one of the, like, factoids that shows up on when there's a sheet about me, that'll be on there. Yeah, that makes two of us. Stop. I was prom king also. Can I ask you a question? Were you also nominated for, like, homecoming king? I was not.

Okay. And I like to say this because I'm a dick to myself. Let's go. Be five boys and girls. girls who were on homecoming court were disqualified from prom king from prom. So that meant I was the sixth multiple boy. I got to have overdue status. Like I was like the like Amy Adams of my prom court.

Because why? Because I was nominated for junior prom king, lost to Nick Cooley, was nominated for Homecoming King, lost to Malcolm Brown. And so by the time it came around for senior prom king, which is really the Oscar. Yes. Because that's the globe, the sag. Right, right, right. You know what I mean? But then the Oscars came around.

Home Kong is like, it's more about football. It's, you know, it's not as formal prom. That's when, you know, that's the one that really matters. I think that those people were great for what they won for and for them to choose me as senior prom king. And it felt good. But it was alleged that there was a cheating scandal. No shit. No, it's true.

What does that mean? There was some, there was some talk. after it was read that maybe a girl who was by the ballot box all night had stuffed it so her best friend could win. Because Jackie Spinks, shout out, she won prom queen and her best friend was Brittany, who it was alleged had stuffed the ballot boxes. And apparently she thought out of all the men or boys at the time nominated that she could tolerate me most winning. So this was the nasty rumor out there that I'm finally, I have the platform to address. So I don't think there's any way to prove I didn't earn it, but there is some scandal. I just want to own up to that.

In high school, too, there was a, they had a thing where you could, it was like mayor for a day. Sure. Mayor of Yorkville, Illinois for a day. And so it was like this little election. And I thought, oh, that'll be fun. You know, like largely day out of school, you know, and they take a lunch. You got big, B.M.E. Big Mayor energy. That's. I will say that about you.

I feel that way. finally um but it was it was between me and this kid that was like and because it was in our school there was it was a small school so there's not a lot of like there's not a lot of colors on our palette you were painting with white was jock burnout nerd got it and um we're we're right yeah yeah and i was just kind of by default a jock because i was like you know i did play sports but I wasn't like a super jock, but I was also like a good kid. Yeah,

and I don't know. Yeah, exactly. The worst than you could be at the time. Well, I think, and I honestly think the huge dividing line was smoking weed.

Yeah. And I did not smoke weed yet. See, cut to me in college. Oh, for me, the second I could get out there and like,

yeah, like yep. And then found out like, oh, this is what self-medicating is. Off to the races. I was like, God,

I should have been so high in APCO. I know. I know. Well, that's like, Oh, my God. And it is like, if I found it out too early, it probably wouldn't have been good.

But it was like, weed is the just spoke to me. It's like, oh my God. This is like a toggle switch on contentment. It's like I'm meeting myself. Wow. I'm meeting a more calm, you know, easy to laugh version of myself. A guy that actually likes being alive. Do you remember the first time you smoked weed?

Absolutely. It was there was, it was the summer after my senior year. Uh-huh. And a guy that had been to our school and then gone away, I want to say like to Nashville or somewhere down south, but like a bigger school. A cool alum came back to the world. He was an alum. He was in my grade. Okay.

And he came back and had like started smoking weed. Yeah. And he had weed. And it was like I said, it was a summer. And we were, you know, we'd do a hang out or whatever and go to the, there was like our pool. It wasn't a municipal pool. but it was like a swim club that cost like five dollars or something so it was like the pool that everyone went to and we would go and get high and then go go swimming and like i remember too there was

i had this like teen movie moment we're still like navigating getting hot and also too it's so dumb get high go be around people yeah interact yeah exactly still a challenge and there was one day one of these days that we were i was at we got I got high, went to the pool, and I'm in the pool, and there's a, like, this beautiful girl that I had a huge crush on. Yes. And she's in the pool, and it's sunny day, but it's one of those days where, like, it started to rain, even though there was sunshine. It was kind of, like, late afternoon shower. Very cinematic.

And just, like, sitting there looking, talking to her, and she's laughing and smiling and, like, rain is falling. And there's, like, angled golden light. And I was just like, this fucking weed stuff is awesome. is how you control the climate. Yeah, yeah, yeah. If only that were true. If only that were true. And then the other, the other, of that, of that period, as that I got, I had, we had, we had a party at my house.

And it was still daytime. It was like an afternoon thing. And, and me and this other kid got high. And then my, my friend, you know, like my three or four tightest friends, who were all much more jocky than I was. Sure. But lovely guys. we're all like like they found out like wait you were getting high are you high right now and it was up in my brother's bedroom when we're sitting around I'm like yeah I'm high right now and they're like dude come on man you're throwing your life away and I was just like it's not a big deal guys and then it like they all were like what's it like tell me what it's not a big deal yeah what is it like I used to be such well my dad was a varsity football and baseball coach and a PE teacher and so he was kind of like he was kind of like a tough jock dad.

He was the oldest of five kids. You know what I mean? Like I was his oldest son. And so I also had the whole closeted thing going on. And so I was very much one of those like best little boy in the world overcorrectors, high achievers. Of course. Because you felt like you had to run on this treadmill of respectability. 100%.

Had to be perfect because one day I was going to hit them with quite the blow, which was this thing that I felt, you know, had made me damage goods as it were. What age did you start to kind of know? So I was 11 when I remember the moment I realized I was gay. A friend of mine was over in the pool and I was having a good time. We're hanging out. And then later on I'm getting ready for bed. And I remember thinking of myself like, today was a great day. Like, I love my friend.

I'm so happy he came over. I love his back. I love my friend's back. Like there's something that my friend's back, I want, I'm gay for sure. Yeah. Whoa. That's why. That's why I haven't been interested in getting a girlfriend.

That's why I like my couple of my friends a little bit more than the others. And so at that point, it just became like, this is Long Island, by the way. And it becomes very much like, how do I spend probably 80% of my energy at all times thinking about how I keep this part of me down, which is a lot of energy to spend on that. And you're like making sure that you're, you know, that your manner and your gestures and your affect is like so that's i guess yeah that that's i guess the part where your voice is already changing at that time because of puberty so imagine trying to like manage it and make it low like you can even hear like some of the way that kids talk on long island now is like very unnaturally talking like this and you know it's like

this like you're gonna hurt yourself um but like it was um it was probably from 11 to 19 that eight year period where I knew that I was gay and wasn't telling anyone, that was just, like, really hard because I couldn't smoke weed or couldn't do anything stepping out of line like that because of what that would maybe open the door to. Also, I was a student athlete, and I was one of those kids that was, like, very involved in the high school community. And I guess I thought that it would totally derail me. Little did I know, it would have just made me a lot more chill. Right, right. And by the way, this was not the case for alcohol because we were all crushing alcohol. Absolutely.

Everyone on Long Island is on their way to functional alcoholism, if not full-blown, especially at that time when I was in high school, like 2004-2008, which was kind of just like, you know, like, at that time, it was just, I don't know, it was very out of sight out of mind with alcohol, but with weed, it was very monitored. Oh, wow. And when I went to school, when I went to college at NYU, there was, like, a lot of, like, international students and people from all over the country with this, like, vocabulary for marijuana that I never had because I was, like, drinking since I was 13. And they were like, you drink a lot. I was like, I know I probably belong at one of the state schools. But I probably should have gone to Penn State.

But here I am. Yeah. And so, yeah, that broadened my horizons a little bit. Yeah, yeah. Because I was away from my parents. I didn't have to answer to anybody. And I could be gay. Yeah, you know what I mean? So then 19, my sophomore year of college, I sort of came out of the closet, opened up, started trying more things. And then now I'm a monster. Was that process to friends first, then family? The way it went was I came out to my work friends first.

Uh-huh. Then I started sleeping with my boss, bad idea. And then I came out to high school friends. And then I told my mother and a few months later my dad. And that he was like, like the big boss, you know. Him and my, my, like, best male friend from high school, they were the two toughest because it's like, you know, the straight man in your life, at that point, you're kind of like, well, they are the end-all be-all, you know what I mean? Like, if I'm to disappoint them, it would have been, you know, devastating. And so I think that that's something that I don't think people, like, want to admit so much is like how much power, like, this straight man in your life have, like, how much stock you put.

It's like, you know, what your dad thinks, what your, like, best male friend thinks. I don't know. Maybe that's a little bit of me being colonized growing up on Long Island where it's very patriarchal and, like, what's top of mind is, like, you know, having a family one day and, like, you know, having, like, a man's job and stuff like that. It's just a lot of deaconstructing. Well, and I think also, too, when you've been camouflaging yourself as something. Yeah. And that something becomes meaningful. You know, it's like when you play straight for so long.

camouflaging so well that I was prom king. I mean, like, I call myself a code-switching icon. I was like, if whatever you needed me to be, I would, I mean, I was Amy Adams. Yeah. Basically, like, it was kind of just that. It was that for a while. So to the point where when I finally started, you know, committing to my real interests, which were, like, doing comedy, I became like a sketch comedian in college, and I was

in the sketch group at NYU called Hammercats. And that was really fun for me because I was like, I didn't realize how good I already was at playing characters because I kind of have been for a while. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And then it was just funny to get to some place like NYU where it's very diverse. And there's a lot of people who have already

sort of conquered this thing, which is the discomfort with being themselves and they've come to embrace themselves as individuals. Suddenly, I wasn't being bullied by the straight guys in high school. I was being bullied by the out gay kids at NYU you who were much scarier. Right, right. Absolutely.

Because they had it backed up. You know what I mean? Like they, they were adults. Could they sniff you out? Immediately. Yeah. Immediately.

Yeah, because then it becomes, it's like everything that made you acceptable in high school is glaringly off. Right, right. I showed up to NYU, like, I showed up with like the double popped collar, Abercrombie look,

like with that horrible, a fierce cologne on. and the hand bracelets and talking like this. And everyone was just like, what are you doing? Yeah, yeah. And in fact, I remember introducing myself to people and they would just laugh. And it was the first time I realized a couple things. A, that Long Island was like a funny place to be from.

Right. I didn't know that Long Island was like kind of a punchline. It was kind of like Jersey. Were they laughing because you have an accent? Because I think I was so typical. Like, yeah, you know what I mean? Like it was just not. It was very, like, bridge and tunnel.

Yeah. And God bless, and I embrace everyone that I, you know, grew up with. And I had a really great time growing up. But, like, I didn't realize there was, like, an attitude or, like, an idea of what those people were like. Mm-hmm. You know, to put it in, you know, as bluntly as I can, there's just an attitude that people are from Jersey, the city, the Bronx, Long Island that there's, like, that we're, like, not smart or culture. Mm-hmm. And so I was interacting with that and also interacting with the idea that, oh, now authenticity is what people want.

Right. People don't want the, you know, washed out version of what I used to be. I shouldn't blend in. I should be an individual. Yeah, yeah. And I knew what it could be. So it was finally an opportunity for that. But it was a scary opportunity because you have to change everything.

Can't you tell my loves it grows? It is interesting to me because, like, as you're talking about it, and I'm thinking, like, oh, you go to NYU where nobody cares what you are or who you are. And then you tell it, it, it's like, oh, no, they care. There's still this, there's still this feeling of, we have, like, we want you to be something different. Or, like, you have to worry about what you are because of my opinion of it. It gives people who have never been apex an opportunity to be apex. You know what I mean?

And it's like, finally, people are like, wow, I have gone through the fire. I've been through the trials. Like, I am who I am now. I'm powerful. And I'm at this school and I'm in the greatest city in the world. And here I fucking go. And then suddenly you don't realize that that superiority that you're trying on for the first time is still keeping other people down who it's a little bit slower to claim this identity.

And it's just so funny because nowadays, I will sometimes. run into people who did make fun of me freshman year of NYU for being like not gay. And I'm like a pretty out representative gay person now. Like I'm like kind of famously gay. Yeah, yeah. And like I'm on the Out 100. You know what I mean? I have this gay ass podcast with this gay guy, Bowen Yang. And you know what I mean? Like it's gay gay gay gay. It's also gay. And I've become so proud of it. And so, like, I really started to thrive once I committed to who I was. But it's just funny that anyone gate kept over me. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

At a certain point and, like, looked down on me. Yeah, yeah. Because now I see them and they're like, hey, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Oh, really? Do they apologize, kind of? Well. Or is it just an air of kind of like.

A lot of them don't know that they have to. Yeah. But, like, in the years directly following me coming out and stuff, like, certainly some of those guys. like came out and they were like, hey, I'm just going to be real. Like, it was just because I had a crush on you. Oh, wow. I hooked up with probably half of them. You know what I mean?

Just for a good measure. That's very manageable. Yeah, half is like, that's not, you're not overshooting. Well, I'm not a trumpet. Right. Right. Exactly. Exactly.

You stepped up to the buffet and had a very sensible meal. I should say there were thousands of bullies. I was kidding. May I ask, just back up like how your parents took your coming out? They were great. I know that some, that can be a very personal. thing but no but i i also feel like it's so important to be like really vivid and really um like honest about this because i think that there is this idea that because we're now in the

year of our lord 2025 that that must be a lot easier and i think what i'm realizing is it's actually harder now than it probably was a couple years ago five years ago maybe even 10 years ago because of what our climate is like and because of the way that the world is sort of shouting at marginalized people now, like, actually still be afraid. Yeah, yeah. So I would say, like, one of the things that made me so confident and able to take on the world as it were and not be afraid of the world is that I did have very supportive and accepting parents and people around me. And it is so important even if you have reservations about what your child is telling you or what you think that they might be. It is really important to surround them and cover them in love because.

Had I not been, I don't know. I don't know. Yeah, I just, I, my, uh, my son is gay, he's 24 and, and for a long time. And he, it's funny, because it was 11 when he came out to us. Did he really? He came out to my, my ex wife and I when he was 11. Wow. Now that's, he grew up, you know, like, and I say, he's 11 years younger than me.

So yeah, it's like that, that was, it was a different. It was absolutely different time. And they, you know, he grew up in law. Los Angeles, you know, and certainly, and around a lot of gay men. And I, and in retrospect, thinking about it, because I don't, I, I don't project on to people. I take them at face value. Yeah. And I have had, like, coworkers, I had, like, I had one coworker who was, we started working

together, never said anything about being gay, would talk about past ex-girlfriends, talk about his roommate and stuff. And I think it was like he just felt like he had to be careful. And then later other people were like, he's gay as can be. And that roommate is his, you know, is life partner. And it kind of hurt my feelings. You know, I was like, I mean, I have no business having my feelings hurt really. But I did kind of feel like, what the fuck, man, you could, you know. You can tell me. Yeah, you can tell me. And people were like, I can't believe you didn't know. And I'm like, because he didn't tell me anything. I will, you tell. You tell. Tell me what you are.

I will believe you because what do I care other than to take your word. Yeah. So, but I think he came out at 11 and it just was so much easier for him. And I would take, I would take like, because and he also too is absolutely darling. He has had the same boyfriend since he was 16. Really? Oh, wow. He's an eight-year relationship at 24.

year relationship at 24 they've gone to they know that his boyfriend still is in dc but they are as tied and together as i have are they together in dc now no he's here and and his boyfriend's in so they're distance but they're still together and there's this like and i mean and they've talked to about like because like all my gays were like sex crazed maniacs you know again coming up to improv and theater and stuff it was just like it was just a bacchanal And that is one of the gifts of being gay. Yeah. I will say that.

It's like when you realize you don't have to play. Like I remember like when I was 11 like in my head, it was spitting around. I grieved so early in my life the idea that I was going to like pass on my family's name being the only boy. I grieved so early in my life as a child that I was never going to be a father in a real way and like never going to get married because it gets. Then, like, even the liberal politicians at the time were, like, no way. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so I let so many things go in terms of what I could look forward to. That then when I really wrap my head around the idea that, like, I can make my own life.

Like, I do think that one of the things that helped that ease the pain, as it were, was just like, okay, you know what I get to do? Low-key, fuck my friends. Yeah. Like, honestly, like, the rules don't apply because if I'm not, if I'm not going to walk into a world that accepts me and allows me these things, I don't have to even play this game. I don't even have to pretend like I want that. Now people, I'm 35 people, my age, are getting into serious relationships. Like, I'm in a new one. And it comes on the table like, are we getting married?

You know, I'm at the age now when my dad got married to my mother and had me. And I'm like, wow, I stopped thinking about that soul. long ago. Yeah. Because certainly a long-term relationship was not something I was getting into at 16. Sure. Like, he's got experience at 24 that I'm, that I'm years away from having. Absolutely. Absolutely.

It's like a gift to the younger generation. Yes. Like, it, but it's still, it's not easy. But they, they sort of look at, they sort of look at, uh, uh, uh, uh, this is, a story came to my mind that I just can't tell about about. No, but just about like, well, my ex-wife started to notice and they, because like her gay friends, our gay friends. Yeah. Like some of them when he was like getting to, because he's a beautiful human being, would say shit to my, he wouldn't say it to me, but say stuff to my, like, ooh, your son is hot.

Yeah, because they feel safe. He's fucking 15, you know. It's crazy. See, that's where you need to get the hose on the gays. Yeah. It's like, all right, gays. To him and his gay peers of their age, the ones especially that, like, were maybe closeted for three minutes, you know, that is like, they're like, what is with old gays? I know.

They're so horny. We're so weird. See, by the way, I just said we're so repressed. I don't refer to myself as an old gay. No, but. But I will say, like, I think that the repression has a lot to do with it. Absolutely. My dad is gay.

Oh, really? Yes, yes. And that, and so he definitely, it skipped a generation. It skipped a generation. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Which, I don't think he thought it did. Oh. That was always like.

Well, that was some projection. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And it was like, he still, I think, had this, like, very. Who's this Conan? This very, yeah. He still had this. His partner, Conan. He had this very, I think he still has a very 50s gay thing where, like, every person with, like,

anger issues is gay that's just they're gay like that's the answer like being closeted and being gay and any kind of rejection is because i'm gay you know and it's and it's kind of tragic in a way it's really sad yeah but we internalize so many things and it gets calcified because we're alone with the thoughts yeah yeah yeah it's like if anything it's like anything that you can um uh drill down as the thing that is wrong with you yeah when you have a period of of time where you can't talk that out with like, you know, let alone a counselor, because who was talking about therapy when we were growing up, nobody. But when you're alone with yourself, it's like you start to believe all these things

that you tell, the stories you tell yourself, one of which being, like, I'm broken, I'm ill. I thought I had a disease. Yeah. And it wasn't like anyone needed to tell me. Like, I didn't need to hear about AIDS to hear, to know that there was something. like I had convinced myself there was something wrong with me. There's a divine punishment

that will happen. I remember thinking, and this is dark, but it was like, oh, like I'm 11. I don't have any role models that are gay. I don't see anyone in the media

that's gay. All it is is Will and Grace and there's Will who's the acceptable one and Jack, who's a fucking joke. Yeah, yeah. And so I better be like... Very funny joke. Well, hilarious joke again and again and again.

Yeah, yeah. And, you know, I've actually come to know Sean Hayes and we work together and he's such a hero to me because of what he had to deal with. And also playing a character that well, but also it is still being conflicted about how much to share and took a long time to share that. It's like an impossible position to be in. But it's just like I didn't have anyone to look up to. So I remember thinking like, oh, I'll either die keeping this secret or I'll just die a different way. It's very fatalist, the way that you can treat yourself when you're alone with yourself, which is why I think it's important to, like, I know it's been said a million times and it feels like ad nauseum and like it loses its power when it gets said a lot. But representation matters.

I also think nowadays there's so much complexity. in terms of, like, what people's preferences can be sexually the way people can identify and stuff. Yeah. It's just about, like, speaking your truth. Yeah. Because people are listening. Yeah. And, you know, I hope that, like, we're still allowing people to speak all their truth, even if it feels crazy.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because it's going to matter to someone. Yeah. Yeah. And you just, I mean, the, my, my, my feeling with, you know, there's such regressive tendencies in culture. down like you spoke about a parent having a kid come out now, you might have a problem with it because you're afraid for them. That is, I think, something that I don't, I don't think kids are thinking about it. They're thinking, oh, my dad's not going to accept me. It's like not that. Now I think I understand being a little bit older and like understanding responsibility a little bit more and what it means to really care for someone else. One of the first things that my father said to me

after I came out to him. He was good. He took about half hour to himself, and then he wanted to go on a walk with the dog. And it was all, it was kind of just like, he wanted to find a way. And I think he needed time to find a way to ask me

if I was quote unquote being safe, which is coded language for, I'm worried about AIDS. Yeah. Because I think that, especially my generation, all of our parents, like I said,

I graduated high school in 2008. I'm born 1990. Which means that my parents were of breeding age when, like, everyone was dying. Yeah, yeah. Everyone was dying. And I, it devastates me, like, because what this world could be. Yeah. If we had all those brilliant people.

Absolutely. And you know what I mean? Like, just these, because, you know, I believe it was, um, um, what's her name? Fran. Fran Leibowitz. Friendly Bowitz has a beautiful thing about this, about like... She spoke a lot about how that entire generation of gay men were not only making culture, but also, like, receiving culture and talking about culture.

Is that, yeah, if you look it up, because she's just like, it just devastated so many different areas of the arts and fashion just devastated them. You know, just like... She puts it very bluntly. She's like, you know, the cool people were fucking. Yeah, yeah, yeah. This is her words. Like, don't drag me.

But, like, it kind of does make a little bit of sense. Like, you had people that were involved in community, engaged with each other out there in the world. And they all died. Yeah. And with not only no help from the government, with a complete disregard, active disregard and abandonment from the government. And so that, I think, is just something that you have to say out loud because it wasn't that long ago. No. Especially now, it's like, as a.

I get older, I realize, like, someone said recently, like, wow, it's 25 years since oops, I did it again. I'm like, fuck off. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm like, how the fuck is that real? That's your gauge. And then I realized, like, when I'm 10 years old, it was less time than that that the AIDS crisis started. Yeah, yeah. So, like, this is a drop in the bucket when it comes to time. Yeah. So, like, if you think that, like, things can't, can't circularly come back around in terms of attitudes towards the gay community. You're fucking, you're out of your mind. Yeah, yeah.

You're out of your mind. As fucked up as things are, and as much as this sort of like the attitude, you know, if it's a graph, bounces around. We're heading toward, like, like, the gay marriage. It's like it's, people have a reason to feel like it's, you know, that it's, that it's threatened. They had absolutely every reason to feel like.

Well, had they made a different decision, it would be. They just happened to make a decision that they wouldn't come for it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But they could have made a different decision. But all this stuff, I'm just, I just feel like, you know, at least it feels like things kind of, you know, women couldn't fucking vote. Women couldn't have credit cards, right, you know, like we're moving, get used to it. Just fucking, like, yeah, there's going to be gay people. There's going to be trans people.

There's going to be asex people. You know, just like just fucking shut up and just get used to it. Yeah, yeah, I would 100% agree. Yeah, I think. I mean, that's just me being exasperated and just being like, oh, shut the fuck up. Because isn't it tiring? Don't focus on, oops, I did it again. Focus on feeding people.

What's fucking really important? We have to treat each other like human beings. Yeah. Because I'll say this, like, after this last election, I was floored. I couldn't fucking believe. it. I watched that one debate when he said they're eating the dogs, whatever, and I was just like

I was so exasperated and I watched it in like a space with a lot of people who were actually voting for him. I watched it at an Irish bar in the financial district. Wow. On a date with a gay guy. Oh wow. Why? Why? I don't know. There's so many why's. Is it

a kink? It was, you know what? Maybe I did have some like some sort of like punishment kink. But we did have great sex that night actually. Oh, there you But it shouldn't work out. Let's go. Shout out to Josh, I think your name was. But basically, like, I was in that space watching it.

And I was so floored when the election results came in. And I was like, you know what? I'm going to have to start doing, unfortunately. I'm going to have to start consuming different kinds of media that I never would. And so I actually started listening to against everything in my being. I started listening to like some right. wing podcasts and some stuff like that. Not because I was interested in like absorbing anything, but I was like, I want to hear

what it is that they're thinking and how they communicate with each other. And I have learned some things. Like, it's, it's, they're just, I do think that like religion has people in a joke old. Like, it gets a little scary there because, and I think also there are media narratives on, on both sides that we're believing, which are just not that important. Because I'm an optimist. I think at a certain point,

we're all going to really realize that when it comes to the really important stuff, a lot of people are talking about the same thing, which is we don't want our lives to be the most expensive thing in the world. You want to be able to feed yourself, let alone your family. You want to be able to pursue your goals.

And I do think that the more we weighed through this, like the Mamdani phenomenon is the same type of thing as the Trump phenomenon, because they're both talking about the fact that, like, isn't it fucked how they take all your money? Yeah. And isn't it fucked how hard it is? And it's like, Trump is obviously bullshit. But like, and he's like lying to everybody, which we see now as like costs obviously skyrocket. And he doesn't seem to have a concern about like what people pay for their health care, et cetera. He would have been happy to let people keep suffering through the shutdown, etc. But I think and I hope that we can wade through the bullshit enough to see that like

it is really just about like not, I hate to say taking the money from the, from the richest people in the world, but like really examining and figuring out how we can fix wealth and equality. Yes. Yes. That's what it's about. Yeah, absolutely. That's what it's about. You have to make it about the economy. You have to make it about class. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's like, go back to Long Island and I'm like how what changed because like there's so many Trump flags on the on the lawns like it's just like and I know these people and they're not bad people yeah so I'm like but what and I realize it's just like because people are getting fucked yeah and they don't know what to do yeah yeah so they go for the outsider yeah and they also too like I've said this before and since

he's dead now I can say it but whenever people are like talk about like getting in a time machine and killing baby Hitler, I was always like, while you're back to kill baby Roger Ailes. Yeah, 100%. You know, just, I don't know if that would have made a difference, but it's like that Fox News stuff, it's fucking ruined us.

Can I say something about babies? Yeah, sure you can. If they're annoying you, if the baby's being too much, toss it. Yeah, might be a Hitler. It might be a Hitler baby. Yeah, yeah. You don't know. Sorry. Your honor. At this point, we're never going to know

when it's going to be. Malala. You know what I mean? Like, get rid of the baby. It could be Hitler. It could be Malala. It's at any point. And if it's Malala, she might end up doing TikToks with Jimmy Fallon. We love this turn for Malala. I love it. She's a survivor letter to TikTok. Do you, I mean, you're obviously, you know, you're obviously very engaged. How do you, how do you, because I have a hard time with and throughout like the history of the Conan show. Because we were, we were on the air. We were doing. We were doing. our absurdist fucking puppet show, you know, and having two, you know, two or three segments with Mickey Rooney. Right. You know, for, for years. And it was the good days then.

Yeah. And then it kind of, you know, the Daily Show, which is brilliant and very watchable. Like that became the, you know, gold standard of comedy. Totally. And we, you know, we had to use Topicale. We, initially when in 93 when we started,

we're like fucking topicality that's like eat your vegetables yeah we're gonna be we're just gonna be up our own ass yeah yeah yeah and then quickly we the actual show comes and we're like oh my god I hope Madonna does something so we can write something

I know I know like topicality just is your friend because you gotta lay so much track for this railroad that's coming at you and it does take over sometimes like it comes in a receipt it's like people want people want like content about what's happening but then people don't

Like, it's interesting. I don't really know where we're at now. Well, we were always kind of, and Conan actually, we had a conversation once about it. And what he said was perfect. And I believe, he said, he said, yeah, we could try and chase every headline and make it sort of. And because my feeling was always, and he would say, like, there's, it's not laughs. You're getting cheers. And to me, it always felt a lot of preaching to the choir, which to me is not satisfying

comedy. No. I always used to joke like, after a comedy said, I don't want to go, good point. Yeah, exactly. High five, dude. You told him. Yeah, and so Conan said, I, he said, I truly believe that

absurdity and absurdism is doing a better service to humanity and that will ultimately end up meaning more in an artistic way and in sort of a cultural way. And it's evergreen. And I believe him too because, yeah, Because there's plenty of like, you know, I would look back at my old tweets and I would make some sort of very funny cutting joke about something that just happened. And then eight months later, I'm like, what the fuck is that about? What was I talking about? Like, you know, like, maybe they'll throw pumpkin pies at the Kansas City legislature. You know, I was like, you know. And I, and I believe the same way. And I wonder, like, do you, how do you sort of balance that between? Well, it's funny. Like, we have like, um,

Our podcast, Las Culturistas, is weekly, and we do talk about culture, but it can be hard because it can be hard to make light, you know what I mean? And then I also think that in times where people feel super politically hopeless, they have extra ire and extra energy one way or the other for these trivial topics. So I can be like, you know what I really liked? The new Sabrina Carpenter album. And then there will be thousands of people. to tell me that somehow

it makes me like a fascist. You know what I mean? It's like the leaps that people will go through. Taylor Swift is a really good example because she can't just put out an album without it being how she didn't do enough this, this, this, this, that, the other. It has to be about a million other things.

And I do get it to an extent, but I also think when you zoom out, it's weird. Yeah. And I think that it's because it does boil down to the, fact that like we can't we feel like our no one feels like their voice is being heard enough so i would say like when it comes to comedy it's like there's room for both like i'm happy that conan was like i'm going to keep being conan yeah he's smart enough to do whatever the fuck

he wants you guys are both like you know what i mean like it's i would feel in good hands if at any point there was a decision to tackle topical stuff and i'm sure obviously as the years go on at like ebbs and flows but I think someone like John Oliver is made to do what he does. Yes, absolutely. And like, you know, I think Jimmy Fallon does a great job doing what he does. And I think that

there's like a place for everything. It gets hard when you're like straddling a line. Yes. And, and, you know, it's when the audience gets bigger too, you realize you can't satisfy everyone. No.

So, Jimmy Fallon actually had a quote recently where he was like, you know, I wasn't prepared to be disliked. He said that. And I was like, that's a really like candid admission. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Like someone that comes with all the good attentions in the world and someone that's just like, I'm an entertainer. I'm a clown. You know, I respect Colbert for going down like he's going down.

Yeah, yeah. And I even just said like there was like a study that came out, which is like 40% of queer characteristics. that were on TV last year are going to be gone this year and I was just like you know I even put on my story I was just like I just hope that the people who are in a position of power to change this go down trying to change this because I have news for you you're going down right exactly you're going down anyway our business sucks to everybody that cheers that just get ready for in three years when six thousand gay characters are at least I know right and then it's like god damn it yeah yeah yeah Oh my God, it's a gay tsunami.

The overcorrection on this? Yeah, yeah. Is that just going to be gay pride parades? It's going to be. I know, I know. I mean, I ride tsunamis. I honestly, I hope. I hope, I hope.

Because it is, you know, just the pendulum nature of things is just, it just doesn't stop. And you're like, but it does it. Like I said, in my lifetime, like just to think that like Ellen coming out, that was in my adult lifetime in terms of like the attitude and what a big fucking deal it was or the fact that like on Melrose place there was a gay kiss that they cut away

from. Yeah. Like it that's in my adult lifetime. Yeah. And you know and where we are now like granted there's still repression and there is there is sort of a Yeah we're going back to it. We're going back to it. We're going back to it but I can only hope

that it's yeah you know that once once the poison is eradicated. Yeah, we're gonna get some snakes in here. Then, then,

you know, that we will, that some sort of sanity will remain because it just, it's in, it's impossible. Yeah.

You know, I, I, I'm, people are out there probably going like, you fucking idiot. It's not impossible. And,

you know, they have a point too, but it's just like, I just feel like, and I mean, it's just my attitude about all this kind of stuff. Like,

just, let's just get to be in fucking, Denmark already. Like, come on, let's just be fucking Denmark, because look how nice it is over there. I would agree. I mean, my thing is, though, like, I can, I can understand that for a lot of people, like, they, I've been in a home where someone saw a gay kiss and said, why does it have to be a gay kiss? And I'm like, sure, there's also a million other things to watch.

You know what I mean? It's like, it's like you don't have a right to. control the content of whatever show, the film, whatever this is. And also, I'm not someone who needs a gay character and everything. I don't really care like that. But I think if we're going

to tell authentic stories, like tell authentic stories. Yes. Like, my only thing is I just want things to be good and feel like they make sense. Like, I don't need to shoehorn in quote unquote diversity. Yeah, yeah. I actually feel

we got to a place where it was like, you watched any network sitcom and it was the same bullshit it was seven characters two white two mixed race one this one that whatever and it was just like every single show seemed like a forced melting pot of course it was a forced melting plot in a workplace comedy or whatever and i was like i'm sorry but this feels like forced this feels like you're tokenizing people absolutely because guess who was never one or two on those call sheets the diverse characters yeah yeah yeah So in that way, it was kind of just like, okay, like, it just feels like you're checking a box, the target of it all. Yeah.

The second, it wasn't in vogue for them to be like, you know, have a Benatom. Have, like, yeah, have like, be like a rainbow covered. Yeah. They weren't. They completely threw us under the bus. So it's just as you get older, you realize what bullshit it is. No. And so all you can do is, like, look to your own community and be like, let's do things honestly on our end.

Yes, yes. Because they will ask you to change later. Yes. I know as someone who came up in an environment that was like, oh, we love the Brooklyn Alt comics. You know, like, we love like all these gay actors, whatever. Like, we love, yeah, pop off on your podcast. Say what you think. Do that like subversive joke.

Like, yeah. Then you get into the real business and it's like, okay, so are you actually going to say this? Because we're really worried. It's like they want you to be you until there's money involved. I have experienced, you know, so much, you know, in getting my own shows or developing my own shows of the initial sort of wooing of like, we love you, we love your voice, we love everything you are, we love how, you know, how unique you are and how precisely you are, we want to do business with you, okay. And then get down, it's like, you know what, could you actually be more like someone else? Would that be the things that are kind of, I know you're trying to do something that's sort of like a little bit different. Could you be more like something that we know works?

And it's just, it's infuriating. And it's like what you were saying about diversity, like, I just long for the day where there's a gay character who's just gay. Yeah, right. And it's the most incidental thing to the whole, you know, it's not like, because it's now it's like, I'm gay. Yeah. Oh, here comes gay. You know, or it's just. Yeah, well, we've now reverted back to like, um,

I could call out a certain show, but I won't. We've reverted back to it. You never know who's hiring. We've reverted back to this environment of like palatable gay. And I'm like, oh my God. You know what I'm just like, it's just, I don't know. It's never going to be what I'm into. But now I'm realizing more and more, it's just like, we have the podcast and we have full control over what's on there.

And I remember we had Tina Faye on about a year and a half ago. And she said to Bowen, like, you're too famous to be real now. Like, authenticity is dangerous and expensive. Like, you can't say your real opinion on movies because you're in the business. And she said, Matt Rogers, you have about one more year. And I thought it was like a funny read. And I was like, that's hilarious, whatever. But suddenly you get that it's true.

Yeah. You get that it's true. It's like, but I'm starting to care less. Yeah, yeah. I think, like, in New Year, like, I'm going to start giving less of a fuck because what's the point? Like, it's like, what is the point? Like, what am I scared of losing exactly?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, there's, you know, what I try and temper, because, you know, I've been openly political, you know, a large, you know, on social media or whatever on this thing. But, you know, I've been openly political. But, and I temper it with just like, is it entertaining?

Right. You know, because I did, there are times when I'm just genuinely pissed about something. Yeah. And I feel like it needs to be addressed. Yeah. And like, you know, like I'm doing dancing with the stars. And I was still reposting things. Yeah.

And people were, there were people that were like getting real pissy about it. Yeah, they were like, I was a new fan of yours and now I'm not. Now I'm not. And it's, and then I, and I actually wrote something where I was like, you know, people are unhappy that I'm doing quote unquote political posts. And I said, but if you'll notice, they're mostly. about the illegal abduction of brown skin people and not feeding children. Like, and those, you know, if that's a problem, sorry, it's not going to stop, you know. Yeah, I think that now we're at a point where it's like any criticism of one issue is like an indictment of the whole thing.

And it's like, okay, well, then we're really fucked. I also, I also think, too, is that there's so much ugly, heinous shit that even the people, the biggest maga person, person in the nose, the biggest maga person in the world knows, this is kind of ugly and haines. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So when you say they're zip tying children, they don't want to hear that because they know that's really, really bad. Yeah. There is a part of them. And then they'd have to encounter that. Then they would have to start like picking away at the whole, you know, house of cards to see if it falls down. Right. And, and, you know, who's got time for that? And that would be, that would be too much because it would, it would, it would, it would, it would, it would

actually cause them to, you know, then interrogate this thing that they've made their large part of their identity. Their personality, yeah. Yeah, which is why I was like, after the election, I was kind of like, all right, in what way am I maybe? Am I, like, in a silo? Like, could it be? Because I really thought this was happening. Yeah, yeah. And then I was just like, you know, I'm just trying to educate myself and learn as much as I can about the way that people think regardless of how they think. Right. I don't know. I think a lot of people are doing that yeah i think it will be good for us it has to be better than this yeah i just keep telling myself physics every action has an equal and opposite reaction like we were just saying the pendulum yeah

and i just remember swing back baby please please it was 2008 i it was november 2008 i had been like just moved to the city i was thinking about coming out and obama was elected and i went to fucking union square and we were all celebrating and excited and it felt like anything was possible and And that feeling that I had for, honestly, those eight years that I was in college and then in, you know, in New York as a young developing comic as a developing artist as a developing person, like just the idea of that possibility freed me. Yeah. Mind you, I wasn't someone raising a young family. I don't know how that feels. Yeah.

So now I'm just trying to get a more holistic understanding of how everybody feels. Yeah. And at least being able to speak to those concerns and recognize those concerns instead of being like, well, that's not a concern. Yeah. Because that's not helping us. Right. Exactly. No, it's and it's, yeah, and it's also sort of selfish, you know.

You see Trump now doing the same thing that they were knocking Biden and Kamala for, though. The economy is great. Yeah, yeah. What are you talking about? Right, right, right. Price are going to come down. They are. Yeah, yeah.

It's like, okay, you can't tell people the economy is great when it's bad for them. Yes, exactly. You just have to, now we'll see if it, if it is a demerit on him the way it was a demerit on them. Yeah. You know, it's just, yeah, it's all the same shit. Yeah. All right. Should we cheer?

Should we cheers again? Cheers, Chinchin. Did you put any, oh, you finished? I drained my champagne. Oh, why'd you do the outro? Well, listen, I want to say your Christmas and December tour is going on now. It's going on. It says, you'll be at the Fonda in Los Angeles on December 3rd.

Tickets at www.mattrogers official.com. and Las Culturistas. Every week, Wednesday. Just keeps chugging along. He's chugging. Yeah. For better or worse. But thank you so much for coming in.

It's been real pleasure talking to you. Likewise. Thank you so much for having me. You're welcome. And thank all of you for listening. I'll be back next week with more of this. The three questions with Andy Richter is a team cocoa production. It is produced by Sean Doherty and engineered by Rich Garcia.

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