The Three Questions with Andy Richter - Michaela Watkins

Episode Date: November 19, 2019

Actress and comedian Michaela Watkins talks with Andy Richter about a hereditary love of math, her first stage role as a British maid, how to stay invested in the material, bidding farewell to Portland for a career in LA, and the boom of female-led projects in Hollywood. Plus, Michaela discusses what she’s learned about the fine line of nuance in comedy.This episode is sponsored by Betterhelp (www.betterhelp.com/threequestions code: THREEQUESTIONS)

Well, hey, everybody. We might as well. We'll start this now. Hi, everyone. This is the Three Questions with Andy Richter. And that's Michaela Watkins talking on the other end of the pod here. We have two cups, one string. Yeah.

We have a pod between us, which is the name of my memoir. Well, I'm glad to have you here. Oh, I'm so happy to be here. I don't know you very well, but we know a ton of people in common. And I do, but you're also like one of those people that i feel like i do know you i know what you mean yeah it's true and uh you're like kind of like you're like me like there's nothing too precious that you i mean there are things i probably wouldn't tell everybody in the world but like for the most part pretty open book um

i don't know you seem very familiar to me yeah well i especially for what i do for a living the the the people that are that you get the sense like oh i'm talking to who this person is all the time is is it is it's not necessarily rare but it is a distinct thing. And I think it is in the minority of showbiz assholes. Yeah. And you seem to be like you're a, you know, a WYSIWYG person. What you see is what you get. Yeah. Yeah.

A WYSIWYG. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know. Now I don't feel like I know you at all. Nobody I know would ever say that. Is WYSIWYG. Well, I'm a big techie.

That's why, you know, garbage in, garbage out. Oh, and I'm just a star athlete. Well, we have a bunch of friends in common, too. We know a bunch of people in common. That's true. Some of your Chicago contingency, which I've never spent any substantial time there other than to shoot one thing one week, one time. Yeah. And yeah, but I like it.

And I'm from Syracuse, so New York, which is like Chicago adjacent. I mean, it's more Midwest than it is East Coast. Yeah, I can see that. Yeah. Yeah. When I first moved to New York, I was surprised at how country upstate New York is, you know? I know. And you say, you know, where are you from to anybody? Oh, that's one of your questions. Yeah. But if you say that to anybody, you know, and I say upstate New York, they're like, oh, I love Westchester County. You're like, no, no, no, keep going. Keep going till you hit Canada. Yeah. You're like, no, no, no. Keep going. Yeah, keep going.

Till you hit Canada. Yeah, right. Where the inbreeding really starts. Yeah. Well, now let's get to that. You're from Syracuse. Were you born there? I was born there.

Cross-Serving Memorial Hospital. And your folks are academics? My dad is a professor, a math professor at Syracuse. He just retired, but he's still working away. Doing math. Honestly, one time I picked him up because I had to go to an audition, like, when I first moved to L.A. And I dropped him off at the Tar Pits. As one does.

As one drops off at the mathematician. Go to the Tar Pits. Have a field day and i came back and when i told him i was going to pick him up and he was lying on the lawn staring at the sky and i had to like double park my car throw on the hazards and run over and be like dad i'm picking you up now i'm here and. And he's like, oh, I'm so sorry. I was just lost in a math problem. I was like, sorry, gals. He's taken. Are you in any way that?

I'm a daydreamer. But I mean, but math. I mean, because math to me is so foreign. I'm math-ish. I'm not his kind of math. He does combinatorics and plane theory. I'm more like I can play a board. Like I figured out sort of, oh, I think I know how to win at Settlers of Catan, like pretty, you know, pretty early on, that kind of thing. Or I'm, I'm strategical in terms of, I, you know, always loved card games and puzzles and things like that.

But my dad, and I always love it. It's a very fun thing for me. This train is going this amount of time and try to figure it out. Those are exciting, fun games. Yeah. So I used to love to balance my checkbook. I used to love it. And you don't anymore?

Does someone do it for you now? No, it's a shit show. I think I might go to jail. Really? Maybe. Seriously? I don't know what's happening anymore. Like everything is credit card. You know, before it was like when you are living paycheck to paycheck.

Yeah. And your, your wage is based on your tips and everything like that. The only upshot I would say of that time in my life was I knew exactly what was happening all the time. Yes. And how much money you had. Yeah. And I mean, it's also like a, it's a burden because you're like, Oh, that person ordered another beer. Okay. That's going to set me back. But at the same time, I was like, I'm going to have a steak because I earned it this week and you could, and that was so stress-free. Yeah, yeah.

You never – you were never out of your – or I wasn't. Right, right. I was pretty responsible. Yes. Having a mathematician. I had – when I incorporated, you know, which – are you incorporating? I am. Yeah.

It's something – I mean, you know, I don't know if some people know but it's just basically it's a tax dodge in a way you become you become your own especially now that you you know so sad but donations are only yeah tax deductible for people who are yep incorporated and i do a lot of that shit yeah it's just sucks. You know, people are trying to do good. And the only incentive they had was that was sometimes tax deductible. So they were like, okay, it's not a total hardship, you know? I mean, I don't want to get too much off on this tangent, but yeah, it does seem like there is a real pro cruelty vibe that is kind of like, let's, let's try and try out the most needy as aggressively

as possible. Let's make, let's make giving and caring as difficult as possible. Yeah. Yeah. Let's, let's sort of de-incentivize just basic decency. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like not a value. I think that, I think that it's like some sort of knee-jerk reaction to what they call.

Compassion? No, no. Empathy. Income distribution or whatever. You know, the redistribution of wealth. Okay. You know, like they think that like they don't like the notion that any of their money might be taken away to be given to poor people because they think, which is, you know, it's like I make a good living and I could never, ever in a million years think I deserve every penny I get. Like for being on a talk show, you know, I mean, I'm doing what I used to do for free.

Right. And I'm getting paid very well for it. So the notion that like every penny is mine is just bananas to me. But there are people that feel that way. I know. And I think they're just the notion that giving to poor people. I think that's like been the hardest thing about these last few years for me is that realization is just like not everybody. about these last few years for me is that realization is just like not everybody I just assumed especially like I'm not Christian but I grew up in a Christian sort of town and world

environments and I you know I absorb like a lot of what is talked about I've seen every embroidered pillow and they all have this whole you know giving do one to others yeah this whole thing and I just sort of thought like we all collectively agreed that we're going to take care of each other. And then I just realized in the last few years that there are people who just fundamentally, they don't have it. They don't have that sort of file in their download.

Or it's not been uploaded to their mainframe. And they just don't really care or want to or feel any. And it's just so strange to me because it just feels so embedded in my being. I think what happens is there's a tribalism where people think, oh, yes, I believe in the golden rule. But the notion of others, doing to others as you would have them do, you know, the others is like, well, there are others that I do have that will fall under that. And then there are other others that are just like, they're not me. They're not, I don't have to really think of them because they're so different from me. And it's, you know.

I mean, it's not like I've been a saint my whole life. Let's be honest about that, you know. But when people made fun of me as a kid, I learned very quickly how to do unto others. I was like, I will make fun of you. And I found out I was pretty good at it sometimes, you know. But then as you get older, you're like, oh, it's not. I guess it's sort of a sign of weakness that I default to that. So maybe I'll try to, you know, leave the world better than I found it. I find, too, young people, because as a young comedian or a young comedy person, there was a lot of, you call it whatever you want, ball busting, ragging on, the Chicago is ragging on each other.

Oh, yeah, that's Boston. I moved to Boston when I was 15, so ragging was a big thing we used. And that's what you do. You know, there's all this kind of like insult comedy. And as time goes on, you're just like, oh, you know what? That's, oh, no. Yeah. There's a toxicity to that.

Yeah. I don't think I want to partake in. And I honestly feel like I'd rather say nice things to people whose company I enjoy than say like, you know, like, well, that's you, you fucking idiot. I think if we could just do 90-10, that's pretty good. 90% like try to be our higher selves. Yeah. And then 10% of the time, if we're going to just, you know, people's pretty good. 90% like try to be our higher selves and then 10% of the time if we're gonna

just, you know, people need an outlet. You gotta off gas. You gotta off gas a little bit. Yeah. And if you're like, fuck this fucking guy over here. You know, if you have to do that like keep it 10 or below percent. I think there's nothing, nothing wrong

with harmless therapeutic bitching. Yeah. You know, just like sitting and saying like, that fucking guy. And, you know, even if it's non-confrontational, it's just, again, like I said, it's off-gassing. It's just like this poison judgment builds up and every once in a while you got to dump it out. You know, you're going to do something more stupid. Yeah. Or you're going to start to resent being.

Well, I hope everybody has learned everything there is about being a good person today. Look, they're still, they're on the edge of their seats. I know. So let's get back to your dad. Was he, because just in that little microcosm you told me, was he an engaged parent? Yes and no. After my parents split, he became more engaged. At which age?

I was eight or nine. And then it was a very stressful time. Both my parents were totally out to lunch. You mean reeling from the divorce? Yes. It was the 70s. So they were out for blood. Like they didn't know another way to divorce. It was sort of like Kramer versus Kramer. It was like, it didn't even start out pretty. It just went straight to ugly. And I didn't know anybody else whose parents were divorced. So there was really no template for that. Yeah. So there was really no template for that.

Yeah. And there was no hiding it from you. There wasn't. I mean, not even an attempt. Any siblings? Two older sisters. Okay. One just smoked pot through the entire, she was six and a half years older than me.

Yeah. So she was stoned. The other one is like a serious intellectual. She's an awesome badass, but at the time she was a supreme next level nerd. And she like learned Japanese, graduated high school early and got the fuck out of Syracuse.

Oh, wow. So she was like, she just put her head in a book. Yeah. So two very different ways of dealing with it. But I was like eight, nine, and I just absorbed all of it. You know, I wanted to kind of fix it and fix them.

And, yeah, you know, I just kind of wanted to normalize their whole everything because everything was so disrupted. Yeah. Did they confide in you? Did they overshare, like, aspects of it? Yeah, they did. I wish I was a little more protected i always thought i would love to do like a this american life kind of thing i probably shouldn't

go into that on here but um why because it's so personal about my parents like it's my story i would tell it but it's about my parents yeah the long and short of it is you know my mom always accused my dad of something which he forever. And my dad never apologized for what he clearly did that my mom really needed to hear. And were they two different things? Just the same thing. Oh. But I feel like if I could just interview them separately and give them each. The tape?

Well, just be like, you know, while you were so angry at him about this, do you think it was helpful to tell your daughters about it, you know? And just have her be like, you know, because don't you think that kind of soured us a little on her dad, you know? And like just have her have her opinion about it and then just say to my dad, like, you know, could you just apologize for this thing you did and let her have that? You know, would that have been so hard? Like it's been so many years. The truth is it's been so many years that now nobody gives a shit, but I just sort of felt like it would be a really nice fine point on a story.

Well, and I do think that's like, because I had a very similar situation in that my mom will say things like, when you were about 10, I stopped arguing with you because you would always win. And then I started seeking your advice because you had good advice, which, I mean, as the time as a child. If I were a mother and my kid said that, I would feel so, it'd be so gratifying. What do you, oh, I said that. You're always right, and so I seek your advice.

Yes. I'd be like, oh. But the thing is. Did you read my diary? That's all I've ever wanted to hear a person say. But the thing is, though, is that it's not healthy. You know, it's not, it's too much. And at the time, it felt flattering and special and special and I felt mature and I felt valued.

But it's like one of those things where having become a parent, looking back and seeing that kind of thing and think like, oh, I wouldn't do that. I wouldn't do that, but I wouldn't do that because I know what it did to me, which is kind of created years and years and years of putting off me and what I wanted out of life. And because I had gotten so used to sort of taking care of other people. And I mean, like I'm a fucking talk show sidekick. It's not a coincidence. It's like I was engineered for the fucking job. You know, like the sort of like, no, no, I'll be fine. You go get what you need. I'll be here when, you know.

Yeah. But I also, too, as a father. I'll be liked enough. Huh? I'll be liked enough. Yeah. But yeah. Well, like I've also said this too, that like in improv, I early, doing improv early on, I learned like there are some people, they really need it.

And you get on stage with the people that really need it. And just my makeup is just go like, all right, go ahead, go get it. I'll stand back here. And then as you get more poised as a performer, it becomes, go get it. I'll stand back here. And then as you get more poised as a performer, it becomes, you go ahead, I'll be back here and I'll win. I'll stand back here and I will wait and I will come in and I will step on you. It's such a funny dichotomy that you are because, you know, I just love, and I know you're being facetious, but I just love the idea of I will win at improv. Yes.

Which is like so, you know, just so counterintuitive to everything that improv is. But at the same time, like, that's what my suspicion is about every person who is happy to be a sidekick, you know, or the support team. Yes. Is that somewhere in the back of their mind, they've got the whole picture wired and they're like, oh, no, I'm making a mistake. It's not all, like, I know exactly what's happening. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, it's like, oh, okay, go ahead, take up all the oxygen.

Yeah. But, you know. I know where the exits are. Yes. And I, you know, and so, but what I was saying like about that dynamic being set up is that I also, as a parent, look back at my mom and think, because she went through a pretty bad divorce when I was a teenager and I was very much included in knowing too much about what was happening. And I do have sympathy in that, like, she was hurting, you know, and she, yeah. I mean, can you imagine trying to parent when you are not sure you're going to be able to have a house anymore? Yeah, yeah. Or a roof over your head. Yeah.

Or clothes or any way to provide for your kids. Yeah. I just really feel for my parents at that time. And emotionally, you know, the heartbreak and the, what they did terribly was, was what they were, you know, was the arguments over stuff. That was the shitty part. Everything else I understand. I wish, you know, I think parents then also forgot, you're not just saying something crappy about my mom or my dad.

You're saying something crappy about half of my DNA. So, you know, I think it instilled a real loss of esteem for me. And I think I had to learn to overcome it because through the eyes of both my parents, you know, each half of me was such a fucking loser for one reason or another, you know? And so I think I had to repair that. I've actually never said that before. So this is a real revelation, but I- Is it something you knew? Well, I just thought, you know, I just think I thought, oh, I'm really, but maybe I'm a sensitive kid, which I think I am, you know? But, and I think I made, you know,

which I think I am, you know, but, and I think I made, you know, most out of what was happening. You know, I found, thank God, humor was sort of my, you know, Sherpa out of this time. But I think like, thank God I had that, you know, I think I have sort of this weird, it's funny, I have like this sort of bit of optimism that's kind of thread in there, even though for day-to-day things, I can tell you all the horrible things that ever happened. But like, I feel if you are really down in the dumper, you want to come to me because I'm going to find the, I'm going to find the light. But, and I think, thank God for these things that I'm lucky to have, you know, that are just sort of there. That was a good, that was a nice little trade-off for that. But I do think that low self-esteem, trying to prove my worth or my value or fit in or be normalized by other people, I felt really like everybody would know I was somehow less than.

Yeah. Somehow less than. Yeah. And, and. Less than because, because of that sort of devaluing of, of, well, you know, of like the two most important people in your life. Where like the two people that you are most connected to, I don't know about worship or whatever, but they're like, this is, this is your template for being a human being. And both of them are shit, according to the other one. Where you're sprung from. Yeah, that's kind of like you're left like, well, what is it to be a grown up?

If I said, you know, you are made out of diamond encrusted, you know, beautiful gemstones and tuna fish. And then I was like, and you are, you know, sprung from boogers and old meatloaf. It's just like in the back of your mind. You're like, oh, I'm boogers and meatloaf. Yeah. I hope, you know, I'll never be gemstones, you know, that kind of thing. Yeah. Did you get along better with one or the other?

You left with your mom. They were so different that my mom was, you know, now I know she's severely ADHD. Oh. But so there were no rules. It was a lawless place. Oh, wow. And my dad was all rules and all, you know. Math. Math and business.

Yeah. I mean, but I, so when they were married, it was a really good combo for me. I had structure and free form. But when they split, I had to, I was just so chaotic because I would be in my mom's house where I was having like chocolate and peanut butter for breakfast.

And I was at my dad's house where I was allowed to watch only a half hour of TV on the black and white TV, you know, it was just really hard to adjust. A duality. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I was sort of, God, this is really interesting, Andy, because I did, I feel like I was sort of, I feel like I sort of split at that time, you know? Do you think that is like a performer inspiration, you know, like where you got to play two different

roles well it made me grow up really quickly because I couldn't wait to leave both of them so I could just hang out and do bad things with my friends yeah yeah you know part of my thing too is like you said being funny finding out oh I'm funny, is morale keeping. Like when things are tense, okay, it's my job to keep it light, to keep it loose, to, you know, and make sure everybody's okay. Try and put out fires. And part of that is that, I mean, there's like these archetypes of, know like that's i think there's a joseph campbell archetypes and one the one that i think i fit is like the the center person that i don't remember what it's called but like it's like always trying to take care of everybody always trying to keep the peace and then like the last thing is like is usually the first to leave

you know it's like okay yeah i yeah, I'll, you know, let me keep these plates spinning and okay, bye. Sorry if the plates fall and crash, but I got to go. Yeah. Fuck all y'all. Yeah. And that was kind of, you know, I mean, I'm the one that lives away.

Everybody else does not live away. They all live close. They're all together. My siblings and my parents and my mom, you know. And you flew the coop. Yeah. And I've been New York or LA. Gotcha.

I mean, you know, my job is such that that's the case too. But I think you're an artist, you know, and you need new input. Yeah. I mean, it's been a convenient sort of geographic thing. I mean, I feel like most people who want to do something outside of, you know, who are performers and artists or creative types, you know, need to constantly feed the beast. And get out of there, too. Yeah. Get out of there.

Yeah, for sure. And I took the first opportunity I got. So when my mom got a job in Boston, I, I hitched a ride with her, but. How old were you at that time? I was 15. 15. Yeah. I was in high school. And had you been living with your dad or with your mom or. You know. 50, 50. Alternate weekends, Wednesday night dinners, that kind of thing. Yeah. Yeah. It was sucked. Um, but mostly I was, again, I was just with my, um, my friends who were bad influences. But they were my influences.

And, yeah, it's so funny because I love where I ended up, you know? But I didn't love that journey, but I love where I ended up. So I don't feel sad or sorry for myself or anything like that. I, I have this, um, I think my, the thing I thought a quote recently, that's like, I wish I could quote it. I'd probably have to look at it cause I have no memory, but it was something like. Everything happens for a reason. Yeah. But it's like, it's more, you know, I love to give advice. I love giving advice a lot. And I kind of made a pact with myself that I wouldn't give any more advice unless anybody asked me for advice. And why is that?

Because I used to, I went through such a shitty time in my 30s where sort of the veil came down. Where in my 20s, you know, like from my teens and 20s, I sort of blocked everything out. And I just was in this forward momentum of pursuing comedy and acting and all these things and boys and making out and whatever was interesting to me. And I was so forward in that thing of wanting to kind of crawl into this life that I imagined for myself. kind of crawl into this life that I imagined for myself. And by the time I got to my 30s, I just sort of hit this wall where I realized like I had to deal with myself, you know? I had to... Had you been in therapy at all? I was in therapy at the time and probably why I hit the wall, quite honestly. I mean,

I went to therapy for a fear of flying and I came away, like breaking up my, you know, I was engaged, like ending my seven-year engagement and falling in love with this man. I met on an airplane, like I just kind of nuked my life. Yeah, yeah. But I, again- When you said for fear of flying, I was like, the Erica Jong book? Oh no, right, right. of flying um yeah um yeah well yeah i think that's what happens is you open up you open up that box yeah and a bunch of you know shit flies out yeah a bunch of you know

peanut brittle snakes fly out yeah and then the thing that you keep you know. Shit flies out. Yeah, a bunch of, you know, peanut brittle snakes fly out. Yeah. And then the thing that you keep, you know, the therapist keeps coming back to and you're just like, I don't fucking want to talk about this anymore. Yeah. Ends up being the thing. Yeah. That's, you know, cratering your life. Yeah, yeah. And so I was really lucky.

I had a great therapist. Yeah. And who kind of, well, I switched to a great therapist who kind of pulled me out of the darkness or helped me along. But I realized that I had to step on every rake, you know, and get bonked in the head. I would love to have been somebody that didn't have to. So I don't necessarily give advice because I don't think people suffering and going through hard times. Maybe I'm a shitty person, but I am starting to believe that I think that's actually not the worst thing to happen to a person. Because if I hadn't, I never would have met my husband and really seen who he is. And, you know, I don't think I would have realized my career in certain many respects, you know, I can't say for sure, but I feel like only when I lived these hard things, like did my full self materialize.

Yeah. And then it made space and room for kind of awesome things to happen. Yeah. some things to happen, you know? And, and, you know, I always feel like by the time I got like my best job, there was nobody in my life that I was spiteful towards, you know? And so I was like, ah, God, isn't there some ex-boyfriend that I could, you know, scramble up that'd be like, I did it. You told me I couldn't. But the truth is, even if there was, like, I don't care. I wish them well.

That's fine. You know, I'm not a saint, but I just, there wasn't even, I couldn't even scare up that person because I got to this place of like such humility because I had been, I'd been so low right before that. Yeah. So, you know, that's sort of where I landed. So that's why I don't really give advice unless people ask. Yeah.

Because I've, at the same time. Well, that also just seems to be common courtesy. It is common courtesy. You know. But not, I can't help myself. I understand. Because I'm that way. I'm especially that way.

I've over time had to become, in work situations, I have to bite my tongue when I go do guest spots on places because I'm used to a work atmosphere where my opinion is valued and and I mean beyond valued like wanted and so and I'm very much involved in every aspect, you know, every like, you know, from like that shirt is distracting to this bit needs a new ending to, you know, just really, you know, on the Conan show. I, you know, I'm a producer. I produce the show. So I'll go and do I just did a guest spot yesterday and they're just, it's so hard for me because I also have, I've done some directing. Because you're like, stay in your lane, stay in your lane, stay in your lane. But I'm like, but I'm like, and I, but there are times when I.

Did you say you were directing it? Yeah, no, I have directed, but I was doing this guest spot and there's just so many solutions that I just like. You can see. And there's just so many solutions that I just like blocking things or, you know, I'm like, there was an awkward part where I knew the director, we're doing a pickup. And I knew that the director wanted to just get what part the director wanted. And the AD is like, well, let's take it from this beat a minute earlier than we need. Right. And I was just like, can't we maybe start from? We need to make it from this beat a minute earlier than we need. Right. And I was just like, can't we maybe start from, and the director's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, we can start from that.

And he shot me a look like, who the fuck are you? Exactly. But I was like, hey, buddy, I just saved us all some time. I know. Andy, I have completely learned to shut my shit in those moments. Because you're hypervigilant is what it is. Yeah. Like you're, you can see all the cogs. Yep.

And ADs are so focused on their one thing. And I can't believe how much sales right by them constantly. And I, I just was like, I know this is going to be so much more efficient. I know, I know. I just know it and it's killing me. And you just was like, I know this is going to be so much more efficient. I know, I know. I just know it. And it's killing me. And now I'm like, you know what? As long as the check clears at this point, fuck it.

Like, I have so many stresses in my life. I guess I'm just not going to take this one on. Yeah, yeah. It is so, I mean, clearly why you probably need to direct more. Oh, yeah. I mean, I eventually, I've directed commercials uh and and how do you like it it's fun it's really fun what's fun about it is that it's like um it's almost like a like a game in that you have well first of all i love people telling you you can't succeed at this. No, no, no, no. I love problem solving.

And directing and actually any kind of production, even whether it's writing a script or whether it's blocking something or shooting something, you are presented with problems. And you just take them one at a time and you think up, well, let's, you know, how can we fix this? What are our alternatives? And I really enjoy that and um directing a commercial it's like a beat the clock you have a set list of things you need to do you got a set amount of time to do it and as time goes on and things take too long you have to adjust and say you know what let's fix this and do this. And it really, and it just is.

And then you do it. Energizing. Yeah. Because, and you're kind of, it's all moving along and it's good. What about when like you have to problem solve in seconds? Like how do you handle that? Just. Bullshit?

Just do it. Yeah, yeah. No, I mean, just like. When they're like, we're going to have to lose this one part do you fight for things oh no it all depends it all depends and i mean and but it is like again it's it's problem solving it's like what are our options i'm very i have a very linear linear kind of spatial way of thinking that there's this what are our options what's the best one like just i just think that way that's really in a work situation and actually in a personal situation i was gonna say that's a really good thing i could probably take it to my life

all the time because i started to laugh because i was like i'm second guest sally and i went directing which a lot of people are like when are are you going to direct? When are you going to direct? And I'm like, well, how much time can I schedule in my directing for buyer's remorse? Because, like, I know that I would be, like, see, I'm sitting in the edit being like, I knew it. I knew I should have done that. And I just didn't. This is some regret time. Yeah.

Yeah. Like, can we pencil that in? Or, yeah. Yeah, and I just didn't know what I was doing. This is some regret time. Yeah. Yeah, like, can we pencil that in? Yeah, because I just, I mean, I can't. I'm just like, I got gluten free. Yeah, yeah. I knew it. I knew at the time I should have gotten the kind of way. Of course they eat gluten.

Well, I also, too, because of working on the Conan show, I have a lot of practice at. On your feet thinking. Every day we have bits that, you know, that, and there, there's more than what we usually, you know, more than what we use. So it's, have you ever had to deal with, I don't know, maybe you can't talk about this. Have you ever had like a legit train wreck on Conan where in the moment you were like, I got to save this. Like this is going south. you were like, I got to save this.

Like, this is going south. No, I mean, not for a long time. Not for a long time. It's a pretty well-oiled machine. Yeah. And I mean, I have done that. I have done that in interviews. Because I've seen you bring levity when clearly it's like somebody is very nervous or a little buttoned up or not great at the.

Yeah, no, I mean, that's, you know, that's like one of my jobs is to sort of, you know, utility player and fill in gaps and stuff. I'm just wondering if anybody just was like, I'm sorry, I took too many Xanax before I came out here. No, well, I mean, there's. I'm just going to go night, night, right now. Early, early on, there were some sort of really awkward, awful interviews. But they're sort of few and far between. And those ones, there wasn't much to do anyway. But there are times when I, when it is a little, you know, when somebody's dull, then I just

will be, Conan and I'll start talking to each other you know and that's just kind of like well yeah all right this person is obviously not going to help us out let's just you know you and i have some fun yeah um so that kind of thing yeah um but yeah it's uh you know i just you get used to it you just get used to it too you know and i have a you know i'm a wisecracker i have a facility for it. What a cool job that you have such an outlet for. Because I don't need to be a talk show host, but I would love to get my punches in. No, being a talk show host.

I mean, doing this thing is actually, like, I didn't expect to do this. I never thought, like, well, I'm going to interview people. So this is just, and I'm really enjoying it because I'm having the, I'm having conversations that I want to have. I'm not just talking to you about your latest project, you know? Yeah. And I, and, and from being, from sitting next to Conan for all his years, there's no fucking way I would want to do that because it just it's an artificial kind of form and it can be very fun and it can be very light and i enjoy sitting there with it but it's

not the kind of thing that i would want to drive it's not the kind of thing where i would want to every day get a sheet of information about somebody and have to go through and figure out to put together like funny anecdotes for a chunk i just it's not actually now that you're describing it is starting to sound kind of fun to be honest oh really yeah i'm like oh yeah i would dig that i just i like pressure i like the free form yeah i like a free form conversation more so and and we actually the show now is a lot more that way that we're in a half hour format. And rather than split up the interview into acts, we just do one long interview and then cut it up and show it on the air. And then the full thing is on the internet.

Nice. But so it's much more, it's much more natural now than it used to be. But I mean, as a, I don't know what the personality type is called, but I could see where if you're aware of everything that's happening in the room, I mean, your job is so great for that because like, all I want to do is make the most uncomfortable person in every room feel comfortable. And I can, my GPS will just zero in on them immediately. Yeah. Somebody brings a new person and I'm, you know, saying terrible things about her, whatever. Pick a topic, you know. And then I turn to them and I go, I'm so sorry.

I mean, maybe you have some different feelings. But, you know, I just sort of like, can I draw you in somehow? Or if I just notice one person isn't eating cake you know and it's not even my house or my party I just sort of like oh did you not like cake where do you think that comes from um sort of take care of the lowest yeah yeah I fuck I don't know where do you think that comes from I don't know I don't know it's it life, man. Maybe I wish somebody had done that for me. Yeah. Is it possible?

That sounds, you know, like a good one. That's a good one. Yeah, yeah. I don't know. Because I can take care of myself. Yeah. But maybe I'm just sensitive to that because, like I said, I just. Do you think it's just kind of a basic nurture and that's sort of the avenue that it takes?

I don't have kids, but I can be extremely nurturing. Yeah. Yeah. Because that could. Which is partly why I don't have kids. Because I'm like, that's. It'd be too much. A lot.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It is a lot, but it also is. The thing about having kids is, yes, it's the biggest thing in the world. And it's also the most common thing in the world. I know. You know. Like next to death. Yeah. Well, and also, too, the, you know, in the world, and it's also the most common thing in the world. I know. You know. Like next to death.

Well, and also, too, you know, the first kid, you're terrified. And then the next one, honestly, you do think like, oh, it's not going to die. Like, you know, I mean, it's like you're so afraid of somehow killing this little tiny helpless creature. You're like, oh, no, no, no. These things, they're hard to kill. Look, I've tried. Oh, no, no, these things, they're hard to kill. Look, I've tried. I'm going to sound so neurotic when you hear this, but I even took a baby CPR class because I couldn't relax at pool parties,

watching parents just, like, hang out while their kids are swimming. Oh, my God. I know, it sounds crazy. Wow. But I just was like, I'm not going to relax unless I at least know how to save the life once I grab the kid. Yeah, yeah. So, yeah. It's also, that's also like a real power move on a parent, you know, like.

Stand down. Yeah. I've got this. Get away from your drowning child. Yeah. You know. Keep drinking your spritzer. I'll get it.

I'm a comic actress. You may know me from such shows. Here's my IMDb. Now get out of the way and go boil some water. It only went one season, but you know what? It was critically acclaimed. Yes. I'm an indie darling. Yes. I'm an indie darling. Can't you tell my love's a-growing? Well, so you end up in Boston with your mom. Mm-hmm.

And how does that translate into showbiz gal? You know, which is a really modern way of saying it. No, that's what it says on my personalized license plate. Oh, I wish. Wouldn't that be amazing? Oh, showbiz gal. Showbiz gal. Oh, God, I just barfed. I think I'm going to get it.

Showbiz gal. Please get it. It'll be our inside joke. Everyone will hate you. So I feel like this is sort of a common thing. My mom just one day was like, put up or shut up. You know, she said, I signed you up for I was visiting my dad in Syracuse and I come back on the train. She picked me up and she said, you're auditioning for the community theater here.

And you're it's a British farce called See How They Run. And you're auditioning for The Maid and I signed you up. And. How old are you at this point? I'm 15. And why does she do this? Because you have always been like, I'm going to be an actress. I think I was more like, why didn't you push me to be an actress? I should have been, I wanted to be an actress. I have a grandmother, my father's mother who got married at 17, who always wanted to be an actress. I have a grandmother, my father's mother, who got married at 17, who always wanted to be an actress and blamed everybody for her not being an actress because, you know, she got married at 17. And was very austere, but very funny, I guess, very pretty. I never knew her much at all until she was very sick. And so my mother, you know, they had a very strained relationship.

And my mother said, I'm not going to have another Watkins saying they could have, would have, should have been an actress, you know. So do it or don't. I was like, shit. Okay, lady. I think maybe I was 16. And so I went and I auditioned and I had to speak with a British accent and be like, oh my God, I'm the maid. That was a little Australian, I don't know.

And I was my cockney and I got it. And then I was just bit by a bug. Is there a different, like, if you had your druthers, are you like a stage actress or a stage actor? I mean, I started out as a stage actress because, again, I'm from Syracuse. Like, that's what showbiz looked to me. There wasn't film crews around. Right. That felt like such a very sort of alien dream, you know?

Yeah. I went to theater school. I did classical theater training. Where'd you go to college? Boston University. Uh-huh. I moved to Portland, Oregon after a very starvation-induced year in New York City. Why Portland?

Just liked it? I just ended up there on a road trip with a girlfriend. She was a good friend of mine in New York, and she was like, hey, do you want to blow this clambake and go drive cross-country in my parents' van? And I was like, well, let's see. Let me count how much money I don't have. $4. Yes, please.

Yeah, yeah. You know, I could rent out my room, use that to, you know, support your food or whatever. And we'll just go for a month and get the fuck out of this city because it's killing me. Yeah. It's killing me. How old are you at this point?

22, I guess. Uh-huh. And I ended up in Portland and I was like, what is this magical place? Yeah. Where, I mean, the whole, it's where 20 year olds go to retire was not a joke. Uh-huh. And I, or it wasn't hyperbolic, I should say. I worked as a bartender there and I did theater and I started to become a good actor for the first time because I

was really bad really oh god yeah I was pretty unwatchable even through school yeah I was um I was funny why do you think I was a fucking crack up you know what I mean like I could make everyone piss themselves but my Shakespeare and Moliere and all that was garbage um why was that it's just I you know that's also I don't I just had no life experience to draw on. Everything felt so phony and inauthentic to me. It felt like everybody was putting on these arch airs and trying to be my Lord, you know, and just like everybody, I felt like loved the costumes more than anything. And, but everybody was such a, you know, they, a lot, not everybody, but a lot of my class were naturally very good and they, they kept getting better and better. And I kept wanting to smoke more pot and kiss more boys. And I just think I should have, if I, you know, could do it all over again, I think what I really probably should have done is gone and lived my life a little bit and then gone to theater school because by the time I graduated, I remember thinking, I wish I had this brain on my freshman year.

Yeah. I wish I brought this girl to the table because now I feel ready to learn. I just was, I was just a late bloomer. I just, I just, I just had to like, yeah, exercise some demons, I think, first. Well, I also can see, too. But, I mean, I have sort of a jaundiced view of theater school just because I took a couple theater classes. And I've talked about it before here where I just felt like, why? Why are we doing this?

And there is something about- And now I understand it. I do understand it. Do you? I still don't fully. Wasted on 22-year-olds. I mean, unless you really, and this is what I mean about what we were talking about before we started recording about kids these days. They really, a lot of them have come to the table with such an incredible understanding of like the human condition in many ways, you know, and what it is to just be a person and, and know themselves so extraordinarily well that, you know, that kids can come out at a really young age, you know, at a time where

that was just not even on the table, like when I was growing up or, you know, what they fixate on and what they don't fixate on is just always so amazing to me. You know, I'm so impressed with this batch of kids. Like, they're so empathic. They're so, they just understand why eating meat might not be a great idea. You know, I just, these are terrible examples. I'm so sorry, but they just, I feel like they get big, complicated notions and ideas and they just get it, you know, that I didn't. And I just feel like these kids maybe could have gone to my theater school, but I couldn't. And, you know, I wasn't ready to look at my shit yet either. I didn't have a context for it. I didn't have enough distance from anything.

Any of my pain and sorrow, I was still processing. I'm a very, I'm a slow processor. And I didn't know how to contextualize anything in my life and be like, oh, that's because of this or that's because of that. And this is how I step in and be another person. I just didn't know how to step in and be another person. I just, I just, I just didn't know how to bring myself to my work yet. Yeah. And at all. And then all of a sudden I realized, oh, acting, it's listening and responding. Yeah. Yeah. Imagine just responding how I would respond. And then I, you know, got to know myself. Yeah. I set out to be a film actor because I went to film school and that was sort of where my,

where my focus was. Yeah. And then I started doing improv, you know, because I was, you know, it's sort of like I could, I wanted to be in film and I worked in production and then I kind of wanted to write, but I also kind of wanted to perform. And so it was kind of all this sort of churning mishmash of all of it. And I, you know, like I have acted in lots and lots of things and, but I really don't know how to act. Like I just, for me, I've always, I've always said, and I've had people get mad at me for saying this. I was like, I've always said, and I've had people get mad at me for saying this. I was like, for my, what I do as an actor is just try to lie convincingly. It's just, I'm not a basketball coach and I'm not, you know, I'm not this person. And in the same way that you, you know, when you learn to lie and just to try to get away

with things, you learn about like adding little details or how you, you know, when you learn to lie and just to try to get away with things, you learn about like adding little details or how you, you know, use your voice or don't oversell it. And so for me, I've always kind of just kind of thought like, well, this is a person on the page and I'm supposed to make everyone believe that this person is me or that I'm this person. And so I don't really have techniques. So, so much of what people talk about when they learn acting is just a mystery to me. And as I've gotten older and I do think better at acting, older and, and I do think better at acting.

It's just, all I can do is my process is watch myself in things, which I don't like doing for the, anyway, for the first thing. And watch myself and go, that wasn't good. I don't do that. You know, just kind of like. Self-correcting. Yeah. Just know that like, that could be better. And it's just like this sense of like, just having a taste in like what's good and what's

bad. Yeah. And just regulating that as time goes on and learning from other people too, you know, like learning, learning from actors that are amazing, just kind of, and I don't even know, like, it's not like you can, it's a granular thing. You take little things. You're just like, oh, wow. That person's sense of self-possession or whatever, you know, it's just, you know, one of the most amazing acting, like watching somebody act experience that I ever had was, uh, I did a guest spot on, uh, Will Arnett had a show

called the Millers. I think it was called. It was on CBS for one season. Right. For people that don't know, when you do a multi-camera, you know, before an audience sitcom, you sit in the makeup room before you start and you do a speed through, what they call it. Yeah. And you just do, you do a line. Isn't that what you guys all do? We all get what they call it. Yeah. And you just do a line. Isn't that what you guys all do? We all get coked up.

Coked all the way. But usually because you don't want to mess up the makeup, we blow it up each other's asses. But we did the speed through. You're just sort of like making sure everybody knows their lines. And you just kind of zip, zip, zip, zip, zip, zip zip and margo martindale was a regular on that show watching her do the speed through just the intensity and the voice just it was one of the most amazing things i'd ever seen and she just was like she was just rattling through her. And I mean, they're sitcom lines. They're not, you know, right. But I have to, I used to be somebody who could just be like, um, what's in the fridge?

Yeah. Well, that's mine. No. Then put it down. Okay. Well, if you're not going to drink it, I'm going to drink it. You know, I, I used to be able to do that. Yeah.

But the, it's weird. I'm having all these dumb little revelations, but I realized that I cannot do that anymore. I have to act it every single time I do it. Because if I phone it in one time, I think I'm afraid I'm going to phone it in on the day. Oh, wow. Yeah. And plus, I'm always trying to find new things constantly.

Like, I don't do takes twice the same way ever, really. I mean, sometimes if the director goes just like that, can you do it just like that? I do the same thing. Because we have a fucking boom in the shot. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I do the same thing because it's like you want to give them variations. I want to give them variations. But I also have this idea that I can really improve on the moment if I'm even more present than I was before.

And I find that checking out and just doing lines is disconnecting something in my brain that is dangerous to disconnect. So I, I stay very invested. Yeah. Even when I do table reads, like I go for it. Yeah. That's great.

That's great. Well, that was kind of, that's what. I used to think it was super dorky when people did. I was like, look at, look at all.

Mr. Super trier. Yeah. Oh, we get it. You're very invested. Yeah. Yeah. But now I sort of understand it. Yeah. Yeah. No, that, but it was, look at all mr super trier yeah obi get it you're very invested yeah yeah um but now i sort of understand it yeah yeah no that but it was i that's basically what it was is it was just

seeing somebody and i couldn't even it's hard to explain but just like an eye magnet where i just everything that she all these you know dopey sitcom lines that she's kind of, you know, going through real quick. But she's acting them as much as a person possibly could, but just quickly, you know, without any sort of filigrees and, you know, doodads. Just it was amazing. And she's also marking it in her mind, you know? Yeah. Like she's probably like, no, I'm pulling the toaster marking it in her mind, you know? Yeah. Like she's probably like, now I'm pulling the toaster.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, and also, I mean, she's, you know. I know how Margo Martindale thinks. No, I've never actually met her. But I'd like to. Yeah. Well, that's, so how does that then eventually get you to L.A.? You go from Portland, you're in Portland. I'm in Portland.

You're kissing boys, getting high, serving drinks. Doing a lot of theater. Doing your Moliere's. Starting to do, yeah. I'm doing classical theater for the first time. Yeah, you're a comedy Adele Artis. In a paid venue, in a paid form, regional theater.

And I started doing improv there. I knew nothing really about improv, but I was like a fake it till you make it kind of thing. Why did you start doing it? Just because you felt like you got to do a holistic thing? I just, I've always been drawn to comedy. Like I said, in undergrad, I was very funny and a very bad actor. So like, I would be like shitty on stage and then backstage killing it.

Yeah, yeah. So I. My favorite kind of people. I felt bad for the audience. But anyway, I tried to reverse that in Portland and tried to act well on stage. And I to do the paid gigs, you had to do like the Shakespeare's and everything. And I realized I fucking hated it. I just, I would sit backstage for like two of two and a half of three hours, you know, and, and, you know, I would say probably my collective time on stage was 30 minutes and part of it would just be holding a fucking chair or a door. And I never got the juicy monologues.

I just, I always say, forgive me if I've said this anywhere else before, because I have, but there's like four. I wouldn't know. I wouldn't. Out of like, I just find it very inequitable. There's like 13 parts in any, let's say there's 15, okay? Yeah. I don't know.

Let's say 11 parts are for men. Four parts. In Shakespeare. Or you mean just generally? In Shakespeare in general. Yeah. 11 parts for men, right? For women, four parts. Of those four parts, one is great. Two are fine, serviceable. And one is like, what news? And I was usually that gal. I was just getting my equity card and all that kind of thing. And I just always felt like a fucking imposter. Every time I did it, I just, I never felt strong in that area. I wanted to be like, I said, that's all I was exposed to in my life. You know, we didn't have film crews. I mean, I'd seen television and film, but I just thought, oh, that's for those people. They get to go to LA and do that. But I loved performing,

you know, in the improv group. And I just finally was sitting backstage and I'm in this corset and layers of cute things. And I just stood up and I said, I'm moving to LA and I'm going to go be on a sitcom. And everybody was like, why in fuck would you do that? It's like, we're in Portland. We're doing, we're living our dream. We can still, we do theater. You bartend one night a week and can still get a steak dinner anytime you want. That was sort of a very comfortable, nice life. But I just couldn't anymore. And I just said, I'm going. And I did. I just packed up my shit, got in a truck, came down here. And I was like, oh my God, I've made a terrible, terrible, terrible, terrible mistake. And my pact with myself was, okay, I'm going to be here one year.

And if I still feel this way after one year, I'm moving back to Portland. And I can say, I tried. I tried to go to LA and I tried to be on a sitcom. Did you know anybody here? I knew one person, a friend of mine from college who was an actress and who had lived in Portland. We were roommates in Portland. She started writing. She wrote a law and order script that she sold. So she moved to New York. She was like our first success story. So I think in a way, Krista Vernoff is her name

and she now runs Grey's Anatomy. Oh, wow. Big shit deal. But she was the first one. I think she wrote a practice spec. Yeah. And then it got her a law and order. And from there, she just worked her ass off.

So I think I was like, oh, there's an avenue. But other than her, no. Had you been here much? And spent any time? Never came to L.A. before. Never once? No. So when you moved here, that was your inaugural visit?

I thought L.A. was colors. The movie, Colors. I'm not kidding. I was like. Well, no wonder you were nervous. I was very nervous I thought it was just going to be helicopters

and then I got to pick a side am I a crip my blood am I you know remember that movie Grand Canyon

no Kevin Kline you still I don't know oh it's just like he's coming home from a Dodger game or something

he gets lost downtown and then anyway Danny Glover saves him from getting murdered. But anyway, that was L.A. to me. Yeah. Or it was like Beverly Hills, you know, 90210. Yeah.

So I just, it just was this, and apparently I'm right. It's this huge economical gap. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, but anyway, there's this other place called Hollywood in Los Feliz, which has some, you know, a little bit of like poor people. And who aren't necessarily in a gang. And so I decided to start off there. And I went for a hike. And this girl I knew, oh, I hooked up with this friend of mine

from high school, from Boston, who I hadn't seen in years and years. And we went for a hike in Runyon Canyon. And she told me about the groundlings. And by the time we were done with our hike, I was like, I'm doing that. I will be a groundling. And she's like, well, it's a little hard, you know, you have to go. And I was like, no, no, this is exactly why I moved here. Groundlings. Whatever you just described, if that's really what it is, it's for me. And I did. I took all the classes there and I became a groundling.

And then from there, you know, I guess my big, sort of my big break was SNL. SNL, yeah. There was 2008 and 2009, yeah. And then I quickly and unceremoniously returned from SNL. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Who is like your, what crop was that? I was right after Amy had a baby.

Oh, okay. So I was, the women were Kristen Wigg, Casey Wilson, and then me and Abby. Oh, yeah, yeah. Elliot got hired at the same time. Yeah, yeah. And the guys were Fred Armisen, Will Forte, Fred – sorry, I already said them. Sudeikis, Andy Samberg. Yeah.

Wow. Bill Hader. Yeah. Great, great group. Yeah, yeah. Lovely cast. And how – I mean, generally, I don't want to do a full on, you know, because I'm sure it's. Boring.

Yeah. Well, and also that's like, I'm sure you've done lots of. I know. What was your SNL? I know. People love to ask about it. I don't have much to say about it. Or I have, I think I unpacked it once in great detail.

And I just sort of feel like, well, it's out there if anybody's curious about it. Right, right. And that's what you want. Yeah, exactly. But overall, like, you know, it's one of those things like I thought I had a great time, but then when I wasn't asked back, I was like, oh, was I, did I, only I thought I had a great time. Is there any, do they give you any kind of clue as to what happens or anything? It's just the caprice of Lauren, you know? You know, I really was friendly with a lot of the writers and they were really sweet.

And, you know, they've all said, like one of them said, I've been here for 14 years and I've never, he's like, and I've seen some crazy decisions here. He's like, I've never seen a decision this kind of out of nowhere, out of the blue. Like, maybe he's trying to make me feel better, but I, I, I was, I, I'm a pretty good gauge. Like, I know if I'm annoying most of the time, I think, you know, I can always feel it and I back off. You know what I'm saying? Like, I know exactly what you're saying. Yeah. Like, yeah, you're, you're like, I didn't fuck up that bad. Yeah. I mean, the only, like, I'm trying to think that when I die, am I going to get a file that just says like, here's the transgression? You had no idea. Here's what happened. And here's what you did, or here's what you said, or here's

how it went down and no it wasn't your fault but this is how it all came together like somebody took a shit in lauren's office and you just so happen to be like walking away at the time and lauren decided he took a shit in his office you know what i mean hmm what watkins woman, hmm. She seems culprit. Yeah, that smells like her. Yeah, no, in fact, he was very complimentary when he let me go. Yeah. But I think he can't, my suspicion, do you want to know my suspicion?

I would love to know your suspicion. I think he just didn't realize my age, maybe. And I think that's something you can't really fire somebody for. So it's probably. Oh, he didn't realize that you were older? Yeah, I was like very, I mean, I was 37 when he hired me. Oh, wow. Which is in SNL years.

Yeah, yeah. He's like 95. Right. They probably, you're just lucky they didn't shoot you. You know, just to put you out of your misery. They kept going like, you know, we got, did you, did anybody tell you about the rabbits in the field and back? Do you want to go, why don't you go take a look? Just wander out there. It's like that scene in Goodfellas.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Hey, like, why don't you go look at some dresses? Ah, no. I don't know. No, nice fur coats. Get yourself one. Oh, Lauren says to you, I'd you, it's your turn to be made. You're going to get your button. Yeah, or like, was it Lorraine Bracco goes, he's like. Yeah, exactly.

The dress is right here. I got to go. You know? Yeah, yeah. No, I'm good. Yeah, yeah. I'm good. See you later.

Yeah. Yeah. No, I, yeah. Oh, that's, that makes sense, you know, because that's, you were there at a time because when I, we started doing the Conan show there in 93. And it was, and I just, it was a terrible time to be a woman on that show. Terrible time. An aggressively anti-woman time at times. Aggressively anti-woman time at times.

I just know from, you know, people, firsthand tellings of what happened. What I want to know is, like, what the dudes do. You know what I mean? Like, I just hope, like, the fucking work field has changed in a way where when guys see how incredibly inequitable it is towards half the staff, you know, that somebody is like, no, I can't tolerate this, you know? It does need to be forced on people. Yeah. Because they just, they... I don't want to make waves.

I hate conflict. Well, and also too, being a white man is not noticing anything because there is like, and I'm sorry, but in relative terms, being a white man, if you're middle-class, you know, and,

you know, and especially in television and comedy, it is a fairly frictionless environment, you know, like sort of path for you. Like I say, in relative terms. So there's just lots of times where the lack of, you know, the Conan show started. It was all white men. And you're kind of. You're like, oh, that's comfy.

Yeah. It was just like there's. And then you go, you know, we'd go do sort of like panels at the at the at the Museum of Television. You know, they kind of and, you know, up and comers want to ask questions. And it was it would be. How come there's no women? How come there's no black people? How come?

You know, and it was like, oh, yeah, that's a good question. Gosh, I never thought of it. You know, and you it like, oh yeah, that's a good question. Gosh, I never thought of it, you know, and you, it has to be forced upon people. It really does. Cause if, you know, if somebody came to my house and said, you know, how come there's no window treatments? Yeah. Not that women are window treatments. Right. But you know, you're like, oh, I, I, I was comfortable. I never noticed it. But now that you mention it, like this place could really use window treatments. Right. And again.

Oh, my God. It's like 30 degrees cooler in here now. Well, it is. It's true. It is. Like, it's also you have to remind the white male. I mean, throughout my you know, I'm not I'm not saying like I'm some big, huge feminist hero or something, but I definitely more so than most men, I think because I was raised mostly by women,

you know, I didn't have a lot of male presences in my life. So I think that I do have more of a likelihood to see things from a female perspective or think like, what is this like for the woman that's sitting here? have more of a likelihood to see things from a female perspective. Or think like, what is this like for the woman that's sitting here? Or you didn't grow up in a world probably where women were like in the kitchen drinking wine while men did blank. No, no. Women did everything. It was integrated. Women did.

No, women. There were, you know, my folks divorced when I was four and there just wasn't a man around. And that was, and then we moved in with my grandmother, my grandmother and my mother were, you know, they did everything that they ran, but my life, you know? And so, but I mean, there's been instances of like, this is just like a very sort of elemental one that you're looking for the joke of here's

something that will ensure everyone to watch this thing. You know, like this is, there's something boring, but here we'll spice it up with something that everyone loves and everyone will want to watch. And somebody says like a sexy girl dancing. And it's like,

you know, there's something other than heterosexual males in the world. So that when you're saying like, this is the universal thing that everyone will want to see. It's like white guy, white hetero guy goes, sexy girl dancing. And it's like, you got to think a little bit outside yourself. You know, here's a great thing is that as I was driving here, every billboard that I was passing in every bus depot and like in every, you know, bus stop and every, I guess, billboard on the, you know, and on a bus was these female centric, like one with Colby Smulders called Stumptown, like that was everywhere. And I was like, oh, look at that. And then I kept seeing the same, you know, billboards. Yeah, yeah.

Alison Tolman is starring on this other show. Yeah. And her face, you know, holding a little girl. And I was just like, one after another, I was like, this is bizarro. Yeah. Like that every billboard I'm passing right now is a female-centric show. It's getting better. It is getting better.

And it's like we're teaching dudes how to come into our stories now. You know? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's so cool. Oh, it's great. Yeah. Well, and like I've always said, one of the best things about getting on Twitter for me, And one of the best things about getting on Twitter for me, and Twitter has been real.

I mean, I know a number of women who became comedy writers because they were funny on Twitter. And there was something, it tended to be a more egalitarian format. And there were a lot of funny women that got noticed because it was, it's an equal playing field. Yeah. And there also think, I think there is something about just that, this little joke nugget and women that are good at it. Like it's just their joke nugget is so much different than the male joke nugget. And. What's her name? Dweck?

D-W-E-C-K. Yeah. Jess Dweck. Oh God. She's one of the best joke writers in the world i want to just unbelievable yeah and it's like i wish i could like well and it's her she's a she's like a nuclear reactor for jokes and it's and it's yeah and it's she does something like she takes something that everybody's taken a swing at and just drops a nuclear bomb right onto the like the best way to say it. Yes. That's the thing. I was like, oh, I was kind of turning this concept over in my head.

Yeah. I couldn't get there. Yeah. And I certainly couldn't get there in six words. Right. So, but I, you know, I've often said like, I, I really like, I just, I funny women. Um, I, there's so many married to one. Yeah.

And I mean, and I've been surrounded by them and someone, my best friends are funny women and I love funny women. And, and I like to the, like more than funny men. And I don't know if it's because I'm such a great feminist or the fact that I've been hearing funny men for fucking ever. And now, now there's just like a lot more funny women who are being funny, not in a way that's like, I got to be funny the way men are funny, which happened for a long time. Like now there's just like.

Oh, my pussy this, my pussy that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sorry, maybe I can't say it on your family show. You can say whatever you want. It's your pussy. I mean, whatever. It's just like. Oh, my pussy this, my pussy that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sorry, maybe I can't say it on your family show. You can say whatever you want. It's your pussy. I mean, whatever. It's not mine. What?

I don't say my pussy. I'm quoting my pussy. Yes. No, but I just mean I fell into that. Yeah, yeah. I fell into that rat trap for a little while where I was like, I'm going to be more disgusting than any man. Just to sort of, that'll be my induction into the club. Well, and there are female comics who are brilliantly filthy.

Mm-hmm. But then there are a hundred – Yeah, Amy Schumer. Brilliantly filthy. Is brilliant. Sarah Silverman. Brilliantly. Brilliantly filthy and says uncomfortable, terrifying things.

In a fresh, fresh way. And then there's like hundreds and hundreds of women going like, well, I guess I have to be filthy. Yeah. Which is, I think that's happening less and less. Yeah. Not to bag on my fellow ladies. But yeah, I think it's a, I think it's a, it's a trap. And I, you know, God bless women who can do super blue but keep it fresh.

Yeah. I do really love that. No, and I like filthy stuff from everybody. Me too. Yeah, yeah. I don't like people. You know, did you? Oh, so off topic.

We probably have to end. How long are we going? No, we are going too long. So we'll hurry up here. I feel like I could talk to you all day. Well, yeah, me too. That's what happens sometimes. I just feel like I need to go off on this other tangent about.

I started out of this thing. I was like, I'm really going to stick to an hour. And it's really falling all apart. Well, you got thumbs up. Thumbs up all around. That's like one of the best. I actually just lived a showbiz dream. In a recording studio, somebody on the other side of the glass gave me a big thumbs up.

That is such a moment in a movie. You did it. This is part of the montage. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It is. We need the reaction shot. I'm Elton John, and this is Benny and the Jets. Yeah.

Yeah. No, but anyway, go on the tangent. Now I want to hear it. Okay, quick tangent. Yeah. It's also a dangerously controversial tangent. How do we feel about this? Well, if, you know, we'll see.

Well, I'm on the plane coming back from Colorado yesterday and I- Must be nice. Oh, you know. Yeah. It's where I go for dinner. No, I was there for the Telluride Film Festival as a spectator. And I'm a bad flyer, as you know. And so until my sleeping pill kicked in, I started watching the Chappelle, Dave Chappelle stand-up thing.

I haven't seen it yet. It's really audacious. Yeah. It's, I had so many feelings. I wish you saw it so we could talk about it. Yeah, yeah. But I had just had so many feelings because I love that we've come so far that there are some things that we just don't fucking say anymore. Yeah.

Need to say, you know, I love that. That's 90% of Michaela Watkins. Yeah. 4% of Michaela Watkins is about to say that. I do miss a tiny bit. And this is like, I know that this can be a slippery slope. So I'm saying this as like for people like who microdose, you know what I mean? It's just like microdosing versus becoming a full on drug addict.

It really misses a time when comedians, not our lawmakers, not policymakers, but comedians could say fucking anything. And they get to because they're doing comedic commentary on our world. And we as people can decide ourselves if we like it or not, you know? And, and I, he goes there. He's like, goes there in a, a very audacious way and says things that are supremely polarizing and gave me hives. Yeah. But also did it in a very, like, if you're gonna do it, did it in the most funny way. Yeah. Did it in a very, like if you're going to do it, did it in the most funny way. And that line is so blurry, you know?

And I feel like in a weird way we have to talk about that blur. Because I think what we are doing with, and again, 94% of me is all about like, we don't need to say half the shit we used to say anymore. Like we did it. It's probably not great. It really otherized a lot of people in really tragic ways. Yep. We don't need to do it anymore. Yep. And then part of me is like, but I don't know that I want to police comedians.

Well, my take on it is that we are in a huge change period, you know, especially like just the fact that in my work lifetime, the sort of like just the progress that's been made in terms of like women just not being treated like shit, you know, and they're being awareness of you can't do that. You can't. So we're in a period, I think, of somewhat of an overcorrection. And it's not going to last forever. Yeah. And it's not going to. But there are things where it's sort of like, look. To say, oh, yeah, racial stereotypes are bad, but you got to admit that this kind of people really is like this. To me, that's not a truth teller. That's not like anything that's a challenge or anything.

It's really kind of just contrarianism. It's like, this is naughty. I'm going to say what's naughty. Hooray for me. And there is an audience that will lap that up and go like, he's saying what's really true. Because it's usually a he. And it's frequently a he that has had to deal with some kind of consequences. Right. You know, most most comedy males that have dealt with consequences end up on the PC is ruining the world bandwagon because they wish they could be in a time when white men were unassailable pretty much.

And white men could say whatever the fuck they wanted. Right now we're learning like, no, no, white men can't say everything that they want. So, yeah, it might feel constricted. It won't be forever. It won't be forever. And it also is a challenge to everybody to find new things to be funny about. It is. It absolutely is. But then at what point do I police what a black man gets to find new things to be funny about. It is. It absolutely is. But then at what point do I police what a black man gets to say, you know? Right.

But then again. I don't know. It's case by case basis, you know? And it's the case by case that I think is rattling everybody's cages because people aren't, I guess this is what made me sad when I was watching it. And this is, I think, ultimately my point about the 4% and the 90% and that there's random other percent that I didn't account for, which is like has a big question mark over it,

which is, I guess I just feel like some, I know one of your questions is what have you learned? And it's like, I guess I've just learned that people aren't nuanced, like they are not nuanced thinkers. Yeah, yeah. And I'm, I want to comment on things sometimes as somebody who understands gray, you know? And I realized that because we have to bring some people who don't think in gray. You know, they're black and white thinking. Yeah. And that some of it is really whack.

You know what I mean? Like women belong in the kitchen and black people don't deserve fill in the blank. Yeah. You know? Yeah. Or like I said, this kind of person, you know, this race is this, you know? Yes. The all lives matter people.

I feel like we're trying to, you know, pull them into sort of a kind of a more inclusive mindset. And I think you make a great point. I think maybe you're right. I think as much as I had glee at some of his like really wrong shit that he was saying and was like sort of what I was maybe is like it was triggering a nostalgia for like what comedy used to be. Yes, when you used to go, whoa, that was, wow, that is, you shouldn't say that. Right. But maybe it's okay that we don't.

It's, like I say, it's case by case in terms of like the topics. But yeah, it's like, just there's a lot of it that's like, that's not new concepts. There's not, it's just, it's happening, at least in this country, is the demographic shift to a white minority. And that's part of this is white people, you know, like they say to somebody, to an entitled person, equality feels like oppression. And that's, I think, kind of what's happening right now is that we're moving into a time where white people aren't going to, and I don't know how long it is, but like it's- They don't get to call this.

Yeah, their power is diminishing, and the white hegemony is not letting that go easily. And white men are very confused by that. Yes. And white women are very confused because then you've got intersectionality. So now I'm like, okay, as a woman, when a man is saying really offensive things, I'm like, you don't get to do that. But what if it's, what if he's a man of color? Yeah. Okay. Well, is he saying things against me as a woman or is he saying things

against, okay, what if he's saying things against the LGBTQ? Yeah. Okay. So, hmm. Now who, now who gets to have, and this is where it does get, I think, very confusing. And this is, I think, how we have to hold so many things at once. Yeah. I don't know. And this is why I don't give advice anymore. Yeah. Well, and there's also, too, in this same kind of vein, there are things that just aren't worth talking about in public.

And there are topics that happen, like on Twitter, that I might want to address that I'm just like, eh. Yeah, I don't need to weigh in on this. Yeah, I don't need to weigh in on this because it just... I don't need to weigh in on your hunger strike because they're not bringing back the OA. Yeah. I'm going to let you have that one, okay? But I mean, but there's just stuff where it's like, oh, this is just, this is just, I'm not, I'm not even going to be, you know, I'm not doing myself any favors by wading into this. I'll just let other people fight this one out. Yeah, yeah. So, but we do need to kind of move on here.

I know, we should probably shut our mouths. So you have, but I do want to, you have a new movie coming out, right? I do, Brittany Runs a Marathon. Brittany Runs a Marathon. I've been hearing really wonderful things about it. I'm so happy. I feel like you dig it a lot. Yeah, yeah.

It's like super, it's everything I was just talking about. It's funny as hell. It's a little raunchy, but it is so much pathos and it's so loving. It's a really, really loving movie, but it's about struggle and it's everything kind of in one house. So it's like, if you don't know what kind of movie you want to see and everybody's arguing about it, you should go see Britney Runs the Marathon

because everybody's going to get something. Yeah. And at the end of it, you're going to feel so inspired. Yeah. Yeah. And you kind of, just from the trailer,

you kind of like play. Yeah. Yeah. And you kind of, just from the trailer, you kind of like play. Yeah. Like everybody in the movie, nobody is how you, how you first meet them and think they are. And they're sort of positioning me in the trailer

as her. The bitch. The bitch neighbor. Yeah. Yeah. So. But I'm sure, but I know I imagine

if you're going to run a marathon together, there has to end up being a camaraderie. Yeah. Spoiler alert. Right. Yeah.

Well, it's just, you never know where your support system is going to come from. Yes. Well, and also too, you have a thing, you have what I've been accused of for years. You have a likability. I've been accused of herpes. I have herpes. No, you have a likability. Oh, thank you.

And so I think that... It casts its bitches constantly. No, but that's because you can get away with it. Because if you, you know, like it kind of like, you know, there's some, you know, there's actresses that are like, they don't seem like they're that pleasant. So they have to kind of play the heroine. I did have an AD tell me one time, like he said to me, because I was playing a really nasty character. And he said, you know, it's so funny. I've been doing this a long time. And actors who are really just mean always are so concerned on set.

Like, but do I seem likable? But do I seem likable? Yeah, yeah. He's like, and he's like, some of the nicest actors I work with are like, love to play. Right. The meanest, shittiest person. Shittiest humans. See, I'm kind of getting to that point where I am getting kind of, I've been able to do some things where I get to play the asshole because they're like, well, you're so likable that you, that you can get away with being awful. Right.

And I'm so fucking thrilled. And I think, too, as I age into this fucking baby face of mine, that I'll be able to actually play some really great dicks. Super dicks. And I just. I feel like I'm in my golden age of dicks. Yeah. I didn't mean to sound like I'm in my golden age of dicks. Yeah. I didn't mean to sound like a humble brag there, you know, saying, but I just was, I remember when he said that about actors because I found it so fascinating. Like if I had.

It didn't seem like, it just seemed, yeah. Well, I just wish that I had more gravitas, you know, like, or, you know what I mean? I just wish I, it's funny. I love to go there, you know, but I think about these actors who change the temperature of a room, you know, like they walk in, you're like, oh, did it get chilly? Oh yeah. Did all that oxygen leave? Yeah.

I've worked with some male actors where you feel palpable menace from them. Yes. And I'm just like, I would love to bring that kind of fire. Yeah. But whatever. But like, I would love to bring that kind of fire. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But whatever. But what are you going to do? What are you going to do? Murder somebody in an alley?

Come in all bloody? That's right. You're like, hi. Where's my trailer? Yeah. Well, good luck with that. I can't wait to see it. And I, you know, the where are you going part,

do you have any, like, specific aspirations that you're heading towards? I mean, obviously, direct, direct, direct. Everyone's telling you to direct. No, but, yeah, I don't know. I really want to sink my teeth into some juicy, beautiful film, you know, in a really meaningful way. I finally got four years on a great show, Casual, where I got to do that. Yeah, yeah.

And I really love to just do like a, I want to do like a period piece. I want to do like a Jane Austen thing where I'm like, she shall piano now. And it's like, oh, Lord in heaven. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love that. Nobody can actually sing. See, I want to be like a, just a, like a sociopath. I want to play like, just like a violent fucking monster.

I would for sure cast you as that. No, I'm not. I'm not being funny. Yeah, thank you. I'm serious. Like, I think that's the thing is because like there's an every, like a every guy funny. I'm serious. I think that's the thing is because there's an every guy quality to you. And I think those are the dudes that scare me the fucking most. The turn? Yeah.

Yeah, absolutely. Oh, my God. You have to. All right. I got to go. Bye. Bye. No.

Enjoy murder. Well, I guess the what have you learned part of this question, you know, I got to hit them because otherwise the executives here at the podcasting company will just be down my throat. The suits just came down from the 34th floor. The higher ups who are all 12 years old. Seven assistants in tow with clipboards ready to pull the plug on this operation. Yeah. What have I learned? I think I named 17 things I learned.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But mostly I have just learned there's nobody in charge, so we have to do well one-on-one with each other. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I really thought like we'd always have parents, like the government would be parents and, you know, and now I just, we're in a time where I realized like, oh, there's no parents. Yeah.

There's children. There's little babies. Yeah. In control right now. Yeah. Little egos. And so on a municipal, like local level, we just have to start to take care of one another and let that hopefully go up the chain. start to take care of one another and let that hopefully go up the chain.

I always have said, cause my, my mother, it was a small business owner. My stepfather was a small business owner. So, you know, my teen years was spent working for them and being in there and it just being, there's no business plan. It's just like, oh shit, that's going wrong. I better deal with that. There's no forward thinking. It's just all waiting for something to happen, sitting until something happens. And I thought that somehow out in the big professional adult world, there'd be a, no. adult world there'd be a no no it's still the biggest organizations the biggest corporations giant juggernaut contraption operations everyone's just like it's fucking wizard of oz yeah they're

all just like oh i don't know oh shit you know there's not planning there's not nobody's really quite sure what they're doing. We're all just. One megalomaniac with like controls. Yeah. Being like, it's, I'm telling you, it's like Wizard of Oz. Yeah. It's just such the illustrative version of this, which is just like, I have a booming voice, but signifying nothing. Yeah, yeah.

Well, it's like, I always think. Shakespeare in there. I always think that. Full of sound and Fury. I know. I know. That's a Faulkner thing too, isn't it? I don't know.

Yeah. Sound and Fury. Don't read. I forgot what I was going to say. Oh, and it was really, really good too. Oh, fuck. I'm so sorry. That's all right.

To me, fair friend. Oh, my gosh. She figured so sorry. That's all right. To me, fair friend. Oh my gosh. You figured out the way to make him forget everything. I honestly, Shakespeare, for me, the last I saw, the last Shakespeare thing I saw, it was in the park, in the Shakespeare

in the park in New York City. And I had this moment where it's like, I don't have to ever see any more Shakespeare ever again. Yeah. But when it's done well. I know, but it just, even the done well, and I've seen it done well, I just. You felt okay.

It's just like, honestly, it's hard to know what's going on. It's kind of amazing because there's nothing I watch 20 times. Like, I haven't watched Star Wars 20 times, and that was my favorite movie growing up. Yeah, yeah. Okay, maybe I've watched it 20 times. Let's say another movie I love, you know, Eternal Sunshine. I haven't watched it 20 times. But Shakespeare is over and over and over and over.

Yeah, yeah. Not me. I think if anybody takes anything away from this is that Shakespeare sucks. That's what we've learned. But it's important. I know it's important, but I just, you know. But you're good. Yeah, no, I mean.

Look, people didn't live this long in Shakespeare time, so they wouldn't be watching any more Shakespeare. That's right. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. I'd be dead from syphilis by now. Yeah. Yeah. So you're good. I am, thank you. Or your right. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. I would have, I'd be dead by, from syphilis by now. Yeah. Yeah.

So you good. I am. Thank you. Or your children would have killed you. Well, there's still a possibility. Well,

Michaela, thank you so much for coming in. This was really nice. Yeah. Yeah. We should be pals. I know we really should.

Friends. Friends. This is why I had this podcast. Conan's podcast is about making friends, but it's really me that needs them. He's out there in the Palisades palling around with, you know, going on bike rides with John Paul Gosselaar and things like that. No. Whereas me, I'm here in Burbank picking up dog shit.

Not even mine. My dogs. Not even your dog's shit? Not even my dog's shit. Just some other dog's shit. Yeah, I have a compulsion. A compulsion and a collection. Jars with things of other dogs.

Someday I'm going to get to analyzing them. But until then, they just stack up in the guest room. I think I just found your next movie. Well, Michaela Watkins, God bless you,

even though I don't believe in it, her, and him. I believe in you very much so. And thank you very much, all of you out there, for tuning in to The Three Questions. And we'll hear from you next time. The Three Questions with Andy Richter is a Team Coco and Earwolf production. It's produced by me, Kevin Bartelt, executive produced by Adam Sachs and Jeff Ross at Team Coco,

and Chris Bannon and Colin Anderson at Earwolf. Our supervising producer is Aaron Blair, associate produced by Jen Samples and Galit Zahayek, and engineered by Will Becton. And if you haven't already, make sure to rate and review the three questions with Andy Richter on Apple Podcasts. This has been a Team Coco production in association with Earwolf.