The Tim Ferriss Show - #103: Drunk Dialing Fans--Celebrating The 100th Podcast Episode!

Starting point is 00:00:00 optimal minimal at this altitude i can run flat out for a half mile before my hands start shaking can i answer your personal question now what is this episode is brought to you by ag1, the daily foundational nutritional supplement that supports whole body health. I do get asked a lot what I would take if I could only take one supplement, and the true answer is invariably AG1. It simply covers a ton of bases. I usually drink it in the mornings and frequently take their travel packs with me on the road. So what is AG1? AG1 is a science-driven formulation of vitamins, probiotics, and whole food sourced nutrients. In a single scoop,

Starting point is 00:00:50 AG1 gives you support for the brain, gut, and immune system. So take ownership of your health and try AG1 today. You will get a free one-year supply of vitamin D and five free AG1 travel packs with your first subscription purchase. So learn more, check it out. Go to drinkag1.com slash Tim. That's drinkag1, the number one, drinkag1.com slash Tim. Last time, drinkag1.com slash Tim. Check it out. This episode is brought to you by Five Bullet Friday, my very own email newsletter. It's become one of the most popular email newsletters in the world with millions of subscribers. And it's super, super simple. It does not clog up your inbox. Every Friday, I send out five bullet points, super short, of the coolest things I've found that week,

Starting point is 00:01:38 which sometimes includes apps, books, documentaries, supplements, gadgets, new self-experiments, hacks, tricks, and all sorts of weird stuff that I dig up from around the world. You guys, podcast listeners and book readers, have asked me for something short and action-packed for a very long time. Because after all, the podcast, the books, they can be quite long. And that's why I created Five Bullet Friday. It's become one of my favorite things I do every week. It's free. It's always going to be free. And you can learn more at Tim.blog forward slash Friday. That's Tim.blog forward slash Friday. I get asked a lot how I meet guests for the podcast,

Starting point is 00:02:15 some of the most amazing people I've ever interacted with. And little known fact, I've met probably 25% of them because they first subscribed to Five Bullet Friday. So you'll be in good company. It's a lot of fun. Five Bullet Friday is only available if you subscribe via email. I do not publish the content on the blog or anywhere else. Also, if I'm doing small in-person meetups, offering early access to startups, beta testing, special deals, or anything else that's very limited, I share it first with Five Bullet Friday subscribers. So check it out, tim.blog forward slash Friday. If you listen to this podcast, it's very likely

Starting point is 00:02:50 that you'd dig it a lot and you can, of course, easily subscribe any time. So easy peasy. Again, that's tim.blog forward slash Friday. And thanks for checking it out. If the spirit moves you. Hello, my sexy little kittens. This is Tim Ferriss. And welcome to another episode of The Tim Ferriss Show, where typically it is my job to deconstruct world-class performers, to tease out the habits, the routines, the favorite books, the morning rituals, that you can use. And if you want that, then I have now more than 100, 100, my God, episodes that you can choose from, including Arnold Schwarzenegger, Tony Robbins, Whitney Cummings. Those are three good ones to start with, perhaps, if you're looking for those,

Starting point is 00:03:37 all available at 4hourworkweek.com forward slash podcast. So just go to 4hourworkweek.com and click on podcast, all spelled out. But the purpose of this episode is to thank all of you because this podcast started as a harebrained experiment. It was really intended to be a break from books. I had a very traumatic experience with my last book launch. It was boycotted by almost all the big box retailers, as well as Barnes and Noble. And that's a whole separate story for another time, but you can check it out. It was the first major acquisition by Amazon Publishing, which I'm still glad I did, but suffered a lot at the hands of others. And I suppose myself beating myself up and I decided to take a break. So that break was to

Starting point is 00:04:25 try audio because I so enjoyed being on podcasts like the Joe Rogan experience or Nerdist, for instance, Mark Maron. I really loved being interviewed by these guys and just have a blast because it was luxurious to have the long format, to have the space to actually dive deep and go down a number of layers in any topic and also to digress and to curse and to be oneself. It was just so refreshing after spending so much time on morning shows where everything is scripted, everything is read through a prompter. And I wanted to see if I would enjoy being on the other side of the table, so to speak. And the beginning was rough. For those of you who have been following the podcast since the beginning, you may recall my very first episode with Kevin Rose, which was really a softball.

Starting point is 00:05:16 He's a buddy. And the intention was to sort of really lead me gently into this world of audio. And I got shit-faced. I got sloppy, sloppy drunk. And remember listening to the audio afterwards and fast-forwarding and just being disgusted with how completely garbled and slurred everything was. So to celebrate passing the 100 episode mark. I can't believe it because the intention was to do six episodes of the podcast to try to get better at interviewing because the research portion of writing the book is really what I enjoy. So it's taking my favorite part of writing a book without the writing. I wanted to see if I could get better at interviewing and get better at speaking, really, quite frankly. And I'm not where I would like to be yet, but I've improved, I would like to think.

Starting point is 00:06:16 And we're at 100 episodes. Holy shit, who would have thought? And I'm so grateful to each and every one of you guys for listening to the podcast. And I won't get all teary-eyed right now doing the intro, but I just feel such intense gratitude to all of you for putting up with all the glitches. I've made my audio mistakes. I've tried to do the editing myself and made every assortment of myriad fuck-up you can imagine. And I've published podcasts as stereo instead of mono, so you would hear one person in one ear and the other person in the other and made a lot of you completely insane. I've made a lot of mistakes, but I've learned from those mistakes and you guys have been very forgiving and very, very supportive. So as a thank you, what I wanted to do was revisit the, the, the, the enjoyment of being shit faced in the first episode with Kevin Rose.

Starting point is 00:07:06 And, uh, what I mean by that is I decided to, uh, call you guys to drink a bunch of vodka and to call fans and answer your questions. And that's, uh, that is what this episode is. It's a compilation of a bunch of those calls. It's a compilation that includes getting different men and women on the phone, also getting some answering machines, or I suppose as the younger folks would say, I don't know, voicemail greetings, I guess. It's not really an answering machine. In any case, left some of those, some more amusing than others. And, um, I really enjoyed it. I really enjoyed it. This is not intended to be, uh, extremely information and tactic dense, although we did cover a lot of really interesting stuff. People asked me about everything from marketing and job interviews to, uh, getting out of sort of a negative downward spiral to tantric sex, my views on marriage and kids, et cetera. So I do think we cover some interesting ground, but, uh, I am probably sound a little more dulled and alcohol infused than normal. So with that, I hope you enjoy this episode. It means so much to me that you guys listen to this podcast at all.

Starting point is 00:08:27 And if this is the first time you're ever hearing this podcast, my preambles aren't usually this long, uh, but it's very late at night. I'm out in the countryside where I grew up and I'm feeling very emotional, very loaded, uh, because this podcast has become a massive success with no intention of it ever being that. And I have you guys to thank for that. So thank you for listening. And if you want to check out

Starting point is 00:08:52 the past episodes, if you're like, what the fuck is this guy rambling on about? You can check out the other interviews. There are some real amazing guests and they are all at four hour workweek.com all spelled out, click on podcast and you can see every single one of them. So onward to the alcohol show. And I was drinking bar Hill, B-A-R-R Hill vodka. I have no association with these guys. So Caledonia spirits, bar Hill vodka from Vermont distilled from raw honey. I'm usually a gin guy. I do like wine, of course, as many of you know, but if I'm going to do a clear drink, it's usually gin. I love Hendrix. I love Boodles, for instance, mostly Hendrix because it's easier to get, but because I like the juniper berries, right? A lot of chefs drink gin and not vodka because vodka is vodka is vodka usually. But this stuff is, it has a very subtle flavor to it that

Starting point is 00:09:53 I really enjoy. So that was my alcohol of choice for this slew of phone calls. And as always, let me know what you guys think and shoot me a note on Twitter at T Ferris, T-F-E-R-R-I-S-S or on Facebook, facebook.com forward slash Tim Ferris. And as always, thank you for listening. Justin, this is Tim Ferris. How are you? I'm doing well. How are you? I'm fucking fantastic. I'm having some Bar Hill vodka and playing with my puppy and making some phone calls. And you're my first phone call. Oh, I'm honored. I'm stoked that you submitted your info.

Starting point is 00:10:35 So I'm going to try to answer as many questions from as many people as possible. So I would love to start with yours. So I'd say just lay it on me. I'm a huge fan of yours, and I follow pretty much all the podcasts you put out. Actually, you turned me on to Ryan Holiday as well. He's a smart lad, that one. Very thankful for. I'm in the middle of a job transition, and I'm going into all these interviews,

Starting point is 00:11:05 but I have a hard time kind of marketing myself. And I'm a marketing director. Right. Often happens. How would you kind of get better at that? And I know you've kind of answered this in parts before, but never kind of really specifically like that. Yeah, I would say there are a couple of things.

Starting point is 00:11:26 So the first thing I would say is you could consider a book that I was recommended by, I think it was Trilogy Software when I was first graduating from school called How to Be a Star at Work. But that's more about implementation on the job. And I might be paraphrasing the title. The recommendation I would make is to study how good people hire, or I should say people who are good at hiring, how they interview, and what they're looking for. So there's a book called Who, W-H-O, which was written by two guys,

Starting point is 00:11:54 one of whom was the son or is the son of the guy who wrote Top Grading, which for a long time was considered the Bible of hiring. So I would say check out Who and look at the Bible of hiring. So I would say check out who and look at the interviewing chapter specifically. So focus on, for instance, I know a number of people who are very good at hiring and the things they look for are crises that applicants have faced and kind of play by play how they responded to it, like emotionally how they reacted and then how they took action afterwards. And, uh, they're also interested in what type of cool shit you have

Starting point is 00:12:30 done in your life. Uh, and for instance, I think it's Y Combinator who asks applicants, you know, what's the coolest thing they've ever built, uh, outside of tech or outside of a startup on their own time, for instance. So I think that those would be a couple of tips off the bat. And then last, I would read the 22 Immutable Laws of Marketing, because the 22 Immutable Laws of Marketing, the original edition, not the updated for the internet version, which was out of date by the time the book went to press, but the old version with like Amstel Light and airline examples and so on,

Starting point is 00:13:08 the 22 immutable laws of marketing apply to anything, not just a product or service, or I should say it applies to a product or service, even if you happen to be a product. Does that make sense? Right. Yeah, yeah. No, I definitely have read that one already per your recommendation.

Starting point is 00:13:25 And so I think I'll definitely take up on the who as well. Yeah, check out that. And just I think that in all of these rehearsals, the name of the game, just like negotiation, you don't want to have the most important negotiation of your life be your first or your second or your third or your tenth. So I would say get comfortable with your pitch, like actually do mock interviews, uh, and make sure that you are comfortable doing that. And I mean, it depends on the stakes involved, obviously, but being interviewed by your friends is a good place to start. But I would actually consider hiring people to mock interview you who are strangers,

Starting point is 00:14:05 but who are good at interviewing because that would make the psychological terrain more similar to what you're actually going to react with when in a real job interview. So those would be my thoughts. Yeah, well, thank you so much. I really appreciate the insight. Yeah, yeah, no worries so much. I really appreciate the insight. Yeah. Yeah. No worries, man. My pleasure. And for those people, if this ends up in the podcast, would you like people to find you

Starting point is 00:14:32 anywhere on social? Maybe there's somebody looking for a marketing director out there. Oh, yeah. JOliverSF on Twitter. All right. JOliverSF. That's a lot. Will do, man.

Starting point is 00:14:42 Have a good night. Hello? Hi, this is Beth. This is? Beth, this is Tim Ferriss calling. Good evening. Oh, my God. Are you serious?

Starting point is 00:14:58 Oh, I'm 100% dead serious, like malaria. How are you? Oh, my God. Fucking fantastic. Hello. Where am I finding you? Oh my God. Fucking fantastic. Hello. Where, where am I, where am I finding you?

Starting point is 00:15:08 Which part of the world? Rochester, Minnesota. Rock on Minnesota. Cool. Well, I, uh,

Starting point is 00:15:14 I'm very excited to connect and I'm having a refreshing adult beverage and I'm all yours. So I would feel free to ask anything that may be on your mind. Oh my God. How many do I get? I'll give you, I'll give you one, you know, I'll give you, I'll give you one, maybe two, depending on how long winded my answer is to the first. Okay. Tantric sex. Tantric sex. What about it? Um, have you done it? How does one go about doing it? I thought somebody else had made a comment about some kind of meditation type thing. Sure. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:15:52 So, all right. Tantric sex or tantric sex. Living in SF, I have a lot of friends who would claim to be experts in such a thing. I do think, of course, there are tantric sexual practices of various types. I've looked at different books, and I'm not sure which facet of this is most interesting to you, but I think his name is Mantak Chia. I could be totally butchering that, but the multi-orgasmic man. So looking at not only the, say, 15-minute orgasm as detailed in the 4-Hour Body, so orgasmic meditation or OMING, which I have looked at very, very closely. But the possibility for non-ejaculatory orgasm in men

Starting point is 00:16:37 is something I've looked at quite closely. I've actually experimented with that and decided on some level that it's not my favorite thing in the world for a whole host of reasons. Partially because in the early stages of practice, it often requires that the woman, or that's in my heteronormative world, but the woman take her index finger and middle finger and basically dim-mock, death-press your perineum, or perineum, right when you're about to ejaculate, which kind of kills the mood for me, quite frankly. But I do find a lot of it very interesting, but I don't have any extensive domain expertise, alas. Sting seems to be up to speed. He apparently can have sex for like 73 hours straight or something ridiculous like that. So I'm sure he has been

Starting point is 00:17:34 asked about that in interviews and may have recommendations that would be easily found on the interwebs. But beyond that, really the closest I've come to looking at that very seriously was looking at the orgasmic meditation with a focus on female orgasm, which it really touches on a lot in terms of not just the physiology, but the psychology, the emotional barriers, past trauma, and how that can be overcome, et cetera. So the practice of something very simple like this 15 minute, uh, mostly a clitoral stimulation, it actually includes a lot. Uh, and I think that in sex, you know, how you do anything is how you do everything really reflects a lot about someone's life. And I suppose, conversely, if you're able to overcome problems and challenges in the bedroom, that often translates to similar progress in other areas of your life. So that's why I spent two chapters on it in my second book. But I am going to have to run, but do you have a Twitter handle or anything that you'd like to share with the world? No.

Starting point is 00:18:52 Okay. That's probably the wiser choice. Yeah. All right. Well, have a... That's so cool you called. Yeah. Have a wonderful evening,

Starting point is 00:19:00 and I hope you find what you were looking for. Yeah. Thank you. All right. Bye-bye. Bye. Yeah. Thank you. All right. Bye-bye. Bye. At the tone, please record your message.

Starting point is 00:19:11 When you have finished recording, you may hang up or press one for more options. Spencer, this is your uncle Joe. I'm at the emergency room. I seem to have a few stitches. Nothing terribly serious. I'm joking, this is Tim Ferriss Sorry to miss you, goodbye

Starting point is 00:19:30 Andy, this is Tim Ferriss calling How the hell are you? Tim, I'm doing well, how are you? I'm great, which part of the country or world Am I finding you in? I'm in West Des Moines, Iowa. Nice. Home of Dan Gable. Well, kind of.

Starting point is 00:19:52 Well, kind of. I'm treating this state as one big neighborhood. I apologize. That's true. So I am all yours. What might I be able to answer or attempt to answer at least? Oh, man, that's crazy. I wasn't even expecting that. I wasn't figuring you'd call, so I'm really on the spot here. You can take a second. Well, gosh, so here's a question, Tim.

Starting point is 00:20:21 I'm really having trouble. I'm not in the greatest physical shape right now as I used to be. I'm in pretty decent shape, but I'd really like to get back to the point where I can run half marathons somewhat easily, as easily as somebody can run a half marathon, or really just be able to get out and run about five miles at a time and have that be something that's enjoyable rather than a real challenge or even something that I can't do. And I'm really finding it really difficult just to even get back out and do that.

Starting point is 00:20:51 I've been to that place before and not really there and not really finding anything that's motivated me to do that. So I guess from your perspective, what's a way that you've found when you're just not feeling like anything is motivating you to work out and get back in shape and achieve the goals that you want to? What's a good way to make sure that I'm doing that and sticking to that? Does that make sense? It does make sense. Yeah, I think that in this case, the question is really a why to and not a how to.

Starting point is 00:21:19 Because if you've done five-mile runs, half-marathon runs before, you clearly have the capability to do that, and you could probably just replicate a previous training regimen. And I could make all sorts of advice or give all sorts of advice related to, say, Brian McKenzie's approach to CrossFit endurance or deadlift-based protocols or jumping rope to work on your Achilles tendon and sort of impact points on the foot and so on and so forth. But it seems to me, like many people, it's not that you lack instruction. It's that you need an incentive. And I think that for me, and I'm thinking about this a lot right now, I just watched tonight a documentary called Meru, or Meru, I'm not sure exactly how to pronounce it, about rock climbing, or I guess alpine climbing.

Starting point is 00:22:12 And it became really clear to me that I need a sort of male camaraderie in a team framework to be really happy in life. And I've always, or I should say, going through school, I had that, but I need to build that for myself with a competitive context of some type. And I experienced that recently with, in fact, Brian McKenzie and Laird Hamilton and doing some training with them. And it was just such a breath of, of incredible life that I felt being, uh,

Starting point is 00:22:48 being able to train with a group of guys in that way again. But the, the point I'm giving is that, uh, coming out of this movie, I started thinking immediately about how I could incentivize myself to get into optimal shape for X, fill in X with some type of goal, which means having a deadline and incentives, right? So what does that mean in practical terms? That means that

Starting point is 00:23:14 I will probably follow the stakes element that I talk about in The 4-Hour Chef. And that simply means, much like my friend A.J. Jacobs, I'll give that example. So stop me if you've heard this, but other people may not have, which is A.J. Jacobs, very hilarious writer, does a lot for Esquire, has written a number of fantastic books like The Year of Living Biblically. He wanted to lose weight, and I'm paraphrasing here, but he wrote a check he's jewish he wrote a check to the american nazi party for some amount of money that was painful enough and gave it to i believe it was his wife or best friend to mail off if he did if he didn't lose

Starting point is 00:23:57 x number of pounds by y point in time and you knowulously, he fixed his python that swallowed a goat physique, right? So this is a clear example, but he's no exercise scientist, but he figured it out because he had a sufficient penalty in place. So I think making a very public commitment or a commitment to other people publicly or privately whose opinions you care about is probably enough. So you could use sites like stick, S-T-I-C-K-K.com. You could use sites like let's see, Lyft, which I believe is coach.me. So that might actually be a good first step because you get an accountability partner or coach. So coach.me might be worth checking out. Or you could put together a betting pool with a handful of friends or coworkers, for instance, hopefully the same thing, who have a similar aspiration, right? Or you could just put together a betting pool

Starting point is 00:25:05 where people are betting against or for you, right? And make it public enough with a very specific deadline so that you feel compelled through social pressure and risk of embarrassment to do what you would like to do. Because I think that without that, let's face it, right? You don't need to run a half marathon to save your life. It's not like this is a must-have low on Maslow's hierarchy of needs. It isn't optional, like it is for most people. They're like, oh, I just want to look great in a pair of jeans, or I just want a six-pack, but it's not

Starting point is 00:25:41 really a must-have. And I think for those optional nice to haves that are still important to us, that you have to ratchet up the incentive. And that incentive can be a reward or a penalty. And I hate to say it, but in the US, we like to talk about pat on the head, gold ribbon for 13th place, but the penalties work really, really well. So we will work a lot harder to avoid having someone steal $100 from us than we will work to make $100. And we can use that psychology. So creating a betting pool where you stand to lose quite a decent amount of money, enough that it will sting, is a very simple way to tackle it. So I would do that,

Starting point is 00:26:27 and then you can focus on all the how-to stuff that 99% of which you probably already know. But that would be my suggestion. Okay. Awesome. That's great. I appreciate it. Cool, man.

Starting point is 00:26:41 Well, I'll let you get to it then. And I guess people are going into the office tomorrow. We're talking on Labor Day. So you could have this sort of done and be off to the races, so to speak, end of day tomorrow. So are you willing to take care of that tomorrow? I work from home but it'll be a little more difficult for me but I'm going to see what I can figure out the first thing I'm going to do is

Starting point is 00:27:11 I'm going to get out and run three miles tomorrow and then I'm going to figure out who I can recruit to have some sort of challenge group and some sort of betting group to help me out with this yeah check out coach.me. Check out stick, S-T-I-C-K-K.com. And then if you want to see how the betting can work in a different context, you could also check out dietbet.com.

Starting point is 00:27:40 Okay. Cool. All right, man. Well, I will let you go. Thanks for everything. I own all your books, but I did buy a few. But at some point, man. All right, Tim. Thanks for everything. I own all your books, but I did buy a few, but at some point you got the royalties there. So I'll buy the next one retail. No problem, man.

Starting point is 00:27:55 I appreciate it. And send me some updates on Twitter or Facebook. So at T Ferris, T-F-E-R-R-I- I S S or facebook.com forward slash Tim Ferris with two R's and two S's. But let me know when you're going to run your half marathon. Absolutely, man. Hey,

Starting point is 00:28:13 thanks a lot, Tim. Cheers. Yeah, you too, man. Bye-bye. See you,

Starting point is 00:28:16 man. Hello, Ann. This is Tim Ferris calling. How are you? I'm calling. How are you? I'm good. How are you? I'm splendid. I'm petting little Molly. That is my six-month-old or five-month-old mudblood rescue pup.

Starting point is 00:28:37 Yes, yes, yes. She is cute. She's a cutie, And I am all yours. So I'm happy to answer any question that you might have. Well, you know, I am. I'm wondering about your love life. I've been happily married to my husband, Joe, for 31 years. We have two beautiful daughters. So I really, you know, I hear you in a lot of your podcasts talk about children. And so I'm just hoping that that is in your sight there because they are such a really beautiful blessing.

Starting point is 00:29:19 It's just a beautiful legacy to have children and to watch them grow up. Yeah, no, I appreciate that. I was actually just with one of my former college roommates today and playing with his three kids for the last two days. And it's something that, of course, I'm biologically programmed for. And I feel like I would be a good dad. But then I have all sorts of questions. I think you would too. I think I would. There are all sorts of concerns that pop up for me that are not maybe directly

Starting point is 00:29:56 related to having kids. But for instance, I realize as much as I may be programmed to have kids and to protect them, I'm not necessarily programmed for monogamy, for instance. And I live in San Francisco and there are all sorts of different arrangements that can be had that are socially accepted there. But that is part of my internal struggle because I don't want to bring kids into the world and then have some cataclysmic implosion in the home that then leads to divorce, et cetera. So that is part of the calculus that I'm struggling with. And I don't know what the answer is, quite frankly, but I do enjoy... I'm not one of those people who hates kids. I actually... Now, don't get me the answer is, quite frankly, but I do enjoy, I'm not one of those people who

Starting point is 00:30:45 hates kids. I actually, there are, now don't get me wrong, when I see three kids or four kids melting down and their parents having complete panic attack in an airport, I don't envy that experience. But simultaneously, I see how much joy some of my closest friends are getting out of having kids. And it is something that's very much on the mind. So it's, um, it's not something I'm ignoring. It's something I'm thinking very deeply about, but I, I guess, um, my sort of policy so far has been, if in doubt, do not pull the trigger for lack of a better description. But what do you,

Starting point is 00:31:26 let me ask you this. What, what do you think has allowed, what are the, so many marriages fail. So many marriages are on the rocks constantly. Um, what do you feel has enabled your,

Starting point is 00:31:38 what are the, the, the characteristics of your marriage or of how you interact with your husband that have allowed you to have this relationship last so long? Well, first of all, my husband and I grew up in pretty much the same sort of families. We grew up in the same city. We actually went to the same grade school together. And so when I talk about his parents, I sometimes say I fell in love with

Starting point is 00:32:08 his parents before I fell in love with Joe. Right. And I really do mean that. I, I really, um, you know, sometimes they say that if you, um, you know, if you see, um, you know, I saw his father as somebody that I knew that Joe would be. Right. And he is that. He pretty, in a lot of ways, there's not, you know, I think, but to be perfectly honest, it's really the spirituality. Right. We grew up as Catholics. Mm-hmm. We grew up as Catholics, and it doesn't mean that we have not had really serious, you know, when we were first married, we really had some serious problems that I didn't think we were going to get go back to how we were raised and really be able to think reasonably about had we given our marriage an opportunity to grow and develop and change and really, because both of us were both in, grew up in the 70s.

Starting point is 00:33:23 And so, you know, we both grew up kind of struggling with monogamy, too. I think we both walked down the aisle wanting to do things the way our parents did them. Both of our parents, you know, my folks have been married for 56 years. His parents were married until his mother just recently died. But, you know, really wanting that and knowing that the culture doesn't support that kind of relationship. It really doesn't. But knowing that both of us had, both of us honestly had moved away from Catholicism and we were both practicing TM, too.

Starting point is 00:34:11 Oh, Transcendental Meditation. Isn't that interesting? Yeah. And then I kind of came at it a roundabout way and was studying Ayurveda and then came into learning about TM through Ayurveda. And so we both were practicing. I had gone through after him. But it's funny because TM kind of led us back to our faith, believe it or not. How was that? How did it have that effect?

Starting point is 00:34:48 I'm so curious. Because TM is very secular in a way. It is. It is. But it was really funny because I had expressed to Joe that I wanted to learn TM. And he said, well, just be careful because, he said, they think Maharishi is Jesus Christ. And, um, and he was joking, but there was that, um, you know, when you go through the, um, the initiation part of it, that something happened in my heart that I realized that I had already given myself to somebody, Jesus Christ, and

Starting point is 00:35:28 so I was able to take all of that, even though I still practice, I don't practice TM in the same, I don't practice TM as with that mantra, that mantra that I was given, I took all of that and directed it toward deepening my relationship with Jesus Christ. Well, I think that's, yeah, I think that's fair. I think that's totally fair though. I mean, I think the value of TM, and quite frankly, which now for me, I find that, um, I did not want to adopt that particular, um, fixation that they, that they really bring up very early in TM

Starting point is 00:36:17 and haven't myself. I've really focused on the mantra almost as a sound or white noise with therapeutic value. But there are times I will say that I envy people with a religious faith because it gives you a playbook that you can compare to your partner's playbook to see if you're playing by the same rules or not, at least at a very high level. And it's, it's, if you go from, say, it's kind of like you can travel around the world.

Starting point is 00:36:55 And if you're a fan of a particular soccer team or the Yankees or whatever, you can, you can speak a common language. And I feel like with least specific sects of different religions, for instance, also true of certain philosophies, you can share that common language even if you don't speak the same language verbally. And so there is a part of me that greatly envies that, although I haven't come to the same conclusions that you have myself. So big topics. Yes, exactly. But I think that's what's carried Joe and I along together with our daughters. And now they're grown up and we're kind of in a new, we're experiencing a new place because our daughters are grown they're grown up and we're kind of in a new, we're experiencing a new place because our daughters are grown. One daughter's married and, um, and then the other

Starting point is 00:37:50 daughter's, um, pursuing her, um, college career. So anyways, but, um, yeah, so, um, it was that. And then let's see, I don't, I don't think I had another question for you, but that every time I hear when I'm listening to your podcast and, and I think it was the other part of the TM when, um, I think I heard you express it or somebody else that you were talking to express my, um, misgivings with TM was the cost involved in it. And I thought, okay, they're always talking about the weakest link in this, the whole, you know, the supernatural, and when we're practicing TM, that weakest, the weakest link is that person not practicing, or the weakest link in society is not, you know, and I thought, well, then you should be doing this all for free, you know, because if we're teaching people to really transcend themselves,

Starting point is 00:38:49 if we're really teaching people that it really isn't about the physical thing that we experience here. But anyway, so I thought whoever brought that up in my podcast was like... I brought that up because it's bothered me. I brought it up because the argument that TM would make – and so people who want to check out TM can check it out, TM.org. There are a bunch of other organizations. I think it's the David Finch Foundation, I think it's – or David Lynch. I'm sorry. I'm mixing up my names.

Starting point is 00:39:19 I've had a little bit of vodka. I apologize. Kind of required if I'm going to call this the drunk dialing episode. Yeah, yeah, I saw that. But there's CFTM.org if you want to check that out. But also you have very low cost or free apps like Headspace or Calm, which both can really help jumpstart a very similar type of mindfulness training. And for those people who haven't listened to the other podcasts, 80% of the people I have on this podcast and interview have some type of meditative or mindfulness practice.

Starting point is 00:39:54 But I tell you what, we could talk all night, but I want to make sure I have a chance to chat with some other folks. But I appreciate the reminder. Okay, thanks for your phone call. Of course. Yeah, very good. Keep up the great work. Thank you for everything you're doing.

Starting point is 00:40:07 Oh, my pleasure. Thank you so much. Okay. And thanks for providing a role model for what it sounds like is a wonderful family you've built. So thank you. Well, okay. Thank you very much.

Starting point is 00:40:21 All right. Bye-bye. We'll see you. Bye-bye. We'll see you. Bye-bye. When you have finished recording, you may hang up or press one for more options. Carol, this is Tim. I know I've been calling a lot. I'm sorry to keep calling, but you never pick up. This is Tim Ferriss. Just kidding. I wanted to just leave you a voicemail because I feel compelled to tell you how much I've been missing your voice, even though I've never heard your voice. And that's all. Merry Christmas. Goodbye.

Starting point is 00:41:02 I'm excellent. How are you? I'm doing very well. So Alden it is. I was wondering how to pronounce the name, but it looks like I got it right. So I am stoked to connect, man. I'm all yours. So I would be honored to answer a question if you have one. All right, I do. So I'm a fitness enthusiast and a health coach. And so I'm trying to find a question that hasn't been asked pertaining to health. No worries. What are two to three supplements that you would recommend someone to never take?

Starting point is 00:41:42 Ooh, that's a good one. Two to three supplements that I would never recommend someone take or that I would advise against. Or in most cases. That's a very tough one. That's a good one and a very tough one. I think it's largely situational and dependent on blood markers and whatnot. Uh, I do think that, uh, men who consume multivitamins, daily multivitamins containing iron among other things are asking for trouble. Uh, so I would say multivitamins oftentimes can do more harm than good. That would be right kind of off the bat. And I think that

Starting point is 00:42:27 on a related note, one of the theories for the longevity or lifespan discrepancy, sort of median lifespan discrepancy, I guess it's not median, it would be mean, lifespan discrepancy between men and women. One of the theories is that men do not menstruate. Therefore, they develop toxic levels of particular, say, heavy metals that can in part be excreted through menstruation by women. So that is one compelling reason to donate blood, for instance. Let's see. I may not have a second and a third that come to mind, but I'd say categorically, if something is highly isolated, much like beta carotene was not all too long ago,

Starting point is 00:43:18 people believe that you could get all the benefits of, say, beta-carotene as found in carrots through consuming isolated or synthetic and or synthetic beta-carotene supplements. And what they realized is that that could produce many unintended side effects because it wasn't being consumed from whole food sources that contain cofactors, many of which we probably haven't even identified and named. So I would say that whenever something gets highly isolated and synthesized, I like to see longitudinal data in humans before I act as a guinea pig. Even though I'm very well known or thought of as a human guinea pig, I actually like to play it safe with a lot of that stuff. So even something that I think is potentially very promising, like metformin or rapamycin, for instance, even if I were to start at both of those today, I would not be an early adopter,

Starting point is 00:44:17 even though I'd be well ahead of most people. So I'm still waiting for more data and input from doctors on a lot of that stuff. All right. Well, I will say that I wholeheartedly agree about the multivitamin. And interestingly enough, I recently read an article for John Meadows' Mountain Dog Diet website on the interactions of beta carotene or vitamin A interfering with vitamin D absorption as well as other things. Yep. And so I actually stopped taking multivitamins primarily for the fact because of the high isolation or high concentration of beta carotene.

Starting point is 00:44:55 Yep. So I think that we suffer from a great deal of epistemologic or epistemological arrogance, as Nassim Taleb of the Black Swan would say, we think we know more than we actually know. And that can get us fancy monkeys into a lot of trouble. Cool, man. Well, I tell you what, I want to try to get to as many people as possible. I don't want to cut this too short, but can people find you on Twitter or anywhere else? Would you like to give people an opportunity to say hello? Sure thing. I'm at AldersLodge on Twitter, A-L-D-E-R-S-L-O-D-G-E.

Starting point is 00:45:33 Or if they want, they can email me. I wouldn't do that. I wouldn't do that. That's true. I know that. I'm going to save you. I'm going to save you from certain death. Okay, cool, man.

Starting point is 00:45:47 Well, good to connect. And hey, keep up the good fight. Thank you very much. It's been an absolute pleasure. Hello? Hello, is this Marifer? I apologize. I don't know how to pronounce your name. Yes.

Starting point is 00:46:09 Did I get that right? This is Tim Ferriss calling. Oh my God, are you serious? I really didn't think I would ever get a call from Tim Ferriss. Well, here we are. Actually, right. Well, I'm actually laying down in a bed in colombia south america wow are you colombian or where where are you from i am colombian you are colombian and yes and you should totally my

Starting point is 00:46:35 question what for you will be what would it take for you to come down here i will be your guide i will take you everywhere you will have a blast it doesn't take you everywhere. You will have a blast. It doesn't take very much. I actually lived for a month in Medellin because I absolutely love Colombia. So which part of Colombia are you in? I'm in Barranquilla. Barranquilla. Nunca estuve. How is it?

Starting point is 00:47:01 How is Barranquilla? I've heard a lot about it. I've never been. It's awesome. It's really hot, right? I mean, it's hot. It's on the coast, in the North Coast. Barranquilla is famous because we have the second largest carnival in South America. Of course, you have like Sofia Vergara is from here. She happens to be my cousin as well. Shakira is from here. She happens to be my cousin as well. Shakira is from here. Yeah, I actually was her personal assistant while she was moving from Miami to LA to be a movie star.

Starting point is 00:47:35 Wow. So I went through all that crap. Yeah, her whole plan has worked out, it would seem. Yes, I was a big part of it. That's amazing. So why do you speak English so well? How did you learn English? Well, I grew up here and I went to American schools down here. We have about four different American schools and I grew up with American teachers. I lived in a private neighborhood where a lot of foreigners

Starting point is 00:48:06 live and my neighbors were from, I had neighbors from Denmark and I had neighbors from San Luis, Missouri. So I grew up just, it's either, you know, there was only like maybe including my brothers who were like eight kids in the gated community so it was either you you spoke some language that we all understood or you just didn't have friends and my danish friend he sucks at spanish he still sucks to this day he lives here and um he yeah he really draws girls away because he's kind of like too intense. He gets in their face like, hello. That sounds, wow. So he's just like, also Perezoso.

Starting point is 00:48:51 I mean, he's just like, he won't learn languages, huh? Right, yeah. When you were down here, nobody ever, like I followed your, I've been reading your blog and I'm a total fan. So I thought, I was like, I got to let this guy know that whatever adventure he wants is here. Well, I've been looking for excuses to get back to Colombia. So it doesn't take much. Seriously. I had such an incredible time in, what do they call it?

Starting point is 00:49:17 La Ciudad de Primavera Eterna. Is that what they call Medellin? It's so beautiful. I mean, the altitude also caused me to suck wind a bit. But you know what? I could talk about Colombia all day, but I want to let you get to bed, and I want to also have a chance to have some more vodka and call some more people.

Starting point is 00:49:39 So I will ask you if you have any questions that I can answer. Certainly, I'm happy to answer questions about how I feel about Colombia or other things. But what question can I answer for you? Honestly, what I need the most help right now, I've been in a very negative spot for the last month and a half. I made the mistake, a very unfair action of hiring someone for my business. And I fired this person and I've been stuck in this negative hole. Just going around in circles like, what the F? You know, how did I make the mistake? How did I not go through?

Starting point is 00:50:29 And my business that I'm trying to launch a product that I can ship out, you know, again, following your advice. So I invented a ketchup that is completely made out of vegetables. So I'm marketing it. I'm also an internet marketer. So I market this as a hidden veggies ketchup for children made with natural and organic ingredients. So I finally found a co-packer that would do all this stuff for me. But the problem is now I need a little bit more funding than I wanted to. So the question will be, where do you get a little bit more funding without having people going, I want 50% of your company?

Starting point is 00:51:07 This is a good question. So you asked a couple of different questions. So I would say or implied a couple of questions. So in terms of the dark self-doubt and negative space, there are a few things that I found very helpful because we all experience that or most humans do. There are maybe some mutants out there who don't, but I spent time with a lot of successful people. You know, some very successful people, obviously, and everyone I think has moments of self-doubt and negative spirals. So a few things that helped me tremendously. The first is a book with a terrible title and great content, but it's called How to Stop Worrying and Start Living by Dale Carnegie. That is not his best known book, but I think one

Starting point is 00:51:54 of his most helpful. And I've actually sort of written about my thinking around this or to, to make it seem more human, this type of self-data wrote an article called, uh, productivity tricks for the manic depressive, neurotic, and crazy like me, something like that. So if you search neurotic and Tim Ferriss, it'll pop right up. But the, the other thing, uh, that I've found is exercise. Uh, exercise is really sort of the number one most effective way to self-medicate and in this particular context. And if you have the ability to either go for it, to either run or swim. There's something about the, the repetitive motion that is very meditative for people in terms of the financing. Uh, there's a book you would probably have to get it used, but, uh, called gorilla financing. Uh, I believe, and I think

Starting point is 00:52:59 the author's name is Jay Conrad Levinson. I think it's Levinson as a last name. Someone might be able to correct me on the internet, but Gorilla Financing, G-U-E, I want to say R-R-I-L-L-A Financing, although my spelling has been better in years past. Yeah, your Spanish spelling needs help. Well, no, no, but in this particular case, so a lot of people would spell like gorilla, like gorilla the ape, but in this case it's like gorilla warfare. Yeah, I read the gorilla marketing.

Starting point is 00:53:35 Yeah, so it's the same author or the same series of books, but it's called Gorilla Financing, and there are some very interesting recommendations and aspects. The other thing that I would suggest you check out is a post that I wrote with the help of a CEO I know called Hacking Kickstarter. So I think that an opportunity for you to raise financing would be potentially crowdfunding. But crowdfunding has a lot of promise, a lot of peril if you don't follow certain details. And this particular post is very, very detailed and effective. And it gives you the exact scripts, the exact details and instructions. And literally

Starting point is 00:54:21 three days ago, met two founders who used that post, followed it step by step, word for word, and raised $4 million on Kickstarter. I don't necessarily recommend raising more money than you need. But the point is that crowdfunding, at least at this point in time, is very entrepreneur-friendly. So it is worth, I mean, the terms and conditions are very favorable towards people posting projects. So it is an interesting and advantageous time for people to look at that as an option. So I would recommend that.

Starting point is 00:55:03 Okay. I remember all that. Okay. I remember all that. Cool. Perfect. I've actually, yeah, I've actually remembered, I've actually read your Kickstarter post. And I mean, yeah, so I'm familiar with it. But I have to tell you that this, I mean, this, you know, it's like, I can't, I'm just like, oh, so mad at this person.

Starting point is 00:55:24 This person's like, I'm going to sue you. And I can't, I'm just like, oh, so mad at this person. This person's like, I'm going to sue you. And I'm like, go ahead. Yeah. Not to sell out. Yeah. That stuff always happens. And I would say the how to stop worrying and start living is a good one to read. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:55:41 And then secondly, in terms of letting go of resentment and anger and so on, which is an issue that I've had for decades, I would say that the Stoic philosophers that I talk so much about are still and will probably always be my recommendation. So Seneca, The Younger, Letters from a Stoic, etc. Marcus Aurelius, Meditations, a little less so for me, but people like Ryan Holiday seem to prefer him. I would suggest checking those out as well. What kind of meditation do you do? I'm starting Transcendentalental meditation on the 24th.

Starting point is 00:56:32 I have my first class. Yeah, I do mostly, I'd say it's a blend of Vipassana meditation and transcendental meditation. So what does that mean in concrete terms? That means, but TM is really what I've focused on for the last one or two years. That means that I meditate 20 minutes in the morning or 21 minutes. And I focus, depending on the day, how I'm feeling, et cetera, on either my breath or the mantra and the repetitive sound or nonsense word that you will repeat as part of TM. So I combine those two. And I've also borrowed some aspects of the meditation that Sam Harris recommends. So Sam Harris has been on my podcast twice. He's a neuroscientist by training, PhD, very interesting guy. But I am also spending oftentimes the last three to five minutes meditating while looking at the sky. This requires some explanation, so I'll let you.

Starting point is 00:57:32 You can listen to my latest episode of the podcast with Sam Harris, H-A-R-R-I-S. Gets into this in some detail, but that's currently that's, that's currently how I'm doing things. Oh, cool. Cool. Thank you. I'll follow your advice. Thank you for calling me.

Starting point is 00:57:51 And, um, I know that you want to drunk dial a bunch of, are you drunk? Uh, I've had three or four vodka drinks, so I'd say I'm pleasantly, uh,

Starting point is 00:58:00 smoothing out my rough edges. Listen, Jim Paris, you could have been right here, right now, having some really good aguardiente and enjoying the weather. I could. Nos vemos en Colombia. Ojalá, Tim Ferriss, ojalá. Ojalá que tengamos la oportunidad.

Starting point is 00:58:25 And I will talk to you soon. Okay. You have a good night. Bye. Hello. This is Eric. How's it going, Tim? It's going well. How's this evening treating you?

Starting point is 00:58:43 Oh, another night in paradise, man. I was actually just getting through the final minutes of your podcast with Wim. With who? With Wim. Oh, nice. Yeah. Wim is Mr. Wim Hof, the Iceman. Yeah, absolutely.

Starting point is 00:58:57 Sounds like a mad scientist. I like him. He is a mad scientist. He definitely, definitely is. Where am I catching you? I was about to read the first few numbers of your phone number. That would have been terrible etiquette. But you are in Canada, it would seem. Yeah, I'm in Victoria, BC. Beautiful place. Beautiful, beautiful town.

Starting point is 00:59:18 Do you make it up to BC often? Whenever I want to contact high from just walking down the street and inhaling marijuana smoke, that's my first pick. It's a beautiful place. It's really, really one of my favorite places in the Pacific Northwest. Absolutely. So what question can I answer for you? So, Tim, as a young guy just getting started, I work in the events industry, not dissimilar to Jason Daynard. What's the best way to go about actually getting a hold of you? Well, you're doing all right so far.

Starting point is 00:59:53 You have me on the phone. So if you want to, you could try pitching me right now. What's your pitch? Absolutely. So in Seattle, we're doing an event called the Underground Entrepreneur Summit. So what we're trying to do is put together an event, not just similar to Jason's, where we put together about 200 people in one room in an incubator program. So people who are highly ready for new information.

Starting point is 01:00:20 And we'd love to have you come speak. So the people in the incubator, I associate that with startups. Are these people who opt in who are entrepreneurs or are these any particular type of attendee? Oh, absolutely. It's all entrepreneurs. Got it. Of all different shapes and sizes.

Starting point is 01:00:43 All different shapes and sizes. Most of all, like, at a very low level, just trying to get off the ground. Got it. Okay. So the best way to get a hold of me, I'll just, so I'll give you feedback on two things. So the people that are ready for new information, I would make more specific.

Starting point is 01:01:01 So you just, if you pitch, say, someone like me or anyone you want to get ahold of who gets a lot of these types of pitches, the way you can differentiate yourself is by doing a couple of things. Number one, realizing they probably don't make the initial decision. So for instance, in my life, I have a right-hand person who fields all of my speaking or engagement inquiries like this. Sometimes, for instance, you can get IMDB Pro and find out who they are represented by. If it's, say, a CAA or a WME, like a talent agency, oftentimes those people will negotiate speaking. In my case, I have someone full-time

Starting point is 01:01:41 who handles that, among other things. And if you go to the contact page on my website, I'm pretty sure you would find at least one or two of those. A common mistake a lot of people make is they will try to get direct to someone who ultimately isn't actually the least likely to respond just because they have other people to handle that type of thing. The other thing I would say is I would get very specific, right? So what are the benefits to the person you're pitching, right? Is it location?

Starting point is 01:02:10 Is it you setting up stuff that they can do around the event? So even if the event is just getting started, like Jason's mastermind talks were just getting started a few years ago, that might not be enough draw as an event in and of itself. But are you going to set up some type of unique cultural experience that isn't available to me off the rack, so to speak? In terms of the attendees, are there any particular impressive attendees we're going to show? Or do they fit a certain category that I would find interesting, like Fortune 500, fastest-growing, privately-held company CEOs in Canada, something like that?

Starting point is 01:02:51 Can you get one of those people to attend so that you can put that in the pitch? And other things would include, is it free or not free? In other words, is it a free event for the attendees, but also are you offering – you don't have to answer this right now, but are you offering a speaking fee or what some people call an honorarium to speak, right? Does it have to be done in person or if somebody can't attend because there's a date conflict, would you be open to doing something via Skype, for instance, Skype video, something like that? In any case, those are all of the recommendations I have on the pitch. And kudos to you and Big Balls for doing it right now.

Starting point is 01:03:35 Jason, if you haven't reached out to him, he's a fellow Canuck. I feel like he would be a friendly fellow to reach out to. Have you spoken with Jason before? I haven't spoken with Jason. We're just actually looking to reach out to. Have you spoken with Jason before? I haven't spoken with Jason. We're just actually looking to connect with him. We kind of got the second connection to him, so we're going to be reaching out to him this week. Got it.

Starting point is 01:03:55 Let me make a couple of recommendations. So the biggest mistakes that first-time or not first-time, but sort of novice intermediate event organizers make is, number one, they don't charge enough for the attendees, and therefore they have very little pressure to create a high-value event, and they also lack, therefore, the budget to put together a really good event. Second is not offering busy potential speakers enough options. So for instance, I will not do, in most cases, unless you're like South by Southwest or some, or Ted, I won't do a keynote for free. It's very unlikely. Or maybe if I'm speaking to students or, um,

Starting point is 01:04:41 something like that, I won't do that for free, but I might do Skype for free or less. Or if you make it interesting outside of the event and offer me the opportunity, uh, to meet people I wouldn't otherwise meet, then I might be open to doing something like a Q and a session, which would be sort of an Oprah style fireside chat. Um, that chat. That is an option that is surprisingly effective at getting people you might not otherwise get. So those are my thoughts off the bat, just because I get pitched dozens of these a week. But those are a couple of ideas

Starting point is 01:05:18 that may or may not be helpful. Right on, Pam. Well, thanks for the feedback. I really appreciate it. Yeah, no worries and I would just say also if people want to learn more about the event or if you have a twitter handle or anything like that

Starting point is 01:05:32 people should check out what is it it's our company called tribe of zero we're making business events fun you can find us online at tribeofzero.com or at tozevents on twitter at tozevents and what is it to zero what is the name again at tribeofzero.com or at TOZ events on Twitter. At TOZ events. And what is it to zero?

Starting point is 01:05:46 What is the name again? Tribe of Zero. Tribe of Zero. Got it. Okay. Well, I will get the background on the name another time. But in the meantime, good luck, man. Okay.

Starting point is 01:05:58 Have a great night. Hope it's a home run. Take it easy. Yeah. Enjoy the wine. Thanks. Kevin, this is Tim Ferris calling. How are you? I'm great. How are you doing? I'm doing great. You must be, judging by the area code, I'm not going to read your number, but you must be getting on the late side, getting close to midnight. Yeah, so I'm 516.

Starting point is 01:06:27 I'm originally from Long Island. So where are you now? I live in San Jose. I moved out here for school. I haven't left since. I hear you have a similar story. Yeah, man, Jose. I spent two years down in San Jose in the Willow Glen area.

Starting point is 01:06:44 But I'm actually on the East Coast right now, so I'm on the later side. But I am pleased to connect, and I'm all yours. So please ask anything that's on your mind. Yeah, that's a – wow. Carb launch right here. Let me see. You know what actually really does, I'm very curious of like, what is, I know, like I've heard James Alpert talk about how, uh, millionaires have

Starting point is 01:07:11 like seven, I think it's like seven streams of income. What like are those streams for you? What are my streams of income? Uh, sure. Yeah, we can dive into that. So I would say there are many, many, many, many, many different streams of income. And some are very small relative to the biggest. So some are just a few hundred bucks a month, right? And then some are much larger than that. So my streams of income right now, I would say, can be separated into predictable on a regular basis and then unpredictable on an irregular basis. And the latter category is a little easier to describe. So I will cover that first. The unpredictable on an irregular basis is actually the bulk of my net worth. And that is related to startup and early stage investment. the winners in that category, whether Twitter, Facebook, Evernote, Shopify, Alibaba, et cetera, all companies I've invested in, those will generally, from the point that I invest in them, take seven to 10 years to get to a liquidity event, meaning an acquisition or an IPO after which I can freely sell my shares

Starting point is 01:08:48 or stake in that company. And so that is one. There are others, right? So I would say that you have everything ranging from Amazon affiliate links, which are not a main driver. But if you consider that I have 600 plus blog posts, when you add up all of the affiliate links, four things that I would have cared enough about to recommend, even if there weren't affiliate links, that adds up to a non-trivial sum of money per month. I then have, I would say, more finite upside opportunities. For instance,

Starting point is 01:09:37 like the book club. So I have the Tim Ferriss book club, And there are maybe seven to 10 books in that category or in that book club. The upside is very limited. Whereas investing in something like an Uber is an ideal scenario could be anywhere from 100 to 1,000 or more than 1,000 extra turn. But in the case of the book club, I know that it is exceptionally difficult to sell more in the case of a home run, exceptionally difficult to sell more than say 25,000 to 50,000 audio books. So I can calculate the likely maximal upside in one of those. And I've had to strike different deals with, say, authors or publishers, and that affects the percentage of my ROI.

Starting point is 01:10:36 I have the usual author streams of income, and by usual, I mean speaking engagements, consulting fees, but I say no to almost all of those because I find them boring. So I don't do really any consulting and I do very few speaking engagements. And I've tried to take a position, and this is based on advice from Josh Waitzkin, who's been on the podcast before, that I either do things for free or for full retail in the realm of speaking engagements so that I don't spend a lot of time and energy negotiating anything in between. So I either do free at something like TED or South by Southwest where the audience makes it worth it. Or I do full retail, which means no haggling. This is my price and I don't drop below that price. And you could look at sites like Washington Speakers Bureau

Starting point is 01:11:34 or others to get an idea of how much different people get paid for that type of speaking engagement, a keynote, what have you. I'm trying to think of other sources of income. We have the podcast, which is an accidental business, right? So the podcast really was started as a project to fill space, meaning I didn't want to do another book, and I decided that I wanted to try podcasting to see if I enjoyed interviewing as much as I enjoyed being interviewed in these long format podcasts like Joe Rogan, the Joe Rogan Experience, Nerdist, et cetera. in the beginning because I'd always had a rather low opinion, or I should say low expectation of CPM-based,

Starting point is 01:12:33 meaning cost per thousand, where advertisers are paying for each thousand impressions at a set dollar amount. I had a low view of that stuff because the pricing had been eroded so much with online advertising and I assumed it would be comparable but we are in a golden age of podcasting where the CPMs are

Starting point is 01:12:54 fantastic for publishers who are able to put out high quality content and maintain that over time. So the podcast itself has become a source of revenue. A very... Sorry, how does an advertising contract with an athletic greens or one of those companies that you signed, how does that work? Per episode kind of thing? Well, I'm not going to speak to any particular company because I have

Starting point is 01:13:22 sort of non-disclosure commitments to all these folks. But I would say, generally speaking, I've experimented with one-offs. I've experimented with, you have to pay for three episodes or you don't get to play. And where I have landed myself is that I don't offer discounts for tests, because if you test a podcast at a discount rate, that doesn't prove that you can make money at a higher rate. And, um, I am in a position fortunately where there's, there's just more demand for spots than supply than available units. So, uh, I try to keep things very, very simple and this shouldn't be surprising to anyone who's read the 4-Hour Workweek.

Starting point is 01:14:06 But I, at this point in time, still do prepayment. And I do not offer extended payment terms for anyone. And generally speaking, the only way you get a discount per se is by buying... Actually, forget generally speaking. The only way that you get a discount is by buying a high volume of units upfront. Why is that a discount? Well, it's because you're buying at the present value. And my download numbers and my listen numbers are going through the roof. So if you buy 12 episodes and lay them out over two to three months, you are going to have a substantial discount or you should three

Starting point is 01:14:52 months from now when I'm charging, you know, 20, 30% more per episode because you locked in that bulk rate in advance. Does that make sense? Yeah. So. So that's typically how that works. And I have little things here and there. Occasionally, brands approach me that want to do partnerships of one type or another. But those are the sources of income that come to mind. Of course, I have the books. The books still do very well for our workweek, for our body, for a Chef, all three of them are usually in the top thousand on Amazon. The four-hour workweeks very often even still now in the top 100. The Four-Hour Body very frequently in the

Starting point is 01:15:35 top 250. So those books still deliver residual income in the form of royalty payments. Yeah. So you just kind of get like a rolling sort of royalty payments. Yeah. So you just kind of get like a rolling sort of royalty check or something? I don't know how being an author really works. No. In the publishing world, at least in the book publishing world, that's typically twice a year. So you get royalty checks twice a year or on a quarterly basis, something like that.

Starting point is 01:16:03 But I would say most authors who work with large publishing houses, meaning the big five or the big six, get royalty payments two to four times per year. And they only get royalty payments if they have earned out their advances, right? So the advance is by definition an advance on royalties, after which you get paid a certain set amount based on the unit sales above that threshold. But I might be missing a couple of things here and there, but there are – I have other revenue streams, but those are the primaries that come to mind. Yeah, and then sort of most of your time now is kind of in the advising roles, you say, do you think? Well, I've actually cut back dramatically

Starting point is 01:16:49 on my startup activities because I feel like there's a lot of noise in the market and a lot of inflated pricing. Not in some cases where, for instance, I've been an advisor to Uber since 2008 or 2009. I don't think some companies like Uber, which have strong counter-cyclical potential and extremely healthy cash flow, I don't think those are inflated, but the riding on the news of many, there's such an overwhelming number of new entrants into the startup world because it's a sexy sector. The noise is such that it makes it harder for me to do my job. And I don't like my job to be difficult. And i'm in it for the long haul so if i'm i'm not a fair weather

Starting point is 01:18:07 angel investor i am more than happy to wait until there's blood in the streets and invest when only the hardcore entrepreneurs who really want to build something because they cannot help themselves they cannot live in a world where that company doesn't exist. I'm perfectly happy to wait until we find ourselves in that circumstance again, and then double down on those people. And in fact, if you look at my most successful investments, they've almost always been in dot-com depressions, so to speak. Not when the covers of every business magazine feature startup founders and CEOs or venture capitalists.

Starting point is 01:18:55 So I'm not saying there's a correction pending any particular point in the future, particularly with quantitative easing and so on, makes it exceptionally difficult to try to time this type of thing. But I am focusing more on building my assets and machine within my editorial world for the blog, for the podcast, for email, and so on, because I can magnify any opportunity I capitalize on with those assets. Then I am focused on the, by definition, highly speculative world of early stage startups, particularly when the deck is stacked against me with a surplus of capital coming into this sector and just a lot of silly nonsense going on.

Starting point is 01:19:49 So I'm spending less and less time on that and more and more time on what I enjoy, which is putting together writing and the podcast and so on, which gives me an opportunity to also develop skills and relationships that translate to other areas. Definitely. That's awesome. Yeah, I'm loving the blog, love the podcast. You put out so much stuff, it's almost exhausting to keep up with. Just imagine how I feel.

Starting point is 01:20:21 Yeah, I know. But we all have to spend our time doing something, and I think the biggest misinterpretation of the four-hour work week is that the objective is to be idle, and that's not my objective at all. The objective is to control time so you can allocate it to the things that you enjoy doing or that are highest leverage, and that's exactly what I'm doing right now. So, Kevin, I tell you what, I'm sure we could talk for much longer,

Starting point is 01:20:45 but I'm going to have one final swig of vodka and probably get a move on. For sure. Thanks for taking the time, man. Yeah, of course. It means a lot. And enjoy San Jose. I've spent a lot of time there.

Starting point is 01:21:00 And I appreciate the time. Yeah, for sure. Thank you again. All right, man. And keep doing you. I will. You too. This episode is brought to you by Wealthfront

Starting point is 01:21:15 and this is a very unique sponsor. Wealthfront is a massively disruptive, in a good way, set it and forget it investing service led by technologists from places like Apple and world famous investors. It has exploded in popularity in the last two years, and they now have more than two and a half billion dollars under management. In fact, some of my very good friends, investors in Silicon Valley have millions of their own money in wealth front. So the question

Starting point is 01:21:39 is why, why is it so popular? Why is it unique? Because you can get services previously reserved for the ultra wealthy, but only pay pennies on the dollar for them. And this is because they use smarter software instead of retail locations, bloated sales teams, et cetera. And I'll come back to that in a second. I suggest you check out wealthfront.com forward slash Tim, take the risk assessment quiz, which only takes two to five minutes, and they'll show you for free exactly the portfolio they'd put you in. And if you just want to take their advice, run with it, do it yourself, you can do that. Or as I would, you can set it and forget it. And here's why.

Starting point is 01:22:13 The value of Wealthfront is in the automation of habits and strategies that investors should be using on a regular basis, but normally aren't. Great investing is a marathon, not a sprint, and little things that you may or may not be familiar with like automatic tax loss, harvesting, rebalancing your portfolio across more than 10 asset classes and dividend reinvestment add up to very large amounts of money over longer periods of time. Wealthfront, as I mentioned, since it's using software instead of retail locations, et cetera, can offer all of this at low costs that were previously completely impossible. Right off the bat, you never pay commissions or account fees. For everything, they charge 0.25% per year on assets above the first $15,000,

Starting point is 01:22:52 which is managed for free if you use my link, wealthfront.com forward slash Tim. That is less than $5 a month to invest a $30,000 account, for instance. Now, normally when I have a sponsor on the show, it's because I use them and recommend them. In this case, it's a little different. I don't use Wealthfront yet because I'm not allowed to. Here's the deal. They wanted to sponsor this podcast, but because of SEC regulations, companies that invest your money are not allowed to use client testimonials. So I couldn't be a user and have them on the podcast, but I've been so impressed by Wealthfront that I've invested a significant amount of my own money, at least for me, in the team and the

Starting point is 01:23:29 company itself. So I am an investor and hope to soon use it as a client. Now back to the recommendation. As a Tim Ferriss show listener, you'll get $15,000 managed for free if you decide to open an account, but just start with seeing the portfolio that they would suggest for you. Take two minutes, fill out their questionnaire at wealthfront.com forward slash Tim. It's fast. It's free. There's no downside that I can think of. Now I do have to read a mandatory disclaimer. Wealthfront Inc is an SEC registered investment advisor. Investing in securities involves risks, and there's the possibility of losing money. Past performance is no guarantee of future results. Please visit wealthfront.com to read their full disclosure. So check it out, guys. This is one of the hottest,

Starting point is 01:24:09 most innovative companies coming out of Silicon Valley, and they're killing it. They've become massively popular. Just take a look, see what portfolio they would create for you, and you can use that information however you want. Wealthfront.com forward slash Tim.

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The Tim Ferriss Show - #103: Drunk Dialing Fans--Celebrating The 100th Podcast Episode!

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The Tim Ferriss Show - #103: Drunk Dialing Fans--Celebrating The 100th Podcast Episode!

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