The Toast - The Wayward Women of Hollywood: Wednesday, February 18th, 2026

Episode Date: February 18, 2026

1. Miley Cyrus to Return for ‘Hannah Montana 20th Anniversary Special,’ March Release Set on Disney+ (Variety) (17:47) 2. Hilary Duff makes rare comment on ‘complicated’ family dynamic amid feud with sister Haylie (Page Six) (30:41) 3. Zach Bryan's Ex Brianna Lapaglia Says His Marriage Was Dig at Her (TMZ) (38:09) 4. Mossimo Giannulli steps out with much-younger stylist — again — after Lori Loughlin breakup (Page Six) (51:14) 5. ‘Tell Me Lies’ Creator Dives Into That Jaw-Dropping Finale and Explains Why the Show Is Ending: “We Couldn’t F*** It Up” (Hollywood Reporter) (53:28) The Toast with Jackie (@JackieOshry) and Claudia Oshry (@girlwithnojob) ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Toast Patreon ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Toast Merch ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Girl With No Job by Claudia Oshry ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Camper & The Counselor⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Lean In Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

It's Jackson, Claude and neighbor show the fast five things you need to know. We'll start your day off, swirly. It's the toast. I sound amazing. Welcome back to Toast and happy hump day. Don't forget to hum someone you love. And speaking of girls that I love. I'm joined by my co-host, my partner in both work and in life.

It's me. I can't. So if you care to find me, look to the western sky. That actually sounds good. Like that's your pitch. Yeah. Register, yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, Slight Mama. So good. That's who it is with Claudia today. It is. It's me. And Paul Salem. Paul Salem. We have our BMOTW behind us, our business man of the week.

I feel really good about this new segment. Me too. I would like to address some comments from yesterday, specifically one being like, what about the business woman of the week? And you're listening to the wrong show. You're missing the point. And also.

The whole point of the businessmen, is to help pop stars in need. Like, it's for women. It's, of course, it's a women's issue when you boil it down. And let me tell you how badly I don't want to see, like, Glenn Powell with a businesswoman. No, that's not the point, you guys. You're misunderstanding.

The point is for wayward women of Hollywood to find a stable businessman. The wayward women of Hollywood. I love that. The title. Can count on. 1,000 percent. Chloe Kardashian and Paul Salem. Wait, it's for women who need to be buoyed to see.

something tethered to, you know, someone with their feet firmly planted on the ground, someone much like Paul Salem. And I just want to say, based on some of, like, the information I received yesterday, Paul Salem and Nicole Kidman, like, are seeing one another. And that's, that was like sort of the point of the TMC story. But they literally said that they're not. They've been on two group dates. But like they're seeing one another. Like they're, they're, it's a courtship. Like he's courting her. Yes, he's courting her. He hasn't had the courage to ask her out on a solo date yet. we're rooting for you, Paul. We are definitely rooting for you. But yeah, this is for the women of

Hollywood who need more and who need to settle down. Love that. With a billionaire. Today's a huge day. It's Wednesday, which means we've reached sort of an inflection point in the week and how you choose to receive that is quite beautiful. But it's also inflecting on. Oh, I'm reflecting on. I'm like I'm receiving the middle of the week as like yeah you know yeah we sound like one of those like fake podcast clips wait really to job my love that's kind of a big statement and that's a kind of statements you can come to expect here okay that's a big statement what I was trying to say was that it's a big day because it's the tell me lies because it's the tell me lies series finale recap we're going to do if you haven't watched yet it will be at the end of the episode so this is a spoiler free zone um I just want to say I am feeling really excited to talk about it. And I'm personally feeling like, and this is not going to spoil anything. I'm personally just feeling a huge weight lifted off my shoulders

that I don't have to watch a show anymore. Because like it was getting to a point where it was such a good show. Like I was taking it on emotionally. And I come to sort of like dread it. And I just feel free. I agree. It was a lot to get like sucked in every week to this anxiety-inducing show. And I'm glad that it's over.

But I'm glad that like we experienced it as we did. I don't want to spoil anything. But I think that the ending was. like really great and we can send ye on you merry way I am smiling because it's over but also because it happened yeah yeah we'll talk about that at the end of the show though but that literally that took up my whole night because I also had to watch last week's episode so I have like a two fur for you I also watched a lot of shots of sunset and like the people that I was liking like are starting to act out and I think I need to stop watching the show because it's like kind of inconvenient for me to like change my

alliances like I'm sorry I like bam shot and sky and like they're crazy like so it's just not it's convenient for me anymore. Okay. What about the, but you, when like your faves become the villain, I'm out. But that's when they need you the most. Yeah, I'm just kind of a fair weather fan. I just got here. But do you still, like, what they're doing, like, is wrong or everyone just thinks it's wrong? Both. Like, they're making a bigger deal for sure, but like, she's just like a, like a brat. And she, like hates the valley. She hates the food in the valley, the houses in the valley, the people in the valley. During COVID, like, they took a hit financially. So they had to move to the valley. And now it's five years later. And like, they're ready to move. But it's kind of like very,

relatable thing. David, it's amazing mortgage rate. And they can't, they're like stuck resident was like, you're crazy to move. You have such a great mortgage rate. And she was like, but it's not my dream house. They moved into it when they were like on, you know, harder times. And he was like, you're just crazy if you move, but she like wants to go back to Beverly Hills. And so she's at this dinner with people who like live in the valley, love the valley, love their houses. Like they're living the dream. It's really the American dream for a lot of them. They own homes. And they're just like sending their kids to school. And it's great. And she's just like, I hate it here. It's disgusting. So like, they're like, okay, well, that's.

rude. And she just doesn't know, like she, do you want to say, I can't blame everything on this show for, like, being cultural because they're all from the same culture. But like, it's definitely like a little cultural, especially like, you would think if you watch a show that all their marriages are in disarray. Like, they fight nonstop. But it's like a very Middle Eastern type of fighting. And I don't know. I'm not worried about a lot of them. Some of them I am. But like, no, they're not like they're fine. Yeah. Also to say, like she's just being bratty and like condescending and rude. And like this is a way of life. Like all these people really love. Like they love their homes. They love their gardens. Like, like, it's nice. And she's like in hell. Like it's actually funny. So she should just leave. Yeah, yeah. But then she like leaves the show. Okay. Yeah.

I heard that it was supposed to be called the Valley Persian version. Mm-hmm. And they changed it to the Valley Persian style. And I just want to say who was ever decision that was like you should be fired. You're obviously mad at your job. But also Shaz of the Valley was right there. Of course. But they want to franchise the Valley.

So fine. They wanted it to be the Valley colon Persian version. Hilarious. Why didn't they do that? I don't know. Versions like not a great. word. It's not a great word to be in a TV show title. Like, I get it. But neither is a person's style. It's good enough for Taylor. Taylor's version. We are like, Loki matching today in rugby shirts.

Rugby striped shirt. Yeah, mine's from Nordstrom rack. Mine's from Cynthia Rowley. I went to Nordstromack, IRL and had the best time. I didn't even know what was waiting for me on the website. The shirt was like seriously $17. I don't know that to be true, but it was like under 40. It's really cute. And you just need shirts when you're a podcaster, a daily podcaster. And your shoes? Oh, yes. I'm wearing fancy, like flip flops. They're called... Oh, my God.

Texas. Tequise? Teeks? Teeks. Yeah, because, like, who wants to wear flip flops? But, like, these are so elegant. Texas, mur.

P.K. She said... Texas from Pek. She says Texas from Pek. That's the brand. Yeah, Texas from Pek. How are the stories today? They're good.

It's, again, like, there was a lot of stories that were, like, all lightly interesting. Not like so significant. So I picked my five. Yeah. Any businessman of the week come to mind this week? Well, we already have our businessman of the week.

So I didn't want to feel so conflicted. Yeah. And I just want to make everyone know like, don't come to expect businessman of the week to be every week because then it gets forced. Think of it more as like a Kelly's mindless news. Like when a businessman makes news, whatever week that may be,

he will be the businessman of the week. And until then, Paul Salem is a businessman until we found another one. Yeah. And I think the businessman is, men like would like that. Are we going to keep the photo rotating? Yeah.

Or Paul Salem, he's our inaugural, like he's forever. We can't have a picture of Paul Salem up here forever. Oh, and do you want to hear the best part? Unless like he wants to be businessman of the week. Every week. Do you want to hear the absolute best part of this whole thing? Is the cardboard cogey element of it? Because I wanted to get a frame.

Does that frame look familiar? Home goods? I bought it at Home goods like a little while ago. Because we took these really cute holiday pictures like with Santa and everything. in the kids and I was like let me just like frame it and I bought it from home goods it was six dollars and it was actually broken like the picture wouldn't stay in that like it doesn't stay up it's like so broken so I meant to return it obviously never did and now it's been repurposed yeah cardboard cogey reigns supreme and except cardboard cogey didn't make the return I know oh sorry no I

sorry we did and they were like you didn't buy this here I'm like excuse me I did and they're like and you also broke it I'm like you broke it yeah and then I got to a fight so it's just been like it's been hanging around and now I found a purpose for it. Yeah. Of Paul Salem. But any businessman, like, it's never too late to be businessman of the week if you want to give us a jet. You could be businessmen.

Oh, that's a very easy way to give us, like, if you want to be businessman of the week, here's how you can get it. Give us a jet. We can be bought. This is a segment. Oh, where bribery is like very much a factor. Or if like you're in a business that's having like trouble optically, like you could sponsor businessman of the week.

Like a strong. That's a great idea. If astronomer, like, wanted to rehabilitate their CEO, they could have bought businessman of the week where we had to say nice things about that CEO. Yes, it could be a sponsored segment. So just like, I want everyone to know, like, that's coming. Giving us a jet either like for a trip or, of course, in perpetuity. Yeah, evergreen.

Making us like, you know, they're always giving like celebrities. Like the chief mom officer. Yeah, we'll do that. A paid gig. You called me something yesterday in the ads of Thrive Market. I said you're the chief brand officer. Maybe. That's a good job for me if the CEO of Thrive Market wants to be businessman of the week.

And we're just assuming that all major companies have CEOs who are men. No, if they have a CEO who's a woman, you're not eligible. This is very much like a binary segment. But that's amazing that you did that. You love to see women like in high places, slay mama all the way. And then you don't need businessman of the week for your business's optics because you're probably in a good spot with the woman in the way. It's kind of like how we have women's history month but not men's history month. Like you have businessman of the week but not businesswoman of the week.

Yeah, some things just are. Some, they need uplifting. The businessmen need uplifting. Correct. Yeah, I'm really excited to see what comes of this. Yeah, I'm like looking forward to seeing what the future holds for BMOTW. I feel like we're going to meet some really great businessman. I mean, and I didn't even know about Paul Salem yesterday and he's like literally like,

changed my life. And Nicole Kidman's, hopefully soon. In a positive way. And if you're a celebrity who watches the show, like maybe get some inspo. for your next boyfriend. Yes, of course. Although, unfortunately, like, a lot of the businessmen are wiped up. Yeah.

But not in a meaningful way sometimes. Yeah, or, like, formerly wiped up. But, no, we're not here to, like, break up any marriages. Maybe we can only have. Single? Single. Then we're really, that's, like, really hard to find. Like, I feel like we're really pigeonholing ourselves.

Yeah, we are. We are. We'll see the natural evolution of BMOTW. Yeah, one thing, we have to let the chips fall where they, I can't believe people said what about business women. I can't believe you guys. I know. It's like, do you not know us at all?

Like, stop. Just stop. Oh, so yeah. So yeah. That's the latest. And the greatest. Do you want to get into the stories? I do.

I really do want to talk about tell me lies. And unfortunately, we have to do the stories before we can do such a thing. But there are a couple of stories. Like, I actually really need to talk about. And I just want to, like, warn everyone, hate her alert. I'm kind of like hating everything today. Some days I really try to come. come to the show with like light and positivity and be like, you know what? It's going to be great.

And then you know what? I just want to be honest. Yeah. Our fast five stories are presented to you by Okay, Smartmouth. If you're a coffee drinker, a garlic lover or married to me, SmartMouth has got you covered. SmartMouth is the only mouthwash that's scientifically proven to give you 24 hours of fresh breath with just two rinses a day. The secret is their dual solution smartzinc technology. So as you pour, the two solutions activate billions of zinc ions. that instantly eliminate bad breath and keep it away all day. It's backed by science. It's developed by dentists who literally wrote the encyclopedia on bad breath.

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So Miley is celebrating 20 years of Hanner, calling it the Hannaversary. She will be participating in a Hanna-Montana 20th anniversary special on Disney Plus. So it will feature. It will be filmed in front of a live studio audience and will feature an interview with Miley hosted by Alex Cooper. She will revisit iconic moments from the show as well as never-before-seen footage and recreations of the show's sets. Disney also promises that, quote,

there will also be some familiar notes that find their way back into the spotlight. Oh, great, can't wait to see a never-before-seen footage. Like, that's not what the people want. Like, Miley is, oh, I'm sorry, like, I'm hating this. Miley is always a dangling Hannah in front of us and she's been posting so much about the 20th anniversary, the wig. And it's a girl, all we want is for you to put the wig on and sing. Like, that's all we want.

We want the songs. We want the music. People love the show, of course. But we want Hannah Montana the pop star. Oh, great. We're going to recreate the sets. Like, I'm good. Yeah.

This would have been nice, like, paired with a concert or a tour or, like a DVD or something. Like, I'm sorry, this sucks. It's like the Friends Reunion. And the Friends Reunion was, like, not my favorite. It was, like, live studio audience, like, talking about the fun memories. But it was cool to see the Friends back together. Like the show about like Hannah and Lily and Oliver, like great. But that's not what people love.

It's the music. It is the music. I would love to hear her up there sing the hits, shaking that thing. I need like a backyard sessions. Remember her like old YouTube series where she's just singing Hannah? Stripping them down. Yeah. Fine.

Don't even wear the wig. Okay. Like all of the things about Hannah Montana like are great. The sets, the people, the footage. Sure. But it's really the music that like carried the generation through. And it's what people miss. No.

They did not say that. They said they're recreating the sets, watching old footage, and taking a look back. Okay. There might be some familiar notes that find their way. Notes, that's a weird thing to say. Are they withholding? Are they withholding? That she's going to sing, because to me, that's the pull.

I, yeah. It's weird because a bigger fan of Hannah Montana, you could not find than me. Then our family, by the way, like. I could not have watched a show backward. It shaped me. person. So this is for the fans. For you. For me. This doesn't do any. I don't need to hear behind the season what happened on the set of the show that I watched 20 years ago. It was like a show for kids. There's not going to be drama. It's not like that tea, you know? It's not tea. So I don't really

know what this says. And you're right. Miley's always dangling Hannah. Every time she gets a haircut with bang, she's like Hannah. Every time she gets a haircut, it's a Hannah T's. Every time she releases new music, it's a Hannah T's. Every time she's like cleaning out her closet, it's a Hannah. Like she has dangled it in front of us for so long. She does give us like little crumbs. I know she sings the climb live a lot like on her shows and tours. But like she's overarchingly giving us, given us nothing except that she is,

thinks very fondly of Hannah, which is nice. Now, this is really not enough for me. Now, again, I can acknowledge, like I have a high bar because like you said, like love Hannah. Like Hannah shaped us. Like I know everywhere. I just sometimes listen to Hannah Montana in the car

and I still know every line to every word. Everywhere to every line. So yes, my bar is high. I don't need a sit down interview with Miley. Like maybe in addition to the concert, this is just not what I need. If she did like a lot, you know what they should have done?

They should have done like a live show at like the Hollywood Bowl where they streamed it live on Disney Plus. Like people could buy tickets like in person thing where like she either performs as Hannah or like Miley, you know, reflecting on Hannah and she could talk about, you know, maybe the tour stage is like designed like her Malibu house. And maybe she'll talk in between songs about maybe Lily will come out and sing a song. Like sure.

But the music not being the center of this, like, I'm so out. I just don't think there's even a good way to do something like this. Like, it's just a moment that's gone, you know? And can't we just accept that? Like, no, I don't think she has to accept it. Like, I think there is a way to honor it and this is not it. I don't know. What do I need from Hannah now?

20 years on. I need her to sing. Yeah, I guess. Like, that's the only thing I need from Hannah right now. Yeah. I don't know. Like, so this is for me. I don't know if I will.

get around to watching it. It depends what the meat is. One, the same, but two, maybe there are interesting stories that I don't even know I would be interested by. I don't think her dad is going to be involved. I think he will be there and go to place. And if he's not, that's... Yeah, I don't know why I just like, I don't see it for him.

I think he's like very polarizing. And then the whole river rose, fire rose. Did you hear her voicemail? Or not voicemail. Like, her secret recording. Yeah, it was bad. And yes, him and my other year, like a little touch and go. So I think it's probably like, you know. And Oliver is in the slam.

For meth or something. Yeah, so it's like, we actually don't need anything. Fresh out the summer. Besides Hannah. Okay. And I feel like her and Emily Osmond are actually not friends. And Emily's really the only, if we don't get Jackson. Rico!

If we don't get Jackson, throw it in the garbage. And if we were doing like a concert style format, we could have gotten like Rico and Jackson's beef jerky song. Like there's so much to be done. Like, this is such a shame. Jackson. Jackson. We need Jackson.

I think maybe. He's a little too like, he's very artsy, Moises. He's like a photographer. Do you think Moises would go back there? You mean 490TX? I mean 490TX. I do think Moises would go back there. This element is interesting to me.

Like who will participate in what capacity? If there isn't a song to be sung, I agree, throw it in the garbage. But beyond that, I don't know, it just makes me feel. old. Who hosted the Friends reunion? Was it James Corden? Yeah, I'm just because this is like the most similar format. They do a lot of like classic shows reunions.

It was James Corden. Classic shows like reunions or reboots. Like they always do something. And Friends was the first one to like kind of veer from the template. And they did this like interview type thing. I'majig. And so this feels like the most similar to that. That's why I keep comparing it.

It's just like, okay. The good news is, though, is like, I love Miley. Yeah. I love a Miley interview. So this is also that. Yeah. And I think, you know what? It depends what I'm up to in late March, but, like, I think I'll give this a shot.

Yeah, so no, I definitely have plans to watch it. And I guess my expectations are so low. Like, maybe I'll enjoy it. But this is just not what the fans want. I feel like... There was nothing they could have announced that would, like, just capture what it was because it was a moment in time it's fleeting and it's gone. I feel like you're not giving my concert idea like any, you would love that.

I would, but like it would just make me feel old, I think, like to watch us being old, like, I don't know. I think it would make me feel, like, I look back on, like, I don't even think of like Hannah Montana as the glory days. Is she to put on the wig to sing the song? I don't care. I don't think she does. I think of it as like really the soundtrack of my childhood in such a positive way. It reminds me of my family. And like, it's so, it doesn't make me feel sad at all.

It makes me feel like grateful. And so, like, if she could just honor that. Like the show was amazing, of course. Like, it's not about that. I like your backyard sessions idea. I mean, bring back the backyard. What was it called? Backyard sessions.

Backyardians. Yeah. It was backyard sessions. Yeah. So good. Jolene. Bring back backyard sessions. And the bun.

If we could get the button. Yeah. And sing Hannah songs in New Miley fashion. That would be pargy. Yeah. I mean, she could have brought out Dolly to do a collab. She's always bringing out Dolly. Yeah.

Who else was on the show? Brook Shields. Who guest starred on the show? You know who was on the show that was like when we were talking about him, we couldn't remember like how we knew him, but it's actually from Manhattan, Montana. Oh. Kind of dark, but Rob Reiner. He was in an episode of Montana.

Was he playing himself? I think so. Yes, he was. Honestly, his kids must have been fans. That's how like Brooke Shield says like she didn't even know this show. Larry David was on it with his daughter. Yes, because the kids were fans. Dream.

Like, that's where being an Epilbaby like is actually unfair. Like, I'm fucking fair. I agree. You got to meet Hannah and Miley. And be on the show. Best of both. Oh, and what about Jake Ryan and Austin Butler?

He won't be there. Jake Ryan is not Austin Butler. No, and was Austin Butler on Hannah Montana? I think he was. No, he was on Zoe 101. I can get a small role. No, he just looked like Jake Ryan. Okay.

And what about Jesse? Jesse. So to me... And like, Austin Butler was on Hannah Montana. Who did he play? Just like... It wasn't a major role. Okay.

It wasn't like a love interest, was it? Uncredited role. Okay, are you sure he was on? Derek Hansen. In one episode. So he was literally an extra. Like, that doesn't count. Okay.

You were confusing him with Jake Ryan. No, no, I wasn't. But I know that he's, like, credited when people talk about his past as being on Han Montana and not as Jake Ryan. Got it. So I just thought he was like a boyfriend at one point. Roxy like a Puma better show up. Yeah, she really influenced us. Like, we were always saying that as kids.

Yeah. And what about the girl who said, Don't worry, Hannah. We'll keep your secret. She's from the movie. There will be movie elements. Oh, well, if the movie's in it, then we have so many more people.

Lucas too. Vanessa Williams. Vanessa motherfucking Williams, Tyra Banks. Also, who's the actress, Jan from the office? Jan from the office and the woman from Secretariat. Oh, and Rascal Flats. Ah! They should come out and sing Blessup.

See, if we programmed this, like we would have made it like really um for the fans like this to me i feel like miley like deviated from disney and in recent years she's like very much back in the disney family she did she got a disney honors award and so i feel like her doing this like maybe it's not her preference on how to honor the show but like she's back in disney's good graces and like maybe one day we will get i'm just so desperate like you will not yeah what what's due to us but i also don't think myly does anything she doesn't want to do. Yeah. If she wasn't about this, she wouldn't do it. So I don't think it's like Bob Eiger, not businessman. So let's like, oh, he, if he, if this went off like with

without a hitch, yeah. He could be businessman of the week. Bob Eager like was a businessman of a decade. We talked about him incessantly on this show because he was like the only businessman we knew for like the first five years of this show. So he's gotten his flowers. He has. I also don't think he's at Disney anymore. No, and then he came back. He came back and then he's still there. He left and came back, right? Yes. Very, like, Needy and Greg. And I feel like he's the CEO. We're so, like... No, he's not. He's like a chairman. Yeah, he's like fancy. Chairman. He's so rich. Chairman Bob. I gotta be the chairman of something, you know? The toast. Okay, you'll let me.

Sure. That would make me your boss. You're fired. Okay, well, like, I would love to be wrong. I just want to say that. But all in all, it's just not what I would have preferred. Yeah, it doesn't. really scratchy itch for me. And it's I feel like I've, will never be scratched. Yeah, because like I've gotten back and watched Hannah. It's on Disney Plus. And like it hits, but it just like, you're right, it was a moment in time. But I just want to say like I think for a lot of girls our age, like, looking back on it, like it does not make me feel sad. It doesn't make me feel old. It really makes me feel like

happy and grateful. And like, look like Hannah raised us. She really did. She really did. So let's, let's hear from Hannah. Let's see. I'm going to give her a shot here, what she has to say. but I just want to go on record saying, like I wasn't asking for this, I wasn't waiting for this. And if we were going to get something to honor the 20th anniversary, like it was not an interview style look back.

Yeah, at the sets. Like, I'm good. And I follow the girl on TikTok who lives in the Malibu house. So, you know, they had a picture of the outside of the Malibu house and they would, ooh, and they were like showing it from the back. The inside was obviously like a fake set.

But she lives, her grandparents own the house. Well, I would love to hear how they came up with some of those rips for between scenes. Like, maybe that's the notes. they're referring to. Where did that come from? Ooh, yeah. I love it.

If they have the footage of her recording that, I would find that interesting. There's potential. And the more we talk about it, the more I'm open. But when I saw this, I'm like, move on, everyone. No, I don't agree.

It's, we can, like, move forward and honor Hannah, but without, like, killing her, beating her to death. Yeah. I don't know what's right for Hannah. I don't know what's right for her. Maybe it's this. Maybe we're wrong.

I'm very open to being wrong. Yeah. I'm going to give it a shot, though. The more we talk about it, the more potential I see. And you're right, it does center around the music. So she better be up there shaking that thing. Big time. And that wig. Yeah.

Are you ready for our next story? Uh-huh. Hillary Duff is making a rare comment on her complicated family dynamic. Yes, I saw her opening up in Glamour magazine. Yeah, so she sat down with Glamour magazine. She touched on her rift with her sister, Haley. And Ashley Tisell. her father and why she wrote about it in her two of her new songs.

I wouldn't know because I don't listen to her new music. Right. I just know about like the one with the blowjob. Correct. That one I heard. Becca, there's it and I give in your head. Something like that. She said, quote, that's my family.

Those are the people that affect you the most. Take up the most space naturally as a human who's born into something. Well, true. Just because you're born into a family doesn't mean that it always stays together. You can only control your side of the. street. She acknowledged that she's had a very complicated life and said that her parents have a very complicated dynamic as well. They are forced. I know it's not rare and I think it goes to the back to the theme of why share now. I guess I just felt ready, she said. Well, that makes it even sadder that her

and Haley aren't close and like actually hate one another because if they did grow up in this sort of like unstable toxic environment like your sister, your sibling like that's your life raft. Yeah. And so like they're all on the fritz. Like that's really sad. Especially because they were so close for so long. like, got through hard times. And then she also said she was like, talking about like friends she's made as a mom. And she was like, it's been really surprising that like a lot of the friends I made later in life

like through motherhood are like the deepest, most amazing friendships, even though I haven't known them so long. But then you also like start to prioritize like being around people whose values align with yours. It's giving politics. You think so? Yeah.

That's like what people say. Yeah. There's a lot of kinds of values, especially when it comes to parenting. Yes, that's true. Or it could be like, maybe she's referring to like politics or parenting style. Yeah, like the gentle parent. Right, like maybe Aschita Tissau props up an iPad.

There's a lot of things that could be. I agree. It doesn't rule out politics. Right. But they're never beating the political allegations. Great, but also like politics also can spill over into other things where it's more so like. Right. You parent this way because of your politics.

Right. So. But I feel like if you take a step back and stop trying to like zero in on these two, Like if you said someone is not your motherhood friend because of like your values don't align, like you would understand what that meant, right? Yeah, I would, if I said that, I would mean that like we just parent really differently. Yeah. And like, yeah, that's what I would mean if I said that.

So I understand that statement. It doesn't have to be like, well, she voted for this one. Right. Our values as parents don't align. And if your values as parents don't align, like you probably also voted for different people. Well, yes. Right? Like, yeah.

Very sad. I'm like on Hillary talk. Okay. She's still doing this like very small tour. She looks so beautiful. She's styled to perfection. Like I don't know who's like she's not wearing like typical tour outfit. She's not wearing like you know a body suit.

She's just wearing like really chic pretty outfits. And she wears a different one. That's like the beauty of being on this like little small tour. Like she just she's done like 20 shows and she's gonna work 20 outfits. Like it's not. And she looks so cute and pretty and she's singing so good and she's just like really well adjusted. It's nice to see. You don't see that a lot. And she never had

a period publicly. She might have like battled behind closed doors. But she never had that like stereotypical. Which is also surprising considering now we're hearing about like her family drama. Tough home life. Yeah. Yeah. And that usually lends itself to like some sort of spiral publicly. Especially as you

transition from child start to adult. Yeah. But the child's like doing okay today. This this child, I actually attribute a lot of Hillary Duff's like to younger. I feel like that was a really important bridge for her. Yeah, not even, by then she was, like, grown.

Yes, but, like, it stopped her, it really... Her ability to transition, like, really... And continue working. Yeah, from, like, raise your voice, even though who would ever want to leave. Where's the Raise Your Voice 20th Anniversary Special where Hillary Duff sits on a stage going, Ah, ha, ha, oh, yeah.

Ha ha, ha. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. The reason why we need that is because we know nothing about Raise Your Voice Behind the scenes. It's like a steel trap. You know, we've heard from Hannah over the years. We even back in the day, like we, there were interviews, you know, Disney Channel.com. But this was just like a movie.

This was a movie. We don't know anything about it. Also. Who wrote it? Did you see that Hillary Depp was actually reunited with her Raise Your Voice mom, Rita Wilson? They like took a picture. I don't know if Rita went to her show, something. They saw one another and took.

picture and it was like seriously the best photo I've ever seen in my life. Rita Wilson is low-key in everything and she's also a country star. We needed to see her with John Corbett. Was that the dad? No, he was the teacher. Oh, of course. The singer-teacher. Right. Who were her parents? They weren't really in it. She went to like boarding school, right? No, they kicked her out because like, oh no, it was the brother. The brother sent in the tape to go to the music school. Yeah. So like the parents were kind of irrelevant. Alan what? Wilson. I don't know him. Rita's brother. Rita and Alan Wilson?

Dad from Raise Your Voice. No, the parents were insignificant. I know I make mistakes I live my life. By the way, have we ever put together that Raise Your Voice was directed by Sean McNamara? Yes. Yes, we have. Okay. I love him.

We need Sean McNamara documentary. Everything Sean McNamara has made is perfect. It's very, very true. we've done this before but I think we need to do it again I agree okay raise your voice of course brats godie we have to have them on the toes the sweet life movie oh remember the movie baby geniuses oh we loved that movie yeah he did that's like oh bring it on fight to the finish I don't know that one is that sharks first yet no do you want to hear the funny and then wait also um legally blonde remember those two twins from Disney yeah yeah yeah it's like the go-to for he's an extremely

decorated. He also did a couple of Casper movies. Oh, and then of course, bow artists at war. The Holocaust movie. That we were doing hats for. Yes. And directed by Sean McNamara. Yeah, that's why he's on my brain. Who also did brats. Yeah. King. King range. Do you want to know something so funny when Olivia did the toast with me, we were talking about something about the Jets and I like made a joke, Sharks versus Jets. And she was like, what's that? And I was like, oh, this like bring it on where it's like sharks versus jets cheerleading. They're an extremely turt bring it on. That's exactly what I said.

Bring it on seven. Yeah. Sharks first jets. So, Claudia and I say everything is sharks first jets. But apparently, Sharks first jets is from West Side Story. Yes. Oh, you didn't know the original. Like, no, now that sounds familiar, but like Bring It on Seven was referencing West Side story.

Yes. Bring it on Seven is like a modern adaptation of West Side Story. Not a lot of people don't see that, but it is. It's like how clueless is like Jane Austen. It's exactly like that. Yeah. Yes. Yeah.

Yeah. The Lion King is Hamlet. Correct. Bring it on Seven is West Side Story. Yeah. Yeah. So that was funny that I learned that. Yeah.

Are you ready for our next story? Mm-hmm. Brianna Chicken Fry went on impulsive podcast. It's actually making a lot of news from this podcast. Yes. So she's discussing Zach Brian's new marriage and friendship dissolution with Grace. Which I literally, like I'm over Zach Bryan. Like I love what she did for us, like letting him know.

Like we all know who he is. Like I don't need to hear from her on Zach Bryan. I feel like the more interesting thing is her relationship with Grace because like there was a two week period where everyone on the planet was talking about them. Yeah. And like their friendship breakup and there was everyone was team grace. Like that's when Brianna really became the villain. She was like riding this high of like being beloved by everyone after telling everyone about

Zach Ryan the $12 million, turning it down. And then I think people also really understood like how her and Grace had started to drift part she was in this really toxic relationship and you probably weren't being like the best friend you could be. And everyone took Grace's side in the friendship breakup. I feel like that was like bad for Brianna's cue score. Like everyone was loving her after the Zach Ryan thing and then it went completely downhill. I just want to say I was never like 100% team grace because I kind of saw and this is exactly what Brianna said. Like she said when people started like speculating that there was beef between them and then really started to like send brianna a lot of hate while brianna was dealing with this

abusive relationship that grace knew about nobody knew about it but grace did brianna was like can you tell like people to like fuck off a little bit like this is a podcast that briana started that brianna made popular and then gave grace a job at and then gave grace a platform people started to really like grace they were like you know like us like a jackie and a claudder you're like a grace or a brie and like there are a lot of friendships that mimic that and then she kind of like created this monster in grace where like grace was getting more hype and everybody loved grace and when brianna was like really, you know, going through it, Brianna was like, can you just like tell everyone like, we're good? Like everyone's like, especially because they were, they were like coming at Brianna

on Grace's behalf. Yeah. It's like, it's very easy to be like, no, Bree and I are great. Like, please stop. And also it's the fans of their show. It's not just like haters. Like it was their own fans, like turning on Bree for the sake of grace. So grace could have been the quickest way to end it and be like, no, we're good. Stop. Like, please stop sending hate. And Brianna said on this podcast that Grace like said no. Now I do give Grace a little grace because like she was, So new. There's no easy way to navigate, like what they, like the TikTok drama. It became so big.

There's no right way to navigate that. Maybe if you're like five, 10 years in this business, you know what to do. But she was literally a year into it. She was like unemployed before. No one knows how to handle it. So I give her a little bit of grace, but like she should have defended her friend, especially when at that point her friend had done so much for her, like giving her a job, gotten her a job at barstool.

It feels like basic like friendship. Even if you're on the schoolyard, someone's bullying your friend. You say, hey, that's my friend. Yeah. It feels like you don't have to be in this business for so long to just like, and it's not like you're even putting yourself out there. Everyone loves you. Yeah.

Everyone loves us. All you have to say is like, no, like, please stop. Bree and I are good. What you're saying is just unwarranted. Right. That's it. And then the interesting thing was, was like, I remember us talking about their friendship breakup and the podcast breakup being like, this is so interesting because like the drama is so big,

but the podcast was not that big. Like it's very outsized. And when they both like split up. up and then it was like big drama that she went to unwell remember i was like very interested to see if either of their individual projects were going to take off in a meaningful way because their shared project like wasn't even that big it was just so crazy how big the drama came i think it was like the zach ryan of it all and now she does a podcast and it was like all the people who were like gassing up grace weren't really doing it for grace i think they were doing it because they hated briana

because grace's podcast i don't even know if they still do it it wasn't like it wasn't like she had all these fans it was like they really let the internet come between them like in a real way yeah and i think they could have gotten past it but then what brianna said on this podcast it's like you know they're home friends they have like a whole group of friends outside of internet people we don't know like college friends high school friends hometown friends who like are getting married like they still see each other out a lot and she says grace she literally said grace is evil she said like grace won't talk to me she's telling everyone like she hates me when like briana has said like maybe there was room to reconcile but grace says like no. And now Brianna says no. Yeah, no, now like they're done. We will never be friends again.

And I think there was a period where like interviewers would like ask Brianna. Brianna does a lot of interviews. Grace doesn't. They were asking Brianna like, oh, your friendship breakup. And she was like very political about it. You know, leaving room being like, I just want what's best for great. It's like, we're not talking right now, but like we're good. Yeah. And now it's like I hate her. She hates me. She's evil. She thinks I'm evil. Like it's bad. The gloves are off. And I guess that was the catalysts or that was like them having, you know, interactions at like, you know, engagement parties, life things of your hometown friends, um, that went really poorly. Yeah.

So that's that on that. Like it was kind of interesting though, like from a podcast perspective to see like a, people weren't comparing it at the time to call her daddy, right? Like the breaking up. But call her daddy at that time. Was doing like a million downloads an episode. It was the biggest show in the world. It was on top of the charts on top of Joe Rogan.

Like it was the biggest show in the world. So it was... When the biggest show in the world breaks up, it's the biggest story in the world. This was just like two girls... Yeah, but it became so big and it was like... And if you even listen to the podcast?

Right. And I think that like the answer was no because both... I don't even have a podcast anymore and I don't even know if Grace does. Yeah, they ended BFFs, but I think... Right.

But I think... Right. Solo? Yeah. I think in some capacity there is still plan Brie. Well, the drama was bigger than the show. Grace doesn't still have a podcast? She might.

Like, I don't know. The point is that you don't know. Correct. Like, I know she does stand up, but, like, based on how people were just, like, gassing her up and, like, hating on Brianna, you would think that, like, she's out, you know. Yeah. Well, a different lesson that I think you have to, like, learn the hard way.

And it's not something that's so clear. It's, like, to not let the Internet, like, affect your real life. Yeah. That's something that, like, more years of experience might have, they might have known that. So I feel like maybe Brianna knew it. Like, but Grace was so new. And that's why I really can't fault her. And when everyone's, like, telling you,

You're so great and Brianna's mean to you. And she's such a bad friend. Like it's hard to not hear that. And so maybe she believed it. And that's why she didn't stand up for Bree because she believed it. And Brianna now talks about it very openly. And I actually would love to hear Grace's POV.

Like. Have we not? She went on Theo Vaughn. Did she? But I think that was when they were still in the period of like, we're not friends. We might not ever be. But like we're good.

It was like very civilized. And now something I think happened. We're like they hate each other. With home friends and like. Yeah. people against each other. Yeah. That's such a weird dynamic and it's really sad to me.

I remember when it happened, I felt very sad about it. I don't feel as sad now because now they're just... Grown women. Yeah, but they just felt like, like, girls who they came into this world together and they had each other. And, like, really grew up very, very regular. Like, and this was, like, their big break and they could have been huge. It was a devastating story about how, like, the internet is so cruel.

And Zach Bryan. Like, yes, Bree wasn't a good friend and she chose him over grace, but, like, also she was young and impressionable. In an abusive relationship with a rock star. Right. Going through her heart. So like I give her grace for that also. Right.

No, it was like a crazy saga. It was and it still is. Yeah. Now they just like both operate in the internet sphere, which isn't like huge and at their friends' weddings. Correct. The two influencer friends who hate each other.

Honestly, it would have been sadder if one of them was booted from the hometown group. Like that would have been wrong, you know? If then suddenly grace doesn't get invited to anyone's wedding. But it also makes you feel like not one of them is so clearly in the wrong because if they were like their other friends would have taken aside

and been like how could you do that? Correct. That's a good point. So it's just to hurt people, hurting people. Yeah, I'm kind of ready for the gray sit down. Like Brianna's been very open. I saw her on a red carpet also talking about it more. Like she doesn't give a fuck anymore.

I'm telling you something happened. So I'd love to your grace is POV. Yeah. This would be a good show, you know? Like tell me lies. Yes. That's like two small town girls who get into like

influence. Wait, they should shop it. Maybe that's the project that brings them back together. No. And then Brianna like further apart because it's like more fame. Oh yeah. No, and it's also like, are we telling your version or mine? Like Ashley Tisdill or? Yeah. But the concept and then like one of them started dating like John Mayer, you know, like yeah. I love that. And then it comes between them and the show and tell me lies people should do it. It's like a combination of like tell me lies. Nobody wants it. I was going to say that. I want to say like Anna Delvey because that just started as a story that got picked up just a free idea i don't have the time to do it because i have a lot going on but i would watch it we have the time to watch it not to make it yeah and support it and

if you guys like want to bounce any ideas off me like i'm around but beyond that i can't participate free idea free idea don't call me seriously don't call me and that goes for everyone i will never pick up your call except me obviously oh no you FaceTime is fine. Yeah, family members. Yeah, yeah, yeah. FaceTime is good. Other people, like, seriously, do not call me. And I feel like I'm getting more calls than ever. It's insane. Are you ready for our next story? If it's our next story that's brought to you by the container store, does your home or schedule feel a little chaotic lately? We'll head to the container store where they can help. They don't just sell containers, but they do sell containers.

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you love a good scent, this is your sign. Shop Goldbond's new scented hand creams now on Amazon. And as always, use as directed. Thank you, Turd is directed. I'm a director, much like Sean McNamara. Oh, if only could have a career, a story this is. Fingers crossed. Our next story, some businessman news. Massimo Giannuli steps out with a much younger stylist. Whatever the opposite a businessman of the week is, is Massimo, like. After his breakup from Lori Loughlin. So, Massimo, Giannuli, ex-husband of Lori Lofland, father of Olivia Jade, is spotted with a new lady love. Her name is Hannah Harrison, and she is a stylist.

How old is she? She is younger, unclear, 32. And he is? 62. That's really yucky, especially when you have, like, daughters around that age. Yeah. Um, I literally hate Masimo Gia Nuli. Maybe she's consulting on his new line?

Sure. Um. She doesn't look like she's dressed as a consultant. Let me say. She looks like she's like having morning after coffee with her man. Like imagine fumbling Lori Loflin. Like imagine Lori Loflin like taking the L for you and your family. I just like I think he's disgusting. And like fumbling your family.

Like what a family? She literally looks like she'd be friends with like Olivia. Mm-hmm. I can't lie. Like he's extremely good. looking. You kind of looks like David Beckham, don't you think? Look at that picture.

Yeah, a little bit. Yeah. A little bit. I'm just not here for it. Definitely candidate for weenie of the week. Go home to your family and stop it. Yeah. Go home, Massimo.

Do not come. Yeah. Are you ready for our fifth and final story? The reason. And I just hope Lori Lachlan is like getting dick down by like a bit with Paul Salem. Okay? She needs Paul Salem. She actually went businessman and it went south.

And that's the thing about Masimo, that's so frustrating is like when you choose a businessman, you're supposed to be getting all the things. You're so, like, what he did was so the antithesis of like why we suggest a businessman, both for women in Hollywood. So he's like the failed experiment. He's the exception, not the rule. Of course. So I hope she continues.

Actually, at this rate, though, like she doesn't need like a stable. She just needs to have fun. Yeah, whatever. Let her hair down. Lori wants. Maybe like Jacob Allorty has like a friend. her. That's what she needs.

Her and Olivia would be going on like double dates, okay? Our fifth of final story is Tell Me Lies recap. So the Tell Me Lies creator is diving into the finale and explaining why the show is ending. She said, we couldn't fuck it up. Yeah. So Megan Oppenheimer, who's the creator of Tell Me Lies, gave an interview, explaining why this season is the final season.

And I like how they dropped it, like, the day before. It's not like we were waiting all. It's kind of better. Like that was clearly an intentional choice when I was confused by, but ultimately I like. And it also helped. If we knew that this was the last episode like coming up, we would know that things are almost over. It would almost be a spoiler that like, oh, we're not getting more wedding.

Yep. Like knowing that, it was like, oh, okay, so this wraps this up. Like we were even talking about it how there's going to be a second half of second semester. Right. But no, like second semester is over. Like we learned a lot in knowing that the series was ending. So she said, I went into this season. we're going to wrap things up and give a satisfying ending and then see what happens.

I always felt like three seasons was a perfect number. I always knew that I wanted the final downfall in college to culminate with whatever happens at the end of the wedding weekend. Yeah, the last episode was so crazy. Now I watched the two of them back to back. So some of it, like, it's going to, I don't remember what was in the finale. But spoilers from here on out. So let's talk about the ending.

People are interpreting it one of two ways. And to me there's like literally only one way. But so, you know, she gets in the car with him, like, ugh. And they stop for coffee and he literally abandons her on the side of the road. And the show ends with her laughing. And a lot of people, like myself, I was like, well, of course, like he disappointed you one last time. But at this point, like, you've hung on for so long. He's actually not interested anymore and, like, jokes on you.

Like, of course she got in the car. Now, other people are like, well, no, why she was laughing was because she's finally free. She lets Stephen think that he is choosing to get away. kind of how like Diana did it. Like, that's what the advice Diana gave Lucy is. Like to unravel yourself from Stephen, it has to, you have to make him think it's his idea. Yeah, because like if you reject him,

he's such a narcissistic egomaniac, he will lash out and you will never be free of him because he'll always wanting to be punished you, as opposed to if he thinks it's his idea, then- That's how Diana got out. He moves on from you because he's over you. Now, to give Lucy that much credit,

like you guys have not been watching the show. I mean, there's no way in the world that she thought this through. because you know when Diana gave her that advice, she wasn't even listening. Like, this is a girl who time after time, even as of this morning, had sex with him. Now, maybe you could say that was all a part of her plan. I don't think so. No, she's never had one good plan.

We saw it with the one she was trying to get the tape back. Oh, my God, going to the Yale thing. I was shaking my TV. Girl, get out. Oh, my God. And still, it has not occurred to this girl that she can transfer. She's guilt-stricken with guilt. She's sick.

What she could do for herself is tell everyone the truth and say, I'm transferring before they have a chance to ruin her life. Or get expelled. Yeah. I feel so terrible. Like I'm literally watching this girl come. I'm like, you could just,

all of your problems go away if you transfer. You didn't kill anyone. Nothing that you've done is a crime that will follow you. Outside of Baird just leave. So when she was going to study abroad, I'm like, Alisa, that's better. She needs a break.

But like she needs a break from Bree because she did really hurt her. And you can't have a true friendship with someone. I know she doesn't want to tell Brie because she doesn't want to upset her. but like you can't have a true friendship with someone when you are harboring the secret. So even though it would be selfish to tell Brie, because it's like you were underting yourself, you need a tabular rasa.

So yes, I found the finale a little frustrating just because it felt a little bit rushed. Like I do think it was a good ending and the perfect ending. And for people who want to give Lucy the benefit of the doubt, like there is a version. Sure, think that. That's not what happened. That's not why she was laughing. Also, I think maybe it was. but like then there's a loose end of the fact that she like walked out on her friends.

Bree said like if you leave now, there's no chance for us. This is your last chance to not make a choice that's completely embarrassing. And so even though maybe she got rid of Stephen, like she has nothing too. Right. She doesn't have Bree. She doesn't have her friends because they all think that she's a dormant again. So there were like just a couple of random jumps. It felt a little rushed.

Like we never understood how and why Lucy was dating the bartender at the wedding. Yeah. Like that was such a random thing. Especially because like now she got expelled. She's not going to see him. Of course, she's not going back to that town. Right. And then also like that whole professor intervention.

That was weird. That was so weird. Maybe it was like fueling Bree being in a really bad mental state to make the decision to release the tape. Yeah. Which was a great plot twist. And being in a bad mental state to take Evan back. Like all the disruption in her life. And Evan, and it's like, Evan you would think it's like, Bree and Wrigley are.

you know, having an affair. And it's like, what about Evan? Like, all he's guilty of is, like, loving her. But then they turned him evil, too, by, like, having him try and get inside her head. And the thing is, his plan didn't work. She wasn't destabilized because her mom came drunk. She was destabilized because Wrigley had sex with Pippa. And that's why she went back to Evan.

So, like, he did all this for nothing. Well, Rigley and Pippa, Rigley and Brie ending up together, like, we won. Yes, but I have a couple things to say about that. Like, first of all, the fact that their origin story is just like this photography class, and a kiss. And it musty kiss. I agree. And then they're holding on to that for years.

For years. When they finally get back together, it just doesn't feel like enough of like an anchor of like a great forbidden love. However, if things had worked out for them and like they were able to let the dust settle and then start dating a few months later, I think all the, you know, the shock from like Pippa and Evan, like all of that would have clouded their potential to have a relationship. They really couldn't have embarked on a relationship. In college.

In a timely manner in college. So they had to have this gap. But then when they finally get back together again in Evans' parents' house at the engagement party, like it's another, like we never got like a pargy romantic moment for them. First of all, they have the same hair. Second of all, why does Wrigley look like a mess with that wig? Okay, the wig. Why did they have him look a mess?

The wig. And he should be wearing a wig in college and then be like handsome, clean-shaven Riggly in the future. Agreed. I want, like, he looks like a disaster. And I remember from the first episode, like he was having a hard time at the engagement party and they said it was because it was the anniversary of his brother death, but now we realize it's because the girl that he loves is getting married. He's getting married to someone else.

But like he doesn't seem like he really got it together after college. Does he have a job? No, I know. So it's like that's who Bri ended up with. But she was like looking for that stability that, you know, stable force for, and that's why Evan was so great. Yeah.

But they had to make Evan a villain. So that we don't feel bad that she's cheating on him. Yeah. I just also, a criticism I have of the finale was like they kind of made levity of everything, you know? Like this was like a serious show. Like he low key killed someone. He wasn't abuser.

Like, And why was he invited to the wedding? Yeah, why did Evan... Like, Brie, you can't tell Evan... Even if he stayed friends. Like, Bree, you have no control over who's invited to your wedding. I know she said it was like Evan's parents, but like you're inviting him and Lucy to your wedding.

And like, why did they need to go through all that for Lucy to be free? Like, was she not free when they broke up? And she got kicked out of college? And he was going to law school? Yeah, and he sort of had the last laugh. Like, she was completely destroyed. Best part of the show when they were like, who would send?

Yale admissions about and then they cut to Wrigley walking down because I was like who? Did Pippa? It made like just girls in general look so stupid because it's like Lucy, Diana and Pippa are like racking their brains of how do we get back at Stephen? How do we make him suffer? They literally go to Wrigley and in two seconds. He fixes it. He like has an appropriate reaction and plan for how to destabilize Stephen.

Like the girls don't look so good. Yeah. Where is the Emmy for some of these actors? Like Lucy at the scene in the Dean's office, like that was a plus act. acting. Bree was like really, has a show ever nominated for an Emmy or anything? It should be. And I think Lucy is really an amazing. And of course, Stephen, because apparently he's like a good quote. I'm sure he is. But Lucy just like is like, she's the ball of anxiety. And then also they kept alluding to like things getting really bad for Lucy's sophomore year.

I was waiting for her to like have some sort of episode. Well, it was an episode. Yeah, she got expelled. She got expelled. She's forgetting things she's having like night. And like whatever happened with Lydia, like so many sort of. of like loose ends. Well, they could have dragged it out so we see Lucy go home and have a mental breakdown and go into it. And why didn't even show us her mom? Her mom was such a big part of the first season. Yeah, go into and probably didn't want to pay her for this season. Right. Go into a mental like stuck an extra in the front seat. Yeah. Like we probably like she probably has to like get help. Does she go to another college? Yeah. It was nice to see that like Diana and Pippa clearly worked

it out. Yeah. And like they were in a new relationship. So they weren't together these six years. Because honestly if they were, they probably would have broken up. Right. So they made their way back to one another. But it was nice when they were like, should we get out of here? Like they're still, and that was like the theme with them. Like they really both pretty much stayed out of it. Like they realized how crazy these people were. Oh, the scene where they both.

No, they didn't. Like, Pippo really took it upon herself to make sure Stephen paid the price. She would not let it go. Everyone knew even's a bad guy, but Pippa was the only one who was like, why are we letting him get away with this? Yeah. Also, the scene where she. she tells, Pippa tells Lucy that she's cheated on Wrigley for the last couple of weeks. And then I was like, oh, I guess we're sharing.

Lucy shares about Evan and Pippa's like, get the fuck out of your disgusting. Like that was really sad. That was really sad. And like I feel Pippa, but like they are both guilty of this same crime. And Lucy's is a little worse. Yes. Like lying to her best friend. But to act like you're so morally superior, you're not like that much greater.

Yeah. Especially because like then you lied, like you made Wrigley feel like shit and lie to him. And then you correct. And then you only corrected it because you didn't want to be as disgusting as Lucy. Right. So you should thank Lucy for showing you how to be the better person. Yeah. Right.

That was sad. But we had to see Lucy like really hit rock bottom. Yeah. I don't know. Like the last scene at the wedding like Stephen's speech like didn't give me that like feeling just because like it was so light. I really thought a chandelier was about to fall on it. Oh no.

I thought when they got into a car it was going to be like the show started with that. car crash with Macy, they'd get into the car. They were obviously drinking. It was three in the morning. And like they get into an accident and either like he leaves Lucy there or Lucy lose him there, like something sort of poetic. No, he just left her on the side of the road. The purse on the floor was hysterical.

That would have been good to have like a car symbol. That's what I thought. No, I really thought he was about to die. I'm like, wait, this is what we said. Yeah. He needs to die. Yeah. And this, I get.

It was just like funny and joking. the whole time it was like not a funny, jockey show. Yeah. Like when Wrigley and Brie looked at each other with... But it's also like six years out, like all that stuff when you're in it feels like... So heavy. Like, feels so serious. And even for Lucy, like what was happening to her was so horrible.

Yep. But again, if she just left the environment and went anywhere else, like it's over. And I think that's also the point is like in the moment, like everything, these feel like the only three people on earth. These three guys and these three girls. And then like it's six years and it's a big world. And it's like, it's like a joke. Yeah.

I mean, it's crazy that Evan and Bree actually got married. Yeah. They're going to have to get an old. Right. But for everyone else, it's like, oh, there's a whole world out there. Right. And, like, as much as all these people have grown up, like, Stephen is able to get under their skin in three seconds.

Yeah. I don't know why Lucy even engaged with, why she was even struggling with Stephen at the party, because it seems like after sophomore year, she never sees them. Like, it's over. So. And how many years later, six years, right, 2009 to 2015? Okay. So why is the whole wedding engagement and the Bachelorette, remember those episodes too?

They were at like a bachelor, the joint bachelor bachelor's party. Oh yeah. Like, taunting her still. Yeah. Like why is she struggling so much? So she has to extracrate herself again. So now when Bria and Wrigley get married, she's going to have to do it again? Yeah, I just want to, like, I aim one day to be as delusional as the people who think that

like she extradited herself on purpose and got left on the side of the road and her plan worked. Like, have you not been watching the show? she could have also not gone to the wedding. If you're really like... Healed. And healed. And I don't think her and Bree are that close. It was like the kind of that friend you have in your bridal party.

If you are inviting this person to your wedding. Like I love you, but I can't come. I can't come. And like that person would, and then Bree would go to Evan and say Stephen can't. Like it's very, that's how actual real friendships would work. But I don't invite someone's like abusive ex to your wedding. I don't think Bree and Lucy, like we're even that close over the six years. I think it's like, you know, you make someone your,

because they were my college roommate. Like I don't think that they were even that close. So like it was. But they were close sophomore year. Yes, no, it was like a special friendship that like had potential to be sisterhood. Yeah. But then it could never be because Lucy was hiding in the secret. And then Bree was hiding a bigger one, I would say.

I would say as well. And the greatest line was like you have the opportunity right now for the first time in your life to make a decision that isn't totally fucking embarrassing. Yeah. Every decision this girl made was. The Yale. I was clenching my butt cheeks. I don't know why I were rooting for her.

like she's also the villain of the show. And I said that last season. No, because she makes so many bad choices. Yeah, she's not the villain. And some of them are. But she's very hard to root for it. But like you have to keep reminding yourself that like she's literally 18 and being abused by like one of the most so like sociopathic people on the planet. So you have to keep reminding yourself of that.

Some of the errors are unforced errors. Yeah. She got away, by the way. But also I don't know what Stephen was going to do. initially made the lie about Chris and said it was her. Yeah, being like a justice warrior. Nobody asked her to do that. But then that also made her relationship with Pippa, like, really complicated.

So, like, part of you also wants to shake Pippa being like, Lucy, like, she's insanely dumb, but she did all of it in earnest, like, to protect you and, like, to fight on your behalf. Yeah. So then, like, like, like, she gets expelled and, like, it's like, Pippa didn't even show up to pack her bags. Yeah. It was an R.A. Crazy. Crazy. Very good show. Very good show. I wonder what it was happening in the book. I know. I'm good.

No, I just am curious, like, sound off in the comments. What was the book about? I guess, like, the big reveal was that, like, Bree was the one who released the tape. Is that happened in the book? I guess... Is there a tape in the book? I could see the book being, like, Lucy experienced this, like, life-shattering thing in college, where her ex-boyfriend, release this, like, revenge tape. And then she goes to the wedding to see him for the first time. And it's all about that. And then she comes to find that, like, it was actually her best friend, Brie. Oh, interesting. Like, that could be a really good plot twist. get there because I feel like the book was about like Just college? Macy. Right. You know, first season was more macy.

Did Brie and Riggly end up together at the end of the book? I don't know. Like let us know. Sound up on the common. Right. Is the three seasons like the book or it was like season one the book and then they like made it more stuff? But even if they added it afterwards they really and I would love to watch the early

episodes again now to see if. Yes, I was thinking that too. If the bread between Bree and Riggley is there. But no, jolly good job. Yeah. Yeah. The wiggley wig is so weird. The wiggly.

The weekly. I like that. Well, that's Tell Me Lies. That's a season wrap on Tell Me Lies. That's a series wrap on Tell Me Lies. And that's our show, you guys. Thank you so much for listening to The Tell Me The Daily. and I'm wondering your show. I'm going to know many different.

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