The Triple Option - The Next CFB Playoff Format, Michigan's Warde Manuel Joins, plus Who Goes #1 in the NFL Draft?

Episode Date: March 5, 2025

The 12-team playoff was a success! Time to blow it up and make a new format. Coach Urban Meyer, Mark Ingram II, and Rob Stone look back at the 12-team College Football Playoff and what they enjoyed and what should be fixed ahead of the 2025-26 season. They then debated if the proposed 14-team playoff, giving the Big Ten and the SEC four guaranteed spots EACH is good for the sport or another money grab. "The Game" wrote another chapter, but this time a friendly one as Michigan Athletic Director and 2024 College Football Playoff Chairman Warde Manuel join Rob and Coach to talk about the historic rivalry between the Wolverines and Ohio State. He also took us inside the CFP decision making room, the discussions that led to this past year's bracket, as well as the changes he would make in the second go around. Warde also shines some light on the future of the Playoff, the Big Ten's stake in it, and how the current proposal is good for the whole sport. The NFL Combine was this past weekend, Mark Ingram goes down memory lane to his time in Indy and the guys decide who they would take with the #1 pick this season. Hint: he already won the most prestigious award in all of College Football. New episodes of The Triple Option drop every Wednesday. Make sure you’re subscribed on YouTube and following on all podcast platforms. Also make sure you’re locked in on social @3XOptionShow on all platforms for highlight moments, bonus content, and to engage with the guys and the TO community. (https://tripleoptionshow.com) The Triple Option is presented by Wendy’s. "Go to Wendy's® and taste the difference in a hamburger. - https://m-wendys.app.link/hamburger25 A big thank you to the rest of our sponsors: BetMGM Use bonus code OPTION or go to https://betmgm.com/OPTION and get up to a $1500 First Bet Offer on your first wager with BetMGM! First Bet Offer for new customers only. Subject to eligibility requirements. Bonus bets are non-withdrawable. In partnership with Kansas Crossing Casino and Hotel. See BetMGM.com for Terms. US promotional offers not available in New York, Nevada, Ontario, or Puerto Rico. Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER (Available in the US) Call 877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY) Call 1-800-327-5050 (MA) 21+ only. Please Gamble Responsibly. Call 1-800-NEXT-STEP (AZ), 1-800-BETS-OFF (IA),1-800-981-0023 (PR). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I did great in the meeting room. When they handed me the ball, had me going over the bags and changing directions, football stuff, I did. Now, if you wanted someone to look good in underwear, that's where you come to me and coach. I'm coach. And run fast and jump high and not play football really well.

That wasn't me. He hasn't heard the music in a while. He's got a little extra pump, a little extra kick to it. Back from Safari, everybody. Welcome to the Triple Option and welcome back Mark Ingram, baby. How was it? It was fantastic, man. Just had South Africa was amazing. Was able to explore Cape Town.

We did the wine lands. We did the safari, went to Johannesburg, did the safari. Then we laid low and went to the Seychelles after that. Got the little island living. So me and the wife, two weeks. The parents held it down. They held the fort down with all the kids. Right.

I thought we were gonna see like a lion's head or an elephant head behind you on the- Some pelts behind him right now. I am a hunter, man. I do like to hunt but those animals there, you know, they're prestigious. They're they're my hunting bag. They're gorgeous. They're beautiful. You see the leper. You see the cheetah. You like dang, it might look good on suffer, but no, no, we're gonna let them live. We're gonna let

them live. Mark, you see Mark. You see any cheetahs hanging out in trees. That's the that's the leopard. The leopard, whatever. Yeah, the leopard will be up in the trees. I didn't see him in the tree. So we saw the big, so you know they got the big five animals. So they got the big five animals. You know what the big five are, Coach? Yeah, I've seen them.

OK, so you know the big five. So let's go through it again. Elephant, rhino, water buffalo, tiger, lion. Tiger is in Africa. No tigers. No. Lion. There's three. What did I. Tiger isn't in Africa. No tigers. No. Lion. There's three. What did I say? I said hippo. I said rhino.

No, hippo's not one. Hippo's not one. Giraffe. No, giraffe's not one. Oh jeez. How about you just correct us? All right, elephant. All right. Lion.

Yep. Leopard. Yep. Oh, really? Water buffalo. The buffalo. Yeah. And then the rhino. Wow. So we saw four out of the five on the first drive, the first night, and then we were like,

we need to find the leopard. We didn't find a leopard at all until the last drive, the last morning. Do you see a kill? No, we didn't see any kills, man. Did you see a migration? We saw about 200 buffalos crossing the street. I guess that's classifies as a migration. They say there's times there's a hundred thousand animals going on a migration across.

Yeah. Yeah. So that great migration that's like in Tanzania, I think, but we were in, you know, Johannesburg, three hours away from Johannesburg, but it was a tremendous trip, man. Highly recommended. Me and my wife had a great time. We were friends. Oh, that is basically like family. And we had a great trip, man. And I'll shout out to my parents, man. They held down the fort with the five kids. We came back, everything in the house was still intact. No broken bones. Everybody didn't throw any parties. No grandparent parties. Those five kids, those five kids ain't normal now. You know, they can party. They can get a party because they held down the fort for us for two weeks.

So I got an all inclusive expenses paid party for them if they want it. Heck yeah. All right. So Safari talk is done. Welcome to the triple option presented by Wendy's go to Wendy's and taste the difference in a hamburger as always. Thanks for joining us. Thanks for listening, watching wherever you are working out, taking a walk,

driving to work, whatever it is. We appreciate you. You could find us on Apple podcasts, Spotify, wherever you are working out taking a walk, driving to work, whatever it is, we appreciate you. You can find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, wherever you get your podcast. We are on social media 3x option show new episodes every Wednesday. Alright, so this week, we're done with the Safari Safari survivor talk, right? No more Safari talk for now, at least. So we got Mark back, which is a bonus. We're going to talk about the NFL combine, we We are gonna ask these guys who they would take

with their number one overall pick. Plus, what a great guest we have this week. Ward Manuel, the Michigan Athletic Director, also the 2024 College Football Playoff Committee Chairman is gonna join us in the B block. So let's start with the wildly successful first ever 12 team playoffs. Remember a week ago executives they got together to discuss changes or potential changes come 2025. Also a

proposal from the Big Ten and the SEC to alter playoff seeding and buys. All right, so I think let's just start looking back to last season coach, I'll start with you. I think we all realize it was wildly successful. We're all in favor of it. I think most of us are in favor of expansion. What were the issues for you with the first year of the 12 team college football playoffs?

Real quick, as a former coach, I think it was fantastic. I wish it was there when we were, Mark and I were involved in the game. I mean, our 2015 Buckeye team, if we would have gotten in that darn thing. So number one is great success. Obviously the seeding is that, I don't want to belabor it,

but when you start seeing boys in Arizona State ahead of some, the great year, great season, but they did not earn that by. Ahead of Ohio State. Yeah, I don't see that. I've already heard that's not gonna happen again. I'm really intrigued. This is the entire, when you say the word college football,

you don't say academics anymore, you don't say university, you don't say rivalries, you don't say networking after you're done. Those are all topics of old. The new topic is money, money, money. And I think there's gonna be some, I've heard, you know, the SEC and the big 10 carry the big stick, which I know will hit soon.

But that's gonna be the topic, you know. God bless the playoff. And everything was great about it. The seeding was not. And I'm sure that's gonna be changed. Yeah, I mean, not to beat a dead horse, but I think the main thing, I think it was great for college football, the expansion.

I mean, we got to see Boise, we got to see Notre Dame, we got to see Arizona State, we got to see SMU. So I think the expansion was extremely successful, and I think it was something that everyone enjoyed. But the seating, you know, the seating has to be fixed and I think that's the main thing is I don't want to be dead horse. You mentioned already coach them. So the seating definitely has to be I think that will be addressed. It feels obvious It feels like an easy fix as well just to reflect back four Big Ten programs Made the 12 team playoffs three from the SEC, two from the ACC, again, the

Big Beef, Arizona State, and Boise State as a conference champion, getting one of those buys. And again, what bugs me as a college football fan is it does slightly devalue winning your conference championship. And I think that was the original intention is to reward these programs, these four conference champions and, and give them a buy and there's validity to that. But when the differential is so great where a Boise state in Arizona state is sitting there, technically in your top four, yes, it pushes the Ohio States back, but it also changes the outlook for your Georges and your

Oregon's who all of a sudden in their first games after by are seeing the Ohio States, right of the world. That's the part that didn't feel great. But guess what? It's a college football playoff. You have to earn your way through the playoffs to be the national champion. You're going to find a heavy hitter eventually. But I think if you're the Georgia's, if you're the Oregon's, you're saying that's fine, but maybe push it back to the final four. One other thing that was kind of missing coach was the Pop Tarts Bowl experience, if you will, right? It's Jesus

Bowl, right? The cheese. There's no crazy mascots. There's no fun. There's no laughing. There's no side visits. It is business and we get it because this is a big business and there may be no bigger business in college football than the college football playoffs. But a little bit of college football is certainly lost with this pivot towards all focus on the playoffs. Yeah, I want to hit Mark with that in a minute, but that was a great,

my first bowl game as a head coach was Liberty Bowl and it was phenomenal. Phenomenal for our players, families. I mean, it was an experience in Memphis, Tennessee. And that, you got to remember though, that's still there to a degree at the smaller bowls. But you really felt when you went to an orange, a rose, a sugar, a fiesta, when your team went there,

I mean you're talking about ridiculous hospitality, great experience, not so much for a coach because we're all working all the damn time, but I know the players and the families, we tried to make that as positive as you could. great experience, not so much for a coach, because we're all working all the damn time, but I know the players and the families, we tried to make that as positive as you could. And I talked to a couple of the coaches, and they said it's just pure business.

It's no different, obviously, the intensity and preparation, but you're flying in a couple days for the game, and you're playing the game, and you go back home and prepare for the next one. So it is business, and I'm'm curious about Mark because once again coaches, remember coaches on the bowl experience, you know my bowl experience was you're up at six, your family goes to some event, you're watching practice, you're making the tip sheets, you come home and your wife and kids play, we had a great time, I was like wonderful.

Right, wonderful. Yeah, we're glad you had a good time. Here's our seven on seven script and inside run for the next day. So Mark, what's your thoughts on the bowl experience? Coach, the bowl experience was amazing. I mean, you said it, when you go to a Rose Bowl, you're playing in a national championship, or you go into one of those January day bowl games, like those experiences are great. The gifts you get, the events that you go to, it's like, Those experiences are great. The gifts you get, the events that you go to. It's like, you know, Alabama versus Michigan State.

You got to do a little competition like Guitar Hero and stuff. The families are all there. It's kind of fun. But at the end of the day, this is a new landscape for college football. It is all business. These players are getting paid now. So why are we worried about the bowl experience? Because it is business. We're paying you money to perform at a high level. And listen to this, Coach.

When you go to the playoffs, under the playoffs current performance-based distribution model, each team earns $4 million for qualifying in the CFP. So we're paying you, and we need you to get to this college football playoff. And then you get another 4 million for playing in the quarterfinals. And another 6 million for playing in the, in the quarterfinals

and another 6 million for advancing to the semifinals and 6 million more for competing in the title game. So this is through and through a business. We're paying our players so you don't get a bowl experience. You don't get free gifts because I'm paying you. You can go buy your own gifts. So I got a great story. So, so I just learned this in my evolution as a coach. So, you know,

when you get the bull bid, that's right around finals time. And I mean, you go to a big bowl game, your gifts are ridiculous. Yes, some great gifts for the players and coaches. And so I finally figured it out that I would have someone parade in and whether it be a leather jacket, whether it be, you know, a TV, whether it be it be a chair You know they there's some cool gifts custom headphones Yeah, I had great headphones, and I'd have mark and Rob I'd have the player like one of the players or someone walk around with it their players start clapping I said now Here's a cool thing You 17 guys that are under 2.0 right now. You don't get one

You're not getting one now So I if you want that, look right there, study really hard for finals and then I would pull out the ring because when you win a championship, you know, Big Ten or SEC, you get a ring and I'd bring out the ring and say once again, you four guys, you're not getting it. So that was a great... Dangle that carrot coach, dangle that carrot. But at first, you know, first start everybody gets gets it. And I said, wait a minute, I need a little extra motivation here.

So I call the families and say, oh, by the way, the old boy is not getting that leather coat. Yeah. Oh, I encourage. Help me encourage your son to get that C plus or be in psychology or whatever. Yeah, that was awesome. No, but I love the ball experience, man. But these coach these these these young athletes are getting paid and deserve at least so. But now you talk about it's a business, it truly is a business because these universities

are getting big, big money. You talk about 10, you talk about 10, 14, probably possibly 20 million you can earn you play from the first round to the championship, 20 million. So this is a business through and through. And so the ball experience is no longer there if you're in the college football playoff because you are getting paid. You could buy your family a ticket to go to the game. You don't got to get the reimbursement plan. You can buy that leather coat.

You can buy the headphones. You can buy the gifts. And that's what it is now. It's a business through and through. But the ball experience was definitely special. I'm glad I got to enjoy it. So the 2025- I would much rather get paid though, I think, Stone. Yes, exactly. Don't bury the lead, Mark. I'd much rather get that money.

So the 2025 format, it's going to stay right there to dozen teams. There could be some minor changes. New contract begins in 2026. There was a memorandum agreed to last spring, which basically gives the SEC and Big Ten sole discretion on the future of the college football format that starts in 2026. So if you thought the SEC and Big 10 already had big muscles, guess what? They are banging away at the gym and they are ready to flex those muscles in the college football playoffs. One of the proposals going forward at the Big 10 and the SEC are said to be pushing is a 14-team playoff. I think we're all in favor of some form of expansion, whether it's 14 or 16. So conversation out there,

the Big 10, the SEC would like a 14-team playoff. The format would be, and remember these numbers, four, four, two, two, one, one. There'll be a quiz on it. 44, 22, 11. Sounds like a great play. The fours, four automatic bids to the Big 10 and the SEC, two automatic bids to the Big 12 and the ACC, one to the highest

ranking, you know, group of six program and then one out there if Notre Dame should finish high enough in the rankings, meaning Notre Dame is somewhere inside that top 14 or maybe the numbers get pushed around a little bit as well. So that is our fresh moves of the week brought to you by Wendy's. Go to Wendy's and taste the difference in a hamburger. So the agreement grants the league's decision-making powers over the format but directs them to have quote meaningful consultation and to collect quote input from the other conferences before making their decisions. So you look, let's just talk 442211. Does that make sense to you, Mark Ingram, right now looking at it from the eyes of the Big Ten and the SEC and then maybe through the eyes of everybody else?

It makes a lot of sense to me, especially with the expansion of the Big Ten and the expansion of everybody else. It makes a lot of sense to me, especially with the expansion of the Big Ten and the expansion of the SEC. I think that is very justifiable. And you talk about the four you had four from the Big Ten already this year. You talk about three, you had three from the SEC and people were advocating for four or five,

maybe even 16 from the SEC that could have possibly been in it between Alabama, Ole Miss and South Carolina. So the four or five, maybe even six teams from the SEC that could have possibly been in it between Alabama, Ole Miss, and South Carolina. So the four or four is justifiable. You get two from the ACC, which you got this year. I didn't think they were supposed to get two in, but they did. They got two in. Then you had one from the Big 12, and I think they deserve two if you talk about a 14-team expansion. And then you get one from the highest ranked group of six and then you got one at large bid, which is designed to go to Notre Dame, but it could be a fifth SEC, it could be a fifth Big 10, it could be a third ACC or a third Big 12. So that last at

large bid, which is designed for Notre Dame if they handle their business. But I like the format. There's a 14 team playoff in the NFL. Why not go to the 14 team playoff for the college? I think you have a 2018 playoff in the division too, which is an exciting playoff too. So I'm all for the expansion. I think the 4-4-2-2-1-1 is a great kind of method, a great kind of outlook on this playoff and a great kind of, you know, outlook on this

playoff and we'll see how it goes. But I think that's fair. And I think, especially with the expansion of the big 10 and the SEC, when you add an Oregon, you're adding Washington, you're adding Texas, you're adding Oklahoma, I think those expansions justify four teams for the SEC and the big twin. I agree, Mark. And I'd made a phone call when I saw this and it is gonna happen. That's not this is not maybe

Remember in the fall that you had the Commissioner of the SEC and the Commission of the Big Ten get together Those are the big dogs and it's really unchallengeable So and what drives the big dogs remember college football now is synonymous with money It's it is money and when you just start throwing you get four million to qualify for for the semi-final in a quarter. I'm sorry six million for the semi. That the first of all the seating I would not be surprised somehow if they adjust it this year but for sure I can imagine the Commissioner Sankey and Petiti at the Big Ten just said, you know what, we're gonna make some decisions here.

And I know this is pretty bold, but they're probably, it's not really conversation, it's we're gonna demand this. This is we are gonna do this. Yes. We take the ball and go play. Remember now, SEC is ESPN, I know the relationship's there. And they,

you know, they basically own the the playoffs. So I can promise you that there will be four FCC teams in the playoff. Yeah, coach, I promise you there's gonna be some pushback to and deservedly so from pushback was in the ACC, those in the Big 12. Those in the Mountain West. I mean, we're talking two conferences that are holding all the power and I think that's too much power in too small. You're lucky you're giving you two bids. Well, all right we're talking, okay that's all right this is good because I want to hear you Mark because

I'm ready to come back at you. I'm ready, I'm for the little guy right here and I want to see all of college football be welcome. Not just the SEC Big Ten Invitational and they are welcome decide to bring them in. We're not to the same extent. Not to the same extent. We're talking. There are numbers to back our conferences of equal value, though. The ACC was a trash conference this year. Right now they might not be of equal value. But who's to say that's not going to change in a year? Listen, you go down to the Big 12 Mark Ingram. I'm going to

tell you right now there is a lot of oil and gas money out there. And there are some big time head haunches. You can go down to Lubbock, you can go down to Fort Worth, you can go to SMU, right? Talk to me stone. I'm talking right now. And you get a couple of those billionaire alums for SMU for, for TCU for Texas Tech. They say, you know what, god dang it. I want to get my team to the college football playoffs and I want to win it. And we saw how much money Ohio state raised and they got themselves a national title.

You're going to tell me there's not some big wigs down there in Texas. We're going to say, let's go. I love my program. Come on. Red Raiders. Come on. Horned frogs. Come on.

Mustangs. We are going to shell out the shekels and that is going to throw off this balance of college football. It can happen. Now, will it happen? Long term? You get two bids to do so. That's the problem though, because they might eat up those two bids and now you're going to look and say they need three, they need four bids. I understand. Schedule Notre Dame, beat them and then get the at-large bid. So we're going to talk schedule right now, right? Because all we've been talking about is teams not scheduling hard team.

Well, you want to at-large, beat Notre Dame. The at-large bid is supposed to go to them. That's the only reason for at-large bid. So I'm with Notre Dame and then go. All right. So I love this because this is what's going to be happening in some random hotel. All you have to do. Oh, really?

Conversation stops when you see the television contract from the SEC versus the ACC and Big 12 and the Mountain West, etc. You got two teams that dominate the two conferences. I get it. For the purity of the game, I agree with you. For the reality, you're Whistlin Dixie, pal. All right. Hey, listen, I agree with you. For the reality, you're whistling Dixie, pal. All right. Hey, listen, I like my Dixie.

You got two conferences. Sometimes there was not four teams in SEC or Big Ten that I would want to see. Sometimes there's not four. Correct. Yes. Sometimes there hasn't been four teams in either conference that I would have one to see. Preach. But with the expansion now, you have Oregon there, you have Washington there, you have Texas now, you have Oklahoma and SEC.

I feel like the four teams are justifiable because there's probably going to be three or four teams. And then the fourth team in those conferences has a great argument over the second team in the ACC or the big 12. Previously, most times, you know, I'm not saying that the Big 12 and ACC can't elevate their level of play that they can't raise the right money and get the right teams and the right players there because they

can because guys are going to these schools to play for money. But I'm saying for for Big 10 for SEC, these are the power they make things just to file or not Make them happy. You gotta remember the lane Remember laying Kiffin sending text messages out etc about what? SEC teams belong and then the SEC kind of did not do well, you know in the playoffs Did not do well in the playoffs and so soderon we keep going it's gonna happen. Or they're just gonna put or there's gonna break off and do a power a power conference

and do Big Ten versus SEC playoff. I don't think that's good for college football. It's not I'm with you. I'm with you. This is fascinating and I think there is a solution here. So again, I'm gonna I'm gonna I the quote unquote little guys out there, which is BS to call the ACC and the Big 12 little guys. But ACC Commissioner Jim Phillips saying that the ACC has not cemented a position on a

format that quote, there needs to be fairness agreed and access to the championship. It needs to be a true championship, not artificial, and not an invitational. Agreed. Big 12 commissioner, and we're a big fan of Brett Yormark, says his conference has been exploring, quote, predictive analysis, and, quote, I'll be armed with data. You bet he is, because he's fighting for his conference.

Here's a fascinating number breakdown. This is a great article over on Yahoo Sports. They go back to the 2014 playoff, right? And if you look at the top 14 teams just before conference championship weekend, OK? So starting the 2014s, the SEC has averaged about 4.7 teams per year inside that top 14, which certainly validates their point of saying, we deserve four automatic births, correct?

Same time, the Big 10, they've averaged 4.6. You can even make a conversation here that the SEC and the Big 10 are hurting themselves, right? And you're taking those averages from 2014. Because almost five teams. Correct. The Big 12, since since the 2014 just before conference championship, they have averaged 2.1 teams inside the top 14. Right behind them, the ACC 1.8,

Notre Dame 0.45, the group of 5.27. So if you're the SEC in the Big 10 and you're doing that number crunch and you're going to show your data to Big 12 Commissioner Brett Yoramark, you're the SEC in the Big Ten and you're doing that number crunch and you're going to show your data to Big 12 Commissioner Brett Yormark, you're going to say, here's the numbers and they match. They match what we're pitching, right coach? Yeah. And then it's the numbers, I don't know what you're looking at, but it was Oklahoma, Texas were probably the Big 12 teams.

And then you had Oregon, USC, UCLA, Washington. So they pivoted with those in mind, right? They did? Yeah, yeah. Okay, so I think it's first of all. I think the numbers are fair, honestly. It's done, it's done. The numbers are fair to me.

You don't get three teams in. So, the numbers are fair. BYU was gonna get in as the third team out of the, you know what I mean, or? I know, I'm a romantic, I'm a romantic, and I like know I'm a romantic. I'm a romantic and I like the little guy. And I guess I too, but that's what bugs me. So conference isn't created equal at the same time. Correct.

Correct. Correct. So there's going to be, there's going to be years where the balance is going to be off and it may not be the heavy hitters of the Big 10 and the SEC in charge. So to that point, I think there needs to be built in a little flexibility, right? There needs to be the the accordion, right? So give me your proposal. So my proposal instead of and again, if you're the big 10 in the SEC, you have the power, right? And the art of deal

making, if you will, right is go big, go bold. But know that if you don't get your quote unquote, foreign for you're going to be okay with three and three. So just hear me out. If it goes 332211 plus two, right? So the big 10 and the SEC, they get their three automatic bids each that takes you to six, the big 12 and the ACC remain at two, right? So that's four bids right there. We'll still give one to the the Notre Dames out there, we'll give one to the group of six, right? So there's two. So

that's at 12. That gives us plus two, plus two picks. To me, that plus two, all that is, is the best two teams in the nation that don't fall under in that gap. Can it go to the SEC in the Big Ten? Hell yeah, it can. in that gap. Can it go to the SEC in the Big Ten? Hell yeah it can. Can two of them go to the SEC? Absolutely. And that's on the committee? I have. You put that on the committee.

Who votes on that? Is it ranking? Is it ranking? Or is it eye test? Top 14 teams. Nope. Okay. Now we can figure that one out as well because it has to be the... Because I like this model. Yeah,. I like to I like this model. And there has to be you know, everybody has to understand how we're going to characterize the top 14 teams. If it continues to be the college football, you know, playoff rankings that came out, which personally I'm okay with. I'll live with that. And

again, the SEC and the Big Ten are automatically going to get three teams in. And then there's two wild card spots for lack of a better term. I know you've beat that up enough stone. So here, I actually like that. Thank you. But I would say you need analytics on scheduling that. Yes, you can't getting voted in over Alabama or you have the same same type of issue again with those last two spots. Yeah, it's a tough one. It's a tough one.

You're not going to make everybody happy. We realize that. I know we're going to hit scheduling at some point. I am really fearful that we have finished. We will never or very rarely see marquee non-conference matchups. You're going to see the 50 to 7 preseason games for the first three weeks of the season. Yeah. And Big New will have to be at one of them, unfortunately.

So, so yeah, I think that's great. Big New, we got Texas, Ohio State this year. Did you come up with that yourself, Rob? I did. Did you come up with it? It really wasn't that hard. That's good though. He did his thing, right? Coach? It wasn't that hard. I just subtracted and pushed some numbers around. That's all fuzzy

math these days. That's good stuff there. You know what, you know what I'm going to do. I'm going to pitch my three, three, two, two, one, one plus two model to our next guest coming up here on the triple option. He ain't hearing that. He ain't hearing that. Michigan man joins us. The Wolverine athletic director of the 2024 college football playoff chairman the great Ward manual joins the triple option presented by Wendy's next and we got questions for you Ward. I can tell you right now Ward ain't trying to hear that. Welcome back to the Triple Option presented by Wendy's Rob Stone, former Ohio State head coach, Irvin Meyer with you. And my goodness, look at the background we're working with for this next guest, Ward Manuel, the longtime athletic director at the University of Michigan. Last year was the college football playoff committee chair and Ward joins us right now. And I can't quite make out who's over

your right shoulder. help me figure that one out more. That's an easy one. This is a you know, a my home office set up my office in in our building, we had the power go out. So we were told to work from home this afternoon. And so I happen to be here and it's I know how much Urban and I have talked about Bo and Woody and the great respect we both have for those two coaches. And I know Urban has met Bo and talked to Bo before we talked about that.

So I didn't feel like it would be too bad if I took this podcast from here. So great to have you on and we got to actually spend some time together. I think it was the Orange Bowl might have been the national championship game and had lunch and hung out and I remember walked away and someone said man you just hung out the Wolverine athletic dress. Yeah he's actually a hell of a guy man. So I met I met Woody Hayes in 1987, right before he passed away. Spent some time with him. I, uh, worked for Earl Bruce for a long time. And then, uh, I told you the story, but both Schembechler invited me up right

when I became a first time head coach of Bowling Green and I read every fricking book on both Schembechler that was my generation, how was it to play for one of the greatest that ever do it? Well, it, uh, he wasn't easy. I could tell you that he, he, uh, he, he taught me, uh, the, the meaning of really effort, hard work, determination, uh, teamwork, uh, commitment, uh, many of those big words. But the most important thing he taught Urban was, people will, they'll do a lot for you, but they'll do more for you if they know you care about them.

And what we always knew, no matter how mad he got at us, no matter what the tension and the pressure were, we knew that Bo loved us as people first. And so it was easier to take some of the hard coaching that he gave when you knew that it was coming from a point of love and wanting the best, wanting the best out of you. And so I'm sure that a lot of what you have done in your career in the coaching is that you could be hard on players. And I tell my staff, I don't expect you to be easy, my coaches.

I want you to push them because our student athletes come here because they want to be better and be the best. But just make sure they always know that you care about them as people. And, and, uh, that, that was one of the biggest lessons I learned from both. You know, Rob's dying to get into the college football playoff conversation, but I'm trumping him here because we got ward manual on the, on the show here. So the robbery was one sided. Now it's four in a row.

What one or two things, obviously the talent, I mean, there, there's been some that, that national champs team is one of the best teams I've watched. And, but even last year, what one or two things that you've witnessed, cause you've been around this rivalry forever. Yeah. That flipped this thing. I don't know if it's one thing or I mean, you know how that is. I mean, that game, you could throw out the record book.

You could throw out the, you know, where people are and who's, who's supposed to win, um, those games and, um, I don't, I don't know what it was. I don't, you know, I can, you know, obviously I'm gonna give credit to Sharon. I'm gonna give credit to the staff and especially the student athletes. I mean, we, you know, I played in that game. It's hard.

It's a lot of effort. And believe me, we didn't win because Ohio State wasn't giving effort. Everybody was giving effort. But the reality is you had some things, you know, go our way. You know, you had an early pick changed, I think, the tenor of the game. In the second half, you had a couple of missed field goals from

a kicker who was strong all year. That just seemingly it happens, right? And so I think that in just the tenacity of the game and the way our kids fought particularly, I think as we evolved, I think Wink called a great game defensively that may have thrown off the game plan. I mean, you know, as a coach better than I do, I just look at it as in the sense of that battle, it was so close that little things made a difference. And both teams were, that was a hard hitting game

as you saw, the effort was there, the everybody was engaged in it. And I think you have, as it comes in all these games, little things that make a difference. Cause normally they're not blowouts. I mean, there've been blowouts on both sides over the hundred, almost hundred years, a hundred years of us playing.

But, you know, it's rare that that's the case in these games. And again, no matter what the record. And so, like I said, I give a lot of credit to the kids and the fighting of the teams, both sides fighting for a win. And ultimately, the way it came out is we won the game and obviously very happy to do it. But it just not, it wasn't like we had some secret, you know, things that we did.

You know, it's just in, in y'all didn't, Ohio State didn't do any secret things either. I mean, everybody just came in this is just a scrap match from the very start. And so that there was, there was nothing, I think and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, do it. And yeah, stopping the run, I mean, we, as you know, the two anchors of our defense are right there in the middle. Two young, unbelievable young men, but also just extremely talented defensive linemen. And, Ohio State Center was out, you had moved something,

they had moved some people around because of injury. And those kids had stayed injury free and played unbelievably well. So maybe those two are the key, the running game. And then as you said, stopping the run. In Ohio State showed they could run the ball. We just said that in that particular game had a great, great effort defensively on stopping the run. You know, I'm gonna hand it to Rob here in a minute, but I have to say this.

So it's interesting. He said, Wink Martindale, the D coordinator at, at the Wolverines called really a straight game. A lot like Vic Fangio did against Kansas City chiefs in the Superbowl. People related the two where they they forced Ohio State, you know, when you play that too high structure to run the ball and they ran right into the meat of that defense. A lot like the Chiefs and Eagle.

I mean, it was unbelievable. That's a good point. You know what? The heck with Rob. Let's just talk ball here for a while. Hey, I'm still getting paid the same. Doesn't matter. Well, hold on. Let me add one more little question about Michigan and Ohio state in this new age

of the college football playoffs and the Ohio state athletic director made a subtle comment after the game last year. Does Ohio state Michigan still matter to the degree that it has and did for you too, with the college football playoffs being the ultimate goal lurking in the background. Absolutely. I didn't hear the comment, but it is nothing. I like Ross. He's, he's been a friend for a long time, uh, and remains a friend, but, uh, this

game means, means everything to both institutions and I'll speak on behalf of Michigan. I mean, this is, this is the game for a reason. It's called the game for a reason. And that's not going to change with the college football playoff. It didn't change with the BCS. It didn't change with the, the playoff format of four games. It is not going to change with 12.

And if it goes to 118, it won't change is the game for a reason. Yeah, you don't need to go there. I know where you stand already on that one, Irvin. You're good. I just like to hear it from the Michigan side. I like to hear the Bays and Bays and blue chime in on that. Alright, so let's talk about the college football playoffs ward. Last season was the first edition of the 12 teams you were the chairman for it. When you reflected back with the rest of the committee and reassessed how

everything went, what were the big success points for you guys in your committee? Well, I think one, you know, the process that we followed this year was the same process that has been followed, uh, for the years, you know, before us, we selected the top, uh, 25, uh, for six weeks. Uh, we went all the way through as we were asked to do by the commissioners through the championship weekend, uh, and selected the top 25. And so I'm very proud of what the committee did. I'm, I'm one of 13.

I'm, I'm the spokesperson for it, but proud of the way that we went about doing our business to rank the teams. And you're always gonna have people who disagree. I mean, that's just the part of the business and part of being on the committee that's ranking the same thing. They do the same thing with basketball committees and any other committees. There's always second guessing as to why something happened the way it happened. So I'm very proud of that very, very proud of the way the 12 game play 12 team playoff play played itself out.

I mean, it's, you know, you can talk about upsets and who lost and who won. But there was a lot of engagement towards the end of the year, in my opinion, more engagement, because there were more teams involved. Even if you go all the way to the ACC championship game, where Clemson was in the game, where they wouldn't have even been a part of the conversation, had it not been for the way the playoff was organized, where the top five champions get into the playoff. where the top five champions get into the playoff. So for me, it was very much a great result

for the first 12 team playoff because of that, because of the amount of engagement in games. You think about the SMU on the other side of that, you think about the pack, I mean the big 12 championship game and what that meant. Those are things that I think add a lot of value to the importance of college football towards the end, because the year prior it was probably what? Six, seven, maybe eight teams that were being discussed.

Now you have all the way up to 16, 17 teams being discussed. Those things are, I think the value of, uh, of bringing us this championship, uh, in increasing the numbers. And so I thought that was, that was a good aspect of the change. I think the other great thing is the fans want to see the great players and it's heartbreaking at the end of the year when they don't play, they all played. I mean, it was so much fun to watch. And so, so the look test is something that you hear quite often.

And one of my concerns is, and I shared this is that I don't know how you do it. You know, you're on that committee and the analytics or that, how do you say, how do you reward a team that plays a, a difficult schedule and how do you punish one that doesn't, you know, I, I hope, I hope we don't see the, I hope we don't see the disappearance of the Ohio state Texas, the Wolverines, Alabama, the, the non-conference that is so good for everything, but it's not good for that team until they get rewarded. So I'm interested on your thoughts on that.

First of all, I don't, I don't agree with some of my colleagues who think, that playing a tough non-conference opponent is the right way to go, that you're better off. I think the committee values those games, Urban. I mean, there's no doubt about that. We understand that there's no doubt about that we understand when teams play tough opponents, uh, and, and they have a loss. Um, if you look at it, uh, you know, Alabama was the highest ranked three loss team because they had a very tough schedule and they won some, some tough games, uh, but they were, I think 11th at the, in the last ranking because they also had some bad losses. And so there was a balance there.

Could we people often look at Indiana and say, well, they didn't play anybody. They didn't play a tough non-conference. They didn't really play a tough conference schedule. Well, they didn't select their conference schedule. And there were some other teams in other leagues that were also had a quote unquote easier path in their conference from the SEC, from the big 12, from the ACC. And so it's hard because of the increase in the number of teams in these conferences, you're not getting always getting top teams either playing each other or playing other teams

that are playing well in that particular year. And so that is, I think, Urban, the thing that really sort of complicates the ability to have like resumes in front of you when you're judging a team that plays a light schedule and wins, and wins either in a big way or just wins, in a team that plays a tougher schedule,

it may have some losses to tougher teams. I think in the discussion, in the discourse that goes on in the room, we actually evaluate that and talk through those things about how we see a team, regardless of whether they lost to a tough opponent, are they still one of the top 10, top 15, top 25 teams in the country? Not just looking at, well, they lost.

So we're going to kick them to the side. I have to ask this one question because I get it all the time. Does the committee ask the simple question,U Boise, you know, if, cause I was in Utah, so sometimes I fight for that underdog, but it's also there's the reality you stick their butt in the big 10 conference or the sec where it's week after week after week. I've just, how does a committee come to grips with that when you have that conversation? It's hard.

It's hard to do because it's not gonna happen. And so you really, as a chair, I'm trying to keep hypothetical situations out of the conversation. And I say that and it's no slight to teams, but, and I won't even name teams this year. I'll leave it up to you guys to name. There's certain teams that lost this year

to opponents that you would say, 100%. If that team plays that team, that bigger team, that stronger team, that stronger brand is gonna win. 100%, I guarantee it. It's like Charles Barkley, I guarantee that you're gonna have a win. And the problem is, we see it over and over annually. Each year, we see teams who should beat other teams

that on paper, on the ESPN it has what 95% certainty a team's gonna win. You never see a hundred because people know anybody can be upset at any day of the year and so it's hard you know people want to go that way outside of the committee room. But all we could do is judge the resumes we see in front of us and judge people by whom they play. We can't say what would happen if Michigan had the same schedule as Indiana or Indiana had the same schedule as Penn State. We can't go to those places because that's not what exists in front of us.

And so whether it's a Boise or Utah compared to Alabama or Michigan, you can't, you know, reverse it in play them and then say, hypothetically in our mind, how would that play out? Right. The main criticisms out there were in regards to the seating. How would you change the seating going forward? If, if you were asked and, uh, does it actually need to be changed? Or should we still be honoring these conference champions

and giving them that by? Well, you know, uh, Greg Sankey and, uh, Tony Petitti came out and said they would like to see the seating changed to seeing the teams ranked and seeded as they are. Uh, and I would a hundred percent agree with that. I think, uh, what threw it off in, in, and I battled that with friends, uh, in, in people who would say, well, you know, uh, the number three team loss, you know, in the playoffs, the number four team loss in the playoffs. And I'm like, no, number 14 was ranked 12.

Number three team was ranked eight. Now one and two lost because they were the same. But you have these shifts and you have these teams that to me, it makes it unfair. When teams are ranked one and two, and because of the way they're seated, that people can come into those positions and back stronger teams up into positions where they're playing you earlier than they normally would. And so I think it puts than they normally would. And so I think it puts those teams

that bounce out of the top four because other teams come in, I think it puts them at a disadvantage because you're playing either tougher teams earlier or as the number one and two team did this year, they're playing a higher ranked team earlier in the playoffs than they would have if they would have just seeded them. So in my opinion you add the five conference champions

and you leave them ranked where they are unless they're outside. So this year everybody would have been ranked one through ten. Arizona State would have moved from 12 to 11 and Clemson would have moved to 12 and then you, then you set the playoff from there. Agree. Any, uh, it's very simple, right? I agree with you, Ward. I think we all do the college football world. I'm just trying to think of all the alphas in that room and all the,

all the investments, uh, you know, experience. Is there a time where it gets heated? Is there a time or, I mean, I the investments, uh, you know, experience, is there a time where it gets heated? Is there a time or, I mean, I, I, I, I just saw, I, times I'd visualize what in the heck is going on in that room? Cause this isn't a game anymore. This is a business, but it's also players lives. It's it's, and then the road to the championship is so, and that was also received some criticism,

which I get it, you know, that not necessarily the conference champion had to, or some of the teams had a much easier road than another. And it's all part of the draw. I mean, tell us about the heat. Is there a heat? Is there intensity or, or share what you can share? Yeah. Well, urban, I remember one time I was before I went on, it must've been the second or third week I was watching.

Uh, the preview, the show as they were announcing and the argument that was going on in the studio, you know, between Reese and Joey and Booger and Greg and their argument over why certain things and which team and who should be ranked and those kinds of things. And one of the questions came up and I said, guys, we did this, we did the same thing for, at the time, you take it, we are there seven, 11 to 12 hours, we're sitting in a room

arguing over the top 25. And yes, it can get heated. Yes, it does get heated that people, nobody stands up, nobody pounds, nobody threatens anybody. It's all professionally done. But people, it gets loud at times because people really, every one of the 13 of the committee members care deeply about wanting to get it right.

And so they're going to express themselves. I, as a chair, would pull people in if they weren't talking just to just to get them to, to give their thoughts about it. And a lot of the times, people would add wouldn't talk because it's already been said. So they felt like, well, what I was gonna say has already been said, but it's good to pull it out of them. But you know, in, in this case, yeah, I mean, there's a lot of that kind of debate that goes on in, and I want the one thing to understand about what happens in that room, urban is that it's always one through 25.

There's no let up because we're, oh, we're out of where we're past 12. Let's just There's no let up because we're, oh, we're out of, we're past 12. Let's just hurry up and get it done. I mean, there's arguments between, you know, 21 to 25 in terms of how people rank because we understand to your point. It's important to those coaches. Uh, it's important, especially to those players is important to the institutions. Uh, in it. to those players is important to the institutions. So we care what happens one through 25 and put that effort in all the way through.

Or let's pivot forward out into the future. And I know things are gonna change in the coming years. So the Big Ten and the SEC reportedly have put out this concept for a 14-team playoff. And I know you're very well aware of it. Four automatic bids, if you will, for the SEC and for the Big Ten. Two automatics for the ACC and the Big 12. One for the non-big boys, if you will, and one that's still kind of lurking out there

for Notre Dame should, fill those qualifications. So the four four two, two, one, one model, why is that the best thing for college football if it is in your eyes? Well, I think, listen, it's all, it's all a part of the conversation. Uh, it's a, it's a conversation about expansion. It's a conversation about a way to potentially structure play ends into the championship that it's actually played on the field. There's commentary, for example, that certain people have said that they rather

not be playing in the championship game. Well, that to me takes away from the fact that you have championship games. So if in the sense of it, you can come up with a format that actually has people who play into the playoff, everybody would play into the playoff, that actually adds to me value to it, as opposed to some people saying,

well, I'll just sit out and I'll be selected. Well, you're leaving that game, that's a game of chance in terms of what the committee's doing. But I just think it's part of the conversation is something that I applaud Greg and Tony for bringing forward and having conversations with us as ADs to think about a new way,

to think about this playoff. Everybody, and when you look at to think about a new way, to think about this playoff. Everybody, and when you look at and compare us to the profession, particularly professional football, everybody's playing that last week into a playoff game. And in college, we don't have that. We have championship games where you have a certain number playing games. In this year, it's 18 out of, you know, 132. So if there's a format that allows some way for all teams to be playing in to the playoff,

I think that adds value to it. Is it fair? My last question. My last question. Real quick, coach, let me just hit this. I think that adds value to it. Is it my last question? My last question, real quick coach. Let me just hit this because I know where you're going here. Is it fair to the big 12s? Is it fair to the ACCs? Is it fair to the mountain West of the world? I don't know.

I mean, you know, again, it's a conversation to be had around, uh, the, the playoff itself and, and how do you structure and how do you strengthen it so that it adds a lot of value to football. Nobody look the argument of and I've read some of it that it this has only been done doing done out of greed. That's not not the case. I mean, we feel like we would earn those spots anyway in this, in a particular way.

But if it's about changing it so that people are able to enhance the playoff structure and to play in and to the points that were made earlier to get rid of this concept of subjectivity. Let's make it objective. Let's put some parameters on it and put a structure around it that has some objectivity where teams have to play in order to play in

as opposed to certain teams playing their championship games and others get in because of the fact that they're ranked at a certain place and, and they can't drop far enough to be out of it. I mean, that, that to me also says there's something when the, when the questions are about so much about subjectivity and what people are talking about, uh, in the room, I think I think you put some objectivity to it and you put some games as a way to play in.

That I think makes it, you know, people see it as, instead of just seeing it as, well, you're taking four spots. You're taking four spots, two spots, whatever spots the commissioners decide to do, and you're actually having people play games to play in, that to me is a format that follows what a lot of our leagues and our teams that we have in the way we get to playoffs. All right, my last question, the word is this,

is that there was not long ago that the SEC Big Ten really wasn't close, you know know, I was part of that. I remember when I first went from the SEC, the big 10, I was like, this is even my wife and my gosh, uh, and then you have national championships the last two years, the stadiums. And this is even with Wisconsin, Michigan state, Nebraska, not being what they normally are. I'm sure they'll be back.

But as an athletic director or former player to big 10 school to see the train, you know, and once again, next year is a whole other year. I get sick when people say, is the sec done? Of course not. No, but you have to recognize the transition of power would just happen. And you have to appreciate it. If you're, you know, I'm a big 10 guy grew up in that area. Now that doesn't mean it's over. You know, I gotta make, cause I guy grew up in that area. No, that doesn't mean it's over.

I, you know, I gotta make, cause I can see the headline right now. It's not, no, it's not. There's a lot of credit to a lot of people, the athletic directors, the coaches, and most importantly, the players that have made the big 10. What it is today. Yeah, I agree. Urban. I grew up in born and raised in Louisiana.

So I know, um, you know, what the SEC is about. I was raised in that, you know, football. And I do agree that there was a time where the speed, the different things that they did in the SEC, they had speed with power, right? I mean, that was the combination. The Big Ten has always been about power and about running the ball. And I think, you know, I give credit to, you know,

what Jim did, what Sharon's doing, what you did, you know, what Ryan's done, to really say, we want both. We want to really compete and we see what we need to do to compete against teams that were dominant in that. And so I agree with you that there's been a change, there's been a different focus. There's been a need to adjust to the level of football that needs to be played in order to win the national championship.

And so I agree that the Big Ten has changed the way they've done it. You know, you brought that in from the SEC. Jim brought it in from, you know, being in professional ball and understanding how to get to, you know, in his case, the Super Bowl, those kinds of things. You have to make those adjustments to, to figure out a way to win, you know, a game in multiple ways. And I think that's, that's been the success in the past couple of years. Hey Ward, when I say Ohio State, as a former player and an AD for Michigan, what, what kind of goes through your whole body when you hear those two words, Ohio State?

It's the greatest rivalry in college sports. It's a team that makes us our best and that we want to win at everything we compete against them for. And so for me, it is a level of competition that makes the difference in terms of how you are measured. We measure ourselves against each other and we play that way. We play at everything we do.

We try to win against them and that that is an opponent. That's why I've always had respect. And I think that's why Bo respected Woody as much as you had the 10 year war is because when somebody can bring out the best in you in the most competition and bring that level, then, then you have to, um, to acknowledge that and make sure that you're, you step up to compete, uh, at every, every time and every sport, uh, any day that you're playing that opponent. Now you want to do that against others, but the history and what that game and what those competitions mean against each other, I think just elevates it to another level.

I'm three in one, right? We think so. What do you mean you think so? You got to know these numbers, man. Coach, what urban, what were you against Michigan? Yeah. No, I can't remember. He knows his numbers.

I can't remember. Yeah. What was that? Seven and a. Oh, it sure as hell was. That's why I said three and one. Because he wanted to make sure I. You fell right in. Pulling you all in, man. That's so great. Very, very generous with your time, Ward. Thank you. Yeah, thanks so much for joining us. Thanks for Thanks for the coverage. I'll do for for college football

and everything that y'all bring. Hey, we do it for college basketball too. I'm heading in the studio right now for college. We've got some great Michigan hoops still to go this March. Ward Manuel, the athletic director at the University of Michigan. Thanks so much for joining the Triple Option. Thank you guys for having me. Welcome back to the Triple Option presented by Wendy's,

Rob Stone, Mark Ingram, Urban Meyer here with you. Now that we're in the college football off season, we're going to take a look and take a crack at predicting the future with the old Triple Option crystal ball. So this segment, of course, brought to you by our great friends at Bet MGM. Place your money line prop parlay and same game parlay bets at Bet MGM. Download app today please gamble responsibly as always these lines are subject to change so we're going to be looking at some future odds from the NFL draft college football team win totals a lot of other things so with the NFL combine just wrapping up the other day and kind of launching us into this NFL draft season we're going to talk about the number one overall pick but before we get to combine odds, we want to flashback Mark, we're going into the triple option time machine,

your combine visit. All right, when you were a young man leaving the University of Alabama, you weighed in. What do you think you weighed in at? I weighed in at 215, I remember. 215, a mighty five foot nine. 10, they cheated me. I was like five foot nine and three fourths of a mighty 5 foot 9 10 love my they cheated me I

think I put nine and three me on my ID as well I should be 510 a 4.66 40 your verse a lie I don't know we all got that number okay your vert what was it what was it what we're six six four six four high four five something like that are you all right with your vertical at 31 and a half? I didn't test well at all. You did not have a good combine according to you. Your broad jump, nine, ten. Listen.

You all right with that? I didn't test great. I didn't test great at all. But listen, everywhere that you need a football player, I did. I did great in the meeting room. When they handed me the ball, I had me going over the bags and changing directions, football stuff, I did. Now, if you wanted someone to look good in underwear and run fast and jump high. That's where you come to me and coach. And not play football really well. That wasn't me.

That wasn't me. I was a football player, man. Not an underwear model. So you get me on the board doing the X's and O's. I'm going gonna tell you who I need to pick up in pass protection. I'm gonna tell you how I need to press the heels of the alignment and cut it back and get vertical, get yards after contact. That's who I was. I was your football player. All right, so you're not an underwear model.

You are a football player. Okay, we got that. Who you want, coach? You want somebody that look good. I know you have fast people all on your team, coach. Yeah. Well, I think there's a fine line, but yeah, I'm not a big, you know, who can bench the most, who can do this. Don't say that's not important because that is absolutely important. It is important. I think you also have to look at how is he coached. You get a Nick Saban player, you know,

that players, and this is really intriguing. You get a player that from a program that is not well coached, you would always look and say there's a lot more room for growth there. You're gonna get a guy that you know and is the elite developer. An Alabama kid I like to think maybe at Ohio State when we were there in Florida there, those players were coached up now. Those are you know Mark Ingram, you better appreciate what you got because he's been coached hard. He's been taught the right fundamentals. Don't devalue that kid that comes from some program. Then you go in and the scouts go in and say, wait a minute.

Now this cat has not worked on past protection. This guy's not worked on this. He's not. And then can he learn that? That's to me, the fine line of the NFL draft is take a look at what is the maximum when that guy maximizes, what will he be? And the one thing about a Mark Ingram, I don't, you know, Mark, tailback, you know, I never that worried about 40 yard dash.

But can you do all the other stuff? I had the fastest 10 yard split though, out of all the backs. I had the fastest 10 yard split. Will he, will he stick his nose on you in pass protection? Will he come out of the backfield? Does he understand a complicated offensive scheme? Those are all high value marks in the NFL draft for that. That's why the combines always so interesting though is because

people get attached to this little window of data that is thrown at them jumping and the bench press and as he said, the lingerie show walking around in their underwear, but there's more to it is very important stone. It is very important. But at the end of the day, I think some people lose the point of what the combine is. You're evaluating football players. So turn on the tape and see how this man plays football. And sit them down and talk to them

and have a real conversation with them and learn who they are. And I think that's the real value these days of the combine is those interviews and what happens in them. So here's what we're gonna do guys. If we were picking number one overall, who would we take right now? And, and we're not going to break it down and say,

well, we're Tennessee or we're the Giants or we're whoever, we're not going to talk NFL fit. We're talking an expansion franchise, picking number one, the odds you're going to see them right now. They are set in franchise, picking franchise. I don't have a quarterback. You have nothing. Okay. The odds set up there by our great friends at Bet MGM. And this is something

you guys can play with out there. And you're going to see the odds right now. And right now the number one overall pick is Cam Ward. Again, the Miami QB over 4,300 yards passing. Abdul Carter, the great defensive end from Penn State plus 185 Travis Hunter the two-way guy at plus

1,100 his teammate at Colorado Shador Sanders at 1500 Jackson Dart the Ole Miss QB at plus 500 So there's a lot of ways you can go with it and coach you were in this position obviously But I think the general consensus there is you can win first with a good defensive team, right? If you can get a good defensive team, you got a chance. But boy, if you got a quarterback that you believe in and can live with for a while, it's super tempting out there to take that QB to be the face of your program from the get go, from the jump.

Yeah, I think the quarterback position is is you know what it used to last I used to laugh when they'd say well in the NFL the quarterbacks most important position I was like, yeah, no shit. So enough so in college junior high and even pop Warner It's a quarterback driven, but you know if you're gonna take that quarterback There has to be zero point zero zero doubt that that guy cuz that guy, because that's not like a corner, that's not like a linebacker. When you take a quarterback, invest that kind of money, he's yours.

And that's it, it's overdone, it's a wrap. And over the history, I don't have that in front of me, but we've also studied it before, when you get stuck with a guy that's not the guy that you think he is, that sets the program back or franchise back years. Because you can't, no one's going to eat up his contract. It's, you know, it's, that's, that's a rugged place to be.

And we saw it just in the recent history. There's been a couple, you know, quarterbacks taken early on and they end up being backups at some other place. And those teams, by the way, are really struggling. You know, we know, know who, you know, you don't want to list them. There's too many of them, but you take a guy as a number one, number two, number three pick, and you say, I need a quarterback.

I would say, no, you don't need a, you need a quarterback, you need the right quarterback. Right. And I'd rather invest if it's not that guy on a Travis Hunter, Abdul Carter. Yep. So who's your number one coach? I'm giving you the number one pick right now

with your expand, yeah, the fight in Urban Myers will take. I'm taking Travis Hunter. I just think he's in my lifetime, very few can do what he can do. I stood next to the guy. I watched him. Obviously we covered him quite a bit. I probably would play him both ways

and just invest in that guy. He's a good person. He's, I mean, he's got a skillset that not many, I've never, you know, they can do both I don't know if I've ever seen that mark I don't know if I never seen a guy at that level do both and there's something about him when he plays 170 plays Is 168 on offense blocking 25 yards down the field the same energy they did on play 16 Yep, so I'm going for the hundred 20th. Yeah, forcing the fumble and overtime on the

goal line to win the game. Yeah. So he's still getting a high level of play from this player, even though he's playing 100 plus snaps. All right. So coach, you're taking Travis Hunter, Mark Ingram, you are on the clock with the number one overall pick this year for your expansion team. You are my expansion team And my expansion team doesn't have a quarterback Lord Listen this isn't me talking because I'm a big fan of Ken Ward and I'm a big finisher Shador Sanders

I think that they're going to be good professional football players You're not looking you're not looking for good with the number one overall pick. You're looking for elite. The talking, this isn't me. I'm not a talking head. I'm just Mark. But the talking heads out there are saying that this is the worst quarterback class in recent history.

That's what the talking heads are saying. So don't say Mark Ingram said that because I'm not a talking head. I'm just on a podcast with my friends. My name is Mark the second. So I'm not the talking head, but'm just on the podcast with my friends. My name is Mark the second. So I'm not the talking head, but that's what they're saying. That's what those people are saying on this TV. That's what they're saying. All right. So what are you saying, brother?

So I'm saying right now. Sounds like you're buying time. I hate to be the copycat. You know what I mean? If I don't love if I'm not in love with the quarterback selection here, I'm going to grab me one free agency like someone like sam donald who did well in minnesota and rustle wilson Who is going to be on the block? You know, I mean you got james justin fields. Yep. Yeah, justin fields Maybe I go with a veteran guy until I love my pick the next year. You know what I mean?

and i'm gonna take a playmaker at the wire receiver position and the cornerback position by the name of Heisman trophy winner, Travis Hunter. I'm copying coach right here because I just love the guy. I love his mindset. I love his work ethic and the rarity of the talent that he's playing with at the wire receiver position and the defensive back position. You're getting a number one shut down corner. He plays man.

He plays press. He could play off. He has great ball skills on the defensive side. Then you got a guy who has great running, good speed and great boss skills. We've seen him high point the ball, make acrobatic catches, run with after the catch. So you're getting two players for one. Yes. Right now in this draft, I'm going with that Travis Hunter.

I'm getting two players with my first overall pick and death is who I'm taking with the number one pick that I'm have to revisit free agency for my quarterback. How about you Stone? Stone is a big fan of BOGO buy one, get one free, right? So Travis Hunter, I'm getting myself a starting wide receiver. I'm getting myself a starting defensive back. Hell yeah. I'll take that.

I'll take that all day. Travis Hunter for the sweep on the triple-hack. Also I would definitely trade out a number one. I'd get out of that. I'd stockpile picks. The one thing that worries me or it doesn't worry me makes me curious about Travis Hunter is you know there there were definitely some conversations during that Heisman Trophy ceremony and going beyond it about off the field stuff with Travis. Everything that we've seen and we've dealt with this is a top level young man. This is a an elite human being not just an athlete but I

would want to make sure everything is kind of dialed in with his camp, but everything that I've seen and that we've been lucky enough to witness, and he's got Deion Sanders right there, who is going to be looking out for this young man in a father figure type role. I think I would feel very comfortable with that electric smile on billboards,

all over beautiful Stone City as my number one overall draft that he is an elite human being on and off the field and I think I like to trade out of absolute game difference. What's that? I like to trade out of first. Yeah. Oh, how do I get out of it? Expand. I would, I would be so happy. Yeah. I'd be happy to trade out of you trade down to seven, eight, nine. You're still going to probably get your guy. And guess what? Give me a late round one or early round two, and I'll be happy with Jackson Dart as a quarterback sitting right there and learning for a year or two

and then just kind of pinging things around. So I like Dart, but I think it's pretty surreal that we all agree that Travis Hunter would be our face of our first year franchise. Pretty cool. Congratulations, Travis. We'll get you something for that from the Triple Option. Make sure to follow, subscribe, rate us on YouTube.

The Triple Option number one overall draft pick. Number one, you win overall number one, wherever you get your podcasts, as well as across social media at 3XOptionShow. As always, thanks to our great sponsors, Wendy's and BetMGM. And Travis Hunter, congratulations on being the number one pick of the Triple Options brand new franchise team.