The Ultimate Blog Podcast - 104. Growing a Multi-Dimensional Blogging Business with Cynthia Samanian from The Culinary Boss™

Episode Date: December 12, 2023

We have Cynthia Samanian from The Culinary Boss™ on to share more about her journey from finance and tech to food blogging and culinary business. Cynthia Samanian is the founder of The Culinary Boss, where she helps experienced solopreneurs grow their multi-dimensional dream businesses. She shares the importance of having a core revenue stream and understanding how to monetize before branching out into other areas. We chat more about tracking data from email subscribers, business funnels, and building a solid foundation and consistent revenue before expanding further in your blogging business. This conversation was full of so many actionable tips that you can take in your blogging business! Tune in to hear all of the wisdom that Cynthia shares!Thanks for listening! Let us know your thoughts on Instagram: @sparkmediaconceptsWe have a goal to reach 100,000 downloads by December 31 and we need your help! Share an episode you love with a friend and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts! We would be so grateful!Check out the show notes (link below) for more information including links and resources mentioned in today's episode!SHOW NOTES: www.sparkmediaconcepts.com/episode104

Welcome to the Ultimate Blog Podcast with Amy Reinecke and Jennifer Draper. We're on a mission to empower women who want to start or grow their own blog. This podcast is for women who want to learn blogging basics and who crave inspiration and encouragement. Whether you're just getting started or have been a blogger for years, we're excited to welcome you into this space where we are passionate about creating community over competition. We are bloggers who want to encourage you to believe in your potential, step outside the norm, and step into a life where you create your own schedule, your own success, and your own story. Join us for weekly episodes as we navigate blogging

and work from home life, all while raising a family and having some serious fun along the way. all while raising a family and having some serious fun along the way. Hey, everybody. Today, we are excited to bring on a guest that is going to dive a little bit deeper into some aspects of food blogging and having a culinary business. We haven't really done a deep dive into this before. So we're excited today to welcome Cynthia Samanian. She is the founder of The Culinary Boss, where she helps experienced solopreneurs grow their multi-dimensional dream businesses. Growing up as a daughter of Iranian immigrants, Cynthia is no stranger to the power of food to unite people across cultures. She's a graduate of Harvard Business School and currently lives in sunny Oakland, California,

with her partner and two toddler girls. Welcome, Cynthia. Thank you so much for having me, Jennifer and Amy. I am thrilled for our conversation today. Yeah, I'm excited to dive into it. Before we get into the thick of this, do you want to just tell everybody a little bit more about your background and how you specifically got into online business and the culinary aspect of that as well. Absolutely. So as many of your listeners, I don't think people were born thinking that one day they would be a food blogger or be in this space. But it was a passion for food that really led me here.

And it was a windy path. I actually worked in finance. I worked at General Electric, one of the world's biggest companies at the time, which was definitely an interesting experience, wearing pearls and collared shirts, and went to Harvard for my MBA. And then after that, got sucked into the Silicon Valley tech world, which was fantastic. It was such a great time. It was basically right when Instagram had launched and I was working for a competitor, which no longer exists, but it was such a fun time to learn about what was happening in the space of social media and kind of taking it beyond what we knew of Facebook at the time. And my role actually was a product manager. So I worked with designers and

engineers and it was basically the glue that helped bring it all together. And it was a product manager. So I worked with designers and engineers and was basically the glue that helped bring it all together. And it was a lot of thinking through the roadmap and the strategy and making sure that we would ship the products and features on time and listening to customers. So it was a really dynamic, fun, exciting role. But when I would clock out, I would go and watch some of my favorite cookbook authors and chefs host talks here in San Francisco. We're really lucky we have Omnivore Books, which is such an incredible bookstore here. And they would host so many talented authors. And I just fell in love with this idea of a career in food. I almost applied to culinary school,

had my packet ready to go. But after looking at my finances and realizing, okay, I already have a graduate degree. Now it's time to actually start doing, I put that on hold. But I pursued my passion through food blogging for a few years. I then actually started a food events agency where I got to work with brands like Bob's Red Mill and Bear Snacks and help them put on these amazing in-person live events. And that was the business I thought I was going to run forever. And then in 2020, we all know what happened. Events completely disappeared. And then I had to make a pivot online. And that's when I launched what is now the Culinary Boss.

But at the time, it was called Culinary Creator Business School. And in that online program, I worked with food bloggers, registered dietitians, a variety of people in the culinary space, and baking included, who really just wanted to find a way to diversify their income and not be tied to restaurants or even the day-to-day content creation of their blogs. So I helped them think about how to teach online. And now I help them do more than that. And I focus a lot on overall strategy and this idea of a multi-dimensional culinary business, which we will talk about in this episode. Your story is so fun. I love how you've learned probably so much from each and every stepping stone that you take that knowledge, and then you take it into the next experience. And it just continually has provided for you in

a way that now you're turning around. And while you're making an income from it, you're giving back to the industry that once had you so passionate before you ever even stepped into it. Yeah, I love it. I mean, I tell people like, I'm not a chef. I am just a very passionate home cook. Like I love learning from my students because they are masters and what they do in the culinary world. But they look to me because they're like, you know, business, you know, strategy, you know, tech and operations, and it feels so good to provide value back to that community. And I will say most of the people that I work with happen to be women, a lot of them happen to be mothers. And through this journey that I shared, what I did leave out

is that I had two kids in three years. Our first being born on the 4th of July 2020. So that was interesting. Yeah. And the next was born, gosh, 15 months later. And yeah, so it was a busy time. But I tend to think that the due dates of my babies have also pushed me to launch things very quickly and procrastinate. I love that motherhood's allowed you to still step into something that you're passionate about instead of holding you back. And I think that there's a lot of people listening who can maybe relate to that, that we think like, I have to be a mom or follow and chase the dream. So I just love hearing the perspective of someone who's chosen to do both and have both. And I think that that's an important perspective to share. And building an online business is not something that is

easy. But it is something that gives us a lot of... It's empowering. And it's a gift. I think that then we get to turn around and give to others. So let's dive into this idea that you mentioned a little bit ago about multidimensional culinary, like a multidimensional culinary business. Why is this important for a food blogger to think outside the box into what they are doing with their food blogging business. Sure. Yeah. And I love this topic. This is something that has just evolved over the years of me working with people in the culinary world and the food blogging world. And what I realized was that people want to do everything, right? They want to have a YouTube channel and they want to have a successful blog. And oh my gosh, wait, this

person's doing Substack. Should I be doing Substack? Like there are so many conversations happening around what I should be doing. And even though like in my past business, I was really helping people focus on teaching online. At the end of the day, we were having conversations about all of these things. And what I realized was that what people wanted to build was essentially this, a multi-dimensional culinary business.

People didn't just want to do one thing. They loved being in food and wanted to find many different ways and facets for them to share that, whether it would be starting a podcast or going all in on one platform or whatnot. But the idea was that, okay, they have their hands in many pots, and it's impossible to do everything well at the same time for the first time, if this is your approach. And we can talk about some of the benefits and challenges, but I'll just hint that burnout is real. And I think a lot of us have experienced that, especially when we look around

and we see our peers and we admire what they're doing. And we're like, maybe this week I'll try that. And it doesn't work. We get discouraged. And so I have been really passionate in this new evolution of my business to work with solopreneurs who want to do many things, but are excited to do it in a way that is a little bit more step-by-step. It's a little bit more methodical and doesn't lead to burnout and helps people understand, okay, this is what I should be doing right now. And then tomorrow I'm going to work on this. So to take a step back, a multi-dimensional culinary business is this idea that you can have more than one revenue stream in your business. That's like the simplest way to describe it. So I think about things in three buckets. So you have

your paid content, which would be paid newsletters, cookbooks, courses, memberships, digital products, things you create that people will pay you for. The second category would be ads and brands. So many of the bloggers listening here, right? You understand how ads work on your blog. Also YouTube ads, sponsored content, even affiliate income, I consider that to be under the ads and brands category. And then the third is paid events. So there are people that I work with who want to get out there and they want to do in-person events or they want to do online cooking classes.

They want to host retreats. So those are the three different buckets I think about. And there's no right or wrong combination. You could do all paid content or you could do an event here and blog ads here or there. You can mix it up. But the idea is that diversification is what's going to benefit you. And you will have your own recipe for what diversification looks like. And that, I think, is always a good thing. Diversification, we look back at what happened during the pandemic. If you were all in person, like I was, you had to

quickly figure out a way to get online. But when you're diversified offline and online, or even in multiple different areas online, it can be really beneficial. Yeah, I think that when we think about being a blogger, a food blogger, whatever kind of blogger we want to be, we we think about the creative side of the business and how much fun it's going to be. And we're going to be able to share our passions with people. But we also have to really take this business at and put it on and think about how we're going to make this sustainable for the long term. And like you said, I think we can feel like, oh, there's so many different things that I want to do. How do you sort of take the first step and figure out where you were even going to start with your business so that you know how to start making that long term plan for how you're going to

diversify when you're not even making any money yet? Where's the best place to even start thinking about all that? Yeah, that's such a good question. And I think it's good to have a long term plan, but also recognize that things are going to change quickly and being open to that. So it's a little bit of a balance. When I work with clients, we look at pretty much quarter by quarter because you can look between probably next three to six months, but I'm not going to ask you what your five-year plan is. Maybe what your five-year vision is, like where you want to be, but we don't even know

what platforms will be around then, right? Right. is, where you want to be, but we don't even know what platforms will be around then, right? So the first things first is you do need to have a core revenue stream. I believe in this. I believe you need to understand how you want to monetize first. And then from there, you can think about what's next. I've said this in other talks and maybe I've already said it here, but it's like, you can do many things, just not all at the same time for the first time, right? Like that's the key. And people will try and spend a week doing sub stack and then a week doing sponsored content and then throw their hands up in the air and say, it's not working. And it's like, well, you've got to put more time into one

thing first and really see it through. So, and I actually am pretty agnostic when it comes to how to monetize. I think some people have a better opportunity than others, depending on their current audience size, their skillset, what they enjoy doing. So for example, there are some people who, I know this audience is primarily bloggers, but there are also some people who have shifted completely to Substack. And they've decided that they want to do paid newsletters and they want to monetize by having subscribers. And then they're going to add cooking classes or other things to bring in income. So some people have walked away from ads altogether. Whereas some of the bloggers, one that I'm working with right now has a solid ad revenue coming in as well as affiliate income. And she's getting burnt

out by all the content creation. And she's getting burnt out by all the content creation. And she's like, oh my gosh, I don't want to keep doing two to three new posts a week. What can I do instead? So we're exploring digital products for her. But I think to answer your question, Jennifer, you've got to start with one revenue stream first. And if you don't know what that revenue stream is, if you are really early in this, one of the key things that you need to know is your niche. We can talk about that. I don't know if you've had other guests talk about the importance of a niche, but I believe in having a strong niche and understanding your funnel as a business. Those two things, no matter what you offer, who you sell to, whatever it is you're doing, you have to understand those things. That's the foundation. And then from there, you can build on. We talk a lot about foundations on the podcast because we do find that to be a really important key component in blogging is that there are these specific foundations that you need to know when starting. And gone are the days of

sitting down at your computer and saying, Oh, I'm just going to write a diary and share. Now, you can do that. Okay, so anybody who's listening who's like, Hold on, that's what I wanted to do. That is fine. But I just got to be honest with you that that is building more of a hobby blog. And it is going to be much, much, much more difficult to earn revenue streams by just being popular, essentially, is what you're doing.

Because you're just hoping that people want to learn more about your life. This podcast, the guests we bring on are helping people who want to grow a blogging business. That is the idea. That is the goal. That is the kind of education that we are providing. And so you brought up a couple of things. One, knowing your niche, which is, it's critical. You have to know not only who you're speaking to, but what are their problems and what solutions are you providing? But the other thing that you haven't said exactly, but you've said it in a roundabout way is it takes time. And in a world of instant gratification, we have to still understand that blogging and building an online business, I don't care what ad you have seen today,

it does not happen overnight. It is not built overnight. It's not built in three months and it's not built in six months. It takes several months in order to grow this business. And I think just shedding some light there can be really beneficial to those listening. Oh my gosh, Amy. I'm like so riled up right now when you said that

because I have been on a little bit of a high horse lately because you're right. You see these ads and because I think I fall under coaching or whatever. I have a loaded relationship with that term, but I get targeted for ads where it's like coaching for coaches and coaching for coaching for coaches. It's just like, okay. And these ads, you're right. A lot of them are like, you're just one funnel away from a six-figure business tomorrow. It's not true. It's not true. And I work my tail off. I think I'm pretty smart. And it's hard. It's so hard. And I think there's a little bit of luck that comes with it as well. And I think sometimes people point to one or two people they see and they're like, but look, Cynthia, they went from zero to a million followers overnight.

And it's like, yeah, there's hard work there, but there's definitely some luck and timing. And you can't always replicate that. But I think that is so, so true. You've got to have patience in this game. And I think that's why I want people to understand this idea of burnout and how real it is. And just staying in your lane, focusing on what matters to you and why it matters to you. When I work with my clients on Roadmaps, we don't talk about other people. We don't look at other people because I'm like, what's your life like? What's your reality? Do you have someone else supporting you financially that can help balance things out? You know, do you want to, you know, travel on weekends? Or do you need to be home with your kids? And I think all of that has to come into the conversation. And that's the stuff that's

missing from these ads that just like romanticize this idea of an online business. I mean, it is, it's hard, but it's also super rewarding and fulfilling. Like all things, right? You've got to put in work to get the to get the outcome at the end. Yeah, there's not like a one size fits all, like, here's your system, I'm gonna, you buy my system, and you follow my steps, and you're going to be rich tomorrow. Like that just isn't realistic. And neither would it be beneficial to us, because we got into this online business as a way to create something for ourselves. And we want it to be something that we are excited to get up every morning to build because those times when it is difficult, those times when it does take longer than we feel like it should, we still have to feel

passionate and excited about it. And it has to fit into our lives in a way that feels good as well. So that we're picking and choosing the things that we want to do and the ways that we wanna make money that feel right to us and that feel like something we can sustain. I have a confession. I have signed up for those systems. I've paid a lot of people for those systems. I've even sold a system like that.

And it's what you wanna do is create this step-by-step framework that's like anyone can do it and anyone could get results. And while a lot of people get results, what I learned and the reason why I totally have left that and now have the culinary boss is that I realized people need more help putting the pieces together. And it's not as simple as A to B to C to D. It's like, no, for some people, it's a windier path. And I just love that you acknowledge that because there are a lot of out-of-the-box systems that people sell. And I think that's a little bit different than a framework. A framework is helpful to

help you work through steps. But when you see these things that just promise huge results, and it feels too good to be true, definitely think twice about it and think about, okay, what do you really need? What do you need to learn right now? What's that skill? And it may be something as simple as I need to learn how to run Facebook ads, or I need to learn how to reach out to brands and focus on investing in those things versus like trying to buy something that says it's going to fix everything for you. Right. We're trying to find something that is labeled as like a one size fits all. And I think that that's kind of the mindset shift that when you come into this online business

in this space, that it does take a little bit of time to wrap your brain around that, that we come from a space of, you know, I worked at a bank. So this is how bankers work. This is what bankers do. Jennifer was an accountant.

This is what accountants do. This is what, you know, all accountants do. But then you enter into the online space and you're like, okay, I'm going to be a blogger. Okay, so where is my ABCDE list of the things that I do? And that list looks different for each individual person, which there's two sides to that coin. It is beautiful and amazing. And that is one of my favorite parts of this business. And it is also the part that leads to burnout sometimes because you're running the rat race of trying to figure out what you're meant to do because your measuring stick is the person that

you know who's blogging. Well, they're doing all these things. So that means I need to do all these things. And if I've said it once, I've said it 100 times on the podcast. Jennifer and I both have independent blogging businesses that we do very different things in each business. It doesn't make one of them right or wrong. It just makes them completely different. And we hope to really shed light to the people who are in the Spark Media Concepts community that there is more than one way to build a business. But if you don't have the foundations built first, then you have no idea who you're talking to, what you're trying to quote unquote sell, and where you're trying to go. If we don't have an idea of why we're wanting to build this business in the first place, then when it gets really hard or when it takes longer to

build it than we think, it's very easy to give up, quite honestly. Yeah, exactly. And I think, gosh, we're so aligned here. I mean, foundations, that's exactly it. Like the funnel that I teach, it's simple. Attract, engage, convert. I didn't invent it. It's been around, but there's like, you know, a 20 layer funnel if you want to find it, like a complicated one, a funnel just for Instagram, a funnel just for fill in the blank. And to me, it's like, keep it simple. It's like, are you going to attract your ideal customer? How are you going to keep them interested and trust you? And then how are you going to convert them to buy a product or service that you want to sell?

I mean, those are the things that don't change. And that's why I love these types of conversations and being in this work, because there are lots of other moving parts, what you can sell, what you can offer, like all of that kind of is interchangeable. But when it comes down to, like you said, the foundations, like you will always need to know your ideal client or customer. You always have to know that you always have to know your niche. So that's the stuff that lights me up, because I feel like it's empowering, it allows you to kind of choose your own adventure of how you want to attract them,

how you want to engage them, but you still have to do those things. Yeah. And sometimes it feels a little bit tedious, but I think it's important to put in some of that work. I know I'm at a place now where I finally have some systems in place and I'm able to create content on a really consistent basis. And that really helps me with my goal of ad revenue. So I feel like I'm in a good place with that. And now I'm ready to say, okay, what else can I do with my business? And what I would love to talk about, I know you had some examples that you could share with us about what a multidimensional culinary business could look like. I think it would be fun just to talk about

and envision what this looks like so that we can all start dreaming about what might feel good to each of us. Yeah. I'm like, Jennifer, should we put you in the hot seat? Yeah. I'm like, Jennifer, should we put you in the hot seat? Ooh, that'd be fun. Yeah. I'll share a few examples. And these are people that I'm thinking most of the listeners here have heard of. So Lindsay and Bjork, right? Food blogger, pro, pinch of yum. I mean, of course, they're the OG food bloggers. We all kind of know who they are and love them. I'm not saying you could start a blog today and it would be pinch of yum tomorrow.

But I think it's interesting to look at their model and to see what they have done to diversify because they, of course, have more than enough blog ad revenue. That would make a lot of us happy. But on top of that, they also do affiliate. So that's another stream of income. They also have the membership, Food Blogger Pro membership, which I think a lot of people are saying they might be a part of. Also through their podcast, they do podcast ads. So I mean, they have a lot more than just that, but they've really approached this idea of a diversified culinary business in a unique way that works for them. There's someone else who is not actually an official food blogger, but she's a cookbook author. And I think a lot of your audience may know her,

but Julia Tertian, who's written so many great cookbooks, she's just fantastic. And she, while she could have a blog, she actually has decided to monetize through cooking classes. So she hosts a Zoom cooking class every week and has continued to get dozens of people showing up live cooking with her. On top of that, she has a Substack newsletter that she has a premium subscription for. And then she also writes her cookbooks. So for her, she's figured out that these three things could be a great secret sauce for her diversification. As I mentioned, so there's someone that I'm working with who has an online course that's been really successful. She also does brand partnerships. And now she's like,

okay, what's next? And so we're going to add a membership for her graduates of her online course. So these are just some examples to kind of get the wheels turning. But Jennifer, I don't know if you want to talk about what you might want to do next. I mean, if you already have your blog, it sounds like your content machine is going and there's something more that you want to do. I mean, what are you leaning towards? Just curious. Yeah. So full transparency. I mean, I've hired help this year to be able to make this happen. It doesn't, you know, it's taken a lot of work to get to this point to where I can consistently create content on top of obviously doing what we do here with Spark Media and helping

other bloggers. So I've tested out and tried different things over the years. I've worked with brands. And that's just not my favorite thing to do for me personally. I know a lot of people do really well with it. And they love it, but it just doesn't spark much joy for me. So I've also done some freelance work. I've done some food photography for other bloggers, which is great, but just definitely time consuming. And so my next thing that I want to dive into is more like course creation or specifically helping my audience in some way where they can purchase a course or some type of a membership and just dive deeper and learn more. So I know that that's kind of where I want to go because once I create it, it's not taking a significant amount of my time, but it can also diversify that revenue because relying solely on

ad revenue, like you said, it's just not a good long-term business plan because you never know what's going to change and what's going to happen. So I want to start breaking off into some different areas so that I feel more safe and secure in my business as well. I love that. And I think that echoes the conversations I've had with other bloggers who want to just create more value for their reader. And I always, when I was teaching people how to start online cooking class businesses, I was always so excited to work with the bloggers because you already have the audience. And there are a lot of people who would come into this world who didn't have an audience. And so we'd have to start there. And that obviously takes a long time, as you both know. So I think that bloggers have a leg up in

that you already have an audience, you've built trust with your readers. And oftentimes, they're just looking for like, what's next? Like, what can I what can I get from you? How can I support you? And so figuring out that right digital product, what's the right fit? Is it a membership? Is it a course? Is it an ebook? I think that's such a smart route for bloggers to take after they've built their audience to a place where they feel like, yeah, now I could add something more to my plate and it wouldn't be crazy overwhelming for me to manage. Yeah, it feels like another way to just dip your toes in the water, so to speak. You're creating something, but it's not so overwhelming that you're putting all your time into it. You kind of test maybe something a little smaller with my thought and see how they react to it. Are they interested? I still want it to be really valuable, but I don't want to spend a year creating something and then have it fall flat. So I want to kind of test it out slowly and see if my audience is even willing to pay me money. Yeah. And I'd say this too. I've seen a shift even from my audience of business owners. People want smaller bite-sized things. People's lives are getting

busier again. So the idea of creating a six-month course during the pandemic, people had time for that and a willingness to actually dedicate and commit their own energy to do it. But I think you're right to start small because I also think your audience probably wants something a little bit easier to consume. So thanks for letting me play this game with you. I love it. Not in our outline for today's conversation. We like getting candid about things and just being transparent about what's going on behind the scenes with us too. For sure. Hey, I just wanted to pop in real quick and say thank you so much for listening to today's episode of the Ultimate Blog Podcast. We are coming up on our two-year anniversary in January of 2024, which is really, really exciting, but we need your help with something. I have set a huge goal to hit 100,000 downloads by December 31st. And we are inching in on that goal each and every day, but there still needs to be more downloads. And so I'm just going to

ask for your help here. Just shamelessly plugging the podcast. If you would take one minute right here right now, as long as you're not driving, and if you would just leave the podcast a rating and review, it would be so instrumental to the success of this podcast. Not only that, we thank you so much for taking the time to do it. We know you're busy. We know that you'll have the choice of literally thousands of podcasts to choose from. And we are honored that you chose ours. And so thank you so much for just helping us spread the word about the Ultimate Blog Podcast. And thanks for taking time to listen to today's episode. It really does mean so much to us. And we hope that you are learning a lot from us and that we are helping you along your blogging journey. Thanks again for leaving the rating and review. It means the world to us.

Thanks again for leaving the rating and review. It means the world to us. Cynthia, I think something that would be helpful for those listening who might be kind of in the same position that Jennifer's in, they're an established content creator. Maybe they don't know what's next for them. They may or may not have ad revenue, but maybe they have affiliate income coming in. And maybe a course is the next step or like an ebook or something. What about the creator who's like, I just share recipes? What could I possibly turn into a course? Do you have a framework or just some trigger questions that you could ask them to just get the ball rolling and thinking outside the box of more than just pumping out a bunch of recipes? But what can a food blogger coach their readers on?

Yeah, oh, that's a juicy question. So I guess we've talked about there's no one size fits all, but I would say the principles are the same and that you need to understand what your reader really, really likes about what you provide, right? So you could look at like your most popular posts,

for example, see, you know, are people like really into your holiday content? Is it you know, this is where like knowing your niche is really clear, because some of the people I work with don't really have a niche. Like if it's, you know, like healthy, easy recipes, like that's not a niche. So for some of them, it's it's narrowing in on that niche more before creating something. But if you feel like you have a well-defined niche and people know exactly what to come to you for, for example, like gluten-free baking is still probably niche, I'd say. Then from there, I mean, I am a big, big fan of talking to your audience, talking to your readers. So I also am a big fan of an email list,

going back to foundations. I think it's very important to have an email list. One of the many reasons why so that you can get in conversation with your audience. And yes, you can do that on Instagram, but email, we know, actually, for the most part gets opened by at least a good number of your of your audience. So one of the like more tactical steps I would recommend is creating either a very short survey or identifying who are your most loyal readers through email opens, perhaps, or clicks, and taking those people and seeing if they'll just have a call with you. this before. You get a Starbucks gift card and you just give them the code and have them scan it. And some people might buy $20 worth of things, but most people will just buy a cup of coffee, say it's on me. I would love to hop on Zoom and just chat with you for 10 minutes, 15 minutes about your experience as a reader and pick their brains and see what they love, see what they want more of. I don't believe in surveying everyone because you're going to get just a hodgepodge of responses. But I think you focus on the people who have shown up for you and who are

like your most loyal fans and find out how you can really like wow them with whatever you create. I'm a big fan of just talking to people. And Instagram polls, you could do that and then maybe like follow up with them, the people who respond. But you can't target as well on Instagram polls, whereas emails, like you can look at their behavior and focus on the people who have shown up for you. Yes. They'll be so excited to hear from you. I have to say that. Yeah, they will. I think that's a good idea because just coming from a reader's perspective, so I think of some of the newsletters that I get. One, knowing that you're more than just a number, like you're more than just somebody that's hopping in their inbox. But they genuinely care about what you're sharing. I think that that's important.

And I think as a reader, if I had a blogger that was like, Hey, I would like to hop on a call and get some insight from you. People love to give their opinion. We really love to give our opinions. And so when you give them the opportunity, I just think that's a really cool idea as a way to connect with people. Because if they're opening your emails on a consistent basis, which we agree that email marketing is a very foundational piece of this business. If you're paying attention to those statistics as well, which we believe that you should be, that is how creating content becomes easier. Work smarter, not harder. When you know what they're opening, when you know who's opening it, then you know, okay, this is what they want. This is about what

we can target for how many opens we'll get and how many conversions. I mean, we could really dive in to that whole business. But I do think that it's important to know just the activity of your email subscribers to know then how can you show up better for them? Exactly. Because I don't have the answer. I can give ideas to the people I work with and say, Oh, have you thought about this or that? But I'm not your reader. And so when you're so close to it, you're probably not the best person either. And so I do this all the time. I mean, just last week, I'm like, okay, I want to host a workshop this week or this month.

And I had five topic ideas, put them out in front of my audience. I'm like, which one do you want? And of course, I'll use my judgment too. But I also qualified it and said, okay, do you have an email list? Yes or no. And then from there, I got their responses. Because again, you don't want to just like survey everyone, you want to make sure that you are focusing on the people that are specific to what you want to offer. So it may not be everyone in your community. And that's okay.

But I think getting in conversation with them is never is the wrong thing. And if you think like, what if everyone responds? That's a great problem to have. Yeah. It's a great problem to have. It won't happen, but it would be a great problem to have. Yeah. It won't happen. No, I think we've talked about some really great ways to get some ideas for what we can do. So let's talk about next steps. So say you've figured out what you want to take on. I assume you should only take on one new thing at a time.

But let's talk about what those next steps look like. I'm sure there's some structure that you need to put in place to make sure that you can actually follow through because we have ideas. The follow through is the hard part. Now, how do we make it happen? Yeah, absolutely.

So if you imagine the funnel, attract, engage, convert, right? What I recommend doing is plan from the bottom up. So plan on how do you want to make money from your audience? Then how do you want to keep them engaged? And then how are you going to attract more of those types of people? So I say plan from the bottom up, but then execute from the top down. So for those of you who don't have an email list, let's not even talk about selling anything.

Like, no, get your email list set up, attract people to your email list, let's not even talk about selling anything. Like, no, get your email list set up, attract people to your email list, write consistent email newsletters, build that, and then start selling. Because some people come to me and they're like, well, I don't know what to sell. I'm like, well, who do you have in your community? And they're like, zero people. I'm like, well, that's where we're going to start. So assuming that you have an email list in place and all of that, you still want to think about executing from the top down, making sure that, you know, before you put something out in front of people that you have a freebie or some sort of opt in to build your list, that you have that ongoing communication, whether it's on Instagram or your email list, and then you get to be in the exciting place of converting. If you have all of that in place, and this is like the second or third monetization stream that you're looking to build, then you've got to think about, okay, what are all the activities I could do to help make this happen? Right?

So there are a lot of ways. And we'll just take an example. Let's say that you decide that you want to... We'll just do the digital product example. Let's say that you want to create a digital product, right? And in addition to everything that you're doing, so that would be starting at the bottom, like digital product is how you're going to convert, whether it's a course or a PDF, we don't know. So then you think about, okay, how am I going to engage people and bring them into that world of this digital product, right? So you could,

of course, continue with your email newsletter, and it may be what you're already doing on Instagram. So it's not like you have to do anything new here, but we want to understand what are the activities that are going to lead to that. And then if we move up to attract, it's like, okay, well, how am I going to bring in people who are interested in this? Now, that's where you might have a shift and you might say, you know what, this mini course, yes, it's for my audience, but it actually could attract some other people. Like maybe it's focused on gluten-free baking again, and you could tap into some other gluten-free communities.

So that's where we could say, well, what if you got on some podcasts that also talk to the same gluten-free community, right? Maybe it's gluten-free lifestyle, not baking, but there is an overlapping audience, right? Then we think about the activities you could do to attract people that would be great for your overall business, but also specifically this new thing that you're creating. And so you could do podcast interviews, you could do guest blog posts, right? Of course, you want to continue with your own blog posts and your Instagram. So you can see we're like layering on some new activities to help promote what you have coming that's a little bit new and different from what you've done before.

Then what you want to do is think about, okay, take a step back and say, can I do all these things at the same time? The answer might be yes, if there's a lot of overlap, or it might be, oh my gosh, no, like this is a lot. So then we have to think about how to prioritize them because you can't do it all. And I like to think of things in terms of level of effort. So like pebbles are small things that you could do in an afternoon. Rocks maybe take a few days or a week and boulders are huge. So if you find yourself looking at multiple boulders, like let's say for Convert, you're like, I'm going to create three courses by the end of this year.

boulders. Let's say for Convert, you're like, I'm going to create three courses by the end of this year. No, you're not. If you do that, you're not going to do all the other things. So making sure that, okay, you can take on some pebbles, you can take on a rock, maybe one boulder, but let's be realistic about what we're doing and what we want to take on. And I don't have a visual to show because we're on a podcast, but there's like a very simple graph. You can just imagine impact is like the line going up and down and effort is the line going left to right. And you want to chart these things and say, okay, what is the impact on my business of doing these activities? And what's the effort? And you want to make sure that you only do things that are high impact and low effort or high impact and high effort. So if something is

low impact, you don't want to do it. So sometimes people will do things because they feel like they just have to keep up with other people. And I've told people, I'm giving you permission to not post on Instagram for the next several weeks. And they're like, Cynthia, what are you doing? I'm like, we've looked at your data. Instagram is not going to drive things for you. So like, take that energy and start working on your podcast or start working on reaching out for speaking gigs, like, you know, giving them permission to do things that they're like, wait a minute, I thought I had to do it because everyone's doing it. And it's like, well, no, like, let's chart it out. If this has such a low impact on you, and it's high effort, why are you doing it?

This is where the personalization comes into play. So you want to think about the different activities, prioritize them, and then tackle them one at a time, really systematically. I love your thought process. It was a lot, but I think it's so encouraging. I think what you just shared is very encouraging. And I think sometimes people need permission to pull the things out of their business that don't spark joy, or that they hate doing. And they are like, I'm just doing this because I guess that's what content creators and bloggers do. That means I have to do it. No, you don't. We have people in our ultimate blog bootcamp right

now who are like, I don't want to grow on Instagram. That is not my goal. And that is not something that we tell them that they have to do. Then you are going to have to lean into other ways that you can connect with your ideal reader. But we would never want anybody to feel like in order to be a blogger, that also means that they have to prioritize growing on Instagram. And that really is... I think that we're in a day and age that we have people who are still very gung-ho. And I'm just using social media as the example here. But who are very gung-ho on social media. But then you have people who are still very gung-ho, and I'm just using social media as the example here, but who are very gung-ho on social media. But then you have people who are like, hold on, I'm trying to

get off my phone. I don't want to be on my phone a lot. Or I don't want to have to spend more time on growing my social media following. I want to spend more time on the content that I own, which is on my website and my blog. And so that's where I want to spend my time. And our encouragement is just you can do that. You have to be very methodical in how you're doing that. But I think that goes back to, once again, the foundations. That you're asking yourself that question from the very beginning. What is the goal with this business? Is it a business at all? Or is it just a hobby? And from there, then we go to the then you

go to the niche and you go to what the problems are that you're that you're helping with and then you go to what lights you up what sparks joy and then what can you do to connect with your readers more i think that you've given this kind of roadmap that is so beneficial and so helpful in a really honest and transparent way. And I just want to say thanks for that just as a blogger myself, but also for our community, because I think it's important for people to recognize that no two businesses are going to be built the same. But we all really do have the same questions that we have to ask ourselves from the beginning. And those answers are going to look different, which means that our next steps are going to look different. But if we are constantly looking at the person next to us as the measuring

stick, and as the idea of, oh, this is how I become successful. And this is the only way. My fear is that you're never going to find your own true success. And you're going to be so worried about building somebody else's business that looks... You're going to be worried about building your business that looks like somebody else's and that might light them up. But what if you get to that point that you've built your business, you have your multiple revenue streams, and you absolutely hate what you do? I mean, wouldn't it be easier to go have a boss and work 9 to 5 and get health insurance? Like, for real, if you're going to hate your job, that's not why we blog. We don't blog

or have these online businesses to in turn hate what we're doing every single day. This business is meant to let us lean into our passions and have us be helping people. I often say that bloggers are helpful and they're helpers. That's what we're doing. We're providing solutions to people who need them. And so I'm getting on my soapbox a little bit, I guess here. Sorry about that. But I just... No, I love it. I'm really passionate about what you've shared today.

I think it's really important. I think it's really just encouraging. You've empowered me today. So thank you. Good. Absolutely. And you mentioned goals, which we didn't even get into. But that's a big part of it too.

But you have to know where you're going. So goal setting is huge. But I'm glad to hear that this resonated with you and Jennifer and hopefully your listeners, because I work with people who get to that point where they are so discouraged because they've looked around and they're like, I hate Instagram. And I'm like, great, don't do it. Like, let's go find you speaking gigs and let's go on Facebook because that's where this person's audience specifically is. And it just, yeah, I think you're right. There is this shift from follow the system. This is exactly how you do it to, no, let's help you figure out the best way for you to do it. And great point about loving what you do. I mean,

that's the cliche is that being an entrepreneur gives you that freedom about loving what you do. I mean, that's the cliche is that being an entrepreneur gives you that freedom to love what you do, but it is also very tempting to follow other people's path. And like you said, to find yourself in a place where you don't love what you do. And I've been in that road. I mean, there's a reason why I have changed the businesses I have, or even just like woken up and been like, what am I doing? Like, I'm dreading today. This is normal. It's okay to have that. But I am in full control. And there's no boss to blame. So let's change it up. So I think feeling that way is normal, but also giving yourself the permission to change. I mean, I'm changing so often my students and people in my community are like, Cynthia, like, when you change, it makes me feel like I can

change. I'm like, of course you can. Do what you need to do. The industry is moving quickly. Things are happening fast. Why do you have to stay static? You don't. We're changing in our own lives. I mean, we're all in different seasons all the time. So in different seasons of our lives, things come more effortlessly than they do in other seasons. And I think just recognizing that that pivot doesn't mean that you're failing. It just means that you continue to lean into how can you show up as a content creator, as a blogger, as an online business owner. That's just part of the job, quite honestly. And I think when we just allow ourselves

to do that, to pivot, to change, to try new things, to grow. When we've put thought process into it, when we've not just changed to change, it's empowering because we know like, hey, I'm going to learn a new skill. Hey, I might get in front of a new audience that I otherwise wouldn't have gotten in front of. And that's the beautiful thing about this business is just getting to meet so many people and connecting with so many like-minded people who are passionate generally about the same things that you are. Absolutely. And I think that comes from having, going back to like the, one of the first things we talked about is having some stability in your business, right? And like, I think it's a luxury to be able to explore other revenue streams for a lot of people. And when you approach it from a place of opportunity and not desperation,

you bring a whole new energy to it. And I think that's just the key. If you're searching for like, oh, the next big thing, you most likely are not going to find it or you're going to feel so pressured to get it right. You're just going to self-sabotage in a way. So I think the key is to have a foundation, have an email list, have a revenue stream. And it doesn't have to be huge, but a consistent revenue stream that you're like, okay, at least I know if I create content and I'm going to work towards getting accepted to this ad network, or I'm going to pitch brands for sponsored content, whatever it is, that's right for you. Have that one revenue stream first, I think, before you put pressure on yourself to do more.

Because I think that's just when it can all implode. And you feel like you're behind and you're not doing enough. When really, the most successful bloggers, I think, have just been consistent and have been doing the same thing long enough to see the results. And it builds over time. This incremental 1% better is what Bjork talks about. And 1%, 1%, it compounds. And it's not like you're doing anything crazy different.

You're just showing up. And then you get to a place where you have the space and energy to see what else is out there. So much good, solid advice all around. I've absolutely loved our talk today. And I feel like what you've given our listeners is some really actionable advice. They can listen to this episode today and they can put some things

in place in their business immediately to start working towards creating that multi-dimensional business that they want in the future. So thank you so much for just breaking this down and explaining it in such a helpful way. And I know that you have several ways that you work with people. And so could you tell us just a little bit about how our audience can connect with you and in the different ways that they could work with you? Yeah, absolutely. So the easiest way to work with me is actually through something that I call the niche concierge. This is a freebie, but it's not a download. It's me. It's my time. So this is like kind of unheard of. But I am so passionate about helping people find their niche that I have a

very short survey, it'll take you like less than two minutes, you fill it out. And then I am going to create a video and personally design a niche statement for you and then give you recommended action steps based on where you are. And so like I go and I like, I look you up. I looked at your website. I looked at your Instagram. I see what's going on and I will give you recommendations and people have found it really helpful and valuable because they're like, oh my gosh, like you actually did it. It was not AI. It wasn't a bot. No, it's me. So if you want to take me up on it while I'm still offering it, you can go to the culinaryboss.com forward slash niche, N-I-C-H-E.

And again, just a quick type form survey that you fill out. And within two business days, I'm going to get back to you with a video. So that's super fun and free. And then the other way you can work with me is through Mise en Place. So Mise en Place is my core service within the Culinary Boss. And I essentially help you with your strategy, tech and operations so that you can focus on your culinary zone of genius. What that specifically means is that I help you every quarter on your roadmap for the quarter, exactly what you're going to be doing across your funnel. So attract, engage, convert. We come up with your key metrics and our team actually updates those metrics for you every week. I also give you my insights so you know what's important, what numbers you should be

paying attention to and what you should be doing to improve them. We also have a task planning system, one-on-one calls with me and weekly office hours. So it is not a course. It is not a course. It is not even one-on-one coaching, I'd say. It's actually like having a culinary business manager in what I like to call your apron pocket. So if you've wanted that business mind to be a partner for you, that's exactly what this is. And I'm so excited. We just launched our first group in, gosh, a few weeks ago. And it's already been amazing just to help people see what they have in front of them and give them clarity on their next step. So if you always want to have that idea of like, what's my next step?

If you're asking yourself that, this is the answer to that. You will always know your next step and you'll have support to execute. So again, it's called Mise en Place and you can go to joinmise.com. Awesome. That freebie is incredible, by the way. So we will put all these links in the show notes. And I hope that if you're listening to this, you take advantage of that for sure. So thank you so much, Cynthia, for everything that you have given us today. You've given us a lot of insight and a lot of motivation. And I just thank you so much for taking time to pour into our audience today. It's meant a lot. Thank you.

Yeah, thank you. Thanks so much for tuning in today. If you'd like to continue the conversation about blogging with us, please find us on Instagram at Spark Media Concepts. You can also sign up for our weekly newsletter where we share blogging tips and inspiration. You can sign up by finding the link in the show notes. For those of you who are ready for the next step and want to start your own blog, join the waitlist for the ultimate blog bootcamp. The link to join the waitlist is also in the show notes. Go out and make today a great day.