The Unplanned Podcast with Matt & Abby - Love on the Spectrum: Why Abbey Romeo wants to get married

Episode Date: March 5, 2025

Abbey Romeo stole hearts on Love on the Spectrum, and today, she’s opening up about growing up with autism, her dream of getting married, and why she’s never having kids. She reflects on feeling isolated as a child, finding love with David, and how she sees marriage as becoming a princess. Plus, Abbey’s mom gets emotional as she shares her biggest fear for Abbey’s future. This episode is sponsored by Wildgrain, Needed, Liquid IV and BetterHelp. Wildgrain: Get $30 off your first box plus free croissants in every box when you go to https://Wildgrain.com/unplanned or use promo code UNPLANNED at checkout. Needed: Head to https://thisisneeded.com and use code UNPLANNED for 20% off your first order. LiquidIV: Get 20% off your first order of Liquid I.V. when you go to https://LiquidIV.com and use code UNPLANNED at checkout. BetterHelp: Visit https://BetterHelp.com/unplannedpodcast today to get 10% off your first month. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

In Love on the Spectrum season one, they're interviewing me and they said, what is your fear for Abby's future? And I said, my fear is that the world will be mean to her and hurt her when I'm gone. As a kid, I felt left out in the cold. I felt isolated and alone and I used to identify with Ariel. She wanted to be where the people were, just like how I wanted to be where the typical kids were.

The way you have mothered Abby so selflessly for 26 years. You've done so much work for her. She's the one that's done the work. Tell me a little bit about your autism. The type of autism I have is where you have autism communication disorder. I had 22 years of speech therapy and 15 years of occupational therapy. To get where I am today to be able to talk just like this. Wow.

And look at me now. You're excellent at talking. I've had such a good time talking to you and I'm excited to talk to you more. So your autism, that is really a big motivation that Love on the Spectrum wanted to have you on their show. What was it like filming Love on the Spectrum? Did you enjoy it? Was it a lot of work?

The first day they came and filmed, I stayed in my room with me sitting still and I was completely zoned out and I had a hard time focusing. So luckily, another day they came back and they finally let me walk around so I could focus better. No way! Wait, was that kind of scary with all these big cameras everywhere? Yeah. It was in some ways, but I didn't care about being on Love on the Spectrum.

You didn't? Well, I did care, because I never knew I was going to be on TV until now. And now you're kind of like a celebrity in a way. Yeah, I would say so. Well, I don't want to be too conceited. I think it's fair. A lot of people probably recognize you and enjoyed watching you on the show Do people ask for pictures?

Yes, fans do so when people want to take a picture with you. How does that make you feel? very happy Successful, I mean accepted for who I am And that's a big deal because I remember you sharing about how when you were a kid you didn't feel that way so much as a kid I felt left out in the cold. I felt isolated and alone and I used to identify with Ariel. Because Ariel was a mermaid living in a world alone under the sea. She wanted to be where the people were just like how I wanted to be where the typical kids were and when Ariel finally became human she couldn't talk. That's how I felt. Wow

that really is a perfect group. That's whyermaid and Ariel were still even important to me today. Wow, and your hair clip kind of reminds me of Ariel too. Yeah. Did you do that on purpose? Uh, starfish hair clip. Yeah. Yeah, that was gonna say that's something else we have in common. We both also really, really love Disney. Disney's huge in our house. Well, even before we started recording, you looked down at what you're holding in your hand

and you counted them and realized you have 20. Yeah! Which is just like Ariel in the movie. Yeah! What does she say? You want thing of a bobs? I got 20. But who cares? Cares, no big deal.

I want more! That's so funny. I meant the real Ariel at the Grove. No way! I think two years ago. The real Ariel? Jodie Benson! What?! Wait, she does the voice of the real Ariel at the Grove. No way. I think two years ago. The real Ariel? Jodie Benson. What? Wait, she does the voice of the original Ariel.

Yeah. Was she nice? Oh yes. Was she pretty? Like a real princess probably. Yeah. It was really an amazing thing. She DM'd Abby.

So we got Abby's reaction to the DM from Jodie Benson. Oh my gosh. And it was one of the most amazing moments for me as her mom that like this is even happening for decades. Jodie Benson, Jodie Benson, Ariel. They were having dinner with her at the Grove. Oh my gosh you got dinner? Yeah. You're like I've heard your voice in my house for years. Yes and she's absolutely ethereal, iconic, and lovely and sweet and an amazing mother. She has two kids. Her story is just beautiful. So, so sweet and kind and they actually sang

a couple of bars of Ariel together. No. Yes, at the Grove. Abby, that's incredible. Was this like a private thing or was it in front of people? We was just in a restaurant. It had an open patio outdoor and there was Jodie and there was Abby and they just started singing together.

What did you sing? Which song? Part of your world. Of course. Of course you did. And I have some of my original songs too. That's right. I was looking at your Instagram and I saw you've been releasing music. Categories is your latest release, right? Yeah, my latest release.

It's how my mind works. That's so cool. Tell us a little bit about categories. The way my mind works, categories and memories come first before any words or emotions do. So right now I'm in a Gestalt language brain and memory therapy. And I'm learning how the three parts of the brain, the smart brain, the emotional brain, and the survival brain. And my five senses too.

So writing that song, was that therapeutic for you to get to explain the world? Yeah, I wrote it with my friend Casey Kelly, my cousin's college roommate. No way. Hel helped me with it. And is she, is this person that co-wrote the song with you, is that what she does for her job is like write music and stuff? Not necessarily. I mean she, she has a different job. She just does it for fun.

And she happens to know Abby and she's very talented and patient and she has worked with Abby on a couple songs to get the feelings, the imagery onto the paper, the words, and then they kind of do it together. It's been amazing to watch the process. That is so fun. I also love music and I got my feet wet with that whole world of music last year and it blows my mind how many talented people there are, you know, and how much work goes, like you hear a song, you don't realize how much work goes into one song, so I know you put a lot of work into that song. Yeah.

Yeah. It takes like a year for her to really get it done and all that sort of stuff, yeah. Yeah, it's not easy, people think, oh music, like that's, oh these people that are big artists, they, you know, they're famous for no reason. No, these people are very talented, and they work so hard.

So that, I mean, you should be very proud of yourself that you put out your own original song. How cool. And it's always been about the love of music. It's never been about wanting to be touring the US, although if anyone wants to, don't care. But it's just about the love of music because, Abby, why don't you tell everybody about how you could sing before you could talk? I could sing before I could talk. No way. I started singing when I was two years old and when I turned three I did something called music therapy with a woman named Casey. She'd come in with a guitar, she'd play the guitar and I can remember a note.

Wow. No way. Did you grow up doing theater? I was in a play called The Miracle Project when I was in junior high for people on the spectrum. Theater, yeah. That is so cool. We love theater too. We actually met doing theater. I'm in a theater right now called Epic Players. That is so cool. We love theater too. We actually met doing theater. I'm in a theater right now called Epic Players. That's cool. She's in a neurodivergent theater company and I have used theater as a therapeutic intervention since day one and I did some acting stuff back in college and back in the day when I you know all that stuff but I used the principles of acting to practice social skills and I started doing it right when she was four. Wow. Yep right in the day when I, you know, all that stuff. But I used the principles of acting to practice social skills. And I started doing it right when she was four.

Wow. Wow. Yep, right in the moment, right when it happens. Okay, let's try that again. This time we're gonna say, hi, my name is Abby. What's your name? Like when she was, you know, like four and didn't know social cues. So I'm a big advocate of anyone with social skills

to practice and have a safe environment to be able to enhance their self-confidence and just have a little bit more of that I'm in control instead of the variables of unstructured language which can be really hard for some people. I feel like in general the theater community is such an accepting and warm community so it's probably like good people to be around and to try new things. And how cool is it that, Abby, here you are, you grew up doing theater and you probably thought,

oh, if I'm ever famous one day, it might be because I played Ariel on Broadway. But now you're famous for just being you. How cool is that? Yes, I am! How cool is that that people just like you for who you are? It's amazing. That must be a really cool feeling, especially

growing up feeling like you didn't belong and now you feel seen and feel heard and that must feel so empowering and you must feel, I don't know, I could be completely wrong, but you must feel really jazzed up to be 26 and just living your life. Yeah, and I feel more, I don't feel as autistic as I did as a kid, but I'm still on the spectrum. I still am.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've heard you say a lot in interviews and conversations that when you were a kid, you felt alone, but you always knew that when you grew up you kind of had that perspective that you when you grew up you'd be accepted and yeah that's why I say as a kid I want to be an adult right now that's so because I isolated alone what made you have hope for the future as an adult do you know what that was I knew my brain would do what I was telling it to do really you never gave up on yourself that's so. When she was 12 she had this moment where, look, language was

really hard because I didn't know what she was feeling. I didn't know what she was thinking. I didn't know what was happening. So you have to be like a detective. It's very difficult from the caregiver point of view because they're not able to really express like, I don't like school because blank. You just don't know. But one day she was sitting on her bed, she was 12, and she was very frustrated. And she was just in a self-awareness moment, and she just turned to me and said,

my stupid brain, why won't it do what I'm telling it to do? And she went, my stupid brain. And then she said, I just wanna take it out and give it to someone else, and take a typical kid's brain and put it in my head. And then I said, why are you so angry? And she said, because I want what typical kids have. Yeah.

And I, and I, that's why I used to, I felt like a mermaid because mermaids couldn't talk. I mean, that must have been so hard for you as Abby's mom to see her go through that. How did you cope as a mom who just wants your daughter so badly to feel like they belong? Like, how did you cope? Was there a certain parent that you- I mean, I did everything. Some things that were really stupid.

Like, me, if I was like the funny mom, the first graders would like me more and then therefore they'd like her more. Like I was like acting like, I mean there were moments of like that like in the lineup on the play yard when she was in the typical school. Like I'd be all like cool,

like to help bridge how she was interpreted. It's like fail that didn't work. First graders are not gonna respond to that crazy mother over there I think she's cool cuz she's dancing on the play yard you know what I mean like I did that I did therapies I did interventions I went to every conference and and you know seminar that I could to learn more about this. So I've seen some of the autism greats over my lifetime because I went everywhere. Temple Grandin is one of the most famous people with autism. I went to her

seminars when Abby was four. I have a book from Temple Grandin that says signed to Abby which I have is one of my archival that's one of my you know family heirlooms. But I said to myself back then, what did her mother do? And I found that her mother, Eustacia Cutler, was speaking at some conference. So I ran to that conference. It wasn't even that many people, it was like 50 people in a room, which was insane, because these conferences have thousands.

And met her, listened to her, took notes. I have a book from Eustacia Cutler signed to Christine. So I've got the book from Temple to her and the mother's book signed to me. And then I went to Chico State University and I got to do a speech and talk to their community and I brought my book from Temple to show those people in the audience that I was them at one point sitting in the audience just trying to figure this stuff out. And I talked about the mother, I held that book up and then Temple Grandin, who was the afternoon keynote speaker of the same event, stood up and was in my speaking engagement.

Wow. She was? And I didn't know she was going to be there listening to me. And you're like, I have to... So I was like, okay, I can retire now. I can go to heaven. Like my life. The universe has a store for me.

Like that moment was truly, I, it just made me want to say, believe in dreams, believe in your hope, focus on the positive. Because if that could happen, I can't wait to win the lottery. No. I can't wait to win the lottery. I know. And when Abby is celebrated and seen the way that you see her on the Netflix show Love on the Spectrum, was that a similar experience for you then? Everything that has happened since that, like with her being accepted, she says it best. How does it make you feel? It's the same for me. I feel like she's accepted. It's not about. How does it make you feel? It's the same for me. I feel like she's

accepted. It's not about celebrity or people recognizing you. I am so grateful for every single person that just says, we love you. Like for us, it's just like liquid gold. I mean, it's those moments of just gratitude and human connection and just that acceptance. And we hope that other people like Abby and their caregivers that when they're out in the world that other people will embrace their differences rather than judge them. That's what I'm hoping. Because it's a very, very difficult when you're at

the elementary school and she's having a meltdown because the bell went off and all the parents are staring at you like. Why did I have a meltdown when the bell went off? Because of auditory. It was hurtful. It hurt your ears. See a bell to me is a pain. It's annoying. But it hurts her ears. It's painful. And that's the difference because she's processing auditory sound very differently than I am. Abby, how does it feel that like before we started this interview you're telling me about how you love Sharkboy and Lava Girl.

How does it feel that you are now friends with the person that played Sharkboy? It's amazing! I was a big fan of him growing up. And my favorite part of Sharkboy and Lava Girl is when they go to the Land of Milk and Cookies. That place is awesome. Those cookies look so, so yummy. When you met Taylor Lautner, what did you think about him? He was amazing. Isn't he so nice? Oh yeah. He I was expecting him to be this like super tough guy because we we also got to meet them and like do podcasts with them kind of like you guys did. I thought he's gonna be like this super like macho

like he's you know he's in Twilight he's the wolf but he was so nice amazing and Tay his wife is also amazing and lovely and they just made Abby feel and me so welcomed and just kind of go with the flow we had a really great time with them and what's their dog's name? Remi. Oh that's right. What kind of dog was Remi? I can't remember but beautiful dog. You have a dog too Clement right. What kind of dog was Remy? I can't remember, but beautiful dog. You have a dog too, Clementine, right? What's Clementine doing today? She's back at my house and Ben's there with his little puppy Navi.

She's an Australian Shepherd. Cute. We have a puppy at our house now, so that's been amazing. You have a puppy? My son came back from Indiana with a puppy that's a mini Australian Shepherd. And I've never actually had a small dog in my life. I've only had big dogs. So we're in love with this little angel. Well, yeah, I was listening to you guys on the squeeze

and you said that your dog Clementine is 75 pounds. That's a big dog. That's a big dog. Yeah. Big baby, big dog. We love her. She's a mixed, we rescued her. Well, yeah, we were,

Abby and I were talking about the story of how you got Clementine, which seems so cool because Clementine's from Joshua Tree, right? This episode of the Unplanned Podcast is brought to you by Wild Grain. There are very few things more comforting than fresh baked, warm, delicious bread. When you bake fresh bread, it actually changes my life.

Every single time. It makes me very happy and I feel very accomplished and proud but also it is a labor of love. That's why wild grain is so cool because you can get those same delicious bread fresh baked bread scents in your house without all the labor involved and in a way that supports numerous different dietary needs. Wild grain is the first baked from frozen subscription box for artisanal breads, pastries, and pastas. Wild Grain's boxes are fully customizable to your tastes and dietary restrictions. In addition to their classic variety box,

they recently launched a new gluten-free box and a plant-based box that is 100% vegan. Our first box is actually on the way to our house right now. I cannot wait. I'm like so excited to get that happy meal, be baking some bread in our house, and it's really cool that they have so many different types of options too.

So, are you ready to bring all your favorite carbs right to your doorstep? Be sure to check out Wild Grain so you can begin building your box of artisanal breads, pastas, and pastries. For a limited time, Wild Grain is offering our listeners $30 off the first box plus free croissants in every box when you go to wildgrain.com slash unplanned to start your subscription. You heard me. Free croissants in every box and $30 off your first box when you go to wildgrain.com slash

unplanned. A croissant? Oh ho ho! Wildgrain.com slash unplanned or use promo code unplanned at checkout. Do you want to tell everybody a little bit, like fill people in on how you got Clementine and the person that I think the person that gave you Clementine found Clementine like on the side of the road in Joshwood Street. Yeah and I don't talk to that person anymore. We had a helper that lived with us and she so Abby was terribly afraid of dogs and it's in in autism for us there's certain things

that Abby I don't think can really explain but one of them is the feeling of being startled. So we used to think that it was the octave of a dog barking that hurt her ears but now I'm sort of zeroing in on it's the startling that happens when a dog barks abruptly. Oh. And I think that's the thing that you know you have to really peel away the layers. So that really made her be afraid of all dogs at all times. We get this helper, she moved into my house to help me out. We were bothering, that's how I got through my single motherhood, is I'd have someone move into my back room.

And then her dog. My little bedroom. And she had a dog. She said, and I love this girl so much, and she brought her dog, her American Bulldog, and she's like, oh, I want my dog to move into. And Diesel tried to. True, the dog moves in. He did. Diesel's his name? Yeah, he spoke in dog language that he was barking to say change the memory in dog language.

Is that what you think? Yeah he was saying change the memory to help me overcome my fears of dogs barking. Right because she was living with a dog and this was a very sweet dog. She learned that dogs bark when they're like scared or they're just someone knocked on the door and she slowly lost the fear of the dog barking and the reaction. So we had been talking about getting Abby her own dog so she could learn responsibility and it could be her pet to take care of. Diesel got bone cancer and died in a very short window of time. And so our helper was in Joshua Tree with some friends and she said, I saw a sign that said, free puppies on the side of the road.

Someone was giving them away. And she called me on one Sunday and she said, I've had a spiritual moment with this puppy that has come to me and crawled up into my arms and this is just what Diesel did when I rescued him from the pound." And she said, I think Diesel is bringing this dog to you. And I said, I just said, I trust your instinct. If this is the dog we're supposed to have, bring it. And Clementine then was there within six hours.

I was not prepared. I had nothing. And we had this puppy and the rest is history and Clementine has been a very, very important part of Abby's life. Does Clementine bark sometimes? Only when someone comes in. Oh, how do you feel about that? It's not as bad as it was. You know what else, speaking of other auditory issues, I went to Joshua Tree, there were two roosters crowing

at four in the morning. Oh gosh. While I was asleep, I could hear a rooster crowing in the middle of the night. We used to live in Hawaii and we would hear roosters crowing at four in the morning. Oh gosh. While I was asleep, I could hear a rooster crowing in the middle of the night. We used to live in Hawaii and we would hear roosters crow all the time because for whatever reason. Especially if I'm asleep, a rooster crowing. Isn't that annoying?

You could hear it even when you were sleeping. Yeah, I could hear the roosters crow in the middle of the night. You guys lived in Hawaii. We did and it's funny because she mentions the roosters all the time. There's just like, there's kids holding roosters. I thought they were supposed to crow at the morning.

They would crow at all through the night. All through the day. We went to Hawaii. Do you remember seeing all the chickens around? Yeah, there were so many chickens in Hawaii. And you see the kids just carrying them around in their hands? Yeah. Those kind of chickens.

They're like their little pets. That was the truth. Yeah. Like, obviously you used to not really like hearing dogs bark but now you're seem to be more okay with it. With roosters are you still not a huge fan of their crowing? Well their crowing is just annoying

especially when I'm sleeping. Yeah. Then how does that make you feel? Like babies crying is annoying. Yes, cause we have two babies and so I didn't know if, do you try not to be around babies crying cause it might make you feel

Stressed if they're if they're crying really loudly. Yeah, what do you do to help yourself? Listen to music and you know what sound? Ted Helps me to ignore a sound. I don't like the dial-up modem sound Really the dial-up modem sound is how the internet first started That's how'd you find that Because when I was three years old, I had a big Apple iMac G3 and whenever I'd go on the internet, I remember hearing that sound when I was like two and a half. Oh. Can I help explain this to you? Yes. So what she's saying is that that internet sound from the dial-up modem is very pleasant and very pleasing to her. It calms her down. So when she's feeling dysregulated,

she's working in speech, that listening to that sound, which you can just Google, is regulating for her. Wow. No way. Not my choice, not my understanding. It's the memory of my old computer.

I remember hearing it on the old computer when I was like three years old. It's the memory of, I think, the sound, which brings her back to a feeling and a time that was she was relaxed or something so that's why she I think it's kind of a cool sound effect. I'm gonna have to I'm gonna look that up after this. What does David think about the that sound?

Does he like that sound too? It's kind of a little bit annoying but to me the static part sounds like the ocean waves. Sounds like the ocean. I want to talk a little bit more about love on the spectrum. I want to ask you, what was that decision? Or it sounds like a waterfall. The dilatmotum sound? The static part sounds like a waterfall.

All relaxing sounds. It's kind of cool. That's awesome. Or some of it sounds like a guitar string. Okay. And do you remember AOL? No, I never had AOL. Don't you have an AOL email Abby? Or yours is Hotmail? I have Hotmail. Her friend Alana Stewart does AOL. Alana Stewart does. He's older. That's the whole joke with the people that got their emails 20 years ago. I don't know how I still have an active hotmail, honestly. Yeah, it's funny. Sorry, I brought a hotmail, got us off subject.

Abby was asking about love on the spectrum. I imagine that was a tough decision to make as a parent. Yeah, you mean going on love on the spectrum? Yes. It was, first of all, it was happening during COVID and no one knew what it was. It was just literally a guy, this is how they found Abby. She was in a theater program called Spectrum Laboratories,

where it's to me, therapeutic social skills in theater, you know, help you with your connecting socially. She's in that program. The producer, Kion, went to many autism programs, looking for just different people and meeting people. So they called us and just said, there's a guy who's doing some sort of maybe a documentary on relationships

and autism and he wants to zoom with you because it was 2020. So I didn't know anything about it, I didn't know what it was, and they zoomed and that was great. Then they called back about a month later, we zoomed again, still didn't know what it was. Third time they called back again and then they say, we were kind of sitting next to each other because I still didn't know what it was. And the guy says, can we have a moment alone with Abby?

I go in the other room, I'm sort of standing by like our washroom, but I can kind of see her. And so she's zooming with Kion. And you were zooming with him and then you turned in the middle of the interview to me off camera and you said, mom, how come when you're driving, you call everyone an asshole? Yeah. me off camera and you said, mom, how come when you're driving, you call everyone an asshole? And I don't know who these guys are.

I go, Abigail, that is, keep focused to the question that is being asked of you. And they asked her, at the very end they said, you know, we want you to be part of this project. And I'm like, okay, what is this project? I had never heard of it because it hadn't come out yet. Maybe their season one had just come out, is what I think, I think maybe. So, he said it's gonna be on this little network called, starts with the letter N.

Yeah, just a little one. It's not NBC, and I said Netflix. It's Netflix. They said Netflix, I was like, oh my gosh. Okay, so then, you know, I watched the season one and the season two of, or season one of Australia's Love on the Spectrum, and I'm just gonna tell you the truth from my point of view.

Which was, when I watched those individuals on the spectrum, I saw a man driving a city bus as his job, a couple traveling Europe on their own, people that didn't need aids or helpers, and people with no expressive language problem. And I truly said to the producers, I love your show, I laughed, I cried, these people are lovely, she's not right. I said, those people have what we formally called Asperger's.

And are you okay? And I said, Abby doesn't have that. She has language struggles. If you want someone, that's going to be really hard. And they said, we want to show more diversity of the spectrum. Ah. That's when I said, okay, then we should include. We're going to do this. So that's when we decided to give it a whirl. And what Abby said earlier, remember what you were talking about once they came to the house with the very first day?

I already explained that. I know, you sat in a room that was hot and you couldn't move, remember? She was sort of sitting there and they were asking these questions and it was a bit of a struggle. And I was listening in the other room and I thought to myself, what have I done?

This is so not fair that I sort of threw her in this thing or encouraged her to try doing this thing when The questions were too much the reciprocal language was too much and I felt really bad And I kind of cried a little bit and I thought I made a mistake But I didn't want to rob her of the chance Do you see what i'm saying? Like I was really I felt caught so by a miracle

They called in the next week and they said we want to come back because I thought oh, they're we're never gonna do this They're gonna say no this didn't work. Yeah, they came back and said we'd like to shoot Abby in her natural environment Just letting her walk around the house. Yes, like do her thing and I was like, oh, okay, and that second day they came back What did you do for Keyons? You remember what you did when Keon came back? You told stories, you did impressions. And she did an impression of Bruce the shark from Finding Nemo, because he's Australian too. But I'm not Australian. You're not.

Can I have a break? Do you want a break? Oh yeah, let's take a break. Thank you to Needed for sponsoring this portion of today's episode. What percentage of pregnancies do you think are unplanned? Oh gosh, I said this already last time and I completely forgot what it is. I'm gonna say 40%. Yeah, you got it. I've already told you this twice. It's never

too early to start thinking about improving your fertility and that's why we're excited to introduce you to today's sponsor, Needed. Needed is a women-owned brand that offers a complete nutritional system for fertility, pregnancy, postpartum, and women's health, from egg quality support to women trying to conceive, to a lactation support plan for breastfeeding moms, to stress and sleep support that supports all women, including those in perimenopause. I think Needed is an incredible brand. I love that it's entirely women-owned because I feel like women's health is an area that

we're starting to recognize more and more is severely under research, under supported. I also love though that they also have sperm support for men because you know they're 50 percent of this fertility thing here. That's pretty cool. And it's a very important ingredient. Represent. And I love that they're thinking about that too.

There's so much on the journey to parenthood that you can't control, but nutrition is a big one that you can. Needed is a collective of more than 6,000 practitioners working together to set a radically better standard for women's health. So head to thisisneeded.com and use code unplanned for 20% off your first order. So Abby's walking around the house, doing her own thing,

leading the producers around. She's funny, she's articulate, she's a laugh a minute, and I now as the mother am going, that's my girl. Yeah. That's what, she's articulate, she's a laugh a minute. And I now as the mother am going, that's my girl. That's what I've seen her capable of. And the producer turned to me and he said, is she always like this? And I said, yes. That's so cool. This is what she's like. And I learned in that moment that there are so many kids, not just like Abby, but with ADHD or neurodivergent learners, I call them,

that need to be moving or doing, that do not function their best selves when they're sitting at attention like soldiers in a quiet room and they're not supposed to move and they're supposed to listen and write off the board and learn the way that our traditional schools have us learn. I love that you're saying that because I have a cousin

that goes to a private school where they change the classrooms to allow kids to sit on a bean bag, sit on the floor, lay on their back, do whatever they wanted to do to learn. Asking with ADHD, I cannot sit at a chair all day. Like, I'd like to do what my cousin does at his school where he can lay on his back on the floor if he wants. And so that's, I really love that when they came back, the producers with Love on the Spectrum,

I love that they just let Abby do what she wanted to do. It was very cool of them to let her do what she wanted to do, which they've done the whole time. They're very much let Abby, when they're shooting, just do her own thing. And they're very non-invasive. It's like, you hardly know they're there. That was the main thing I took away from that, which is to advocate for teachers who may not be familiar with alternative learners because they're older or they're,

you know, there's a lot of new stuff we're finding out about neurodiversity and learning, and I say, wow, you know, sit on a bean bag, sit on a rolling chair, give sensory breaks, let people move around. Teach in a way that's high affect. High affect means you're doing something. You're physically doing something to learn that lesson.

You're not just sitting there reading off the blackboard and writing it down. Like the idea of that sort of quiet, isolated, sit down, be quiet, I'm not a fan of that anymore. I know Abby's taking a break right now and yeah, like we totally respect that and I'm sure we'll talk more later about love on the spectrum, maybe a little bit about David, but for everybody listening right now who may know someone that has autism or maybe it's a parent,

maybe it's a mom, kind of in the same shoes that you were in when Abby was two and a half and she got diagnosed, what would you tell that parent who just had a child diagnosed with autism and they are just trying to figure out what to do, how to operate with this new normal? What advice would you tell them? I mean, if you've been officially diagnosed and you're between the ages of, say, two and five, that's a very hard chunk to be in of time with understanding what to do,

because there's no clear-cut path. My personal opinion is that autism is such a big word, and it means a million different things. And even 20 years ago, when I was doing this with her, I'd say don't panic, don't cry, be a detective, see what they're doing, put your ego in the toilet, and flush it, because that's, you know, no ego on this, because some parents, I think, think, you don't have to ask me for that.

Just you can do whatever you need. Okay, good idea. It's a daunting thing. And when I sat in the chair and they said autism spectrum disorder, everything went black in my head. Everything went into slow motion. I remember the woman, it was like in my face going, you're going to have a lot of work ahead of you, you're going to have a lot of work

ahead of you. You're going to have to be spending hours in therapy rooms and clinics. And I remember feeling that I was going invisible like, no, I don't want to do this. I don't want to do this. Like I waited to the last second to have kids. I'm not prepared. You know what I mean? And so it's a lot better now than it was 20 years ago in terms of information, accommodations and understanding.

I think people have changed their ways of understanding and embracing. So that's a plus. We didn't have that so much. There's a lot of judgment, a lot of dirty looks, a lot of people. I had people come up to me in this grocery store when she was struggling and just say, you should take care of your child. You know, that kind of stuff.

Oh my gosh. And I had those moments of one time one woman in a grocery store said, you should control your daughter. And I went, my daughter has severe autism, which was a bit of an exaggeration compared to what some people go through. And I said, and she's struggling with sensory issues. Would you like to take her for the weekend?

Because I would love a break. If I were you, I would like keep the super soaker on hand at all times. If anybody ever corrected my parenting when like you're doing an amazing job, I would have been like, hey, super soaker, to your face. I didn't know. But the hardest part right now is that,

and here's my pitch, everybody on the spectrum deserves services and support from the lowest support needs to the highest support needs. So hear me when I say that, because some people feel like I don't hear the low support needs. What I'm saying is low support needs, which is the terminology we use today, is different than the ABI support needs,

and ABI's different than the nonverbal or non-speaking. They're all different needs, but we don't have sort of like a protocol because we don't call it anything but autism spectrum. I'm on the spectrum. That's to me a vague term, and if we could get better language, I would say Abbey has autism communication disorder.

Some people have autism high intelligence, non-speaking. I'm reading a book right now called Underestimated about a young man named Jamie who at 17 gets a letter board. The father doesn't know the kid at all. He's banging and he's very troubled in expressing himself. They get him a letter board. He goes into a therapy. This is from, I think it was written in like 2010 or something,

and all this language comes out on a letter board. And that kid knew everything that was going on from the beginning, so there's that population of high intelligence that's non-speaking. And then you've got others that might have some cognitive impairment where it's a bit more of a struggle, so there's all these different things. So if you're newly diagnosed and you're a parent, is to find a community where you see

other parents that have kids with the same struggles as your kid. That way you're in the commonality of a therapy that might make sense. And that's even what I did. I'd go to conferences and I'd go but my kid doesn't do that Mm-hmm like I went to an Asperger conference. That's what we called it before 2013. So I can say that yeah 2011 is that is it like bad to say that in a way now? It's politically incorrect really because Hans Asperger the doctor who discovered you move over just a hair honey who discovered Asperger's He was connected to the Nazi party, I believe.

There's something that came up in his past. And that's fine, come up with a different word because that population is very different than the Abbey population. Sorry for, any more questions for me? Oh, of course. Yes, I was just finishing up talking about, a little bit about-

All right, finish the questions. For new parents, is that okay? Yeah. Can you please stop petting me like this? You can pet me. Do you guys like to pet each other? Are you okay? Yeah.

Do you need a sensory break? No, no, no. I'm good. Okay. But I guess his last name was Asperger, which is why people decided to get rid of the term because they didn't want to- Well, they got rid of the term Asperger's, but it was also because people with Asperger's were not getting the same services as people with autism.

This is my understanding, by the way. And so to make it a level playing field at the time that people in the boardroom at the American Psychiatric Association who creates the manual that people use to diagnose said, you know, let's just make it a level playing field. Everyone's on the spectrum. And I understand why they did that, but I think today we could say it's really not working. Because you took people with high, high intelligence, but limited social interests,

and now you've made them, instead of identifying, because a lot of Asperger people have high, high intelligence, now you've made them just on the spectrum. Finished my questions. I wanna talk a little bit about David. You fell in love with David on Love on the Spectrum. What's your favorite go-to date with David? My favorite date is that when we saw The Lion King on Broadway together.

We went to Africa together and we went to Disneyland or Universal Studios. Those are big dates. How often do you and David get to hang out? We hang out like or Universal Studios. Those are big dates. Yeah. How often do you and David get to hang out? We hang out like twice a week. That's awesome. That's really good. Monday, Fridays. What do you typically do when you hang out?

We go places like we go bowling, we go to Castle Park. Are you an avid bowler? Just don't put your mic up here. Huh? Do you like to bowl? I do. We actually went bowling last night. We did. Where did you go bowling?

It's a place called Bolero. Bolero? I think it's a chain. I've heard of that. Yeah, it's kind of fancy We grew up in the Midwest where we were saying there's so many like Rundown locally owned ones that are like really cheap, but here there's only like big chains It was like $32 for the two of us to bowl one game. And so I was like, this isn't the Midwest anymore. Well, I thought it was funny because I'm very competitive and Abby isn't and she smoked me in bowling. So when you, yeah, when you and David bowl, who typically wins? I don't know. You don't know who wins?

Uh, I sometimes me or David. Oh, just take turns? Yeah, we just take turns winning. Are you competitive? What does competitive mean? Like do you really wanna fight to win games or do you? I can be competitive sometimes, but I'm not that competitive.

What makes you competitive? Like I really wanna win a game because when I was younger, when I didn't win a game, I would get very upset. But what's changed now? It doesn't make you guys upset? No, not necessarily. I can get upset upset but not as bad

Not like I used to okay. Do you know why because I'm blaming it on autism Losing at a game reminded her it was because of autism she lost She had to work in therapy to change that association which therapy I Think the ones with Jackie that type of therapy the ones when they came to the house and you guys played games Yeah, was there a lot of fear involved in that? Yeah I think the ones with Jackie, that type of therapy, the ones when they came to the house and you guys played games. Yeah. Was there a lot of fear involved in that? Yeah, whenever I would win a game,

I would sing a song I like. And what's a song that you like? Part of Your World. Part of Your World! Comes back to that. Yeah, and my mom says you can't cry over a silly game because it reminds me of I was acting like a kid and I don't want to be like a kid at all.

But when you sing part of your world, did you dress up as Ariel like for Halloween as a kid? Like was that a big part of your life? I dressed up as Ariel for Halloween this year. No way! But it's size for women like me. Did you ask David to dress as like Sebastian? No, he dressed up as the shark. Oh, that's cool. Does David like Ariel like you like Ariel? It's on a list of his favorites. No way. But he has a whole list. How many? Do you know his list? It's too much. I want to try and make a long story short. It's like 12 movies. Like he has a whole like list of movies that are his favorite Disney movies. And what for you, Ariel is one of your favorite movie characters. What is one of David's favorite movie characters?

Mufasa. Mufasa! Oh, yeah. Well, think about it. James Earl Jones just died. Aw. That's very sad. It was his time.

Yeah. The circle of life. He was also Darth Vader in Star Wars. Wait, no way. I didn't know that. He was. He was the voice of Mufasa. And Darth Vader.

Yep. Wow. I didn't know that. He was. He was the voice of Mufasa. And Darth Vader. Yep. Wow. I didn't know that. He's a voice actor. He's a voice actor, but he's also been in a million movies. And her client knows, he was one of my mom's friends' clients. Yes. No way.

When you go on dates with David, does your mom go too, or his mom? Not really, but we did go to Toronto, Canada. Okay. Yes, that was true. We spoke at a conference in Debbie, David's mother's name. And then we took a plane from Toronto, Canada. Okay. Yes, that was true. We spoke at a conference and Debbie gave its mother's name. And then we took a plane from Toronto, Canada to Indianapolis. Wow, you travel a lot.

And you know what? What? What? Also, when we were leaving Indianapolis, there were two babies sitting in front of us. No way. Can you explain that story? Just the auditory. Unfortunately, we were on an airplane and there was a crying baby right next to Abby.

And we didn't have the right earphones and we didn't have the right plug for her phone. You know, you have to really bring two headjacks. You have to bring the round one that goes in if there's a movie, and then you need one for your phone. So anyways, it was pretty bad. And luckily we got to switch seats. That's good.

Yeah, we switched seats with another passenger. Thank God. I think you guys are honest with this headphone thing because with our second child our babies would cry a lot in the night I started listening to like really calming music when I would feed and change the diaper of my baby and it made it so Much less stressful because it's it's that's why I'm never having kids Anything I just want to stick with animals and that's it. That's fair. So no kids. You think you'll just be an animal mom? That's perfect. I think that's a great idea.

That's wonderful. How many dogs are you going to get? I don't know. Or cats, big cats. What did you used to tell me? You said you and David are going to have a house and in the backyard what are you going to have? Trained wild animals run in the backyard. Nice. In LA the backyard. Nice. In LA?

Yeah. Wow. You know what David does to tell me when I hear a baby crying, ignore it Abby, just ignore it. Oh, does he have sounds that bother him too? No, he just wants me to be, he doesn't want me to get dysregulated. Oh, that's really sweet. She says don't call the crying baby's names.

Oh. Like sometimes I call them names I don't like. Oh. It's a frustration when she can't get out the fact that it's hurting her, so. And I associate kids and adults to the couple song lyrics from a song I did when I was in elementary school. So songs have become language. It's the Gestalt language processing thing we were talking about earlier.

Like I did something called a visual dictionary. Like in my, like my therapist Ryan does AI, artificial intelligence, and she came up with a visual dictionary of crying babies eating vegetables and spicy foods, foods I don't like. Because those are categories of not good. So instead of saying I'm bothered, that makes me uncomfortable, I don't like this. She put the feeling words next to it. She speaks the memory. And you know what she drew a picture of a visual dictionary of adult women eating

junk food. No way. Because I like being an adult woman, I like junk food. Well I saw a video on your Instagram about you talking, you said that you think, you said witches eat vegetables. Yeah. Is there something like that that David will say to express something that yeah because I don't like witches and I don't like the texture of certain vegetables what about David does David do that he associates numbers his colors he has synesthesia no way that's very cool he thinks each number is a color that's why synesthesia made him very smart and math no way because that's why he was he got high grades in math. So every

number is a color and it goes up to like what 15 or 20 or something? Yeah something like that I'll have to ask him. But he does not have the associative gestalt language processing part. He has synaesthesia. So David is having to learn her gestalt language processing imagery stuff. Wow. And so it's a little bit tricky for David to learn that a lot of people don't understand that because he actually has a more clear cut language. Got it. That's more direct and so in their autism,

you behind the scenes, you see them try, he's trying to process it. Wow. It's not that easy for him. Which is why we want to honor Abby's categories and memories. We're not trying to take that away. If that's the way her brain goes boom, right to witches eat vegetables, that's what happens.

But we're trying to see if we can add a bridge where have the thought, say witches eat vegetables to yourself, but then say, I'm upset, I don't like this. Because the average person's not gonna understand. Think about it, I like for example, I'd say that adult women are mermaids and crying babies are the sea witch. Cause why? Cause I don't like the sound of crying babies and I didn't like the sound of Ursula's doing her evil laugh. Abby, I'm going to be honest with you. If you sat next to us on a plane, the pascal

flights we've been on, you would have thought a sea witch was on that plane. Because there was a lot of crying babies on that plane. You know what crying babies sound like to me? What? The wicked step sisters from Cinderella. Yes, yes. Well, you know it's funny because crying babies, obviously it sounds, it can sound like a sea witch when they're crying.

But the wicked witch of the west from the Wizard of Yeah, Margaret Hamilton. Can I tell you something? We met doing or we started dating when we were both performing in the Wizard of Oz. Yeah, I was a flying monkey Oh, and I was a castle guard. I was on stilts wearing a big green outfit and I was like 10 feet tall in the air Really? Yes. Thank you to liquid IB for sponsoring this portion of today's episode Do you like tastery tastery tasty hydration beverages? I do because we we do I personally like their sugar-free options, but you guys this is not a joke I literally have liquid IV every single day It's my afternoon pick me up because I feel like that's when I stopped drinking water

I work out in the morning and I feel like I get a lot of water in and then the day starts drifting on I'm like feeling the dehydration hit me and that's when I go for a liquid IV and I just chug it because they're so delicious, but also there's so many electrolytes in them. Liquid IV is powered by LIV HydroScience, an optimized ratio of electrolytes, essential vitamins and clinically tested nutrients that turns ordinary water into extraordinary hydration, eight essential vitamins and nutrients, and always non-mo vegan gluten-free dairy free and soy free I love there's a raspberry melon flavor. I love the rainbow sherbert one Great. I like the lemon. I like the peach. I mean really they're all so delicious. I like the strawberry

So so yummy They even have some with some caffeine in it if you're looking for that Totally recommend it and great for the kiddos as well If you're trying struggling to get their water intake up, definitely recommend Liquid IV. Treat yourself to extraordinary hydration from Liquid IV. Get 20% off your first order of Liquid IV when you go to liquidiv.com

and use code unplanned at checkout. That's 20% off your first order with code unplanned at liquidiv.com. Have you seen Oz the Great and Powerful, the prequel? We actually haven't. Mila Kunis was in it from Family Guy. Oh, I like her. She voiced Meg from Family Guy. Have you seen Oz the Great and Powerful the prequel? We actually haven't. No. Mila Kunis was in it from Family Guy. Oh, I like her.

She voiced Meg from Family Guy. I didn't know that either. You have a lot of facts about movies. Do you like movies and TV shows? Do you like The Simpsons? Oh, do we like The Simpsons? Speaking of The Simpsons, I'm obsessed with this scene in The Simpsons movie of Burt Simpsons skateboarding naked.

I'm sorry. And he has no clothes on and he's skateboard boys to a burger and there's this guy eating french fries and he says boys before we eat don't forget to thank the lord for the spoutful and then Bart goes and then he says something inappropriate and he and you say Abby you're hilarious! You're funny! Stop it! Abby you're hilarious! Okay now I'm gonna just give you the backstory.

This is her favorite story. She does it every time she sees a French fry because that's what's in the cartoon. They're eating French fries. So we're in the Louvre in Paris. There's a lot of statues of naked men. And in the Louvre, she did that full volume. Penis! In the Louvre.

Did people look at you funny when you shouted penis? In the Louvre? Yes. I think it's really sweet how David has you know, taken the effort to learn the way your brain works and how he can help you if you're saying you feel dysregulated maybe.

To help you like ignore the baby whenever you walk through it. Whenever I get startled startled can I talk about startled are we why don't you ask them can I talk about being startled of course you know I'm speaking of whenever I would get startled I do a certain gesture what was that gesture I would do that would do a certain gesture I would clap my hands and stick on my tongue and I shouldn't do it on the podcast I'm not gonna do it something called the dolly dance.

So she's down in a very deep memory right now. When she was much younger and she had a hard time with language, she used to do just the silly gesture thing like this, which kinda meant, she's sorta trying to be funny, I actually still don't quite understand how or why she did it. So she's referring to that. Only if I was upset or if I didn't get what I wanted,

I would do that. That's more of a frustrated thing. One of the things with missed out language processors is they use language when something happened. I used this reference before, like if the coffee spills when you're startled and then you get startled, every time you're startled again, you say the coffee spilled. Oh, okay. Instead of saying I'm startled.

Got it. So it's lived experiences when language comes in. And when people did it back to me, they were trying to show me how it looked. Well, that makes so much more sense to me now because when I was watching the video of you saying witches eat vegetables, I was so confused at first. A lot of people are and that's kind of why I sometimes get a lot of feedback like stop talking, you're taking up her time, and you're interjecting for her, but I already can see the struggle. I can already, parents know their kids the best,

so for new parents, advocate for them integrating into the world and plan for your own death. Because ultimately you are gonna be gone, and I speak Abbey, but no one else does. So what good is that if I don't help her bridge or translate, you can have your feelings but get to what that really means for us so that you can be understood. And so that's what's happening a little bit right here. I don't know why don't you ask? Have you heard of the book of Bad

Case of Stripes? Oh I love that book. Do you remember um Camilla Creme's the main character she loves lima, but she never ate them because the other kids in her class didn't like them, so she wanted to fit in. She felt isolated and alone. So she pretended she didn't like lima beans and she turned so striped. No way.

You're right. And then when she was at school doing they did the pledge, she turned red, white and blue. Yes. Did you read this book? I didn't. We have the book at our house. It's funny, because the way you just described this girl

eating lima beans to fit in is exactly why I started drinking beer. Well she didn't. Because I don't even like it. No, it's kind of the opposite though. And then when she said doctors came to examine her and they gave her pills and once she took a pill, she turned into a big pill.

Yes. And she wasn't being her true self. Well, tell the moral of the story. There was this girl, she wasn't being her true self. But that tell the moral of the story. There was this girl She wasn't being her true self, but that's the end just tell us what was important about that story There was an elderly woman that gave her lime and beans and she went back to herself And she learned that she loved lime beans to be her true self That's so cool That's a great personal connection to make that book. There's this other book called When Sophie Gets Angry.

Really, really angry. Oh, I haven't read that one. That's a book about a girl that falls over a truck because she didn't want to share her stuffed gorilla with her sister. And she got very angry and she blew off steam. She ran into the wilderness in nature and she started crying and then she found herself out in nature.

Wow. And then what? She calmed and relaxed and she had back home. She just identified with these two stories because I think they go way back to explaining what must be going on inside of her but she can't get the words out so that book Sophia gets really really angry really helped to process her anger in a way that she couldn't verbalize. Do you like to read? I love that book. Do you remember the book No David? Yes. No David is a book about David was he went in the house and he was all muddy. Yeah. His mother goes no David no. Right. And he was running on the street. Oh

my gosh he said he like lost his pants or something like that. Yeah. Well, I think we read that book to our son. Come back here David. He pulls the cat's tail, right? And he burps at the dinner table. Yeah. Yeah, our kids like that book too. And his mouth was full of food. Remember how he had a big mouthful? Wow. David, that's enough. Well, Abby. He had a lot of food in his mouth. And what if your brother, David, did that? The story we were talking about, I think, like a minute ago, you were saying you resonated with someone who is being their true self. And so I'm curious if you mentioned going on, like you and David went on a safari together, you went to Hollywood Studios together, and that you and David got to see like the premiere of the new movie Mufasa.

Is all of that, is that your true self or do you just love David so much that you really like doing those things? I really love doing those things. And you love David. I love David so much. I've heard you say that you plan on getting married. That's exciting. You said you were gonna save your cookies

for the wedding earlier, so when does this wedding happen? I'm gonna take some cookies for the airplane ride. Take as much as you want. Where are the crackers that Addie left me? The crackers? Oh, I think there's some crackers in the fridge. Put it in the fridge because there's cheese with it. So yeah.

Well, I didn't see any crackers in the bad boxes. Oh yeah, I think we have a lot of chips and snacks, so whenever... We're going to eat lunch, we have plenty of time for eating. Oh, can we go out to lunch and get like... We're talking about kind of you and David and your... Your future plans. Remember you were talking about your wedding and you said something to me.

You said when I get married at my wedding we're gonna serve... Cookies! Yes! And what else? What's the main course? Remember what you said? I don't know.

What you're gonna serve at your wedding? Costco pizza and yum yum donuts. Yes. Costco pizza! And yum yum donuts. That pizza that sounds yummy that's what's gonna be on the menu do you like Costco pizza more or yum yum donuts more yum yum donuts I'll be honest I've never had a yum yum donut I haven't either where are they only in LA they get him do you get him in the grocery store

Abby no I don't know oh I think she saw them in the grocery store, Abby? No, I don't know. Oh, I think she saw them in the grocery store. We have a chain called Yum Yum Donuts too. Well, I thought it was so cool because Rolling Stone did an entire article about your wedding that potentially might happen at the end of 2025. She said that.

But if you ask David, he doesn't know anything about it. Yeah. You gotta get him on board. Are you working on David? Yeah. She said that, but if you ask David, he doesn't know anything about it. You got to get him on board. Are you working on David? Yeah. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. I love therapy and it's just so good. Like I always leave refreshed. I feel better about myself.

I feel like I understand myself more. And if you haven't gone to therapy before, definitely consider BetterHelp because it's entirely online and you can switch your provider free of charge at any time. If you don't like your therapist, you can just switch. You can get a new one and they don't charge you a penny. It's that easy. You don't have to feel like you're at an all-time low or in a crisis to seek therapy. Obviously, it's there for you if you feel like you're in that position. No matter what you're dealing with, I guarantee you can benefit from some therapy.

The reason we love BetterHelp is because it's so accessible to everyone. I know that it can be hard to find resources that are affordable and convenient and can fit around your schedule, but BetterHelp is completely, entirely online. They have a brief questionnaire that helps you match with a perfect therapist for you,

and if it's not a perfect match, you can switch at any time, like Matt said, with no additional cost. BetterHelp has more than 30,000 credentialed therapists with a wide range of specialties. It makes therapy affordable and convenient serving over 5 million people worldwide. Build your support system with BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com slash unplanned podcast to get 10% off your first month. That's betterhelp.com slash unplanned podcast. For the wedding, you know, for both David and Abby, both of them would say, does that mean I'm

going to have to move my room? Because David lives in a condo with his sister, she lives with me. And there was not a rigidity, but the idea of changing everything. And that's really scary. Yeah. And I said, and I said this to David's mother too, like their marriage can look like whatever they want it to look like. For example, if I were to ever get married,

I would recommend that my husband have a house down the street because I'm never sharing my double sinks. That's my space. That's never gonna change. But I said it can look like whatever they want it to look like. It doesn't have to be in the traditional sense of what a neurotypical person would make it look like. You can have your place. He can still have his place.

You can still do what you do until you're ready to like move in together. Yes. And for now, you know, your room is her room is her sanctuary. That is her safe space. Yes. That might have to stay intact. Like so it can be whatever you guys want it to be so that they can make that commitment without having to have it upheaval everything else. I think in today's world, marriage can look like

whatever you want it to look like. As long as your heart's in the right place. Exactly, so I guess for Abby, is marriage, is it more of the wedding that really excites her or the actual marriage itself? What do you think, Abs? The actual marriage itself, because I've always, always wanted to be old enough to get married. You've got your head I've always, always wanted to be old enough to get married.

I've always wanted to be old enough to get married. Can I tell them the example of how jealous I was of couples when I was a kid? I think we should talk about you and David, actually, because let's stay on topic, okay? You were talking about, you know, being a bride and how much you love David, but you know it can look like whatever you guys want. You don't have to give up your room. You don't have to move in and lose the space that you're in just yet.

It's where your heart is. Yeah. Yeah, what does marriage mean to you Abby? Marriage means I'm like a princess. Like the queen of the castle. Like you're Ariel. Like you, like you're Ariel and then David is Eric Prince Eric Yes, and then the remake Prince Eric had a song he did. Yeah

What actually didn't even know that I yeah, you know in the remake they took out the song Daughters of Triton Which I'm was pissed me off It's not in the new one. Wait. I actually want to know, now I'm like so curious, what's your review of the new Ariel movie? It's pretty good, but it's different than the original one. Yeah. We loved it. You went to the premiere.

Yeah, I got to go to the premiere like two years ago. Oh, you went to the actual premiere of it? That is pretty cool. Abby, what does a typical day look like for you? What's a typical day? Like, on a random Monday. You wake up, do you wake up early? I wake up, it depends on my schedule. I do a brain and memory therapy, then I go on my date with David, then I warm up my voice, and maybe I walk

my dog, knit hats. That's my daily routine. That's a nice full day. She does have a very, what we've been working on is that Abby controls her own day, but we must be productive You know you can't sit around and I think that's one of the hardest things is that I? Taught her the therapists have taught her how to initiate her own day We're still working on that so she knows she she loves singing she sings every day on a recorded pre-recorded class with a teacher and she now walks the dog on her own which is actually the hugest deal because this is prime Los Angeles it's very busy streets for her to be out on the streets but she knows exactly what to do she has her phone with her it's during the day and she has that on her own which is very independent and that's

a push toward the kind of independence I think parents need to be aware of is letting their kids go into the world and do that kind of stuff. She does that. She goes to the gym. She has a gym membership. She's shooting content and the big part of her day is making her hats. How many hats did you sell in November December? Do you remember of last year? Remember? How many hats did I sell? I sold over like a hundred hats this past November December. What? Yes so a hundred hats in 60 days and they're all handmade. By you.

Oh my goodness. Yeah. You hand make these hats. You got a new customer. I'm going to have to order this. It all started out when I was in a work program called Textiles at my school Miller because the teacher was retiring the next year and so my mom asked the school if I could take advance weaving.

She went to the principal but he said no, we don't allow that here. So Miss Carol, my Textiles teacher, came to the house every Saturday to volunteer to help me make hats on a circular learning. And show her how to do it. Wow. You're a great learner too. Yeah, I am. That kind of reminds me of a book. Have you ever read Caps for Sale?

Oh, yeah. He has all the caps on his head. Yeah. And you're just selling your hats. Is he a peddler? I think so. What's a peddler? A peddler. Peddler. Peddler. Yeah, he pedals his hats and he wears them all on his head.

Yep. That's like you, peddling your hats. That's really cool. I'm excited to buy one. You must be really good at knitting. He's really fast. And so the interesting thing was Abby went to a vocational high school, graduated,

and then I put her in a vocational post high school from 18 to 22. And they do all these different programs. You learn farming skills or bakery skills or cooking skills, and it's just so that you have a bunch of skills. So when she went into the weaving, she had the skill of weaving actually on a big loom and they were scarves and they were beautiful, but the school didn't teach you all the skills. They only taught you the middle skills, which is it's already threaded, it's already, and they sort of taught you a portion of it. But the teacher came to me and said she was so fast and she was so good at

it, and I was like, we found something. Like we found something and I'll sell my house and invest in making her have a business. I'll make this a business. So when they said she was great at it, I said she needs to do advanced weaving so she can learn the beginning stage and the end stage. It's like when they were cooking, the students weren't allowed to touch the ovens. The students did the mixing. So you're not fully for liability. So anyways, I went to the school and said, can she do advanced weaving? I asked the teacher, would it be okay if we did this? The teacher said, what a great idea. The principal said no. And I went home defeated as a parent trying to create something for my kid. I. The principal said no. And I went home defeated as a parent

trying to create something for my kid. I was very sad, defeated. And I called the teacher, Miss Carol, and I told her. The principal said no. And she said, well, I'm retiring. I'm just going to come to your house, and I'm going to show you what you can do on your own. No way.

And if it wasn't for her, we would never be doing this. That teacher, she did it. She was the one that came to our house and said, yes, I will help you. And now you have your own business. We started on Facebook. I started selling to my little Dixie Canyon girls who I just saw this weekend and they started buying hats at my house in my living room. And then we put it on Facebook and people from my high school started to buy. And that was beautiful. And then we just, you know, that's why her

name is hats by Abby because when we were doing TikTok I thought well, maybe this will help the hats. Yeah, if I say hats by yeah, maybe this will help her and and she's you know, just I mean, it's amazing and now she's filling orders and she's you know Writing notes to people and maybe doing a video for a customer buying the yarn choosing the colors and stuff like that So she has a whole store. So we, in our last neighborhood, our old neighbor, very first day I met this guy, he came up to me and said, hey, my name is blah, blah, blah, and I have autism. And I was like, that is so cool that in the very first sentence that I met this guy, he had the confidence to just like share that with me.

And I had no one had ever done that before when I met them. And I ended up learning he had his own company. He had a video production company where he would film car commercials for car dealerships. And his autism was different than Abby's autism, the type. But I'm so curious with the type of autism that Abby has, are creative jobs typically ones that people with the same type of autism that Abby has. Like do people like to usually do creative jobs? I think it depends on the autism.

I think Dani Bowman from Love on the Spectrum is in animation, right Abby? She is. She does all kinds of animation. Abby is not as interested in that as she is in solid concrete structured tasks. So for Abby, if it's actually a job, Abby loves structure since day one, and that has been a fuel to get her to her next level for everything. And so the hats is a very structured process. That's why I think for some people on the spectrum,

structured jobs with a beginning, mental, and end are great, but for people that, it seems to me, this is just my take, is if they have autism and they went to college or high school and they got their degree and they are great, but for people that it seems to me, this is just my take is if they went, if they, they have autism and they went to college or high school and they got their degree and they did well, if they're that kind of learner, creative jobs might be better. That's not how Abby learns. Abby's always been a hands on, repetitive task kind of learner. And that's what we just focused on. No judgment, just whatever works for you is what you gotta follow.

That's right. Abby, it must feel really good when you finish knitting a hat. It feels amazing. Do you feel like you accomplished something when you finished the product? I do. And what does it feel like when people

maybe post on social media with a picture of them wearing the hat that you made? It's pretty great. And do you remember, I was reading comments to Abby. Abby doesn't read all the comments, and that's because of visual processing. When you go on your device and you look at the tiny little letters,

that's really hard for her. In her IEP, in her individualized education plans at school, everything was double-spaced enlarged print. So font size has to be 14 or 16 even. It's a visual processing issue. So font size has to be 14 or 16 even. It's a visual processing issue. So I read the comments to her and remember last night how many comments? What were people saying about you? That was amazing. Yeah and she was just like it just still she's taking it in you know and the hats are definitely

part of that. What's your favorite word you like feeling? Remember the word you always say? Sat feeling satisfied and productive. Yeah satisfied and productive I Mean productive not productive That's even a real word Earlier we were talking about Kelly Clarkson and I was saying Abby you've been on Taylor Lautner's podcast, you've been on Raven Simone's podcast. I'm like, would you want to be on the Kelly Clarkson show and what did you tell me? Yeah, I'd love to. Why do you want to be on the Kelly Clarkson show? Because I've never done it. You want to try something new.

Pretend that Kelly Clarkson might see this. What's your message to Kelly Clarkson? Kelly Clarkson, I used to love listening to your music growing up. Do you know any of her songs? Since You've Been Gone's a good one. I want to see you and Kelly do a duet, just like you did a duet with Ariel. And I know that if anyone can do it,

it would be you, Abby. Yeah. Oh my God. How come I was singing high in belt? Well, you've been working your butt off on singing. She sings almost every single day. No way. Is that why it's happening? Yes. And I'm going to tell you this one quick story because Bob Garrett is her current vocal coach and he's like a real coach and my friend Leslie Ann Moran gave me his name as a vocal coach. She's an actress, singer, Broadway gal icon and I was scared to call him as a parent because I thought he wouldn't understand Abby's autism

And he is a professional has worked with people in movies and things like this So I hesitated for almost a year before I called him and then one day I said Christine You're standing in the way of her growth get out of the way call him give him the information and let him decide If he's okay with her. And today she is one of his favorite students. No way. And he's actually in studio helping Abby on her new song, which we can't talk about, which is going to be coming out probably later in the spring.

No way. Yeah. And he came back in studio and helped her. So she records these sessions she does and then she practices them on the day she doesn't actually have a lesson. Yeah, I'm gonna do it tonight and tomorrow, tomorrow evening. That's so cool. Well I hope that either this gets clipped or someone who was watching this is friends with Kelly Clarkson and somehow through the grapevine Abby gets to sing a duet with Kelly.

That's my hope. That's my dream. That would be incredible. Yay! Yeah, I don't know, that would be awesome. That would be amazing, that would be amazing. And so full circles, we've had so many beautiful, full circle moments and we're so grateful that, and we just hope that people are embracing autism

and people with differences. My hope is that people start understanding that people aren't weird. Situations can be weird, but people with differences. My hope is that people start understanding that people aren't weird. Situations can be weird, but people aren't. They're different processors, there's different types of social skills, there's different types of brains. Embrace them all, be kind.

If you see someone struggling socially, be the one to make them feel okay. You don't have to just be a judger. I actually wanted to ask you as parents of young kids that are gonna be you know in settings with all types of children what do you wish parents did if their child was not didn't have autism but they were with another child that did have autism like what would you hope that that parent did or what they would say to their child or?

I mean the kid that didn't have autism. Yeah. So I mean two things. One is if you do have a child on the spectrum, I told all of my son's friends, Ben's sister has autism. I took them all aside and said, Ben's sister has autism,

so if she says repetitive things or she doesn't understand you, just treat her like any other kid, say, I don't understand, what do you mean, try to get her to talk, whatever else. She's not deaf. She's, I was very upfront because when I was in high school, I had a friend who had a sister who I didn't understand, who had strange behaviors and would talk to herself and do all these things that no one understood. And kids-

Who would talk to themselves? This is someone I went to high school with. And so people were afraid of the sister. The kids were afraid. I was afraid. And I went to their house, and I prayed that the sister didn't answer the door when I knocked because I wouldn't know what to say to her because I didn't know what it was.

And bingo, she's born, she's diagnosed, and I'm sitting at my kitchen table thinking of my high school days, and all of a sudden I said, oh my God, Carolina's sister had autism. That's what it was. And in my own memory, and I felt so bad because I wished if I'd known I would have been able to have been more compassionate or talk to her, but I avoided her because I was scared and I don't want any of my son's friends to do that with her. So I sat them down and I told them.

So I think parents should be okay with telling people when it's obvious there's something going on. I understand if you have the kind of autism that is not presenting, you're what I call neurotypical passing. So there's that. But then I told my son when he wanted to have the end of the year school party, pool party,

like the last day of school pool party, and you're at our house, I said you invite every kid in the class or you invite no one. Yeah. And I really wanted to be invited of school pool party, and you're at our house, I said, you invite every kid in the class or you invite no one. Yeah. And I really wanted to be invited to that pool party. Friends? Yeah, and you know what?

But that wasn't your class. Yeah. So that's why you weren't invited. And can I talk about, can I tell them about the swimming thing or no? No, because we're just finishing up talking about, talking to other parents about kids with differences. Well, I love pool parties.

So the number one thing is thing is when kids are different, be the one that is compassionate and sweet and kind. You don't have to be their best friend, but do not allow bullying. It's never okay to make fun of somebody, and if you see it happen, either report it to your teacher, because a lot of kids won't report it because they're scared.

They're scared that they might be the brunt of it, but they can go to their parents and say, I saw this happen at school today, that kind of stuff, might be the brunt of it, but they can go to their parents and say, I saw this happen at school today. That kind of stuff to be the difference. Ben, her brother grew up in therapy rooms. He's always very compassionate about it. If you see that your kid was a bully or did an action, be the parent that calls them out on it.

Don't defend your child. Kids make mistakes. Yeah. Her brother did a thing where he was, had a really close friend in this friend group but it was my son, her brother, that was taking the backpack and kicking it around the school yard as a big group but his lunch would get smushed and he couldn't eat it. One day Miles told his dad that my son Ben was the one instigating the incident of kicking the thing around, the backpack around, even though they were friends. But on the inside Miles was feeling less than. They found, and when I found that out I called up the dad and I said, apparently

Ben has been doing this, because I found out. I said, we're coming to your house, have at it. I want you to say anything and everything that you want to Ben, no holes barred, please. So we went to the friend's house. So there is kid Miles, the friend who's getting the backpack, he's around the dad, the mom, me and Ben. And that father just called him on, I sat there.

My son was bawling, gut-crying because he felt so bad. Do you think he ever did it again? It was just typical fifth grade thing but he never did it again. And that to me was me taking responsibility to teach my son a lesson. That even though that he's your friend and you thought it was funny because you were getting the laughs, Miles wasn't getting the laughs. That's where we stop bullying. Nobody should be the brunt of someone else's joke unless they're okay with it and they say,

let's do this fun thing. That's what I mean. Like you really, it's that kind of responsibility as a parent and then it's also just understanding that you teach your kid compassion. We don't jump on the bandwagon. I don't care if everyone else is saying something bad about this one, we don't jump in.

On the flip side too, like I'm someone that I get worried about hurting someone, like I just, I really never wanna hurt anybody, so sometimes on the flip side, if I'm worried that I might do or say something that could be, end up hurting someone, I'm like, it might just be easier to not even engage. And so I loved how like when Abby in this interview would say something silly, you would laugh and you would like engage with her because you're like it's you can

still like laugh with someone who has autism, you can still laugh with someone who is neurodivergent because they can say silly things too. And I think that was really enlightening for me because you know, on the flip side, I found myself have this like have this desire to, okay maybe I should like step back because I never wanna do or say anything to hurt anybody. So I think sometimes people can get afraid

that they might laugh at a not okay time and then accidentally makes one feel bad. So it was really cool to see you laugh with your daughter and just engage with her. We laugh at everything. I mean, Abby and I took our, and when she was younger, it wasn't the case. It was a lot of work because Abby is rocking it now.

Yeah. Killing it now, right? I'm going to just say this one thing. Five years ago, when we were going to go on a trip and you went to pack your own suitcase, what was the suitcase full of? Stuffed animals. Bingo.

She literally, we were packing, she just put all her stuffed animals in it and we're going. So I would have to pack everything. I would have to do every, so I'd have to pack for two. And so since that time, Abby's become so much more independent and so much more in her own space of herself. And so together we're growing in her differences and embracing them and just saying, I mean, she stops me in my tracks sometimes. It's funny. This is funny.

Do you need to take a break? Yeah. Why don't you get up again? We can also be done. We can also wrap up. Can we just call it a day? Yeah, let's call it a day. We can wrap it up if you want.

Yeah, we can wrap it up. But it was so nice. I love being on your podcast. Thank you so much. You're so kind. Thank you, Abby. Yeah, thank you for coming here and flying on a plane to be here. That really means a lot.

That was an awesome conversation. I wanted to tell you, I think that's probably a good time, but earlier before we started filming, I'm like gonna cry. You saying this. Oh my gosh. The way you have mothered Abby so selflessly, it just makes my heart feel some type of way I don't really have words for but like the way that you said you raised Abby and her brother as a single mom and you said that you had thought about dating prior to your after post your divorce thought about dating you thought about you know entering having someone else come into your life and then about dating, you thought about, you know, entering,

having someone else come into your life, and then you felt like you came to a point where you personally had to decide between having another relationship and then being Abby's mom, and you chose being Abby's mom. And, you know, for 26 years, that's like been your sole purpose, and like, just, you've done so much work for her,

and you've done it like so I know it has not been easy but like to see where Abby is now and like to be able to have this conversation it just really affects me like it's really really I'm crying because I'm happy because Because you're crying because your mom is such an amazing mom to you, Abby. I do care. I know. And it's just like you can tell that you're her safe place and that you have just like put her, like gotten her to a place with her hard work too, where she's not just like, you know, living, she is thriving. Yeah.

And I know that did not come easy. And I know that to you with a lot of sacrifice. And I just want to tell you how much I admire that. Thank you. Thank you so much. I mean, there were times when she was younger and this all went down that if I told you the other part of the story, like single mother, there was a time where I didn't have any income. So I was working a minimum wage job when she was little.

And that didn't even cut anything. Like, you know what I mean? Like there was that and it was just the being a detective and the interventions. And then I really saw myself as a relationship person. Like I'm old school, like traditional very much so and I Realized I I couldn't I had to make that choice of either being Putting myself and my purpose with a relationship before her needs and I just couldn't do it It had to be her and her brother that and I will be honest though once I made that choice

And I jumped into honest though, once I made that choice and I jumped into it, everything got easier. And I just said, in this lifetime, this is where I am. I'm supposed to be this mother and I'm not supposed to do the relationship thing in this lifetime. That's so selfless. It just was the right choice, it seemed, you know? Yeah. And I couldn't be more proud of what she's, I mean at the end of the day, she's the one that's done the work. I think what's so cool is, you know, when Abby was a little girl,

you were so worried about her being loved and so worried about her being accepted. And now she's changed the world. No, now I'm her plus one. I mean, seriously, I'm like, oh my god, Abby, can I go with you to this thing? And I'm going, did I die? And I'm in some sort of coma. And I'm just imagining all this because there were days when it feels like that. But besides that stuff and people recognizing her and being so kind and amazing like the fans are so great and she does she gets recognized all time We've been driving down the street and someone will roll down. I'm just gonna say this

I'll never forget this girl and she go Chico, California. She rolls down and she goes Right now and that girl I just fell in love with She's like, what the f***? I'm seeing Abby right now. And that girl I just fell in love with. I think I took a picture of her in that moment of the band because I thought it was the funniest thing ever. And I was just so filled with gratitude and love for that girl. And it was so amazing. And so there's that part in Love on the Spectrum season one, they're interviewing me and they said to her, they said to me, what is

your fear for Abby's future? And no one had ever asked me that. And it's the director asking me that. And I just, at that time, I said, you know, I'm not gonna live forever. And I said, my fear is that the world will be mean to her and hurt her when I'm gone. And I know that's what so many parents think. So I speak for them when I say that. And so I think that now, and I'm like, I'm your plus one. How did this happen? And it's so great, because I think

that we're looking at neurodiversity differently. We're looking at autism differently in Williams I've been so happy to be part of love on the spectrum. I don't know why Tanner comes to mind from season two but he's so Absolutely lovely as a human being he is so adorable and sweet and kind and bring so much joy to people and We embrace that and before people may look have looked at that as weird or strange And I don't think people are doing that anymore that have seen the show and that's what I hope for all people with differences Whether it's more of the you know anti-social Autism or a different kind of autism that people just have a little bit more kindness to people with all disabilities too.

And I, I will, you took a risk doing Love on the Spectrum for sure, but I, I think that because of the reach that Netflix understanding of people like Abby and I think that definitely created like a kinder world. Like I think that will be a result for because of it. So I hope that you're like, I hope you also feel like that risk was rewarded and honored in some way. I'm glad I took the risk. There's been a lot of risks like, but I always say like the risk from her walking the dog on her own, from her jumping into the vocal training with Bob Garrett, were all risks. But if I let my fear get in the way of her growth, then I did a bad job. Because it's a balance between those two things. Look, if the coach didn't work out for the singing thing, you'd say this isn't working out. We tried it, it failed. If she walked the dog and she got scared and called me, she had her phone, she could call me and say I can't do

this, then that didn't work. But at least we tried. I think sometimes, especially in the neurodivergent world, in the autism world, when kids have obvious struggles, we worry because we're trying to protect them. But we get our kids till they're 18. We have to train them for the front lines of life, even if they're neurotypical. You know, my son was working at 12, he worked at the summer camp. And I wanted him to have that same,

like get in the world, like jump in, and just do the best you can for who you are. We're not saying you have to be the CEO of a company, we're just wanting you to have all the skills so that whatever you choose to do in life, you're prepared and you're confident and you know how to solve problems. So both of them have had kind of their own thing and I'm proud of both of them. Like I said in 2022 when I had my detached retina that she loves talking about, bringing up, she has Love on the Spectrum airing on the Wednesday and the Sunday before my son graduated Purdue University in engineering and I did that by myself. So I was like, okay, I can retire now.

I can't actually retire now, but. Well, where can people find you? I know you and Abby are both on TikTok, Instagram. Where's the best place for you? I know you and Abby are both on TikTok, Instagram. Where's the best place for people to connect with you? So for Abby, Abby's on YouTube, Facebook, and Instagram. No way, okay. Hatsby Abby, so please follow her. We're doing more like long form, kinda like behind the scenes of Abby's life

on her YouTube. And then I'm also on YouTube as Christine, Abby's mom, and I do long form. My long form is kind of educational. I want to share with people just tools. What did I do? What worked? What didn't work?

What did I wish I knew? Because the interventions are key for her success for sure. And then my shorts are just kind of like fun stuff. And then Instagram, Christine Abbey's mom. Buy a hat? Yes. And you can buy a hat and hats by Abbey. So you can buy a hat? Yes. And you can buy a hat and hats by Abby.

So you can buy a hat or merch. You know, it's funny, people will write to us and say, Abby did her merch store before Love on the Spectrum. That came from TikTok. No way. Well, because we show people in her thoughts, as you see, she has these associations and comes up with really funny lines.

And the new one is witches eat vegetables. So that might be going on a shirt. Yes, everyone if you like the episode comment witches eat vegetables down below. I feel like that would be a great way just to have some fun but seriously though I want to see Abby do this duet with Kelly Clarkson. I think that would be epic especially knowing that she's done a duet with the voice actress that played Ariel. Jodie Benson. Jodie Benson. So that would be cool. Anything's possible. She's actually scheduled toet with the voice actress that played Ariel. Jodie Benson. So that would be cool. She's actually scheduled to sing at the Greek Theater. Are you kidding me?

In LA in April for Autism Awareness for Light It Up Blue. Wow. And yeah, because Stephen Stills is very involved there. So that would be, that I believe is happening. So wow. How cool. Well, thank you for being here. Thank you so much for Sharing your story. I know a lot of lives are gonna be changed by by this interview So thank you so much. Thank you so much for having us here and letting us share with you guys It means the world really does we're honored. We are truly honored. We're honored to we're gonna go I guess eat some snacks now Think Abby might want some chardonnay

We're gonna go get drunk with Abby Abby but it was great talking to everybody