The Vault with Financielle - "I Want to Retire at 45 — Am I Delusional or Is FIRE Actually Achievable?” | The Vault Episode 127

Episode Date: July 30, 2026

We're closing the Vault for a little while, but we're going out on a high 🥹This week's dilemmas:💸 "I Want to Retire at 45. Am I Being Delusional or Is FIRE Actually Achievable on a Normal Salary?"💸 "My Brother Gets £150 a Month in Pocket Money — How Do I Set Him Up Financially Before He Makes My Mistakes?"Thank you so much for being part of The Vault with Financielle community, we'll be back soon with some of our favourite episodes while we take a little break. 🤍In the meantime, check out all the amazing content we have at https://financielle.com/ 💖💸Connect with our Partner🫶 Protect yourself and loved ones with our friends at Lifesearch ** The above is a tracked link, which tells our partner we sent you and may in future result in a payment or benefit to our site.

Welcome to The Vault with Finance Child. This is a safe space where we talk all things life and money and no topics are off limits. Guys. How do for one last time? How are you feeling? Emotional. Guys, it's Lucy's last fault podcast. If you miss last week, you're going to be in real shock right now.

Oh no. Yeah. To give you a backstory. This is actually, we're not joking. This is Lucy's last episode of The Vault. I'm scared. You scared? You scared?

One, tell us your emotions. Scared. Sad. Excited. I feel like you need to keep the chair, the microphones. Yeah, can I take this home? Yeah. This would match my couch, actually.

Yeah, very nervous. What's it? Like, I feel like I'm anticipating. Yes. But I just need to be present. Yes. You do. You need to enjoy it.

We've got, how many have we done, Lydia, with Lucy? Well, this is episode 127. Guys, we're going. That's consistent. Like we talk about consistency at Fanon Shell and like we are living and breathing consistency with The Vault. Yeah, we are.

It's the sad circle of life. So yeah, we're going to miss Lucy. She's moving on from Fanon Shell, but we, she can't go away because we know where she lives. We've got a mobile on the phone number. Don't know she'll change it. So if anyone has any messages that they want to send,

we will get them to her. So please do. Yes. The Vault at Fan Shell.com. Send us your emails. DM comment. I've got Pio box. Yeah.

You want to send some butter, some roadlit glass. Yeah, need that. Literally, but like people, you know, yeah, do you want everyone following your own Insta? What's your handle? But we will get messages to her and we'll see we can rope her back in for some reunions at some point in some form, whether it's pod or not. But we will. So very, very sad that it is your last episode. And also, we've just talked about consistency, but we actually are going to have a little bit of a break.

Which we've not just to like, you know. Yeah. had a break from financial like you'll see a lot of people doing like breaking for summer breaking for Christmas like you know we never do that we even release stuff on Christmas Day Lydia don't we Christmas Eve like we've done it all like we've never had a break so summer is coming up and we have all right really hard yeah well yeah there's summer holidays I'm not started for our children yet so they're just about to around the corner and so some of we share this on Instagram stuff all the time but you know I especially holiday in the summer

I am a first world problem person that all winter, well not winter because I'm going in winter as well, but in spring and in other half terms like we slug it out, we work with the kids. And then we are doing France and Belgium, a little road trip. And then I'm due to a couple weeks in Portugal. And I'm actually not going to work this time. I worked last year, but I'm not going to work. And we'd squeezed in a recording and we've decided actually we're going to leave that recording. We're going to release a couple of things.

So you're not going to miss out. We are going to have a version of the vault. But we're going to take a little bit of recording break. and then we'll be back with you in the autumn time. So you won't miss out episodes will be released, but they might be a little of mashups or repostings of some big ones we've done. Like, not recently. We'll go back.

No, we'll find some really good ones. Early on, I was looking through the pre-production documents. Oh my God, some of the dilemmas. The wild. Crazy. So we definitely need to resurface. I remember I only found one that absolutely went crazy. We'll have to bring that one back.

So we'll do that. So we are being consistent, but we're being consistently resting. as well. So we'll do that and then move back with you. Rest is productive. Yes. Well, exactly. And we'll, you know, we'll have a little um, judge and bring some, some good dilemmas to the table and some good topics. So we'll miss you lose it. Take it away for your last one. What have you got for us? If you're stuck in consumer debt, listen to this. One financial user said budgeting the financial way helped her clear over two and a half thousand pounds worth of debt and finally feeling

control of her money. If you're ready to do the same, download the financial app and join our community today. So, for our first dilemma today, I want to retire at 45. Am I being delusional or is fire actually achievable? Hi ladies, so I've gone down a bit of a rabbit hole. I discovered the fire movement about six months ago and I haven't been able to stop thinking about it since. For context, I'm 29 and I earn 44k a year. I have 8k in savings, 12k in my workplace pension and no debt. My monthly outgoings are pretty lean, around £1,400 a month, including rent, bills and food. I don't have a particularly lavish lifestyle, but I do enjoy it. The idea of retiring at 45 or even 50 feels almost too good to be true, but when I actually sit down and do the maths, it doesn't feel completely insane. From what I

understand, the goal is to build up roughly 25 times your annual expenses and then live off 4% a year. So for me, that's somewhere around 420K, which feels huge, but also not impossible over 20 years if I'm aggressive about it. My question is, is fire actually realistic on a normal UK salary? Do I prioritise maxing out my pension or does that defeat the point if I can't touch it until I'm 57? Should I be putting everything into a stocks and shares I say instead? I just feel like nobody around me is talking about this.

And I don't know if I'm being really smart or completely naive. I'm like you to this one away because I feel like when you first started your like money journey, you were positively influenced by, as it feels very American. Yeah. It's like very American coded. And I don't actually know that much about the fire movement. For me, words that spring to mind when I think about it is like ultra frugal, living on the bare minimum,

putting all your eggs in one basket. That's what I think of it, but you might know a little bit more. I've never been in that community. I've never consumed that type of content. I definitely rabbit hauled early days. And I think that's when I got on a deptory journey and wanted to learn more about money.

And then you did, there's a movement. I bet there's a really good Reddit community on fire. I was thinking Reddit. She said Fire. I was like, go and look at Reddit. Reddit. And actually the OG was Mr. Money Mustash. I think he was called.

He had like a blog, an old school blog in the day, and he documented his process. And I think that all went a bit sad because I think he ended up separating from his partner and a whole lot of drama. So maybe I could do more research into that and we'll really share it one time. But I think it's when you're, when you hit a stage of money management

and you have a mentality that you give less of a shit what people think, really empowering because what you realize it is if you don't care what people think and you don't care what your life looks like, And if you don't place value on certain things, you actually can live off less. And if you can live off less, you can save and invest more. But also later in life, your retirement pot that you need is predicated on what you need to, what you spend. So someone that has annual expenses of, say, 30,000 pounds needs a different pot to someone

that has annual expenses of 15. And that's just an example. So this is all math and it is right on the 25 times multiple. It's got quite a few assumptions baked in, but it's based on the idea that you could live off the growth of the pot and the pot stays the same. So basically, you've virtually never run out of money because, say it's a million in the pot, you know, you live off the growth and it stays at a million. Because if you spend more than the growth per year, and obviously that's on average because it can go up and down, growth can change. But if you live off more, you'll chip away at it. And even that's the thing with fire, fire, some people accept that actually you're guessing how long you're going to live.

Yeah, it's weird. But that's why if you're retiring early, it needs to be an amount that basically doesn't chip, it's not chipped away at because otherwise the math doesn't work. And if you end up living, you know, if you retire at 45, but you live until 95, you know, have you baked in enough to, for not to disappear after 50 years? So I really got into this movement because I was fascinated around the fact, I was, I'd like, maximize my earning, you know, the side hustle bros would say not. But in terms of my salary and my life, like that was my salary, how much can I optimize and you, you know, you go on

comparison websites and you switch things and you get cashbacks and you get the best deals. And then you start to go, okay, well, what else can I do? And you look and the fire movement has really good tips for like budgeting for living off, making your meals, meal prepping, not going out to eat and deciding that's not where I put value. You are right, It's very basic. And I think it's very healthy when it's lived to, actually, I'm in control of these expenses. And every decision I make is robbing from my future self. So is this experience okay or is it not enough? If I say yes to everything, then I spend all my money. If I say yes to nothing, then I'm also not living a good life. And so there's a balance because it can get super, super frugal and very life limiting as well. So there's a balance. What is just so interesting about it is, all of this is based on assumptions of how well we're going to live, how much we're going to earn, what costs are going to be like. And in the U.K., the question is a generic, sorry, it's much more a higher level one, wasn't it? Which is like, is this possible in the UK? And everything's possible,

but life is tough and expenses are tough and there's so much that you can't foresee. And a lot of us don't like the idea that would be like, you know, working forever. But also, lots of people enjoy work and lots of people find value in it and find value in really simple things. You know, as long as you're baking in travel, yes, maybe. But, you know, are you living in a location that brings you joy and are you exercising and are you eating well? Do you have a good friendship circle? It's not all about, you know, work's not all bad because part of that is work.

And can you create a life that you enjoy? Because if you can do that, whether it's 10 years before retirement or not, it doesn't really matter. You know, I've talked about this before, but we all know someone that's died too young and you can scrimp and save and decide I'm going to retire at 45 and then something happens and you no longer with us or you get poorly and you can't. We also know the other side, which is someone that waits until retirement and doesn't live a nice life and then passes away young. Or, you know, there's the idea that lots of us, when we will live an awful long time and can we sustain

ourselves, did we save up enough? Did we prepare enough? Because it's kind of too late when you're you know, mixed it, mid-60s and 70s to suddenly go, I could do with the pension pot now. There's so many of some books, and I think there's a lot of pressure for people. I love the idea of exploring this.

What it is, it's about growing your wealth and growing your net worth and growing your assets, and that's all a good thing. I think at Finan Shell, we like to talk about balance, we don't really talk about

financial independence retire early, but we do talk about financial independence and we do talk about financial wellness, like feeling well, not spending well over your means, like not keeping up up with the Jones.

Being in control, like on your table. terms. And so when it comes then down to what you should do with your money, and also like, there's also, I think, an interesting concept of a blended retirement where you can optimize how you work, whether it's actually, I do go hard in some of these early years and I'm earning what I can, but then I can work part of time. I can contract. I can work seasonal. I can go, you know, live in the French Alps half the year if I want to. Like, there are lots of flexible choices that I think you can explore, especially with the digital nomadic.

life that we do have. Lots of us can work from laptops. We can work flexibly. We can work from different locations. I would say firstly put more effort into deciding what your dream, like retirement would look like and can you do it now? And then the other side of that is being really sensible with your money. So if you decided to not invest for retirement, which locks away until 57-ish for most of us for now, law could change that at any point. if you put it all into a stock and shares I say, you don't get the tax break that you would get now. If you're a higher rate taxpayer, you get significant tax break in pensions. So you would be foregoing that, leaving money on the table to get to access it early.

But if you did it all the other way, you can't retire before 57 because you've not got access to any money. You know, we talk about the playbook on here a lot and this is what really, really helps because when you get to grow because you're in a really good budget, you've got an emergency fund, you're consumer debt free. the big thing about grow is balancing your investments. And it is about balance and making sure that there's a risk in going ham on one because what if we all went into investments and the property market boomed and you never bought a home? Or what if you went all into the home and you ever paid the mortgage but you didn't get in the market? Or what if you only locked things away for retirement and you have no access to liquid cash and you need it? So unfortunately there's no easy answer to this.

But I think the intentions are in a really good place. Ambition is really, really strong. But put effort into thinking, what life is it you designing? And can you design that life while you work? Yeah, some people, like, I feel like do it to escape a job that they don't like. So they're like, how can I or like a career path that they've gone down that they then regret? And they're like, how can I get out of this as just as possible? Yeah.

Instead of like, how can I take control of the job that I'm in now and go and find one that I actually want to do? Or a career that I wish I'd done or make a hobby into a career, or whatever it might be. I feel like sometimes it's people are trying to escape something. as well. But like you have, lives can be either really long or really short. Like we've seen it at both ends of the spectrum. You can't, you don't know when you're going to die. You don't know how much you're going to need in retirement.

You don't know all. Is there going to be a state pension when we're older? Like there's so much negative energy around pensions at the moment, especially I see. Yeah. In the media. But then you've got really good financial experts like a Martin Lewis and other people and Laura are on the BBC being like, don't demonize pensions. Like they actually give people a really good quality of life.

So just make sure you've got a good. balance and I think that's the key that you, to summarize what you've said, I think it's a good balance. And for me, it's making sure that you're happy in the life that you're living now. So you're doing the job that you want to do. You're not spending your day hating it, looking at the clock, waiting until the end of the day, waiting for the holiday. Like, yeah, I feel like a lot of people do fire as an excuse to escape an unhappy life that they've got. So is it anything that you can do right now to change that, make it better, but be financially well. Like I said, I've referenced, not keeping up with the Jones is like,

are you a spending pattern that's unhealthy? Like looking at fire could just make you go question all your choices that you've made, but I just worry that sometimes can be a little bit extreme. And the stories I've seen are people in fire have actually been people that have then come out of it and gone, I literally like wasn't eating. Yeah, because I was trying to... Yeah, I was trying to pull back, you know, the spending so much that I actually ended up being scared of having money and, you know, like, it's a bit...

It's an extreme way of living, isn't it, is what I'm trying to say. It's like if you fancy going really intense on a debt-free journey for a month or so. it's an amazing little rabbit hole, but it's with that in mind, which is like a retreat or like a period of time, a challenge. And it really opens you.

I think it can cut a lot of the fat, if that makes sense. Yeah. A lot of, train the fat, no, yeah, yeah,

in your budget and stuff. There's stuff that just isn't groundbreaking. Again, this comes back to, and I would love for people to be able to not demonize work and not,

you know, not see it as a bad thing, but also it's not be full of bad energy and stuff. It's not like what you exist for either. There's like a bad, balance of not hating it, what it's not being you. And I said this to, we were talking, I was talking to Anthony Ruth about this because she's just 61.

She was like, how dare you tell everyone my age? She doesn't look 61 as well. She definitely looks younger. We were talking about, you know, if you won the lottery, I don't know if it was a lotter. I don't know if it was said about lottery, so I'm going to put words in the mouth. But basically it was like, if you didn't need to work today, would you? And she was like, yeah. I was like, and would you do the job you doing?

And she went, I think. I think I would. She wouldn't like, oh, I'd write. I wish I'd trade as a bet on something. Because I think suddenly she was like, you know, actually it does contribute to me and what else would I do? You know, like she, you know, and listen, in two, three years' time, she might change your mind because we're not talking about it straight away.

But it was that concept of planning forward planning. Like, what does life look like? You know, I've got a couple of friends at the gym, the older guys and they're retiring quite young, I think ones in the police, like a couple of similar examples. and they're both doing barista courses and this is so cool I know Neil wants to cough shop. So you're listening.

When I get home, we're not talking about it. But they're both doing barista courses because they are retiring early and they're really into the fitness so they could definitely fill their days but they don't want to be sat at home. And so they're designing an earlier,

not a 45, but I'm sure the early 50s, mid-50s, they're designing the next phase of their life which is possibly work optional you know, doing something that's social and doing something that's flexible, a skill set that you could go around the country or go around the world doing if you wanted to.

There's things that you could do. So I think put effort into that and then money will naturally gravitate towards whatever that goal is. And listen, money's money, it gives you options. So make sure it's balanced. Make sure if some's locked away in a house and some's locked away for retirement,

some's accessible. That's kind of what we teach at Farnchelle and you've got options in. I love the romanticised. job. Like post-retirement. My dad once said that he would start a blog. When he retired.

He could do what now, though. I could be like, why start? He is going to be retiring, isn't it? So he's going to need... Get him on Substack? Yeah. Dave's Substack? I'll subscribe.

We'll get you some subscribers, Dave. Yeah. Okay, before our next dilemma, yet again, week on week, please subscribe. Your last episode gone, ham it up. And these you've got two. For Lucy.

For me, please. We're going to measure a before and after numbers actually. Yeah, yeah. Better be a difference. Check whether there's a change because otherwise it's shared that you didn't really like. Subscribe if you love. Yeah. But we've got a summer of fun content coming up.

If you're a new listener, you'll get to listen to some OG episodes, which are crazy, as we said before. So subscribe, follow, comment. Send us your dilemmas. Share with your pals. Put it in your WhatsApp. Can I say? Girls' WhatsApp groups could change the world. We're like, if there was some sort of movement that we all wanted to do,

like, the amount of issues we solve in our WhatsApp group is actually crazy. And I'm like, imagine if we all just like join into one big WhatsApp group with women, like, you wouldn't read it, so it's no point. She'll leave us on red and then not respond. You'd ask Neil to join the girls' WhatsApp groups. That's true. Can you just action all these things that they've all come up with? TLDO.

Holly was talking this morning about Gary Neville's not in his WhatsApp group. No. your husband said Gary Neville's not in any WhatsApp groups and you were like yeah it's fine because his wife poll this and carries everything His wife's like so

she's got a netball at 7 I'm like how do you know that in the WhatsApp group that you're not in because you just offloaded it to me wouldn't it be nice would be nice to be in the monosphere sorry Gary I don't mean you

I do just mean Jenna did you know that over a third of women in the UK have no protection in place compared to just 16% of men we've partnered with life service so you can chat to an advisor for free and get the cover that you deserve. Head to fanashel.com forward slash protection to get your free quote today.

Okay, our second dilemma is, my brother gets 150 pounds a month pocket money and I really want to set him up financially. Where do we start? Dear financial, first of all, I love your podcast and your content. Thank you so much for everything that you do. I'm currently in the survived stage of the playbook. Things are a little shaky, but slowly my finances are coming together, which is really encouraging. I'm 31 and I've made almost every financial mistake you can think of.

My younger brother has just turned 16. He's an amazing boy, smart, funny, kind and confident. As he's the youngest with a large age gap between him and the rest of us, he's a little bit spoiled. We all give him varying amounts of money each month and my parents give him pocket money on top of that. Each month he probably receives around £150, which I couldn't even imagine getting when I was 16. I've just helped him create his first CV and he's planning on applying for jobs once he finishes his exams. The reason I'm writing this in is because I want to help him avoid the financial mistakes I made and start building for his future as early as possible. I've mentioned investing in an ISA to my brother and my parents numerous times and have sent them links for more information. But my parents just don't buy into it.

My whole family are traditional earn and save types. My brother has shown some interest which is a positive start but it's not really at the forefront of. his mind and I don't believe he can open his own account yet without my parents' involvement anyway. I'll be honest, I don't fully understand investing myself and I'm still trying to pull myself out of the financial trenches. So it's a bit of a do-as-I-say-not-as-I-do situation, which makes getting buy-in from my parents really hard when they're already risk-averse and don't know anyone who has invested beyond a traditional pension. Do you have any advice on how I could help them understand that investing is really the way forward for my brother's future?

And if you know of any books or other resources, I could share with him, that would be fantastic help too. What a great big sister. This is where I wish she was here because I've got questions. I've got so much to ask. God, he's getting a lot of money from them all, isn't he? I'm like, you're in Survivor. You shouldn't be giving you brother money, sorry. He doesn't, he doesn't.

Imagine he doesn't. Hey. Which is a student should I text today? He's going to go to the news agents and spend it all. That's all that I should do. Can have a 12,000 jaw breakers, please. And tango spray. because I can't feel like,

I have the vimp to spray the time's right. This is such an interesting a few different dynamics to talk about here because you've got his dynamic, her dynamic and the parents' dynamic, right?

So you've got the parents, like, and people are, everyone's contributing to him, but they're like, oh, you know, you should save investing is dangerous, da da da da da da da. So you've got that to contend with.

You've got you yourself are not in the best financial position. You're working, you're through survive, you're on a journey. but you kind of helping to contribute to him and give to him and kind of, yeah, do as I say, not as I do. And then you've got him who may just could not give a shit.

He definitely won't give a shit. He's 16-year-old lad. He's the baby of the family. He's sorted for life, isn't he? Imagine he is cushy. He's cushy. Wow. I recently saw actually the CEO of quite a big PR company

did a LinkedIn post and she was saying that her, I think brother was like, I want, oh no, my nephew. I want to work with you, Auntie. and she's like, fine, you will get a summer job in a cafe. I think she's a bar or cafe show me that you can like talk to people, problem solve, work. You were going to go and study and you're going to get this. You're going to go then get experience because she runs an agency in a different agency,

not in mine. You're going to intern at a startup and you've done all these four or five things, come back to me for a job, but you're not being given one until you've got to go out there. And so it resonated with me massively, but what made me say, think about that in this scenario is that guy wanted to so that like you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink. Sometimes the maturity is varying. And so you can't make them want to do something. But also they may not know that that's the thing that they should be doing as well. For me, there's two big things here. One is he will be doing what you do. So you need to share. share, however dull it is for him, maybe, but share your journey, keep him updated, little and often. Think about the language that you're using or can't wait to pay off the step because I can't wait to invest. It keeps me up at night.

I can't go on holiday with my pals. Don't be making mistakes that I didn't make. You know, you can learn from my mistakes. I'm looking forward to when. Did you know that the S&P went up this, this month? Or did you know actually that how much, if you invest, you're at 16. I mean, I did this with Ariel when she came over. from ours and I gave for the calculators up. I cried at how old I was because she's so young

that if you show them what like 150 a month would do and you know it feels a long time away for them so they're like, I don't care when I'm 50 and you're like, well I'm staring down. But you have to show them that they've got enough excess in their other bit of the budget that it's not a big deal. It's only a little and if they do that as well as living their life, but it's going to be down to you and it's going to be down to you demonstrating that you're doing it as well because no one likes the lecture from someone that doesn't do the work themselves, you are doing the work, but don't be afraid to share that with him. Share where you've gone wrong. Drop it in. Do you want to see, you know, do you want to see, because you might

be, she might be investing in a pension. So if you're investing in a pension, get the graphs up, show him this is investing. Talk about brands that he knows and likes. Like, you know, he may know who Elon Musk is and went back a few weeks ago in the SpaceX. And like Roblox, you know, and the difficulties they may have now with their share price on who's a growing company that's doing really? really well. Show him like, I was thinking, when she was like, how can I get him interested? Show him, and you have to be careful about this, go and look, find credible people,

but like financial content creators. Oh, yeah, definitely, especially bona fide ones that you... Yeah, because there are some really amazing ones that are like, you need to, like, what are you all doing? Like, I hate the, I don't want to have it. Finance Bros is difficult. Yeah, be careful of who you find, make sure that they're regulated or that if they're working with brands they're financially regulated, like do you do diligence.

Don't let him go down a rabbit hole. I've dodgy people turning to put his money. money and anything that isn't your standard stuff. Find some goodies and drop them in. I think they are so impressionable that rather than lectures sometimes it is that like getting them a little bit interested. Just dropping little ones. And really, I think other than compound interest calculators and stuff, you know,

the investing thing is this is like bonus money, right? So 150 quid a month is pocket money. It's not going to change the world. I mean, it would on an investment basis eventually over time. But it doesn't sound like he's saying. needing to save up for anything is not actually working right now. This is like nice little contributions and what we've always done with our children younger than him, although my eldest is a similar age, is every time when he comes in, it's like how much do you want to invest?

And I think you can also, you maybe sit down with your parents and show some really good articles, especially on money and pension services, they're very, very neutral. We might have some on our website that just shows the benefit of investing and that this isn't for something. Like it's not like he's putting his health deposit on black and red in the, you know, roulette. They don't have to choose stocks and shares with them as well. It could just be a direct debit set up. If he knows he gets £150 from either his family, well, yeah, it's just his family at the moment because he can't work or when he does get a job. A direct debit of £20, £30, £30 a month.

Even with your parents, like proportionally splitting it. 100 into savings, 50 into investments and share it with them and take them on the journey. I think if they're really uncomfortable with it until he's older and he doesn't want, he, he, he, if he doesn't do investing, it's not the end of the world. Like, you can't force him to. All you can do is facilitate it. A budget could be the best thing that you could teach him because the investment might then come.

Do you know what I mean? Just to show him how he can live a really good life. Having a donut in the financial app. Like it's so visual to see like when he's not going to get any expenses, but you mean to pretend. Yeah, yeah. Be like, okay, when you get to, you know. Yeah, let's say you renting a flight in Manchester with your friends.

Make it set. Make it fun. Like let him visualize it. and then be like, imagine if you'd just put this away, by the time you're 30, you're going to have X. By the time you're 40, you're going to have X. Make it an ambitious thing for him, but really accessible by just putting 20 pounds.

And then 30, and he might put pressure on his parents because I think you have to be 80, don't you, to open an ICA in the UK. And I think keeping it positive as well, like not being like, oh, you need to do this, you need to do this, I don't make it sound like admin. No. Make it sexy, make it fun, be like, if you want to be like them,

like who are his role models trying to tap into it? The footballers, do you think that they all they do is, take a salary. No, they're getting investments in the background. They're putting the money into this. A celebrity's KSI. Yeah. Save yourself.

No, but I think, yeah, I think osmosis, people learn by osmosis. So be the, you are already an amazing role model for him. Keep it up. Don't over worry if people aren't comfortable. He'll get comfortable in his own way. And all you can do is provide those like frameworks for him and drop it, drop in the right things at the right time. And I know it'll work out that way.

I really really do. Rather than nothing, but definitely not going too far into it. Make it positive. It could be exist. Yeah, you are. I'm not saying that you and do very well yourself. Okay. That is all for this episode.

The Vault is now closed. And for the final time, The Vault is just a trap around life and money topics. We are not giving financial advice. Thank you, Lucy. Oh, well done, Lucy. You got through.