The Vault with Financielle - The Truth About Budgeting, Downsizing, And Lending Money | The Vault Episode 48

Episode Date: January 23, 2025

Send us a textIn Episode 48 of The Vault, we discuss this week’s controversial opinion, “the 50/30/20 budgeting rule is bullshit” before diving into our listener dilemmas:💸 "Do we have to downsize after our children have moved out?”💸 "My brother in law won’t pay us back”We’re super excited for a community member who paid off her first credit card - £3924! 💸✨ On to the next one, you’ve got this!If you’d like to share your money win, head to the community in the Financielle app or email [e-mail] your (totally anonymous) money dilemmas to [e-mail] and we may feature yours on a future episode 💌As a Vault listener, you can get a whopping 25% off our digital course, The Money Playbook. This is a step by step guide to being financially well. It has 101 lessons where you'll learn how to budget, ditch debt, build savings and grow wealth. Use this offer code at checkout: VAULTCheck out The Money Playbook course here  💸Chapters:00:00 Introduction00:44 Welcome to The Vault01:02 January Decluttering and Organizing04:36 Project Pan: Using What You Have13:09 The 50/30/20 Budgeting Rule Debate16:15 Sinking Funds and Financial Goals20:33 Adjusting Financial Goals Based on Life Stages21:37 Dilemma: Should We Downsize Our Family Home?23:38 Exploring the Benefits of Downsizing30:39 Community Win: Paying Off Debt31:59 Dilemma: Brother-in-Law's Unpaid Debt43:09 Conclusion and Final ThoughtsThe Vault is an entertaining yet thought provoking podcast that answers our community’s dilemmas and confessions surrounding women and money.Visit https://www.financielle.com to download our app.Watch the podcast on YouTube.Follow Financielle for more:▶︎ TikTok▶︎ InstagramAbout Financielle:Financielle is a female focussed finance app helping women to take back control of their money, ditch debt, increase savings and invest in their future.Recorded and Produced by Liverpool Podcast Studios▶︎ Web ▶︎ Instagram▶︎ LinkedIn

Hey everyone, it's Holly here. Before we get into the episode, I want to share something exciting. That's right. If you're looking to take control of your money, the Financial app is your go-to tool. With the app, you can track your spending, create realistic budgets, and hit your money goals faster than ever. In fact, did you know our premium community members save three and a half times more than our free users? That's incredible. Plus, you'll be part of an amazing community where we all support each other on our money journeys. Whether you're starting to pay off debt or planning for your future, the app has everything that you need to make it happen.

So what are you waiting for? Download the Financial app today and start your free trial. Trust us, your future self will wish you did it sooner. Welcome to The Vault with Financial. This is a safe space where we talk all things life and money and no topics are off limits. Good morning. Hello. I've not got tea in hand actually. I should have had it in hand. Comfort blanket. I've got it now. I've got it now. Warm comfort blanket. How are we all doing? It's a good color we're good we're definitely loving january so far january's the time for organizing i think decluttering i don't know about you but where we're declutter mode i drove past laura's house the other day in her car you couldn't get in it because it was

full i'm assuming that's a charity shop drop yeah yeah no it's gone now. Don't worry. But it was the opera. So my husband knows he has to catch me in the right mood and like headspace because I just go, no, no, no. And so it started the week we took the decorations down at the beginning of the month. And that was a really good time to do it when no one's got any other like plans or activities or stuff. So we started there. And because the kids were were distracted with new things I went upstairs and I was in the rooms and I think actually I'm in a better place for it this year last year I struck my middle child will not give things up at all even if you talk about like giving and you get new things she just I found some straws from Portugal in the summer that were paper they weren't even like a nice straw but she just doesn't like you throwing anything away so you have to be really really careful about how you navigate it

but I also held a lot of like toddlerish stuff back of hers just in case the little man wants it well he's just one

on his own he's an absolute nutter and doesn't like cuddly toys ever he's got a Maggie from Steve and Maggie which is a YouTube awful programme

it's a lying magpie it's a magpie so he has that and he's got a Mickey Mouse Olympics nothing nothing else. He'll launch it at your head if you give him a teddy. So we downsize things like teddies and then, you know, bedding that he will just not need or want. And so suddenly we're on a roll. And that was just example of one room. I then went for my eldest. Someone's like, right, come on, let's like

go through your drawers because you can't find things in our drawers. We do like to keep things, but you just don't know when you're going to need it. But I just saw, I was so motivated early in January. So many people on Instagram and TikTok saying, it's a clear out, it's a clear out that it's looking amazing. In fact, only one of the things I cleared out, I've got these lovely open shelves in my kitchen and they were just getting cluttered with books.

I noticed that you'd tied it all up. That I wasn't, I wasn't reading the books and I kind of read them and thought right and there was like loads and loads of trophies like rugby trophies I was like this wasn't the aesthetic I was going for

really and like a bit of a dumping shelf so I put a lot of Christmas stuff on it and cleared everything out and one of the books was How to Dress Like a Parisian and fully in it I read it

I wrote it looks like you today do you know who and also another book next to it and you're a bit of a combination of the two it was Alexa Chung it drove that book I've got

I don't think I donated that it might have gone but it was a combination of the Parisian one so you've got your nice jeans and your stripe and your haircut

thanks for noticing I said it like a sailor but I'll take French you've got a bobble on your wrist as well I've always got a bobble on my wrist if I've not got a bobble on my wrist.

If I've not got a bobble on my wrist, yeah, if I wake up, I'm lucky I've got a hand left. I can't remember the last time I used one of those bobbles. Why? Because it protects your hair. Because they ruin your hair, don't they? And these other fabric bobbles. Yes. So I was looking at anthropology the other day

and there was a knitted hair bobble and I was like, I would buy that for Lucy tell them why you were looked at anthropology I know why I was just checking to see if my Christmas present that I got a few months ago

had gone down in the sale I actually was looking to see if they had it in silver weirdly enough because I love it so much I was like a bubble page

oh yeah yeah no I'm not going to because it's not silver so I was looking for silver because I've worn it a couple of times I really like that and I never do that thing

where you buy it in a different colour and you definitely should I am very much pro that so I looked for it but it was in the sale which was a bit annoying

but I saw it on the internet Talking about buying things actually I keep seeing people that started at the start of the year Project Pam Yes

Yes I'm going to do it I've decided I might even film it I'm going to do it I don't i might even film it i'm gonna do it project peter pan i watched hook basically it's where you stop buying things so skincare yeah is like the best example i think and it's where you actually just use everything that you've got yeah well if you like it or not yes you just get the bottom of the bottle or the jar or whatever

yeah and it's a combination of if you're just not gonna ever use that blush because it was just not a good color you give it you get rid of it you either you know hopefully not been it hopefully you can give it to someone i'm sure on the hygiene of showing some things obviously like not to scrape the top off but but it is that and so what people would do it in when you research it on tiktok you'll find it but realizing how many hand creams they have realizing how many like toners and how many like foundations and then I think I've been mum's project pan for a while any foundation she doesn't like just give to me and I'm like I can make a Picasso I can just like I'll get the color um but I recently started masking care out into okay that's like for this that's for that that's

for that hair stuff like I thought things were face masks and they're actually hair masks and so if it's in the hair one I'll know to go for it and actually when I was doing it this was when I did my tidy up action but I've not actually put project pan into place I was finding shampoos and stuff and I've been buying shampoos on the shop and so I hopefully shower gels and stuff you buy you find like presents that people got you like gift sets yeah and they're all in the back of the cupboard. That's what it is. You constantly buy a new shower gel. So moving them to the bathroom.

And then when you reach for a shampoo, you use up. In fact, it's even better to put the little ones first because you're easy to get rid of them. So are you going to do it? How have you been doing it? I think, I mean, I literally got so much skincare for Christmas as well. Oh, really? So I've probably got two years worth of skincare, I think. Amazing, because it's expensive.

I hate buying makeup, I hate buying skincare. So I think I could definitely go minimum this year without buying skincare. Imagine how, for me, it's the not a lot in the drawer, like easily looking and going, that's my skincare and that's all I use but when it's you don't want to get rid of stuff that in the past you just keep it so then like you're hunting around for things like we need to make our lives simple like if you're busy and it can feel overwhelming more stuff everyone talks about how much I mean god I know it's been a little while now but when we took the decorations down I was like huh yeah it's fresh yeah you feel

like you've got a new house but there's You can dance. But there's rules when you're doing, organising isn't it, where you have to have like an exit strategy. That was the biggest thing that people don't do. So they keep the bag of the charity stuff and they just move it from one room to another or like it's in the car. Yeah.

You have to have, if you're going to do it, you have to have an exit strategy. Yeah. So you have to have like a bag for the tip and you have to take it that day. You have to commit, bag for the charity shop

and bag for like friends and family I've been driving around with a tip bag in my car you're not the only one I feel like that's just completely normal

what's all that rattling I was like oh don't think about that I do a thing now whereby because we hand stuff to Ali if it's in good condition

Laura's youngest I'll wash it sometimes I'll tell you if I haven't but the last few things I've washed and I'll hand it straight over like the other day there was a dressing gown I've got, but the last few things I've washed and I'll hand it out straight over.

Like the other day, there was a dressing gown. I've got like an age four dressing gown. I'm like, there you go. Thank you. It's in the wardrobe already. Yeah.

Like done. Because otherwise it'll be sat in my room for six years and then by the time I go to give it to you, you'll have grown out of it. Yeah. So like exit strategy. It is a good time. I hope for everyone listening,

like you've you've found that moment where you can do a clear out a reset and you know find the stuff that you want to use and lean into this year and stuff that just you know Marie Kondo doesn't bring you joy don't feel bad about and like there's this um balance actually between vinted and charity shop because you don't want the vinted bag sat there but actually if you're on a debt-free journey or you've got a savings goal you like selling stuff is a really good way of bringing extra income in and I think for a long time I'm going to confess I've been really cushy we've got a budget that serves us we're hitting some moderate goals we

haven't set stretch goals which we have done this year and um the only way at the moment in our lives we can bring in extra money would be through maybe reselling and so um I've got some like beautiful uh oh um fancy dress like really expensive fancy dress that we got that were from Disney which was absolute fortune and I was like thinking of people in our life that we can kind of give it to and some of the people already probably have them as well anyway and my auntie Ruth was like sell them

and I was like oh that's my hat switch that back on Halloween anything I have to do fancy dress for with the kids I will actually get on Vinted

because I hate the thought of buying a new fancy dress item because I know that they're only worn a couple of times when you think about everything going to landfill

like it really does stress me out so fancy dress I will like I will always buy from Vintage I'll let you know like I don't want to

the downside of Vintage is the time it takes or it's sitting in the corner and actually you could have just donated it yeah there's a balance I think if it's on there

for a couple of months and you've had no hits and you take it off like let it go well I'll let you know I think that's a good idea I think I've had a bag and just take it off like let it go well I'll let you know I think that's a good idea I think I've had a bag of stuff going going on vinted a good six months oh really and I'm

like I should just take that to the charity shop but it's hard to know they'll get anything for it because people are so if I probably literally added up like sell this for two pounds you know a good little that's a money you, we talk about our money minutes though, that's a good, a money minute tip would be sit down with a cup of tea and get the bag and search on Vinted

and for every item, if you, you have to be really meaningful for you, it needs to be worth your time. So have a look and if it starts to add up to a good amount or ditch the things

that are just not selling or that are for cheap and then you might end up halving your workload for vintage but you get a bigger return for your time and you've done that

and you might get to the end of it and go I'm actually not selling any of it I'm going to just donate it and then that decision's made but the decision is like the forever to-do list isn't it

sat there in the corner of that bag the mental admin oh my good luck sometimes the money's not worth it I'm just going to put it out there for the mental admin of how much you'll get back and then also it I'm just going to put it out there for the mental admin of how much you'll get back

and then also having to go to the post office and get bullied in the post office so gauging how much do you think a possible not the 50 quid

60 quid we all know that's not going to happen probably I've looked vinted for like if you're on maternity leave or if you are a homemaker and you don't work and you kind of look

after the kids and there's elements of time where you can pop into little errands that amount of money can stack up but if you are working full-time dealing with like your hobbies dealing with this that and the other and then suddenly like oh I need to post that vintage parcel for four quid I just think yeah it's you know and it's got a pile of golf stuff to go and I'm like does anyone look for golf stuff on vintage it might be like a

lucrative thing but there's like literally a bag of really nice golf things that you just you just put things on as like bundles I was like

if you're gonna upload that do not do one thing at a time just literally put a bundle on for like 30 quid

because there's loads of really good stuff in there I've got rid of loads of stuff on Olio the app it's just free people just collect it

from your house there's literally like you take a photo of it and then we don't use that but we notice before you go on holiday if you've got a fridge full like a flavor of crisps you're not yeah then you can just put it on there yeah don't people collect anything yeah like that's so cool before you go on holiday i'm always like offering food out to our family we always go together so that's not helpful but like my auntie sometimes I'm like oh I've got like red onions

peppers gherkins never I love getting that dropped off from mum or Ruth you don't want to throw it away

why would you do that I don't really think that because we use the local Facebook groups but that's limited to the people in the group whereas Olio is a platform of okay right

we'll look into this more I think that's really helpful actually people in the group whereas Ollio is a platform of okay right we'll look into this more I think that's really helpful actually that it's wider than food I think I've seen it more as like

food things can you just tell everyone what you've got for your lunch today if you're being savvy with your fridge

I'm doing a podrick pan with my food because I'm a big food waster I'm hoping it's not from years ago. Yeah, these sausages are actually 2016.

For my lunch today, I have three chipolatas, like half a sweet potato cubed, and I also left it in the oven for too long yesterday, burnt it. And then I've got three slices of gherkins and it's all mixed together and touching the cold gherkins are touching the what will soon be warm and I think yeah and I'm gonna have to hold the gherkins whilst yeah so hopefully can micro it jeez so yeah I'm all right there's a lot of rogue not judging yeah i don't mind being touched i literally just

well she didn't tell you she was going to put cottage cheese in it as well yeah i wouldn't that's too far lucy i love cottage cheese okay i've got a controversial opinion for us today the 50 30 20 budgeting rule is bullshit oh my god cancel for that one lucy that is a big people love it in the budgeting world yeah 50 30 20 is like probably the most popular method method yeah it is but it's it's so simple so you make sure you can understand why people like it gateway it's a good it's a good gateway into budgeting so that 50 30 20 is where you um you allocate your income 50 to needs um 30 to want and then 20 to it's a saving and now actually what people think that that's also

possibly saving investing it could be paying down debt it's that extra bit is is for that and um it's a really good mental prompt to be like you have your needs your basic needs to like survive you should buy things that you want sometimes and this we're meant to like enjoy ourselves and it's not all meant to be absolutely scorched you know don't buy anything and and frugal frugal and then this reminder that 20 which is obviously only a fifth of the your expenses should be good um your income should be going to things for you, for your future self. So I like it.

It is bullshit though. Isn't it? It is. I think if you just want to coast by. Yeah, but like... It's just so not personalised. It's like out of touch. For calories, like you and I should...

Like if we want to lose weight and you go on like i don't know like a my fitness pal or whatever it might be our weights are different so therefore our calories are different like our hormones are different yeah everything is different our exercise is different 50 30 20 imagine living in central london or then living in whitehaven shout out to the Whitehaven producer Calvin's from Whitehaven we were talking about earlier

but that 50% of living costs you can't compare that to London in London you might be looking at more of like a 60 or 70

depending on the income that you've got coming in versus your outgoings because rent is so ridiculously high compared to

somewhere else in the north of England like you just it's not a blanket room single or in a couple yeah it doesn't work how would you i genuinely don't see how it would people so passionate about it if lucy dares do a tiktok on why the 30 20 rule needs to be like re-looked on or whatever it's like death to the budgeting app financial like people just love the 50 30 20 and like you say it might be because it's a good gateway it's got someone in they've never been able to budget before and that easy breaking it down has

allowed them to budget some sort of level but it's just not personalized at all and we're all so different i this helps bring out though when you do a budget in the financial app you get your donut which we've talked about before and your donut't notice your expenses kind of split out and it's not split out needs, wants and future self. It's split into fixed expenses, flexible expenses, sinking funds and then your excess. We don't determine the percentage you do based on what, first of all, you start with and then you can improve month by month and squeeze different areas of the budget. Because one month, what if about one month you've got three kids

and it's all their birthdays in that month? Is that 50, 30, 20? The percentage changes, like whether you like it or not. I think that's why we really like the excess. So the excess is green on the donut. And basically, well, I like the purple sinking fund and the green is excess. And what that tells you, if that's a really good part of your budget,

it means that you are definitely saving, investing or paying down debt, which is your future self stuff and that's your financial well-being stuff. But we're not going to determine what that percentage should be. They'll get asked it all the time. I think aiming for, you know, 5% of your income and 10% and then getting up to 20 and then even beyond that, wonderful. But it's all relative. As you said, it's personal. But i like purple because purple is telling me that people

are saving for things coming up that purple as a part of your budget is uh paying for things in the next year that you're not going to put on credit and that you've planned for and it might be an indulgence well it might be a uber big travel fund or it might be a clothes fund because we're gonna have a brand new wardrobe or it's gonna be it's a home or car repair fund and um but they're all different our biggest question into community i think in over the last few months has been around sinking funds has it everyone is so curious about how much what ones do you have i saw a post the other day it was like can everyone list the sinking funds out and i was like someone had god help I think I have a lot if I counted mine up it'd be

near enough I'm annoyed at the moment with Starling because that's where I keep my pots and they've pulled the interest on the box I need to find someone I was like should

because of that yeah well I think it's on the list of dreams of things to do but I we were doing our net worth and it was a really healthy check to look at

I think I've shared before like we have the trading 212 cash ISA at the moment. It's one of the best ones on there. So that's what my husband and I choose to have. But I'm not, you know, my other ones just are not paying enough interest. Barclays pulled their really good rate. So I'm going to close that account and move to Felts where Starling had a really good fixed saver that's just matured, which is really good. It's like a bonus. I don't know if you've ever done a fixed saver about to mine's just like 250

quid dropped in um because it builds up all year but you don't have access to it so instead of getting interest bit by bit yeah you lock it so you don't get access to the money but the bank rewards you with that with like a higher um percentage so now it's a good time to sit and go you know what what how is everything performing I'm sat there going I was thinking Valencia the cash is sat there and it used to be okay I think it was around

three-ish percent I can't remember what it used to pay it wasn't as high as the savers but it was well it was good and now it's not so I'm going to not I'm not

banks are not like football teams you can switch them I'm going to have a look at because Monzo did the same so they're not great either I'll have a look at Chase Chase is the only other one that I can think of

that's got the space. I have actually started just putting everything because I have like my emergency fund just in my Monzo like instant access saver. I think it was good.

It was good. It's come down now. And now it's just like it's not the best. But I kept getting interest on that every month and I was like why is the rest of my money

not sat in there? Yeah. And I can literally see it right above it yeah so I just moved everything in there and then organised it in the financial app

in the app because we've got the sinking funds tracker now so you don't necessarily I think it's just it doesn't need to be separated out no it doesn't

I think it's just I like personalising them all and seeing them and seeing how much is left in them and all that kind of stuff so but now we've got the

sinking funds tracker in the app for chunkier so if you imagine like travel absolutely car maintenance something that's a bigger one that you're not going to dip in and out of it might be a couple of times yeah that you do it yeah oh that's fascinating but yeah i think having a look at that that donut and and sharing and chatting there's nothing wrong with trying to get to these goals of like 20 for your future self but needs and wants is a very um personal thing uh you you live in situation your location your um relationship and more importantly where you're at in your money journey i'd say if you feel really

financially well that 20 might yeah yeah the same for your future self you might go right i've got everything organized i'm totally in order i feel financially well i'm going to ramp up my investments so then you go well I have to stick to 5th, 3rd, 20th so I'll just keep it at that but then for other people who are in an aggressive

debt payoff I want you to have less wants absolutely there's got to be a time in your life where you're pulling back we've all been there in that difficult period

where you're like I really want it but I'm not going to because I want to be debt free it's a great starting point but it's don't feel pressured to hit. Yeah, but it could be just asking to fail.

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. If it's just so unrealistic for you, then. And it is because it's not personalised. No. We're not talking 52%, 35%, and then the next month it's different. It's like 50, 30, 20.

People are very passionate about it though. It does make me laugh. I do like to drop a little. See people fight on TikTok to Lucy I love writing back to some of the comments sometimes on your anonymous account Holly I would never yeah okay time for our first dilemma do we have to downsize after our children have moved out? We're a retired couple in our late 60s and we've been living in our family home for over 30 years

now. It's a big beautiful house that holds so many memories of raising our children, celebrating milestones and hosting holidays. Now that our children have grown up and moved out, it's just the two of us here most of the time. They do come back for regular visits, especially for Christmas and summer holidays, and it's lovely to have the space for them. But in the day-to-day, the house feels a little bit too big and a bit empty. We find ourselves wondering if it's time to downsize and move into something more manageable. Financially, we don't need to sell the house, but it feels like a lot to maintain just for the two of us. On the other hand, we worry about losing the space when family come to visit or when grandkids come along in the future should we hold on to the family home for sentimental reasons and occasional use

or would it make more sense to move somewhere smaller and free up some equity we're feeling torn and would love some help so firstly what house are you picturing guys like I'm picturing like a big house river at the bottom yeah of the garden I think I'm home alone house what did you picture Lydia what the kind of bougie house big house farmhouse well it says big beautiful house I'm thinking oh I don't know yeah the home alone house she doesn't mention horses I don't know they've, the home alone house. She doesn't mention horses. They've got alpacas in the back. I romanticise that house the way she described it. Yeah, like I totally get this dilemma

and I feel like I fully understand why they would be feeling this way and torn about the decision. But there's no reason why you can't still create memories in a new home and host people. Yes, it might be a bit more squished than it was in your other house, but to free up some of that equity,

you might not score more holidays, travel more. Like you are getting older, whether you like it or not, we all are. Like that house might become impractical when it's a bit too late and the situation's a bit more stressful. Someone could get ill, someone could fall. Like there'd be loads of things where you're then going to have to make a rush choice. They're so young. Yeah, they've still be loads of things where you're then going to have to make a rush choice now they're really they're so young yeah they've still got loads of time left

so do something while you've got the capacity to do so and it's not in a rush it's definitely a really good question we've talked about this quite a lot on BBC Morning Live before like with you know the audience typically is a retired audience and we've talked about awful things like equity lease mortgage

and how difficult that is to navigate unless you've got the proper advice and you fully understand what your options are. And so often an option that people don't consider, and this is when you need money, it is downsizing. And it's because you're torn. And so I think there might be some people listening to this outside of our dilemma, our person that's written the dilemma in, that might have this in their life or their parents life for financial reasons and so there are different variations um there's the there's the if you are struggling financially um and things

are a bit tough and it's hard to maintain and these beautiful big houses just take so much money there's a definitely a wonderful path that is the down size to the bungalow or apartment like part of me is like jealous of my old apartment life where it's like i envisage buying a really amazing home still just because it's smaller doesn't mean like you sacrifice style or substance or and you can still have like i'm thinking cottage or like an epic living area where if it is important to host people, you don't need lots of bedrooms, but you need a really good open plan thing that the Christmases can still be with you

and events can still be with you. You still have a beautiful home that's small. Yeah. Arguably, I would prefer that. Bigger house means more to clean and tidy. Well, that was what I was thinking though. It sounds like it's understanding why you want to keep the thing and so,

just think about the memories and, because they seem financially sound, I'm with you, you would only really want to move to something epic,

just smaller. Yeah. Because you don't want to regret that decision because it sounds like they may have money to be able to get gardening help,

cleaning help, a little bit of housekeeper once in a while, you know. But it's not that, it sounds like it's just too big for them now and they're holding on to it for reasons that aren't their own though no I think she still sounds like she likes it she's not she's not um but I always say why write the dilemma in them you're like she

definitely doesn't I guess it's like the natural thing to do though isn't it like everyone's moved out it's your family home it's like okay is it the norm it should die but i don't think she's feeling negative about the house when the way she'd written the dilemma in because i want to give someone permission to stay i think this is like a girl this is a money conversation we answer things with a money edge yeah yeah she doesn't need and she doesn't need the money financial no um but which therefore alex i'm with you i think i think if you're going to move don don't feel like you should. No. Because it's this time of life, like you're still so, so young.

Or because you're rattling around in this big old house because when you have people there, you're happy. You will not be in a great place if you move to somewhere not as nice. Then you go, oh, so either make it epic and the next new adventure that ticks the boxes for the entertaining the family stuff and let another family have the house like that's a nice thing as well like releasing some of the equity like it might mean that then you go oh we're gonna book like an airbnb for all the family for a summer holiday like so we can host every do you know what i mean

like if there's you've got options if you've got money definitely it's not like that doesn't have to stop that hosting and the kids come in and all that kind of stuff doesn't have to stop. And I wouldn't want her to hold on to that house for that reason alone. Because 90% of the year you're rattling around the house and it's like costing a lot of money and it's maintenance and all that kind of stuff. Yeah. It is funny though, like you can't sit waiting for people to arrive and that's why you have the house. Like the house is for you and your life and you can still have like oh god some of the best christmases we ever had was at my nana's house which was a two and a half bed tiny thing terrace in in wigan you know

you and and you can make spaces work for you and also like this new project and adventure because you're still so young yeah that um like you said hall doing it a bit late is then... It might be a rush job. Yeah, and needs driven. Yeah, you get in a house that you don't truly love. Like, it might take you two years to find your dream house. Yeah, that's true. You know, you can have the power of choice, whereas when it's something, for God forbid, happens,

your arm's tight behind your back and you might, oh, we'll just get the bungalow then because we've got all these, you know, we have to pick... I can understand why families struggle with it yeah it's definitely like I like giving people permission to leave

the house behind you know the pressure isn't on you and don't let any children that you have be like oh you can't sell the house that's our family home

see on films you're over there he's like dad you're not moving why dad in particular what's his house like that's just where I grew yeah okay no we just put this on Lucy go on then so I'd be like no just leave it to us how

how often do you go like three four times a year you're like you cannot sell the family home I just get so sentimental about things like even going out of a hotel room I'm like I'm never gonna see this again yeah we're never coming back here until next year yeah yeah and I'm like even getting on the train I'm like I wonder if I've sat in this seat before wow is this the last time I'll sit in this seat? Oh God. So romantic. As in like,

I'll sit on a different seat tomorrow, not like, I won't be here. God, who knew you could romanticise a train seat? Yeah. And touch it with your hand. In the north of England,

that's impressive. And if you've got a hand gel, just ask him for a friend. Rubbing the train seat. God. So, yeah, children like Lucy

are the problem don't be don't be pressured just don't tell them you can use the equity for Lucy's therapy yeah that's what we are

but like I said it's a downsizing is such a good thing to explore when it's financially driven especially like so many people get into like

credit and debt and mortgages and stuff Laura's sat there going sell the house yeah but they just do and it's it's because they're driven by this emotion and sometimes I found if you give someone permission to leave go you like it's a nice thing like let's buy a new place and let's embrace that and let's adventure a new adventure like it's still your time you have so

much of your life left to embrace don't like feel like you're letting everyone um down but at the same time if you wanted to stay somewhere and you just think it's something you should do you'll use the finances that you clearly have to like bolster it so don't make it too hard for yourself don't be sat cleaning a five-bedroom house and make sure the garden's not do the bits of garden that you like and then the bits that you don't like got someone else to do um and then you might like mull it over for a year or two yeah yeah and get more and more used to it i want i want to be them right now i'm going right move that's all i want to do oh yeah i'd be living on right yeah so we'll pick you a few options if you could send us your postcode

and your radius desired areas i've got a community win i've done it credit card number one has been paid off 3924 pounds paid since joining financial two months ago i feel amazing onwards to the next one and thank you for giving me the strategy to get this debt shifted once and for all that's impressive isn't it two months yeah love it i'm always like we always say if you can do that in two months what you it that's amazing i'm always like we always say it if you can do that in two months what you're going to do in a year yeah wait till december what have you achieved i'd love to know keep us updated on that one if you'd like to send us your win head to the community in the app or email it to the vault at financial.com okay next dilemma just a quick one

laura here if you're wanting to take back control of your money, ditch debt, make better decisions and build wealth for the future, the Financial app is for you. With Financial, you can track your spending on the go, hit your money goals faster and create a realistic budget that you can actually stick to. Not to mention, you'll be part of an exclusive money community who share tips, offer support and celebrate your successes along the way. Click the link in the description to download Fan and Shell and start your free trial now. This is your sign to take control of your money today. Okay, I'm done. Let's go back to the vault. My brother-in-law won't pay us back. Just over a year ago, my husband bailed

his brother out of a large amount of gambling debt. Unfortunately, this wasn't really discussed between us, but I've made my peace with that now. So we can't tell them to break up. That's how it bounds. As soon as the money was paid, a repayment plan was set. However, it hasn't been adhered to. Only around £250 has been paid back over a year because things like holidays and weekends away have taken priority in his budget. There have been other incidents where he's gambled large sums of money meaning there are now further debtors to be paid. I have a chronic health condition that is exacerbated by stress so I really need to

resolve or make peace with the situation. Do you have any advice on how to go about getting this money paid back? My brother-in-law has signed a document stating he owes us the sum of money. Can we take legal action? I don't see us being paid back any other way and we're losing money every day on this sum not compounding any interest. She doesn't say how much does she? No there's's no number only around 250 pounds has been paid back and he's still gambling large amounts of money away borrowing money and then gambling it away not from them oh geez so she's kind of saying does she just make peace with the situation and let go or can she take legal action if they have a document that he's signed? She can, but one will...

So I think this is why we don't lend money to family. It's a really, really privileged thing to say. And it needs to be done in a safe environment with safe family boundaries and kind of, you know, maybe between parents and children a little bit more than this situation was never going to end well and so I know you said it was out of bounds but your husband was absolutely bang out of order and discussing it even and you're a saint for kind of saying I've made peace with that because that's I think that's the bigger battle and I feel for

your husband because obviously wanted to help his brother out and lots of people have been forced to make decisions like that you know to bail out a family member and especially if it's gambling or other things like it's just such a dangerous world actually that some people just want people to be safe and feel okay you know it's not as bad if it's a credit card company but if it's gambling debt it's like is it people is it you know so um you've already done the hard yards right um i'm gonna put it out there i don't think you'll ever like your brother-in-law i think he might have a problem yes but i don't think you'll like the decisions he's made the and the fact that he's carried on doing that the fact that they've tried to carry on living their

life when you he owes you money and he's not stick to a payment plan you know not sticking to a repayment plan but also going out spending is being a bit of a dick that's my thing it's not that you've got a problem and you've gambled everything holidays i think we had a dilemma way back in the day i think you remember at the beginning of our pod and it was a girl that had lent a friend some money and the girl kept going on holiday you're going out for nice dinners yeah like that there's one thing not paying it back because you can't afford it or because you've got an addiction so you continue to you continue to do the thing that is your like trigger but still go on holiday and go out for dinner that's literally rubbing their faces in it and I would be getting really bloody frost now

yeah and listen when if someone isn't um able to get the help they need that's never gonna stop and so I and if he's not got much money by the way we're spending it then even if you took him to the money court because you just and you and everyone else because if you logically and there's loads of other people as well it's gonna be a long drawn out process emotional stressful and again I think it's hard to know with it's hard to to know without like, it was this 20 grand. I know. Or was this like two to three? Yeah. But if this isn't, and I hope it wasn't a life changing sum of money for you. If it was a two to three grand, which is a lot of money, by the way, but it doesn't change your life.

I would be tempted to suggest that your husband makes one more attempt to put the payment plan back in place which is look we know you're struggling with this addiction we helped you out this is really important like it's important for our relationship that this money gets paid back so what can we put in place what we know or you know just what can we put in place that finalizes it you get you get someone to receive your salary instead of giving it to you. Garnishing wages. Well, I just think there's one more chance for me to say, this is really going to damage our relationship.

I appreciate you've got other stuff going on, but you borrowed money from us. We bailed you out. As a family. As a family. And so for us to have a good relationship going forward, you need to put this in place. And either that works and he fails at it or he doesn't do that,

you know, then you have to, I think, write it off. And mentally, one of the best things you could do for you is write it off. And basically, even treat it as a gift. Treat it in your head because this is about how you feel. You were never going to get it back. Because he's going to annoy you then. You'll have to work on you, you not him you'll have to work on you for the rest of your life you will because every time you see him do anything just be like gut wrench it'll be annoying but time will help and i think if you see it as you helped a family out family member out for a period

of time they're struggling they've got a lot of other issues on they're not living another fancy life like genuinely a couple holidays here and there like it might look like he's living his best life going on holiday and stuff but he's got an addiction at the end of the day it's not going well unless he fixes himself you know it's very difficult there's loads of loads of really good gambling aware um websites and charities you can go to for help but he they're not living the life of riley riley that's gonna say larry who's larry he's having a great time but i hope you understand what i mean when i say you have to look up to you because about how you feels more important and if you you get your chronic illness gets triggered by stress and you will just fester and girls can

fester we're gonna sit aren't we like oh yeah you have to look at what you can control yes you can't control him and you don't need to eat up the relationship between you and your partner because you might all if that money's still owed that that that decision that he made your partner forever it's still hanging around whereas if you like if you i hope it's a i hope for your sake that it's a sum of money that's bloody annoying rather than life-changing i feel like it's more of the bloody annoying one I would say so

she doesn't lean into this is holding up financial distress now honestly like Laura said one more go but with it in the back of your mind that it's probably

not going to work but at least you've tried everything you can and honestly write it off if you can that's very privileged place for us to be able to say

I don't think legal route is going to work anyway I think this is where you're looking at options and legal route will absolutely tear the family apart which they've done already so it's not your fault you're entitled to that money but so is everyone else and you're not going to get it that way so i think that the only way your money can go to the top of the pile is emotional not blackmail but pressure yeah do you know like this is this is family it's very

rare that lending money to someone works out almost ever i feel like there's like a few i know a few people that lend money off family and they're really good with it and they are spending behind the means and that's why they need to borrow money but they're religious they religiously pay it back but then they always go back for more they never like learn how to it's like a line of credit rather than like sometimes we've seen an emergency scenario or a little bit of a help with a deposit because there's a rent situation it's getting a bit difficult and it's like a bridge of emergency yeah or or you're on a money journey

and then life's hit you and you've not quite got that emergency fund and so there are circumstances where you could do it but i think this is because this helps showing that you can't control life you don't know what's going to happen this is why you shouldn't borrow this is why we say don't do credit cards this is why we say don't do buy an appellate don't get an expensive car loan because you just don't know and you could be all in a good state of frame of mind and everything's going fine and then suddenly life hits you and you can't pay that back and when it's family it's next level and again they're like the brother's scenario like that's like that Christmas is a difficult Christmas you just maybe just don't have christmas together as well yeah you do separate sittings if laura if that was me and laura i personally

like it would just be so difficult to continue everyday life you'd be like oh you're going out for tea again and you're only like thousands of pounds it would just irk you whereas if um i'm gonna say this this way around let's see what you say. If I, if there was like a scenario where we'd like lost all our money and we really couldn't sort the car out and we had a roof leak, I think that you would be happy giving me even that money. It's a different, completely different scenario.

And it literally, you've forgotten about it. It's a completely different scenario when it's like that hard when someone's got an addiction. It's an illness. And we've talked about that, think we have a few other things 100% like and this is where like if they're trying to get this is where also you shouldn't lend people money because yeah it's a gateway you're giving them the opportunity to continue because it doesn't never ends I'm so bad I'd be like I'll buy you therapy sessions seriously I would and what do you need but it's because it was to settle the debt and then because it's the gambling debt it's like I can win it back I'll buy you a six month subscription to therapy to try and get you and that's good

I'll buy you food for six months yeah but it's because it was needed for the gambling debt listen so super I'm super impressed with how you made peace with your partner because you have to stick together on this one you've done well and you know they're trying to help their brother like i get it family any final words i don't want to i think again really brave to write that and i don't want to finish on too much of a low and there's lots of scenarios like holly and i also speak from quite a privileged position by saying yeah shouldn't borrow money from family lots of people do but these are the ways it it can go wrong um but if there's one thing you can take away from this for me it's fixing you not them so the ability to flip that into a gift yeah i can't even tell you even though even though morally you're like

yeah no that was like a loan and you are spending all this no no imagine how I'm thinking about how you will feel yeah like short I think go to a rage room is that where you smash things

yeah you just go in that's just my like room computers I'm in a mood rage room but whatever it is

for you like thinking about you you can you can change how you react to this situation even if it's not morally right we've got this like balance between what's right and what you can control and i just think you'll you'll be the better person for doing it definitely we're big on making yourself feel better yeah like what what can you do to make yourself feel better and i genuinely think sometimes it's shortbread and sometimes it's my rage rooms shortbread both maybe it's shortbread after the rage room in the rage room with a visor on eating a shortbread on the bed after axing the mattress I've just literally never seen these I need to do

I think I definitely need to put one now. Yeah, I think it would be a good activity. I would like that. Okay, that's all for this episode. The Vault is now closed. And just a quick disclaimer, The Vault is just a chat. Our life and money topics, we are not giving financial advice.