The Vergecast - Can Fairphone survive the US market

Episode Date: August 31, 2026

Skyrocketing RAM prices put a spotlight on product longevity and repairability, which makes this a particularly apt time for Fairphone to launch its first smartphone sold directly in the United States. Today, David Imel talks to CEO Raymond van Eck about the Fairphone 6+, the company's goals of user-repairability and ethically-sourced materials, and what place AI has in the future of Fairphone. Further reading: ⁠Read Tim Cook’s final message to Apple staff as CEO⁠ ⁠Sony Music Publishing and Warner Chappell are suing Anthropic⁠ ⁠Google capitulates in Trump’s attempt to rename Lake Ontario.⁠ ⁠MapQuest downloads surge after refusing to rename Lake Ontario.⁠ ⁠MapQuest knows this whole thing is ridiculous.⁠ ⁠Fairphone’s latest repairable phone is going on sale in the US⁠ ⁠The new Fairphone 6 Plus gets a perfect repairability score.⁠ ⁠The Fairphone 6 no longer feels like a compromise (except in the US)⁠ ⁠This environmentally conscious smartphone is finally coming to the US⁠ Subscribe to The Verge for unlimited access to theverge.com, subscriber-exclusive newsletters, and our ad-free podcast feed. We love hearing from you! Email your questions and thoughts to [e-mail] or call us at 866-VERGE11. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Welcome to the Vergecast, the flagship podcast of sustainable Android smartphones. I'm David Mell, and today we're talking to Fairphone CEO Raymond Van Eck. Now, Fairphone is a Dutch electronics company. They're most well known for their highly repairable smartphones, like the Fairphone 6 Plus, which just launched in the U.S. But they've also got things like sustainable and replaceable earbuds and headphones. They've just released this phone in the United States since their first phone in the U.S. market. and I wanted to talk to Raymond a little bit about how that's going and their plans for the future. But first, here's what's happening on the verge today.

This is 90 seconds on the verge for Monday, August 31st, 2026. Today is Tim Cook's last day as the CEO of Apple. Tomorrow he'll be passing the baton to John Ternis, and Cook will transition to executive chairman of Apple's board of directors. In a statement to the company, Cook reminisced on his time at Apple and expressed gratitude for the people he worked with. While Cook was focused on growing the company's supply chain to one of the most impressive on the planet, it will be pretty exciting to see what a product-focused Apple looks like in the coming years.

Bloomberg is also reporting that longtime Apple executive Phil Schiller is stepping down from his role as head of App Store and Apple events, but we'll be staying with the company to continue working on unspecified initiatives. Next up, Sony Music Publishing and Warner Chapel have filed a lawsuit in the U.S. District Court for the Northern District of California, seeking damages for tens of thousands of of copyright it works. The companies are asking for up to $150,000 per work, plus up to $25,000 for each instance of copyright data being stripped.

The damages could amount to several billion dollars if Sony and Warner awarded the maximum amount. And finally, MapQuest downloads have surged after it refused to change the name of Lake Ontario to Lake America following an executive order on August 27th. Google Maps officially changed the name over the weekend, and Interior Secretary Doug Bergam says Apple may soon follow suit. In a tweet, MapQuest said,

we're not changing the name of Lake Ontario. Name it whatever you want at your leisure. You can read more at Theverge.com. That's 90 seconds on The Verge for Monday, August 31st, 2026. In the AI era, you have to stop cyber attacks where they start, so security has to be fused into the infrastructure itself. That's why the network that connects everything is also your best defense. Cisco, the critical infrastructure for the AI era.

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Download today. Raymond Van Neck, welcome to the Vergecast. Thanks, David. Happy to be here. So first off, for people that do not know Fairphone, you're the CEO of Fairphone. Yes. Can you explain the mission of the brand here? Yeah, well, Fairphone is a Dutch tech company, and we are doing something that was long thought to be nearly impossible, right?

which is building high performance modular smartphones that can last for an extremely long time. So we have a five-year hard fare warranty, which is also in the US, but also seven to eight-year software support. And it's all done so you can hold on to your device for as much and as long as possible. And we also focus on ethically sourced materials

and fair wage labors for the people working on the fair phone. and to give you, let's say, a quick example of what that looks like. You know, if your phone battery died or you crack the screen, you know, these things happen to all of us. Then instead of paying a lot to someone who needs to fix your device and you need to wait around while that person does that, you can just repair it yourself, right? So you can order the spare part on Fairphone.com.

And let's say, $30 and a few minutes later, you have a perfectly working device done on your kitchen table with a single screwdriver. And, you know, that's what we do. And that's what we're pushing right now as well into the U.S. to be the norm. Yes, so you just entered the U.S. with the Fairphone 6 Plus. I've got one here in this very nice purple color. Very well.

How is the launch in the U.S. gone? And what has that process been like for you guys? Because it's famously very difficult to get phones launched the United States. Yeah. Well, it's going actually quite well. So we have a lot of interest both from media as well from customers and we are shipping out the first orders. So that's super nice. Yeah.

So on August 18th, we relaunched our latest and greatest. That's the 6 plus, right? And well, we are officially entered the US smartphone market now as well after doing the audio last year. And basically we are tapping into this growing right-to-repair movement. So, you know, I would say you as customers as well, right? They got used to the plant obsolescence and the expensive upgrades, which you have on phones. And at the same time, you have this global memory shortage, which is also causing a lot of market polarization. And you also see, let's say, shrinkflation over the, also in the mid-range Android market where we're in.

and basically with that we thought okay it's now time to give an alternative especially with the right to repair movement reaching momentum through all the states so that created for us a perfect environment to do our officially entry in the US market and we do that step by step because we also look closely on what happened on the market before and took notes I would say so first of all you can order the Fairphone on our website Fairfond.com as well as to Amazon. And we are slowly but surely building that out. We are talking to MV&Os and MNOs as well and actually building up the momentum there. Do you think that you're going to be able to get on store shelves in the United States or is that a

whole separate process that's very difficult? It's a process that's also connected obviously to the bigger retailers as well as to the MNOs. And we're also talking to the retailers and M&O parties, of course, to be on that shelf space. And that will be a process in due time that we need to succeed on that. So what are all the repairable components in the Fairphone? Because I'm sure that there are certain pieces that people tend to break more often than others. But maybe there might be something that is a little less common to break. What is everything you can actually replace in this thing?

Well, I think you of all people, they said no, right? I think you have told me that you switched a camera the other day as well. So first of all, you'll have the cameras here which you can switch. But also things that people easily tend to break, right? The screen is also a matter of a few minutes that you can just swap out. Same goes for the battery, but also PCBs. But also one thing that is really much overlooked by a lot of people, and it's easily breakable because people try to harass it all the time,

is the USBC port, which is also just in a blink of an eye, you can just swap that and have a brand new. In the interesting part, for instance, it also makes people to get used to the fact that they can switch and use these modular items, but they also get used to the fact that it's okay to open the device. hey, if you can't open it, you don't own it, right? Right, right.

I think something that a lot of people mix up between like Fairphone and maybe some other companies is a lot of people expect that these phones are going to be upgradable. Are there any upgradable parts in these where if you have like, say, an older Fairphone, you can put some of the newer components in or things like that? Or is it mostly just made to be repairable? It's now mostly made to be repairable.

In the past, we had, for instance, camera upgrades, when that still was a thing, I would say, from the Fairphone 3 to the 3 plus. But nowadays, we would love to be able to have something like that on offer. But the current hardware upgrades also on the 6 plus are not elements which are simple to play with and to move between devices. So for now, these remain two separate funds. for instance, the 6 and the 6 plus with separate spec sheets, though with a lot of shared components. So a lot of people in my demographic, at least, are thinking a lot more about sustainability.

They're thinking about, you know, moving away from Google and Apple and trying to buy a phone from a company that they actually want to support. How has the reception been in the United States? And are you seeing, like, a lot of momentum here? If you look to the U.S., right, also on our social media channels, in our community, etc., There are a lot of people living indeed in the US and ask us, like, okay, when do you, when do you come to the US? When will I be able to, at least to have an Android alternative to, for instance, also to Google and Samsung, etc. Yeah, and of course, it's needless to say that those people are very happy with the fact that we now entered the US market.

But it's also interesting to see, for instance, in a demographic of the order. ordering process. So we see orders coming in from across the US. So it's not particular, I don't know, sustainability, California thing or whatever, what you have. We see it across the state. And that's interesting as well because that's actually quite parallel to what we see in Europe, where we're growing a lot. 80% of the Fairphone six buyers, for instance, are new to the brand of Fairphone. So we more and more tapping in into that mainstream segment. as well, stepping out more and more out of this niche, as you may. Is there an age range, like globally that you guys are saying more particularly of?

Because at least people in my demographic age range, they're talking a lot more about sustainability, being able to hold onto their phone for a longer period of time. We see people buying it across all age groups. But more and more, we see also people that are a little bit more younger, Gen Z, buying our phones, or at least also have a particular interest in it. not only on the sustainability side, but again, also on the fact that it's self-reparable. And also they understand more and more the fact that when you buy a fair phone,

you're not only buying it for the specs at that moment. You're also buying it for, let's say, the total cost of ownership, which sounds quite technical, but in the end, people start to understand that, you know, again, if you can swap your battery for, let's say, $39, in a dollar or for $90 your screen that is also attractive to people. Something that I found very interesting on the last fair phone that I feel like kind of like plays into the demographic that I exist in is this kind of smart switch on the side that puts it into, I don't want to say a dumb phone mode, but it kind of is like

a focused dumb phone mode. What was the mentality behind that? Like what made you guys want to have a hardware switch for that? Yeah, you know, fair phone is not maybe also fair for the industry. It's also fair for, I would say, people. And also we more and more notice that people also are getting distracted with the phone, right? Or, yeah, as you may every now and then want some focus time, but they do not necessarily want to switch to, let's say, a dumb phone.

So what it does, for instance, here you can see my phone with all the apps that are there my kids, my wife, but if I switch the button, it immediately goes to a focus mode. And in this case, it means you can select basically the apps that you still want to have working. So in my case, I have Spotify, if I want to be in the focus, I can use my camera if I see something when I'm walking outside and I don't want to be distracted. I want to take a picture off. And actually, only my wife and kids can call me and all the rest is being blocked out. And I can switch it immediately on again the moment I just. want to be available.

To me, especially, right, talking to people or, for instance, like you, or even better, right, if I want to show to my kids, for instance, that they should less use their smartphone. Then I'm happy that I can put my phone on the table and switch the moments on instead of being disrupted by a call, the moment I try to explain to them that they actually need to put their phone away, right? Yeah. What are all the features of fair, do you call it fairphone moments? That's the toggle mode with the hardware switch.

What are all the things that that can do for you? Yeah, there are a lot of different features there. So one is also a light bulb. So we have here in the setting screen, you have basically a whole list of things that you can just make your switch do. So you can just put it as a simple Do Not Disturb mode or a flight mode or a torchlight.

Also, for instance, if you want to switch between your private profile, your work profile, battery saving. There are different things that you can attach to this fairphone moment. Most people choose to use it basically as a focus mode. Or for instance, when they're driving, that only Google Maps works or whichever navigation app you have. And you're not getting distracted by WhatsApp messages during your drive, etc.

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I'm participating A&W locations in Ontario. Do you wish you could just hit skip on the worst parts of your life? You know the same way you can skip an ad? I get it. I'm Siaiaa and I live in Ice Cove. I've made some questionable decisions that didn't end up the way I planned. And today, I'm still figuring it out. Somehow, things usually get worse before they get better.

Apparently, that's how I roll. So bundle up and come along for the bumpy ride. Don't miss the new season of North of North starting September 8th on CBC Gem. One of the toughest sells for a lot of people in the United States is selling a mid-ranged Android phone. In the U.S., people tend to be on carrier plans, so they buy expensive. phones and one of the most popular phones in the United States is the iPhone Excel version, you know, the Pro Max. Is it difficult to sell a mid-range Android phone, especially in the U.S.? Like, do people struggle with making that trade-off between their

ethics, I suppose, and a mid-range phone? What have you seen there? Well, you know, Europe is in that case maybe not so different. So it means that you also have people here who just want to have the latest and greatest and want to upgrade their phone every year. But in the end, right, people are not stupid, I would say. So they see that spending a lot of money to have that latest and greatest and then have this incremental change on a phone to a lot of people actually that is, you know, it's becoming more and more clear that when you buy a fair phone, which I think it's also a bit of a misconception to see that, you know, it's becoming more and more clear that, you know, The phone is expensive because in the end, especially by the way, if you look to sustainability,

that's not a key driver on the price of a phone. Mostly it's skill. So the bigger we become, the better that is for a bill of material. But having said that, most people that buy it also understand the fact that you buy it and then be able to hold on to that phone for longer, especially if you look to this total cost of ownership concept again. you know, try to replace a screen at one of these iPhone Pro Max models that you were just pointing out. Yeah, you can almost buy a fair phone for the cost of that. Right. Right. You talk about

sustainability a lot here. And in 2021, I interviewed your previous CEO. And he talked a lot about the goal of the company being to persuade other companies to be more sustainable, to be more thoughtful about where they're getting their lithium from. Can you explain your efforts there? And is that still something that you're focused on? Yeah, absolutely, right? Our mission is also to change the industry to become more ethical when it comes to producing consumer electronics. The rising tide lift up all boats.

So what I mean to say with that is that we have, for instance, things in place also in the Republic of Congo, if you may. There is cobalt is being mined there. Yeah, we have founded there the Fair Cobalt Alliance, in which we also have now teamed up with Tesla, also with Google, Glencourt, other players. And basically what we do, we pay just a dollar extra for every gram of cobalt that we get out of the chain.

And with that extra money, we can improve the circumstances and the mines, take the children outside of the mines, etc. And that is something that we do just in a broader level. So team up with the industry. We're open to that. We're very open in everything, right? The blueprints of the fire.

and we are open source, they're all there. It's just for someone else also to pick up the, to pick it up and start working with it. And yeah, maybe David's already to catch you off your feet. I think a lot of people then ask us, yeah, but what is everybody else is doing it, right? Where is your competitive edge? Well, again, first of all, where on repairability,

we see now the level is going up because there's legislation. If that's the bottom, we're still at the ceiling. So I think we still have a lot to offer to everyone else to make fair for an attractive offer, even if others start copying it. What I do hope, sincerely hope that will happen. Speaking of repairability, you guys also make earbuds and you make over there your headphones, which you are currently wearing. What's the story there?

What are the parts that you can replace there? Why did you choose those parts to be replaceable? Can you explain that? People have this conviction that, for instance, if you take the fair butts, you know, in ears, it's of course, and you think of it, it's super strange that if you lose one earpiece, you maybe have to buy a whole new set or if the battery wears out that you cannot just open the little thing and change it. So you just toss it away. We make also these headphones, every part is replaceable, even the drivers.

But if you look for instance to our fair butts, even the small battery. you can change and yeah so it's also the battery in in the cases itself it's and and basically if you open them you can just you can totally open it so for instance you can replace the the batteries on it and actually basically all the different parts you can also see by the way of course on fairphone.com you can see a total list of all the parts yeah there you can you can replace that yourself so everything is designed. I think that's good to say there's repairability. But repairability often requires someone else to do it for you. And we design this basically to do it yourself. So even I, I have two of these left hands. I would say I'm not the most, I would say I'm quite clumsy, but even

I can do so. What do you think has changed about the company in the two years since you've been CEO? And where do you want to take it? What's your primary focus? So my primary focus, actually is for us to instead of being the exception to become the example. And for me, right, where Fairphone was really

good at was in the end the whole impact story. So for instance, if you look to our impact report and the things that we are doing in the whole supply chain, that's unprecedented, right? But you can only really have an impact if you also are able to scale and to grow.

And that's why we were fully focusing as well now also on the product because if somebody walks into a phone shop, they just want to have a good device. And then sustainability becomes the reason they feel good about the product they already have decided to buy. You know, within, in my opinion, within four years from now, four to five years from now, we need to be just this impact tech unicorn company.

And I think that's feasible. And that's something that we really are going forward. Well, is there anything that you want to tease for the future, the direction of the company, or anything fun you got coming up? Of course, you haven't seen the last of us also on products. So we are quite busy, again, thinking of also our next smartphone and the direction to take that. We always take the input of the community there as a starting point. So we also got some good pointers already from the community, what they really are in need of. And that's something that we're really looking into, as well as thinking on all kinds of AI features that we could include into our next phone as well.

And, yeah, you know, I think it's also good to mention that with also the Gen 6 Plus, we also have upped our memory, which also means that to be future-proof for all the AI developments that are coming as well. And that's also the direction that we are heading, right, just to deliver phones that also. that also in this dynamic world can still be there and basically are built to last. I want to touch on that real quick before we close out. When you say like AI features, things like that, how do you guys think about AI and AI features? Because that is a very contentious topic

and for like a sustainable company that thinks about ethical stuff. Like what's your angle for that? Well, first of all, right, AI is here to stay. So I think for us, it's important and it can tap right into the values that we have. So one of the things that we are offering is also privacy-friendly phones. So first of all, our phone comes without bloatware. And we also make sure that privacy is respected.

And I think if you then sway over to the topic of AI, right, you can think of all kinds of developments that we could put on the phone that also respect the privacy of the users. of these AI features. But also on the sustainability side, you can also think of things like that really support you to hold on to your phone longer or to be more conscious on the energy users of the phone

or what have you. So there are all kinds of developments that we are doing. But I cannot open the kimono, of course, fully. We are quite busy with these developments, but we're also happy to come back and tell a little bit more about that. Yeah, great. Sounds good. Well, Raymond Van Eck, thank you for joining us. I really appreciate it. Thank you, David. Appreciate it.

That's it for the Vergecast. Let us know what you think. Call the hotline 866 Verge 1-1 or email Verge at theverge.com. And to support everything we do here and get ad-free podcasts, subscribe to the Verge. The Vergecast is a production of the Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. We're produced by Josh Kahas, Eric Go, Thomas, Brandon Kiefer, and Travis Larcuk. See you next time. Two and five Canadians will hear the words, you have cancer. That's why every step and dollar raised matters. On September 19th, join thousands in Toronto for the Princess Margaret Cancer Foundation Walk.

Challenge yourself, friends, and family to walk 21 kilometers in support of life-saving research. Together, we can carry the fire and help create a world free from the fear of cancer. Register today at pmcfwalk.ca.ca. Don't you wish you could just hit skip on the worst parts of your life? You know the same way you can skip an ad? I get it. I'm Siaiaa and I live in Icecove. I've made some questionable decisions that didn't end up the way I planned.

And today I'm still figuring it out. Somehow things usually get worse before they get better. Apparently, that's how I roll. So bundle up and come along for the bumpy ride. Don't miss the new season of North of North starting September 8th on CBC Gem.