The Vergecast - Cut the night

Episode Date: February 26, 2016

Another week of Vergecast and we have SO much to talk about so we extended the episode to 90 minutes…and then some.Mobile World Congress just wrapped up so Nilay, Dieter, and news editor Jake Kastrenakes are here to analyze the coverage. Also, the Oscars are this Sunday so our entertainment section is taking over Vergecast during halftime! Entertainment editor Emily Yoshida leads the discussion with entertainment editor Jamieson Cox, and senior reporter Bryan Bishop. Nicola Fumo commands the hype matrix once again for this show-within-a-show episode of Vergecast! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

So hi, welcome to the Vergecast. It's today or for many people tomorrow. I'm Neil Apetel. I'm here with you in your heart. I'm joined by Dieter Bone, who I've missed terribly. Jay Castanakis is here. Yes. Fummo's here.

What up, girl? Hi. Here's the thing that's going to happen on the show. This is a special 90-minute extended Vergecast remix. Halfway through. So the first half, we're going to talk about MWC, technology, Apple versus the FBI. The plan was to not talk. about Apple, but they decided to file a massive

legal brief. They filed a massive... Minutes of four airtime. And my heart exploded with joy. I don't know about you guys. It did. That was completely sincere. And then halfway through, we're going to... Everyone's going to leave. Oh, Brian Bishop's on the phone. Brian.

Hello. Hey. Brian Bishop, Skyping in from L.A. Halfway through... Congratulations, Deeter. Thank you. Deeter and Jake are going to leave. Goodbye. Emily, Yoshita and James and Cox are going to come sit down.

And we're going to talk about it. some movies and the Oscars that are happening on Sunday. So, and Brian is our glue because Brian was OG Verge, started with us the very beginning, hardcore tech reporter, now senior editor, senior reporter on the editor, whatever. Brian's a senior dude on the entertainment beat at the verge. So like you see the continuity, you see the... The intersection of technology and pop culture. Yes.

Is embodied in the person of Brian. In Brian. It's like technology has. It's like technology is on this side and then culture's on this side and then it's a door you walk through and Brian is the arch. Yeah. He's holding both the doors open in the middle. Brian's actually a triangle that holds all the weight between the arch. Yeah.

Is that a bishop? Is that called a bishop? That's a keystone. Brian, change your last name of Keystone. I'm not changing my name of Keystone. Brian Keystone. Brian Keystone is a great name. Not a porn name.

Yeah. That's a good name. It's like a, it's like a cop who didn't succeed. Ah, Keystone's on the case. I got it. Yeah. Brian Keystone, anyway. Anyway, Jake, to answer your question.

So, Dieter got married two weeks ago. Yep. He and his now wife Lisa requested that we fly the rings down with the drone. So that we would. GGI. Phantom 3? Phantom 3 professional. Great, great product.

How much? How much drone practice did you have before this? I would say, well, so I had a lot. Oh, okay. Of, like, I watched, like, a day of YouTube videos. Oh, yeah, that easily all fights you. Neil, I flew down to the Caribbean, like, a week early so he could practice the drone. Yeah, basically.

It was, like, for a vacation, but really it was so he could practice the drone. I had this whole moment where I realized I'd spent, like, an afternoon in my house watching YouTube videos, and I was like, I don't know. This is, it seems. And then I was like, this is a bunch of, like, drunk 12-year-olds on a boat to our flying drones. Like, like, with like, you know, it's like, there's a lot of those videos where it's like, like, Phantom first flight.

And it's like a guy in a speedboat and he's like bright red and he's like, ah! And it's like, I can do this. Like, if that guy can do it, I can do this. And then I was like, but what if we made it even more complicated and ruined one of my best friend's wedding will fly this drone? But so we had, the one part that was scary was, I bought a tea strainer and I put the rings in. So like a little round thing.

and it was all tied and decorated and at least had like some flowers. And Deer's like, oh, that looks great. And he like held it up and started jingling it. And the thing immediately popped open. So that we had to like wrap it and... But it worked. Yeah, it worked great.

And it worked. It was stupendous. It was something. I haven't yet posted the video because I didn't want to like turn your wedding into content in the website. No, go ahead. All right.

I wrote a post. Anyway, so let's talk about what's going on. There's a lot going on. There's some news that just broke. Yeah. In the Apple case. And then MWCF. So let's do the Apple case quickly because I'm going to write, I'll write a big thing tomorrow because I love playing about legal briefs.

So thus far in the Apple case, and this is the FBI wants Apple to create a new version of iOS. It bypasses the lock code and the law code restrictions so that they can try to brute force enter a pass code on iPhone 5C that was owned by a San Bernardi terrorist. If you're listening to this show and you don't know that information, I have no idea what you're doing. But anyway, so thus far, the FBI filed a motion to compel in the court, and then it's been Apple was not involved in that motion. They have not replied that motion. And it has been a PR war, right? Basically, it's been PR war. And, like, literally Tim Cook was on ABC last night and was like...

He just answered the same question for half an hour. Yeah. But, like, his line was like, the government is trying to give the technology industry cancer. Like it was that level of rhetoric from Tim Cook, and he's very firm on that they're not going to do this. But what's interesting to me is there hasn't been any legal battling. It's just been this PR. They're setting the stage. And the PR war has, like, not broken in Apple's favor this far.

Although it's kind of interesting. We sent... It slowly started to maybe turn because there was one poll that said majority of Americans did want him to do it. And then a later poll was like, well, actually, the majority is not so sure or doesn't want him to do it. I like slightly question that poll, though, because that wasn't on the online polls. that's true. But I feel like that pole probably skews more toward people who... Nevertheless, Neely is right.

It's like, unlock a phone is something that everybody assumes Apple can do pretty easily. And it's a terrorist's phone. And that's a really steep hill to climb. It's bad to be... But then we sent Kirsten out. There's a video on the site on YouTube. We sent Kirsten out in Times Square just like do a man on the street and talk to people. And what was really interesting was they all started...

saying Apple should unlock the phone and then as Kirsten sort of fed them more information about how that would work and what it would mean almost all of them changed their mind really yeah that video is crazy like we were I was watching like walk through like so you know what that means right and then told them right like if this key gets released then anybody could unlock a phone you're fundamentally

phone more and secure if they unlock one phone then the government can ask them unlock all kinds of other phones yeah and you just sort of watch people come to the inevitable conclusion that eventually the government will be able to do crazy things like request Apple turn on the microphone in their phone.

That is fundamentally the capability of the government is asking for is we would like Apple to write us custom firmware targeted to single iOS devices. And if Apple can do that with one phone, they can presumably

do it to every phone and then the government can say okay, this guy, we have a search warrant for him, write a version for iOS that sends us every Siri command or is constantly listening or whatever the hell they want to do. And that's where,

that's like you're walking all the way up to there. And then everyone is like, no, we don't want, we would never want the government to do that. So it's like really, so the PR war is like furious back and forth. The more people learn, the more they change the mind. Donald Trump is,

he's still tweeting from his iPhone, even though he said he's banning Apple products. It's crazy. And then today, the thing that happened, which I think is the most notable moment, thus far is Apple filed its response motion to vacate, this order and say this is bullshit.

And you can see what their actual legal argument is instead of their PR argument. In the legal argument, I've only, we literally Deere and I were just like reading it as fast as we could before he came in the air. Legal argument is not as strong as I want it to be. So what are the core arguments here? So it's structured, there's three core arguments. The first one, I got to look up with the actual Akron stands for. Yeah, it's Kalia.

Oh, God. Mac, you know how Mac has these little previews and you hover your mouse over? It gives you little arrows instead of just opening the damn thing on PDFs? Yeah. The worst. Anyway, so there's this law called the Communication Assistance for Law Enforcement Act, Kalia. That's usually acronym. Passed 94.

And basically it says if you run a telecommunications service, you have to help the government tap the community. That's it, right? Just I'll read the first line of Wikipedia. So the United States wiretapping law passed 94. Clea's purpose, enhance the ability of law enforcement agencies to conduct electronic surveillance by requiring the carriers or manufacturers or equipment, modify, and design their equipment, facilities, and services

to ensure they have surveillance capabilities. Right. It's the wiretap lot. It says if you run, if you're AT&T or Apple or whatever, you've got to do this stuff. And their, Apple's first argument is a very specific, I'm going to get a law professor on the show right now. It's a very specific line.

They pulled out a subsection of the law that says, the carriers have to wiretap and help intercept dialing information and the audio of the call. And there's a subsection, like section B of this says this does not authorize the government to require the design of services or equipment, which is specifically Apple's thing, is you're requiring us to design iOS such that. I mean, maybe that's why they've been using this language so clearly, because they've, I mean, every single time they're saying they, to code a new operating system. Right. So that is their first argument is

Kalea is the United States wiretapping law. Kalea in this section says this subchapter does not authorize you, does not authorize the government to require the design of a thing. That's great. The problem is that that is, and this is like the deep lawyer,

saying this subsection does not authorize something doesn't mean that it's prohibited. Right? So if I say this law, this chapter, chapter 47 does not authorize me to, like, hit Jake. And then chapter 48 is you are authorized to hit Jake. 47 doesn't prohibit, doesn't, it doesn't, it doesn't. Yeah, it's a difference between you are not authorized to hit Jake and this chapter doesn't authorize you to hit Jake.

I no longer feel safe as much cast. Right? Like, it's like, Jake is dead. Viewers, please stay on. It's going to be an hour, it's going to be 90 minutes long because it's snuff film. It's just Jake slowly dying. No, but like, Brian, you are a paralegal. Like, you hear what I'm saying, right?

Like, it's this subchapter does not authorize this. Does not mean this law prohibits this. It just means you have to go find some other authority to do this outside of this thing. So that's their first argument. Does that make sense? Am I crazy? Is Brian still here? Yeah, no, that makes sense.

The government is like, I just want to make sure you're there. You know, you're like on Skype. You're all alone. I miss you He's not in a club room The other thing you People that love him The other thing you should know about Brian

Is when Apple was suing Samsung Brian and I were like The fucking strike team Brian was in the courtroom We had secret back channel Voice comms open So I was like listening in court And like blogging as fast as I should

I think we can't talk about this It's over now What are they gonna do? That case is so over You know what happened? That would have been really cool If we had done that No yeah

It's so cool. I can't, whatever, man. The case is over. All right. I mean, Brian and I were deep. We're deep in the zone together. Anyway, so anytime there's an appell legal case, I think about Brian, fondly, as it is. Jake, however, is going to die.

Anyhow, so that's their first argument, right? And I think that is a really weak argument. That's bad. I just don't think it's great. I can be wrong. I will say that before they get to the actual legal arguments, like the moral force of their rhetoric is very good. Oh, the whole thing is designed to be quoted.

Yeah, it's designed to be quoted as a layperson. It's like, oh, yeah, oh, oh, yeah, I'm with you. This is great. I totally am convinced. Okay, so we should get off this because there's much more depth here, and they talk about another case where the government forced, literally a 1946 case where they forced a New York phone carrier to install a wiretapping device using this.

And they're like, this isn't the same. I'll get into it. I'll write a whole thing tomorrow. But that's like the big breaking news is like Apple, they're making their legal argument now and not their PR argument. And I think that is really fascinating. And this is one in, someone's going to make a decision here.

And, you know, it's Apple's like doing the infomercial thing where it's like, everything's so hard. And they're like, how could we possibly code a new iOS? I'll fall down. And it's like, they're like, you're the richest company. The other thing that's happening is Microsoft has said it's going to file a brief in support of Apple, and I think Google now is also said they're going to file a brief.

It's supposedly Facebook as well. Yeah, makes sense. Anyhow, I mean, if you're Facebook, the last thing you want is the government just like, oh, and Verizon backs Apple. Yeah. Of course. Why? Why, of course.

They've been, they've given the government everything it's asked for. Because the government is, because if you're Verizon, you are already tightly regulated, Oh, so they don't want... They're afraid that... They're afraid of... They're actually genuinely afraid of this slippery slope argument that if the government can compel Apple to make new stuff to let the government spy on you,

that they could also compel Verizon to expend resources to make new stuff to make the government spy on you. Yeah. And so Verizon's argument is there's already a complex regulatory scheme that provides the government with... That compels us to help the government in law enforcement activity. If you want to help... If you want us to help more, Congress should go pass a law saying we should help more.

The government can't just like, that would be my guess. Anyway, stories going on. But because it's an endless show, endless. And Jake's still alive. It's time for Jake to talk about NWC. So, Nicola, did they provide you with pictures of phones, as I requested? Dieter sent me all of the links. Which one?

Which one? Let's start with the S-7. So Galaxy S-7 is announced at MWC. Jake, you want to do the specs? That's in the Samsung tab. Samsung tab. This window. By the way, Samsung tab,

actual name of a Samsung product. Oh, man. Galaxy tab. Yeah, but come on. It's close to it. Galaxy tab S2. Yeah, they do have one called the Galaxy tab S2. I'm not kidding.

S7. Yeah, so, Snapdragon 820. In the U.S. Outside the U.S. It's something else. I feel like this is like the worst Samsung asterisk of all time. You can't say the processor

of Samsung phone because someone in YouTube comments right now is like, and the U.S. Are they using their own? Are they using their own processors outside of the US? Yeah, always do. 4 gigawatts of RAM.

It's got a 5.1 inch quad HD. The S6EH has a 5.7. Thank you. I mean, they're the same phones, right? They spec-bop the S-6 and they made them look nicer. Am I missing something? They don't have USBC for some... No, they don't have USBC so that they can connect to the gear.

The big big deal is they made the battery way bigger. It's 3,000 milli-a-mps now. They also added SD card for expansion, and they also made it waterproof. So basically they took all the little things that people didn't really like about the S6, and they just fixed all of it. So this is like the S6S more than it is the S7. Okay, it's weird. This in some ways feels like the most like boring Samsung launch.

I love it. Exactly. It's like such a sleek looking phone. It's so well-rounded. I'm like really impressed. Do you think the phone is so well-rounded? This is the one that I opened and I was like, I have already. already seen this.

Oh! No. But you see, that happens with the iPhone every other year. But as a person whose eyes are not attuned to these things,

I'm like, I think someone already has this phone, I've seen it. But now that you're saying, like, oh, it's because they fixed all the little things and didn't do anything wild. I mean, the big thing they fixed

was on the edge, which is the curved one. Yeah. Literally one of the notes was we made the back slightly rounded, so it's easier to pick up. That, by the way, was a huge problem.

But it's just like super funny. It's like, they didn't notice it on the first one. Like, did no one ever put down the Galaxy S6 edge on a table and try to pick it up before they released it? Did that not occur? And they're like, oh, shit, we blew it. I don't understand.

They also reduced the camera from 16 to 12 megapixels so they could have bigger pixels. That's a thing. I don't understand why the edge has to be like an infinity pool. Like, why does it have to all fall off? Because it's awesome. I like a nice hard edge. You should not get that one. Do you know anybody with a curve phone?

Do you know anybody with an Android phone? I feel like I see so many. You know Evan Rogers. You know at least one person who has like an Android phone running Sanchez. He's living the iPhone lifestyle now. Yeah, he's listening to the show. He messaged me once and I was like, what is this blue bubble?

Because I expected a green bubble. What is this? I was like, oh, I expected a green bubble. Yeah. Wait, when you become friends with someone, do you assign them a bubble color? No, but we became friends at your birthday party. Which I don't remember. And then, no, because I just knew.

I remember the friendship. We had talked about Android phones, so I expected a green bubble. I see. And I got a blue one. I think you should do a feature for us where you just categorize various celebrities as blue or green bubbles.

Okay, sure. That's a thing, right? Yeah. Yeah, but I hate that. Who's a green bubble celebrity? Green bubbles are okay. There's nothing wrong green bubble. Yeah.

By the way, my new website, greenbubblecelebrity.com is now online. I'm trying to think of a young person, green bubble. Like only old people? Tom Selleck. Yeah, Tom Sellick is a green bubble. Yeah, because like Green Bubble, it's my dad.

Because he just goes to Verizon and he's like, this is neat. Oh, it's in the plan and they get it. Yeah. I think that's how a lot of people shop for. Do you think Marco Rubio is a blue bubble or a green bubble? Do you look like you're melting? All right. So the S7, the big news of the S7 is arguably not the S7.

It's a Zuckerberg walked on stage and stole the show by talking about, you know, VR and they've got like a crack strike team of VR people working with Samson apparently. Do you buy? Oh, and they put out a 360 cam, the Gear 360. Yeah, which is everybody has a 360 cam. My mom has a 360 cam. Yeah, but there's something. There's something. Oh, I wrote a whole column that I spiked because it just made no sense by the end. It was about diagonal integration. You ready for this concept? My God. You ready? You ready? Samsung's whole 360 VR stuff is

the only one out of that group of companies that would be successful. Like maybe Sony because they have PlayStation, Google because they're Google. But Samsung is poised because they're diagonally integrated with Facebook and Google. Right. Right. So Facebook has Oculus. They run on the Samsung hardware.

Samsung tunes the hardware for Facebook to do all the Oculus stuff. They make the screens for Facebook. They're like tightly in the game. And it all runs on Android. Yep. And Google's. And so Facebook and Android or Facebook. and Google run huge video distribution platforms.

They're both heavily bought into VR, and they're all going to deliver this stuff onto hardware that is being specifically tuned for at least one of those platforms. Samsung's the only company that's getting content and support from two sides of the VR battle. And they are the only company that's doing the hardware stack. Everything except for diagonal integration

is awesome in that idea. No, but it's dumb. Because they're not vertically integrated. It's like striped integration. They don't. No, they're not stripes. That's horizontal. Stripes are horizontal.

It's not an integration at all. It's a really good idea, you guys. Yeah. It's a tartan integration. By the way, I would like to point out that I just confidently said all stripes are horizontal and no one even came close to checking the- The least ridiculous idea you put out there. All stripes are horizontal.

Where do horizontal stripes fit on the height matrix? Wait, actually, S-7. Where does it go on your matrix? seems practical and a little bit elegant. There you know. I'm a big fan. I'm excited to try it. Okay.

So then LG did a bunch of stuff. Oh my God. LG went crazy. Go ahead. Get into it. Let's you have. Yeah. It's great.

So G5, whatever. It's got the same specs. It's got specs. I don't care. It's high-end phone with specs. Yeah. It's got the stuff. But you can flick a little switch and pull the bottom off of the phone and the battery slides out.

And then you yank the battery off. off of that thing and then you can stick it onto another thing and then stick that back in the phone. So you can do, like, one of the modules is a camera grip. Yeah. And another one is like a big, it's got a PC card. Okay. Wait, answer me this. That's what it is, right?

Kind of. When are you ever going to put a camera grip on your phone? Never. No, I think they just didn't know what it was for. Another one is for a DAC. So, again, right. That's for like two people. If they had one that had a big ass back.

The camera grip has a bigger battery on it. It's got an extended battery built into it. It also has a giant camera grip on it. Yeah, well, it's like the bump on the phone. Well, what about a speaker, a loud speaker that I could slide onto it? Okay. Huh? Right?

I mean, legitimately, what would be the thing? The thing that would make it cool is if they developed an ecosystem. The problem is all the ideas of what people have wanted to attach to a smartphone are all the ideas that they've all been attached, and so we, like, don't know what's next, right? But I believe in my heart that there is because I love the handspring visor so much. Yeah. So talk about the handspring visor. Give us a history lesson.

So Palm, as it often did, was really crappy in the 90s. And so one of its founders, Jeff Hawkins and Dubinsky and Colleg and they're like, screw this. We're bailing. We're going to start our own company that will make Palm handsets. And we're going to do what we want. And what they wanted to do was make a PDA. but it would have a modular system. And it was literally like it used a PC-MCA interface.

It used the same plug interface. It wasn't, didn't use those same commands. Anyway, and the idea was it was a PDA, but you could slap an MP3 player to it. You could slap a memory card expansion into it. You could slap a modem into it. You could slap, you know, other kinds of cartridges. There was a whole list of stuff that you could get. And there was a pretty big ecosystem of, I don't know, a few hundred different modules you could get that to slap into this.

And there was a DIY ecosystem. It was cool. But the real reason they did it was because they wanted to have one of the modules you'd slap into it be a phone to turn the PDA into a phone. Think about that. Think about how far we've come. Because one of the modules for a G5 is actually a palm organizer. That would be incredible, by the way, if one of the modules with the G5 was like a Palm 3. You turned your phone over.

I'm sorry. I just want to say that the reason you have an iPhone today is because of that idea. Because there had been other smartphones, but they were like, hey, we'll try. It's an experiment. They didn't really believe it. But Hanspring made a real concerted effort to make a broadly popular consumer device that would become a smartphone. They made the visor so they could test out the phone so they could make the trio.

But you're saying this ecosystem failed. Well, no, it turned into the trio. So Palm, which at the time was like, bought Hanspring because Hanspring bought a really expensive headquarters building and they couldn't afford it. Their mortgage bills. So Paul had to buy him. The entire Palm story is just classic mistakes.

And then, but they also thought it because they were excited about one of the next versions of the trio that were coming out. And so then Palm made the trio for a while. And that was going great until it wasn't. How often do we have a Verge cast that doesn't get into like deep Palmer WebOS? I love it. I learned so much. No, I'm just saying it's, if there's one thing in the DNA of the Verge, it's like the PTSD of the Palm story. We have some of the best Palm reporting in 2016.

Yeah. By the way some exec from Alcatel finally admitted that they're not going to do anything with the Palm brand. Oh really? There's a lot of a reason. But no, but so... G5. I don't know what else is going to get plugged in the G5,

but I love the idea that you could plug other stuff into it. The thing I'm most excited about from LG, though, is the robot ball. Have you seen the robot ball, Nicola? Okay, what it... Wait, okay. Open your LG tab, which is not a product, but a tab on your computer. Does LG make a tab? Is there a

tab? No. Well, it's not... There's got a G-tab. Easily. What is it? Wait, what is it called? Oh, Rolling Bot? Yeah.

I'm reading the URLs. Like, guessing by URLs. Wait. Look at the G5. A drunken headless BB8. I've met BB8. Yeah. Here.

So, it's like BB8. Yes, right? Right? Yeah, it's crazy. Wait, it's supposed to be a bunny? Well, you can put a little bunny on. Yeah. So it's a little bit of a ball.

Do they sell accessories to make it a bunny? Yeah. I mean, I don't know. I mean, any accessories that fit around. thing I believe will fit on it. But are like people, is this a thing? Like people are making out to the summer. Oh my God, the opportunity. So it's a rolling ball just like a Sphero or a BV8. You control it with your phone, but it has a camera

on it and a speaker on it and a laser pointer on it. And the idea is you're at the office and you want to screw around with your cat. You turn the ball on. You like roll the thing around your house so you find the cat and then you turn on the laser pointer and then start moving the laser pointer on the cat goes chasing after it. You know this means. You can you spy. You can put it in auto cat troll mode

where you just hit the button and then it just rolls around the house, shooting a laser pissing off the cat. I have a question for you. Is that LG's idea for the device or Dieter Bone's idea for the device? Why else would you put a laser pointer on a rolling ball? Can you, wait. How much is the cat torture bot?

Who cares? It's amazing. I'm into it. I mean, the whole G5 thing is like LG was like, you know what? Everything. We're going to make with our phone this year is every. They put out a VR headset for no reason. That VR headset is such garbage.

It looks real bad. It looks really cool. It looks okay. I mean, it's nicely colored. Do you have a picture of it? It's like, it's smaller than all the other ones. It has this like felt piece. It looks like, it doesn't work.

Yeah, James Vincent is like, this doesn't work very well. Minor oversight. But like compared to everyone else's VR headset, it actually like looks the nicest. Yeah. The poll quote, light leaks in. and with it reality. Oh, no, I like how this looks. Yeah, put it on the Matrix.

The people wearing it. It's very slim, wow. Yeah, that's why low light leaks in along with reality. What if you could buy accessories for it? They're like eye cups. This is drab ostentatious. Drab ostentatious. Because it's not like, I mean, it looks pretty good for like being the thing that it is,

but it's like the dorkiest thing. Oh, so I forgot that thing and all the other things you plug into the phone. and this roly ball. Do you know what LG calls them? What? Friends. They just went for it. Yeah.

They just went for it. No, but the G5 as a phone, you know, it's like nerdy and awesome and maybe they'll be cool modules for it, but almost surely not because there's no algae is going to get support from a broad ecosystem of hardware developers to make stuff for it. But it is the first G5 in a while

that doesn't like basically look at and go, oh, that's cheap and plastic. Yeah. Which is a big deal. That's something. I just, I don't know. Listeners, tell me if I'm wrong. I just feel like LG is

the perennial also ran in this entire game. Yep. Like they're so big and they make so much money making screens for Apple that they're like, we'll make a phone too. And they just need to what differentiates an LG phone? I feel like this is... I think the G4 had a good camera, right? Yeah, but

and now like this seems like the first year that they've got one that's just all around really nice, but they're also trying something kind of crazy. I mean, the G4 or the G3 they were like kind of forgettable. They were bendy. You could flex them. People like the G4.

It had a decent camera. No, they had a cool camera. It had a decent camera and like just, but the thing did not look and feel great. It was just like, and also their software. No, they got, isn't it better on the G4? And the V10 had two screens for no reason. Yeah. That's a thing.

Oh, both the Samsung and LG have like always on screens now. The time and like your notifications are just on your screen all the time. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. What else happened at NBC? What do you, wait, what do you think? think of the G5. Do you understand

that when the LG puts out the G6, we will listen to like a G6 in 2017, unironically. It's a massive corporation just bumps that song at us. It's un-escapable. It's coming. Everyone just be warned.

Today, know this. A year from now, we'll be on the show. I'm quitting next January. Listening to like a G6. It will come for us. Pop and bottles in the club. G5. Okay, do you think they were also

About the friends next year? Wait, the friends? Is that going to be around that next year? Is that even going to last? What are the chances friends last? No, there's no way. I'm just really excited about them. Yeah.

As a gadget, it's cool. You don't have to, you don't have to. No, it is cool. Thinking something is cool isn't a recommendation that anybody buy it. I'm just happy it exists. In what world does this succeed? Like, wait, excuse me.

Dieter, I know. I just bought a Viopi, man. I bought a Hot Pink Viop. I spent $290. I'm with you on the gadgets thing. Okay. I'm just saying I want LG to like get a win. Yeah, no, they're not going to win.

I want Sony to get a win. Yeah, so do I. But it's just not happening. And also it's stuff at MWC, the new Experio's phones, are like bewildering. I don't know. Wait, why? They just exist at this like weird mid-range points. No one's really sure where they fit.

Yeah, yeah. That's the impression I'm getting. Also, I like that every Sony phone now has a quality. amplifier in its name. It's like, this is the X-7 something. Every single one. Like what? Premium, compact,

forgettable. This is the X-7 forgettable. It's called performance. The others don't perform. Oh, and Sony also made a bunch of random crap that goes with their phones. There's a, there's a, you know, what's it, her, what's the movie with the girl? Wireless headset. Her, yeah.

there's a Amazon Echo Clone and then there's like a thing like a pedestal that like displays stuff on the wall and does stuff and like who knows if they're actually going to sell this stuff their Echo clone

is called the Sony Xperia agent Yeah They just can't name a product one name No The Experian agent That sounds great That wasn't the name of the things in the matrix

Trying to kill you constantly The thing about Sony is an experience. Do you remember the original Experia? No. The original Experia was a horizontal slider that ran Windows Mobile 5 and it was badass, right? Like, before it came out, people were losing their minds over this thing.

We're really stretched. No, it was the first like smartphone hardware that had amazing, like, build quality, and it had aluminum, and it was like, whoa, this thing is going to be amazing. And then we started using it, and it was hot garbage, and the keyboard was terrible, and, like, the buttons were bad and whatever. but I probably spent like $900 on that thing. Just moving on. Just slide that one in.

I sent $1,000 on this Windows mobile phone. I'm just saying. I imported it, you know, like you do. But after that thing didn't live up to expectations, maybe they should have stopped using the word expiria for everything they do. I mean, I don't know where they used it once. What does the word expiry mean to you, Nicola? Experia?

Yeah, that's Sony's smartphone brand name. It's like multiple experiences, I guess. Yeah, I've had a number of experience today. Yeah, we went on a trip and we had Experia and tried new food. I mean, that's so awful. I went to Europe. I went to Europe. That is 100% what the worst girl at a boarding school says.

Yeah, that is the worst. That is the worst. Like, who's the worst mean girl at your? your elite Connecticut boarding school. She's the one who's like, I've had Experia. Look up Sony Erickson Experia X1 and tell me that doesn't look like the hottest shit you've ever seen. We covered the hell out of this. Oh, it's with an X, not an EX.

I remember this thing. This was like an Engadgett special. This is like a thing that we got down there. All right, this looks kind of sweet. It had the curve. Yeah, right? And then you used it. It was like, oh.

I just like that the interface has like a million things going on. That was every Windows phone. Yep. It continues to be every Windows phone. Oh man, you can buy one for $80. I'm buying an Experia. What did we give? We reviewed this. Of course you did.

And gadget. Yeah. That's not. No. It's garbage. None of this is right. None of these things are the right thing. 2008.

Darren reviewed it. What do you give it? What do you give it? What do you give it? Do we have scores back then? I don't think I covered the Experi X one at Windows. Well, well, what does.

Darren's review ends with if someone figures how to get Android on it, we wouldn't say wholehearted recommendation would be too far from the realm of feasibility. We would recommend this if you stripped of an operating system and put a different one on here. Yo, there's an ExperiaX won on eBay for $27. Hey, this is your...

I just bought a Viopi, man. Here's what's going to happen at the... Wait, could I load that the Chrome OS? Chromebook thing on this? You need Intel processor. Damn it. I think we should start a Sony hardware museum. Ooh.

Sony hardware... And then people pay tickets, and then people would actually pay money to get Sony devices. Until recently, Sony made... Was that Deeter Shade? Yeah. Yeah. No, it was like deep. Sony's like a...

Sony's business is an insurance company in Japan, and then they have this, like, electronics business on the side. Oh, they also make camera modules. They make camera modules for Apple. Yeah. Like, that's their business. They make the world's best camera modules. They make TVs that very few people buy, and they sell insurance their own employees in Japan.

And it's amazing stuff. stylish gadgets that no one buys. Right. Now, so like all through the late 90s, 2000s, and into the sort of mid-2000s, Sony made the craziest best hardware. And it was funny because I did that thread about what's the coolest old laptop and the comments, to put Chrome OS on,

and what's the coolest laptop with Chrome OS on? And the comments were, it was just people posting pictures of Sony computers, because they were all so cool. And they were all, Sony was such a bad software company that they were all garbage in different ways. So the idea of not putting Windows on there and putting just like Chrome as a browser actually is like a wonderful idea.

So I've purchased a hot pink Sony laptop. Cool. And I'm going to put ChromeOS on it and then it's going to be my computer and I'm going to be the happiest point of all. I literally think about it every day. I've shown it to so many people. It looks awesome.

Yeah, it's going to be amazing. When does it arrive? I think it's next week. I mean, it has a 1.6 a hertz atom processor. It's not going to be great. It's Chrome. It's funny. Right?

You can open like two tabs. Yeah. I'll take some notes in a meeting. You might not be able to load the verge. I probably won't be able to load the verge. I might be able to, if I can get Gmail and like any notes website,

anything where I can type a note, that'd be great. If you're lucky, maybe Slack. Who cares? Because it'll just be me and just type it away. I'll stop my phone. If I can just turn a thing into a Bluetooth key, ooh, that's an idea.

Hey. What will go on the screen? Who cares? I'll just be able to. I was looking at my phone That's a great idea So that's MbVC I mean other stuff

Jami We got a Johnny released another iPhone No Actually this one It looks pretty nice This one looks like a It looks like an iPhone

No no It doesn't It looks like a It looks like a Samsung phone Which looks like Jami phones Was the Me 5 6? It looks good

It had like a cool back or something Yeah That thing looks like an iPhone Are you kidding me Come on I guess it's a little Squared off on the sides It's squared off

That's what they did It looks like... It's not coming to the U.S. Of course not. You know why? Because both Apple and Samsung will sue this company. It looks like the front of an iPhone

with the back of an S6 edge. Yeah. But they kind of did that before the S6. Wait, what's the worst quadrant of your grid, Nicola? The worst? Yeah. Probably drab... There's no bad quadrant.

Yeah, that's the thing. I mean, everything has its place. Yeah. Is there like drab utilitarian? The drive utilitarian is pretty good. Drab practical? Drab practical. Drab practical is great.

Wait, how is utilitarian and practical different? But drab and practical. But drab and practical and practical in the room? No, no, there's no utilitarian. It's drab elegant. Yeah. Practical ostentatious. Oh, you weren't here last week.

No, that's right. That was not here. There is really no negative practical elegant. Drab practical is fine. That's like an extension cord. That's right with the computer mouse. Everybody knows an extension cord. Yeah, an extension cord.

Yeah. It's drab practical. Like a really good line. I mean, how are you going to make it elegant? Like, it doesn't need to be. So being in between. If somebody could send me a picture of an elegant extension cord, I'd be super into it.

Think about it. I think the bad quadrant is elegant ostentatious. Is that possible? See, now we're in like a matter of lifestyle because I love elegant ostentatious. I think that if you're ostentatious, you're by definition not elegant. This is real hard. That's one thing I've learned with you and your people. Everything gets so literal here.

Last week, the debut of the thing. I mean, the follow-up questions were insane. We're just having fun. Okay, we don't need to, we don't need to litigate it again. I'm sorry. That's all I have to say about MWC, I think. I think. I think.

Yes. Yeah, I quit looking for whatever song is you're looking for. Oh, you're the worst. Can I tell you a story about that lyric? No. It's really bad. Please. Okay.

I'm just saying, if LG blows this opportunity, I don't know what they're doing. Like, they have a phone right now called the G5. They should already be stealthily playing this song, like in clubs, in the background of, like, LGTV commercials. It should just, they should be setting the stage for Like a G6 to come back huge. Seating it to the right DJs. Without a doubt. Just mix it in. Next year, they're going to go with, like, the G5X.

They will screw this up. Like, how do you blow this up? acting like they drunk what year did this this is they've just been waiting to 2010 yeah they started because the first one wasn't called the G1

by the way our audio engineer is listening to how long the song has gone on realize that it's beyond the amount that you're allowed to do for fair use and he's freaking out he's sitting there how I'm getting at this I got to cut it so that it's all getting cut cut cut

and the phone spins in the ad think about it we're reporting on it so it's fair use. I feel like they're going to fuck it up and do some kind of like really absurd like there's going to be beavers or something. You know what I mean?

They're going to like try to meme it. Like pre-meem. Like I hate these these advertisements that are made to be memes. A pre-meam? Yeah. Basically like all of the lazy Super Bowl. That's oh my God.

It was so frustrating. So that there's a lyric in there that she's like I'm drinking scissor. But for years my friends and I totally misheard it and we thought she said she was drinking scissor. Which is in my opinion

And if you're listening to this show, I want to talk directly to your heart now. If you're listening to this show and you maybe have too much money, you don't know how to spend it, you want to make an investment, I have a complete business plan for a vodka brand called Cizzer Vodka. Does it involve this song? It doesn't involve a song, although I think having a famous song in which people appear to be saying drinking Cizor on the club is a good look. I just want to do an entire print billboard campaign, like physical. media campaign of like hot people and they just they're looking at you with their fingers like this and it just says cut through the night this is a radio show people are in the car what are your fingers doing they're making scissors man what do you think they're doing i'm just giving it back to you

because you know if you're in the car right now here's what i want you to do i want you to look at the car next to you it's sort of a piece sign it's a little thing right it's a piece sign look at the person in the car next to you no you're alone but this is why are you alone you're on the road Because you're commuting places. People always drive their cars alone. No, but in the car, the other cars around you. In the traffic jam. In the traffic jam.

Make eyes of the stranger. Make eyes of the stranger. Man, when there's self-driving cars, that's all we're going to have to do is like look at each other in cars. And put up two fingers in like a slight scissor shape and then just mouth the words, cut through the night. And that, people are going to do that. Cut through the night is good.

For scissor vodka. I would. So, again, I'm seeking directly to through heart now. This is a beautiful. you have more money than sense and you would like to make this happen for me I'm your friend I love you and I think you and I that's the kind

of pitch you would hear on I mean that's just the worst thing I've ever heard my life I have a second one for a trampoline vodka which is just the word bounce it's just it's endless TV ads of people leaving clubs when does the Oscar say it begin

I mean this is like some 80s sitcom dad has a job and he has to go pitch the thing that's kind of like pitch Cut through the night is great. Cut through the night is great. Bounce is awful. That's,

but that's like... Cut through the night is awful. Cut through the night is great. No, cut through the night is fantastic. Okay. Yeah. And there's already a song that everybody's...

I already want to cut through that. You're drinking a scissor in the club. Now I'm feeling so fly. All right, we should just get Emily here. Brian was... Yeah, Brian. You didn't talk about phones at all. Yeah, I don't...

I'm sorry. I'm still recovering from bounce. Which vodka slogan do you prefer? Yeah. Brian is slacking me. Definitely better than bounce. That's definitely true. Where does cut through the night?

Okay. Cut through the night is great. It's just people. No, it's better. I didn't say it was great. Oh, it's great. Brian, say one thing about a phone and then I'll leave. Friends is crazy.

You're high for lacking. I don't understand at all. I just like that it exists. I need to read. I need to read some advertising, which I need to find. By the way, if you're listening, it's at the bottom of the... I don't open it because I'm a bad person.

You're a terrible human. That's where all the links are. You want me to read the ad? I don't need the links, Nicola. Whoa. Check out today's ad. What's our ad for? Where is it?

I know. I'm using it right now. Is it for Cizzer vodka? It's for Cizzer. Can I read a fake ad for Cizzer? Are you alone in the club? Do you feel like you should go to a different club? No, I think this is for aging millennials like myself, where it's like...

And you're aging. millennial? Yeah. It's like, it's being out getting hard. It's one o'clock when you want to leave. Cut through the night. Get amped on scissors box and I swear to God

you can stay out until four. Yeah. Well, it's more like you'll just wake up and it's four because you've cut through the night. You like time warp through that. Are you already bored? Get daumped on scissor pockets. Did you actually yawn?

You'll wake up in the gutter. Cut through the night. Do you want to skip directly from sober to regret? Cut through the night with scissors. Okay. I'm gonna read this. There's probably a positive version of that ad. It's like people snaking through the front of the line.

Yeah. You know, it's like the group of friends walks into the concert and there's like a big crowd and they're like, and then one of them like, they see their friend way up to the front and they're like, they're already on stage with the rapper and they're like doing this. And they're like, cut through the night. And they go in. Yeah, exactly.

The shovel comes when you cut too far. Yeah, to regret. Don't cut too deep. Yeah, that's it. Don't cut too deep. That's our anti-drinking and driving. I'm going to have to time machine. Go back in time five minutes and tell everybody on this show that they can skip ahead.

No, that was free magic. Don't cut too deep as like it says like drink responsibly. Don't cut too deep. What is Slack? It's a messaging app for teams. It brings all of your communication at work. into one place integrating with the tools and services you use every day. Slack's mission is to make people's working life simpler, more pleasant, and more productive.

So many teams transition to Slack from a solid collection of tools they've cobbled together to build their own communication fabric. It's email, it's IM, at Skype. You pull these disjointing conversations into a single, organized, and searchable view that helps decisions get made faster, but it also radically increases transparency. Nearly 100 integrations work with Slack, including Dropbox, GitHub, Trello, MailChimp, Google Drive, Hangouts, although I'm not clear why you'd use Hangouts and Slack. Oh, I get it, because of the video conferencing.

Anyway, and there's lots and lots of customers of Slack. There's Airbnb, there's NASA, there's AOL, BuzzFeed, Dow Jones, eBay, Expedia, Intuit, Ticketmaster, MIT, Samsung, Spotify, Salesforce, Sappos, Wall Street, Journal, Pinterest, Solar City, Out, Transparency, Box Media, Slack Organization. We use it, we love it. Slack has more than 1.25 million daily. active users. It's a lot of people. And people use Slack report a 32% productivity increase, 48.6 reduction in internal email, and 25% fewer meetings. So just do this thing that I want you to do.

Go to Slack.com slash Verge, create a new team, and you get $100 in credit, so you can decide if you like Slack, you can try for free, and if you decide to upgrade to a paid plan, you can use that $100 credit and upgrade your lifestyle. Anyway, look, here's a thing. Locks me to use a Slack, these people use Slack. Some of us like Slack. Some of us love Slack. I'm biting my tongue so hard now. Emily has her own feelings about Slack. But if you're not using Slack, you are not using the right tool. And that is the end of the Saturday. That's true. What are you using a competitor? Like, I don't think I can just bite competitors in the Slack. I don't think we can do that. But it's Slack. Slack, it's the one. Is that really it? That's it. No, it's not the tagline.

Cut to the conversation. I just don't know how to end the. Slack. Slack. through the night. Kind of. Wait. We got through your inbox. We're back. We're back. We're back.

It was clearly over. I didn't realize that by jumping into the middle of a podcast, which was like a very risky gambit. Yeah. I would be missing so many inside jokes. Oh God, it's already real bad. It's real bad.

I feel lost right now. And I'm supposed to be like know what's going on for this segment. I'm supposed to be steering the ship. And yet I have no, like I feel so left out. All I know is that we're literally cutting through the podcast right now. Yeah, it happened.

Well, Let me ask, let me, okay, Brian. Nick, no. T. Come on, man. So let's talk about Fuller House the next 45 minutes. Nope. I'm just going to ask these two, because they're fresh,

fresh ears, fresh minds. If I were to start a vodka company called Cizzer Vodka in honor of my misinterpretation of the lyrics of like a G-6. Which is my favorite song. One of my favorite songs.

It is. I mean, we were just, I can just hit play. I can just push the space fire. Oh, it's a fantastic song. One of my first articles on the version. That's good. I talk very, very favorably about, like, a G6. Well, so LG's phone this year is called the G5.

And I've been saying they're blowing it if they don't start seeding this song again so that next year. Oh, yeah. Anyway. How many things have been named in a series of G something, are there? Because it were Max, too, for a while. There's a G4. Yeah.

And they got to G5, and they stopped. Oh, conspiracy theory. But the planes didn't. stop. The planes kept going. Yeah. That's true. Poor Far East Movement. Oh, man. But anyway, so I have always misheard the lyrics to like a G6

is drinking scissors in the club, and not Cisorpe. And I was saying, wouldn't a great tagline for a brand of vodka called Cizzer Vodka be cut through the night? Just think, just God damn it. It sounds really sinister to me. Yes. It should be sinister. No, I don't, I don't. I don't.

I don't think a vodka ad should be sinister. Yes. It should be, like, dangerous and sexy. I'm much too old to drink spirits, so I can't... What? I just... Old people drink spirits. But not me.

You age into spirits. No, I aged out of them. Okay. When I was... I know what you're talking about. You aged out of going hard. Yeah, exactly. I go soft.

Jameson, Jameson about a six-pack of what's it called not your father's root beer. I don't take the remainder of the podcast to explain that debacle. Let me just let me just time out for one second. So if for some reason you have decided to live through that transition with us, Emily Oshita is here. Hi. And Jameson Cox is here. Hey.

Jamison secret weapon at Theverge.com in my opinion. Hidden away in Canada. But he decided to come down. Blogging machine. Yeah. I came down for the Oscars. Yeah. came down to dawn my

formal wear. And we should say he came down to watch the Oscars on television with us. That's pretty great. Brian, who is also still on the line, is going to be at the actual Oscars. So he gets the fun part of it. But the rest of it are going to be

just eating pizza and watching the TV. Are we all going to dress up? I know T.C. really wants us to dress up secretly. Or not so secretly. Are you coming to the Oscar? thing and so well i have to do my own racked i'm gonna be yeah i'm gonna be on it are you coming yeah i'll be here yeah they're throwing a whole thing they're making the whole staff guys everybody

oh i love us dressing out the vax media new york headquarters for the wait can i tell you content making oscar's party ever can i sidebar to my favorite tc clothing story just because like i think that the audience knows and likes him all right all right go so tc and i become friends on twitter without really ever meeting in the office you guys worked 25 feet away from each other. I know, but like it never really happened. And then one day he walks by wearing a poncho and I slack him for the first time. Oh, there you go. I slack him for the first time and I'm like, tell me about this. And he just said, TLDR, man discovers Etsy. And like, I just, I just met. That to me is like one of those, you know those forward short stories,

like baby shoes never worn? TLDR, man discovers Etsy. It's like right up there. So perfect. I still think about it. That's amazing. Yes. Anyway, so if the man says formal wear, I'm with it. He really knows his way around ahead. Like, that's incredible.

I love it. Okay. So Emily, I'm going to let you drive. This is your 45. Okay. Well, I was just talking in the control. And we're at PSA, I heard the whole background about like a G6. I knew where Cesar vodka came from.

I'm totally with this podcast. Yeah, you're in the game. I was just saying, though, in there, I'm not really sure how to attack the Oscars. I think at some point, I think it would be fun to go through and to say who we think is going to win, the major awards. But we should probably start by just talking about what a fun shit show this year's Oscars are going to be, because that's why we're watching on television. We could follow along on Twitter and just find out the results or watch a boring telecast. But it's going to be an interesting one.

There's a lot in the air. Obviously the whole Oscar's So White controversy now. two years strong has really reached a peak. A lot of people won't be there. A lot of people that one would expect to be there are boycotting the show itself. And I feel like a lot of people are going to use their time at the podium to air some grievances with Hollywood. So it'll be fun. It'll be real fun. Lots of, yeah, lots to watch. And, you know, I think, think it's funny everybody's saying that the biggest the biggest narrative is around Leonardo DiCaprio finally picking up his Oscar I don't know I feel like it's one of those

things we're just going to get it over with I feel like it's it's going to be the most anticlimactic part of the entire can you get an Oscar for a movie that a lot of people I know are just actively avoiding because it sounds like a brutal experience oh I mean it's not even that brutal the movie I mean it's pretty it's like pleasant to watch there's like sunsets in it and bears. I just don't, the thing about this year's acting nominees, I think normally it would be another loss for Leo because he doesn't really do that much in this movie. But, and people are already mad at me.

I've already spoiled the Revenant on this podcast before, so I feel like it's fair territory. I can do, I can say anything I want. It's getting broken again. The bear comes back. But, I mean, I think in any other year, it would be another leader. loss. We continue having the Susan Lucci narrative around him, but this year

he's not really up against that much. Like, here are our acting nominees, just as a refresher, if you haven't been, like, bathing in this stuff for the last month. We've got Brian Cranston and Trumbo, which nobody saw. We've got Matt Damon and the Martian, which is, like, not

really getting any traction in any awards at all, like none of the pre-awards. And it's like, you know, I think that whole, I think the comedy thing with Golden Globes really hurt it. I think it's become such a punchline like, oh, that comedy, that comic performance and the marshes, which to be fair, a lot of it is comic, but it's just not a comedy. Yeah, it's not a comedy. And if it was a comedy, it wouldn't be that funny. And I don't know, I'm not a fan of that movie, but I just think it's like a weak

entry for, as many interesting things are in that movie, I just don't think it's being taken very seriously for awards. Then we have Michael Fastbender as Steve Jobs in Steve Jobs, another film that is having kind of a hard time breaking through except for Kate Winslet for the supporting her supporting role in it. I again like this is probably the only one that has a chance of getting of being Leo but again very very long shot and then Eddie Redmayne and the Danish girl which he won last year for the theory of everything so it's very unlikely if Eddie Redmayne wins two Oscars for best actor in a row something really weird has happened. Well, and especially for the Danish girl,

which is like the most transparent play for acting Oscars. Yeah, I feel like people have Eddie Redmayne's number at this point. Like he's taking, you know, first he's going to be Stephen Hawking and then he's going to be a transgender woman. It was a tragedy that he wasn't nominated for Jupiter ascending. I forgot that he was in Jupiter. Jupiter extending. Wait, Brian has feelings about Eddie Redmayne and Jupiter. ascending. Well, the movie was a horrible

piece of shit, but he was the one like entertaining spotlight. We were like, I'll watch that guy do that crazy shit anytime. Yeah, I mean, it's not that I don't like him. I just think his agent has been a little agro. That's all I'll say. Like, the projects he's been picking are a little bit, like

calm down, Eddie. Like, you have your whole life ahead of you. He's still young. I think I might be older than Eddie Redmayne. I feel like he's kind of going, coming in a little hot right now. So, yeah. That's who Leo is going up against. Who, like, I don't know.

Can anybody make a strong case for anybody other than Leo? I would love to hear it. Like, that are actually nominated? No. Yeah. I saw Trumbo previews for, like, five straight movies I went to see back. Closer. Closer.

I can't figure out the distance thing. I really wasn't briefed. He's not been media trained yet. Yeah. It makes me sound like I'm a puppy, which, to be fair, I am. Media Poppy Jameson Cod. Media Poppy Jameson Cod. That's my official title, actually.

That's your new Twitter bio. Yeah. Oh, yeah. So Trumbo, like, I went to go see five movies, and there was a preview for Trumbo before every single one. And I was never really convinced that it was a real movie. It kind of reminded me of, like, the Tropic Thunder previews. Like, Trumbo, followed by Satan's Alley.

Oh, my God. Wait, there were two. What was, there was another screenwriter show, or not show, a movie. I'm trying to think of what it was. What, Truman Capote? Like, recently or like 10 years ago? No, like this year, this past year. I don't know.

Maybe I'm just thinking of, it feels like Argo also, but Argo also won best picture, so who knows. I mean, this is like... But Argo is a best picture winner to me always seemed like. Did you, did everyone just pick the, like, the joke? I think, I think it was a week year that year. I'm trying to think of what else came out that year. Do you, do you know off the top of your head, Brian?

not the top of my head, but it was a weird pick, and it didn't it didn't win across like all the guild awards that you normally expect it to win. That feels like it may have been a thing that won because of like the the tiered system of voting, you know what I mean, or it's not just like everybody votes on one thing and that's the only thing that counts? Yeah. Wait, was that 2012? No.

Oh my God. You know, we've had a bad run here recently. The artist won in 2012. I forgot. Remember the artist everybody? The best movie of 2012. I mean, no, the Oscars are notoriously bad. Wait, so why are they so important, though?

Like, why do we cover the hell out of them? Like, why does everyone make so much? Why is Brian writing a column every week about them? It's the most visible way to track, I think, what Hollywood thinks is valuable, not from a money standpoint, but from an artistic and intellectual standpoint. I mean, is anything, what do you think, Brian, aside from that, I think the visibility is just a huge part of it. That's the thing. It's like the best way to think about, look and see what Hollywood thinks about itself. But I think what's interesting about this year is it's also become a driving part of like several narratives that are about how Hollywood is actually out of touch with like the rest of the country and world in a really, really profound way that's made this year particularly interesting.

There's been a lot more fun things to write about this year instead of like, oh, now like so-and-so looks like they're going to win. instead and that's kind of me. Yeah, I mean, I think a lot of years, the Oscar conversation becomes a conversation about a specific genre of movie, like a very cloistered off genre of movie called the Oscar movie and like the goings on and the dealings within that sphere.

But now I think because that just became so insular and so, I don't know, like naval gasey that the conversation, you know, I think people just had enough of that. They're like, this has nothing to do. for the definitive award or honor that you can have in Hollywood for a film. It has nothing to do with anything that's going on in film. And as Brian wrote about a few weeks ago, this has happened before.

There's a cycle, I think, and it'll probably happen again in like 30 years after all the changes were made in the academy. It'll, you know, things stagnate and then get remade. Yeah. We'll all just slowly age and become irrelevant. And the youngs will get mad at us. Soon no one will drink spirits. will all be too old. I think too, like, when we're talking about, like, the relative value of the Oscars,

even if they're not particularly meaningful in a vacuum, they're still way more meaningful than the, like, big award shows in other areas of culture. Like, compare them to the Grammys. I think the Oscars are way more reliable as, like, a year-by-year snapshot of what was important than the Grammys, which are, like, practically useless in that regard. Yeah. I mean, we just did bring up the artist. Right? Like, yeah, but, but there are other movies that were nominated. Like, you can look at all of the nominees for album of the year and the Grammys some year, and none of them were particularly good or relevant, like, past that ceremony.

I'm going to tell you what was up against Argo, the year that it won in 2013, just for funzies. I'm into it. Okay, we had Amor, which was really sad and depressing. Beast of the Southern Wild, Django Unchained, Limsarab. whoop, whoop, Life of Pie, Lincoln, Silver Linney's Playbook, and Zero Dark 30. Now, this was a big year

where Zero Dark 30 got kind of slandered, not slandered, but it got kind of beaten through in the campaign. Yeah.

There was a lot of controversy surrounding it and depiction of torture and stuff like that. And I think a lot of people would say that was one of, if not the best films of the era.

and Catherine Bigelow was one of the best directors of the year. But, you know, campaigns are brutal. Yeah. No, I mean, you could, but there's, in that list, you could make arguments for Zero Dark 30. You could make a sort of half-hearted argument for Silver Linnings Playbook. Like, you know, like a fun one, like at a bar, like you have to. There's something else that you mentioned. Like, there's, like, three in there that you could make, well, two that you could make serious arguments for in Silver Linnings Playbook, right?

Yeah. In Argo won and it just felt like it won because it was like the biggest. It was fine. Everybody was like, it's fine. Yeah. I don't ate it. Like, shout out to Le Miz

for giving the Eddie Redmayne hype beast the boost that they needed. Because he was Flames in Le Mace. That was the beginning of it. He was really good. You know who else was good in that? Aaron's Vite of Greece Live. Well, he can, like,

he can keep that one on his mantle piece for life. Oh, Django. That's the one I was thinking of. You could have made a real... Yeah. Yeah. Also, Anne Athaway, the queen. I'm like, I'm an Ann Hathaway stand on the low.

Let's just talk about, can we just talk about what? Wait, Nicola is making a face on a face. Tell me what is happening to your face right now. I just like Jameson unfolding. And like, I really like that being part of what the like 12 things I know about Jameson. Maybe six. I went to go see the intern like on opening night. I actually believe that Jameson is more of an Anne Hathaway than a Joe.

Jennifer Lawrence. Oh, yeah. Yeah. If anyone, I really, I really, I really empathize with Ann Hathaway. I think,

why, please. Because she's like a theater girl, like, little, yeah, she's, like, no one is ready for the nuclear theater girl

explosion when it happens. Do you think she's, like, always, like, holding it in a little of it to, like, play it cool? Yeah, I'm with James,

like, I'm a, like, I think you're much more of a Jennifer Lawrence. Because, like, I'm going to be very real about myself right now.

Like, not cool. And that's fine. I can really like, I can work my way like into like a life so much is happening. And Anne Hathaway is not cool. But Jennifer Lawrence is like, I love beers. I love making fun of reporters. Whoops, that tripped. Oh my God. Oh my God. Is that Robert De Niro? Like, and I'm like, that's not me. Like, I don't know. Emily and I had a slack conversation once where I described myself as the peat. Oh my God. It's a Slack native. But we were talking about like The Hunger Games. And at one point I was like, yeah, I wish that I was the Caesar Flickerman of the Verge.

But really, I'm the Piedomilar. And that's very real. I forgot about this entire conversation. It's all coming back to me. We assigned characters for every single person at the Verge. Yeah. To wrap this up, I think that Josh Hutcherson should have been nominated for Best Actor. Oh my God.

I do not regret having Jameson be on this podcast right now. This is the best verge cast of all time. It's calling you right now. It is, something's happening. Well, by all means, let's continue to talk about 2013 nominee for best to actress and winner. Brian, which on your game's character do you think I am? Isn't it obvious? It's terrible.

I mean, wait, no, no. Nelai is obviously Caesar Flickerman. And Dieter is Blue Dark Heavensby. Yeah. Do you. It's not a coincidence that... Hold on, let me Google. I'm just going to say, it's not a coincidence that Nilai opened this podcast by going,

Ha! Emily Yoshida, the girl on fire. No, I never want to hear that again. Well, anyway, let's get back to talking about Jennifer Lawrence. Sike. I don't want to talk about Jennifer Lawrence because I don't think... I mean, she's going... Is she going to want to...

I don't know. Let's talk for real about the best actress face. Okay. Okay. We've got Kate Blanchett for Carol. Green Larson for Room. Jennifer Lawrence for Joy, Charlotte Rampling for 45 years, and Sir Ceron. I got her name right. I figured out how to say your name for Brooklyn. Brian. Breelarsen.

Yeah. I mean, there's no... I mean, it's been that way for Mons. It seems like nobody's ever really challenged her. I mean, she's been the frontrunner since the beginning. And the performance is actually really, really amazing. I think the film is really, really strong. Have you guys seen, Drew? Yeah, I have. I like this.

There are so many characters in the Hunter Games. Okay, I'm not going to let this derail me. Like a train speeding to the capital, I will not be derailed. Eli's just trying to hide the fact that I don't think he's seen any of the nominated films. Yeah, something is happen. I think if I did. Hey, Eli, which Hunger Games character is Bree Larson?

Breed Larson. Commander Paler, played by Patina Miller, who first appears in I definitely have the Wikipedia page. Bree Larson is totally Jennifer Lawrence in... Wow, this is too bad. All right, keep going. So I think I'm going to make a statement. I think that this is the strongest acting category by like a wide margin.

Oh, you mean in this... In terms of quality performances, yeah. For this year or in general... Oh, you mean in general, like the best actress category. Yeah, like the crop of nominees is way stronger than any of the other acting categories. Yeah, I would, I would, you know, supporting actor is pretty great. I would say, I don't know. I mean, I just feel strongly, I feel very strongly about like every actor in spotlight.

I was listening to another podcast recently, oh, and I'm going to forget which one it was, but they were talking about how you could like tell a lot by your personality, by which spotlight performance is your favorite. I don't know that I have a favorite. I think it might be Roughlow. Like I'm pretty happy with him getting that nomination. He's like very, very, he's like the most showy performance in it. Yeah. If I had to pick my favorite spotlight performance, I think I'd go Schreiber.

Yeah, Shriver's a great one. I mean, man, that movie is so good. I mean, if I had I, my Duthers, I think Spotlight, Spotlight or Mad Max would be my favorite, or would be my pick for Best Picture. Like, I just, I don't know. I really love both of those films. But, but, but, but, actresses. leading role.

Yeah. I don't know. I didn't see joy. I didn't see three of these, actually. So I'm not doing my job. I haven't seen 45 years yet. And see 45 years. I really like weekend, which Andrew made before 45 years.

I really like complicated old people love stories. That's very specific. That was actually something for real, Jameson talked about, I think in the interview process for this job, You talked about loving geriatric, like, comedies. I'm very predictable. I mean, really, the unpacking of Jameson Cox right now is real deep. Now I'm trying to remember which geriatric comedies.

You know what? I think we were talking about that Netflix show. Grace and Frankie. Grace and Frankie. Yeah. Grace and Frankie. Was that good? Well.

It comes up a lot of my, like, you should try. Like, okay. So qualitatively bad for me. delightful that's Jameson type I loved it I think at this point

though I think I know exactly what that means like what that that evaluation means I think once you know a person well enough and they say that you it's like very personal

yeah but it's a sign of like true well like there's a real difference between best and favorite right and I think being you know part of being

a good critic is being able to differentiate between the two yeah not let your emotions get in the way like a good Yeah. So maybe that's my, what's your matrix called, Nicola?

What's it called? The height matrix. No, what are the axes? Drab to elegant. Yep. Practical to ostentatious. Right. So mine quite hard to showy, but it would be like favorite to like hate or whatever.

And then like good to bad. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, they're actually. By the way, Revenant, drab ostentatious. Okay. Think about it.

Drab ostentatious. Wait. What? I thought Drav Aastentatious was one of the axes. No, Drab is on the left, elegance on the right. Oh. Practical's at the bottom. Austentatious is at the top.

Oh, no, it's elegant, ostentatious. It's, I mean, it's so... How could an Iarito movie be anything other than elegant? Yeah. Ooh. I mean, or like, oh, I'm not going to say Cheebo. An Emanuel Lubeschi movie has to be just... Oh, okay.

I see the argument. Yeah. I was thinking of something else, but I thought... Well, the fashion in it. The fashion in it. in Revenit is is on the drab end. A lot of pelts. Yeah, like it's like a movie about drabidus.

They're all wearing Yeezy Season 3. I saw some. No, they're wearing Easy Season 3 in District 13. Which is actually true, I feel like. I'm pretty sure. I mean, when I was there at MSU for the listening event. I was there. We were both there.

Yeah, we were both there separately. But when it was unveiled, I totally thought it looked like a sci-fi set. Yeah. I know what you'd give it. Yeah. But like in a student way. Mm-hmm. Ooh, somebody's got some criticisms of...

Nicola's just been waiting. I feel like Nicola's been waiting, and Brian has just been hidden on the digital... He's at the end of the tube over there. Oh, I wish Brian's face was up front and center the entire time instead of mine. what are you guys looking at i'm looking at a three shot of you guys so now we're looking at you we're looking at our live shot and we just got it fixed so now we're talking directly to brian but now the live shot is just brian yeah that's terrifying i'm sorry that's fine that's fine that's cool by me um it's like you're right here so um i will tell you what um what actor

what category i have the strongest feelings about or the one single strongest opinion about and it's so minor, but it's actress in a supporting role. I think Alicia Vickander's performance in the Danish girl is terrible. It is bad. It is not just not up for, like, not award worthy. I think it is actively obnoxious. And I think she's great in Ex Machina. I think she's the best part of Ex Machina.

She holds it together. But that is such a textbook. It's like 10 years of people making fun of Manipixie Dream girls like never happen and she's just like I'm going to do this like the spunky wife who like decide to like do a little gender vending like in the bedroom with my husband and then it becomes so much more than I bargained for it's like very very offensive to me um I don't know but that's and and I only say that the only reason I have strong feelings about this like so many things with the awards is that I'm pretty sure she's going to win so right well I would like

like to just say that I think that Oscar Isaac's arms and shoulders carried ex machina. But that's fine. And I think that Rooney Mera should win this award. And facial hair. And facial hair. He's a really something. But yeah. I'll let him hold my gelatinous brain any day.

Wow. I would do. Okay. But yeah. I mean, like I think Rachel McAdams is really good. And I think Rooney Mera is even better. And I think neither of them have a chance of winning this award, which is too bad. I mean, yeah, the Rachel McAdams performance is so understated,

and she really only has, like, a couple of scenes that are all her own, or, like, that she's just splitting with one other person. But it's so good. I mean, she has some of the most emotional stuff in the movie, and I just feel like you deserve something to take home after a year where you were in True Detective Season 2. Like, you just need a little something to make the year worth it, because, oh, God, damn, that was...

Can you guys tell me about it? Kate Winslet and Fastbender and how Steve John, like there are great performances in a movie that nobody liked. Like critically nobody liked and audience-wise nobody went to go see. I'm kind of mystified about the Kate Winslet thing because, yeah, because nobody saw it and because it's not like it's one of these legacy awards where like, oh, that person like deserves it at this point. She's won and been nominated a bunch of times.

She's not like, this is not her first rodeo at the Oscars. So that one I just feel like, I feel like with so many other supporting rules, I don't really get it politically. Yeah. I don't know. But I get it more for Fastbender. He hasn't, he hasn't won anything, or he hasn't won an Oscar at least. And, you know, he's very respected. He's been in a bunch of stuff that's kind of been looked over.

So now he's in this, like, showy, very high profile. even if it wasn't seen that much, like it's a very demanding role to take on to be Steve Jobs. So I understand why that would be in the running. Yeah. And plus I think there's a correlation between, you know, turning in a strong performance in a Sorkin movie, despite whatever our feelings about Sorkin may be, I think that gains a certain amount of credibility with people nominating actors. I'm just surprised that like it seems like Winslet is kind of poised to likely win or, you know, and that surprises me because the movie does seem sort of blah.

Yeah. I feel like it's her in Vakander, but I feel like the Kandr vote would actually be for ex-Machina, even though you mean. Yeah, totally. She was fantastic on that. Yeah, well, and it continues, you know, Vakandrwin continues in the best supporting actress tradition of, like, anointing the next person up, right? The ingenue.

Yeah, and I think that's the best argument for her victory. They love to give the supporting role to an old, grizzled veteran, ala, Sylvester Stallone, and the supporting actress role to a new, bright, shining, pretty star. And that could be very well the way. I mean, it's pretty likely that it's still a win for Creed, which is a great performance. It's good. It's obviously very, you know, contested or controversial just because, like,

he's the only person to get nominated for a great movie. Like, did that movie even get a cinematography nomination? It didn't, did it? I don't think so. No, it didn't. I mean, granted, there's a lot. You got Deacons. and you've got like, yeah.

I mean, this is a very... Cinematography is a serious category this year. But I feel like there was a lot of really great stuff in Creed that should have been given a nod at least. Yeah, speaking of cinematography, other than The Revenant, which is likely going to win because it is like gorgeous. What do you think?

What's your favorite film? I mean, shot film of the year, Emily. Ned Max. Yeah. Yeah. It's so... I don't know. I actually watched it on cable again recently because it's on HBO now and they're showing it all the time. So I watch like half of it. The, the, when it's night, like their, their weird day for night shooting is so bizarre and memorable and like completely. It's like 100% stylish. It doesn't resemble any kind of earthly atmosphere at all. And it's so, it's so cool. I don't know. I mean, yeah, but I feel like.

there's a lot of like using those muted tones and those very like tasteful yeah like the like deacons work in saccario i mean it's really it's beautiful but it's like it's not 100% unexpected and i feel like there's way more crazy stuff happening in um in fury road but yeah no i mean i feel the same way and that's the bummer about revenant because it is part of that i feel like every film that those paired together especially shoot there's got to be like a cinematography gimmick to it yeah and this is like all available light and that's the only thing. Yeah. And I think Fury Road is actually much

more kind of like audacious in terms of like leaning back on older techniques and just, you know, people had not seen a movie that look like that in like decades. Man, can we talk for a second about just the overall campaign for the Revenant, whether you're talking about Leo or the movie itself or the cinematography.

Like, why, like Mad Max, I'm sure, was very hard to film as well. They were in the desert for a really long time shooting stuff with real cars and like, a bazillion cameras everywhere and stunts and a huge cast, like way bigger cast than Revenant. Why, like, why?

They built the guitar truck. Yes. That guy was on the truck. That guy met the love of his life on that set because it was so hard. Yeah, no, I just don't, I don't know why. It's so frustrating to me in this narrative of like, well, they worked so hard, so they deserved it. I am.

Oh my God, I'm going to go down such a rabbit hole. Robert McKee wrote Story, the handbook, which is responsible for probably some of your least favorite screenwriting in the last 20 years. He has a blog, which I was made aware of last week, where he refused movies and talks about whether or not they work on a script level in like the most formulaic, predictable way you can imagine. and he loves the revenant, obviously, and, like, his reviews are a little check marks for each, like, element that worked, and the last one isn't even an element that worked. He's just, like, I'm just glad these guys could pull it off.

It seemed like a real hard film to make. And, like, meanwhile, he's trashing Carol and stuff. It's just, it's really incredible. But that narrative that has emerged around that film is just, like, very, I think it's effective on a certain kind of, like, old-school voter. I mean, at least from, my very distant perspective, it feels like

the entire narrative around the Revenant is like we almost killed Leonardo DiCaprio. And it's like, did you? Like, was that true? Was there any chance that he would have died in that movie? Like, percentage wise, is it 2% that Leo would have died? Because it feels

like they're saying like, only Leonardo DiCaprio has the strength of spirit and the desire for young chicks to go back to L.A. after he almost died making this movie. Oh no, that's the best thing is like when he's done filming, and goes straight to the club. I cut through the night.

Yes. Say what you want. I think it's really inspiring that he kept a picture of the dance floor at One Oak in his glove. So when he was really feeling down he could just like peek at it.

Peek shed his singles here. Peak Nicola face right there. You really want that to be true. One Oak of all the places. That's no one oak is a totally like, duh. I don't know, like of all the, like there's so many. I'm just saying,

as someone who. who really closely follows all Leonardo DiCaprio plus model coverage. One Oak is a frequent appearance. I remember feeling like he revolutionized the thing of wearing a baseball cap in like the mid-O's. Like that sounds very, very boring. But like being out with your boo wearing a baseball cap and sunglasses because you're famous, which is like not, it was just not a stylish look, but that immediately became

code for I'm famous leave me alone. I have a baseball hat, and whenever I wear it, more people look at me, and I think it's because they think I'm famous. Yeah, I think it's totally. But it's like, I'm on the J train. I'm not famous. I don't know, I don't know. I'm sorry.

Those celebrities are just like us, man. On the J train. I live in, not New York. Can someone explain to me, is the J train not glamorous? It goes to Bushwick. The J train goes to Bushwick. But isn't that of where like a lot of arty hipsters live? Yeah, but like if you're celebrity, you'd be,

in that Uber black or something. Like, you wouldn't be on the subway. And definitely not the... What if you're a celebrity who prized themselves on being a member of the common folk? I would be a stubborn celebrity. Like you're Mark Ruffalo and you're right. Actually, no, it would take zero minutes for me

to be like, I get driven now. Can't you imagine... Can't you imagine Jason Sudecis and Olivia Wilde taking the J train? I can. No. No, absolutely not. You know, I think that there are a lot.

lot of people where we overestimate how much money they actually make and whether or not it's actually practical to have a driver to take them anywhere in New York. I'm just going to put that out there. Jameson, if you're here for long enough, we can ride the J-Train and you can come to Bushwick. That, I mean, that is Facebook video gold. Just Jameson, Jameson and Nicarla go to Bushway. Oh, my God, it would be great. I already have so many things we could do. I don't know if you wanted a BFF all here in New York, but I'm not. I'm not. I'm not. I'm not. I'm I'm not sure if you're aware of the fact that Nicholas proposing a series of ongoing adventures. Like a crawl. I think I made a crawl.

Through the night. Yeah, it's done. Bring cash. Real quickly, I want to get back to talking about the Oscars. We're going to keep trying. Real quick. I promise it won't take long. I'm so sorry.

I just want to know what movie got dicted over the most. Carol, it was Carol. That was not me, by the way. If you're listening to this on audio, that was not me. It was Jameson. And it was Carol. Carol, like, here's the thing about Carol. Carol is not only, like, a piercing and, like, super touching love story.

It's also super funny. Like, I've been quoting lines from Carol for the last month. Yeah, not even just the names that the people have, which are absurd. But everything anyone says is very funny. Like, okay, so I live in Waterloo, Ontario, Canada. and there's a scene in Carroll where they're in a place called Waterloo, and they say that it's awful. And I just want...

That's what that really hit home for you. Everyone in the theater, and it was a close to Pact House, started laughing, and it was a beautiful moment watching a beautiful movie. So if we were, if this was just up to the people, the voting contingent of Waterloo, Ontario, Carol would be a lock. I think so. People were very stoked upon leaving the theater.

And there's something like, what does Cape Lanch's say? She's there when they're like having their first date basically. And she's like, oh, what a funny girl. Fell out of space. Oh, fell out of space. Yes. I've been saying to people, oh, how funny. Fell out of space for the last month.

So yeah. They should say that when that astronaut gets back next week. Like, what's his name? Yeah. Yeah. I'm going to say that to Lauren Gresh. If she doesn't put Fell out of space in her post, we're through. Oh, man.

Wow. So really, I mean, it's a deep, it's a deep cut. I'm trying to think of what made. Yeah, what you want in your space content is Carol Gifts. You know, I don't, I can't think of something off the top of my head that I really, I'm like, and now I'm also having complete amnesia. This is one thing that the Oscars do that I think is one reason to care about them is they really do take over the conversation about what happened in. film that year because right now I'm like I know there were like five movies I saw last year that I liked way better than anything on this list that I can't remember because we've been talking about

these movies for so long now well it feels like forever I think we did mention a few of them like over the course of the podcast like Creed and ex Machina are two movies that I also think could have you know why why weren't both of those nominated for Best Picture I think they could have been and yeah ex-marketing like oh I was gonna say and after Sunday I think that my Those are my two as well, and I think that opinion is going to change to Matt Max on Sunday because I feel like it's not going to win anything. I think you don't think it's going to win anything. I mean, they'll win a technical award.

It will win like editing, I think. I think there's a really strong chance that George Miller can win for Best Director. I think that's possible. I agree. I think he's going to get the consolation prize when the Revenant wins. Yeah. I mean, I think it's going to get. going to split. I think it's going to be either, like, I think it's a longer shot for it to win

best picture, so I think Revinan will win best picture, but then I think, I think, I don't think that Iner Reto will win for director if Revenue wins for best picture. I think it'll go to somebody else. But that's, also, I always find the Vegas odds amusing, which went out today, and they actually have pretty high odds on, I mean, Enioreto is higher, but Miller is not far behind. also you know what okay maybe some of you are watching the verge cast you're meeting me for the first time you should always be on this show

I'm just putting I actually love Jameson's radio voice I have to say it's really calm it's so NPR it's very good is that this Canadian that's like a real there's some shade in saying somebody's voice is so NPR yeah but my whole life We already established he's Anne Hathaway

I mean I don't know like my whole life is very NPR that's okay he's wearing new balances. I just want to be there at the moment when Jason was like, you know what? I'm never going to be cool. You should have been there on October 25th, 1992 when I was born.

Stop it. Don't say that. Don't say 92. Jameson, I'm October 24. Are you for real? Yeah. That's Drake's Drake's Tila, the United Nations. I have.

Tealahua. I have Sierra, Katie Perry, one of the bare naked ladies. There you go. This horror. this right. These horoscopes? Yeah. Oh, sorry.

I'm still stuck at 92. I was, I was, I'm so sorry. I did have an actual point to make. So you know me, you've got to feel for me at this point. You know that I like old people comedies and romances and chill wave. Chill wave. Yes. And so I'm going to make an argument for Brooklyn, which is a movie that is delightful.

The chill wave of movies. No, it's so good. So I went to see Brooklyn, the first half. So funny. Made me laugh. Made me wiggle in my seat as Sursa Ronan gallivanted across the Atlantic Ocean. She gallivanting. Because she's like, just prancing through Jessica Perez there in the department store.

And she's just having a ball. And then the second half on pins and needles the whole time. Wait, isn't it just about like what boy she's going to fall in love with? Because it's like there's a debate between her home and her old home and her new home. you home? Yes, that's exactly what happens. And that doesn't change my statement one bit. I was on pins and needles the whole time.

I just thought Brooklyn was really well done. I think everyone is kind of like laughing at it or casting it aside because it's this very like lightweight, you know, romantic movie. It is the one that my mom was like, you should see this. Yeah. And I am the mom of the verge. No, you're so many more things than just the mom, but you are the mom. I thought Ross was the mom. Really?

I'll have to find it out. Ross. Yeah. He's who I asked all the questions. Huh. What? You think you're the mom? No.

I used to be. You're the wacky uncle. Yeah, I'm the drunkle. Yeah, I didn't want to say it, but that's what I meant. Wacky. That's what you tell the kids. Yeah. Oh, that's him.

Yeah, it's your comic uncle. Don't talk to him so much. Brian, what category do you? Well, okay, what's the movie you think got dicked over? And then what category do you have the strongest feelings about, either positively or negatively? Dicked over Ex Machina and Creed. Those are like the two movies for me where it just seemed like they were so strong. But it was like, Creed, there's really no excuse.

But Ex-Machina was just so early in the year. Yeah. And it was like that weird, like, cadence release. It came out in the UK last year, I want to say. Yeah. And like it trickle out this year. And that's just a shame because there were so many strong points about that movie. Yeah.

And it did some other awards recognition, but as for now, not really so much. And the other, the category I feel most strongly about is actually probably director. I am, I'm pro old, Inerritu, and not so much new school. Really? Yeah. So, but I fear in my soul, like, I have a terror in my soul that he'll win for the second year in a row. That would be really unprecedented. I know, but he won DGA, and that was the first time ever, too, like it went back to back.

It's like it's possible. I've a feeling it will definitely split like best picture and best directors just a matter which one that ends up getting. Yeah. I just, I mean, it would be another great like just statistic to have that like Kubrick never won a best directing Oscar, but you're reaching one twice in a row. Like, Oscars. Like, I don't know. Yeah. It's just such a showy movie. You know what I mean?

Like you can see like the directing in every frame. And I'm just not a fan of that so much where like it's, you know, it's, you know, Mad Max is flashy, but it's about creating a world where doesn't seem so, like, self-conscious. Yeah. It's interesting that, like, kind of creating a world or doing something that's more speculative or sci-fi works for Mad Max, and it doesn't work for ex machina. Because usually I would put, like, before, like, last summer, I would have put both of their odds about the same for being in an Oscars conversation.

And I think, I mean, yeah, Mad Max just has more direction on the screen and more stuff going on and it's got you know, it's got I don't know. I mean, I think the performances are really subtle in that movie in a great way. I don't know. I just, I guess it's just that there are cars. Power of cars.

Yeah, I mean. I also think there's something about George Miller in terms of making it more palatable, you know, white got the nominations. Him, you know, being an Oscar winner coming back, you know, kind of rediscovering his mojo after decades, for this kind of movie is a really appealing narrative to the Academy that's like average age 60, right? Like, you know, that conversation.

I think that's a factor too. Yeah. No, I think I think the, you know, yeah, George Miller's age and race might help and gender. Yeah, I'm trying to think of what else that I feel like really got left out. You know, one thing that people have been talking about is like a snub, which I think it's, like, weird to call it a snub because I think it would have been a long shot. But I feel like Jada Pink and Smith in Madamax XX XX L is one of my favorite. performances of the year. Everything about Magic Manga XXXL

is so good. Yeah, that movie was never going to get anything, but it is one of the more special movies of last year, like, on a pure... I'd have to watch that movie for the first time. That whole sequence in her nightclub, you want to talk about, like, shooting stuff, too, is just, like,

exquisite. It was mind-blowing. Oh, yeah. The cinematography, yeah. Sotaberg on the camera. Yeah, it's really, it was really... really, really well done. My boyfriend watches live with Kelly and Michael every morning, and let me tell you, never the same after you've seen Magic Mike XXL. There's just like a subtle charge under the service of every show.

Yeah, yeah. Wait, please unpack that for me. Michael Strayhan is in Michael, no, hold on. See, look, he's got me all flustered. Michael Strayhand is in Magic Mike XXL and he lights the screen on fire. Doing what? He dances. He does a whole whole thing.

That's that dude? The first guy. Like not Twitch, who does the mirror dance with him. And Justin also watches Ellen every day. Oh, yeah. So it's just like two hours of like unbearable tension. Which is amazing. Also, both those castes are like incredible.

I'm so far behind. But like what I've gotten from this so far is that you watch this movie and suddenly daytime television. Yes. It's just like totally charged as a cycle time. Part of it because who watches daytime television? Oh. It's like, no, it's like.

Man, Emily threading it. It's just like, think about it. Imagine. Mom's a Jameson's boyfriend. Imagine, okay, so. James and the old person. Nila, you like the Packers, right? Yes.

I don't know where this is going. Imagine that Eddie Lacey breaks like an 80-yard touchdown run. Okay. And then every play where Eddie Lacey like runs three yards, and falls down after, you're mad because you're like, I've seen what everybody can do. He's broken an 80-yard touchdown run. I know he has that potential within him. When I see Twitch sit behind the desk at Ellen, or I watch Michael Strayhan sip his coffee

with Kelly Rippa, I know that there is like a latent sexuality. It's just waiting underneath. And that's what it's like. I'm absolutely losing my mind. We got that. It all came together in the end. I don't disagree with any of it. I mean, that was a magical performance, Jameson.

And that's why I'm... I feel like this has just gotten meta, though, because I feel the same way now about... Yeah. Wow. I can barely speak. I get it. I get what you're saying.

It's just Michael Strayan to me is like real goofy motherfucker. Yeah, I know. He does like metamusel ads, literally, but you just... It's sort of like... Wait, the Meta mousal... That's had the same effect, though, now. I can't even go in that aisle in the grocery store.

It's just way too much, which is too bad because so many of my favorite products are this. David, I'm done, I'm done. He aged out of spirits through the root beer and right into the fiber supplements. Oh, my God. Well, let's get outside of the, I know we've been sticking to the nominees really, really closely and just having a really rigorous conversation about them. But let's step outside the awards for just a second and talk about the show itself and what we're looking forward to predicting about the general goings on. Are you doing red carpet coverage of Inekelo? I am.

Yeah. I will be watching E and bringing you all the hot takes. Do you guys do, like, do you guys talk about, like, what people say on the red carpet? I feel like, I feel like that's going to be, it'll be an interesting red carpet to watch because whatever the, it'll set the tone for the rest of the night as far as... Yeah, we have like 15 different sets of eyeballs probably on this red carpet. No, not that many.

But, yeah, we're on it. It's going to be, I don't know, it'll be interesting. One thing that Jameson has predicted for this show, which I think will be interesting. to see happen, especially now that Joe Biden is introducing Lady Gaga for her performance. The performance list is stacked, right? Is it weekends performing? Wait, once a little. I don't know.

Sam Smith will be around. Sam Smith will be in the building. We're just doing a really boring song from. The Brit Awards yesterday? Oh. I didn't really know what those were. it was the best thing. You've never watched...

Well, I've never watched them before, but I've always been aware of them. They're like the British Grammys. The best part was like they cut to like the host sitting in the chair at a table and he was like, we're with Cold Play. We got Cold Play. Like, because they literally got everyone.

And it was just like, we got them. Yeah, everybody does go to that. The Rihanna and Drake, oh my God, her pants. Like... Okay, so the Brit Awards actually tie into my Oscar prediction, which I'm going to reveal now. All right. I think...

In advance of tomorrow. Yeah, this is a spoiler. Prediction. Okay. I think that Lady Gaga is going to shout out Kesha during either her performance or her acceptance speech.

Wait. It's almost definitely going to happen. I'm willing to. Can I admit, I don't know what's happening with Kesha. Okay. Let me give you the TLD. Wow.

The ostracist podcast just took a hard right turn. Kesha is currently involved in a contractual dispute with her producer, former producer, Dr. Luke, and her parent record. label, Sony. And she is also alleging that he abused her. And that is the root of the contractual dispute. And it's currently, it's a very complicated case, but that is the gist of it.

She's not suing for damages over the abuse either. She's just trying to get out of her contract. So last week, a motion that she had filed, I'm sorry, Nelai, if I mess up any of these legal terms, a motion that she had filed was denied. And it was to be allowed to record music somewhere other than with Sony and with Dr. Luke, because that's part of her contract. And then there was this huge swell of public support both from fans and from other artists, which coalesced under this hashtag Free Kesha. And one of the most ardent celebrity supporters of Kesha has been Lady Gaga on Twitter and Instagram posts.

and she is a survivor of abuse herself, and that's part of why she feels so passionately about it. And the song that she's nominated for, until it happens to you, was recorded for a documentary about sexual assault on college campuses called The Hunting Ground. So this mix of relevance and timeliness and the prominence of the Oscars,

just to me it's a natural fit that she's going to reference Kesha. And there's also an award show precedent set at the Brit Awards when Adele said, I'd like to declare my support for Kesha. Yeah. Yeah. Can I be real, real about this also? That song is terrible.

Yeah. The song is really bad. And it's, I mean, I read somewhere that she really didn't have much of a hand in writing it. It's kind of a... It's just her. Yeah. What's the change of word get a third? It's one of those.

Oh, yeah. And Diane Warren wrote the bulk of it. Diane Warden being the power ballad master of the last several decades. Okay. Yeah, so that should be interesting. That's my prediction. Yeah. Well, all that stuff is, it's funny because the right outcome for Kesha is not to have a trial.

Right. The thing that she lost was not, there wasn't like a trial and then she lost. Right. Right. She actually asked for the big step of the preliminary injunction, which you almost never get. Right. Like you get a preliminary injunction to totally reduce this through an abstraction when like someone's like, I'm going to, I have a.

the right to cut down this tree in your yard and you're like court stop them from cutting down the tree until this happens so we have a trial and we decide if they have the right to do that so it's like it's meant to like hold things in place yeah and that's like not this moment for her like in the right outcome is all of this artist pressure and all this public pressure sony'll just say fuck it just leave right right which is like the i think that's the outcome and i think that's that's the moment we're about to be in yeah and she's and she said as much like she wrote on facebook the other day kind of her first major public statement in the wake of all these new developments. And she said, you know, I'm not doing this for attention or like Emily said, for damages or

anything like that. I really just want to be free of my abuser. Yeah. That's all I want. So, yeah. Yeah, it's, I feel like between that and between the Oscar So White controversy, I mean, I just feel like it's going to be a very big sounding board on Sunday. Like a lot of people are going to use the time that they have.

to speak their truth, whatever that truth may be. And, yeah, I'm, I know, the disappointing thing is that I do wish some of the people who are boycotting it were going and were presenting or something. Like, I wish Ava DuBernay was going to be there and like, I don't know, freestyle, but she's busy. And, I mean, she's going to Ryan Cooghler's thing. Ryan Cooghler isn't going. I'm the director of Creed, who was not nominated. So, yeah. What else?

What else about Oscars? Are we looking forward? Should we? How long are we allowed to talk? We're way over. Forever? You know, you guys have gone for now. Would you like me to summarize the entire plot of the intern for you?

Does anybody learn a heartwarming lesson about self-respect at the end? Everyone does. Yeah. That's what I always want out of the movie. I don't know. And the verge cast. No one in this show, except for Jameson, who is more comfortable with who he is in any other single human being I've known in my life.

Jameson keeps us grounded. That's true. Yeah. I'm going to end the show. Okay. Is that okay with everybody? Yeah. Of course.

We've done some solid work here. I think we've had a lot of hopes and dreams. Let's just plug everything real quick. Okay. You should read Brian's column nomineering, which he's been doing for the past, what, eight weeks? And doing a bang-up job of it just, getting deep on some of the more, some of the different weird murky corners of the Oscars,

whether that be the nominees or the politics around campaigning, all that stuff. And you should check it out and get caught up for this week. This final column will be tomorrow. And then we're going to be doing some predictions and stuff tomorrow, so check that out. And we'll also be covering the show live in some way or another on Sunday.

So if you need to choose a media outlet to keep you up to date with the goings on at the Oscars, choose the verge. Yeah. And let's be, if you've stuck here for like. Sorry, Nicola. Racked is out. Cut. If you're here. And or Rack.

If you're here like. Racked at the beginning once a show starts, switch over. Actually, I'm curious about this. I'm only doing the red carpet. I'm not watching. Nicola, who's going to have the best dress? You know, we have on Rack.com some dress predictions. I love that you have dress predictions.

Yeah. Amazing. I don't, I'm, I'm interested to see what Lady Gaga picks because she just went through this whole like, I'm regular, you guys, moment. And now it feels like she's back to being a freak. And so I'm here for it. Lady Gaga's getting out for me that I'm regular thing. Still live for me. Anyway, yeah, I'm excited to cover the Oscars.

And thank you for having me on the Vergecast. Are you going to die now? You'll be back. It'll be cool. Okay. I will tell you the YouTube live comments are exploding for Jameson. This guy. The love is insane.

I got to say, the young superstars of the Verge. They're all over the place. Yeah, all these people are really young. Wait, where's the live stream? I never even want. On YouTube, there's comments. So Emily and Liz have a show called Verge ESP that you should listen to every week. It's wonderful.

One of my faves. We talked a little bit about the Oscars this week, but we also talked a lot about Gasha and Dr. Luke this week. and about me not drinking for a month. Hey. I'm sorry. That's like a dream that I have. Yeah.

I did it once for 18 days. I'm proud of you. You're the drunkal, Neil. Walt and I have a show. Yeah, I've got to stay in character the whole time. Walt and I have a show called Control Out Delete, which is really fun. This week, we did not talk about any of the things that Emily has talked about. We talked about Wi-Fi Routers for 45 minutes.

It was really loopy because I'd come off a red-eye flight, and Walt was hopped up on cold medicine, and it got weird. And we have What's Tech with Chris Plant, which can, Just consistently gets weird. And then our very good friend Lauren Good has a show on the Recode radio side of things called Too Embarrass to Ask. Karas Fischer has Recode Decode and Peter Kafka has Recode Media. I don't have anything. I think it's very clear that you should have a show. It's just you telling the audience that they should be cool with themselves.

I do have semi-regular Periscope broadcast from my living room, but it's not quite the same. Get on that Facebook Live. Anyway, all that is available. I want to see Jamison's self-affirmation series. Sorry, just throwing the idea out there. Oh, yeah. Like a Jack Handy type thing, I feel like it would be really, really well. Yeah, you were born in 1921.

So we're at Virgil on Twitter. We're Virgin on Snapchat. We're Virgin Instagram. We recently became the most popular tech and culture publication on the Instagram platform. There's a competitor we have that starts a W that our friend, Helen Havelac crushed into a fine pattern. So, screw you, David Pierce. On YouTube, you can just search

for the Vergecast and find us. You can also find us on Twitter. Nicola is Nicola underscore Fumo. Jameson is Jameson Cox. That's right. Emily's Emily Yoshita. It's pretty easy. Brian is BC Bishop.

And I, treat my character, Michael's. Is that it? Is there anything else that you should do? I don't know. Just find a social media platform of your choice, communicate with us. And continue listening to the show.

Week in, week out. That's it. Thanks, everyone. have a nice weekend. Thanks guys. I love you, Jameson.