The Vergecast - Dressed as a Pirate

Episode Date: January 30, 2015

It's a very special episode of The Vergecast. This is David Pierce's final day at The Verge, and as such, we have dressed him as a pirate and forced him to discuss technology, film, and the merits of Snapchat. Nilay Patel wrangles the troops, Sam Sheffer brings the swag, and Emily Yoshida is back from Park City to reflect on Sundance. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Here's what I want you to know in your mind. You're in your car right now probably or on the subway. That's true. That's based on the, I'm tracking your phone. And most people who listen to this show are moving. At this moment in the future when this goes like. You're moving. You're almost certainly moving.

Not moving like residences. No, like you're physically, your body is traveling at some way. It's very fancy in a new hall. Yeah. So close your eyes, but not so much that you'll be in danger. Close your mind's eye. Close your mind's eye. And I want you to know that David Pierce is dressed as a motherfucking pirate.

That's true. Now, I can tell you why he's dressed as a pirate. But I suspect why. I don't know who is behind this troll, which is great. Very uncomfortable. But know that this day is David Pierce's last day at the verge. Which is insane. For some time.

We tend to reel him back in. But for the foreseeable future, David is leaving us. He's going to Wired. I suspect that the reason David has been receiving pirate regalia all day is because Wired is not a pirate ship. This is my guess. So this is not preparation for a pirate ship, though. No, this is sabotage because you won't fit in on a non-pirate ship. No, so the other problem is that I just cleaned my desk for like 45 minutes and it's still really messy.

Yeah. Which is like, I'm just objectively, they're going to be like, oh, look at all your kitchy lamps, David. get out. What's the best thing you're leading? So if you don't know, so David's, we're all very sad. I, most people are sad. I have vowed to take revenge. You are murderous. I'm, I, it's going to be really bad. It's basically like taken four starting Nilai Patel. You're going to come, like, blow up a European city. I have a unique sense of it. Except the difference is that. And that is not dealing with breakups. Except the difference is that David is voluntarily leaving. Taken four. She just left. That's not. She just like walked out. I don't know. There's a

There's a hair difference. Are you really breaking down the metaphor? Yes, because the metaphor breaks between the taken movies and David getting a new job. Yes, it's because David is not getting kidnapped by Wired. He is voluntarily leaving. Here's what I know. Wired has a beautiful new office.

It is beautiful. It is beautiful. A beautiful new office in there just go. And when they opened it, Scott Dada Shedernchief Wired. He was very talented. Really good hair or two. Whatever. My rival.

That's where you'll stop. That's where the line is drawn. sent out a memo saying that everybody in the office had to keep clean, desk clean, no action figures on desk, no kitchen lamps. And the line, wired is not a pirate ship. So David is spending the rest of his time at the verge dressed as a pirate to remind him who he is. So what I like to assume is that somebody edited out the line after that, which was him being like, it's seven pirate ships.

David, I think you're going to find. It's a pirate spaceship. Pirate airship. I think you're going to find that the real world in your imagination, Are the same. I agree. Anyway. So, look, I'm having...

Can I take this off now? No. It's all of my... I'm still your boss for, like, I would say, easily the next 24 hours. So no. Otherwise, I'll fire you. All right, whatever.

There's news. Emily is here. Hello, Emily. Hello. Sam. Did you like just get back, Emily? Last night. This is the Vergecast.

It's been a fun week. Whatever. It doesn't need an intro. A podcast. Of course it needs an intro. No, it doesn't. It's a podcast. It's a podcast.

If you think the show needs an intro, tweet at me and Eli. If you don't think the show needs an intro tweet at me and Eli, sound off, please. Well, you just want tweets. You're just like thirsty for tweets, man. What is this new meme about being thirsty for things? It's like, what is it? 2005 again? Come on, guys.

Thirsty was not a thing in 2005. Yeah, but it's like, it feels like retro. Like you're trying to like act like 90s again. And it's like, come on, guys. Here's what I want you to know. Right before this show started, Sam confidently announced Emily. I'm a teen. You know what? He wasn't going to get any argument for me because he knows what Snapchat is and I don't.

So therefore he is a team. Let's start. It's on the list. Fine for Sam. This is the Verge cast. I'm sorry. Where David is just a mutineer. A heartbreaking mutineer. That's a better explanation for the pirate thing, I feel like.

You're mutineenine. You are keeping the hat off. Yeah, of course. I would say you do look good in a hat and bandana combo. Thank you. Okay. this is the Vergecast where we talk about stuff. The first thing we're going to talk about.

But is that a good intro for you? I'm Neelipatel. That's Emily Yoshita. That's Sam Schaeffer. This is a dead man. Dead man. Okay. First thing on our list, Snapchat.

So Snapchat actually did a bunch of interesting media stuff this week. And before we get into it, Sam, I would like you to explain to Emily what Snapchat is. Because I tried to show her today. and like she physically rejected what I was showing. Wait, can I introduce one rule? Yeah. You can't use the word ephemeral ever. Okay.

So Snapchat is a way for you to send and receive photos or video that you can draw on. You can do text overlays and they self-destruct when you send them to your friends. So I can send you a photo of me, you know, going 100 miles an hour of a car and you'll see it for three seconds and that's a snap. And then they have this other thing called stories. So if I want to share with all my friends that I went 100 miles an hour in a car, I could post that photo to my stories. And then it lives on a clock that lasts for 24 hours, basically. And that's basically Snapchat.

And it's used primarily by teens. But you know what I just realized? The craziest thing about Snapchat is that it's now everything. Yes, Snapchat is everything. It's now like you can have it for 10. Maybe this is why I'm so confused. Sweet Jesus. Another bag has arrived.

Excuse me, everyone. I mean, you have to understand David's been receiving, he received a telescope. Oh, no. I broke it already. Everything's fun. Now, David, I want to know, would you have gotten the pirate ship connection if the, or how, rather I should ask, how long did it take you to get the pirate ship connection? This memo from Wired came out, I think the day after I told Nelai I was leaving.

And Nelai sends me this link like four seconds after it gets posted and he's like, I'm going to send you so many pirate ship things. things. It's true. And so it's been it's been top of, I've been waiting. Yeah. It's fair. Like I'm waiting for like a fair threat. A dead man to show up. Here's what I want. He's going to replace my hand with a hook. Here's what I'm and this is a request to the listeners of the Vergecast.

This is true. If you are a pirate impersonator or a Captain Morgan wannabe and you live in San Francisco and you think that you have the talent and ability to break into the Wired's office, please let me know. So you think you can be a pirate. So this is now taking five. I think there's some business we can do together. So take it forward, David Lee. All right, continue with the Snapchat discussion.

Yeah, okay, so then let me segue into Discovery. Wait, Emily, so you're clear on Snapchat. And the fact is, it's a super primitive. So my question for Emily is, why are you so dismissive or suspicious of Snapchat? I just don't know how I would integrate it into my every, I don't know what hole there is in my daily experience that needs to be filled. by ephemeral media. I don't think it's about... Burn!

So, so... Corporate burn! You could have gotten a lot of usage out of it during Sundance, like, instead of opting to, like, post a pretty photo on Instagram that you maybe spend, like... You mean of the little fur Mankini thing? Yeah. So you could have, like, taken, like, a really quick and dirty video of that

and either send it to, like, all of your friends that are already on Snapchat, which is probably a lot of people. I don't think so. I don't think my friends are on Snapchat. Maybe that's not why I'm not on it. Nobody is ever like, did you get my snap? Like, I don't know. I will say Snapchat as far as I can tell.

It's very popular among like the New York media and teens. Yeah. It's demographic. I did have the Wikipedia research on this before I did the podcast. 80% of its user base is in the United States and its main demographic is 13 to 23 year olds. And I will say like more than almost. any other social network I've ever used, it sucks unless your friends are on it. Because in all the ways, like, Twitter in a way is like performance art. So if you're just doing

it for strangers, then fine. And even Instagram, some extent, is like, here are pretty pictures. And even if nobody looks, like, whatever. And Facebook is like designed to, I don't know what Facebook is anymore. But Snapchat, like, if you aren't getting stuff from people you know, it's just boring. And if you've nobody to send stuff to you, then like, there's nothing to do. about Snapchat right now, it's like, remember back, I can't put a year on it, but when AIM was at its peak, you would, like, you would, you would just be on AIM and it would be like the place to digitally hang out with your friends. That's what Snapchat has become for these kids. Okay. All right. I guess, I guess since I was a teen, I've moved from being a social animal to a

performative animal, so I think. Yeah. Because you're a Twitter person. I am a Twitter person. I think I'm an Instagram person. Yeah. Yeah, like I'm a Twitter and Instagram person. I went through, I would call it a heavy snapping phase last year. Where it was just whiskey, Eli, on demand. Yeah.

Well, he's a character that appears in my life. He just shows up. Is he coming tonight? He loves you until he hates you. He's coming tonight. And he's coming for David Pierce tonight. No.

And I was like, look, this is too real. Like, I literally had a moment where I woke up and I was like, that shit got too real. Yeah, no idea. And like, I turned off. Like, I was like, done. And now I consume Snapchat heavily because everyone's always posting their stories. And that's really fun and interesting.

So it's fun to just be a consumer on Snapchat. You don't have to snap. If your friends are properly, you know, curating the lives. If you follow like the real verge on Snapchat, that's my guy. Then like, what? Just keep going to. That's cool. No, it's going to be awesome when, you know, when your new media company is so good at new platforms.

That's going to be super fun for you. That's great. We're going to laugh you on the Snapchat. Sick, bro. I told you this should be torture. But the thing I like about... The thing I like about Snapchat, which is what, like, fundamentally makes discover. Make no sense to me.

Wait, is it discovery or discover? Discover. Okay. With the lower case D. We should get into it. Right. So first describe it. But the thing I like about Snapchat is that it's so geared towards not ever being a performance

art, right? Where it's like, you don't know how many followers you have. You like kind of have to do work to see how many people open your stuff. And like, it's not... Tap once. But like, it's not out there in the way. that like a follower account on Snapchat is not a thing, right? It doesn't matter how many followers you have on Snapchat.

Like you can know if you'd like, but it's not out there. Right. In the way that it is on Twitter or Instagram or anywhere else. But then, which is the opposite of what somebody like any big media company that wants to be on Discover, which was just announced this week, which is basically like a small video platform for brands to get in front of Snapchat people and teens. Right. So I think that's similar like what Instagram did when they started having advertisers. Right.

But then for Instagram, it's like they're all about numbers, right? And Snapchat is like, I'm sure showing this stuff to ESPN and Vice and Yahoo on the back end or whatever. But like it's very much not designed to be like a competition and be like, look how big we are. It's like it's like, it's weird in this way where it's like, I don't know what, I don't know what vice gains by just like hanging out with my friends. Well, I mean, I think about for now. I think we need to High check Snapchat. It's everywhere.

It's uncheckable. Can't be. The thing about Discover that's really interesting is that it's not like a Snapchat story the way most people use Snapchat stories. Like if you look at our Snapchat story, it's all stuff shot with this, stuff that takes place in the office.

Discover is like a separate kind of part of the app that's professionally made just for Snapchat. And it's just interesting because I think it's going to confuse a lot of people because the icons are circles and the stories on the stories page are also circles. So I think most people are going to look at Discover

and press and hold and wait to see like the vices like story. But it's so far from like a regular Snapchat story. And it's going to be interesting to see how people receive it. And it's it doesn't just go away, right? You can like watch. You can watch it over and over. So here's a thing about Snapchat.

So that we, it's funny, Snapchat when we covered is so polarizing, right? It's people, some people are like, whatever, it's for teens and sexting. And then there's, like, Sam, who loves it? And then I'm fascinated by it, even though I barely use it. Like, I consume Snapchat, but I rarely use it. But what it is, like, technically underneath it is, like, maybe the best video sharing service that exists. It's really good. You can take a video with your phone in, like, a second, and send it to somebody else,

and it shows up on their phone, and they can watch it, and then it's going to gone. Except for the app to, except for the fact of the app is crashy as all hell. Right. Um, but two versions ago wasn't that bad. It's like the lately they've had some of your problems. And what's really interesting about it is people are making, and I think this is like, Snapchat's like flaw. So people have developed an entire vocabulary of Snapchat video. Like our video team will love Snapchat. They're great at Snapchat. Yeah. And we can never show it to anyone. Right. It's like there's an entire way that people have of talking and making and creating on Snapchat that is like lost.

Well, but why, like, why is that, what's unique about Snapchat in that way? Like, people have developed it because it goes away and now they're making a thing that doesn't go away. And so, like, all of this, like, shame and fear of screwing up and having to make it perfect is all going to come back. Like, there's a reason that these news brands aren't putting the same iPhone crap that everybody's doing because it's there and suddenly it reflects on you in a way that something that disappears in six seconds doesn't.

I think, I think it's just really interesting that there's, like, an art form here. It's impossible to be a critic of. Right, because it goes away. It's gone. So, like, the way it feels to me is like... But now it doesn't. Like, that's the thing. Well, and discover it does, but that's, like, whatever.

Like, kids are spending their entire lives, and people are spending their entire lives, like, looking at this app and making and creating an art form that is lost. Even, like, I can go back onto an old computer and fire it up and find transcripts from my aim conversations. Yeah, and they're great. They're amazing. No, but you understand why, like, Vice and whoever else,

CNN, right? You understand why like those are video companies. Like Vice is a video like it's a cable not like masquerading his website Right like like um well it's sort of I guess a little more like what TV used to be before you could there was any way to record it or go back and watch it again or anything and so it's natural that you have one more screen of like pro stuff I think I think just the thing about Discover on the surface is that Teens 13 to 23 are spending a Crap load of time in Snapchat and now that this Discover thing is just all already there, people are going to look at it.

Well, but so here's the question, right? So here's what I want to know. But are they going to look at CNN Snapchat? Well, so, right, this is what I want to know, is discover about CNN saying how do we get in front of 13-year-olds, or is it about Snapchat saying, how do we get in front of 34-year-olds? No, I think it's about them saying how do we get on. I think it's about Snapchat saying we have all of these kids in this app already who slash what brands do we want to put in front of them.

And we'll take all their money on. I will say this. You know, I just gave you, like, Extreme credit for building, like, a great video sharing platform, but this app is garbage. Like, it is just hot garbage. Like, it's, like, crash. It's not working in here now.

The, like, sharing a video mechanism is great and everything else about it is awful. Wait, so I'm actually confused because why, I don't understand what about this still would not encourage performance? Because it seems like... A lot of people use Snapchat for performance. Like, there's a, there's a dude...

It's a... Jerome Jarre and Nicholas McGalas. These are, like, huge Vine stars that are finding that, Snapchat is, you know, where they should be right now. Like Jerome Jarre in the last year, Nick Bill and just did a really great profile. You're watching ESPN's right now. Nick Bill did a great profile on this kid.

He's like 24 from France. He came to New York broke. Then he made a Vine account and just started doing funny stuff on Vine. He's like, has like five million followers on Vine. And now he's just totally transitioned to Snapchat. And is our advertisers paying him to Snap? I don't know. But people, a lot of people, like the big Vine stars, I've seen a few of them move over

to Snapchat. Why? ESPN's has a sponsored ad in the middle of it. Like one of their snaps that's sponsored and has an ad. So an interesting thing about that, it's a 50-50 red share split between Snapchat and like the media company. So like the advertisers will come in and say we'll give you a million dollars for the one day or whatever. Just making up that number and then both of them get half a million dollars for one day of snaps. Yeah.

I mean this is like, I get it. Like it's cool. But like it's like, okay. For for the 17 year old like high school kid that comes home, he can just watch last night's daily show or whatever is on Comedy

Central like on the bus instead of like waiting to get home and like finding that video on the computer I do like so you swipe this way to yeah so that's like a condition and like go this way to do that live live

I like how this is there was a long time when the Vergecats were just turned in online shopping and I've noticed that now it is like mostly turned into like us watching things did you guys buy things on the podcast

I have bought so many phones and laptops on the show it's like uncountable Whoa. Like, is it like an extra buzz if you buy it on? Like, because usually when a phone comes out, I'm like, I don't know. And then I'm like Googling on the show and I'm like 10 people tweet it and you like, you should buy it. I'm like, yeah, I should. And then like I buy it and then like someone tweets at Becky and then Becky emails me and she's like, did you buy a phone?

Wait, is there any Snapchat performance art? Yeah, but I can't show it to you. Rondo has a ridiculous Snapchat. So I'd be like like contemporary artists. Like people who would show, like do performance art and I guess. gallery or something. Yeah, I would say Rondo does that kind of stuff in a Snapchat feed. He, there was one time it was like probably 500 seconds worth of video of his bird. And he was like playing music and it was like a purple light. It was like a whole thing. And it was like he,

he created a story without any words. And each snap was a full 10 seconds. And you just sat there holding down each time and you got this crazy experience that I really can't even explain. You should. So Emily, you should. I mean, the way you should get just a Snapchat. And and find and find Roddo. But this is my favorite thing about what you were just saying about it being like early TV before you could record it. Right. Whereas like you have conversations like that now.

Yeah. Right. Where it's like it used to be if you didn't watch the show, you'd be like, damn it I didn't watch the show. Yeah, yeah, I missed out. Go find it the next time and all you could do is talk about it. Yeah. And I've had it happen with Rondo where somebody's like, you didn't see his snaps.

And then I went back and like furiously added Rondo and now I will never ever miss one of his snaps ever again. Because like I don't want to miss it the next time. Yeah. And it's like because of that, like that's half the fun of Snapchat. It's people being like, you missed it, don't miss it again, and then like you just, you get in on it. That's like, once you're in your ear. I'm noticing that you're not wearing your hat.

It's so itchy. I am a terrible pirate. I have the telescope, though. You are. I think it's pretty clear that you're a terrible pirate. The thing I don't understand is I've gotten a lot of. I think that's why you're going to be not pirate ships. I haven't gotten an eye patch.

Like, what the hell? Well, that's like, that's pirate. You're your fear with your podcasting duties. You need depth. That's a good, yeah. I have one more question about this. Wait, what was it? Okay, do we think, because I'm not up on the philosophy of Snapchat right now,

but do we think that it is like kind of a part of the rental economy in general instead of keeping things and keeping tweets and like having a record of things you own, AK followers or whatever likes that it all goes away? You don't need to own it. Their origin story, like, it's a really interesting comparison because Snapchat definitely started is like a fratboy company to like sexed. It was it was a class project for Evan and one of his friends. He like wanted to show his bro like the girls he was taking home and like didn't want a record of it on a stall.

It was called. It was called like Snapchat. It was called what? Pickaboo. That's all. Was it really? Yeah. Everyone should be ashamed.

That's super fun. But not Evan Spiegel like, you know, like his emails are out in the world of him being like a pretty dushy frat boy. Typical college. It's just funny. Weird, a tech guy? But it's funny that you make that connection because I don't see them as being explicitly part of that rental culture,

but it's the corporate culture lines up with Uber so closely. Right? Like it's right there. Like that connection is there. Isn't that a strange kind of the thing that these companies that are built on not owning and not consuming necessarily?

Obviously spending money but not hoarding the property unless they're girls that you're taking home, obviously. Women are indeed property. Yes. I think that that much is clear. Yeah, but yeah, that it comes out of this kind of douche culture that ends up being this sort of non-commercial. I don't know. That's interesting.

I hadn't even thought about that. Yeah, I mean, it's like a fact of. And Snapchat has dealt with it since the beginning because A, like it was started by teens, basically. They had these attitude problems, I'm sure. They've hired now like tons of. ex-Facebook executives. So there's like adult supervision all over the place that company. That's why they're growing so fast and moving into like real media company stuff so quickly.

So they are trying to transcend that. And it's Snapchat. So everyone was like, oh, it's for sex. But it's definitely for texting. And that's what it's for sex. And that comes up always. Like Snapchat and sexting are forever linked. Yeah.

And it's like you're watching basically the adults in the room try to get far away from that. Well, but isn't it, I mean, isn't that sort of the story of every Silicon Valley success story? like Facebook started as hot or not. It was like all of these, like the, like, it's this big cultural thing that like the people who are making these services and apps like, not always, but by and large are like douchy college guys. What about Airbnb? Was that originally just like crash places for hookups?

Probably. Yeah. Oh man, there's an entire lifestyle you can live here. Yeah. It's like you don't own anything, but you're an asshole. You get laid constantly. You're like just with no trace. Like you got like a jam bag

Like a rule Somebody like picks up and drops off your laundry You've got a lot of You've got a lot of statements on your bank account for like Brand products No it's something like I just think It's funny because if you look at I don't know like it

As much as we exist in the media bubble right Like the media bubble loved LO Which was like an unsponsored Facebook And it was like we're gonna be on ELO That feels like a million years It was a million years ago. And it was like, it was going to just flame out because it was never going to be big. And the media, I think, is like pretty, like, why Snapchat?

Like, I have this conversation a lot. And it's just funny. It's, well, because that's where the people are going. Like, I think, like, I am very careful with Facebook. It is just a thing. Like, I don't know who is going to look at my shit on Facebook. And at this point, it's like, I don't, like, my parents aren't, like, thank God, cross my fingers. My parents are on Facebook.

You think. That would be weird. but everybody they know is. Yeah. So, like, I'm like, I don't swear on Facebook anymore because someone will tell my mom. And, like, I'm 34 years old. No, it's a real thing. Right?

Like, it's, that's a real, like, what? That makes no sense to me. But, like, that, so that space is just as public as anything else. And it's weird because Twitter for me, like, nobody on my family is on Twitter. Speaking of Twitter, perfect segue to move on. Oh, cool. Hype check segue. I've never written one, but I really want to.

Okay. Sam. Look, look. Try to keep this trade. Aren't you going to be sad when you leave this behind? He died. He then died. All right, all right.

Twitter this week announced, which I still don't have in my app, the ability to post native videos, which is awesome, and to do group DMs. The app update for me, I have group DMs, but I don't have video. God, speaking of video platforms, Twitter's native video platform is awful. It's super hot garbage. It's so slow. You can't criticize Twitter in front of. because he gets all sad and defensive.

No, it's... Would you say Twitter's your Bay? Would you say it's on Flink? Right now, my app Bay is definitely... Oh, man. You did this. It's a three-way tie between Instagram, Snapchat, and Twitter. Why?

Why did I go here? All right, let me... Why did this happen? Three-way Bay? No, actually, I have a question for Emily. Here's a thing. Yes. And, no, I do.

I'm right. It's true. It's a real question. It is not a subtle Sam troll or a violent threat against David's like, no, so Sam is right. So Twitter announced a video platform. Facebook is like super hot in video platform. We're obviously talking about Snapchat, which is basically a video platform. Do you see anyone not watching YouTube to go to these other places?

Because that's the bet everyone's making, right? Is that people will create entertainment on all of these other places and it will just displace text as entertainment. And we'll all just watch videos everywhere all the time. and like I don't I don't know like I'm curious like you just came from Sundance where everyone was doing VR all over the place but I doubt anyone was like hey watch our video on Facebook um I think I mean isn't there kind of an issue of of bandwidth for a lot of stuff like text is kind of going to be preferable I mean I can load Twitter in so many places where I can't watch a video on YouTube or watch something on Instagram or whatever and that it alone makes Twitter a platform of choice for me to get you. get information from because it generally, I can have 3G service and I'll get, you know, I'll still be able to read things. Yeah. Stay on the mic.

Stay on the mic. I am on the mic. Yeah. I mean, I, you know, I don't, I'm not one of those people who consumes a lot of entertainment on YouTube, I guess. I mostly go there, I guess, to look at advertisements for other entertainment. Yeah. Like trailers.

That's a really roundabout way to just refer to a trailer. Advertisements for entertainment. advertising. We've been having a lot of philosophical discussions about the trailer recently, so I think that. But yeah, no, I, what was the question again? Oh, yeah. Is anybody going to displace YouTube? I mean, that's kind of the question. It's like we just, we, like, you can look at it pretty linear. Like, first, there were movies, and then there was television, and television and movies, like, had a relationship for a long time, and then there was internet video, and then internet video

and television and movies had a relationship for a long time. And then there was YouTube and Netflix and they like eight television and then television turned into really long movies right and like that's like a whole little yeah that's a story that you can tell mm-hmm so you're saying what people are betting on is that instead like is the next turn facebook status updates they'll have videos yeah like i think twitter is betting on like instead of tweet storming like random vc's are gonna like hold it like they're gonna like selfie storm you can't you can't you can own the problem with video selfie storm that's good i made it up and far hot i like i do see i mean i can't can totally say that happening, but the problem with video, the problem with anything that

exists, that is a temporal way of communicating, I guess, is that you can only do one at a time. Like the amount of information you can intake, this is why I don't watch a lot of videos on the internet because it takes too long. Yeah. I need to read something really fast. I need to skim a whole sheet of stuff. I'm not going to stop and watch a video. Yeah. And so I think that, I actually think like as we, as that pressure becomes greater, because of course it will, oh, it will, always want to be consuming more information in a given amount of seconds that I think that will be the limitation of video. Well, it's just great.

Because the turn and the, I think it's like we haven't figured out how to make money on paper or off of paper, which is why you're going to a dying print magazine. Right. Just run towards the money, David. That's going to be right for you. Keep going. No, we haven't. Like, there was a time when print magazines like made money.

And it was because they could put ads on paper next to words on paper. And like that shift is not just like, it hasn't just happened on the internet. Right. It's not that simple. The text is not as easily monetized as it was on paper. But everybody knows how to make money against video. Like everybody, it's like put ads on it.

Like real ads. Like good ones. And then make them last 30 seconds and then make people watch them by putting in front of the video. I think you can make money off of video. But I think like you can't dispense with information as easily with video. No, that's true. Like it's because it's real time. Like you, it takes five minutes.

And like that's why podcasts at like 1.5 speed are a thing. Yeah. Which our producer hates with a pack. I'm, let me say one. Oh, good. Yeah, it's her last day, and I just gonna do whatever you want. Basically.

Jerk. So I think the thing, the bet that Facebook and Twitter and everybody is making is that you're already there and they can make more money off of you on video. Right? Like, I don't think Facebook is trying to kill YouTube.

I think they like to kill YouTube. I think YouTube is terrified of Facebook. I think so too, but I think Facebook is less concerned with YouTube than YouTube is with Facebook. Yeah. Because what Facebook is saying is essentially like, hey, you're already on our page.

You'll probably watch a video. if you're already here and it already starts playing. Like that's why this stuff auto plays. Yeah. Right? And like if for like Instagram for whatever reason, it never really has worked that I can tell. But what Facebook is saying is like, oh, if you scroll over this thing, like we already have so much of your attention.

If we can get 30% more and then put a big ass ad in front of it, that's a ton of money. And like that's going to work. Yeah. Like I don't see how that doesn't work for Facebook. Well they have to figure out how to is how to make them and the people who make the videos for them money. Well, they have the biggest, their biggest problem is Facebook video. I mean, we put videos on Facebook.

We have all the stats. It's funny. It's funny when we talk about this stuff because there's like a line that I shall not cross, which is like I know a lot of this information. But like... I mean, I don't think it's revealing too much to say a lot of people watch videos on Facebook. A lot of people watching it. But we watch our videos.

But like here's the thing. They released a number. It was like a billion views. Yeah, it's crazy. But like the key to Facebook is they silently play. Right. Right. But like if they change it, so like, we're like, oh, I'd like to watch that and you hit

a button and then like an ad plays for 30 seconds. Like they will wreck that. version right sure like i will just scroll like screw you i'm done okay i'm gonna hard transition because there's a there's a real reason emilies here which is to tell us stories of adventure from park city utah which you were just at sundance i was sundance sounds like it was actually pretty crazy yeah it was my first time there i went with uh brian bishop and and kase new and if you want the full sundance report there is a separate podcast so you know it's wonderful everyone should listen to we pushed it we pushed it to you like bono yeah you can you can actually um yeah

You can play it while you're over this. You can layer them and there's a secret message. All at 1.5 speed. It's Sam just begging for a retweet. I don't need to retweet. Thank you very much. You see my babe count lately? Thank you very much.

Oh my God, Sam. I just wanted to crawl out on my skin for a second. First of all, what was your face? And what was that, like, non-humble brag? You were throwing shade. I throw shade right back. I don't, whatever. Emily, please save us.

What was the, like, Can't tell us a story. What was the weirdest? Like the single strangest encounter you had with a human being at Sundance? The single strangest encounter with a human being. I feel like there are a lot of weird people at Sundance. No, there's not really weird people. I mean, if you've lived in New York City or L.A. for any amount of time,

all of these people will be completely familiar to be. Interesting. They'll just be wearing sorrel boots. Like, that's it. It's, uh, it was really interesting though. I mean, because I, you know, I was coming at it like from the point of view obviously of wanting to watch a lot of movies, and it was going to be a big thing for film lovers

to go binge five movies on a day. The thing I ended up thinking about way more, which is obviously what I ended up writing about more in my diary entries from it, or journal entries. I was trying to see journal, but everybody says that they're doing a Sundance diary. I wanted a journal. And I wanted it pronounced gurnal.

Your journal. My journal. But, yeah, but a lot of what I ended up thinking of was actually hype. Hype is like the biggest was the thing that I found myself walking around thinking about more than any one movie or anything

like that. Because it's such a strange, small, concentrated ecosphere where everybody goes in knowing nothing and hits the ground and immediately wants to have that one line review or report from a movie they saw that they can

tell somebody else and feel in the know about. And I think in one one post where I was talking about that, one of the readers was like, oh, that sounds like CES. Yeah. Fair. So is it like currency if you're walking around,

like you saw the movie that only like a few people have seen? I think it just, you know, a lot of times it's not even currency. It's just like you're on a shuttle with a stranger and you need something to talk about. There's that. But yeah, I mean, but yeah, if you're pressed, definitely it's currency.

I mean, you know, you want to be able to have, the speed of which some people would go watch a movie, movie, you'd see, like, you'd be able to tell the journalist because they would, they would be out, like, before the credits were even over, like, with their laptops already open, like, and going off to some corner to write, which just, I mean, we didn't really approach it from that way there, but, but it's, that, that is, that is a big rush. And it's funny because a lot of these people, a lot of people, a lot of people won't even see these movies, you know, I mean, there are exceptions. There were a few really big deals there, but, and I guess a bigger,

there was a bigger market there than it's been in years past, like, more stuff was bought, but, Yeah, no, it was, yeah, I thought a lot about, you know, how a movie can go from being something nobody has even seen a trailer for. And then four hours later after it screams, everybody is rushing to the next screening of it because they heard that everybody cried during it. Is that like a unique, like social media enabled thing? Yeah, I would be really interested to see what it was like there before that or how word would travel like that. Like, would it take till the next day till everybody had like gone back to the bars and socialized and, you know, actually real time shared the, their, their buzz about movies. But now it's just, you know, you know, like,

oh, this movie's getting out now. I'll check my feet and see what people are tweeting out of it. And then you have- Was the opposite true, too? Like, did you watch movies die in real time? Like, people would come out and be like, this movie's garbage, and then you just, like, never heard about it again.

Well, that's sort of how I felt when I watched, when I watched Adventages, one of my favorite movies that I saw there, which is also one of the few real sci-fi movies there. And you can just feel an energy in the room where you're like, yeah, and then immediately afterwards I was checking Twitter and I was seeing, you know, what are people saying out of it? And there was, you know, noticeable silence compared to other stuff and other stuff that had, you know, bigger stars in it and or that wasn't

genre. I mean, and that's the thing I think that it was a little bit discouraging to me about it is that there is definitely a Sundance film. And that is something that I was kind of joking about ahead of time, but actually being there and seeing the stuff that gets prioritized again and again and again, which is mostly coming of age stories about white kids. There's some exceptions. There's tons of exceptions. But that's like, one of the biggest deals was this film called Me or All and the Dying Girl, which is based on a book. And it was one of my least favorite films that I saw. But it was. And everybody else liked it. Everybody. You were like the crazy one. I felt like the crazy one. I think, and this is what friends of mine who've been before tell me is that

like eight months from now when these movies come out, everybody will kind of like not be able to remember why they were freaking out so much about this. They're like anything. Yeah. Wasn't that true every year at Sundance? Like there's always like the three movies that everybody's like, oh my God,

they're gonna change the world and then they come out and people like, oh, those came out? Yeah. Well, the exception, I mean like last year, the big thing there was boyhood and that's an example of something that actually did end up like, yeah, that worked out for them. It also happened to have, you know,

to name talent stars and a beloved director. Coming of age tale. Yeah. The coming of age tale to end all coming of age tails. So, I mean, it had a lot going for it in that department. But yeah, there's other stuff. I'm Whiplash was also last year too. That was a big one out of last year.

So, you know, all these, another kind of coming of age tale. So, you know. Can I just say that I really dislike coming of age tales? I don't like them. Like, I don't know. Every time I... It's a broad statement. They just don't.

I don't know. Isn't like, like... Anand Green Gables? You don't fuck. They had a green cable. No, okay, fine. Screw you, Ann. Get back to your gable.

That's awful. That's the worst. Like, I should be fired for that trick. I should have to go work at Wired. That should be my punishment. Oh, man. Yeah, no. It's got you.

It's just sitting there. I got this much more time. No, like I, you know, it's like the iTunes thing. Yeah. Like iTunes, like, loves Sundance movies. It's like comic books or a delightful coming of age tale. Yeah. These are the movies that...

And they're always in front of me and I always watch the trailers and I'm always like, I bet that's heartwarming and super annoying. Yeah. Right? And that's the thing. This is the kind of thing that reassure...

Because at Sundance here, obviously, forced to see a lot of things you probably wouldn't normally see just because they're there and, you know, you should see them because you were at Sundance and they are Sundance film. So I saw a lot of those movies are not things that I would normally seek out in a theater

but I'm seeing them there. And then it's like I have my preconceived notions. Oh, yeah, I don't like care about... you know, a Brooklyn family drama or something like that. And then I see one and I'm like, yeah, I still don't. Is it weird just watching a movie at Sundance? It's a very particular crowd of people to go see a movie with. Yeah, it's weird.

It's, I mean, there's a lot of, actually the biggest population of a movie go over there that I was most aware of was the Park City mom. Really? Yes. Or like local. It's just like townies and fur parkas just run up. Yeah, well, they're rich is a thing. Sure, they're in Park City.

Yeah, they're, like, maybe they don't even live there. They live a little bit for a winter. They're there to ski or something. And they're like, oh, we'll also catch the movies. And we'll see if we can, like, meet Jason Schwartzman. Yeah, and they, they love, yeah, they love that stuff.

Jason Schwarton, by the way, like, is Sundance. Like, if you were to personify Sundance, I feel like it's Jason Schwarzen. Well, Kristen Wigg was, was equally, I think the most prominent people this year there, just in terms of, like, being at stuff and being in films also is Kristen Wig. James Franco and I feel like there's a third person who was in several things.

I feel like I was listening to the Vergecast Special Edition and I like it was like on the background but like I definitely like my ears perked up when I heard Brian be like I just can't take James Franco seriously ever and like it's weird because the last thing I saw James Franko and was like on Broadway and of Mice and Men but I had that feeling of being like this is really serious and like quite sad. you're just Josh and you're gonna do something funny

It was like you did nothing funny You know what's weird is I feel like it was of all the things he's done Was it the Oscars that he hosted Where he was like clearly high and being That was what ruined James Franco for me Yeah well that's when it became less Like Pineapple Express I'm like it's good You can still be a serious actor

But then he does that with Anne Hathaway and I'm like you're done I got nothing like oh I see You got Hathaway love I got mad Hathaway love Well yeah and it's it's just sort of like At a certain point you can be kind of the goofball the room or always like always be super stoned or always say something weird but at the like that just kind of I think cross the line for a lot of people who are just like just do your job a little bit though

like you can do like a goofball stoner version of your job and that's fine but like he was so checked out and and I mean I I don't want to be like oh respect the Oscars there a storied institution you need to you know show some respect kid but like he's getting paid a lot of money for that And that's, yeah, and it's, it's just sort of, it's sort of gross. Like, Seth Rogen had done it and, like, done Seth Rogen things. It's fine. Yeah. But, James Rangel, like, he wasn't even there.

I just, I hate it. I hate James Franco. You're so mad. He's so talented. Is he? I mean, yeah, he's pretty good. But, like, I hate that guy. Well, I mean, he has many times.

He chooses to use them poorly. Right. Hype check James Franco. I did that already. When? I vividly remember doing it, and I was like, in this room. Yeah. Hype changes.

No, he's great. I rewatched. I rewatched. watched the interview. You would. You would. I bought the interview. You watched the interview twice.

I watched it once. Why would you buy that? I only watch it once. Yeah, I bought it because you had to that day. Yeah, I bought it that day and I watched it like a week ago. I rented it. I rented it. I ran it.

I read it. I did it. Like, curious Americans whose curiosity was rewarded by owning the interview. It felt good. That's like a moment that we all. I don't own it.

I rented it. Could you rent it that day? Yeah. Yeah, it was six box and then 15 to buy. Why? Would you buy it? What did I do? God.

You're the problem. We're all in a club together, and that is a club of desperate people buying stupid movies. Wait, so the other thing we need to talk about is, but you didn't hype check Franco. You can't just say I did it already. No, he loves him. He loves him so much. The love is back. Oh, geez.

All right, Emily, so the other thing we got to talk about something, which is like a big story all around was how much VR was there. Yeah, you know what? I'm not the person to talk to about that because I didn't get to see any of it. Why not? Because they only did the lost one day, but I mean, I was, and I really wanted to see it because Brian Bishop went and you can read his report on it and it sounds amazing. Basically, Oculus is rolling out kind of their first.

I think they're getting different filmmakers. This person, I think, did some shorts for Pixar before this director. And so the first film is called Lost and it's just sort of, it sounds like a really simple short. It's sort of about this big giant, but you are in a film. You're in, it's a computer-generated thing so they don't have to worry so much about the, you know, the resolution. of the screening and everything. It's sort of, it's an animated film. But, you know, there's, like, credits that roll in it while you're in this three-dimensional

space in Oculus, and that sounds, and then, you know, you're actually a part of the story. It seems like there's very small interactive portions of it, but it still feels like you're watching a movie, and that's super exciting. But, yeah, no, that's actually, because I've seen one thing on Oculus, it's like a narrative thing, and that was the wild thing. that Fox did. And that has a fox in it. And the fox is,

and the fox is like one of these sort of semi-interactive parts of it. And I'm kind of wondering if we are going to discard with that part that we feel like we need in Oculus as far as like a narrative format. Because it's like, I don't know why we feel like we have to have something that, like, is triggered by you looking at it. I don't know. I, I don't know. Because I, I missed that part when I did the wild thing. Like, I didn't see it.

and it still kind of played out for me. So I don't know. Well, it's kind of like you're on rails, right? Like things are going to happen and it's going to move for you because you can't move in an Oculus. Yeah. And you can just like look around really hard. Yeah.

Right. And that's that's kind of, I mean, I think that's fascinating. And then the interactive stuff. Like I saw a picture of, I think it was Casey, like horizontally suspended. Oh, right. From Birdley. Yeah. What?

I missed that. Oh, it was ridiculous. Wow. And like, I think they thought that was like Brian and Casey from where I thought that was like was like the most amazing. Yeah. No, that sounds really, I do wonder about like scaling some of that stuff

because Birdley feels like it sounds amazing to me. And I haven't, again, I haven't done this stuff. But it feels more like a ride. Whereas the Oculus thing in Lost, that's really more of a film. Like you can call that a film. When I was asking Brian,

like, what were your favorite movies here? Like, he said Lost. Lost was his favorite movie there. So it's really interesting that, you know, we think about some experiences some way.

and others as like a story that's being told to us. I think, yeah, I would be a little bit nervous about a potential future where we feel like all these films have to be interactive on some way because I think that the beauty of film is that you lay back and like lay back or sit back, either one. You fall to the ground in raptures. But you let somebody else's vision be your complete field of vision in reality for two hours or whatever. And that's, you know, it's, it's kind of passive and there's something nice about that.

And I would be, you know, I would be a little bit disappointed if it felt like everything had to be like, oh, you're in control of the story. Because I don't think that that's the most interesting thing about it. Does that go away even when all you can do is like look around? I wonder because like there is something to the idea that you just sit on your couch and like look straight ahead and watch a thing in front of you. Yeah. And like, I wonder if that still persists, even if there's something going on like next to you. and behind you and you don't change it, but you can see it differently.

You know what I mean? Yeah. That's the part that, that's why I'm curious. It's like, are you going to be tired at the end of one of these? Right, right. Yeah, it's like, it's not going to be relaxing or something. I mean, I think, like, I mean, I understand that, like, you know, you can have a character who's like, look over there, and then you look the way they're pointing,

and then you see the thing that you're supposed to see. But, you know, I would still feel like I was controlling it in some way, even though it's like supposed to feel natural and fluid like you look over there and you see the thing. But I would still be conscious of like, oh, I looked that way. So the sensors in my helmet are triggering an event over there. And that doesn't feel, I don't know, that that still feels a little bit, I don't know, hackneyed or something. Well, video gaming. I mean, like, that's, I think.

Yeah, and they're two different things. When I talk to the people who work at Polygon, right, they're always like a thing about Polygon, which I think is really interesting. is that like, I think it's really natural the thing of Polygon as being like an extension of tech stuff, because it's video games. But like most of their writers have like drama degrees or like screenwriting degrees or like film degrees, right? Like, because it's, what they're doing is evaluating

performances of various kinds and like stories and art forms. And it's like really funny because I, A, I don't think that's really obvious to people. And B, it leads to like a lot of like talking right over the top of each other because I'm like, oh, you must be a nerd. That's so funny. See, I would totally have assumed that, because I mean, the people who went into gaming studies and stuff that when I was in school, they were all in our department and the film department. Yeah, that's funny. That reminded me of another conversation we had during Sundays where people, oh, we were talking about South by, which is the next big thing that's coming up that everybody has to go to. But they were like, yeah, they're like, oh, yeah, it's going to be interesting for our readers to like kind of realize that, hey, there's some art and some music at Southby, too.

And I was like, to me, that's all South by is. Like, the interactive part is like a footnote for me. For the record, that's how everyone feels about it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I truly hate self-by-self. But it's because I never get to go to the music part. I never get to film part or the art part. I always go to interactive, which is like 100 startup bros being like,

we started out the company as douchebags, but now we think we have potential. And it's like, I don't want to talk to you. No, they didn't say that. They're like, come to our party. Yeah. And then you leave. And then it's always the Nashville party and it's always awful. It's just like...

Shots fired. It's true. The thing I want to know is like were people at Sundance who don't care about this stuff the way that like the verge as a publication does? Like was everybody talking about VR? Like were the Park City moms talking about VR? No. No?

So it's not there yet. It's not like what the average conversation that you're going to overhear or that you're going to start talking about with somebody within a bar is. So it wasn't the hype. You weren't like riding shuttles. Like how about that gear VR? I think that on the internet, people can get more excited about VR because right now it's more of a concept and an exciting thing that people want to learn about and see how it's going to be integrated in their lives. And you can get a sense of that from reading somebody's report on it or, you know, seeing some photos or seeing some video or something.

And it's a little harder, I think, you know, when you're not at Sundance to understand what's special about the overnight, like this movie with Jason Swordsman in it, for example. Like you know, those are like subtle or little differences between different versions of the same form. And so I think I think that people outside of Park City are probably more curious about that than the people in Park City who are still kind of into seeing what the what this so-and-so-famous afters is doing. I think you keep bringing up Jason Schwartzman. Oh, yeah. I'm fixated. Tell me, are you? No.

He's the Alpha Omega, the Alphan Omega of Sunnance. He's everywhere. Everywhere you look. He's there. Well, because there's also like Sun-Ans is like, we're business. happens. Yeah. Right?

People, like, a lot of people come to Sundance to, like, buy movies and, like, figure out distribution deals and, like, there's Russian oligarchs there being like, I own 10,000 meters. I mean, that's ostensibly the purpose, right? Like, that's, that's theoretically why Sundance exists. Yeah. It's a market. It's not, like, the biggest market. I mean, Cannes is more of the market, like, over the whole year.

And, and Toronto, to an extent, too. But, yeah. But, I mean, for that indie level of movie, I mean, like, the deals that are being made there, it's, like, I think, Meryl and the Dying Girl, was one of the biggest ones and it was or it set a record actually I think for Sundance for 12 million so that's the kind of money you're talking about there

and then Dope I think was sold for 7 million so you know it's still it's not like these huge it's not the biggest deal that such and such a studio is going to do and it's still all their indie divisions like it's like search light and Sony picture classics and stuff like that but yeah I mean I still I still think for a certain

yeah it is a small world I guess is what I say it feels like a small world there it's a small world of people that care about the stuff right now on the internet they for the films that break out and people care about more that's the rewarding thing because you see them right now in their infancy when people start talking about them and then you know we'll find out half a year from now which of those end up being an actual thing right you know it's funny because the news that came out of son ends concurrently about VR was that like airlines are like looking into VR headset is like in-flight entertainment and that shit is dystopic.

Wow. Like can you like just it's like a thin metal tube hurtling through the air at like 700 miles an hour 35,000 feet and everyone is just wearing a headset and they're just in another world. You know what sounds amazing? That I do not know about that. What's the motion sickness factor there? That shit sounds crazy. That sounds amazing like what sounds like a really good use of VR that?

No it makes it makes perfect sense on your six hour flight. What if it wasn't a screen this big? is like 400 pixels wide that looks like garbage. What if you could forget that you were on a plane? And just like lie there for six. That sounds awesome. This is the slippery slope.

If you say Wally, I'm gonna punch you in the face. Well, I know what you're talking about though. But it's like at the individual level, like that sounds great. But it's like the eye walking onto a plane and all of these people are like,

they check out. They're like out of and out and just like zone. You're like going to be a flight attendant. You're like, would you like some water? Well, yeah, because it's like dealing with an unpleasant situation

by removing yourself from it through artificial means. Yeah. And the more we do that, the more we're all going to be blogs. It's like you're one step away from just like, the stewardess is just like handing out the Vicodin, like in flight. Also something I'd be psyched about.

Yeah, I'm saying at the individual level, this is like, sure, yeah. That's what I want. But like, it's really the, I mean, that's the problem with VR in general to me. That ends with like the billi- that ends with like Zuckerberg going crazy and like only living on a plane. And just like existing in a world below through his VR headset.

Oh, man. That's the final form. That's why he bought Oculus. What if that's all to live on a plane? He's going to buy, what was the airline? Was it like Quantus Airlines? The Zucker Jet. He's going to buy Qantas Airlines next.

Yeah. It's over. You know what it ends up being in space travel when you have to have a really, really long space flight? That's what you use it on. And then you're in Oculus, but you're in space. And you're in space, space, but you're not even there. You're in the coolest place in the world.

But you don't even want to be there. But then you go on spaceflight in the Oculus. Yeah. You just keep repeating. It's like, how was the trip? Oh man, the Oculus of it was awesome. I'm just saying, like, they're going to keep moving the seats closer and closer together. Oh, God.

They're just going to start providing more and more drugs. And then they're like, check it out. Here's gear VR. Everybody's in like a little chicken coop with their heads. They're just like feeding us through tubes. Like, it's super crazy. So VR is, it's it's over now. We're done.

Can you just see it? like United Airlines, we figured it out. We know what it's good for. I will say, though, I am psyched about the first time I get on a plane and like walk past the first class people who I just like reflexively hate and they're all wearing VR glasses and I get to just like stop and just take a picture of each one of them as I walk back. That's what I want. No, this actually is something I've been thinking about a lot with VR is that you are completely distracted while you're on VR. You're going to get so much shit stolen from me while you're doing virtual reality or get killed. You could get murdered while you're doing VR and like the subway station or whatever.

You have to be really dumb. It's like all of the stories about like when the iPod came out, it's like these white headphones are going to get you jacked. Yeah. It's going to be like copy and paste, but like wearing Oculus at night alone on the street is dangerous. I just like the idea of like people standing on subway platforms like tied to the beams so that nobody can push them onto the same.

Like bungee cording. They get all the way to the edge of the platform. They're like, no, I'm just running back. They're like, no, I'm good, guys. Back in the game. I'm sorry. No, it's great. VR is totally not going to curate Wally.

Well, do you think that it looks weird enough to wear it right now that there will be that barrier that you can only do it in the privacy of your own home? I think you're not a glassful. I think planes will work. I don't think people are going to stand on the subway platform and do it, but I think people will sit on a plane and do anything. You ever have that moment where like something really crazy happened you early in the day and then like you had a really weird conversation and like that is totally contextualized now?

Because here's what happened earlier, me to. I was sitting at my chair upstairs. Totally normal, pretty quiet. The verge, like the story meeting was happening. So most of the people were not in the main floor of the office. They were having the meeting. And Addy was behind me. And I didn't realize she was on the phone. She was just listening. And I just heard her like yell. Wally. What about Wally? And I did it. She was talking about. She was talking about. I was talking about. I was talking about. I was talking about. I was talking about. I was talking about. I was talking about. She was on the call with us. Oh, really?

Okay, this is, and this is important. This is a really good segue. All day, like, I feel like, why did she just start yelling Wally? But she was on the phone, so I felt bad. No, this is, this is, this is, this is a really good segue for a discussion we should have. Okay, so we were talking about Chappie. Okay. And we were talking about Mordecai, and we were talking about movies that are terrible and flop.

Sure. Because they are named after a thing that nobody knows what that person is. Oh, that's what she was yelling about. Oh, that's totally, I thought I had it. But then TC was trying to prove us all wrong by saying, like, what about Harry Potter? And it's like, that's not the name of the movie. It's Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone. Yeah.

Then that's more, there's more explanation there. You don't know who Harry Potter is necessarily, but like, oh, that Sorcerer Stone sounds pretty cool. I'm going to check it out. Okay. I don't know if that is. That was what got me. I disagree with you. I love stones.

I love stones. Perry Potter is a bad exam. I love goblets of fire. Damn. I love goblets. I love fire. Who knows? How bad?

I do. I drink out of a goblet every night. Put some fire in that shit? A chamber of secrets. I need more of those. What is this? I'm familiar. I'll pay for that.

1350. Done. That's great. That's great. That's fine. That's fine. Anyway, this is. This is our theory.

I'm going to do a big list of movies that failed because they were named after a person. And Annie Hall does not count. What about Medea? Is that the whole name of the movie? Oh, crap. I don't know. No. I bet it wasn't.

No, that's the Greek tragedy is Medea. That is the single name. What about Anne of Green Gables? Huh? Bringing it back. No, she lives. That says where she lives. There's more information there.

It's not just. There's a location. Also, two people. That's not like the old school last name where it used to be what you did. It was like Smith if you were a blacksmith. Like her last name is just of Green Gables. I mean, I'm just saying that Emily's theory

is down to Guy in a Thing is a winning formula but just guys definitely do. By the way, Chappie is super doomed. I know, that's what we're talking about. You can argue like the fringes of this, but right in the middle of it is Chappie and it's like, yeah. No one knows that's a story

about like a lovable robot who has to fight. I didn't even, like, I wasn't even aware of that, I have to say, like. Hype check, chappy. There's no hype. There's no clue. I saw a trailer. It looked pretty cute. Yeah, until he has to, like, fight for his life.

So the most important thing. Until it, like, goes totally District 9. Sorry, I'm like. The most important thing about this movie that is, like, buried and I totally forgotten about until I was looking at a press release again for today, is that Ninja and Yolandi Visser are in it. Yeah, right? And that's, like, crazy.

And that's enough to make me want to go see it. And, like, Russell Crow has, like, basically. Like, they gave him a haircut. Yeah. They were like, do you not, have you not seen the trailer? No, I don't think so. Excuse me, I'm going to watch the trailer. Let's watch the trailer.

Everybody would be cool. I'm sorry, I'm going to buy a phone. I'll be back in a minute. Emily's going to watch Snapchat. Yeah, yeah. This is going to get real weird. No, the trailer's crazy. Oh, I just blanked.

What's the band? What's the band? Oh, the out word. The out word, right? So they're in it as like real characters. Yeah. Fun fact. But they're in it, like, for real.

and they look like themselves. Like they didn't do any like additional casting. They're like, we're building a fucked up version of the future. You should just be in it as yourself. Well, the great thing about that we were talking about is that I remember when they first came out and there was like one video of them and they were just like in their backyard and they're like, you know, shady little neighborhood and they were talking about how much they love Neil Blomkamp and how they had a script that they wanted him to make and like

they were like obsessed with District 9. And now it's like four years later and the dream came true. So the dream came true for somebody. I feel that's Neil Blomkamp's perpetual problem. Everybody's like, what if you just made District 9, 10 more times? Yeah. Because that movie is awesome. And then he's like, what if I made a different movie?

And everybody's like, I hate you. Check out Elysium, guys. Oh my God, Elysium. I was so excited for that movie. What if all the rich people lived in space? I was really excited for that movie. I was too. And it should have been great.

It was like such a good idea. Yeah, no, everything about it, if you explain it to somebody, it still sounds great. Right. Except the movie. The entire third act of that movie is like, oh, he's back. Oh, there he is again. Hey, Matt, Dave. Cool.

Your super cool half machine works again. Good. Now this is, I got it. You're back. What was I going to say? Oh, somebody is tweeting me Michael Clayton. Here's what you've done to me. People are just going to tweet names at me.

Well, this is what was happening just during our meeting. It was that people were tweeting from the meeting. from the meeting different, well, just T.C. actually. That sounds right. Professional troll T.C.S.O. Yeah. was tweeting from the meeting.

Oh, me tweets. That's when you start. It's going to start real douchey, but then we're going to have a real business plan. It's just going to be pictures of girls in meetings. That's the first wave of adoption. And then eventually you'll be like a code meeting competitor. But you'll still have emails that involve girls in meetings. Yeah.

But the backstory. Right. It's like, yeah. Girls and meetings sounds like a really, really boring thing. to call them my old podcast. It's also definitely like a rich shutterstock category. Did you see,

Ract wrote a story today called We Need to Talk about your laptop? It's basically a response to, you know, Lockhart's Steeler editorial director gave an amazing, like, quote to New York Times. Like,

New York Times wrote like a bad style trend story about how like, the new media elite don't go out to power lunches anymore. And Locke was like, just going. into Le Pen Cotidian is a massive move, which is like crazy, because of all of the people

who go to lunch, like, Locke is like the powerest power launcher of all together. Sir Act wrote a story to take called We Need to Talk About Your Laptop, which is just a list of shit, like crumbs, like types of crumbs. But the, this is awful for the people on the audio, but the stock photo is just amazing. Like, it is the best.

Wait. Like, it's just a woman, like, in a laptop, like, holding an enormous coffee cup and, like, giving the, like, the thumbs up thing. Like finger gunned. It's pretty good. Oh, man. This is also, I believe, a wired memo.

Oh, that's cool. By keeping your place for city as you clean. God, that's going to be good for me. It's great. So are you excited to live on the West Coast? Yeah, so we just moved Emily. I feel like you guys have like cross-country. Yeah, I mean, it missed you.

It was really what it is. It was like, what we need is one more. Souls. Exactly. Soul. That sounds not right. Well, I mean, you're going to San Francisco, which is different than L.A. It's actually not even comparable. I can't tell you the number of people who I have told that I'm moving to San Francisco and they immediately are just like, that's the worst thing you could possibly do with your life. Yeah. Like Chris Grant, editor-in-chief of Polygon, met him outside. He's just like standing outside, talking to somebody. We were talking. He's like, so you're moving to San Francisco. And I was like, yeah. And he was like, let me tell you why San Francisco is bullshit. And like, I thought he was kidding. I thought he was going to like, you know, give me a hug and I go outside. But he, I was, I stood out. I stood out. in the freezing cold with that man for like 15 minutes why he explained to me all the reasons

that San Francisco is bullshit. And he made a very compelling case was the problem. Yeah, no, he probably made a compelling case because it's true. No, that. I'm sorry, I hate to break it to you, but San Francisco is terrible. Burritos, though. There's burritos so many places. They're better burritos in San Diego.

And San Diego is even more bullshit than San Francisco. If I can move to San Francisco, if I could move to San Diego, I would do it right now. I would move to San Diego. San Diego is the city that I go to. Wait, wait, why do you think San Diego's bullshit? Because here's my, I've only been there once. Here is my conception of San Diego. It is full of somewhat annoying but extraordinarily beautiful people who are all just

chilled the fuck. Oh yeah, they're very chill. They're more chilled than San Francisco people. San Diego's like ASU built a climate controlled dome for its students to move to. Where it's just 77 and beachy everything. They're like, just take your Jeep Wranglers and drive directly to San Diego. Like that is my entire conception. San Diego.

Yeah. The first time I went, I was like, I was visiting a friend out there and it was like 1 o'clock on a Tuesday and he just left work to hang. And I was like, don't you have work? And he was like, nah, pretty much everybody's gone. I was like, it's too. But I was like, whatever. That's cool.

Yeah. That's the West Coast. Yeah. So we go out on the beach and we're sitting there on the beach because that's what you do, you know, 145 on a Tuesday. And I was like, so what's the different he had moved from New York? So I was like, what's the biggest difference between New York and he's like, you know how like everybody checks the weather obsessively in New York?

and I was like I was like yeah of course and he was like nobody does that here because it's just like this all the time and he just like grandly pointed around and was like this is my I was like I hate you yeah and then I almost didn't leave I'm gonna interrupt and say we need to talk about the FCC because humongous changes happen today I don't know yes yes I said the early part of my week like at a telecom conference I you then talk about it it's super important here just mention it two minutes right two right here Why is he get to tell you what to do? Because, you know what it doesn't know how to stay on topic. We're on topic. The topic was David being a traitor to his blood and family. Yeah, do we really want his last podcast to be about? Real talk.

How many times has the Virchcast ever been on topic? We're going to get better around here, David, right? Now that you're leaving, we're going to get better around here. Can we have a quick Twitter survey of who wants us to talk about the SEC right now? I'm just playing the Sarah McLaughlin song and having the remaining emotions that I'll have. how much these rights cost. Now, look, here's what I know, David, and I want to experience this moment with you, where this song, I think, signifies what you might perceive as love.

But I'm telling you, this is the song you're going to play when I'm dead. Dead animals. Dead animals. This is how you die. This is a soundtrack to your demise. Sorry, it's really loud. I'm going to turn off. Here, okay, David, say something cool about The Verge before you are a traitor, and I believe Jordan has a surprise for you.

Oh, no. Oh, God. I'm so sorry, everyone. Oh, God. So today is my last day. This is, like, the last thing I'm doing here. No one likes you. I mean, there's one more thing you're doing here, but it's going to be really damaging to your body.

There is that. Whoa. His liver, specifically his liver. We're going to force me David Grain and eat it. You know, like, to be clear, the way, the way this night ends for. me is drunk and just beat into a bloody pulp with Nilai writing a note like, Nilai did this on my like dead body and then just like giggling and running away. But you're in a VR headset.

Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's how we kill people here. Yeah, I think that's right. I, like, so somebody asked me today what my favorite verge memory is. And it took me forever to come up with one. Okay. Because there's like a billion.

And I've been here basically my entire life. Like I was people like, tell me your life story. And I'm like, well, I was born. And then I started working at the verge. Yeah. And then I've been here ever since, and now I'm 66 years old. And here we are. You look pretty good for 66.

Got you. You look like garbage? Right. But I think it, my actual answer is, I think my favorite verge memory ever was from our old office. We'd been, which was like, for anyone who doesn't know, basically a converted, not very nice apartment near Union Square. Yeah. That's fair. Right?

Okay. So there were like two little rooms. little kitchen and the bathroom was right in the middle. So you always knew who was going to the bathroom. But that's a whole different thing. Not relevant to my story. Yeah, that's the weird favorite memory of the verge. It's like, completely like perfect bathroom information.

Listen, you gotta know things. I'm a journalist. I'm a reporter. It's what I do. But I think my favorite memory, and I think Jordan will probably remember this, was one night we were at the office and I was trying to take pictures of something. And my favorite thing to do when I was taking pictures would be go out on the window sill of our office. There were two windows.

We were over on the 10th floor and the windows were just open. So you could just like good die out the window if you wanted to. And William Savona, our reviews coordinator, his dog at one point almost fell out the window. Do you remember this? Yeah. That was awful. And then that dog did not come to the office anymore. Nope.

But so there was one night I'm like perched precariously out on this ledge trying to get like the little bit of light I can to take a picture. And I don't remember who, but somebody, I think it was Jordan. like comes around the corner looking for me and like doesn't actually know that I'm out there but comes around as like David and then like comes around and then like yelps

because they see me on the window cell and hearing the yelp freaks me out so I'm sitting there like leaning out over 10 floors and start like tripping and falling out of the window and I'm like oh this is how I die taking a picture of the Samsung Galaxy Tab 7

that's it's a way you're gonna die yeah right that's that's the one it seems very appropriate and then I was like I grabbed onto the window pulled myself back up and whoever it was that had said something to me was like you're very dedicated to your job and I was like yeah that's it that's your favorite that's your favorite memory that's terrifying yeah because that was one of many times I've almost died for my job yeah

the thing about memories like that is that you realize that over time working here and emily I believe this is a curse that will afflict you as well it all just fades into an endless series of sales and stuff like just an endless never-ending flood you are You will always be at CES. No, the thing is, you're never. The thing is, I'm never at CES. Because you feel this way, too. Like, I go to CES,

something happens, and then I leave. Every year at CES. I don't remember anything. I have no memories ever from CES. Yeah. They just, I, I go to Vegas, and then I leave. Yeah. And everything in between is nonsense.

Yeah, and then, like, our group me at the end of the... Right. I like catch up, but I'm like, okay. It's like illegal. Yeah. Illegal group me. That's when you banned. Yeah.

I don't know. I love The Verge. If I talk too much, I'll cry, so I'm not going to cry. And I think that's really, when I said I was going to torture you. And I almost cried, oh, so many times. You have to cry on your last podcast. No, I'm not going to. Oh, my God, I cried so much.

Last podcast, it was really embarrassing. I didn't think I was going to. No, I'm not going to do it. It's not going to happen. It's not going to cry. You have a choice. You have a binary choice. You can weep or you can dress up like a pirate.

Do you remember? We both know my choice. Do you remember the first time that you, knew that this was your home and that you were like you were destined to be here like for a really long time and that you had a spiritual connection to it. It was actually in my interview. Yeah. So I interviewed. My interview is with Joanna Stern, who is my first boss when I got here, RIP. She's not dead. Geez. Hi, Joanna. I love you.

Well, thank you. Joanna and Josh Topolski, also RIP. Now Bloomberg. Extremely successful Bloomberg editorial director, Josh Walzky. And my interview was at the two of them, and I sat down, and Josh didn't, like, introduce himself, didn't ask me questions. He just informed me that if I took this job, I wasn't going to have any friends. I wasn't going to have any hobbies. I wasn't going to have a life. I just nothing. He, like, he spent, like, 30 minutes explaining to me, like, how God awful this place was going to be.

And then we get to the end, and he was like, so what do you think? It's like, okay, I'm in. And then he was like, great. And he left. And that was my whole interview. And then Joanna was like, okay, can you? you like fill out this piece of paper and like maybe we'll call you do you know anything about laptops yeah right she's like let's talk about netbooks and then we talked about netbooks but that was

like that was like that was when i knew like Josh gave me this like whole long speech he was like this would be the only thing you did and he was right yeah like that was we do all my friends i yeah like all my friends in like the verge heartbreak is a thing uh yeah verge breakup club is real yeah it was more real i think earlier yeah when it was like when it was like all of us in a smelly office that nobody was like real startup time yeah like verge break Cup Club was like, oh, because everybody got dumped? Wow. I didn't know if that, like, dumped is like the wrong word.

Right? It's like, everyone just like faded out. Well, I assume everybody had some version of the conversation of like, it's either me or your job. And then everybody went, eh, and then there's significant other. It was just like, okay, bye. Like, it was, it was that early crew and it's most of that early crew is still like around.

Like, those stories are like, they, they, they, oh yeah, we've all, we were all there. It was, it was real. It was funny because Engadgett breakup club had been real too and so I was like the wise old man I was like

it's it's blocking it's blogging kid like it was super silly yeah um okay but that was one I knew I was there I'm gonna whatever Jordan

so here's what here's what I want to tell you to the loyal listeners of Verge cast I will say something nice about David okay but it's a lie because he's

dead to nature no David is very talented David helped us build this place employee number one of the Verge which by the way is basically the kind way of saying you all refuse to make me a founder because you don't belong here but that's clear so get out uh no it's true david and the the career i will say i'm very proud of david for taking this job wired even though i think he's you know picking the side of evil instead of the side of good um their offices are so nice

yeah you're gonna i mean just the amount of fucking pirate ship in their office can you can i just build a whole pirate ship in their office and they'd be like, I don't know where this came from. Look, it's a pirate ship. Yes. And I'm telling you the materials to do that. Like, lumber is on its way. No, I will say this. David came to us.

You were David Polk's intern. I was. You were a baby laptop reviewer at PCMag. And you came to us as a baby laptop reviewer. And over the past four years, you have managed to do this thing where you are going to take the job formerly occupied by Stephen Levy at Wired, which is incredible. and I'm very proud of you, even though you are a stupid jerk. I never want to see your dumb face again,

and it's a good thing you're moving across the country. I hate you. Call me later. Because I would hit you with my car if I hadn't. You're 2001 escalates. So that's that. That's for the verge. Because I'm going to buy a 2001 escalade, my dream car for $8,000.

I'm going to find you. You can take you get a death seven. I'm going to love to tap the shit out of you with it. It's going to be great. So that's David. Please forget that he existed. and don't read him our competitor.

Goodbye forever. Please and follow him on Twitter. RIP me. You can follow any number of the rest of us here at the verge. You can follow the verge. Just follow somebody else

named David Pierce. I'm sure that there's a show. So David is at Pierce David. Today is the day you unfollow at Pierce David. Find at David Pierce and confuse the hell on it. True story.

Because that dude is hired. True story. Straight up one to one replace me. That guy is delightful. He's a lawyer. He went to ASU. True story. Probably.

lives in San Diego now. He drove his white jeep directly to San Diego. Delightful. Lovely guy. Okay. So we're at the verge on Twitter. No, no, we're at the verge. Oh, shit.

Smiley face. We're at verge. Yeah. There's a script that will correct you if you sure it up. We're at verge on Twitter. We're at the real verge on Snapchat. You should actually go. Our Snapchat is awesome.

If you're not into Snapchat, like I would actually recommend, like, getting it just to see what Sam and Helen and the rest of our crew is up to on Snapchat. because it's great. YouTube.com slash The Verge. You should subscribe. You can't eat. And you should also go to Instagram.com slash verge and follow us on Instagram too. Now throw on the ball back to you, Eli.

That was our show. David is dead to you. I'm sorry. I'm going to, don't worry. I love you forever, David.