The Viall Files - E1123 - RHORI Breakdown w Liz, Amanda's Beach Lie, Dinner With Kyle & West's Seating Choices w Ben Mandelker

Episode Date: May 7, 2026

Welcome back to The Viall Files: Reality Recap!  The Rhode Island era has arrived! Liz Mcgraw joins to break down the drama surrounding her Real Housewives of Rhode Island castmates and why the smallest state is already giving big TV. Plus, Ben Mandelker from Watch What Crappens stops by to recap the latest Summer House episode, including the West and Amanda of it all, Kyle's breakdown, why Amanda's hat looked like that, and why this scandal is working so well; as well as how RHORI stacks up against the RHONY reboot. You won't want to miss it :) "Excited, grateful. #grateful, #blessed" HEY! YOU! DO YOU NEED DATING AND RELATIONSHIP ADVICE?  Email [e-mail] and be a part of future Ask Nick episodes! Want ad free episodes and incredible bonus content?  Start your 7 Day Free Trial of Viall Files + here: https://viallfiles.supportingcast.fm/  Subscribe to The ENVY Media Newsletter Today: https://www.viallfiles.com/newsletter  To Order Nick's Book and/or learn more about the show, go to: https://viallfiles.com THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: Nature's Sunshine - Get a daily detox with Chlorophyll Stick Packs. Nature's Sunshine is offering 20% off your first order plus free shipping. Go to https://naturessunshine.com and use the code VIALL at checkout. American Home Shield - Listeners can get 20% off select plans today! Just visit https://ahs.com/viallfiles to sign up. See https://ahs.com/contracts for coverage details, including service fees, limitations and exclusions. Chime - Head to https://chime.com/viall. It only takes a few minutes to sign up. Wayfair - Find furniture, decor, and essentials that fit your unique style and budget. Head to https://wayfair.com right now to shop all things home. Merit Beauty - Right now, Merit Beauty is offering our listeners their Signature Makeup Bag with your first order at https://meritbeauty.com  Clearstem - Go to https://clearstem.com/viall and use code VIALL at checkout and receive a free mini HYDRAGLOW plumping Moisturizer when you spend $75 or more. To advertise on this podcast please email: [e-mail] or go to: https://advertising.libsyn.com/theviallfiles   Timestamps: 00:00 - Intro 11:38 - Ben Joins 58:26 - Liz Joins 01:25:30 - Outro Episode Socials: @viallfiles @nickviall @nnataliejjoy @elizabethjosephmcgraw @benmandelker @the_mare_bare @justinkaphillips

everybody welcome back to another episode of the va files reality recap edition i'm your host nick joined by the other host natalie she's also my wife oh and i'm also still pregnant indeed you are we also have sweet boy justin and mary with us we have a fantastic episode lined up for you today we have ben mandelker and he is with us to talk all things bravo obviously another just kind of jaw-dropping episode of Summer House. There's always like, wow. For people watching this, this is how I was sitting on my couch while this was happening. The entire time.

That was all dramatic. We were in bed. I was, I mean, I was dramatic. I was like, wow, that's crazy. I was like, that's insane. Anyway, we have obviously that to get into. We are also incredibly excited to have Liz McGraw. She is one of the many stars of the Real Housewives of Rhode Island, which is a show we are,

I'm really enjoying. Love it. We have heard to get into some of the ongoing burning questions. Obviously, we have the recent news about Rula and Brian and this kind of evidence that Joe Ellen has uncovered. And there's obviously a lot to talk about with Liz. And we have her later this episode. So super excited. I have a question for Natalie before we jump into it all.

I'm curious, like, what has been getting you through your pregnancy at this moment? Are there any cravings? Because I saw you post the photo the other day. of like laying in bed with your feet up. And I just think it's very fascinating to see like what people use. I don't know. What's been getting me through? I mean,

I definitely feel like the scheduling, not scheduling, but I just like make sure that I do lay down and put my feet up. Because if I don't, I have started getting Braxton Hicks, which are like false contractions. But it's just because I like do so much and obviously River is so active and she's so busy and she's go, go, go nonstop that like used to be when she's. nap, I would do laundry, I'd clean, I'd like try to like pick, you know, do whatever I could. And now I'm like, nope, I'm gonna lay down and I'm gonna lay down and I'm gonna lay

me that's the best I can do. You need some time to relax and just like reset. She's also kind of just in survival mode at this point. Yeah. One day at a time. One day at a time. And like packages are starting to arrive. That's fun. Vasenet.

It's a little scary. Yeah. We're really, really close. I don't know how now I just done it. obviously super thrilled, excited, blessed. Yeah. Excited. Grateful hashtag,

grateful, hashtag blessed. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I got enough stress in my life, you know. I, you know,

it's like I'm waiting for that heart attack. Yeah, it's not like you're like running a company already have a kid or traveling all the time. So it's just like I, I'm just going to set that aside. The, the two babies is just going to pin that.

We're going to circle back to that. We're going to circle back to that. Yeah. It's going to be really inconvenient when, So they did announce, we now know that Love Island, season eight, we'll be dropping on June 2nd. Super excited about that. That's the universe telling you to name baby number one love in the second. Island.

Island. Love Island. Love Island. Yeah. Or whoever ends up winning Love Island. Oh. Yeah. Yes, of course.

Yeah. What's crazy is that my mom has decided a few months ago, she was like, oh, I'm going to go. My aunt, her sister lives in Spain. And so every so often, every few years, you know, she gets to go to Europe and visit her sister. And she was like, yeah, I'm going to go and visit your Aunt Dana this year. I'm like, oh, cute. What are you thinking? She's like, probably in like May-ish.

I'm like, okay, cool. And then last week, I'm like, wait, when are you going to Europe? She's like, oh, I go May 13th through, like, middle of June. I'm like, huh. That feels like you're cutting things kind of close to like the arrival of twins, don't you think? When did she plan this? And then she was like, oh, then she started panicking. Then she called my Aunt Dana.

My Aunt Dana's like, if you're going to cancel your trip, you got to tell me. You got to tell me right now if you're canceling. Because now my mom's like, oh my God, what if we, what if I go and then I can't get back and then you have the twins and then I'm stuck in Europe? Maybe she doesn't have to go for a month. I don't know. They've got plans. They're booked. They're busy.

They're going to Greece. Yeah. They're going, they're popping all around. But I was like, honestly, mom, that was wild for you to think like, now's the time. You know what? This sounds like Leah planning her pregnancy on my planned Europe trip the summer. Which is a story in like we don't need to get into. Anyways, happy for both of you guys.

And I understand your mom. Are you going to Europe? Not anymore because she's in eternity leave. So I understand your mother. I'm like, been there, done that. But my mom was like, I just needed one more, one last hurrah before I've gone. got because my brother's also expecting a baby this summer. Sometimes, you know, you need, it's like, y'all get a baby moon, but like, she needs a baby moon.

So she's going still. She just might have to fly early from Greece. She's going still, and she's like, you just better keep those babies inside. And I'm like, I will do my best. Hold it in. I will do my best. I'm a little scared. Yeah.

I'm terrified. I am shaking in my boots, but we will. survive. You guys are going to be fun. Everyone is, everyone says the first year is pure survival. They always say that. What happens if you already feel like you are surviving survival mode and your quarter zone is already, what do you do then? I don't know. I think I'm going to be on nine flights in like seven days. What's wild is river, like she understands so much. Obviously it's so weird because she just is like, it feels like every day it's this new grown child.

You know, like she just, it's just crazy to me. Like, she jumped in the bed this morning and she's like, I'm river. And I'm like, yeah, you are. How old is she now? She's two and, she turned two February 2nd. So don't ask. I just say too now when people ask.

Yeah, I think you can't do. Is she an Aquarius or Pisces? Aquarius. Cute. So it's Justin. Her original due date was my birthday. Wow. It was.

It was. That's so cute. But I told her, like, Daddy's going out of town for a few days. And it's like, when she was like, no, I play with Dada. And I was like, I know, but he's got to go work. And she was like, no, I play. And I was like, well, go out there and play with him. And then she did.

She came out crying. It's like crazy. She loves you. She does. If you do the math, you've raised a child for two years, which means you can do one year per twin. So you are prepared. Honestly, that's a really good point. That is so true.

Think about it That is so true Sometimes math saves We're fine We're fine Yeah You guys are gonna We're fine

I feel like I'm also Prioritizing Like when I have a moment One of my favorite phrases Is touch grass Oh yeah I hate when people tell me To go touch grass

But I love to tell myself To touch grass I love to tell myself To touch grass And then jokingly tell others To touch grass But I do understand How frustrating it is

Yes But when you actually do Go outside And put your feet Into real grass We're like, okay. Put the damn phone down, you know? Put the phone down.

Sometimes. As my wife would tell me. Yeah, you just got to, wait, what are your guys' like favorite ways to touch grass? Well, lately, I've been drawing. You've been drawing? Yeah. Well, yeah. I don't know if you've noticed.

He's been chalk drawing. I got a couple to post. I haven't posted. He came home from the lake and told me his mom bought him a bunch of chalk. Aww. How nice. My mom wanted me to draw for her at the lake. That's so sweet.

The only problem is, is the concrete at the lake, you know, like driveway. concrete for anyone who cares. It's a little rough. It's a little rough. They literally take a broom and sweep because they want to have that kind of texture. Oh yeah. But we have some smoother concrete in LA. Anyways, I absolutely love to get outside and it really has been like I, you know, when I got into it because now you

bought River chalk and then I was, you know, stealing your chalk and then I realized it was just really relaxing to draw mountains and happy little trees. Be outside, hear the birds tweet. Yeah. I had an happy accident. yesterday. You did? The stream, I had my stream go one way and I'm not talking about

peeing guys. He's talking about chalk drives. I know I'm talking about happy accidents and streams but I really mean I drew a river not my daughter. So many double and don't and I wanted I just, I changed it up so I had to fix it.

Yeah. And were you happy with your finished product? I'd get it a 7 out of 10 Mm-hmm. Yeah. I definitely, I mean, we have a daughter who is obsessed with being outside. And so I think just like sitting in a comfy outdoor chair with like a cup of coffee, rivers running, dogs running, Knicks chasing, there's giggles. It's like that is just pure heaven to me. Mm-hmm. Mine is like I just grew up going to the beach so much.

And so I don't do it as much here just because, you know, it's colder here. than in Florida and it's a bit more to like go but no my favorite way is just like going to the beach and just like absolutely compressing and just because cell phone services usually kind of bad out there too and you just get to like hang out and it just feels like so nice in my body just to like relax everyone needs a reset you know everyone needs a little reset and you know who gives you the best reset who nature's sunshine i've heard about nature's sunshine supplements give us the opportunity to reset from the inside. Specifically, the chlorophyll stick packs, which I will, I just honestly just make a drink

and then send it next to my little square drawing. Yeah. With sustainably sourced ingredients from all over the world, they're figuring out where each plant grows best because we all deserve the best. And because their nature sunshine, they used solar-powered U.S. manufacturing. That's pretty sick. I'm literally drinking chlorophyll while drawing chlorophyll. That's like inside air.

an outside giving back. It's like I'm like planting in two trees when I cut. You are the tree. And chlorophyll supports gut health, blocks pollutant absorption, deodorizes from the inside out, and boosts antioxidants. Super easy to use, delicious. Oh my gosh. Get a daily detox with chlorophyll stick packs.

Nature of Sunshine is offering 20% off your first order plus free shipping. Go to nature's sunshine.com. And use code V-I-A-L at checkout. That's code V-I-A-L at natures Sunshine.com. Everybody go touch some grass. I know you all want to get into last night's episode of Summer House. And Ben, from Watch What Crappin is here to help us do that. And I'm sure we'll also dive in to some of your other favorite Bravo topics.

And then we have Liz McGraw from Real Housewives of Rhode Island. But before we do, don't forget, the Vow files plus is now ad free. You can get all your VileFiles episodes add free on VALS Plus, your reality recap deep dives, your pop culture roundups, and your update specials. All available on Vialfiles Plus. So just go to Viofiles.com to sign up. Ben, you'll be glad that you did. All right, Ben, from Watch What Crappins is up next.

If you're a homeowner, whether you've owned your place forever or you're a first-time buyer, you already know this. Stuff is going to break. It's not a matter of if, it's when. Many homeowners dealt with some kind of breakdown just in the last year, and without a home warranty, those fixes can cost thousands. That's why we're big fans of American Home Shield at AHS. Home Warranty helps protect your wallet from covered home systems and appliance breakdowns.

no matter how old a system or appliance. That HVAC system that came with your home and has trouble heating the house, American Home Shield can help. They can help thick parts of major home systems like HVAC, plumbing, and electrical, plus kitchen and laundry appliances, and if a covered item can't be repaired, they'll replace it. Owning a home is stressful enough. American Home Shield helps make it a little easier. Listeners can get 20% off select plans today. Just visit AHS.com slash Viofiles to sign up. CAHS.com slash contracts for coverage details, including service fees, limitations, and exclusions.

Well, if you're like me, mornings do not have to take forever. That's why the minimalist from Merit lets you get a polished natural look in just five minutes. It's not a foundation or a concealer, but it'll replace both in your makeup bag. It makes getting a polished natural look effortless so you can spend your time on something else. In the mornings, I definitely do not have time to sit and do like a full glam, be. I just, you know, I'm trying, like, rivers digging in my makeup drawer. I got, like, coffee's being spilled. Nick's blabbing. He, where's the keys? Where's my wallet? And I, it's just too much is going on. The dog threw up, you know, it's just too much. So thankfully for Merritt,

I can get ready in less than five minutes. I can do it in the car. I can do it so fast, and it gives me the full glam look without spending all the glam time. Merritt's bestsellers are proof that less really is more. The flush bomb gives you that natural, healthy glow. without overdoing it. One was sold every 30 seconds in 2024. That's just how good it is. Then there's the minimalist, which works double duty as both a foundation and concealers so you can get quick coverage without layering on a bunch of products. The best part is all of Merritt's products are clean, vegan, cruelty-free, and made with nourishing skin care ingredients that leave your skin looking better long after taking your makeup off. Right now, Merritt Beauty's

offering our listeners, their signature makeup bag with your first order at Merrittbeaut.com. It's a really cute brown suede. It ties at the top. Very chic, very chic, very good. cute. That's M-E-R-I-T-Beautcom to get your free signature makeup bag with your first order, meritbeautom. Ben, welcome to the show. Thank you so much for having me here. Well, thank you so much for coming. Obviously, you guys are a big hit with the Bravo community, and we appreciate you coming.

We'll have to have your other half here. Yes, thank you. Yeah, he's in Austin right now, so I'm representing both of us, hopefully well. I'm sure you will do just fine. And we're really, obviously, there's no bad time to have you guys, but this is really a big Bravo day. Oh my God. Following the Summer House episode. And there's just, you know, right now, there's just a lot of

great Bravo content going on these days. We got Rhode Island popping off, Atlanta, which we haven't really, really dove into this season, but we're hearing nothing but amazing things. Justin and Maria locked in. Oh, my God. Pinky's bankrupt. Oh, my God. Yeah, that's... This past episode, it's funny, the first, like...

I haven't watched the newest episode. Oh, okay, well, the first three quarters were like a snoo spats, and then all of a sudden the last quarter, I was like, oh my God, this is the best show ever. It was so, it was amazing. I loved it from the start and Angela is so good. I love Angela triggered. It's like, you just have to, you can't argue with her.

Yeah. Like she's just so good. Honestly, all of them. Like, Camichelle's story, like everybody and like what they're sharing. Yeah, the Mr. Clean Papa Smurf was legendary. You know what I just thought of kind of a show I do? What? Maybe this is stupid.

I did special forces a couple years ago that show. Oh, yeah. And I did not join the military. I applaud you because every time I see just a commercial for that show, I'm like exhausted. It's crazy. But part of, you know, part of that experience was like, I never did. And I always wondered like, man, that would like, I wonder if I had what it took to like join the military and obviously give so much of yourself. And there is a part of me that like, well, I've done reality TV and I've done The Bachelor.

When I watch Bravo, I'm like, I wonder how I would move in this environment. And I kind of almost like, how could we come up? with a show that would be like like making. It's like you're, it's like a meta experience of making a reality TV show but you're not really like I just want to do one episode

where I'm like integrated into like that I would say special forces but bravo. Yeah, special housewives and you're like for like one day it's like can you do housewise boot camp and you're like I've got to be in glam for six hours today. That's like mission number one. I got to do that once. It's so funny I was talking with Zach

out there. I got to do that once with twice with Big Brother because Big Brother used to have these media days where they would bring in, you know, various, like, bloggers and whatnot. This is, like, 2010. So it was blogging. And you'd spend a day in the Big Brother house and you'd do, like, all the competitions and everything. And, like, you do a week's worth of Big Brother in one day. So you got to feel like you were in Big Brother for a day.

And then, like, you were popped out and back into real life. It was the best thing ever. That's fun. They should do that for the Housewives. They should do that for the Housewives. I'm signing up and I'm crying immediately. But I'm signing up. You get to go to one homeless.

It's not toothless dinner. Oh, yeah, perfect. Doing into a charity, go to Beverly Beach. Well, before we just dive into the meat of the episode, give me your, like, where are you sitting with Summer House? Like, are you, like, part of the fan base is just, like, fuck these people, or are we having fun with it? Where, you know, are we worried about Carl?

Well, we're always worried about Carl. We're always, we're always, Carl has, like, his persona has now become, like, delicate house. Who always has to be, like, managed at all times. But, yeah, I'm having. fun with it. Summer should be fun, as one person famously said. I have loved Summer House since day one. I've been like, in the early days when people are like, who are all these Vapid people on Bravo? It's like, it's Bravo. That's like where Vapid people are. And I am, I love this scandal.

I'm having so much fun with it. I, of course, team Sierra, you know, of course. Could you imagine if I was like, guys, team Amanda. Amanda didn't really do anything wrong. You're like they just like each other Well I mean the funny thing is that she was having such a good edit until this all happened Right because like her relationship with Kyle falling apart for like eight years now since it began And like you know he had that one episode where Andy Cohen was like guys this is the worst episode ever for Kyle And I was like boo Kyle boo Kyle and now like literally Kyle once again last night told Amanda May I curse here?

Yes you may fuck he said fuck you to Amanda again. Again. And like, you know, six weeks ago, we're all like, Kyle. At this time, everyone's like, yeah. I think she kind of deserved it. Maybe he made up,

you shouldn't have said like, that we might have made a boy. Well, a couple things I was thinking about watching last night's episode. Think about just this season alone. This season started with us, or one of the internet, really. Like that bed scene with Jesse and Sierra

and everyone was like, how dare Jesse pretend to ask to make out with her and then we had Kyle like saying fuck you and we have like forgotten. I know. Like that was like five seasons ago. All the like delicate seeds that were planted for our villainy this just all went out the

window. It was like wait we're supposed to be so much angry at different people at this point but that's actually the fun of it. Like what makes this scandal special as well as Scand of all is like it's one of those rare scandals that's unfolding while this season is unfolding and so what we're seeing on screen is kind of telling a different narrative than what we're

what we have in real time. And that's like the most fun ever. Because the truth is, what's tricky as like a podcast or is like what we do as we recap these shows is like, we sometimes have to say, okay, everyone, well, we are now going to criticize what we're seeing on TV,

pretending we don't know about the scandal because it is messed up that Kyle said, fuck you to Amanda, regardless of everything happening, you know, so you always have to be like, okay, everyone, well, let's pretend like we don't know what's going on.

But it is really like, it's so fun looking for all the breadcrums and like the Easter eggs of like, like this potential I mean before we had him saying fuck you at the table we had Amanda at Beach Day oh my God talking to Mia about

Sierra and West she would be the happiest person on the planet I wrote some of those lines down even if they got back together happy literally would make me the happiest person in the whole entire world the happiest but he needs to be fucking ready it's him I'm skeptical I'm

very weary of him. She's like, you know what, let me... In a little bucket hat and sunglasses. Let me test drive him for you. Just to make sure it's safe to you to get in. Let's make sure, okay, I wouldn't want you to wind up with the wrong person. That was the craziest scene, actually.

She said I would die for that girl. The way I would cut West off in one fucking second if she looked at me. If she gave me one look, I'd be like attack. You can't help you like. Oh, that was... No, you wouldn't. Like, that's either just like the worst foreshadow. of all time in her life

or she's being totally psychotic in that moment. I gotta believe. Well, the only thing that's what, because that last dinner scene was crazy. I'm sorry, like I'm, overall, I'm not one of those like big, like, I don't think this was happening last summer. I'm gonna take Amanda and West at face value.

I know that's maybe dangerous to do. But like, it's not that crazy to think that there was clearly obviously a close friendship and obviously emotion. there are probably moments they share where it got a little like funny and fuzzy but I'm gonna believe them that no physical boundaries were crossed until when they claim

whatever but that dinner scene where Kyle says fuck you to Amanda and Wes gets up Moose his chair sits behind Amanda I don't like confrontation I don't like confrontation and says talk to Talk to me, don't talk to her No, well Lindsay talk to Lindsay talk to

Talk to Lindsay don't talk to her He's still his wife it's just like I'm all for like I'm all for standing up to men who are speaking poorly for women. And even if it's your, you know, even if it's someone else's wife, but the way he said it was like, you shouldn't talk to your, it should sound like, it should, dude, why are you talking to your wife like that? It should be like what everyone, all the other guys, the table order was just like, bro, like, calm down. Yeah. Right. But like the fact that he like pulled up that chair.

Yeah. That was, I am like you. That was wild. He was like, I just don't believe that they are secretly sleeping together during the summer. Like as much as what they're doing, I think, has been like really shitty. I just can't believe that Amanda would go on camera and say these things if she's actively like having an affair with this guy. But there was something like last week, I don't, I forget what it was.

But I was like, hmm, but that chair thing was wild. I was like, this might move the needle for me. I think it honestly just goes to show why it was so easy for Amanda to fall into Westbed or to make the decision that she made. It's showing us just how much he was really her, like, rock and her safe place and he had her back when no one else really did. I mean, the other guys, like, it kind of took a minute. Finally, when he starts, like, freaking out, Carl stands up and he tells him to get out. But, like, KJ didn't say anything. Ben didn't really say anything.

Nothing. Jesse was, I mean, I think, the most silent. But, like. Jesse started it, too, by the way. He honestly did. He was always like, hey, Kyle. about your DJ gig. The thing is that it was so out of character for West's.

Totally. And like they tried to set it up earlier in the summer when Kyle and Amanda had their first, like that other fight where he said, fuck you. And West said this thing about like, I don't like to be confrontational. But like when it's something like this, like I do like draw like a line in the sand. And I was like, even at that time, I was like, what? Where did this come from from West? Yeah.

But he's even delivering it in like this me kind of like, I don't know, it's just like feelings are hard. And it's like really hard. And so then it was like that the sitting behind her was like really weird. But I do think at the very least this is like it's it's their their relationship has to be also. If they weren't they weren't banging at this point like it had to been tied to the way he was defending her in this moment. It definitely seemed it seemed like it was already at least a little bit emotional to me. this point because there's that scene where it was before dinner and when they're getting ready and stuff and Amanda like pokes her head to West and Jesse's room and then they're like they have

they have a thing they have a thing like I'm like that's chemistry that's flirty what that doesn't mean they acted on it at all but it was definitely there and it was they were leaning into it but and then she walks by Kyle later nothing but emotional affairs are to some people more damaging physical. And when you assume that there is at least something emotionally going on, one, Amanda's married, so it just kind of fucked up, right? And you're in a house. And then you, then in the beginning of the dinner scene, this, you know, what are you grateful for what you lost? Sarah is in love with this man. It is so obvious. She's just like the way she is just melting now that she can say we're friends again, that she can let her guard down. She's like the person I genuinely

love the most. This is not like us being like some sort of like relationship spiritual like mediums that we can read a room where not like it is. It's so obvious. You can tell when someone's in love with someone and when someone wants to fuck someone. And she's talking about what friendship like again this is I've never, she's been so articulate about and so clear about like I want to fall, I want to have a friend. I want to fall in love with them and I want to do it that way.

That's the path I want to go. and this is like the path that her and West are on. And he just pretends that's not what is happening. Yeah, well, and you already see him in the episode, already pulling back a little bit. He's like, well, I mean, we're just like friends or whatever. And I just... Oh, when he goes, KJ. Oh, when he goes, oh, Jesse goes, well, Wes has a new best friend or back to being friends.

And then Wes is like, you mean KJ? Knowing that he was referencing Sierra and it's like, you're already pulling back, bro. Yeah, already. I just, it's, I think what's so... interesting about this scandal it's like and what makes it different from scandival because that like with scandavall it was just like so big and so shocking and like we've these are people we've been with for like years and we thought we had figured out everything that was left to be figured out on that show and then like boom it wasn't and they were just like watching it all unfold and but i also feel like when you saw

scandal about like we knew really everything it was like it was all out in the open when they got together and and there were some debate like oh they were dipping out were they dipping out were they not dipping out. But here it's kind of like, we know information, but we know all the information, so we feel like there's still stuff to, like, dig into.

And this stuff here, it's like, when did it start? When did the emotional affair start? Like, how could they do this? And like, there's still so many questions and we're like looking under every single rock. It's so fun.

Yeah. Well, we had Tom Sports on yesterday, and he had just hung out with Carl and Kyle. Oh, yeah. And we asked him if, you're not defending the way Kyle has spoken to him, man.

You want to make that clear. but and then this was before we watched the dinner scene is there a world Tom where Kyle has been defending Amanda in ways that we haven't really even tried to look or appreciate and Tom is clear to say yeah I think so and that Kyle has been defending but protecting taking the heat you know again this is not in any way just to find the fuck you but like watching last night's

dinner scene you saw a man who like I don't first of all didn't seem that drunk yeah you know Because other times Kyle's fucked up and it's like, again, not excusing it, but like, okay, he's fucked up. This seemed like a man who was just pushed to his limits and just got finally fucking fed up with the way he has been hired

almost like to swallow some things that he would otherwise like just take. Right. And he's tired of it. And I can't help but wonder if like just watching West behind and like the gang up where it just felt like. Yeah. But to be fair, Kyle does this every season as well.

Like every season, it's like, Guys, come on, I'm doing so much right now. And he, like, loses his mind, whether he's drunk or not. Just felt a little different, though. Well, I will say, like, yeah, I think it was really shitty that he said, fuck you to Amanda. I thought it was really, really shitty. And I think that, like, Lindsay was hammering him on things that weren't necessarily wrong. Like, he should be having these conversations with Amanda.

That being said, Amanda seemed to know about this whole Vegas thing anyway. So, like, there were conversations. But I do think that, like, it is frustrating because it is, like, your relationship is hanging on by a thread. and now you're like having to have like this whole conversation in front of everyone at this dinner. I mean, that very much gave to me two professionals giving us a last dinner scene. Yeah. Like Lindsay was clocked in. Yeah.

That was like obvious from a start when she, you know, gave Carl his shit. And they were like, oh, she's on one tonight. She was great. Like they were like she, yeah, like here she is. I mean, I think that was the two of them serving us up a scene. I think the fuck you to Amanda is so just like natural for him that it just like slips out. But I do, I mean, I think we had the scene a few episodes back where he like comes into the apartment and he's like, so I think I'm going to get this manager. That seemed like the first time she had heard about it.

And he had already clearly had like some meetings and some phone calls and he had been talking. And she was like, oh, so you're planning on doing this. Like this is going to be your career. Yeah. I think it's like very clear. This was not a good marriage. This is not a good relationship. It was never built really on.

I don't know what it was built on. It just seemed like proximity at a certain point. And they just were like, had like, according to her show. A couple episodes, nothing. It was built on nothing. Yeah. I mean, when she said that that was crazy

when she was like, where was the part about you guys falling in love? It's like there wasn't really. They just, she was, they were like hooking up. And then they just, I think they just forgot into like this rut of like we just hook up.

And then I guess we're in a relationship, you know? I empathized with Kyle when, how do you go to couples therapy and then have a man. Amanda download that to Sierra and then Sierra, I don't know if I would have, I should separate. Huh? Like if I, I would have received that poorly if I was struggling with my wife. If we just started, we just started this step.

It was so hard for us to get to this step. And our mutual friend who at the time is more friends with my wife comes and suggest, like, hey, by the way, your, your wife kind of wants to move out. Yeah. How do you feel like that? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. by the way. I mean, I think Sarah's right. They do need to separate clearly. But I can understand

how, like, if you've just finally gotten into therapy, you're like, wait, let's let this process work first before we do that. Like, I could understand how that would be upsetting to Kyle. But, like, the thing is this, this relationship has expired. It had expired a long time ago. And I think that, truthfully, Amanda never was just never able to get past, nor was she under any obligation to get the cheating that happened several seasons ago. And it's clear that she's never felt like he hasn't stopped cheating on her. You know, like, she's like, there's rumors constantly about you. And like, I don't know if they're too much.

She's checked out. She's not falling asleep at some stranger's house at 6 in the morning. Oh, that was, oh, yeah, because that happened after our show. So we had one of my, one of my prize and joy is we do a show every year. We call it the crappies. And it's like our award show. give out, you know, awards for Bravo, et cetera. And we do it.

We alternate between L.A. and New York. So last year we did it in New York and Kyle came and he was drunk. And then he was like, he came to our after party. And he just was drunk and we're like, okay, bye everyone. And he stayed there. And then next thing you know, he wound up, like, passed out on someone's sofa because of our show. But apparently it actually really was like a purely, like nothing happened.

Apparently there was like a bunch of people there. Yeah. Yeah, I don't doubt that. It just would just be tough. But it's like a bad look. You don't want to assure that. Yeah, it's like, I don't even know if Kyle absolutely was like consistently cheating on Amanda. But I think for Amanda it was more just like I don't like how like she didn't feel safe.

I don't trust your behavior when you're drinking. Yeah. There hasn't been enough like like that like that time for of like stability to be like, okay, I think everything is is good. But like yes, I have to say I am deeply honored that I feel like in some indirect way affected the summerhouse timeline. Yeah, how do you feel to be the reason for all of this happening? Thank you. I feel like I just basically like earn my own show on Bravo. 100%.

West was just on his podcast talking about the leaks from the reunion. He was just like, you know, I've heard a lot of people and it's a long way to go. And like the reunion is kind of a first step in like a healing process. And reunions aren't easy. But it also like is a, it's the usual West thing. It was just all like a bunch of like, again, like, like therapy it's like it's somewhere between like therapy speak and like memes speak and it's just easy words that sound like you're being thoughtful and introspective that really just sort of don't

mean anything at all yeah and it sounds like west's plan is really just let time pass yeah and kind of wear people down yeah and then still be his kind of charming yeah affable self or it's like that's good and that's what will happen and he'll wind up going on like the traders or something He'll go on something and he will wind up out of the doghouse, like Sandoval wound up out of the doghouse where people say, well, you know, what he did was really shitty, but like he was so funny on the traitors. And then all of a sudden it's like, well, we kind of like Sanctawall again. It's so he'll be honest, I'm kind of okay with. The idea that we watch these shows and we love the drama, I don't want to be like canceling anyone for like making. Well, cancel culture, I feel like doesn't even really exist. But making bad decisions and things like that, it's just like they're going to get the heat and they might lose some. I want to welcome people back because I decided that you're welcome back, not because you manipulated me back. You know, like, don't do your, don't do your like, you're like, well, it's going to be like a healing process.

I'm like, well, learning and growing together. Like, no, just like be quiet and we will tell you what you're back. But with like, Tom and Wes, to me, it's just more like, Wes is never, I mean, again, I don't take it that seriously. And if I've, I've known Wes in person. and I think he's a nice guy. But the way we talk about him on the show, it's just more like, now we know who West is.

And I don't think, you know, like, we know who Tom's, like, we've kind of always known Tom, but now we really know Tom. Yes. But it's kind of like, yeah, maybe you're not going to introduce him to, like, your girlfriend, not your girlfriend, but like your sister or whatever.

But like you're less mad at him, but you clearly know who he is now. Right. And I don't think, like, I don't think West is going to change. Like, I just, has he accepted who he? is though? That's the thing. Well, on his podcast, he did say he finally talked about the reunion and like referenced the leaks and stuff and he said it was a dark reunion. He said you don't often get that much feedback on how your actions impact other people. There's a shock to your system from it.

But the only thing I can do from this is learn and try to be better. And then he said, for example, if he doesn't go on the reunion and doesn't say after what, Watching back this season, I realized Sierra like what you were communicating to me. And I just completely ignored that. And I was dismissive of your feelings. And like, I need him to name it and actually hear that he understands it. But saying something like a platitude or something cliche, like, clearly I've hurt people. It's all on the heels of that conversation he just had with Sierra by the fairy dog or wherever they were.

And it's like, yeah, they have like this nice. Yeah. They have this like what seems like a really nice conversation and had this scandal never surfaced. We would have been like, wow, breakthrough. I would have been like number one Weston Sierra. Yeah, we all would have been like, this is great. They're finally communicating.

You know, she can finally let her guard down. He can finally like acknowledge like how he heard her. We can all move on. But so like how do you have that conversation that seems to be like the result of a lot of personal work and thought and then then you do this you know it's just it's that's what's like like not making any sense west isn't an evil person but it's just like you obviously know better i think that's the thing it's like you do seem emotionally intelligent and like you do have like a good heart and it's just like why are he's moving like an 18 year old man with the emotional intelligence of a 30 year old man

but like conveniently like leading into the 18 year old I'm not sure he's emotionally intelligent, honestly. You don't think so? Do you think he knows how to fake it? I think he has picked up like the signals of being that and like he knows how to regurgitate it but he hasn't quite caught up with what they mean

because honestly I was watching the clip of KJ on Watch Whatter Happens Live last night. Did you see this? Yes. And he read this text message that Wes had sent him right after the reunion and he hadn't read it yet and he read it on the air and like it was a nice text actually. You know, it was thoughtful.

But KJ was, like, really affected by it. And I kind of feel like West is trying to be the person that KJ is. Like, KJ feels things, and he's, like, moved by people, et cetera. I think West is trying to present like that, but he actually isn't that. Yeah. Astute read. Thank you. I love this podcast.

In the text, he sent to KJ, he said, I wanted to thank you for your articulation and kindness yesterday. Despite being hurt, I have been off social. And I think I lost touch with how much hurt there was. I am incredibly sorry. I'm sending you blah, blah. But like, how do you lose touch with how much hurt there was? I don't think you've been off social. Yeah.

You've been posting your friends on social media. You've been on Instagram stories. Unless you've just been like in a bar, here's a picture of my friends post get off. But also like how do you not know how much hurt that you've caused amongst your friend group? It doesn't matter with social media. Yeah. These are your friends. Yes.

You should know them and know what would hurt them. Yeah. I just don't get how after the whole like Sierra and West scene at the dock, how in all Sierra and the whole group saw it as this is the maybe the start of them rekindling this romance. Yes. Sierra made this very clear. I mean, it's just like so obvious. And he just pretends that they're, she's like one of the bros.

Well, but what was what's so weird is that he like is saying, I think I'm in love with her or something like that. telling Ben, I have a crush on her last week. He definitely, like, indicates that he has romantic feelings, too. So it's not like a one-sided thing. But it's almost like the moment that they rekindle, he starts to walk that back a little bit. And that's just why it's, like, so shitty that, you know, of all the people he would get with Amanda,

of all the people she would get with West. It's just, like, you, like, Sierra has been so, like, outspoken about how these things affect her. And you would just think for the sake of your friend that you're now on camera sitting in the floppy beach hat talking about how you would never want to hurt her heart, got to protect her heart, and you don't want West to be in it,

and then slink away, and you say all these things, but then you're going to be doing something that you know it's going to be so hurtful to her. That's what's crazy, because now after watching it back in hindsight, knowing what happened, because at first you're watching it,

it's just like, you know, I got to protect her. It's almost like you're saying she can't protect herself and now it really just feels like a rip on Sierra. Like she's not capable handling a man like West.

So I'll go ahead and do it for it. It's like so weird. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's like performative. Like I am going to have her back.

You know, my friend Ray, Sonny, who is great. She's hilarious. She was on a show recently. I think she was on bitch ses. And she made a really great point, which was, were Amanda and Sierra best friends? Or were they just

two people who were friends with Page. I'm like that is like that, I think that's the crux of it. I think they really had a friendship like that. There's that and I also like, I kind of referenced this too. I just, this is a job and a TV show for all these people. And I think they all become friends. And I think there is a bond that, you know, when you do something as crazy as these shows,

when you do something extraordinary with a few group of people, there's only a few group of people you can bond with. And there's this, an organic chemistry you feel with all those people. But to that point, there are also a lot of people you wouldn't be friends with or fuck with outside of that extraordinary environment that you've all agreed to put yourself in. And I think in those lanes, things can get really gray and muddy. I also think like, why didn't Amanda just like give a good go at trying to be single for a little bit, you know? Literally. Like why are you jumping to another guy?

I honestly think that they, and I've said this before, I don't think they ever planned. on this being a thing. Like I think they were going to just hook up, hang out. He clearly had his own roster. Maybe she was starting to build hers. But then they were forced quotes. I think it's a real statement. I will say I've referenced this.

And I don't know if people agree or buy it. But I, you know, talking to other women friends I know in reality TV, I think if you're like a single guy in reality TV, your DMs are open, you're pretty comfortable sliding. You're out in the bar. It's like if you're a woman on reality TV, generally, like, that's a pretty great lane in terms of influencing you have these opportunities, your audience is women. Everyone's audience is women, right? And so, like, you're connecting with your audience different ways.

A lot of the opportunities for men are the bar appearances, the going out because the women fans want to meet the men, right? And so, like, I think in that kind of space, there's a lot of opportunities for the reality TV men to go out and engage with women and meet them and hook up. And I think it's different for women because, one, the fans are women. And I think for the men, like, to go on like a dating app for the first. I think it's scary for anyone. It's also scary for like a public figure knowing that people are going to screenshot and judge and critique and you feel less safe. And I just, you know, I think in that sense, that's why it kind of makes sense where it was maybe a very intimidating for Amanda to kind of go out there and date as a public figure recently divorced. I mean, maybe I just kind of also feel like, I mean, just in general, I can't stand.

when someone's like, I've never been single and I'm finally gonna be single and you're like, yes, we're gonna go out, we're gonna go out. And then two days later, it's like, I actually met this guy. And it's like, okay, okay, I'll see you in 10 more years. Like, I can't stand that. But it happens all the time. It happens all the time.

So I'm like projecting that onto Amanda. I was like, you were supposed to be single. But even with that, I don't know, like cross-pollinate with a different show or something. Like, go for a Tom Schwartz or go for, I don't know, whoever's around. Like whoever's, there's people around. At least give it like a week.

Yeah. At least give it a week. Give it like sometime. There's somewhat like, it would have been fun if she won't. One of the kids from like southern hospitality, right? Like that'd be kind of fun. Moving on from Wes and Amanda still staying on Summer House,

I just thought it was nuts when Ben was talking about his relationship. Sabrina Bell. Sabrina Bell. And it just is like, so are you guys boyfriend and girlfriend yet? I'm like, what? You last couple, you were taking her off. I thought you guys were married. And I'm like, what is going on with dating people these days?

And then he said, he's like, he's waiting to tell her that he loves her. Before their boyfriend and girlfriend? Is that the new? I thought you, I thought you liked someone and you're like, hey, do you want to date? And then you're like, your boyfriend and girlfriend now means like, I don't know how it happened. It's like a marriage contrast. But boyfriend and girlfriend is like basically saying that you intend to marry. That's crazy.

Maybe it's different in Australia. I don't know. Maybe it is different. Maybe there's still normal there. I don't know. I have to say, I don't much care for this Ben character. I don't know. I have not...

He's falling flat from. Not only is he falling flat, I just feel like there's... There's something there that I'm just not like... You don't trust him? I didn't like the way he talked to Bailey when he confronted her about that joke. Like, was her joke, like, maybe in Portease, perhaps. But, like, I didn't like that joke. I mean, I'm sorry, I didn't like the way he talked to her.

I didn't like the way he talked to Amanda. When Amanda said something to Sabrina, I have actually not... really love the way he's talked to Sabrina telling her to like get dressed or whatever and like I just feel like there's something there that like it's rubbing me the wrong way I can't put my finger on it but I don't like it and I think that like the fact that he and Sabrina keep on taking all these like videos of themselves kissing no that is like why why do we why do they have like this collection of videos I kind of remind me of like 2012 when Facebook was a thing and then you would that one couple would get together and just obnoxiously just post about how in love they are and they're more in love than you. But it is like that. That's how you know like that couple online.

Let's kiss. Wait, before we kiss? Hold on. Let's get the camera up. And then they have to tell Bravo, like if y'all want these, we have a lot of videos of us making out. Like if you want to use them in the show.

They showed like a montage last night. A montage of them kissing with their selfies. That's what I don't believe. I do not believe that relationship is absurded after Ben was on this show. Yeah. I think this was definitely something that was. Yeah, I think he probably lied.

But didn't they pretend he was single when the season, when the season was episode one was, wasn't he single? His whole thing was that like, she loved me, but then I got scared so I broke it off, but then I have regrets. I'm like, I don't know. And then, you know what I couldn't stand? I couldn't stand how like, if we're just going to take it on face value of what their relationship was, he's been broken up with her for like three months. And then he rekindles things. And after like two or three days, he's like, hey, that's my misses. And all of a sudden

We have to like now Like oh they're like a special couple When you've been broken up for all this time And like And you just made out with Bailey and this been the bottle And you're being weird with Amanda We had a set ben up A upset Ben Up event and like

He's like I don't know how to flirt I just don't know what to do And then all of a sudden Australian Bachelor It was a good accent Thank you thank you It transported us all to Sydney It did

But I don't know There's just something that feels like I don't trust it I don't trust it. Do you know what's going on with everyone kind of slightly coming for Dara? They're all kind of like, oh, she's in it for fame. KJ really likes her. Like they're all kind of doing these press things and like coming for her. Yeah, I don't know what that's about. Is it maybe because she came in via West? Is there like some West taint on her? But she's with Cage. That's true too. That's true. Yeah. And also isn't Dar, aren't Dara and KJ still together?

Yeah, there's still they are. I feel like they seem legit. And everyone loves KJ. What's the issue? I don't get it. She seems fine. She seems fine. I really don't know enough about her.

I want to kind of give Jesse props. I'm kind of buying this kind of, hey man, I'm approaching 30. I beat cancer. I was a little messy last season. I watched it back. I got a little embarrassed of myself. I don't know if I want to be this guy, a la West Wilson. And I want to maybe be more intentional with my dating life.

And, you know, he's giving back. And I'm kind of, I'm kind of buying it. I thought it was a nice moment that he had. I don't know. The thing is this is we've been burned by these shows so many times. Yeah. How many times, I mean, how many times does Carl come on here and be like, God, it's Carl 6.0?

And it's like, it's like all the guys on Bravo were always like, I'm growing up. This time. I'm growing up, everyone. And then, like, I usually fall for it. So Ronnie, my podcast partner is much more cynical than I'm. He's like, oh, fuck them. Oh, they're all fake. But like I actually usually am like, yeah, I think they are growing up.

But for some reason, I'm like, I need more evidence. You know why? Because Wes really ruined it for him because I was believing that West was growing up. And no, I don't know what to believe anymore. Jesse are that closer friends outside of Summerhouse. They have like a weird rivalry. They like undermine each other in a way that's like sort of fascinating. It's a little bit of that going on.

Like all the stuff in the beginning of the season, like you said, we sort of forgot about it. But Jesse going after Sierra was kind of like a little weird. And then West sort of like launching a shadow campaign against Jesse and the house. And then him going to Jesse being like, yeah, everyone thought that was super weird for you to say that. Yeah, there's like some weird undermining. That's such mean girl behavior. Everyone thought that.

It's also completely, it just goes to show that like West, regardless of what conversation he was having with Sierra. And it goes to your point of him not actually. being emotionally mature, which is just, if that had happened with Sierra, Wes would not have moved with Sierra this season the way he would have if he actually had feelings for her. Because it's like, Jesse just kind of like basically is treating her like an option, not as a person. And you have the opportunity to be like, no, Sierra is a person and we should not be speaking

about her like this when she's not around. He didn't do that. He instead did his whole little shadow cam. campaign thing, which in retrospect is just like sickening. Well, it also goes to show like where is he, like, this is why it's also just stranger that he is willing to buck up with for Amanda's honor. Whereas with for Sierra's honor, he does not. He just sort of sits there quietly and he's like, um, but I like her, you know.

So I don't know. Like, so the whole thing with Jesse is that his actions are backing up what he's saying. There was no real indication that he was doing anything buck boyery over the summer. so that goes in his favor but I just feel like after the West thing I'm kind of like let me see like another season or two and then I'll let you off

he's a finished product but I feel like his intentions are pure we didn't see him bring anybody home from the bars you know we didn't have a yeah I will say that one girl Bravo really you know I know they really will like have their you know they put their cast through it

they certainly will show their messy aspects of their life but in ways like when you watch the show and you see Jesse and it says musician. Yeah. You can kind of be anything you want on these shows. You really? You can just be like, you know what, guys this season?

You know what? I want you guys to call me? Astronaut. Yeah. Because I, you know, because I'm going to be an astronaut. And all you have to do is take a course maybe. You don't even have to have, you just have to name it. And they will put it right under your name.

You know, if he wants to release some mid-tempo songs, that would be perfect for a waiting room. Then far be it for me to say, don't do it. You know, everyone's got a. follow their dream. It is perfect for a waiting room. Follow your dreams. Jesse Solomon. Switching gears a little bit. Are you watching Rhode Island? Of course. What are your thoughts? I really like it a lot. I feel like every episode it's getting better and better because I feel like you can really see the cast coming together and jelling and get like their chemistry is really improving. Agreed. And I love listening to their voices. I love the way that like Alicia's voice just sort of

trails off. She's like, you want a cracker? But like her in these crackers It's kind of crazy I know I love her pushing a cracker agenda I feel like crackers are just a thing you put out A fig Newton A fig newton You gotta have a fig newton

That took me back to childhood Because like during During school like snack snack time The figons came out Oh I had four of the zip lock back I remember like breaking them in half And then you could put them back together

Oh god It's a miracle And it's like that's what Rhode Island can do for us Rhode Island can like transport us back into those times I also feel like for the, like, like, Ashley, I feel like she's getting into a lot of these women, but you, they name it and you watch it, where like the new Roney,

it was almost like they immediately started pretending. They all knew each other. And so it was like, but clear that they didn't. Right. And now with Rhode Island, I feel like you're just, if there isn't like a prior existing relationship,

you see these women know that they have to be together and then figure each other out as they go, and it's fun to watch that. Well, also, like, what Rhode Island has that a new Roney doesn't have is that, like, I think we're curious to find out about this world. You know, we're learning about things like pizza chips and, you know, how, like, my mother's father worked at Superior Bakery. And, you know, like, you're learning all these interesting things and backstories and you're hearing these voices. And you're like, oh, my God, like, I need to know more about this. Are they mob connected?

What's happening? Whereas, like, New New York is like, hey, let's look at some people who work. and PR and influencing. It's like, okay. It's not like my curiosity isn't really peaked. Like if I go to New York on a real housewife show, I want to be taken into the world of the

Upper East Side. I want to see like deluded, wealthy women who have no idea what's going on in the world. With those really big, ugly dogs, you know what I'm talking about? Yeah, like the Boer's eyes. And be like, like, how are you existing? Because I feel like half these shows are like that.

Like, how do you live in the same world that I do. And so to watch, you know, like, Aaron and like go to the shop and get a coffee. I don't know. It's like I'm not like inherently. Yeah, that's a good point. You're not, you're not getting the culture from the city in which like you, you know, which is part of the. Yeah, Bravo, I think was trying to give us something fabulous. Like look at these like chic, fashionable women, which they are. But I don't think that there was anything like, uh, like inherently interesting about. this group of women. Yeah, like, I don't want them to be known.

I really don't even want them to have an Instagram. Like, I want them to be older women on the Upper East Side. Totally. Or if they're going to be the fashionable set, I want them to be, like, fashionable and just, like, fabulous. Like, ladies of London. Ladies of London is the perfect example about that. Like, they come on, and they're just, they are fashionable, and they're getting drunk, and they're calling each other psychotic cows.

It's hilarious. They're not doing that much, but we just enjoy being in their presence. Whereas on like new Roney, it was just like, I don't know. But with Rhode Island though, like it's fun to go into their world. And you have a season one husband actively leaving set to go to his mistress's house. Exactly. Like that was wild. Yeah.

To continue filming. It does. It feels like old Roney, old Jersey. Yeah. Like even even just with like the way Atlanta was just like so. funny off the bat it's like yeah they your casting really popped off like give me Alicia and her dolls yes I want more of that and it feels it doesn't feel like it's put on for camera like these are women who have like like decades old friendships and that always comes through isn't it like

amazing with these shows what the audience can always pick up on like when when something is like forced we always feel it like if it's not authentic and you see that on summer house you see when the house has a good chemistry versus when it doesn't have a good chemistry like this isn't really working. And it's like that intangible thing, but we always feel it. We always pick up on it, you know? Well, I mean, they're not actors, you know?

And I think that's what it is. And I think... It's kind of like when this most recent episode of Rhode Island, when Liz, you know, they're kind of flirting with like the butlers or whatever. And Liz is like, I'm going inside. Like, I'm not flirting with these 20-year-old. And Ashley's like, I'm going to go check on Liz. And then she's like, I know you probably don't really like me.

And she's like, no, no, no, I think you're so sweet. And that is clear that they don't know each other, but they're getting to know each other. And like I like to see that unfold. Yeah, I was going to say, by the way, I really like that, Falcato, you did for Liz, because we know it really sounded like, no, no, no, no, it's okay.

I'm like, yeah, yeah. They do do scenes. You know, like some of the stuff isn't, like, truly organic, but it always has to be rooted in truth. You know, it can't just be something completely made up. They have to be, you know, and that's the best reality TV. it's just like, in a real world, if there's no cameras,

we might let it go. We might remain calm. We might take us offline. But there's still a disconnect and there's still something we're both pissed about. But since we're on TV, we'll lean the fuck in. And as long, you know, so it's got to be rooted in truth

as opposed to like just pretending you care about something you honestly don't. Yeah. And I think that's like with new Roney. Like there's something that's missing. Like there was some cast chemistry that was a little bit better in the second season. But like there just was,

like something was not working there and I don't know what it was because it seemed like now they've been working together for years they should know each other a little bit more but it did not come together and like I really hope they get it right this time

I really do Jenna Lyons was absolutely fabulous and awesome to see on Bravo but it was like okay I want Jenna Lyons to host project runway not necessarily be she had her own show on HBO that was great yeah that was great and that was just all focused on

weirdness. Yeah, and I was like, you don't, you're not the kind of person that's going to like really care if someone didn't have past apps at a party. Right. You're going to pretend, but then you also don't like. But also sometimes like I, maybe you have a good perspective on this having been in reality TV that I always believe that when people start self-producing, it like is a stink that infects the whole show. Because it's like when one person does it, then I think it would make someone say, well, why should I put everything out there if they're holding stuff back? So I'm going to do it a little bit. And I feel like you just can, you can sense it and you can feel it. And I look at real housewives of Dubai. And I look at season one, which I thought was so boring.

And then season two, which I actually thought was really good. And I felt like in season two, they got the memo like, oh, we have to actually like throw ourselves into this show more. Yeah, no, that does happen, you know, and you feel it on the other end. Like, sometimes like, it's like you were reading Reddit, you know, like you were. Yeah, you can just tell. Yeah, and so it's like, it feels really weird and icky when you're a part of that. And you almost like, you'll disconnect if you think someone's performing. Right.

And that does, that definitely happens. And it ruins the vibe. Yeah, and then all of a sudden you're sitting through endless scenes of like, hey guys, let's play a game at dinner. And like, oh my God, true truth's and a lie again, you know, and it's like. Well, because then, you know, you just also, I think it is a reality TV star, it kind of makes you feel a little unsafe because, again, if it fits. If it's rooted in truth, Uleys can come in with a perspective of the situation.

If it's rooted in I'm doing what I think my fans want me to do. Or I'm responding to my critics and I'm going to move differently. Or I'm going to call you up because I think the fans don't like, you know, whatever it is, you're like, I don't, this is a rogue person. Yeah. And I don't, you know what? I don't want to fuck with them because it's, they're, they're, I'm not talking to them. We've let the internet inside this, right, this house. This scene, this show.

That's a gross feeling. Yeah, it's all about, like, authenticity. And I think viewers always pick up on authenticity. Yeah. You know, that's why we're so mad at the scandal, too. Like, because West is hitting all these notes of being an authentic person. And then we're like, oh, you are not authentic at all. You've actually been lying to us.

You're performing authenticity. Yeah, totally. Yeah. Ben, so much fun, man. Thank you so much for having me on here. This is great. Yeah. So much fun.

Please come back with Ronnie. Absolutely. Anytime. Yeah. I love talking. the stuff with you. Likewise. Thanks for having me on. Tell them about your show.

Yeah, go check us out. Our show is called Watcher Crapins. We're on every single day. We cover every single Bravo show and even other non-Bravo shows. Like we will randomly do like House of the Dragon. And so, you know, we go all over the place. And we're doing a cabaret in New York City in June

because that's what you do in the world of Bravo. So come join us there at our tickets are at watchwreckrappins.com. All right. Well, check it out. Thank you for coming up next. We have Liz McGraw from Real Housewives of Rhode Island. and talking about all things, Housewives of Rhode Island,

including everything going on with Rula, Joe Ellen, the entire cast. It's a great conversation with Liz, and it is up next. Chime is changing the way people bank. They offer the most rewarding fee-free banking. This is fee-free banking built for you. They're not like traditional old banks

that charge you overdraft and monthly fees. They have thousands of fee-free ATMs, because why pay to get your own money? I've never understood it. Built for you, not the 1%. Chime members can benefit from up to $1,150 in annual rewards, fee. Free direct deposits unlock the most rewarding way to bank at Chime. Chime is rated five stars by USA Today for customer service,

Real Humans 24-7. You're not just switching banks. You're upgrading to America's number one choice for banking with a chime checking account. Get 5% cash back on Chime card in category of choice like gas or groceries. You get savings that grow faster with 3.75. APY, that's nine times higher than the national average. Plus, you get premium travel perks like airport lounge access 24-7 travel concierge included with your chime.

You can even get up to $500 of your pay when you save with my pay. They also have SpotMe, which lets you overdraft up to $200 fee free. Chime is not just smarter banking. It's the most rewarding way to bank. Join the millions who are already banking fee-free today. Head to chime.com slash V-A-L-L. That is chime.com slash V-A-A-L-L. It only takes a few minutes to sign up.

So what are you waiting for? Chime is a fintech, not a bank. Banking services for MyPay and Chime card provided by Chimes Bank partners. Optional products and services may have fees or charges. Stated annual percentages yield and cash back for Chime Prime only. No minimum balance required checking account ranking based on JD Power Survey published. October 20th, 2025. For more information on APY rates, my pay, spot me and travel perks.

Go to chime.com slash disclosures. Chime is a financial technology company, not a bank. Banking services and the secured Chime Visa credit card are provided by the Bank or Stryde Bank N.A. Option. Option. Option. Option. See chime.com slash fees info. Terms apply. Limited time only. Must open the new account and complete qualifying activities to earn rewards. Advertised annual percentage yield with Chime Plus status only. Otherwise 1% APY applies. No minimum balance required.

Chime card on time payment history may have a positive impact on your credit score. Results may vary. See chime.com for details on applicable terms. I posted a selfie the other day and I got so many responses about how glowing I look. They're like, is that the pregnancy glow or have you done something different with your skin care or like what is going on? And my secret is clear stem. I was introduced to clear stem when I was pregnant with River because I was so scared about using products and like what to use what I couldn't use. And I was recommended clear stem by a dear friend of mine. And I have not looked back since.

I've used it obviously not while pregnant. But it is my go to while being pregnant. It's so safe. Clearstim is the first clinically tested skincare line made with zero poor clogging ingredients. They're clear poor promise. No more choosing between acne care that dries you out or anti-aging products that clog your pores. you can have the benefits of both without dealing with dry, irritated, or clogged skin. I always know when I see a clear stem product, I can try it and not be worried about like,

oh my gosh, is this going to break me out? Is this going to, is my skin going to react bad to this? Like, I just trust every product that Clearstem makes because all of them are made with the zero poor clogging ingredients. Clearstem is the first acne brand that connects internal and external skin care through supplements and topicles with no poor clogging ingredients ever. They target breakouts inside and out with a full routine nutrition supplements and clinically effective topicals. Clear is more than skin deep. Clearstem's TikTok viral bestseller mind-body skin targets hormonal acne at the root without the harsh side effects. They have a great

makeup remover wash. They have a great exfoliating. They have great serums. They have great moisturizers. I literally was just wearing their neck and face mask the other day. And I looked so hydrated when I took it off. So discover the clear stem difference because clear skin changes everything. You know we've been partnering with clear stem for a while now. And we're so excited to share a new special offer for our listeners. Go to clearstem.com slash V-I-A-L and use code V-I-A-L at checkout and receive a free mini-hydrogel pumping

moisturizer when you spend $75 or more. That's C-L-E-A-R-S-T-E-M dot com slash V-I-A-L and code V-I-A-L at checkout for free gift with purchase when you order $75 or more. Wayfair believes a home is personal. It is where life happens, style comes to life,

and memories are made. They are purpose-built for home offering every style, every space for every budget. Only Wayfair has all things home from functional to just for fun for every style and budget in one seamless experience. They simplify the process of expressing personal style. They truly have everything you could possibly imagine for your home, both indoor, outdoor spaces, big and small items. You can literally get trampolines and pizza ovens. You can get amazing dining tables. You can get office furniture couches. It really is the one stop shop for everything in your home. We've even upgraded our office space through the help of Wayfair

and then it's been an incredible experience. So it really doesn't matter what you are looking for. If you've been maybe you're this spring, you are looking at a room in your house and thinking, maybe this room just needs a little bit of an upgrade, a little bit of a refresh. Well, you can do that with the good people at Wayfair. They make that experience so fun and enjoyable. It's also, depending on if for some reason you don't like your product, their customer service is top-notch and and they make that experience wonderful and enjoyable and remove all the hassles, and so that you can truly enjoy the upgrading experience that you have with whatever room that you're looking to upgrade today.

So if you are looking for that amazing refresh this spring in your home, look to Wayfair. Find furniture, decor and essentials that fit your unique style and budget. Head to Wayfair.com right now and shop all things home. That's Wayfair.com to shop all things. Liz, welcome to the show. Thanks for having me. excited to have you. We are just such big fans of you and really honestly the entire cast. It's really just obviously people know Ashley's one of my best friends, her and Jared. And so I was always

going to watch, but like with any new season, you never really know how fans are going to receive it. And it's been so fun to just be like, you guys just really came out of gate strong. And it's really just exciting to see. And I just got to say like the entire cast is awesome. Like it really just, it's so, I think it's really hard on these shows to get, invested in all these characters as quickly as we have with all of you ladies, you know, and there's, you know, many of fans of this show are fans of other franchise and it just takes a while. So first of all, we just love you. But why do you feel like this cast of women has been so kind of like well received and why do you feel like it's working so well this early?

You know, I think partly because it's just, it's such a unique place. It's not a place that's ever been really kind of discovered on that type of forum before. And I think that being first season cast, I think, you know, everyone was really concerned about digging in, you know, and we gave it. Yeah, yeah. And then some. Yeah. It feels like you're kind of seen as more like, is like almost like the matriarch of the group.

Like. The dinosaur? That's me. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, wisdom. No, but I do feel that way, you know? I mean, there's such disparity in age. And sometimes, like, you know, I'm up there on an island. So I wasn't really sure coming into it how that was going to look or be portrayed.

I still don't. I'm still a little nervous about that. I think we saw it in this most recent episode, you know, with you were like, I am not flirting with a 20. something, your old butler, I'm going to go lay down in my bed. And it was like, honestly, relatable. Yeah. Same. What am I doing here? Am I going to splash around in a thong and pretend to like, you know, want to like hang out with these guys? Like it just, yeah, it was kind of like, where do I belong? Why am I here? I felt a little bit. Well, I do think you definitely belong.

And we love that you're here. You bring such, such a different vibe. I feel like to the cast that is very much needed. Where do you, I mean, obviously in this most recent episode, we watched the latest piece of evidence rolling against Brian, which was giving very much like newspaper, today's date, the car, I mean, with the time and date on it, they were very, they were like, you were not about to call our bluff on this. why do you feel like the mistress is so, like, down with... Hell bent on it. Isn't that crazy? I don't know. And, like, I don't...

It's so uncomfortable because, you know, there's so much white knuckling. And Joellen is so intent on not, you know, on making sure she's... She's right in all of it. It's, yeah, it's... It's uncomfortable and it's like you can't, you can't deny it after seeing this stuff, you know? So it's fun. Yeah. And it's always interesting because it seems like, you know, at first it was, you know, Joe Ellen kind of seemed to be aware of this.

And then obviously it was more like this is, you know, kind of like stay out of it. It's another your business, Joe Ellen. But if you can prove it, go ahead and do it. And do you feel like, you know, it's one of those things where like, I guess now that she's gotten this evidence, it's almost kind of justified everything before. that, you know, in a way, or do you feel like there's a world in which maybe Joe Ellen got a little too nosy and stuck her nose and were something it maybe didn't belong and maybe even though she found the video? Are you guys grappling with like the kosherness of it all? Here's the thing. Rhode Island is a ridiculously small state. So this is something that we've had

heard about a really long time before even filming, you know, so it was something. then we all kind of, you know, it was going on for a while. Joellen, yeah, she was motivated to kind of get her heels in there and dig into it. You know, so that's why when you see us like, oh, Jo Ellen's messy, Joellen's messy. However, what she was saying wasn't untrue, you know. So, I mean, me being the female recipient of that information, I would be like, oh my god thank you guys help me you know what i mean let's let's let's figure this out or i would be if i was if i were too proud to put it on display on tv i would probably not ask for evidence you know

i would be like this is my business how i deal with it is how i will deal with it if i want to include you i will but in the meantime it's none of your business so it was just uncomfortable you know Rula's diffarming with the pride and Joellen digging. It was, you know, it was, it made for a great seesaw. Yeah. Do you feel like Rula was, you know, you mentioned that's a small state. You know, rumors are flying. Do you feel like there's a world in which she's heard this rumor as well and maybe

she was just in denial about it? Yeah. So like I said, it had been going on for some time. And she did. And like I called. her, you know, when, you know, Joellen was really kind of into it. And when Joellen, like, found that wild thing, she found some photos online from the mistress.

And this was, like, probably in December, so six or seven months before we film. So it had been going on for a while. She, there's no way Rula didn't know to what extent. I'm not sure. You know, I wanted her to know. I didn't want her to walk into all of this looking like the fool because that would be my biggest fear. You know, everyone knows something and I don't.

But again, I would be, I would know before any of these girls. I would know. I is just a fan. I'm always shocked whenever you see it, especially in our first season, it's more like, what made Brian not think that this would come out, being a part of this franchise, knowing that this franchise is all about rumors, receipts, and timelines and all those things. And, like, did he, was it just kind of a hubris on his part and just too much con? Or is it ignorance not really realizing what this, what this shows about?

It just kind of blows my mind that he was doing this and was like, yeah, no, I'll, I'll be a housewife husband. And doing it while filming. Right. And we discussed this. My husband and I discussed this all the time. Like, what? the, what was he thinking? What, what was he possibly thinking? I mean, does he not know what the shows are about or how they're going to spin it or is he, does he not care? You know, that,

it's honestly, guys, it's even to me and I'm in it, it's a mystery. I really don't know. I don't know. And it just got worse and worse and worse. And when you see me like kind of chasing him, like, come on, let's go for a walk. And then the clown music started playing. It took me all the way out. It just took me out. Like, it is so uncomfortable. Even for him, it's like, oh, you're such a schmuck,

but I'm still, like, uncomfortable for you, you know? Like, I don't know. It's wild. It was just. I know. I imagine, you know, we can't give too much away. I'm sure a lot will be revealed as this season goes out. guess do you think rula will when this when all the dust settles do you predict that she will be

better for it from like her perspective and do you see a light at the end of the tunnel i mean you know they say that all the hardships we go through we only grow from you know but uh i i i don't know like rula is a super hard read yeah and she's so unlike myself that it's kind of kind of a conundrum for me every time I just, I never really fully get where they're coming from. Either one of them. I don't know. I mean, you know, she's for all intents and purposes. She seems really happy. You know, what did she say? She had some quote that he like atoned for sins or something. I don't, I truly, I don't know. Like, it's wild. I don't know what's going to happen today. Wow. Do you think she was actually sick and

that's why she didn't come to the trip. I mean, she said she couldn't see. I wasn't there. I can't say for sure. I mean, if I had to guess, no, she may have been feeling emotionally sick or mentally sick. I don't know.

And I had sent her a text message. And for some reason, that entire trip, I had no service on my phone. And I only found out like after I got home, it never went through. Unfortunately, I have kind of like shifting gears a little bit from Rula. The boat culture of Rhode Island is very, very fascinating to me. I'm from Florida, so boat culture is very like, go get drunk at a sandbar.

And I'm wondering what like the Rhode Island version. Like what's the perfect boat day for you? Oh, we do that too. Perfect. So, yeah, my husband being a fisherman would, would take, you know, those long sport fishing trips. But a boat day for us would be just like, you know, filling the boat up, getting the captain and just going off.

Black Island, Newport, Nantucket, and just going off. And usually for a few days at a time, if not weeks. Oh, a few days? Wow. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, we'll get dockage and we'll just go.

And we'll meet friends. People come and stay on the boat. We'll have nice dinners. It sounds wonderful. What advice did Dolores give you before you started filming? Get this question a lot. Dolores never really dug into like the nitty gritty of how the process works for me. She didn't give me a lot of pitfalls and watch out for this and this might happen and do this.

I think that coming into it, she mostly just said, you're fine. Just be yourself. I had a lot of questions, but her mean, you know, thing to me was just be yourself, always be yourself. Well, looking back, do you feel like that was good advice? Because, you know, I honestly appreciate her almost not telling you too much because I think sometimes you almost have to kind of enter into this kind of world, kind of more open-minded and to kind of be, you know, kind of don't do this and don't do that. You almost, you don't want to self-edit. You know, you don't want to produce yourself and things like that. And I wonder if maybe Dolores was mindful of that, that she trusted you, that you got

casted for a reason and you're this kind of dynamic, fascinating person. And the last thing she would have wanted was for you to like come in, come in with a bunch of dues and downs and kind of scare yourself before you even got started. Right. I mean, listen, I was frightened out of my mind to begin with. You know what I mean? And I wish, I kind of wish she had told me more to, like, you know, calm down a little, being back.

Every time I see myself played back and I don't know if it's like they pick out the bits and pieces, but I'm always yelling. Everything I'm doing, I'm yelling. I'm yelling in my confessionals. I'm yelling on scenes, you know. Far and few in between them, I just come. Oh, my God. We appreciate that.

Why do you think Rosie and Kelsey are always at each other's? throats. That's a good question. I think that their personalities are just so vastly different. Okay. You know, Kelsey is super reserved, but then when pushed, she can be outgoing. And I think that Rosie's super outgoing and when pushed can be super reserved. And I think that they just kind of butt heads because they meet at different times. They meet on the opposite. at time all the time. And they're both, you know, young and starting out and, you know, there's that whole component. But. Yeah, because it almost kind of feels competitive in a way. And maybe it's because they kind of have a very similar look and there seem to be relatively in the same stage of

life. And it almost feels like they're in a weird way competing with each other in a ways that like they're not competing with, say, like Ashley. And, but it is fascinating to hear your perspective on ways they're different. Yeah. I can see. I can see. where it would appear that way. But truly, I truly believe, and I've seen it time and time again, and whether we see this or not on the show, I think it's more of a personality thing. They really truly butt heads.

Like, they really are the antithesis of each other in so many ways. And I think that they don't understand the other's language. You know, and they dig into shit that we don't necessarily dig into at this age. You know what I mean? Stuff that no one really cares about. So I think that that's why it comes across that way. But stay tuned, we'll say. Who do you connect with more, Rosie or Kelsey?

I haven't had great opportunity to really connect with Rosie when I have. She's not been super interested. and I don't know if that's because I'm close with Kelsey, but I would definitely have to say Kelsey. I mean, we're on the phone around the clock, and it's funny because she's the youngest cast member, but she does really well at relating or seemingly trying to.

Anyway, we get along well. How long, when did you become aware of her kind of untraditional relationship dynamic that she has? And was that something you were as equally fascinated by as most fans are? Or were you just kind of like, you know, whatever, do you? You know, again, being in Rhode Island in such a small state, we all, I mean, years ago. You know what I mean? We all kind of, it's very incestuous here.

We know so much about who's who and what they're doing. So, so coming into the show is kind of like old hat for me. You know, I know the boy. the ex-boyfriend so well, I know the new boyfriend so well. It wasn't, it wasn't shocking to me as I would have imagined it would be, you know, to the audience, but I see why. I can see why. Yeah, it's not something, it's not a dynamic that I would be interested in, but it's unique

and interesting and she was young and having fun or whatever. Why did you give Ashley the worst mask? Oh, you know, I'm so glad you asked me that because as soon as you said we're close with Ashley, I wanted to say, that was not on purpose. So when I received those masks, it was very last minute and it was very slim pickings. So I will tell you, there were two masks that were left out. Rula wasn't there. And that just happened to be the best option that I could try to make sense of where we were going. with her. The other one had some super long beak, like, you know, the old medicine man. It was like

out to year. And the other was like very two-faced. And I couldn't do that. So, I mean, to deduce it, it wasn't on purpose. And it felt really bad, but that didn't come across. I felt so bad because she is the sweetest girl. And she's real. And she's just, she's sweet. She feels, she's caring. She's, was a good person. I didn't want to put her in. I wanted hers to come off immediately. I wanted her to go first so she could take it off. You know, I did feel so bad. I was really moved last episode by Joe Ellen's story about her mom. And also, I kind of regretted because on the first episode, I was a little critical because, like, I'm a new, I'm a new parent relatively, you know, got a young daughter. And so, like, I'm very, like, pro parent, I guess, or, you know, like,

like have empathy for parents and the challenges of, of raising a kid and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And the season starts with Joella being like, you know, my mom is not a great mom. And I was like, yo, like, that's, that's, that's, that's harsh. But we see this episode and, oh, my God, it was honestly hard to watch. And it was really, you know, like, it was just a difficult conversation to receive.

When did you learn about her relationship with her mom and her childhood? And I guess, like, well, how do you think that affects Joe Ellen today as an adult and does that, did that kind of help you give perspective about kind of who she is and how she moves as an adult? That's like an amazing question. It's weird.

I don't know if I intuitively thought of this before I jumped on here, but, you know, throughout the past couple of years, she has mentioned her mom and, you know, how tough she is. And, you know, in bits and pieces, never these really specific stories

that we're now hearing these really traumatic deep stories. And even I, watching it now, I'm like, wow, like that was difficult. That was harsh. That explains a lot. You know what I mean? That being said, I feel like, you know, sometimes hurt people, hurt people. And the two aren't mutually exclusive. You know what I mean?

So it doesn't necessarily negate it. I think for Joellen, and I've said this to her, when she first shared all this with me, it was actually in the castle and you don't see it. I said, you know, I think it's heavy and it's heavy on the heart. And me always trying to find the silver lining, I'm like, you know, I think, you know, they say the only way out is through, right? So I think it's important for you to now move away from that, not use it as a catalyst to promote more heavy stuff in the world. It's go out, go out to some of these places and find that little girl that you were and help them.

And that's your way through it. So, you know, I say that. But, you know, it's she has a grand opportunity to stop the cycle. now as a parent. And that's powerful. If, you know, she can, she's able to do that and she decides to do that, that's very, very, very powerful. And even today, I'm still learning, you know, how difficult it was for her, which does make me understand her a lot more, feel a lot more compassionate. So insightful of what you said, too, because I think, you know, I think, I think for all of us, Like we all have very different degrees of childhood trauma and things like that.

But I think sometimes, whether people try to or not, it's like I think sometimes we can, our trauma can be our identity in a way. And especially once we open up about that trauma and we receive that support and sympathy that sometimes can be difficult to kind of let go of. And to your point, it doesn't really allow us to get through it and almost kind of keeps us stuck in it. So it's stagnant. Yeah. So it's, you know, how we take it.

If you look at life like a school, you know, the worst things you go through, it gives you the greater opportunity to elevate. It's all about what you do with it. You know what I mean? Sometimes the negatives, there's opportunity in that, you know, like that whole thing about, you know, feeling displaced. I was thinking about that last night. Like, I have had times in my childhood where.

I felt ridiculously displaced, but I don't, I'm not one that just, I don't bear at all. You know what I mean? I try not to define myself through it. I'm certainly never trying to compare through it, but like I can relate to that and understand that as well. Yeah. Overall, how would you rate your experience being a housewife versus what your expectation was going in? and do you think there's a long-term future in this for you? I am such an, I've always been since inception,

an avid housewife fan. Like, I have barely missed an episode of any franchise of any year. Oh, wow. So, I mean, you know, this was always my guilty pleasure. And so, you know, when I kind of got an inkling that this was what this was, I was like, oh, but no, I can't. I mean, you know, carrying all kinds of shit into it with it. The expectations is, yeah, it's radically different.

It's radically different actually being on it. And it's still so surreal to me. And the opportunity is wild. And I am so grateful. I think it might be a little different from me because I didn't necessarily feel like I, always fit in. You know, I would have loved to have my cohort. I would have love to have Dolores Theremore or someone I could kind of bounce off of or someone who may be related to me

a little more, you know, on an age level. So that, I'm not sure. You know, that was kind of difficult because if you look at all the other franchises, everyone has a cheerleader, you know, even the even the ones that are not well received have a cheerleader. You know what I mean? You know, they have someone who can relate to them remotely close to their age. I didn't have that. I mean, you know, so I don't know. I'm still like, I have to see how it plays out because I think I'm probably in for a bumpy ride.

But I don't know. I'd have to carve like a new niche for myself where I felt a little maybe more comfortable. What was your reaction when you found out you were sinner shell? I don't know. There was like speculation. There were times when I was like, no way. I might not even be in it at this point. I might be cut out of it all together.

I'll probably be on the end. And they put that. And then there are a lot floating around that actually have Alicia in it. So I'm like, it was wild. It was surreal. But it didn't kind of make me feel happy because I felt like, maybe they threw me a bone no no you're being humble Liz you're really you're an awesome housewife

center pearl in our hearts and in reality that's really sweet thank you before we let you go Liz and I just want to thank you for your time and we've enjoyed this conversation so much what is your favorite housewife franchise outside of Rhode Island of course I mean different years I've had different opinions. I mean, I really loved OG New York. I'm loving Salt Lake. Yeah. I enjoy Beverly Hills. I really like them all, but those are probably my time. I loved, I loved Jersey. What was more entertaining than that, you know? They're all so different. And, you know, I'm really proud to be a part of this franchise because I love my hometown so much.

Well, we're excited that you're a part of it as well, Liz, and really appreciate you taking the time. Hope that we can talk to you again. Have you hit in person sometime? But thank you again for your time. Congratulations on an amazing new show and being a big part of it. And it's been a lot of fun watching you. And we're very excited to kind of see how things unfold. One more quick question.

What is the thing that you can you tease a little bit the thing that you're maybe most nervous about without spoiling anything so that we can kind of look forward to the rest of the season. Oh, I can just say that I'm in for a bumpy ride. And that's what makes me the most nervous because that's the one thing that I dreaded the most, you know, like drama, being the sage, how indignant, but I'm in for a bit of a bumpy ride, you know, and I just hope people can figure out that I'm actually not a monster.

You know, the only way through it is through it, Liz, you know, and we'll get through it together. Just now you have fans in us, and we're big fans of you, and I'm sure it is not as bad as you worry. I'm sure it'll be fine. Either way. I think it's pretty bad. Well, we'll circle back. We'll circle back. Yeah, well, hear our thoughts on the show. I would love that, actually.

I would love the opportunity for that, because you guys have amazing questions. You're really smart. Well, I appreciate you, Liz. Say hi to Ashley if you see her. Thank you for taking the time. We really appreciate you. All right. Thank you, guys. That'll do it for today's episode. Thank you to our guest, Liz McGraw and Ben Mantlecler from Watch What Grapins.

We appreciate you guys listening to all your friends. Go check out this week's episodes. If you haven't listened to them all, we had Tom Schwartz. Yesterday, he really shared some tea on the whole summer house of it all. Talked about the Valley. This is great to catch up of him. He's also in love. He's in love. He really seems super in love.

Emily D. Baker breaks down all the Blake Lively, Justin Baldoni's Settlement. Lots of fun stuff. We also had Jay. Ella is very talented, very sexy, very wonderful actor. Super cute. Super, just great to talk to. Just fun, fun dad life. So anyway, a lot of great stuff for you to check out.

Also, check out the Astnick episodes if you haven't already. We had Mark Wahlberg on last week's episode. So be sure to do that as well. We'll see you back next week. Bye-bye.