The Viall Files - E1137 - Hunter Harris And Jamie Lynn Sigler Break Down The Summer House Reunion & Love Island USA Premiere

Episode Date: June 4, 2026

Welcome back to The Viall Files: Reality Recap!  Prestige reality TV season is upon us once again! To celebrate, we're joined by Hunter Harris and Jamie Lynn Seigler to dive into the weeds of Part 2 of the Summer House Reunion / In The City AND the premiere of Love Island USA. Is West Kyle 2.0? Who is the hottest new single in the villa? What was Ciara's best read? What are everyone's thoughts on brunette Ariana Madix? All that, and more. This is must-see podcasting, baby.  "Own it! Just say you're sorry!" Nick is on Substack! Subscribe here: https://nickviall.substack.com/subscribe  HEY! YOU! DO YOU NEED DATING AND RELATIONSHIP ADVICE?  Email [e-mail] and be a part of future Ask Nick episodes! Want ad free episodes and incredible bonus content?  Start your 7 Day Free Trial of Viall Files + here: https://viallfiles.supportingcast.fm/  Subscribe to The ENVY Media Newsletter Today: https://www.viallfiles.com/newsletter  To Order Nick's Book and/or learn more about the show, go to: https://viallfiles.com THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: Reddit: Download the Reddit app and get answers on your favorite subreddit r/AskReddit. Download the Reddit app today. Monarch: Use code VIALL at https://monarch.com to get your first year of Monarch Core half off at just $50. Helix: Go to https://helixsleep.com/viall for Summer Savings, 20% off Sitewide. Ollie: Get ready for both you and your pup to be obsessed. Head to https://ollie.com/viall, tell them all about your dog, and use code VIALL to get 70% off your Welcome Kit when you subscribe today! Merit Beauty: Right now, Merit Beauty is offering our listeners their Signature Makeup Bag with your first order at https://meritbeauty.com  To advertise on this podcast please email: [e-mail] or go to: https://advertising.libsyn.com/theviallfiles   Timestamps: 00:00 - Intro 10:39 - Jamie Lynn Joins 41:58 - Hunter Joins 01:50:22 - Outro Episode Socials:  @viallfiles @nickviall @nnataliejjoy @jamielynnsigler @hunterh @the_mare_bare @justinkaphillips

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Welcome back to another truly jam-packed episode of the Valfals Reality Recap Edition. I'm your host, Nick, joined by my... She's pregnant. ready to go. She's counting the days. I kind of want to go back to all the compliment. You do? Now it's just, she's pregnant. Still pregnant. I'm not allowed to say she's beautiful. She's huge.

Size of a house. We got a jam-packed household here. Sierra is with us. It's a summer house and Love Island Day. Are you also watching UK? Yes, I am. I got a VPN. It took me 20 minutes to figure out how to make that shit work, but where there's a wheel, there's a way. And now I am watching. You're not like so well-versed in that. You do it every season, no? No.

No, I used to do the Hulu, add three days, four days behind. Then I would see all the spoilers on Instagram and nothing is more frustrating. So I said, this year, we're starting it right. This year, we're starting illegal. Oh, and I'm so happy I did. Is it illegal? I don't know. Like, you can download a VPN.

I pay for it. They do ads. Somebody charged me $15 a month. That's so true. It's not like when I was 13 and I was trying to watch movies and I would. I don't remember the website, but I do remember that they were filming it in the movie theater. And people would get up. You've watched a movie like that?

I have a story about this. My grandpa got me the Rugrats movie back in the 90s. But I think he got it off of like a bootleg seller. So this VHS, right? I watched it all the time. Loved this movie. And then all of a sudden it started getting weird. And it turned into psycho.

And so I'm like, um, I don't know if it was filmed over something. It looks like, it seems like it was. Because that's a thing that happened right back in the day. It's like if it was filmed over something. Like over the VHS tape. Oh yeah. And I was a baby. So I was like, what is happening?

Suddenly you just see the Alfred Hitchcock masterpiece. Stabbed in the shower and I was like, this doesn't happen to Angelica. You're like, where's Reptor? Well, this reminded me this time last year for the premiere of Love Island USA. We were filming Age of Attraction. We were up in Whistler on our way to Vancouver. It's the first time using a VPN because we were in Canada. Yeah.

And Peacock in Love Island. Love Island USA, not Love Island Canada, you know. And then we got invited to like a dinner with some of the Netflix executives and we were supposed to like go, you guys probably remember the. I remember. Yeah. We were locked out. We got locked out all night long and like River was like, I don't know how many months old.

Me, Nick, my mom and River all like cremned in one hotel. Because there were no hotels available in Vancouver at like 2 o'clock in the morning. And then we woke up and we were watching Love Island USA. Via VPN. Via VPN and the laptop. In between dinners and. in chaos. There was a lot of TV last night, guys. We had Summerhouse

reunion. Guys, I don't think you need to appreciate how good. Love Island. There was a lot. A lot of things happened obviously at the reunion part too. I think we now realize that maybe the statement and which consummated this relationship was not West and Amanda

statement, but Amanda and Kyle's statement. There were a few different Instagram stories with text. But definitely should have been clarified. first go around by Amanda. A lot of things weren't clarified. That was a little bit of frustrating and obviously you'll get into.

My biggest is like some amazing reads of West last night, Dara with probably one of the best ones. Just to the point, I loved how she didn't have to use words like narcissists to just describe a person's behavior. But all we got from Amanda was, yeah. Like I want an, you know, Andy's obviously like no notes for Andy,

but also just like I just, I want to know what does she think. about that. All we got was, you know, in the, on the break of like her saying to West, but like, oh, that part really, like, you know, like she's hearing what people are saying about her and West and she wants that confirmation. I want to hear her speak on that. And we didn't get to hear that. There is a bit of a smooth brain thing happening with Amanda, it seems. I'm sorry, but there's just no world in which I could be in a room, especially if I've wronged somebody. You tell me about myself or why I did the things that I did.

especially if you're wrong and not get a reaction. Except that, as Amanda pointed out, she got triggered, I guess, by Sierra. I don't know. Where? Part one, she was like, yep, I mean, she said fuck you. But even that, that fuck you is like, not West friend, fuck you. Like, it wasn't like, are you kidding me?

Fuck you. Like, that's what I'm saying. It's like, don't tell me who I am or about myself or why I did those things. For West, I'm like, what Darrow said was amazing. But I'm also just like, for West to have zero reaction or rebuttal to that, where it's like, She's literally saying that you were incapable of commitment. You always put yourself first. You're a selfish lover or a selfish person to be in a relationship with.

I would at least want to be like, whoa, whoa, whoa. Like I think that that's a little harsh even for myself or like, you know, explain yourself anything. He gives nothing. I just could never be in a room with somebody telling me about myself and not feel the need to defend myself or speak up or explain my actions. And they both are just taking it on the chin. I feel like they had a little talk beforehand. I was just like, you heard their game plan, which is Wes was like just listen, sit, apologize. which honestly is a better plan that what Amanda is putting out there.

That's also what I'm like shocked about is that I'm like, I'm surprised that Andy's not mad at them because it's like Amanda, every time she's asked a question, she's like, well, West and I had a conversation about that and I don't need to share what happened in that private conversation. Guess what you do? That's why we're here. We want to understand you. Like make your case for why we should want you back next season. But for you guys to just sit there through a 10 hour reunion, giving us nothing and then be like, leave us alone. Okay, cool. Get off my TV.

Well, Sierra is already ready to get into summer. house. We're going to try to put a pin in that for just a moment. River's potty training. How is that going? Pretty good. Of course Nick says that. It's the most, it's like emotional for her. It's emotional for me. It's a lot of feelings. I will say we've like dabbled it in a little bit where we've kind of introduced her to the big girl potty and she's like gone peepee a few times. And it's like, woohoo big. And then yesterday I just out of nowhere was like, let's not put a diaper on you this morning. Let's just see if you can like go number two. And she did. Oh, my God. I know. And we, like, facetimed Nick.

It was like this huge thing. She's like, good Target, get a surprise. I'm like, yes, we will go to Target and get a surprise. It's mommy's daughter. Yeah. But it is like me being this pregnant and getting up. Because I'm like sitting on the floor next to her by the body. And it's a lot of just like, you're so brave.

You're so big. And like, oh, what flavor popsicle are we going to get? And it's just like so much. And then she's like, can you play that song? Uh-huh. Yeah, caution in a chow. And I'm like, yeah, it's the March song from Jungle Book, the Elephant March song. And I'm like, yeah, I can play that and they're all sing that.

And so then I'm sitting on the floor singing. And then she's like, I don't have to go. All gone. And then she gets up. And then I'm like, okay, well, let me know. And then she's like, oh, I take it. And I'm like, okay, let's run. And then we're running.

And then it's there's just, there's so many accidents and so much. And it's, it's been a lot. But, you know, I cannot change three diapers. Yeah. You know, like that feels. just like too much. I think you have, you're gonna have to deal with enough. Enough. And that is

just, you know, pick and choose your battles. That'll put me over the edge. Yeah. You know? Yeah. So, I just think if we can get her potty train. Well, I mean, if you're looking at me, like, why don't you change diapers? I'm looking at you. Yeah, it is kind of crazy that you said it was going. Right. It's going great. And she made a point to say three.

First of all, she did up, now they had to go to the doctor yesterday. She peed on the toilet with me. Her baby toilet. I don't know. Did my part. Also, it's just in the diaper, in the diaper changing category,

I've definitely changed more diapers. No, Nick definitely changed more diapers. It's like an 80-20. But he can't change three at once. Yeah. Like, he can't change the ones. So you meant to say, Nick can't do three at one.

Yeah, Nick can't change three diapers. I will be nursing two babies at one. By the way, no complaints. That's the least I can do. I do change the diapers. But I did not realize just like, how much attention to detail that would take. Oh, yeah.

You know, and you got to be ready. You got to be ready at all times. It's easier when you're a track star, but, you know, you've got. Yeah. She's like, Mama, run. I'm like, I'm trying. Rever's really fast. Well, we truly have a jam-packed episode lined up for you guys.

Jamie Lynn Siegler joins us to talk about her new memoir. Also, her passions about reality TV. She was recently on Watch what happened. live, I thought she gave an excellent take regarding the Summer House scandals. She's also just a big Rhode Island fan and she likes talking about reality TV the same way we like talking about it and we're super excited to have her

to talk about both the Scamanda Summer House reunion part two and her memoir. We also have Hunter Harris joining us after that. She is not only a fan of Summer House, she is the journalist that interviewed Sierra for that glamour article. She was the, you know, basically got

the exclusive first access to Sierra to get her, a thoughts and feelings regarding the scandal, and she is with us to talk about that, the reunion part two, and Love Island. So certainly a lot to get into. All the conversations are going to be around the honest and newest TV shows that are out right now. We are excited to bring it to you. But before we get to Jamie, don't forget that Valfaus Plus is available, ad-free.

All your favorite Valfals episodes are ad-free plus. You get your ad-reta-recap deep dives, which now that Love Island is here, boy, you are definitely going to want to sign up for Vials Plus because this is too much TV. Talk about it on Rea-R-R-Reyat-Rew, and that's where we get into the weeds, to all your favorite TV shows. Certainly in the city, Summer House, Love Island will be hot topics of reality recap deep dives. Plus, you get your pop extras, all your favorite pop culture topics. We certainly don't have time for on reality recap. And your update specials, all your favorite updates from your favorite ask Nickal. So be sure to check it out. And don't forget,

Sub-Sec. They got a new essay out there. What I hope to teach my daughters from the Scamanda saga. This essay is free. I hope you really enjoy it. I enjoyed writing it, working on it. And certainly now that, again, I'm about to be a dad of three girls. I definitely look dating and advice a little bit differently. So I hope, I think this will be very relatable. Everything I talk about, not only on this show, but certainly the substack is just lessons I've learned through life. And this is kind of my new way of sharing and getting a little bit more personal about my experiences. So I hope you guys enjoy it. Well, I think Jamie's here. So let's, let's get to Jamie.

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with code V-I-A-L. Well, we've all Googled something very specific and usually the best result that comes up is some kind of Reddit thread from years ago because it's all about community people. And if you are looking for a community with whatever your interests are, maybe it's obviously for people listening reality TV for for me. You know, my passions outside of reality TV are often sports related. Maybe you're into cooking. Whatever your hobbies are, chances are there's a community for it on Reddit where you can get great insights, feedback, best practices. Maybe you're into true crime. There's always some great threads out there in communities discussing the latest true crime cases that are out there.

Whatever your passions are, there is a community for you on Reddit. No matter what you're going through, whatever your passions are, there is a community on Reddit talking about whatever you're going through with some great insights and advice. And sometimes you can just like shoot the breeze and debate, which is, you know, like what a lot of people love to do for reality TV. I love doing it for sports. But whatever your passions are, whatever you are a fan of,

you can have a shared community on Reddit. the Reddit app and get answers on your favorite subreddit download the Reddit app today Jamie Lynn Siegler welcome to the show thank you so much for having me I'm so happy to be on oh we're so excited to have you we've been fans of you for some time you have a new memoir out and also you are deep into the summer house and bravo lore which is always very exciting to have friends enjoy the same stuff it's always fun to like be fans of people and realize we love the same things and love talking about the same same kind of TV shows it's always feels relatable yeah really bonds you doesn't it especially especially these types of things

and when your appearance and watch what happens live a couple weeks ago i thought you gave one of like the better like takes i thought it was just really interesting when you were just kind of talking about like despite all the like the hot takes and vitriol out there just like just trying to empathize and understand why there might be some kind of whether it's short term or long connection between Amanda and West. And at least we're trying to approach it from like an empathetic light rather than like screw these two people,

which, you know, I think is nice to hear because it's always boring just recurgitating the same hot takes you see from Twitter or Instagram and things like that. For sure. I mean, look, I've never been on reality television, but I love it. And, you know, but you have to remind yourself

these are human beings, right, that are willingly living their lives in front of other people for judgment, for commentary. It's kind of what comes with the, with the territory. But I mean, look, I know I have a book to talk about, but I could talk about this summer house stuff this whole time. I'd love to. Like, I just feel especially watching last night's second reunion, I get the reasons why it happened. I get that they fell for each other. They had these feelings for each other. Like, it happens, right? Like chemistry happens, feelings happen.

She's coming out of this marriage. She's very vulnerable. He's kind of just who he is. And like, no, whatever, no commentary on that. But the fact that there just wasn't more acknowledgement of how this made other people feel. I just feel like they were entering in this like very combative and defensive and sort of ready to be like, Like this was the timeline. See, we did nothing wrong.

And it's like, no, no, no, no, it's not about what you did. It's you're not acknowledging. First of all, I feel so bad for the guy. You know what I mean? Like, this is so fucked up. Like, this was his friend. I just keep going back to West being like, telling Jesse, like, it wouldn't be cool for him to even pursue Sierra. A girl he didn't even really date.

But you can go after your friend's ex-wife immediately. It's just like, do they even like each other? Like, West and Amanda? Like, I'm missing the chemistry. It seems unclear about West's feelings. Amat, I guess I just assume that Amanda really likes West because... It seems it all summer. Yeah.

Yeah. I can at least wrap my brain around trying to understand how Amanda got here, you know, coming out of a 10-year relationship, feeling isolated, scared to date again. You know, that all just makes sense. Yes. Wes pursued her. We now know. I still can't wrap my brain around like what's Wes's logic. We're now like trying to figure, you know, I think that the best guess we have now is that like he was trying to capitalize on the sympathy he thought Amanda was going to receive post-divorce. But right, that's really threading a needle that is pretty hard. It's just like.

Yeah. I just would love to know again what what conversations could possibly be. had and how Wes could be so smooth to not only like convince Amanda that this is a good idea, but then also it's just like you have a girlfriend, but you guys had a private conversation that says it's okay for you guys to make out even though he has a girlfriend. Like what could possibly have been said or like, you know what I mean? Like how smooth can one be with words that you would be like, yeah, it's fine. Let me abandon any iota of integrity, of empathy, of having a conversation. But yeah, you can sit here and yell at Jesse about even considering the idea of kissing Sierra.

Did you think that we would get more accountability and ownership from Tom Sandoval via Scandival than we're getting from Amanda and West? And I don't even think it's close. I know. And what Sandoval did was so much worse, you know, but he fully owned it and he took it. And he said he deserved it. And I just, I think it was weird to hearing,

Meja, when she was talking to Sierra and saying that he doesn't want to publicly say that he's dating her because he would be fired from the show if he wasn't dating someone within the Bravo universe. I know that Sierra and Lindsay have been calling out being like, you are so calculated, you care about what others think about you. But hearing that type of stuff, how could you not think that about him?

I don't think he's as calculated as everybody's making him to be, but I think it's like whatever's right in front of him, like whatever can sort of save him in that moment he's going to do and he's just like not thinking too far ahead. It just seems. And to go off of that, I'm like, think about the fact that Amanda walks off right,

outside of just like everybody having to convince this man to go after her. But then it's like the only quote that we got was if you're going to cry, cry on camera. So you can't even comfort this person. Do you like her? Because I'm sorry, if one of my friends or my partner ran off crying, wouldn't I want to comfort that person?

and we got zero of that. We saw you comforting her all summer long. Right, but you can't do it at the reunion. This man was given hugs and forehead kisses. I think he's like stuck. Yeah. Like, if this scandal was still happening, like, would they be this committed? Obviously, Amanda was completely checked out of this marriage coming into this, you know?

And look, a lot has obviously happened over the however many years that they've this decade or so that they've been together. nobody's faulting her. I mean, I feel like I saw some clip recently where they were showing, maybe it was BravoCon like talking about this upcoming summer house season and like, oh, Kyle's the villain, Kyle's the villain. So, yeah, saying like this really was supposed to be the Amanda's redemption and her time and Kyle's sort of downfall and it's crazy how it's all transpire. But I think she was crushing on West over the summer.

Like, I'm sorry. I would never sit next to a guy and like cuddle and ask him to look at my ass walking away if I wasn't flirting and wanting that type of attention. Not to put it down. That's just kind of like what you do as like a woman when you're crushing on someone. And it was probably very confusing for her. And he was picking up on some type of vibe and sort of, you know, used it as like he was being a good friend and comforting her. But it just got too messy. And honestly, it's just like doesn't make sense to me that no one in their life is just being like, own it.

Just say you're sorry. Like I can think of so many moments in my life where I've just completely just apologized and owned my behavior and said, I know this is wrong and I'm so sorry. And I've been never met with any confrontation back, right? It's like that's when healing can happen. That's when conversation can happen. They're doing none of that. I don't know if they're going to call Mija on stage or just like show all these receipts. but like I'm so curious what Amanda's response to all of this is going to be.

Because from Meeha's perspective, it's like, no, we were exclusively dating. I was staying at his place while he was filming Summer House. Like we were fully together. He's calling me his girlfriend. He's saying, I love you so much. Like building his furniture? I'm sorry. I know.

I said, you were doing what while he was gone? Make it out with people? Mm-mm. But like Amanda, did you know all of that? Because she said, you know, we've had so many conversations. I knew about her. He told me. I mean, listen, I feel like buzzwords are often overplayed.

And the word pick me is definitely up there. But it, it's, she is demonstrating so many qualities that we've all demonstrated in our late teens, early 20s, where we just justify they want me. And we're different. And I mean, I remember my first girlfriend, my best friend. he dated her best friend and me and my girlfriend at the time, like, had the dumb conversations, like we're more in love than there. You know, like these stupid kind of like competitions we have, even with our friends because, you know, and it's just like the only thing that makes sense between Amanda and Wes is that that's their mindset where it's just like no matter who says what to Amanda,

she's just like, he picked me and what I have with him is different and you guys don't understand. And like it just makes. You're so right. It's so young love. These people are literally accusing you, telling you who you are and how you felt and why you made decisions, literally asking you how you went from being a wife to a side chick. And yet you just have no response. If I was sitting there, I would either be sobbing, like, fighting for my life on that stage to be like understood. And yet you're saying absolutely nothing and being like, it's fine if you feel that way about me.

I only have five more hours of this to go. Correct. I mean, she looked like she was going to fall asleep in the lunch break, wrapped in like a dry blanket. When they took a lunch break and then she still wasn't back. That's a good hour lunch break. You know? Yeah. Oh, yeah.

And Sierra being like, where is she? Like, what kind of break is this? She's just not coming back. She's like, you know what? I'm good. West, like, yeah, it's all cool. I mean, I was ready for like my Carl's a mess merch the same way I bought to send it to Daryl sweatshirt, you know?

Like I was taken down with this much like Scandival. But just, again, she's just shocked at the lack of accountability. But, you know, when I was, did watch what happens live with KJ, did you see when KJ read West's text? Yes, that he had sent him after that. And it's like, that should have been said on air. I don't know if he just shuts down in confrontation and that's kind of just his personality. But it's like, I would imagine that they were given many opportunities to say their side. And they just didn't.

Or at least so far they haven't. And it's, if I was Andy Cohen, I'd be so frustrated. Or like if you're West like knowing yourself or knowing that you shut down in confrontation, the brain doesn't fire off fine, then write some stuff down. Like I would have come there with like something to say to each person. So I'm like, hey, like, I freeze up in confrontation. I can't get my points up. But this is what I'd like to say to each of you. But it's just like again, there's no preparation that went in on either of their parts it feels like. I mean, he definitely had a moment when KJ, you know, was talking to him about, I think it was about his dad. And he was like explaining all of that background and how it had heard. them. And Wes is like, yeah, man, like, if there's a moment ever where we could, like, get a lunch or and have the conversations that need to be happy, just say it. Say it. Just have the conversation right now. But that's, that's the west of it all. It's always like, I'm sorry, we'll deal with it later. I'm sorry, we'll deal with it later. It's always, you know,

he. That's how you know that he coached Amanda because it's like, I've just never seen Amanda clam up on stage or not say anything or not defend herself. The only person she came for was Kyle. but it's like they both are saying this whole like him saying that to KJ being like we'll have another conversation off camera essentially and it's the same thing that her answer Amanda's answer for everything is is West and I had that conversation it's private between us and we don't really need to explain ourselves but I understand well yeah and she's still just she's just really using it seems all her fuel is just still all her anger at Kyle and not to invalidate that and not to invalidate that and not to invalidate that and not to her pain and anything that he might have done or his behaviors that really hurt her. But it's also shocking to me that she can't look at a man that she was married to only months ago or still legally right now and can't be like, I understand that this is probably hurtful that I'm fucking your friend. Yeah.

You know what I mean? Like just the fact that she can't even look at this man that of course there's love there. I mean, he still loves her so much and you can see that. It's really, it's, my heart breaks every time the camera pans to Kyle, because I just feel like he doesn't know how to navigate this. And it's like, again, I don't think they're acknowledging what this is like for him enough. I don't want to repeat the things he did. But it's really, that's really fucked up.

It's like maybe he should know better how to show up for his wife when they were married. But it almost comes across as like, maybe he didn't know better. And then you. Yeah. You know? like you feel for. I didn't have sex

for how many years? Four? Four years. She hated him. Yeah. No, she hated him. She hated him. When Sierra was like,

I'm sorry, I didn't realize what you're going through. Oh, yeah. Amanda was pissed. You could tell it was eating her alive that Kyle was getting sympathy that she never expected him or wanted him to get.

It's like the going back to you being like she just needs to say like, Kyle, I'm sorry that I fell for your friend and fucking your friend. Like when Kyle got choked up when she said, I don't want to go out with him. And then Lindsay was, like, firing off.

And he's like, hold on, hold on. Lindsay, hush, Kyle, what are you feeling? And she's like, it's because I said that I don't like to go out with him. No, like, we heard. Yeah, no, we know. But also, like, what else, Amanda? Are you, like, what else do you think is hurting him? Well, she's basically saying, I don't like him.

Like, that's basically what she was saying, which, you know, it's, again, I just think she's, I didn't realize how young she was when they were showing all the things. growbacks when they got together. That's not a lot of time to figure out who you are. No, no, it's not. Well, let's figure out who you are, Jamie, because you have a new memoir coming out, and so it is, a memoir of acceptance and hope. I assume it must be very vulnerable writing a memoir. And I guess what made you want to write this? What was your process and how were you able to, like, go back and kind of open up about some vulnerable moments in your life? I've been approached over the last decade ever since I became public about having MS.

a handful of times, like, would you ever want to write a book? Would you ever want to write a memoir? And I always had this, like, very visceral reaction of like, no. Because I didn't want MS to be sort of my only story. I didn't want it to sort of define me or have it be kind of, I don't know, even my currency. You know what I mean? As, as my career. And over the past decade, I think I've kind of really learned how to be, even more honest and more vulnerable in my sharing and felt such a shift within myself of being comfortable in my truth and not hiding parts of myself, whether for fear of being judged, or for fear of my own judge and myself that I'm projecting out into the world or feeling limited or defined. And when I was approached two years ago again to write a memoir, are, it was all of a sudden kind of like this full body yes. And in anticipation of thinking of like sort of taking this out and pitching it to publishers, I sat in front of my laptop to see if like what would kind of come out of me if I'm going to start writing. And this letter to

my younger self poured out of me. And it was just basically like your life is nothing like you imagined, but what if I told you that, you know, you were on one of the best TV shows to ever be made, you had an eating disorder, you got married, you got divorced, you live with a neurodegenerative disease, but the girl that you've told your entire life is a loser and not good enough and a fraud, you love her, and you fight for her, and you care about her, and you're proud of her, even though she walks with a cane and has to wear depends sometimes. And it was like, oh my God, I am ready to just share all the things that I have felt such shame about and such guilt about. And knowing that if this is a story that I can put in someone's hands of giving hopefully a reader an opportunity to see where they can offer themselves grace and forgiveness and love and feel seen and give them hope and maybe a

acceptance around circumstances that they can't change in their lives and gratitude for the things that happened to them and knowing that it all brings them to who they are today. It felt like writing a memoir then had a purpose beyond just sharing my story, but something that I could give to other people through reliving my experience. That's so beautiful. And I really love your title because, I mean, in my adult life, acceptance has been the thing that, you know, I've struggled with the most when it comes to things that, you know, difficult moments in my life. It's the thing that I've been the most grateful at getting a little bit better at. And I love how you have acceptance and hope in the title because sometimes I have found that part of acceptance is letting go of hope in certain situations.

But I'm curious for you, how do you balance acceptance and hope in your life? Because sometimes those can be very kind of polar opposite thought exercises. Yes. Absolutely. So and so it is was the first tattoo I ever got in my wrist. And I got it because it was a time in my life where I all of a sudden felt like I found sort of a foundation of faith of something that I could cling to and come to. I was coming out of probably one of the darker times of my life where I just fell completely untethered and completely lost and completely out of hope. And what fell in my lap was a friend and a life coach and a life coach and a, a spiritual practice that just made me feel all of a sudden connected and alive and acceptance. What I learned was the most important step in any healing process in life in general. And that acceptance doesn't mean you have to like what is. It doesn't mean that you have to agree or even be okay with it.

But the truth of the matter is it's here. It's happening. It is what it is. And we can't change in the only way to move forward to only way. to only way to have any sort of healing around anything in your life is just to accept it. And so learning that acceptance didn't mean that I had to like the fact that I was living with MS or like the fact that I was single or unemployed or all those things, but just saying this is what is, where do I want to go from here?

It's sort of then I was able to sort of alchemize my pain a little bit and sort of shift my perspective and shift my way of thinking. And this isn't like a one and done thing. like you said, like being a human in the world, pain and struggle just comes with this experience. It's kind of what's, but being human is about, but it's how we evolve. It's how we grow. And it's just something and a practice and that I come up against daily or whatever it is, whatever challenges I'm facing each and every day and just giving myself those moments to accept,

but knowing, especially when like I went back through my life, especially in like, the times where I felt completely isolated and completely alone and seeing that I never was and that I really did have the love and support around me that maybe I just didn't think I deserved or opened myself up to. The hope comes from now knowing that I can move forward in life no matter what comes my way, knowing that that is there. And I only learned that through struggle. So also understanding that through pain and struggle also comes gifts. Yeah. Wow. It's really beautiful.

I wonder what Amanda's memoir will be about. You know? It'll be like, fuck off. I'm sure there'll be a lot of tough lessons that she's had to learn throughout her life. Was there any other kind of specific, like, revelation that you had while writing it, that you kind of had an aha moment that stuck with you since writing that? You know, I think we, especially in the entertainment industry, you can always feel like you're going to miss an opportunity or if something doesn't happen, it'll never happen again. and just really knowing and trusting that not only the lessons and the gifts, like they will continue to reveal themselves until you are ready to take them,

until you're ready to walk down that road. And just knowing that I'm never going to miss anything that's meant for me, I was able to really see going back through my life. But also, you know, there was a lot of healing, particularly for me around my first marriage. I mean, it was like a really, it was something that I have wanted to forget and never talk about. It was really volatile. It was really toxic. It was really traumatic. But I really intended when writing the book, like, this isn't a takedown of anyone, right? This is an opportunity

for me to share my story. I didn't want to hurt anyone in any retelling of anything. But I needed to be honest and they needed to be truthful about what happened. But I was really, because of that intention, I was really also able to see his side and also really remember how much we loved each other. even though it was bad and even though it ended bad, like, he did love me and I did love him. And so to be able to not only offer him that forgiveness, but myself too and not beat myself up so much for the choices I made and the things that I did and just really seeing, like, I was doing the best I could. We all were. And so I didn't expect to have that healing around particularly that moment, but I had it around so many. Yeah. This is very fascinating, Jamie. I really like how your brain works. I'm curious, as someone who comes from a legendary TV show like The Sopranos, what is the most obnoxious or knowing question you get all the time? And what's maybe a question you've gotten from fans that you were surprised by and even enjoyed maybe answering?

Well, I mean, I'm always asked like what happened in the ending. Sure. Yeah. There's no, like, you know, I could give you my opinion, but there's no answer. Do you have an opinion? I think he died. I think he died. I think he did. But I think that the way it was edited and the way that we were able to sort of see that the family was oblivious and sort of going about their life. But we could see all of these potential threats. And at any moment that it could end everything for all of them, that's the world they lived in.

That was their reality. And so they needed to sort of be naive and purposely ignorant to all of it. But whether his life ended then or a week from then or 10 years from then, like, that was the fate of Tony. Like, that was the fate of the Sopranos. That's the way I took it in. Questions that have surprised me and I've enjoyed, I think it's more just when people are like, where do you think Meadow is now? Like, I love to still have the fantasy because she's like, you know, she's such a part of me.

She was my alter ego for so long, a role and a woman that I could sort of escape into because she was so much bolder and so much more confident and so much smarter than I was. So I was able to sort of learn and feel so good in her skin. So anytime anyone invites me to sort of fantasize more about her, I love that. That's really great. You've been open about struggling with eating disorders and it sounds like you're also a big advocate and you kind of give of your time. What are some of the conversations you would like to see maybe change in the entertainment industry to avoid maybe more people struggling with eating disorders like you were so open about? You know, I think just being able to be open and honest about a struggle, about body image, about

pressures, like it doesn't say anything about you. It says you're human. If anything, it makes people feel more connected to you. You're more authentic. You feel more in your power, living your truth. So I wish for other people that they could just feel more comfortable. I mean, look, you don't have to share everything that's going on with your life, but there is a lot of healing and there is a lot of possibility for healing when you share. When you understand that saying that you have something that you struggle with doesn't define you or say that you are weak in general, right? It's just saying you're a human being that's struggling with this.

How can you not? It's especially for me, like, as a child of the 80s and 90s, like, diet culture was like, we were bred that way. I mean, like, we grew up with our moms being, like, fat-free, and, you know, every magazine cover was how to lose 20 pounds or whatever, how to look hot for him? And so, like, how can we not consciously feel self-conscious? And it's something that I check in with myself all the time about, even though I haven't had an evening disorder in a very long time. Like, being somebody who just turned 45, like, I'm dealing with aging and my face changing and my body changing. I'm like constantly you have to check in.

And the big thing for me is just not keeping it inside. Because anytime I sort of allow myself to think for too long, it's just it never goes well. So saying it out loud, whether it's to a friend or even my husband, just being like, I'm feeling this way about myself. I don't even need you to like come back with like, no, you look great or you're wonderful. It's just like, just hear me. Just let me sort of get this out. Because I think anytime you can say something, it has a little bit less power over you.

I definitely feel like I've found three. the trauma that I've gone through talking about it because it does make me feel so much less alone. And when I'm just alone in my head, I'm like, oh, my God, I'm the only person who ever feels like this. And then when I talk about it, you get so much response of like, me too, me too, me too. I thought I was the only one. I thought, you know, have you felt that response when you talk about the things that you're passionate about? Oh, my God. Yes. And it's so funny because it's not even what I thought was going to be on the other side of it. It was more of like, what are people going to think of me? And instead it was like, oh, my God, let me hug you.

Thank you. Me too. Yes. I even had, I did a book signing a couple of weeks ago, and this woman walked up with a cane, and she was like, I can't tell you what it feels like to see another woman in her 40s with kids, with MS, that walks the way you walk and does the way. And I was like, same girl. Like, thank you for walking up to me right now and showing me that I'm not the only one. And there's somebody else out there that's living a similar experience that's fighting every day. Like, I see you. Thank you. And so there is. is just such a beautiful exchange that happens when we share our vulnerabilities, you know? Totally.

Do you have time to talk a little Rhode Island before we let you go? Sure. Sure. Okay. Well, first of all, like, what are you? I mean, we're obviously big fans. It's, uh, I never thought I'd love a housewife, uh, franchise as much as I like Salt Lake City.

But there is something about these women. Obviously, Ashley Ia Kennedy is a dear friend of mine. But like, what do you like, not like, how are you feeling about Rhode Island? There's nothing I don't like. I am with you. Like, I, like, out of the. Gates, this show was like phenomenal. Whoever casted this was genius. I think Alicia, to me, is like the greatest housewife debut since Sonia Morgan. Like, I just love like a beautiful, likely

authentic. Like, give me the accent. Give me, give me like pronounce every word wrong. Like, show me your pantry. Like, I just love everything about her. I just think these women are also have genuine relationships and history. And it's really, it makes such a difference when they have that, right? And it's not like manufactured relationships and friendships. I don't know. I just think it's, I think it's gold. I mean, Liz, I'm just as scared of her as everybody else. I'm the hair pull. The hair pull, I was like, oh, fuck. And the way that she did it was so sneaky. And it was so like, I bet if I do it this way, the cameras won't be able to see. And then, when Joellen, like, they had that little lunch, and she's like, you pulled my hair. And she's like,

pulled your hair, really? And she, like, got all defensive. And it, oh, my God. But when we had Liz on, like Natalie pointed out last episode, we were like, oh, we love you, Liz. And like, you know, early in the season. And she gave us the heads up. She's like, well, you might, you might feel differently in a few weeks. So maybe she just, you know, maybe she just got too into character. Maybe, you know. Listen, I can't imagine the pressure that you're. feeling, right? The thing, like, and you, you probably have a producer sort of riling you up, right? I mean, they do it, right?

They give us great TV. Yeah. But I am with you. Rhode Island and Salt Lake are at the top, top of the game right now, and my two favorite shows, hands down. And to answer your question, that definitely does happen. There are definitely producers, you know, reminding the women, this is a reality TV show, giving them a heads up if they don't feel like they're getting their best.

And so we always do have to take things with a grain of salt. But I think that's part of the fascinating aspect of reality TV and specifically Bravo. It's just like, which is more true? Like, is this a safe space for you to show the real you and then blame it on the edit? Or is this you just kind of elevating your reactions because it's a TV show? And trying to dissect that season after season is always, I think. think one of the most fun aspects of getting it to do this. Absolutely. But I mean, this is either great producing, but it feels like this is really them.

And that's what we're getting to see. And that's why it's, it's so enjoyable. It's my, it's like, it's the new Sopranos, you know, it's the Sunday night television. I love it. It really is. And Rhode Island, it gives us a little bit of that, you know. Yes. Do they know any of the mafia? Maybe. Maybe. Maybe possibly, who knows. Jamie, this has been so much fun. Thanks for taking the time to talk with us. us about our favorite reality TV shows. And obviously, congratulations on the book and the memoir. The book is, and so it is, a memoir of acceptance and hope available wherever you get your books.

And is it a book on tape that for all the dyslexic people like myself can listen to? There's an audio book, yes. Wonderful. Wonderful. Well, be sure to check that out wherever you get your audiobooks or your books, Jamie. Thanks so much for taking the time. We really appreciate it. Thank you, guys.

That's so much fun. Thank you. So much fun. Bye-bye. Bye, guys. Well, we're just going to keep the show going because Hunter Harris is here. Jamie, great kickoff to some great summerhouse conversations, but they don't stop because Hunter Harris is here to talk all things,

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you'll get your money back. That's OLLL-I-E.com slash V-I-A-L and enter code V-I-A-L to get 70% off your first box. Ollie, view the obsession. Welcome to the show, Hunter. Great to have you. Thank you. We're so excited. Being so excited. How has been lots of great TV out these days. I would say too much.

I was staying in more than I'm going out because I just, I had to get my numbers up. Honestly, truly. There's so much. Or you're watching Love Island Summer House in the city. Yeah. Yeah. And I'm trying to like text my friends back too. And like eat and shower and the other things.

Can I just say Tuesdays? Roughest day. Because it's like, oh my God, please don't text me. Don't call me past 5 p.m. I don't have time for you until bedtime. I'm working a shift. Literally. Literally.

Like I'm going on a new restaurant. Like I have work to do tonight. Does it ever for you? Does it mean? Because for us, obviously we watch a lot of TV, cover a lot of TV. And it can feel like work sometimes. Does it ever feel like work for you as you're watching it? Or are you just still full?

I can't say that. No, I said always. You said it sometimes feels like work. Can I go always? Well, actually, no. Lately, like the Summer House reunion and honestly in the city, I have been locked in. I've really, it's been enjoyable, like well beyond like I'm not doing it for work at all. How has it been for you?

I have like done a lot of film criticism. So watching stuff always feels like both personally rewarding and then also like it still is work. But it wasn't it didn't feel like work actually until I had to watch three seasons of Summerhouse in like five days. And the guy that I was saying at the time was like, oh, what do you want to watch? I'm like, I actually have to watch Summer House, like for work. And he thought I was joking. I absolutely wasn't. But otherwise, I mean, I love it.

It's such good drama. So did he sit and watch with you? Or was he like, okay, call me when you're done? I was like, you have to go. Like, sorry, I'm locked in. Like, I can't entertain. I don't need to do the small talk. Like, I have work to do.

I'm in the lab, actually. I have my lap. And with Love Island USA, are you like us where we are, you know, for us, it's really not necessarily Sierra, but for me and many other people, like season six is like season one almost. Oh, absolutely. Season six is perfect TV. I don't know that we as a country will see 250 years if season seven, if season eight goes this away that season seven did.

Yep. Yeah. I don't think we can do that again. No. Can you, what is it saying, bat 100? No? Bat a thousand? Bat a thousand.

I was going to say, I know you're not asking me about sports analogy. I just don't know if I have another season of like the way the online discourse about Love Island went. Yeah, but I don't like listen to it for the discourse. I know. I just want to like enjoy the show. That's why I'm excited about the, because we were talking about the cast not having access to Instagram. I think that's going to help a lot. Oh, yeah.

They stopped the families from posting about. on their accounts. They can't hire their friends to run their accounts anymore. Which I think is good. And I think they turned off the comments and whatnot. But I'm just like, yeah, I'm like, I understand. Trust me, I'm passionate. I'm watching UK and US at the same time. Like, that's passion. But I'm like, I just don't know why anybody feels the need to like go on somebody because their behavior pisses you off to go on their page and like rip them to shreds. What good is that? Well, you have a job. That's why. You have something else to do. Say it again. And many of them are like, they're 15.

Yeah. Yeah. Like, I was talking. to Anna Peel. I don't know if you know. Oh, yeah. And she wrote a really cool book about Love Island. And she was saying, oh, like, something like 30, 40% of the audience is under 18 and they can't even actually count that towards like the actual viewing numbers.

But like, we are giving a voice to a lot of younger people. Well, it's funny because I'm like, I know that I was influenced by like certain things incorrectly. Like I just remember like I watched girls next door and thought that like at one point when I was like 15, I was like, maybe it's a gold

to be like a playbate. You know what I mean? So I'm like, because I thought Holly and Bridget and Kendra were so cute. And so I'm like, it's kind of the same thing with the whole like Love Island guy that went on, quit his police job to be on Love Island. And the mayor's like, why? So shocked. And it's like, well, work for 20 years up the ranks in a pension or like, I don't know,

maybe an old spice collab. Did you see that, Hunter? Yes, I did. What did you think about that? You know, just weird. That wasn't even the weirdest part that he left that job. the weirdest part was him saying, oh, I got a girl pregnant and now I have like a, the way he said that like semantically, semantically was so bizarre to me.

It's like, how can you remove yourself even more from like your own drive on? Three years ago, I got someone pregnant. And two years ago, I had, she had my son who is two years old, my only child. Like, couldn't you just been like I have a kid? Yeah. Yeah. I have a son. I have a two-year-old son.

No, even that. It's simple. Wow. Imagine that. Forward. Are you team mayor? What do you think about just him leaving the police force? Because it seems like the mayor is upset because there's the mayor has got to have other things to do. Right? I'm going to say it might be team mayor. Really? Yeah. Sorry. I feel like him making the statement almost proves the point that Love Island is so big that like who wouldn't take up that opportunity to go on. I guess but I love a dramatic mayor. Sorry. I love a mayor that's like, you know what, this discourse needs me. Like, I'm the brief party here.

That's hilarious. It is definitely hilarious. Sincere does, in fact, seem very sincere. He has like, um... He does seem very sincere. He seems like... He seems very earnest, maybe. He lives up to his name.

He does live up to his name. I'm not usually into, like, a playful spirit like that. I... What are you into? I don't know, like, Roger Deacons, Deacons, a cinematographer. Like, I... Cheek. Okay, very cheap.

said. The Love Island USA guys, they're so like goofy sometimes. I'm like, okay, like I'm a grown up. I don't need to, this is not doing anything for me. That is how I felt about Bryce's hair. He looks like he's food god. Jonathan. Oh my God. He needs to cut his hair. He cannot be almost 30 years old and have that haircut. I'm so sorry. He looks like he's trying to kiss me a thermopolis and like the beaches of when Ariana was like, oh, you're a model and you did the Calvin Klein, but like, what's the most maybe surprising thing about you? He was like, I'm sensitive. And I'm like, I don't feel like, I would assume that tracks with male models.

But then he was like, I fix garbage trucks. And I'm like, you should have led with this. That's what that was interesting thing about him. And he said it was an insecurity for him. And I'm just like, why is it an insecurity that you can do things with your hands? I'm sorry. Also, the sanitation employees are like truly keeping, like heroes. in keeping us afloat.

You're a good person for that. It's like real work. Yeah. He was also very scared about not having gone to college, I think, which I'm like, who cares? Like, who is that a prerequisite for? If you're not flooding in student loan debts, good for you. Exactly. Exactly.

You made a smart financial choice at 17. And you're employed multiple times over. Look at that. Winning. Yeah. Just cut your hair. So then we had the like the doors, the compatibility. That was just so much making out.

So much making out. No, 12 minutes in we're like, what's your favorite sex position? Yeah. I couldn't imagine. Can we talk about Ariana Maddox's new hair? Yeah. Loved. Yeah.

I was very pro. Love the brunette. I thought it looked very nice. And I did not expect it. Every time she walks in, I'm like, her stylist and her hair, every time I'm like, this eats. They're working. It's so good. Yes.

Ooh, question for the girlies, Nick. You can't answer. Probably won't. When a blonde woman reveals that she's gone, Burnett, what are your usual gut feeling reactions? Is this for your personal? Are you thinking about going to Brinette? No, no, no. I just mean in general because I always think it's like, I think when a brunette like bleaches,

bleaches or her hair blonde, that's like one moment. And then when a blonde woman goes brunette, it's a different one and it doesn't always quite land the same way. Interesting. So I'm curious to your thoughts. I think going brunette is like, okay, you're locked in. Like, you have an agenda. You're like on something serious. Going blonde, it's like on the spectrum of getting bangs or I'm like, is everything okay at home?

Is there a breakup? I'm okay. I promise. Oh, no. You're great. No, but it's like, but it's also like that's a commitment. Like you have to commit from going brunette to blonde. Yeah.

It's like truly Sarah Pigeons. More often than I do. But we did have the bombshells come in. I always love that moment. It is chef's kiss how they did it, first of all. Kinsey being like, I hear him. It's him. I know it.

Babe. Babe. Kada and Gabriel, hottest bombshells popping off night one. Like, I'm like, are we kidding? Yeah. I was like, Kada, if I want to come back as you in the next live, Gabriel. Well, I always love. I'm engaged.

I always love that because, like, obviously everyone's hot. Yeah. But like with, you know, this is, you see this around reality TV for years. Like sometimes even the hot people aren't the coolest people. They don't have the most swag. There's some nerds in there, which, you know, everyone has their charm and we like different things. But it's always fun to see how, like, producers know, like, you know, they're going to pick someone who smells good, who has the swag, you know, like. Because they're going to be blindfolded and things like that.

And you want that person to come in with, like, a major impact. And this Gabriel guy, just like. It's giving Miguel. Sex. It's giving sex. When Miguel walked in, I was like, oh, fucking finally. When he unbuttoned his shirt, pretty much all the way down, and then like grabbed her by the neck. I'm like, oh, okay.

That was the equivalent to me of Miguel during the heart rate challenge, putting his hand in the fire, and then putting it on Leah's neck. I was like, okay. Yes, you've got my own. America is voting for you. No, I love a performer. That's a theater kid. That's a theater background.

Exactly. Put on a show. Honestly, I feel like being a bombs show would be so much more fun than being because you get to play into that role of like, oh, I'm putting on a show. But an early bombshell. That's like the best role to have is like a bombshell

that comes in end of episode one. Yeah. Before episode five. Because then you're still kind of, like we're watching it now. It's the first episode. And I just, I keep thinking about like what are we like,

what is love Eiling is saying going to look like two weeks from now? Like, you know, half these cast might be gone. We're going to be falling in love with people We haven't even been revealed yet. It's like it moves so fast. You sort of have like a plausible deniability to if you're an early bombshell where you're not like after someone.

You don't, you're not like, you know, messing up a dynamic that exists already. So you can kind of, you know, become what feels like an OG. And also if you're an early bombshell, they're bringing their best. Like, you're the hottest, as you were saying. Like, that's really nice. Remember when Hoto was like, bitch, you better stop to Iris. She was like, me. She's like, you better stop.

It's like, you don't even know. this girl's name. Like, what are you talking about? What did you think of the lip sync for the beginning opening scene, the music video that they put together? Okay, I'm about to completely expose myself. I kind of fast forward every single time. It's so embarrassing. I get such a new embarrassment. And it's not even that like anyone's bad. Just the whole idea of it is so awkward to me. I feel like if we're going to do it, we should just keep the same song. But like also, why is it seven minutes long? Do you think they had to practice? No, they definitely did. Do you think they're bombshells in...

Were like dancers in the background? Yeah, the background dancers. Do you think they might like, why wouldn't you have gotten... No, I think that would... That would spoil it, I think. A bombshell can't walk in and you're like,

oh my God, girl from the first day. That would be so crazy. But like in the background, where they're kind of blurry? So we'll be the purpose. Yeah. Yeah, I suppose because the islanders were, you know. Those are local hires, baby.

It must have been a lot of work. I'm not a good lip-sinker, so... They all look like they have known that song since they were kids. Imagine like the rehearsals. Oh my God. I mean, that's rough. And I feel like they don't even know if they are like OG cast until they walk into the villa.

So I feel like it just have everyone practicing that. Yeah. I think that's like. So then how do they? They have so many like on standby and so many who could be bombshells and whatever that the first time that they know that they are officially part of the cast is when they walk into it. All right. But then how does that work with producing the opening scene? I feel like they probably just have.

everyone doing it. I think it's like dance moms. Like everyone just drills. Yeah. Or like a drag race. Yeah. Like I want to see them do an acting. So are they cheating it when you see everyone on the boat?

Is that just like a bunch? Is that just like dancers? Yeah. No, but they, you would see some of the main cast on the boat. That's why I'm like, I feel like they have to be told like maybe they film that the day before they go into the villa or something and maybe that's when they're told.

But I'm like there, there, it doesn't make sense because to everyone's point, I'm like the bombshells are not supposed to be. seen by the main cast no matter what. Like they can't even leave their hotel rooms. So I'm like, there's no way that they're filming an opening number and then locking them back up and being like, you'll forget all of this. Maybe they're green screening it. Or maybe they

shoot it like after I don't know. I guess. Did we have a shot of all of them in it? Because maybe they are just shooting them one by one and filming the entire fucking song. Maybe that's why it's so long. That's why it's so long. That's true. Okay. Do you

have any standout favorites among the cast yet. I like sincere and I like Beatrice. When she said, I will not be listening to country music with you. She said I would rather have another disability death. Listen to that.

Was the funny, she's so funny. When she was lying in bed and she was like, I feel like I'm like Neapolitic. I don't know what she said to the guy she was with, but she just seems like a normal person. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. She's authentic to herself. Yeah. She just is like doing her thing. She's not trying

to like perform love island girl. Yes. And I like that. Do need a race between her and sincere at some point. That could be a challenge. Her opening segment. Scoofing after breakfast, you know. Her opening segment when she was talking about the haunted house and how she was like,

the guy said I was going to cut you to pieces that she took off her leg and was like, I'm already in pieces. I'm like, I just love you. I'm literally obsessed with you. Did you have any that you were like, oh, I could do without? Bryce, the model. Yeah, he was like, and also he's 29, it's like, look he like,

you're old. I'm 31, I can say that. I'm like, you're kind of too much of a grown up to be here. So in your mind, what is the age cut off for Love Island? 27. Yeah, I would agree. Yeah. Who was it? It was like, he was like, bam. Trinity. So what year were you born?

I think it's like if you're not under your, if you're not able to be under your parents' health insurance anymore, I don't know if you should be able to go on Love Island. That's 25. 25. No, 26. 26. Hey, hey, Nick, it's 26. It's just, you're in a house with people who are like 23 and 24. Like, what do you guys even talk about?

You didn't watch the same Disney channel. Like, it's hard. It is crazy to hear someone say that they were born in 03. It is kind of like, I don't like hearing. I don't like hearing it. Nope, not happy about it. And then we have Zach who is Charlie's brother. I like him more than Charlie.

Sorry. I saw a post of his last. Zach looks like a Disney character who wished he could be a real human and now he's experiencing the real world. And I like, it really hits. I think he's cute. He's very attractive. He's got like beautiful curly hair. I don't know how I feel about him versus Charlie.

I like them both. We met Charlie. We said this the other day at L.C. On L.A. Very nice. Very charming. Very sweet. Very sweet.

Not very swaggy. You know, which is fine. Yeah. But I want, you know, it seems like something. It seems like last year, like. the women, for whatever reason, we all thought, oh, here's this Charlie guy. It seems like a really good looking guy. Seems really nice. And this, the women didn't seem into him.

And they do seem into Zach in a way they didn't seem to be into Charlie. So wait, so you met Charlie and you were like, okay, I see the charisma deficiency here. It wasn't a deficiency. He was just more like. Because all the time we're watching, we're like, why does no one like him? No. Like, he's got to be short. He's got to have bad breath.

Like, what is it about him? No, he's like, he's like six foot. He's tall. He was very sweet. But like, and not even a deficiency, but it was like, I don't know, maybe in love island, a love island world where you have other more, maybe bigger personalities. Yeah. I was just trying to figure out why he just wasn't like resonating with the women on the cast. But it seems like Zach is.

Charlie's like the serious, like sensitive one. It's giving the Nick Jonas and Zach is the Joe Jonas. Like, you know what I mean? He's got that personality. He's putting himself out there. He's like, yeah, we'll see if I get further than my brother. Like, you know what I mean? Like, he seems playful and fun, whereas Charlie seemed like everything was like brooding and serious.

That does feel like older, brother, younger brother dynamic. Like, that seems pretty, like, part of the course, I think. And I'd take it. But I also felt like, Kenzie kind of felt like she clocked that from the second because she was like, I thought you were Charlie when you walked and she was the first one to walk up and, like, hug him. And I was like, oh, she's going to pair with him. For sure. For sure.

Anyway, shape or form that she can pair with this man, she will. I was shocked that she did. did not stand on the red after he, she was so stressed about him being like, you're not my type. I don't go for blondes. This isn't like what I typically do. And then she was like, I'm going to stay in this relationship. When he was explaining with a waffling after he was just like, I've never dated anyone that looks like you. I typically go for red nuts with like darker features.

And she was just like, I can't read this man at all. I was like, babe, babe, bam. He's telling you straight to your face. He's not interested telling everyone, I don't want to have. hug her. So should I dye my hair? She like has box dye like tomorrow night. She's like so my roots.

I don't know if you can tell, but they actually, they're brown. So I'm really concerned to listen to Britney Spears' blackout album. I was wondering what you thought about that. Were we surprised at K.C. was a standing solo. Was that plants? Yeah. That was a choice. And also like I just feel like whether it's true or not, you just don't tell women you're not

into animals. Like I feel like that's just kind of like a weird deficiency. Sometimes the bit just doesn't land though And like I don't want to not give them I don't want to wait for that bit to land I'm not trying to like kind of wait around and see Because of allergies or something? Well no his answer was also like

Like women like plants Right like it felt like he was standing in front of that door because he thought Oh there's gotta be one One yeah you know like women love planting Edgy you thought like plants over animals is edgy I hate a plant guy I hate a plant guy I hate when I go to a guy's home

And it's like you have plants everywhere Yeah Me too Literally Or he's late because he has to water them No I don't even want to think about The idea of maintaining all of that It's just like

He said happy birthday Here's the bonsai Take care of it So I have an Now I have somebody to fucking take care of Literally And every time I see No I have an errand

That's crazy of you to give me Labor for your birthday You're going to be like How's the bonsai doing? It's dead It's obvious Literally brown. Dehydrated, okay?

That's how it is. Fire hazard at this point. But I was shocked that no one, it couldn't have been the plants that turned everyone off of them. I mean, he works in a nursing home, like takes care of old people. He's got a crazy body. Nursing home doesn't get swaggy to me. And I love, I love the idea that I love a generous heart in that way. But it's not giving like hot, want to be with you.

Like, let's see where this goes. It's giving like, okay, like. Nice. Are you like the cynic who's like, that's nice, but like, why are you doing this? No. It's almost like too nice. No, I think, you know, one of my biggest icks is when people are impatient with the elderly. And so that I think is very sweet.

Very sweet. But it's like, you're sweet, like a friend's sweet. Not like, okay, what are you doing later? Right, right. It's not giving I want to jump your bones. Right. Talking about chivalry? I kind of like that conversation.

I have to admit, embarrassly, I did not know about the right side of the street until I met Natalie. I was like, why am I? walking next to all the cars. You want me to get it? I always like desired to be a chivalrous guy. It was like, you know, hold the door open type of stuff. You know, like, you know, do your part. And I, I know, but it's like, to be clear.

No, I know, but it's like, it's the one thing. And sometimes it even gets a little, like, in the way. Connor tries to do that when we get in the car. And I'm just getting a car. It's like, or also, have you ever been, like, when they get stuck? Like, then a lot of people come and then now you're just like, stuck holding the door for a lot of people. And it's like, okay.

I'll see you up there. Now, just shut it. My big thing is sitting on the inside seat. I hate one of guys that's on the inside seat. It's like, how dare you? Inside seat of what? Like a booth at a table. Like your back should be, yeah, like to exposed.

I should be sitting close to the wall, like, away from the door. I should be the one viewing. What are some other chivalrous things that men should be doing? A lot. The limit does not exist. I don't know. Because it just kind of depends. Like, I feel like I've been a relationship for so long.

But I'm like certain things where I'm like even watching in the city where I brought up the Danielle and Lindsay like how they made up and came to the table. And then they were like, okay, great, we made up or whatever. Like when Kyle turned to Danielle and was like, hey, like, I think you actually owe like my wife an apology. Like I'm like things like that where I'm like having your partners back indefinitely. I feel like that's something that's very chivalrous. Like where it's just like I'm going to pick this battle even just because I feel like you're owed that that honor or that justice where it's like, I don't know. For me, I find that. I find that. I'm just like, I don't know. For me, I find that. to be very chivalrous. I have a lot to say about that for the summer house reunion because that was such a weird thing between West and Amanda. Like, oh, I've got so much to say. I feel like my dad always taught my brothers, like if they're wearing any sort of hat, it was like the second that you walk in a room or you meet someone, like your hat comes off. Like you don't meet anyone wearing a hat. I think helping like women when you see that they're struggling or that they need help, I feel like a lot of men don't do that nowadays. Helping women with luggage.

Oh, my God. Oh, my God. You need to be looking for people to help on the airport if you're a guy. With the West Wilson of it all, now I'm like, is chivalry just, I don't know. Performative? Yeah, like being too chivalrous. And I'm a bit like, okay, now I'm skeptical. Yeah.

You're doing the right things. Would you have the right intention? But then I'm like, I got it. Like, I'm independent. I don't need your help. So one thing about me, feminist. I can carry this myself. Yeah, I do feel like the thing with chivalry is like, I mean, I don't think.

Listen, I'm not dating men. So, like, it's not, like, gendered to me. I think it's really just, like, being intentional and, like, thinking about the person that you're talking to and, like, what they would want in that moment. And it's literally just preemptive thoughts. Being attentive. Yeah, being observant. Without, without the compliment or the acknowledgement, you should, you can, you should, especially if you're being chivalrous for a stranger, you should quickly be forgotten. Exactly.

And, like, be, like, something that I think about later at the day, being like, oh, that was so nice of that guy. Yeah. You know what I mean? Not like, you're welcome. I will say one of my favorite things to do is like call out when men aren't being like me being pregnant and trying to, you know, going through a, and they just shut the door. Like, thank you for holding that for me. I got it.

Don't worry about me. Just. And they're like, oh, I'm sorry. I didn't even see you there. It's like when you saw. Yeah. Who do you think is going to go the distance and who are we worried about like may not last? Bia will definitely go the distance.

Absolutely. Yeah. I think Cato's going to go the distance, even though she's a bombshell. I think Kenzie and Bryce are going to struggle a little. I don't think Kenzie is going to be with us for very long. I don't think so. You don't? I don't think so.

She gives like Kailer energy, but just like not it. Beldasha a bit. Like, yeah, it's just like it's a little too chaotic and a little too like, I don't know how to feel about you. And I like I like I like her. But there's just something that's like very like chaotic energy with her that. I can't wrap my finger on. I mean, she called Zach a cheater after he kissed the vompt. You know.

It's too much. It's too much. But no direction. Exactly. That's kind of the sense I get from her. What do we think about Sean? Do you think he's going to last? He's got spice it up for me a little bit to last.

Yeah. I mean, I don't know. Not with Bia. Also, I don't like it when people like where I'm like, God bless. He was the one that was like, I'm from like five different states. And it's just like, no, you're not. You lived in five different states. Yeah.

But like you were born in Hawaii. You grew up in Arizona. and now you're working in Pennsylvania. Like, it wasn't that hard, but we named like five different states across, like, the greater United States. Harsh. Damn.

That is true. No, laid on the law. I like it. I'm sorry. Honestly, that is so true. Like, it's giving, what's his face from Love is Blind that was like, oh, I'm a nomad

and I work in five different jobs. And it's like, we're doing too much. Yeah. Right. I think Casey is going to be like a slow burn and eventually be really, really great. I actually really like him. I like his, like,

demeanor. I like how he actually asks questions. Bryce and Trinity, they're sitting there and talking and she's like, but how old you are or what year you were? And I go, this man hasn't asked her one follow-up question. Yeah, no. And I was like, you're done for me. Sorry. Like, she's sitting here trying to get to know you trying to connect and you can't even be bothered. You can tell her you're insecurities. But you don't, can't bother to be like, and how about you? Do you have any brothers or sisters? I like Trinity though. I really like Trinity. She was so sweet. Yeah. Also that outfit she had on. That two piece. Can't Can't wear it, but, you know.

Do you think Casey was being a gentleman when he was like, oh, that's who I thought was going to be behind the door? Because certainly that makes her feel chosen in kind of a positive way. You could see his face when it showed when Sincere chose Melanie. And so it was clear that she was coming to sit with him. And you could tell he was like kind of excited. He was like, all right, that's what I wanted. I read it as like politeness. But I think, yeah, okay, you've convinced me.

Right? Like he's kind of like, oh, fuck yeah. And I think they're real conversation. after the fact is what showed that versus like him being like all right well we're coupled up but let me go talk to anybody else you know what I mean I've seen it either way it was really smooth yeah definitely made her feel good I'm here for it Casey can stay in my book should we move on to Summerhouse oh finally well obviously Hunter you had the pleasure of interviewing Sierra and so you've been front and center of obviously this whole storyline I mean do you want to start with reunion part two or do you want to give us any other thoughts leading up to Reunion Part 2 about what surprised you or what has been most interesting to you about this whole saga?

Let's see Reunion Part 2 because I think it does get too a lot of my ideas about Amanda and West and also about how like no one is really talking about how Jesse Solomon asked West if you could hook up, like make it with Sierra and West was so defensive about it and I'm like, wait, did everyone forget?

It wasn't until last night that people were really I don't know, looking at the jesse of it all that I was, I don't know, that just confused me. What did that mean to you? Like, how did you read that? Well, obviously, like, bro code is a lot more important to West than Girl Code is to Amanda. That's pretty shocking.

And then, just the way that people in the house see Sierra as, like, just being beautiful or being sort of replaceable, expendable, maybe. And also how for, like, it looked like West was trying to date Sierra again. He said that he wasn't. And yet,

Okay, well, let's roll back the tapes. Yep. Also, learning, he was dating Meeha the whole summer. And didn't he make out with some girl with Sierra City? Yeah. Sitting on her lap. And then he made out with Sierra. So like, we, okay.

So you just cheated on her twice. When Meeha was telling that story when she's on the phone with Sierra, that was like shocking for me is someone who's, you know, been surrounded by reality TV stars over the years. Like, I've always known there's always been a handful of like Bachelor guys, when I was on The Bachelor. And there's always like a certain type of Bachelor alumni, guy, specifically guy, who they would be known for, like, in always like different season, a group of guy friends would go out.

And they would use their kind of insider baseball of being, you know, they would try to like pick up girls because they would be like, I can get you on the show and stuff like that. And just trying to like talk about the show in a way that was like, well, you don't know what it's like. Let me tell you about it. Kind of like put themselves in this. kind of weird position of power and listening to her story how west was trying to like well you don't want to go on and i'll get fired i'll get fired and that just like obviously it's a different type of storyline it just it like i just it like a light

bubble in on my head it just reminded me me me hearing i would like have women friends some of which would eventually get on the show and they'd tell me like i know i met that guy a few years back he told me all this crazy bullshit yeah and it just like and it's true that like so many people who are fans of these shows you know, that's why we do this show because there's so many like, what is it really like? Is it real? Is it not real? Like, how does you know, how does the producers work, you know, like storylines and things like that? And it was just like, it had such an icky feeling that clearly West is using his like celebrity in the, in the fascination that people have with these shows is a way to kind of control and manipulate the women in his lives. And it was just like so kind of like, yeah, just a little, little icky. Because I've seen it. met much over the years with other people in reality TV and it was just like the same type of theme of and the guys I know who did that were always like this the trashiest of guys who just like

really used their being on TV for a few minutes just to like score uh with women that really drives home the point that I think Sierra and Carl were making like in their little huddle where she said okay so he was dating Meeha but wouldn't bring her on the show um he was publicly single of course he's going to choose someone like Amanda who's technically married and not available to him so that he can really, you know, use her as, you know, some kind of like white knight narrative for himself, but doesn't actually have to commit, doesn't actually have to be a boyfriend. Can I just say that I said this during the season? You did.

Because I literally was just like, of course he would go for Amanda. She's committed. She's fully married. The process of her getting divorced and having that clear to then therefore action. be single is enough time for West to be like, oh my God, I'm so sorry. I'm not interested anymore. What do you feel like his game plan was? I think he thought that Amanda, like kind of what Kyle said, I think that he thought Amanda was about to get the Ariana Maddox, the, she's going to leave her husband or like Kyle's going to be the villain of the season with this

fight. If I'm in her corner, I'm in the background, I'm the guy that had her back. I'm the support system. I'm the reason why she felt comfortable safe enough to leave. Therefore puts West in this like, oh, like he checks on his guy friends. He's there for the girls. And then that way, if they did decide to do something or come out with something, we've seen him being supportive of her this entire time. So it's almost like, do you feel like he did that hoping that fans would then start like sipping them, you know, the whole like, oh, we want you guys to date.

And then the fans would almost give West and Amanda a permission structure to actually be like, no, well, maybe we should. And then they would, you think that was it? 100%. That kind of makes sense. Yeah. Maybe I'm naive, but it would, it surprises me that he would be that calculating, like, that he's seeing, okay, I think there's a, you would actually want people to ship them together. I think so. I would have agreed with you until I heard that Miha story. And it's like, I think so too, because look at how, okay, you can watch any past reunion with Amanda, especially with Kyle, Amanda's got an opinion. Amanda has something to say. And I feel like her and West sat down together and we're like, hey, whatever conversations that we've had between each other, it's between.

us. We don't owe them anything where I'm just like the whole point of the reunion is to clear up any confusion that has happened throughout the season. So the fact that every time they're asked a question about something personal, Amanda is all of a sudden answering in routine like, well, West and I had that conversation. I would love to know what Wes could possibly have said to you to make you feel comfortable with making out with a man who's had a girlfriend for a year. Yeah. And also fucking over your best friend in the process. I would really love to know how that conversation went done. But somehow you both are in cahoots that we don't owe you guys anything. Yeah, that makes sense to me. One of the craziest moments of the reunion to me was Amanda saying, well, it was a private conversation. It was personal between West and I, like, why I, you know, trust him all this. I'm like, whoa, whoa, hold on. Sorry, do you know you're on a reality TV show? Do you, all this up with Kyle that you guys were going through? You had no problem sharing it because that's part of the job. But now of a sudden with West, you have to like, because they're lying, obviously, and the timeline doesn't make any sense. But also because that's just so disrespectful to like the entire format.

I think that's like breaking Bravo's cardinal rule. Like suddenly it's private? No, sorry. It's also so disrespectful to Sierra. Just another thing of like Sierra has opened up about her relationship with West throughout this entire like season. And it's disrespectful both from Amanda and West of like, oh, so Sierra can be the one that like you have to drag through all of this together.

Yeah. Even when it's Amanda, it's like, okay, let's keep this private. And she does it knowing she at time doesn't want to. Like what was it like the other reunion last year where she talked about just the challenges of like, you know, how fans are. It's like, you have to be open, you give yourself to the show, you talk about these uncomfortable things and knowing how fans and shows and podcasts will all react and dissect it.

And that is like hard to deal with it, but she does it anyways. And then you have Amanda being like, nah. That's Lindsay's point. She's like, I've sat here in the exact same hot seat. Everyone's giving me shit and I've never gotten up and left. Granted, she is an evolved human, like Mother Hubbard. But I mean, the line of the reunion of last night. episode for me was

Sierra saying, well, but she is historically insecure. Like, what am I going to say? That was hilarious. That was, I read it down. She's historically had low self-esteem. I didn't lie. The entire cast, a theme that they kept

repeating is you don't date your best friend's ex. That was a line that, like, that was like their main point, which makes a lot of sense. And every time they said that, I don't know if it's editing or whatever, but they paned to Amanda, who's annoyed every time they say that.

One time I think she was smirking, almost laughing. And it just clearly, for me, tells me that, like, Amanda, like, it was discounting that. She's doing the thing that even, like, the few Amanda fans are out there where there's, you know, well, they didn't technically date, which is totally not the point when it comes to, like, this relationship. That's just how West has been explaining it to her. Like, well, we never, I never, like, officially asked her. The same way you didn't officially date.

The same. Yeah. And the best part of that, too, is that. that somebody on the internet, I saw a clip where they were like, they definitely dated and then played a scene from this season of the boys in the kitchen late night. And KJ, it was talking about Jesse wanting to hook up with Sierra. And like, KJ's like, yeah, that's messed up. Like, you guys dated. Like, that was your girlfriend. And that, and West is like, yeah. So it's like, you're agreeing to it on camera. And yet this like weird argument on the internet

of like whether or not they dated. It doesn't matter. No one gives a fuck about how long Sierra and West dated. The fact of the matter is that they were involved with each other and each other's storyline for the last two to three years. So therefore, as somebody who's sitting in the bed with Sierra watching her cry over this man and then to still have the audacity to have feelings for him and pursue it, then that's on you. Like, that's what did Sierra say? Where she was like, if you're gonna roll around in the mud, you're gonna get dirty. Like, stop acting. And that's what I'm saying, her like, Amanda, victimizing herself and like, I need a minute because like, what, that it's embarrassing that you had to tell Sierra that you made out with a guy that has a girlfriend,

that happens to be her ex. Yeah, that's, fucking embarrassing. Yeah, because you're being embarrassed. Like, literally. Sorry, Eva. But that's what you need a moment for. Like, we can't keep doing this. Like, you don't get to walk off every two seconds, but then you're also giving us nothing when you're on stage. Was it Amanda when they were, when it was West and Amanda

in the backstage? It was Amanda to West when she was saying, it was hard to hear. She said, are you talking about trusting him? Like, she was like, it's frustrating that they keep trying to get me to not trust you. And you know, it's so it's, it felt like

In that moment, you know, when like we have a bad feeling, but we don't want it to be true. So we do the thing where we check in with the friend or someone because we want them to hear us. And like, almost confirm it. It's not true. Yeah. Tell us. Tell me I'm crazy. Am I crazy?

Because like, they're saying this. And I don't think it's true. But like, like. And he said nothing. He said just breathe. Just breathe. Oh, like. Breathe.

Oh, he's delivering it simple. Are you even present in this conversation? Well, he wasn't because she was venting to him in the first part and he's on his phone texting someone. No, it's giving very much like Amanda is West. girlfriend, but West is not, or no, excuse me, West is Amanda's boyfriend, but Amanda is not his girlfriend. A hundred percent. And also, when Lindsay started it off saying, West, no one's going to believe anything that you have to say, you're pathy. And, like, not only him, like, agreeing with her,

but then shutting his mouth. And, like, that's what I'm saying is that I'm like, these two people are either, like, on some sort of cocktail where it's just like, oh, if I'm going to have adrenaline, I'm just going to shut up. Or it's just like, you're so wanting to get through this reunion that you're okay with anybody saying anything about you. Well, that's West. I think that that's absolutely insane. Being a reality, TV, personality, whatever, that I'm just like, you're not even going to defend your position as to why you should come back next season. Andy started this reunion with you shit the bed last reunion and you said you weren't

going to do that. We're two episodes in. One left. What could you possibly have to say? Question for you guys. Yeah. Maybe this is a weird comparison to make, but it makes me think of like Monica in Salt Lake City season four reunion where it's like she comes in thinking she had this all figured out with like

kind of West, if we're going along with the theory that West kind of like saw that Amanda, he was kind of trying to do that thing where he comes in and goes on Amanda's coattails as she gets this quote unquote Arionmatics treatment, is he trying to like game that system in the same way Monica did of like kind of going outside of like the Bravo. You know what I mean? Like trying to make himself this central guy. Well, that's the part I don't know if he's that. Yeah.

You know what I mean? Or is that too? I'm getting too. I think you're giving him too much credit. Yeah. We're talking about a silly goose. Yeah. That is true.

He is at the end of the day. West Wilson. Yeah. Yeah. But I do think, I mean, this is sort of unpopular, but I do, I did like the moment when Kyle tells Amanda, fuck you. And Wes moved his chair over to sit next to her. Because I know that that's been like, you know, were they having a fair than whatever. But I think, as he said in the reunion, like, someone else has to say that, like, that's not an appropriate way to talk to your wife.

And it's only been the women. And I like that whenever the man around that table is quite. and Ben is like defending Kyle's DJ career for some reason. And I love Kyle. He's like Princess Diana to me. But some like other guy should stand up and say like this is not right. Like this needs to end. I thought that was kind of a miss for the rest of the guys at the reunion because that

was the one moment where West and Amanda were making sense. Yeah. But like why wasn't Jesse or Carl or KJ in that moment being like, yeah. You know, because it was, it gave West an opportunity. And he was right. Like I'm a piece of shit. I might, you know, backstead my guy friends. all those things, but I don't speak to women that way.

And like that was a very valid thing to say that I thought like was a missed opportunity for the Jesse and the Carls and the KJs. I did want to know Carl's reaction to Amanda. I think Andy asked her, did you feel like none of the other men had ever spoken up for you or defended you? I mean, Carl, like, they're pretty good friends. And I don't know if that's true that Carl's never defended her to Kyle. I don't know.

I guess not in that like physical of a way. I do think that part of the fight, though, was sort of about his treatment of Amanda. I mean, it was mostly about the sophomore thing, which I understand, but I think some part of it. Because afterwards, he, you know, was hugging Amanda, not a long hug, like the West hug, but was, like, that's not right. Like, that's fucked up. Like, he's a loser. And he said that, too, when he was having a conversation in the backyard with somebody about, like, where he's at with Kyle. And he was like, I understand how Amanda feels now because he would choose that DJ deck over, like, any of us in a burning house.

And it's just like, so I feel like that fight did escalate. from you getting up, him getting up with Amanda and the whole thing. But like, yeah, I think part of it too was just like, I would have guessed that because they were talking about that whole you're a dumbass bitch and the conversation in the bathroom that the whole sock over the microphone thing that West did would have come out of like, why did you? I wonder if maybe that's coming in the next episode. But I do hope that that is addressed of like, why did you feel the need to cover your mic?

And what is it that you said that you didn't want the audience hearing? I also just think that West really is just a little clout demon. So it's just like even that whole bit where it's like Amanda is getting up and leaving. I'm like to have her ex-husband, still husband, whatever, like, and friends telling you to go after your girl. And like the only reason. And he's fighting with Lindsay who's like, be a man, go after her. And he's like, what? So you can talk shit about the fact that we both left?

Huh? Like that's where your head is. What? But it's the same thing with Amanda. Whenever West, like this was obviously fraudulent when he's like, oh, my my nudes were just leaked. Like, oh, what am I going to do? And her response is, oh my God, like, why haven't I ever gotten needs from you? That's weird from both sides.

I don't get it. They don't react to like, and I don't want to like police, you know, how someone should respond to something. But if my friend, if either of those things happen, my first off would be like, are you okay? How can I support you? What's going on and not like thinking about the perception from other people. Right. Yeah. Or even then, if my boyfriend is new.

are being released in his hometown. Who were they for? Like, I have other questions besides why didn't I get one? Also, if those new, if his phone was actually hacked in those nudes really, no, people will be leaking screenshots, text messages, all of that stuff. Like, that's more valuable than fucking whatever his dick looks like. A hundred percent. And honey, the top of it said, it was a Snapchat sent to you by Westling Tonrad. So it's like, you sent these intentionally. And if you sent it to your doctor on Snapchat, I've got more questions for you. Wait, you guys, Justin just, just. showed me an incredible meme.

It says hot take West isn't defending himself because he would love for Amanda to take Dara, Mia, and Lindsay and Sierra's advice and leave him. I mean, honestly, that makes so much sense. But that was the only... The biggest frustrating point for me was the episode is that you had Dara make so much sense.

I mean, everyone's made so much sense. It's not hard to make sense about... And then Amanda's this like, other than crying and leaving, she's like, Yeah. Like I want to, I wanted Andy to like push. I want a response. Well, no, but she said it's personal. That was a private conversation. Blah, blah, blah. I'm not sharing anymore. No, but it's more about this.

It would be really crazy if you went from the Kyle show to the West show. Yeah. Yeah. And she goes, yeah. But I want to know, like, what is, what do you think about what all these women and some of which were, at least were friends? And they're making some. And West is agreeing. He's not disagreeing. So how can you move forward, knowing that they're saying this about him. He is agreeing. And in the words of Mia, like, what are you doing? You know, like, what?

I just want to hear her explain her thought process. And if she's going to say, listen, he's going to be like that with you, but not with me, as we've all, like, thought that way. And, you know, just, I want to hear her say that. I want to hear some version of why she thinks it will be different than everyone else. And what even though he agrees. that he's done this. I mean, you see a clip of, you know, episode three.

And he's like, I've lied to a lot of women. So why is Amanda think she's going to be different? I do. I mean, after hearing this meme, I do sort of see that West has gotten trapped in this relationship in some way where he thought that Amanda wouldn't blow up, like, their whole friendship or their whole friend group, their whole lives to be with him. And then she decided that that was worth it to her. And now he's like, okay, book.

Now I'm like, now I'm stuck. Now, maybe that's why he's so, like, loki agreeing with everyone, begging her to leave him just because he's like, I've got girls on Delancey Street. Like, I don't want to be here anymore. He's like, hey, Amanda, I know you're taking a break and you're like, really, but can you come back out because they're saying some really things,

some great things you should hear? They're making some really good points. I would love me to be out here. It's so true, man. It's a classic man playbook of get you to break up with me rather than... Yeah. Maybe the villain.

Maybe the villain. The fact that when a man Amanda left and they were like, go get her, go get her. And he's like, well, I just don't know if there's more questions coming for me. It's like, girl, you're stupid. You are actually the star of the show. Yeah. We'll talk about Ben's family stuff for 10 minutes and then we'll come back to you.

Like, don't worry. Yeah, like no one cares what, like what are we going to talk about? Jesse Solomon's music career. Amanda just locked up. Hold on. I like it. Into my own. I'm a streamer of Jesse Solomon's music.

Okay. I have a very, I actually have a very, very important question for you. You're on a desert island and you can only listen to one artist for the rest of your life. Here are your choices. Kyle Cook, Tom Sandoval and the most extras. Jesse Solomon, Drake. Sounds like Jesse Solomon. You know what?

I'm going to say Drake. That's what I said to. That's what I said to. Because there's so many, there's just so much music. There's so much material. You can go back. Yeah. Like I can live on tape care for sales.

I'll listen to Kyle Cook's mixes. I know them all. Yeah, exactly. I saw him going hard with Gracie Abrams and I said, I could be here. Why did Jesse look so scared the whole reunion? I think that he's genuinely like sad and afraid about the friendships ending because there's no way they can come back. Even if, even if West and Amanda by some, you know, fluke in the Matrix come back to the show, you would just be so bizarre. Like, how can you even break bread with them?

Well, I don't think they'll come back to Summer House, but in the city, I think Amanda's a mainst- Yeah, yeah, she is. So I'm curious. Like, so obviously right now, everything's intense, but fast forward five years. And let's say in the city's a hit still, it's still on TV. And let's say by some miracle, Wes and Amanda are still together. Like how much time has to pass and what relationships milestones do Wes and Amanda have to have for us to like, be like, oh, well, if they're happy, I guess. to be okay with them being like maybe maybe

maybe compatible respectfully this is so clearly not going to work it's not even worth the thought exercise like five years from now like five years from now try like five weeks from now it's just so not going to happen what was your gut reaction when glamour article

comes out they are at the Yankees game kissing It was honestly just shocking. And it seemed so weirdly, obviously, intentional. And KJ later said that he was supposed to go to that game with West. But it's like, okay, if you're going to like try to do this distraction thing, at least, look, like put your heart into it. Like, hit your mark.

It was so embarrassing. Like, it looked so fake. It looked so, so fake. And that, to me, was more of a market. of actual cruelty to that's not like not image management that's like okay we're going to make out of this game so obnoxiously you're really trying to take something from sierra and not like promote your own honesty that's why it was so weird 100% do we believe Amanda when she fast forward in the city which was great editing by the bravo by the way where they kind of did

the flashback. The glitching? I was like, I literally thought I was watching. I thought I was watching. I thought I was watching the ring. I was like, she's giving Samara. They're like, in the city's production value kind of rocks.

It's literally like a Nora Ephron movie and then it's Bravo. It's so awesome. Their title cards are amazing. But do, I know she's hard to believe right now because it seems like they've been telling so many lies. But what do we make of Amanda being like, I know I saw it's going to look,

but in that moment, these were two friends. And this was, what did we make of that? I think at that point, she probably had feelings for West because the way that she was laying it on so thick on the beach during Summer House with Mia saying like, if West wants to date her, he needs to be like the best version of himself, like she deserves so much blah, blah, blah. That was the so like, hmm, huh. So you were kind of thinking about if he's boy for material or not. That's weird.

But I do think that she maybe had feelings for West but was like trying to not acknowledge it. It seemed like a very bit theatrical to me how she was just burying them both up. Yeah. Laying it on thick. This is all I've wanted. Okay. Well, fast forward a couple months. Okay.

We started the episode talking about how now we think Amanda saying we slept together after the statement that she was referring to her statement with Kyle, not her statement with West. Because that kind of makes the timeline makes sense. remember when West said we got serious in February. So usually with serious means you're casual at some portion beforehand that if you guys slept together after she announced that she's officially

leaving Kyle. And then hearing Wes say that he felt Kyle wanted to rush that was really sad. That was one of the moments and I was like, wow, that just really sucks. And I mean like, I couldn't even tell my family. Like you just wanted to press in within the next hour. Yeah. And then Amanda being like, I didn't like

going out with Kyle, which is basically, it's like She hated him. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of, you could see that even on like like three seasons ago, whenever everything he did, she would just like,

you know, not want to do it, get mad at him for like starting something at the table. Like all of the stuff, I'm like, you guys don't need to be together. It was like giving like Lindsey and Carl low key. I will say though,

Kyle still has me lost on the like, you never wanted to go out with me. And it sounds like all he wanted to do is this kind of party and go out late nights where it's just like maybe they just like, I don't think that is a baseline for like, a good relationship to be like you have to party with me all the time. Sure.

And maybe they just didn't like doing the same thing. But he was always very open about that. Thank you. Like that's always going to be a part of his character. Whether it's a good thing or a bad thing, he's always wanted that. And consistent since season one. And like that was the whole thing. He didn't want to be serious with Amanda.

He broke up with Amanda before starting the show. And she came out as the 2 a.m. hookup being like, oh, well, let you forget me. And knowing that Amanda is now apparently going out a lot to the point where Kyle can clock it. That's what I'm saying. I'm like, I don't, I think she like, honestly, if I'm talking from my perspective, I think Amanda liked what came with Kyle as Summer House was growing. And I think she knew that if she didn't lock Kyle down, she would no longer be a part of that. I don't think she got married and all of that just to stay on a TV show because that would actually be psychotic. But like, I do think that the pros of what came with being with Kyle outweighed the cons of actually being in the relationship with Kyle for her. So she chose everything that came with it and then just complained about Kyle on camera. And also I thought it was weird when they brought up the fact that like they used, he said they used Summerhouse as therapy. So four to six months of whatever they weren't discussing or talking about was them living together and then that they brought it all into the house to talk about it and work through

things. Like that's not a healthy relationship at all. He also said recently that they, they had to start watching it separately because they would, if they watched it together, they would just start arguing again over what it was that they were arguing about on the show. Yeah. So they had to watch it separately so that way they could like process it separately and then have a conversation. But even the walk in in the city, they were kind of talking about that too or they're just like, okay, like, you know, she's saying that she's going to get her year long lease,

but it's not a divorce. Right. Sure. But like she was like, we can't continue to like sweep everything under the rug and act like everything's okay for the process to start all over again, which I thought was the whole point of couples therapy. But to get a whole ass year-long lease without talking to your husband who you're not not even separating, she said, let alone divorcing.

I'm like, I'm just saying that the mental gymnastics that we're doing to just not say that we're leaving our husband is actually wild. But then it's also she has the whole argument at the reunion where Sierra is calling her out for going out now with West and doing all these things that she didn't want to do with Kyle. And her whole thing is like, well, I'm not married. Yeah, which what difference does that make? That is so weird.

I would like to go out to clubs while I'm in a relationship. I also don't like going out to clubs if I were single. I'd probably go to a bar, maybe. But like, you know what I mean? It's like the way that she's saying like, well, I can stay up until 2 a.m. Now because I'm single. I'm not married anymore. And it's like, well, first of all, yes, I think it's more of the drasticness.

I mean, she almost described herself as like this hermit who like never left her house. Like this, you know, I just stay in my bed and whatever. And now all those things I'm saying. Because I'm single. Because I have to be? Like, they're kicking us out of the bar. It's a prerequisite. Once you're single, you can stay out till 5 a.m.

But I mean, I sort of think that, like, I really sympathize with Kyle's hurt at this reunion, like, in this whole, even on in the city. But I do think that he's reacting to the fact that he never really prioritized Amanda throughout their marriage. And now that she has clearly, like, done the same to him, that hurts. And I maybe think that Amanda is kind of, you know, rightly or wrongly reveling in that that he finally sees how valuable she has been to him. And so now, yeah, she's going to spend the block and, like, show him how fun she can be, all of this stuff. It does kind of feel a bit of informative to me that she's choosing someone that really rubs in Kyle's face.

Like, I could always be that person. It's just like you were such a bad husband that I couldn't be with you. It also seemed like when they were giving Kyle's flowers and empathizing with like when Sierra is like, you know, I apologize to Kyle because I realize it. you know, he was going through things at the time. The look on Amanda's face seemed so pissed. She just seemed so frustrated that people were seeing his side of things and empathizing with him because, and then,

I don't know what was behind that, but she seemed truly angry. Like, it would just, like, it got to her in a way that, like, kind of aligns with your theory about how she's, like, been handling, she's almost been prioritizing, you know, like this getting over this relationship with Kyle is really driving her decisions. which is, you know, pretty relatable and human. Yeah. And I'm going to play like a little bit, sorry, devil's advocate when it comes to Kyle

because I'm also kind of like, you're also seeing her look for something in West that she did have with Kyle. Because I'm like, if you think about it every time that it goes a little too far, Kyle's the first person. As I said, whether it was in the city being like, hi, you owe her an apology, even though she didn't bring it up or talk about it. Or when Sierra said what she said, which wasn't really to me that harsh. But he was like, hey, like that, that's a little too harsh. I'm like he's always still defending Amanda where I'm like that's his role like I think that's what he did as a husband where I'm like listen I don't agree with how he spoke to her I don't agree how he pops off but I will say that I'm like that man loved Amanda still loves Amanda and like wants

to have her back and doesn't like hearing people talk about her that way even when he was on the street interviews convincing her to come to the into this in the city premiere like I'm like this man has her back and I'm like that's something that she's going to have to also realize that were, like, you complained about his partying or his extracurricular habits, but also didn't help him with paying rent, didn't help him with his suffering business that you guys are supposed to be a part of. You're the one that didn't want a pre-up when he tried to encourage you guys to have one. So it's like he's done a lot of things to try to protect you in ways that you also don't know about either. So I'm like, I think she's going to really see what it's like to not actually

have a man as your partner. Well, it's a real paradox that Kyle is so ready and willing to defend her or like maybe to kind of see her side of some of these back and forth. Whereas I'm like, West, what in the world? Someone is like telling your girlfriend to shut the fuck up. Like, rightly or wrong. You know, whatever. And you're just sitting there. Literally, she was called a side bitch to her face and he has nothing to say.

Yeah. Not even like my favorite side bitch. Like I would take this up at that point, West, then just like, nothing. That's crazy to me. She's at least fine shit. Like, he's not even saying that. No. If you're my boyfriend.

sorry, you need to say something. He's literally agreeing. Bethany Frankel, Portia. These women were like gotten out of their seat already to defend her. If like they were on one of those shows that he's just sitting there like mute, not saying anything. The only thing he can offer in the first episode was like, well, you were technically single event. Like, oh my God. The way he offered it to her though, not to the room.

No, it was like he's prompting her. That's the best you have. Oh my God. It's like, it's like an amateur hour. And then his advice, his advice when they're breaking is like all things she can do better. you know and not anything of like how can he i mean i guess he did ask of like oh can i pop in more and then she says no and he doesn't but he doesn't again the chivalry thing oh my god thank god it's like it's the shiverly thing we're talking about love island of like all it is is would be

like yeah amanda said no but it's like obviously she wants you to fucking support her yeah hunter what did you think of amanda's reaction to lindsay monetizing to uber eats Well, to me, I'm like, girl, whatever. Like, first of all, the ad was funny. And I think that Amanda was really reacting to the fact that like she's not at the center of like everyone's mind in that moment. Because as both Lindsay and Carl said, people that they were concerned about that they, you know, wanted approval from was Kyle and Sierra because they didn't want to add on to their hurt. Amanda, why would they center you and they're thinking about this? That was weird.

That was weird. And then Sierra making that point about how she felt like West and Amanda had, you know, use this like buzzword language racially. Like I see you. I'm not overlooking you. And Amanda saying, that just like really hurts. Like that makes me feel so hurt. I'm like, is this for real?

She said, no. That's the best you have is that you feel hurt as this woman is saying that literally she thinks are like weaponizing, woke language against her experience. experience. Oh my God. And then not even a few minutes later, we have Amanda being like, I just feel like Wes like sees me. Yep. Evil. Yeah. Evil. Yeah. But I asked Sierra this in our glamour interview if she feels like Amanda is or has been jealous of her and she said that she didn't know. But I do sort of think in those moments where Amanda clearly like is familiar enough with Sierra's thoughts, feelings, emotions that she'll use her language against her. That's weird. That's like the scary, shade. like in the gutter stuff that really grosses you brought up a couple of things that made me like one I've said this

a couple times before but I know it was like back in like January February where West started posting his thoughts on politics I noticed the shift of like him posting it and then hearing Sierra talk about her passion about the importance of the politics

these days and what it means for her dating it just was like I know maybe it's like too deep in the weeds but it felt performative for West to do it then and it makes you wonder just like how calculated he was because it just seemed like such a choice all of a sudden to start talking politics at a time where you never saw that from him and then having dara be like you want to be liked by everyone yeah you do shit to be liked what you're saying that reminds me of west like the first party in his first season that he went to he only brought black friends into the

house which always struck me as being like okay i can see how that's like cool but now i'm like that's sort of like weird of you to do. It's weird of you to only bring black friends to one episode when they were not really in other episodes. And it just all kind of feels slimy. It all feels very calculated. Even his like corporation of KJ where it's just like I personally like I think KJ is an absolute darling, but I also feel like he's not somebody that mentally should be in the reality TV space. I think that and I feel like it was irresponsible of West knowing that KJ is going through so much, not only to bring him into the house, but then to find out that, you know, KJ went to a facility and was dealing with actual really deep stuff in the first time that

West is hearing about this is on the stage. I thought this was your friend. I thought this was your buddy. So you know what I mean? And you're the person that brought this man on this show. And it's Sierra and Mia who have taken him under their wings and have made sure that he's okay. But you don't know what's going on with your friend. That's weird. You know, and it's it's one thing to go back to part one of the reunion. When Sierra even was saying to West, it's like, oh, you treat your friend like that. And it's like just to watch and Kyle like saying that West is the most immature phony he's ever met. It's just like yeah, is there anything behind this kind of like performative needing to be liked version of West Wilson? That's actually him just being true to himself or is he

doing everything with the intention of other people reacting to him. And coming back to the monetization thing because Sierra did say that where it was just like, oh, we're upset with our friends for monetizing off of a situation but we can fuck our friends ex. Like the bars and hell, first of all. Yeah, where is the bar? And second of all, I was like, it's weird to me, I would never do that with your breakup. Fine, sure, you didn't do it with Carl and Lindsay's breakup.

At the same time, you did do a Buffalo Wild Wings ad where you literally just ripped your husband's personality to shreds. So I'm just like, it was every date being like a terrible date and one was like a DJ, one was a guy who's obsessed with having fun. And I'm like, so you have no problem when you're the one that fucked over your husband. You have no problem monetizing off of that and making it funny and silly with your Westie. But like if Lindsay and Carl make an ad about something Kyle said, not even involving you two really, like that's what's too far.

It's the, uh, the Iowa never is very like synodered around. Like it's very situational about how it affects you and not like grounded in some type of like right or wrong. Yeah. But it's a false equivalence for her to say that, uh, that they're monetizing her breakup. No, no, no, no. They're monetizing like a meme. Yeah. They didn't make, they didn't do an ad about like her and Kyle's statement because like that, like, that. I can see as being hurtful. Yeah. Otherwise, I'm like, girl, what? No, you're not at this. No one cares what you think.

Like, okay, double tap and move on. We care about Carl. And it's Carl Luke. I also, I did think a great sign or moment. It seems like Sierra is ready or maybe already moved on. And I'm curious if you got that thought interviewing her because they were, like, you saw a preview of three in this episode where she's basically like, Amanda's like, I'm so sorry I hurt you, blah, blah, blah.

And Sierra's like, no, you're not. And I feel like that's a great sign of someone. ready to move on because I think sometimes what keeps us stuck in these things is like that need to feel like the people you thought cared about you care or like they're upset that they wronged you in some way that kind of equilibrium of like I gave so much of my emotions to this friendship this relationship and you fucked me over and it like hurts that it seems like you don't go fuck yeah and the fact that Sierra is kind of like you know what you didn't give a fuck and honestly that truth is like freeing I think it it's in my relationship experience

is that was like a first step for me to be like, I'm kind of ready to be. I see these people who they are now and what I hope they would be to me. And I feel like, because these reunions, they have to like stay in it. You know,

not necessarily perform, but they have to like, they can't move on before they film the stuff to talk about things that we want to hear them talk about. But her saying those moments, I think it was a great sign

that she seems to be really ready to just be done with these two and actually like emotionally move forward. Yeah. I didn't get that sense only because when, we sat down. It was, I think, two weeks after the statement, like, confirming their relationship. And then it was maybe a week and a half before the reunion. And she was still, like, very much, you know, learning new stuff in the hurt and pain and teared up. But I kind of heard the same thing from you. And it's weird then because I think I'm hearing kind of the same thing from Amanda. Except in the opposite way of Amanda's like, I have nothing to say for myself. I really don't care, you know, who's her or I can say that I do. But look at her reaction. Like, she's not coming from a. place of here's what I want you to know about this.

Here's what I want to clarify as West began the reunion saying. She's just kind of like, okay, everyone's going to take their shots at me and I'm going to cry and then guess what? I'm hurt by this too. She's triggered. That's crazy that she was like, I get triggered. I mean, it's like you don't see the effect of her actions hurting her friends on her at all.

Even when KJ said it would really hurt me that you didn't text me, Amanda. And she's like, well, I only texted people who are, like, involved. It's like, everyone is in this friend group. Everyone lives in the house, except for like, Bailey's imaginary friend, that girl. I'm like, no, everyone should get a text. When he was like, all right, Levi, so that's role that's done with you, thanks so much. Poor thing. She's like, all right, bye.

She was like, so great to meet you. He's like, yeah, you too. I hope to see you again. She's like, me too. I also loved when Bailey in part one, too, when she was like, at least I'm not getting fired or getting dumped here. And I was like, are we trying to assure that we are not getting fired? Before we let you let you go, Hunter, what is something you hope you get to see

for part three of the reunion that you're worried you might not see? I think that I want to hear Amanda make a case for how she and West can exist as a couple beyond this drama because I don't think she's ever really said that and said like what gives her confidence not in that he is not going to like treat her badly

but that they can build a relationship from this place. And it can't be. it's been a private conversation. Exactly. We need to know what you'll have said. Yeah, like what makes you confident that West is going to show up for you six months from now or 12 months from now.

Or, you know, because if this friendship and this group of friends is willing to throw it all away to Sierra's point or just the Internet's point, like it better work out. Like this needs to be it for you because that's the only version where we're all kind of like, you know,

I guess they're happy to have. I just don't see what they have beyond West defending. her to Kyle. I don't think that their relationship can exist beyond Kyle's bad behavior. And I wonder how she feels. Or just like him picking her because in a, in a. Or like what if the show, what if they don't want either of you back? Yeah. Like that'll be the relationship. I'm like, because that's the only reason why West is in this. When Kyle's fully removed from the photo and he's not involved in their lives whatsoever anymore, like what else do you have? Yes. What else can he help you with, you know? A foundation of lives. It's a good one. Hunter, this has been so much fun talking about this stuff with you. Thank you. Where can people find all the great stuff that you're doing and enjoy your work? Okay, I have a podcast.

Let me say this. It's now with Higher Ground Audio. I have a substack called Hung Up and it's Hunter Harris. com and I'm just on the internet. Okay. Amazing. Well, it was so much fun. Come back.

We'll certainly have a lot of TVs to talk about with you, but it was really fun breaking this all down with you. Thank you. This is so fun. Thanks for coming. That will do it for today's episode. Thank you to our guest, Hunter Harris, and Jamie Lynn Siegler. Don't forget to buy her book.

The memoir is, and so it is, a memoir of acceptance and hope. And don't forget to check out my substack. I just dropped a new essay. What do you want to call it? Article. What I hope to teach my daughters from the Scamanda Saga. Dropped it yesterday. If you haven't read it, check it out, this one is free.

So get it while it is. Also, don't forget to check out the Amanda Francis episode. Her and Eddie, her husband, Eddie, came to talk about whether she will or won't be back, whether she is going to buy Doreen's house or not. Lots to get into with her. She's a fascinating person, and it's a fascinating interview. Be sure to check that out as well.

We'll see you on Monday. Goodbye.