The Viall Files - E1179 - Let's Marry Harry Finalists & Kelsey Darragh

Episode Date: August 27, 2026

Welcome back to The Viall Files: Reality Recap!   Kelsey Darragh is back to talk about her new book Don't Do What I Did and all things pop culture. Later, Amber, Danelle, and Sam from Let's Marry Harry join us right after the reunion to talk about their experience on the show, what happened with Harry after filming, and the timeline everyone is trying to piece together. Plus, we get into Double Lives of Suburban Wives. You won't want to miss it! "He was tangled in a web of his own lies."  Nick is on Substack! Subscribe here: https://nickviall.substack.com/subscribe  HEY! YOU! DO YOU NEED DATING AND RELATIONSHIP ADVICE?  Email [e-mail] and be a part of future Ask Nick episodes! Want ad free episodes and incredible bonus content?  Start your 7 Day Free Trial of Viall Files + here: https://viallfiles.supportingcast.fm/   Subscribe to The ENVY Media Newsletter Today: https://www.viallfiles.com/newsletter  To Order Nick's Book and/or learn more about the show, go to: https://viallfiles.com THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS:  Quince: Download the Quince app for app-exclusive offers, or go to https://quince.com/viall   Bilt: Download the Bilt app and join the membership for where you live, at https://joinbilt.com/viall   Caraway: Visit https://carawayhome.com/VF10 or use code VF10 at checkout to take an additional 10% off your next purchase.  Merit Beauty: Merit Beauty is offering our listeners their Signature Makeup Bag free with your first order at https://merit beauty.com   Nanit: You can learn more about Nanit on their website at https://nanit.com   To advertise on this podcast please email: [e-mail] or go to: https://advertising.libsyn.com/theviallfiles   Timestamps: 0:00 - Intro 0:13 - Kelsey Joins 5:58 - Remembering Dolly Parton 9:18 - Lindsey Clancy Case Discussion 16:27 - Double Lives Of Suburban Wives Recap 32:27 - Amber, Sam & Danelle Join 1:58:27 - Outro Episode Socials: @viallfiles @nickviall @nataliejoy @samkruseee @ambermozo @dannelle_davidson @kelseydarragh @jsotos1 @ciaracrobinson @justinkaphillips @the_mare_bare @baybaeee

Welcome back to another exciting episode of the Vile Files Reality Recap Edition. I'm your host, Nick, joined by my wonderful, gorgeous, amazing wife. Ali Joy, she's here with her daughter, Iris. We're doing our best. We have a fantastic episode lined up for you. The ladies, the finalist of Let's Mary Harry.

Amber Sam and Danelle are with us later this episode to unpack all the drama of Let's Mary Harry. The reunion aired last night. We had them in studio like, like they basically recorded the reunion. and then they came into our studio. It looked like they went through it. But there was a lot of drama to unpack.

I guess there was some, you know, Amber and Dinell got into it at the reunion. They unpacked it on the couch. Sam was sitting in between them. It was amazingly awkward. Lots of it into. Obviously, they have a lot to say about Harry, which is unsurprising. But it is a fantastic episode. I can't wait for everyone to listen to that.

But before we get to the ladies of Let's Marry Harry, we have Kelsey Darup. Hey. If you've been with us for a long time, Kelsey. was a guest maybe six, seven years ago. We were an acting class together way back in the day. We were. Are you still acting out there? Yeah, sure.

What happened? I mean, I get the occasional audition. I'm booked and busy right now with the podcast and being bad. So, you know, I've hung up. How is his craft, Kelsey? Yeah. You know, he was, he took it very seriously. I remember our acting coach was like, I'm going to put you with him because I feel like

you're going to be able to just like talk to him straight about it. And I was really prepared for a different kind of human. but he took it very seriously. I was like, okay. Okay. I mean, you know, I'm not here to fuck around, you know. He's here to book jobs. I'm a thespian.

Yeah, he learned his lines, okay? That was big time. I always had a, what was, what did they say? Have a beginning thought or something? What, what am I, what's my? The thought before. Have your before moment. Yeah.

Well, welcome back, Kelsey. Kelsey has a new book. I do. That I think all you will appreciate in the relationship space. Don't do. I did break up and bounce back. That is a great title. Yeah.

What'd you do? What didn't I do, Nick? I've done everything the wrong way. I mean, from the social stalking to showing up unannounced at houses to completely ghosting motherfuckers. Like, I've done it all. I've put it in this book that's also a science-backed workbook. So it's fun.

You can open any page. It's for the heartbroken. It's for the relationship. It's for anyone that is embarrassed by, yeah. the things that they've done and want to get out of that rut. So check it out. Was that so fun to go back in your memory bank and pull out all of the shit that you did? I honestly had to book so many therapy appointments in between writing and looking back

at like my 20s, you know, to just see all the crazy shit I did. I could not believe. You're brave. Truly. Going back into your 20s. I'm documenting it. Yes. Proud of you.

But I really, I just wanted to figure out like, why. why it fucked me up so bad. Like why breakups absolutely obliterated me. And so I really wanted to get down to like the science of it and understand what was happening in the body and the brain. And so that was really fun. That kept me sane. Yeah.

Like being able to fix the broken pieces. The broken pieces were, were sharp and scary and messy and had a lot of cum all over them. And I had to really kind of put that together back. Did you wipe those off? What was, uh, what was, what was the one of the most surprising things you learned? Man, I did not treat breakups as seriously as they need to be treated.

Like, I did not understand that your brain treats a breakup the same way it treats a death. Like, it is a literal grieving process and you get addicted to a person the same way an addict can get addicted to drugs or alcohol. And so when we are cut off from our source, our drug dealer, aka our X, we go through withdrawal. And I felt crazy. Like breakups made me crazy. And so putting it in that frame and understanding again, like what the brain is doing, what the body is reacting to, I was like, oh, I have an addiction and I need to treat it as such during a breakup. So that was really revelatory for me. The worst part, you know, not that we're wishing death on our exes at all, but the problem with it feels like death, but they're still around. They're still there and they're still posting. And psychologically, it's like, you know. Torture. Torture. Yeah. And we didn't have this problem before social media.

media too. So like all the stuff that now we have access to, it's very hard. And so I wanted to write this for the people that knew that it was hurting deeper than they were willing to admit and the people that really wanted to figure out how to fix it and, you know, make a healthy relationships moving forward. Is it out? Is it available to order right now? Pre-order? It is. We are just out and you can get it wherever you buy your books. And can we listen if we are a bad thing? Audio book is coming this fall. Okay. Ooh. Yeah. But this is one of those books that even if you want to listen to, probably good to get the paperback because like you said, it's something you want to page through. There's lessons. Yeah, it's got exercises, journal entries, games. Like a big thing with my first book was like I wanted it to be fun and funny. So that worked really well. So for the second book, I wanted to make sure that even when you're crying, screaming, throwing up on the floor or, you know, in a place where you don't want to dive into the pain. I wanted there to still be something fun and funny and light. And like a. game to participate with that that could still be something that's healing but not so traumatic well we

will have the the link of the book in our show bio so check out the book so buy subscribe not subscribe bye bye bye you can subscribe whatever it's with great sadness obviously the world everyone knows about this but dolly parton passed which is tragic oh my god river this was a new thing in river's life was introducing Dolly Parton, and I've never seen a two-year-old take to such legend. I mean, it's not surprising. But my sister gifted her this book of Dolly Parton, and it's like her autobiography. It's the cutest thing ever. But she, this is her reading it.

It's a crime or money. That's a book. Dallie Parton. I hear a song. Dolly Parton. So this is her just like reading the book. just like obsessed with Dolly Parton. And then, of course,

two days ago, we were in the car and, you know, Dolly Parton's playing on the radio, and they've got a picture of her. And she just says, out of nowhere. So she can hear you. It's, I will always love you, and she's just like, Hi, Dolly Parton.

And then I take her to the grocery store, and Dolly Parton's picture's still on there, and same thing. What do you want, ready? In the car. And then I play it. What two and a half-year-old? She has a vocal stem.

Truly just loves Dolly Parton. We are grateful for Dali Parton for touching her daughter's heart and she will be a fan forever. But it's just Dali Parton, one of the absolute legends of America, incredibly talented. I don't think people appreciate how talented Dali Parton was. I mean, acting, performing, songwriting. I mean, I think she's got thousands. They also did so many things for children. Her father couldn't read, is this right?

and she like sent out all of these books to all of these children. Her younger siblings, she like took in all her younger siblings when she got married to Carl Dean and took care of them. Beautiful soul. Beautiful soul. Also, Tim Curry passed away. Yeah. You may not know him by his name, but everyone knows him from home alone too.

Include. A comic genius. So many great characters he played. Pennywise and it. The original movie movie movie. Picture show. Oh, wow. A drag queen.

Yes. Was he also 80? They were both 80 years old. Oh, wow. Both 80. The Grim Reaper just taken all the whimsy from the world. Honestly, the wrong one. You know what I mean?

Wrong target. Who are the right ones? Well, you know. It could have been. I have other choices. I would choose. Tim Curry and Dolly Parton weren't top of the list. I'll tell you that much.

Really sad. Also recently Hayden Penitier as well, a younger one, which is tragic. But all legends, all legends. All legend. All sparkle. Well, all of these people obviously gone too soon and just sending love to all of their families. They will be remembered fondly by all of us. And it's always sad to see legends no longer with us.

If you are following the Lindsay Clancy case, we had a fantastic episode. I'm afraid to ask you, Kelsey. I've gone too far. I need someone actually to call somebody because I am on TikTok to the point where, You need to listen to our episode yesterday. We had Dr. Curry on, a forensic psychologist. She's, I think, world renowned, I don't know, a very impressive guest. And we obviously, because there's so much information on TikTok about this case and so much misinformation,

we talked with her in great length about obviously just postpartum and how that works. You know, we're going through it right now. You know, what's accurate, what's not accurate, how you can be a supportive partner, et cetera, et cetera. But she also covers in great detail the merits of this case from a, from a professional lens. And if you are down a rabbit hole on TikTok and you're not sure what's true or you're arguing with your friends, give it a listen. I think you might learn a lot.

I am, you know, this is just my opinion. But the latest expert on this case, I think she's going, I think she's going to lose her case. I thought it was really interesting, the doctor who we talked about with Dr. Curry. Basically, the voices she claims that she's heard, she only heard them for the 18 seconds for the 18 minutes in which she did this horrible thing. And the, this world renowned psychologist was like, that's just very rare. And honestly, based off this, just my humble opinion, probably could be wrong. I think she made up the voices. There's a lot too about postpartum that is misunderstood or not even known. And what's bothered me

about this case is they have clowns up there acting like they are talking about postpartum from an expert standpoint. And it's like the basic knowledge, I personally know people who have gone through psychosis of postpartum induced or otherwise. And they won't remember a lot of things or they think they have done things that they haven't done. Like, I'll be like, oh, did you do this? And they'll be like, yeah, that was me. And I'm like, no, it wasn't. And so just the nuance feels like it's missing so deeply. And I feel so terrible for her because I can only imagine how scary it is going through her. But what I think the light at the end of the tunnel with a case this big is people are curious about postpartum in a way that we've never really seen before. And

postpartum psychosis is such a shameful thing that is so terrifying and scary for a mom to talk about openly that I think if there's a light at the end of the tunnel, it's that there's going to be a little bit more conversation and nuance around that. The only thing, and I think Dr. Curry pointed this out, is that the hope is that that interest in the awareness of postpartum remains after the fascination with the case goes away. Because it'll go away and then the next crazy story will come out and people will hyper focus on that. And the fear is that it's more about the case than the awareness of postpartum depression

and postpartum sarcosis. And to your point, yes, there's no real bright spot in this case. But if there is more awareness for the suffering moms and there's, There are so many and millions out there who deal with this who don't do what Lindsay did. And hopefully that awareness remains after the case ends because it's going to end soon. But I don't know. I think she's going to be found guilty and go to jail. Jail?

I don't. Yeah. Well, I think she's either in jail or a mental. Well, that's without question that she's not getting out. But I, I mean, that psychologist, that was a dance. That was a damning testimony. Him basically saying in my 20 plus years of experience, this is,

I haven't really seen this before. And this doesn't really track with the other, you know, patients I've, you know, treated who have heard these types of voices and things like that. Who knows what the jury's going to come up with? But that's,

you know, it kind of implies that she made up the voices. Did she say that she heard physical, because in psychosis, there is like a narrator. there is someone talking to you, but it's like your inner voice versus like a schizophrenia where you're hearing an outside like a man's voice. Well, my understanding of the confusion, and again, I might get this wrong, listen to the interview with Dr. Curry. But a lot of people are confusing the fact that she went to her husband and said, I have these intrusive thoughts.

I have these negative thoughts about doing things to my kids and doing things to myself. That is not the same as I have, I'm hearing voices telling me to do something. And people are confusing the two. And they're not the same. And her argument is like, I did it because of these voices, but she only heard these voices in those 18 minutes. But that is a good question that Kelsey has is like, was it other people's voices in her head? Or was it like, yeah, that is this guy. Or like, how willing are you to say, like, I'm having these intrusive thoughts and like my mind is telling me to do these things?

You're not really going to say like I'm hearing someone else's voice because you're going to be called crazy. Well, that's true. I mean, Dr. Curry talked about that, that sometimes people who hear this, they won't, you know, it's part of the paranoia. They won't say it. But in the evaluation after the act happened, that was her story. And she stuck with that story. She did tell someone right after in one of these evaluations, like that her kids were safe now, which does connect with hearing voices. It's a sad situation, obviously, and just sending love to the families affected by this.

Yeah, it's really gone off the rails. There's a now writer for Vanity Fair who's claiming to be a childhood friend who got fired from, she got fired from Vanity Fair because she's in court smiling. Oh, that was actually psychopathic behavior. That clip you've seen of the camera panning to her.

Oh, my God. That's like something out of smile too. Like get that girl to a memory. Did you see her explanation, Kelsey? What was it? Oh, she said that her dad saw her in the news coverage and was like, hey, you look too serious. Like maybe you should smile.

No, no, no, it wasn't just her dad. It was her dad and Hillary Duff's stylist. I mean, how does Hillary Duff catch a stray? Don't drag her into this. First the mom or the friend group, now this. Can't catch a break. But yeah, told her that she needs to stop looking so serious. Yeah, but that's a comedic version of advice.

Like, that's gone too far. Like, getting an improv troupe, do something beneficial with your time. That's. But the way the people have lost this plot, there's this, this is this horrible situation. and people are using it to their own personal benefit and sensationalizing and receiving attention off of this. It's gross. I mean,

we just get off your phones, people. Like, I think it's the social media aspect, right? So look at Casey Anthony, right? She's come back all these years later.

She stands with Lindsay. Imagine. Yeah. She what? She stands with Lindsay. Of course. Yeah. Yeah.

She's a mom advocate. Like, if that would have, if social media would have been around during her trial, I can't even imagine. Oh, my God. So true. Well, we haven't talked about the double lives of suburban wives in a bit.

You've been watching, Kelsey. Isn't it just a beautiful, wonderful show about... The perfect reality show. It's amazing. We've been missing something like this with real people, real families. They look real. They look like Americans. I am obsessed as an understatement.

Do you guys love it? Natural milf? How? Accredible. Who came up with that? She's farting and making money? I can't. Did you guys have you look?

Have you looked? I haven't. No. No. You haven't? No. That was the first thing I did. I think it's different for you than it is for me, Kelsey.

But you're a researcher. This is your profession. You know, I'm just going to go. Yeah, we got people on the team for that. Where's your, where's your interns? I need to talk to them. Did you look? I wish.

Guys. I know. How do you talk to us about it? What did you find? Fine. Okay. Where do I even start? It's literally a mine. It's so much space. It's almost like a parlor trick. It almost seems like a circus act. It seems very athletic. You know, there's like a quiff fetish that I didn't know was a thing. Whenever it happens for us, it's like mortifying. I didn't know that this was something that you want to actively practice. Yeah. People will pay for it. She's getting on all fours bending over and just letting it rip and can't. And it's just like, chiching. Certain flexing positions and yoga positions that I'm like, wait a minute. Can I do?

Like, is that something we all can do? But there's a lot about the anatomy I didn't know that I've learned. And maybe natural milf is cashing in the most, but they do buy a lot of cars. And I'm no financial expert, but I feel like, you know, I've been told as a bad investment. And they're living in the sticks just like, they have a fleet of automobiles. So much so that their neighbors think they're drug dealers, which is... Some people collect Pokemon cards. Some people invest in, you know, the stock market.

She did say that she was holding on to the escalate or whatever. So it's like she's just got some cars that they're just testing out, seeing how they feel, how they drive. Yeah. Yeah, it's freedom. Have you ever wondered what your neighbors do, Kelsey? Not like that, but now this show has me wondering everyone I talk to. I'm like, you know what I bought my first house in L. my neighbor, it parked in the car, giant pickup truck.

And my first thought was, I bought a house in L.A. And I bought a house next to the only Trump supporter in L.A. Because there was this big pickup truck. Oh, no. And listen, I'm not here to talk politics. And I don't dislike people because of who they vote for. But I was just more like, I don't know. This might be too intense for me.

You know, it was a big pickup truck. And then I met him. And he was, he's from Jamaica. He grew reading his background and gave him. it to me all the time and he's Ken handyman incredible man. It's just a resourceful vehicle. So don't judge a book by its car. Yeah.

Don't judge a milf, a natural milf by their pickups. Have you ever been accused of being a drug dealer? Anyone? Oh, I was once in high school. I sold weed to my teachers. But that was just because I was bored and in Florida. To your teachers. Such a Florida story. Such a Florida story. Yeah.

Well, it's everything they say about Florida is true. And you don't realize how crazy that it is until you leave. You're like, oh, you also weren't doing drugs in the bathroom at school and, you know, throwing an alligator through a gas station window to steal beer when you were 17? You weren't? And I was like, no. What do you tell people when they ask you what you do? Oh, I don't. I lie. What do you say? What's your go-to? I lie. I accountant. I'm accountant. I mean, I used to be. Because no follow-up questions. No follow-up questions. No one cares about what accountant does. How do I explain? What do I say? I get really awkward and cagey and then I say I work in

entertainment and they're like, what do you mean? And I'm like, I don't know. And it gets like porn. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, that's something I've had to do. I've been crossing the border a lot because my boyfriend's in Canada. And every time I, they go, what do you do for a living? And I say, I'm a content creator. And then they look like an extra second. And I go, not the only fans kind. But I would. I would. If anyone would like, yeah, I would. I mean, it's so funny because like, I was telling my chiropractor, he asked me what I did. And I was like, oh, me and my husband, they host a podcast. And he was like, oh.

Yeah. You know, it's kind of like a little like, ugh. Yeah, you know, another one. You quit your, you quit your good paying job to chase some dream that's never going to happen. But then it clicked. I should just start telling people that were hosts of a Netflix dating show. There you go. Oh, hell yeah.

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. And then people have exciting follow up questions. It goes from oh to oh. Oh. Then you're like, oh, okay, you've made it. Got it. You're legit. It's like, oh. And then they're like, well, what's the name of the show? Well, we, we, we match really old people with really young people. In a not creepy way. In a not creepy way. They're like, sure.

In a legal. In a legal, they signed up for this way. Exactly. Yeah. And then I wish I said I did Onlyfans. No follow up question. Yeah. It's better when she says it than when I say it. Oh. Well, she's a natural mill. I am a natural. Mel and I am. Looking really hot, by the way, these days.

Hell yeah. You're making it look cool and good, and that's bad for my brand as like a childless woman at her 30s. Making it look really chic clothing that baby right here. Well, we have a lot of people at our house helping out, particularly her mom often, who's not here right now. But I got to tell you, it's really, I really got to sneak in the ass grabs. Oh, my God. It's really hard, you know, to try to be. I mean, if you have the time in the hell, you're human.

No, last night we're feeding, I'm pumping and he's feeding both babies. And then he's like, so should we? I'm like, this is, this feels like a terrible time. This is like the worst possible. It's three in the morning. We're exhausted. He's like, you didn't feel that. You're not turned on right now.

You know, he shared something there. No. No. I just pumped for 20 minutes. and he puts his hand on my boo, but I'm like, oh, that was,

I just already got a lot of stimulation. Get out of the house. I'm just trying to. It could be worse. He could be repelled and like, I have no energy or attraction to you. That is true. I think this is actually champagne problems.

I'm just letting you know that I'm standing by and ready to go whenever. That is true. He could be repelled. He could be like, oh, God, look at all that milk squirting out. Disgusting. That's a kink I found out via our natural milf.

Our researcher here. Yes, I am your new intern. It turns out being a mommy is a whole place. It's a whole. It's a whole place for that. That's too much. Natural milk was feeding the camera where I was like, I wonder what that fetish is like on the other end. Yeah, what are they doing?

Can I pose a question to the group? Has any of you ever tried that type of porn where it's like someone talking to you and it's audio only? No. Oh. I didn't even have this existed. Like ASMR. Like ASMR. Whoa.

It's not a fetish. It's just imagine listening to porn with your eyes closed. Like an audiobook. It's an audio book. I strongly recommend it. Yeah. If you want to switch up the routine. Do you have a favorite double life content creator?

I think it's a healthy thing to participate in a good, it's not hurting anyone. it's a healthy outlet, you know, helps with anxiety when you just got to rub one out real fast. And if I can find something very specific, that hurts nobody. And yeah, you don't, it's too much. There's too much choice now, right? So when you find a good niche, you got a niche down. You got to stick to what you know, what work. And that's what our double lives of suburban wives moms are doing.

They're giving you the niches. Yeah. And I think it's beautiful that she's putting like kink life out there for everyone to see. Like for her to own that kink life so strongly, I think is really cool. I saw things I have never seen before. Right. Like the giant content. Oh, that was, yeah.

What little man wants to be put in someone's pocket sexually? I just got to meet that guy. Do you feel like the guys into the giant porn are short kings who are embracing their shortness? Or do you think it's tall men who want to know what it feels like to be a short king? I want it to be the second answer. I want it to be a tall fetish that they're like, well, I'll never know what it feels like to look up at someone. It's kind of cutesy.

I do think that's adorable. I will say as a man who is six too, there's not many people I have to physically literally look up to. And it is an intimidating weird thing when you're, you know. But what if you also got a boner when you did that? Like, that's the people I want to talk to. Oh, my God. Anything else before we get to our. Let's Marry.

What did you watch Let's Marry Harry? Obsessed. Obsessed. Obsessed in following all the TikToks. Were you familiar with Mr. Harry Jousy before the show? Yeah, of course. It's the guy I love to hate and hate to love, right? I'm right down the middle with him.

What did you just think about like the earnestness of the women on the show? Because it was more like, have you not seen his content? Yeah. I think it's fantastic. The producers did a great job of making sure all. of these girls have TikToks and Instagrams afterwards because it's such a good supplement to the show that I think they're setting sort of like this new precedent about because Love Island kind of did it, but this being so now and happening with the reunion and everything, like I think it's a great

marketing tactic. But I love how honest and free and real all of the girls are. Yeah, no, they're very honest and apparently you guys know what happened and you're going to be giving me live Well, the women we have coming up next, Amber, Danelle, and Sam, the three finalists at the reunion that many people have now listened to this episode probably have seen. And I guess Amber came in Guns of Blazing, the one who got married, quote unquote, and is no longer with Harry. There's a lot to unpack post-filming of the show. He's currently dating someone he met on their honeymoon. Allegedly. Allegedly.

Yeah. What? Which, like, is that not the most fitting thing? for Harry Jousy. Well, he can't have another show if he changed and got married. But also somewhere in between that, he broke up with Amber and then reached out to Dinell. And then they hooked up. And then Amber found out about this.

But Amber didn't know that they were broken up. Amber didn't know this. And they address it on the couch. And when they came into the studio, Sam and Dinell came in first. And we had them sitting like, we actually literally were you two are sitting right now. And we put three of them on the couch. and before Amber, before Amber came in, then I was like, slide over, Sam. And so you have Sam sitting in between Danelle and Amber, and it's, I just can't wait for you guys to listen.

Word. Oh my God. Good stuff. Harry. We need a man to blame. Well, I'm going to give a, we opened up the interview. I'll give this away before we do the interview. But I wanted to know they're familiarity with Harry Jowsey or filming the show.

and they claim who have not known much. They wanted to meet him or himself. You're joking. That's their story. But haven't, I feel like Harry said that in the contract, it clearly said, let's marry Harry, but like what girls are reading all of that fine print when they signed up for the show?

That's not the fine print, but it's just like, don't you look up the guy you might marry and someone who is very accessible via social media? Yeah, there's no way they didn't know. I'm calling them all liars right here. seen too hot to handle. I know far more about Harry Jousey than I would like to know. And it's all been against my will. So there's no way that you don't know. I do not follow that man. I'll only show that I've ever seen him on was the perfect match with Jess. Other than that,

I know nothing else about this man besides I know so much about this man. And I'm just like, wait, why? Because it just gets bombarded on to me. So I'm just like, there's no way you sign up for a show like this to marry someone and be like, nope. And he's such a public thing. figure and he puts himself in the headlines that I'm just like, how could you not know? If you just Google Harry Jousey one time, the amount of stuff that pops up. And I think he was really, he was really playing into the I'm a reformed fuck boy. Like he really had us all thinking we're watching a change man. And that's all we want as women is we want to see the guy prove that it can happen.

And then that way we can project that out into all the fuckboys we've for sure. But you must go into this. thinking it might not happen though, right? Like there's maybe, maybe he's changed. But I also, he really acted like he changed. But as I said, I kind of appreciate the rollout of this all where it was like the breakup with Jess and I'm going to be a changed man, the boyfriend material, the whole thing. Like I'm really, really working on it for him to do this show where we obviously knew he wasn't actually going to get married. But then it was like, oh, and on my honeymoon, I met my girlfriend. But then I called one of the other contestants. It's like, oh, we're just back at square one.

And he was giving us like live therapy during all of his. his confessionals and interviews with producers. Like he really had me thinking like, oh, no, I can see the work. I'm watching it live in his brain, like his little, I'm watching his little mechanisms turn. So I'm like, what's worse? A fuck boy or a self-proclaimed fixed fuck boy? The second. Right.

Much more dangerous. Definitely. Yeah. But then you cast a house full of beautiful women. You have him live in the house with these women. Crazy. Him living in there is nuts. And he's hooking up left and right.

Are they all have mono, like the whole time? Was this like a Love Island situation? Are they sick the whole time? You have to. Pink eye, mono, everyone's sick. Yeah. Not pink eye. Definitely pink eye.

You're touching bits and pieces and like they're on pillows. There's lots happening on beds. Well, I think it's time to get to these ladies. It's an interview. You definitely are going to enjoy. Kelsey, I want to thank you for coming by and just having some fun with us. Don't forget to buy Kelsey's new book. The link is in our bio.

It is called Don't Do What I Did. break up and bounce back. Kelsey, thanks so much for coming. Always great to have you. Come back. Don't make it another seven years before you come back and you guys are so hot. Have some fun with us. It's good to see it. Where can people follow you, follow all that fun stuff? Subscribe. Do it. You know, just hang out with you. Only fans. What do you? Yeah, I'm going to start one today at Kelsey Dara on all the things. And yeah, go check out. Don't do what I did. All right. Well, up next we have Amber Dinell and Sam, the three finalists of Let's Mary Harry unpacking all of their trauma. both on the show and at the reunion,

and it is something I hope you all enjoy. They're up next. Well, don't forget, Valfa Plus is ad-free and available to you all, and if you are looking to get even deeper and some of the things that we don't have a time on reality recap to dive into, like obviously the Lindsay Clancy case is buzzing. Everyone's talking about it, and we are diving deeper into that case this week,

in addition to shows like the double lives of suburban wives, and we didn't get a lot of time this week to talk about Orange County, but we will be doing it on plus. Jimmy is going to be going to be. be joining us this week for uh for plus so if you want to get more jimmy so does be sure to check out vile files plus uh and again in addition to that great content you also get ad free episodes so if that's something you were looking for just go to vialfiles.com to sign up you'll be super glad that you did Ladies, welcome to the show.

Hi. Hi. Thanks for having us. I like always sometimes start these things. You have to. You have to. How is your hearts? Yeah.

Mine's fine. Fine. Fine. Good. Okay. Yeah. Cool. You guys recorded the, the reunion yesterday, correct?

Yeah. It did. Overall, you guys feel like it's, you got that post-reunion glow, which is to say that you, look like you went through it all. Been through war, pretty much. Yeah. Well, by the way, we have Amber. We have Sam and we have Donnell, our three finalists with us.

So welcome, ladies. But starting with Amber, on a scale of one to ten, how would you, for 10 being amazing, one being the worst ever, how would you rate your overall experience on the Let's Mary Harry show? I actually had a lot of fun filming. I think it was one of the most life-changing experience I had. Post show is a different story. But if I was to really talk about what I love. learned about myself on that show, I would never take it back. Like I 100% showed up as myself

were put in a crazy pressure cooker of a situation that not a lot of viewers can really understand unless you live it. And you're also trying to date Harry Jousey. Like it's not this isn't another dating show like this man knows how these shows work, right? He knows where to take you in the house. He knows how it can go. So, I mean, watching it back and reliving everything a year later was a lot to take on. But if I really think about this experience, like most amazing experience of my life. So, is that a 10? Yeah, on a personal level, yeah. Yeah, I come from a small island. I don't do stuff like this. I had a boyfriend for four years. It was my first summer single. Like, I was thrown into the craziest stuff of my life. And I mean, yeah, I don't, I wouldn't take it back. Okay. How about you, Sam?

Happy birthday, by the way, Sam. It's Sam's birthday. We're celebrating our birthday. Thanks for unpacking your trauma on your birthday. Wait, my favorite thing to do, actually. We'll get a drink after this. Perfect. 100%. How would you rate it, Sam? It was honestly 10. It was better than 10. I feel like it was hands down the best thing I've ever experienced. Okay. It was a giant girls trip. Harry was there. You know, I loved everything about it. And I met my absolute best friend in the entire world there. We're roommates now.

We moved in together, Shane. And yeah, literally nothing like that I've ever experienced before. Okay. And Danelle? Yeah. I mean, obviously I dealt with a heartbreak at the end of it. But ultimately, I would give it a 10. Okay.

You know, I learned so much about myself. also just experiencing something so different out of my comfort zone. It was just all around a great experience. And I met my two best friends too, Emma and DeBrily. I love them so much. Okay. And how much of that 10? Because we had tens across the board.

Do we give Harry any credit recognition? Was he part of the overall hectic situation that seemed to like, you know, because it sounds like your answers are all, you know, on the, there are ups and downs, but at the end of the day, I wouldn't change anything. how do we view Harry as part of this of all your experiences? I think he added to it, honestly. Like, despite whatever didn't work out, whatever happened, I think I'm grateful for every relationship.

It taught me something. I've learned from it. Yeah, I mean, I personally enjoyed my time that I spent with Harry during filming. So he definitely fed into that at some level. The thing about Harry is, like, he is funny as fuck. and I need a guy that stimulates me. And he has that. And he's, I told him, hey, this is not the way I fall in love.

I don't know if I'm going to walk off this show. Like, we had that moment. I think third day in. I was like, this isn't for me. I take myself super seriously. I don't know how I ended up here. Like, I got casted as one of the last people and I was just like so over-stimulated. That's why I pop in at the end, honestly.

Harry has something about him that is so fun and funny. and I don't think I could, well, I just, yeah, he makes things exciting because I need that too. So I feel like our energy was matched in that way. So he's, he's fun to film with. Like if the lead was someone else, it would have been, you probably would have left earlier. Amber is kind of what you're saying. Like if they weren't as funny or as stimulating as hair is. This type of show is there's one guy.

It's different when you go in like Love Island. Something's not working with a guy. You can lead someone else. like it was really hard for me to only have it be towards one guy. I'm not going to lie. So with him being the lead, I think it's what left, like kept me there. And I told him. And he was like, what can I do to make you stay? You know, and he was so accommodating to me. And that's why he would grab me. I told him straight. I looked in the eye and I said, if you want me here, make it known. I'm going to give you an opportunity to be in your

manhood. And we'll see if this is for us. If you have. have a better connection with someone else here, explore that. Send me home. I said that. Every elimination. And he's like, you're not going anywhere. I was like, okay. So that was like my experience with him. And I had fun. Honestly. I'm curious. Because obviously I want to unpack, Amber, your relationship with Harry Post show. The question for all you ladies going into the show, what was your understanding or awareness of who Harry Jowzi was in his reputation coming into the show? And how much, if any, did that affect your decision to be a part of the show? I mean, I honestly, I was scrolling on TikTok one night,

and I saw a casting producer just looking for girls for a dating show. And I don't know what made me decide to, I just think everything's a sign. So I was like, I don't know, this showed up on my feed. So I clicked on her page, went to the application and started. And I was like, this is the longest application ever. And I almost didn't finish it. And I was like, I'm already halfway. Like, let me just finish it.

So anyways, I go through all the steps and like it just kept another interview, another interview, another interview. And then it was like, okay, it's a show about marriage, which I want to get married. So I was like, okay, like that aligns with me. Let's see what this is. And then I'm pretty sure it was like two or three weeks before I actually flew out there is when they told me it was Harry. And when they told me, oh, it's Harry Jowsey. I was like, oh, okay.

I didn't know anything about him. So as soon as I got off the phone call that day, I was like, Harry Jousey, who was Harry Jousy? Like searching the internet. Trying to watch the shows that he was on, like just trying to get some kind of an idea. But honestly, I felt like I went into it and I still didn't know anything about him.

I feel like I learned a lot about him while I was there. You weren't aware of like any dating reputation that he brought into the show at all? Not really. No. I knew that he dated Jess before, but yeah, that was basically it. Was that how it is for everybody?

Like you didn't know it was going to be Harry until like two weeks prior? Well, they had been like advertising like, let's marry Harry, which was really weird because during the casting process, like they were hiding who it was. They were like, oh, it's a businessman. That's six foot, whatever. And like towards the end, they told us everyone knew before going on the show 100%. But it was just like maybe a few weeks before. And I think some people might have been able to piece it together if they were.

maybe already following Harry because he was posting about it. I wasn't following Harry. So it didn't click for me. Okay. How about you, Amber? Interesting. Yeah. My casting, I was living in Bali and I was reached out and they said this guy's looking

for someone he finally wants to take seriously. He's like had a career for so long on dating shows. Like this is something he finally wants to like close the chapter on. They shared with me that he had lost his dad, things like that. I have always been friends of people who are in the same industry. Like, I'm a photographer my whole life. I've shot people's content, so I've been on the back of it. And I have, like, close friends.

Like, one of my friends who does podcasting, like, I introduced her to her boyfriend in Hawaii, and I've seen people change. And I really do think that the media paints people out to be a certain way. So why would I judge Harry if he's going to take himself seriously? I'm not really a judgmental person. I like to meet people and I like to see if they're true to them, you know? So I was willing to take that risk. Even though I got so much shade, people were like, oh, it's Harry Jousie.

I was like, yeah, but I know so many people, my best friend who he grew up in Hawaii. Like people trash people. Like people can change. I've seen people fall in love. Like I've seen people on TV fall in love. Like I don't really watch reality TV, but the last season I watched was like, I don't know what season was of Love Island, but Lee and Miguel and them. I was like, that is the coolest timeline in life. This fell into my timeline.

I wasn't looking for it. I don't really put myself out there in the real world, like at all. I don't really, I'll never DM a gut. I'm not like that. So I was like, this kind of fell into me. I'm the last girl. I called Latia, actually. I go, Tia.

I got asked to do this show and she kind of asked like, who's making it. She's like, oh, my God, they did Bachelor with me. It's amazing. It'll grow you. I'm so much like her. really to myself and she's like do it and i was like okay trust that and like my experience of how this came to my life like i literally walked on a cliff and this girl pulled out a tarot deck she's like pull a card i pulled a card and it said in a month from now your life will change it was

september 8th and then i was like okay did a couple calls i was straight into like the heavy paperwork of it i told a tia she's like you're that far in the process your cast did get dresses i was like what left bolly and then that tarot card said like in a month your life will change October 8th exactly a month later they called me and they said we need you here so I was like this is all my timeline I'm just going to be there every day on set and see what this is for there's so much between me and Harry too that was just like really cool we synced up on on like we connected on a lot of different things so as crazy as the situation is like that was kind of how this all fell into place for me so I knew it was Harry they told me that I put all of that

into my head with my friends and just my life. And I was like, okay, I'm just going to like give him the benefit of the doubt and see if he is what he's saying he is because talk is cheap. And through your dating experience, both filming the show for all you ladies and obviously Amber, you afterwards, because it makes a lot of sense and we appreciate that, obviously, like, you know, I know what it's like to have people say a lot of shit, you know, about me online and obviously and you wish people want to get to know you. That being said, do you feel like after getting to know and dating Harry, was your experience with Harry different than the rumors about him as a dater specifically at how he moved in relationship or what did it verifies

priors like is he the same person outside of the show when we really dated no it just more like you know like it sounds like you amber at least had heard some of how like his you know how he dated jess or just how he moved on you know too hot to handle and while i appreciate going and being like you know what, I'm going to meet the guy, I want to see who he is in real life. After getting to know and meeting the guy, was it different than what people were saying about him? Or was it, you know, did it match what people said about him online? Getting to know him? No, Harry was really cool and fun. I actually really enjoyed being around Harry, like when we were together on the show. After the show was, you know, a little bit of a roller coaster. So how long did you and Harry date post,

getting married or not getting married. We wrapped the show late November, and we were together till February 1st. We were supposed to move into a house together on the 1st. Okay. And he's, you know, he's lied to me. He's lied to Dinell. He's done some things that are just really hard

that I just don't invite toxicity into my life. All good. I'll release it. Like, it was, yeah, it was a roller poster. And he's been on thousands of podcasts. His narrative hits different. He's like tangled up in a web of his own lies at this point. I mean, the poor guy.

And in the first month of you guys dating, what was it? Did you feel connected? Did you feel like, did it feel like you were really working on a marriage? Or did it feel like you're working on a relationship? I said in our vows, we're two imperfect people, like perfect for each other. Like there's a reason this is happening. Let's go one day at a time. I said to him and I said, we met in a really strange way.

I don't expect to have a real like traditional relationship. we have to hide. There's so many things we have to iron out. I want to work with you at whatever level that looks like. You need to go like regroup in L.A. Go regroup. I'll go back to Hawaii. I'm not here to be like, I'm your wife. This is how it goes now. I was so easy on him. I let me go to do whatever he wants. You want to film with other girls. You want to do whatever you want? Like, it's all good. So we worked at that pace because we did wrap a show. We couldn't go out. We couldn't do stuff. So I felt like, let's keep integrity for the show and what we just worked on. Let's move in that way.

So that meant for you, your expectation that he would still, when you say film with other girls, like he was going to move like a single man in public? Is that what you were saying to your? Yeah, that's what he wanted. He wanted to film with his friend in Australia. And he's like, this is all smoking mirrors. It's good for the show. I was like, you've done this.

Do it. It's your social media. I'm not going to go fake that I have a boyfriend. I'm just going to lay low. Like, you do what you want with your social. Shulls, keep me in the loop. You know, like, I really, I'm not going to come up into a relationship and change who he is. He likes to film with people. He likes to do that. So, you know, that was my approach with us jumping into it. I think a lot of people have an idea of marriage that it needs

to look like this, this and this. But I think it's like two people, just a good relationship in my eyes. This is where we kind of like, kind of weren't in touch with each other, is just two people, building a life on each other, like coming together and complimenting each other. And I think the sad thing about Harry is he is so, he has so many amazing qualities. But he hasn't done the work and he can't access them because he is used to, and he admits this, he says it out of his own mouth. He admits to seeking out toxicity. And whenever he would try to push me or do things, I told him I was like, hey, there's like low frequency and high frequency. You want me to be jealous?

I'm not jealous. I'm territorial. Like, he just kept trying to honestly, like, do things that I just didn't work with. Like, in Australia, I realized that. You know, it's hard to come off of the show and hide. But I said this time at the reunion. I was like, any girl you would have picked, you would have had to do that with. You understand that, right?

You signed up for the show. Do what with? What do you mean? Like hide for a year. Sure, sure. Because he kept saying like, oh, it's hard to have a marriage in secret. I was like, yeah, but you're trying to not be secret. You're like outside wanting people to paparazzi you.

Why did you drag me into this? I said, leave me at home then. Like, I'm anything I say, though, it falls on deaf ears with him. I'm sorry. Like, we're just not each other's people. I don't like that. I don't like toxicity. And that's what I learned.

And that's why I was good to let it go. It's my understanding, correct me if I'm wrong, I feel like this was discussed at the reunion, but he's currently in a relationship now with someone else. Yeah, that he met on our honeymoon. That was my next question. He met your honeymoon. And you guys went where for your honeymoon?

And I say the word honeymoon and he's like, honeymoon. I was like, yeah, when you get married and go on a trip after, people call it a honeymoon. You got married, right? You should know that. Like, I can't keep explaining something to someone that, like I said, falls on deaf ears. Like, you've done many shows before.

you've done perfect match. You know that these shows come out a year later. You have such a pattern online where every girl that you've dated after, you've crossed over to the next show and then you're in a big mess. Like, this isn't my fault. You are being a victim in a situation you created. You chose me. And now you're using it against me. And I am not one to mess with. Like, don't gaslight me. And the difference with this show and the tone of this show is I did not ever love bomb Harry. Even when you're it came down to me and Dineau, I said, if Dinell's a better pick for you, pick her. Like, genuinely, I want the happiness for you. Of course, the show is edited up. It has to be this way. There's so much of both of our sides that wasn't put in. But the truth is, is like,

he knew what he was signing himself up for. So don't use it against me. I don't fuck with that. What did you think he was using against you? Just the whole way the relationship didn't work out was because of like, it's hard to be in a relationship. Like, go bore someone. else. Like I genuinely, you signed up for the show. So he, was he the one who technically ended it? I mean, yeah. Okay. And basically, so he was saying, I can't, this, moving in private, I want to, I want to live my life and I can't do this tied down kind of thing. No, actually, if you want what really happened. Yeah, I mean, the things I'm about to say is not what's hidden. Harry, I don't know why he does the things he does, but he publicly, all of this is posted by him. So if he watches this and

listens, he did this to himself. He's so embarrassing. I'm embarrassed for him. I'm embarrassed. I was even a part of this relationship. Sorry. So if I laugh, I'm sorry, but like, get it to it. We get off the plane in Australia. I'm like, bro, like take a couple days if you need to breathe because you're stressing yourself out. I'm not here to stress you out. You had 20 girls to pick from you picked me so i'm so real with him you know he gets like off the show he's sorry off the plane in australia and he did this to me on stage yesterday he's like when australia we broke up i was like dude by my phone you were texting me every day every day until the one day where it just went ghost this man's crazy so we get off the plane in australia and this is your honeymoon

Yeah, our honeymoon. He doesn't want to call a honeymoon. Honestly, I don't care. Call it what you want at this point. He's, you know, stress. And I'm like, you're creating this stress. Like, I, he's like, I don't, I just don't want to be with somebody who's like getting drunk all the time. I was like, you were drunk every day on the show and your friends are pouring me shot. Like, we're just beefing about stuff like that. Like, I can't handle being gaslit to every detail of my life, you know? So we're, that's what we're arguing about.

Little arguments, you know, get off the plane. And then he just needed. a couple days. I was like, if you need a couple days, take a couple days. This is like January night. I don't text him for a day. He asked for space. I was like, I'll give you space. Then he gaslates me again and is like, hello question mark. I was like, sorry, I was giving what you asked for. Isn't that not right? He's like, yeah, you're right. I was like, okay, what's up? What do you mean he was gaslighting you? He's just always making it like, I'm doing something wrong where I'm like, I'm giving you the space that you asked for. Like he uses everything against

to me, which I did not like. Anyways, he wants to look at houses. And I was like, okay, are you feeling better? I talked through him through everything in life. Like, we have big conversations. Like, I hold so much space for Harry. Like, he knows that. And then, yeah, he was looking for houses. And he was like, I really want to get a house. I'm ready to just have something bigger. I need you here. Get to L.A. So he's sending me all these houses. He's touring them, sending me videos. He's picking them out, like everything, you know? And, um, That's the track we were on in January. Like he was picking out houses, filming, packing up the house, wanting me to pick out

furniture for the house, like everything. Move in days February 1st. So this is all through January. That's, you know, that was what I thought we were on. And then he doesn't, he blocks me on Instagram. What? He blocks me. Out of nowhere?

Yeah. Like you're still married at this point? Or like you're in a relationship, whatever? What? Never blocked your wife, Nick? Yeah, what that? He blocked me and posted like him in some like Wendy's outfit kissing a rapper. Was he filming a commercial or something?

It was like a music video. Okay. Baby. Yes. Baby? Sorry. There's so much that has happened with this guy. Yeah.

Yeah. Anyways, blocks me posts kissing this girl as if, like, people weren't going to screenshot it and send it to me. Or if, like, you don't have a fenced on, you can't. I actually don't have a fintzda. I ask all my friends to spy for me. You're so at peace. I have so many burners. No, I don't have one.

If you go on my phone, like, I don't. I tried not. I was like, why would he? Like, this is so dumb. Anyways, yeah. He's just been a goddamn mess, honestly. It sounds like all the, like, freedom you gave him to, like, figure his shit out was, like, so convenient for him to, like, do as he pleased as, move as if he wasn't married. Like, I wonder if maybe, no, disrupt, like, maybe he didn't pick you somebody else, say to know, we're on tight program or something.

And, like, he wouldn't have that freedom, that leeway to just move about and do whatever video shoot he did. Yeah. He, whatever girl, he would lie about it. Yeah, you think he was going to move how he want to move regardless? 100 p. Interesting. He didn't. I mean, I kind of think he would probably, no matter who he chose, I think that he probably would have done what he wanted to do because in his mind it's probably just work. Yeah. He uses work like against you to kind of like a cop out for certain things that are inappropriate in a relationship. Like all good, but you don't need to block me. Tell me, hey, I want to do this music beat. I'm a kiss this girl. I said all good. Like I wouldn't care. The boundaries are vague. I wouldn't have cared. Honestly. And that's convenient for him.

Well, yeah, I guess. I mean, if I married an act, like, I think he just like convinced me that it was so much of his work. But now looking back, like in the moment, I didn't care. But looking back, I was like, if you were a married man, you probably should just like say no to these things. Like, shift a little. Like, this is your time to show up as a better man. And I kind of always gave him the opportunity to see what he would choose and he disappointed me every time. And that's the shitty thing.

that's just the truth of it. And just he posted him with his new girl like at a Lakers game. Like he trial reeled himself and tagged her and posted it from his account. And people were sending it to me like him standing there with like Justin Bieber. He tagged to the girl. I was like, why are you giving me concrete evidence of how you're moving? Wait, can we go back to how he met this girl in your honeymoon? because like who was she?

Oh, that's what I heard. That's what I heard from everyone. Honestly, the dynamic in Australia was quite strange. Like he would wake up in the mornings and say he wanted to go like work out with his friend, Josh. And I was like, of course, go work out. Obviously. Why was Josh on your honeymoon? I don't know.

It's like, don't you think that if you came off a show being married, you would take the time out of your life to kind of like get to know someone outside of a show where he jumped right back into work. in Australia. He was doing podcasts. For sure. He was filming Instagram videos. He was filming with his friend who does Instagram, like faking that he's in a relationship

with her. Like there was so much that he was doing. And I was like, okay, you want to jump back into it. You didn't have your phone for six weeks. Like, I'm here and I'm watching everything. So I didn't want to like come in and just be like, I'm the wife. Do this. Like, I was actually just observing how he moved because I was

still testing like, like I said, talk is cheap. And I had skepticism on the show. And a lot of the questions I asked that I'm bummed about that wasn't shown in the show was, Harry, you asked for this opportunity and are you prepared for the shift that you have to make once you become a husband? You know, but my skepticism was so overlooked and made me look, me look unready. Of course, they're not going to put me saying, are you ready to him? It's his show. Sure. Well, regardless, even with that specific question, though, I'm sure he could just be like, yes, I'm just curious for all of you ladies. And maybe I'm curious, maybe you had a different

answer Sam, because you obviously, you're the one who kind of opted out on your own. But did you ask him, like, as Harry, this public figure who's been on TV, you know, who's, you know, has this very unique lifestyle, knowing that the show is about marriage and that marriage is on the line, did any of you women discuss specifically his awareness of how he needs to move differently in this marriage or relationship that he planned on ending up with? Well, I didn't really know much about him prior to the show, to be honest. I didn't like research him or anything like that. I think The only thing I looked up was like what his ex-girlfriends look like. I'm like, do I have a chance?

All right. But. You're so hot, Sam. Do you guys regret that? No. I don't regret it because kind of like Amber. Like I literally, I like to give people a chance in real life. I don't believe what I see online.

I didn't want that to sway what I thought about him. Yeah, I know that's fair. But I am just curious because obviously we are here and we're talking about in Amber, you have some frustrations with how the relationship. moved. And as someone who's, you know, we've watched Terry before, a lot of it is there's a theme here, right? I definitely appreciate people giving me a chance to get to know them in person for sure. Let's say, let's marry Harry season two. You know, he's like, I'm here this time for real. You know, it's like they do another season, right? And a girl calls you up and she's just like,

yo, I'm being casted on this show. And she says to you, I don't want to judge a book by its cover. I don't want to hear, you know, what the internet has to say. I want to meet him and get to know him and judge for myself, which we all like to do, what would you say to that person? I can't speak for everybody's experience. You know what I mean? I feel like I, you know, in my last conversation with him,

I very much was upfront in asking those questions. That's the whole reason I went home. I was like, are you going to be the same person off camera as you are on? Like in a few weeks, am I going to get the same Harry Jousey? And he was clearly very upset about that, did not go the right way. So if a girl were to ask me that, honestly, I learn for yourself, you know, get your own experience. However, this was mine. Like, I just, I don't know.

And I think Amber was kind of like the nail on the coffin for that. Like, she quite literally got a different experience post show. So I don't have much to say other than that. And then now at the reunion it was discussed that you and Harry met up or reconnected post-breakup with Amber? We did. Yeah. So I think just from the conversation that we had at the reunion last night, I personally still feel like a little confused. And I don't really have, I don't really know what's going on. So I saw Harry January 16th was the weekend that I went out there. I was there for two nights. He told me that he was single. That's what he told me. I'm not sure if they were together. if they weren't together.

Like, I don't know. I would love to find out. I just feel like I was put in a really sticky situation, and it was unfortunate. But you were operating under the impression he was single. Yes. That's what he told me. And you don't know if he actually was single or not. I thought he was up until yesterday.

You took him at his word. Yeah. Exactly. And yesterday at the reunion, it was presented that maybe he wasn't. I mean, Amber, you're here. Like, from your standpoint, was Harry single? January 16th? Um, no. I mean, we never really had a breakup. It's Harry.

When can I ask when, when was the breakup? I just need to know for like myself. Like, we came home from Australia, I think that we. To him a break, like he told me at the reunion like, oh, we broke up in the car. I was like, dude, you text me every fucking day. You called me and you sat literally begging like, fuck the show. like I don't care about any of it like move in with me like the man's all over the place you know what I mean like there was never like a like of ending of things he was trying to move me in by February 1st to a house we picked out together you know what I mean I get that that was your guys's plan initially but like I just want to know when the when like when did you guys last contact like last time you

like we talked to each other the whole time he was talking to me while he was with you by the way That's crazy. To Danau's point, at what point in your mind were you like, I'm no longer in a relationship? Me? Yeah. Yeah. February 1st when we're moving in and he, we got into something about something with a TV. And then I was like, he just started saying, you make everything an argument.

And I was like, the thing about marriage, like, I really wasn't. The thing about marriage is you consider someone's opinion, but it's not the case with Harry. you're not allowed to put your opinion. He will view it as like he starts to fend, like he's impossible. So we get into little tiny things. We talked about a TV. I said, you know what, Harry? I'm proud of you.

I have it on text. I'm proud of you. Good luck with moving day. You've wanted this for so long. You want a bigger house for yourself. You want to be with the dogs with a yard. Like, like all good. Like I will talk to you later.

Like good luck with a move in. Never heard from him again until the finale dropped. That you guys just watched. So him blocking you and going to the Lakers game, that was like early January or December or something like that? No, that was like the same week he ghosted me. So he's already in the works with her. And I heard from a lot of other people that he had kind of met her or heard of her from the Australia trip. And did you know he was, he had met up with Denaal?

Or like, because you knew he was. No, and that's why I was so angry at the reunion. You'll see me. I fucking freaked out. to genuinely find out on a Snapchat is not okay, like, at all. It's not okay. Who's Snapchat? Yeah, like.

He posted it. Like, he, sorry. He took it upon himself. He didn't even tell me that he was going to be posting those. So I also saw them. And I was like, didn't know we were doing that, first of all. Just like a selfie? It was pictures of us.

We, like, met up with an influencer. he was doing content. So there were pictures with her and then that was it actually. We were with her the whole time. But yeah. How long did you and Harry hang out for? Was it like a one week and meet up? And it was that just like just reconnecting because obviously you guys clearly had chemistry.

Was there any conversations about you guys exploring a relationship? Yeah, I was under the impression that that's what we were doing. Okay. The whole time. And what was his, I mean, I'm assuming you had. questions about his breakup with Amber or has a let you know from his standpoint yeah I did I asked what happened between you and Amber he was very vague he didn't want to give me too much detail he said that out of respect of Amber he didn't want to share what happened so that's the

answer I got I'm being nice not even talking about what like some of the things you don't have to be nice like with with Harry like no it's just like I've moved on this happened like in January and I'm just like, it sucks to be in this situation. I'm not going to lie. So I just, I want to, like, I just want him to leave me alone and I'd be done with this soon. Like, that's genuinely how I feel. And when he was being so toxic, that's how I felt on February 1st, too. I was like, okay, learned my lesson, learned about myself. I am not going to fight for something that disturbs my peace. I want to be seen and valued and considered in a marriage. Like, I do not play. When I have a person, I have a person. Like, I want to grow.

with them, you know, like, you know, if you want to go, um, fast go alone, if you want to go far, go together. And I, I believe in that 100%. I'm like that with my friends, with my business, with all that I am as a person. It's really unfortunate because Harry comes from a beautiful family. He's really fun. He's really cool for him to do this to himself is, it's sad. Like, I feel sad for him. I mean, I ate him up on the stage yesterday, but at the end of the day, it's just so sad because he walked off laughing with Sunny. Like, he doesn't. And, like, he doesn't. I feel. I feel he doesn't he's not considerate of he's not ready for marriage and that's okay like all the best to you to be honest is do you think he felt like apologetic or sorry like when you were bringing this to

him at the reunion that's the crazy part i felt like i was like waiting for him to come out and be like i'm so sorry to like certain people and like even just talking to people backstage like everyone was preparing me for like maybe an apology i don't know because i hadn't really talk to him up until like you will never get an apology from him. He sat up there and was like, I don't know you guys. No one's getting a sorry. He literally looked at everybody. He looked at everybody. It was like, I don't even know you guys.

I knew you for five minutes last year. And I was like, oh my gosh. Like some girls quit their job to be. Yeah, sure. With you three women, it's a little different. But I mean, just. He dug his own grave. Watch it.

It's actually crazy. He just sat there and acted like too cool. And I understand he was getting attacked. Like, I did feel like slightly. bad at a certain point, you know, but also, like, he did dig his own grave. Like, I don't really know what else to say. He, like, you, he's not getting attacked. Like, honestly, are you mad that, like, it's all true? Like, are you mad that we're saying it? Or you mad that it's true? Like, you have to sit in here and you have to eat it up right now. Like, you didn't want to have

this conversation with me privately from the time we wrapped to now. So we're going to do it in front of everyone. That's what I looked at me in the eye and said we're doing it here. Because you didn't even call me. I asked you anything you want to say. You want to say. to me for a reunion, you could say it. He's like, no. And I was like, have I dragged you online? Have a disrespected you? He's like, no. I was like, hey, do you need to talk about anything? He's like, no. I was like, okay, I'll see you at the reunion. So I went out there and I let him have it. What would you ladies say to the average fan who's followed Harry's journey on TV? What if they were like, what did you expect with the show? Like, what would you say to that fan who has that point of

you? I am just like, I'm a lover girl. I love, love, everything about it. I am genuinely looking for a husband. So like, and like you already said, yeah, I didn't even do my research, but still with that, like people, yeah, why would you think that Harry Jousie really wanted to get buried? I don't know. I think people can change. I gave him the benefit of the doubt. I don't know. It is what it is. I was questioning him the whole time, not going to be. Harry's a type of, you know, he's beautiful, he's tall, he's charming, he's charismatic, he's got money, he's famous. But think about Harry, and he's not, it's not exclusive to him, but he will have unlimited chances, right? Like there will always be someone who's like, but he can change for me.

Has he changed your perspective on how you get to know future men? Have you learned anything from this experience of how to protect yourselves and relationships moving forward? I would like to answer about kind of the last question that Dinell answered. Okay. The tone of the show was really beautiful when we were on set. All the girls were really respectful of each other. We knew what he was like.

But the cast, he got so lucky and he'll stay it 100 times. We were so like. We knew what it was. We were so kind to him wanting to make a shift in his career. And he was so sick of being called a fuckboy that we're like, okay, this is something that you want a different approach to and you deserve that chance then. If you claim that you made lots of mistakes in the past on TV, do good. Let's watch. Let's see.

Where I want to say something is I ended the show with. him and we connected off a tone of I did not ever ever like like I said like play into telling him what he wants to hear that I was ready for marriage early. I gave him so much space to find that. And like we connected because his he he presented to us that he was there because he had lost his dad and he felt like that was the saddest thing in the world to not have. have a family. Like he went through pain watching his parents not be there for each other and he doesn't want to be put in the position where if he didn't have someone, like that gave him a new set of eyes. So we weren't looking at it in any. I personally was only looking at this situation

where it's like, I'm going to take your grief seriously. Like I held a lot of space for that. And I think that was a different tone of the show. The way it was edited and thrown in the PR and the way he talked about it, I was like, this is what I'm seeing on screen is so different than what we experienced. I don't know if you guys feel the same. What do you mean by that? Just like what it felt like being there? The challenges were like vulnerability. Like we did have deep talks. Like yeah, he was you know,

Macking on everyone doing his thing but like Yeah. That's part of it a little bit. It's part of it. You know. What you said about like the girl like y'all understanding like what it was. It was interesting because it did seem like while he would like entertain one girl. Like y'all was like being some girls, girls shit and like y'all became super close. Even post show. I see all y'all videos together. Yeah. 80%

of the experience filming and off of it. the girls were actually like tight. Yeah, that's lit. A big part of obviously the season was you and Harry hooking up in the shower, Amber. Uh-huh. And then how Harry chose to communicate that or not communicate that with the rest of the women. You know, it's like part of the, you know, being the lead is there's damned if you,

damned if you don't, you know. And, you know, if you're juggling so many emotions, you're bound to piss someone off. But like, how did you feel about, you know, at that point, were you thinking, oh, he's going to pick me and that's why I'm doing this? Or is it, well, is this like, lets us have some fun or, and I guess how did you feel about how the other women would feel about that happening? Now that the show's out and the girls have spoken out, two girls had already slept with him at this point. So this was the last day in the house. Only my shit kind of got aired out, all good.

Like, it is what it is. I did. He's the one who picked me up. You watched that. I was the last girl to kiss him, too. So, like, he, I didn't know what was going on. We were drunk, went into the closet. The man knows what he's doing.

He's like, I'm turning our mics off. Let's talk through some stuff because I was wanting to go. I mentioned to him, that was the elimination night, Juliana left. He told me this is the last night in the house. It's going to get more fun. We're going to go on some trips. I was still like, dude, if you're going to entertain Juliana, I don't want to be here. Like, if you kept your on, I would have left.

I was, I was going to pack my bags. We talked through some stuff. He turned off a mic. He purposely didn't turn off one of them. that's why you hear what I say, which got chopped up so much. We were in the bathroom talking. No intention of hooking up with him like in any way. He was at, he turned on the shower.

Actually, this is true. He turned on the shower, turned off a mic, put it on the side. I was standing by the sink like this. He was talking. And he's like unbuttoning his shirt. And I'm like, are you about to take a shower? You know what I mean? Like the conversation was actually so funny.

And it got clipped up to it was like, well, I'm not going to marry someone I don't know what they look like naked get naked. Didn't mean I was gonna fuck him. Like I was edging, like, you know, like it was funny as hell. That was my approach. Then what happened? How'd we go from there to there? He picks me up and takes me into the closet and boom, we just start hooking up.

Like I was like, what the hell? You know what I mean? It just happened so fast. Also, it wasn't like, I mean, call it a hookup. Like, I wouldn't in my real world. But, you know, he likes to claim that it was this. Did you guys have sex? I'm not getting into details.

quite traumatizing to think about him. So that's the shower scene, just letting you guys know. But everyone assumes you had sex. Did you, did you not have sex or did you have sex? I mean a little. Okay. That can mean so many different things. Like, I'm using my imagination right now.

Please fucking don't. No, when I heard whispers like of some things, you know, when I was like, I didn't know he was moving. Like, I guess girls fell into that with him so quick because he moves quick like that. Like, I'm sure. I mean, I don't know. Like, he just puts it on. You're like, are we allowed to do this for a fucking camera?

Like, I was genuinely shitting my pants. I was like, I, like, I felt like I was breaking rules. Like, he's just so. I want to say something too. And maybe just clarify, though, because you said he already slept with two girls before. Are you insinuating one with me, I'm guessing? Well, someone. It's fine.

I just wanted to... He had said something that you didn't come back to your bed for a while. Okay. The other girls in the bunk. He kind of... Like, there was things, of course, whatever. I just... I actually wanted to speak about that.

So, of course, first, there's the closet scene that we had, which was so blown out of proportion, though, because you can clearly see I walk out, like, completely fine. The closet door wasn't even closed. Like, we were in there making out. So that was just crazy. No, I knew that was... Yeah. And then... Absolutely.

The second was, you do see me getting into his bed. And that was, like, maybe... one or two nights after. And that night, we did not have sex. Like, we literally, it was, we'll call it for play. That's all it was. The first night we ever got intimate was the night that. What base did we get to?

We went all the way, okay? That was the night that he met my mom. That's the first time we had sex. That was hard for me to watch that shower scene because I had to be quiet till the reunion and things. And I got so slut shamed for that. And at the end of the day, you didn't deserve that. truly it bothers me. It was really crazy situation. I was the last one who kissed it. Like he knew

the way that way that what I was like, I cannot believe this is that it I got. And that's what you get for letting someone tell your story. That's what I learned from reality TV. Like, I'll take that one on the chin. And it's like, I think the narrative of it all got so twisted because I don't know, just our situation and me being like, did you sleep with Amber in the shower? And like, it was just his lying that bothered me. Like I kept reiterating that. I'm like, just be 100 with me. Like, that's all I care about. I could care less about, like, what relationships he had going on and how they were developing. I wasn't naive.

I wasn't stupid, you know. You just kind of felt like you were experiencing a liar in that moment. Yeah. And he's just, like, looking away and playing games and gaslighting me. He's like, is my hair wet? Is my hair wet? No. See, I wasn't doing anything.

And I'm like, he did pull that. Yeah. And I'm like, what are we doing here? You know? And I'm like, okay, if you're lying to me, I'm going to go home. Like, look at me in the eyes and tell me you didn't do this. And he's like, I promise you, I. I didn't do it.

I'm like, okay. So what's confusing, though, is because you're saying you guys didn't have sex, though. So it's kind of like you technically wasn't lying. No, we got to that point a little, but the way it was blown out, like, we hooked up in the closet, like quick. But the way this whole thing was like, you mean shower. Closet. Like, we were dry. We were dry.

But you guys were in the bathroom, though, right? Yeah, but there's a closet in the bathroom. Oh, got you gotcha. He turned on the show. I was actually so confused of what was happening. This is like that. So the shower was more of a distraction of audio rather than that. Yeah.

And he wanted to navigate it that way because he knew I wasn't going to walk up in that room and be like, let's fuck. I was not that girl. So he discussed like, he's like, I know where we could. Like I was like, okay, let's go have a chat. Like I did, guys, I did not know I would ever take it to that point. So it wasn't like some like exotic or. erotic shower moment. Yeah.

But you're requested that this dies between us. You were like, can't tell another girl. You got a lot of backlash for that on the internet too. In the, like when I walk out, I said, that's not my job. Like you're a man. Like you speak on your stuff. But let's keep this between us is what I said. And then, but I meant for that, for that night.

What did you mean by that? Because I will, I'll be honest. If you were to told me that, I would be confused. I never said lie for me. Nah, I didn't. I said, okay, we have to go downstairs. Don't be avoidant. Let's go.

Let's keep this between us. And I was going to, like, talk to him about it tomorrow. Also, it's an opportunity for him to grow. I wish he would have said to Sam, I am now down to the final five girls. And I'm going to be moving at girls, like, in a different pace and way. Like, he, I expected him to, like, this is the. the point where he's going to start deepening his relationships. And I knew going into the rest of the process, he could very well be with a girl in that way. You know what I mean? So I wish he would have said to

Sam, Sam, I am going to explore my relationships and the intimate parts of it. I have to keep between me and the girl. But I understand how you're feeling and how that's uncomfortable for you. So let's talk through as much as we can. But as far as my intimacy goes with the other girls, like this kind of stays between us. He could have, like, kind of had a gray area with it instead of just blatantly lie. For him to get on the couch the next day, I will lie to the day. Bro, you look dumb as hell. Like, I gave you an opportunity to actually grow there. And I believe in those moments.

How would you have felt about that answer, Sam, if Harry would have gave Amber's answer? That would have been good enough for me, honestly. Like, truly, I just wanted the respect of him. You know what I mean? Like, acknowledging me in that way, acknowledging, like, what's going on? I think it was just confusing because it was like elimination night. You know what I mean? And it's like, oh, wow, it's final five.

And then now we're sleeping with girls. And it wasn't what just like you, it was like Abby and stuff too, like the same time period. And it just felt like, are we playing games? Is this for real? Okay. So hypothetically, if he were to go to the other extreme and just be blatantly honest, was like, oh, yeah, we had sex. Yeah. You would have appreciated that and you would have stayed.

See, this is, people are going to like watch this and be like, what the fuck? But like, truly, I feel like, yes, it was uncomfortable. Yes, I would have been like, ooh, I don't know how I feel about that. But that would have been my decision to process versus like just lying in my face. Right. And he could have come to me as well and said, hey, the girl, like, let's talk about it. And I was like, hey, let's all be honest now. If you guys ask hard questions, you're going to get hard answers.

You want to ask what I did? I'll tell you. That's kind of like where I stand with stuff. Harry navigates things the way he wants. Like I said, we're all here giving him opportunity to grow. And I didn't know he lied to you like that, Sam. When I watched the show, I didn't know that's the way he carried. that. And you actually messaged me first about it before he ever contacted me.

The way you're watching it go down when I was like, my head hurts watching this. I got an apology for you from you before I ever got one from Harry. So I was like, thanks. And also, if you guys wanted to know if I did that, you could have came to me and asked, you really didn't. You did. I was going to say, I did ask you off camera in the bathroom. And then you told me no. In the beauty. actually we were all like making jokes you asked if i got in the shower no i asked if you guys had sex in the shower sex yes oh i don't remember that yeah i was i wouldn't tell you in that moment but you know what i'm just i'm just gonna stand on that i'm the type that i'm like if i were in your shoes i maybe would have done the same thing you know what i mean like you didn't have to tell me that i was to be honest i thought

you had already slept with him and i never asked you about it and i respected you because you didn't come back to your bed so for you to ask me i was kind of like oh i'm not i'm not going to say get out of my business, but I just had to hold my own. You didn't have to share. Yeah. And so it looked bad. This whole situation did look bad, but it happened so fast. And it was so late at night. It was like midnight. And we knew we were packing up and leaving the next night. And I was like, I, if the girls want to talk to me about it, they can. But in that like situation, to be honest, I thought that you had we heard or the way that the house works, you know, we have people running the house. They're like, Tonell didn't come back to her bed. Do you, what do you think about that? I was like,

good for her. Like I truly was like, amazing. Like, I was so like respect. And I think that's how a lot of us felt in the house. Whenever anyone was doing anything, we were like, good for you. Like straight up. I told the girl, go kiss him. Do what you want. Like the sooner he realizes you like him, you don't. With this process moves better for us. I like honesty. But that moment did put all of us, I'm going to say, in a sticky situation. Because I was out here being like, girl, like, I never asked about you. I'm just going to hold this to me for now.

If the girls do ask me in Vegas, I'm going to, like, say. But then it kind of like dissolves. Well, no, there's a scene that shows us all talking about it in the glam room. Remember, we were telling you that we were all spiraling about it? So, chopped up as well. Also, at the end of the day, we're not here to investigate each other's relationships. Like, that, I don't want to know. That's your own business.

Like, that's on him to communicate with us and be respectful to us. Like, truly, I could sit here and ask you, you can lie to my face. You could let a bit. Like, I don't care. Harry, that's a whole different story, you know. No. it looked so much more confusing on the show than us. We were actually really respectful of each other.

That's the thing I really liked about it too. What I appreciate about your answer, Sam, is what I think a lot of people in relationships, and it seems like, to your point, Amber, that from your P of your P of, Harry has a habit of, is he doesn't give you the opportunity to decide for yourself, right?

Like, you just wanted the truth, whatever that truth was, because like, you know, okay, now, as an adult human, I can decide whether do I accept this behavior because I'm in this crazy show and like it's not real life and I'm going to make different decisions or do I still walk away because at the end of the day, whatever your answer is, you, you didn't have the opportunity to decide based off what happened. You made a decision based off of like, I don't even know what the fucking truth is. So I don't even know how to make a decision, but I do feel like he's lying to me. Yeah.

And I think it's just like I had shared with him like our conversations were cut out. quite a lot throughout the show. I feel like it's a little confusing how I even got to top three. But a big conversation we had is like I was with my ex for eight years. It was like a huge thing for me and like I gaslit myself throughout the entire relationship. He was a really good liar. And I love to see the good parts of people, you know, like the rose colored glasses is like a huge issue for me. So I was like, please like tell me I'm not crazy. Tell me like you're telling me the truth right now. And I think he reassured me a million times and I sat there. I think there's like an interview of me, like, after we get out of the spa. And I'm just like, yeah, I feel really good about

everything. Like, truly, like, I'm working through this. It's something I'm working on myself. And, like, I don't know, he made me feel really comforted in that. And then to see everything play back, it's just like, stupid, stupid. No, you were amazing. When I watched that, I didn't know that that's what your guys' relationship was like. I didn't know that this little shower scene, like, scene was such a catalyst for you guys and you did and said exactly what you're meant to and it's not stupid. Thank you. At all.

Sam. Back to my kind of a question I had for you ladies earlier on. But maybe I frame it as like if I don't know if you ladies want to have kids someday, but hypothetically, let's say you do, you have a daughter and she gets older and she wants to date, say, Harry is. Harry, a hairy like, a hairy guy, a hairy guy, a hairy like persona. What advice or what would you do differently to, you know, or what advice would you give your daughter? And let's assume she had a very similar like, you know, I want to kind of go with an open mind and I don't want to, you know,

people change and things like that. But would you ladies that despite, you know, the 10 experience and the making of the friends and overall like, you know, everything happens for a reason, your better off mindset, which I think is important to have. But how would you, if any, would you move differently to protect yourself and avoid whatever traumas or challenges this experience caused? I don't know. I kind of feel like I would still, like if I had a daughter, I'd be like, yes, if you feel the calling that you need to go and experience this, do it.

But just protect your heart and just be smart and stay true to who you are and just do it feels right for you. Okay. I know it's hard to separate your head and your heart and stuff, but truly just like look at things for what they are. Like, I don't know. I think it's so funny watching everything back because it's like truly just to take myself out of the experience for a second.

Like I imagine watching, I don't know, I always see like these funny memes online where it's like, imagine your relationship is on Love Island or something. Like, would you be rooting for yourself or would you be like screaming, get away from this man? you know like I'm just look at things for what they are not how you feel sometimes and um sometimes you just got to experience it for yourself like you can enforce as much as you want into your kid like don't do this don't do whatever they're just going to do it behind your back type of thing you know so just support that's all um our moms were brought into the show so like to be honest like my mom the way she deals with me in relationships like she knows how I am I have a high level of

for myself. But I see things through and I'm so curious and I love a challenge. So she respected me the whole way, supported me. You saw she was skeptical. It's because of where we come from. We've lost a lot. And I think that she trusted me. And the way I carry myself in all my relationships, like, I leave when things, when I get disrespected. I'm not naive. Like she would never encourage me to not, which I think with my daughter, I raise a daughter. I want her to be connected to her experiences and her growth and self-expansion. And the way I came into this show was like, I really did have a huge shift in my life. Like I ended things with someone I dated just because I was like, you know what? The next chapter just demands me and self-expansion. Like I moved to a third

world country. I quit smoking wheat. Like I changed so much of my life that when I came to this, I trusted myself. So I'm going to trust my daughter and her like self-expansion in her life. When that comes to dating, letting love in and into your field is huge. Of course it's going to be hard, but I think my relationship with my daughter will be that trusting, like, you know, that I'm just good. I would say go for it, but I, you know, I support you, but know who you are. And this whole experience, my mom has been the same way with me because it has been really fucking hard, just from post show to now. Do you feel like you're, you've processed this breakup and you're fully over it? Or do you feel like you feel?

like you still have some healing to do? I never experienced being with a toxic guy ever. Like I have good experiences dating. So I was really, really like mind fucked of how someone, I think life is hard enough. Why poison that category of your life with someone? Like start fights and do stuff like that. I was so confused by it. Life got better when he stopped being in my life.

And that's all good. I have such a good relationship with myself. Like, I was homeschooled. I've ran my own business for 15 years. I've never played on a sports team. I'm so good being alone. Like that when it ended, I felt okay as well. And from our breakup to now,

I'm just healing the parts of, honestly, the reunion was big. That's the first time I saw him. It's really triggering environment for me to come and talk about this stuff and show up because this does feel like such a, I have peace with my past. You know, who's to know what he's going to say this week?

The reunion was crazy. I'm not healing from him. Like, I wish him the best. Hope he got his fairy tale ending. Leave me alone, kind of. That's kind of how I feel. But I'm going to stand up for myself. He gaslit me and manipulated me.

And I felt really used. I felt like he wanted a wife, got one, tossed me to the side, messed around with Dinell, lied to both of us, made me feel terrible when all I did was hold space for your grief and you told me like this show wouldn't be anything without you for that to be thrown into my face and then him dismiss me at the reunion too of course i'm going to have to heal with this but i healed with this silently and that's why i was frustrated with denel the reunion because you know she got broken up with on the show but i got fucked in real life and in silence i ate that breakup up and i let everyone cyber bully me and i genuinely had such a hard time with that

that I do have healing to do, but I just want this over. Like I can't now like obviously I couldn't date this year. Like I couldn't do anything. We had a show coming out. Like not that that stopped him. He was a girlfriend. But I'm ready to get my life on track. I love shooting photos.

I love traveling. Like I really haven't been single. Like I said, I went up on that show my first summer single in a long time. I know myself. I'm in my 30s now. I really can't wait to date. and explore people that make me feel good about myself. I'm going to leave this in the past and just do my thing.

I don't think I have much more to say about healing or that breakup with Harry. Danelle, did you feel like Amber's frustrations were justified towards you? Or do you feel like it was maybe a projection of, I guess, Harry's behavior or whatever? I don't know what you want to call it? How do you, yeah, I mean, did you take it personally?

I feel like the reunion was just super heavy in general for everyone. well, mostly me and Amber. I don't know. You know, I kind of had an inkling that she might have seen the pictures on Snapchat, right? So going into it, I was like, she's probably going to know, we're probably going to discuss this. So I have two, like, sides of it. Like, part of me, I am like, well, first of all, obviously, Harry lied to me. He told me that he was single, basically acted like we were just getting back together.

He loves me. He's whatever. We're getting right back to where we left off. I ate it up. I was heartbroken for months. I was like so happy he reached back out. I was like, oh my gosh, like my heart. I just felt so full.

So I jump right back into it. That's where my head is at for so long, just how happy I was to finally like be back in connection with him. after the reunion last night decompressing, taking everything in, you know, like I 100% can understand why Amber would be hurt by that, a thousand percent. Like how could he switch up so fast from a breakup on the ride to the airport to then hitting me up, flying me out to L.A. and then right after that, maybe getting with his girlfriend that he has now. Like, it's like, bam, bam, bam.

So, like, I get the frustration, a thousand percent. I will say, Danielle, as some, I don't know how much you know about my history on reality TV, but I was a two-time runner-up on The Bachelorette. So I experienced what you experienced twice. Oh. I can empathize with your experience because I don't think there's any other dating scenario in this world where you have this very intense period of time

or you connect with someone. And usually in these shows, like you three women as finalist, you guys kind of crossed a threshold of connection with Harry in the ways that so many of the other women didn't because they just had such a limited time, right? Certainly as the runner-up, usually they're the one person who like, again, you're like, I think I'm going to get engaged or I think I'm going to get married. And then it just ends. And then there's no. closure, there's no conversation, there's nothing, and then you have to deal with that on your own while like telling yourself, it's not me, well, there is a better connection, yada, yada, yada. So all I can say is I know that feeling when that person reaches out to you to reconnect

and all the unanswered questions that you were sitting with, however period of time you were sitting with it, and the poll that that is to want to like meet up with that person to get answers and not feel like you were crazy for developing the feelings that you felt. So I relate to your experience. Yeah. You know, I just feel like at that time I was so vulnerable and he knew. He had to have known. As soon as I reached out to Danielle, she's probably going to be right.

Like, I could have her in a snap of a finger, which is annoying because then it's like you flew me out there. I was there for two days and then you're just on to the next. How did that weekend end? Honestly, I wish that I had a better answer for you. Genuinely, I think piecing things together that he had already met his now girlfriend, that he was probably had other, he was interested in her maybe instead. Did you leave that weekend thinking you guys were going to continue to talk about a future?

Oh, no, no, no. So when he was driving me to the airport, I feel like I've heard this before, your story is kind of, the similar driving to the airport and that's when I was like what's going on and he basically is just like I don't know just really like in my head about things not really a concrete answer and then I went to the airport crying and basically enough to keep hope alive but like not put anything set in stone or do you feel like he ended no we were in the car you were like no he flew me out and played me one like do you think he was like just hoping to hook up one last time? I don't know. I don't know why. Like, why did you even have me go out there? Did you guys hook up,

or was it just a weekend of conversation? No, we did hook up. So you flew out there with the intention that like this might be rekindling. We might spark that flame again. And you think he had different intentions. I don't know what his intentions were. I have no idea. It'll forever be a mystery. Maybe he can tell us one day. Who knows? Is there anything that we didn't discuss with you ladies that happened at the reunion, any air you want to Claire before we send you ladies on your way? Yeah, honestly. I think that I came in hot to that reunion and I want, it was like, this is a really toxic situation that I went through in silence. And I felt like I was completely used and drowned out. So getting on that stage, like knowing this is the last time I'm going to say what I want to say and look him in and I wanted him to fucking feel it. So I told him that because he's going to go run his mouth on every podcast and lie. So when we sat down on that couch, I watched you guys answer all your questions at the reunion.

I was watching the green screen. I watched you answer about you and Harry. The way this timeline happened for me was I was picked and felt like the loser, to be honest. And from the finale to just all like the bullying and no support from Harry and to going back on the reunion to nobody knowing what. happened to finding out on Snapchat that Dinell had slept with Harry and I was blindsided by them. I had no fucking clue they would both do that to me. It is the biggest slap in the face to look at a picture of your husband kissing someone and say plot twist. And then for him to tell you on the phone, oh, it's good TV. I was like, you think using your dad's story and connecting with me is

good TV, you're fucking disturbed. Like, this has been something that is really, really uncomfortable for me. That reunion, I just, what I want to say is, and Danelle, I get where you're coming from, because you are a sweet girl. You're one of my first friends there. You're my roommate. They took that away. Me and Dano were like, genuinely, I was like, this girl could win this thing.

She's so fucking sweet. I loved to know. I told them our last date. I was like, if Dinell is going to give you a better life, pick Dinell. Like, I was blindsided by her and him. I find out on that. And then I have three days to walk up to this reunion. None of them reached out to me to have a private conversation.

So I sat down in the reunion and said, we're doing this all here. Because nobody took me into consideration. So we're going to air it out here. I fucking went in. I was, it is months of him, like, exploiting me on Snapchat as this fake wife while he has a new girlfriend. friend while he's fucking Dinell while he's running like his mouth about finding marriage and I'm just sitting here just taking it like it's so hard to do a show where you can't say anything wait to the reunion number which I was like dude I'm going to like this is so unhealthy for me so what people see at the

reunion is a girl who came in with like yeah good intentions and I was I was blindsided by that that hurt a lot and you needed your closure but to trust a guy. who lied to you and said he was going to marry you and trust him again. Like you could have hit my line and be like, are you guys finished? If he wrapped the show with you and reached out to me, I would say, are you guys broken up? I would just consider you. So I felt really shitty about this. So when I came in and I came in, we never talked. And the thing is, is like, we talked since the show came out supporting each other. I felt so bad for her getting dumped in their dress. But meanwhile, I went through a breakup silently and she was with him. Like, so when. When I hear that, I'm like, yo, I loved to know, why would you do this to me? You know, so I was hurt. And things I said at the reunion were hurtful. And I'm sorry that we have to watch that back because I was really angry at you. And you know what?

I am, but I want to just leave it here because I want to wrap up this chapter of my life. After hearing Dinell's point of view, Amber, do you feel like she still owed you that phone call? Or do you have a better appreciation that she was going through her own experience having come off the show and in, And again, like, I don't know what's like to be the winner, but I certainly know like the point of view from a winner because like you're right, Amber, the winner of The Bachelor or these types of shows, it's one of the hardest experiences

because you feel the most alone while everyone else is connecting for not being picked. But everyone, especially the finalist, has their own trauma to unpacked. And I guess I'm just curious after hearing Dinell's perspective, do you still feel like she owed you that or do you have a better appreciation for what she was going through? I think we're just such.

different girls. I can't expect her to move like me or to do anything. Like I see, I see where she's coming from, but I just would have called the wife. I'm like, hey, your man's hitting me up. You guys were in Australia last week. It's in the group chats. Everyone was piecing together if we were together. Like, don't trust the man that lied to you. Like, if you wanted a credible source, like, even if me and Harry were done, I would have been like, you guys deserve your closure too. When we came off the show, Denal wanted to talk to Harry. And I was like, Harry's like, Can I talk to know? I was like, of course.

Talk to her. Get your closure. I didn't think they would fucking hook up. That was way before, though. Yeah. Just to clarify, that wasn't like a. So I, yeah, that was. Yeah.

I would like to just say, though, too, is I am sorry. You know, I feel like I definitely. So just some context here. Me and Amber, the first time we spoke after the show was just this month. we just connected a couple weeks ago right before the show came out, I think. So I am sorry that you were hurt by my actions. You know, that was never my intention. You know, I think you're an amazing woman, obviously.

Could I have handled it differently? Sure. I think my heart and my mind were just a mess when it was happening. I think if I could change anything, if I would do anything different, I honestly would probably once we reconnected recently, I would have told you before. I don't think I would have changed calling you when he told me because I genuinely believed him that I didn't feel like I needed to do that and be causing a three-way like drama by calling you and him and like me, what's going on? What's this? What's that? Like, that's just, that's just what I decided to do in that moment,

I guess, honestly. I don't know. If I could change anything, I wish I would have at least given you a heads up. So I'm sorry for that. That's okay. I think, I mean, I feel you. I get that. It was a crazy situation. He is not the best person.

We know that. Finding out on Snap and then waiting to see if you would say anything. No, no. I was like, okay, we're going to handle that the reunion then. Like, this is so disrespectful. That's how I felt. So, yeah, that was hard for me. And at the end of the day, if you got your closure with him, all good.

I don't really have anything more to say about that Yeah Yeah I think I don't know I was just viewing it for my person Like if if my friend's man even likes my story I'm screensharing that shit and sending it to a girl I'm like what the fuck is he moving like this for I'm so like that

What do you mean by that? What do you mean? I just like if a guy reached out to me I would kind of like ask the last girl he was Hey are you guys still together But like I said like she was in a headspace Like across the board like you get a Some some guys

I listen to this podcast and is like, oh, she's single, she's beautiful, she's available. I'm going to hit her up. The first thing you're doing is stalking his page and reaching out to his ex. This is a different situation. I was married to him like the week before, like the month before. No, I'm just, yeah, maybe I was just misunderstanding. It sounds like you were like in any situation I was going to do that. Yeah, no, I was operating off of the situation.

I was currently living, which was, it was very obvious in the group chat to the girls. They all knew we were in Australia together days before this took place. So what I'm speaking on is that. Gotcha. You know, like I'm just clearing it up and selling the score now because it was so obvious. Everyone knew we got married. Everyone knew we were together.

Harry lied to her. But it's like we were friends too. You could genuinely ask me and I would say yes or no. And honestly, like, yeah, we've discussed that we would have done things differently on both sides. I think with the reunion coming out, it's hard because I was in that headspace yesterday. I felt betrayed. It was so hard to walk up into this toxic environment for the last time. Haven't seen Harry in eight months.

He'd been acting like he's married while he's not using my name. Like I was so heated and I was I was mad at Dinell. Like I, you'll see it in there. So I knew I would see you today too and that we would come to a more calm place. But like that stage is where I really wanted to show people like this is how it went. You guys saw that. This is what I'm feeling. So, yeah.

Is there a path forward for the two of you to be friends? I love to know. I don't know if you hate me from yesterday, but I was mad at you and you saw that. And I'm sorry too for coming on you that hard. But holy shit, I was really, yeah, I was sad. No. And I completely see where you're coming from. And I don't blame you at all.

I don't hold anything against you. I feel like heat of the moment too. You're just spilling how you feel. And that's what it was. And you deserve to be able to do that. that too. Yeah. I think finding out on Snapchat was what really set me off and then saying plot twist. I was like, damn, you're going to throw that in my face. Both of you willingly taking this picture and doing that, slap into my face. Like, this is so disrespectful.

Sam, you're here. Someone is going to ask the question, but you can plead the fifth and it's your birthday. So you can be like, I don't want to answer this question. But since you're here, like, how do you see this situation? And would you have any POV of how you would have like to have been handled as how, you know, if you were in the situation? I was a little sad that Harry got, you know, that little bit from both of them that, like, he wanted the girls fighting. I think that's one thing for sure is, like, I was watching the reels. I was watching the social media. He was like pitting the girls against each other.

He brings up the group chat. Oh, I get screenshots. We're all like, who's the rat in the group chat? You know what I mean? So I think it, like, directed the attention of like, oh, this guy sucks to, like, each other, which was like unfortunate to watch, I guess. I really like in that moment wanted to be like, guys, guys, like wait, like, yes, this sucks. And like, you're allowed to have your moment a million percent.

That's part of all of this. But like, let's redirect it for a second because he hardly spoke. And I don't know. I think now he has the opportunity to go on the podcast and like really think through what he wants to say and formulate whatever versus all of us who are sitting there in the moment, live experiencing this and like, you know, I'm really curious. Like, I don't feel like any of us got any sort of closure, which is like what I came there for in a lot of ways. If Harry decided to come on this podcast and give me a chance to ask him questions, what would you want me to ask them? Or how

would you want him to be challenged, if at all? I feel like he needs the girls in front of him, honestly, like that eye-to-eye contact, he's so good at, you know, formulating his own version of things. And, like, we saw it in real time as he's speaking to you. He's like, no, this is what happened. You're like, Harry, stop lying. Like, he lied the whole reunion. Like, it's, there's no. So, like, I think he needs someone in front of him to check him and be like, wait, that's not how this happened. So now he gets to go on his podcast and say whatever he wants. I'm really curious how that's going to unfold. You probably won't be surprised. So you probably don't have to waste your time. I won't be surprised. Yeah, that's true. I don't even see it as a waste of time.

It's just, like, almost comical for me to watch at this point. You know what I mean? Because it's just like, man, I dodged a bullet. Like, no offense, guys. You know what I mean? But it's just like, geez. I mean, I'd be curious, Sam, do you, I mean, again, no offense to anyone else. But do you feel a sense of, I guess, personal pride or glad that you chose to end things the way you did? Do you feel good about that?

I'm not sure exactly how to word this. I feel like it's not like a ha ha, yeah, I did it right, whatever. It's more like a, yeah, I was really sad in the moment. and for months, I was gaslighting myself wondering if I had made the right choice and if I was being crazy and like it wasn't me, you know, laughing, walking away from it. It was more of just like comfort and knowing that I made the right choice, I guess. I mean, listen, I've had a lot of relationships ups and downs and it's, I've definitely dated the wrong people. I've, you know, picked the wrong people.

But I guess from my own personal experiences, when I started just realizing, guess, whatever roles I was playing or, you know, like, and just making better decisions for myself, regardless of who I was dating or, or how many chances I gave them. That just, that's how things got a little better for me because it was like, that was the only thing I could control. So I get what you're saying, because at the end of the day, you made a decision. In hindsight, it felt like you made the right decision. And that must feel pretty empowering. So I hear you. And just him at the reunion saying, well, it makes good TV. I was like, fuck, you're right. Congrats. I guess. You know, you got what you wanted. He got what you wanted. He was so dismissed.

I said. Amber, you kind of, you referenced a few times in this interview, him mentioning the passing of his father, or you mentioned, I think you said something about using grief. What do you mean by that? Because I don't want people to misinterpret what you're saying or put words in your mouth. Do you feel like him bringing up the passing of his father was insincere? Or was that not what you're speaking on? We came to a really heated part of the reunion where I think you guys could notice he was kind of like checking out, defending himself, gaslighting us once again, laughing under his breath. I was sitting right next to him. He's like, doesn't matter. This is going to get edited and you guys are going to get cut out anyway. He was being dismissive as he's been with me. And I think with him saying, this is good TV, I just threw everything I've seen. seen him on podcasts.

He said he decided to do this show because he had lost his dad and he was looking for someone. So I took that really seriously and to see him laugh and make fun of the girls and not take it seriously or even like he was so shallow in the reunion like to see him be a completely different person outside of the show where he. like, got us to love him because he was like experiencing that grief. Whereas I really, really took his grief seriously. So for him to not take it seriously and him say it's good TV, I was just like, don't ever try to get someone close to you and use that and then dismiss them like this.

You know, I think so hard. I think a lot of people fall into toxic relationships because we sympathize for people. Women are super nurturing. We really, really, we want to help someone out on a hard time and men need women, you know, like, and women need vice versa. But I think that I don't really believe in relationships. Like, he brought up me in, like our relationship was so that tone. Like, we really saw each other in that way. Stepping forward in life after this of like, hey, we kind of both have experienced similar things.

And then the way he responded to. some of my energy at the reunion. It was just like, wow, you're a completely different person. Like, you know, so that was how I felt with the whole grief thing. And his friends were there and the confidants came out. I don't know if you guys kind of, I know we didn't really talk about this, but all of his friends do have his best interest. Like Georgia and Amanda are amazing. And, you know, Sunny said some things about me that were just, like I said, you're cut from the same cloth. Like he told me I wasn't classy because I allowed Harry to do things to me. I'm like, how does that make any sense?

What do you mean by that? That's what I was confused at. Did you guys hear Sunny gaslight me? I was going to ask you how you felt about all of that because Sonny came up. Like that's the only beef I have. I was like, dude, Sunny is like I thought he was the most level-headed guy in the show. I do believe he wants Harry's, you know, interest. I think Harry really looks up to him.

I never thought anything negative of him. He's protective of Harry. I get that. But I brought my heart and my grief into this too. And he didn't date Harry. He doesn't know what it's like. Like you think he's like, I've known him for 20 years. It's like, or whatever he said, I was like, the way he spoke to me, I was like,

this is a part of the problem. Like you're now defending. Did we watch the same show? Like, I'm not classy? Did you watch your friend on the show, bro? Like, don't come at me. So the whole grief thing, like, oh, Amber, like, don't use the grief. I was like, I have grief too.

And you don't know what where we stood on our connection. Yeah. Harry tells you what you want to hear. So that was kind of just like really frustrating for me to get fired at again with someone who has no idea. He was just like saying something along the lines of like people get to express their grief however they want or experience it. And I was just like curious like what you thought of that, I guess.

Because like he said a lot of things for sure. he was just like straight protecting Harry a million percent and I was just like confused what he meant by that I guess I don't know Was he talking in terms of his father's passing and how he's processed that grief? Yeah, and he's just like you don't get to say how people process their grief and I'm like by making a show to like marry a bunch of like you know the whole tone of the show was not to put Harry in the light of being a fuck boy. It was like it was that he did lose his dad and he wants to start a family. This is what I'm trying to like say. And so, you know, Sunny's coming out like guns blazing like, oh, you don't know about his grief.

And it's like, yeah, but like your friend behaved this way. And I don't want to get blamed for that. Like it was wild. Yeah. I mean, listen, I completely get where you ladies are coming from because I think it's very fascinating to hear your perspective of what you thought was, how you thought the show was framed, right? Because in making reality TV, it's very common that, especially in casting. that they present something and then you show up and it's very different.

So I hear you there. I will say like, you know, and I'm sure you, you know, have heard this from like the Latia's point of view. Like the bachelor is famous for highlighting people's trauma and their stories. And,

and, and there's a lot of pressure, even from producers in production to like, well, what's your sad story? Right. So I imagine maybe Harry's friend if I'm trying to at least empathize, you know,

because again, the passing of a parent, you know, thankfully I don't know what it's like. like but I guess I would I would be careful to make a connection that like it was Harry's idea to frame this experience and his motivation and that's why it's like he didn't come up with the show but it makes a lot of sense from a production standpoint to highlight this of you know what like what's his motivation like they're going to do that with any any lead and every lead has a story

and often you know you know if I don't know what your lady's personal experiences and life and traumas, but like it's pretty common for producers to want to pull that out, right? Well, yeah, they said he wanted to change because of this and then he didn't really change and I experienced a lot of toxicity with him outside the show. So that's what I was speaking on and something sunny can't speak on for me. So that's kind of how I was a little bit like, don't call me unclossy when your friend is out here, literally moving the way he did. Like, I'm good off that. Anything else before we let you ladies go?

The floor is yours. I just don't want you guys to leave and feel like you didn't get to say what you wanted to say. I wanted to have one last conversation with Harry. Just because I'm like, what is our beef? What's our problem here? I think I kind of went at him a little bit maybe at the reunion. Just like sharing my thoughts and experiences because I never got to have that last, you know, elimination conversation, whatever. So I had that moment

But then I don't know He like made reels Like afterwards on Instagram And TikToks and stuff Like talking about me My roommate shit Like just like different things

And one of them was like The girls asking like Who are your favorites on the show And he's like oh everyone in the top five But Sam and I'm like He said oh yeah Like he just didn't mention me And I was just like oh okay

I don't know what I did But I just left, like, peacefully because I was just like, this isn't for me. And I felt like he's made videos and whatever. And, like, yeah, I've made my funny little videos as well. But, like, I don't know. I just, I wish I knew, I guess. And, like, I was hoping to hear that at the reunion. Do you think maybe him, maybe you leaving on your own accord, which was unique, especially

when it comes to the finalist that he, like, you think it hurt his ego and you think maybe that it's him lashing out because of like he didn't get to control that narrative in the way that he was able to with the other contestants? I have no idea. Maybe. Like that's, you know, what the comment section tells me.

I have no idea. None of us are therapists. We can only guess, but that would... Yeah. That's just one thing from the reunion I was really hoping to get and I didn't get that at all. So, you know, that's what it is. Well, I want to thank you ladies

for coming here and sharing your story. I know obviously in the past 48 hours have been a lot for all of you. And I am glad that despite everything you all went through, that you view this experience as a positive one. And yeah, I mean, like these experiences that very few of us get to have, they are life-changing. And you can definitely learn a lot about yourself if you're open to it. So it sounds like you all have been, it's all been positive.

And I think, you know, despite all the ups and downs, you all seem like in a happier place so I'm glad that's the case what's next for you ladies and then we'll wrap there Let's marry Sam season two Just kidding

Just kidding Would you want to be With any of the Absolutely Okay I want to find my husband I'm like let's go Anyone but Harry I guess

And if it's not on reality TV If there's a you know It's mostly women listening to the show but if there's any jimmies out there. What are you looking for in a man? Like, who should DM you? No rap boys.

She knows. Timothy Shalamey's taken, so that's off the table. Are you still in the rap boy era? Oh, yeah. Someone save me, however, yes. Really? And is it, like, is it skinny or do you want short too? No, not short.

Never short. Never short. I need a Pete Davidson, a Timothy Shalamee, like a Victorian child starving man. Oof, so good. And you want them to be paled skin? Is it like, can they have a tan? They can have a tan, you know?

I'm not, I'm not that picky. Had to shoot my shot, you know? What about you, Danelle? What's next for you? Would you want to have a let's marry Danelle season? I would definitely do a let's marry Danelle. You know, I've been ready to be married for years, honestly. All my best friends know this about me.

But honestly, right now, I have not been dating. I don't even look twice at a guy right now. Anytime a guy like hits me in my DMs, I'm like, ew. Like I am just, I'm so turned off by it right now. I don't know. I think I just need some alone time. Okay.

Okay. Healthy. How about you, Amber? What's next? Honestly, I love my life. I love being single. I love traveling. I want to, you know, really get into my bikini business.

I have a bikini brand and clothing brand. I want to connect with girls and travel. the world and have more of like a self-expansion era that's where I'm at with everything um it's confusing like I'm such a boyfriend like I'm such a relationship girl I like having a boyfriend but I'm okay with not having one right now and I'm not the type that looks it just it just comes to me so I believe that when that's time to come it'll come like that's energy I believe in that I believe in timelines I believe in all those beautiful things so I'm not going to let this experience hearted me it's actually softened me. I got to know myself better and I know what to ask for and I don't play

about me. And this whole relationship or marriage, whatever, you know, everyone wants to take it for, it really gave me an opportunity to show up for myself. Once again, I'm proud of myself through it. And would it be fun to date? Yes. But I'm always going to protect my heart and learn through this. So that's where I'm at. Let's marry Amber. I don't want to date 20 guys at once, actually. But maybe that could be like, I think it would be fun. I'm like, yeah. I'm like, like, if I don't like you, I'll say, hey, you're going home.

Like, I don't think I could like girls will handle it so differently. I'm so different when it comes to dating. Well, being the lead of any of these shows, it's fucking sucks. I'm sure it's not easy. You know, you have to break a lot of hearts. It's a nightmare. It's a nightmare. You're responsible for everyone's emotions.

feelings and you know you to make one person happy is to make another person sad i think it's different when you're it's a woman lead versus a male lead but both difficult experiences but also i've no regrets uh and you guys you know i i hope uh if you're given the opportunity you guys say yes amber do you think of harry as your ex-husband um for a short more moment of time yeah like to be honest the the wedding like the wedding was amazing like everyone that went like like it was so fucking cool like it was it was incredible that's crazy that you like you experienced a wedding i it was crazy it was so cool um now i don't like i don't care like harry the thing is i was so frustrated i mean so i'm i'm a little sad for him like he does have great qualities that you just

is just i don't know i don't i really don't know what to even consider harry as i definitely think he's my ex. Yeah, I consider my ex-husband. I went through a crazy process where we dated each other till that was like the tone of what it was. I'm so honest in real life, like if I'm where I'm at with guys. So I was honest through that too. Yeah, he's someone I married at a point in time, you know? But I'm divorced now. I'm so fucking glad to be divorced and I've never been happier. And you didn't really have to go through, you didn't have to hire a lawyer, so what a win. Yeah, it's amazing. And I want him to be happy. Find his person. I'm not his person. All good. Yeah, and he's no longer your problem. So also, I win. Yeah. Yeah. Sam, have a very happy birthday. I hope the rest of it is filled with a lot less drama.

Thanks. Don't text your ex happy birthday. Yeah, Harry, don't fucking text me. Thank you. Yeah, right? He hasn't reached you a happy birthday. No. Especially after yesterday. I don't. I'm probably blocked at this point. Well, I wish you ladies, the best of luck. I'm sure your futures will be full of brightness and happiness, and you all, I'm sure, will be better for this experience. I do appreciate you taking the time,

and thanks for being honest about your experience. And, yeah, just all the best to you guys of the future and rooting for you guys. Thank you so much. All right. Take care. Thanks for taking the time.