The Viall Files - E14 Educating the Kardashians with Tiffany Sorya

Episode Date: April 3, 2019

Tiffany Sorya, Founder and CEO of Novel Education Group, joins me this week to talk about what it takes to start your own company. She explains how she ended up tutoring Kendall and Kylie Jenner, Dr. Dre's daugher, and more. We unpack the craziness that is Operation Varsity Blues, and we debate whether Kylie is actually a “self-made” billionaire. She’s got the inside scoop on all of it. Plus, we have possibly my favorite fan call-in yet. After listening to this episode, I hope you also set some “high goals” for yourself. Be sure to rate and review! Follow Tiffany Sorya on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/tiffanysorya See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hi. How's it going? Good. How are you? Good. Hi, everyone. Thanks for tuning in to another episode of Vile Files. I'm Nick, your host. I have my trusty sidekick, Rochelle, with me. What up? And we have a very special, very interesting guest today, Tiffany Soria. Hello. For those of you who may not know Tiffany,

I think she has a very interesting backstory and she's doing some very, uh, fascinating things with her life and in the community. And she also, I think is topical for some of the things that are, have been going on in the news the past few weeks. So I thought, um, we'd bring her on, get to know Tiffany. She is the founder of the Novel Education Group. And I mean, I don't know. I'm always just fascinated by people who start businesses

and unique things that are a bit outside of the box. In general, I think in the world today, it's very easy to have an idea. It's not easy. First of all, it's hard to have an idea, I think in the world today, it's very easy to have an idea. It's not easy. First of all, it's hard to have an idea, I guess. But once you have the idea, it's much harder to execute that plan and turn it into a reality. And that's something that Tiffany has done.

I like interesting people. So we'll get to know Tiffany. So yeah, Tiffany, tell us a little bit about what the Novel Education Group is, and then we'll go from there. Great. So we're essentially a homeschooling and private tutoring agency. But what we do that's a little bit different than your average agency is we cater to a demographic that sort of lives unconventional lifestyles.

When you say unconventional, can you elaborate? Yeah. You know, we have students all across the board. So we help anyone from like a young celebrity or young, you know, if you're like 15 years old and you've suddenly found yourself in a record contractor or you're a young actor or you're a young athlete or something like that. So you live a life that doesn't really, a traditional school setting doesn't really work for you. So we have those clients. And then all the way to the other end of the spectrum, business executives, people who travel a lot for their jobs, or just people that are seeing...

I mean, homeschooling, when I was growing up anyways, had such a strange connotation that came with it. You know, it's like the, like, it was like the weird, the weird thing to do when you're, when you were in homeschool, but now it's turning into just an alternative way to do school. Some, some of my clients don't necessarily have a reason why they're not in regular school. They just prefer this type of schooling because we provide a really tailored service. I mean, it can be helpful, right? Yeah, definitely.

Some of my younger siblings were homeschooled by my mom. I remember when she considered doing it. And the negative connotation, I was like, Oh, they're going to be weird. Do we really want to go down that path? And it ended up being very beneficial from my younger siblings who did that. Once they got to high school, they went to high school, but they got a more personal experience. And some of my younger

siblings didn't respond well when they were younger and kind of quieter. And, you know, I think that it helped their ability to get the education that they needed and the intention that they needed to learn. So yeah, it's definitely come a long way. How did you get started? And like, I mean, let's go, maybe let's go back to the beginning. Like, have you always been in education? And how did you end up being a tutor for kind of this niche, kind of unique community? I was not always in education.

In fact, I never even wanted to be a teacher. I never like considered myself a kid-friendly person, if I'm being totally honest with you. And, and, yeah, well, I mean, I never considered myself a kid-friendly person, if I'm being totally honest with you. Okay. I kind of swear a lot sometimes, and I just always think of it as you had to be a certain type of person in order to be a teacher. And I was like, well, I'm not that type of person, so then I can't be a teacher. I wonder if all the teachers listening right now, they're like, I swear all the time. Perception versus reality, I guess.

Anyways, go ahead. Yeah, I mean, people, I know, for some reason people don't like humanize their teachers. And it's weird. It's like when you see your teacher, it's like they shop, they shop, they shop for groceries. Oh, right, when you were a kid and you would see your teacher at the grocery store

and be like, Mrs. M, holy cow, you're a human being? Yeah. You're just like, I also get this here at Applebee's. And so. I remember that as a kid. Yeah. So then it's like teachers are people too. But anyways, so no, I didn't see myself in education, but I was always like a scholastic

person. I always really liked education. I was always, not always a good student, but for the most part I was, I was a good student. And then in college I started, um, when I was like a super nerd in college, like I became like a super, super nerd. And then, um, I was helped, I was like tutoring a lot of my friends. So I would like help them out with stuff. Kind of took the initiative on that? Yeah, I mean, I became,

I graduated with a degree in molecular biology. Wait, what? Yeah, so I mean, it's like... God, I wish I had a smart degree like that. I was an accounting major, which I guess it just doesn't sound, it doesn't ring molecular. I can't even pronounce

biology? Biology, just a branch of, it doesn't ring molecular. I can't even pronounce it. Biology? Biology. Just a branch of biology. That's super cool. And what does that mean? What? Molecular biology.

Just like biology on a molecular level. Which is? Like cells and stuff. Cells and stuff. Yeah. Yeah, cells and reactions that happen in cells. Please don't ask me anything about it. I reminded that episode of Seinfeld where Elaine's dating the doctor and he gets really scientific about her tongue when they start kissing.

And I'm kind of reminded of what that would be. And he was like, I was a molecular biology major. Anyway, I just find that fascinating. You were a molecular biology major. Yeah. And when I really hit the stride with school, all my friends that were struggling in certain classes, I enjoyed helping them.

I was like, wait, if I can, anyone can do this. Also, it's, you know, like you're like, oh my God, I can't pronounce it. Like you could also be a molecular biology major if you really wanted to. I believe. Do you know what I mean? It's like being a good student is a set of skills. It's not necessarily like this God-given talent. Like I don't really believe.

There are some people I will say that are sponges. Like there are the few that can like sit in a class and they can get it right away. I was not one of those people. I had to work really, really hard for my degree. I had to work really, really hard for my grades. And I feel like I just kind of understood how to be a good student. And so I wanted to share that with my peers.

But I also agree with you. I mean, talent is a real thing. I mean, people have various degrees of talent, but I still think work ethic and the desire to be something and following through is way more meaningful and plays a bigger role than the talent. There's a lot of talented people who don't accomplish what they're capable of. That's almost a limitless pool of

people. And I do think sometimes people get too discouraged about their dreams and things they want to do and assuming that they can't do it. And sometimes we have some limits, but it's those people who find ways to break through those barriers and follow through by, you know, doing what needs to get done, you know, legally to make those dreams come true. So yeah, I mean, so anyways, you're, you're a teacher and you are tutoring your friends and you're like, this is cool. This is cool.

But I still was never just like, I want to be a tutor when I grow up. Like I never thought of that. Or have a tutoring business when I grew up. And then you graduated? Graduated, moved to Los Angeles right after I graduated. Went to school in Portland. Never been. Oh, Portland's so great.

It's great and lush it's really I just I love it more and more as I get older also Portland was not that cool when I was growing up it like recently got cool got hip like recently you know like I'm like Portland was not like this when I was growing up but suddenly now that there's Portlandia and all this stuff it's like this new cool hip place but it's great I love I love it. So you moved to LA. Moved to LA. And just looking. And I was kind of lost a little bit, to be totally honest.

I didn't really know what I wanted to do. That is easy to happen in LA. Yeah. I just, I knew I needed to get out of Portland. What made you move to LA? I was bored. I just, I was done with Portland. Honest answer. Yeah.

I was done. I was done. And I just wanted to go somewhere new. I wanted to go somewhere where I didn't with Portland. Honest answer. Yeah, I was done. I was done. And I just wanted to go somewhere new. I wanted to go somewhere where I didn't know anyone. You had your molecular biology degree in hand. Yes, I had my molecular biology degree in hand. My suitcase in the back seat. I had my sunglasses.

I'm going to change them. And I drove down to LA with no plans. That's brave. You didn't even have a plan. Well, I had a place to live, which is, that's good. That's way ahead of the game. Um, so I, but so I applied for tutoring jobs when I, when I came down here, was that like a way to, well, I know how to do this. I need to make ends meet. So that's what I'll do in the meantime. Yeah. I was like, I enjoy doing this. It's actually, and tutors make decent money. And I was never like a bartending server type of person. And so, and I wanted to use my degree and I knew, I knew how to do it. And so I was like, okay,

I'm just going to apply for some tutoring jobs. So I got hired through an agency. And within a few months, I had like a full caseload. I really took on as many students as possible. So there was definitely a while where I was just bombin' it around LA, tutoring all over. And you're teaching everything. Math, science, English. Yeah, everything.

I'm good at some things and not good at others. I was good at math and science, but I couldn't tell you where a comma goes to save my life. I'm like, there. Colon? Sure, why not? And I just find that you were good enough to kind of teach it all. Yeah. I mean, after a while, once you're exposed to sort of the classes, the English and history classes once, then you kind of get it. History. I liked.

And as an adult, you're kind of just like a better reader than teenagers, I hope, anyways. Speak for yourself. So you can read information and process it and analyze it a little faster. All right. So then you're doing this. And then when does it all of a sudden, when does novel education, when does it click? Right. So I work with sort of some high-profile clientele here and there.

Don't be bashful. And I actually got hired through a school. I was based out of Atlanta just for homeschooling. Very cool. So they're out of Atlanta, but they had quite a few clients out here in Los Angeles. So I became sort of like the head teacher and I was dealing with all,

and I was doing all the placements. I was like placing teachers with families. And so I was kind of already doing it and I became really familiar with it. And then, um, so through, through the school, um, is when, is when I met Kendall and Kylie. Jenner? Jenner. Okay.

Smith. I mean, I know. Do you know Kendall and Kylie Smith? I know a Kendall and Kylie. Because they often get confused with Kendall and Kylie. Jenna. I know a Kendall and Kylie on They often get confused with Kendall and Kylie. I know a Kendall and Kylie on The Bachelor. Kendall on The Bachelor.

Her twin sister is Kylie. It was like this whole thing. Oh, wait. Well, it was them. A lot of Bachelor people listen to this podcast. So this might be, you know, so the Jenners. So you became their tutor. I became their tutor.

Their homeschool teacher. Okay. I think Kylie was in a freshman or a sophomore and Kendall was just one year older. And, uh, and you know, when I started working with them and I just like, I worked with other people prior to them that were in the entertainment industry, but not at that level or scope awareness of like yes and this is at a time when they were a little less well-known than they are now and so but they still had these like blossoming careers and so I was really like faced with this challenge of just how am I supposed to make education relevant to people who don't necessarily need education in order to succeed in life.

In the sense that you mean like, yeah, like if it may not have affected their ability to earn an income or their careers if they didn't necessarily know where to put a comma. Right, exactly. Or like how to do long division. Yes, yes, precisely. a comma or like how to do long division. Yes. Yes. Precisely. So then, yeah. So then I'm like sort of faced with this daily challenge every day of how to make education relevant again to this younger generation of people that are coming up on like social media and all of that. And so that's kind of where like the platform for novel education formed for me was just making making smart stylish again it's like our little tagline like making making making education education cool making it like

trendy making it you know and because i became you know i was i was young and still like i mean just like you know i, I like pop culture. I like fashion. I like makeup. I like all the things that regular people like. But I was also, I'm also educated and I also care about education. So I think that was like, it sort of made a bridge between the two worlds for them. And then also for other people

who started to reach out um because i was like a relatable person that cared about school so it's like teenagers wanted to listen to what i had to say almost like i mean i'm assuming maybe you became a friend but also in a way a mentor to like say um the the your students and um um yeah i mean that's the mentors are um they play a big role in our lives and i think that's i mean i took violin in the fourth grade and i was terrible but i joined violin because the teacher was also the football coach and i thought he was cool and I wanted to be like him. And that's why I decided to play the violin. Um, and then, yeah, I mean, I suck, but like, but at the same time, like that, that plays a role in why we get

into things at an early age of, of, and so that makes a lot of sense. That's really cool about how, um, you know, education is so important in our lives especially early on um and thinking that you know we just again sometimes we don't realize at a younger age like how things are decisions are going to affect us in the future right and when and what did education long ago become not cool like back in the day almost like you know it was kind of a thing where it's like oh school is it because students like kids just don't like, don't like it? It's not fun. I think it's a little bit of both. I think a lot of people are.

The nerd, the nerd, almost like a nerd was a negative kind of thing. Right. You know, we've, it's become hip and trendy now. And like, but historically, if you're a nerd, you're not cool. If you're popular, you were, you know. You kind of suck at school. Right. That kind of, that general stereotype, um, and breaking down those barriers. Yeah. I'm trying to, trying to create a whole new stereotype. Um, so, so yeah, so I met them and then, and then, um, when I was sort of handling everything, that's when, that's when like the business idea

kind of started to form because I kind of felt like I was already doing it. But under all these, under all these different names, under this agency, under this other school. And so I'm like, I can do, I can do this. I feel like I saw like a void in the market for a service like mine that was really tailored. And also was, you know, the branding was kind of cool and a lot of kids and parents took to it. And so, so then I started, so then I started a novel. That's really cool. I mean, what is, and how did you go from the idea to making it a thing for, again, I asked this question because I think it's cool to have the idea and then make it into reality, regardless if it's a school or it's an essential oil business or a makeup business,

you know, like again, having an idea or even for the, just anyone out there who's, who's listening, what were some of the things that you had to do? So, I mean, if, I mean, logistically incorporating the company was the first thing, which means buying, registering your, registering the company, the first thing, which means registering the company, buying the domain. That's the first step. Because I think everything got real after I did that. Once I clicked the little button,

I was like, oh, okay, I guess I'm a company now. Well, isn't that kind of interesting, too? Not that starting a company is hard. I'm sorry. Not that starting a company is easy. Not that starting a company is easy. It's incredibly hard and it just always gets harder and harder and every time you think you have something figured out, some problem happens, you have to adjust to. However, sometimes we are afraid of,

sometimes you just have to do it, registering the company. Well, registering a company is not hard. It's literally click. But I guess what I'm trying to say is sometimes we are so afraid to take that leap of trying to make a dream come true and you kind of have to figure it out as you go. I think sometimes nowadays

we're so afraid to fail sometimes and we have to have X, Y, and Z. It's almost like, you know, and I don't, I think it's fine, but we're having kids later in life. Like my parents tell the story, well, we just, I don't know, we just started having kids. Like they had no money. Like they didn't have really a place to live.

And now people are like, I'll just figure it out. And now everyone's like, well, I mean, how much money do you make? How much money do I make? Do we, do we have our second home? You know, like every, and I'm not, not, I'm not talking about like every, I feel like most, everyone's doing that. It doesn't matter your wealth or whatever. When I, in Wisconsin, it was same, same concept.

You know, you, you just had it all, you had it all planned out and now we can start having kids, which is, it's just so much different now. But there's something lost and just going for it and figuring it out and you, you know, when, and then failures will happen and you adjust and you try to, and then you go from it and you learn from those mistakes and you keep on, you know, going, shavings make a pile kind of thing. Yeah, no, I, it's true's true and a lot and a lot of people ask just sort of like well why like what made you start it where did you and honestly there's not there's not really an answer to the question why do you know what I mean it's not

there wasn't any particular reason other than the fact that I just wanted to start it and thought I had a great idea and then wanted to make it into a thing. So then you click the button and then you're like, okay, I have a company now. But then that's when all the learning really starts. Growing it, yeah, networking. Because then you're like,

okay, you have this entity and so what are you trying to do with it? That is now your responsibility. And that's the hard part. That's the hard part. But how much having did that and saying, making that decision to file and to start the company, how much was that the motivating aspect of saying,

well, now that I did this, I don't want to fail. The fear of failure is very powerful. And then it becomes real. I mean, failure becomes very real once you've incorporated everything. But before, it was like, well, I have this idea. I don't know if I'll do it. And you never do it. So you never failed because you didn't start it.

But now once you start it, I got to make this a thing. So now I start telling people about it. What are you doing? Oh, I started school. Oh, really? How's it going? You see him again. Yeah, it didn't happen.

You don't want to be that person. So you want to, it didn't happen. You know, like you don't want to be that person. So like you want to, um, yeah, I know I'm a, I'm a big believer in figuring it out and, and setting yourself up. So in the fear of failure can be very motivating. Yes. It is for me. I don't know. It is for me too. It still is. I think for anyone. Yeah. Um, although some people would just like to lie, you know, that person is always like, what are you doing? Oh, I'm doing so many things. Like really? That's interesting. This and this and this and I'm so busy.

So busy. We actually do get a lot of listeners emailing in saying that they want advice and how they can start their own podcast or go after something that they want. So I think people really find this interesting. Thank you. Well, speaking in general, like I said, I think having an idea, that's hard too, especially an original idea. And then once you have an idea, I don't know what you think, Tiffany,

but ask questions. I mean, sometimes people are afraid. I think one strength I've always had is a willingness to reach out and ask for help. And I think asking for help is a very powerful tool. Also, even if you are calling customer service, little life hack here, don't call up mad. Don't start yelling at people. Don't say, fuck you.

Just call up and say, hey, Pam, is it? And the next thing that comes out of your mouth is, I really need your help. Oh, yes. People love to help people. If you ask for help, then you are empowering someone. And even if it's someone on LinkedIn or whatever, in some big, seemingly unattainable person or executive,

everyone has that ego of wanting to help someone. And so when you lead with, I need your help, that really works on people. And it's not disingenuous because people have a desire to help. And when you're, you need my help? Yes. Really? Yeah, you're like, I know more than you?

And when you call a customer service, you can tell there's things they can do and there's things they won't do. And sometimes, well, I'm sorry, sir, we can't do that. You can't? Are you sure? Because I'm, fine. Thank you. I call again and then I ask for help again. They're like, oh yeah, no problem. I can't tell you how many times I've been told we can't do this only to call again and be like, oh, that's no problem. And honestly, the more I ask for help and the more I make it seem like I, you, you're the only person, Pam, who can save my day and arguably my life.

Can you do this, Pam? Yes, Nick. Indeed, I can. And I'm telling you, just in life, I think asking for help and asking for guidance is a skill that I think people should try to do. Reach out to people. If you're on LinkedIn, if you're looking for a job, if you have a dream job out there and maybe not starting your business and you have an interview coming up,

look for people in that industry, in your community and say, hey, my name is Nick and I've always had a dream to do this. Do you have 20 minutes for a cup of coffee? I'd love to pick your brand. You could really help me out. And a lot of people will ignore you,

but there's always going to be one person who's like, yeah, sure, man. Someone's going to relate to your motivation and your desire to succeed and want to help you. And maybe you can find a mentor along the way. So I think that's step one. And I think it can go a long way. And then when you do that,

taking the advice of the people that, listen to those people. I think sometimes people learn two different ways. They learn from their own failures and they learn from the advice they get from people. And the more we can like seek the advice of the people who've already failed, the better off and life can be. And so that's the, I mean, that's, to me, that's the starting point. And then there's so many other variables about starting a business. But I think if you can do that, you get a really big hard start. Yeah.

I mean, asking for help is huge. I mean, just to get really specific with how do you start a podcast, I think the first step would just be like going to Guitar Center or something like that and being like, hey, I want to start a podcast. What kind of mic should I buy? Yeah, you can do that. And finding someone who has a podcast, that's the thing. You might not even realize, I guess that's all you have to do.

I mean, there's other variables, but sometimes, and that's kind of a great point, is whether it's a podcast or anything else, the idea of something can sound way more challenging than it is. And it doesn't mean that like things can grow and become bigger. You can start a business. It can be very simple business. Natural habits is a small business and we, we, we tend to grow, but right now we're trying to, you know, walk before we run. Uh, like your, your tutoring business. I mean, novel education was, I had one student, you know, and so that's still a legit business.

Yeah. I had two students that I was teaching and I was novel education and I was novel education group. Exactly. And, and then it just grows, but you have to, you also have to keep like working at your craft.

It's not like you start it and then suddenly you have all this stuff that you need to take care of and you have all this product that you need to send out. You have to build your product. You have to build your service. You have to curate it. And those things come, right? But the idea of something can sometimes weigh us down. Yeah. Of the fear of, well, I mean, I don't know. I never thought I'd own my own business because I didn't know what that meant. And the idea of it seems so impossible.

And again, we're not downplaying owning the work it takes, but if you really have a dream, ask for help. Find out what it takes. And sometimes getting the start can be sometimes easier than you realize. And from there, you have to just be willing to work a lot. Yeah, I mean, I tell my students this all the time. The hardest part about getting anything done is starting it. See, that sums it up.

I took a long time to just say that. Yeah, that's the hard. And then once you're finished, I mean, you're never really finished with building a business, but in terms of just maybe a little steps along the way of starting a business, once you finished a task, then you're like, oh, that wasn't so bad. That was, that was totally doable. And then the more times that you do that, actually the more confidence you gain in terms of tackling things that you don't know how to do. You know, I feel like at this point, personally, anyways, now that I feel like I've done this and there's something that I really have no clue how to do it. I feel so much

more confident being able to at least try and figure it out. Yeah. Um, because yeah, you've like, well, I don't know. I don't know, but it's okay that I don't know. I'll just figure it out. Whereas before, it's like this totally unattainable thing. So the more times that you try and succeed, try and fail, then it kind of just becomes second nature. That's really fascinating. I have some more questions about novel education

and your community in the world you find yourself in for some of these interesting stories that have been going on, the Varsity Blues scandal and stuff. But before we get to that, we are going to sell some essential oils. Awesome. It's ad time. Natural Habits, we talked about, is my company. We sell essential oil blends. Oh, that packaging.

I designed it myself. That's really nice. I mean, by myself, I did it with my friend Kyle and my friend Paige as well. But I came up with the concept. And yeah. And again, I never thought I would have designed a packaging that's predominantly used by women, but intended to be used by both men and women. We want it to be gender neutral. Well, no,

I mean, in a sense, like I knew, I knew, no, I mean, I just knew my, my audiences,

obviously predominantly women, women tend to seem to be more in tune with like learning about like. Definitely. Self care. Like guys are like, you know, but you know, we want it to be gender neutral,

but thank you for, so we, again, we, if you ever had a question about essential oils, they've impacted my life immensely with my ability to sleep better, help with my anxiety, reduce my headaches and just overall improve my overall mental and physical

and emotional wellbeing-being. We are launching our diffuser line. We have our diffuser right here running and operating. It's so pretty. It's lovely. It is. I don't know if you guys use candles and what you guys are spending on candles these days, but it's probably a lot.

And I don't know if you thought about it, but if you are lighting a candle, you are lighting a chemically created thing on fire and then breathing it. I don't know about you. It doesn't sound like that's going to improve your emotional, mental, and physical wellbeing. But essential oils are a great way to obviously make your, if you are diffusing them, your house or apartment smell great. And at the same time, it has these medicinal benefits like relieving stress and anxiety and helping you sleep and reducing headaches. Can you make like a love potion one that you could diffuse in your room when people come over? No, well, you know, relaxing. You can feel relaxed. Like an aphrodisiac.

That's the thing about essential oils. I think a lot of people have questions. Like, listen, it's helped me. It aids in it, right? It definitely helps me. You know, it helps me do things like not take melatonin and Tylenol PM, which I used to do to sleep.

And those can become very addicting. And then when you wake up feeling kind of groggy and things like that. I don't, I used to take a lot of ibuprofen for headaches and I would have to, I'd be able to take less and less of that by using essential oils. It's not a cure-all, but just like I'm a big believer and doing all the things you need to do to be healthy, working out, eating right, you know, using essential oils in terms of helping those additional, you know, benefits that we need or ailments that we have and alleviate those.

There's got to be an essential oil for love, Nick. You've got to find it. Yeah, well, I like to protect the industry because I think essential oils kind of get to a negative connotation of this hocus-pocus kind of thing, and they have some really great benefits to it. It doesn't do everything. I think some people in the industry claim that it's like,

well, no matter what your problem is, there's an essential oil for that. And that is just not the case, but there's a lot of great things they can do. High blood pressure. We specialize. Make my face prettier. When you blend essential oils,

they can maximize their benefits. We blend them for you, ready to go. We have the roll-ons. We can put drickling in your skin. You can find us at nhoils.com. Follow us at Natural Habits on Instagram. What's our special code for today? What's our special code?

We're trying to do new codes each week when we do it. Do you have a... We had Cougars as a code. It worked really well. I don't know. Novel? Novel. Novel. Code Novel. O-N-. Novel? Novel. Novel.

Novel. Code Novel. I love it. O-N-V-E-L. 30% off. We do free domestic shipping for anything over $50. And get it now. Also, it's N-O, just to like.

What? N-O-V-E-L. N-O-V-E-L. How did I spell? I'm the worst speller. I need a tutor. I think you said O-N, but like, I think it was just a mistake. Did I say O-N? I think it was just a-L I'm the worst speller I think you said O-N but I think it was just a mistake

I'm pretty sure I know that you know how to spell novel Did I spell O-N? You're getting schooled She's tutoring you right now I'm dyslexic I'm pretty sure I'm dyslexic I need to find out because I do that a lot

N-O-V-E-L Did I spell it O-N? Anvil? I could just change the name of my business. I said this in front of a tutor. Imagine if I was on a date and I was just like, yeah, you know,

and I'm spelling novel O-N. Just look at me and just... You know, like the book. Like a novel. O-N-V-E-L. You know, an anvil. Have you read any good anvils lately? Yeah, totally. Heard any.

What's your favorite anvil? Yeah. And life-changing anvil? Go. I know a really good tutor, Nick, that you could employ. Essential oils do not make you spell better unfortunately anyways um find us at nhoils.com 30 off with code novel n-o-v-e-l yes gold star Ooh, five-star rating. So, Tiffany.

Nick. I'm really so into this. What is it called? Operation Varsity Blues? Operation, yes, yes. I don't get it. I don't, I don't. So here's the thing.

Do you, like you operate in this world where you are tutoring the Jenners and other people of note in this very niche community, which I'm assuming is open to criticism of entitlement and privilege. Definitely. I'd actually be curious how you, as a tutor, maybe help them to be aware of maybe that perception and how they mitigate that. But this Varsity Blues scandal, I've never heard of a more pointless crime.

I don't get it. I came from a very blue collar family. I have 10 siblings. My mom didn't go to college because, my know, my mom didn't go to college. I've told this story before because she was a woman, honestly. She had five brothers who all went to college and my parents, my grandparents were like, no, you, you're not going to college, which there was a whole, wow. Exactly. And then my dad was a college dropout as a freshman year. He's brilliant and really smart guy. And so my parents obviously wanted us to go to college,

but they couldn't afford to pay for college. It was, well, if you want to go to college, I mean, literally the conversations in the seventh and eighth grade, well, start saving up, go start working. I was fortunate enough that I was athletic and so I you know I got an athletic scholarship but you know there's no guarantees that but like I also worked really hard at that too my point being is this this yeah this I don't get it because I don't I I don't understand here's the thing I saw I saw a tweet that i think really summed up how how the

perception of it it was like in the point of view of like laurie and becky and it was like i want my kids to go to college and then a mission person was like oh great well you could just make a sizable donation and no problem uh no no i prefer to do a crime. Yes. I prefer to cheat. No, no, no, not necessary. Just, just a donation will do. No, no, no. Crime please. No, no, really. If you just, just a small, like kind of, you know, but reasonable donation, definitely crime. I just, but that's kind of what happened. I don't understand because like, from my understanding of what happened and not to knock USC, it's a great school, but like it's,

it's a state school. It's actually pretty, it's actually pretty, it's a great school, but I guess you have to like, yeah. I mean a lot of like, I went to Wisconsin,

great reputation, but it's all, I think the percentage of admittance is pretty low for USC, you know, to the point where you have to... What I don't get is like she was... So, and correct me if I'm wrong, she bribed someone to make it seem like

she was admitted on her own abilities. And then in addition that she was on the row team. Yes. I'm just like, here's what I don't get. Why, why that row team in a sense of what does that do for you in life? And she doesn't strike me as someone who's going around me like I'm on row. But I crew, I row. I crew.

And is that getting her anywhere? I mean, I ran track in college and I'm proud of that. Don't get me wrong. And it's like, you know, but it's water cooler talk at this point in my life. It is not as if I'm like, you know, I'm in a meeting and I'm at like some sort of work meeting and they're like telling me, no, I'm like, wait, but I ran track in college. And they're like, really? It's not about this team. They literally just were trying to get them into this race. No, my point is, what's the motivation for wanting to say that you were in it?

What I'm saying is like the idea being that it was going to give her some advantages or something. Oh, but I'm on crew. As if like, oh, you were on crew? No, that's literally the only way they could get her into the school. So this is the reason behind the athletics, the whole athletics. There's two ways. There's two ways that this happens. The money is what got them in.

No. No. Well, yes. Okay, let me, let me, let me break it down. No. Well, yes. Okay, let me break it down. Listen to her, Nick. I'm just, okay. Let me break it down. There's two ways that this happened, okay?

The reason why the athletics thing, they lied about this being an athlete, essentially, which, okay, I'll get into that later, is because, so, you know, coaches have a certain number of slots that they can fill. Okay. And for these athletes, it kind of doesn't matter how well they did in school. They got to hit certain benchmarks. Okay. I applied for college in August. School started in September to the school I ended up going to

because I was fortunate enough to get an athletic scholarship. Yes. Okay. So there are decent grades, but sure. There are slots that are open to athletes. Yes. And if you are an amazing rower, then they're going to want you at that school, even if your GPA is like a 1.2. Okay. So they'll, they'll, they'll make it work. They'll make it work. Okay. Sure. So, um, so work. They'll make it work. Okay. Sure. So there's that. So that's one way to get people into school. There's a minimum standard, right?

Yeah, 1.2 is a little low. That's an exaggeration. But, you know, that's one way as like a shoe-in. Okay. Okay. So that was one way

that this whole scandal thing worked. So the reason why- That was the loophole. That was the loophole. I think for them specifically was like they do crew, they're on the crew team, they recruit for the loophole. That was a loophole. I think for them specifically was like, they do crew, they're on the crew team. They recruit for the crew team. Here's some pictures of them rowing a boat.

Literally? So that's my question though. And again, I'm ignorant in this world, but can't you just make a donation? No. Okay. I have families that make donations. And while a donation obviously really, really helps, all it really does is put that application on the top of the pile, but it doesn't necessarily guarantee any type of admittance. So you could donate a half a

million dollars to say USC and say, here, here you go. I mean, if you want to give me a plaque, fine, but I don't need it. But it'd be really nice if my daughters could go to your school. They can be like, thank you for the money. They will say no? They can say no. But do they say no? I'm just wondering, does USC

go, sure, but no, we're not going to. But we'll take the money. I don't know if they've ever said no, but I do know that they make it very clear that just because you made a donation does not mean that it's like a green light for you automatically to get into the school.

Do they make it clear for the perception of it? No, I think that they should be more vocal about it. Well, I guess I'm just wondering. Because I think that they should be more vocal about it. Because I think that... I'm curious what actually happens. So if someone... You're saying they make it clear that they don't, right? They don't guarantee. It's just like when you're applying for a job, right?

It's like you have 500 people applying for a job, but if one... Whatever, Nancy Jones... Pam, Nancy Jones. Pam and Nancy Jones. If you know who Nancy Jones's daughter is, then when you're going through those applicants, you're going to be like, oh, this is, this is Courtney Jones, Nancy Jones's daughter.

Well, you know, like, let's look at her application. Like, that's kind of how it works. You know, it just makes you, the donation makes you look at her application. That's kind of how it works. It just makes you, the donation makes you known at that school. The dean of admissions knows who you are. So then when they're going through the quite literally thousands of applicants that they get,

they're going to look for that application and be like, okay, if you meet the criteria, then you're in. So you're saying if in the donation world, it probably gets you in, but it's not a guarantee. It's not a guarantee. Whereas this, I mean, who knows? This cheating world is like allegedly a guarantee.

I think that's why they did it. They guarantee you. It was just the guarantee. It was just like, okay, cool. We can donate a million dollars to the school to get your application on the top of the pile. Or we could bribe the athletic coach million dollars to the school to get your to get your application on the top of the pile or we could bribe the athletic coach and pay him a million dollars to say you're on the crew team

and we know you're going to get into the school because of the athletic coach but also aren't they missing a rower in the boat see that's what i don't understand is that once they're in the school it's like are they like oh my god i wrote it's like like are they like all the people on our team are like well i mean we're like you're kind of bad we're a woman's like are they like oh my god it's like like are they like all the people on our team are like well i mean we're like we're a woman's show they're like is she is she showing up or what's uh what's up that's what i keep taking third place if we had one more person we would probably pretty good yeah that's what i actually i was actually reading up about it um yesterday and this morning because i was like well what happens when they actually get in do they are they on the crew team?

And then people are just like, you row? Did she go around telling people? Or maybe once they're in, they can quit the team. I actually don't know how that part works. What is your stance as a tutor? And I got another question on this topic. Listen, college obviously is an important thing.

I went to it. I'm thankful I went. I was an accounting major. I'm not an accountant. But getting in college, education matters. There's so many benefits to just the education about the life experience. That being said, I think it's not the end-all, be-all nowadays. And especially nowadays, the way the world is is there's so many different ways to succeed in the world. I'm just surprised that here's, I mean, it sounds like her daughter, Olivia, is her Olivia? Yeah. She didn't seem to be that interested, everything that's out there.

She's like, I don't really, really want to go to school. I wasn't that motivated. But so why force your kid? Why? I mean, especially where she has these opportunities. And if it isn't just about the education, hire a tutor. Yes. I mean, I don't know what your rates are for half a million dollars, but I'm guessing you could probably smart someone up. They're lower than half a million. I don't understand. I don't.

Yeah. I mean, this is where I really take a lot of the blame just completely off the students. I feel bad. I actually feel really bad for a lot of the, for all the students that are involved because this is not something I don't think that they were fully aware of a, or B kind of had any control over.

Yeah. If you're 17 and your parents are like, don't worry about it. We'll, we'll hire you to take care of it. Yeah. Like great. My parents,

I wouldn't have known the difference. Exactly. And when I, you know, and when I talk to my clients, I'm talking to the parents that are, that are hiring our service. You know,

we're not talking to the students just being like, Hey, this is what we're going to do to get you into the school. This is what we're going to do to bring your exam scores up. You know, they're just being students. They're just, they're just being teenagers. So I feel bad for them. But, you know, to what you were saying in terms of just sort of like why, I mean, obviously I think that there's a certain amount, you know, in certain circles, the name of where

you went to school is popular. Do you think it still matters as much? It's like a brand name of clothing, to be honest with you. These are not circles I run in, but I guess I don't... Again, that almost surprises me still to this day. Because before I was doing what I was doing, I was in corporate America for 10 years. I worked for a company called Salesforce.

It's like working for Google. It's a very prominent tech company. The sky was the limit for me there. There was a lot of talented executives who had all different types of education. I haven't submitted my college transcripts since my second job. I get asked in social settings, where'd you go to school? But that's kind of the, like, that's where it stops.

And I'm just, and maybe it's just, I'm not operating in that world, but it's where, and even if that's the case, it is a social standing. I think it's a, we'll see that question that you just said of just sort of in social situations of, oh, where'd you go to school? I think they're social, we'll see that question that you just said of just sort of in social situations of, oh, where'd you go to school? I think their social situations where they get that question of where'd you go to school? I think that alone, you know, for them to be like, oh, USC or UCLA or Yale or Stanford. Is UCLA and Yale the same? Yeah. I mean, they kind of hold, mean not totally but they they both hold i mean like wisconsin and michigan are like great big 10 schools and the great educations i always equated like a wisconsin and a michigan to like ucla and usc fantastic educations uh

ceos and executives have all gone there i mean gail Yale, like, you know, cause Yale and Harvard, it's like, that's like this little Ivy league. But even then, I don't know, man, unless you're like running for office, what? Yeah, no, I agree. I agree. I don't know. I just, why we do these things? You know, I, I, I, it's unfortunate, you know, because, especially because there's so many students that work so hard. Yeah.

Honestly, and to get in to school. I mean, like so hard to your point where they're like too hard or like, I mean, there's some like dark realities of students who are stressed out. Oh my goodness. Addicted to things like Ritalin or. Oh, yeah. And because they're studying all hours in the night. And it's just like, hey, man. Right. And the real athletes, I mean, the real athletes are going to school until two. They have practice till seven.

And then they're doing like honors and AP classes until 11 o'clock at night. When I was in high school, I would go to school. I was from Wisconsin. I would run repeat 400s until I'd throw up. And then I would go to Century Grocery Store and work in the produce department. Then I would come home. I'd do my homework and then I would go to bed. That was your life. That was my life. And then you hoped that you would get it. And I hoped I would get a partial scholarship because it was track and field. Let's not pretend it's football or like, uh, you know, football paid for the

college scholarships and you know, so just to like get a little bit of a, you know, I knew it helped me get in. Um, and I knew it would help pay for it, but yeah, I mean, that's, it's, that is unfortunate that that does happen all just to say. The whole thing's really unfortunate. And I, it's sad. And I, and I, I'm curious, like at what point does it stop? Like, does it stop mattering in life? Like when you graduate from college, I guess. But I mean, if even when I meet someone at a, like a social setting, like, oh, you went to Harvard. I'm like, cool. And then we just move on. I just don't know. Where does, move on, yeah. Where does it really move the needle? Well, I think that in this situation, it's just sort of to reiterate,

it's so much more for the parents to be like, oh yes, well, you know, she's 18. She's starting USC in the fall. You know, it's like that conversation. So the social setting for parents. Yes, I think so. That makes sense. Because I don't really think that the social circles

that like Olivia is in, I don't think they're really going to like her any less for not getting into USC. I'm thinking like, she's just like, well, I want to go to the parties. They're like, well, you don't go here. I mean, I'm pretty sure she could go to any USC party, show up to the frat house, be like, hi, can I? Yeah, I'm sure that they'd be like, come on in.

Oh, really? You want to party with us? By all means. I don't know. She's hopefully old enough to drink alcohol. And if not, she shouldn't be there. But yes, what is stopping her to do all the things she wants to do at a college party?

I think it was a lot more definitely apparent thing. That's unfortunate to say. And now, I's, I think it was a lot more, it was a lot more definitely a parent thing. That's unfortunate to say. And now, I mean, I think that they both withdrawn from the school. I don't,

I do feel bad for the students. Me too. Me too. And I think this, obviously the all, the students in all of these universities

are like up in arms about it. I mean, I think the, I think that the admittance rate for Stanford is something like 6%. We're talking six out of 100 kids that apply.

If three of those kids are because of a bribe, then that's really unfortunate. I don't think some of the kids didn't even know their parents were doing it. They're like, yeah! I think about when I was 16 or 17 if my parents

ever came to me and said don't worry about it i'll take care of it whatever that was i just immediately stopped worrying about it right right your parents are your parents whatever it is they tell you to stop worrying about you're like great yeah i'm gonna go fuck off and do, you know, play with my friends. So I totally feel bad for the, the, um, the criticism and like they overnight their world changed. And listen, they, they've lead charmed lives and I'm sure ultimately they will be fine relative to the real struggles that a lot of people have out there. But it's a bummer. Yeah. It's crazy, you know, and to be totally honest, I'm kind of really happy that it's coming up and I'm happy that it's being exposed. It's a very real world. I believe that, but I'm curious is what your point

of view, because I wonder if you feel the criticism by some of the students you do teach and tutor and the perception of entitlement and privilege in that community and what you're doing to kind of circumvent that bullshit. Yeah. Well, I think, you know, I was listening to this other podcast that was talking about sort of how there should not someone that said it I don't remember who he said there should not be a separate admittance system for wealth and the fact of the matter is that there is there absolutely is

and I think people who work in education you know I mean obviously there's I mean I run a private homeschooling business. It's like there is a business out of education in this country. And so while I understand that there are opportunities, you know, to make money and, and to sort of help people guide. It's, it's, um, I think, I don't know. I think it's, you have to try and get people to be self-aware about what they want out of school. Like if she doesn't, she didn't want to go to school, then like she doesn't have

to go to school. And you know what I mean? Like what I mean? I think that's what it's about. Also, there's all different forms of secondary education. My sister was a college graduate, Maria. She played basketball too, but she's a great student. And then she got into, she's a holistic nutritionist. And so she went back to school. And she's glad she went to college, but what she's doing now has everything to do with what she went back to school for and being,

and she went to school in Vancouver and studied holistic, holistic, I don't know. I'm sorry, Maria, but it's like she went, she's a holistic dietician. Sorry. And so to your point, if you are an artist or you want to, you know, there's just different ways to get an education. And thankfully I have not run into this problem myself. I have not run into the problem of just like, okay, look, like my kid is gonna get into school. Like no matter what, like what do we have to do? And you know, I've,

all my clients are really honest and work hard and are also really self-aware of, of exactly what they want out of education. You know, I have students that have no aspirations for college. And then I have students who have major aspirations for college. So treating each of those accordingly, but also just being really honest with the ones that do want to go to college and just say like, nothing's going to get you into college, but hard work. Yeah. And really making that the known thing to them and also their parents. Yeah. You know. other than the arithmetic and the grammar? Are you teaching life skills? Especially in that community, like Kylie, for example,

of having the influence that she has out there and the social responsibility that comes along with the power that this Olivia has with her followers. I mean, that's real influence and there's definitely a social responsibility that comes along with it. Like what are you doing in that space? I think that helping them once again, be aware of the influence that they have

and what that really means. I think it's so easy to have the followers on Instagram and have the following on whatever platform and be kind of unaware of it. Because there's like a big digital wall there. Yeah. I don't think Kylie realized that she was going to affect the market cap of Snapchat by $3 billion. I don't think she, yeah. I don't feel like using it today. Yeah, exactly.

But I mean, that's not on her. That blew my mind when that happened. Yeah, no, and it's not. So I think making them aware of the impact that they do have on this young generation is really important. Not too long ago, Chloe was criticized for a Fit Tea ad she did. I mean, I'm certainly not them. And I certainly have a social platform I run. I've promoted things other than natural habits.

I definitely try to, and I do, use the stuff that I promote. And I try, not try, but when it comes to my messaging, natural habitat is a perfect example. I don't go on there and say, everything I'm doing is a result of that. I need nothing else other than essential oils and this is how it's done everything.

Or I've promoted a scale before and I do use it. It helps me track and how I, and how I promote that is to say, um, I'm fortunate enough to be in shape and it's, I don't lose weight from it, but it helps me track my progress and helps me stay motivated because I look at other things other than like my weight or body. And so like I get, I get behind it. And Chloe got criticism by suggesting that her entire look was based off of fit tea. Yeah. I mean, friends of yours, but what are your thoughts on, on, on that type of social responsibility? Because no doubt the influence that they all have

is immense. I don't know if there's a lot of people out there who are waking up trying to replicate and literally do everything I do and look like me and be me and just mimic, but they do, they have people who are young women who are truly just all that, all they ever wanted to be is literally them. You know, in Chloe's defense, I think she's very vocal about how often she works out and what she eats. So I don't think that it's all the tea, you know? I didn't see the ads. And I also, I don't think I saw it either. And I also, you know, I think I would be really surprised if she was just like, it's all because of the tea.

You know, like, thanks. I got my post baby body all because of the tea, you know, like, thanks. I got my post baby, post baby body all because of this tea. And I think everyone knows like, you know, she's got the show, the, the, the work that I don't know what it's called, but the fit, the workout show that she does. Um, so I think she is really vocal about, about other things that she does, but there are some people that are not vocal about, about other things that have not as much influence as them, but a lot of influence. And I think we have to be really careful about what we do with influence because suddenly you're getting young girls who aspire to be

social media influencers as a career and you're not actually influenced. Like what is an influencer? Like, do you know what I mean? I do. I mean, what is it? So what are you gonna do? It's like, cool. I'm going to post about these sunglasses. I'm going to post about this candle. I'm going to post about these, this jacket. You know, it's like, is that, what are you actually influencing here by doing these things? That's, that's. I think there's a bubble there in that, you know, when social media came out, people were really building.

And again, for me, I fell into it. Like I, I have a following based off of this unique experience I did. And now I'm utilizing it to the best of my abilities while still trying to have a positive impact and leveraging my opportunity. But building these followings, I know I feel like there's this bubble there now where I don't know if it's as easy to do anymore.

And I'm glad. But I think we all have, like social media, I feel like there's this bubble there now where I don't know if it's as easy to do anymore. And I'm glad. But I think we all have, like social media, we all have influence to a certain degree. Even if you don't, if you're not the Jenners or you don't have a massive following, people have access to your opinion now. And you can share that and influence people positively or negatively by the things we say on social media. Yeah. Yeah,

definitely. So just, you know, in terms of my students anyways, or the influence that I try and have on my social media or what I try and tell other people is if you're aware, you know, it's just so important to have some type of message because even if you aren't super into education yourself, there are so many people that follow you that are, and it will affect their lives. underprivileged kids, those kids rely on education as a ticket to get out of whatever shit neighborhood they're in or whatever, you know?

And, and so those are the people that honestly we have to influence because then they should be looking at all these Instagram accounts or whatever and being like, wait, they think, they think school is cool. I'm going to think school is cool too. So that's what you have to be aware of. Totally. And if you are, you know, the most people who are listening to this podcast aren't influencers, but so maybe more the people who are listening to people who have influence.

That's great, but still form your own opinions, obviously. Yes, yes. And other than if your parents are trying to cheat you into college, listen to your parents. Yeah. You know, and that's an important thing. It's just like, let's not forget who our circle of influence should truly be. And that is family, friends, mentors, the people you have direct access to that can share with their personal experiences and mistakes and relate.

You can only have so much influence from someone through a computer screen. And you can only, you know, because everyone's story is unique and different in terms of experience that they've had. And so, yeah, I think it's important for people to I'm a big big believer in mentors and having that, you know, knowing where your influence comes from. And just if, you know, if you are going to be following people, that's great. And, you know, I follow a lot of people that I'm like, oh, it's a cool, like, it's a cool jacket. It's how so-and-so is wearing this or a certain sort of style.

I mean, it works. It definitely works. And I like that, you know, but who you are and the kind of the values that you have and the type of, you know, it's important to come from your inner circle. Yeah. And it's, you know, it's a position of power. Let's get like, let's be honest, you know, being able to be an influencer is a position of power.

So it's like, what are you going to choose to do with that? You have a, you have a lot of responsibility on your hands to teach these young people. I know. I'm taking it upon my, you know, I'm going to tell everyone that wants to be an influencer needs to listen to me. How do you feel about having tutored a billionaire? Great. I think it's pretty cool.

I taught her everything she knows. Do you have an opinion? I taught her everything she knows. Do you have an opinion? Your friend Kylie has fallen under recent criticism for this title of self-made billionaire. Yeah. And just, and help me understand, because I'm aware of Kylie. I'm not fully educated on every move that she makes.

Was it Forbes magazine that called her a self-made billionaire or was it her? It was Forbes. Okay. Youngest self-made billionaire. I think before it was like Mark Zuckerberg. And then a lot of people kind of jumped on this title and criticized the title. I guess criticized Forbes, but also indirectly criticized Kylie for this title of self-made billionaire. Yeah.

And then she has, I guess, defended it by saying. I think, I don't know. I mean, I think she, I think she came out. Please don't quote me on this. I don't know if she actually said this, but she, she said that no, nothing in my bank, not one dime from my bank account is inherited. Yeah, since you're like 15 or something.

Yeah, so that's what self-made means. I think people's criticism of self-made is because she grew up with privilege. Yeah, which she did, which is fine. And she grew up obviously already having some fame. I think that really helps. And I think that's what people, that's what the criticism is. It's just like, well, you were already famous

and you had money. So you don't count. I think that's what people are trying to say. Yeah, I don't really understand that and I'll get to why. But before I do, I'm curious, minus her privilege, let's not pretend she doesn't have it

and she didn't have it. Huge advantages. Fine. You know her. You were part of that process of when she started it. What are some things that she did that had nothing to do with her privilege that resulted in her business being what it is today?

Developing a product has nothing to do with fame or privilege. Developing a good product and developing a good brand has nothing to do with fame or privilege. She really worked very hard at developing a good product. Sourcing it and developing the product. Going through several formulas, trying them out, things not working. I mean, even the formula that's out now is different than the first formula that came out.

It's like continual things. It's like you can't sell millions of something and have it be an awful product. It's like no one's going to buy it again. They won't buy it again. Yeah, that's true. Right? And so they might buy it a first time,

but they won't continue as customers. The reason why I ask that question, and I don't think you're necessarily an expert in everything she's doing, is that I sometimes don't understand why as a society we like to poke holes in people's success. We always do it.

And I don't have the background or upbringing that Kylie has. She has immense advantages. Great. Fine. We are spending time as a society debating whether she's a self-made billionaire or not. And my thought is, who cares? She's a 20-year-old billionaire and I don't care what advantages you have.

It's amazing. She had to have done something right. Again, there's a lot of things that what she did, the average person can't replicate. But for me as a small business owner, and I certainly have advantages as well that I've gotten now as a result of things I've done. That came from, there was luck a result of things I've done, but I didn't, that came from,

there was luck involved, but things I have done, but there's things that you can replicate in terms of hearing her story. And I don't know if Kylie goes and ever speaks to like things that she's done in her business, but there's probably takeaways of why it's, you know, and you may not be able to grow your business to a billion dollar empire. That's not the point, but you can grow your business into something more than what it was. And you can have sustainable success and you can have repeat customers and grow your business. And there may be things that she did right that you can take away from. And yet we're spending more time arguing whether she's the youngest self-made billionaire or not. I sometimes don't understand why as a society we do that.

I don't know. Yeah. That's just me. I mean. I don't know, Rachelle, if you have a thought on that. People are always going to. I just, the fact that she's like part of the Jenner Kardashian clan. I get the, yeah.

I think has just kind of, that just, I mean, she could, you know, she could brush her teeth and people would criticize. Totally. And I'm not, and I don't just mean her though, but we do that with everyone. Anytime someone has success, people are trying to, I kind of equate it to, and again, I understand there's in a lot of ways they're not, they can be not relatable. I get that. And in some ways they are. But like when I was in sales and sales, and this would happen every time

when you have a team of salespeople, and every day something cool would happen, a big deal. And there was always two groups of people when a big deal would close. There would be people who would walk up to that person who closed the deal and go, it's really cool, man. How'd you do that?

Was there anything you did or a unique thing? Did you try something different? I mean, I've been trying to close a similar deal and maybe there's a takeaway. And then there'd be another group of people who would kind of go out to lunch and drinks and be like, it's fucking bullshit, man. They got lucky or whatever.

They don't work that hard. Their manager likes them to get in the better territory. There might be truth in both sides of the argument, but what advantages do you get as someone who's just going to go and complain and poke holes? And even that person had some luck involved. I'm not saying there aren't advantages, but the people who were just curious enough to ask, was there a takeaway? Was there something I could learn? Those are the people who are going to help themselves later on. And I just think we should do more of that stuff. I feel like I get similar criticisms sometimes

where it's just like, oh, well, yeah, you were able to build this tutoring business because Kendall and Kylie were your first students. Of course. Of course your thing's going to be successful. First of all, yes, it did help. Yeah. Let's not pretend that doesn't, that happens. Let's not pretend like that's not, yeah.

But there's other things that. Yeah. It's like I was a tutor long before I had Kendall and Kylie. And not only that, but taking advantage of opportunities and being aware of what those opportunities are has nothing to do with, you know, that, that's like a thing all in itself. And then executing that Fyre Festival document was a perfect example of opportunity and like setting yourself up for success only to epically fail because you can't execute and follow through

with a plan. And so that, you know, there's two ways that story could have gone and it was an epic failure. It could have been a major success. If it was a success, I would have been more interested in what they did to make it a success rather than spend time being like, well, you had all these famous models promoting it. Clearly, they had those same models promoting it and it still was a failure.

It still was a tragic and epic failure. That's kind of my point. Just because you have opportunity doesn't guarantee success. And people always want to bash. People always want to bash. They want to bash opportunity. And they want to be like, well, you had the opportunity, so that's not fair. It's like, what are you talking about? I just think that maybe some of the anger comes from, you know, the situation that a lot of people in where they're working so hard and they're

still barely making ends meet. And then you see people like, even when Trump was like, I got a small million dollar loan from my father. It's like what I would do for a million dollars. And a lot of people just feel like they can't even get their feet under them. And so I think that's that kind of anger that maybe they take it out on the wrong people. I get that. And, and again so I think it's that kind of anger that maybe they take it out on the wrong people. I get that. And again, I talk about my childhood a little bit too.

Obviously, we didn't come from money. I mean, there wasn't a day that went by as a kid that I saw my parents stress about money. I mean, it's ingrained in my memory of always seeing my... And when I was old enough to be aware, like eight or nine, I had an amazing childhood and my parents busted their ass to give it to me. Same. But I saw them struggle. And, you know, that kind of affected me in wanting to like work hard and things like that.

And I certainly had been, I was gifted with athletic ability. So I used that to my advantage. I still worked hard to maximize that. There are things that people could poke holes in me and saying, well, you got lucky this and you were fortunate. And I've been very fortunate in my entire life, but there's also a lot more I have done

to lead to the success that I've had in terms of, I now have people, I mean, people like to be like, oh, Nick, what do you do? You remember that? I have five jobs. I have a podcast. I have an essential oil company that I run that takes up a ton of time. I've been acting now, both commercially and

theatrically that like, it takes a lot of work and I've been busting my ass to do. And yeah, I saw some stuff on Instagram too. And I'm not saying like, that's not really a job, but like, and you know, you have to be creative. And I mean, I don't really consider it a job, but I am doing things that I am proud of. And that took a lot of hard work. And also, I was lucky enough to. But there are things that I have done that people can replicate if they ask questions. And they can say, well, if you do X, Y, and Z. And then people say, what is luck when opportunity meets, when hard work meets opportunity? And that is true a lot. I do think it's like a, this is an interesting topic of

privilege, which I know that word maybe makes some people like cringe or get angry. But saying that someone has privilege doesn't mean that they don't work hard also. And they didn't. But it's just a reality. Some people have privilege that other people don't. And it does suck that there are people who bust their ass, who have to do it that much harder. I will say that if you are that person, it will be sweeter. And when you get to there at that moment

and you know the work that went into it, it feels gratifying. And it feels great to know when to reflect back on the things that went into it. It feels gratifying and it feels great to know and to reflect back on the things that you had to do. And yeah, and unfortunately sometimes it does suck sometimes. The world isn't fair. It's not. It's not.

But yeah, I just think that, I guess my point of all this is instead of focusing on how things aren't fair, because that is reality, I guess my point of all this is instead of focusing on how things aren't fair and what, and because that is reality, if we focus on making the most of whatever situation you have and taking advantage of what advantage you do have in opportunities that are in front of you, you can improve your station in life. It doesn't mean you're going to be a billionaire.

It doesn't mean you're going to be a millionaire or doesn't like, it just might just be far more successful in whatever you're doing it just might be you're the middle management and that's a great job and you can do all the things that you never got to do as a kid I mean my when I was a kid I didn't know what it was like to go to Disneyland

growing up every week some kid would be taking a week off of school like hey we're taking a family trip to Orlando I'm like well great because my parents couldn't afford to put like six kids on a plane you know be taking a week off of school like yeah we're taking a family trip to orlando i'm like well great because my parents couldn't afford to put like six kids on a plane you know like yeah that just wasn't a reality um and then i grew up and i went to disney world i was like not that great i guess i'm fine um right that's yes i don know. I guess I hope I'm, I'm hoping I'm making sense of the people listening is like, let's make the most of what we do have and ask for help and ask

people's questions. Just don't focus on it too. If it really irritates you. I mean, if, if yeah, if there's someone that has reached a level of success and that you're in that, that just irritates you and eats away at you. I mean Literally, it's eating away at you and it's taking away parts of you that could contribute to something so much better for yourself. Just focus on yourself. Focus on your own

thing and you'll be a much happier person. At least in that, you'll be a much happier person. I don't know what advantages Kylie... I mean, Kylie's had a ton of advantages, but she's a billionaire. It's amazing.

She's 21 years old. It's amazing. And I'm sure she's been super fortunate. I don't... Yeah, yeah. And she clearly has. No, but she knows... I mean, she's a smart girl.

She knows... You can't... You don't just fall into a billion dollars. I'm sorry. No, you don't. She knows exactly who her audience is. She knows. You can't, you don't just fall into a billion dollars. I'm sorry. No, you don't. She knows exactly who her audience is. She knows, she knows her product. Yeah. She's, it's all, you know. I would rather compliment that than criticize whether she's had privilege, which she's had. And that's awesome. And congratulations. Yeah. And then like,

let's acknowledge it and then move on. Right. And then if I, if I, you know, were someone that was looking at her situation, I would want to be asking questions. This goes back to the asking questions thing. I would be asking questions about how. If I ever met Carly as a small business owner, and there's a lot of things I can't relate to, and she can't be like, well, get a billion followers, I would still be like, well, what is... I would have so many questions for her.

I will. I would. I would just be like, well, tell me about this. And there's a lot of things that she'd say she did that, well, I can't do that, okay? I can't do that. But I guarantee there's things that she could teach me that she's done, and I would be thrilled to hear that. So, I don't know. Yeah.

Yeah. I just, yeah. We, you up for some questions with some, some fans and share your words of wisdom as a tutor and life coach. Do you kind of consider yourself a bit of a life coach as well? I don't know if I want to like take that on. It's kind of like, yeah, it's not the most positive. I like to just be like, I'm, I know math and I know these things.

I mean, like I, you know, I like if I can help people out in that way honestly I think that's really great and I appreciate I appreciate people asking me that. I don't know if I want to like say that I'm a life coach because I just I don't know.

I get it. You know what I mean? No. It's a lot of responsibility. But you probably tutor about life a lot especially when you're Yeah well I mean what we try and do you know because you probably tutor about life a lot. Yeah, well, I mean, what we try and do, because you were asking about life skills and stuff like that.

Do we teach life skills? Do we teach? And it's not like we teach life skills, but we try and understand the skills that you use as an adult and try and apply that through the you know, through the curriculum. Two plus two is two. Two plus two is four. Also don't be a douche. Yes. Right. Exactly. Just side note, extra credit. Extra credit. What do you do in this situation to not be a douche? Yeah, but no, we really do though. We try and just get them

because I mean, you get the question all the time. It's just like, when am I ever going to use the Pythagorean theorem ever again in my life? And the question is, you probably. Wait, the Pythagorean, is it, which one? No, it's, it's a squared plus b squared equals c squared. Yes. Fuck yeah. You just used it again.

What's the one that's a plus or minus the square root of, uh, for a plus. That's the quadratic formula. Oh, yes. It was pretty. See? No, I remember too. I remember when I was like just tutoring math. And I was like, remember all those times when you were like,

I'm never going to use this again. I was like, don't become a tutor because you will use it. You will use it again. But yeah, but it's like more so it's problem solving skills really too at the end of the day. It is. And that is the key to life.

Well, it's one of them, I think. Yeah, it is. Hi, Nick. How are you? Good. How are you? Good. Thank you. This is my friend, Tiffany. Hi. How are you? Hi. Tiffany. Hi, how are you? Hi, I'm good.

How are you? Whatever she says, you should listen to. She is, she knows what she's talking about. Well, Kelsey, Kelsey, how can we help you? So I wrote in, I had a question about me and my boyfriend. We've been together officially about four months since December, but before we were officially together, I was, you know, seeing other people. I live near New York and that's just kind of what you do. Um, I learned

because you're near New York. Yeah. Just to be fair to to you kelsey it's not just a new york thing uh but continue well whatever i think i guess especially feel it out here okay but um yeah so i was seeing other people he apparently was not and you know that's kind on him. I straight up told him at one point, you know, I don't think you and I are in a relationship at this point. I'm still keeping my options open. Like, I was very clear when I told him this. And about two months after that conversation is when we made it official. Okay. So he didn't realize that, you know, I meant what I said. And I was actually seeing other people. He didn't realize that. Right. Okay. Okay said and i was actually seeing other people right okay okay i immediately like you kelsey i know me too i'm i mean so i i don't know it's just it's kind of sometimes a point of contention like he and i've been together a couple months now and it's going really strong and everything's fun and he's a great guy. I really like him. My family likes him. But every once in a while,

like this will come up about how he doesn't trust me all the way. And there was a little bit of a twist to this where I kind of had goals for myself to maybe be a little bit more of a hoe than I have been in the past. Wait, it's just that we're hearing you correctly. Did you say goals?

Goals to be a hoe yeah how old are you kelsey how old are you own it i had two goals in particular um so one of them was i wanted to get my number and i think you guys know what i mean by, up to a certain number by the end of 2018. And when I met Mike, it was Q2 of 2018. And let's just say I was a little behind. Okay, okay, okay, okay. And you were how old are you, Kelsey?

I'm 26. Okay. And when did you set the goal? I look, um, her quarterly statement was behind the mark a little bit. So, all right. So, uh, okay. I've, can I ask you some questions? Yeah. I mean, whatever you got to do. I'm just kind of, this is fascinating. Why, what made you want to get your number up? I'm just, I'm not, I have no judgment. I'm just curious. Yeah, I know. No, it's fine. It's a fair question. I just kind of did. Um, I didn't really act out a lot in college and I didn't do anything at all in high school. So now that I was in my mid-twenties, I was like,

if I'm not going to go nuts, I don't know, I guess this is kind of the time. Because I just didn't in college, and a lot of my friends did. Yeah, you're like, my turn. I appreciate the self-awareness. I mean, for those who are listening, I'm assuming, I don't assume, I know

there's people listening who are just like, all these different opinions thrown out right now. But what, what is it? Listen, this is your choice. You want to, you know, experience more sex and you are entitled to that sex positive. I appreciate the self-awareness. I mean, you're also an adult, so you are entitled to do that. And you seem to have a good sense of humor about it, which I appreciate.

I just love how matter-of-factly and how openly you're saying this right now. I think it's really great. How old is your gentleman? He is 30. He's 30. Yeah, so there's a little bit of a gap, but not too much. Yeah, it's totally fine. I thought he would be younger, to be honest.

No. He's like, he knows what he wants at this point. So I think that is part of why I'm in a committed thing with him. Okay. Not because necessarily you're ready? Are you reluctantly in this relationship? No. You're in.

You're happy. Well, by the time he and I made it official, I knocked off both my goals. Well, I was going to say, that was my next question. I was like, well, did you hit your goal? This is great. Before you made it official? Okay, so you're happy because you're like, got there. Sorry, go ahead.

No, please. No, no, no. I'm just saying like, so you're happy because you're like, okay, cool. I mean, was that your thing? You're like, hey, before I make it official, I got to hit this goal. Was that like the sort of thing or? It would have been, obviously I'm happy that I did hit both of my goals.

The other goal, by the way, was I wanted to get two people under my belt, so to speak, within the same 24 hour period. Wild. So that was my second goal. And I- 24 hours or? And you had reached the goal. Okay. Okay. Like, yeah, like two new people in the span of 24, one, one fabulous weekend, I guess.

You know, listen, I, I'm really curious about this call for, you know, again, we talked about, we, I have a predominantly female audience. Um, this is an interesting caller for, uh, thank you for speaking so freely, but, um, you know, again, the stereotype of men going out, um, and, and having this, having this type of activity and, yeah, they can be like, oh, he's a player, kind of a, a man whore, but they call it man whore. Not, you know, they, oh, because it is kind of like, okay. And I hope people aren't listening. Listen, Kelsey wanted to have some sex and she wanted to experience life as a single person.

Did it make you feel- Safely. Safely, hopefully. Safely. I hope everything was done safely. Yes, no, safety was a huge priority for me. Was it a liberating feeling that you want to do experience? I just didn't want to feel like I was missing something.

And I guess this is a very weird and quantitative way to make myself not feel that way. But I'm a very analytical person. Yes, clearly. I mean, Q2. Yeah. And again, for those of you listening, this Yes, clearly. I mean, Q2... Yeah, and again, for those of you listening, this is, yeah, we have different ways of how we process

and communicate. Kelsey's clearly analytical, as we can tell. I appreciate it. I am very matter-of-fact. I love it. But getting into your relationship, clearly you're vocal vocal and you are so confident in yourself that you're willing to come on this podcast and share your story. And I appreciate you doing that. Is he obviously aware of this whole thing?

So, yes, he is. And that's kind of why we still fight about it because I wanted to get a certain point, you know, I hit a certain number and with the addition of him, I still had two numbers to go. When you met him. Yeah.

So when, when he and I first got together physically, I, after, after adding him to the list, I still had two more open spots to hit michael and okay but you weren't official you weren't official no we were not and i made a point this is very important i made a point of laying my cards out there and not exactly saying

what my goals were but saying you know he had just gotten out of a very serious relationship i had been single for a few years and wasn't quite ready yet at that point to be in a relationship. So I laid it out very clearly like, hey, you might want some time for yourself to be single. And I still want more time for myself to be single. So let's not put all of our eggs in one basket right now and continue just, you know, seeing each other casually and seeing where it goes. right now and continue just you know seeing each other casually and seeing where it goes and um he agreed but you know he said that he didn't really take it that seriously and he was treating me like the only one but then i literally the next day uh went and got with someone else to knock off my 24 hour period goal yeah no and and because at that point i wasn't thinking relationship. I told him what I was thinking and I felt free to do what I wanted to do. Um, and then a few weeks after that, it was another guy's birthday. So, you know, happy birthday.

And so I was able to reach my goal for both of both goals. I was able to reach both of my goals in October and I had until New Year's. So I was feeling pretty good about myself. Oh, yeah. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Thanks.

So then it fast forward to December. So, you know, this was September, October where I was accomplishing the goals. In December, like I was basically at the point with Mike where I knew I was ready to be in a relationship. And he he claims he made it official, but it was really me. He like brought me out to the city for like this night on the town. So like with the purpose of asking me to be his official girlfriend. But then like I just beat him to it because I was getting impatient. And I was like, oh, can we just be official already? And he was like, Oh, that was the

point of this trip to the city. Um, so by the time December rolled around, I was ready to be in a relationship, but I told him about the goals at that point. I said, you know, before we make this official, I just want to lay everything out there and tell you what I've been up to the last couple months. And he was like, look, I can understand, you know, you wanting to experience things, but I don't understand why I wasn't enough. Why? Like you may have had these goals before you met me, but then when you did meet me, why did you still want to pursue them? Why wasn't I enough? And I was like, look, all I could do was tell you. And I did tell you that I was still playing the field. So this was a few months ago.

This was in December. And, you know, it's March now. We're going strong. Everything's great. I'm seeing him later tonight. But every once in a while, you know, it'll come up that he doesn't fully trust me because I was able to do these things I did. And I just don't like that we have a crack in our foundation, so to speak. Like, I really like this guy. I know it may not seem like it from the onset, but I've gotten to the point where I do really, really care about him so much. And I want to be with him for a while. But now I realize that, you know, we might not always have the most even footing if we're starting off at this place of, do I really trust you?

So that's kind of my question is, Nick, I know you know what it's like to have a clear favorite in a group of three. I hate to bring that up, but you know, how do you handle it going forward? You know, on The Bachelor, I'm trying to make a connection here, but you know, it's known that you're dating multiple people at once. I tried to make it known I was dating multiple people at once, but it still played out kind of weird. So I was wondering if there was any perspective on just how I can continue to reassure my boyfriend and make him think that he can trust me because he can. I have no intention of not being faithful to him. Well, here's what's interesting is that I don't think your issue is trust. If you could have done anything better, it sounds like the way you tell the story

is that you're honest with him about I'm not ready to settle down and implied, you know, there's an obvious implication there that there's why aren't you ready to settle down? Because I want to keep dating other people. And if you're not in a community relationship, you have the right to do whatever you want.

You maybe could have been, you know, you're obviously clearly upfront and direct person. You could have really leaned into that and been like, just so we're on the same page, I plan on having sex with other people. Well, when I first met him, I was having sex with someone else and he knew about that person when I met him.

Okay. So I guess what I'm saying is I don't think honesty is really the problem. You've been very upfront. You seem like a great communicator. Your own, your, your biggest problem could be, and I can relate to this over communicating sometimes. Um, and, um, so I, I just, you know, like, I don't, I don't think he has the right to feel how he feels and it feels like it's trust. But I, if he was going to listen, I would suggest, in fact, you, he could probably trust you more than anyone he's ever trusted before. No, because you're so, you're so like, you're so open about your experiences.

What he's having, you know, like a hard time processing is this need of feeling like he's enough. And that's a real feeling that people feel out there. But both men and women too, I think, I think it's important to feel special in a relationship, not to discount that. But I think sometimes, again, going back to people get bogged down in the idea of things. I mean, it's all perspective and what he values and what he thinks is enough. The fact that you are so liberating and open and wanting to do this, but he's the guy

that you truly want to commit to makes him special. Maybe not to him, but into your mind it does. So his perception of feeling special is entirely up to him. And I guess my point is, that's not anything you can necessarily control. I don't know the dynamics and it sounds like you really care to him. There's not, and I guess my point is, that's not anything you can necessarily control.

Right. He, I don't know the dynamics and it sounds like you really care about him being a nice guy, but I think it's very self-aware for you to recognize that there's a crack in your foundation. And before you really get serious with this guy, he needs to accept you for who you are

and the person that you were before the relationship. And he needs to, and again, you might not be the girl for him and that's fine for him not to want to be with someone who might be as sexually liberated as you are. That's not a crime. And for all those, like, again, this is all personal preference, but you deserve to be with someone who sees your openness and your risk-taking, you know, while being safe and the fact that you wanted to live your life before you, and you were self-aware to know that this is what you want to do so that you can fully give yourself to whatever relationship you are in is a, is an admirable quality, but someone needs to appreciate that about you.

You need to be with a guy who is confident enough to probably have done the same thing. And his ego isn't so big that he, he knows that he's enough because, you know, does that make sense? And I don't know if he is the guy for you because he just needs to see that for what it is and not to make it worse. And he just needs to accept it. Right. Because it's kind of like when you're cheated on and some, Oh, I forgive you. And then they don't really forgive you. If he wants to be with you, he needs to accept how you met in the early stages of your relationship sooner than later. And if he doesn't want to, that's okay on him too.

It doesn't make him a bad guy. He's entitled to not be okay with the beginning of your relationship. And I'm not saying that you did anything wrong, but he's entitled to not be okay with the beginning of your relationship. Yeah. And I'm not saying that you did anything wrong, but he's entitled to not be okay with it. I think he deserves, he deserves to be honest with you about him, whether he's actually okay with it or not. I think that maybe if you're trying to get to the reassurance part, if you're like, okay, what can I do? Cause I really care about him and I want to be with him and I want to try and figure this out. What can I do to make this issue less of an issue? I think maybe communicating to him that his issue of like, of the reason why you have these goals has nothing to do with him and only to do with yourself. It's a great point. You were always going to do with him. Yeah. And only to do with yourself. It's a great point.

You were always going to do this. You didn't sleep with other people because he wasn't good in bed or something like that. You were sleeping with other people because you had a personal goal because you wanted to. It had nothing to do. It just be like, it wasn't about you.

Yeah. So I think maybe letting him know that the way that you feel about him is neither here nor there in terms of what you were doing in the first two months of your relationship. And what is about him is the fact that you really like him and you want to be in a committed relationship. And you don't need to continue what you were doing because, you know. Now you feel fulfilled and you clearly are someone who's confident themselves that if they didn't meet the right person could just continue to have a very entertaining life right and so he isn't filling a void he you're dating him because of the person he is and i think i think

the difference point let him know that and communicate that with him to give him that confident. But also I think maybe have a conversation with about like, what do you mean by you don't trust me? Because I've been completely honest and I understand if you're not okay with what I've done, but you certainly can trust me. Um, cause there's two, there's a couple, it's feeling, it's him feeling as a guy like inadequate or ahead of his masculinity. And, and, and again, for different reasons, women can feel that too. I've had plenty of women be like, well, I want, you know, I want to feel, you know, everyone wants to feel special in their relationship, but it's all perspective. You know, he should feel special. He just doesn't in a traditional sense of how you, I mean, there's probably always something kind of deep down inside him that thinks just like, what if she wants to start doing this again?

Then like, I'm going to get hurt, you know? So there's probably always that fear. But I mean, it's like you could what if yourself into lunacy. So yeah, but should have that fear regardless. Like, right. You're right. Yeah. So I right. Yeah. So I don't know.

Listen, yeah, I think Tiffany makes a great point. I think we all, and I can do a better job of this. We all, you know, this is a strength of yours, of who you are, and to you. But it can sometimes be intimidating to people. Sometimes it can rub, your admirable qualities can sometimes rub people the wrong way, even in relationships. And so being aware of how you come off or, you know, and not, you know, just anyone, and especially in a relationship, how do you communicate that so he doesn't, he sees it as a quality. And ultimately he needs to do that too. And, you know, it's not your job to make him

appreciate you, but how you communicate your action. So he understands your point of view is an important thing. And that's the biggest disconnect is he doesn't really seem to understand where you are coming from and your motivations. His, he thinks it's about, he thinks it's about him and it's not, it's not about him at all. He thinks it's about him and it's not about him at all. So try to help him understand and try to ask questions and make him feel confident and do whatever you can. But I do think at some point he needs to accept you for who you are. And he needs to just accept that that's what it was

and it's not that anymore. And you can move on from that rather than it was and it's not that anymore and you can move on from from from that rather than continuing to bring it up which is really hard to do by the way it's not like it's i mean i think we all have issues of you know like when you're in a relationship of things coming up from the past and continuing to fight about things that happened like five years ago and stuff like that but yeah And in fairness to this guy, listen, it would have been more ideal had you met your goals

and then met someone six months later. Yes. Does this kind of overlap? It was like, any guy is going to like, okay, or even girls. This is not a sex thing. The overlap kind of makes... Yeah, it's circumst it's, this is not a sex thing. It's, you know, the overlap kind of makes.

Yeah. It's circumstantial, isn't it? I think relationships are highly, I think successful, the success of a relationship is like half circumstantial. I feel like you can meet the man of your dreams or the woman of your dreams and not be in the right place to be with them at that moment, which kind of seems like, you know, I don't know if he's like the man of your dreams, but it seems like you met someone while you were in the middle of, you know, this life. Yes. Like while you're in the middle of

working on something else. And so, and so, yeah. So like it's, if you had met him afterwards, then obviously this issue wouldn't have even been, been one. Yeah. So I think, yeah. So just to sum it up, I think the best advice is I wouldn't apologize. You were honest. I would articulate that you were very honest, but I would empathize with his point of view that you understand where he's coming from and then try your best to make him feel how you feel about him and that you really care about him and you really want to see this relationship can go.

But he does have to trust you. And that trust is ultimately on him. Thank you, guys. Yeah, I agree. I think part of it is just time. thank you guys yeah i agree i think part of it is just time like as it goes on it'll become less and less relevant and you know we're going to continue to grow closer as we would hopefully and it just you know we'll take the sting out of it you know as long as i keep being reassuring and letting him know that i care like you guys are saying then you know time will speak for itself

hopefully but if in six months from now he he is still bringing it up and not dropping it, I think that's a red flag you should consider. You don't want to invest in a relationship that five years from now, he can't be bringing this up. And that happens in relationships where people will not get over things. And you don't want that to grow into a tumor and be a bigger problem down the line. You have a good point. I mean, I'm definitely going to continue to be self-aware. So I'll be running those little checks for sure. All right.

Well, thank you for the very entertaining call. All the best to you and your boyfriend. Take care. Thank you, guys. Have a great day. Bye, you too. Hi. Hello.

Hi. What is your name? Marina. Hi, Marina. I'm Nick. This is Tiffany. Hi, Marina. have a great day bye you too hi hello hi what is your name marina hi marina i'm nick this is tiffany hi marina what's your question so my question is um about six weeks ago my best friend and i had a disagreement because he has been liking and commenting on pictures of a girl who my only real serious boyfriend so far cheated on me with. And I've asked her to stop a few times. It's been going on for a few years and she hasn't. And this time when I confronted her, she just said that I was being insecure and that I needed to get over it. So my question is like, am I overreacting? Like, what do you think? Are you still dating this guy? No. How long has it been?

Um, about three years. Oh, uh, is she friends with this girl? No. What is she liking about the, I don't know. Why, why is she... Seems like such a simple ask. I don't know. So they went to high school together and she kind of knew her, I guess. But when she cheated on me and I told her like who the girl was, they weren't following each other at any social media platforms

or anything like that at all. And then they started following each other? Yeah, my best friend followed her about a year after the cheating and started liking all her stuff and commenting. And this is out of nowhere. She's not like an influencer of any, like, does she look up to anything that she does on her social media account? Yeah, no, there's really no real support because it's not like they bump it's not like they're friends or they bump into each other it's kind of just out of the blue I have a thought but do you have uh do you I mean

that would annoy me I would just be like why totally I mean there's no why what does she say when you ask her why actually I mean you've asked her why so when I ask her why actually? I mean, you've asked her why. So when I asked her why she just kind of said like, it's social media, it's not a big deal. Um, and basically just said like, you shouldn't care. She can't tell you how to feel. Okay. Um, well, what do you think? I listen, I, Listen, loyalty matters to me in friendships. And so that would bug me. The fact like there's no real motivation for her. They're not even friends. Like it can be, it could be dicey.

Let's say she was kind of friends with this girl and now she has to pick sides. If she's truly your best friend, it would seem like such a simple ask to ask your best friend to have your back in this situation and not like the picture. That being said, yeah. I mean, sure. If you want to look at the other side, she shouldn't tell you how to feel.

But forgetting about her opinion, you know, trying to like let go of that unfortunate situation would be helpful. I mean, it'd be nice if she helped you along the way to do that. And she would probably help you move on from it completely if she just stopped making it a thing,

but she's like scraping the wound. Is she like, do you, have you guys been arguing or like, have you, I mean, I've definitely had friendships with very, very close people that like, we were, you're like kind of annoying each other

for a long time and kind of like doing things to get on each other's nerves and press each other's buttons a little bit. Um, no, I mean like we've had a really great friendship, which is why this is ultimately so confusing to me. And for me, it's not really about like the likes and the comments. It's that I've asked her to stop and she's like, yeah, yeah, I'll stop. I'll stop. And then doesn't. And I had this block, so I didn't even know it was happening.

And then whenever I like kind of discovered it, I was like, this has been going on for years after you said you were stopping. So, so she's lying to you. It's weird. I mean, how old are you? 26. Okay. I mean, yeah, she might not be the best friend that you thought she is. I like, yeah, that would really annoy me. And I would just be like, is it worth, she is. I like, yeah, that would really annoy me. And I would just be like, is it worth, was it worth it? I mean, I'd be like, is it, is it worth, like you feel the need so strongly to like and comment on her photos when you know that it's hurting my feelings? Like, what is it? Does this other girl get some sort of, I mean, I'm talking about the, the cheaty. Does she, I mean, I'm talking about the Chi-T.

Does she, does she, does she get, like, is she, like, loving the likes and comments specifically from your friend for something? Have they, like, had some sort of bond? Like, it just doesn't really

make a lot of sense to me. I don't know. All the comments are just kind of the typical girl, like, you're so beautiful. You have such a beautiful soul. And that's one that bothers me beautiful you have such a beautiful soul and that's one that bothers you you have such a beautiful soul bitch you know actually no like

fire emoji fire emoji fire emojis here i you know what i here's my takeaway oh i'm sorry go ahead oh i just have a question how did you find out she was even like um she's really into fitness and she's beautiful like the girl he cheated with like she's beautiful um but it's always like kind of like half naked pictures of her and then my best friend is commenting like you're so incredible and i'm like that's who my boyfriend cheated with like but how are you even seeing this? Are you stalking her? The cheaty? Are you stalking her? Open Pandora's box probably. No. So the reason why is because I follow a boudoir photographer and the boudoir photographer posted pictures because this girl went and had a session with her. So I saw all of those, which was really fun. And then I went to like new boudoir photographer so that I wouldn't see them for a while.

And I noticed that my best friend on those had commented and liked them. And I was like, is she doing this on her normal profile too? So I went down the rabbit hole. So here's my thought on this. I now have a strong opinion about all this. This happened three years ago, the cheating. Not to downplay, like cheating is a terrible thing to happen to anyone and it's hard to get over, but three years is too long for you to still be pining over this experience of being cheated on.

And unfortunately, the situation that your friend is putting you in, it's like, again, it's like scratching at a wound and she's not letting it heal. And you should just, you should not have to worry about like this. You being reminded of your boyfriend being cheated is not something you should be indifferent about at this point. And it's not entirely your fault that you're not, you could probably try to do things. So my guess to follow up to that is I personally think it's super weird when people lie about weird small things. And I usually think in those situations, it's like that is a red flag for that's just the only thing you know that they're lying about.

And this weird little motivation, we don't know. There's something more there. I don't know what it is, but she's lying to you for no goddamn reason, which means that she has no problem with lying to you for no goddamn reason. And to me, that's a red flag as a human being, as a person. And so I hate to say it, that maybe this best friend is not really your best friend. And she certainly doesn't have the qualities I would want in a best friend. And my best friend, I want them to be loyal to me to a fault. And if I'm being unreasonable with some of my loyalty requests to have that friend check me, but I don't think you're being unreasonable. And if like, she's

like, well, she was my best friend too. And I don't want to, fine, but that's not seems to be the situation here. So I guess the biggest takeaway is you need to get yourself to a place where this cheating experience is something you're no longer Stressing about or thinking about or even putting any effort into it's been three years and you need to get over it And I don't say that as like get over it Like you need to put yourself in a situation to help yourself get over it and unfortunately your best friend Is making it worse not better. And so if that's the case, you need to remove that from the equation. And I think to help you do that is to realize that

she's lying to you about dumb shit. And that's, that to me makes me really nervous. I, I, people who lie to me about dumb things make me really nervous because that means they'll lie about big things. And this, the covert stuff makes me really nervous too i don't like i just think it's all kind of shady and i if it were me i would personally not i would like really distance myself from this friend because she's obviously not making you feel very good yeah and like what like you just i just don't i don't know it's hard and like this is such a girl thing that guy i mean for me i don't know it's like i just think men do it too maybe that situation i can't imagine a guy liking another guy's photos yeah but it's not the liking his girlfriend cheated with him on and i hate to say that not to be like sexist or anything like that

or like anti-feminist but like um, um, it's just, I mean, this, this is like, just don't be friends with people that don't make you feel good about yourself. I think I don't like that. And it's like, it's obviously hurting your feelings and it's like not helping you get over this thing that happened a few years ago. And she knows it hurts your feelings obviously. And she's still doing it. And I think that's kind of fucked up. Having a best friend is also a relationship and every relationship every day should be immeasurable. Like it, there's no free pass. Like every day you have to earn that friendship and she's not doing a good job. Yeah. Right. Yeah. And that's kind of about like, it's not really

about the cheating anymore. Like that's long in the past and honestly I don't even really hold it against this girl because I'm like who knows maybe she didn't even know that he had a girlfriend like I don't know what she knew I've never talked to her so it's not really a thing for me it's like you told me you stopped and like I had a lot I didn't know but you never stopped like it was going on. And it wasn't just like a like here and there either. It's like every single picture. So I'm like, that's the bigger issue. Yeah. Yeah. It's a bigger issue. And when I confronted her about it this time, she just said, um, literally not everything is about you.

Like that was her response. Not everything is about you. And I'm like, but this is not everything. But also like to me, I hate it when people say stuff like that, because that's not the point. And again, I, we just met you. So maybe you're a totally selfish person. I don't know, like whatever. But the point is you have the right to feel the way you do. And if your best friend, that's what best friends are for to ask these kinds of crazy favors and have loyalty within reasonable. And if her response is it's not about you, then fine, fair enough. We're just not best friends.

And I think like, you know, I mean. Yes, yes, that's, that's, that's totally right. You're right. But I want this, you know what I'm saying? Like she. You're like, right. It's not about me, but I don't like you. Yeah, I mean.

So. Because we're talking about friendship here. We're not talking about whether, we're not talking about Instagram. This is not about Instagram likes or comments. No, and like, why do you feel like you need to do, like, I'm supposed to be your best friend. And like, so why is this girl, why is this urge that you have to comment

and like her photos? Does that like trump over our friendship? I don't get it. This is a story about loyalty and honesty and being upfront and not telling little white lies. And if you're willing to tell a little white lie, you're willing to tell a big lie. So I think that's what you should focus on and try to figure out, do you want that in your life or do you not? And just because she's your best friend today doesn't, or was your best friend yesterday, doesn't mean she's your best friend today. It doesn't mean she should be your best

friend tomorrow. And every day is a new day to prove your loyalty and friendship to all the people in your life. And family is one thing, you know, they're family, you love them to death do your part, but friendships come and go. And, um, they do. Yeah. I think a lot of us feel obligated to be friends with people that we've been friends with for a really, really long time. And I think you have to ask yourself if you were to meet them today, would you want to be their friend? And in breaking up with a friend is sometimes like hard as breaking up with a significant other, but sometimes to Tiffany's point, if they're not making you feel better about yourself then you need to remove those equations from your life yeah I agree it's just I mean like it is

really hard because she's been a part of my life for so long so it's like I was just making sure I'm not like completely overreacting and like blowing something up for no reason I don't think you are I mean there's no reason enough to call and get our advice it's not like you've like follow your gut yeah yeah you know listen you've you've you've communicated with her she she it's on her now you have other friends yeah absolutely all right thank you thank you yeah i mean, I guess what is our takeaway? What is our... Let's all call having sex meeting our goals now.

Meeting our goals. Right. Wow. Wow. So let's try and put this in the bigger picture here. Yeah. Owning yourself, being self-aware. Being self-aware.

I think that was great. But yeah, I mean, like obviously you're doing a lot of great things. I think higher education in general is something that is important that I think we sometimes dismiss at times. But actually education, not the idea of an education or the degree. We can learn both in school and from mentors in life. And I think bettering ourselves is very important. It sounds like you're doing a lot of great things

just learning you know learning in general being open to learning you know I always say that I'm always trying to teach my students how to learn so that when they're adults they want to learn about things and they have interest in things and I think bringing not having

education be like so much of its own sector so much but really just a part of everyone's life. Totally. Because like educating yourself is a... You do not stop learning when you stop going to school. If you do, you're in trouble. But yeah, I mean, that's really cool. And I commend you for starting novel.

N-O-V-E-L. Novel. Can you use it in a sentence? Indeed, I can. I've never won a spelling bee. I won my third grade spelling bee. Of course you did. I spelled the word cassette.

That's a hard one. It's a hard word. That's a hard one. So, you know. Just there's that. C-A-S-S-E-T-T? Yes. E?

Yes. He wasn't going to add the E. I was not going to add the E. I'm fucking terrible at spelling. Anyways, I thank you so much for being with us. It's been a lot of fun. Come back anytime. You're in LA.

Thank you. And if I may, now that I have your cell phone number, uh, text you, um, how to spell things. Yes, no problem. Because here's my problem. I'll, I'll, here's my answer. I'm so bad that it's like, how do you, you know, like you auto correct. And a lot of times my iPhone's like, I have no fucking clue. You spelled it so badly. my iPhone's like, I have no fucking clue. You spelled it so badly. So badly.

They're like, I've spent- Everything in our computational powers cannot help you. I'm like, I'm going through all these options and I finally am like, okay, what's a smaller word that says the same thing that I know how to spell? That one. Great. I'll use that. Anyways, thank you for joining with us.

Thank you so much for having me. It was a lot of fun. Thanks for listening, guys. Don't forget to rate us on iTunes. Five stars if you want. You can, again, find Natural Habits at nhoils.com. This has been a ton of fun. We'll see you next week.

Have a great week.