The Viall Files - E144 Trying To Understand Karen Culture with Sarah Colonna

Episode Date: June 24, 2020

Are you fascinated by “Karen” culture? Well, we are and wanted to take a look into what is going on with this new pop culture phenomenon. Nick & Krissy are joined by Actor, Comedian, & Author Sarah Colonna, who may have played a “Karen” here and there on TV. We take a look at how this culture came about, the behavioral traits associated with it, how it is being used politically, and why it is sometimes better to just take a breath and walk away. Most importantly we send lots of love to everyone out there named Karen who might find it to be a difficult trending topic.  “How dare you.” Be sure to subscribe so you don't miss an episode!  THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: EACH AND EVERY: eachandevery.com/VIALL INTELLIWHITE: tryindiglow.com CODE: SHOW FUNCTION OF BEAUTY: functionofbeauty.com/VIALL Episode Socials:  Viall Files @viallfiles Nick Viall @nickviall Krissy Lindquist @thekrissylindquist Sarah Colonna @sarahcolonna1 See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

what's going on everybody happy wednesday to you all uh i'm nick uh if you didn't know that uh just uh i think do i stop introducing myself we've talked about this already we talked about this already creature it's great it's nice it's formal it's an introduction hi everybody uh chrissy how are you i'm good chrissy a little bit of a week for me but i'm good back uh yeah uh chrissy's still in the east coast we are back in the studio uh at least for now we'll be back and forth a little bit i don't know if we'll be here full time but it is nice to be back in our studios here slowly getting back to normal

still sanitizing like crazy it is nice to just get out of the house wow I never thought I would enjoy that as much speaking of houses did you get your house? I know for those of you who don't know, I'm house hunting.

And I was really close to what I thought was going to get my dream home. I did not get it, which everyone's like, oh, you'll find something else. I really loved this one. I'm sad. What really sucked is that I found out that I was going to get the house, and then someone came at the last minute and offered a deal they couldn't pass up on, only to find out that the seller of the house

realized who I was, and apparently the person who got the house, and anything can happen. I guess it hasn't officially closed yet but apparently it's a single mom who who who recently got a divorce so they're like well i know we didn't sell you the house but maybe we can introduce you and you guys could like fall in love and and and live there together and i was like that right now i don't want to hear that right now i don't not a big setup guy to begin with. But why don't you just sell me the fucking house?

You didn't give me my dream house, but you're trying to give me my dream wife? Yeah, in the house. I truly never thought that would happen, that I would try to buy a house. They'd not sell it to me and then try to set me up with the person who they sold the house to. My real estate agent called me and was like, hey, I don't know if this sounds weird or this is normal for you, but just so you know. Yeah, you can come over, go on dates with her, be upset that it's not your house and it's hers.

So house hunting is going great. I'm going to leave here and check out another house. But hopefully, you know, we'll see. So thanks for all your positive. The next house is your house So thanks for all your positive vibes out there. Speaking of positive vibes, I think we have a fun and interesting episode today. I have been fascinated by this whole kind of Karen culture, these Karen videos out there. I didn't even know what it meant. And I wanted to talk about it.

videos out there. I didn't even know what it meant. And I wanted to talk about it. And I thought, I wanted to find the right person to have a conversation with this about. And I thought Sarah Colonna would be perfect. It's the first time I met Sarah in person. I'm a fan of her work. She is a very talented and successful comedian. She's friends with, good friends with Fortune Feimster and Heather McDonald, who have both been on this podcast. You might recognize her from Chelsea Lately. She is on Insatiable on Netflix. She's on Shameless. She might even play some Karen characters,

if you will. And so we just have a fun discussion about Karen culture. Maybe times we've been at guilty of at risk of being karens what does it mean to be a karen and we're sorry karens the the people actually named karen um so anyways it's just uh kind of a fun uh hopefully informative um discussion about karen culture if you maybe you aren't maybe you don't even know what the fuck we're talking i think everyone knows i still can't believe you're just like hip to the karen game now it's been like

three months i didn't realize it was like a thing i i my guess is the people listening i'm not alone in that that in 2019 they they they didn't know what it meant to say karen what we're calling someone a karen meant And now it's my new favorite thing to watch the quote unquote Karens go down. Instead of watching the news, I've taken up to like Karen's social media. I just don't get why people have to be shitty to other humans.

You know, what is that? I don't know. Anyways, we discuss it with uh sarah colonna uh very talented again comedian author actor uh anything else chrissy before we uh get right to it no uh well like this episode it's fun well let's get to it don't forget don't forget to send your questions at ask nickickatcastme.com for our Ask Nick episodes. Check us out, obviously, on Monday for We Solve the World's Problems. And I think that's about it. Without further ado, all things Karen with Sarah Colonna.

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the promo code SHO. That's T-R-Y-I-N-D-I-G-L-O-W.com and use promo code SHOW, S-H-O-W. Sarah, how's it going? It's good. How are you? I'm doing well. Thanks for coming in. Thanks for having me. I was very excited. Thanks for being my first guest back in the studio post-quarantine. Yeah, well, it's kind of nice to actually be in person doing something. I quite enjoyed my 45-minute commute here just because it was like something to do.

You were going somewhere? I was going somewhere. I know. I had to put on jeans today. I was like, oh my God, I'm going to a place. somewhere i know i had to put on jeans today i was like oh my god i'm going to a place i i last night i went to bed looking forward to like driving somewhere and having something to do it's true leave my house and you guys did it very it's like it's all safe all masks until you sit down and we're far apart you know sanitize the shit out of everything um for covet not just because of me right well it's about 50 more for me um i still i've realized i i do bite my nails um i don't know why nervous habit i've my whole life but i am uh if you can see oh they're growing because you don't want to put

your hand not only that but they're like they're like they you would never know you have nice hands right yeah i've gotten really good at that but i don't have any overgrown cuticle looking situation i don't know maybe but i've i've realized since corona that is a i know he's new as a disgusting hammock i've really now people just tell you now it's really i mean now like shaking hands is well the other day i was i went up with my friend at the beach and his girlfriend i'm like you know what i'll get out let's go to the beach the three of us you know keep our distance we live in venice and then all his friends showed up and i was about to leave and everyone's just like wanting to introduce himself and shake their hand and i'm just like i'm never going to talk to you people again and

i don't want to be a dick but i was like why are we why are we shaking hands yeah didn't you guys get the memo i was a little shaking hands it was a little that made me a little uncomfortable where like there's definitely a fuck it mentality there is and i mean it's it's hard because like i've never met you before i'm a fan of yours i didn't tell you that before when you messaged me but i got very excited um and i so i'm like oh i don't we, you know, we did a fist bump because that's what you do now. You have to be respectful of the other person's space. Like you can't just go in.

Someone tried to go in for a hug for me recently. And I was like, what planet are you on? I know. You can't do that. It felt weird. Like the first time I met, well, first time I met you, 10 minutes ago when we met in person and I threw out the fist bump. I got to be honest, I've never done that to introduce myself to a woman, to throw out

a fist bump. It's the way. And then I immediately sanitized my hands after. I was just like, oh my God, I don't know where she's been. Yeah. Fair. Well, I thought you would be great to have this conversation. I've really been fascinated by the Karen culture, if you will.

Yes. I didn't even know it existed a month ago. I didn't know what it was. And I got to say, right now, my favorite guilty pleasure is watching, quote unquote, Karens go down on the internet. I mean, I will, I'm with you. I'll spend a good hour and a half every morning just watching these videos. And, and then I'll read the comments on Twitter as like Twitter tries to identify who they are. And it's like, it's fast. It's's real fast people find people very quickly um and it's just it's

just a kind of a fascinating discussion because i think there's a lot of angles to this discussion as a straight white male i'm like do i even have this discussion is it how we're we're living in a time where we're trying to break down uh and lumping groups of people into a category. And yet here you have this kind of term Karen to identify a more or less of a behavior, I look at it, rather than a type of person. Oh, definitely. It's a behavior. Yeah.

Because I feel, I really do feel bad for the people named Karen that are not Karen. That's the first question, right? So for all, just, you know, all the Karens listening right now, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Totally. Yeah. uh vial yeah right i i didn't realize my last name was a thing until i had my first girlfriend and then she made me aware of the fact that it was less than appealing and i was just like oh vile uh oh i didn't even ever i never put that together neither did i yeah and then i became really self-conscious about and then i go on tv and I was the villain at first. So then people had fun with that, be like, of course, the vile villain. And I was like, well, it's not vile, it's vile. And it was just, I got very self-conscious about my name. So I get that.

Imagine being a Karen right now. I get that. I know. And there's some, I know some really wonderful Karens and I'm like, sorry about your name being abused, but it's just the perfect name for some reason. It just became the right way to describe someone. I was reading up on it last night, and apparently it was like a top 10 name for about a decade in the late 60s, the early 70s. Okay. It has fallen off the cliff for a lot of reasons right you know definitely not

going to happen there's not going to be any after this never canceled name yeah i mean it could like the way it's going now like it could be right up there with adolf right i mean who right now in the year 2020 having a baby girl throwing out names goes i know karen and no one in their family is like hey just a heads up that's not gonna be it go with a kate anything else with a k yeah you know there's especially if like their last name starts with the k and they want to do this kind of what's it called the double i don't know yeah what is that called i don't know what it's called what is it called chrissy do you know anyways you know like i know what you mean Victor Viall yeah like that would have been that just sounds like a creepy guy it kind of does um anyways I I'm just I'm fascinated

by it and um do you know how long has this been around do you know well I do feel like it's made like I'm like you it's I guess it's been around for a bit but I think over the past few months it seems like 2020 is when karen's really truly picked off um you know and like i said it sucks to be a a nice person named karen and it just does it just fits though it you know but then i see it a lot with the um they compare it to like the kate goslin like they use her face which i saw that. Yeah. There's something about her cut that made her Karen. Well, that was my question when I saw that was, did she do something on the show? Or did she do something in life after the show where she demonstrated that behavior?

Yeah, I don't know. Or is it just because she got kind of a very unattractive haircut? I think it was just about the haircut and they decided that's like a Karen. Oh, well, that sucks. I think, but I could be wrong. I mean, maybe there was something she did that's very Karen-esque. So for those of you who don't know, the definition of a Karen and kind of the urban dictionary, if you will, is it kind of started with a meme. Karen is a middle-aged white woman with an asymmetrical bob. So specific to the haircut haircut i don't know if i i feel like it's

more broader than having a haircut asking to speak you know someone who like will ask to speak for a manager uh a sense of entitlement uh generally ignorant uh lately it seems to be people who uh demonstrate behaviors of racism yeah uh stereotyping groups of people they don't like to seem to wear a central park karen right the central park karen right uh the whose name was amy amy yeah so lately it's it seems to be definitely more uh on it seems to be has politicized and i always kind, I'm cautious about doing this on the show with any group because I got to say, thinking about what Karen means, the behavior, I'm pretty sure I know some Karens, quote unquote, who would identify as liberal.

Yes. Right? Yeah. Yeah, I definitely think it's more, I mean, lately, we've just seen the examples, like you said, but I definitely think it's more like, you know, the person who had to wait two minutes too long for her food. Sort of that's where it came from, right? Like, I think anyway, sort of the people that just, like it says, want to speak to the manager right away. Do you have a favorite Karen video out there recently i mean amy cooper the dog the birder was that was hard to be my favorite just because it truly was sad no it was sad and you and like

what could have happened to to somebody by calling the police on you know yeah well we've seen this with and what taylor yeah and the way she said actually like i'm gonna say that there's a african-american man so that it was it's hard to call that a favorite it's more just like that was just yeah that was eye-opening yeah um what is going on and this past month that's what i some for better not for worse and i guess for better in the sense that we are becoming more aware it's just you're just seeing it more like will smith had a tweet out there like racism isn't like coming out of the woods you're just being recorded there's a lot more videos videos and now you're seeing that we have taken this for granted

that it's not happening and people just um they keep just talking right into the camp they know they're being filmed what is it the woman that uh that one that the skincare company and she went going off on the guy for putting in chalk on his own home. Oh, yes. Lives matter. And she was like doing this. Yeah. Yeah. It was real creepy.

And she knew she was being recorded. She just kept going. And she was saying, I know who lives there, but he actually did live there. He lived there. So I was just like, why once that, I think there's something about the quote unquote Karen that once the, the film starts rolling, they're just get more defiant. And you're like,

don't you know this, how this is going to end? Haven't you seen social media and what happens? Well, that's an interesting question. It's really blown up in the past few weeks. Yeah. Right. But yet there's an Instagram account.

I'll call it like Karen's gone wild. Yes. Which is very enjoyable. A new favorite fall. I did. past few weeks yeah right but yet they there's an instagram account i'm calling like karen's gone wild yes which is very enjoyable my new favorite fall i did influence it's right after influencers gone wild which i i don't know if you follow that one i haven't followed it but i've heard of it it's quite enjoyable it's just you know someone trying to take a photo in the ocean and getting knocked out by a wave or you know they end up fine so it's so but it's wonderful um but i will say my favorite one recently um as far as although i feel a little bad for this woman because i think she was just having a bad day but i don't know if you guys saw officer karen or the woman um i did see that it was it was confusing the egg mcmuffin and it was confusing because i kept waiting for something

to have happened that upset her. And really, it was just that she had to wait. She had to wait. And when they brought the coffee, she was like, oh, I guess you must be poisoning my... I don't know. I don't mean to brag, but I worked at a fast food place. My first job was at McDonald's. Thank you.

I worked at Hardee's. We're rivals. Hardee's. Yeah. Which I didn't realize was Carl's Jr. now. I just thought Hardee's went away. It didn't used to be, Nick. Okay. It used to be its own thing. But. Which I didn't realize was Carl's Jr. now. I just thought Hardys went away. It didn't used to be, Nick. Okay.

It used to be its own thing. But apparently it didn't do great and then Carl's Jr. had to buy it out. But yeah, you know from working

in a fast food restaurant sometimes you do have to ask people to pull forward and wait for their food and it does not mean you're putting razor blades in their eggnog muffins.

Sure. And you're right. That one was I have a brother who's a cop. Yes. And yeah, I'm all for the reform. Things need to be corrected. There's not a doubt in my mind, but I empathize with-

The stress. The stress. Yes. And certainly the many great polic men and women out there. And I understand the stress. No, I do too. And that's why I was like, okay, I'm thinking now. I was like, oh, you'll just feel bad for her.

She's under so much stress, but don't make the video. The Karen aspect of it is the lack of self-awareness that making the video. Don't post it. Yeah. This whole five- epic like lead up this like and you're watching it well like whoa what i was like somebody did something awful to this officer i'm gonna feel bad for her and then it turned out she just uh she just they told her i've you know how many times i've had to pull forward and wait yeah and then have them screw it up yeah five

different times before they've gotten it right and then do you complain complain, though, when they screw up your fast food order? Or do you just eat it because it's almost like a happy accident because you got someone else's taco or whatever? Well, here's what I do. Because we talked about a big barometer for identifying a Karen, men or women. Because men can be Karens. The Chads. Okay, Chad. You go with Chad.

I was thinking Todd. Todd. I think Chad. Yeah, Chad is. You're right right have you ever met a chad that well i actually have met some good chads but i've met a lot of bad it's like 50 50 why i don't know the phenomenon of like there i've known a lot of shitty chads i don't know wait there was there yeah there's this yes yes yes even in bachelor nation one of the worst kind of humans in the from the show he was a chad yeah um and maybe that's where it came from yeah being a child i uh i i know some good i loathe

mayonnaise loathe okay i can't stand it and so i just i can't i can't eat it i just won't i will like have a gag reflex so if someone were were to- Something's wrong with you. Yeah. That's just one of many. If I were to say, I used to always order Big Macs. I can't eat McDonald's now just because I had a bad experience and I just can't do it anymore. But I used to always get Big Macs without the special sauce. Right.

And if they would put it on, I'm always like, because I have this annoyance with mayonnaise and people put mayonnaise in everything and then they put it on and the weights, I'm always like, because I have this annoyance with mayonnaise and people put mayonnaise and everything and then they put it on and the weights, I'm always just like, Hey, listen, I know I'm the pain in the ass here. I want to apologize in advance, but is there any chance? Like I'm really cautious. I mean, you asked for it that way. So it's fair to ask. I'm like, Hey, I know I'm annoying. I'm one of those like annoying people who ask it for on the side. I get it. I am so sorry.

But can you please? You're like the opposite of a Chad. You're just like, I'm so sorry that I'm asking you to fix something that I asked for in the first place. But I do that too. It's from working in restaurants. That and I also don't want them to spit on my food and I'm not trying to give them a reason to.

And also, if you work in the service industry just because you asked and i wrote it down and i put the order in correctly doesn't mean the kitchen got it right right i would always blame the kitchen even if i was the one that you always yeah you always blame the kitchen she's like oh yeah sorry gosh those guys again and i'm like oh crazy i forgot about that i would totally do that but um i'm always i yeah, I'm more fascinated about the behavior of the Karen. And I'm wondering if it's going to change. Where does a sense of entitlement come from? We had Tyler Merritt on a podcast the other week, and we've talked a lot about privilege,

right? Obviously, with these times. And even myself, I think there's a really, in a positive way, been a kind of a reflection period for a lot of white people of like, man, even though I complain a lot and I complain, I have my like stress days where I'm like, oh, fuck, this sucks, man. I'm just having to, it's just like, wow, I've never had to deal with that. You know, Tyler coming on and telling the story about like having to worry about making himself look smaller around old white women so he doesn't scare the shit out of them right i'm just like i've never thought of that and wow what a terrible stress to have to deal with day in and day out and yet we still find our ability to make a big deal about small things yeah i mean i'm definitely guilty of having sent like an email

you know like you know usually it's on like usually i'm trying guilty of having sent like an email you know like in a you know usually it's on like usually i'm trying to think of what i've ever sent one about i feel like it's usually has something to do with flying you know but i try to do it nicely because like whatever but i'll you know complain about like i've done that before i mean i know that i've done it like i can't think of a specific time but i know that i'm guilty of it it's a being we've all and now i never want to do it we all of us been karens at some point yeah no one is karen free right right of of having a moment where you're pissed and you feel wronged and when you look back and go i probably made a bigger deal about that than i should have yeah i'll tell you what my armpits are fresh.

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Guaranteed. I think especially at the sort of, before Twitter turned into whatever it is now, I feel like there was a lot of anyone who had a decent following would complain about something to try to get the company to respond to them, right? I've tweeted about my airline experience before. Does that make me a Karen? No, I mean, I've done it too. I don't know if it makes us Karen so much as maybe just people who took a moment to complain. Like you said, like you're just in a, and you're taking a second and you're complaining

and then you're like, did I really need to complain about that? I'm thinking out loud here, but my justification has been, there's nothing that makes me more mad is when someone tells me they can't help me when I know they just don't want to. Yeah. And like the airline industry seems notorious for like apologizing for things they have the power to fix, but they're just like, nah, it's a numbers game. Right. Yeah. Fuck you. Yeah. Like you still flew and you'll fly again. You're going to have to fly what are you gonna do walk yeah no that's very true all the airlines are like let's just agree to be equally terrible right

and therefore you know there's no airline that doesn't have a terrible airline experience absolutely from their customers and there are times when you're like am i complaining about something that was worth it? You know, when I've taken to Twitter to do because I've definitely done that, too. I'm like, was it worth it for me to complain about that? But if it's something outrageous, obviously, there's a different space for that. But sometimes I've definitely felt like, oh, man, maybe I was just being a brat. I was probably just being a brat.

I have not yet. I've never tweeted about an airline without people suggesting that I'm a bit entitled. That's and I'm like, fair. Yeah. Your character on Insatiable could be a Karen. I think she could be a Karen. Yeah, a drunk Karen. Have you had any Karen moments on the show? I mean, I've seen it, but I don't know. I haven't seen all of your parts.

I would say, I'm trying to think not really um yeah i'm sure i feel like she would definitely she also though like works at a fast food place and is basically um if someone tried to be a karen to her she would just ruin that person yeah yeah yeah she would just care in the back she wouldn't listen and they're like your character on shameless would probably be the same way oh yeah oh yeah she i feel like this character I play on Shameless, again, in a fast food restaurant, I feel very stereotyped right now. I'm realizing I just only work in fast food places on shows. Well, you've really been pigeonholed.

You're not a typecast. You're the manager. And I play the manager. So if someone wanted to speak to her, I feel like she would just basically be like, you can leave, you know, which I think me personally, if I was a manager, that's, it wouldn't be great for anybody, because I would probably lose my job quickly. Because if someone complained to me, I'd just be like, okay, that's it. Like, I don't think I'd help resolve the situation. I don't think I'd be friendly about it. I just think I'd be kind of like, all right, sorry, you didn't like it. What do you want us to do? Well, if I were, I'd just be like, what do you want to make? I don't care enough to not try to solve your problem because I don't want to fight with you. Right.

Yeah. It's kind of like, okay. I think the biggest place where you find the most amount of karens is facebook yes um even my uh group of friends back home there are lots of of karens not in karens and i like in the mom town facebook i don't think they would like you know again when i say karens certainly that i don't know of any any of them to be racist or would you know knowing when i say karen's certainly that i don't know of any of them to be racist or would you know knowingly call the cops on a person of color you're talking about the like but like complain about a small thing yeah they go on it's always like those cryptic long messages

and it's just like i just want to say something and for all the real people it's finally it's good to know who my real friends are and it's's just like, what the fuck are you talking? And you know, they're talking about like one person. And they want that person to see it on Facebook. On Facebook. Yes. And that,

you know, and they want that person to be like, Oh my God, who is she talking about? And then she, and she just want, and you do, they just want someone.

And then they want everyone to comment and say like, I, you're amazing. I love you. I love you. And it's just like, why do you got to put that out there? There should be a Karen book. Like instead of Facebook, there should just be,

yeah, Karen book. Like they should all have to go. They should be banned from Facebook and they should all have to just go and complain to each other. If I'm trying to understand or just like empathize with the Karen in terms of like, all right, why did you have this moment? Yeah. I mean, like in some cases i'm like does it come out of boredom you know what i mean like you just don't have anything else 100 going on did you see that one video with the girl uh getting coffee who was called out for not wearing a mask and then started coughing on people yes yeah that was my favorite. That's my winner. Because one, she didn't realize she was getting

videotaped and you saw the look on her face when she looked at the camera. And then also, that's the one where I really looked at and I thought to myself, here's this seemingly younger person. Because it's never okay to be ignorant or racist but like when you see like a karen video of this much older woman you're just like well maybe she just doesn't know better right you know like she's just not gonna change she's just not you know like 60 years of being around a tight community and there's just ignorance all over the place but uh a woman who's in her early 20s living in, say, New York, who you would think a lot of progress is around her,

and then she does that. What caused her to feel such rage and pride? Because someone's like, hey, do you mind wearing a mask? Yeah, and it's just being polite. It's just taking care. It's not that big of a deal. You put it on, you can take it off the minute you get out of the store and you're not around anybody.

But I would say you're right about that being the favorite i had kind of forgotten about it because even with like the officer one we talked about earlier there's a way you can go okay she's under a lot of stress she just had a breakdown yeah you know lapse in judgment certainly like not self-aware right but you you understood maybe there's some sort of sympathy with like she's there's a lot going on yeah But with this, that lady, there's no, there's no sympathy because what, why, why would you go start coughing at people in their faces during the, in the middle of a pandemic? Aggressively. I don't get that. When, when, when the pandemic first came out and I understand, no, I don't like to be called out. Everyone has pride. I was, I live in Venice.

It was much, it was early. It was pride. I was, I live in Venice. It was early. It was like, it was a time where it was like, hey, masks don't help you. Do they do help you? I was confused. What's the protocol here? Well, at the beginning, it was confusing.

They didn't tell us. They're like, you know, like, ah, well, it doesn't really help. But, you know, just wear it anyways. So early on, I didn't have a mask on. I'm at Whole Foods and some lady calls me out. And I'll be honest, it irritated me. Yeah. I just walked away. Yeah, you didn't go cough in her face? I didn't say a mask on. I'm at Whole Foods and some lady calls me out. And I'll be honest, it irritated me. I just walked away. Yeah, you didn't go cough in her face? I didn't say anything to her. I was just like, hey, cool, you know, fine. But what,

and don't get me wrong, it annoyed me that she did that. But there's a way to walk away from something and then think about it. Just minding your own business, right? Like the lady in Central Park, like just minding your own business, it seems to be a lot of people's problems. Like, okay, when you're when you when we're in the middle of this stuff, and you need to say to someone, hey, would you please just put a mask on at a store? That's, that's fine. Like that's being safe. But I saw at the very beginning of this, I was at the grocery store. And we had there, nothing had been locked down yet, but they were sort of, you know, it was coming. Like we all knew it was coming here in Los Angeles. And this woman was buying a lot of cleaning products, but nothing with Lysol. She was buying like Pledge and Windex.

Saw some signs of hoarding. Yeah. Windex and saw some signs of hoarding. She, yeah. So this other woman in the aisle sees her doing that and, and says, you know,

and it wasn't even, it was like maybe three bottles of pledge and a couple, you know, and so this woman in the aisle gets in her face and she's like, you are hoarding. They're telling us not to hoard. And she goes, um, no,

I'm not. It's, it's fine. And she's like, you're hoarding. They telling us not to hoard. Can't you see the sign? It says to,

you know, sanitizers per, per household. And she's like, this is pledge. I'm not hoarding. And she was trying to like, just get away from her and the woman wouldn't let it go. And finally the woman looked at her and she goes, I'm a housekeeper. This is what I buy. I'm a housekeeper. This is my job. I have to. And I started laughing because I was like, if you just would have minded your own business or the minute she said, you know, and so I started laughing and the mean woman looked at me because I was laughing.

And then I just ran. I don't like to get involved. I just run like a wimp. I laugh in their faces and then I just run. So they don't say anything mean to me. Under your breath. Yeah. There are definitely some busy body people.

It's just like, why did you need to do that? But on the flip side, actually Amy Cooper, it was, she got called out. Same with the coffee shop gal. No, you're right.

Yeah. It's this idea that how dare you correct me? Right. I am certain Amy Cooper has not minded her own business, though, in life. Oh, no, totally. You watch that video and go, she has definitely nitpicked people. like getting called out for not having your dog on a leash wasn't that what it was yeah and in fact she was wrong and that's right and that's something where you just have to go oh you're right i am supposed to have my dog and put it on you know sorry about that move on

and you know um so you're right it is sometimes the being in someone's business is that you're trying to correct them from doing something that could harm someone else or they're breaking flat out rules. But sometimes it's just like the busy body on the other sense that can be that Karen thing. You don't need to look at what's in my grocery cart. Don't worry about it. We're fine. I got pledged. That's not going it's not gonna hurt you

i'm trying how can we prevent karens from being karens going forward um well it doesn't seem like posting them on social media is stopping anybody yeah it seems to be just sort of this blind rage of like in different you know just like i can just say what i want and you're gonna record me fine put it up there um but then they lose you know some of them lose their jobs um especially when it's obviously in a a racist situation as they should um so i don't know how to stop them though i don't know well that's the thing too it's because like we're kind of bouncing back and forth between the behavior of saying well we've all had our moment or i've had my chad moment you've had your karen moment right and then there's the people who are truly you know i don't have a problem saying like amy despicable human being in terms of like i you watch these videos and you

think why is it so like hard for you to be a good, like, is it that hard to be like a decent human being? Like what happened to you that caused you to be this way? To use your, to say, like literally use your whiteness to say, I'm going to call the cops and say,

yeah. And that's, and as far as that, there's like, I don't know if, if what we can do, right. There's certain people, you've seen, we're in these extraordinary times, and I do think sometimes it can be scary, and there's been some unfortunate situations. But overall, I do think that there's a lot of good that's come from this recently. And that's what I mean, like the Black Lives Matter is becoming a mainstream thing. Like the average, even my quote unquote conservative friends are like, oh yeah, it just means Black Lives Matter. Cool. No problem.

I know. Like it's not a terrorist organization type of thing. That's a positive thing. It is positive. And it's taken a while to get there, but I'll say same as you, like, I grew up in Arkansas. So I have a very, a lot of conservative friends and family. And one of the, I mean, I like one of the greatest things I've seen was someone I know well, who didn't understand it before. You know, not that I hate the circumstances that made it happen that where she had understand it. But she, it clicked with her. And I was just like, okay, if people are, you know, this is, at least it's something. At least it's changed.

Definitely. It's even meant a lot on this podcast or even on my social where you, certainly you put stuff out there and you're getting a lot of noise of trolls trying to just write things to even deliberately make you mad. But there's been a couple people who said you know what it's stuck this time i get what you're saying now yeah understand it and it's just like yeah it sucks that it's taken this long but a lot of a lot of times it's just come like listen when i first time i heard uh black lives matter just echoed i think you know i think i've said this before. Someone said it was kind of this radical organization. And it was like, oh, I didn't realize that.

And we believe things that we just kind of hear out in the open. And if you are surrounded by people who have a narrow frame of mind, that's how these things get passed along. They do. And I think hopefully people learning, you really have to dig deeper, you have to find out for yourself what it means, like anything, because you can't just take it for face value, because someone said, well, that's what this is, because then you go, well, that's not how I understood it. And then all of a sudden, you're learning on your own. And I think sometimes people get, and maybe even from the Karen standpoint, change is scary. I think people, they see change happening and it's, it is a scary feeling for people

in terms of what they're seeing out there. And that's the realization that you could have been wrong for so long. Right. Right. Yeah. And like you're subconscious of being like, wow, I think, you know, let's say someone heard Black Lives Matter as a reference point. And then you actually got in a debate with someone and you said to them, well, I don't

think you should, I think all lives matter or something. And you fought with your friend. Right. And then five years later, you're like, wait, I don't, I get it now. But you don't want to admit it out loud because you realize that you have said these things. And I think that people's psychology, it's just like people sometimes are so resistant to change because what does it say about you as a person? It is hard for people to admit they're wrong. But like the one way to fix that for

people would be to go like, oh, it's actually, it's great to grow and to admit you're wrong. Like I've been wrong so many times and i can i have no well you know ego about saying it and that's why i try to on my like on this it's just like i keep saying i have not always thought this way i have been wrong i have um just through a product of my environment said things that like i realize that we're not okay to say, or we're ignorant in nature, you know? And I think that's,

as long as you keep growing, it's, it's a, it's a, it's a positive thing, but. And for, I mean, maybe for Karen's one first step they could take is like,

I've, I've even done it for myself. Like if you're about to fire off that email that maybe isn't worth like your laptop, that's broken, fire off an email, talk to someone, you know,

but something over, you know, a food thing or, you know, just something, maybe you just go either way today. Does it really matter so much the next day? And if it really still matters to you that much,

I guess, go ahead. But if you're about to scream and say, or like if the words out of your mouth are about to go, how dare you? Chances are you're at risk of being a Karen. That's true. That's it. You should start like a whole, you might be a Karen if.

Yeah. Because really, if you say, how dare you? I mean, yeah. Like what is anything that happens to you you could not like how dare you yeah i that's it's very um it's very entitled soap opera how dare you yeah but yet people say that a lot they do and it just seems like something that should be held for like movie scripts i'm like yeah i i said that to you yeah how dare you i'm so offended i mean if you're white and straight and you say the words i'm offended yeah buddy it's a chance especially if you're a guy i mean yeah i i don't know if what i've said like what

i could what could i possibly be offended about i'm trying to think if any of ever said how dare you to anyone i feel like i can't have because it doesn't even sound like words that would guys can say things to women that are offensive don't get me wrong so they yeah but yeah i guess i would use different words when i when someone says something like that to me uh you're a pig like f off yeah fuck you i'm offended um but like yeah i think is when we feel offended there's a good chance that we should just our pride takes over again Again, I remember that grocery store when the lady called me out for not having a mask on. Yeah. And I didn't like it. No, you're wrong. But just. But you walked away. You breathe. And I think we just have those

moments because you're right. It's really can be embarrassing when you realize that I overreacted. Yeah. I mean, we've all had our definite moments of overreacting and there it doesn't feel good you know even if it's just in like a private situation like with your relationship or something and you're just like oh sorry you know i mean i'm like sorry i threw the printer last night because it wouldn't work like but at least you do it in the privacy of your own home and then feel shame about it have you read not that i've ever done that guys uh and there is also some truth too and i mean kind of going back to the like like being like the Amy Cooper being called up for something she was doing wrong. When I've had when I've gotten the most offensive, it's when I'm being again, like even by friends, other things. I remember times where it was like.

They're definitely not totally wrong. Right. You're like, you can't prove it. And I'm going to fight this. But like, I mean, I've had fights with friends about like, you can't prove it. And I'm going to fight this. But like, I mean, I've had fights with friends about like, I mean, stupid, like video games about like, we used to have this Madden draft and we and I got accused of trying to convince another player to take a different player because I wanted this player. And I got accused for it. I just fucking went off on him. And I'm just, how fucking dare you accuse me?

What the fuck? And I'm like, in the back of my mind, I'm thinking like, I mean, yeah, kind of a little. Yeah, but you went full Chad. I just went full Chad out. Yeah, but that's like, it makes you feel better. And he was like one of my best friends, you know. But that can be forgiven, you know.

Yeah, and I didn't say anything like, I didn't accuse him or, well, I definitely accused him of being wrong. And you're like, I was totally doing that. I didn't make threats or whatever, but thank God it wasn't videotaped. But it is funny how when you're wrong, how, you know, with somebody close, especially, that you can just be like, I'm not backing down. I'm just going to say, you are attacking me and you are so mean. Yeah, you are so mean. How dare you?

You gaslight the shit out of them it's like and the whole time you're like they are so right yeah like i'm like i can't wait for this to be over so i don't have to quit acting like i'm mad even though he's totally right halfway through the argument you're like oh fuck am i like oh uh but yeah we i think it's just don't just take a moment i think to take a moment is the probably the biggest part and that can probably apply to so many people on it just in different ways in your life like you know before you fight with a loved one or a friend or before you get defensive about your madden thing uh you know that you can just take a moment and be like okay all right is this worth it you know and then maybe you won't end up all over twitter with you know i've uh listen and

recently even like i've especially with these times i have responded to people that i've been like you know i don't i don't know if you follow people in bachelor nation but uh oh i do you know garrett you know his recent blue lives matter post yeah and so uh i responded you know politely but you could tell i was like critical but like i wasn't going off it was more like well are you what are you saying this are you saying that right but i definitely believe that when it comes to fighting with the internet there's a zero like it it never works out there's a there's a no-win situation and so like yeah like the current like if you're going to put out your frustration on the internet yeah that's a you just have to know that you're not going to end um

not changing anyone's mind you're not changing anyone's mind you're not going to feel good so for me i'm trying to focus on like the things, like I said, where someone I know back home has finally realized certain things that she, you know, was defensive about before. And, um, you know, and the people that are finally understanding, like, Hey, you know, I think I saw it best when I saw someone say like the black lives matter. Like when you say that, um um boston you know the awful bombing happened in boston and it was boston strong nobody went well what about philadelphia strong yeah like it's just a great analogy yeah and it's like okay you know or people are like

fuck cancer you're like well what about hiv yeah it's like no you can you can just you go help the one thing that needs the help right now and the focus. Well, that's the thing. You're resistant to it. And that's literally a great example of you know what they're saying and you just, for whatever reason, want to fight it. For what reason? Let's talk about the reason that makes you uncomfortable with this saying, okay, I get it. And strangers, you're not going to win with. Yeah.

I get it. And strangers, you're not going to win with. So it's almost like take the points with the people that you know and you can actually try to have a good conversation with. Because fighting on the internet, even though I still do it sometimes. Yeah, we're all human. Yeah. I mean, it does it. But it never makes you feel good. And it just makes you more mad and angry at the world.

And then you're like, well, now I'm upset. you know, and angry at the world. And then you're like, well, now I'm in a, now I'm upset. Like, now I'm in a shitty place all day because I fought with somebody named, you know, with like no profile photo and like. And again, a great thing to combat Karen-ness or Chad-ness is as silly as it sounds, not silly. Are just like acts of random acts of kindness too.

Think about like the Karen videos of the woman, like standing in a parking spot to save it and and like just sitting on people's cars because they're trying to save it or you know next time let someone you know you got to that parking spot first and you see someone you're at a standoff and you're just trying to fight for that spot let them in instead of being a care and just be like no problem yeah this might take me five more minutes to find a spot but it's not worth it yeah not worth it yeah uh if you gotta walk like and I've had those moments where you just you just feel that road rage where just like you will always

feel better when you like take a moment and go I'm gonna let this person have this even though I want it yeah instead of like doing the Karen moment that you're going to get enraged and angered, feel shitty in that moment. Like playing chicken with them to get into that spot. And you're going to, first of all, you're going to work yourself up. You're going to get anxiety. You're going to feel rage and mad. And you're going to say things.

And afterwards, you will be embarrassed, whether it was videotaped or not, about like having done that. Instead, just go, I'm just gonna do this for this person. And you will end up feeling much better about yourself. That's true. Giving, it goes back for like opening the door for someone when you're in a rush, especially when you're in a rush,

especially when you're feeling impatient, especially when like you feel like dismissed by whatever. It's like giving other people attention. It's always a great way to combat that stuff. And the opening door thing is like, it's so, I do it all the time. It's just habit. And I can't, I can't tell you what it does. Like, it's the weirdest thing to me when someone just like lets a door close in your face when you're right behind them. It's just such a weird, dismissive sort of like, oh, I guess I'll just go. I've caught myself a couple of times where I have been in a rush. I go in and then I don't think and like the door has like slammed and it'll be like this

nice old woman i'm like i'll stop like oh god i'm so sorry we didn't realize someone's behind you yeah but i've done it yeah it's just like holy shit i have one thing to ask you if this is a karen thing because i need to know if i need to correct my behavior um when someone parks thing because i need to know if i need to correct my behavior um when someone parks like a complete asshole takes up like parking spots i have been known to leave like a you park like an asshole note on their window and then i run so they don't know who left it uh i don't know if i don't think that's a is that a karen thing is it a psychotic thing do i need to let it go it's a little bit above like an ocd thing it's an ocd Yeah, that's probably it too. First of all, that person is being an asshole. Right.

Are you not minding your own business? Well, listen, I'm going to say no because then I'm totally a Karen. Because especially the people listening, I call out people all the time. Yeah. Especially on this podcast, Bachelor Nation people, they say and do things. I've addressed it. We've talked about it yeah i've been critical of people i think in this case you had the best intentions right i don't

know what you wrote it usually just says you park like an asshole that's exactly what i write like word for word yeah yeah yeah but you didn't call the manager of the store to have them come out to tell the guy that That's true. No, that's true. I just left him a passive aggressive note. And by the way, never. They're probably still parking like that to this day. All of them.

I'm not changing anyone's mind, but it just feels good. I don't think it is because let's talk like the coffee, Karen. Was the girl wrong by saying, hey, you should be wearing a mask? No, not at all. She was correct. Yeah. You know? So listen, it was the lady wrong who called me out at the Whole Foods.

I mean, she's kind of annoying, but technically I should have been. Right. I think it's just the people who react in the sense of entitlement and those when they're called out. Obviously, these situations where, you know, from the, the, the racist things were like that,

that one story where this woman saw a group of black people barbecuing and called the cops on them. Yeah. And it was like, this is illegal. When you like are accusing people of crimes, are you familiar with the Stassi Schroeder story, the Vanderpump Rules stuff going on?

So I know about it, obviously. I know she got fired. She called the cops on a co-worker. Yeah, someone from the show. Yeah. Who was black. And tried to accuse her of a crime. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, that's just fucked up. It's fucked up. And people have debated like, well, it had nothing to do. I don't care who she called the cops on. That's fucked up. Right. To accuse someone of a crime.

And not like jaywalking. A real crime. Yeah. Now you add to the element of... What was the crime? I don't know enough about this. I think theft of some sort. Oh, Jesus.

Okay. Right? And then you add to it, it came out in a climate where brianna taylor was murdered in her home yeah who you know serving a warrant and like went on they they basically tried to arrest the wrong person the wrong house yeah went to the wrong house and killed someone that adds that element of the climate that we're in but regardless yeah it's a bad idea to be, it's like, where does, where does that even search your mind to begin with to do something like that?

But then to, like you said, to add to it, especially like the Amy Cooper situation, like you wouldn't, once you're getting police involved in something you don't know, you know, unless it's a real, if someone's breaking into your house, call the cops, right? Like if you're at home and someone's breaking it, call the cops. You know, like if there's reasons to actually call the cops right like if you're at home and someone's breaking it call the cops if so you know like if there's reasons to actually call the cops um yeah but is stassi a karen or is that just being a bad person it feels like it's just being an asshole i mean that's what it sounds like

um i i feel like she could be a karen though yeah probably i mean was it i don't want to make you explain the story to me because i know i should know it better because i've heard but was that like it was actually a crime that happened and she just said oh my co-worker i don't want i bet it doesn't make much in 2018 i'm not trying to by the way i'm not at all giving her any um uh getting her off on like well she went on Bitch Bible, which I had her on my podcast, which... Oh, doesn't this ex-con girls... She went on a podcast to brag about it. So that's the thing. It wasn't even a lapse of judgment.

That's what makes her kind of like terrible. Yeah. Is that here she had this catty moment. She called the cops on this girl she knew didn't commit a crime. Well, that's the... I mean, it's inexcusable to call the cops on someone you knew didn't commit a crime well that's the i mean i that it is inexcusable to call the cops on someone you know didn't commit a crime period like a real no here's a crime and then and then goes on this podcast and bragged about this story and then try to keep it going it was like oh we should also like if you're out there just you know

you should you know yeah she's still out there just, you know, you should, you know, yeah. She's still out there. It was like, it was, so she's just an asshole. She sucks. Yeah. I think probably think she's somehow being funny.

I mean, I don't, that's not the excuse, but like, I don't know if her in her mind, if that's what I'm doing. Like, Oh,

you guys, I'm just stoking these fires. I'm just stirring up. It's like, no, this is a, this is a crime and you, it's a crime to false, falsely'm just stirring up drama. It's like, no, this is a crime. And it's a crime to falsely accuse someone of a crime.

Like, that's, I don't know. Especially knowing that if you were. Yeah, maybe she is a full-on Karen. Like a real mean one. I mean, I was on her podcast, Stassi's, years ago. And she was nice to me at the time. But you hear these stories that she's can be rather cruel right to people yeah in this situation yeah i don't know yeah there's almost like this uh like mean girls grow

up to be karen's maybe yeah well did the the some people have been trying to identify where karen came from and main girls the movie was one one of the apparently moments where it was identified as like a Karen or did they call someone Karen Chrissy? What was it? Yeah. Oh, wait, hold on.

I'll play the video for you. She asked Katie, if you're from Africa, then why are you white? And the other girl says, you can't just Karen. You can't just ask people if they're white. That started it. That's probably it. And that's and that's like like yeah there's like people say that that's kind of like

the start of the karen movement can't just ask people if they're white karen well listen i i always try to put some sort of spin on uh how can we learn from from this i feel like we would cover this and address this trap in a hopefully positive way. But listen, if you have these moments in your life where you feel stressed, anxious, you're running late or whatever, chances are, as Chris Rock would say, just let it slide. If you can let it slide, you'll be... take that deep breath take a deep breath you're not going to care uh as much as you do in the moment five minutes later you're not and if you still do a few days later then maybe you need to talk to someone you know if it's a small thing

and you're still i will do that i'll work myself up about that or i will write something and then like you know 20 minutes go by. I'm like, I don't give a shit. Yeah. It's not going to matter to me. I know. And it's funny how, you know, and sometimes and maybe even that's another thing you can do if you're like, if people are in that in that mental state and wanting to, you know, go off about something like write it down and look at it later and go, oh, okay. Before you hit send, you know, take another look at it, like treat it like you're writing an ex-boyfriend or an ex-girlfriend.

And did you really want to say all that? Okay, maybe you didn't. And just, and then you can just delete that. Not that it's always emails. Obviously, a lot of these people don't have time to delete it because they get right in people's faces on camera. But walk away first. If you think you're at risk of being a Karen, just a couple best practices.

One, avoid making yourself a big deal on your birthdays let people like always let someone go in front of you in line at a starbucks like oh were you here first no problem i know like even if you're like oh you you were in front of me or like at a grocery store when you're like waiting for like the the meat person or like or the deli person it's no it's nothing to you i don't even know if i was first but please go ahead yeah it's nothing to you to just let it's nothing to you and it's a great opportunity to never avoid being in like again real random acts of kindness go a long way to avoid karenness that's true i mean if you think about the woman that coughed in people's faces in that coffee shop but she just would have turned around and walked out. Or just say, you know what?

You're right. I'm sorry. Yeah. Wow. Imagine that. Imagine that. I still am trying to, I would, I mean, I would love to talk to that girl and be like,

just what were you thinking in that moment? What were you feeling? Did she ever, was there like an interview with her? I don't know if she probably just went to a dark place yeah because i like the amy cooper came out and tried to she sort of sort of tried to apologize but it didn't come out well no at all and that's not i mean i'm not worried about the statement i want like even in like not on a podcast but if i and she would never be like, but I just want to sit down and go. What was going through your head? Tell me what was going through your head in that moment.

Yeah. What were you feeling? Was it rage? Was it embarrassment? Was it pride? Like, what was it? Yeah. Like, I want to be her therapist.

Yeah. In that moment to find out what drove you to do that. Yeah. And you almost had, like, did something happen to you that morning? Yeah. That just. Just. Set you off.

Set you into some crazy. Yeah. happened to you that morning yeah that just just set you into some crazy yeah um and also to the you know to the people out there named karen i'm sorry that you're going through this moment yeah we know there's some really wonderful karen wonderful karen's out because most of the people who are karen's aren't named karen no in fact i don't know if any of them are none of them are named karen yeah i have a someone that follows me on Twitter had sent me a photo of her aunt Karen marching in Black Lives Matter rally, you know, protest. And she had a big sign up that said, Karen's for BLM. And I was like, there we go.

Well, Sarah, thank you for coming. Can we spend a few minutes talking about you being a New York Times bestselling author? Oh, gosh, we sure can. I mean, why not? Yeah. What to share with the audience about your your your writing? I so I've written two books. And my first one. I mean, the titles are life as I blow it. And has anyone seen my pants? They're obviously not very serious books so if anyone's looking for some quarantine reading uh you know I'm proud of them um fun books with some heart I definitely think um and yeah my uh first one was number five on the New York Times bestseller list which was very exciting um so are they are they like fictional stories or what? No, they're, they're nonfiction.

They're just, um, I mean, I don't want to say like a memoir because I'm not like a person that should have a memoir. Uh, but just, you know, as a comedian and someone that has like, you know, worked in writing and, and really loves to write, I, um, I just was like, oh, I can, uh, well, back when I used to be on Chelsea Lately, which was on E!, a book agent reached out to me and he was like, I just think you're funny and you have this great, you know, sense of humor and voice. And let's see, do you want to write a book? And I'd always wanted to, but I just didn't know how to go about it. So someone championed me to

do it, which was awesome. And there's just stories about like my first ones, like I grew up in Arkansas, I'm moving to Los Angeles and it's just sort of like fumbling my way through my twenties and stuff. And then my second book, um, has anyone seen my pants is a little more adult about like being in my thirties and newly single. And then I met my husband halfway through writing it and that kind of made the whole book a little different. So yeah, it came out and a lot of people would read it and then like immediately said they would go to my social media to make sure I was still with the person that the book ended with because I was like, who knows what's going to happen. But so there are true stories and, you know, I hopefully relatable to people. It was my main

thing. I just want to write something for people to, you know, relate to. relatable to people. It was my main thing. I just want to write something for people to, you know, relate to. Well, Sarah, I really appreciate you,

you coming on. It's been a fun topic to talk about. Anything else you want to plug while you're here? Just, you know what? Standup comedy will soon come back. Or maybe it won't. I don't know,

but dates will be on my website when they are. We'll make sure to. And, and where can, on social? At Sarah Colonna1, C-O-L-L-O-N-N-A with two N's, on Instagram, because someone got there first. God damn it.

Yeah. Did we try to get it? No. You don't care that much? No. I'm like, now it's just on there. It's fine. And Sarah Colonna on Twitter.

All right. Well, people, thank you for listening. I hope you enjoyed this topical conversation about Karen. Don't be a Karen. Sarah Colonna on Twitter. All right. Uh, well people, thank you for listening. Um, I hope you enjoyed this topical conversation about Karen. Don't be a Karen. Don't be a Karen. And Karens, we are,

you're probably, you know, I quite honestly, I would, it's probably safe to say that the Karens of the world out there, the actual ones named Karen are probably very delightful and very like hypersensitive. Oh,

totally. Like every Karen in the world is just like, don't be a bitch. Don't like, don't't be rude even about something they like have the right yeah they have the right to be upset about like well i don't like please no like i'll just like everyone like uh you know everyone gets a slice of the cake before they do until the cake's gone yeah no please just whatever my car it's just run into my car just it's fine it's just a big dent okay my insurance will cover it it's's totally fine. Fine. Yeah. Listen,

let it slide people. The world will be at a better place. If you just, that's good advice. Try to take a breath and, you know, but if you are calling a call, call center,

call back. Yes. Yeah. Definitely call back. Otherwise they'll, they'll, they'll screw you up. Thanks for listening.

Don't forget to send in your questions at ask Nick at cast me.com cast with a k for our ask nick episodes on on mondays and we will see you next time