The Viall Files - E145 Ask Nick - Open-mindedness with Kaitlynn Carter

Episode Date: June 29, 2020

On this episode of Ask Nick we are joined by host of The Bright Side podcast & television personality Kaitlynn Carter. Kaitlynn and Nick really jump into it when it comes to dating rumors, bi-sexuality, being on reality tv, trust, honesty, and falling in love, all before we talk to our callers this week. They then speak to a woman who is struggling in her interracial relationship with her boyfriend who is becoming a police officer, someone who sexts for money, likes it, and wants to make sure she communicates it properly to the next person she dates, and a quarantine dater who is trying to navigate through all the issues the current world is presenting while she explores a new relationship.  “If you are going to be judgemental of me you're not the fit for me.” Don't forget to send your sex and relationship questions to [e-mail]. THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: LIQUID IV: liquidiv.com CODE: VIALL BEST FIENDS: bestfiends.com Episode Socials:  Viall Files @viallfiles Nick Viall @nickviall Krissy Lindquist @thekrissylindquist Kaitlynn Carter @kaitlynn See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

you're crazy what's going on everybody happy monday welcome to another episode of the vile files we got a great episode today and a special guest to help us with our ask nick the one and only caitlin carter how are you thanks for. Thank you for having me. We just got done answering some questions, and you were a great, what is it, support person? Great co-host for the episode. What do I call him?

I don't know, guest? No, I was impressed by your answers. A guest would work. You were also great. So I thought it would just be great to have you on on i know you're doing a lot of great things you have a new podcast out yourself i do um why don't you tell us about that quickly okay um i i listen to it it's good i know thank you i don't i do i should i not say that? Like, oh, no, it's good. Surprisingly good. Here's the thing about podcasts.

There's so many, everyone's dropping. You appreciate the ones where you're like, I would listen to that. Okay, well, thank you. I finished an episode. That's great. That's really good feedback, actually, because I have no idea what I'm doing. You know, I actually hadn't even really listened

to all that many podcasts before I launched mine. But what essentially happened was one of my best friends works for a production company. And she approached me to – she's like, I think that you have some interesting perspective and insight on things. And I also think the way you tend to think is really positive. And I think there's some way that we could create a podcast. And I – you know, at the time, I was actually right in the middle of, you know, I'd just been through a couple of breakups, actually. And I was sort of at a point in my life where, I don't know, I was just trying to really be optimistic and positive about what was, you know, where I was going to be going forward from there. And I realized that

that's just sort of the way that I think in general is like, I like to really think on the bright side of things. And so we were talking, we were having a conversation about that one day and we were like, that's kind of a cute idea for a show to just create a show where it's 30 minutes of positivity. You know, like everybody, whoever listens gets something happy and positive out of it and bring guests on who have a similar mindset and way of thinking. So we created my show, The Bright Side. And I just try to bring people on there who I find inspiring, who I think have something positive to share with the world

and who I think that my listeners will just get to enjoy 30 minutes of, you know, like we're in COVID times and there's a lot of negativity in the world. And I think that it's just good to have 30 minutes of nothing but positivity. Yeah. What I liked about it, you do this segment of taking topics that might be naturally seen as negative and try to see if you can put a positive spin on it. I enjoyed that. been on it. I enjoyed that because I only bring that up because

there's a difference between trying to find the bright side of things without being annoyingly positive. The people are just like, oh my god, it's like amazing. But it's more an objective like, okay, let's look at the other side of it. It's about being realistic while

also just trying to find the good in difficult situations because I do sincerely believe that there is always some kind of silver lining to any situation. And I'm a big believer in not having regrets for that exact same reason. Because I think that no matter how difficult a circumstance or a situation in life can be, there's always a reason that that happened. I think that always one way or another, it plays out in a good way ultimately. And so even if something is really hard at the time, I think I would never take anything back because I think that's, you know, how you grow and how I am where I am today.

And I think that people, not everybody thinks that way, of course. And so I just thought if I could in any way inspire someone to feel like if they're going through something hard, they can end up in a better place, ultimately, that that would be a good thing to be putting out there. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And I'm assuming a lot of it came from your willingness to be, as you said, so open about your experiences. Yeah, I think honesty and transparency is so important in, I mean, every aspect of life. But of course, when you're creating a show also, I feel like why even, I mean, you're the same way on your show. You're just very straightforward and honest with your thoughts and opinions. And I think that it's sort of pointless to have guests on a show or even do a show in the

first place if you're not just going to be willing to put it all out there and be real and be transparent so people can connect with you. Like we're real people, you know, and the people who are listening are real people. And the odds are that whatever it is you're talking about, even if it seems strange or too personal or private to you, there's probably someone out there who's going through the same thing. And from my experience, I think sharing with as much honesty as I can has always been the thing that resonates most with other people. For sure. So yeah, I just thought, you know, I wrote a piece for Elle magazine back in the fall about my experience in dating throughout my life. And it was also about sexuality because I, for the first time in my life, dated a woman. And I was kind of coming out the other end of it. And

it was really cathartic to write this piece for me. It was good. I read it. Thank you. But I think that when I put that out, the response was so overwhelmingly positive and just so many people who wrote me thank you notes for writing it. And that was never, I didn't, honestly, I truly wrote it because it was cathartic. Like I didn't realize that it was going to have an effect necessarily on anyone else. But in hearing back from so many people that it helped them in one way or another, it made me realize that maybe I do have things that I should be putting out there and sharing with the world that other people would be able to was that the first time that wasn't the first

time you've talked publicly about a relationship and that was your relationship with with Miley and then you've also like had a public relationship before right yes yeah I mean I was married sure yeah I don't know I don't know how much you know or don't know. I know enough. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. That was also, I guess you would consider it a public relationship. Yeah. Right. Right.

Yeah. I mean, it's on TV. Put it this way. If I heard about it without watching The Hills, then it's definitely because like I knew you from the peripheral in that relationship. And it's funny because the more I've learned about you and get to know you, I feel like there's a lot of similarities in the sense of,

and I'm curious, you've been on a reality TV show. You've done a lot of things. Background, you're very intelligent. It's obvious with talking to you and things that you do but also you're like myself um very known for relationships or your public relationship how did for me that's something i constantly battle with people it's easy to make a lot of assumptions about people uh who are best known for reality TV and dating. Do you find that same kind of thing where you're out there letting people know, that's not the only thing about me?

Yeah, I mean, absolutely. And that was another thing. That was when my friend who got me to, you know, she works for the production company that's making my podcast. That's what she said. She's like, you've always been attached to someone else and you're known for your relationships and you're known for dating and you have so much more to you that no one really knows about. And I think it's important that you kind of stand on your own two feet and do

this. And she was absolutely right. It does become so frustrating when every time you do an interview or every time you're involved in any project whatsoever, whatever comes out of it is always attached to your dating life. Because, of course, that's just a very small aspect of who I am as a person. And, yeah, I think it is a little bit of a struggle always to try to push, you know, like any other project that I'm working on without leaning on anything related to dating. Because it's an easy thing to do, right? If I wanted to sit around and talk about my relationships all day, I could probably drum

up as much press as I wanted to, but that's not, you know, how I want to live my life. I want to be able to have other projects. And so this podcast, that's another thing I've really been working to discuss other stuff. You know, I had those two, the two women on the other day to discuss Black Lives Matter. And each guest that I have on the show today, actually, my friend Maddie Noyes, who's a singer-songwriter, I just really try to talk to them more about what they've got going on

and ways, of course, that we can tie that into the theme of the podcast, which is positivity and optimism. But yeah, it's been a good way to kind of redirect maybe. Sure. Hopefully. It is a balance too, because I definitely deal with that where it's just like, ugh.

And I've almost become too cautious where I don't want to share. Yeah. But then here I have a podcast, we talk about relationships. Also, I mean, how do you, I mean, I'm sure you definitely would have thoughts on this. I think that what I've really realized

is like now with dating, I'm super private about it. That's the other thing. So on the flip side, if we are going to talk about dating, which here we are again. But yeah, I mean, since last fall, I just, once that whole kind of situation came to a wrap, I was like, that's the last time I'm doing a public thing. You know, I just want it to be as private as it can be. I mean, it's unavoidable that at times it won't be private. Sure. But I'm assuming even when you were dating Miley, the intention

wasn't for it to be public. It just... Right. By its nature. By the nature it was going to get out there. Yeah, for sure. And I mean, I think we actually did work pretty hard to keep it as private as we could, but it is what it is. But I think that it's so hard to go through a breakup in the public eye too. You know, it's like you're navigating things that you... You don't say.

I mean, I don't know if you guys heard about it, but... Sources say, well, who the fuck are these people? Dude, it's so rough. But, you know, I think there's also a lot to be gained and learned from that. And yeah, so now I'm just super, super private. Do you, for someone who most of her life dated men and then fell in love with a woman, dated her, I have a good friend, Demi Burnett, who I was publicly, you know,

on The Bachelor in Paradise, dated a woman, got engaged, but had mostly dated men. Yeah. Then she got out of that relationship, dated a guy. Do you now feel any pressure or people, you know, for someone who is bisexual to have to justify what sex you currently are or not dating and does that make sense a little bit only because well i don't okay i don't put that pressure on myself i think whoever i want to date is who i'm going to date

um and honestly it's been kind of interesting to just find who i am attracted to like that that one of the callers we had earlier, I was like, she's really cute, you know? And like, if that's, if that's who it is,

you know what I mean? That I date. Shoot your shot, Caitlin. I know. Well, I didn't, I know I should have,

huh? We could probably, I'm sure we've got our information. We could probably make this work. No, but you know what? I think that it's just like, it is what it is.

I do feel that there's this sort of attitude in general that when someone just dates a woman one time like maybe it was just an experiment and maybe they're not like people i think that's what i mean in terms of like people labeling you and i find that pretty frustrating um because truly i just i don't even i don't think that the labels are what matters as i wrote in that article i think it's more just about who you're – you just – you can't help who you're attracted to. So I don't know. I don't put any pressure on myself. I do think it would be kind of fun to explore that side of myself more because I think that a relationship with a woman is so different than a relationship with a man. It's just a very different dynamic.

And so I think that it would be cool to have another experience where I, you know, just to try it out again. But then again, at the same time, whoever I meet is whoever I meet. If I meet a man first that I want to be with long term, I'm not going to put that off because I want to try dating a woman. Sure. You said before we started recording that you haven't dated for fun most of your life. Well, I just don't have fun dating. Well, it's interesting you say that because I think a lot of people relate to you when it comes to that. And I'm trying to change that mindset.

For me? No, for people. I'm like, be who you are, Caitlin. I don't. I'm here today to make you like dating. Yeah, but we, a lot of people, like people say that all the time. Oh, I hate dating. Well, okay.

I think, first of all, I don't love meeting new people in general. Oh, at all? I'm just a little bit more reserved. Yeah, I don't know. I kind of have my group of friends, I don't love meeting new people in general. Oh, at all? I'm just a little bit more reserved. Yeah, I don't know. I kind of have my group of friends and I... I get that for sure. Like I don't love small talk. I feel awkward and kind of shy.

Same, yeah. So of course I meet new people that sometimes I just have great chemistry with and it's easy and that's great. But so with dating, I'll just not do it unless i happen to meet someone that where it really really all right off the bat click i totally get that and listen don't get me wrong there's always going to be awkward things about dating i'll even do that where it's just like oh she seems cute we've talked about going out and i'm just like

oh do i have it in me to get through that kind of- The first few days. That layer. Not even the first. Because I'm definitely, I can't have small talk. I just can't do it. Right. So for better or worse, on our first date, we're going to dive into some shit.

Because I can't, I don't, I'm not interested in like, okay, well, tell me a little bit about yourself. But I want to know what you think about life. But that's the thing is that you just have to go to that first date and what if the other person isn't good at anything besides small talk? And then you have to spend an hour of your time with someone that you just don't have any chemistry with. And like, to me, that's so awkward and I just hate it so much.

I know, but that part sucks. But it doesn't, don't, have you ever had fun? There is a fun getting in a know you. But have you ever had fun? There is a fun getting to know you process. Have I ever had fun? Let me finish my thought. And getting to know, like everyone in relationship, especially if they've been in a relationship for a long time, they're just like, I just miss the excitement of the first few.

And I think sometimes we forget about that is all I'm saying. So when you are single discovering the new thing and you're discovering the new when you do find someone you're having that fun connection with for sure when it like when it clicks it really clicks but that's what i'm saying for me i i feel like i'm so all or nothing like it ends up being i'm either super into the person i'm like it's on or it's just like, no, thank you. I don't want anything to do with it. I am absolutely obsessed with liquid IV. No joke. Listen, we talk about drinking a lot of water and hydration on this show, but the truth is I like flavor. I do. I like flavor in all sorts of life. What's your favorite flavor? Well, with Liquid IV, easily the lemon lime. But my point is, before Liquid IV, because I wanted flavor, I would drink a lot of juices

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That's friends without the R. Best Fiends. So, yeah, I struggle with that a little bit. I struggle with, like, the dating part where it's like you're still casual and you're having fun. Although, I feel like I've been getting better at it just because now I think having done so much work on myself, and this is going to sound so cliche, but I think I've spent so much time being single and on my own and going to therapy and really trying

to be super happy and good just by myself that I have gotten to that point where now when I'm dating, I care a little bit less or I invest a little bit less like right off the bat. I'm just kind of like, okay, well, whatever. If this doesn't work out, I'm fine. Yeah. You know? Yeah.

We do anything. We do that or we apply all this pressure on ourselves. It's like, this has got to work or it's like, or not, you know? It's like, probably just going to watch Netflix and then anyways, you know? What would I be doing anyway you know yeah I've I've talked about before

I've almost become too laissez faire where I have a hard time investing in anyone anymore yeah well okay because obviously you were on The Bachelor and that the intention there was to become engaged to someone at the end.

Sure, yeah. Right? Do you still feel like that when you're dating? Like you want to date someone who you're trying to find someone you want to marry? Well, ultimately, for sure, yes. I just have a hard time knowing how to do that. What I mean by that is I can connect with people.

I've met a lot of great women. But it's like, well, you know, when you're younger, it's like, I'm excited. We,

I mean, I love you. Like, is it crazy? Should we get married now? Or I don't like, you're all I can think about. But see,

I'm such a romantic like that. And that's kind of the thing that I've had to dial back because I am. That's exactly right. Like if I start to fall in love with someone, I'm like, this is it. And I just want to do everything so fast. And I think as you get older and you have these experiences,

you realize that that's just not the smart thing to do. You really have to get to know someone. You really need to take your time. People aren't just saying that it's actually important to do that. have to get to know someone you really need to take your time people aren't just saying that it's actually important to do that um so yeah so the bachelor for me was uh it's very much like that and so it brings that and since i certainly have that romantic part in me it brings it out um i have one thing i've always wanted to ask about The Bachelor. And so since you're here, I'm going to flip this interview. Is it like when you're dating that many women at one time,

isn't there one that you're like this? Like I definitely am the most into this one. Yeah, 100%. In fact, that's almost how it always is. Because I don't know how you act like. It's very challenging. I would think that would be so hard. Imagine. because that's what it's like in real life imagine being the bachelorette being as particular in a great way that you are about the people you like and don't like but having not

the luxury of just getting rid of being honest with them and then uh it's a little easier like there's like it's hard to be the bachelorette for you know it's a sexist kind of by nature it's a bit sexist the show and and there's a lot of pressures on the bachelorette as the bachelor it's challenging because you just don't want to be a dick you just yeah you don't want to hurt anyone you don't want to hurt anyone's feelings and you're just like i don't i'm not into her i don't i don't like she's great she's beautiful i'm just, I don't want to make out with another person tonight. I'm like, ugh.

Right. Well, and I can think, I think like you said, you're so particular and that's how I am. And I'm telling you, you could put me in a room with 50 people and I would maybe find one that I wasn't, yeah. That's normal. That's more normal.

Okay. But yeah, for me, I just, after The Bachelor, it kind of, they've replayed Caitlin's season, Caitlin Bristow a couple weeks ago. And watching it back, I said, was good for me because I have become a little – a big criticism I get from women I date is they have a hard time getting stuff out of me. I'm a bit closed off. Really?

Yeah. Oh, see, I feel – I mean, I've known you for so long since an hour ago i feel like you're quite open there's a well being emotional is different from just there's a difference between i bring them in by like by by being honest about myself and my past and like this is who i am i have no problem saying that it's like hey listen i can't tell people who i am on my podcast i might as well tell you we're we're dating but when it talks about when when it when it comes to that point where we're progressing as a relationship at dating i have a i'm very reluctant to open up and emote are you actually emotionally unavailable though or are you just not communicating i'm

probably i'm just not i'm a a really, I don't know how, my biggest fear with relationship is I don't know if I'm, I don't know if I'm going to be able to tell if I'm in love. Have you ever been in love? Well, for sure. Okay. And I don't, like all the people I've said, I love you too, even on the show. I meant it.

I don't take it back. Right. But just the no, I haven't been able to get there in a long time that, I haven't been able to get there in a long time that is i haven't been able to get there in a very long time especially if you if it it didn't come from a controlled environment like the bachelor so that is a fear i have of like how do i you both like have like an issue with like people like coming up to you and like do you automatically like have a closed off thing because you both are like you both are in the public eye so do you when you meet somebody do you automatically like question their intentions before you just kind of like no i don't and i

don't and people have told me that i should be like more a little more concerned than i am but i feel like a balancing act yeah i i generally don't i know my facial recognition has gotten worse because i'm generally can be aloof and then like not pay attention and then you meet people It's a balancing act. Yeah. I generally don't. I know my facial recognition has gotten worse. I generally can be aloof and then not pay attention, and then you meet people, and then you're just like, have I met you? Someone you've dated? No, not dated.

No. Well, that's good at least. Not dated. No. That would be pretty bad. Date. Went on a date. See, I have the opposite fear of you that I'm like, I just fall in love

way too much, way too fast. So I'm trying to like calm down. I'm the opposite where I'm just like, I'll go with that. Oh, I really like you. You're cool. Let's talk. Let's get to know each other. You don't think you make an effort to intentionally stay distanced because you're scared that

you'll fall in love with someone and that you'll be, I mean, have you been really hurt in a breakup before? For sure. And I definitely acknowledge that fear. I just, it's honestly more the opposite with me is that, you know, I see a lot of, I know I've been let on before, and I know women have that fear. And I will say it's, you know, having gone on the show, I don't ever want to make promises I can't live up to.

And so, you know, it's just like, well, he said this and now it changed his mind, which is everyone has a right to. But I've been I'm very cautious about like leading people on. I had a crazy I had a crazy dating experience like in this past winter. Yeah. I don't know if we would go as far as to call it a relationship. But I had a thing. I had a crazy dating experience like in this past winter. Yeah, I don't know if we would go as far as to call it a relationship. You had a thing. I had a thing. And it was with this guy and he was super romantic. And he's like a musician, an artist, you know.

So he was like really, really romantic. And actually Becca Tilly is the one who introduced us. Really? You know, we go to church together and he's so sweet. He's so romantic's such a softy he falls in love so fast and um so we dated for a couple probably two months but like a well yeah maybe a month and a half two months um and he sort of started getting like a little flaky like a month in and kind of you know disappeared and then came back and was like i'm really sorry and i and you know so it was i kind of, you know, disappeared and then came back and was like, I'm really sorry. And, you know, so it was, I kind of could tell that there was something strange going on in the

first place. So I was sort of trying to keep some distance there, like not let myself do what I usually do, which is just dive head first in right away. But he, when he came back around, we were like hanging out again, trying to keep things more casual. And then one night he was over at my house and he told me that he loved me. And I said, I don't think you do. I don't think it's possible. We haven't been seeing each other that long. I don't know.

I didn't say this to him, but I just kind of was like. This is what you're thinking? Yeah. I'm like, oh, that's really nice. I'm trying to think. I'm like, well, I'm not in love with him, so I can't say. And I was like, I don't know. Maybe you don't. And he goes, no, I'm like, oh, that's really nice. You know, and I'm trying to think. I'm like, well, I'm not in love with him, so I can't say. And then he goes, and I was like, I don't know. Maybe you don't.

And he goes, no, I'm in love with you. So again, I just try to be really sweet and polite about it. Then this was a few days before Christmas of last year. And then he literally just never talked to me again after that. Like just went home for Christmas, never said Merry Christmas to me, never spoke to me again and then like three weeks later he was dating some other girl and was like you know so that sounds like a guy who's not really in touch with his um emotions bizarre right sure but people do bizarre

things all the time people this was like my intro back into dating by the way i was like i am never dating anyone ever again people say things uh they don't mean i get that's for me what you were saying i'm i'm i'm overly cautious about that um i think you should be i don't think you should be going around telling people you love them unless you love them part of it too is i always struggled in relationships whether it was on The Bachelor or in life, and for the relationships where they ended it, especially my first one, we broke up and got back together a bunch of times, I would fucking hang on to the things that they said,

like a fucking disease, and ruminate and over-process about like, but they said this to me, you know? And I just couldn't get over it. And I would just obsess over the things they said to me. But I think you are probably like how I am. I don't say anything to someone unless I mean it. Like everything I'm saying, I mean it.

Very much so. So if you're like that, then you expect everyone else is going to be like that too. So when they tell you something like, I love you, you assume that that's real. Yeah. And so I've become incredibly cautious about what I say to people

to the point where I don't give them probably, I probably feel a little bit stronger than I make. I'm just very uncomfortable with ever. Well, it's kind of nice. You're like protecting them a little bit by not saying. Yeah, but I also, you know, like we talk about in today's episode, it's just like, you know, things can change. You know, they can't.

What do you want me to say? And I get very caught like, you know, I had, you know, girls say this or men say this too. It's like, I don't want you to waste my time. It's like, I don't know what to tell you, man. Like, I don't, I want to date you. What do you want me to do? Sign a contract that I'm never going to like, we're going to realize we're not compatible.

Right. I've gotten, I get extra cautious about that. I've become more cautious in my public life. I think also one thing I've learned is really that it's about paying attention to someone's behavior and the amount of time that they're spending with you and the things they're doing and not just what they're saying.

Because people do love to just say things. Yeah. And guys, I think, are more guilty of that, of just being like, I love you. That's how I feel right now. I don't feel like women do that as much. No. I have to be pretty in love by the time i'm gonna say it you know yeah and pretty deep i think uh i'll be on yeah and as a guy i mean there are plenty of times where i'll be i'll be dating someone and in that moment i want to be like i fucking love you you know

fuck you know and i don't fucking say you. You know, fuck, you know? And I don't fucking say it because for those reasons. Why? Well, because I know. Because I don't know how I'm going to feel tomorrow. Yeah. You know? Really, do you fall in love and out of love that easily?

Keep in mind, again, there's a moment, you know? Yeah. You're in love with the moment. Literally. Not so in love with the person. When uh not in love not so in love with the person when when caitlin broke up with me on the season her whole like she was you know she was like no but i i do love you i'm like you're breaking up with me stop telling me you love me and she was just like but i felt those things in the moment and i literally was like what i felt for you is greater than a moment being like i know i'm going to fucking say it because in that moment,

I'm just feeling so much for you. And I don't know if that's the moment I'm in or it's how I actually feel about you from a holistic standpoint. You're good. You're bad. You're not just the moment we're in. And so I'm very cautious about that. Yeah.

Too cautious. Yeah. I think that it's, that's sort of something i've been trying to with the person that i've been seeing recently i'm trying to do that take it really slow and make sure that everything's actually really kind of in place before i'm even letting myself think like that yeah because yeah i do i do feel like moments of like yeah i fucking wow you're fucking great i fucking love, it's true. You sometimes look at someone and you just think,

God, I do love you. But then, yeah, okay, I get what you're saying. And then like a week later, they're like, why are you being distant? I'm like,

oh. Oh, you did it again. Because you're annoying. Isn't that the worst when someone you really like starts getting annoying? You're like, no, not again. But know? Isn't that the worst when someone you really like starts getting annoying? You're like, no, not again.

But listen, that's the thing in relationship is, you know, you have to realize that as always, that's inevitable. It's working through that. Yeah. And. That's kind of how I've always decided that I really want to be with someone is when I just never find, I can be with them all the time and I never find them annoying. Like, it's not even so much about, am I like so in love with with them i don't know if that's possible uh-oh really well i just

think realistically you've never dated someone that you've always been annoyed by the person you've dated at some point well i know you said you're dating someone right yeah but at the same time you haven't i mean what i'm saying is we're both generally kind of single. Yeah, yeah. We're not boyfriend and girlfriend. My point of saying that is like, well, it hasn't worked out yet for us. And so, yes. Have I ever dated someone that something about them didn't annoy me?

Of course not. And I think that's normal. I think that's okay to say. This idea, I don't ever want to get annoyed with someone. Good luck with that. I think getting annoyed and then being so much of being like, I don't ever want to get annoyed with someone. Good luck with that. You know? Yeah. I think getting annoyed and then being so much of being like, I still love you.

I still work through it and understanding them and then not being annoyed later on. I think what I'm, I think what I'm referring to as annoyed though is like something about them. I just don't even, I'm so turned off by that. I'm like over them all together. The core. Yeah. Who they are.

Yeah. Not like they're chewing. No. Like it's something that makes me be like, I don't want anything to do with you. Yeah. Versus, you know, we're having an argument and you're annoying me because you're not seeing my point of view. Yeah.

You know what I mean? Yeah. I hear that more from women where they'll just go from, they'll just be like, no, I can't anymore. You disgust me. Yeah. I hear that more from women where they'll just go from, they'll just be like, no, I can't anymore. You disgust me. Yeah. I don't think guys are like that. That happens to me.

No, yeah. I've had women friends tell me that with other guys. It's like, I don't know, just one day. Just like one day. Just like. Just did something. Ew. Yeah.

Ew. That was the last cabinet door you left open i always like for me though and i've said that like oh god i oh every time i date someone it's like oh i just love this about you and except that about you i'm like i can be super fucking obnoxious like i don't just like a heads up you know you know you're like but i also skate so there's that oh yeah wait i saw some i saw a video i'm an excellent roller skater oh by the way this was another funny thing some random person keeps writing on my instagram that you and i should date like they on every single post that i put up they'll comment and it's the it's the same person every time i don't know who

it is it's just like some random person and And they're like, you should be dating Nick. And they just do it on every post. I haven't had an eligible woman on here who's kind of single that someone doesn't have been like, oh, my God. You guys would be so cute together. Thanks. Yeah, but it's weird because you and I have never. It's in the Bachelor hot gas. People are really just, they just need me to settle down, you know?

Yeah. Well I think it's just funny that that was happening because we're actually in no way connected until now doing this episode. Yeah. Well reality TV. Pretty random. Yeah. Yeah. And I'm the same way. Now they're going to ramp up those comments.

Oh yeah. Get ready. But I have been very proud. I have an active dating life. I've dated people for periods of time, you know, and I just don't talk about it. And I'm not as, like, lonely as I pretend. I can also be really fucking lonely, but I'm not, like – as far as my public life, it's, like, I've been generally utterly alone. Do you put, really? Do you try to, do you put yourself out?

Like, are you very open with the world about like your dating life? No. Oh, okay. You're pretty private. I don't bring people to weddings or red carpet events or whatever specifically. For that reason?

For that reason. Yeah, I'm careful about that would you do the bachelor again no no why uh well i mean i just mean like would you would you take it back oh do i no i don't regret it i don't regret it no i've met some great people have great experiences and everything i'm doing is kind of what do you do reality tv again i don't know what what and i would have a hard time being the subject yeah but there's not a world and like i can't say no but i i it's not my i don't have a burning desire yeah we um i sort of had this thing with because we're filming the second season of the hills right now how does that work with –

Well, we had to stop during the virus, but we actually are supposed to pick back up in two weeks. So we filmed the first three episodes right before coronavirus. And I just had this thing where I originally went on The Hills because I was with Brody and he was an original cast member on the show. So we decided to film because we thought it'd be nice for us to be able to spend more time together and you know we both through work were you know he was djing he's on the road all the time and i was on the road for work um so we're like we'll shoot this

film and then when or the show together and then um after we split up i was like i don't want to be on this show sure um but i couldn't get out of it. And I'm like, God, I like what for whatever reason, contractually, I just needed to come back and film the second season. And so I just tried to really embrace it. I'm like, you know what, I'm so lucky that I get paid very well to go film a show with a bunch of people I know and just like have fun, essentially. So now and it's so different being single on a reality show. Because you know, before single on a reality show because before when I'm married to him, you're kind of representing two people there. And so you have a responsibility to the person that you're with.

Now I just represent myself. I'm not responsible to anyone. So I've been really embracing it and having so much more fun this time around. So I feel like my attitude about it has changed so drastically. I mean, for better or worse, I'm good at reality TV. Because I'm just honest.

Why don't you come on the hills? I'm just like, this is why I'm good. We need to cast me a new boyfriend for the hills. You'd be perfect. It's just, I remember my first time on the show. I was very cautious.

I was like, I don't know. And then like a day and I was like, fuck it. You want to know what I think? This is what I fucking think. And that was just, you know, I,

when you embrace that, it's the best. Yeah. That's, this is who I, it's just who I am. Well, Caitlin,

should we get to these questions? Oh yeah. Yeah. Let's do it. I can't wait. Before we get to, tell people where they can't wait. Uh, before we get to, um, uh,

tell people where they can find you. Um, um, you can find me at, at Caitlin on Instagram, which is just K A I T L Y N N. And my podcast is at the bright side and the episodes of the bright side are available anywhere.

You can listen to podcasts. Awesome. Well, uh, you guys should check it out. I know, uh, like I said,

I listen to it. It's really good. And, Well, you guys should check it out. I know, like I said, I listen to it. It's really good. And without further ado, let's get to our callers. How's it going? Hi, good. How are you guys? Great. Good. How can we help? My name is Elise and I'm 25.

So I am in kind of a rude situation with my relationship. Okay. So basically this kind of sparked due to everything that has been going on in the country as far as the protests and the Black Lives Matter stuff. So obviously I'm of color. I'm actually half black, Hispanic and half white. My boyfriend is white and is actually becoming a cop on Friday. becoming a cop on Friday. Okay.

So I've kind of been in a weird position where I don't feel as though I'm prepared for what is in store with the rest of this relationship because of everything going on. He and I have had conversations about this before. It's kind of hard to do so being that he has been in the academy and we don't get to talk every day um so you know the few conversations we've had have been super brief about what's going on um but for some reason we've never really had conversations about what it would be like to be not only in an interracial couple but also for me to be a strong activist towards, you know, Black Lives Matter and, you know, just equality in general. And he's very much has a lot of pride about what he's doing by becoming a cop. Sure.

Which I totally support him for. And he's a really good person. And I know that I wouldn't be with him if he was going into this field for the wrong reasons. But I can't help but hesitate what the future holds with that. You know, he's going into a system that, as we can all see, is kind of corrupt. And I think he doesn't really know how I feel as far as, you know, the other side about the fact that I'm not okay with what's going on and that I can't fully give my support to what's going on with the police. So I kind of feel like I'm on both sides where I want to be an activist for everything that's going on. But I also want

to be able to support my boyfriend and support the positive that can come out of the police. So let me let me ask you a question here. I totally understand the general awareness of what's going on and the interest in being an activist and the reluctance and concerns of your boyfriend, you know, becoming a cop given the times, but are there specific things you guys have talked about that have raised red flags?

Because the obvious counter argument to your overall general concern is this could be a great thing. Again, I've said I have a brother who's a cop. We need great cops. We need people to go in there and want to be allies and truly see people as equals and fight up for what is right and stand up against their peers if they see their peers doing something wrong. We need people like that. And we certainly need cops like that. But I'm curious, are there things he said to you where you have discussions where you go, I'm concerned by the influence you might be getting in the academy?

Yeah. Even before he went away to the academy, he's always been someone who will defend the police. He kind of would get really upset when people would already call him like, you know, oh, well, you suck because you're going to become a cop or calling him a pig or something. And he hadn't even started yet. So he's very, very quick to defend that, you know, not all cops are bad. quick to defend that, you know, not all cops are bad, but at the same time, his upbringing, his family, his background, you know, law enforcement all around, and it's kind of part of who he is. And I think in the past, when things like this have come up, when we talked about it, you know, he's been very quick to defend, you know, the police standpoint and not really looked into

why everybody's mad about what happened. Yeah, so do you feel like he just sort of has a blind loyalty to the police and that's the problem you're having? Yes, yes. And so actually, I think it was last week or two weeks ago, he went home from the academy for a couple of days and we had a two and a half hour conversation about all this. And I told him, you know, how I was feeling about it and how I felt like I totally get where he's coming from on his side. But I wasn't feeling like I was getting the same on my side. You know, does he really understand why people are out there protesting?

Does he really understand why I'm upset? You know, does he really understand why it doesn't look great to be saying things about the police when all this other stuff is going on? Sure. So I got positive responses from it. Like we were kind of on the same page with it, but for some reason I'm still having doubts. And I think it's because I don't know if he's just telling me this to say,

Hey, don't worry about it. I got you. I understand your side. Or if he really doesn't mean it. Well, the truth is you're probably not going to get a very clear cut answer. Certainly not here. And you're going to have to see how he responds. I've had conversations with my brother in the past, you know, month. I feel for him. It's not easy being his position. Everything that I say, you know, it's not like there is a discussion going on between and it's easy to feel defensive, I'm sure, as a police officer.

Yeah, I mean, if he's quick to getting defensive, that's something as a couple, you're going to have to continue to talk about. No matter what, in any relationship, you're always going to have, whether he's a police officer, like it doesn't really matter what your jobs are. You're always going to find points in time

where you don't agree on things. And maybe those are matters where you just kind of have to say, all right, everything else is so great in our relationship. And he is a good person and I'm a good person. We don't have to agree on absolutely everything. And maybe those are topics that you sort of avoid unless you really have to discuss them. Because if he's a good guy and he supports you and you support him, I think that's the most important thing. Yeah. How can I say this? It's one of those things,

I know you're trying to put yourself in his shoes and you almost feel like he's not doing the same for you. So I'm almost kind of, I'm going to like double down and tell you to put yourself in his shoes. But if his family is a long line of law enforcement and then it's his dream and then he's about to be a cop given this time, I can imagine the personal conflict and defensiveness he is feeling. Right? Right.

So what I'm saying is we've talked about this on this podcast before. talked about this on this podcast before. This is not like something people are going to talk about. Well, they might, but this is not something people should talk about for a week or post a black box for a few days and be like, all right, have we talked about it? Are we good? All right, let's just move on with our lives. This is an ongoing conversation. So what you need to know is that is your boyfriend, as he becomes a cop, as he starts going in there in the training, is he always willing to have a conversation with you about these things to check in? Where is he at? You ask him, how's it going? Do you see some of these things? As he keeps relating to you, what you want to be careful is, as a couple, you want to make sure you're not bringing in your energy of your frustrations you have with the world and society into the

relationship. And that's going to be a challenge, right? Because your boyfriend might be a cop, but he, you know, he doesn't represent every cop out there, you know, certainly not the bad ones. And so he needs to recognize that, you know, as someone who you are and who wants to be an advocate and ally to, you know, people of color, and you want to be kind of the bridge between, you know, someone like himself who's white and was a cop to understand not just your point of view, but other people's point of view. Because empathy is, I think, quite honestly, and I can even say this as a straight white guy, sometimes when I interact with law enforcement, I don't feel a lack of empathy from them. You know, it's just

more like, I'm a cop, you know, do what I want, you know, and sometimes I think people would appreciate that. And I can only imagine as a person of color, and that's what this whole, it's like, they feel very differently. Here I am as a straight white guy, and it's just like, and I'm just like, yeah, they can be dicks sometimes, you know, I can only, you know, so I think you have a unique position here to try to continue to have these conversations. As a couple, are you guys willing to almost like take turns of saying, all right, like you might say, hey, as a couple, can we sit down and watch the 13th on Netflix? I think it would be really interesting for us to watch together.

And he's like, okay, sure. And then maybe he brings you a source of material saying like, I'm not trying to change your mind. I just want to maybe share another perspective on what it's like from a law enforcement standpoint, because there is a lot of truth to the fact that I don't know what it's like to be a cop. Most of us don't. And there, for all the great police men and women out there, are very challenging situations that every day you pull someone over, you're putting yourself potentially at risk, you know, you don't know. And so, you know, is it, does he, again, it's not,

I don't think you guys should try to change each other's minds. It's about understanding each other's perspective and can you get to a place where you generally have at least a mutual respect for each other's thoughts? I think what's putting a lot of pressure on me too is i'm actually supposed to be moving to a completely different state for him um in a couple months and it's kind of scary like that i'm having all these questions right now and i'm supposed to be like we found an apartment it makes a lot more sense now why this is sure because even part of me i'm just like i don't know just figure it out as you go i know it sounds crazy because like we've only been together for two and a half months but like I'm just like, I don't know. Just figure it out as you go. If he has a big dick, break up. I know it sounds crazy because we've only been together for two and a half months, but

I mean... Wait, two and a half months or two and a half years? Two and a half years. Yeah. I'm like, all right, pump the brakes. To me, two and a half years isn't that long for me, especially because I've never been in like a real relationship before then there's nothing yes there's nothing wrong in terms of thinking

about marrying this guy and moving at 25 years old and dating him for that's totally fine and normal and yeah it's like a big transition coming up so what are you leaving behind in your current city like i guess what i'm saying is it's the worst case scenario is you move for this guy and it doesn't work out so what you know people have moved uh for relationships only to fall in love with the city or they don't and they move back you know um yeah it's not the end of the world i don't feel like whatever you decide you're not you know well yeah what what are you changing are you leaving your job yeah everything are you getting a new job i know it's a lot i'm just saying i'm not downplaying it but sometimes we make this mistake of of yeah i mean i think the adventure is part of the fun so that's yeah i was before all this like happened, like, I was so excited for June.

Because I was like, okay, like, perfect. Like, we're going to look at apartments. Then we're going to move in. I was open to moving to this state. He works for the state police. So, like, that was his, that was it. Like, he was set to live in this state forever. I mean, what a crazy time to be trying to figure this out.

Yeah. Yeah. So, it would just be, the job thing but other than that like i we found a great apartment like i love it i'm not moving there until i find a job there so we're still going to be kind of long distance for a little bit longer but listen these are all big things i get that but i say this is someone who's a little older and it's, you know, you sound like a methodical person who's doing her due diligence. Some things don't work out, you know? I'm just saying like you could move there, love the job, hate the job, hate him, love him. You don't know.

But most likely you'll figure it out. And that might mean staying in the city after you break up, moving back, going to a different city, finding a new job. You also never know. There's just no guarantees in life. Anytime I thought I had my life figured out in any way, it's always gone in a completely different direction. So you really just can never know. So you'll figure it out, bet on yourself type of thing. And so what I'm saying is take that stress out of it. I understand because right now, here's my fear for you is you're putting all this pressure on yourself about this move, about this relationship, about what's going on in the country. And you're trying to get definitive answers in a very short period of time. And that's not realistic. It's like, all right,

before I move and quit my job and find a new one, I need to know if you're going to be a good cop for the rest of your life. And like, you completely understand my point of view and people of colors. And I need really clear answers in a week. And I just don't think that's realistic. So you're just going to have to decide, is this the type of person who I think will continue to grow with me and at the risk of it not working out and we break up and I'm like 26 years old and still super young and can still figure it out, you know? So that's what I'm saying. You don't want to like put that pressure on yourself and him and the relationship because then you could push him a little too much too quickly. You seem like a very pragmatic and well thought out person

who is going to figure shit out for herself. I have no doubt. I try. So best of luck. But yes, keep going. It sounds like you guys are doing the right thing. Best of luck with the move. Just keep having conversations as a couple.

Be willing to learn his point of view and challenge him to be willing to do the same. And as long as you feel that, that's a good sign. When that stops happening, then you have some real concerns. Right. Exactly. All right. Okay. All right.

Well, thank you, guys. Best of luck. Thank you. Thanks for calling. I really appreciate it. How's it going? Hey, my name's Alex. I'm 28 years old.

Hi, Alex, 28. How are you? How can we help? I'm well. How are you guys doing? So good. Thanks for asking. Awesome. So I guess I'll jump into my issue. I'm going to give a tiny little backstory just because it gives some sort of context to my question. Um, so I was in a long-term relationship that ended about like three months ago. And in that relationship, we had like an open relationship. Um, we did a lot of, we explored like a lot of kinks that the both of us had. Um, you know, we had such a strong friendship. Like it was an amazing relationship. I'm really sad that it ended, but unfortunately it did. And now I feel like I need to start dating. I've been very reluctant to start dating because I was kind of hoping, you know, we would get back together and

all this stuff, but I'm just trying to move on now. But my only thing is that apart from me already having a hard time trying to find someone new because my ex, I just absolutely adored him and loved our relationship. Something else has come up in my life that I feel like is going to be kind of hard for maybe some other men to understand. So essentially when COVID happened, I lost my side job. And, you know, I just needed to kind of like a little extra side cash to make it on my own. Now that I was living on my own without my ex, like kind of supplementing some of my income. And so my friend hooked me up with this older gentleman who pays me money to sext him, which is like the greatest gig I've ever had. Like,

I don't know. I can make like 200 bucks in like an hour. And I agree. All right. I got a few questions. No, please. I just want to know what you write.

Like, I want to hear some of these. Honestly, this particular guy makes it quite easy. So he is into some fucked up shit, like no shame like that. But really, it's some stuff I've never heard in my life and was not expecting to come from like a 75 year old man. But a lot of it, I think he just like wants me to like listen to him and like confirm like his kinks um which i'm more than happy to do like i'm quite positive um and so like i'll send him like a couple pics of me in my underwear and like oh so you are you are sending images yes i of course never put my face in it but

yeah like of course a few pics each time which honestly i'd prefer to send a pic than to like make up some crap to be honest but um okay so i'm just like so is it like he's once i start i'm sorry we have more questions about the sex i have so many questions okay is he like pleasuring himself and you're like oh Ooh, baby. Ooh, baby. Yes. Daddy. Here's a picture of my butt kind of thing. And then he's like, Ooh, yeah. I don't like, is that what you're talking about? Or. Oh yeah. So you'd think it would be that way. And that's what I was expecting. I don't know. I don't.

It's like, it's like better than I expected because he's not even like wanting me to like pretend to desire him okay he just like wants to like tell me how hot i am or a thing that he does is he like kind of tells he'll like tell me a story about um one of his fantasies and then it's kind of like pretend but it kind of has nothing to do with me like he talks about like um his past relationships a lot like he'd be like oh me and this woman that i met me like he talks about like um his past relationships a lot like he'd be like oh me and this woman that i met in like bangladesh like one time we did this and then

i'll just like ask him questions about it and be like i'll just be like oh i bet you really like that because you like sucking cock or like something like that like i don't know because he's like into like a bunch of shit. So then I basically just like confirm his kinks for him. And he doesn't even really like tell me if he's jerking off or not. Like I'm sure that he is. It's more like he doesn't want someone to talk to. Sure. Yeah.

Uh, I'm assuming even despite kinky, uh, which there's nothing wrong with kinky, but these are all like legal things. You're not like saying anything that's compromising you know he's not like saying fucked up shit where you're just like i don't know if that's okay no no it's just it's just very like interesting stuff that i wouldn't expect for like his age

i guess you could say oh a guy who's 75 now was 35 40 years ago you know if he was into toes then chances are you know totally totally um but yeah so my question is like so this is something that honestly i kind of need this money and it's like very easy to do and i want to carry this out as long as i can like why not it's i feel comfortable with it sure when you say need the money which is fine you know no judgment over here but uh if you didn't need the money would you do it um yeah that's the other thing is that i kind of that's that's the question you can ask ask yourself because when you say i need the money it there's a level of like compromising yourself at least it sounds like that like well i wouldn't do it if i need the money but i do so like i can i can justify it but you know i think it you know

going into your bigger question is is i want to keep doing this if i start dating will someone accept it i don't know how some guy's gonna respond but you're gonna go a lot further by not by saying i'm not doing it just because i need the money i also think there's a big difference between just sexting and sending pictures like when it comes to dating someone new because i think that some people might have different feelings about you know just communicating through writing is a little bit of a different thing than sharing images of yourself. Sure. Yeah. Totally. I agree with that. And that's why it's weird too, because of my last relationship,

again, it was like an open relationship and my ex would actually like be turned on knowing that I was like Snapchatting another guy, like a hot picture of me, like in a bikini or whatever. So that's, you know, so he would have been okay, perfectly okay with this. Well, that's what I was going to say. Regardless of this sexting older people, it sounds like your last relationship was a non-traditional relationship. And you very much valued that about the relationship. That was one thing you valued. So it's safe to assume that in your

next relationship, whatever that is, you're going to need the same type of open-mindedness from your next partner, right? Like regardless of the fact that you were sexting older guys for money, chances are if you were to, you know, the next guy you had a crush on and started going on a few dates and he was like straight and narrow right just like uh very traditional looking for a wife want kids very much the nothing monogamous relationship i'm the idea of anything else would blow his mind that's not going to work i mean do you want do you want an open relationship going forward that's the thing is i feel like the answer is probably no, because my last relationship, I feel like, like I was not expecting to be okay with that, but it worked for us because of the kind of people that we were and the kind of trust that we had for each other. But moving forward, I don't really know if that would be the same case if I started to date another guy and it got serious.

I'm not, I'm willing to sacrifice not having an open relationship. Like that was kind of just something really unique about my old one. You know what I mean? But I do need somebody that's like open-minded. Yeah. I had a similar dynamic in one of my relationships where it worked in that specific scenario, but I've actually said since then, I don't think I would do it again going forward. I mean, unless it happened to be the right person because i think you're right it's pretty rare to find someone where you have such good open dialogue and friendship and trust that you can make that dynamic work and it's it's just sometimes easier to not have that in a relationship so i could see how but i do think nick's right you're still gonna you're still you regardless

of whether you have the an open relationship with someone or not. So you're still going to have a certain type of person that you're attracted to going forward. And they're most likely going to be pretty open-minded because you are. Yeah. And like, for example, your next relationship regardless of the sexting might not be an open relationship. But you're going to probably tell them like my last relationship was an open relationship, but you're going to probably tell them, like, my last relationship was an open relationship, and that person that you date

is going to need to be open-minded about that idea in a sense that, like, there's a lot of people you might meet, a lot of guys who are like, I was in an open relationship, and they might judge you for that. They might get defensive. They might, like, why would you do that? I can't believe you did that. That's not the type of person you're going to date. So you just, you just need to, they just need to be open-minded

for you. It sounds like, right. So that you can say like, I'm an adventurous person. I've had non-traditional relationships and feel like that person is not like, if they want to be inquisitive, fine. If they want to learn, they're like, oh, I never thought about that. As opposed to like, I don't like that about you yeah I mean I think that's something and and again from my I can only speak from my own experience but that's sort of something I've had to navigate as well not because I want that same thing going forward but just being in being honest with the person a new person I'm seeing I'll just kind of throw things out there like be really honest and real because I figure if their reaction

is bad then that's not the type of person I should be with anyway. Like if they're going to be judgmental of anything about me, then they're probably not the right fit for me. And I think that's been such an important part of just, you know, maturing and getting older and learning from my relationship experiences is that it's so important to just be true to who you are, regardless of what you're doing, whether you're having a sexting relationship or anything else going on in your life. You really, it's important to just be able to be completely honest with anyone you're starting to see because you don't want to be changing anything about yourself or trying to make something work that actually wouldn't work if you were

being real. Yeah. I mean, and it kind of, and for me, it's just like, as I've gotten older and I've dated, I've enjoyed dating and getting to know women who have had different paths than I have, right? So if they might say, well, I was in an open relationship before, or maybe I dated a woman. It doesn't mean I want that, right? But for me, it's been fun because I have a very open mind about things is to talk about

it and learn from it. Are there aspects of your open-mindedness and creativeness in your past relationships that we could potentially bring into our new relationship wrinkles of it i don't know right but like for me it's just that been that fascination of learning from other people's past i like that right some people don't right and i think you need someone who is kind of just has that very open-mindedness of relationships back to the sexting that is a very unique thing um so you know listen the reality is is that you're going to have some people who aren't okay with it and some people who are and you'll just have to navigate that i don't know how i'll tell you

like is it even necessary to tell someone that i'm dating? Like, when does it get to the point? Pretty early. When it's necessary. Well, again, one of those things, I don't think, whatever you decide to be in life, whoever you are, job, your relationship, I can't imagine a world, I know a lot of people have to, especially, you know, and we've come a long way, but the LGBTQ community, I'm mumbling, but has had to lead a life where they can't be themselves and can't be who they are. I would assume you would want to be whoever you are, right? Especially in your relationship. So

you should want to be able to tell people what you do and say it without feeling ashamed or embarrassed for it. So to answer your question, I think you should want to put it out there fairly quickly. I don't think you should want to hide it. And if you want to hide it, I think you need to address why. And I get it because you're afraid of being judged, but we're going back to the chicken before the egg kind of thing. This will help you potentially find the type of person

you should invest time in, right? So this could be a great opportunity, like Caitlin said, she's like, I just kind of throw it out there because I don't want to waste a lot of time going on a bunch of dates with a guy who's ultimately not going to accept me for who I am once I drop who I am. I mean, yeah, it's something that it's a part of you and it might be just a part of your past by the time you meet someone else or who knows, but it's still who you are and it's something that you enjoy. So, you know, you got to be real.

Yeah. I think you should, yeah, say it. I mean, maybe not like the first date. No, I think you wait until you know if you like them. Yeah, I feel like it's a lot. Yeah, I think you wait until you know if you like them enough that you would be interested in continuing to see them and then you tell them. Yeah, it's kind of that.

Exactly. Like if it's a guy that ends up like screwing me over, I'm like, why did I tell you like something that's very personal to me? Like now you're walking around knowing this and you're an asshole. Like what? No, I know, but it's, yeah, there's no like two, three, four dates. I don't know. But there's always that period of time where you're going on a few dates and you're like, I still don't know a ton about this person, but I like what I see so far. And now I want to start investing time, you know, because like, it's one thing to go on a couple of dates on a Wednesday. Cause like, what else are you going to do? Right. But now when you

start, like, I'm going to hang out with this person in lieu of going out with my girlfriends or guy friends, then it's like, now I'm starting to make these sacrifices. Um, and you don't want to make a lot of, you don't want to invest a lot of time in someone who ultimately, and that's kind of that sweet spot of when you're like, hey, before I start like really investing my time, I should, you know, let them know. Because yeah, there's always that weird, especially if you're dropping a bomb, the other person's going to feel more defensive when they're like, if you've been dating for like three months you're like by the way well i feel like you'll be able to feel them out also in other ways before you are able to you don't this doesn't have to be the first thing that you say that's you know maybe a

little bit different from the norm so you could talk about other things that are generally in that space and vicinity and see what their thoughts are on it or even ask them hypothetical questions maybe and just kind of feel out what they're the way they think i'll tell you what uh next time you meet someone you want to date i'm really would appreciate a follow-up call and let us know how that went because i am curious yeah totally i will yeah um all right alex uh we really appreciate the call it's been uh interesting and and and learning yeah you're you you would biggest takeaway is this is who you are be who you are and don't be afraid to get to let people know who you are um but people you are

but you trust you know thanks i appreciate that all right you are, but you trust, you know. Thanks. I appreciate that. All right. Take care. It was good to meet you guys. You too. Bye.

Stay healthy. Bye. How's it going? Good. Hey, Nick. My name is Rachel. I'm 31 from Ontario, Canada. Hi, Rachel.

How can we help? So recently I split up with my ex about a year ago um it was a pretty it was an unhealthy relationship and we were together for quite a while it was a difficult split so i needed like time after we broke up to kind of figure out what i wanted in my next relationship so it's been like like I said, a year. So a couple of weeks ago, I felt like I was ready to get back into dating, which is really weird timing, obviously, with COVID. But I thought, what the heck, let's just see. Let's just try it and see what happens.

So I joined a dating app. Great. Great time. It's actually an excellent time to join a dating app. Yeah. Well, I listened to your show quite a bit and I was kind of like receptive to the advice that it's a good time to do this because you can kind of build a deeper connection with someone potentially. So I ended up matching with a couple of people. Um, one of them is actually someone from my past um i guess in my mid-20s we kind of dated neither of us were very serious about it like we both come out of long-term

relationships and it was we had a lot of fun together and a very good like we had really good chemistry but you had good sex there wasn't much else there so he and i he's reached out we've been talking and like he's kind of a fuck boy so i was pretty clear i said i'm not looking for a hookup i'm looking for a husband like okay um yeah my ex and i have a two-year-old daughter together so that's always in my mind kind of as well with dating so i want to prepare for a future kind of thing sure someone that makes sense um yeah so he's been talking to me and kind of as well with dating so i want to prepare for a future kind of thing sure someone that makes sense um yeah so he's been talking to me and kind of telling me what i want to hear i think he's like well we could like i want to commit to you and i want to be

exclusive but i think he's just kind of telling me what i want to hear his life hasn't changed at all um which is a big turnoff i haven't seen any like growth what do you mean by that what do you mean um same job still living in what's the job is he like a bartender or you know does he sell insurance factory okay well like which is fine working a factory doesn't make him a fuck boy not at all no not at all my my ex was in construction like that's fine that's not the issue it's just that he's like even through the conversations we've had like he doesn't have a lot of motivation or drive i grew up in a small town he grew up in the same small town he's still there a lot of guys from my high school all went to work at that factory he's still there gotcha you know all right so then

there's another now there's another person yes Yes. So the other person, it was really random. So he actually turns out to be my co-worker's brother. And she and I are very close. Like we've formed a friendship and we talk almost every day. She had tried to set us up months ago. And at the time, I wasn't ready to date. So it didn't work out but oddly enough I matched with him and now he and I have been talking and that's going really well we've had a couple of

social distance dates so he came to my house the first time and like we just clicked right away it was really like natural easy conversation i'm attracted to him and yeah it's just it was good it was weird to have a social distance date and sit across from someone and it was kind of nice at the same time too i think it took the pressure off for both of us a little bit so what's the big question okay so I've had a second date with him social business wise. And so my thing is I can only really see him every other weekend because I have my daughter. And so we're having a social distance date every other weekend. So I've seen him twice.

Each time I feel like, oh, more connected and like things are progressing in a nice way. But I don't kind of want to lose the momentum like i've never progressed in a relationship without any physical component okay you know what i mean sure that makes sense i don't know i guess but then how's this what's this have to do with fuck boy oh okay so initially it did but as time has gone on like i realized that i'm much more interested in this other guy like i see yeah i was gonna say bill bill the fuck boy yeah it just like okay you know yeah you got on a dating app you hadn't dated before oh i know this person easy to talk to he was like a good warm-up he was a fluffer for a dating app you know easy to

reconnect with somebody you've already connected with you know and he was like a gateway to this this new guy i mean listen you're how you've done it before hasn't worked out so this fact that you're oh i'm not used to this isn't doesn't mean it's wrong you know um it's all about do things keep moving forward regardless of how slow that forward is, you know? Okay. You know, where does he live relatively close to you? Yes. And, and why can you only hang out every other week?

Because of her daughter. Because of like co-parenting situation. So you, but like you can't get a babysitter i mean i guess i don't know yeah well yeah stuff i personally think that it's kind of nice to have it like the process dragged out and kind of slow down because i feel like you can build tension that way and then by the time you guys actually can be more physical with each other it'll just be that much more exciting. I don't think you lose momentum. I feel like if anything, you might get some false momentum by like building up that tension.

But yeah, all in all, I don't think there's a big problem here. You know, yes, you're right. Babysitters, you know, COVID, not easy. But even though you can't see each other, can still facetime every day zoom talk text a lot of ways to continue to get to know each other um right sext you know and for free um and uh don't worry about it you'll uh you'll figure it out with the last the last caller we had so yeah listen uh don't make the mistake, of getting all your answers right away. Uh, that's part of dating, right?

Um, we do that a lot by saying, you know, people love to say, well, I don't want to waste my time with you. I don't know what to tell you. You know, like, uh, I've had that situation where it's just like, well, you've been single for so long. And like, are you, do you really want like a girlfriend? I'm like, yeah, I do. Like, well, why haven't you had one?

Because like, I'm a little bit more selective. Well, I don't know if I believe you. Okay. I don't know what to tell you. But like, do you want a date? Because I'd like to keep getting to know you. But I am not making any promises that we're going to get married and have kids. Everyone just wants guarantees.

Yeah. And it's just not how life works. You know? No. have kids everyone just wants guarantees yeah and it's just not how life works you know so you just have to keep checking in with yourself and keep checking in with him and if and if you invest a year and it doesn't work out you can't be like fuck you you know you you know i mean listen if you catch him in lies and he ends up being a guy who had like a second family kind of a dick move you know but you guys can't promise each other uh how things are going to progress you know and people do make that mistake of like well tell me you're not going to hurt me well i mean certainly not intentionally but like i might

change my mind about how i feel about you you know as we get to know each other and and and you could easily people have no problem with changing their minds about people but they just want other people you know, as we get to know each other. And you could easily. People have no problem with changing their minds about people, but they just want other people to change their minds about them. You know? That's true. Yeah. I mean, you're very good.

I might opt out, but I need to guarantee that you will never break up with me. In the meantime, I need to know. Yeah. Not realistic. Yeah. We do that a lot um yeah and he makes honestly he's he's like made this very easy for me this process like he's very understanding about my circumstances and like he's he does keep the connection going but it almost starts to feel like friends only and then when i see him i'm like oh you're like i i feel it all again but in between like the conversations

we're having are um more friendly i guess we'll mix it up yeah i mean you don't have to get into like immediate sex but like you can talk about like you can talk about sex. You can talk about past relationships. You can. Would you? Would he talk about sex or sexed? Yeah. Well, there's a difference between talking about sex and sex. I don't know.

Well, yeah. Is there? Sure. I mean, I guess. Well, it can. It can certainly. I guess it depends on the direction. But if you like talk, I think people often are are afraid to talk about past relationships

i personally don't mind it i'm not a jealous guy i don't have no illusions that any girl i'm ever going to date is not going to have a past and quite honestly that would bother me it's just like i am like at this point in my life i'm not interested in and and teaching anyone anything about like the the basics of like a relationship. I don't want anyone to experience, honestly, the first time anything with me. Right. At this point in my life. Right.

And so I'm fine with talking about it because it allows me to get to know that other person about who they are. Like, you know, that's not everyone. And honestly, I would be, but I don't get the vibe from him that he would be comfortable with that you know like he sent me a selfie and i'm like oh you look so cute like i'm trying to kind of how old is he you know a little bit and then how old is he how old is he the same age as me okay yeah well i mean he could be immature for his age i don't know but that's so that's again that's part of the dating process or he could be immature for his age i don't know but that's so that's again that's part of the dating process or he could be extremely conservative and you realize you

don't align in that way maybe these are all things that come in with dating you try these out you have these conversations to figure out people you know you don't avoid them like well i don't know if you'd like that well find out um that's very true it's just like i've been in two long-term relationships pretty well that's about it and then like a little fling or whatever but um like sex is important to me in a relationship like nothing for everyone chance there's a good there's a good bet he's into sex yeah yeah very true very true yeah maybe not you're right yeah and highly unlikely that he wouldn't be but yeah but he just might not be as comfortable talking about it you know i also think that guy well at least from some of my experience it can be a little what you read into what's

going on in text messages can be very different from what's actually going on and i think a lot of times women love to over communicate and they want to hear more. And a guy might not even be aware that he's not giving you the communication that you're looking for. Totally. And this might not be it, but we are in, you know, extraordinary times and we are, you know, there are a lot of great guys out there. We keep hearing stories about guys who are not. And I mean, every guy, when you kind of hear all these stories about guys doing and saying wrong things, every guy is just like, oh, I just want to make sure I'm being respectful and I'm being good. So sometimes you just want to get that okay, and he doesn't have that comfort level with

you. So there could be some timidness from his point of view about like, I don't know why is, you know, I don't want to make, I don't want to be creepy. I don't want to be creepy, you know? And so there is that fine line between creepy and hot. It really comes down to, is she interested in having this conversation with me? But I think the key is that he's continuing to go on these dates with you. So he's clearly interested.

He wouldn't be doing this just to hang with a friend, I don't think. Yeah, listen. You're kind of new to dating and back into dating right and there's a lot of people with dating apps we have this part of the problem with dating apps is this abundance of choice and then people kind of are trying to date five people at once and that's no good and then you have the opposite end of the spectrum what you're in you're just like well i'm not used to dating so i'm gonna like really go into just the first person who comes along that i click with.

And so you got to, what I'm saying is keep getting to know him. Don't be afraid to decide he's not for you. I don't know. This is part of the, you know, you just have to keep figuring it out and don't expect all the answers to come in one day, but also just know that this isn't, this doesn't have to be your guy, you know, and two months you months, you can realize, I've invested a lot of time in this guy, and now I need to not anymore. People do it all the time. I've invested three months. I've invested six years as an excuse to keep investing more. That should have no bearing on how much you keep investing.

All right? Definitely. All right. Well, best of luck. Thank you so much. all right. Definitely. Okay. Yeah. All right. Well, best of luck. Thank you so much. All right. Take care.

Thank you. All right. Bye. Uh, Caitlin, thanks so much for, uh, for joining.

This has been a lot of fun. Um, yeah, I, uh, we probably could have had Caitlin on our, our regular interview episode, but,

uh, we thought we should also, she would also be great at, uh, answering some of your questions. So we did a little bit of both. Well, maybe I'll come back for another one. Yeah. Well, you're welcome back at any time. It's been a ton of fun. Remind people where they can find you again. Thank you. They can find me,

my podcast is The Bright Side and it's at The Bright Side Podcast on Instagram. And you can listen to it anywhere. You could listen to your podcast. And my Instagram is at Caitlin. Awesome. At Caitlin. podcast. And my Instagram is at Caitlin. Awesome. At Caitlin. At Caitlin. I snagged it. I'm so jealous.

Well, guys, as always, thanks for listening. Don't forget to send in your questions at asknick at castme.com. Cast with a K. We will see you tomorrow for our recap. Honestly, I'm recording this a week ahead of time so i don't even know what episode the the bachelor is recapping and what guests will have but it'll be fun um i know we'll have some probably hot goss for you and then uh check us out again on wednesday uh until then thanks for listening as always don't forget to send in your five-star reviews

on itunes because you know we like to be complimented. If you don't want to give us five stars, don't bother. I'm not actually interested in real feedback. I want pandering on iTunes. That's too funny. Thanks for listening, Caitlin. Once again, I really appreciate it.

It's been a ton of fun. And we'll see you guys tomorrow