The Viall Files - E163 Bachelor Recap & Hot Goss With Cathy Kelley

Episode Date: August 11, 2020

Cathy Kelley re-visits The Viall Files today and joins Nick as they recap Jason Mesnick’s GOAT episode of The Bachelor. Jason’s season was the first in The Bachelor series Cathy ever watched, so she has a lot to say about it and also a special place in her fandom heart for it. Nick and Cathy talk through recent news on what is happening with the new season of the Bachelorette as well as what they would like to see the show get back to in reference to Jason’s season. Influencer contestants, production quarantine theories, the right reasons, and more as they discuss all the optics surrounding the show today.  Thank you for sending in your questions! We love hearing from you. Send your relationship questions to [e-mail] and, as always, make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode.  “I was like, an advocate for Myspace” THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: THERAGUN: theragun.com/viall  to try Theragun RISK-FREE for 30 Days CROSSROPE: crossrope.com/viall  to get up to $40 off Crossrope sets plus free shipping EARNEST: earnest.com/viall to get $100 cash bonus when you refinance a student loan Episode Socials: @ViallFiles  @nickviall @cathykelley  @catherinekelley on twitter See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

what is going on everybody hey i wasn't sure sprightly today i wasn't sure if we're gonna have a bachelor uh episode today but it was jason's episode last week when we recorded the for those of our yeah uh diehard ass nick uh listeners which if you're not on that boat people are digging the ass neck if you're not on that boat come on it's taking off people anyways uh jason mesnick season what and it truly was a it's a it's a really good greatest of all time. Yeah. Season. So we get into that. The lovely and wonderful Kathy Kelly is back helping us break down all things Jason. Getting it done.

And Kathy watched this season back in the day. You didn't? No, I was not a Bachelor fan back then. So Kathy has some hot and excellent takes. As well as we have an update from The Bachelor Bubble. Oh, another one? Another update from The Bachelor Bubble we have to get into. Did you know there was a comment that people were like, everyone take a shot every time they say Bachelor Bubble?

It's a new game. Great. It's a new game. Well, if you're driving, don't do that. Don't do that. But yeah, there's a new update. So we'll discuss that. That's amazing. Also, before we get into the episode,

I'm going to give you guys the hard sell today on Nick V Talks Trash TV. You don't say. It's been really exciting. So many of you have listened, have joined. It means a lot that you're supporting the project I worked hard on. A lot more of you have dipped your toes in. You've checked out the page.

And I'm assuming you've said, I don't want to pay $5 for that. I get it. I understand. I can't tell you how many times I'm a big sports fan. I'll go to the sports subscription service. And I will look at it and go nah nah not this time and i'll come back not this time and then finally i'll do it yeah listen many of you lots of you tons of you and i thank you for that are about to listen to us recap jason mesnick season from nine years ago

with a wonderful with the wonderful kathy kelly if you enjoy this and you will because it's amazing by the way you are the the nick v talks trash tv with all the women from most the women from my season many of the loving wonderful mainstays of my yeah you're going to just die for how good it is and i'm telling you it's just worth your time. Yeah. If you want to join, you can cancel at any time. If you just join for the Bachelor recap, because there's going to be much more amazing content heading.

Yeah. If you've been to Starbucks three times in two months, it's worth it. Right? It's the cup of coffee you keep passing through. That's it. So check it out. I promise you, you won't regret it. If you've thought cup of coffee you keep you keep passing through that's it so check it out i promise you you won't regret it if you've thought about it you're like oh i don't want to come in leave whenever you want it's uh if you've ever bought an audiobook if you like tell all type

of behind the scenes i promise you trust me the netflix me here. You will love it. Yeah. You will love it. I did watch. I did watch. It was pretty good. Like even Angela, who was just there on night one, that episode is kind of amazing. Thank you for saying. You're welcome. Anyways, if you can find it, you can go to my Instagram.

There's a link in my bio. It's on my Twitter. It's go to Patreon and search in Nick V. I promise you, you will love it. Yeah yeah so if you're going to listen to this you need to listen to that anyways uh anyway god i gotta stop saying anyways anyways apparently anyways isn't a word it's not i guess i don't know. It's anyway. We'll Google it later. Yeah. Anyways, Kathy. Yes.

Welcome back. Thank you. I feel so different. The world is like. I know. I haven't seen you since. It was like I saw you right before. A couple of days before. And now I'm in my sweatpants on the bottom.

Party on the top. Got the vibe. Is this you pretending you're roughing it? I'm still in quarantine. I was like, wow. You look really nice in sweatpants. You can dress up sweatpants

with heels and get away with it now. I didn't even know they made dress up sweatpants. I want to start wearing pants with sweatpants on heels. Whatever, you have dress up sweatpants too.

You sure? Yeah, but I don't make them out like that. What have you been doing? A lot of nothing. Yeah, quarantine's been great. It's just been very relaxing. I've read like 20 books in that time.

Just a lot of like self-help and then some fiction. I've been baking a lot of like self-help and then some fiction. Been baking a lot. Lots of cookies, lots of breads, eating all of them. So it's been great. Well, yeah. Winning. Yeah. Are you also working out?

All the carbs. Oh, yeah, sometimes. Been going on a lot of hikes. I mean, because I got to say, you get to sell those baking goods if you're just not working out and eating them. That's all I do is just be cooking all day. Well, I wanted you to come in and talk because obviously there's a lot of buzz going on in the Bachelorette world. I'm curious. We have some bubble updates.

have some bubble updates um before we get into that though you were uh a viewer of the jason mesdick season yeah back in the day which um we recap and i gotta say yeah that is very back in the day it was a good season when was it like over 10 years it was 11 years ago 2009 yeah did you watch it i did watch it so i'm the only one who didn't watch it when it was going i do remember sucks to be you i do remember it being talked about like i remember it being i remember because he was really the very hated at the time for what he did which is i mean they had if you look at the past track record brad wilmack was kind of not liked because oh yeah at the end but jason like what he pulled that was the first time that something like that happened. There was a switcheroo, yeah. And now that's so common?

Well, it's not as common, but it is interesting that, yes. And I was thinking about that too. I remember knowing about the season because Molly worked at Kohl's Corporate in Menominee Falls, Wisconsin. And I was living in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. And so it was kind of a buzz that the girl from Kohl's. I got my, just fun fact,

I was offered a job at Kohl's Corporate that I turned down out of college. I mean, I kind of wish I would have taken it. Stop bragging. Yeah, seriously. That was kind of a regret. That was kind of a regret, but I wish I would have taken it.

It all worked out. But anyways, anyway. You're doing fine. Maybe they'll offer you a job. that was kind of a regret but uh i wish i would have taken it it all worked out but anyways uh anyway you're doing fine um maybe they'll offer you a job they'll be listening to the podcast and be like wow this could be a great fit for us i don't know if i want to get into the department store industry nowadays do you think they have fancy sweatpants there probably that would be a good selling point yeah j-lo has her own line at kohl. I bet they got some fancy sweatpants. Yeah, so Molly had worked there or was working there when she went on the season. So it was definitely talked about.

But yeah, it's crazy. Yeah, well, there was Brad. And then Juan Pablo was a dick. But he was after. Yeah, but I'm just saying like the guys, it was interesting. And I think what is fascinating and different is that even when i was the bachelor when i talk about the pressure

the leads feel yeah and i think it was it was different the both bachelorette and bachelor felt pressure but different i think the bachelorette never wanted like until hannah was crazy the bachelorette never wanted to be the first bachelorette who left alone, not being proposed to like, like, what is that going to say about me? You know, turns out the great, great thing for Hannah Brown in terms of, but that was, I think, I remember, I remember in the fantasy suite with Andy, her saying that to me, you know, like, I don't want to be because i remember being like so do you really want to get engaged like because i this is like our alone time and i'm thinking hey this is like

a real thing i really like you but like i'm fine with just dating yeah like nobody like this is ending an engagement i mean there's definitely extra pressure with that involved but it works sometimes no yeah but i'm just saying just saying it's just fascinating because, and then I'm going to say the Bachelor feels just like, well, you can't have this opportunity and waste it. Yeah. Because you had heard about the Walmacks and the Jasons before them that when it didn't work out,

they were hated. And then you go back and watch, what did Jason do wrong? I mean, we just have this unrealistic view on what the show is supposed to be at this point like the fact that you're able to not just find someone that you want to spend the rest of your life with out of a group of people that were cast yeah randomly for you you know but to to get engaged within less than two months. No, I know. It's crazy. But you know what's kind of fascinating is that what The Bachelor does or did is they do try to show all the points of view, right?

You got Molly's point of view. You got Jason's point of view. You got Melissa's point of view. And then we watch the love stories movies, the rom-coms, the notebook and in every rom rom-com there's always the like look about the notebook right there's what the guy the the army guy uh jason what's his name the actor oh ryan gosling no well he's the hero the other guy oh the other james masden maslow mas, no, not Maslow. Maslow's the Disney kid.

Or Big Time Rush. Yeah, but, you know, the... Yeah, yeah, yeah, him. The Bridesmaid movie guy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. James Marsden. Yes.

Yeah, the hairspray guy. Yeah, great actor. And he's... Clearly memorable. But, like, in that movie, he's the... he's... Clearly memorable. But like in that movie, he's a nice guy. He's not even like the villain. He's like a nice guy. Yeah.

And she leaves him for... Yeah. They just don't have the chemistry. But what I'm saying is we should have the movie where you get the other point of view from the person in all these rom-coms who gets let who's like the collateral damage yeah because there is always one in these rom-coms and we don't give a shit we're just happy that doesn't feel good at the end if you see this person crying and eating ice cream yeah remember what tall said tall said that at the end the bachelor in the movies are

the same he said that happiness or love starts when the movie's in yeah yeah and so the bachelor needs the the sad sob story so that they can have a new bachelorette like that's the you know i know but it's just kind of crazy how it all it all matters the lens that we we view it on and so the jason and molly love story in the short term at the time, you know, kind of suffered. Well, yeah, it seems scandalous. Yeah.

I mean, clearly in retrospect, it's worked out very well for them. I mean, they have no problem propping up those two in that family. Yeah. Anytime they need to be like, Hey,

the bachelor works. Yeah. And I love that they're trying to set up their kids. Like Stephanie was trying to set up her daughter with Jason's son, like over Instagram. Yeah. Like that was like, okay. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, you know, keeping that going. Keeping the mess going. It was wild to go back. It's been funny with watching Ali's season, watching Jason's season, just how much time has gone, like 2009 between now. Like the fact that they couldn't even air it in high definition,

like they had the bars was kind of wild. That's wild. Yeah, Jason's was the first season that I watched. I had watched a little bit of Andrew Firestone's season and Trista's season because my babysitter would let me stay up late and watch that and my mom had no idea I remember my first girlfriend was watching Andrew's uh Andrew Firestone season and I just remember a scene because there was a girl who was like who he was on a date and said

how Olive Garden was her favorite Italian restaurant the breadsticks and at the time i loved the olive garden and i was like yes and and andrew from milwaukee so that's like the best italian no actually actually no oh okay milwaukee has amazing italian restaurants uh i some of the best color on club little plug if you're in milwaukee it's the best it's amazing but as a 22 year old you know chain restaurants or or it's that anyways andrew was like uh that's garbage and i remember being offended because he was like a super he's from the firestone family so that's like plebes pleasant or peasants go to the Olive Garden. Sure. That's not even in their vocabulary.

He's like, for me, right? Well, that's how it was painted. Yeah. But the truth is you don't have to be from wealth to realize that maybe the Olive Garden isn't the best Italian restaurants that you can find. Maybe a local family-owned restaurant. But anyways, I'll always remember the end. The a local family-owned restaurant. But anyways, I'll always remember. Olive Garden is a family restaurant. The Darden family.

Tell me Chili doesn't real Mexitex, Max. What's going on? Sorry, guys. So Jason, was your first season? First season where I watched the entire thing? Yeah, I was in college, I think. And looking back, i really only remember um molly and melissa um and so reliving those other or getting to see those other relationships

again was really interesting yeah yeah uh the who was the girl who shannon who went nuts shannon the one who was like the stalker and when they knew everything oh yeah knew everything about his brother and his brother that's that's just instagram nowadays like you don't have to stalk someone you literally just look on their page and you know everything i thought that was really fascinating but now myspace that's what i love standard yeah i miss i missed i looked at all of your top eight i made sure that they weren't girls that you dated before. I miss MySpace. Do you?

I did. I liked it. I liked it. What did you like about it? You liked the song choices. I did. I liked the song choice. You know, you come on. It's a vibe.

Did you have a lot of followers? I don't know if I had any. Did you have followers on MySpace? Yeah. And then you had your top eight. You had your friends. That was like the big thing. Yeah.

Yeah, I did. Oh, yeah. And your top like whatever. I. And then you had your top eight. You had your friends. That was like the big thing. Yeah. Yeah, I did. Oh, yeah. And your top like whatever. I was so petty too with my top eight. Yeah. I would like always change it. Sometimes I'd have one. Sometimes I'd have none.

I was very emo in the MySpace era. Like I always had like a Fall Out Boy song playing as my... And oh, God. My... I was the worst. I kind of self-taught myself how to do a bit of computer programming oh via my oh so you could like change up because like yeah you uh this is when i was an accountant so i like hated my job and i just sat at my desk and like fucked with my myspace page

i was dreaming of working at kohl's and updating my MySpace page. And you could have like, remember the backgrounds you would have? You could design your wallpaper, if you will. And really, you were the only one that cared. There might have been like one or two people that would look at it and be like, wow, I love that background. I found this one, but i didn't quite like it and so i like figured out how to go in and change some of the code to like change the color or flip it and i felt real smart yeah i have

no idea how i did that i couldn't do it no i mean knowing those codes back in the day was like the thing yeah and then i remember i also remember like, because that was a time where Facebook was still like for, it was specific to college. Colleges, yeah. And so I was out of college by the time Facebook. I forgot how old you are. Came out. He's just brushing over that.

And... You lose your train of thought because you're senile and so uh yeah and so i remember being like no you gotta go to my i was like an advocate for myspace i was like selling it to people you really wanted myspace when i remember you and justin timberlake yes when when uh when i remember being at this training and it was like i was like two years removed from college and like a bunch of people were like just out of college i'm like oh no it's my space time man like let that college shit go i was way off i was not i was i was way off anyways faragon saved my life this weekend i woke up and i my back really my back i was and then i was stressed out i had

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Visit earnest.com slash license for a full list of licensed states. But I also remember the Shannon. It's interesting how thinking how the show has changed too because I think there's a world where if someone like Shannon was on the show now, she would, you know, the Demi, the Corinne's of the world, the someone who, she was funny. They get quirky, beloved quirkiness. Yeah, she was funny. The moment where she was trying to kiss him as she was crying,

and he was like, she's like, he didn't want to kiss me because I had a napkin on my face. That was funny. That would be something that would be a very memorable moment. Yeah. I mean, he didn't want to make out with her after she was crying. That was a little intense. But she blew her nose. The napkin.

And the truth is, who knows? Maybe she was totally nutty. And maybe she was someone who had a great sense of humor. Yeah. And in that world, if you're sarcastic and if you tell a joke and if you are, you know, have very dry sense of humor, they can take that and change it real quick. Yeah. And make you seem totally insane or evil or a dick or whatever.

I almost want, well, I don't want this, but to watch a season of The Bachelor without any of the music choices because it would change everything. Yeah. People actually might have liked me on Andy's season. Even you, Kathy. Really? I don't know. No, I mean, like, that's a thing, too thing too like if you watch andy season all of my

bad things they have villainous music behind it all the time all the time you don't even think about that you're watching it it's like why does this seem i don't know i love it i appreciate it as somebody who's like into like making tv i think it's so good and so smart i get it but i'm you're right kathy it changes your entire perception everything and you don't even realize what's going on because it's just your brain functioning but it was that was kind of fascinating you know what i what watching this recap really made me miss and i would like the show to get back to what um we've gotten away from like the single parent you know i i know we have matt james well because they were all 12 on the last season like they were they weren't old enough to even reproduce

i'm gonna say i'd like to see that and we have matt james great but i would like to i i'd like to see have we ever had a single mom no yeah, we had Emily. Yeah, Emily, yeah. And that was an amazing season. I would like to see a single mom Bachelorette or a single dad Bachelorette again. I mean, Juan Pablo was a single dad, but he kind of ruined that for the single dads. Yeah.

But just the idea that the conversations about, I'm a dad, my life is different. Yeah. Having those conversations were you know for who was the girl and the real conversations about like

are you ready for this kind of thing? Naomi. Well that was that was what was so interesting too is to have his son so included in the season. I remember Emily

was very protective of her daughter and didn't want any of the men to really meet her but ty was so involved with this like he met i think a couple of the at least he met melissa i don't remember if he met any of the other women but he was involved yeah yeah um but it's it's very interesting to if we had another single parent um would they even choose to show their kid on the show and it was cool that he

brought in stephanie's kid for that date that was like kind of cool too that i was kind of like how did that get set up because well of course it was a setup she seemed authentically surprised yeah oh yeah but obviously she must have i mean the kid must have been with her family or something. Maybe it was, maybe they asked her, hey, if you make it to hometown dates, would it be okay if your daughter was on it? Or would they film something and then later ask her? They could do that too, right? Like, yeah, what a great moment. You okay with us using this kind of thing? Yeah.

For sure. Because he even seemed hesitant at first watching it back to introduce himself to the daughter like he wanted permission from her um which i really respected yeah i i i think we've talked about them being so young the past few years obviously with claire it was like aging up i thought you were gonna say so before they had all of these girls, like Molly being this like Midwestern girl who was just a cute worked at Kohl's. Now it's all influencers. It's all former like pageant girls and models. Well, the pageant, they got nuts with the pageant thing.

Yeah. For Colton's season, you know, and they've really kind of stuck with that pipeline. Well, the fashion bloggers and the- There's only so much. That's just the new normal. Yeah. It's like you can't, Bachelor- People expect that at this point.

Not only that, but yeah, Bachelor can't control Instagram, right? Yeah. And it's to say like, what? I don't think they can be like, you can't have an Instagram. And also that would be foolish. But the being here for the right reasons, I think only came about in maybe the last

five or six years. Because before you had all of these people that I feel like genuinely, at least when I was watching, and maybe that's because I'm young and naive at the time, but thinking that these people were genuinely there to find love. And that was the only reason they were there. I don't think anyone was questioned on that Jason season about being there for the right reasons. What was funny,

and I've said this, but like it used to, like, I don't know when right reasons became a thing, but it's been a thing for a long time. And I agree with you only in the past few years, it is actually legitimate. Yeah.

And it's even talked about less now. I would, I almost think do you think that the show's gotten more popular in the last few years because there have been so many more celebrities that have come out and said that that's that they watch religiously or gotten cooler it's different because it's hard to it's an admittable guilty did that start after your season i i was right in the like i was i remember i was right in the middle of it. Yeah.

You know, when I, Andy's season, Instagram existed. By the time Paradise 3 was happening, that's when, and quite frankly, it was my season of The Bachelor. It was really, I mean, it was cool. It was cool to have Brie Larson invite me to her house to do a viewing party. And, you know, like it was, oh, you met The Bachelor. And, you know, I was talked about on like nighttime TV. It was surreal and wild with celebrities.

And it happened a little bit before that. I remember a little bit with Chris Soules' season and Ben's season. It really just kind of popped on my season. Who were the first celebrities? Like I remember Amy Schumer coming out and saying she was a huge fan. Oh, Mila Kunis and like- Charlie.

Yeah. And now it's just everyone. It's everyone. So I think it's gotten cooler because popular, it's hard to say. I mean, less people are like, when people are watching Jason's season, cable and Netflix and all these streaming options didn't exist. Oh yeah, so you had to watch it live. So you were getting 20, 30 million viewers.

Yeah. That's not what they're getting now but it's also harder to predict because people are recording it they're watching in well before they're watching in groups you know your bachelor you know people that will be interesting how it might change because bachelor parties aren't gonna this will be the first airing... Oh, this season. Clarification season, whatever. Will be the first season where it's going to be taboo

to have a bachelor viewing party. Well, people are still going to do it. They will, but not as many. Cross rope. You love to... I love to jump around and listen to music. The truth is,

I'm a creature of habit, which is great sometimes. But when it comes to working out, you need to mix up. You need to do new things. If you've been running constantly running constantly that's great but your body is getting used to that your your your return on investment is reducing yeah if you're doing uh plyometrics every day or pilates every day whatever it is yoga that's all great but if you're not mixing it up your return on investment is lowered so cross rope jumping rope it's an amazing workout we don't think of it as it's as often as kind of a, jumping rope, it's an amazing workout. We don't think of it as often as

kind of a typical workout. And it's an amazing workout. Cross rope is doing fun things. You have these great weighted jump ropes, all different jump ropes. They have this app that gives you different types of workout. It's fun. It's motivating. It's different. If you're trying to dunk a basketball, which I think everyone listening wants to do, it's going to help with that. Because you're jumping so high. Because you're working on your jumping because you're working on your jumping super high but it's also i sweat the crap out of what i'm well the app is helpful because it teaches you different like exercises that you can do all the time with the rope so it doesn't get boring here's why you get it cross rope lets you get a killer full body workout in

just 30 minutes 30 minutes it's amazing you're sweating you're like. Crossrope lets you get a killer full body workout in just 30 minutes. 30 minutes. It's amazing. And you're sweating. You're like, but you feel good when you're done. It's amazing. So if you're ready for a new cardio and full body home workout, visit crossrope.com slash V-I-A-L to get up to $40 off Crossrope sets.

Plus free shipping when you check out today at crossrope.com slash V-I-A-L-L. That's spelled C-R-O-S-S-R-O-P-E dot com slash V-I-A-L-L. That's crossrope.com slash V-I-A-L-L. Get your jump on today. Yeah. But anyway, so yes, it's gotten cooler. Yeah. Because I think 10 years ago, it was a legit guilty pleasure.

Yeah. People talked about it it but it wasn't like it was also guys were not able to watch it like that was not a thing now i feel like i have so many guy friends that are like no i watched the bachelor especially when i mean when you say when i say cooler that's part of the equation too because i don't think guys weren't want guys were still being dragged into it and probably enjoying it. Maybe not as much. You don't think so? Yeah. Now it's more of a thing of like guys be like, yeah, I watched The Bachelor.

Yeah. But you don't think 10 years ago they reluctantly watched it because they're girlfriends and then they got into it like you. No. I mean, like even guys that I've dated, like they've said they didn't watch it. Like it was it was taboo to watch. Like if you were to say you watched it like that's a girl show and now it's like oh yeah like i had a girlfriend that watched it and i watched

it now i i like really i'm into it so like i'll watch it on my own yeah boys just don't i have a couple friend that called me after watching the bachelor and like and my friend will be will be like going off about this is is horrible, this is terrible. I can't believe I had to sit here with my wife and watch this for the last like hour of my life. I wasted my life. And I'll be like, but you're invested because you're complaining. So you love to watch it.

No, they get you. Listen, it's relatable for both sexes. I would like to see father. Yeah, I would like to see father. Yeah. I would like to see the parent and those conversations. And yeah, they're never going to get away from it entirely, but I do think it does have to do with who they're casting.

I don't know. You know, the, yeah, the 22, like when, when half your cast is 23 and they live at home, that's, that's, those are the type of conversations you're

gonna have so like the they need to do more in terms of like it is hard because if they have a job in a weird way i feel like the younger girls get hurt more because they've never experienced that kind of pain and they haven't worked yeah to get rid of whatever ego um it can vary too i think yeah if you're gonna get the inexperienced lover uh on they're gonna they're gonna respond to heartbreak differently but even you get the person who's um like melissa you know it was or even like when i was on any season it was like i'm i was someone who had experienced heartbreak before so i was trying not to experience again publicly no but i'm just saying like the i this the person who goes on scared of yeah so i'm saying like the response

you can get anyways but yeah i think i'm watching jason's um i loved what, going back to Jason's season, Melissa said when she was publicly dumped after the final rose, she said, I'm showing him that I'm angry, but that's to mask that I'm hurt. For someone to say that 10 years ago, 11 years ago, is a really big deal. Yeah. And it was crazy watching that back because it wasn't live. There was no studio audience.

Yeah. Kind of weird, but probably. I mean, that's how they'll do it now. No studio audience if they do it after the final roast. True. But they didn't do a studio audience because it wasn't live and they're trying to keep it a secret. Right? Yeah.

Yeah. It seemed like she really didn't know yeah and that's probably they they really they definitely screwed jason in that sense because do you think when he was and i don't know you remember it more as a fan was jason hated because he ended things with melissa or was it because he brought her out on tv and did it there i think that's what it was um i don't know at that point because it had never been done before that they gave him an option um she even said on the the show that she was blindsided in that she had asked does it have anything to do with molly and he said point blank no um and then that night that same night is when

he asked molly out he didn't give it a beat um so it was break up with her on air she knows something's wrong break up with her on this show and knows something's wrong. Break up with her on the show and then cry, cry on commercial break. And then you come back and you're like sitting with Molly. And then he even mentioned, they mentioned in the interview with Chris Harrison that they were in a house secluded for the next week, him and Molly.

So like they were together from that moment. I think it was that there was no beat between him ending his engagement to going into this new relationship where like you just as a viewer, you just saw him proposed to her. You just saw them get engaged. You saw him with their with his kid and jumping into the pool and everything. So what they it's just the optics of it all. I actually wondered, I remember wondering at the time, because as Molly was leaving, as he was saying goodbye to her on that last day, day she said i think you're making a huge mistake and i always wondered if that played a role in um him leaving melissa i doubt it yeah because

it's been said many times after that okay yeah um yeah but yeah also that was the first time that that happened and i think america was just expecting a proposal and for them to stay together or break up after two years yeah no it's that was the norm it's just kind of i'm just kind of fascinated how you know the audience responds because wouldn't you just want to be happy for molly and jason and yeah we've all been there we've we've been on the receiving end of feeling stupid now i think people are happy now i think that people understand his decision but in that moment definitely not totally but it's also crazy too it's the think about the framing what peter did to hannah ann was it literally the same thing oh yeah and yet when possibly worse possibly worse and when on the live show they definitely like

they were definitely protecting peter because i think they felt like they put peter through the ringer and they brought hannah ann out but it was kind of like so yeah you're broken up hannah ann and hannah ann nailed it she said her piece and she looked like a rock star. But they didn't like let it marinate. You know, when Chris does his things and you're just like, when he asks his follow-up questions and he's like kind of like leading the audience down a path, they kind of brought her out, let her say her piece and like let her go. Yeah.

And it was... Peter just seemed very confused. And that's, this is the very confused. And that's, this is the first season, Peter season, where we heard so much about, because Kelly talked about it, producers really having that sway on the leads,

perspectives on people there. I mean, I don't, what about Ari? Ari's the same thing too, right? Yeah. I mean,

Ari picked Becca Kufrin and then decided that he was in love with um what's her name yeah i mean the one that he's married to lauren yeah i've listened it's hard i i've disagreed with kelly's point of view but i think it's easy to have a revisionist history i get well i mean like they're together yeah so i mean i i get that. I mean, if you're not as interesting television. Like she just seemed normal and she wasn't going to be swayed by. I get that. But a lot of winners are not interesting television. Most and many of them are.

They don't have to be. No, the Shannons are interesting television. The Corins are interesting television. Vanessa could have been amazing television, to be there no the shannon's are interesting television the corinne's i mean vanessa could have been amazing television but they didn't air a lot of it for our sake because it's you know what i'm saying they're telling a story yeah so well a lot of people do shut down yeah i'm just simply i can only speak from my experience and the people i've talked to if you're this like like, I really like this person, they stay.

And they don't try to convince you to like, I don't know. I mean, they might like, for example. But you're not someone who can be easily convinced. There are a lot of people who they turn to their friends or in this situation, the people that they're closest to, which are producers, because their friends aren't around and they ask for counsel. And then that's what they base their decision off of. to which are producers because their friends aren't around and they ask for counsel and then that's what they base their decision off of i they're they're definitely there for that but

i'm just simply saying if if you are like i'm really like this person yeah that's it you know like they're they're just not this big you know if you're on the fence with someone sure that's what i'm saying you know like if you're just like i don't, sure. That's what I'm saying. You know, like if you're just like, I don't know, like I just, sometimes it's good. Sometimes it's bad. Then they could steer you down a path. Yeah. I'm just simply saying, if you're like getting towards the end and you think you,

you know, this is about finding love. Yeah. Then, you know, if they can convince you to send someone home, then you must have had your own doubts, I guess is what I'm trying to say. Right. So they're, they're,

they're not going to be like mind fuck you so much that you went from that's but i'm i'm just trying to think of like in a normal dating situation i know like from my own perspective i would be fine but i would be super weird and uncomfortable if i knew that the guy that i was dating was dating four other women at the same time or 20 other women at the same time. Listen, if you want to convince me that. And then also hanging out with them. Kelly showed up and was like, this is fucking bullshit.

I don't, this is not my jam. I don't want to, like, I don't want to try to fight with these other, like, I get that. And she kind of shut down and was just like, eh. And then that combination of Peter being like, why are you being like this? And you seem to be like, that's a fucked up world. And I can, right?

Those two, you could convince me easily that those two in that world, it was never gonna work out. And then you bring in the fact that she might've been difficult, all those things. And then they were like, she's gotta go. And Peter's like, you know what? She is being weird, you know know and she had a bad week and then you get outside of the bubble they reconnect and totally yeah i totally get that so they're i'm just it's it's

nuanced is all i'm i'm saying um well 11 years from now when they re-air his season and they're still together oh i'll be shocked i'll be shocked and they prop up all their kids on their lap i'll be shocked if kelly and peter ever break up really oh yeah barb loves them too much he would never disappoint i uh i'll be shocked i'll be shocked yeah so and you're right they will be brought out as a successful yeah yeah that's the interesting thing about jason is like when they're getting down to those people like you were saying about the families there's a difference like intimacy and there's a different like consequence to it because you really are kind of like looking for your family as opposed to just somebody to hang out with for a little bit it's like there's a

consequence added to it yes there there's it's not a perfect and that's a and that's a thing kind of to your point i guess what you're saying is that world is not a perfect world their number one goal is tv and relationships second to that end and sometimes they don't get it right or even the like jason got it wrong you know and the fact that he was like crucified temporarily for being like well hey man i don't know i was all fucked up in the head and then I don't know, you know, and I can totally, yes, they probably were different, you know? I mean, right after Vanessa and I got engaged, it was like, okay. Yeah. I have my concerns, you know? Maybe I should see your place.

So, yeah, that was kind of wow but it was fun to watch and i i do hope they um i think we can agree that they get i hope they go back to their grassroots a little bit yeah i mean i would love a single dad over someone that lives at home still i don't think it's going to age up or i don't think we're going to get away too much from the influencing with matt james's cast yeah well because that's uh it's better tv but i think more he's not more women will apply right so he'll get more women will apply and more people will go on i think because the world that we're living in and less people having jobs that they're concerned about leaving for some time there could be that

yeah right more professionals because they lost i think i don't know he's such an attractive person like he's like the most attractive person that they've had as the the lead in like the longest time since my season no offense and maybe ever you know No, he's a great looking guy. Hang on. He's a great looking guy. He's, I mean, yes, he's going to be, it's going to be a great season. I'm just saying when we're talking about the terms of like he's not a dad. Yeah.

He's not, he's in his late 20s. Yeah, we're not going to get away from that too much. Yeah. But it'll be interesting to to see what have you been following about the bachelorette oh my gosh everything like what is your i do have an update from the bachelor bubble oh as promised i was gonna ask you i really wanted the the hot god i i i've now i'm just coming in talking to my my source inside the bubble breaking news your walter cronkite moment yet again i mean all they said was there is definitely love in the air and a lot of it

no idea how this will all end wow that is true because i think they realized that what they sounded like it was a bit of a bit of a bit of a Chris Harrison vagueness to it. But I didn't say it was going to be the most dramatic season ever though. So they did not. Oh, they did last week, but they did. Yeah,

they did. Now, a couple of things. We've heard nothing quote unquote official from any bachelor Warner brothers. Instagrams as relates to Tayshia being the Bachelorette. Is that true? I have not seen anything official official. Yeah, right. Because I know people's like, oh, it's Tayshia. And I think some of the outlets

like E and even people, you know, some like have said to pick Tayshia's new Bachelorette, but I've gotten no confirmation. my source inside the bubble won't confirm or deny this information and then which I find a lot of other bachelor franchise people in La Quinta that I don't hold too much weight with yeah I can tell you Hannah Ann's already out of the bubble yeah well Hannah Ann ann was there who else was there jared and ashley jared and ashley were there they're just doing becca was pictured there which is another also interesting yeah i think that the becca hannah ann i bet they had like a sit down with kind of thing yeah uh yeah nothing or would they would they just bring them there um to film something completely different to throw people off i don't think so

what i find interesting about them not announcing um tasia tasia that means something because there a lot goes into promoting your next lead you, you want people to be invested to get to know your Batch Threat. But they also don't want, if they confirm Tayshia, they also have to confirm that Claire left. And then that would also lead into confirming the gossip that she left with someone that everyone knows.

Sure, but wouldn't that create a, I mean, the buzz that- But why would you want to watch the first half of the season if you know who she leaves with because you want to see how she leaves yeah it's the how it's not the who yeah um i mean we we're talking about whoever season it claire season tasia season yeah now more than ever my favorite thing out of all of this the most fortuitous thing was um claire's tweet that didn't age well of uh respect me respect the rules respect the opportunity that you're given in regards to matt james yeah and then there she is the first person to ever leave halfway through film that we we know of yeah and i know like

yeah last week it was you know i i listen i've been i'm quote-unquote critical of if claire in fact quit for that reason uh i go back to like this is a tv show we're talking about so like it's no this like we criticize in this world and no one no one should be hating on claire no i always have to say that because like you you put stuff out there soulmate and she was like i don't want to make out with other guys for your television show props to her i mean like every every lead wants to do that yeah so that's i mean if there's what what is the the at stake in your contract if you leave early you're you owe them like a million dollars if you spoil the season what is it i don't remember it's something like that though it

might be maybe you can't say i honestly don't remember you know i don't i'm sure there's something in there uh they it would imagine the nightmare pr if they sued their lead yeah if they crew if they casted claire whatever the reason i mean they didn't do it to caitlin no i know that's what i'm saying like can you imagine what it would be like if even if claire you know broke the rules did things that were like clearly against the contract and then they sued the shit out of claire imagine the challenges they would have going forward of finding people to do that and it would also only be a million dollars like that's nothing for that size of a franchise like how much money they sure but it would be it could be life

ruining for the people they sue i guess i was just about to be like a million dollars yeah for warner brothers it's nothing or for people it's could be everything i guess so um so i but in in this case what i'm saying is when people say like good for her like yeah sure good for her yeah um i don't think she be should be awarded any medals in the world of The Bachelor because this is going to be amazing TV. I'm glad it happened. Like I've said before, this can only really be a one-off thing, right? If Matt James quits in three weeks

and this pattern happens where the lead feels emboldened to like just close up shop within the first two weeks when they lock eyes on someone this franchise is going to tailspin i mean this is really the only time because the other you know rumor is that they were talking in that break and so this is the only time where i think you would have that opportunity otherwise it's you have no idea who the cast is until you're already secluded and don't have a phone. Sure. I mean, that leads to like, yeah, if she was talking,

it was a little bit of the, you know, it certainly a lot of differences, but when Caitlin and I were talking and then they asked her to be the best, right. And then I showed up. Yeah. But yeah. But even then, you know, liking like if I played the Claire card, I would have quit after week three. Yeah. And just said, well, I'm going to pick Vanessa and I don't want to lead anyone on and I don't want to make out with so-and-so. And I'll just, if you don't let me just date Vanessa, I'm going to quit. Do you think that would have, because you said in the past that that was part of the issue is like seeing your other relationships develop. Do you think that that would have given you more

of an opportunity to succeed in that relationship? No, no. As far as what would Vanessa and I've had a better chance of succeeding? No, I, I, no, no. And if you want to learn more, why tune into my Patreon with Vanessa on September 1st, but we really come for that segue. Thank you, Kathy. No, we,

we do talk about it, but ultimately Vanessa and I were just weren't compatible. And sometimes the pressures of the bat sir world will bring up problems that you're inevitably going to figure out maybe later, much sooner. I do think that for the most part, the couples that were going to work, make it work. Because for all of the bullshit that the bachelor franchise

and having to fall in love through that process of making out with other people can challenge and damage a relationship, There are a lot of incentives too of making a relationship work so that, you know what I'm saying? Like there's a ton of relationships. I mean, put it this way. It's a safe bet that of all the bachelor relationships that end up ending they ended three or four months past when they should have right because they're worried about what the what people are going to say i mean there's financial implications like the reality is that you you're more valuable you're more valuable as a couple than you are as individuals that's just a fact and it's not like

you it's not enough to make you stay together forever yeah but it's certainly enough to make you go like let's fucking try to make this work i'm sure that's that's part of the reason of what um becca and um her dude are going through right now sure yeah i mean they're all real i'm sure becca and and garrett having real conversations that are not about money but it's i'm just saying that's in the back of your mind. So just like the, there's things that pull you down and there's things that make you not quit. Like, cause in real life, you're just like, well, fuck it, it's just not working.

And maybe you could have tried harder. Maybe you could have, would Vanessa and I ever gotten therapy if it weren't for like the pressures of trying to make it work? I mean, I've never gotten therapy with someone I't for like the pressures of trying to make it work i mean i have i've never gotten therapy with someone i was dating for seven months other than vanessa so take that for what you want yeah so yeah i don't know if it would have definitely mattered that way um if it is taisha are you excited about taisha yeah think I mean, she seems like such a sweet girl. She has some

interesting taste as far as JPJ. But no one wants to forget that. No. But yeah, I'm excited. I, I'm actually, I am one of the few people that I feel like likes when they stray from the pattern of you have the eight weeks of television and you pick one person at the end. I think this is more interesting because we've seen that formula so many times. So to have potentially two bachelors or bachelorettes and them not pitted against each other, I kind of feel bad that she only gets half a season and whatever picked through Claire's leftovers if

that's what it is that we don't really know yeah i mean they could add weeks that's the interesting part we have no idea this is the closest thing we're getting to a bachelor in paradise season this well it almost sounds you know the bringing hannah and bringing back up bringing uh ashley and jared um they've done that with like know, the sit downs and things like that. And they, you know, they brought Demi in for on Hannah's season a lot. They brought Hannah back on Peter's season. So they've been doing more and more of that,

but it does, this season is clearly going to have a little bit more of a Bachelor in Paradise feel. They canceled Bachelor in Paradise. So maybe that's a good thing. Cause there are like, they're not not traveling they're on location at this one i mean it wouldn't be the best to just watch someone make out with three different people on the same night or something yeah considering the times that we're in um maybe not the best pr

move but um it it will uh i'm really curious how how it all all breaks down but uh on the episode jason mesnick season they still were talking about claire like they were still building up claire and so either that being pre-recorded or i mean the fact that they haven't announced taisha yet are they going to promote her in the same way that they've been shoving claire down everyone's but here's the thing pre-recorded yes but if they had to uh when did this claire stuff start over a week ago oh like three two or three so they easily could have taken that stuff out of the jason's goat episode yeah they deliberately left that in well they definitely left it in. Chris Harrison asking Jillian about advice for Claire and how they thought she could

I'm saying they could have taken that out. Yeah. They could have probably. Do you know something that we don't know, Chrissy? No. I'm just, like, it's just such a prerecorded thing. Like, I think I just look at it differently. Like, I always, like, when I watch watch tv i look at tv differently as a person who

maybe they just they still want i get that it was clearly pre-recorded i can tell you they recorded it like i mean my goat episode recap that's been a couple weeks we did this four or five weeks ago yeah what i'm saying is you know when they edit it they lock in the episodes if they wanted to take that out because claire is like somehow going to be erased from this season and it's all i don't think she's going to be erased they could have edited that out yeah well they ali said they edited out her advice for claire so clearly they can but um well what here's what i mean like they edit out ali's advice for claire they edit a lot of it like you know when they did my interview they're editing it all they yeah they they shorten it down they edit out Ali's stuff in my in my

guess was because they didn't want that in there they edited what I'm saying is when they lock in the episode they're like here's our episode and we're gonna have this moment for Claire and then all of a sudden like oh shit this happened yeah we need to take this out what we have locked in they could have done that and they decided to jillian didn't really even say anything she just welcomed her into the sisterhood she wasn't like you have to pick the right person you have to do this this and this because then they would have taken it out if you've already done filming i bet somebody looked at it and was like trying to sit there and figure it out because that's what i would have done

looked at it and like okay so or do they want to spend that extra money yeah on an editor when it shows up i don't think it's nothing listen they haven't they haven't confirmed taisha that's clearly it's making us talk about it yeah i just don't think it's on purpose i think they just left it in they were like that basically it was too much money or it's too much work or it's not worth thinking it out. This is like, I'm a big Jason Bourne movie fan. Never seen one. Anyways, in the movies, he's like an assassin. They're like, maybe he's making a mistake. And she goes, they don't make mistakes.

And what I'm saying is nothing they do is on accident or not thought through ad nauseum. And if like there's something- It creates more speculation. So if they not announcing Tayshia and there is value in getting the audience excited about a certain person, and if they're making a last minute switch, you would think they would wanna prop up Tayshia.

There's a reason why. I don't know what that reason is, but I'm safe to say that they're going, they're like Claire, I still think is going to be a big part of this season. I don't, and so is probably seems like Tasha, but nothing official has come out about Tasha. And I'm curious as to why.

I would think they would want to try to do that. I'm curious because we got the news that she was there and then she would have had to quarantine for some time. Yeah. So maybe they didn't want to announce anything until she was actually filming. I think she's been... Until she's actually COVID free. Yeah.

Well, my understanding is they bring people in from my friends who have gone. You take a test. You have to go there for four or five days. You take another test. Those people aren't making out with anyone. I don't know. I mean, I don't know. That's the difference is all of my friends

who are back on sets, like the ones who have gone to Vancouver to film, they have to quarantine by themselves for 14 days, no matter what's going on. Well, if it's in Vancouver, Canada has a whole different. Yeah, I mean, it's great. But here even too

is like you're expected to quarantine all of the athletes. I don't know the... But it seems like they've been filming and I can't imagine they would put all of Claire's guys

Maybe they're still filming with Claire and her dude. Maybe. I... My guess... Have they left? Is that... I thought I saw somewhere

that they were in a house somewhere on the same property, but like in a villa on the property. That would make sense. Yeah. I just don't, I, if they're still filming,

they're filming with again, like assuming it's Tayshia. They also probably don't want to risk having this dude and Claire. Out and about. No, even on a plane home. Also, could you imagine the nightmare okay you bring all these

guys in they got to quarantine for 10 days yeah right then you start filming with claire claire's like eh picked my guy yeah you pause the time out you don't know what to do maybe you bring some guys back and then like we will bring in taisha and she has to do another two weeks of quarantine so these people are just sitting in the house for 14 days. I mean, I think they have to do, if they're going to bring in Tasia, I think she's going to have to be quarantined. I mean, I am really curious about all that

because I don't have the answers and those are all the questions we have in terms of how do they make that work. I would, I will want to hear from these guys who had to quarantine for 10 days. Listen to Claire, just be like peace come back be like we got an and be like what and just sit there tasia huh i mean i'm sure there's some excitement because maybe guys who felt like they got no connection with with claire that'll also be super interesting for did filming continue in the times that the guys had no lead there because you'd have to

think if there were fights going on or whatever yeah no i when i you know when i read the text from inside the bats for bubble and i keep saying this there's good at adjusting it's fascinating when i've talked to some of these producers having gone through these experiences and they seem like these mad scientists and so smart and they're like you must have planned this all out and you only come out and find out they're just like man we had no idea what we were fucking doing this happened we got so lucky with this they're literally in the trenches just like there's a lot of using your best. Yeah, but it is fascinating to see how they do that stuff and how some of it is luck, some of it is planned, some of it is things don't work out.

And then there is editing, then they kind of massage it. And that is really all kind of fascinating. But the behind the scenes is, I'm as fascinated as any other season of what it was like, what they were experiencing. I hope they allow, if we have some of these people on the podcast to talk about that experience,

what that was like to get that kind of sense of being locked in and getting excited about Claire and then getting excited about Taysh and then getting excited about tasha dude also no one's talking about this and it's probably not that big a deal but that area of california right now is anywhere between like 110 and 115 degrees every single day i did it for two days just for a friend's birthday and it was miserable so they're inside an air conditioning outside in an oven but yeah you're either you're like 120 degrees like all the time yeah it's not ideal it's not you know because i don't care what resort you're at just heat exhaustion and like

probably delirious yeah and it's it's crazy it's uh because you know paradise is is a little paradise there's no air conditioning so that sucks but you are literally on the beach and you have the wind and it's super humid but you're only wearing a swimsuit and you get to kind of roam around and it's actually the food's great and i you have a great time but but to just be laying on a pool floaty for 10 days not sure if like there's another bachelorette like this is how i die can we set up all dates inside of a ballroom and not being able and not being able to like interact with people that's why when they say there's so a lot of people are falling in love i believe that because none of the dates are allowed to be outside of this resort either are they no so you

can't the whole experience big brother the whole experience is about withholding love i mean you fall in love on that show not because you get to spend a lot of time with people because you don't get to spend any time with someone and you make a connection with someone and they pull you away you're just like no bring it bring it back like you know clara was just like all i want to do is spend time with this guy and they were like no bring it bring it back like you know clara was just like all i want to do is spend time with this guy and they were like no you got to spend time with this guy and they had to like take dale away whoever this dale guy is and she was like no give me more dale taisha's in for uh she's in in for it because it's going to be even more complicated and more confusing as the lead of

right reasons he's just going to come in and there's going to be that one guy that's just all sunburned. Yeah. Right. I want to, I said this on the chicks in the office podcast. I want to see the date. I don't know how long they film. We speculated 12,

13 days with Claire. So there's, there's been some dates. There's been some interactions with other guys. Clearly is going to be a lot of Claire and Dale, but she clearly had talked to some other guys. And I want to see the guy or guys who had time with Claire and were like she's amazing I'm falling in love she's great I can't I'm just I love Claire Claire Lee's with Dale Tasha comes in

yep I want Asia I love Tasha I want that guy to get the first I want that guy to get the first one. I want that guy to get the first one-on-one. If there's another guy other than Dale who has fallen hard for Claire, I want him to have the first one-on-one with Tayshia. I mean, Tayshia, I feel like, would have the most valid reasons for going into a season as the Bachelorette thinking, what if some guy doesn't choose me at the end? as the bachelorette thinking what if some guy doesn't choose me at the end like that out of any season because none of them even thought she was in the realm of possibilities of being cast yeah realistically i don't i get what you're saying realistically i mean no one's there for

claire or taisha then no one's there for me or Ben you know certainly it's this one it was um they said it was Claire they announced it was Claire they started filming immediately then had a break so all of the the men that were there knew that it was going to be Claire the reality is is like you it's it's just as likely that many or most of those guys would have preferred Tayshia anyways to Claire or vice for you know like it's just they probably thought the worst part about the season was going to be that they couldn't travel yeah they get thrown all of this yeah it uh it is crazy but uh i'm i'm curious to see how taisha handles i'm clear curious to see if taisha kind of comes in with

this like i'm so grateful i'm so happy for Claire. Does she get engaged in the end? And I'm so happy that I get to do this. Or does Taysha come in with more of a, I don't know if I could trust these guys, kind of chip on her shoulder, kind of thing, you know. And Taysha is measured. I mean, Taysha got super mad at me

because I said she was boring TV. I mean, that's kind of an insult. Is it though? Well, boring i i don't know i don't maybe she stopped listening at boring if you just i think if you're boring tv that has nothing to do with you being you could be an actual human being like real human beings it's not dramatic you choose not to like insert yourself and click baitable TV moments. I don't see that as a criticism to anyone. Yeah. But she got super mad at me.

She unfollowed me as a result. She hates me. So I just think, but my point is, I know she's, you know, as we all are, we're sensitive.

We care what people think. I'm curious how measured she will be. I was excited about Claire because what I love about Claire is she doesn't give a fuck. Interesting television. we care what people think i'm curious how measured she will be i was excited about claire because what i love about claire is she don't give a fuck she might she might tweet this shit about matt jay only do the same shit two weeks later that is great tv yep taste is a little more thought through you know yeah and that might make her more polished, more easier to be a friend. I don't, a lot of things. It may, may not.

Are you trying to get that follow back? You're really milking it. But I'm just articulating my criticism of, which is not criticism of the person that I don't, I'm curious how Tayshia will be. Yeah. Clearly a ton of the men will be into Tayshia. That makes for great TV. How many men are still there how many men are i'm curious how taisha will approach it i think that'll be

fascinating um and i hope she really goes for it and and puts herself pushes puts herself out there because all we've seen is taisha it was jpj and who der? Who was she? Derek for a second. What? She was on Colton season. No, I know. But like in Paradise. Yeah. Derek after Demi. So like that was her only choice.

I'm curious. Derek and JPJ. Because Paradise is sometimes a little bit of a preview of how like, you know, Tayshia was sought after in Paradise. Yeah. So she was kind of.

I'm surprised that she continued that JPJ relationship post filming, post show. show it's interesting you never she likes that quirky little kind of i don't know you never know what people's motives are you know it didn't last no um spoiler yeah so i uh i'm as excited as I ever thought I would be for this particular season. Disappointed we don't get to see Claire date, go through the traditional process, but I am excited to see how it goes down,

how it's all handled. She knows what she wants. And I'm excited to see, assuming it's Tayshia, nothing official, but it should should be it'll be fun to get some new content for sure uh kathy any final thoughts anything you want to let the people know what you're doing no i think i'm just i'm excited for yeah baking writing um coming on this show before and after where can they buy your cookies follow me on instagram at Kathy Kelly.

I did some like quarantine kitchen stuff, but I'm still baking and posting it. And maybe I'll upload some more recipes soon. Well, it's always fun to talk Bachelor or Bachelorette with you. Thanks for having me. We'll have to bring you back when Claire season is going on. If you get those early screeners, I'm going to be here every week. I got you.

Thank you so much for coming. Always fun. Don't forget to subscribe. Tune in. What do we got tomorrow? Pastor Miles. Pastor Miles. Going to love that episode.

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