The Viall Files - E34 Your Picker is Off with Amanda Stanton

Episode Date: August 14, 2019

Good friend and fellow Bachelor alum Amanda Stanton joins us today to talk about her new book, Now Accepting Roses. But first, Nick dishes on Ashley and Jared’s wedding, we recap Bachelor in Paradise, and Nick gives his opinion on Blake releasing those text messages. Then, Amanda opens up about her dating history and why her “picker is off.” We then take some vulnerable calls from fans. Avoid medians, pay attention to red flags, and learn from your mistakes. Be sure to rate and subscribe so you never miss an episode! Thanks to our sponsors: NOOM: https://www.noom.com/viall ROTHY’S: https://rothys.com/viall RAYCON: https://buyraycon.com/viall PROACTIV: https://www.proactiv.com/nick See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Welcome! Oh God, hello! Wow, so they dropped in with the welcome there, hi! Welcome to another episode of Vow Files, I'm your host Nick, we have Suge. Thank you for having me. And Rochelle as always. What an exciting episode. I,

this is probably my favorite episode. What? I love Amanda. Don't say. Amanda Stanton, our very special guest, we'll get to her

momentarily. I'm very excited. I wasn't here for this interview so I'm just here to listen along with everyone else who's listening

so I can't wait to hear. Yeah, well you really missed out. Wow. It's great. Don't you and Amanda to hear. Yeah, well, you really missed out. Wow. It's great. Don't you and Amanda have a nice friendship? We have a great friendship. I actually saw Amanda this weekend at Ashley and Jared's wedding.

What a wedding. Rochelle just grabbed my hand with excitement. What a wedding. Was it pretty? It was. I mean, honestly, it's so funny. Ashley and Jared, you didn't expect anything less. But it was.

I was in awe. You were in awe? Just it anything less, but it was, I was in awe. You were in awe? It was just, it was top notch. It was really well executed. It was really, the mansion that their reception was at was actually at the mansion that the first great Gatsby movie was filmed with Robert Redford,

of which I didn't even know that at the time i got a lot of people commenting how i looked very gatsby-ish you did what a hot photo anyways um was um was it because i know like caitlin was there was that weird what you're so weird why am i weird no i saw caitlin and jason we all hung out. Have you seen her recently? It was great. Last time I saw Caitlin, I haven't seen her in person in a while, but we have spoken. Yeah, you squashed it a little bit on the phone, didn't you? Totally. I think Caitlin and I hopefully soon will be doing each other's podcast. We had some discussions about it.

We'll see. TBD? Maybe. I don't know. But no, it was great to see her and Jason we all all hung out

and had a good time the wedding was fantastic I know some people on my Instagram I posted a little like Ben and I recreating When Harry Met Sally

that was really good that was because at Ashley and Jared's wedding I don't think either Ashley and Jared are overly religious

and so all weddings are different while Ashley and Jared in wedding. I don't think either Ashley and Jared are overly religious and so all weddings are different. Well, Ashley and Jared in the true form of their passions, instead of doing readings from the Bible

at their wedding, at the wedding ceremony, they had their friends do clips from their favorite movies. The first one was from Jerry Maguire. That's so sweet.

Aw. I love that. And the second one was from when Harry met Sally and I was asked to do that scene. Wait, were you Billy Crystal or were you? You were off book. I was off book. I was off book.

I got asked to do it that morning. I said, sure. And I felt like I got an applause from the audience and I was fine. Do you remember any of it? Yeah, I could do it right now. Do it. This was at the ceremony? It was at the ceremony.

I want to hear some of it. I've been doing a lot of thinking and the thing is, I love you. And she goes, what? And I go, I love you. Well, how do you want me to respond to that? Well, how about I love you too? And then something, something, something.

And then I give this whole monologue. Who did you do it with? Her childhood best friend. Oh, cute. It was a fantastic wedding. So congratulations to Ashley and Jared. It was truly, it was a great weekend. I got to see a lot of my friends. It was an absolutely, the weather,

I mean the weather all weekend was like perfect. It was a non-humid 78 degrees all weekend and sunny. It was really, I was really impressed. It's a really great, it was emotional and fun and exciting. And I got to see some great people. It was a really special weekend and I'm very happy for them. And I had a ton of fun. Did you get any action?

No. I did ask Amanda to dance. Amanda and I danced. I was like, hey, I mean, let's-. Did you get any action? No. I did ask Amanda to dance. Amanda and I danced. I was like, hey, I mean, let's- Amanda and you? Amanda. Oh, Amanda. Our guest this episode, Shug.

I don't know if you- I'm sorry. It took me- Yeah. No, I mean, Amanda's a good friend, as you know, and we'll talk about it on this episode. But yeah, we had a nice little dance. And yeah. No, she's a friend yeah um i think i think amanda and

i and and tanya rad right had been the only single people there no way like everyone oh my goodness but i didn't go there to fuck i went there to celebrate love was that in your speech speech i did give a speech at the uh uh the the uh rehearsal dinner i got a little choked up everyone else cried too oh batch nation has seen that before am i right the only reason i know that is because you've shown me a clip of you crying which you have to see it wasn't that like i did anyways uh congratulations congratulations yeah congratulations wonderful friends yay congratulations Ashley and Jared

Bachelor in Paradise yeah I know you have some strong feelings be sure we get to Amanda it's first of all it's a great season so far I want to backtrack

and get a little I have some strong opinions on on on this whole Blake and Kalen drama it literally came out right after we recorded last week Rochelle being the I have some strong opinions on this whole Blake and Kaylin drama. It literally came out right after we recorded last week.

Rochelle being the opportunist that she was only cared about the fact that we couldn't cover this last week. I was in, you know, we talked about, I was at Ashley and Jared's wedding to talk to a lot of bachelor friends. A lot of people also have opinions on this topic. I also learned some information about this, this, and I have some strong, I'm a, it's interesting because I tweeted something about, you know, Oh, in the, on the show, I've had some, uh, my experiences. I've had texts with people of which had I released them, I could have maybe changed other people's opinions. I just have a serious problem with, withake revealing these texts about kaylin even if it may be in out of context i mean i think both people look bad right i'm not

necessarily even defending kaylin and let's say she lied or stretched the truth um yeah is she maybe a little over dramatic fine but like we also don't know in which the con like we're all basing this off of an edit that we're watching on tv of which kaylin was talking about how blake tried to silence her or that she regretted the experience right i mean is it a kind of a dick thing to say is is blake a criminal because he had sex with someone and said oh we shouldn't have done that? No, it's just kind of a dick thing. My problem with the whole text part is,

what did we think about Blake after watching? Before the text messages were released, what did we think about Blake? We kind of thought he was basically a douchey fuckboy, right? Yeah, he just came off like a player, like he's's playing right yeah and so on this show or in general general this this season oh for bachelor that after before the text message release yeah his edit if you want to call it that and his actions on there made us all kind of think well i guess blake's a douchey fuck and that's kind of what chris teased on our podcast correct right and then as a result of that,

Blake decided to release these text messages that he shared that were private conversations with him and Kaylin about a night, of which that we're gonna totally throw her under the bus. And so the problem I have with that is Blake knew it was going to affect her. And then he deleted the text messages 10 minutes later. Right.

I know by talking to a lot of people over the weekend that Blake admitted, I know that she's going to look bad. Right. I know that he threatened people about releasing these text messages for months in anticipation of this coming up, which makes it all that more premeditated.

And then he ended up deleting it when it got really nasty. But it's not like he didn't realize this whole idea. I didn't think this would affect her the way it did. He knew. He admitted to it. There's texts out there of him saying this. Thankfully, those people aren't going down the same path Blake did and releasing them.

But like it was premeditated. He knew it. It makes it all that much more nasty. He also, Blake, asked the advice of many people before he released these text messages every one of them advised him not to do it everyone well i can't say everyone i mean usually when you ask a bunch of people for advice and they keep telling you what you don't want to hear that's why you ask a bunch of people right because you want someone to agree with you i'm sure someone in his circle agreed

with him a lot of people who were part of bachelor nation who is it advice he asked told them not to do it and he did it anyways the problem i have with it is like all blake's trying to do is and that's break's problem to begin with like is it a crim a crime that blake had a bunch of sex after getting dumped by Becca? No. He's allowed to do that. It doesn't make him a criminal. It might make him a douchey little fuck boy. But Blake is.

Listen, the problem is this whole weekend of stagecoach, Blake and his apology note on Instagram. Yeah, it's up here. He's trying to paint it as this one weekend of poor judgment. And again, it's not a crime, like blake it wasn't a weekend you had a bunch of sex there's stories out there all over and it's to the point like i i witnessed it other people have witnesses in the brief times we you hang out with him he's been told by friends and acquaintances like myself or like hey man slow down buddy and again that doesn't make him a bad It just makes him kind of a fuck boy and maybe a little bit douchey. We've all

made mistakes. We've all had our bad moments. But Blake, the problem I have with this whole scenario is Blake tried to show up to paradise and pretend to be someone he's not. He wanted people to keep thinking he was, say, more Ben Higgins than some other fuck boy. And it didn't go his way. And then he decided to retali boy. And it didn't go his way. And then he decided to retaliate. And it was a retaliation to release these text messages, even if it was painting a picture. And maybe there was, and again, I'm not defending Kalen.

I'm just simply saying he knew that it was gonna be out of context. And he knew that she was gonna get hate for it. And it was more important for him to try to change people's opinions back to like, oh, Blake is just a sweet boy who this was just one weekend where he got a little drunk

and had a little bit of sex. No, he's been like fucking like crazy for an entire year. And what buddy, that's fine. And had Blake showed up to paradise, walked up and met Chris Harrison and Chris was like, hey, Blake's good to see you. How's your year been?

Well, Chris, I gotta be honest with you. You owned it. And when Becca broke my heart, I was crushed. And you know what? I responded maybe not the best way. I'm not necessarily, but I've had a lot of sex, Chris. I mean, I have been sleeping with everyone. In fact, I'm a little nervous to go down these stairs because while I don't know who's down there and I'm not great at math, I'm pretty sure there's a couple of people down there I've banged. And I'm a little nervous about what they're going to say to me and i guarantee you if he would have said that america would have been like hey i've been there it's the problem is he's trying to pretend he's something he's not and he's not the blake that we all that he loved his edit and

he loved that everybody revered him thought he was the sweetest guy ever and he tried to pretend he's still that guy all while going down and and having some sex and being and he's just stupid well and we found out this week that he went to visit hannah g before yeah i mean what do you think hannah i mean yes i mean again it's all premeditated and then he goes and asks out taisha yeah bizarre uh listen i mean you know who knows he you know, who knows? Blake might be like, oh, the producers told me I should, like, again, producers don't have a gun to your head. And that's the problem is he went in with some plan.

Him and Hannah had this plan. And we went, Hannah, when Dylan comes up and is talking to Blake and then, and like Hannah just looks like in that moment she's just staying there and literally not saying anything. Yeah. And it was just more like

her trying to figure out who will give me the most Instagram followers in that moment. That's just kind of the impression. She's just for Blake to go down there

and they kind of I don't know what that was but it seemed like a very planned event of which they kind of had a plan. what that was but it seemed like a very planned event of which they kind of had a plan and listen they're not the first people who go in there to make out in front of dylan you mean no to like date on paradise oh to do yeah obviously that was their plan that happens all the time and whatever so i'm not criticizing them for that per se it's just more like it's not cool cool that Hannah wasn't honest about it.

And I just, again, this whole like, as far as the text messages go, this is who Blake is and that's fine. That doesn't make him a bad person. It makes him a fuck boy. It makes him potentially a shitty guy for being willing to throw other people under the bus to protect an image that isn't accurate about himself. Just to, I mean, this is probably annoying, but isn't that kind of what you did with Andy?

You kind of threw her under the bus. Oh, a lot of people, again, I'm not defending, again, what the problem is, I had a lot of people, like when I text something, I wasn't, I've, how many times have we, have you talked about like, I wish I didn't do it. Right, right, right. And I'm not justifying it. That was a live moment of which I regretted saying that in the moment. Is this the, why did you meet love to me then?

Yeah. Yeah. And again, like, I don't think Blake's necessarily, but, but again, finding out that for months Blake had considered these release of text messages, asked people's advice, got advice about not to do it, still do it. Asked a million. It wasn't a spur moment. Admitted to people he knew it was going to make her look bad

et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. Like not cool. I mean, again, we all make mistakes in a reactive moment. We all respond emotionally. And like I've said before, I often regret those times in life where I've reacted emotionally. I never regret not reacting emotionally,

letting time settle, and then maybe reacting in a way that isn't based off of my emotion. Yeah, what do you think about, Chris Harrison said in an interview for the Hollywood Reporter that it's the same. It's akin to releasing someone's nude pictures dean said that not chris harrison did chris harrison say that too yeah chris harrison um that's a little strong i mean i think nudes are

um it's a violation of trust and also texts are completely out of context as kaylin said blank and and uh Kaylin dated before, before this whole stagecoach weekend, and that's when he allegedly ghosted her, which all could still be very accurate. That has nothing to do with these texts. These texts are basically a night at stagecoach where they're both drunk,

and she wants a little sex. That doesn't make anything she said not true prior to that. It just means that in that moment, she still wanted to have sex with Blake, and it doesn't mean that the next day, she still wanted to have sex with Blake. Yeah. And it doesn't mean that the next day she, he could still could have been like, we shouldn't have done that,

which is all fine. Yeah. He's allowed to say that. And we can all judge whether he was douchey for saying that or kind of a dick. It doesn't make it untrue. Yeah. I think what Blake said was shitty. What he did was shitty.

I think it's 10 times shittier that it was premeditated. He knew, and he was only, he only gave a shit about his false narrative that he wanted to maintain. He was told by friends not to go to paradise because like, dude, there's no way this isn't going to come out.

There's no way your activities for the past year isn't going to come out. And he still went and that's on Blake. And to try to like a last ditch effort to save his brand was to throw Kalen under the bus. And again, I'm not defending Kalen if she was exaggerated or whatever, that's not okay too. It's a bad look for everyone.

I'm just more talking about what Blake did and his whole general thing. I will say on Paradise, I don't know what you guys think, but I do find it fascinating so far this season that you have Dylan, the guy who's just, I want to be with Hannah. And you have Blake, the guy who's like,

eh, I don't know. We'll see. I'm going to play my field, play the field, play his field. I don't know. And it's so funny out there. I'm watching this episode and how many of us, even Amanda coming up on this episode

talks about her poor taste in men or how she's always going off the wrong thing or the red, every time a guy shows a red flag, it's almost like a shiny toy that we wanna fix. Hannah in past episodes going after the wrong guy. And here you are again, the seemingly nice, goodlooking guy in dylan who at worst might be a little soft uh and then like she's getting all her friends are telling you

her demi don't do this blake's an idiot and yet hannah is just seemingly she seems way more into blake yeah she seems like she's just like if if she feels like blake's fully into her yeah he's she's feel like she's ready to set dylan aside yeah right i don't know i think so well her face when dylan was kissing her neck was just like she was like it's somewhere else not there right i i mean i don't know it just seems like she is reluctantly dating Dylan because he's nice. Do we think that it's more of the, you know, more than anything because they are,

it's just, this whole thing is so weird because like they're in this like time restraint. You're, it's almost like they're in a weird science project is all I keep seeing because, and I'm wondering if like the, the basic psychology of humanity comes out in these things.

And that being, we want what we can't have and what's presented to us in an easy way is kind of human nature as we tend to kind of turn our nose at it. So, you know, the one guy, the dark haired one, not Blake. What's his name? Sorry. Dylan. Dylan. I know. Dylan.

Dylan. But Dylan is like, I'm here for this i'm in it's easy for her to turn to him he's sweet he wants it whereas blake like you said he's like one foot in one foot out and it's like for hannah time restraint is there they only have four weeks like that pull is just naturally stronger dylan's a stage five clinger. That's unattractive to everybody. I don't know. I feel like if Dylan played it a little differently and not as like sure, I bet she would be more into.

Well, to your point, it is fascinating watching the show because again, this whole Hannah Blake meetup in Alabama is a very strategic play and all about like, how can we maximize our time on the show? That's what I'm saying.

Like it's such a, especially this one getting to know the bachelor with you all you know last season was really interesting because this is like slower burn because it's one person whereas this one all of these people are in the science project totally it's a little different listen and everyone

responds differently some people are like Demi didn't talk to anyone you know a lot of people don't I mean when I went on I went on, like Jen and I talked a little bit before. Oh, you did? Yeah, we met at a party we had talked before. And all of a sudden, like when you go on, when I went to Paradise and I showed up and Jen and I talked about it, I'm like, I'm not lying to anyone. I showed up and I'm like, I don't know when Jen's coming.

But if Jen shows up, I'm going to ask her on a date. And I was like, Amanda, I'm going to ask. I showed up. I'm like, I don't know when Jen's coming, but if Jen shows up, I'm going to ask her on a date. And I was like, Amanda, I'm going to ask, just see. I showed up. I'm like, I'm here for basically Jen. She wasn't there. So we can go into every one fucking new that when Jen showed up, if Jen showed up, I was going to ask her out. And it was like, if I get sent home before she shows up, so be it.

It is what it is. Don't lie. Just don't lie when you go down there and again people like everyone's talking before paradise now literally everyone there's so many events where it's impossible not to meet but this whole like what people are doing is they're like negotiating with each other and then thinking that's not going to get out and they start having all these other relationships but to say you meet someone and talk and express a mutual interest like and then they start lying.

Hannah is just as, like, Hannah's excuse, well, I didn't want to, I thought it was between Blake and whatever, and I don't want to call him out. Like, I think Hannah, she's, she, here's what I don't get. These situations that happen with Hannah, and then who is the other girl who's going out with Clay? Nicole. What are these fights where these two guys are basically arguing in front of these women that's kind of hot it reminds me of like

that's kindergarten guys like fighting over you you fascinate me so much rochelle we're like i'm watching it i'm watching it i'm the guy here and you are constantly just like you know losing your shit about this random like you know uh like you, like men and women dynamics and all the stereotypes are out there. Losing my shit. Listen, you have triggers and that's fine. But all of a sudden I'm watching two guys talking about a girl right in front of her debating what's best for her. Oh, no, that bothered me. Yeah.

Why don't they just ask her? Also, why don't these women speak up? Why don these women go why are these women letting it happen yeah there is something hot about it i think that's what it is fought over that's like goes back to like whatever time it's such a double standard you guys confuse me why i'm told i'm thinking i was judging hannah for watching two guys fight over her like that and watching two guys talk and try to figure out what's best for her. That is true. That's a good point.

Why wasn't she like, hey guys, hey, listen, if she wants to talk to Blake, why don't she go, Dylan, listen, I'm sorry, but I want to finish this conversation. No, you're right. Why did she awkwardly make two guys fight right in front of her and just be like, I'm sorry. She didn't make them. They were going off on their own and yes she was standing there listening of course she could have interrupted but they're also twice her size

and she was just standing there playing with her ponytail i mean the whole thing again she's playing a game these people aren't really into anybody and they're playing games she's probably sitting there thinking like how does this play best on tv is it if they keep fighting or if it isn't 100 what she was doing i totally agree i just think in general when listen you talk about women having a voice speak up no i agree with that that did bother me too and they're like this is what she wants no this is what she wants like she's literally right there but why doesn't she speak up and say no guys this is what i want you guys talk about having a voice all the time fucking use the voice in the situation but you need to point the finger

what do you mean the guys should have asked her not they absolutely should have i don't think the guys should be doing it either but why doesn't why doesn't these women take the time to say why are you guys talking about what i want let me tell you hey i find i'm watching this episode i'm like oh really what i'm really curious what rochelle's gonna think about this guy and now she walks in she's like god that was fucking hot you know i was wet the whole time i'm like what really i didn't huh i thought you're gonna be like oh mad and shit and like i'm surprised that you didn't like dylan oh no not into the way he's acting. No, I mean, I get that. And he does look a little soft, but it seems sometimes.

Like value yourself. Totally. But we're all in fairness to Dylan. We're seeing. Well, we'll see how he takes this because I feel like this move of Hannah's with the making out on the beach. And because she like turned down the date. So that gave him hope. Right. And then she comes back to him and and then she goes and makes out with the other guy on the beach so now dylan really needs to shut it down and dylan he's not some wet blanket who's

not objecting to anything she's doing he's like well this is fucked up or but you know he's that's true he's he's taking stands but he's this want he wants to keep giving her every opportunity to like him and his his his rope is long you know his rope is very long and we're not talking about his dick i mean i have no idea maybe he's trying um but uh yeah yeah i don't know know I hope you enjoyed this episode with Amanda Stanton and yeah until next week Amanda Stanton hi how are you I'm good

thanks for coming thanks for having me very excited about this Amanda and I have been friends for some time now we were talking about this before we started recording we met I feel like i feel like i met you for the first time at uh what's that bougie bar that likes like people go to it's on uh la cienega so we met at warwick but it was after no not that one i feel like well that's also

a bougie bar i feel like we're really shaming ourselves right now in terms of where the places we've it wasn't nice guy nice guy was it nice yes thank you oh i did meet you yes that was the first time i met amanda just randomly i was like i don't really go to nice guy uh but i got my my friends were going and then you walked in with a friend and yeah that was the first time i met you and then you were asking me who i thought was going to be the bachelorette yeah and. And then the second, no, I think that was the second time I met you. You think so? Yeah. I remember the first time I met you was at Woman Tell All.

How we all went out after. Yes. To Warwick. Also, again, ran into them. No. No. I don't believe that for a second. You were at our table.

I swear to God. I swear to God. I was out with some friends and stumbled upon the entire cat i really no i swear what a coincidence i swear i swear to god you i was there first i didn't talk to anyone from that at the time i wasn't talking to any of you women that's surprising um no i really wasn't okay um certainly no one who showed up that's for sure and um and i was like i i was not thrilled because again at this point keep in mind i i was this was before paradise yeah i had the thing with caitlin the year before and i didn't want to

look like ben z showed up i remember and he's like a thing like the guys that show up to the woman tell all totally and i remember benzy was in thirsty like bachelor thirst ben ben that's why he doesn't want to admit it ben dm'd me and he was like hey no ben dm'd me and he was just like oh he's like you're i'm in town i'm like oh we should get together and i'm like what are you planning on doing and he goes well i'm gonna definitely meet up with the girls from tell all i'm like well i'm not doing that and then i went i was some friends i went to warwick and then they all showed up i had no idea that the universe really conspired in your favor yeah anyways uh it was a lovely time and that's when we hung out yeah and you helped me find my phone that i lost amanda lost her phone yeah did you think you were gonna

be you were in the running for the bachelorette no No. No? Not at all. That's not true. No, I really didn't. I never did. I don't believe you. I swear to God. I mean, everyone, okay, don't get me wrong. When you get eliminated from your season, you have that moment where you're like, could it be me?

But also, I don't think I was in a place where I could have handled that. You would have turned it down? No, okay, you always say this. Of course, You would have turned it down? No, okay. You always say this. Of course, I wouldn't turn it down, but I just don't think I would have been a good bachelorette. That's a different, that's honest.

And I don't necessarily agree with that. But I felt like, I feel like when you asked a nice guy, when you're asking me who I thought was going to be the bachelorette. Did I really ask you that? Yeah, I definitely remember. I remember because I didn't know who you were at this time. And here, like, who do you think is going to be the bachelorette. Did I really ask you that? Yeah, I definitely remember. I can't, I remember because I didn't know who you were at this time and here like, who do you think is gonna be the bachelorette?

Do you think it could be so and so? And all I remember is like, she wants, I'll be like, she was like, you're kind of fishing. Yeah, okay. It's fine. Maybe I was a little thirsty back then. I just dropped the show. Hey, to your point, you're right.

You don't go and you don't finish top four or five and keep in mind, none of us have done this at this point your first time. You get eliminated, you're right you don't go and you don't you don't finish top four or five and keep in mind none of us have done this at this point your first time you get eliminated you're bummed and like the consolation prize is could it i wonder if i could be like there's nothing wrong with that and anyone who says otherwise is lying that's true yeah i mean i it's it's totally true it doesn't mean that's why you went doesn't mean the whole time but it's like you just got dumped. You're just like, well, I don't know. What's next? What's next? I do think, I don't know how it is now. I do think at least back in the day,

most people never really imagined being the Bachelorette or their Bachelor because it felt so surreal. Would you agree? Yeah. No, I get what you mean yeah you know like i can't believe i got casted on the show right let alone like have your own and then you know all your friends are like oh you could be the next bachelor you're like no way i'm like i can't even like i'm going home week one yeah but now people are thinking of that at the get-go i think like it's changed a lot i think it's changed just because there's such a i don't even know if it's necessarily the lead but i think everyone's going in with these uh

it's all about the followers it's all about the followers now for you don't i mean the the jed drama and like all like and again not to shit on the girls in the franchise i think the men and the women are just as guilty on both sides of any type of insincerity of going on the show. It is not just the men at all. Would you agree? Yeah, I agree. I do think though that the attention is different. This is always what I say is that like, okay, so yeah, like, you know, the Instagram fame and all that, like girls and guys probably are equally as guilty when it comes to that but when it comes to the attention that you get from the show like a majority of people that watch the show are women so your followers are all women right so like when

you're a girl and you go on the show your followers are like where'd you get that shirt what kind of makeup are you wearing when you're a guy and you go on the show they're like hey take me home like so i feel like it's like guys that probably didn't get a whole lot of attention before the show, like love the attention, where like the girls on the show don't really get the same kind of attention, if that makes sense.

I agree. I get what you're saying, that there's a different type of attention and that when the men go out in public, it's a lot of, ah, you know, a little bit of that. And the women certainly get approached, but it's a lot of uh you know a little bit of that and the women and the women certainly get approached but it's differently also the men especially the bachelor guys are also fucking tall right so you're also standing out in a crowd i mean amanda goes out in a crowd she's five foot

three most people don't even see i do think the guys get a little bit more attention that way and it's fleeting and i kind of um but yeah but i don't know that's i don't think that's why the men go on no but they they like like it afterwards you know they take advantage of it after it changes them you dated well you dated some that maybe were particularly notorious in that space. Maybe one. One in particular, Robbie. That's like his, that's his life. What's his life? That's what he lives for.

I was once told from, not Amanda, that it was actually a hairdresser on a show I just shot, a scripted show. Yeah. And she had met Robbie and some of the other guys. And I was told that they admit their shtick, their thing. What they do is they go out to the bars and they'll get approached and noticed by women about being on the show. You think Robbie still gets noticed? Of course.

I think he told me this actually. I did tell him. I told him that when we were in New York. here's their shtick. It's like, it's a it's literally, they've admitted that they're, they basically will go up to, and then they tell these girls that they can get them on the show. They can get them casted. No. And they're like, oh, you can totally

go on the show. I'll show you, I'll get you in you in i'll make all the introductions and they use that to sleep with them and then obviously never get them and then we're getting on the show and the other the hairdresser is telling me this story and she's like does that really work and the guys are like oh 100 every time it works like a charm and these are like 21 22 year old women that they're you know girl they'll go to places that are like strong in the college community. In like college towns. Uh-huh. Yeah.

Wow. Robbie Hayes. Yeah, it's gross. You never use a bachelor to get. People ask me, should I go on the show? I'm like, probably not. I mean, listen, I'm like, you know, like, listen, if you get the opportunity what i always tell people if you don't have to sacrifice anything that you aren't willing to never get back

then go no i'm serious like dark well but that's the truth like if you have a dream job don't quit your dream job if you won't get it back that's true uh if if you have a boyfriend you love don't break up with him if you think he's the one or a girlfriend but if you know if you don't really like your job or you don't have a job or you can always get that job again and you're dating someone and you're like i've haven't think about bringing over them anyways. Why not? Go for it. Yeah, no, I agree. Right? Yeah. Rochelle, what? Oh, I just wonder, like, are you like, happy with how it's all turned out for you? Like being on

The Bachelor? Yeah, no, I always say the same thing, too. I'm like, oh, this is really close to my mouth. There's like pros and cons, you know? Yeah. Like you have moments where you're like- Depression. Yeah. Loneliness.

Yeah. You have moments sometimes where you're like, oh, I kind of wonder what my life would be like if I had never done it. Sure. But then you also have so many good opportunities. What do you think your life would be like if you've never done this?

I honestly don't know. Do you think you- I was going through like a huge life change already during the time that I went on the show. So it was, I don't know. You're single now. Yeah. Do you think had you not done the show, you would still be single?

I honestly don't think so. You think you'd be in a relationship? I do. Yeah. Same. Yeah. Same? Yeah. People, people always ask me

too they're like oh going on the show makes it so much easier you're gonna meet all these people like like actually i think dating is so much harder after the show yes and no i also like it's a huge risk it's non-traditional like it's not um can we take okay robbie's pictures like that's enough of shirtless Robbie. Yeah. That's not. Yeah, I totally agree. We brought Amanda here to talk about a bunch of interesting things, not just The Bachelor. She has a new book coming out called.

Called Now Accepting Roses. Now Accepting Roses. It's out on September 3rd. Ooh, September 3rd. It's coming out. You can pre-order it now. We'll get into what her book is about. Amanda and I have been,

we've gotten to know each other. So we've known each other for what, three years now? Yeah, about three years. You dated. You've been per- We went on a date. We went on a date in paradise. I mean, sure.

Yeah. But we've always been good friends. Amanda has, throughout the years, talked about and been open about your relationship what are some things about your relationship and maybe this is in your book I don't know that you know you find frustrating you know as a young woman what's the the biggest frustration I think do you have or do you still don't understand or get? Okay. So just like over the past few years, I've been in a few relationships or dated,

you know, a few different guys. And one thing I've noticed is like, there's not one thing. And I think this is like, what's getting so frustrating in a sense is like, it's not like, okay, so like in one relationship, like everything could be great, but it's missing one thing. And then the next relationship, it's missing another thing, but it's something completely different than the other relationship was missing. And it's like, there's just different things. But then it's probably normal though. It's normal. Yeah.

But I've just realized, like I used to be like, oh. But these are, are these specific things that like, you know. They're like big enough issues for me to be like, to be like, this isn't going to work for me long term. Can I get an example of one? Okay. So for one would be, okay, there's obviously a guy who's kind of shady or you don't trust and whatever.

That's one issue. So that thing you don't have. What? Okay. So I've been in a relationship with a guy who I didn't trust him. Okay. You know? What else? And then I've been in a relationship with a guy who I didn't trust him. Okay. You know? What else?

And then I've been in a relationship with a guy who was really controlling. Okay. And I couldn't deal with that. Hmm. And then, yeah. And what else? You know, it's funny because, okay. Nick, he already knows all of this anyways because I.

I think there's a really interesting. Okay. He's really interesting. So like I was in a relationship and this is like coming, coming out of relationships where like, this wasn't the biggest issue. Like, I mean with Josh,

for example, like we had a very passionate relationship, like a passion in paradise. Like there were other issues in that relationship. This is the first time that I was experiencing it. Like, yeah. Yeah.

But no, it was the first time I was in a relationship with somebody for a little bit and we were it was like very platonic like it wasn't very we didn't have like a very good like it wasn't very romantic wait you were making out like non-stop on the show no no not josh not oh not josh yeah someone from her past okay yeah someone from my past so yeah it was it was pretty like platonic wasn't very romantic like in any sense. And we had so many opportunities to be really romantic. Like we would go on trips together and stuff like that. And it was just very.

So the sex life wasn't awesome. Yeah. And it was more, it felt like you had a buddy. Yeah, yeah. It was like I could just be dating one of my friends. Would you describe like this kind of person? So it's interesting because like, you know, you had the controlling and you had the shady. Yeah. You've had, you know.

And so was everything else about this other person pretty damn good? No. No. He was kind of shady too. Oh. So then that's where it was really bothering me because I was like, okay, everything else was perfect, but like this wasn't working.

Maybe we could fix it. And so I tried, but then there were other things too. So you're in a relationship and you're not getting laid. I wouldn't say not, but not in like a natural, passionate, like mutual way. It was very like planned. Like, oh, I'm gonna. It was very like planned. Like, oh, I'm going to like get ready for bed and brush my teeth and take a shower

and then let's watch one episode. And then after this episode, then we can. He was saying this? I mean, it just kind of worked like that. I feel like that's just a long-term relationship. But this wasn't like a long-term relationship. Do you think, so that's what you think, Rochelle? I mean, the thing that happens a lot. Because I could happens a lot happening later was it like this pretty early on it was

like from the very beginning like there was just no like chemistry but also even if that happens in a long-term relationship i mean i get sometimes sure you're both busy you know things like that but but you still have moments where it's like fun and romantic and passionate or whatever what about like when you were like hanging out like was there a lot of affection or do you like PDA? I mean, like, I guess. Yeah. I'm not against it. Yeah. I think I'm really close to this microphone. It's totally fine. Okay. Um, yeah, no, I do. I'm not against PDA. And how did you, did you tell this person that you were sexually frustrated? Yeah, so the thing was, so he-

How did you do that? I mean, I feel like that can get defensive. This is kind of funny. So it was like, it was a sensitive subject. Took me a while to feel comfortable enough to bring it up. And then I was trying to be like nice about it. And, you know, obviously just like communicate how I was feeling,

but there were other things that were weird too. Like it wasn't just like the sex life. Like it was things like he didn't like to kiss. At all? Uh-uh. What do you mean? Didn't like to kiss? So he would kiss me,

but then like, okay, this was one thing that bothered me, but he always had his eyes open. He never closed his eyes. Oh God. Never? Never.

I would literally sometimes close his eyes. Do you guys always close their eyes? No, but like you like you don't like they're not wide open if i think if i was kissing a guy to open my eyes he's staring at me i would be so scared yeah staring at you like i don't i don't like kiss a girl and stare into her soul but like i don't like kiss a girl and immediately close my eyes okay not like that but like like his eyes were like wide open Like he would like open your eyes and go.

Yeah, I'd be like, I don't know, it was weird. And so there were things like that. And so then when I finally brought up the frustrations, like, hey, like what's going on here? He was like, well, you should be thankful because, yeah, because every other girl that I've dated, like I don't even kiss them and I kiss you all the time and I am super affectionate with you and blah, blah and i'm not normally like this so i was like

okay that's great like that's cool that you're like that with me and you weren't like that like at the end of the day i don't really care what you were like with anyone else sure that's true but also like i would be time up like why the fuck not you're kissing your girlfriend yeah yeah it doesn't make you sound better it makes you sound worse exactly yeah i was just like okay so clearly this like isn't something with me it's just like a weird is he issue that he has i guess but is he a sexual sexual person i guess apparently not i didn't think so and he's into women like yeah i don't know i don't know i mean that's that's just that's an aggressive trait to like go to your current girlfriend and say i don't even kiss

i've never kissed any of my exes well no like yeah like he's like i everyone knows you don't like kissing that's like who i am and i was like okay i don't know it was just oh it was i don't like kissing that's who i am so anyways weird flex it just got to a point where I was like, okay, I feel like we're just friends. You know? Man. So there was no like great sex ever. No. How did that make you feel?

Did you ever, did it ever? I ask this because we get a lot of questions about like, I mean, I think there's a theme with some of our, especially female audience that men are, are you know men are the frying pans as as emily said you know uh and a few episodes ago dr emily and they always want to have sex and so when a guy doesn't i feel like traditionally women think that there's something wrong with them or they're doing something wrong because all guys like to hook up totally yeah no it makes you at first it made me like super insecure because i was like hey i'm dating this person i don't think he's sexually attracted to me you know and that's like a problem i was like hey like what's going on here and um i think you know by the end of it i accepted the fact that like i

think that's just how he is. There were other things too. You know, I think he's just like emotionally unavailable in certain ways, you know? And I think that kind of comes with it. So by the end of it, I knew it wasn't me, but I definitely went through a period of time where I was like, is there something wrong with me? Are you not attracted to me? Like it made me kind of lose my mind a little bit. Oh yeah.

I can only imagine. How'd you get through that i mean where did you go from having that insecurity to realizing this is not a me problem it's a him problem i think the more that i got to know him and like understand him as a person it made sense like i would see him in other situations even just with like his friends or how he was even i don't want to say because it's going to give away who it is so i yeah i can't say um but i would see how he was with other people that he like cared about and loved and he wasn't the most affectionate with them like he just wasn't a very warm person so i was like okay i don't think it's me i think it's just how he is that's i mean good that you realize it's not you yeah right but i mean again i'm not i wouldn't be described as an

overly affectionate person in general like i'm not like for like i have a brother who ever since he was alive literally to this day the first thing he does when he meets anyone is give him the biggest warmest hug it's beautiful luke is just a sweetheart yeah and i'm just like not that way but in a relationship i'm very affectionate and i'm i love to be very physically drawn to the person i'm dating so like it's okay i can't okay so there's like not too much i can say because i don't want to say who whoever it is but um yeah no there were other things too much I can say, cause I don't want to say whoever it is, but, um, yeah, no, there, there were other things too. It was more like, even just in conversations, like it was very surface level.

Like you couldn't go deeper. It was just like, you know, it was very, it was, it wasn't just that, but at first that's, that was kind of the first thing I noticed, to be honest, because it stuck out to me. This isn't what I'm used to, I guess. You've kind of admitted to, and I think this, you talk a little bit about this in your book, your track record and your selection.

Your picker's off. Your picker's off. It's so bad. Your picker is off. Yeah, I think it's fixed. How do we improve your picker? I think I fixed it. How so?

I just think, oh gosh. It it's funny i saw something the other day and it was like what did it say it was like when you're super picky but you still end up picking the wrong ones and i was like that's me i'm so picky and then yeah in fairness though it's yeah everyone it's everyone yeah um but no i just think like i said i think just like the past few years dating different people i think it's helped that I'm saying like I've had one issue with this person a different issue with the next person a different issue with the next person I think it's kind of made me realize I think after my first relationship after having kids I was like okay I can't be with someone who is gonna cheat on me or it can't be with someone who's controlling and I think over the past years I've realized like

there's more than just that. And I think, yeah. Sure. I also think I'm exhausted of dating, like douchebag. I'm like, I can't get it anymore. So the only person, I mean, I know you dated Robbie or whatever. Yeah. But obviously I'm familiar with you dating Josh, right? Yeah, Hayes.

Robbie Hayes. Oh. But I'm familiar. I was literally there when you started dating Josh. Mm-hmm. And while it was part of the show, it was authentic that you were, you know, kind of hinted by many of people in the area about Josh. Josh. And so I wonder, has that been something that you've dealt with in the past where other friends that you were dating someone early in the dating process that red flags popped up and you were just, you know, there was some sort of meme on Hannah's season where a guy has a

bouquet of red flags. And I think we all, again, we all, do you think it was- Yeah. Do you see the one that's like, red's my favorite color? Yeah, something like that. Where do you think you were guilty of that? And do you think you've gotten better at not trying to fix the flags and realize that maybe the flags aren't for you?

I do. I think one thing that I'm still working on, and I think everyone does this, but when you start to like someone, like you kind of like, not fully, it depends what it is, but you make like a little bit of excuses for them or like cut them a little bit of slack here and there.

Sure. But not to the extent of what I did on the show. But one thing that I've, if anything has gotten really bad and my friends are like, you need to chill, is that like, I'm so picky and like a guy will do the littlest thing wrong and I'm like no I'm done and they're like okay you can't be like that you need to like understand people are like human you know it's like I'm either one extreme or the other so I'm trying to like balance it are you I

get this sense that you're really like physical attraction is really important to you same too so like don't see the negative because yeah i do like the the guys i know you dated objectively are hot good-looking men yeah and i do remember at least in especially with josh you're like oh but he's just like oh stop how much of that plays in a role for you in terms of like accepting certain red flags honestly i think i've gotten less shallow i think it was i don't i don't even want to call it shallow it is a little shallow have to okay i wouldn't say shallow it's like a physical attraction like you said it's important to you but i think it has gotten less important to me okay yeah i've been able to not have to be less

important as much as you're just more willing to uh right does it have to be less important as much as you're just more willing to, right. Does it have to be less like I can, you can still be just as attracted to, to physical appearance, but be open to realizing that it's not an excuse to accepting other things that are okay. Right. Like,

yeah, because like, I think some people are more drawn to the physical, like literally it's in their DNA to value that over other things. Isn't that called being shallow? It's called, yeah. Do you think so? I mean, why?

I mean, I guess I get how society sees it, but like let's say someone's super funny, right? Their best quality is he makes me laugh, but he's a cheater and he's like, let's say instead of being really good looking, Josh was incredibly funny, right? But everything else was the same. And does that make someone more or less shallow

because they're into humor? And they love, they love that all of their friends think they're funny the thing about humor is it's lifelong it's not like you hit a certain age and it's fine i'm just saying it's one characteristic that you're drawn to and especially i think the shallow part comes from how you look with them or how people perceive you together. Don't you think so? That's also being shallow though. No, that is shallow, right? Because you're caring about how you look together. So what I'm saying is just plain devil's advocate, right?

If you like that you are with a funny person and you like that your friends are like, he's really funny. You know what I'm saying? What's the difference between that and liking how they look? Right? No? I mean, is that just- Yeah, no mean yeah no i mean it's i guess it's kind of i mean if he it's funny but he's still like an asshole then i guess it doesn't make it any better that's what i don't know if i'm saying just this fact that you are drawn to someone physically doesn't make you shallow if you are sticking with them because you like how you look together that's

different don't i i think it all comes down to how you feel sticking with them because you like how you look together, that's different. I think it all comes down to how you feel about yourself. Like if you don't feel good about yourself, you probably need someone super attractive to make your value go up. Again, if you are dating someone who's super attractive to make yourself feel better, yes. If you just like the way someone looks and you're like yeah i really like having sex with this person that's not shallow that's an attraction yeah it's an attraction it's a turn on if you if you get turned on by someone who makes you laugh or if you get turned on but

the way they think and their ability to go deep and but at least it's like something that someone can kind of control you know like you're a deep person or you're funny. Like the way you look, like you're just born like that. It's not, they didn't do anything. I get that. But like we talk about love languages

and how you're attracted. I just, I think there's a huge difference between, again, I think you pointed out how someone makes you feel. Right, that's the most important thing. Is the most important. But if they make you feel shitty, but you are valuing how you look with them over your own feelings shallow i'm on more with that if you were just like seeing them naked yeah and it turns you on does that make

you shallow that that turns you on as opposed to someone who makes you laugh or makes you feel you know i guess not i guess it's i mean no but i get what you're saying it makes sense have you done like have you figured out why you're like drawn to people who don't make you feel good about yourself okay so okay so this isn't always a thing i mean okay i will say with josh and i will say this to everyone like he obviously had his flaws no one you know no one's perfect. You know the whole story, but he did. He was very loyal.

Like I never had to worry about him cheating on me. He was really loyal and he did make me feel really good about myself for a while. He did. Like I always say, like at first, when I first got engaged to Josh, like he literally made me feel like I was the only girl in the entire world.

It's so cheesy, but it's true. Like he didn't look at other girls, but I also think it came from a place where he didn't want me to do that. So he made me feel like that. That way I had to do the same. It's a little bit of Luke P, right? In this kind of Hannah season.

But it did make me feel good for a while. No, I mean, that is interesting because, and then how do we figure out, how do we, I think that's what's interesting about Josh, because then how do we figure out how do we i think that's what's interesting about josh because then how do you kind of value i mean that's what makes kind of dating and selecting your lifelong partner hard is figuring out what you value more than others yeah and what you can put up with what you can't because to your point no one is perfect you know it's not like literally i mean it sounds like of course not but the next person you date or

i date there's going to be something about them we don't like yeah you just have to you have to like pick and choose what are things that you don't like but you can live with and what's something that you don't like that you're like i can't live like that and the big question is is like the making you feel safe is that real safe or is it kind of directly or indirectly almost i mean manipulation yeah and what's crazy too is that i started feeling so much like because he made me feel like that but then sometimes they like i said they do that because they want you to do it in return sure but also when we broke up i feel like he moved on way faster than up than i did so that was kind of weird to me i was like wait you made me feel so good then you moved moved on really fast. Do you think that really matters how quickly people value how quickly

people take to move on as a barometer for the relationship that's already over? I don't know. It just, it made me feel like it wasn't as genuine as I thought it was. I'm not talking about like breaking up and not talking anymore. And he moved on. I'm saying like, we broke up, but we still were talking and like kind of working things out meanwhile it was kind of like a gray area of him doing other things sure do you know what i mean yeah so that's different i'm totally with you on the fact like if you break up with someone and you're done then like you're done it doesn't matter how fast they move on but this was like we were still kind of trying to work things out meanwhile he's still kind of like but But like, that's the thing though. If once you decide to break up,

whatever you're doing afterwards, like, and I've done that too. You break up, but you're still talking. Yeah. Then you're breaking up. If you don't, if you still want to work on things, I don't get why people say that. Like, let's break up and then work on things.

Well, I mean, it makes no sense. You're not supposed to do that. I would never do it again. Because breaking up is just a basically excuse to maybe see other people which is like if you don't want them to do that then don't break up if you want to slow things down spend some time apart but still stay committed going then do that yeah no again i'm with you i've been there yeah no we're not that's why no i i said to that, I was like, I'll never do that again. Like now when I break up with somebody, like it's over.

We'll never get back together with an ex. When it's done, it's just done. And I get the natural feeling of valuing like somehow how someone's ability to move on quicker than you is somehow as a barometer of how much the relationship in the moment meant to you. But for the people listening, it's not. No, it's not true. I agree with that too.

Like some people, also you don't know what they're thinking and feeling. Like he unfollowed me on Instagram. He blocked all my pictures. He went on a date the next day. What does it all mean? Honestly, I don't know. It depends on the person.

They may be doing it just to piss you off. They may be trying to get a reaction. They may, who. Who knows? Like they may. See, when I block someone, it's because I want to move on and I don't want to see their stuff. Not because I'm trying to get a reaction out of them.

Yeah. But some people will do it. Obviously. Sure. And sometimes even if they do want to move on your desire to have to follow them. And I think that's good because ultimately you should do what's best for you,

but your, your need to unfollow them speaks to how much you cared in a sense. I don't want to follow them. And I think that's good because ultimately you should do what's best for you. But your need to unfollow them speaks to how much you cared in a sense. I don't want to see them anymore. I need to move on. And then like not unfollowing someone, I think is like the biggest flex you can do. Be like, I don't know, I don't care.

I don't even care what you're doing. Look at your face every day. Whatever, are they dating someone else? Good for them, whatever. I mean, seriously, if you want to make your ex mad and it doesn't feel like that, don't unfollow them. I actually told that to my friend recently. She wasn't like fully dating this guy, but it ended up not working out. He like wasn't talking to her for a few days and she was going to block him on Instagram.

And I said, don't do that because then it's going to show that you care. Yeah, it's true. show that you care. Yeah, it's true. It's like more offensive. Almost don't like their stuff. Maybe don't view their stories, but just don't let them know that anything's changed. I said,

but who cares what they think? That's what I think. I'm saying if you care, or you know what? You can mute them too. Oh yeah. That's different. Yeah.

Mute them. Again, mental health or you know what you can mute them too you can oh yeah that's different yeah mute them again i will say the right thing to do is whatever you need to do to move on that has nothing to do with what they're it has nothing to do with their perception is the right thing to do that means block them unfollowing whatever not caring how they're going to interpret it is the right thing to do isn't it funny though that we do it? Like just sometimes like out of anger, like just make the other person mad. I'm like, I'm blocking you.

And then you like end up like unblocking. But the best part is it usually has the opposite reaction of what you're trying to get. Yeah. Like someone blocks me or unfollows me. I'm like, I'm flattered. Yeah, this person really cares. You're really mad. Yeah.

You really care about you know my opinion or what i think and so and you don't want to hear it or you don't you're trying to get you're trying to get a reaction from me i only care i mean the people i try to get reactions from like i care about yeah no it's true right yeah i mean yeah you would obviously care but i would hope you would care after a relationship and want to not see that. I mean, for me, it was really easy to just block them and not want to see their stuff anymore. But I will say I was in a different place the last time with my breakup

than I was at Josh. Cause with Josh, I would still like snoof sometimes. The Josh breakup lasted a while. Yeah. Yeah. It was bad. Really?

It was like, it was like a sick, it wasn't even like a breakup. I don't even know what it was. It was just like a, as a, as a mother, how hard is that? And does it, I mean, it wasn't even like a breakup. I don't even know what it was. It was just like a. As a mother, how hard is that? And does it, I mean, it's got to make breakups extra hard because at what point do you introduce them to your kids?

Obviously Josh met him pretty quickly, but not just Josh. Like I got to imagine that makes it more challenging. Yeah. So I feel like with Josh, it was the hardest because when I got off the show, I was like, Oh, I am engaged.

Like we're going to get married. Like this is it. So I introduced him thinking like, Oh, this is the only person I'm going to have around them. It's great. After that, like just dating and stuff.

I don't bring guys around my kids. And to Josh's credit, regardless, I mean, he was pretty good with your kids and very affectionate and nice. He was. Yeah. I mean,

what guys have, what do you think his intentions were? was pretty good with your kids and very affectionate and nice he was yeah i mean what guys have what do you think his intentions were he seemed like a pretty nice guy with your kids and and caring about that and it's got to be i can only assume as a single mother and attractive quality yeah well i think that's like probably the biggest reason why like after we broke up i was like okay it was harder for me to just like end it there and just move on so that's kind of the reason why our breakup was dragging on for so long was because I was like, oh, maybe I should try harder to make it work or whatever. But after that, like just dating, I don't introduce guys to my kids like at all. At all?

No, like I don't even bring guy friends over that are just my friends at all. Oh, just because it's confusing? I mean, if it's like my friends, I mean, I honestly, I just don't really have a lot of like guy friends that I hang out with. So, yeah, I just don't really ever have guys around. Oh, hi. Rochelle does this. It's like you talk about something, you bring a picture up and you're like. Yeah.

So, yeah. And like Bobby was the only other guy that I really brought around. But I also don't think people realize like we didn't live together. So, he would come over. but it wasn't like the same as like with Josh, like Josh was around for like five months straight, you know? So that was the hardest. With Bobby, like he was around.

He was definitely closer with Charlie than he was with Kins. I do remember that Josh was living in LA because he texted me and threatened me after one of my interviews. Why? It's like, I hope I run into you oh god i think it was maddie that did an interview with e and all i said was i really think andy dorfman is going to enjoy watching this season of paradise which i think she did she sold a lot of books

yeah um and i got this random text about like, it was a- Hope I ran into you in LA. Yeah. And it was a bit of a- Just because he got edited so poorly on Paradise? Well, the show hadn't even aired at that point. Yeah. I was just, I suggested that it would go the way it did.

Did they edit in like the kissing noises? No. They were so loud. Yeah. The first time- No? no no i mean maybe maybe a little maybe they turned it up i don't know but i will say the first time i noticed the moan i don't know if i've ever said this before it was it was a rose it was on andy season it was the rose ceremony ceremony in belgium when it was down to the final six. And I already had a rose and Josh was standing to my left.

And Josh was the only one I was worried about in a sense that like I knew Josh and I could tell there's a strong connection. I wasn't worried about Andy's other relationships, but I was definitely worried about Josh. And at the time, Josh and I got along quite fine at the time. And she calls Josh's name and he just goes and i immediately was just like what the

what was that really dude yeah and then it was like when it was just him and i and chris was gone and then i'm like listening you know like once you hear it you can't unhear it was it like when he was eating and stuff too when he was just he just that was josh he was a yeah he was a moaner that's how he showed, shows affection. Yeah. He would listen to like, like then I couldn't,

like I couldn't, couldn't unhear it. Every time he'd listen, listen to like R and B, he's a big R and B guy. Oh, he loves R and B. Loves R and B. And he's like,

and it was like, oh, constantly. Make it stop. He's a very sensual person. Yeah. So yeah, that's really funny.

did Josh think it was edited in? Well, yeah. I mean, like he said in interviews, like, oh, it's edited. And maybe it's like a subconscious thing. He doesn't know that he's doing it. You know, it's maybe he, you know, like it's like we said, like the self-awareness. Like maybe he doesn't even know that he's doing it. So when he heard it back.

The pizza was edited? Yeah. He said the pizza was edited. I watched Josh. He was like, I don't even like that he's doing it. So when he heard it back. He said the pizza was edited. I watched Josh. He was like, I don't even like pizza that much. He talks about pizza all the time. He had him eating pizza on the cover of his podcast, which by the way, if you haven't listened

to the first episode, it's actually entertaining. Anyways, I feel like we're being petty. Like he, there was a time in Paradise, there's like 15 of us at a rose ceremony. Just sitting there waiting for Chris Harrison to come in. And at this point, the producers noticed that Josh is constantly eating pizza. And again, what the producers are good at doing

is taking a situation and maximizing it, whatever it is. The chicken nuggets from Hannah's. The chicken nuggets, whatever. So they noticed Josh is constantly

eating pizza. And to Josh's credit, the pizza down there was pretty damn good. The pizza's really good. The food in general was really good. And Josh kept eating pizza

and again, the audio guys know it, it's constant eating and moaning, eating and moaning. So one of the producers told me this towards the end is like they just started serving Josh pizza.

Okay, so I remember one of our dates we showed up, it was like this beautiful dinner and like they had like, I don't know, some like plate of like fish in front of my seat and then just the giant pizza in front of his and he was so mad. Oh, he was so mad about it. Because he could tell it was

turning it up but like what there's 15 of us at a rose ceremony 15 people and they brought in one small pizza in theory for everyone it wasn't like and they just put it next to josh and like josh just starts eating it and no one else and it's just josh eating a pizza and like in theory it was for everyone but they brought in a single pizza and just set it down there and josh just like well i'm just gonna eat it again there's nothing wrong with it like it's like funny i think i think that's why it was like even funnier was that like paradise if that had happened to you like you would have been laughing and been like oh i love pizza and like just joked about it do you know what i mean sure and if it weren't for the moating honestly if like all josh was

eating pizza like josh's biggest crime well that wasn't his biggest crime but if that all if that was his biggest crime then so what but yeah we're gonna play a little game of manner called do you know me okay and then we're gonna talk a little bit more about your book cool uh this question it's a fun little game okay that we like to play on the show. It's also a game that if you are looking for a game, Amanda, for your friends, maybe you're getting someone new. It's a really great, fun way to get to know someone. Cool.

It's a great drinking game in a way. If you are among friends, you can even play with your kids. You cannot drink. You can find it on Amazon. It's called Do You Know Me? There are random questions that Rochelle and I are going to have a competition and see who knows Amanda Stanton better. I hope it's you, Nick.

Does, and don't answer quite right away. Don't be like, yes or no. Okay. Okay. Does Amanda like... What? There's options. Does Amanda like oysters?

I'm going to say no. I'm going to say yes because they're aphrodisiac and she's very into that. She wants that dick. Yeah. Ew, you guys. Actually, can I answer no? Yeah. I don't like oysters because i've only tried them one time

and i got food poisoning from oh no yeah i didn't know that in san francisco no yeah chris were you there no you just don't seem like an oyster gal i don't really like oysters no okay no not a thing does amanda believe in ghosts? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I'm going to say no. Why not? Why don't I think Amanda believes in... I think she's in touch with the spiritual side.

I think she likes to believe in ghosts. Like, it's fun. But I don't think she actually deep down believes in ghosts. What's the answer? I think because... That's actually really true. You know her well. Yeah.

I don't i don't i've never like had a moment where i like saw a ghost or anything like that but i like to think also i'm guessing to think that they're real but i did this is kind of off topic i don't think this is a ghost but i did talk to a psychic and that was real so i guess if you count that that's more like telling the future it's not ghost right okay so no i don't really i'll never talk to her again it freaked me out she like told me pretty much that like my whole 2020 i like don't date anybody yeah it's awful i had a girl for my season tell me that a median. Medium.

Medium. No, I know. But she told me a median told her that we were going to get married. Stop. Wait, who was this? She is in your book. Actually, she has some. You asked her to write in your book. Actually, she has some, you asked her to write in your book.

And I was like, huh? And then I like, well, they didn't air it. They didn't air it. It was on camera. And then I sent her home. She was convinced. She was in my book.

Anyways, not, so median is a, something that helps direct traffic. Yeah. A medium is another name for a psychic. Well, you're not Mr. Word Perfect either. True?

If I, well, I mean, no, I'm not, but I do know the difference between words. Oh yeah. Wait, do you guys believe in ghosts? No. Okay. Has Amanda ever had sex in public? Is TV public? I guess so, yeah.

No, it's not. It's not? Okay, so for the purpose of this game, it's not public. Then yes, she has. Yes, I'm gonna say yes. No. Wow.

Yeah. Okay, wow. Gotta get on that. No. Wow. Yeah. Okay. Got to get on that.

Has Amanda sent any nudes in the last year to anyone? You go first. She's been in a relationship. So you're saying no? I'm going to say no. I'm going to say yes, of course. Look at that hot bod. I haven't.

I'm so weird about it. Yeah. I don't want to send that out to someone unless they trust him. So no. She also was in a relationship. Yeah, I was in a relationship for over a year. Yeah, but he. Oh, he wouldn't have cared.

No, I don't think he would have appreciated it. Has Amanda flown first class in the last three or two two months yes amanda she collects the glam oh i would have said no amanda definitely has flown first class oh uh has amanda ever taken anyone's virginity yes no in high school yeah i don't think she took theirs no she dated she definitely was the freshman dating the senior in high school he was he was actually a junior whatever yeah the hottest guy in school i'm sure a man yeah amanda was the little freshman coming in and he had definitely had sex with someone and he took hers is my guess wow this is weird this is weird i'm good maybe he's a median uh you just have to read the tea leaves so to speak

has amanda ever no that's the same one uh has amanda ever quit a job definitely no yes they have ah i think i got zero um which i don't think this is not i don't think amanda spends a lot of time doing things she doesn't want to do oh what does that mean that's a great quality i'm not saying it's a bad or good quality it's just do you spend a lot of time doing things i do and and i'm sure roch, it's not a good or a bad quality. I think it can be both positive and negative. I think there's positive qualities in that. And I think Rochelle would admit that at times it doesn't serve her well. And I think you could probably say the same about you about not doing it,

where maybe there's times where you maybe should stick it through. And other times you're good at not wasting your time. I haven't quit a job since like high school. But yeah, I did quit. Yes. That is, do you know me that was and apparently i do i want to i actually i don't even know if i would get with you tell me more about your book before we do some questions with fans i do have uh well what's the general premise of uh your book okay so it's it's like a memoir so it talks a lot about my life before the show going into the show and afterwards yeah and then at the end of every chapter there is like a section it's called um well there's like the rose and the thorns which

is like the pros and the cons and things that i learned from each chapter yeah see what i did there i had some help um so then at the end of each chapter it'll say like what i learned from each situation so i sent you the one part so that's like the end where it says like the pros and cons like what i learned from the situation and i thought that you would think that one was kind of funny but it's also a part of the book that is like a little more shady so i feel bad bringing it up here but i guess go ahead well because i mean read it i'm gonna read an excerpt of amanda's book okay i'm so excited uh this is amanda speaking so from i just think it's more fun if i read it okay i don't know why yeah the rose stop kissing frogs is the title of this excerpt.

If he doesn't turn into your prince, stop kissing him. This is what I sound like? Josh's behavior was very frog-like. Rippin'. There were control issues. More than a few untruths told. Plus other red flags along the way. Not to mention Andy Dorfman even wrote a book about his jealous self-serving ways.

And what did I do? I kept kissing him. Hoping he'd turn into a prince. I knew Josh was a kind of controlling. I knew Josh was kind of controlling when we were filming. But the second we got home from the show, he went full throttle. He would give me a hard time when I wanted to talk to my close friends. I know that to be true.

Well, the twins would always be like, we're not allowed to talk to Amanda. Not allowed? I would even have to wait for him to go to the gym so I could call my best friend, Lauren Bushnell. What? Yeah. Or even my mom. What?

Fuck, Josh. Oh, no. He didn't approve of my childhood friends or my neighbors. Who did you get to hang out with? Josh. Oh, my. He didn't approve of my childhood friends or my neighbors. Who did you get to hang out with? Josh. Oh, my goodness. Jesus. He used to pressure me to unfollow certain people on social media.

Sorry, Nick Vile. I didn't know, but that's fine. I thought that he would think it was funny. He was like, he didn't even notice that I unfollowed him. Told me what I could and couldn't wear he what really yeah like just like what he looked nice or he was like that's too revealing it was too revealing oh my god this is like you were a prisoner i don't mind if my girlfriend slots it up a little bit i'm just i don't mean that mean, whatever. Fuck it. I don't care.

Whatever makes her feel good. Yeah, because if I see a guy is like checking her out and they're like, I'm like, yeah, and I'm going home with her. Yeah, see, I don't, that's how I think it's good. Anyways, I don't think

I've ever seen you wear anything revealing anyway, so. Yeah, nothing too crazy. I mean, I live in LA, so. Anyways. When i caught him peeking beneath the bathroom door to make sure i wasn't texting anyone i finally had enough from this experience i'm learning that from being i'm learning i'm learning that from the beginning. If it ribbits, hops, and jumps, it's a freaking frog. And I should stop kissing him immediately. More to come in Amanda's group.

How fun, Amanda. That's so great. Yeah, I'm excited about it. Is it a little dirt? There's a little dirt. I mean, that was probably, that's a little dirt right there. But for the most part, so I really tried to like be intentional with it.

I didn't want it to be petty. I didn't want to just say stuff just to say stuff, but it was like, if it was something that I learned from, then I included it. If it was something that was a learning experience for me. So yeah. Yeah.

I mean, I think it's hard in those kind of tell all formats not to sound petty. Obviously we probably, I mean, I even probably been a little those kind of tell-all formats not to sound petty. Obviously, we probably, I mean, I've even probably been a little petty this episode. I don't know. Sometimes with pettiness, it's like, I think, you know, even with Luke P. last, the last Hannah season, I mean, I think sometimes the thing that frustrates me the most about people is a lack of self-awareness. None of us are perfect.

We all do things. And I think when given opportunities to show humility and learn from your mistakes and at least throw it out there, I think it's frustrating when people don't do that. And sometimes when people

constantly make excuses for their actions, it's kind of like, all right, you know what? You're fair game. Yeah, I agree. I'm kind of justifying penniness a little bit,

but whatever. I feel you. But Penny's not. Penny's not the greatest, I agree. I'm kind of justifying penniness a little bit, but whatever. I feel you. But Penny's not the greatest, I guess, right? No, it's not. Who cares? Rochelle. Sometimes it's fun, you know? So you can pre-order Amanda's book right now.

Where can they find it, Amanda? So actually, if you go to nowacceptingroses.com, it will list all of the places that you can buy it. So it's on Amazon, Target, Walmart, Barnes & Noble, IndieBucks. And you and Andy Dorfman are good friends now. Yeah. Is there a bonding thing between the book,

the now authors? A little, but like not really. We honestly just became good friends. Obviously it started because we both dated Josh and we ended up meeting up and kind of exchanging stories or whatnot. You both broke up with me today, Josh. But yeah, like after that.

We don't really talk about him anymore though. We're just kind of friends. Aside from that. No. She does her own thing now, so we'll talk about whatever she's doing whatever i'm doing i have and i don't she just doesn't really do podcasts that much ask her i'm not getting in the middle of this she said she said she would oh andy dorf. Come on my podcast. Next week. Yeah, sorry.

Can we get Andy Dorfman? Someday. I'll try. I'll try my best. I mean, I just think the people want it. But does Andy want it? Does Andy want anything? What does Andy Dorfman want?

What does Andy Dorfman want? What does Andy Dorfman want? Can we do a whole episode? If Andy won't do the podcast, you can come as Andy's friend, and I'll ask you a bunch of questions, and you will give me... That would actually be pretty fun. Andy's interpretation of the podcast. We should do it. Just kidding.

I'll try to convince him. Are you down to answering some fan questions? Sure. Yes, let's do it. Once you're done with it, Are you down to answering some fan questions? Sure. Yes, let's do it. Catherine, I'm Nick. This is Amanda. Hi, Amanda. Nice to meet you.

We also have Rochelle in the room. Hi. Hi, Rochelle. How can we help you, Catherine? Well, I was kind of wondering, I'm not really good with the whole dating thing. I really only had one partner. Hey, who is? And I was wondering, when it comes to dating, if I'm overanalyzing situations or if I'm

kind of just wanting a partner, so I'm ignoring any red flags or any turn-offs that I don't really want in a partner, but I want someone to get in touch with. Do you have a specific situation that makes you feel this way or wonder? Well, I tried the online dating thing, so I kind of was chatting with some guy, and he would talk a lot. Like, he would answer right away and ask a lot of questions and say a lot of stuff.

But I didn't, like, get excited to talk to him. I was just like, oh, okay, I'll get to it when I get to it. Have you ever had a boyfriend? Yeah, I'm actually divorced. divorced oh you're divorced okay yes see my take on it i'm a single mom oh same good well yeah so my take on it is that like you can get lonely sometimes but i think you don't want to settle and if you're not excited to talk to somebody or you like think you're over analyzing someone you're probably not i feel like when you meet the right person it's gonna be somewhat easy sure yes you're gonna be excited to talk to somebody or you like think you're overanalyzing someone you're probably not i feel like when you meet the right person it's gonna be somewhat easy sure yes you're gonna be excited to

talk to them it's gonna be mutual you're not gonna feel like that um and you don't want to settle just because you're lonely and give someone a chance even if you're not excited about them because then you'll end up being more lonely when you're in a bad relationship with someone i have a question for both of you at At what point do you start thinking about, you know, Catherine, you talked about overanalyzing. Do you start thinking about your kids and how it plays a role in your relationships? I know for me, I don't come out and say it right away, but I don't hide it. Okay. Do you think of, but do you think about it? Is that something you worry about?

Oh yeah, for sure. And do you worry more about from your kid's perspective or what the guy will think perspective? I think he's young, so my son doesn't really understand everything. But I think more of like not all guys want to be with someone who has a kid already. Sure. Yeah. See, I come out. I mean, I don't think there's really a right way to do it whenever you feel comfortable. But I always say it right away because I'm like if someone doesn't like kids i don't even want to waste my time or go on a like you know what i mean even like start to like

somebody if they're not gonna i think that's yeah i think just letting him know that you are uh a mom is okay um to that point like yeah i should probably chill a little like i'm like on a first date and I'm like showing them like photos. I'm like, this is my daughter's dance competition. I don't know.

I mean, I feel comfortable with it. But setting up for an expectations is at least good to know. I've always, I've said before, like listen,

some guys just might not be into it and that's fine but you definitely don't want to waste time with guys who aren't into that. There's plenty of men

who are totally fine with it. So I don't think you should stress it. How long have've been divorced for um we've been separated almost three years okay so it's been a while like you're you're totally over it you're ready to get a significant amount of time my my advice would be like i know this sounds bad but i would just like date lots of people like go on dates and eventually you're gonna find someone you click with but don't like force it on one person just because they text back fast or they're around that's well that's the hard part i totally agree with definitely going out there getting experience in dating and trying out options the only trick

about sometimes dating apps is sometimes too many choices so first you have to figure out what you really want or what is important to you what you value and then go and find it knowing that you know what you want right right and then finding the people who meet those very kind of whatever those things you are value the most um right and make you feel a certain way and have your expectations instead of worrying about whether a guy likes you or whether he's okay with you having kids or doing the things you know i think that's that's really important but having the confidence and going out there and like really just being fine with uh with going out there but you don't want to go too hungry but you don't you don't come across as like no you know i don't i'm getting that i'm not some sort of desperate what am i going to do vibe from you or anything

right what's important from yeah yeah what's like really helped me is like having other friends that are single that are like the same age as me or something like that because then i think it kind of like if you're if you're feeling lonely or like you know you need to like get away from the kids like you know how it is sometimes when you're around kids 24 7 you're like i need to like go to dinner like get do something with like some adults you know it's nice to have like other single girlfriends and you guys can like exchange date stories like whether they're bad or good or just like go out and have fun and it kind of takes the pressure off feeling like you need somebody because you have friends that are single and in the same place i think

that's great do you have other single friends sometimes that's harder okay you do that's great are they also moms or divorced or they just single um yeah there's a few that are moms and a few that are just single and don't have kids and you don't necessarily they don't have to have the i know amanda has other single friends that are not moms and divorced but i'm just you know yeah it's good to have people to relate to yeah it makes it a lot easier what about the question she's asking about like writing people off because one thing isn't right, you know, on the dating profile. I struggle with that too. And my friends tell me that I write people off too easily. But at the same time,

if you wouldn't be doing that, if you really liked that person, sometimes I think also for me, sometimes you try to find excuses to write someone off because you know, you're not that into them. So you find like the littlest excuse to write them off well i think to amanda's point and if you are doing this i don't know but when it comes to dating apps if you're going to invest the time of talking to them get to know them i think it would be foolish to write something off based off of something they have on their profile unless i mean unless they're saying something aggressive that's like whoa okay i'm not into that but yeah yeah you don't know them. You can only get to know someone so much.

I think dating apps are great to go out there and find people who are open to relationships like you. But I think you should go get that drink or cup of coffee pretty quickly because you can only get to know someone so much through text. And if you can't meet, schedule a FaceTime date that's an option right like yeah you can like so many so many ways you can like senses of humor aren't shown through text like emojis really hard to to get to know each other via text so i would argue in a dating app you should try to meet up as soon as possible if there's a mutual interest and if like maybe schedules don't allow it or proximity maybe it's too far i think a facetime

date's a pretty good alternative i mean like hey i can't meet up but do you want to like do you want to pour yourself a glass of wine and we'll facetime and i think that's kind of a fun alternative especially if schedules don't allow it it's true i have one more thing one more thing for you also one thing that i've had to learn is that first dates sometimes are awkward and like sometimes someone's nervous or you're nervous and you're not fully yourself because i have a thing where like i'll go on a first date and it's not great and i'll be like that was not good but sometimes it's just because there's a first date and it's like a little awkward or uncomfortable and sometimes you have

to give someone you know another chance or a couple more chances to really see so i wouldn't write them off but also like don't set too high of expectations for anybody right if they're big i agree with it if the biggest criticism you have of a date that it felt a little stiff and awkward but you liked you like you're attracted to them they seem nice and there's yes i would say challenge yourself to go on a second date. Yeah. Okay. See if you get, there's no harm, you know? Right. You know, why not? As long as they feel like they're gentlemen and they're nice and they respect you. Like, yeah.

Yeah, exactly. You just got to keep shooting, shooter. Yeah. All right, Catherine. I'll try. Good luck. You're going to be great. There's a lot of people like uh you and us out there just

just trying just doing our best all right take care hi hi hi what's your name um my name's kyla hi kyla i'm nick i'm amanda nice to meet you how can we uh help you so basically um my best friend my best guy friend of four years just started dating this girl about two months ago. And since then, he's been like ignoring me and all of our friends and canceling plans. Like last weekend, we were supposed to take a trip somewhere and I did on him on Wednesday. And he was like, oh, actually actually I'm taking my girlfriend instead I'm like okay cool like not angry that you're replacing me but like heads up would have been nice um and so I just like am wondering how much of this is a grace period that we have to give our friends and how much of this is a grace period that we have to give our friends and how much of this is just

bullshit that i don't have to put up with like if they break up and he like comes back and apologizes do i have to forgive him i'm really annoyed he's just have you ever hooked up with this person no no he's always just been a platonic friend? Yes. Well, listen, I think this is a tough situation. How old are you? How old is he? How old is his girlfriend? I'm 26.

He's 30. He's 30. How old is his girlfriend? Who knows? Who knows? She's like 24 or something. And do you feel, I mean, and being honest, you've been friends with this person for four years.

Do you think he was ever attracted to you? Like how their friendships start? Yes. Oh. Okay. We, but I think that was several years ago. I think we put it like, I don't think that's the case anymore. I think we like have just been really good friends. Sure.

Fine. And that may be true. But I think the reality when it comes to a lot of men and women relationships, especially if they did start at one point with there being some sort of physical attraction from one end, is that I'm sure he accepted the fact that you guys were just platonic and that was fine but he is now most likely getting what he got from you with his girlfriend and in that way you have been replaced um and sometimes and i know it's sad that does happen right and uh right i have she also you you also don't know if maybe it's early and this is a new relationship i'm guessing

i'm hearing right um so there's elements of him in the honeymoon phase and he's just really excited about her and again getting from her what he never got from you and not that you did anything wrong but he's prioritizing that you also don't know if she's maybe feeling insecure he's talked about you he's asked some questions

and you're just not a priority right now and again it comes down to reality that this is not the same as his bros um and even sometimes listen sometimes even guys with their guy friends early in a relationship have a way of uh like losing that like sometimes they're just so into a relationship they they do the same shitty things to their guy friends yeah that's what i was gonna say even like with my girlfriends like right now i'm super single so i do everything with my friends i

could go on a trip i bring a girlfriend say i start dating a guy that i'm really into i'm probably gonna want to start bringing him that happens and then it happens and it's not anything against my friends it's just that i'm in a relationship no totally but i also think in this particular case there's also layers of uh if layers of, if this ends up being his person, it may never be the same. Great. I'm sorry. Right. And super happy with him if that's true.

But I don't know if I like. I do think. Like, really? No, really. Honestly, like, I want him to find that person. Like, I think that would no really honestly like i i want him to find that person like i think that would be really exciting there's been some other things that make me think this might not be his person um fair but like if if it isn't and he like comes back and is trying to hang out again like

is that something that you accept as part of the friendship is gonna yeah kind of yeah kind of yeah my friends did it for me when i yeah i, I kind of ignored them for a while. And then I was like, hey, guys. I think at the end of the day, I think there's nothing wrong with telling them how you feel. I think you could say, listen, I missed you. It hurt me that you did this. I understand. But this happens in relationships.

And you can say, listen, and I wouldn't like call him out for maybe having feelings, but you could, you know, what I advise to you is like what I meant. I would treat yourself like you're one of his guy friends to say, regardless, you're my friend and I didn't get to see you. So like next time you do that,

I would like you not to do that and see what he says. But there may be things outside of your control. I don't think it does you much good holding a grudge. Yeah. Or if you're saying saying you have reasons to think that she's not the right person for him. So it makes me think you maybe aren't the biggest fan of her. And sometimes when you're newly dating someone

that you really like and your friends aren't the biggest fans, you kind of push them away instead of pushing. Why haven't you dated this guy? Why don't you want to sleep with him? He drives me nuts. I would kill him within like two weeks're gonna get married what do you mean you'd kill what do you mean he drives you nuts but why do you miss him so much as a friend it's not even that i miss him as a friend is that when we're in group settings and i try and talk to him and he ignores me,

or when we make plans and then all of a sudden those plans have changed without any sort of communication, that makes me frustrated. Okay, but fine. But people, that stuff happens to all of us all the time. I mean, this is bothering you particularly more than, say, someone breaking plans with you. So he's done this before. When he didn't have a girlfriend? Like two years ago, he was in a relationship that really damaged our friendship because we stopped talking because of the girlfriend. And he apologized and promised it would never happen again. Well, it's going to, listen, I can assure you that it will always happen when he has a girlfriend.

But also, why doesn't she try to be okay girlfriend well i have said this on other podcasts that the best way to have a relationship with him while he has a girlfriend is to be her best friend that's right rochelle that's the only way to ever do that is to be her best friend yeah and then have her invite you out so that he doesn't feel like he's doing anything wrong because i I do think sometimes guys, whether they're dating a jealous girl or not, they feel like maybe, because again, if he ever had feelings for you, he doesn't want to give himself away or get questioned about his loyalty to her. So if you become her best friend and she's like, I love her. She's great.

Let's invite her out. Then he doesn't have to worry about that. It doesn't sound like you have any interest in being her friend yeah so i so yeah bobby had a girlfriend like that they're best friends but she never tried to be my friend so then i kind of had a problem with so i was like well you know so i agree with that if you're her friend then he's gonna be more comfortable hanging out with you because y'all are friends oh yeah i i think in general if you don't want to date this gentleman that's fine but eventually this will be a friendship that someday is going to end. I mean, it is, right?

Because this is, I just think also, have you ever had a boyfriend while you were friends with this guy? I'm dating someone right now. You are? Okay. So then what's the big deal? someone right now you are okay so then what's the big deal literally just i feel like you should be protecting your friendship and like that's just where i is this guy your person that you're dating how tell me about your boyfriend right now um we've been dating for a couple of months i really like him all right i don't know if he's my person but me neither um

listen i i'm giving you a hard time and i really appreciate you giving you giving us a call but listen i i just in general i think men and men and women relationships when they're just friends and they definitely have started when someone was attracted to someone else it's hard to have those not end it's hard to get to a true place of true platonic relationships and that has to come from a place where two people are totally fine with not having sex because even if they are totally platonic their spouses might be um you know more threatened or whatever there's so many variables that go into it um the fact that he's done this before there's maybe a quality in him and you can't criticize it like he just when he's in a

relationship maybe he's very dedicated in that relationship and maybe he was raised to say hey if you're gonna be in a relationship that person should have all your attention and energy. And he's focused on that. And that's a good quality as a boyfriend to have. And maybe he just doesn't have enough bandwidth to give you the attention that you want when he's focused on her. And I think if my guess is if you, you know, eventually you will be in a relationship where you won't worry about him yeah i agree yeah i does that an excuse for him being rude and setting plans and breaking him and flaking no that's just like a common courtesy that he should but i'm guessing it's more than

that and you know there's something you know like i think there's i think you have grown to love him even as a friend and you miss your friend and that's okay and there's probably qualities about him that you're not even getting from your boyfriend and it pisses you off and you have no control over the situation it's driving you fucking nuts and and and yeah this is my guess okay so I should just a become best friends with this girl, but B, take this as this is what happens when you're friends with... Kind of. With some people, yes. And especially this guy, he's shown a pattern.

Or C, marry him. That's what I said. I said you're not going to get married. Or marry him. I think, yes. I think if you truly want him... Let's say this girl is his person and you're just biased or whatever, or wrong, or who knows, and you truly want him, let's say this girl is his person and you're just biased or whatever or wrong or who knows

and you really want to be friends with them, your only shot, your only shot then is to become friends with her first. Right. Yeah. And I think it would be totally cool to reach out to her and say, hey, do you want to grab a cup of coffee? And then you get a cup of coffee with just you and her.

You're just like, you know, I don't, you probably don't, he's my friend and I want to be friends with him, but I also want to respect you guys' relationship. So I want to be friends with you. Yeah, I think that's perfect. And I think- I would appreciate that.

Yeah, I think most people, men or women, if I were dating a girl and she had a guy friend, I would want him to do that and vice versa. And i think that's a very disarming thing to do for the for the person who's new in the in the social circle she's new like right you have the benefit of having mutual friends and all these things and she's the outsider yeah i haven't met her yeah really like i don't know her that's why i all. All she, all you are. I have nothing against her. All you are to her is a threat. You know, she doesn't, and she doesn't just cause she doesn't know.

So that's what I would do. Okay. All right. I really appreciate you calling in. Good luck. Let us know when you marry him. Yeah. Invite us to your wedding.

All right. We're just kidding. Thanks guys. All right. Take care. Nice to meet you. All right. We're just kidding. Thanks, guys. All right. Take care. Nice to meet you. Bye-bye. Bye.

Sarah, how can we help? So I guess I was calling because I know you both have experience with dating and trying to make relationships work when it's kind of exposed to a lot of people. And obviously, mine is like a lot less than what you guys have gone through. But I recently got engaged and then broke off my engagement, but have been, yeah, I've been seeing the person again trying to make it work. But it's been super hard because there's been a lot of people talking.

Obviously everyone knew something happened when we broke up and it's just been really hard to like make the relationship work when there's been a lot of people talking obviously everyone knew something happened when we broke up and it's just been really hard to like make the relationship work when there's been like yeah everything's so exposed and vulnerable for people to make comments and assumptions why did you call off the engagement so i'm 21 okay um and i think like i've always wanted to get married really young always wanted to have kids and And I just got to a point where I realized that I wasn't actually in a good place to be getting married. And he wasn't either. There were some things that happened that I just like felt like, okay, we can't start off a marriage like this. Okay. So that sounds like a very healthy and normal reason to call something off.

So you're not necessarily questioning your desire to continue to date him. It's just roar about maybe you're not ready to get married. Yeah. Do you come, where do you come from? Where are you from? Where do you come from? I'm from Edmonton in Alberta, Canada. Okay. And everyone is kind of like the town drama this is like a

juicy story that you were engaged and now you're not and everyone's talking about it kind of thing i mean at least in like the circles that we're in and we do like a lot of yeah we're just around a lot of people a lot of the time and so kind of everywhere we go how people are talking did you guys did you call off the engagement and immediately kind of everywhere we go people are talking and how did you guys did you call off the engagement and immediately start dating or was there some time was it like listen i love you but i we're just not ready yeah it was kind of rough the first time we broke it off um and then we were on and off a little bit, but privately. But now we're back together. Like I wouldn't say we're engaged.

Like I don't wear my ring or anything like that, but people know that we're together. Listen, here's what I think. I think I want to give you a lot of credit for having the maturity and self-awareness to realize you're not ready. And for the reasons that you're pointing out, I think that can be very difficult, especially if you're from a small town, of what it feels like or judgment or other people's opinions. And I think there's

a lot of people out there who don't call off their engagement and move forward with something that maybe deep down they don't feel is right because they're afraid what people think or what they're going to say. So I give you a lot of credit for doing that i think my only advice to you is just be confident in your choice right um and as long as you two are okay with it like there's nothing wrong with saying we weren't ready i mean you wanted to get married and i'm not shaming anyone who wants to get married young but more and more people are not doing that anymore and for good reason because it's just different times just society in general is getting married late. So it's more abnormal when you are young.

And listen, I wanted to get married young too. And Amanda got married young and it didn't work out. And I've had siblings who got married and it didn't work out. I'm not saying you shouldn't, but it's a different time. We're starting to mature later in life and getting to know ourselves later in life. You might feel differently when you're 24, 25. So unless you really want to, unless you have no doubt about marriage in general

or this person, I think that's an absolute great thing to wait. You can always wait and you should still get to know each other. And I think all you should do is continue to be confident in your decision. And if you ever hear people whispering, let them know that like, listen, I'm fine with it. We're fine. All we are is not ready to get married and that's okay. And I think more you outwardly say that, the more people will realize you're probably right.

People want to always think there's more drama than there is. It's like, why did they break up? What's going on? And you just say, what's so hard to believe that we weren't ready at 21? Yeah. So for me, I got married when I was 21 and I knew going into it that it wasn't right. And I wrote about this in my book,

but I did it anyways because of kind of what you're saying. It's like the talk of the town. Everyone knows that you were engaged and then you called off a wedding and it's like, you feel kind of embarrassed almost. And so I, you know, obviously went ahead and went through with it, but it's like, it's easier just to trust how you're feeling. If you're not ready, don't, don't be embarrassed. Don't care what other people think. I know it's hard sometimes, but you just have to do what's best for you. In six to 12 months, there'll be some other story the town can talk about if not even that long i do think it's really important and like it was the hardest thing or wish the thing i had the most when i was younger in your age and i'm sure amanda will agree is more perspective and that's just the it's hard you can't teach perspective um that's something you get

through life experiences and so that's why i give you so much credit that you had some perspective that you got for some innate reason and maybe it was from maybe witnessing other maybe you didn't realize it but like your willingness or gut to follow through with that instinct you won't i can sure you won't regret it and you're making a really good and he might you might marry this guy but i can assure you that if you do decide to marry you guys you now have a better chance of having a much happier marriage because whatever didn't feel right um now will hopefully change but it had you got married now you would never have gone over that kind of feeling of our am i ready yeah and like whenever you know say it does happen in two three four years whenever it is i don't think you'll ever look

back and be like oh i wish we would have done it sooner you know like it's okay you can take your time with things and i don't know about this guy the relationship but i will give you some one bit of advice i wish i don't know maybe amanda you. In a relationship, if you're in a committed serious relationship at 21, 22, make sure you're dating someone where you mutually want each other to do more, not less. Like where you're comfortable with having each other take risks and like get outside of your comfort zone and grow as a couple. Because I think a lot of younger couples who are dating at such a young age, they're so afraid of losing each other that they're like, well, we don't want to move and we want to stay in this small town and we just want to live a simple life. If that's what you want to do, great.

But I think sometimes some or both people in a relationship are so afraid of someone growing apart from them. They're not supportive and new jobs jobs I think it's important to be dating someone who you both are willing to is let's say someone gets a promotion willing to we're willing to take a risk together and grow because otherwise one or both of you at 28 26 is gonna feel like you missed out on opportunities and you sacrifice from them and you're gonna there's gonna be resentment so I hope you are both willing to do that yeah i feel like that's part of the reason we called it off too they just like i was so scared that i would end up marrying someone who would feel kind of like regret that that happened at

a young age before we kind of got to experience like living yeah yeah i mean you you can be in a relationship at a young age you just have to both be willing to uh take risks together and be supportive of um growing you know i think younger couples make the mistake of of isolating themselves and suffocating each other yeah so hopefully that's helpful i think you're doing a great job. I give you a lot of credit and don't question your decision to follow your gut. Yeah, thank you so much. No problem. I really appreciate it.

All right, take care. Good luck. Bye. Well, Amanda, thanks so much for coming. Thanks for having me. I'm so glad we could do this. By the way, I'm obsessed with that diffuser. I have it in my kitchen.

Oh, thank you. Amanda is a Natural Habits customer. I am. How do your kids like it? They love it. Yeah. Like Charlie always wants to put the little drops in and it makes the house smell really good.

Yeah. Do you, when do you use it the most? I just like, I put it on at night, like when we're hanging out in the living room or something. Oh, very calming. It is. I love it. Natoils.com, everybody.

Well, Amanda, thanks so much. I really do appreciate you coming. Of course. You've become a good friend over the years. Check out Amanda's book, Pre-Orderer, right now. It's not out quite. When's it come out? It comes out September 3rd.

But the cool thing is, so a lot of the websites, if you pre-order it, you get the lowest price. So if it ever goes on sale and you have it on pre-order, you'll always get that price. And then something kind of cool that I did is I made an e-chapter, which is like an updated chapter. So if you order it on pre-order, you'll also get sent that chapter. So it's like an extension of the book. Yeah.

Oh, that's fun. So yeah. There's some good tea in it, people. There is. It's fun. Thanks for coming. Yeah, thanks thanks i never talked about amanda telling me some guy she dated um this is the small dick story yeah oh i was gonna ask about it i never talk about this stuff on podcast but i knew it was gonna come up with with nick because she was dating someone and early in the relationship no uh he just goes listen i know

i have a little dick and i just think that's hysterical and what did you say i just i remember i was like this is not really happening and so i was you know i just was nice i was like what really i don't notice it's fine but you did Wait, you had already seen it when he said that. Did you notice? Did you noticed, but did you think it was an issue? Were you like

ever like... That's a yes. I'm not answering this. I don't think it was an issue, but I mean I noticed. I wasn't like this is a problem, but I mean I noticed. But you wished it was bigger? No, I didn't say that. He could tell you were disappointed. That's why he said it didn't say that he could tell you were disappointed that's why he said it did you think he could tell you're disappointed you think there was just an insecurity i think it was an insecurity and he basically said this yeah i don't think it was anything that i did or said i think he just like felt insecure and like wanted to

address it and then you keep dating not much longer but it wasn't because of that yeah it wasn't that yeah i mean yeah i feel like you dated for at least a minute. Like maybe two weeks. Three weeks. Anyways, I just, I remember you telling me the story and I was like, what a wild conversation. Yeah. It was so awkward. I can imagine like dating a girl and be like, hey, listen, I just.

I've had guys say that to me. You have? Like a preamble. Yeah. Like before it happens, just want to warn you. I like a warning. You do. I like knowing what I'm getting into.

I think we have to do a whole episode on dicks. Like we're not dick shamers here. No. It's just a funny story how he said that. It's just like a funny conversation. Yeah. When it's micro. What about the opposite end of the spectrum?

Yes. I want to be in the right head space. I tape it to my leg. If it's any indication of what you're about to get into. But you had already hooked up with this person. Yeah. Anyways, I forgot to bring that up in the middle. Yeah, it's funny.

It was hysterical. Thanks for coming, Amanda. All this good stuff and more let's listen to red flags right let's listen to red flags yeah i think that's uh that's thank you rochelle yeah a good takeaway follow your gut get you know i i don't how many what how do we keep following our gut if something's telling you ask more questions something telling you is off and listen if they're hot that's fine you're not shallow but um be maybe a little shallow yeah it's fine you think so it's okay to be a little shallow i don't think liking someone they're hot is shallow only dating them because they're hot and shallow. That's the takeaway. Okay. And follow the red flags.

Yes. Not follow them. Don't follow the red flags. I hope you guys learned a lot. Yeah, this was fun. All right. Thank you, Amanda, as always. Thanks.

Great to see you. You too. Thanks, guys, for listening. As always, we will see you next week.