The Viall Files - E35 Ask Nick - From Friend Zone to F*cking

Episode Date: August 19, 2019

Our weekly episode featuring questions from fans is back! Nick and Sug joined by producer Richelle answer your calls about sex and dating. We talk about friend-zoning, waiting until marriage, and *gulp* STDs. Plus, we dive into the details of Nick and Sug’s friendship. Has she seen the D? You’ll have to listen to find out. Be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode. Send your questions to [e-mail]. Thanks to our sponsor AURATE! https://auratenewyork.com/viall CODE: VIALL See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

you're crazy happy monday everybody welcome to another episode of vile files questions with nick edition once again we're excited to uh be with you twice a week. We have Suge here. Hello. We have Rochelle, as always. Yes. Lovely ladies. How's life been? Really great, I assume? Yes.

Pretty good. It's been a pretty good life. We got some great, great calls coming up. Really exciting calls. I thought it was fun. We kind of delved into you and Suge's relationship. We talk about my relationship with suge our relationship our friendship we have uh a lot of interesting calls a lot about friend zoning and

yeah and uh jumping ladders from friend zoning to fucking maybe maybe suge and i are or maybe we're not tune in to this episode you gotta find find out, have I seen the D? It's the big question amongst my gays. I know that much. Listen, life's confusing and we're just here to try to have some conversations about life and dating and we thank you guys for tuning in with us.

You are good at female friendships. I will say that. Do you think that's true? At having female friendships for himself? Yeah, I think that's true. Sure. How friendships for himself? Yeah, I think that's a difficult thing to do. Sure. How about you? Are you good at having male friendships?

Oh, yeah. Really good. Really good? What kind of friendships? I just get friend-zoned, I feel like, immediately. How has your dating life been, Rochelle? Well, okay, so I asked a guy out. I've been on a year of asking guys out, okay?

Okay, that's great. But I've gotten my rate. What's it when you get zero responses i've been batting zero average you're batting zero yeah okay i'm batting zero okay what do you mean no one says yes and how are you asking like on dating apps in person i always do it over it's i never do it in person which is you're sliding in the dms or texting or emailing i've emailed no one no one zero well this guy circled back i asked him out a year ago he just circled back cute okay you mean you've gone on dates i know you're not that's i've gone on dates yes sometimes people ask me out but when i've asked someone out, this is the only guy and it took him a year. Okay, great. So he circled back.

This is not encouraging. Hey, hey, he circled back. He circled back. I want to focus on this and how's that going? Maybe you have a type of people who just aren't very motivated

in life. Well, it was a nice date, but then, so we went out a couple times and he invited me over and he turns out he's like super into vr virtual reality video games like he has stickers on his car about vr okay so i get there and he makes me watch

four videos of him playing vr because that's weird right he makes you watch him playing vr when he said makes you watch not make me but sit was like here i'm gonna play this for you yeah but it was like the least sexy thing you could possibly do and that's a long time maybe one where maybe one how did it come up there was no segue well he's like thinking he's gonna sell these videos to someone and like make money like get them on a network but so he has this idea for work and yes you're taking on it or yeah that's a little bit more normal than he made me watch a video that's how he also ignored you i'm sure for four of these games and was super into his game or was he involving you no he wasn't playing the game

i was watching a video of him playing which i think is weird but it is it is like a thing is it well i think for like like twitch I don't know. I don't, I'm not familiar with this world. It blows my mind but apparently there's this, like gamers can make a lot of money. Tons of money. Lots of money.

They have like gaming houses where you move into a house and that's what you do all day. And people watch them play the game and get tips and tricks and shit. Yeah. Is he giving tips of how to play? It's just like funny.

He like edits it. It's meant to be comical so it's like a comedy and you're a comedy woman funny he knows you're funny he wanted he respects your opinion okay maybe i said it in worse it felt not fun for me fair enough so but doesn't yeah just because he meant to be funny doesn't necessarily make it funny people attempt to be funny all the time yeah but i then i got in my head i was like why are you so obsessed with vr and then i was like are you watching vr porn because i watched black mirror and the first one last season is all about good yeah have you seen that i have not

oh it's about yeah it's two boys two best friend guys that play vr and they run into each other in the vr world and one is a girl and one's a boy and they start hooking up as their vr characters it's excellent i'm like is that what he's into is he like living some double life with some anime girl on vr so that's that's where you went yeah that's where i went i mean i don't think there's a i don't think you make that assumption that quickly that he's in the v. What if he is into VR porn? Is that a problem? And when you say into VR porn means he watches VR, that's his taste of porn?

Or like he's obsessed? But you know, in the Black Mirror, like they couldn't get, they weren't excited by regular experiences anymore. Yeah, but that's playing off just porn in general. Yeah. Like, right? I mean, what if he watches vr what if that's his only

point he watches that extra weird no i just feel like how can you compete with vr titties oh honey the real thing look at those sitting beside me if i grabbed your boob right now i guarantee you that would be more satisfying than me pretending to win a game. They're doing incredible things with VR. I've played. I have a friend. I don't think he's obsessed with VR porn. Incredible things. They are. And while it was very cool and very realistic to kill a zombie in the VR world, it still wasn't like a real zombie. No, it would be much more satisfying to kill a zombie in real life.

Or also just way scarier if there was an actual zombie there. Scarier, yeah. So where are we now are you so okay after i was like listen i don't know about this guy i'm gonna wait till he reaches out and then see so i never reached out he never reached out was a mutual ghosting okay that's a nice ghosting mutual ghost is that a thing? No, just to not reach back out. What is that? That's a thing. Not even to say thanks, that was fun. Moving on. Well, it wasn't fun. Oh. It was fun-ish. Wait, so now you want the guy you don't want?

Yeah. Because he doesn't want you? Exactly, Nick. That is how my brain works. Well, this is how everyone's breaking up. No, fun-ish isn't, you know, whatever. Next. You don't like the guy.

Anyways, this is what questions with Nick. And do we call it questions with Nick? I know I did on my Instagram. You want to call it questions with Nick? I don't know. Ask Nick is what I called it. Ask Nick. Ask us.

I want to be wanted. It doesn't matter by whom. Don't we? Yes. Really? Of course. And you are wanted by me. I'm still thinking about grabbing your boob.

Also, you probably were just like judgy. Listen. I was judgy. I love you, Michelle. But when you get judgy, it's pretty clear on your face that you are. Was he handsome? Not into it. Yeah.

Yeah? He was hot. He was a hot VR person. Who respects your opinion as a comedian. Who respects your opinion as a comedian. Your opinion as a comedian. And wanted your take on this video. And you sat there like, Nick.

Nick. Yeah. So you never followed up with him? Mm-mm. Well, maybe we should follow up. If he wanted to go out again, would you go out with him? At this point, yeah. No, it's been too long. It he wanted to go out again, would you go out with him? At this point, yeah. No, it's been too long.

It's been too long. How long has it been? It's been a week. Oh, my God. A week? Not a week? Holy shit. Is he even alive still?

You guys are the worst. A week is not a long time. Well, I think... I don't know. It might be worth another shot. Give it a shot. A virtual shot. I mean, listen. He hasn't followed up shot. Give it a shot. A virtual shot. I mean, listen.

He hasn't followed up with you, so take that in consideration. Yeah. That you are... A week is too long to not reach out. A week you didn't reach out? I think he probably... It would have been nice

if he reached out to you by now. Absolutely. But it's also not too long to be like, I just don't know how much she judged him to his face. I know. Oh, God. That's hard. He might be a little bit like, I don't know how much she judged him to his face. I know. Oh, God. That's hard.

He might be a little bit like, I don't know, she doesn't respect my livelihood. And I haven't heard from her. Yeah. What if he's feeling very vulnerable about opening up his door? He's probably worried. She probably thinks I'm super into VR porn. I don't know. I'm curious.

If you have any interest at all and if you feel like it went off the rails because conclusions were being jumped to, it might be worth reaching out again. What's the worst that could happen? With what? You asking them out again. If you reached out again. Just don't. I think it's better to let sleeping dogs lie. Because you're not into it.

That's it. You're not into it. To me, I'm like, you're not into it. I'm not. Fair enough. Moving on. We've moved on. Anyway. If you're not into it, fine. To me, I'm like, you're not into it. I'm not. Fair enough. Moving on. We've moved on. Anyway.

Well, guys, as always, thanks for listening. We have an exciting show ahead of you guys. It's going to be great. Question time with Nick. Let's ask Nick your sexy questions. What is your name? What is your question? How can we help?

My name is Stephanie, and I'm calling in today asking you about potentially getting yourself out of the friend zone with one of your oldest friends. So I really have really strong feelings for a friend I've known for 20-something years. We've kind of been there with each other through everything. But lately, I've realized that I like him as more than a friend. But I don't know if it's risky to try to date your oldest friend or how to even find out if they would potentially feel the same. How long have you known this friend for? Like 24 years or something. Really long time. 24 years. And why have you decided that you want to pursue this?

Well, in the last few years, I've had stronger feelings for him, more than a friend feeling. But he's always been dating someone else. So I've never talked to anyone about it or pursued it because he was dating somebody. But now he's single now he's single and I'm single and I'm like, we hang out real a lot more than we used to, you know, during our college years. And so I'm just kind of thinking like, you know, maybe the two of us can try to date or something, but I don't know. Have you guys ever expressed or has there been any when you first became i mean that was 24 years ago this is not like i mean has there ever been a moment that without you trying to search for it um like has there been an obvious awkward situation so we're both like very like physical

people like you know we hug a lot and we're like always all over each other so it's you know very like when you say all over each other i mean sure like you know he'll like like when we walk like you know he'll kind of like lean on me or like we'll hold on to each other like we'll hold hands sometimes like but not in like hold hands i don't think he ever intends it let's just cut to the chase have you seen the d have you no she hasn't seen his have you seen the d what have you seen his penis yeah oh no no yeah uh so it sounds like it's safe to say you don't really have much to go on hit the fact that he's your physical he's physical suge is a very physical person every time i pick her up she constantly strokes my bicep i don't think she's trying to sleep with me. I just know that should likes

physical touch. And as friends, I don't read into it. I think sometimes people can make the mistake, especially if they've decided, oh, I might want to be curious about that. You start reading into situations that really just aren't there. I mean, I don't know. I don't have a lot of information to go on about this guy. But if you're speaking in general about friend zoning and how to take that leap, it's incredibly challenging. It's even more challenging for you because you've known this guy for so long. I mean, would you consider him your best friend or is he just some guy you've known for a long time? You've always been kind of pals. He's like one of my best friends. Like, you know, we hang out a lot. We talk to each other a lot. Like we kind of like lean he's like one of my best friends like you know we we hang out a lot we

talk to each other a lot like we kind of like lean on each other for everything so let me ask you this i mean and that's great because obviously when it comes to relationships that's i'll you know there's a lot of things about having a best friend of the opposite sex you're just like man like well we love hanging out you know like sugar and i are great friends and we spend a lot of time together we are platonic friends there's a lot what Suge and I do on a daily basis. We're like, well, you know, whenever I meet someone, I'd like to have this type of, like, fun and comfortability with someone. But at the same time, I'm just kind of really curious about why, other than that, fine, why have you decided that, you know, just because he's available? Because, again, I'm using suge as the example

and i have other women friends that i love spending time with uh other than am i just bored and lonely you know why have i decided to want no i'm just talking about you know what i'm saying like if you are friends with someone what is changing you or go oh well you're single i guess have you always felt this way and and I mean does it come down I'm so curious about like the physical touch of it all like because I I haven't had that happen to me where I was in a friendship and it switched over but I I have I guess wanted to explore what it would be like physically you know or are you like really starting to picture this as your husband yeah back to next point.

What did change? Yeah. Because I don't, I don't think she's just like, yeah, he's hot. I always wanted to fuck him. No, I know. But that when you suddenly want to have sex with your friend, it could mean a lot more. What changed other than the fact that you're both single isn't a reason. So we'll start there.

I, you know, I honestly, if I really rack my brain, I really don't know what changed because we've been friends for so long. And like, you know, he's always dated while we like we've been friends. But I think like over the last few years, he's just been there for me more. And I just I kind of like I like having that. And he's just he's just an all around good guy. Like, you know, he has fun and you want an all-around good guy like you you know he has fun and you want to have fun with him like you know he makes you laugh he makes everyone laugh

he just always wants everyone to have a good time I think I just I don't know maybe it's just I really enjoy hanging out with him and I'm that all turning that into like wanting to date him but like again it's not it's definitely not like just a physical like oh I really just want to sleep with him like I really could see myself like, Oh, you know, I never thought of it before, but like, you know, he's a really good guy. Like I could see myself dating him and being happy. Totally. I, uh, I think, I mean, the generalization is you're going to have to make a choice.

I don't know this guy, how mature he is, how could he handle you putting yourself out there? Would it change the dynamic? Are you guys mature enough to, are you mature enough to be rejected and then still have the same type of friendship? I mean, these are all variables you have to consider. I mean, honestly, I know I definitely am because I've had it happen before where like a friend, like I've expressed that I liked a friend and they, you know, weren't feeling the same and we're still friends today.

Right. But I think with him, it's same and we're still friends today right but I think with him it's just we've been friends for much longer than the rest of the group and I'm very very nervous about like you know trying anything but maybe if you approached it without like you know let's get into a relationship but just like the honest feeling of like, hey, like I'm suddenly starting to think of us in this way. Is that a, have you ever like making it an easy conversation? I've never made that transition. I'm usually the one who I'm, you know, just as my personality,

if I don't ever like grow into wanting to date someone if I'm friends with them, that's just me. That's different for a lot of people. I think that's the person I try. I think there's two ways to approach this. I don't necessarily... I'm not saying which is one's better than the other. I think it has to do with personality.

There's the slow play option, right? You could simply just kind of put it out there, maybe feel him out. At some point, you're going to have to be vulnerable to let him know like you can't confuse him and just start rubbing his arm a little bit more you know like you can't you know like you can't just start like being like do you want to go on a date you know like you have to put yourself out there at least a little bit yeah but you could generally play it a little bit slower where you can just slow play it or you can or you can like take a stand almost and say, I've decided I want to pursue a relationship with you in your head.

And then you really put yourself out there. I see Shug shaking her head. Here's the thing. The first option is the safe play. That makes it easier to put yourself out there, put your toe in the water. It's a little cold. You're like, I really don't want to swim in that pool. But I do think the second option is a bigger risk.

But if you really want this, I think it has the best chance of having you succeed. The reason why I say this is because a lot of people in relationships, they like to have their cake and eat it too, in a sense. And that doesn't make him a bad guy, but he also, I'm assuming values your relationship as well. He probably comes to you for advice and there's a comfort thing. Again, sugar and I, we kind of joke, but like we're, we're both single. So there are moments that because we're both single, it's kind of like, Hey, can I, can I wear and talk and whatever? If either of us in relationships, I'm not saying we will stop hanging out or be friends but that our significant others will start filling those spaces right and so right right i'm just saying uh usually people in friend zones the best way to change that or jump that ladder is to stop

giving them what you're giving them in the friend relationship right because they can have it they don't need to necessarily date you to get the value that you're bringing to the table already. And if they don't want to be in a committed relationship. So to really do that, you kind of have to stop to say, listen, if you want this, you have to have all of it. And I want to be in a relationship with you. So I'm not going to be available. And it's kind of like, it sucks, but you have to kind of stop being the friend that you are if you want the relationship with them. Otherwise, people tend to, again,

I'm not saying that's what you should do, but talk about a friend zone. Like it's very hard to accomplish what you're doing. Most likely after 24 years, maybe. And like the love story, you got Ashley and Jared, you know, fine. But those are the exceptions, not the rule Ashley and Jared, you know, fine. But those are the exceptions, not the rule. I just think you have to stop. And again, back bringing Ashley and Jared,

for those of you who know Ashley and Jared, Ashley had to move on. Jared like had the friend, he had it all. And Ashley finally, for the first time in their friendship, she started seriously dating someone else. So there needs to be a trigger or a rattle and they have to stop thinking they can get it. That's usually the only way to get person to realize if I want you in my life, I need to have all of you. I just show you, again, that's not the only option. You can slow play it. But generally speaking, people don't tend to come around

unless he's just like on some other podcast calling right now and being like i like this girl i don't know how to say it we're friends for 24 years like who knows that's highly unlikely i i just think to me because you it sounds like you have such a great best friendship and that is so rare maybe if not even more rare than being in a romantic relationship to me so not losing that should definitely be a priority and i know that that's that you're not saying to give that up but because you're in such a good close friendship there's no reason to me that this isn't a conversation and you know if he's like oh i don feel that way, then then you make a decision like, OK, do my feelings go away or am I in love with him? You know, like if you're just at the point and it sounds to me or you're like, wow, I'm starting to kind of think and picture and romanticize this guy, which I haven't done over 24 years.

And that's starting to happen to you, it's almost like you're in a better seat to kind of catch it before your fantasies about him take over. And then you need to be like, hey, I need to stop fucking being around you. I agree with Shug. In your situation here, my gut tells me you're not totally sure if you want to date him. You're not convinced. You're not like 100%. You're like, maybe and to suge's point yeah you have a great friend that you i'm at the i'm kind of at

the point that i'm just like is it is it worth it to keep thinking about it and possibly ruin my friendship or like just the friend group itself and make things weird just because i want to date my friend like here here's, I don't know. My gut tells me you're slightly bored with your dating life and a little impatient and he is a potentially great option. And you're like, huh, what if I date him? He seems like a great guy. It makes a lot of sense.

I think to Shug's point, you have a great friend and there is a risk there. So maybe like don't nest, let's kind of more search inward on yourself for a little bit longer still date other people and see really see there maybe explore in the meantime while you're like focus on yourself maybe put out a little feelers and kind of see if it's even an option i think what i'm saying about the cut it off is again using ashley and if you're using ashley as an example ashley was in love with jared she it wasn't a question she wasn't debating whether i want to be friends with them she's like no i want to be with this guy and i will settle with a friendship if you

get to that point and you can't just be yourself for the people listening and they're in this like and again these friendships a lot of people in these friend zones, there's that person who's like decided, okay, I guess I'll be your friend because it's my only option. And eventually you'll get stressed and you'll fight and you'll like, you'll give them your time and you will be there for me. You'll make yourself available all the time and you'll do all the nice things. And again, Ashley did all these sweet things for Jared and it was sincere, but in her wanting to make Jared happy, but she always wanted she always wanted Jared's love in return and what I'm saying is right if you're that friend out there

who who knows you want to be with someone you have to stop doing that to get that person to see you in a different light like Ashley and Jared so I just think for you right now in your situation I'm not entirely convinced this is what you want i think you've decided maybe it could be a great option because he's a great guy which is a true thing which is a true thing yeah and you know that that really is a very beautiful way for a marriage to start and like one of the ones that i think would probably last is ones that happen between friends and people that know each other and that's what they say. You want it to be your best friend, like Ashley and Jared. Like that's the kind of stuff that lasts forever.

So I think it's so worth you having these thoughts and worth you pursuing this idea at a paced way and involving him. You know, look at you, girl. Yeah, I would keep trying to date other people while slowly figuring out if there's anything there and then decide if this is what you want girl. Yeah. He should. I would keep trying to date other people while slowly figuring out if there's anything there. Yeah. And then decide if this is what you want to go for.

At some point, you might have to take a risk. But usually these things don't just wake up and we're dating. You know, like one of you, you'll have to figure it out. And until you see the D, you don't really know what you want. I'm just kidding. You're just nodding like it's serious. You know the D means the penis. What I would slowly start doing is definitely,

if he wants to talk to you about girls he's dating, fine. Never ask anymore. Stop asking. Stop asking about his relationship. Stop giving a shit about that. Stop pretending you care about wanting to hear about him having sex with other girls. Just set that precedent early on. Kind of subconscious of you're not, stop being a person.

That is something that I kind of started doing. So a few months ago, he invited me out with our, like our friend group. It was a bunch of us. I'm usually the only girl in the group. So it was very, like, it's always very chill, honestly. But so he invited me out specifically to get my approval about a girl and then like i told him like yeah she's really cool i like her like you know we get along she doesn't seem stuck up like keep dating her if you want to but like i

didn't make a big deal out of like you know anything that she was doing like he made me like her handler for the night when we all started drinking a little bit. And then a few weeks later he stopped dating her. I'm like, he was so into this girl. I mean, welcome to, it just felt like, it just felt like the second I told him I liked her that he like was like,

okay, I'm done with that. That you're reading into, um, for sure. You're, that has nothing to do with you. He just decided he doesn't like a girl anymore.

A lot of guys like a girl and stop liking them overnight. So that has nothing to do with you. So stop reading into situations that aren't there. It just felt weird. I was like, I hope I didn't. Nah, it felt weird to you. Yeah, it had nothing to do with you. But the reason that Nick is saying to stop having interest in the people that he's dating i think is because

that's a clear sign that you have romantic feelings about him like really like look at the places where you can send those signals right it's like he was the more he goes to you for advice the more he sees you as a friend right so you got to get him to stop you'd have to slowly get him to stop seeing you see you you have to slowly start to get you got it slowly start get him to stop. You'd have to slowly get him to stop seeing you. See, you have to slowly start to get. You got it. Slowly start getting him to see you in a different light. Right. So, all right.

Hopefully that's helpful. All right. Thanks for calling in. All right. Have a great day. Thanks, Stephanie. Bye. You too.

The friend zone thing. It's a real thing. No, it is but again I think A lot of friend Zone relationships There's the ones that are true Friendships and there's an even playing Field and especially a lot of them

Are there's not people just accept To be friends because that's all they can Have totally and if you Like you have to take at some point you Have to risk the friendship But I always like if that's all they can have. And if you, like, you have to take, at some point you have to risk the friendship. But I always, like, if that's, but if the friendship isn't what you really want, then you're not necessarily losing anything. Because a lot of times these friends own relationships,

so much of that relationship you have because you don't have the boyfriend or girlfriend. They're filling that void. And you're just lying to yourself about like how close of friends you are. But in reality, they're just taking up the emotional side of the relationship. It's like you're just not getting the sex. You're saying if they want something more than just a friendship. Yes. If they want that. Yes, I agree. And the truth is, it's kind of like with anything. If you're not being true to how you honestly feel in a

relationship and like you're on one side of it and you're like yes i'm just your friend but really your insides are telling you something it's so toxic for you and there's not a real friendship there anyway like you're always wanting for something that's not happening it's just so so unhealthy and and it doesn't end well so you're right like standing up and being like yeah the only way to do that is to shut it down and shut it down you gotta you gotta shut it down uh you do you guys not struggle with that at all you guys being you're both single but we are no there's never been i mean you know we're talking about people lying about themselves so in theory i guess neither of us would know but i would fully admit we don I get, maybe, maybe we're also like,

again, again, not to aid shame the youth, but like as older people, I think it's, you're more comfortable with the things you want and don't want, you know? Yeah.

I mean, I think it's easier for people who have been in relationships before to just be platonic friends because early in life you meet someone, you have this chemistry and you're trying to figure out what that means as opposed to like, listen, if we have sex, it's gonna get weird or whatever. So we don't, I don't with other women, but I can't speak for everyone.

It's a- I think it's a beautiful thing when you can early on analyze where more benefit is gonna come from from a relationship and like with nick for an example i think that that's you know i look at it and i'm like where am i going to get the most benefit out of having this person in my life it's not from from being in a sexual relationship with him i feel like that was like a passive aggressive dig at my dick but oh trust me i'm very interested in your dick but but I don't want to

be in a relationship with it. Okay. Yeah, anyway, it's fascinating. What is your name? My name is Lauren. Hi, Lauren. I'm Nick. This is Suge. We have Rochelle in the room as well. Yes. Nice to meet you guys.

Nice to meet you both. I have to say, Suge, I used to watch you on YTV. Oh, we have a Canadian calling in. Hello. I'm in Montreal right now. Oh, lovely. Montreal, all right. Fellow Canadians, yes. Wonderful. Oh, well, you know, I love the zone. We'll be there in our hearts forever.

Wonderful. Yes, exactly, yeah. How can we help you, Lauren? our hearts forever. Wonderful. Yes, exactly. Yeah. How can we help you, Lauren? So the question that I sent in has to do with a friend of mine who is somebody who I used to have a pretty intense relationship with sexually, emotionally, everything like that. But were they your boyfriend or girlfriend? Or like you just, everything without the label? We were never, yeah, we were never officially in a couple or anything.

But basically what happened was I, a couple years ago, ended a relationship. And a few months after that, I met an older guy that I'd kind of known through my ex-boyfriend. How much older? And so we have a 16-year age difference. Okay. How old are you? Yeah. I'm 28, and he'll be 45 at the end of the month.

Okay. So, yeah. So we both kind of met at a time when we were both going through a difficult time, and so we became really, really close. And eventually it led to a sexual relationship. And so that kind of went on for about five months. And eventually one day it was he kind of he made the decision that, you know, it wasn't really the best idea that we continue going in the direction that we were going in, given that we both you know obviously

the age difference and everything and just had different like plans in life and stuff and so so now it's been um about a year and a half since the last time we slept together um but we're still extremely close okay so we we call each other every morning and every night. Who's calling who more? Who's calling who more? He's probably calls me more. Yeah. I'd say he's a little bit more dependent on me, but we go through our phases.

Like, like sometimes like he'll be busy doing something and I'll get really dependent and like, why aren't you talking to me? Or other, sometimes it's the opposite. So, um, yeah, it kind of goes back and forth. Um, so what's your question? dependent and like why aren't you talking to me or other sometimes it's the the opposite so um yeah it kind of goes back and forth um so what's your question and well so my question is is because i have this friendship with him that i don't really want to like i i don't want to give up on that friendship but i do want to start dating again but i'm not really sure how i can uh do you want to be in a relationship with him like no i don't want to be in again, but I'm not really sure how I can, uh, Do you want to be in a relationship with him? Like, no, I don't want to be in a relationship.

You're a hundred percent. You're certain of that? I'm like, yeah, I'm 100% certain. Why don't you want to be in a relationship with him? Because he's, um, like in a non-malicious way, he's just a very selfish person. Okay. Yeah, he's not. You know, for example, I had a an emergency this past winter with my cat, and he didn't want to come and help me. Yeah, I gotta say it sounds like he's doing something now. Yeah, honey, it does sound like he's taking up a lot of your real estate. And yeah, that, you know, real estate being like a morning phone call

and an evening phone call, that's relationship kind of stuff. We've been, Nick and I have been relating a lot of with callers today about like our friendship and we're just friends. And if he's trying to pose it to you, like you're just friends, but he's taking that good morning and that good night call. Like we really do as women and as men need to reserve certain things for relationships. And I think that crosses a line. Like, doesn't it sound Nick? Like they're kind of behaving in a relationship. Totally. I totally agree with that. That's why I'm just trying to figure out, I think one of these situations, it's important to figure out what do you really want? I think that's a really great observation to know that he is selfish and in a relationship you want someone who wants to help you take care

of your cat or whatever that's great to know yeah um i just want to know like again like if he called you up and just like i i love you lauren i want to be with you and he really fought uh how would that change your mentality or you just don't see him that way? Is there a world in which you could date him? No, I really don't. I don't. I can confidently say that. But my thing is that I would like to continue my friendship with him and continue doing all the things that we do together.

All the things? We go camping. Well, not all the things. But also be able to have a relationship with someone and have them understand you know that him and i were just friends yeah but to suge's point you're not honest about you're not just past has been yeah right to suge's point you're not just friends right there's also the element of that you you used to be sexually intimate with him. I have women friends that I am best friends with that we have slept. We met.

We started dating. Like, different than my friendship with Suge. But we, like, we met. I met Suge in a friend situation. I met other girls when we pursued each other romantically the first few weeks. There was intimacy. And there was a gap between. And we never really dated that long where it got weird

and now we're we're great friends that's the situation but this is someone not only that you were you were sexually intimate with right now he is feeling so many roles as a boyfriend and we're not just talking about like like in sugar and i and our friendship do we hang out and spend a lot of time together sure do we do activities together sure do i do i pop over and and download my day if i've had a bad day and vice versa sure do we call each other every morning and night no are we taking like camping trips and overnight trips together no do i invite suge as i date to a wedding ever no and vice versa jeez you can take me to a wedding no i'm just saying but like i guess if i if i guess i would take take me to a wedding. No, I'm just saying, but like, I guess if I,

I would take Suge to a wedding, but I'm just saying like, right now he is feeling so much to Suge's point of this boyfriend. And if you want to date someone else, sure. I mean, you should, you should taper down this relationship.

So you have to decide what kind of friend do you really want this whole morning and night thing, this camping trips. Cause I can tell you you right now when you do meet a guy confident or not he's going to be like all right like i'm fine with him being your friend and i can even get past the fact that maybe you had sex with him a year and a half ago but like you're fucking dating this guy like i don't like i don't and to that point i mean you wake up and yeah if you want the same friendship,

that means you're going to date this guy and you're going to be sitting next to him at seven 30 in the morning and Chuck, whoever the fuck this guy is going to call you up and be like, Hey Lauren, what's up? Like, well you say goodnight, you know,

like we talk about that and we, we, we both acknowledge the fact that obviously once one of the, one of us starts dating somebody, our relationship is going to change. But I guess in denial that, you know, we have so much fun when we do these things together. We go camping. We go to shows.

We head down to Vermont. It's super fun. And I would love to be able to continue it. You can. Yeah, I think. You can, but you need so. It's so important that you make room now in your life for this new person to come along. And when, you know, the new, I don't know, Brad Pitt of your life shows up and you're spending time with him, you can bring Chuck on the camping trip and he can meet Brad Pitt and it can be a great time.

a great time but those boundaries really do need to be set up now and you have to get used to being just friends with chuck before brad pitt comes like brad pitt isn't gonna step in until chuck is is has like very healthy boundaries i totally agree because it's also gonna it's gonna whatever you think this relationship is it's it would get met if you let's say i meet a guy tomorrow and you just happen to go to you know meet a guy and you're just like oh wow i think i met a guy and i think he likes me because you haven't done this yet it will inevitably get messy right you like chuck whoever like he would start he would get jealous or whatever i mean there's there's something there you guys are doing that you're not being maybe totally honest with the relationship and maybe it's because he is just selfish and he's just around but i totally agree

with with suge that you don't have the real estate to most likely fall for someone right now because he's taking up too much of your emotional time um you rely on each other so much for like emotional intimacy and that's different than a friendship um and that would be a challenge so you can still he can still be a very close friend but he can but he can be the type of friend where he is just a friend and right now it doesn't sound like he's just a friend it's like this weird kind of almost boyfriend but it is weird yeah and you said it he's selfish this bitch doesn't even show up to take care of your cat get the fuck out here. Don't call me in the morning. That's the new attitude that you can have a little bit.

He felt like it was too traumatic for him. Oh, Jesus. Oh, boy. Get out of here, Chuck. I'm just kidding. You could be friends. Because I have also recently started reflecting on the fact, well, maybe this friendship is actually just preventing me from meeting somebody, too.

It 100%. Because I'm just so comfortable with him. Yeah. I know that he's always going to be there if I call. Yeah. It 100% is in some degree. I can't quantify it by any means, but it certainly is.

Do you have... Sorry to interrupt you. No, I mean, like, that's the thing. I was going to ask, like, how is your friend circle outside of him? Has it been a little bit monopolized by this one person? Or can you start, like start kind of looking at putting more percent of your time to your other friendships?

Yeah, no, I mean, I think I have a better balance now than I did maybe like a year ago. Yeah. Partly because we have opposite schedules now, so we don't actually spend that much time together. But there was definitely a point where i'd say he was pretty much the only person i was spending time with yeah i mean investing i'm usually at work quite a bit yeah but investing in those a bit of time i have myself

yeah like yeah get some and chat up some girlfriends or he's uh some new gays he's 46 i mean i don't have any problem with the age gap. You're an adult woman, but he's not changing. You know, like this is who he is. Most likely. That's what I see is he's like, he's very set in his ways. And that's why I'm quite confident that if one day he were like, Lauren, I'm in love with you. I wouldn't reciprocate the feelings.

That's fine. So like you have to slowly taper. Yeah. Yeah. I think we can agree. You have to slowly taper down the relationship and set those expectations. And I think this would be a great time if he starts being like, hey, why have things changed?

I think you say to him, listen, I love you as a friend, but I do want to meet someone. And I'd be curious what his reaction to say is like, I want you as a friend, but I do want to meet someone. And I'd be curious what his reaction to say is like, I want you as a friend, but I can't keep doing this because, and regardless of what he says, he might try to convince you otherwise, but you need to be confident in your conviction of what you want the relationship to be. Because I'm really curious how he will react when you start changing the dynamic of your friendship. You don't see, I personally, and I'm interested in what you think about this.

I wonder if it's like a conversation of like, hey, I'm about to set up some boundaries here and I don't want to have good morning and good night calls anymore. And I love you, but I need to make room in my life. 100%. I think that would be like a nice like instead of a slow taper, like an actual like, hey, because I think that that just sends messages to your whole new journey that you want to go on into yourself, into your brain and all the rest of it. Like saying it out loud, saying it to him, I think will set you on a really good course and kind of like give you a faster route to finding what you are looking for, which is, you know, love and partnership with the right Brad Pitt. I think that would be an excellent exercise if you're willing to do that, because to Shug's point, not only does it set expectations with him, but it almost is kind of a kick in the pants for you to really go out there if you really want to start meeting someone,

because you are definitely very comfortable in this very bizarro relationship that you have. Yeah, it's a bit weird, yeah. I mean, it's fine. And I think you're right that it's a good, clean conversation. No judgment, but you know you don't want to date him. I think it's good to know that. But you are investing so much energy and emotional time with him

that it's almost impossible to really do other things. All right? Yeah. Very good point. Thank you for your time. Really appreciate you calling in. Enjoy Montreal. It's a great city. I love you, Canadian. Goodbye. Take care.

Yeah, bye. It just seemed a little bit daddy-ish. He's a 45-year-old man. She's 28. Still, I was getting daddy vibes. It's interesting. I wonder what his life is like and how lonely this guy is a little bit and like i don't know if if she's describing this guy like she's doing the same thing selfish okay she gave one example all i'm saying is before we start like painting this picture of this who this you're

right he's maybe a great guy i don't know he can be selfish also doesn't make him a guy and doesn't mean that she has daddy issues if he's selfish it's a unique relationship issues i just said daddy but i mean listen there's definitely an age gap there but 28 and 45 is not like the end of the world and it happens and she's an adult woman and he's an adult guy. Yeah, and love shows up in all different shapes and forms. It sounds like it's been drawn out into something that's not what she wants. And this story that she told could happen with two people

who are two years apart or the same age. Maybe true. Are you just getting defensive? Not remotely. I feel like it. I don't date women usually that are 16 years younger than me. But I'm just saying, I'm just saying in general, she's also 28. Like at that point, like she's an adult. You know, she's totally.

Yeah. I mean, whoever she wants to date, that's fine. And the story she told, nothing about that. What's the tea? What's your biggest age gap? Oh, my biggest? Just like five years. Weak.

No, it's fine. I wasn't getting a vibe from her that the issues had to do with the age. Other than the fact that you might be sent in his ways. But you can be 30 and sent in your ways. It's true. I don't know. Daddy issues. Hi. What's your name?

Allison. You look like Taylor Swift. Yeah. Ooh. Rochelle says you look like Taylor Swift. That's a comment from Rochelle. Oh, thank you. I'm Nick. This is Shug and Rochelle uh Alice thanks for calling in Allison how can we uh help or try or yes um so basically um at the end of my senior year of college, I probably should have gone to the doctor sooner. But like I thought around like Christmas break that I like felt like almost it was really stupid.

I thought it was like a skin tag around like near my vagina. And then I eventually it like grew a little bit. So I was like, OK, like crap, I should definitely go to health services at school. I went, they were like, yes, this is a general award. I was diagnosed with HPV and now I know that it's like, it's a virus. So it's not treatable. I texted the last guy that I had had sex with. And it's the only guy I've had sex with without a condom on.

I was like, Hey, so by the way, way like you should probably know this is a thing that has happened um granted he said that it wasn't him because of course um i also i don't think he would even technically know because i i'm not a doctor we all know this so you're not yeah i like we like i've you know i've been std tested plenty hpv hpv yeah but like i don't know if men can be diagnosed with it like you can you can men can be tested now yeah can they yeah they can look i know i've been okay i'm gonna look it up on the list okay we're gonna look it up and it continues go ahead but yes he probably would say that uh yeah but so now it's just a little bit uncomfortable I feel

like for me moving forward because it's like if I'm excited about a guy how do I bring that up basically without scaring him off and like what's the point when I bring it up if I'm talking to him like I don't want to bring it up too early and then it sounds very presumptive like oh I knew that you were going to want to have sex with me because then I just found a little narcissistic and my ego is huge. I mean, you're a pretty girl. Let's assume every guy you meet kind of maybe wants to have sex with you. It's fine.

There's worse things in the world than going on a date and being like, I don't want to be a dick to assume they might want to have sex with me. You're totally fine in that department. But way to be humble. Okay, so continue. I'm just butting in there is no test for men there is no no yeah that's the thing so yeah there is no actual test for men i thought it was told this like when we go on the bachelor you get tested it's on the list of things they

test for but guys don't know if they are carriers but you said that there's a there's like an external it's like a it's like a genital um kind of wart like there's something showing on the outside it can lead to genital warts or cancer but they removed it right they didn't um they gave me a cream there's like one that's still there it's like i don't know i guess it takes a while um and i did get the gardasil shot but apparently that only protects against cancer like because there's a million different strains i've learned a lot yeah and it's something like up to 80 percent of people are diagnosed like like 80 percent of people have hpv oh yeah so everybody has h i mean like i dated a girl once

who uh were she was my girlfriend and we were one of my best girlfriends ever had and you know she went to the doctor and the doctor you have precancerous cells and they had to do this whole thing and it was a very scary moment for her and like I was at the time I was younger I'm asking all these questions what does this mean like they from an HPV standpoint the doctor's like there's no you know she was immediately wondering well was it you know and she had other boyfriends before we dated and we had been dating for a year and you know there's a lot of questions about like potentially cheating or things like that and i was also me i was nervous but what does this mean she's just like honestly everyone like has been in contact with from an

hpv standpoint right and like there's literally no way to know if you got it from your boyfriend or someone else most likely you probably because it's precancerous cells could have easily got it from something you did in the past and like but hey let's just take care of this situation and it was kind of like something that just blew over yeah um you're in a situation where you have this visible thing and it's, you know, it's like literally, I mean, I can't, I can't imagine. Right. And so.

I have a mole down there. I know that it's very, that's not the same thing, but just to, you know, kind of get on the same page with you in some sort of way. I have like a beautiful mole on my vagina, like right on the lip. It's like right there. Yeah. And I just let it be a surprise but that might be but that's different but i i will say it and and getting to your question like i i went on a few dates with a guy and we were like kissing passionately for the

first time like we had kissed or whatever. But then like, I don't know, it was maybe third date. And we were like laying in a hammock and we were kissing. And he pulled away and he said, you should know I have genital herpes. In that moment. In that moment. Yeah. Which was a bold choice.

But at the same time, I, you know, I had no choice but to respect it because he was saying it before I pulled it out or whatever. So it became an interesting topic. And what I also respected was that he was giving me the choice on how to proceed. Like, do I want to continue a relationship with, you know, a disease, again, that I know you have medicine that prevents it, it's totally controllable, and it's the same with HPV. Like, I understand how

scary it might sound to present to somebody, but the right person is going to be like, either I have HPV too, or it doesn't frighten me and i had some friends that were like somebody has genital herpes keep i mean it's yeah it's interesting this is such an interesting topic because there is a lot of i mean i've always been kind of a hypochondriac when about this stuff so like like you know like i mean the first time i had sex the first time i

lost my virginity i was convinced i had aids you know like i was told never you know, like, I mean, the first time I had sex, the first time I lost my virginity, I was convinced I had AIDS. You know, like I was told never, you know, Catholic guilt or whatever. You call me a lot and say, I think I have AIDS. I just, now, even now I joke around. I'm like, if I have sex with someone, I'm like, all right, well, I'm going to go get tested, you know? And like, no, it's, and so over the years you research

and there is a lot of misinformation about STDs in general. You know, the general herpes or herpes in general, type 1, type 2, again, like the type 1, 80% of the people have at least the antibodies in their system. They may have never had a cold sore, but they have the antibodies because when they were two, their uncle kissed them and whatever, you know, whatever. HPV is even more kind of cloudy in that sense because like men and women for like the herpes can be tested and then men and women equally have, well, breakouts. I mean, it can vary in terms of severity, but it varies with people.

The HPV one, I actually don't know in the sense of like, so like you said, there's so many strands, know in the sense of like so like you said there's so many strands like is your specific strand uh you're prone to the the wart or is it just more case by case so because you have this strand you could potentially a guy you sleep with could also get that or just you just reacted to it differently um i think it's a little bit of both I think that there are some strains that are more like you have a much higher chance of getting genital work. But I think that obviously with every strain, you're not necessarily going to show symptoms. A lot of guys just simply never show symptoms. Sure. Now, with you treating this, the reason I ask, it's so interesting because, again, the girlfriend I had had the pre-cancerous cells it was kind of like she dealt with it she took care of it she's

fine she's you know we broke up she's moved on like it's so out of sight out of mind right and this young lady's situation she has the physical no it's gone right the the warts are gone right no she's it's still there but even still she knows that she has a particular virus that makes it prone to that. And so I'm very curious. How are you feeling? Like, how are you feeling about it? Are you upset about it? Have you accepted it?

I mean, this is this is, you know, this is going to be your path and you're going to be strong and great about it. But how are you feeling? My initial reaction was like I feel gross like I feel I like I feel less than now like I feel almost like I don't know like damaged it's like I got like a knock off of like what like my I guess like my dateability score could be because it's just like oh who wants to date the girl with std that's not treatable um and i think since then i've kind of more so come to terms with the fact that it's like yeah

this is a shitty situation 80 of people have it yeah it sucks i'm just gonna have to like put on my big girl pants and deal with it like there's nothing else that's a healthy approach and yes a lot of it is to that point a lot of his stereotypes i mean what's so fascinating you talk about herpes like literally i don't know i'm throwing out a number but a strong amount of people have the antibodies over colds you see someone down the street and they have a cold sore on their face you're like oh that sucks i don't want that but like i know a lot of people who've got cold sores and they're in relationships and it's just like a thing they both like it's not even a thing they talk about, but if it's on your genital, people lose their shit.

And because the society has told us that it's different, doctors will tell you it's literally the same. In your situation, you have this HPV wart and yet 80% of the people have the pre-cancer cells or have come in contact. Guys don't even fucking know and they just kind of go about their day but because you have this visible thing you feel even more stress about it and that's just kind of it's really is this a society thing i agree with you you're taking a great approach i think it's good to be up front with the guy it's hard for you and i'm not in any way suggesting you shouldn't be up front what's hard for for lauren is it's just so hard to have that conversations because like what is a guy you're like oh but then there's so much information that people don't know and what that means for him

it's it's harder to do if anything it's a great way to have like maybe sex with someone that you just only want to have sex with it. You've, I'm guessing you can have a very great sexual relationship with any person you're in a relationship with and they can be fine. I don't know how it works with if once the wart goes away, is he less likely to get it or not now that you have the shot? Yeah. So all these,

all these things and then the, the sense of feeling less desirable, it's a probably, it's a normal feeling, I would assume, for anyone to have that. But to your point, a lot of people just don't talk about it and everyone out there is floating. And again, when I was dating someone who had the pre-cancerous cell, what is the difference? I don't know. Technically, literally nothing other than the fact that she, instead of didn't get a wart, but she got cancer cells in her body, which is technically scary and life-threatening, but she caught it early and dealt with.

It's just a really scary thing and all the more reason that we should always practice safe sex when you're specially sleeping with people because this guy that you slept with didn't know, I'm guessing, and still doesn't know. And when he goes and gets a physical and he goes and gets STD tested, he goes and he gets his blood drawn and he gets his dick swabbed and he goes, and the doctor goes, yep, you're good. And you might've gotten it from him because guys aren't getting tested from it. So he, he's just like, he doesn't know. tested from it so he he's just like he doesn't know um so what do you what do you think like because your question is when to bring it up was that your question yeah yeah because it's like i don't want it to like come up too early and then it's like oh this guy didn't even get the chance

to know me or he thinks i'm really i don't need it or whatever and then later on it's like well you wasted my time. Like I wouldn't have considered going into this relationship as far as I did. I don't think you should ever bring it up on the first date. He's like, you wasted time. That's not the right guy. Don't bring it up on our first date unless you want to hook up on the first date. I don't know, man.

Like this is a question for Doc. I have a suggestion. I really think that you need to focus so much on what you want with this like you need to really evaluate how much you want to have sex with this person or or like really like get your relationship to a point where you really see something in them before you sleep with them i'm not saying you know, having one night stands are off the table for you. But if you like start dating somebody, I would give it a beat for you to decide that you actually like them and that they're showing characteristics and qualities and maturity

of somebody who can hear this information. Because like Nick said, listen to how Nick's taking it. he's not scared he's not squeamish he's not like you know pulling away from this or giggling or anything like that like he's like okay here i'm a mature man i know that this stuff happens and this is how it like there are men that are going to take it that way so i would just like as for you take a beat to kind of gauge what kind of person this is and And then to me, I would, you know, my hammock guy in that in that heated moment was a little jarring, but he did say it right before he thought there was any potential of us getting physical to a point that I should know. You know

what I mean? So yeah, I totally agree with Shug. A couple of things in general, I would say this whole, like whether it's this HPV situation or, you know, very different, but similar in the sense, well, I have kids, when should I tell them? Or I was divorced or when should I tell him? Because there's always this fear with these people who feel like they have some baggage they have to reveal. Is someone going to reject them when they tell it?

And they're so, did they waste my time? Not your fucking problem. Whether a guy has decided you wasted his time or not. And also bonus, any guy worth your time isn't going to throw that in your face, even if he doesn't want that in a relationship, right? Like is any whose time is so valuable, but they can't go on four dates with someone and have it not work out because they didn't share some information with them about them. They didn't want to accept. You have the right to your own privacy in any dating situation, as does anyone else, right? Is it weird if you would

wait six months, but if you're not sleeping together in the first six months of your relationship, you know, whatever, it's your right to privacy. And so you don't have to feel guilty about that. That's a very good point. In your situation, if I were say dating someone or going on a date, right? I'm just thinking out loud here. And you said, hey, listen, here's the situation. I would just ask a lot of questions. I mean, listen, it might behoove you and try to just deal with the situation, have it be gone. It probably, because I would, me personally, I would like, oh, like, is it still there? All right. Well, what does that mean if it's still there? You're more contagious if it is still there. Okay. Can we like is it still there all right what does that

mean if it's still there are you're more contagious if it is still there okay can we like have it not be there and we can wait great uh we should use condoms you know I would go to a doctor then and ask a million questions to my physician me like I like this girl what does this mean and I have to say like with hammock guy it was this is probably 10 years ago. OK, I'm old. It was like 10 years ago. And that's exactly what happened to me. A, he brought it up really early.

So this was third date. But first date was like a non date. Second date, we barely kissed like he brought it up really, really early. And I didn't know him very well yet. And there were other red flags with him that I didn't particularly think we were going to go very much further beyond third date. And then he sprung this on me and, and I was very clear with him of like, Hey, I understand that you have this thing. I want you to know that this isn't why I don't want to pursue this.

And I asked a thousand questions and, and, you know, like that's bound to happen because the people are, you know, inherently good. And I think that the good ones will ask you those questions. And listen, again, not being a doctor, I think once you deal with the ward itself, I think the good news is whenever you find your person, they'll love you for who you are also there's a highly strong chance that you will meet someone have sex with them and they will never have to worry about getting a wart themselves if you guys take the proper steps so this is not in any way and again there's just so many people out there who have been in like i mean literally everyone's been in contact with it some

way, shape or form. You just unfortunately experienced the actual ward itself. And a lot of it is the psychology. And like, again, we always talk about like, don't be afraid if you are struggling with it from a mental health standpoint to talk to people about that. We really thank you for coming on this show. I guarantee you a lot of people can relate and talking about it and like just showing your face you're a pretty young woman it shows a lot of confidence and strength to go out there and like suge said if the worst thing you have to sacrifice is not having one night stands because you don't know if you should tell them right away so you're just going to not have sex great you're probably like i'm not knocking one night stands

but like no one needs a one night stand to be happy in their life. It's just like, if you want to have it, go for it. But for you, you'll probably be safer and more confident in yourself by maybe removing that situation from your life and just vetting out people and figuring out, is this someone that I want to tell and be open with or someone I don't even want to bother with? Or you can have one night stands where you're like, I'm going to keep on my pants and just do stuff to you. You know, there's so much fun to be had in the world of sex.

Yeah. I mean, listen, final thought on this call is no one's really talking about it. And when it comes to STDs and sex, the more, again, conversations and honesty people have, we're just so afraid of judgment. People just pretend they don't. And a lot of people just don't know. There's just an overwhelming amount of ignorance about STDs and sex. So we do really thank you for being so open and calling and sharing some life. And again, I don't, we don't, none of of us have all the answers we've all had our own experience and asked a bunch of questions in the situation there's always a lot

of fear um and there's a lot of pointing fingers and judging that come from a lot of ignorance you know so all right well thank you guys you're gonna be just fine you're very pretty and you're not gross no not not at all no all your friends have experienced that they just may not have talked about it yeah you're just lovely and so strong and brave clearly like you're gonna you're gonna you're gonna rock this whole thing all right yeah we'll take care you too all right bye-bye bye yeah what a badass eh yeah i mean griff for it is fascinating because it's like i remember when when this happened with the girl i was dating i had all these questions and the doctor was like well i mean we can't test for it so like oh you know like you're like well what do you mean like

you know it's literally like guys don't experience symptoms as much right and well i just remember talking to her doctor about it and i was almost shocked about how like dismissive or nonchalant they were about it right yeah you know like unfortunately women um have these if they come in contact like elian though you want the cancer is the scary part so you want to be checked out about it. And now they have shots to help prevent that. And that's great. And everyone should look into that. But it was, I don't know.

Yeah, I got the shots free in college. So if you're listening, check into that. And men can get the shots too. Yeah. Great great that's interesting you can get shots for it but they can't detect it and men i think they just like give you a shot what is your name natalie hi natalie i'm nick this is shook hello rochelle here hey uh how can we help you natalie yeah um so uh i recently downloaded dating app for the first time congratulations exciting big big first step yeah huge i'm on um hinge and bumble and it's been

going really well great um one guy in particular we've gone on four dates in like two weeks um i'm like pretty excited about it it's been going like good no red flags or anything um but i'm kind of nervous about um like having to have a conversation with him because I don't want to have sex until I'm married. How old are you? And what'd you say? How old are you? How old am I?

I'm 22. Okay. So, um, yeah, so that's just like a thing about me. It's something that I care about. And I don't know like when I should bring it up or how or exactly how to approach that situation.

Why are you – I mean, that's the obvious answer, but why are you afraid if that's something you are proudly decided that you don't want to do? um yeah i'm just i'm basically anticipating that he probably doesn't share that conviction with me so uh i'm just trying to like see if there's any way that i can tell him in a way that doesn't have things end sure terribly or like and just to understand you more you your is this a religious aspect or you just don't want to? Or why have you decided not to? Yeah, it does come from a religious place.

Okay. Yeah. Okay. And again, I'm just trying to understand. So in terms of what you are, have decided you don't want to do, are you not letting your, what base are you willing to go to here? You know, I'm just a serious question. Like, are you just like, we're, I'm only going to be kissing until I get married or, or I'm just not going, I'm not rounding all the bases. Like, what are you, what are you comfortable with?

Yeah, probably like first or second base. Probably not going to third base either. Okay. What is first and what is second base? I don't know. I mean, I think it's like kissing. Oral sex is probably third base. I think oral is third base.

I think any holes. Yeah, oral, yeah. Okay. Yeah. Have you had serious relationships before? Have I had serious relationships before? Yeah. Yeah, my last two relationships,

each lasted about two years. Those would be my two past relationships. I mean, listen listen there's the the short answer is if this is something you probably don't want to do um you i think you your first step is to have conviction in it right and so whenever you have this conversation with anyone um i don't think you ever should be ashamed of your answer. You should be very, let's be like, I know I don't want to do this. And no, I'm not going to third base either. I wouldn't be like, you know, especially like if I'm the guy asking like, all right, well, help me understand here. What base can we go to? I would be like, probably no. You're like,

you don't want to go. I think you really need conviction because well, one, guys will be like, oh, do I keep trying? But I think you really also for yourself need to know that that's what you don't want to do and just own that. And that in itself will be attractive to people in general. That aside, I think, listen, it is going to be something you are going to, I guess, struggle with. Let's just keep it real. We live in a time where less and less people are waiting to get married. Historically, that's why a lot of people got married younger because they were just like all horned up. And like, the only way to not burn in hell was to have to get married. And again, I'm not knocking your faith or your beliefs. That's just like generally how people are operating now. It's a weird...

It is fascinating, right? I grew up in a traditional household in terms of what's more right or wrong. The reality is you're probably going to want to get married sooner than someone who's like, I'm going to have sex and I want to wait. And I'm not saying one's better than the other. But it's probably going to be easier for you to date someone who shares similar beliefs. My only risk, you know, the only thing you're at risk of, you meet someone who doesn't. They love you. They're like, oh, you're such a babe. And you know what? I'll wait forever. But also, let's get married. You know, because like they want to

have that relationship and it's going to be a struggle for you because, you know, there are, let's just keep it real. There's a lot of people out there who rush into serious relationships as a result of not wanting to have sex before they get married. Right? That's my would be concern for you is how do you balance that? And sometimes I think it's hard for us in the moment to try to figure out which part is true. It's fascinating. This is totally unrelated to you. And I don't know if I'm assuming you probably watch The Bachelor, but I always talk about like on my first time on Andy's season, I'm a very competitive guy. And I knew I was self-aware that I was very competitive, right? And I go into this world and I knew that I had genuine feelings for Andy. And at the time I knew the situation where I'm competing with a bunch of

guys that like I knew this competitive element. And I truly didn't know in the moment being aware of both, which was playing a bigger role, my competitive spirit or my genuine feelings for her. And what I mean, and I only say this story is because in your situation, it's sometimes I think going to be hard for you is do I really want to get married to this guy or do I just really want to have sex? And I think sometimes it's a struggle for people who are trying to live this, to abstain from sex before marriage. And I think that's going to be a struggle for you. to abstain from sex before marriage. And I think that's going to be a struggle for you.

And I think it's totally fine. I think the best thing to do, going back to my original point, is I think you just got to own it. And you can't waffle because that's going to be confusing to the people you date. It's going to be confusing to yourself. I think you just have to be steadfast

in what you're willing to do. And eventually you'll find a guy who finds that attractive and is willing to wait. And eventually you'll find a guy who finds that attractive and is willing to wait. Should you put it on her dating profile? I was going to ask that. Or is there like a Christian or I don't know what religion you subscribe to, but is there like a dating app for that? There are. Yeah, right. There's more Christian. Christian Mingle. Christian Mingle.

Why are we... She's making a face. Are you Christian? Yeah, yeah, I'm Christian, yeah. I'm pretty sure Christian Mingle is like for older people. Oh, bird. Is it? My dad met his wife on Christian Mingle. Oh.

So probably not the right demographic. I'm curious. So just for fun here, your dad is divorced and met someone else? Yeah. But that's kind of against the law. I mean, I am not knocking your conviction at all. I'm just, I think it's awesome that you value sex. And I think you should continue to value sex.

I think you should also continue to be open to new experiences. But you just need to know what you want and make your own decisions based on what you think is best for yourself and not make decisions based on how you think you're going to be judged. And it sounds like you have. It sounds like you're very sure about this. You don't think she can put it on her profile or dating profile? Yeah. She can do whatever she wants. Have you tried that? Did you put on there like... Will not have sex before

marriage that's what she leads with or or it's like i like nobody's gonna go out with me exactly because like here's the thing yes they will no no listen i'm talking about listen she's a pretty girl but if a guy in a dating app is swiping through and a girl says i will not have sex with you he's gonna be be like, nah. But you said the perfect person for her to date is somebody with the same convictions. Ideally. But I think Natalie is open to the idea

of maybe not necessarily having to meet someone at Bible camp or wherever it is you might go and meet these people. And it sounds like Natalie, and Nataliealie correct me if i'm wrong is open to going on a date and being the beautiful wonderful woman that she is and confident that guys would be just swarmed to her there's just one little thing that she's not willing to do that a lot of guys want to do and there's a hope of loving her for herself and her

charm and her presence in person and i think let the guy fucking meet her first and then and then you know before they get a chance to like decide whether they want to wait forever based off a photo she put on an app you know like i am natalie i'm pretty i like to travel and we we can't fuck um you know but you're right though and, though. And that shouldn't really be a deal breaker for people, you know, like not having sex to me. Have you always felt this way, Natalie? Yes. What's the furthest base you've ever gone to? Can we define the basis?

Yeah, I want to know, too. Have you ever had oral sex? What's on the basis? I want to know too. Have you ever had oral sex? Have you ever had oral sex? No. Okay. Have you ever been naked with a guy? No. Okay.

Her parents are going to be like, this is good stuff. We've got all the answers. Thanks, Nick. And this is all, this is all a faith thing? Yeah. Do you have siblings?

I do. I have a younger brother. Yeah, a younger brother. Okay. How old is he? 20. What's he up to these days? Where are you going with this?

I'm just curious in terms of like as to all her siblings feel this way purity culture christian purity i'm i don't again i'm curious is i'm curious her is her brother is part of the or is he like yeah whatever fuck it um yeah i'm pretty sure my brother's on like would be on the same page with me okay he's in college he goes to ohio state do you think your dad's having sex with his girlfriend he's married oh he's married do you think they do you think they hooked up before they got married nick jeez natalie you're allowed to say no you're not at court so if there's you don't have to answer always i feel like she's fine yeah i would go guessing no okay um i'm just kind of fascinated by the uh the purity culture i guess

um yeah and then there was an earlier episode i was listening to you where you guys were talking about like passport to purity culture and all of the like shame and guilt that it kind of creates around sex. Yes. That's just my personal experience. You guys about that. Like, I think that the church at large has done a lot of harm in terms of understanding sex and communicating about sex.

But I do still believe that if you can like strip away the negatives and like the terrible side of purity culture there's still some truth and wisdom in like the original teaching or kind of like understanding of like what sex is for and totally now you seem like a very smart young uh woman who i like who is you seem very assured of your choice and i think back to my original point you should lead with that and there's nothing wrong with you wanting to wait and again to you know there is shame and stuff and we're not here to say what's right or wrong but we just don't want people to feel shamed into making their choices you don't seem to want to do that you seem steadfast in your conviction and own that yeah that's a gorgeous um and yes you are you gonna run into a guy who's just like listen i'm not like i i i don't i'm not waiting um yeah

i'll wait for a while but i uh i don't want to i don, and again, like, we'll see. But like, I do think you might meet the right guy. I still think I'm a little old. Like if I met someone, it would be weird for me to take someone's virginity at this point in my life. But if I met someone who was like 28 and they were like, and I was like, I fucking love this girl. Yeah, I'd wait. wait you know i'm ready to

settle down totally but like if i really was you know i i mean i'd probably be like hey can we go like second base natalie he is single oh shut up uh but like i what i'm i'm just thinking out loud i would uh i i could wait you know i mean i would want a physical relationship with her. I would want to know that we have physical chemistry. I would want to round some bases, if I'm being honest. But could I wait to have sex? Yeah, I could wait. And I think you'll figure that out, how far you're willing to go with any guy you really

like and to test out. And because it sounds like you're very open to meeting someone who's not part of this purity culture. Is that accurate? Yeah. I'm curious, would you be okay if he had slept with a lot of people? Yeah, that's my next question. So yeah, he's okay with meeting someone not part of that culture.

So you're assuming, I think when you're on Bumble and Hinge, you're assuming that any guy you want to go on a date with might not be a virgin, right? Yeah, for sure. Right. That's interesting. I commend you for that. This is all about your choices, not his. But to that point, any relationship, whether you're talking about sex, relationships are

about compromise, right? Any relationship. So whether we're talking about sex or your choice in movies you guys are going to have to compromise what you're comfortable with and what he's comfortable with and if he's just like i don't know i'm just no judgment i'm just kind of used to having a physical relationship can we have no physical relationship like i want to respect your choices but like kind of want to see you naked too you know like how you'll have to figure out as you grow with someone is You know, like you'll have to figure out as you grow with someone, is there a point where you're willing to round more bases as you,

as you like, I think I can marry this guy. And I think I've been dating him for five or six months and we're talking about our future. And I'm not telling you what you should decide, but I'm telling you there might be conversations around that. And there's a part of you having, you know, again, it's about compromise. You know, are you saying, hey, listen, buddy, I'll date you if you're not a virgin, but these are my absolute rules. They're non-negotiable. And until we get married, you don't really get to see or do anything with the goods. That's tougher. You know, you will have a harder time. So I'm just kind of laying the landscape, so to speak. Totally.

You just have to really decide what you're okay with. But I do think, once again, whatever you decide, you have to have conviction and you should be proud of it. Because I can assure you this. It's an attractive quality to be confident in yourself and your choices, whatever those choices are. And anyone will find that choice sexy and confident. They might not agree with it. They might not want it, but they will find that conviction confident.

If you look like someone who's like, my parents told me not to have sex, very different mentality and it will read differently. So just be confident in it and then you'll figure it out. All right. Well, hopefully that was helpful. You're going to be fine. I wouldn't put it on your dating profile,

final thought. Good luck. You're going to be great. Thanks, guys. All right, take care. Bye. It's fascinating. I don't, there't there's no right i don't know they need a hip young christian dating app i think is what we learned i know well i don't know anything about christian mingle but my guess is her biggest gripe is that her dad met his girlfriend on there and if christian mingle's

listening who works there they're probably super like no guys come on i guarantee you christian mingle is not just for old people yeah otherwise they would market themselves that way it's definitely not like a cool thing well people not to knock religion a lot of people don't think who are outside of religion consider it cool the people in the religion are proud of it and they should jay swipes cool i i don't that's the jewish community but the jewish community is different whether it's yeah it's more of a tightly knit group i think you know there's more i don't know i don't know if it's about the we're just saying christian mingle time for a rebrand yeah if you are listening there's people out there who think it's just for old people so step it up you need to mark it market differently. But I also feel like her, she's like her dad killed it for her.

Yeah. You know, like she is like that. And it sounds like she might be open to meeting very different types of people than are in her own little pack. So that's nice. It'll be interesting. I'm curious about her life. I'll probably find out.

She's interesting to date people outside of this culture i did and so inevitably inevitably she is going to meet someone who she feels safe around and depending how fast that goes my guess is she'll start running more basically yeah that's what happened to me uh and that's fine and maybe not. But it's, yeah. Because the guys will be like, eventually I'll get her. It's bad. What do you mean?

Do you say that? My ex-boyfriend said, no, he was like, you'll give in one day. Did you? Yeah. It took a long time. Same with anal sex, you know?

Oh, no. Oh, Nick. It's a joke. No, it's a, yeah. I think she was really convicted and I think that's her, the best thing she's got going for her. But yeah.

Yeah, Natalie in five years, check back in with Nick. He wants to know. I'm curious. I'm curious if she gets married as a virgin or not. But she seems like she knows what she wants. And I'm curious how quickly she gets married. Have you guys seen Forgetting Sarah Marshall?

It's one of the best movies of all time. It sure is. But that couple, you know, is so funny because they waited and that's what happens. She doesn't strike me as that couple. My parents waited. Your parents waited? Yeah, they're happy. 40 years ago.

My grandmother waited. How long were they dating for? They didn't date. In my church, you don't date. You just got married. Yeah. And it worked out. I mean, they're very.

Sure. Listen, there's a million different ways to meet people. And we'll never say what's wrong or right because there isn't a right or wrong answer. There's just variables and different opinions. But I what's interesting about natalie is the biggest takeaway is she it's a she's trying to date in a world of which she has decided she doesn't want to be a part of right right if natalie was just like listen i'm i only i only meet boys at church or christian mingle and then it's like all right well, well, you know, let us know. Or like a lot of people in the Mormon community.

Yeah. Right? It's, they just, they're all on the same page. So it's easier to do that. She is trying to, I don't know, like she's drug free going to a rave. Dangerous. Totally.

So it's like, that's the big challenge for her and and truthfully like we joke like she might give into it um she's gonna have a hard time if she doesn't and i'm not saying she should she's trying to date in a world where guys are like i don't i don't get it they're like but i don't i don't get it and it's fine at first but like month three or four and they're like it's hot and heavy and she's she's always just like no no yeah it's it's super interesting i wonder if you just need to come up with some new rules like okay like while we're seeing other people you can sleep with them but you can never sleep with me you think natalie's gonna be into that i don't know i don't know if you need to keep it this is shut down but i'm not saying

that needs to shut down i mean that would be wild can you imagine someone who's so steadfast in their own conviction but so open to other things that they're just like this is about my vagina and not your dick that they're just like yeah whoever you want, but I can't have sex with you. That's not happening. That would be wild. That's a great concept story movie. Well, this was a fun episode. That's Rochelle saying, all right, wrap it up.

Time to wrap it up. Thanks for tuning in once again. And we hope you guys are enjoying our new Monday episodes that are just more questions and more interesting topics. On Wednesday, we have my dear friend, Andrea Russett, a fascinating individual. Really fascinating. She is from Indiana, grew up in a very Midwest town. She has a strong presence on YouTube. She's funny, talented. I found out she could sing. She's created quite the empire for herself and she's a very open person sexually and she deals with a lot of things

like mental health. We're going to talk about fuck buddies and the difference between fuck buddies and fuck boys. Topical. Interesting. So I hope you guys enjoy it. It's going to be wild and crazy. As always, thanks for listening. We need more of your questions. We'd like

to hear from some more guys. You know, our 10 percenters, even women out there. I feel like this podcast isn't just for women. No. Let your guys know. I mean that we could all the guys out there, all your girls out there who have a bunch of guy friends who are doing

things wrong. Bring them along to the party and have and so you guys out there we'd love to hear your perspective i'm sure the women listeners would love to hear your perspective and um and the insecurities that you guys have and the struggles you guys have i always find it fascinating with women and they'll hear a guy kind of ask questions and have insecurities about women and women always thinks it's just them having them i'd love to hear more men be open about that so please submit your questions to ask nick at castmedia.com and as always feel free to rate us five stars on itunes thanks for listening we will

see you on wednesday have a great couple days hi jan from toyota here hi jan my friends keep posting photos in their new toyotas summer's Hi, Jan from Toyota here. Hi, Jan. My friends keep posting photos in their new Toyotas. Summer's almost over, and I've got FOMO. Well, FOMO, no-mo, because Toyota's national sales event is on. And it's the perfect time to squeeze out the last of summer in a new Tacoma, Highlander, Camry, and more. I can't wait to post photos of myself grilling at the park with my new RAV4.

I will meet you there. Well done, Jen. you