The Viall Files - E366 Ask Nick - Money Problems with BF’s Man

Episode Date: January 10, 2022

Today on Ask Nick, we start with a caller whose best friend’s boyfriend has asked her to borrow money for her friend’s engagement ring. She is confused as to why he wants to spend outside of his means, and is wondering whether she should tell her friend who she knows is pushing for the engagement. But she soon realizes that maybe what she should really be questioning is whether to go into business with a friend who is rushing some very big life decisions. We then speak with someone who was ghosted by her “best friend” after her father passed away. Now they’re both attending at a mutual friend’s wedding and our caller is dreading the confrontation. Should she ignore the situation, or try to have a heart-to-heart before the event? “Money problems turn into other problems.” Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] to be a part of our Monday episodes.  Check out our new "Introvert" merch at http://www.viallfiles.com today! THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: Luminess: Go to http://www.BreezeAirbrush.com/VIALL, you’ll receive 50% OFF their airbrush makeup system PLUS free shipping. Curology: Get started with your free trial today at http://www.Curology.com/Viall  Article: Go to http://www.Article.com/Viall to get $50 off your first purchase of $100 or more. Episode Socials:  @viallfiles @nickviall See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

you're crazy what's going on everybody happy monday happy ass nick i i've been told by some of our listeners that it this is the way they start their week and it brightens their day so you're welcome and also thanks for listening I'm Nick, I'm your host thanks for tuning in

thanks for downloading whatever it's called welcome to this show joined by Allie and Amanda back in studio from their holiday travels the team is back together my social media assistants I don't know. We need a name for you guys. I don't know.

I guess we called you the social syndicate. I feel like we need something else. We'll let the audience decide how you should be labeled. Sure. I like that. Amanda's not as thrilled as that idea Amanda has like eight ideas on the ready no Amanda sometimes reads comments yeah not in a way I don't upset me what do you think they would call you take away their mics I honestly I find I think it's I I know you think it's a terrible practice I think it's a terrible practice. I think it's good exposure therapy.

To read comments? Yeah, you think it's a very bad thing to do. No, I think it handcuffs your creativity. And with the podcast, Small Flex here, this large, you're going to invite, like, it's impossible to be unanimously liked. So you read five comments and say, take away their mic. unanimously liked. So you read five comments and say,

take away their mic because like, there's five, you know, like, people who obsessively like, are like,

I don't want to hear my voice or something. I don't think it is that much of a handcuff for creativity because I think it is good to know how you're received.

Not necessarily, like, not care how you're received, but know how you're received. I think it's a self-awareness thing. To a certain degree, yes. But it takes, there's other ways to go about it, you know, to get feedback. And it requires a Jedi-like discipline, I suppose, to not let it handcuff your creativity

and your confidence to speak up and say things. While simultaneously get the feedback you could not get anywhere else. That's what I think. What do I know? How's life? What's new? Guys, tragic news. Just to let you all know.

I know you don't know my grandmother, but my grandmother kind of had who we referred to as like her boo, her boyfriend. Things were not official, but you know. They were grandmas in a situation shift? Kind of, and yeah. And his name was Sam. And two nights ago, Sam passed away in his sleep.

And I just feel bad because I feel like it gave Marilyn, you know, like something to look forward to. Your grandma's name is Marilyn. Yeah. That's an awesome grandma name. It's a great name. So I just kind of, I'm like, Marilyn. That's sad.

My Phyllis, my grandmother, known. As Phyllis. We call her Phyllis. I don't call her grandma Phyllis. I just call her Phyllis. I have. My Phyllis, my grandmother known… As Phyllis. We call her Phyllis. I don't call her Grandma Phyllis. I just call her Phyllis. I have a Grandma Phyllis. Yeah, that's great. Yeah. Also, she…

My grandfather, they got divorced when my dad was in high school and she's been a business woman raising kids her whole life. And she's had only rich boyfriends that have come and died. Is Phyllis still around? Yeah. Should we get her on the podcast and ask her exactly about her different relationships?

You know, I think Phyllis would have made an amazing special guest from time to time like 10 years ago. Okay. I don't know what her comfort level is at this point. She does have a new boyfriend, though. Okay. You know, I don't know what her comfort level is at this point. She does have a new boyfriend,

though. Okay. Older, younger, rich? I'm not, they're always rich. Always rich. They're always. Do you think it's ever possible

to have a string of dating rich people and have it not be like a, do you think, do you always think of it as a superficial judgment type thing? If it's not Phyllis,

it's not an accident. You know, people have it. How does she know? Do you's not Phyllis? It's not an accident. You know, people have it. How does she know? Do you just like ask for proof on the first date? Phyllis roams in elite circles.

Oh, yeah. It's like once you're in, you're in, I feel like. Yeah. Well, I think that's part of it too. It's just like, you know,

once you're, yeah, you're shopping for a type, right? Yeah. If I were Phyllis, I'd be doing the same thing. Interestingly enough, she always kept my grandfather's last name.

You know, I think she like, that was her love. And now she was, I think she was dating for companionship, not necessarily for love. And why not have them have a few bucks in their pocket? Yeah. Amen. The better to go to Palm Springs with. How's Marilyn doing? Is she mourning? The hard part is like her hearing has

gotten really bad. So we can't like call her. So we just like emailed her. She loves, she loves a good computer. She loves a good Facebook moment. So grandparents love email. Yeah. But this is the grandma that loves the bachelor. And when I, I emailed her being like, I don't know if you remember Nick season, this was like a year ago when we started. Did Marilyn like me? Yeah, I texted you about it. I was like, Nick, you should know I like attached a photo of you to this email to Marilyn. And she responded. She goes, quite a good looking fellow or something like that. And I was like, my grandma thinks you're hot. Good for me. Good for you. I will say for my grandma, also hard of hearing, this is Grandma Jean, not Grandma Phyllis, and she will use the phone on speakerphone, but put it up directly to her ear.

And that seems to work. Whatever works. I feel like I do that sometimes now. I don't know what that says about me. Speaking of money, we have a great episode for you with some hard-hitting questions and better answers. Relationships and money. Boyfriends asking their friends for money.

Their girlfriends' friends for money. Wild stuff. We won't spend too much time spoiling what is a fantastic episode. We'll get right into it. A couple housekeeping notes tomorrow. The wonderful and delightful and expert in all things

Bachelor. Kathy Kelly returns to recap episode two of The Bachelor. And on Wednesday, we have the wonderful Shayna and her fiance Brock. She don't be in the studio, Brock.

We don't really know. He will be maybe Skyping and Zooming in. It'll be fun. It'll be great. Talking about all things Vanderpump, their upcoming season, all the drama we can expect, their life.

They have a new baby? Yeah, they got a new baby. They got one in the mail. We'll be talking with Sheena and Brock. Can't wait. Great week for you. don't forget to send your questions at asknick at

castmedia.com cast with a K and all our Ask Nick listeners go ahead who are listening to this on Apple iTunes podcast go leave us

like a five star review we have to make up for all the Bachelor fans who don't like our you know when we when we disagree with their favorite Bachelor person

and they think that we're They take it very personally. I'm sorry if I'm, you know, Clayton's warming up to me. Although I did see something someone said to me that Clayton was

specifically asked about my criticism of him. And he said he didn't take it personally and immediately made me like him better. Aw. Should we have him in? Of course we're going to try to have him in. Good, good.

Good man. And it made me really like him better. He doesn't, you know, he doesn't take this show as, you know, he's human and I'm sure, you know, he has his ups and downs, but it seems like he gets it, you know, and I really respect that as opposed to having other people

handle things much, much differently with threats. So ominous. Anyway, we have a great week. We have a great episode. Thanks for listening. How's it going? It's going well. How about you? Good. What's it going? It's going well. How about you? Good. What's your name?

My name is Haley and I'm 24. How can I help Haley? So about a week ago, my best friend's boyfriend reached out to me to ask to borrow money. Your best friend's boyfriend reached out to you to borrow money. Yes. So it's a bit of an interesting situation. Bold move. Yeah. Super bold and sending red flags all over the place that were already there as well. How close are you with this person? She's one of my bridesmaids. No, no, no. How close are you with him? Oh, not at all. Like, I only know him through her.

Damn. Yeah. Granted, it wasn't a lot of money. Like, and that's all relative, right? But, like, it wasn't a significant amount of money. How much did he ask, though? I need specifics.

It was $100. Okay. All right. Yeah. Like, significant around the holiday season for sure but but certainly

depending on who it is a hundred bucks is not nothing it's not like spot me a five yeah exactly so

so he messaged me and asked me for money like over text didn't even call or anything like that so it was kind of out of the blue

and I'm kind of taken aback and my he's just like hey what's up quick question can I have 100 bucks? Did he say what it was for? Yes. So the backstory is that he's going to propose to her and I knew about this. And so I've been helping him pick out rings and like find her style and whatnot and help him plan the whole thing. And I've been super involved in that. And so his argument was that he put a down payment on a ring and that set him behind in his car payments.

And so he needs a hundred dollars and he would pay me back in two days. And so that sends red flags going off all over the place because she, so my, my best friend. So why is it send off red flags I mean it's certainly different weird

presumptuous I don't know if we can immediately say it's a red flag but certainly it's something to look into but why do you think it sends off a bunch of red flags? So it's a red

flag because my best friend vents to me all the time about how horrible his money spending is and how much debt he's gotten into. So you had the benefit of having some of hearing her point of view. Nice ring by the way.

Oh, thank you. We're talking about her engagement ring for all the people listening. All right. So you knew that your friend's frustration, a big part of her frustrations were his money, how he handled his money. How old is this guy?

So he is 23, I believe. Okay. All right. So essentially, I know of his history of money problems and how they always have a hard time communicating about it. So my response back to him was, I'm comfortable giving you the money with no expectation that I even get it back. However, no expectation that I even get it back. However, she needs to know. And is that because you're just like, I know who I'm dealing with here. I love my

friend. I'll give her the $100, but I'm not going to let this affect me if I don't get it back. I'm not going to turn this into a me problem. That's smart. A lot of people aren't able to do that. I know if I give someone money, you have to know that that's probably not coming back to you.

It's possible. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's just my assumption. And that's fine. I can live with that. You make everything a surprise. Yeah. I love it. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. So then at that point, I was just kind of like, I'll give it to you, but she has to know about it. I'm not going that from her you told her you told yeah i told him that yeah i can borrow you this but there's the price is not necessarily you paying me back but me having to be up front with her what did you say yeah so his response was yeah i don't really want to do that because then she'll know what it's for. And I was like, okay, fair.

Yeah. Yeah, that's cool. But at the same time, then you need to have that conversation with her about just you're having money problems. Right? That's kind of where it was coming from. Yeah. It's interesting because the topic is around an engagement ring. And we could probably spend a whole hour or a whole episode talking about

people who are proposing, regardless of what stage you are in their life, and how much should we spend on something like an engagement ring? Do you spend what you don't have? Is there, you know, does it say, is it romantic in any way to say to slightly overextend yourself? You know, like people have so many different opinions on this particular topic of what's the right thing to do? How much should you spend? Yeah, maybe you can't necessarily afford it, but it's an investment in your relationship and she's going to really appreciate it and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Yeah. So there's no clear answer. There's no clear answer. Right. So my friend has made it very clear. I don't care what kind of ring it is i just want a ring and like she's definitely putting the pressure on him and but the pressure isn't for like the amount spent that's the thing it's just i don't know why

yeah i don't know why he's like gone outside of his means then because it's not just the pressure that is applied from our partners. There's a societal pressure. He's, even as a young man, fully aware that if he gets engaged, that people will say, let me see the ring. And they will immediately assign a value towards him. It's like a lot of people who are bad with money. Part of the reason they're bad with money because maybe he's someone who very much cares what people think about him. And people will have a tendency of overextending themselves because they want to buy things with the assumption that people are going to assign value about him towards what he spends money on.

It's a big reason why people are bad with money because they, you know, they use that as a way to find value, right? Or, or value in themselves, right? So it might not be coming from her, but maybe it could be his parents, his friends, you know, whatever, or himself, TV, you know, whatever. So it's not, I think it's a little unfair to say, well, she's not putting this pressure on him, so I don't get why he's doing it, right? Okay, yeah, that's totally fair. And also, sometimes people be like, I don't

care what the size is, and they totally fucking care. You know what I'm saying? Like, I'm literally looking at your engagement ring, and I don't know, it looks pretty damn nice to the TV screen. It pops, you know, and he's seen it, and so maybe he's just like, i don't know it looks pretty damn nice to the tv screen like it pops you know and he's seen it and so like maybe he's just like i don't i don't want my girlfriend to have to say she doesn't care you know i don't want i don't want to feel like it's it's half the size of her best

friends or or whatever so like you know it's fair and in defense to him i can at least empathize with why he wants it to feel like it's nice you know and because she is putting pressure on him yes for an engagement she is moving up the timeline of which he can afford it maybe you know we have we we do this thing where we again this whole show is about lying to ourselves. And a lot of times we lie to ourselves because what might be best for us in the future might not be best for us now. We will want that instant gratification. So we'll change the narrative in our head because what we want now is more important.

We don't know what we're going to want later. So very easy for your friend to say something like, I don't care about the ring because more importantly, I want to get engaged now. And that might be true. And I'm sure your friend fancies herself as not a superficial person. But in three years, she might be like, fuck, I really wanted a bigger ring, you know,

or whatever the fuck it is. So it's all these little things. And like we are super young. Yes, you're both very young. Yeah. And you know, you can upgrade and things like that and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You know, so. Movie quality

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that I ultimately didn't ask for, right? Have you told her yet? My loyalties, no. So this is why I'm kind of asking for your help is like there's two ways this could go. I informed him like how we left things was basically like, okay, I understand like fine,

we won't go ahead with this $100 transfer or whatever so that you can catch up on your car payments. But I still think that my friend deserves to know that he asked one of her best friends for money. Yeah. And like that's a really awkward space for me to be in. And it gets even more awkward because we're about to go into business together. Who is we?

Me and my friend. Okay. Interesting. Yeah. Layers. Yeah. Yeah, it really does. My snap reaction is that I actually disagree with you in that I don't think your friend

needs to know based on all the things I just said. And that while a hundred bucks isn't nothing, it's an amount of money that you're fully prepared not to get back, right? Like it's not changing your life. It's not going to stop you from being able to go into business and things like that.

It's like a pair of shoes that you might want or whatever the fuck, right? Right. But what if I was his, like, because of his history, what if I was like one of his last resorts? What is his history?

Yeah. What is his history? I mean, how bad are we talking here? Like, like pretty bad, like for, for being like,

whatever, between the ages of like 20 to 25, when it started to go downhill for him, like, it was pretty bad. Do you have any insight on what we're talking here? Like, are we talking significant

credit card debt? Yeah. Really poor credit. Pretty bad credit card debt. Yeah. So what's your friend's rush into getting engaged to a guy? How old is your friend? 24? Your age? She's 24. Yeah. So he's 23.

She's 24. You guys are old enough to know that money is a huge reason why people get divorced in relationships. And he can learn. Certainly, he's young enough to learn from his mistakes, make adjustments. He can fix his credit. By the time he's 30, you know, it'll be all right.

So the reason I wanted to tell her though was because how we left things was like, I would encourage you to tell her yourself so that I don't have to because I feel like I was brought into it, right? So that was my suggestion. He wants to propose and have it be a surprise. Well, yes.

But then his response back to me was, yeah, but I hate talking to her about this stuff, which is my red flag. For the relationship. Yeah, for the relationship. Yeah. So then it's like, well, if I go to her, this is part two of the question, is like, if I go to her and vouch my concerns for the relationship, then this is going to come out. Yeah.

Right? She's going to be like, why do you feel this way? What's your concern for going into business with someone who prioritized what she wants in the moment over what might be best for her in the future? Because you're going into business with someone, like I don't know anything about your friend.

Yeah. I barely know anything about you. Right. And I don't think you would go into business with someone you think is not particularly bright so there's no and that's the thing right yeah but yeah intelligence has nothing to do with uh it doesn't always have everything to do with uh willpower or our ability to lie to ourselves or being emotionally vulnerable when we really want something, you know, and our ability to convince ourselves we want something, you know, like, yeah, you know, until, you know, and so you can be very smart and being compromised when your

emotions come into play. Right. And that's a life skill we all have to learn. It's often a skill we learn right around the age that you guys are right now. It's a skill a lot of people learn in their 20s, to be totally frank, right? And your friend is showing you an example that she is fully aware of her boyfriend's money problems that aren't just like, oh, once in a while he bets on sports and I wish he wouldn't do that. But no, he has bad credit. He has some significant credit card debt, we can assume. He is nevertheless still getting engaged. I empathize with his desire to want to get something nice for his fiance. I don't fault him for that, right? And you can make an argument that he's humbled himself to ask you to do it. Now, again, who knows how many people he's asked and things like that.

It depends. Like, some people have no shame and no pride. And they're just like borrowing money left and right. And it's just like not good. And some people can be bad with money and still like fairly prideful where it took them a lot to ask you. I don't know this guy. Oh, it definitely did. I'm sure. But I truly feel like I was probably a last resort and he probably already asked his other people.

Yeah. Who said no to him? Yeah. Or did give him money. Because I just found the amount so weird. $100 for a car payment. To my knowledge, you can call and say, I'm going to make a late payment and absorb the charges, right? Yeah. Maybe he's trying to get his credit back. Maybe he doesn't want to make a late payment on that car payment. Maybe he's trying to improve. And then maybe he decided to ask the best friend of the girl he's going to propose to, because there's a level of trust there. You would understand not only that you should keep this secret, but also like what it was intended for. So he was thought, he could have thought,

I mean, it's weird, but like, there's no one I trust more who's going to understand me more in the situation than her best friend. Yeah. And I wanted to help him out. Genuinely. I just didn't want to do it behind her back. No, I get it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. My snap reaction is if they're going to get engaged, like this, like soon, yeah, this hundred dollar storyline isn't like, you're not going to be informing your friend in anything she doesn't already know. Right. Yeah. She already knows he has money problems. He is simply just verifying what she already knows. It's also not a significant amount of money where you have to be like, she needs to know about this $10,000 because if you guys get married, your debt becomes her debt, right? It's a hundred bucks, right? And she already knows. And so at the risk of needing to be upfront with your friend,

you might be spoiling the big surprise. So I think the big surprise in this situation is worth more than informing your friend of what she already knows. Okay, fair. I think you should be extra cautious about going into business with this friend who's so clearly insisting on getting engaged with someone she could easily wait. She's 23, 24. 24, yeah. Why not wait a year or two, invest in this relationship,

work with him and his problems? She's just like, I have this big problem. This problem I know affects relationships, but I'm going to say fuck it because I've decided I want to get engaged now to this guy. We've been dating long enough. I want this thing. You know, how long have they been dating? That's the thing, like two years.

And yeah, and she has told your friend, I don't know anything about her, but I'm pretty confident in saying that like 21 year old her told herself that I'm going to be married by the time I'm 25. Absolutely. And two years is too long to be dating anyone without a ring. And her desire to get engaged to this guy

is solely based on that premise she told herself when she was 21. And she doesn't want to be wrong and she is going to lie to herself and and convince herself this is the right thing and despite all these problems i want x y and z and here's what we'll get over it and that sounds like a person i wouldn't be more to get into business yeah to get in business with i'd be concerned yeah no but i'm more concerned like the thing aside, like we're not in that deep. Like that's fine. But I just, I fear for her like more so like as my friend, like getting

into that. Yes, she knows about the red flags, but like, is it worth it to discuss the red flags and just kind of say, I'm here for you. I noticed these things, but like whatever you decide. Well, again, I think you can have this conversation with your friend without bringing this $100 into play. This $100 doesn't really... This $100, whatever. I can very easily convince myself this is a very genuine thing that's not really a red flag. The fact that your friend, forgetting about this story, The fact that you, your friend, like forgetting about this story, right? Yeah. Your friend has come to you and said, I want to get engaged to this guy.

P.S. Also big money problems. And if all you knew was that, you would be like, well, friend, I'm glad you're happy and you found love. But like, are you sure you are, you know, this is the right thing for you and yourself given that he has money problems? Because we all want to think money problems turn into other problems. And it's not that he is poor that she has a problem with. It's the fact that he's bad at money.

Even if he's rich, you know what I'm saying? There's a huge difference between not having money and being bad at money. And sometimes they coincide, but they don't always correlate, right? A lot of people are just like, yeah, whatever you make or earn, as long as you're responsible with that money that I'm fine with, we'll make it work. But when you start overextending yourself and you're making your problems my problems, and then we're going to start arguing about what we're spending money on what we should invest our money on our kids those that's a snowball yeah and that's what i'm envisioning all of this happening and just so concerned for one of my closest friends that yeah i don't want to watch that

happen to her but it's so awkward knowing what i know. Yeah, but again, if you really believe that your friend is putting herself at risk with this engagement, you can absolutely have that conversation with her without bringing up the story. Yeah, I definitely want to have that conversation with her. It's just so fast, this timeline. So I envision he's going to propose her in the next two weeks. So I don't know how far my conversation will go with her, but I'm definitely going to try. It's a risk. Well, you know me. I think the best friends are the ones who have the hard conversations, even if that means for a period of time, she stops calling you her best friend.

I don't know. Yeah. If she doesn't appreciate what I have to say as her friend and as kindly as possible that I can go about it while being honest, then like, you know. And selfishly, this is an opportunity for you to test whether this is someone you should really get into business with. Yeah. Because this is a tough conversation

that you are thinking about having and you know this tough conversation might lead to her disappointment and you don't want to get into business with someone who can't effectively communicate while being disappointed. I think this situation has created an opportunity for you and your friend and him asking you to borrow a hundred bucks is actually a blessing because it will create a conversation that you otherwise

might not have. And I still don't think you really have to bring up the money. I really don't. No matter how bad this conversation goes with your friend, if you feel like she's not hearing you, you're going to want to at some point go, well, there's something I haven't been telling you, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And you're going to want to blurt this out. And I think if you get to that point, you will lose. You lose. Yeah. That's when your emotions will be taking over. Because again, this $100, while nothing isn't significant and it doesn't tell her anything she doesn't already know but it might ruin the surprise and even if she decides to move forward with the engagement you she deserves to be surprised at least and she deserves to have the engagement that she thinks she wants yeah i don't want to take that away from her so

so yeah all right okay okay that sounds great you. Glad we could talk through it. All right. Thank you. Happy holidays. All right. Take care. All right. Thank you. All right. Bye-bye. Article, the most beautiful and easiest way to make your space look beautiful. That's right, article. Article is kicking butt in the furniture department, a company that combines the curation of a boutique furniture store with the comfort and simplicity of online shopping. And I've always gotten so many compliments with my article couch. That's right. Listen, they just make it easy and nice. And if you don't want to spend an arm and a leg, but also want to make your living room, your bedroom, your outdoor furniture look like you spend an arm and a leg, think of vertical. Get fancy without spending the

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Hi, Nick. My name's Natalie and I'm 26 years old. How can I help Natalie? So I am planning to go to a college friend's wedding early next year. And I was really excited about it until I recently found out my former college best friend is going to be attending. When I found that out, I felt like I was going

down a roller coaster and my stomach was just in knots about it. I mean, what happened? I mean, like people. So two months before college graduation, and this was back in 2017. So it's been a while. My dad passed away. And I, I, when I reached out to my friends, I only told a couple of people and this friend was one of them. I didn't really receive any support or anything. I know you're really strict on how you define ghosting, but I felt like I was ghosted. I literally didn't hear from her for almost two months, maybe like I think a week or two before graduation is when I heard from her.

And that was just kind of out of the blue, or I just remember feeling really confused. I tried to give it the benefit of the doubt because, you know, it's college graduation time, people are trying to figure out, you know, if they're going to land a job, where they're going to live, stuff like that. But this was like a really, really good friend. Like, I thought she was going to be in my wedding if I ever planned to get married um you know we talked we had like very real conversations it wasn't just like hey you want to pre-game for this party like let's let's hang out this weekend it was like you value you valued her friendship yeah exactly and I didn't get any type of like I mean I wasn't looking for like oh I'm so sorry this happened to you.

Because like, that's awkward. And like, sometimes you don't know what to say. Like, I'm not going to say, oh, it's okay. Like, no, like I'm grieving during this time. But like, something as simple as like, hey, like, let's go get coffee. Or like, can I help you with anything? Or like, do you want to come over? I didn't get any of that.

But I was getting that type of support from people I was acquainted with that I didn't even think like knew my name. So when I didn't hear at all from this friend, I just kind of accepted that maybe this wasn't the friend, this friendship wasn't as real as I thought it was. So that was really hard because like, while I'm grieving the loss of my dad, I was also learning that I had to start grieving the loss of like my best friend. And so we didn't talk at all. I think maybe like the last week of college she, she hit me up like late at night because she didn't have anyone to go to a party with. And so she wanted me to go with her. And I just remember feeling so upset

because I was like, you haven't talked to me at all. And this is what you're texting me about. Like you're texting me to go to a party with you. And so after that, we didn't talk at all. I think maybe she texted me to like congratulate me because she heard through the grapevine I got a job. But that was it. Like we never talked again. Um, we follow each other on social media, but like, we don't, we don't talk at all. That was it. You were friends with this girl. You perceived this friendship to be one of your closest. You've you, you called her a best friend. Your dad passed away. She was pretty MIA. And then you noticed her lack of empathy and remorse for your situation. You didn't address it, correct, with her? thinking about it um and i i talked to some of my closer friends who knew that this was happening and i think they kind of had brought it up to her but i i never did just because i felt like

you don't know that for sure though i'm pretty certain i mean these are like really good friends um that i mean maybe they didn't do it in the way i would so that's fair to say they might not have approached it in the best way. But as far as I know, I think that you think you think that they at least said something to her. Yeah. And she and she did nothing with that information. Correct. I think one thing that set me a little over the edge or just kind of made me feel weird. And this friend probably shouldn't have told me this, especially because it was very raw, but we were in like a Greek organization together. And so one of my good friends like reached out to this friend and said

like, Hey, can you help organize like sending flowers or something to Natalie and her family? to Natalie and her family and she just didn't do it. Um, she didn't really have, I guess, didn't have interest in doing it or just didn't want to, um, do it. And I thought that was kind of weird. Of course, I'm hearing this from like, you know, a third party. So maybe she interpreted that differently, but, um, yeah, that was kind of like the deal breaker for me when I, when I learned about that. And, and so what's your question? My question. And then just to make sure we have all the information, I'm sorry for cutting you off. You moved on, you graduated, you just accepted it.

You know, she asked you to that party. You're like, what? She has you at that party, you're like, what? And then she hasn't really been a part of your life until you got an invitation to this wedding and you realize that she was also invited and now you're anticipating this confrontation or awkward moment for you. Yeah, and I think when I wrote in,

my question was a little different but i don't want to i'm not going to acknowledge this at the wedding because like this is not about me like this about like celebrating my friends and so yeah i was thinking if it's worth reaching out to her prior to the wedding um and just maybe just saying like hey it's been a while i saw that you're going to so-and-so's wedding like how have you been or something just to kind of test the waters or like i don't know i know it's going to be a smaller wedding and so i'm not going to be able to avoid that i'm going to have to be cordial so um so i just got one question for you, though. Yeah. You say she was your best friend or one of your best friends.

And I do understand that. I don't know what it's like, thankfully, to have lost a parent. I can only imagine how difficult it would be. But nevertheless, I'm still wondering why you didn't confront your best friend about this. Like, if someone I considered my best friend wronged me, and while this is, I get your, like, no one listening, I don't think anyone listening is saying, like, that's not something to get mad about or be hurt about of course like we all empathize but there there might be

explanations you know um i don't know but you you confront your best friends you know you talk to your best friends best friend doesn't mean i'm never gonna hurt you just like having a boyfriend and girlfriend doesn't mean i'm ever gonna hurt hurt you. Just like having a boyfriend and girlfriend doesn't mean I'm ever going to hurt you. And if someone does something that hurts you, short of it being immediately unforgivable, and even then you at least confront them about it. I'm just wondering why you just were like, you had this kind of like, well, she can say something to me, but if not, you're fired. And I'm just wondering why didn't you at least pick up the phone, you know, after you grieve, or maybe when she reached out to you and said, do you want to go to a party? Like the next day you pick her up and be like, I don't know if you care and maybe you don't,

but like, this really hurt me. And I'm just wondering why? Cause I value your friendship and I'm just like, it would have meant a lot for you to friendship. And it would have meant a lot for me to have your support during a really hard time. Why didn't you ask her then? I just don't think that I was... I don't think I was emotionally in the right place to be able to do that. I don't think I was emotionally in the right place to be able to do that. I will admit, like, I think I wasn't as confrontational then as I am now. Like now I don't think I would have a problem confronting someone about that.

But back then, like, I think who I was, I was very, it was very easy for me probably to cut people off. And I don't know. I guess I just thought that it was so... This was such a huge thing that happened that I shouldn't have had to explain myself. I think that's what my justification was. And I'm just challenging a little bit because, again, I empathize with how difficult that moment in your time in your life would have been. But what you just said there is I think you something you need to be careful for. I don't, I, a lot of people do that. They make that mistake. I don't feel like I should have to justify myself, but like people aren't mind readers,

right? And if we want people to empathize with us, we need to take the time sometimes to have conversations and difficult ones with people we care about, especially when there's a misunderstanding or when they hurt us, and at least give them the opportunity to correct the wrong. Again, I'm just guessing here because it does sound shitty. Don't get me wrong. Your friend, if I'm guessing, I'm just guessing like, listen, you met when you were younger and it turns out she really wasn't her best friend. She's just kind of selfish. And when you reflect back, maybe she's just, it's all about her. That's my guess, right? But nevertheless, maybe, I don't know, maybe she's

not good with death. Maybe it's awkward for her. Maybe she has her own baggage when it comes to death. I don't know. Maybe it was a fight or flight moment for her and she just needed to avoid it. And so she did at the risk of alienating you in a very difficult time. It's possible. It's not the craziest explanation, right? I just think in the future, I think you should use this situation as a lesson

to challenge yourself to have tough conversations with the people you're close to when they disappoint you or hurt your feelings or you feel wrong by them, whether it's friendships or your romantic lives. I just think this is a lesson for you to learn because, yeah, you're going to deal with disappointment and things like that. Now, as far as this situation and what you should do, I think if you don't do anything, you'll be fine. As an adult, you recognize this day is not about you. And you can go there and you can see her and you can be pleasant and say hi

and do the fake, how's it going? And again, really focus on the fact that this day is very much not about you and you don't have to have the best day possible. You don't have to have the most amazing time. That's not what this day is about. It's about your friend. And so you can definitely get through it without it having be that awkward or difficult or whatever. It's just not a part of your life. So that's option one. Or listen, if this is still eating away at you, if you think maybe there's a reconnecting to be had that maybe you're still not, it still hurts you a little bit. If it does still hurt you, if you're not indifferent about this person, then it might be worth reaching out. Again, I'd be very,

like don't have any expectations. This is about you expressing yourself. This is about you practicing, just expressing your feelings. And you could say something like, hey, I know so-and-so is getting you married. I reached out. This might be coming out of the blue for you,

but this hurt me then. And I just wanted to ask you, and maybe we're just at different points of our lives, but come from a place of you were sad and don't come from a place of being accusatory. It's not going to do you any good to reach out to this person out of the blue, no matter how shitty it was for her, to be like,

I thought it really fucking sucked that you did this. You know what I'm saying? You're not going to get anywhere. So, you have to decide whether you want to bring this back into your life, because it's going to trigger some things. It's going to certainly, you're going to have to

go back to a place where your dad passed away. It's going to trigger some emotions there, and you're going to have to go back to a place where your dad passed away. It's going to trigger some emotions there. And you're going to have to decide whether that's worth it to you. Because I definitely think you can get through that one day. You can easily just not think about the situation from now until then. Deal with it on that day. Focus on it not being your day. Get through it and never see her again.

I think I can get, I definitely could get through the day. And that would not be like the time or place to like talk about something like this. And I have thought about trying to reconnect with her over the past few years. Like there's definitely some times where you know i'll i'll miss her i'll be like okay maybe um i should just try and reach out um i guess it's just scary because it's like i have to go in with the expectation that like like you said it may not end the way that or it may not you know play out the way that i hope it should play out um or i want it to play out. Like, do you need her back as a best friend? No, I don't. I'm just someone who like, I don't like having bad blood with people.

Yeah, well, that's good. Yeah. So also you can just redefine your expectations for her. Like as we get older, I know there's a lot of people where it's just like, you know what? You're not my best friend. You're not someone I really, you're not my ride or die. I don't even particularly trust you. I don't share a lot of information, but you're a cool hang? You're not my best friend. You're not someone I really... You're not my ride or die. I don't even particularly trust you.

I don't share a lot of information, but you're a cool hang. You're fun. You're fun to hang out with. I enjoy your company. You're that kind of friend for me. You can still have her in your life. You can forgive her and work through it and just

agree to just move on. She acknowledges she couldn't say something like, yeah, I'm sorry I didn't do that. I wish I would have done that. But maybe deep down, she's just kind of selfish. She's just kind of like not, you realize she's not your ride or die. She's not the person you're calling on

when you really need a favor. She's not your best friend, but she can be a friend that is stealing your life from time to time. You enjoy her and she still adds some value and then there's no bad blood and you redefine your expectations of the friendship in her and that way you won't be disappointed in the future. Yeah, that's a good way to look at it. I think it would probably be worth trying to, It's a good way to look at it. I think it would probably be worth trying to, even if she's, you know, not my best friend, which is totally fine. I think it might be worth acknowledging. I guess it's just scary because it's been so long. So it's like, I don't want to like cause drama or something out of the blue. You know, like, I think that's something i worry about too like well don't don't don't yeah then don't you can you can talk to her and and like without demanding a certain kind of apology you know what i'm saying

like you know if you if you reach out to her and be like you know this was shitty and blah blah we're both gonna be there and i don't you know like just come from a place of like hey listen like i know we're gonna be there and i miss you it made me sad and that's for me that's why we lost touch but I know you're going to be there and there I think about how you're doing I see you on social and I guess I just before I didn't want the first time to see you to be at the wedding and give her an opportunity to say something you know don't make it about like this big you know you know you don't really need answers maybe you could just assume that she's a little selfish and you're not your ride or die and you've re-evaluated your expectations for her but you're not prepared or don't really want to swear her off and you don't want the first time to see her to be at the wedding.

Okay. Yeah. I think I could do that. All right. Okay. Well, best of luck. Thank you. All right. Thank you. I appreciate it. All right. Take care. You too. All right. Bye-bye. How's it going? Great. Hi, Nick. My name is Amy and I'm 37. Hi, Amy. Hi. I've been dating since like mid-January, a 47-year-old man who is divorced and has an eight-year-old son. And it's been a new experience for me. I've never actually new experience for me. I've never actually dated somebody who had kids before. And so I'll just preface it with, I'm definitely coming in as the inexperienced one. So a lot of firsts. Obviously, you know, I've been in this relationship now for a year because I really do, I really do love my partner, but unfortunately we're sort of in a place now where a lot of,

I hate to call it baggage, but it really is. A lot of the baggage from his past life seems to sort of loom and doom and really weigh heavy on almost every aspect of our relationship. And a big part of that is the dreaded ex-wife. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So, you know, it. In what regard? I mean, she's.

What was that? And like when you say the dreaded, are you being like, is she truly like just awful or or just the fact that he has an ex-wife? Right. Well, I think I'm sure she's a fine woman if he chose to marry her and have a child with her. Right. I think the part that I am having the hardest time with is I feel like there's no boundaries with the divorce taking place and how in order for him to kind of move on with his life with a new partner and, you know, having another chance at marriage, having another chance at having kids with a new partner, there has to be like a level of separation, I guess, between his life and the life he used to have with the ex-wife. And that's

sort of where there's a lot of issues is I feel like she's still very much in the picture. And I guess that's where they have a kid together. So on some level, she will always be in the picture. How long has he been divorced for? Seven years. Okay. So a while. And where do you feel like she's crossing boundaries that you don't necessarily feel like are normal or okay? Oh my goodness. Well, for starters, she calls and texts all day, every day. And it's often not about their son. all day, every day. And it's often not about their son. If we have an evening where, you know, he doesn't have custody and, you know, by the time we wind down our days and maybe we're having dinner, you know, the FaceTime with the son is over and now it's just our time and we're having wine. I mean, she's texting him pictures at eight, nine, 10, 11 o'clock at night.

pictures at eight, nine, 10, 11 o'clock at night. Yeah. And of, of her and their son, right? Her and their son is different than her. Yeah. It's, it's both. Um, I feel like there's always one in there of her and their son. So it's like her and her son, her and her son nude. Her and their son. So it's like her and her son, her and her son, nude. I haven't seen any nude pictures. But, you know, even if it's. The point of the matter is my stomach turns because all night his phone is bing, bing, bing, bing, bing. She's calling.

And I'm assuming you've said something to him. Absolutely. And what does he say? He doesn't want to ruffle feathers. You know, he tells me consistently, like, he doesn't want to be in a relationship with her. And I have nothing to worry about in that sense. But, like, he's not really fixing anything. He's not setting boundaries. Yeah, I don't get roughing feathers.

I mean, I understand like they share a kid together, but it's not a big ass to say, hey, Deb, no, we've been married, but and I know we have a son together, but like I'm dating. I really like her. I need you to like pause on that. Should be really easy to say. And the fact that it's not easy for him to say

is an issue you know either he's bad with confrontation or you know like what is she like what she gonna lose her shit you know like i don't know for the most part he's kept us separated um and so i don't know if there's something he's protecting. And I think the reason why I've allowed it to go on this long is, you know, I didn't ask a lot of questions at the beginning. And so I didn't realize how bad it was. What do you mean? I thought it was just a part of co-parenting. I mean, I don't know. We took a vacation together. It was the first vacation he had taken in years. And we took like five days to go to Mexico. And I mean, she just destroyed him and set so much guilt and like set it up to their son that he was doing a trip without his son.

And she just made him miserable about going on this trip with me because she was jealous and he kept it from me. But turns out once I like saw his phone, I saw all the back and forth and it just made me sick. Yeah. I mean, it's a real problem. It's a real problem. Yeah. I think, you know, the custody is another issue because they live in such close quarters. So that's not really being stuck to. And so what a normal co-parenting schedule looks like where there's a trade-off and maybe you're texting when that's changing, that is more like a framework of not really anything that's followed. So like she's constantly

around. Pick up, drop off, school, sports, she's everywhere. And there's really, now that there's no framework for custody, there's no way for us to carve out space that's just he and I. She's now found a way into everything. And as I mentioned, even evening time, her texts are seeping into. Listen, I'm not a dad. I'm not divorced. I can only imagine the struggle it is with parents who share children together and are trying to co-parent and having their kids in mind and wanting to make it as normal and as loving as an environment for their kids right so uh you know i get there's like co-parenting and there's you know they

agree to like who has custody when but like doesn't mean that parents can't like be more open-minded and having like parents being both mutually actively involved like there's nothing i mean i can't say like he's they are doing something wrong there because like that must be great for the kid probably really enjoys it right and i can understand why he would say it makes my kid happy makes me happy that has nothing to do with these text messages are you going on a trip and her you know if she you know is getting jealous and losing control and despite them being divorced still likes to hold influence over him and have him make her a priority. People do that all the time. It's like, I don't know if I want to be with you, but I do want you to make me feel special still or make me feel like a priority. And I like it when you say no to

anyone else and say yes to me. It's power it's control and it's fair for you to expect him as far as it works for your relationship to like set those boundaries with her and and still like you know be the parent and father he wants to be and if he's unwilling to do that and he says like, listen, I'm just gonna be real with you. Like at the end of the day, it's not worth it to me to shake up what I have because at the end of the day, it's just going to affect my kid. And I don't want to affect my kid and my kid's a priority. So this is the situation i'm in at least you then then you can decide for yourself whether you want to be in this situation yeah and you have to decide are you willing to put up with this the correct answer should be no like you definitely should not be willing to put up with

this and don't be someone who convinces yourself that you can. You know, oh, well, I don't want to like, you know, this is not about you being the wicked girlfriend, you know, who's like trying to, you know, steal your boyfriend away from his kid. You know, like you're someone who deserves to be in a happy relationship and have a partner that, you know, makes you a priority regardless if they have a kid or an ex-wife or whatever. You know, because you, you know, you want him to be a father and spend time with his kid and you recognize he has an ex-wife. You recognize that they're going to, she's going to be in his life, but you're just asking for her to respect some boundaries and respect the relationship you have with him. And some people aren't willing to do that. And if that is the case, then you have to decide to choose you and not make yourself feel guilty about like taking your boyfriend away from his son. Cause that's not what you're doing. You're giving him the choice to do the normal mature thing, the normal mature thing, define some boundaries, set, you know, with his wife. And if he is going to prioritize that so much that he is unwilling to make anyone else a priority in his life,

he has the right to do that. But he would be literally telling you, you come way below, you know, in any relationship, even with kids. I mean, when I grew up, when my parents had 10, you know in any relationship even with kids i mean when i grew up my parents had 10 11 kids i had 10 siblings i almost like forgot it and my parents always like you know we as kids i think a lot of kids will do this but like do you who do you love the most like do you love dad like do you love us like you know my parents were always like we love each other differently and my parents always as much as they love my parents gave their whole lives of their kids truly their whole lives everything was about their kids just to raise 11 kids but they always it was always clear to us kids that they made each other a priority you know they wouldn't be pit against each other over their kids they were a united front right so like i think that's what it takes to to you know to make sure you make each other a

priority even and you can still love your give your kids unconditional love but he is making you feel like yeah i romanticize or fantasize i guess a little bit is i also grew up in a mixed family where um my mother and my stepfather brought a child into the relationship and then had kids together, right? And they really were always a united front. And I was able to kind of see how that can still make a beautiful family. And I think- Totally. But they have to choose. There are a lot of parents out there who, once they have kids, stop making their partners a priority and it's all about their kids. And that's fine if they want to choose that. I particularly don't want that for myself or my relationship or my kids. I want my kid to recognize boundaries.

I don't want my kid to be so spoiled that they constantly need love and attention, even at the risk of me focusing on my partner, whether know, whether it's like the mother of my kids or, you know, we get divorced or whatever. And I'm seeing that start to happen too. Well, that's what I'm saying. You know, it sounds like he is, it's, you're describing a situation where his kid comes first, his ex-wife comes second and whoever he's dating comes third. Maybe throw a job in there and then the person he's dating. All right. Well, now well now you know so like yeah all you can do is just face it head on stand your ground define your boundary

attempt to enforce it give him a period of time that's not very long, maybe a month to show you that he hears you and that he's willing to do something about it. And you should see some actual progress. And if not, you just say, thanks, but no thanks. You don't make a stink about it. You don't fight with him over it. You don't... Because you can't tell him how to love you. You can't fight with them over it. You don't, you know. Yeah. Because like you can't tell him how to love you. You know, you can't tell him how to love his son. You have to respect what he wants and you can't make him want what you want. You know, we do that so often where you get in these relationships and we get mad at our partners because we want them to love us a certain way,

even though they've been very clear up front how they love. And we get mad at them because we decided to get in a relationship with someone that we decide we want because we have a handful of good moments and we're physically attracted or some good sex sandwiched in or whatever. But at the end of the day, 90% of the time, we're not really feeling the love, the love that we need. And so we get mad at them because they're not doing what we want and what we should say. And they're just like, but that's not how I love. And then yet you, instead of like accepting that and like saying, okay, well, you know, we had some good sex and

you're a good person and you know, but like, this is not how I want to be loved. And you choose to move on. You fight with them and force it and then get mad at them. And you know, but like, this is not how I want to be loved. And you choose to move on. You fight with them and force it and then get mad at them. And, you know, so like you decide what you want, like, you know, no, you're absolutely right. And the craziest part about it all, like, I think I'm realizing through therapy that what I'm having the hardest time with is this like idea of us having kids together and us, you know, him remarrying and me moving into the house and like this super healthy co-parenting relationship where it is just civil and mature and co-parenting and there's boundaries and like, there's this big, you know, happy ending. And that is now just so far beyond reach that I realize I'm just invested in this idea of,

and it's sad at my age that I'm still doing that, but I really love him. And I really, you know, thought that this was going to go a different way and I just need to. It could, but the only way it's going to go that you want it is you being willing to leave because he can't do it. I don't think he could do it on his own. You have to make him choose you because right now you are allowing him to treat you like an option or like a third or fourth priority. You've been putting up with it. And like, I wouldn't let your A, you're only 36.

Like you're, you know, so stop wasting time with people who are wasting your time. Yeah. You know, don't, don't, don't force it, you know? Yeah. Thank you. It's interesting. If there wasn't the whole ex-wife kid in the situation, I think it'd be easier for me to say, you know, where I need to be a priority that I'm more comfortable with.

I think my inexperience in this kind of, it was a learning curve. I think it took me a lot longer to realize what the trend was. Yeah. And I get it because you're like, you walk into the situation and you're just like, oh, well, I have to respect, you know, the family dynamic and I have to respect you wanting to be a father. And I also find it attractive that you're making your kid a priority. So I get it. But like, you can draw a clear line of like what's healthy and where you fit in and you can still expect to be a priority. You know, like dating someone with a kid doesn't mean to make that relationship work. You have to relinquish this expectation of being a priority. Like that's not, that's not the case. It's the cold, hard truth.

Well, I feel like you know what you need to do. Yeah. Well, hopefully I've, you know, this will hit the next girl who... No, no, no. You're not a martyr. Stop feeling sorry for yourself. You're right. You're right. Well, thank you, Nick. I'm a big fan

and I really appreciate your candid advice. Well, I appreciate you calling in. Happy holidays. Thanks. All right, take care. All right, bye-bye. Thanks for listening, guys. We have a great episode for you on Wednesday.

And obviously, we'll always bring the heat when it comes to recapping The Bachelor. Don't forget to subscribe. Tell your friends. We always love our Ask Nick listeners to leave us reviews on iTunes. It means a lot. Can't thank you enough for doing it.

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And, uh, is that everything? I think so. Sounds good to me. All right. We have a great week. Love you.

Bye.