The Viall Files - E423 Going Deeper - Josh Peck, Game Nights & Office Hours Texts

Episode Date: May 18, 2022

Welcome back to The Viall Files, Going Deeper edition! Today we are joined by actor, comedian, podcaster, and much more, Josh Peck! On this episode we dive deep with Josh and get into some burning questions. We talk about the balance between being opened and closed, how Josh’s sponsor gives the realest advice, and pushing back against the “shitty committee” in your head. We then talk about blaming someone else for your mistakes, a fun game night gone wrong when unsavory words are introduced, and the two main reasons why people get canceled. We dive into the relationship between Megan Fox and Machine Gun Kelly asking if the candle that burns twice as bright lasts half as long. We then bring on two Office Hours Text callers to give them some advice in their situationships. Our first caller deals with processing getting the “ick” and how to communicate with the guy she’s seeing that she is no longer interested. Our second caller struggles when she crushes on her mom’s hot Pickleball Coach. She wonders if she can make something happen when she takes a quick trip back to her hometown.  “I can’t help with the pretend.” Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] to be a part of our Monday episodes.  If you would like to get some advice on Office Hours send an email to [e-mail] with “ Office Hours” in the subject line!  Pre-Order Nick’s Book: https://www.abramsbooks.com/product/dont-text-your-ex-happy-birthday_9781419755491/ Check out our new "Introvert" merch at http://www.viallfiles.com today! THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: Manscaped: Get 20% Off and Free Shipping with the code VIALL at http://www.Manscaped.com Chime: Get started today at http://www.Chime.com/VIALL  Episode Socials:  @viallfiles @nickviall @shuapeck See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

what's going on everybody welcome back to another exciting episode of the vile files going deeper edition we have a great show for you. The one, the only, Josh Peck. Is it Josh? Does he go by Josh? I was about to say Joshua Peck, but then I don't even know.

It's just Josh. I think it's just Josh. His mother might call him Joshua, but I don't think we should. Anyway, he's a goddamn delight. Oh my God. I can't wait to be friends with him. Might you be his new babysitter?

Yeah, so Josh took my phone number so that I can watch his child god i can't wait i think you might know his be might you be his new baby yeah so josh um josh took my phone number so that i can watch his child and uh you know nick if i turn in my two weeks notice you'll know it's become full-time if i leave you for josh back full-time nanny yeah he's great um we have a fun exciting uh episode with josh um we get into some uh well a lot of we did we did two josh really wanted to do texting office hours he was so good at it too i think we're gonna bring him back for like such good advice really he's he is like you know we love all our guests some people have more of a knack a knack for empathetic thoughtful counsel and he was he was picking up details from the callers and he's like well let's circle back

to this like honestly really enjoyed it imagine the energy in this room if we combine josh and justin long wild stuff i went to a party i know i had a party party. I had a game night. I have something I have to get off my chest. We got to confess. We had a game night. Well, I feel like it's their fault. We had a game night. And what's the name of the game called, Amanda? Called Celebrity. And it's a game where everybody writes down words or phrases or things on a piece of paper. And then you break up into two teams and you take turns trying to get your teammates to guess the words, et cetera. And the first round, you can use as many words as you want to describe. The second round, after you've put all of the words back in the hat, so you kind of know the

pool that you're working with, you act it out. the final round you only get one word so i had played this once before with family years ago and we had a large it was like it was uh erica and scott because it was the night after they were gassed matt king and patricia came uh connor wood aka fibula uh a handful of other people you're just gonna start running like a tiktok house out of your home you're like their their manager matt matt matt's more of a youtube the youtube space any i don't know i don't know anyway they've they've all become friends but like become friends like we're i don't really know like yeah like they're all friends acquaintances but it's it's yeah but it's like uh it's an evolving

developing friend group and it's not the unconditional love stage of friendship yeah yeah we're definitely not definitely not in the unconditional love stage it was like let's have a game night la it's a melting pot you you have to try to make friends and and so this there's like 15 or so people and it's a perfect game if you're not familiar with this game to play with large groups of people because you know like it's just hard hard like can't play monopoly with that many people it's a so you everyone gets like three scratch papers and you're supposed to write any word so now like here's three words and I went to my corner to write down my words and I thought to myself,

okay, well, I don't, what should we write? We're all adults. Let's spice it up. Let's make it fun. I'm thinking, so I was like, you know what? I'll write two normal words. I think my first word was whistle and then swinging.

But ironically, given the context of this rest of the story, I was thinking like swinging. Uh-huh. You know. We're off to a great start, especially with Whistle, too. For those who aren't watching, Nick is doing a P and B motion with his finger. No, I'm not. I'm like swinging on a swing.

And Whistle is also an interesting. Why Whistle? Like the song Whistle. I'm not familiar. You're sexualizing whistles, Allie? There's a literal song where he's talking about whistle baby, whistle baby, and it's like about a BJ. I think it's a reach.

Is it? I'm not. Anyway, I was just thinking you could sexualize anything. Anyways, I was thinking normal world, normal world. And my last word, I was like, you know what? I'm going to spice it up. I'm thinking we're all adults. Cards Against Humanity. They have some crazy shit in there.

So I'm going to throw in a word that I think would be funny and weird and would be funny to see people act out. And I chose the word cuckold. So for any of you who don't know what that word is, it's basically when two people in a relationship, one person enjoys watching their partner, I guess, have sex or do something sexual with someone else. It's like, it's like a, it's well, not swinging. It's like swinging if in the sexual sense, that's more, it's more niche. It's a niche type of

open relationship usually like kind of like a dynamic around it of like sort of being like the the person who's watching being more like submissive and like it's sort of yeah like so anyways i just i just kind of thought it popped in my head i laughed laughed. I wrote it down. I also spelled it wrong, which. It's not his strong suit. It's not my strong suit. And then as we started playing, all the words were just like. Sandwich. Sandwich.

And. Flour. You know, just real vanilla stuff. And I started to panic. And I'm thinking, I don't really know all these people too well. You know, I was comfortable with like Erica and Scott. And I'm thinking, I don't really know all these people too well. I was comfortable with Erica and Scott. And I'm like, that's fine. But then I realized that some people in this group might not even know what it is. And some people in this group I know to be more like there was someone in the group whose parents are pastors. And then I started like being like,

maybe this was a bad decision. Like, oh my God, I got real self-conscious. Internally, I'm panicking while everyone's playing the game. He's like, how do I get them in the pool? It was just like, and I was hoping maybe someone like, and then there were a couple of times

where people would be like, I don't know what this is. And they kind of like talk, like whatever. And I'm like. Oh, so it got rejected a few times. No, I wasn't sure. Oh, okay.

Maybe, maybe it did. It definitely could could have was there anything else that was questionable uh i don't i don't i don't remember anyway just like like a scene out of a movie connor wood comes up and then matt king had to leave early he had to go record a podcast and he gets up and i see it there's one left in so it's not as if like it's just like a rapid fire game it's not if someone just said it acted like it's like hey it's a fun word here's a kinky weird word that's like that'd be no and my my nightmare was that someone was going to make a big deal about it and connor gets up it's the last one. And Connor made my nightmare come true. And he starts like getting flush in the face and start acting all weird as if like, how dare someone write this word? And he like started apologizing to the group.

And really like, I felt truly shamed. And like, I was like, oh my God, this is my nightmare. I'm like, this is. And then he started then and then he started making fun of the person who spelled it wrong which was me and i you know i can't i'm not a good speller and i knew it's funny thing is as soon as while i was panicking i was like i know i spelled it wrong i know i don't know why i was thinking that was the cherry on top and so i'm just like panicked everyone's like who wrote it i'm just like shut the fuck up because like they're shaming me or the person who wrote it at the time they didn't know who wrote it and

then people started blaming matt he's like oh matt probably did it he probably like knew he had to leave and he just like dropped this bomb and like dish out i started this like blaming everyone like wow was it you deflect that was crazy and and uh yeah and then and then we played another round and the next round everyone's saying the craziest fucking shit and honestly it made it way more fun and i wanted to be like fuck you guys see like i made this game fun because i clearly gave everyone the freedom to write some crazy ass shit and it really did make it so everyone still thinks it was matt i don't know because even after the game they were saying who wrote it like as if it was like i was like i do not feel safe to i feel like i'm going to be shamed and i should do a youtube style apology video where

it's like hey guys i'm gonna address yeah so like anyways send it to the group chat if there's people in this group who think matt did it matt if you've been blamed for this i'm sorry connor fuck you for making me feel do we think any of these people listen to the podcast probably not okay i bet they someone will dm like it i'm confident in this getting back to them cool cool internet do your thing anyways i felt like I just had to get it off my chest. This is a safe space. And I told Amanda about it because honestly, I was just like, the next day, I was like,

kind of like Natalie suspected it might be me. And the next day, she's like, what were your two words? I'm like, I was cuckold. Like, it was me. Natalie's like, how's your day going? He's like, I wrote cuckold last night i just had to get it off my chest uh and then she just laughed i told a man about it and

appropriately she was like whatever and then you played it that weirdly enough that game it was by coincidence like literally the night or that night we were playing that game at a party i was at and i wrote down cuckold and set a photo and nobody minded. It was loose. I truly felt shamed by the group. It was, uh, I was hyperventilating inside. Anyway, my pro tip though, is the next time you play that game, write down someone in the room. If you want to like stir up some shit. Yeah. Did you, are you the one who told me that? Yeah, I did it. it well because i once played it my ex's family was big game family and they played it at christmas and i wrote down my ex's dad and

it kind of it it caused and the way and they described him as uh one word they used to describe him was anal oh my god i really stirred up some shit no weirdly enough yeah the first round you know what people did they use it as a way to like promote their stuff they wrote down their podcasts and like shows i was like you fuckers embarrassing that's worse than cuckold i don't know if it was the person who wrote down their show or someone wrote down someone else's show that remains to be seen but people's like content was in the pile. And I got shamed for throwing in a dirty word. Anyway, we have a great episode for you.

The one that only Josh Peck is with us. And next week, we'll be getting back into the Amber Heard, Johnny Depp of it all. From a legal perspective. There's a lot going on, obviously, this week. And we have a lawyer coming in to give From a legal perspective. There's a lot going on, obviously, this week. And we have a lawyer coming in to give us some legal knowledge

amongst other things. And the rest was a surprise. Let's get to Josh. Attention, listeners. Are you ready to be blown away? Siren alert.

You asked for it and they listened. Our friends at Manscaped just relaunched the Ultra Smooth Package. It's back, baby. That's right. Your new favorite tool and complement to the Lawn Mower 4.0 to keep your boys smooth. Well, hey, listen. I don't care if it's your boys or your boyfriend's boys or someone's boys. Manscaped is doing great work in the male grooming department,

whether it's their Lawn Mower 4.0 or the other great items that they have. They also have amazing underwear. I don't know if you know that. They have like a body. They have like a two-in-one shampoo and conditioner, a body spray, deodorant. I gifted that to my friend who is a fitness instructor. He's always sweaty. And his boyfriend asked to move in with him.

Is it because of their love or is it because of Manscaped? I literally use the Manscaped deodorant. That is my current deodorant. I love it. It's really nice. And there's no aluminum in it, which is really important for me. There you go. And the important thing too also is that no reason to have hairy balls or nicked skin

or, you know, like... There's no need for that. There's no need for that. Nick doesn't need nicks. It's amazing how you can close your eyes and go to town down there without any fear. It's a comfortable thing. Your guy, your man, your man in your life,

I bet there's a lot of times where it's just a little unmanageable down there. Get them some Manscaped. Get 20% off plus free shipping with the code VIALL at manscaped.com. That's 20% off plus free shipping with the code VIALL at manscaped.com. Smooth out your fellas with the relaunched, ultra smooth package from the fellas at Manscaped. Your balls will thank you.

Their balls will thank you. Thank you. That's how they sound. No one likes waiting on a paycheck, especially when you've got bills.

Good thing there's Chime. Now you can get your paycheck up to two days early with direct deposit. That's up to two more days to save,

pay bills, and generally just feel good about your money situation. But Chime is more than just getting paid early. It's also award-winning mobile app, checking account, debit card, and optional savings account. Nick, did you know that I keep track of all of my money on an Excel spreadsheet every month?

I do, actually. And then I input everything that I'm paid based on the day it comes in, and I prep it ahead of time. But I have my friend's 30th comes in, and I prep it ahead of time. But I have my friend's 30th coming up, and his boyfriend is like, hey, can you pay me for X, Y, and Z? And I'm like, not until freaking 14th of May, but you know how I get it early? Chime.

Yeah. It's super easy. It's really easy. And now we can say cheers to a dirty 30. Cheers to a dirty 30 and no needless fees. Amen. Amen. Let's spend that on booze. So what are you waiting for?

Hopefully not your paycheck. Get started with Chime today. Applying for a free account takes less than two minutes. Get started at Chime.com slash V-I-A-L-L. That's Chime.com slash V-I-A-L-L. Banking services and debit card provided by the Bancorp Bank or Stride Bank N.A. Members FDIC. Early access to direct deposit

funds depend on payer. Josh, welcome. Thank you so much. Thanks for coming, man. It's like I've anticipated this so much. I feel like we've done it in our heads. I, you know, it's, I've visualized this conversation. I'm really excited for you to be here. I already feel like we all have a shorthand and I'm just honored to be here. Yeah. I don't even know. Very positive vibes from Josh. I love it. Come on. Why not, right? Do you describe yourself as like an optimistic, constantly happy person? It's the antidepressants. I really don't have a say in the matter.

Do you take antidepressants? No, but i toy with you sorry which brand are you i'm well butrin oh so is my mom no i uh sorry mom you guys can cut that out or leave it in hey i don't think she listens to the pod no offense none taken she's 77 i don't know if she knows how to get podcasts um but uh i don't you know what i'm constantly thinking about and considering it but i am not currently on one but i am happy to join the ssri gang at any time when you feel down yes what makes you feel down i have a what i like to call the shitty committee in my head and it just just depends how I, what the volume is when I wake up.

But it tends to wake up a few minutes before I do. And it starts telling me all the reasons why I'm not enough. Or why things are not going to work out. Pretty textbook. Do you feel like you haven't, things haven't worked out? Because I feel like you're quite successful. But isn't that the thing? Yeah.

It also is like, if data could be thrown in the face of even mild, you know, mental illness or anxiety or depression, we, you know, in many cases it would just be eradicated, right? But it doesn't do well with reality. I have, you know, I've been sober, like, sorry, I'm just completely opening up. It's like, it's like we've been sitting here for a while. I, I've been sober for almost 14 years or over 14 years. And sometimes I'll call my sponsor and I'll, you know, just like normal catastrophizing that I think many people do, you know, oh God, like if this, you you know i'm so worried

this isn't going to work out and if it doesn't what will then happen and if i come to him with that kind of a problem he'll go yeah i can't help with the pretend like if you have a real problem oh that's what wow that's what your therapist says no my sponsor sponsor my therapist has to be cooler because i'm paying him gotcha your sponsor says that's good to know well i i as a i'm a worrier i i sure what the way you talk i relate to that mindset and i i can go down rabbit holes like i can plant a seed of doubt in my head of anxiety or fear or whatever and i can really i can make it seem very like like this is happening and only only for like something eventually to completely just debunk it or worrying about like why someone doesn't text you back you know or something like that and all of a

sudden that can turn into like everyone hates me kind of thing um i have that ability to like ruminate and snowball those things. But that's a very interesting comment to say, I can't help you with what is the pretend. And does that help you when in that moment? Yes, because it sort of takes the air out of it. Like this isn't, I'm not going to even walk down this road with you because to do it would be this

mental sort of circus you're about to throw up the reality is it hasn't happened yet and if it does happen if you do get canceled or like if you know something you know you do run out of money like then we'll take the necessary steps to deal with that issue. But right now, you're fine. Do you worry about getting canceled? Does everyone who does what we do worry about it on some level? I think if they say no, they're lying. Yeah. And the idea that, oh, well, if you haven't done anything, you have nothing to worry about,

I think is disingenuous. I'd say being married with a kid and being faithful to my wife is really has eradicated a lot of that worry thankfully like i'd be more worried if i was dating or just i mean not really because i'm a i'm a good dude but i yeah but now we but to your point now we like people are out there i mean the truth is the cancel culture in some levels has become a um a cottage industry so to speak where people are making names for themselves by trying to like do background checks and other people and then criticize them for you know saying something that they need to apologize for or a mistake they've made.

I don't know what it is, but there are people out there trying to cancel people for things that people probably have or apologized for in the past. That's the idea. We've all done things that we should have apologized for. We've all made mistakes. We've all said, I that we should have apologized for we've all made mistakes we've all said i'm you know that was i'm sorry for saying that and usually we don't even realize in the moment some usually you know especially when we're younger we had to realize and been

told and learn why that was wrong or why we hurt someone's feelings etc etc but no it's a real thing and people are out there and i think we do live in a time, it's a small group of people, but a group of people who are capitalizing on trying to out people because people are, again, making names for themselves. And if you go on TikTok and you say something kind of catchy and critical, that's what goes viral. Well, and I think it's such a different playing field now because a lot of the people who, you know, are coming into the spotlight, like, I don't know exactly when this started, definitely like a few years older than me, if not further, everyone has pretty much an online presence from at least, you know, high school or college on. Now it's getting younger and younger of like even, you know, elementary school, middle school, people are just putting stuff online. So then once once you get a following there's just stuff to dig through i

mean like people don't have stuff that you wrote as a high schooler i'm assuming i'm like i'm so thankful that i didn't get twitter until like i was an adult and the first i had twitter i didn't tweet you know like i just followed sports teams and so yeah like a lot of it is just like i don't know it's also like we all evolve and learn and change and even a couple years ago like i'm so grateful of of how i evolved as a person and and can recognize my ignorance from the past you know in terms of you know moving to la i've expanded my mind and my views on life. And I'm grateful for that. And it's weird. I think we have a culture that sometimes tries to... I don't think we... We live in a time, I'm wondering if you agree, where we don't...

We're not interested in looking at our growth and looking where we were and where we've gone and how we've grown and, and things that we maybe got wrong in the past or thought and said, you know, I'm really glad I have evolved as a person. And instead of like, you know, saying that's a good thing, we're more focused on sometimes, at least some people are more focused on what people did or said in the past that was things they had to apologize for. Yeah. I think that to your point, and I feel lucky that when I got on social media, I'd been so media trained from being like a kid actor that as far as I know, there's nothing over the last, you know, 14 years since I've been on social media or whatever it's been, but yeah,

I mean, maybe a poorly worded tweet will come back to haunt me. But this is, I guess, what gives me a little bit of a reprieve or reassurance is that I find people get canceled for two reasons. Either they do something that is so glaringly unacceptable that they deserve to go away forever, or they're paying an asshole tax.

That they've been awful for so long. They've treated people so poorly for such a long you know uh such a basically just a long period of time that they found something to get them that's a good point and i think there is some truth to that where you just realize that like maybe they you know they were kind of they rubbed enough of people the wrong way yeah they were they mistreated people for long enough where they finally got them. But I feel like, and I would imagine maybe you'd feel similarly if by being fallible and human, I eventually stick my foot in my mouth, which I probably will. It's possible. Well, then I find that your life becomes your defense because people

will do a forensics on your life the moment you screw up and they'll say has there been behavior that would substantiate this or make us believe that this is who he really is or this is the way he really thinks instead of he was human and said something stupid and apologize and if you're so then your life sort of becomes the thing that vouches for you. And I sleep well at night knowing that I don't lead a life that I'm ashamed of. And thus, if I do eventually screw up, which I'm sure I will in advance, I'm sorry, mom. I feel like hopefully I'll be forgiven because this was out of character for him. Kind of like taking it in the opposite direction of like, as opposed to people having to like dig through, for example,

like past social media to find these things. You also have people on the other side of the spectrum who are very outward in sharing these things. Like for example, Megan Fox on her own Instagram shared a screenshot of a text she had with her stylist where she asked, is this blue outfit expensive because we just cut a hole in the crotch so we could have sex with it? And so we're also in a time where we're seeing this very like exhibitionist, really out there behavior on social media. And I'm curious to what degree you think there's sort of like a cultural pressure or like a, just like the public is so

hungry for new attention grabbing stuff. Like, and to what degree you think it's just other people who want to present that for themselves? I think it would have been better if she was like, was this expensive? I just cut a hole in it because I have diarrhea. That would make me like making fun of someone. It's the other hole, Josh. It's the other way.

Well, you know, we don't know how people do that. You don't know that, Allie. So she cut it. Is that what happened she she cut something in the crotch area so she said cut a hole in the crotch so we could have sex and then included that like in a slide on her on her own Instagram grid of like photos of her in the jumpsuit oh so Megan outed herself it wasn't even like the stylist it was was not leaked. She outed it. She was like,

I want people to know we did this. They're very vocal with their sex life. We did it on the table, at the Airbnb. Like, they're constantly talking about it. Which I guess is good for them. I mean, you... Josh is a very private person.

He's told us this before. Yeah, I mean, I think I just don't know how sustainable that level of, like of intense lust and attraction is. Do you believe more in a slow burn, like a friendship foundation? I think, here's what I think it is. I think that there's no such thing as love at first sight. I think there's attachment at first sight. I think there's lust at first sight i think there's lust at first sight um but i think love

is is proven over time by someone who gets put in a position to be there for you and they prove themselves to be worthy because they don't recoil in those situations they step up and they're there for you i always say love is when you're um when you have food poisoning you're throwing up and that person doesn't judge you, they go get Gatorade, and they make you an urgent care appointment. Maybe a saltine. I don't know.

Beautiful said. So do we know if either of those people would, you know, yeah, that's your point. Maybe had she had diarrhea, and Machine Gun highly stepped up, we would feel stronger about their love rather than two hot people once again he'd be like a red gatorade a little bit of blood

their expensive clothing why i mean like like since you know since we're none of us are therapists or doctors should we psychoanalyze why megan fox decided to like what was this desire to like let the world know that they did that because they're getting i guess it just it's more attention they're so just like rock and roll blood drinking magic like i just you buy it i just feel like they throw it out there i feel like that's part of the allure is having people know i guess i mean at the end of the day they are celebrities who are aware uh and self-con and like they're aware how this all works right and they know it's going to be picked up and talked about as a married man where do you think

this this goes for them if they have a kid if they like become a family do they exchange blood with their children it seems very challenging to do it that much in the public eye and also just like like that's how you know money doesn't buy happiness with how much elon musk is in the conversation every day like if i had if i had you know what is it 200 billion dollars you better believe i would not be tweeting that much and but so i think there's, yeah, a lot of pressure from the outside world. And when you have kids, when you're married, I think it might, it, it, it has the possibility of eroding some of those, you know, things that are important

when you're worried about what the outside world is perceiving of you. Yeah. You have a new book coming out it's called even happy people are annoying happy people are happy people not even just happy people yeah how'd you come up with that um title i uh i used to i spent most of my life believing that happiness was reserved for a certain class of people the attractive attractive, the generationally wealthy, handsome dudes with Midwest accents. I just assumed that I was not, I was an overweight kid who never met his dad and was like, oh, happiness just ain't a thing for guys like me. And I sort of assumed throughout my life that everyone sort of received a manual at birth of how to navigate the world. And I just

didn't get that same manual. So my life and what I talk about in the book, it's sort of like views from the halfway point of like a guy at 35, how I was able to define happiness for myself and not think it was just reserved for that elite class. So we've been telling our audience that we're going to have you say something that you've never said before. Oh boy. Do you have anything for us? Oh man. Now I feel so much pressure to perform.

I know. I wanted to drop this bomb. I love men. If you could just read this. The earth is flat. I have a very niche question that would maybe what is um what is the most exciting and then also most embarrassing title of a playlist that you have oh that is niche I don't you know I don't I do have playlists but I don't get into I have one

playlist it's called my photo shoot playlist because when I've had to do photos. I love that. It's so bad. It's so good. I've done that before. You have to get in the right mindset because it's weird and vulnerable. You feel that because you and I, we're normal civilians. We're not professional, like pretty people.

I mean, we're both nice looking people. We are not Kendall Jenner. You're incredibly lovely looking, but like it's natural to feel a little uncomfortable. Yeah. You got to get your right hype music. What's your hype song? If you had one song. Yeah.

Can we, can you give us a little preview? Let's see. Let me, let me do a little investigation. Are you public on Spotify? I want to listen. I'm not. I'm too cheap to get a Spotify. I think my wife has one.

Okay. That's a new, that's the news. Josh Peck will not pay for Spotify. I'm trying to think of what. Okay. That's the news. Josh Peck will not pay for Spotify. I'm trying to think of what. Okay. So, it's something like two. I'm trying to think of what's my real hype. I got Frank Ocean, Lenny Kravitz on here.

It's not that cool. Rocky theme song. I do. I work out to the Rocky theme song sometimes. The guitar solo. Or Africa. Yeah. Phil Collins. By Toto? Rocky theme song. I work out to the Rocky theme song sometimes. Or Africa. Phil Collins. By Toto?

Wait, isn't it Africa? No, Toto. Wait, that's your hype song? Yeah, I freaking love Africa. That's your hype song? Yeah, that or the Rocky theme song. Wait, isn't Africa a song from the 80s? Yeah, it's like... That's not Phil Collins?

Yeah, it's Toto's not phil collins yeah that's yeah it's toto yeah who's toto i don't know like one that's a wonder like google them and it is so funny that they wrote a song called africa it's like they kind of look like kid rock to me i always thought it was phil collins we're we're breaking down i'm thinking of genesis Yeah. I love that you have a photo shoot playlist. It's rad, right? It makes you feel more confident and prettier. Yeah. I need something. I love that.

Josh, we do this thing called Office Hours. We thought you'd be great at it, and so we booked two. I'd love it. And let's get into it. Please. How's it going? Hi. Hi.

My name's Maggie, and I'm 24. How can we help Maggie? So I guess a little bit of backstory. I've been on three dates with this guy, which I haven't really gotten past the first date in a while since I've started dating again. The first and second dates were okay. Both flowed well, well enough for me to go on more dates. The third date

he offered to cook me dinner at his place. Um, and then, which was fine. Again, Convo flowed really well. Um, after dinner, we went to go watch TV. Um, we were going to watch friends and he sat on a different couch than me, which was a little weird, threw me off guard big time. So describe for us the, the living room situation. What's, what are the seating choices? Okay. So he had like two couches, one love seat, and then like a longer couch on different walls. But they like met like with an end table i think that's a

lot of couches for a single living yeah for like yes it was a lot of a lot of couches for i guess a smaller apartment in a big city so and you started sitting you started watching together yeah we were watching friends together well i like kind of sat in the middle of the bigger couch because I wasn't really sure like what was going on and then I like turned around and he was already sitting on the other couch and so then I was really thrown off and like kind of sat next to the armrest um of the couch I was already on And so then I was kind of like internally panicking, trying to decide what to do. Um, we said they're probably like two episodes. And then, um, I like got up to go to the bathroom, took my friends and came back. And then finally,

after like another episode, he moved over to my couch and then still nothing no moves no like like touch nothing um at this point you were kind of anticipating when you said yes to dinner and a movie or dinner and friends in your mind were you thinking there'll be some was there any kissing on date one or two we kissed on the second date okay like as we were saying goodbye but yeah i was expecting like a little makeout session or something make out at least okay yeah so then another episode goes by still nothing so then i'm like okay i've been here for like three hours i'm gonna leave um so i'm like getting ready to leave and then he kisses me like by the door as I'm leaving, like make out a little, like many,

you know, you made out at his door entry. Yes. As I was leaving. It sounds like a moment out of the bachelor. Yeah. Yeah. Did he walk you to your car?

No, I walked. So we live in like a bigger city where I can walk. So, yeah, no, I didn't walk you home. No, it didn't walk me home, which was fine. Sure. It's fine. But like, where'd you, I'm gonna carry, what were your expectations? What were your hopes? Not that. I mean, my expectations were to like make out on this date. I was really thrown off, you know, for like the last hour and a half of the date and was trying

to come up with excuses to leave so I mean whatever we did make out a little bit at the end but at that point I just really wanted to get out of there it was more of like this has to happen not necessarily like I want it to anymore so I don't know but so yes I get home and he's like oh that was such a great time and then you got home and he's like, oh, that was such a great time. And then. You got home and he sent you a, like, I had such a great time with you text. Yeah, a text. Which is really nice.

Yeah. Yes. I mean, I feel like not enough guys do that. True. Probably. A follow up. True, true, true. Yeah.

We could just be dealing with like a really considerate gentleman who might just be overly yeah yeah may i ask and this is to your credit maggie you seem to have like this wonderful chill relaxed energy about you do you is there any world where maybe even though you guys had kissed on the second date, that he was not 100% sure yet that you were like down the clown wanting to be more physical. Maybe. I mean, I don't know. Cause we did text for like, Oh, we were texting. We've been texting for like a month. So, and the texting is pretty flirty. So that's why I was like really thrown off in person to like our conversations in person are, we're fine, but like nothing flirty. So that's why I was like really thrown off in person too. Like our conversations in person are, we're fine, but like nothing flirty, but over texts, it, you know, it was more flirty. So then I at least assumed that he had some like experience and like make a move to

kiss me. Yeah. Have you talked about previous dating experiences? Like, do you know, maybe he's just like insecure with the physical stuff? Yeah, that's kind of what I'm thinking. We haven't talked about it at all. And I couldn't find any social media to do any looking around. How was dinner?

Dinner was really good. That's a good question. Yeah, really clean. What was the food? Yeah yeah give us a menu that's all i care about none of this romance what are we eating um it was like pasta and baked chicken um and some vegetables yeah that's really good would you ever consider doing like a fourth date with him and just kind of going balls to the wall and like you putting the like for example like if we were to reverse the clock would you have felt comfortable you went to the wall and like you putting the, like, for example, like if we were to reverse the clock, would you have felt comfortable? You went to the bathroom coming back and just sitting right

next to him, not going back to the couch. Like, are you comfortable putting the first foot forward? Yeah, I did think about doing that. Um, I think I like to think that I am, but when it comes to it, I like kind of freaked out a little, i don't know i don't know if i would my friends think that i should consider a fourth date but i am too like kind of weirded out about the whole separate couch situation reading this like you referred to him giving you the ick which i know obviously is a very popular uh feeling these days so just to summarize you had a couple of okay dates with this seemingly nice guy right like he's nice yeah and you were excited that he was nice because it sounds like up to this point you've had a a series of you know first dates that for whatever reason didn't move to a

second date and that obviously is always encouraging, at least in a, it's easy to get discouraged with dating. This was at least some excitement. And then he made you dinner and this whole sitting on another couch really threw you off. And then the kiss goodbye was kind of awkward and you wrote it perpetuated the ick times 10 and so now you're just you're kind of in your mind done with this situation he being the boy scout that he seems to be is all super excited wants to hang out again sounds like yeah he's asked me twice since he's asked you twice and now you're and you are curious about sending a text to shut her down. Yeah, pretty much. Okay, this must be asked, and you gave a hint of it

when you first introduced this story. You said when you were ready to date again, are you coming off a breakup? Not that reason. It's been like a year and a half, but I was in a five-year-long relationship before that. So I've been on a handful of first dates, but again, like, you know, using the term the egg again, I feel like I get that pretty quickly. So it takes a lot for me to want to even go on a second date with someone.

So that's kind of why I'm willing. Is there a chance? And if I'm totally wrong, Is there a chance? And if I'm totally wrong, please tell me. Is there a chance that maybe he's a little too nice, but nice, but maybe a little bit overly, you know, trying to do the right thing, read your mind? And is there also a chance that you're slightly protective of your feelings and yourself going into this thing that maybe you're playing your hand a little close and he's trying to read your mind so basically what's happening here is in an effort to what am i trying to say i know you're you're doing right okay i'm following okay you know what i'm saying like i find like these things everyone's got to put a little bit of skin in the game. Like for me, I've got to like, be willing to be shut down and like go in for the kiss and sit on the same couch and hope that, you know, I'm reading the tea leaves correctly. And conversely, I think it's, it's important that the other person in that scenario is at least giving me a bit of a clear sign of like, yes, please come in. Let's see how this goes. Is there a chance that maybe he wasn't getting the clearest of signs from you? Yeah,

possibly. Yeah. But also to be clear, it was this couch situation that really, it just kind of changed everything for you. Yeah. And up until like, so I'm curious if you could try to go back to your mind frame while you're eating pasta and chicken and it was like oh that's pretty good like what were you thinking about the potential of this relationship at dinner i would say i mean i'm not necessarily looking to be in another like relationship at this point i'm just trying to get to know people and go on you know second third fourth dates um so i think that's probably where i like i didn't see myself actually like dating this guy or like calling him my boyfriend like okay i probably wasn't interested enough in him for that at all but it was like the dates were fine enough to continue i want to challenge you

a little bit with like what is your goals for dating right now getting to know other people because i've only been in one like long relationship okay so and i and i don't really have an answer but like so because like once you start going on a third or fourth date i think for most people at that point there's an expectation of this could go somewhere. And that's where maybe you're just like, hey, I don't see it going somewhere. And I'm only challenging, you know, because you express some disappointment on trying to get to a second or third date. And I'm just wondering if your main goal

is to just kind of play the field, which, hey, good, go for it. Then just make sure you're not getting too disappointed when a first date doesn't work out because it sounds like you are accomplishing that goal of getting to know a lot of people a little bit because there is a balance between like where when do you expect let's assume you go on a date and everyone likes you when do you think is the appropriate time to like to like what are you looking for i mean it can't be just getting to know as many people as possible

i mean i i guess i would say like i'm i'm open to being in a relationship with someone who like excites me and like someone that i'm actually interested in okay yeah so you are open to being in a relationship it's just not this guy but you're in a tough situation right because and i i think that's probably pretty relatable i think we have to remember that the ick is not a non-negotiable. It's a pet peeve. And when it comes to dating, I think a lot of people treat the ick like a non-negotiable. Now, you shouldn't have to force yourself to go on dates with people you're not enjoying their company.

But I think there is definitely something to be said about, kind of like to Josh's point, is definitely something to be said about kind of like to josh's point like i think dating has changed than where it used to be expectations have changed with men and women and i think you know from a guy's point of view especially for guys who are actively listening to like what women are saying about you know the frustrations women are having in the dating scene and and they you know want to be thought of as respectful kings and all the in in and and and maybe they can get in their head about like to josh's point reading a situation a little bit differently you know and and wondering if it's like i don't know maybe maybe i maybe he's like thinking i want her to like sit by me and then he didn't like maybe i don't know it's stupid sure but he

was thinking I'll just sit here and maybe his way of seeing if you were into him would be like you would I don't know somehow like change couches in this like sea of couches in this living room and maybe he's like in his mind keeping a tally because I would I'd be like I invited her over I cooked now I'm like saying let's watch which is really like, we know we've all seen every episode. We're not really engaged in the content. That's definitely like, let's yeah. Where's her move?

You know, like I feel like I've made it pretty clear. I'm interested and I want to, I want to hang out. Yeah. I guess I just felt really off guard because it was his apartment. So I didn't really know like where he usually sits. And so I just kind of, you you know went for like the bigger couch um also i will note that like he got out coasters for our drinks but set them next to like the opposite couches so like his coaster was next to the armrest of the small couch and mine was next to the armrest of the big

couch i mean the fact there's a guy who uses coasters, I'm really impressed. Yeah. So that also threw me off, which is why I originally sat in the middle because then I was like, I'll just sit far away from my drink. I got to say that you trying to read the coasters sounds like you're pretty invested in this kid. Well, actually what it means to me

is that you are detail oriented and you pay attention to little things and that can be a good thing in life and it can be a bad thing in life. And when it comes to dating and knowing very little about someone and the complicated, but dating and all these kind of emotions and fears, I think you can do yourself a disservice by over reading little situations like that. I think you can do yourself a disservice by over-reading little situations like that. And someone like yourself, I think you're more prone to giving yourself the ick by over-interpreting something someone's doing or not doing. I offer this for the group think. Is there anything to be lost by having a fourth date with a little skin in the game, by putting it, not all out there, but with all little skin in the game by putting it not all out there but with

all this now in your mind like changing your strategy slightly because either he shows a side of himself that you're pleasantly surprised by or you learned so much through this process that'll better equip you for the next person that you date with yeah there's that also just to add on what if you know again i'm sure you're very busy and i don't want we don't want to suggest that you have time to waste but if you had like a free wednesday coming up like and you went on a fourth date what if you just like brought this up you know like is it is it that crazy to just say hey can i ask you something i was a little thrown off i mean especially since it's a guy that you're not even overly excited about you're you you called in hope asking for like how can we text this guy see you later and maybe there's some like fact finding to find out you

know because it might be an opportunity to figure out like were you reading him right he might have been like you know i'll be honest i was like i've been talking to my friends about like i thought it was kind of weird that you did x y or z i don't i don't know right and and since you're on this journey of learning more about people and i'm I'm holding you accountable for what you said, I mean, I know you want to, but this could be a way to kind of learn about how people are approaching different things and situations because a lot of your getting the ick is how you read a situation. And we don't know if we read it right or if we read it wrong. situation and we don't know if we read it right or if we read it wrong you might get a lot of information about like reading a situation and to josh's point whether it's for this guy or future dates uh i feel like it might help you out because i'd be willing to bet that the way you read it as someone who's nitpicking every like thing you i don't think you got it all right i don't know if

you got it all wrong but i bet you thought one thing and you might find out something else. And that, and just knowing that might serve you well, you know, as opposed to like, you know, and I know, I'm, I know I'm an overthinker. I pay attention to little things. And once you get an idea, like wrapped in your head, it just kind of mutates and turns into this thing where it's like yeah i know this is a situation and we can be very off in those in those moments so and i think it's fascinating you haven't really said a negative thing about him you've only referenced the feeling that you got from what seems like a miscommunication like and there's some very clear like if he was like yeah i'm a flat earther then maybe you would have just been like i i don't i can't have kids with a flat

earther like it would have just been very clearly but it seems like the reason why you're wrestling on even had a best word the exit text is because you're you you can honor at least that this guy in many ways checked a couple boxes but it seems like he was kind of a dunce in other areas he's also excited about you yeah well we all have to end things at some point all right so how let's answer your question that you came to ask for like if and when you decide to end it how do you do that I think we all agree that like a fourth date wouldn't be the worst idea. Like I think it's going to help you like just change your pattern, help you get out of your comfort zone, like try new things out. You know, like I do think we have to in dating situations, just like try something different, you know?

And to Josh's point, like there're, there's no reason not to, other than like, you don't want to waste your time and your time is valuable. I get that, but you might learn something. And, and it's such a fine line between getting excited about someone and having someone be excited about you that this guy could, you know, there was a moment, why I asked you about how you felt about dinner is like, I was wondering like when it really changed and, and up into this point, it doesn't sound like you were ever that excited about him. It was just kind of, okay. Yeah. Is that definitely true? Or have you rewritten how you feel about the first two dates no i mean in person yes i would say the

dates were like okay um like we texted a little bit before we went on the first date which made me like excited nervous for the first date and then it was it was like okay so then i was like okay i'll go on a second and then no a third so yes the dates like nothing overly exciting but conversation flowed the whole time. Every time. So is there a world like when I said, you don't seem too thrilled about the idea of going on a date just to ask him about third date. I mean,

I'm not opposed to it. I, my friends have been telling me to do that. So, and don't you think it just, I feel like I just got so weirded out and like, it just, the thought of seeing him again, I was really opposed.

But it's been over a week now, so maybe. But I think it's a trap too when people, and rightfully so, no one wants to waste their time. And especially if you're in the dating game and you want to potentially have a long-term relationship with someone you certainly don't want to waste time but i don't think there's wasting time with someone who has proven themselves on some level to be a value and what will be revealed whether you end up with them or not will better equip you for your next relationship like obviously you shouldn't waste time with fuck boys who make it very clear that they have like no interest in something that's like serious but i also think that's a trap people fall into too of like i you know if by the third date we haven't picked out baby names i'm out like because it's not that's not how it works yeah right if you wanted to end it now like could you send a text yes you could just and it would be and it's going to be awkward

and cringe because like and it's going to go some version of like hey sorry i've been you can make up some sort of lie busy you know because you know the truth is a little unnecessary sorry i've been avoiding you um and you just say i really enjoy my time with you i just don't see it going further Like you're the greatest person in the world. I hope, you know, whatever. It's that, right? And you do that so he doesn't call you a ghoster, right? And that would be the right thing to do. If you don't want to go on a date, you could FaceTime him.

You can jump on the phone. You could just have that conversation, not on a date. You could be like, you'd call him like hey you could just say hey sorry i've been busy are you free to chat tonight at some point you get on a facetime and just be like i'm just going to be honest with you i was a little thrown off by our last date which is why i just haven't responded because i wasn't really sure what to make of it can i ask you and you know is that conversation going to be awkward sure a little bit i don't know maybe not i mean people I mean, he could just easily be like, I don't know. I was just kind of read it. Just, I was getting a sense that maybe you didn't want to, and I didn't know what

to do. And again, it's nowadays, like, again, for guys who are out there listening to what women are saying about their frustrations and dating, they're, they're proceeding with more caution because they don't want to make assumptions they don't want to you know have an awkward moment and like I'd rather agree with me too Josh I would rather have a girl if I was dating still I'd rather

have her tell her friends I gave her the ick than say I was creepy or weirdly aggressive or not respectful I'll take ick all day long. You know? And so I'm just saying it's like a possibility and just, you might learn something and, you know, and he might learn something too.

You would be doing him a favor by at least like giving him some feedback on what threw you off. And all it is, is maybe a slightly awkward conversation that I feel like you're more than capable of having and i think it will give you a it'll help you in in the future for sure and the good news is you'll never have by putting some skin in the game maybe by chance you get a great turnout which is that all of a sudden he mans up and you're like wow you you are pretty great or what the byproduct of that'll be you'll have no regrets and you'll never wonder.

Cause you'll be like, I did my due diligence. It was clear. I allowed myself to be slightly vulnerable and awkward. And the result was, I don't ever have to wonder in five years what happened. Let's call him Greg. Sounds like a Greg.

And like, no matter what his answer is, you can still decide not to like go out with him again. I remember at 18, after I lost 120 pounds, and I went on my first proper date with a girl. I don't even think it was a date, but we had spent a little time together. And I asked permission to kiss her. And she said, wow, you really made it awkward. And I made a mental note that I will never say that again.

And so it triggered in my mind, oh, the guy has to be the one to make the move. And that's not necessarily the healthiest idea either. And so. Yeah, because not everyone might agree with that point either. Absolutely. Right. So, you know, so I mean, you talk to certain people, especially when it comes to consent and there's no like never assume.

Exactly. You know, so it's very tricky out there, no like never assume exactly you know so it's it's very tricky out there which is kind of my whole point bringing on it's just like i you know we i think we have to try to be gracious to people who are out there dating and try to give them a benefit of the doubt and and just remember that x aren't non-negotiables. They, they, and, and you have the right to walk away. You owe this guy absolutely nothing, but you can give someone an egg and still want to marry them someday. For sure. It's possible out there. We can turn people off. We've always, all of us have not been our best selves. And also like why I think you should like, don't burn a bridge, you know, too, because it is the first guy who you wanted to go on a third date with.

Yeah. And I'll probably see him around too. You definitely have a potential awkward conversation coming up, but I think you are capable of having that conversation. And if you wanted to send a text, no judgment and just, yeah, short and sweet. Just be like, Hey like hey just not and my only advice to that is don't don't lie don't give them false hope don't yeah just just tell me you don't like them it's fine it might sting a little bit i know but like people you know on the other end it's always like yeah maybe you know it's like that's why i think people should just be honest because like that they can get that closure they can move on they can just you know not worry people will have a way of saying things that they want to soften

the blow but they give that excited person some false hope but you can be gentle yeah i don't think she should be a jerk right but i just think you should be honest are you physically attracted to him not really i should have started with that. Okay. Which is why it was, you know, conversation was good. And I was trying,

you know, thinking maybe something would build, but, and then, you know, the kissing wasn't great. So I was like, okay, yeah.

Yeah. That would have made this much shorter. I'm still glad we, we, we had this conversation but i i still stand by all of it but yeah you just i think you're just not into him yeah but but you were and yeah let me it's hard to answer this question but if you if he was if you were fit if you thought he was like super hot how do you think you would have interpreted the couch situation i probably still would have thought it was really weird um but i might have been more willing to like try to make a move myself

okay like i probably would have been more willing to come out of the bathroom and like sit next to him um but at that point i don't know i don't know if anyone will agree with me but i definitely think getting more information can't hurt anyone and it might if nothing else consider you're doing him a favor right because that i it does the way you described it sounded pretty weird and i think most women would probably get the same feeling you got. Maybe you just give him a note in the future. He might hate you.

He'll never say that. He'll never appreciate it. But I think you'll be helping him out. That's fine. All right. All right. All right. Thanks a lot.

All right. Take care. Bye. How's it going? Hi, I'm Grace and I'm 22. How can we help, Grace? So I would love your help with sending a first text message to someone. So just to give a little bit of background to you.

So I moved away from my hometown to go to college and then moved again to a different city after graduating. But I go visit my parents in my hometown a lot. And one of the last times I was there, I was visiting my mom playing pickleball, one of her favorite hobbies and her pickleball coach. Um, I have a crush on him and I kind of like spent the weekend with him. My mom's pickleball coach, but he's, he's much more like my age than my mom's age, just for clarification. Um, much more like my age than my mom's age, just for clarification. Um, but, um, so, um, I didn't spend the weekend with like just him. Obviously my mom was very much there too, playing pickleball. Um, but I don't really know him that well. I'll just kind of have a crush on him. Didn't see him since that, but we kind of did like a mutual social media following. And, um, I really just

want to like reach out to him and I'm not sure whether I should kind of send just a conversational text or if I should kind of like try to plan a date for the next time that I'm home. So kind of wondering how far I should go with that initial text. Does your mom know of your interests? Oh, yeah. My mom knows. What's your mom's read on this guy? Oh, I think she thinks he's a great guy.

She likes him a lot. Like all of her friends are a big fan of him. I too have a pickleball coach. I haven't gone and seen him in a while. guy um she likes him a lot like all of her all of her friends are a big fan of him um so i too have a pickleball coach uh i haven't gone seen him in a while but he works with a lot of the women at the country club he works with the guys i mean he's he works with everyone but a lot of his clients are are women all of which i think are trying to like set them up and, and, and that type of situation too, you know, and I'm wondering is like, is that the vibe is your, is like, are other people trying to set them up? Is it, is it like, are everyone, is everyone having fun with this pickleball coach

in terms of like, you don't know? I don't get the sense that that's the case. No. And I do know for a fact that he's single. So I know, you know you know i don't know i guess i don't know if other people are trying to set him up but um i don't necessarily think that's the vibe and how's your mom's pickleball game getting better is he a good coach oh just amazing yeah i mean i would say he's a good coach for sure she's stay out of the kitchen yeah yeah yeah i'm she's the better pickleballer than me so pickleball talk for anyone who does uh i will yeah yeah i'm not very good me either um stay in the kitchen yeah for sure i always get into the kitchen i talk you do if i'm him just a heads up like who knows how professional this guy is or isn't but i would have serious hesitation about dating the daughter of a client.

Yeah. Because you really, like, who knows how it goes. Like, I would just, I would, you know, I always, I worry about things and I look for the holes in things. I worry about things and I look for the holes in things. So it would just be one of those situations where you're talking about a very gossipy atmosphere potentially. You know, does he want to be a part of potential gossip? You know,

even if it goes really well, it's all of a sudden his dating life and personal life is all over the country club or, or wherever it is he's coaching so that's just uh that's just a like uh i'm just that's a possibility and something to consider and if nothing else if it doesn't go the way you i still think you should shoot your shot but i'm just saying if nothing else that'll be a way to tell yourself you know what it's not me he just it'll be a it'll help your ego in case it doesn't go the way you want right uh how how do you write this text

have you met him oh yeah what's your rapport with this guy i i mean like um i know him in a pickleball context for sure but he's like he's a guy. He's really easy to talk to. He's really nice. Like very genuine. You have his number. You have his number. Yeah. And may I ask as a 22 year old, lovely, you know, sparkly person, how open are you to some version of a fling? Like some version of an experience that this might just be like a fun couple of weeks and a little secret you two have the thing is i honestly could see it just being

like a one and done date kind of thing since he like i don't live in this town he's in my hometown and i'm not there so i'm like it could just be kind of like a one date and nothing goes anywhere you can use that to your advantage yeah Yeah. I know exactly. And when do you leave town? Um, I'm so I'm not there right now, but I'm going to be back next month for about like a week and a half. Okay. Perfect. Perfect. You're only there for a week and a half. So you shoot him a message and you're like, Hey, I want to be in town, blah, blah, blah. Looking for things to do. I was wondering if you would show me around or something, right? And that way, it takes a little bit of pressure.

It's some version of that, right? Right. Yeah. And you could call it a day. Or you could play a little coy. Or you could call it a day. But you're just like, I'm going to be in town. I don't want to say you don't have much to do.

And I also don't really need him to show me around because it is my home. No, I know. But like, it's still, I want you to be able to take advantage of the fact that like you're there for a temporary period of time. Right. And you're not super available. And that might take the pressure off of him right so i feel like you want to use the fact that you are coming into town

but can't she say like i'll have a night or two free if you want to grab a drink let me know yeah she could i'm just trying to think if there's like a clever way of doing this i don't have it yet any ideas how to be casual yet specific you know what I mean yeah I don't think we should be coy sometimes it's hard

like throwing out a couple nights I mean you've pressured me not pressured that sounds wrong you've encouraged me coerced you've encouraged me

before this is why we don't hang out there you've encouraged me before to be more specific and like demand more of a plan but this is kind of a different

this is a little different you want to be casual chill oh it's a fine line I definitely think you want to put yourself out there but I feel like we

is there like a divey bar that has like any either like pool or darts or something where you can be like I want to see if like your skills at blah blah blah

or anything like shuffleboard blues ball is there like off the court he plays pickleball this guy likes to compete yeah yeah to see if like your skills at blah blah blah or anything like that. Shuffleboard. Boozeball. Off the court. He plays pickleball. This guy likes to compete. Yeah.

Yeah. Or like even like an arcade. What about like Dave and Buster's? Go to an arcade. Maybe a Shakey's. It's very much a small town in the Midwest. So I'm not like we do not even have Dave and Buster's there. But I'm sure there's like something similar. Like, you know, you know yeah with dark cool or like literally any like small little game and then you send like a flirty

little competitive text that's like or is there a mini golf what about active oh yeah because he's an active guy like is there a hike no is that bad and that's fine no i like here i was thinking mini golf it doesn't matter really what it is right mini golf darts i don't fucking care and you could send them a text that says i've been really working on my mini golf game and i i want to like test out my skills yeah uh are you down for a friendly competition and then you know and then it depends how brave you want to be like maybe and if it goes well winner gets a makeout or something i don't fucking know that could be too much too much too much you can you can how about like if the first game goes well then you can like up the ante and be like want to do a bet but i feel like in a text that's a lot i don't know your you said he's a funny guy who likes to joke around yeah i mean

sometimes it just it's a fine line it really is it i think that's better to be said in person yeah you could do that yeah once you suss out the vibes um i have written on a second date text like hey do you want to make out i mean hang out with asterisk not bad not it's good that's good that's what i'm saying it's something like that thank you josh it's a little you know sense of humor yeah you do my point of saying that is you do want to make sure he knows it's a date right we're both like so yeah like how do we ask him out without saying do you want to go on a date without him knowing in the back of mind it's still a date but also like take the pressure off him of like going out with his client's

daughter. I couldn't, she just combined like something like you said of, you know, I want to see if you're like combining Amanda's and Nick's of like, I want to see if you're such and such game is as strong as your pickleball. But like, you can put a smiley face or a winky face on the end of it.

Yeah. No, no. You just said, how do we imply it's a date but i don't know if a wink is this like okay i think no i think first text is like do you have the venue in mind like do you have like the whatever game place yes i've got a mini golf perfect all right okay perfect so you'd be like hey like i'm gonna be

back in town and so and so like with like do you want to do you want to like play a game or like around a mini golf? Like we can see if you're whatever, whatever is good as like, I'm dying to know if your mini golf games as good as your, and then you can do a followup text. If you're really trying to be flirty, you can be like, yeah,

I can't wait to test out that hand-eye coordination. And then it's vaguely sexual. There's no about ideas and brainstorming people. That's great. It depends on how bold you want to go yeah i would not go that sexual but that's just me i i like how many strokes i think it's good for a follow-up right you're not you're i know i think that's good for a follow-up you said yeah if he ask about the mini golf if he's really into it then you could make a little like yeah yeah not rah. Yeah. Not all in one.

I like that. Split it up. All right, let's draft it. All right. And here's the thing. I don't think I can send it right now. Cause I think I need to wait until like a little closer to when I'm going

to be back. I don't want to say like, Hey, I'm going to be home in a month. So I'll be there around Labor Day. It'll be like, it'll be like the second. Yeah.

I'll be there. Getting my year lined up. I'll be there it'll be like the second yeah i'll be getting my year lined up i'll be there um like the second week of june so okay yeah you have some time yeah you want to do this like a week ahead of time yeah a week to two weeks throwing it out there the only reason to send it a little earlier is it's an opportunity to see how interested it is in building like a ongoing text rapport so that like really warm things up for mini golf. But I don't think you have too long to build. I think you can still get the builds in like a few weeks, you know, two weeks might be the ideal two weeks.

Set a reminder on your phone. Send this text. Okay. Started with, Hey boo no hey boo hello lover my mom hey pickle baller pickle big baller no we're kidding does he already know that you're coming back at this time because like i would start it with maybe be like hey like just booked like no she doesn't know he doesn't know wait does he... So he already has your number. Did I miss that? Yeah, why does he have your number? Oh, he doesn't have my number.

I have his number. It's because of like the whole... It's very much the pickleball thing. Like if I wanted to schedule... You follow each other on Instagram? Training with him? Yes. I think you should DM this.

Agreed. Okay. Oh, yeah. So it's like a mutual... We're getting in deep here. He's already said yes to this form of communication. And then you texting him would be like, hey by the way i have your number yeah you don't have to explain why you have his number i would almost say that a way in is over the next week or so when you see an instagram story you think is appropriate you write something because you

follow each other you write so crazy or wow you really helped her stroke and or i love your sock height and then from there if he replies and you go funny that we're chatting i'm gonna be in town in a week or so is he viewing your stories yeah yeah yeah nice i definitely like definitely like sneak some thirst traps in there a little bit you know yeah i was gonna say you gotta have like a story up when you send the dm that you feel like good about that you feel powerful in okay that's a really good point yeah i would say like hey matt hey uh no and i think it's gonna be like i'm dying to know if your mini golf game is as good as your pickleball game okay I'll be

in town I think we should get together okay I like that I like that I'm setting a reminder and then I love he responds and then he responds hopefully yes and then uh and then you say great because I'm dying

to know if your hand and eye coordination is I'm'm dying to know if your hand and eye coordination is... What did you say? I'm just dying to see your hand-eye coordination. You want to put your hand-eye coordination to the test. Perfect. Or, and if you win, I can put the seat back in my Toyota RAV4 and we can see what happens. No, I'm kidding.

Asterisk. And if he says no, I can never play pickleball again. Is that too much? That's not that much of a loss. Right? I mean, if I'm him and he says no for whatever reason,

I 100% use the client relationship excuse. Oh, see, then you're fine. Then you go back to pickleball everything as well. And I'm just like, I'm just like, hey, you're great. But like, I don't like, I just have hey you're great but like i don't like i just have this policy which also he might have yeah i think the second text is like is watch

out you're not the only one with good hand-eye coordination oh there you go oh yeah because then that's like putting it on you it's also like he's competitive yeah i love it thank you so much great let us know I will and I just want to say my best friend and I are huge fans of the show and we're rooting for you to get Harry Styles on same Josh Peck is

a close second thank you so much obviously we appreciate it thank you as well Maggie you yeah um well we appreciate it uh tell your best friend thank you as well you have to tell us how this goes please send us an update i will send us that update okay yay thank you so much bye bye well josh success what a great two callers like yeah one a little serious one fun and yeah playful and we try to mix it up

uh you're a delight to talk to thank you so much for having me this was great we really enjoyed it if you are ever in the area and you want to come back

for questions with Nick our other show we would love to have you back I'm on I'm in we think you'd be very good thank you please let my audience know

where they can follow you find you all the upcoming things your podcast promote it all. My podcast is called Male Models for obvious reasons. I know you get it. And

I have a new book out called Happy People Are Annoying, which you can find anywhere you find books. Happy people are annoying. A little bit. You want to come back? I want to be in the crew. Yeah. We are a crew, Josh. it's already a thing thanks for coming josh we really appreciate it thank you guys have a great week everybody

hey guys thanks for watching. But before you go, make sure you like, subscribe, and ring that bell so you don't miss any future videos like our Monday's Ask Nick for your favorite relationship stories and advice and our Tuesday Bachelor Recaps. See you next time.