The Viall Files - E453 Going Deeper with Hayley Orrantia - Emily Ratajkowski Cheating Scandal & Drake Airdrop Controversy

Episode Date: July 27, 2022

Welcome back to The Viall Files, Going Deeper edition! Today we are joined by Actress and  Musician Hayley Orrantia. You’ll recognize her from The Goldbergs! On this episode we dive deep with our guest talking about what it’s like to be on one show for almost a decade, how the LA karaoke scene is like nothing else, and how relationships that ended poorly aren’t a waste of time. We then talk about how Hayley and her fiancé bonded over dating sociopaths, how forcing yourself to deal with heartbreak is better than ignoring it, and continuing to learn about the person you’re dating even after the honeymoon phase ends. We also cover the Emily Ratajkowski cheating scandal and dive in to present the narrative of why people cheat and why the person cheated on should never feel at fault. We also talk about the Rejection Challenge, why exposing yourself to “no” can make you a more dynamic person, and the controversy with Drake airdropping a picture he took of a woman to her. We then welcome on two Texting Office Hours callers! Our first caller wonders what to do after being ghosted after an amazing first date. She asks how to cut through the noise and learn that this “perfect guy” may actually be a f*ckboy hiding in plain sight. Our next caller wants help in drafting a text to respond to a guy she feels treated her poorly by constantly not making her a priority. Now she has to learn that she shouldn’t be focusing on making a guy from her past feel bad when she’s already happy in a relationship.  “He’s not even pretending to be a f*ckboy!” Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] to be a part of our Monday episodes.  If you would like to get some advice on Office Hours send an email to [e-mail] with “Office Hours” in the subject line!  Be sure to check out my sports radio show Fandemonium, Wednesdays @ 3PT / 6 ET  on Amazon's Amp app.  Click the link to download Amp using my code NICKVIALL https://apps.apple.com/us/app/amp-host-live-radio-shows/id1586403838 Pre-Order Nick’s Book: https://www.abramsbooks.com/product/dont-text-your-ex-happy-birthday_9781419755491/ Check out our new "Introvert" merch at http://www.viallfiles.com today! THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: BetterHelp: Our listeners get 10% off their first month at http://www.BetterHelp.com/VIALLFILES. Brooklinen: Go to http://www.Brooklinen.com and use promo code VIALL to get $20 off your purchase of $100 or more and free shipping. Chime: Get started with Chime today. Applying for a free account takes less than 2 minutes. Get started at http://www.Chime.com/viall Episode Socials:  @viallfiles @nickviall @hayleyorrantia See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

what's going on everybody welcome back to another dare i say amazing episode of the vile files going deeper edition i am your host Nick, joined by Allie and Amanda. I looked at you when I said Allie and I looked at you when I said Amanda. You always do. I'm dyslexic in everything. Everything I do is backwards. He's like, I've never once looked at the right spot at the right time.

That wouldn't be, like, I'd take that criticism. Yeah. You know, it's fine. Wait, were you in the, when you were taking tests as a kid, were you in the, when you were taking tests as a kid, were you in like the extended time special room? I wish.

I was. No, my, I think I was just smart enough to not. It's not an intelligence thing. It's a processing thing. It's true.

That's what I'm saying. But like, I got to go to a different room, I think for like math in high school. It's just I needed more time. I never got more time. It's too bad. I also liked the calming environment. school. It's just I needed more time. I never got more time. It's too bad.

I also liked the calming environment. Yeah. There's also a sense of camaraderie with like all the other. I'm just sitting there with all the other neurotypical kids like, hey guys, see you next exam season. It was a different generation. It wasn't cool back then to be different. Yeah.

Or it probably also like wasn't the accessibility to like testing to get these kinds of accommodations. I feel like it was probably a lot less available, like a huge privilege to even have access to that. Were you talking like standardized tests? Yeah. Any type of test. I always definitely had to like, it's like anything else.

You almost had to warm up mentally, and then you almost found a groove to start. Our high school literally had a woman who that was her full-time thing for normal tests. You could go chill with her. Well well we have a great episode for you hayley arentia from the goldbergs is with us she is lovely she's great i really loved her insights on everything uh also multi-talented music musically what do they call those multi-hyphenate yeah singer songwriter i uh i that's what it said in her.

I didn't know how to pronounce it, pronunciate that word. Hyphenate? I just skipped over it. Thank you. Nick, every time that we have an ad for something with ingredients and he's like,

and it's good for you. Yeah, it's like if it's more than three syllables, it's like I may or may not. I might back down. Yeah, Haley is wonderful. We have a great week lined up for you next week. Obviously, our Ask Nick. So they ask Nickies out there.

I love that. Great episode. Elizabeth Wagmeister from Variety Magazine. You know we love her. She's been on a few times. Help us break down The Bachelorette. She'll be with us to help us break down episode four. And then going deeper, big week, next week, Holly Madison.

Whoop, whoop. Formerly of the, what was the show? Girls Next Door. Girls Next Door. Recently documentary, a bit of a salacious behind the scenes of the Playboy house. Mansion. Playboy Mansion. Playboy Mansion. documentary a bit of a salacious behind the scenes of the playboy house not mansion playboy mansion playboy mansion the not so glamorous glamorous life of the girls next door but uh love holly can't wait to have her on as we learn about her a little bit more and i'm sure we'll talk about a lot of fun stuff so be sure to check that out always Always appreciate your reviews. Well, that's not true. We always

appreciate your five star. Your good reviews. Your good reviews. So if you feel like taking the time to do that on Apple iTunes or Spotify, we appreciate. And if not, more importantly, as always, thank you for listening. Oh, and also sports fans out there, NFL training camp has started and we will be diving into all things nfl so join me and my co-host lindsey mccormick for a fandomonium which is uh live 6 p.m eastern on the amp app uh you have to have an iphone at least right now to do it so check us out uh download the app. And we'll be talking all things NFL today, 6 p.m. Eastern.

Love for you to join us. Anything, ladies, you want to add before we get to Haley? I feel like we should just jump to Haley. Let's get to Haley. Let's get to Haley.

Haley, welcome. Thanks. Thanks for having me. How are you? Good. Good. This is fun. Just crushing life.

You know, staying busy staying busy your bio talks about you being multi-talented oh is that in there it is well i'm glad no you are singer singer songwriter as well i mean you've been a very successful working actor for the better part of going on a decade now yeah that's wild on wild. On the Goldbergs? Yeah. How does that feel, being so successful? You know, I'm tired. No, it's so much fun. I feel very lucky because when you do a show, you don't ever imagine it going 10 years,

as fun as it would be in your brain. It's like, there's no way. Yeah, you always hear, because I have a lot of friends in the acting space, I've dabbled in it as well, especially when the show, you get a show, then you get pilot season, it's going to get picked up,

and if anyone gets picked up, and then you get casted for the pilot, but then there's so many phases in so many ways that it won't turn into what the Goldbergs has turned into. It must be such an incredible feeling. It's wild. I have pinch me moments all the time where I'm like, when we're saying,

oh, we're going on a decade. I can't even really like grasp that that much time has gone by in my mind, but we're just so lucky because we like genuinely have a good time on set. I feel so cliche to be like, oh, we're like family. But I mean, it's like that.

Actually, I can testify to this because my first ever time in LA, it was part of like a grant I won through school. So they like flew me out to meet with Northwestern alumni and the showrunner, Alex Barno, went to Northwestern. And so I got to like sit in on the writers room, sit in on set. And everywhere there was so much like camaraderie and really good energy. And it just seemed like people doing their jobs and genuinely like getting along with one another. It's crazy how like and I've only really done this show.

So it's hard for me to say I've only really done this show. So it's hard for me to say I'm going to going off of this experience. But people who come in as guest stars, they constantly say like, this is a unique vibe of like the crew, the cast, like everyone together is really like having fun and just enjoying being there. And they I guess that's rare, or at least they make it sound that way. So it's so fun to be able to like have people come on and say that it's been a good experience because we feel that every day. We just love being there. That's great.

And then now you have new music coming out? Yeah, so I've just been like songwriting a ton by myself, which has been really therapeutic and really nice. And I'm trying to release some new music. I've got a song coming out August 12th called Gasoline and then just kind of going to phase out some new songs and an EP. What was more of a passion, acting or singing?

Always music. Always music. I started singing and I guess songwriting at a very young age. And then long story short, I kind of ended up falling into acting because labels were like, hey, you should get a TV show and do the Hannah Montana thing. Fallen acting and just become super successful. So just like audition. No, it was a few years.

Did you notice when I moved to LA, have you guys ever done karaoke in LA? Oh. Wild experience. My God. Nothing like it. It's nothing like it. Truly nothing.

Because there's all these very talented people who a lot of them you might know as actors or whatever. And then they go up there and you're just like, oh my God, they're awesome. Heck, everyone is amazing. I've been to so many karaoke's where people go up and you're just like, that was the most beautiful voice I've ever heard in my life. And it's not just the voice, it's the stage presence. They perform.

It is professional level. That karaoke night, I am that person though where I'm like, I will be like, it is like professional level karaoke night i i am that person though where i'm like i will be like it is time for karaoke i beg every rap party when i have a couple drinks and i like go up to cast and crew and i'm like hey are we going to the karaoke place now and they're like no one's going i'm like no but we need to go we're going to karaoke because in la especially if we're focused on acting like i need to get on stage and like just you know it's fun yeah you forget that there's a lot of talented singers out there who have made a name for themselves as actors.

And then all of a sudden you, you, you get a microphone in front of them and you're just like, I'm so beautiful. It's so fun. What are your go-to karaoke songs? Oh my God. Okay.

Weird choices maybe, but I really love miseryery Business, Paramore. Okay. I love... I'm not familiar with that song. Can you give us a hint? You're joking. Well, maybe if you sang it.

No. I don't know. I was like, no, you live under a rock. I don't know the song by the title that you just gave me. Misery Business? I'm in the business of misery. I'll take you from the top. That one?

I'm just stupid when it comes to music. I actually don't know it either. Neither do I. No, this is real life. You know what? Paramore? Like Hayley Willard? Paramore.

I'm familiar with Paramore. Yeah. It's not that if I die young. No! Oh, my soul. Oh, my God. Amanda. We're going to get absolutely flamed.amed wow i'm sorry i i do live under a rock no it's references i really do that's musically i'm stupid okay i don't i don't know credit it

to that three words to any song like i'm definitely a top 40s guy okay i was always the guy being like hey guys have you heard this song people are like it's been out for a year and I'm like oh my bad found it on TikTok yeah that's me that's my thing no

Misery Business is an amazing song I don't know you guys have to go and listen to it now but I also love like you know I want to dance

with somebody Whitney Houston is like by far my favorite song I do know that song or Super Bass Nicki Minaj did a little rapping.

Yes. I like to break it up. All right. And I see you have a beautiful engagement ring. I do. So crushing life personally as well. Working on it. Sometimes, you know, it's always one or the other.

Personal or professional. Don't get me wrong. It was pretty tragic leading up to meeting my fiance. Tell us more. I mean, I wrote a whole EP about it, so you can always go listen to it. How would you take care of your car if you had to keep the same one your entire life? Great question. Maintenance over time.

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For those listening in New York, you can see and feel the comfort in real life. That's right. They have a store in Williamsburg, Brooklyn. I always run by when I'm in Brooklyn. West Village as well. If you're an LA based, they have a wonderful little location in Santa Monica. Check it out. I've been there. It's wonderful. How much of your failures in your personal life and relationships, now that you're in this seemingly wonderful engagement, as you reflect back, a common thing that a lot of people will say in relationships that recently ended, maybe you've said this to yourself before with a relationship that ended. That was a waste. You know, oh, I can't believe that ended. I invested so much in that relationship. What a waste. I feel like, or when you're going through or considering maybe like this relationship is

right for me, you're just like, well, I don't want to waste what we had. But now that you're in this relationship, how much when you reflect back, would you attribute your ability to have a connection with your current partner, like lessons you've learned from past relationships? to view it that way as well, where I feel like you get into a relationship and even if you convince yourself fully that this is like my person forever, that, you know, you take something away from every relationship, no matter how amazing it actually was or how horrible it was. There's always something that you can carry with you of, oh, I've learned that about either what I like in another person or what I'm able to navigate and live with. And you sort of carry that into your next relationship because that's the only way that you're really going to be able to find the person that's meant for you is by all of those mistakes.

And so I don't know, but I've had a lot of lessons in my dating experience. I feel like that I've taken away in a good way and a bad way. A major one that I think led me into my now relationship was we both bonded over having dated like full-blown sociopaths and I know a lot of people say that as like well they're crazy but legit sometimes they are and so I think our what made you realize that what gave you the confidence to identify them as a sociopath well when cops get involved I think it's another level i have a whole like thing i've put out in the past about it but i it's a long story but ultimately you end up finding out that this person isn't at all who they say they are and my experience isn't unique because like second family

no it was i was sort of like preyed upon because of i think what i do for a living and kind of viewed as like a, a wallet of sorts. And so having a lot of things happen behind the scenes that you don't know about just because they're kind of, it was just used and a lot of betrayal. And so I think that through that growing and learning of having something that like traumatic and jolting happened to me, I feel like I was able to relate to my now fiance because we both oddly experienced something like

that. And being able to have somebody to actually have the perspective of, oh, I've been there and I know your lack of trust issues and where they come from, rather than being like, oh, I understand, like I get it. I'll try to work through it with you. Other than having, which is important and nice, having a partner that can relate to you, having which is important and nice having a partner that can relate to you how are you able to not let the tragedy of this past relationship and the lack of trust that you realize that you didn't have because again that that happened that's relatable too i mean maybe they're not a psychopath but like you know betrayal can really potentially affect our ability or our choice to trust. Like, how are you able to not let that affect you going forward?

Especially before you even met your current partner, you must have had to try to... I think in a way I tried to like... It was such a shock to the system that in a way I immediately did the opposite of what I probably should have done which I should have like avoided everyone and in a way I think I worked through that phase as well where you kind of phase people out because you're like okay I don't trust anyone anymore like how do I build that back up but my initial gut instinct was jump into the next thing immediately

and act like that not act like it didn't happen but almost like I couldn't register what it was that just happened to me because it goes so much deeper than just like oh we cheated but in that it's unique but I would say betrayal in general I kind of just did the opposite out of like okay this is what I know like just get into like a relationship again and then eventually I got to the point where I realized no I have to work through some of this stuff and actually figure out like what I'm to blame for with myself and really what I can blame this other person on and claim that as a unique situation and move on. Because like not everyone's a sociopath. Like just because something bad happened to you in a relationship doesn't mean that you have to live

in that forever and have the shame of that or just feel like something's wrong with me. It's like, no, something's wrong with that person and they're not ready for whatever a regular relationship would be or with me. So I guess I kind of just did the opposite. And by forcing myself to do that, I kept myself open to the possibility that while I'm working through my trust issues, I can't anticipate that everyone's going to come after me in that sort of way. What was something you felt like you needed to work on when you said like, there's things I could have, you know, I, I hit the word blame, but like, maybe like hold yourself more accountable. What was something that you learned that you,

that you wanted to do differently in your next relationships? Well, try to take my time. Cause I think sometimes I, I don't, um, I like, you know, growing up in that sort of Disney World land of like, oh, you know, you meet somebody, you fall in love and it's just, yeah. And it's like, oh, it's just, isn't it magical? But it's like, no, the more you actually do take your time in getting to know someone, take your time progressing the relationship in these phases, if marriage and kids is what you want one day, then like, you're going to be able to really figure out who it is that's meant for you. And I don't know. So for me, I guess I really had to work on taking my time with it. And

I mean, there's a lot of things I would also say, not just like in the case of like the crazy breakup, just not assuming that like everyone has your best interest at heart, you know, like you have to just be cautious in figuring out like i don't know who you really are but i don't know be attentive to a relationship i think maybe i i wasn't i could try to blame myself in that relationship for a lot of things but at the end of the day he was definitely yeah it's not so much blame but i think to your point it's just like just things you can learn totally to do a little bit different and like like you said, maybe it was just, I think a lot of people struggle with it.

I know I have, where you jump in a relationship, you want to get excited, you want to start fantasizing with the person you're excited about. And that can be fun. But if you don't check in with yourself or your partner early on, you can get carried away.

You can start to play house. You can stop. And it's something we've talked a lot about on the show. You can, you can kind of almost stop getting to know someone because you can meet them and be like, Oh my God, like, I think, I think they're the one. And I think, wow, you're perfect. And then you just kind of stop. And then, and then a lot of times in the honeymoon phase, you both just kind of like to talk about how much you guys love each other. Isn't this great? Aren't we in love? Blah oh this is gonna be great we should do this but no one's really like getting to getting you're not really talking and learning and no one's saying you know there's

something that i struggle with or bothers me can i share with you and then you work through it or uh we were talking about before sometimes you know you're three or four months in a relationship and like you've had felt a lot of momentum and then all of a sudden for like there's like a weird week where you feel it disconnected but instead of bringing it up you don't because you don't want to ruin the thing right you're feeling so you just kind of go with it and then you just kind of passively aggressively address it like later on there's all these kind of yeah all these things definitely yeah i guess just taking my time with it

was a major aspect of why I think my relationship is so healthy with my partner. Like we both are coming at it from the same angle of being like, okay, I'm like cautious and I'm going to keep everything at a distance to a degree, but also respecting

why we're kind of going through that process and we're able to take time and really get to know each other. And when those difficult conversations or things come up, being comfortable enough to go like, you know, we got nothing to lose here. It's like, we're just two people who are individuals. And if we were supposed to be together and we like being together, then great. So let's, let's just put it on the table. And if we're not meant for each other, then feel okay walking away. Cause like there's 8 billion people in the world so you know speaking my language

speaking of cheating amanda should we we get into the uh emily radichowski of it all yes it sounds like you're our our perfect guest to help us break this down we shall see who here in this room has been cheated on ally no i guess i'm just perfect tell us your ways you break up with him by month 203 and then you never reach that stage all right before we start talking about this i'm curious do you now that it's all over and done with you're in a relationship you're healed do you in any way feel grateful for that experience yes isn't that weird like and i had that the other day where i'm thinking about in the moment the the first year, I would say, after finding everything out and doing the digging and it was just so dramatic.

A year after that, you know, I'm still in that phase of hating that person. But also, I've come to a point now where I know that none of the good things in my life would have happened had that not happened the way that it did. As painful as that was and how much as I wish I could like in some ways go back and look at myself and go, don't date that guy, like red flag, walk away. I'm also so grateful that I went through that because it has helped me in my friendships, in my current relationship, in like many aspects of my art, like I've been able to think, see things from a different perspective than I never did before. So I'm, I am in a way like grateful for it as much as it feels weird to say that. I don't think it's weird. I think it's against the grain of what society tells us,

you know, like I always, I've, I view my getting cheated on as like a pivotal point in my life. And I, I've always been less afraid of being cheated on ever since then, not more. I don't know if that's the norm, but I just was more like I got through it. And then I looked at cheating in such a different way. Like you said before, I was just like, well, it's not a flaw in me, it's a flaw in them. Yeah.

I can't change what people do. So I'll just, I'm'm gonna go ahead and trust and and and we'll see how worst case scenario i've done this before right yeah and so um rather than constantly live in fear of it all and and because i think that's what happens when we're younger we just assume it's never gonna happen to us yeah no i mean you don't start dating me like yeah i'll probably get cheated on yeah it's probably gonna happen you know you look in the mirror and go no who would you know yeah uh and then it happens but yeah yeah but emily emily got cheated on yes and i think it's there's been a ton of discourse on this it's sort of because

emily is i think famously one of of the most stunning supermodels. She's thought of as what? Like upheld as the epitome of beauty. The standard of beauty, yeah. And so I think there was a lot of kind of discourse that was like, see if someone this beautiful can get cheated on. Anyone can get cheated on. Anyone can get cheated on. Which could not be more wrong.

Right. It's such an inaccurate viewpoint. Yeah. Right. And it's a toxic way of looking at it, too, because it's such an inaccurate viewpoint. Yeah. Right. And like it's a toxic way of looking at it too because it's such a helpless feeling. It also puts the blame on the person being cheated on. Yes. Definitely.

Yeah. And I think it's also, so it's obviously really hard to get statistics on this because it's self-reported and who is going to, there's always the chance that people are going to lie about it. But it said, so this is a huge range, but 30 to 60% of married couples will cheat at least once in the marriage. Wow. How many? What's the number? 30 to 60%.

That is wild. Which is just like- It's like most of them. 30 is still a high number. That's insane. What do you do with that statistic? You just don't get married? Cry. I don't know if we need to panic. I think a lot of people are in relationships for the wrong reasons.

Do you think there's any interaction or engagement between a partner and the way they treat you and likelihood to cheat? Where do you draw the line of sort of like, oh, it's exclusively self-sabotage. This exists in a vacuum where the partner is totally irrelevant. Well, no. Yeah. Because I do think the partner's totally irrelevant well no yeah because i do think the partner's totally irrelevant because even if you're a shitty partner and then the let's say you're the shitty one like you're toxic you're you don't listen you're selfish you're always hanging out with your friends and then you get cheated on that person could have

broken up with you like that person cheating on you doesn't get to say that you can be like yeah that's why i did what i did and it might make some sense but like you could have left the relationship right you could have there's a million things you could do and not and not cheat on them you know so it's still the choice of the cheater yeah you know like you can't you can't you can justify that those are the justifying things, but it doesn't, it's your attempt to, but it doesn't work. You know, it's like you're, you're still cheated. Yeah. No one likes waiting on a paycheck, especially when you've got bills due. That's right.

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familiar but like they did the lie detector test and he's like yeah i cheated in high school so it's like yeah i feel like you kissed another girl at a party like yeah maybe you let that slide for me if i was dating now i have a series of questions like in my head i've always had a series of questions if i were on a date with someone or i came up that they had cheated my first question dating now, I have a series of questions. Like in my head, I've always had a series of questions if I were on a date with someone or I came up that they had cheated. My first question is, how did they find out? Did you own up to it or did they find out from someone else? That's question number one. Two, was it a moment of weakness that happened one night or did you have an affair? Was there like something going on?

I think a moment of weakness, I can get over, you know? Yeah. Like if someone I met was like, yeah, three years ago, I was unhappy. I'm not justifying it. I was wrong. I felt guilty. I hooked up with someone else. I felt miserable.

I told my partner pretty quickly. It took me a couple of days to gather up the courage, but I owned up to it. I could get over that. Yeah. What about you? No, I think so. I'm trying to think of like playing devil's advocate, I guess, of just in what circumstances do people cheat? I mean, there's the have your cake and eat it too. It's just like, well, I don't want to really settle down, but this person that I really do like is kind of making me do that. So I'm kind of getting the best of both worlds. But I mean, I don't know, like, are there statistics on, I would say like the, how many people end up leaving the person they cheated on for the person they cheated with? Or is it typically, would you say,

just like randomly hooking up with whoever and again all of the statistics is like right not it's like we're talking yeah like the website cited are like like i fidelity and it's like okay it was probably an instagram poll yeah but one thing that's kind of interesting is here is it says so over 60 percent of cheating women said their partners are more attractive than the lovers but 89 of cheating women report that the man they're cheating with makes them feel more appreciated than their significant other so it's not necessarily that this person is like hotter it's that they are fulfilling emotional needs unmet i saw i was scrolling on tiktok tiktok

handles a professional who-man. And it seems like he's going to school for psychology, but it's this guy right here. So he has a hat on and no shirt. And then I thought to myself, I've given relationship advice with no shirt on and this is what I look like. So maybe I'm gonna stop doing it.

Because I started watching and be like, I'm gonna hate this. And then I thought it was kind of genius. I'm gonna play it. So let me know what you guys think. So just props to professional Who man on TikTok. But it was his explanation of what he thinks people cheat are. And I thought it was really, really interesting.

The entire internet is up in arms. They cannot believe that this man, Sebastian Baer, cheated on Emily Radice. Everyone is shocked. They can't believe it. They can't believe it. This man, Sebastian Baer, cheated on Emily Radekiewski. Everyone is shocked. They can't believe it. They can't believe it. How could somebody cheat on this woman who is so beautiful? I'm not surprised.

Here's why. First off, I got to say that this has absolutely nothing to do with them, but people cheat. So in order to understand why people cheat, it is important to first understand arousal and attraction. Arousal and attraction is a combination of separateness and uncertainty. Another way to put it that may be useful is that longing, longing is the combination of lacking and loving simultaneously. So in order for arousal and for longing to take place, there needs to be a certain element of uncertainty. So I'm about to give you all the solution on how to prevent this from happening. But before that is the case, I want to ask you a question. Can you ever really know someone fully? I don't mean, can you trust someone? Can you, is it a no? Can you ever really know

someone fully? Another human being with all their complexities and intricacies, can you know them fully and truly know them? I believe that the answer is no. And that is a useful answer because when you have that recognition, it brings back uncertainty. It brings mystery into your relationship. It brings a sense of uncertainty, separateness. And when you have that uncertainty, when you have that mystery in your relationship, you have attraction and arousal. So this right here is the solution to prevent cheating. I'm not talking about to prevent your partner from cheating. You can't control other people. But this is how you prevent yourself from cheating, from having that wandering eye.

You need to recognize that you cannot and do not fully know and see your partner. There is inherently a level of mystery in their own humanness. There's a level of uncertainty in their own humanness and in that separation, in that mystery, there lies attraction and arousal. Could not agree more. that was so well said so so genius and it really made me think about like relationships in general because you know how like when you're in a relationship and even like everything's happy like every relationship has like things vary like the power dynamic you know every once in a while maybe you have a week where you're just like you

don't know why you're feeling a little insecure. Maybe, maybe your partner has been like meeting new people and hanging out with friends and all of a sudden you just feel like a little unloved from them. And you know what happens when you feel like that? You want them more, you know, even in that relationship and everything's fine. You're not really worried about the relationship. You're good. And, and sometimes where you don't have that uncertainty as you describe, you're just like, it's will never like take it for granted in a sense where like, I'll never say, oh, nothing will break us up. We're meant to be like, I think every relationship is incredibly fragile. And I, and I, and like him, like that, that doesn't make me more scared of relationship.

It just makes me realistic. Makes me realistic. And now it makes me feel more prepared to protect the relationship that I have. Because in other relationships, I thought anytime I had that kind of overconfidence, that overconfidence turned into complacency and taking things for granted only to wake up one day and like have things not be what I thought they would be like at the risk of of like just taking it for granted like that that's when that makes you check in and that makes you ask questions that makes you like you know like always prioritize a relationship and and realize that yeah people can change and like that that's

why like being cheated on it it doesn't scare me anymore. Or knowing that my current relationship could end. It might end. I can't stop her from connecting, meeting people or connecting with people. You can't stop your partner. You don't want to be one of those people who's like, I don't want you to go out.

I don't want you to meet new people because you're constantly afraid. That's not a healthy relationship either. But yeah, I think what they said was was really a genius yeah and um and i think kind of back to the original point like you know with you know emily being cheated on like i don't know this person or his dynamic but the level of this guy was married to the this woman who most people see as this incredibly beautiful person. And he stopped like seeing her that way somehow. He stopped appreciating this person he had because he just decided he had her. And he took, I'm just assuming, like assumed that, well, I'm married. And that desire of

uncertainty that he was feeling, he chose to find it elsewhere. That validation he probably wanted to feel for feeling like someone valued him. And I think that happens probably in relationships. We no longer get value of feeling special because we just, well, they're our partner. We're meant to be. They're going to be there. And I don't feel loved. And we have happy. They're going to be there. And like, I don't feel loved. And then we have to figure out ways to still like find that. Yeah, definitely. Work at it. I guess that's what they always say though. I'm curious, like on the topic of kind of continuing to know your partner,

has there either been something that you found out about your partner recently that was like, wow, I didn't know this about you. Or conversely, like a question you'd recommend people ask to kind of elicit new information about someone who they've been with for a long time that's tough i'm trying to think if there's anything that it was recently like surprising but i mean i've something recently that i just was mindful of is and i talked with you about this is acknowledging change in a relationship yeah like subtle change and and checking and just and just acknowledging that in the relationship when I say early in a relationship like the first two years that I still consider that pretty early you're you know so that people are complex it takes time and you look at like my relationship like now i moved from savannah and we immediately moved in with each other and we've had this like really great relationship with

very little conflict and etc etc but like as as we settle in to living together and her moving to a new city and her making friends and me making friends and and our lives are constantly evolving and so there's constant change and how we interact will therefore like be different and we've gotten good at just like saying i've this is different not not not naming it good or bad not judging it not saying oh but like it's different i am feeling something from this and like just talking about it has been like a big help in our relationship i know in the past i would be too afraid to acknowledge the change and because i was like well either a i don't want to bring it up because i

don't want to feel or seem insecure or i don't want to come across as jealous or you know etc etc and and and so i think a lot of people don't don't acknowledge change in a relationship and like like subtle changes like maybe that changes your partner is like you know maybe like hanging out with friends more or maybe your partner is i don't know that's like spending more time on their phone than they're used to it's like oh i just notice you know and like and just talking through it because i think we we often just ignore these little things and there's usually something there not good or bad but like you know i think that makes it easier to grow with each other because you're always growing right in a relationship and you just the only question is are you growing together or are you growing apart but you're always growing and i think that's that's something i've i've

learned have you heard of um the rejection challenge so there is uh a guy named jia jang who did a ted talk and his whole idea is about the oh yeah it's like exposure exposing yourself to rejection therapy or something yeah like on a daily basis. So like one of the things he says is like, ask a stranger to borrow $100 as a means of like developing a sort of like defense layer of like where rejection doesn't impact you in the same way. I love that.

And like, yeah, I'm curious. One, what do you think about that? And two, how good do you think you are at handling rejection? I mean, wait, so he's going and asking random people for $100 and then dealing with whatever their reaction is? Yeah. So he came up with this challenge and there's like 100 different things, all things that are meant to elicit rejection from people, whether that's like asking a stranger for

$100 or there's one where you're at a restaurant or like, can I have a refill on my burger? Okay. Just stuff that is like kind of comical, but the point is, is that it's going one where you're at a restaurant or can I have a refill on my burger? Just stuff that is kind of comical, but the point is that it's going to, you're going to get a no from someone in real time, face to face, and having that frequently will- Processing that emotion.

Yeah, and so much of the fear of rejection is what we build it up to be as opposed to what the experience is in the moment. Yeah. I would assume you're good. Yeah, actually. You're good yeah actually when i think about that i'm like i feel like i know what that is all the time though i mean now granted i'm sure there's plenty of people who are maybe they're actors watching this being like hayley shut up you've been on a show for 10 years but i will say leading up to that and also massively understand that in the context of music for me, where it's like on a label standpoint, it doesn't that career has not been the same way that I feel like you do just get used to people being like, no, or like not right now.

Or, you know what I mean? That it's. And also, it's not like you haven't been auditioning for like other shows and movies since you've been on the go. And miss out on it. And my guess is now that you've had some success, like it's actually harder to get rejected once you feel success because you're just like, well, no one's going to reject me now. Right. And then it happens again and you have to reprocess that.

But you kind of have to just become like numb to the just fact that like that's life. Like that sometimes it's going to not work out that way and you just adjust and move on and like you can't let it affect you you have to what's the phrase like roll off a duck's back or something like water off a duck's back where you just let it roll off and it's like keep moving i saw a quote that was like the art of being wise is knowing what to overlook and i was like damn yeah i am not wise yet I mean, I was in sales for a long time. So I got good at it. You were doing your own rejection challenge before it was popular.

Honestly, a hundred times a day. You know, like make a hundred phone calls, you get one yes. And that's just for a meeting, not even a sale. And I attribute a lot of the success I've had out here in terms of being able to face rejection. I think it's something that people should try more on. And like, I think that's great because rejection is like an ego triggering event. It just like, it triggers your ego. And then once you're, once you are listening to your ego more, like then you're, you're just, you're going to make bad decisions. You know, you're not making decisions that are right for you long-term. Like the ego, when it's triggered, it wants immediate gratification. It

doesn't care how it gets it. And it doesn't care like, like who it has to borrow from. It'll deal with the consequences later. It's just about satisfying that feeling in the moment. Yeah. And that's, you know, so. Yeah. It's like a bug bite. Like the rejection is a bug bite. And then your ego makes you scratch it, even though though it's like and then it turns into this much larger thing exactly definitely great completely pivoting uh alicia silverstone is getting a lot of commentary some of it negative about her decision to sleep in the same bed as her 11 year old son what do you guys make of kind of sharing a bed with a child through that age and also just i don't imagine myself doing that if i get to be a parent yeah

i feel like it as much as it might be done out of love and like wanting to let your child know that you're there for them and there to comfort them and in any circumstance i feel like it hinders them from i don't know, caught up socially on certain things. That's something that I experienced as well. I was scared of the dark and I'm an only child. So I was always sleeping in my parents' room. And at first they're really fighting. And then after a while it was like, oh, well, she's terrified. And I had to really work past that. And I feel like that fear that i kept instilled in me for so long has come out in so many other aspects of my life that aren't just like i'm afraid of the

dark that i think that in some ways it it will affect the child negatively despite it becoming from like good intentions i guess i think it's tough it seems like a lot of her untraditional parenting habits that have been criticized, like I think her, what was the bird feeding that she did? What was that one? She like chewed their food. Baby bird it. And spit in their mouth.

I will. A lot of it, yeah. But a lot of it seems like her wanting to feel connected to her kids. Yes. A sense of closeness. But like my fear for the child is being too then codependent on her, their mom or parents. So it's like I only have a dog. I'm not a parent. But I will say like getting my love for Jeff, my dog has made me realize just how hard it is, how hard it might be if I'm lucky enough to be a parent to like disappoint your kid out of love for their well-being or to try to selflessly discipline them or feel some separation from them because I want to teach them a lesson because all I want to do is care for them and sue them. It must be

a real challenge and I can only empathize with parents because I don't know what it's like to be one yet. But yeah, I think it's- That's tough. It's tough because I think even through love, parents can fuck up their kids with the best of intentions. You know, like bad parents don't come from like parents who don't give a shit all the time. And sometimes it just comes from a lack of, of awareness and, and, or fortitude to just try to do the thing that needs to be done. So you're, I mean,

ultimately you're trying to, I mean, it isn't parenting all about setting your kid up for success once they leave the nest, so to speak. Yes. You know, it's a hard balance.

It's a hard balance. Just covering one last topic. Um, did you guys hear about the Drake controversy where he took a photo of a woman at a restaurant? She has no idea she's being photographed, put it on his story with a caption, tried to airdrop this restaurant. She has no idea she's being photographed. Put it on his story with the caption, tried to airdrop this woman a pic of herself

because she's a dime. And a lot of people are saying, don't post a photo of a stranger on the internet. I also just, I wanted to talk about the means of like airdropping someone a photo of themselves that you took. On a plane the other day? What?

I'm sitting there and I had Wi-Fi on the plane and I'm just playing. And then it was like, you know, Brayden wants to send you a photo of your airdrop. And I'm like looking around like, which one of you is Brayden? And I'm like, maybe it was an accident. So I stopped it. But then they just kept doing it. So they like could tell that I was rejecting it. And I was like, I'm not opening this

because I don't know what I'm about to get. That's weird. It's weird to me. It's weird. It's intentionally like, you might as well just go up to the person and be like, hey, what are you eating? You could get very involved in their stuff.

Yeah. I don't think Drake should have done that. I feel like that as a Drake feeling like he's Drake. Yeah. But what if this woman's in a relationship and maybe she's going through a tough bout with her partner and there's a little bit of jealousy and all of a sudden like Drake's posting about her.

Yeah. Well, and I also saw something on TikTok recently and I'm probably going to butcher it, but it was kind of like that video you showed. This guy brilliantly talked about how, and it really made me think about it, how women like in that scenario, what I go to is like, Drake just assumed that there's this beautiful woman to take my number or possibly take my number it's like it it takes away the fact that like women we can't exist in a public space without it being like oh you're you're here to be hit on like i feel like that is something that's

so subtly underneath and every man's subconscious and women's i guess as well the other way where i feel like you can't just assume that this person who's existing at the bar is like capable or able or willing or wants to at all to be able to be like hit on by you and so the fact that drake in his position of like not understanding i just post it to his story i guess what does he have like 34 million something followers like an insane amount of followers too it's like it's just so intrusive and i it lacks awareness of what that person, I feel like 117 million followers. A lot. Like 34 million.

It's crazy. I didn't have many lines, but one, one go-to line of when I was back in the single life and I had some success with it is like, I would do the opposite. Like I'd also like generally feel like I was hitting on women that were used to getting hit on. And so I would kind of very timidly kind of walk up and acknowledge that I don't want to bother them. They must be busy. And then say like on the off chance that you don't have a boyfriend.

And I would say something like that. Like I would love to get to know you or take you out or blah, blah, blah. And that would usually work really well because it came from a like I didn't know yeah I don't know maybe that's that's why but it made me it like made me realize that it's just such a when this guy talked about it on the TikTok I'm like that is so true like we I feel like it's just an assumed that if you're a female by yourself that like it yeah that it's like or that they're interested like as a woman as a person I want to be able to just go out and go get a coffee at my local coffee shop and like go home and not have like feel like you have to go oh god I have to

now navigate this social interaction I wasn't looking for it I mean I understand obviously there's you know you find someone attractive and that's the first step of like oh we talk and we start dating so I understand the the gist of it but it made me really think about the fact that like not only is he just blasting this random person on his social media that like did not ask for that kind of attention but just in general to like make that assumption I feel like is I don't know yeah it feels like we really need a societally recognized space where it's like, if you're trying to shoot your shot or get a shot shot on you, you can go to this place. Because it's not the bar anymore.

Well, I think it's just about the problem with hitting on a stranger in public is that it takes a lot of courage. Oh, yeah. Right? And the problem with that is, is that with that courage that people are personally trying to overcome, there's a sense of entitlement that the person they're hitting on needs to recognize the bravery in which it took to hit on them. Right. And the truth is, when you hit on a stranger, they don't owe you anything.

Nothing. They don't even owe you. I mean, it's nice for them to be polite, but they don't owe you anything. They don't owe you anything. And so often people feel like that the person they're hitting on owes them something, even if it's their like consideration or just like the acknowledgement that it was brave for them to do that. And when that acknowledgement doesn't happen, it can get kind of toxic fast. And so if you are going to approach someone in public, men or women, you have to recognize that they don't owe you anything. They don't owe you anything. And just because it took you a lot of courage to do it, good for you. Shoot your shot. But they don't owe you anything. So yeah. Harry Styles has a new just college, what is it, Texas Tech? People have been sending that to me. We're Harry Styles fans on this show. Oh, Stans.

And so now you can take a college course and learn all about Harry Styles. Wait, what? You can take a college course and learn about Harry Styles? I don't know what you're learning about Harry. Where is this at? I don't know how familiar you are with sociology departments.

You can take a sociology course on anything. It'll be like the dynamics of fast food ordering. And then they'll break down how it's like actually like a microcosm. Is it the phenomenon of Harry Styles that we're studying? So it's just like

what makes Harry like so hairy? Like what's the, is it about the fascination? Okay, so the title of the course is Harry Styles and the Cult of Celebrity, Identity, the Internet, and European Pop Culture.

Makes more sense to me. So I think it's talking a lot about like why this person specifically was able to gain the type of like traction and elicit the response that he did amongst fans so it's like a how to become famous of course or just i think it's more like i think it's more of like a celebrity who's within society and like what does it say about our culture yes based on what we're responding to with this public figure interesting it's not like harry was born yeah that's in my mind i'm like okay pop quiz but does it say about our culture based on what we're responding to with this public figure? It's not like Harry was born. Yeah, that's what I think in my mind.

I'm like, okay. Pop quiz. But it's more like the way the Beatles phenomenon really took over. Yeah, that makes sense. That does make sense. I'd be interested. Shall we do some texting office hours? Let's do that.

Okay. How's it going? Hey, I'm Nicole. I'm 24. Hi, Nicole. How can we help? So I went on a date with a guy about five months ago. It was a great date and we haven't had a second date since. So basically, after I wrote into you, coincidentally, might've manifested it. He reached out. So now I kind of just need help securing that second date. So tell us some backstory. Tell us about this first date. So I met him on a dating app.

We went on a date about five months ago. It was one of the best dates I've ever been on. Went to dinner, got drinks, and then made it back to his house where we listened to John Mayer on the record player and just kind of danced around chatting, being ourselves, having a great time. On the record player is my favorite part. It wasn't a CD. it wasn't an apple playlist vinyl it's sexy right out to vinyl yeah what was it burning in a broken room or whatever what the newest now carry me away is what really stuck

out to me okay um who put it on anyways i hey he put it on. Okay. How did it, did you guys hook up? Yeah, we hooked up. Okay. And I ended up staying the night. He drove me home the next day, walked me inside, met my roommates and my dog and said, I'd really love to do this again. So we had talked about seeing each other again. Then some unforeseen circumstances happened. He got into a car accident. He was fine fine but he just had a lot of things going on so we never really made it on that second date ever since february since february we're john marrying on a vinyl we hooked up in the next like and then did he get an accident the next day or the next week or um the same weekend the same weekend okay so we had talked about it and he was

like i'm just honestly really busy right now. And then I hadn't heard from him for like a little bit. So I like reached out again and I said, oh, like, were you just not into it or like what's going on? And he was like, I'm just honestly busy. So then that was five months ago. He said, honestly, just been super busy with work and the accidents. Don't even have my car. How are you? I was good that was kind of it so then I write into you and the next day he texts me out of the blue and asked me if I was going to a country concert that's going to be here in our town Labor Day weekend I said no but I would like to we were just kind of having small talk and then he said would you want to grab drinks and apps? And I was like, when?

And he sent me a GIF or GIF, however you would like to pronounce it, and said right now. And I was like, it's 9 p.m. on a Wednesday. Not really the ideal timing right now. I love that you said no. Yeah. So I sent back a GIF of just someone shaking their head like no. And he sent one back that said really. So I was like a GIF of just someone shaking their head like, no. And he sent one back that said, really? So I was like, I'm just not. Yeah. He was like, really? Not now.

What? Keep going. And then I just was like, yeah. So I'm like, it's literally almost 10 o'clock. Not happening. So then I waited till the next day to respond. I was like, to be fair, I would have, but I was super tired. You sent that to him? You felt the need to justify? Yeah, I guess I did. That's okay. And then he said, I totally get that. And I said, but we should grab a drink sometime soon and catch up.

He said, yeah, definitely. So then Friday night, he messages me again. What are you up to? I just left the bar. And I was like, oh, am I actually about to head there? He was like, oh, if I knew that I would have already stayed, I'm going out of town tomorrow to play golf. If you need a ride later or anything, let me know. And I was like, okay, appreciate that. But I normally just walk home with my friends. It's super close. She offered you a ride home from the bar. Yeah.

So then it's like 1 a.m. And he's like, want to come over? And I was like, what's going on? Well, I mean, we know. Yeah, we know. Yeah. I was like, I have some friends in town. So probably not right now.

And then I just asked him when he was coming back in town. He said Sunday night. And then I ended up answering really late at night once I got home, which was like 2.30 in the morning. And I said, let's do something next week then. So that's kind of where I'm at right now. I don't know if I should reach out and try and make plans or if I should let it be. So the last communication was you, once again, it sounds like you've done this a couple times. Yeah, I agree. Is saying to him that you would like to make a plan,

which is you trying to plan something. He has responded with reaching out to you at a variety of different times, usually around nighttime. Late. Late, without any plan, hoping that you would be available whenever he is bored for whatever reason or lonely

or feeling like the need of some sort of stimulation. I don't mean just sexual, just like he's, you know, anytime someone reaches out in the moment, like you're an option to help them have fun. And early on in dating, it's not necessarily a bad thing. And since you guys only had one date, I wouldn't say it's the end of the world, but he is very transparent. Yeah. Well, how do you feel in reading like your text messages with him? What is your like takeaway in gut instinct of like, do you really like, what about him is wanting you to like see him again?

Well, it was just like the first date went so well and I've had such a different perspective on him. like the first date went so well and i've had such a different perspective on him but now after seeing these recent texts um i'm just like oh did you're are you looking for something different now i don't know yeah so you're going out of your way to be like make it convenient for him but he is doing the exact opposite with you i mean he is he is giving he is not even pretending not to be a fuck boy yeah so do i just kind of leave him yes and i mean that i know that that's hard because you had such a fun magical night and girl i get it where you're like but we danced to john mayer in the moonlight on final that is hard to beat i hear you but i swear to you there are like

so many other guys in your town i'm sure of of it, that will not just make it where it's convenient for them at one in the morning when they want to hang out, but they actually like and respect you, want to get to know you more, and will go out of their way to do that for you. Because, I mean, that just should be happening. This guy is not valuing you or your time. Just for devil's advocate i mean i completely agree with like that is that is the move but i'll just paint a picture of what the the alternative looks like the alternative is trying to hang out with again and most likely he'll immediately put you into a situationship right if you get any type of consistency it will be just a situation ship and he'll give you the I'm not really looking for a relationship right now and then you might

be able to change our situation ship in a relationship by like doing the whole like this is what I want all the things I've talked about on the show but it will take some time and all that time you will feel less than and confused and insecure but he because he will constantly be avoiding all the expectations that come with a relationship almost a certainty with this guy and like it's possible but like to hayley's point like there's a lot of other guys that won't immediately start off by like putting you in that kind of hookup box. And like, he's not even pretending to not be a fuck boy. So to his credit, like he is like being pretty transparent with his expectations. You could say, you know, he reaches out like late at night again,

because that's what he'll do. Right. You know, like check in and you could say, Hey, if you want to hang out with me i'd really appreciate you making a plan you could set that expectation and just to meet the challenge he might do that but it just seems like this guy it'll be a process so like if you let your ego take over and oh i want to i want to catch the fuck. I want to be the person he chooses not to be a fuck boy for. It's a good chance it will be a journey and it will be stressful on you. So I think short of him surprising you and out of nowhere saying, hey, I'd love to hang out with you. I know this great place I'd love to take you.

How about seven o'clock on Friday? Then you have my permission to say yes, if that matters to you. But short of that, I don't think you, if you have to coach him up to do that, then he's not really doing it. Because you telling him him well if make a plan for me to do that all you're doing him is like giving him the answers to the test yeah right and and you know what i'm saying and and then that he'll just do the minimum to get what he wants yeah so say next time he messages me late at night ask me what i'm doing or to go get drinks do i just say or you ghost him i don't even call it i mean yeah i think yeah he hasn't worked for it i think you should respond in all caps unsubscribe wait i'm sealing that well i guess

i can't know anymore but i'll use it for other things. You have to have the strength to just only send that though, because it's a funny response and he will, he will see that as a challenge and you run the risk of being caught up in that game and him, you know, so like if you send, if you do reply, it's to just kind of,

you know, stand in your power of saying no to the fuck boy all while not responding. Because it only works if you just say, if you only write unsubscribe. Yeah. Okay. I mean, but then again, I feel like it comes down to like how transparent you want to be. You have two ways of going about it too, where you straight up say to him, like, this isn't cool. two ways of going about it too, where you straight up say to him, like, this isn't cool. But I feel like it's so early in like having not gone on a second date that you can just always have an

excuse to why you're busy. And like, eventually this person will not be in your life anymore. Yeah. I do love, I mean, another alternative too is like nothing works better with guys than telling them like what they're not good at so if you just very calmly say to him like you could say unsubscribe and like oh what's up and you say something like listen i think you're great i think you're really nice it just doesn't seem right now like you're at where i'm at it doesn't seem like you're in a place to like, actually, and that's okay. Yeah. But I just, this isn't for me. And like, you know what I'm saying? Like you're saying it as if you've already decided that what he's doing is not at your level and you don't ask him to change. You you're, you're saying it as a very matter of fact, like your decision has been

made yeah now again he might rise to the challenge and do all the things you want him to do just be very like be careful yes proceed with caution it is not genuine it is is it a reaction to you providing a challenge now i'm a big believer believer that everyone's fuckboy is going to be someone's future partner. Someday this guy will grow up and want to pick someone, and it might be you, but it's probably not. So you just have to be very careful if you do these kind of game playing things that are necessary at times, but you just have to be really, really careful. But if you want to give him a little dig and you want to tell him what you've decided he's not ready for, then you can do that.

Because that will really rattle his cage. That's up to you. Yeah, that's definitely the route I'll take on that one. All right. That's our two cents. Well, thank you. Good luck. Good luck.

Thanks. Give us an update, because I feel like you might give in to temptation. No. I have faith in you. I feel like I'll probably get in touch this weekend and then I'll update you next week. Okay. What are the chances you say you give him another shot after this? I think I'll definitely go with the unsubscribe message.

Okay. And then hopefully I'm not'll definitely go with the unsubscribe message. And then hopefully I'm not drinking when he texts me. Great answer. At least it's honest. I like that one. Keep us updated. Yeah, I will. Thank you. Thanks for calling.

How's it going? Hi, I'm Anna and I am 28 and I need help drafting a text to a guy that I have previously been on a date with or was talking to. All right. Why was it previous and why do you want to give this person another chance? Okay. So actually, I don't want to give this person another chance, but a little bit of a backstory. About a year ago, I met this guy and I'm going to call him Marine Guy. Okay. So actually I don't want to give this person another chance, but a little bit of a backstory. Okay. About a year ago, I met this guy and I'm going to call him Marine guy. And so we went on a date and it was hands down,

like the best instantaneous connection I've ever had. And I've been on a lot of dates. And then after I turned out, he actually didn't live in my state, but ironically, like he lives where i i grew up so he's from where i live and he lived where i live so we left that date deciding to kind of continue talking um like facetiming texting all the things and if we were ever in each other's location we would meet up and go out. So a couple months after we decided, well, I was flying back to my hometown and I told him and he asked me out to go on a date and I was

super excited. Like I got a new outfit, all the things told all my friends and whatnot. And he stood me up. And so then after that, I tried to move on, but I kept finding myself thinking about him. And he kept reaching out via Instagram. Time out. Did we address the getting stood up? No, he didn't. Did you? He didn't. We just pretended it didn't happen?

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I mean, yeah, I didn't call him out on it. I feel like I was just excited that he contacted me again. And I was just, so I kind of let it slide. What was the communication like in the moment? Because I've also totally gotten stood up on dates before. And like, usually my reaction is to be like, hey, where are you?

Yeah. So I texted him. I called him. It was just nothing. And then a couple months went by. And then he started to reach out again via Instagram, like my real account. And we were messaging back and forth and the emotional intensity started to like fire back up on my end. And back in February, and I decided to like shoot

my shot, send him a message saying that I was like into him. And then I never heard from him. sent him a message saying that I was like into him. And then I never heard from him. He didn't acknowledge or respond to that text message. So now he reached out to me and saying that he was going to be in my area. I have a boyfriend now I'm in a committed relationship. Things are going good. And he reached out to me saying that he wanted to meet up and go out. And I want to say a text that makes him feel like like i messed up my best job like

i asked up basically and i mean this is like kind of your toxic trait here because i know i know i know this is this is all this is all your ego every step of the way you've let your ego dictate your decisions and you're you let your like you let your ego decide not to like check in or ask him and this whole like you when you wrote when you wrote oh i don't know why i kept thinking about him that was that's that's you that's you not like listen you got stood up it's fucking embarrassed i mean not you shouldn't feel embarrassed, but it is embarrassing. Like no one likes to feel that way. And the only way your ego was to not feeling embarrassed was to get him to show you that he still cared. And that's why we let people off the hook so often when they like do super rude things to us, like ghost us or like stand us up or inconvenience.

It's not because they deserve it or like, but we lie to ourselves about like this need of looking the other direction because we've decided the only way we can stop feeling less than is for them to make us feel special again. less than is for them to make us feel special again yeah and and so you ignore all the red flags that they demonstrated that are so obvious and and we we look the other way and then and then you and now you want to you're happy in a relationship like why yeah i think that's actually one part of the thing where i'm like trying to figure out why too, because I am happy. Like I am very in a very happy relationship. But like seeing that just I feel like threw me off and I instinctively just wanted to be like, what is something that I can send to him to be like your loss? Like I think in a way to kind of get back to him for all the hurt that he caused me. a way to kind of get back him for all the hurt that he cost me. A petty text is never going to hit that way. A vulnerable text might. Like honestly, just being like on a human level, like a text that's like, I think if you do want to send anything, just like a text that forces him to confront your humanity and like the way he made you feel is kind of the move. Like something that's just like, hey, like have a boyfriend now. But also like it really made me feel like shit when i was waiting at a restaurant in an outfit i'd bought for that night and you didn't

show up i i mean that's not like bad but like i feel very strongly by saying there is no text in the world that anyone can come up with that will elicit the feeling you're trying to feel mm-hmm like i'm a big believer and you don't tell people you have, you're happy, you show them. So, you know what I'm saying? Like telling,

telling him he fucked up, you're happy. Like that is, that is, that's you giving something to him that he doesn't deserve. And that is the knowledge of like what you're doing right now. And then once you say that to him, you're going to have this heightened sense of expectation. Cause that's what you want like what you're doing right now. And then once you say that to him, you're going to have this heightened sense of expectation because that's what you want.

Like you're literally like, I want to, I want to send a text that makes him feel a certain way. Well, what happens when you send a text and you don't get the response you want, then immediately you'll be giving this stranger, this guy, this guy who's not your boyfriend, your energy, you're going to be investing energy in some guy when all you should be doing is investing energy in your current relationship. And even if it's just your thoughts, like it's going to, like it's all your ego wanting this and there's just nothing you can send. Even your vulnerability, you're, you're, you're, you, you already have a goal. Like, and that goal is to get him to feel something. And once you send that out

into the world, then your feelings will be affected because you need something in return from him. And that, by definition, is giving away your power to this guy you've already given so much to because you want something back. So just accepting this guy didn't giving give you what he wants and just like not responding is the only way you can get the feeling that you want then like you you're in control that narrative and nothing is worse than not hearing response it always like in these situations where you know you want to respond to someone and you try to get a response think about like this switch it around you know like imagine imagine think about how it felt when this guy couldn't even reply back to you or give you a

heads up he wasn't gonna like that feeling of like not even taking the time as simple as sending a text of i gotta go i actually a concert but which is already messed up enough but sure it's messed up but like at least the acknowledgement but yes and that was worse not getting anything was worse than anything he could have said so if you really want him to feel this thing you want to feel this don't don't respond and letting him know he missed his window is to to not getting a response because you responding at all lets him know that you're he still has a little bit of power over you and the truth is he really doesn't but your ego is giving him this power yeah and and that is your ego still needs his validation and that validation is to know he's now sad and regrets it and that does nothing for your current relationship or for you like i think

this is more dangerous than you're giving it credit to and like you're i think you need to figure out how you let this guy in the situation go and even though you i don't doubt that you are happy in this relationship there is something about and i don't think it's him i think it's you allowing you but like you have to figure out how to truly let go of that feeling and that need for for his validation or approval just because you felt rejected by him once and and i would work through that because it like it affects you it affects it you it's energy you're you're spending i mean as much as i appreciate you calling in and giving us content like you shouldn't be calling in to a show to get advice on how to respond to someone who's not your boyfriend when you have a boyfriend.

Right. Yeah. Like right now you could be thinking about your boyfriend and something go away to like connect with him or plan a date or something like that. And like, listen, you're human. I'm not trying to like, like criticize you, but like, you know what I'm saying? I think that's why we just need to be really mindful about that stuff because it like, I don't doubt that you're happy and it's a very human feeling that you're feeling, but right now you are investing in someone who is not someone you should be investing in and it's taking away, you know, from someone you can, your energy is not infinite. Like the timing, your day is not infinite. And so if you're spending it somewhere else, that means you're not spending it is not infinite and so if you're spending it

somewhere else that means you're not spending it where it could go if you're spending it in a place where it shouldn't be going that means you're not spending it in a place where it can be going or should be going i do think like blocking him is what you 100 should do and just get rid of that kind of toxic energy you're investing in this in this person by checking to see if he's looking at your stories and getting satisfaction that he still gives a shit about you, it really does nothing for your current relationship or your mental health. You're right. So why don't we just block him right now?

I could, yeah. Yeah, let's one, two, three, block him. You've graduated from him. You've graduated from this whole thought process and dynamic. Let's one, two, three, block him. You've graduated from him. You've graduated from this whole thought process and dynamic. Listen, it hurt you. And I'm sorry he hurt you.

And I think it hurt you more than you wanted to acknowledge. And you never process it when it hurt you. And you've held on to that. And this whole time, you've been trying to figure out how to get over that hurt. I have, yeah. Okay, I'm going to do it. I think you just say, just acknowledge that he hurt you. Yeah. gonna do it i think you just say just acknowledge that he hurt you yeah and just say it and just kind of let go of it and and say that i don't need this validation anymore and it'll go away

yeah you're right thank you yeah so and have you blocked him for everything block his phone number block his instagram block everything you don't want to you can't keep trying to look at it like his page and see if he's looking at yours because that's just going to keep the cycle going i saw a tiktok uh i saw a tiktok the other day it was funny it did really well it was actually older and it was uh of a woman who blocked her ex or something and he apparently was hooked up to the wi-fi because they used to date and he uh sent a message to the printer that said call me back oh god the most disturbing thing about that that is so scary like just thinking about the printer going on its own and oh my god yeah the most disturbing thing about that was the comments and the reply was the take him back oh my god and i think a lot of it was

satirical and but i think there's some truth to that feeling is like that feeling of want like oh he he's going out of his way he's trying so hard and that like trying so hard. But it's that ego wanting to feel special. And listen, you want to feel loved and special in a current relationship, but it's not special if it's for the wrong reasons. It's only special when they do it because they want to, because they can, not when they feel like you're pulling away or you're gone or they're blocked. Or they're trying to see if I can get the girl who i ditched and went to a concert and didn't give her the courtesy and if i want if i can get her to forgive me like imagining that ego trip but yeah so did you block them i did yeah you. Thank you. This has been really helpful actually. It's like

everything that like, even like the Instagram thing, I was like, Oh my gosh. Yeah. I haven't been doing that. I have been doing that. We've all been victims of that. Like it's, it's a very human feeling. I hope I'm not making you feel like. No, no. This was like the reality check that I needed because I feel like some of my friends even were like, why are you like, cause I tell them, I'm like, oh, he reached out to me again. And they would say, why don't you just block him? I'm like, I don't know. And so it's good. we often make the mistake of giving them too much credit to think that they're the only they're the only person who can make us feel whole again and it's not that's not true but we have to like recognize that yeah all right well good luck good luck good job having a relationship i'm glad you're happy and uh don't forget like feel like pat yourself in the back today it wasn't easy to do like give yourself

some credit for moving forward don't unblock him and if he finds a way to get a hold of you like don't try your best to not feel good about that you know recognize that it's not a feeling you should take as validation it's like you want the apathy not the hatred yeah all right good luck thank you thank you so much take care hayley this has been so much fun thanks it was so much fun talking to you you too thanks for having me on uh please let my audience know again where they can find your music your social your tiktok your instagram obviously all the things that you're doing. Yes. Music is just my name, Haley Rantia.

And so is pretty much all my social media, Twitter, Instagram, TikTok. Always on the TikTok. Loving the TikTok. You have a great TikTok. Thank you. It's fun. It's fun. Thank you guys for listening.

Don't forget to send us those questions at asknickatcastme.com. Cast with a K. We are back next week. Elizabeth Wagmeister from Variety is helping us break down the Bachelorette. Holly Madison, you know her, you love her, is with us. That should be a fun episode. Very fun. That's on Going Deeper next week.

And as always, Monday, Ask Nick's. Have a great week everybody bye