The Viall Files - E465 Going Deeper with Ellie Zeiler - Break Ups, Being Harry Styles' Girlfriend & Selling Sunset

Episode Date: August 24, 2022

Welcome back to The Viall Files, Going Deeper edition! Today we are joined by TikTok Star and Influencer, Ellie Zeiler! On this new episode of Going Deeper we dive deep with our guest, asking about her recent breakup, how social media has made moving on worse, how dating is a lot more complicated when you’re an influencer, the best places to find people to date, and why it’s important to work on yourself not just when you’re single. We also dive into some pop culture news, talking about Sofia Vergara leaking the wedding of Wells Adams and Sarah Hyland, the shocking divorces from Love Is Blind alumni, and the breaking news that Christine Quinn will be leaving Selling Sunset and how this split will probably be better for her. We then welcome on two Texting Office Hours callers where our first caller wants help with shooting her shot with a guy that she thinks she has a 50% chance of success with. But after not hanging out with him for a while, she wonders how she can ask him out on a date without seeming like she cares too much. Our second caller wonders how to deal with a girl she’s been talking to, who only seems to text our caller when she’s bored. Worried that this person may be a catfish, we help our caller build up the courage to test this person by asking them to meet at a local coffee shop, deciding to block them if they flake.  “No breakups are mutual.”  Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] to be a part of our Monday episodes.  If you would like to get some advice on Office Hours send an email to [e-mail] with “Office Hours” in the subject line!  Be sure to check out my sports radio show Fandemonium, Wednesdays @ 3PT / 6 ET  on Amazon's Amp app.  Click the link to download Amp using my code NICKVIALL https://apps.apple.com/us/app/amp-host-live-radio-shows/id1586403838 Pre-Order Nick’s Book: https://www.abramsbooks.com/product/dont-text-your-ex-happy-birthday_9781419755491/ Check out our new "Introvert" merch at http://www.viallfiles.com today! THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: Betterhelp: Our listeners get 10% off their first month at http://www.BetterHelp.com/VIALLFILES.  Away Travel: Start your 100-day trial and shop the entire Away lineup of travel essentials, including their best-selling suitcases and bags at http://www.AwayTravel.com /viall. Figs: FIGS believes the awesome humans in healthcare deserve awesome scrubs to match. Head to http://www.wearFIGS.com and use code VIALL to get 15% off your first order. Episode Socials:  @viallfiles @nickviall @elliezeiler See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

What's going on everybody? Welcome back to another episode of the Vile Files Going Deeper edition. I'm your host Nick, joined by Allie and Amanda. What's new? What's going on? Oh, I wanted to ask you about your weekend because you've attended a very special event. Welles and Sarah got married. You were in attendance. I was. But it was kind of on lockdown in terms of social. Top notch. I mean, you weren't on Sofia Vergara's Instagram. So were you really there?

That's true. I wasn't. I still can't believe she did that. That was awesome. Walk us through it. I want can't believe she did that. That was awesome. Walk us through it. I want to feel like I was there. It was in wine. Well, it was like two hours. I forgot what city it was.

San Luis Obispo? I think they filmed at least scenes of The Hitching Post was there out of this movie Swingers. Great movie. I don't know the town. It's like three hours up from LA. Two, three hours. Lovely LA two three hours lovely town strong Dutch community oh my people

really quaint town the wedding was top notch I mean it was it absolutely competed with Ashley and Jared's which I've always said was the best wedding I went to

different you can't beat Wells and Sarah's wedding okay but you gotta like give us a little more I don't know it was like

walk us through the day it was at a winery the food they had a oh my god Sarah's wedding. Okay. But you got to like, give us a little more. I don't know. It was like, walk us through the day. It was at a winery. The food. They had a, oh my God. At their, at their greeting party. Was that on Friday? That was on Friday. The best sliders, maybe one of the best sliders I ever had. And honestly, you know me when it comes to wedding food, don't go hungry is my mantra. Except there's exceptional food. Everything about the wedding was exceptional. Wow. I don't know how I could, it was just like, even the views from the wedding, like overlooked this cliff. It was like, oh my God, definitely were tears. Both Sarah and Wells vows were quite beautiful.

They write their own. They did. Sarah's was really great. Wells was great, but like Sarah's, I think pulled on the heartstrings even more. Wells's brother gave a great best man speech. The maid of honor speech was also fantastic. Even those speeches were good.

Who was her maid of honor? One of her good friends. I don't know if I'm supposed to like out her. There were, Wells mentioned- Yeah, but great, great maid of honor speech. Wells mentioned several wardrobe changes when he was on the show. I think Sarah had five dresses.

Yeah. How? Like, was she missing? There was the wedding dress. And there was definitely like like i think a dress for the father of the bride mother of the bride i don't know i don't i don't fucking know there were a lot of they all looked nice and they had like they had the reception and then they had this band that was like amazing incredible live band like really good and then after the reception

was over we all took a bus to another like reception that had a DJ and a dance floor. It was like in a food truck. It was incredible. Like an after hours. Oh my God. It was amazing. You can't beat this wedding. You could do something.

It can be matched. It cannot be beaten. Wow. Like I won't try to beat it at all. I won't even try to match it. I had a fun meet cute with Sarah's parents, which is slightly embarrassing. But so like before we're on our way, we're at our way to the Friday's gathering party. And I'm always meeting a lot of new people.

And I assumed I would meet people I had met once or twice before. And I went to Natalie, I'm like, let me know who I've met before. Cause I can be bad about like remembering certain people. And I hate the whole feeling an idiot. And then Chris Soule says to me, he goes, I've never met a politician about like remembering certain people. And I hate the whole feeling an idiot. And then Chris Soule says to me,

he goes, I've never met a politician who doesn't just say, good to see you. And I'm like, that's fucking genius. Like why haven't been like my whole life? Why haven't I just been saying good to see you? You know, why do I always look so fucking confused when I meet people all the time? So I immediately tried to incorporate good to see you and having a great time.

And I locked eyes with who I now know is Sarah's mom. And I was like, hey, you know, kind of a, and she looked at me, it was like, hey, and like, turns out she watches The Bachelor. So she knew who I was and we embraced and gave a good hug. And we had this nice chat. And she's like, oh, I want you to meet my husband. He came over. I'm like, oh, God, that's a really cool suit. He had a really nice suit. I complimented him. Then I was like, so how do you know the bride and groom? No. She was like, I birthed her. I think she literally said that, maybe. And they definitely gave me a hard time, and I felt embarrassed. But how am I supposed to know?

It's true. And I was like, oh, Dumbledorf, because he plays Dumbledorf on Broadway, Sarah's dad. I don't know if you know that. You mean Dumbledore? Is it Dumbledore? Yeah. You mean Harry Potter Dumbledore? Yeah.

He's at a Dumbledore? I don't watch Harry Potter. I don't know. I probably said that. That's a great discovery that you call Dumbledore Dumbledore. Now he probably fucking hates me. Anyway, Sarah's parents hate me is the moral of the story. They're lovely people. I do think they might hate me though.

But yeah, so that's how I met Sarah's parents. They're very lovely. It was just a ton of fun. I had a great time. Didn't make you want to get married? Didn't make you fantasize about your wedding? Not really, but not any more than I already have or do. It didn't make me not want to. There we go. Other than knowing that my wedding won't look like this. That's impossible. Why don't we remind the people to pre-save your book so that one day you too there we go other than knowing that like my wedding won't look like this you know that's impossible why don't we remind the people to pre-save your book so that one day you too could have a wedding this elaborate yes please please put your order my book so i want to can have a wedding like sarah and wells it was a fantastic what could i share that i haven't shared i mean

sophia already shared the wedding cake yeah i don't know if there was a good dance floor moment if you had any other encounters with like people who you saw at the wedding who you had other famous moments with what color were the bride i got to know debbie ryan i got to meet her fun fun person we hung out with debbie all disney channel moment we we got to know her a little bit what was like the color scheme of what brides Bridesmaids dresses, decor. Bridesmaids dresses were like a rose. Okay. Like a light pink. Beautiful bridesmaids dresses. Those can obviously not be.

Were they matching? Jesse Tye Ferguson married them. Wonderful. Of course he did. It was wonderful. Of course he did. And it was everything you'd expect from an Emmy award winning actor. Known for their comedic timing and heartfelt family portrayal.

Like honestly, truly exceptional. Refrain, I guess. I don't know. award-winning actor known for their comedic timing and heartfelt family portrayal like honestly truly exceptional reference i guess i don't know would you have someone marry you or like you're gonna do like a no probably have someone marry me like a friend i don't yeah i don't know everything about the wedding was exceptional wow yeah so you know a lot of bachelor nation people i just feel like this is like the quintessential like man attends wedding i thought you did a good job no yeah i just feel like i feel like a woman maybe it's not even a gender thing but i'm like like my girlfriends would have been walking through it's like so friday night we got there like even like the seating arrangements came in like these like

mini envelopes with like wax on them that like were made in like the 1400s and like those are the seating assignment i mean everything was did they have signature cocktails for each of them yes what were they i just drink whiskey you're killing me they had signature cocktails they had this the sarah highland which natalie enjoyed it was reddish do you remember what liquor was in it i don't know do we need to just call nat Natalie to get a run through of the weekend? It was awesome. The flowers? I didn't see any flowers.

There were flowers. Yeah, it wasn't that they were there. He just didn't notice them. I had an individual beautifully like wilted peach rose on my table for me. It was great.

The food was exceptional. Seabass and steak and this like kale salad everyone really enjoyed. Top-notch photo booth. On Friday, they had an ice cream and cookie bar. Just a really good vibe. Good people. Could not be beat.

I don't know what more I can say. Good to see people. Exceptional wedding. I don't know. It was really well done. It was perfect size. It was fun. What did you say?

I said, I don't want to repeat it. I said, well's done. It was well's done. Yeah. It was well's done. That's funny. Yeah, anyways. It's like the Highland Dream.

We have a fantastic episode today. Oh, yeah. Please pre-order my book. It'd be a lot. He, too, wants to leave little wax-covered notes for his attending attendees. And maybe you want to get married. And so if you want to get married, maybe check out this book. That would give you some good advice. I want us, me and my audience to be on the New York Times bestselling list. That would be lovely. And I think it's a

pretty good book that I think will help people. And if you have a friend going through it in a relationship, I think it'll be better. This will not be a waste of your money. I promise you. It's one of those things where you're going to tell, you're going to read it and be like, this is so good. And you're going to talk to your friends about it. And you're going to have to be like, it's actually really good. Yes. Like The Bachelor history is going to require an actually.

It's actually good. But it's good. Ellie Zeiler is with us today. It was great talking with Ellie, who recently is going through a breakup. We got some little breakup tidbits from her. And we, well, we cover all your latest pop culture news. Yeah, a bit of Selling Sunset. Selling Sunset.

A bit of Love is Blind. Anyway, we'll- A little bit of Harry Styles talk. You'll find out. You'll find out. All sports fans out there, don't forget, Fandemonium, 6 o'clock Eastern. Talk maybe preseason predictions this week. We'll be talking sports, NFL season, Packers. Check us on an app. You can get the link in our show description, 6 p.m. Eastern. Check us out today if you're listening on a Wednesday. Let's get to Allie. Well, speaking of breakdowns in your bedroom, have you heard of BetterHelp, Allie?

I have. Well, we all know that we subscribe to taking care of our mental health on this show. And working with a therapist is a great way of taking care of your mental health. And challenges with, you know, working, getting therapy can be cost and convenience. All things that BetterHelp is trying to make easier for all their customers. Certainly, it's convenient. You can have therapy in the comfort of your home. You can do it in the car.

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You just give them some basic information, take a quick quiz about what you're looking for in a therapist. And a couple of days later, you'll be doing your first therapy session. How fun is that? Our listeners get 10% off their first month at betterhelp.com slash V-I-A-L-L-F-I-L-E-S. That's better, H-E-L-P.com slash vile files. I was traveling this week. I was seeing away suitcases everywhere. It was like a little club, like Away, Away, Away. Clearly, Away is doing something well because people are catching on and you can catch on too. And the reason why they are so popular and so convenient is because they are durable. They last

long. They have these 360 spinner wheels that help you just glide. You're just like gliding through the airport. They are perfectly sized, especially their carer rounds. They have no issues of someone being like, is that too big big can you have to put that in that thing before you can carry it on also like a suitcase is something where if you buy one nice one especially one like a way where they have like a lifetime warranty they will repair it should anything happen i can't imagine what because it's been incredibly durable but like this is like something you buy once and then get to experience for the rest of your life as like feeling a little like ah classy traveler moment every time you get on the plane it's worth it they have this little thing for on the side for your laundry it's super easy to it just makes a lot of sense charging port

in the suitcase so you can charge your phone on the go because lord knows there aren't enough outlets at an airport away offers free shipping and returns on any non-personalized order within the continuous U.S., Canada, and the U.K. Plus, they're offering you a 100-day free trial on everything Away makes. So you can take the product on the road, live with it, travel with it, do whatever you want with it, get lost with it. And if you don't like it, you can return it. That has to be non-personalized. You won't because you'll love it. It's so cost-affordable.

I mean, what more can we say other than get away? Start your 100-day trial and shop the entire Away line of travel essentials, including their best-selling suitcases and bags, at awaytravel.com slash V-I-A-L-L. That's awaytravel.com slash V-I-A-L-L. Ellie, welcome. Thanks. How are you? Hi, I'm doing well. How are you?

Yeah, Ellie. You looked at me like I was like... You just said it like, Ellie. Oh, yeah. Thanks. How are you? Hi, I'm doing well. How are you? Yeah, Ellie. He looked at me like I was like. Stop it, party. You just said it like, Ellie. Oh yeah, sorry. I just randomly get into it. How are you? I'm doing well.

How are you? I'm great. So nice to have you here. Thanks for having me. It's so cool in here. Oh, what's new? Everything and nothing at all. Everything and nothing.

Well, let's talk about the things that are new. Okay. You recently got out of a relationship. I did. Are you okay? Depends on, I was going to say depends on the day, but it depends on the hour actually. Depends on the hour. Yeah.

How fresh is it? Like a week fresh. Oh no, I'm sorry. Yeah. And then he left to college. So that is when it was like cut. Who broke up with who? I broke up with him.

Is that better or worse, do you think? Worse. Why? Because I'm like labeled the bad guy in the situation. You know what I mean? We're like. The dumper? Yeah, I'm the dumper.

To yourself? Or do you think, do you feel like the bad guy? Has he said you're the bad guy? Are his friends calling you the bad guy? All of the above. All of the bad guy all of the above all of the above and then like something will happen or like obviously if we're broken up if he hooks up with someone else

then it's like well you wanted this are you still talking yes sometimes I don't know because I don't know how to do this like it's so hard to go this is your first breakup yeah my first relationship as well

and how long are you guys dating for? 10 months that's a long time for me I hear ya my first time my first girlfriend broke up with me oh she did? break up with you? yeah

we were young and like it was our first year of college i mean she said she wanted to like explore the world i think she just met another guy we got back together like five more times but uh yeah it happens but uh yeah i was i think we were dating for less than a year. I was devastated. Yeah. She was definitely a bad guy in my – In your eyes. Was he devastated? Were there tears?

Yes. Tears. Multiple times. How did you do it? What's the worst you – have you ever been broken up with? No. This is my first relationship. Well, in the sixth grade, I didn't have –

Oh. I heard – I won't say her last name kelly oh i've heard this story kelly was a twin no she was a twin i was in front of the brother joe and uh we went as a family to the movies and this is when answering machines were still a thing and on the answering machine my whole family was listening. We got home from the movies. I was outside playing. She left a message that said, Nick, this is Kelly. You're dumped. Click.

That's like the start to a rap song or something. That was. Yeah. Or a Joker origin story. Yeah. It's like one of the two. You're dumped. And then I was devastated.

What have you learned from this breakup so far? It's like one of the two. You're dumb. And then I was devastated. What have you learned from this breakup so far? It's still fresh. It's still fresh. I've learned, I think that before I was even in a relationship, I was so cold-hearted and I was like, why are all these people writing songs about breakups? They can't be that bad. Or why is everyone talking about like breaking up

and like a physical pain in your heart when your heart breaks? And now I just totally get it. Like I totally understand. Is your ex a public figure? No, he's not. He's not? He's not.

What was that like for you, for someone who obviously like, would you kind of, I mean, I guess overnight, but like you've become incredibly famous in a short period of time thank you what was that like to date someone who wasn't out of it and did that cause problems in your relationship and your for your next relationship I don't know maybe that will be soon maybe it won't be for a while but do you have an opinion on whether that's something you would look for or not in your next relationship?

It's interesting because I try to surround myself with people that don't do social media and don't do what I do because, and I think that when I first started, I like did try to reach out to people that are in the public eye and it just never worked out for me how so it was i don't know after a few times getting burned and just like like the non-responders or that i'm too busy or the like using you for just to be seen with you and then it's over disingenuous yeah exactly i was just like okay i'm good i don't need it like i'll just not do it again also i feel like it doesn't put as much pressure on it that makes sense where it's like, this is my job. And then I have a social life outside of that. And it's like a good break from in between. But dating this guy who didn't do social media, surprisingly, there weren't that many problems with it, except for like, if you don't do do it you don't necessarily get it but that was

totally fine with sure but oftentimes in relationships that's whether it's social media or i guess anything else like what you do right obviously is it's it's unique and it's hard for i guess anyone doesn't do it to relate to like you said if you don't do it you don't get it yeah and in any relationship if you can't relate or empathize with your partner, it creates disconnect, even if it's no one's fault. You're just like, oh, you want to empathize. It's like, oh, I want to understand, but I'm really having a hard time with this. Totally. And that can sometimes cause conflict if one person feels a bit outside of a world that their partner is in. And that's like a big, that was a big reason why I decided, we decided to break up because I was like, I moved here to LA like five months, half a year ago. You're, I'm like fresh here. You're going to go into college where you're

going to be dealing with like sororities and frats and parties and things like that that like i don't want to focus on and like even just with the added on social media now it's been kind of hard to continue it since we've broken up just in the past like week or two weeks where he's been gone because of the other people involved meaning like his friends or like new girls or things like that. Does that make sense? Yeah. I mean, like I couldn't imagine dating, like I'm older. So like I couldn't imagine like dating at 18 or 19 or 20 or 21 with social media today. Cause it was hard enough for me when I was like going through heartbreak with my first girlfriend, like was hard enough for me when I was like going through heartbreak with my first girlfriend like wondering what she was doing and who she was hanging out with it would have been a fucking

nightmare to like just be able to like go up their store and go over their stories and then worry about like why you know and then like sometimes you can like mute people's stories and maybe you mute their story because you don't want them to like see your stories because you feel guilty but then you don't realize that they could have a finsta and then they could like look at your stories and all of a sudden you're like why did they mute my stories and then like oh my god i would have been a fucking mess all the ways i could just mind fuck myself when i was feeling insecure about me too it's like self-sabotage like as soon as i've like i'm done hanging out with friends or it's like 9 p.m. and I lay in bed, I'm like, time to just ruin my whole mood and like stalk everyone. And like, obviously I can't go private on my Instagram

account. It's my job and it's my career and things like that. And so the fact that I can't see them, but they can see me is very scary. Would you ever block him? Not that there's anything wrong with him, but do you think you would ever block him just so that you guys could just let each other go just because i wonder you said you still talk it sounds like you still talk to him and like first first relationships are notorious for the breaking up and getting back together because it's so comfortable and so easy and it's like the first person you like connected with outside of like your immediate friends and family that like you can tell things

to and you feel a level of trust. And then when like shit happens in your life, you want to like reach out to that person, but they're not. And then you kind of go back into a comfort zone. It's a fucking nightmare. Or it's like the trying with other people. And then it's like, I don't want to have to go through like telling this guy what my favorite color is and my favorite restaurant and what my family is like and all these different things and i'm just like you had only been broken up for like a couple weeks are you yeah but we were off and on before that yeah maybe we broke up months ago and then we broke up like like a month ago was it always you uh yeah it was always me being a little bit maybe too realist like i'm like a realist so wrong with that no nothing

and like i wish i was more realistic when i was younger i think it's fine everything will just work out we're meant to be yeah that's yeah that's very much him which i appreciate because like obviously it's a good i don't know like salt and pepper duo where it's like two different things um that come together but I like predicted how I was going to feel in the future where I knew two weeks ago when I was like it's done that I was like okay in two weeks when you go to college and you're with all these girls like I'm it's really gonna bother me and now it's really bothering me but it feels a little bit better so you almost did you break up with him like as a preventative measure yeah kind of it makes sense though you're right i mean like you're not wrong he new guy college yeah assuming your ex is an attractive fellow yeah you know girl's gonna be

into him yeah like he probably should explore these things totally that's the hard part i mean like me and my first girlfriend when i look back it's like yeah we really loved each other we really cared about each other but we spent so much time like you know we we try to experience life that all people should experience all while trying to like where we were like too afraid to let each other go. And that like create, that just created a lot of like toxic situations and a lot of like hurt and heartbreak because like we were kind of like, we didn't want to face the reality of like living life

and like meeting or just, yeah, or just like, hey, it's tough to like, you know, we were going to different colleges and I missed out on a lot of experiences because I was trying to make it work with her and then we would break up. And it's just like, it's tough to do. So good on you for knowing that.

When did you like stop, stop? It was a seven year thing. So be careful. Yeah, like heads up. Like don't do what I did. It was, we dated off and on for seven years. I'm curious, like not only was social media playing a role kind of like in romantic relationships,

but just like as a whole, like do you have boundaries that you try to implement for yourself or like how do you kind of balance the idea that on one hand it is very much work and so there's a professional element, but there's also this kind of personal element of wanting to stay grounded and stay present in the moment as opposed to not totally screen lock. Yeah, absolutely. I think that in the past couple of weeks, like I used to be before this all happened, I used to be very good at being like, this is my job and I'm going to post for this. And then after like I it's a Friday night so I can have dinner with my friends and like turn off my phone and that will be fine. With a breakup, it's like a whole other side to it because let's say I didn't have this following and like I was still like I was going to college and like all of these things.

I would be posting things to show the other person that I was really busy and doing all these different things. And I've noticed that that is really what I've been doing. And so balance hasn't necessarily been there, but I'm not mad about it. It's fine because at the end of the day, it's like more content for other people, which is totally good. So I don't know if that really answers your question, but it's how I've been feeling recently.

Have you chosen to, like where do you decide how to like open up about your feelings about the breakup or being sad? You don't. No. That must be a decision you made because a lot of people in your position lean into that. Yeah for me I think number one my feelings change so often where like one day I'll be like I just want to not talk about it ever and then the other day like I have this new aspect on

relationships that I really want to talk about but again it's like respecting the other person's privacy as well as like I know that other people are going to see it that are like in his life that I don't want to piss off as well. So I think it's just, I definitely have like a guard up on that aspect. You seem very considerate. Like you care about him. I care. Yeah.

He's my best friend. And it's so hard. Yeah. That's what's so hard. And that's what I really have realized is that it's like, you're best friends with this person. You see them every single day. You love them so much for years or months, however long it is. And then it's like you break up. And in my opinion, friendship breakups are even worse than like love breakups. And so when it's together and like both of them, that's oh that's really rough oh because he also was your friend yeah yeah yeah it's tough yeah like i said it's tough to miss that that person that you you counted on i feel like you guys are gonna get back together i don't think so but yeah great it's just tough yeah you're you're so you don't think so we're done so no i don't think so because

now it's moved on to the kind of like and i don't want to be too specific and like hurt his feelings, but like it's moved on to the classic like toxic relationship where now it's like being with other people just to like be with other people. And like it's very obvious that we're really nice to each other and like nice to each other's faces. But like to our own friends, we're like, oh each other and like nice to each other's faces but like to our own friends we're like oh no like you're venting yeah exactly kind of shit talking behind each other's back totally and like if my friends were to be like are you still talking with him i'd be like no like absolutely not are you crazy because i know that they would be mad at me how often are you still talking depends like every like today for example was his first day of college and school so i was like good luck at school and then he was like thanks or like thank you like knowing me i would have been like try not to get with anyone in econ but like i did

it i i had self-control today i chose niceness when's his birthday june june wait why are you gonna text him happy birthday i don't know. That's so long. That's like in a year. It's also so, it's very hard to like move on from someone when there's not someone else is like what I've realized as well, where it's like you again are like really close with someone and then you'll go on a date with someone else

and they just suck. You're like, oh, I really ruined that relationship with blah, blah, blah. Yeah, you're going to, but yeah, that with blah blah blah yeah you're gonna but yeah that's that's the hard part of dating you're just gonna meet more frogs than princes you gotta always that you have a shift through dirt to find gold like you're just you're always gonna meet more that's how it should be all the cliches are so true well otherwise yeah because otherwise it's not special then you don't get excited for the one person when you do have a really good

date if they're all good yeah like you're supposed to hate most of your dates oh yeah that's a good right yeah i think so not hate not get excited all the time if you're getting excited all the time then okay no all the time every date like oh my god they were amazing absolutely not no i hate dating i think you can see value in people for different reasons. No, I don't mean you can. I think it depends on how imaginative you are. It's like they're nice for someone else who's not me. Yeah, me too. I feel like the majority

of dates are like, okay, well, not my person, but... Yeah. I feel like I always go into it very much like, oh, this is going to be great. Yeah. I'm so excited. Figs. I mean, fig Yeah. I'm so excited. Figs. I mean, figs. It's a vibe.

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scratchy and uncomfortable. And my sister's tiny. She's like five, three, a hundred nothing pounds. And she says like she gets the same scrubs as a guy who's like a 3XL. So she's just drowning in them all the time. And now she has like a fitted, tailored look of super soft fabric in any color she wants. And I think she's probably providing better care when she's wearing her figs. She's feeling more comfortable. Ridiculously soft, proprietary four-wave stretch fabric, moisturizing, wicking, anti-wrinkle, anti-odor, up to 20 pockets on some styles. Easily customize yours with text and icon embroidery if you want. And also, you don't have to be a doctor. They're incredibly comfortable.

They're stylish. I wear them on walks all the time because it's like, I'm like, nothing in my everyday life can get me dirtier than I would be at a hospital. And I know these were designed for a hospital setting. So it's very reassuring if you're like, I just want to go. I might go on a hike. I might get kind of dirty. You just know you're wearing high quality, durable material that's going to be easy to clean. So get yourself some scrubs. Get the healthcare workers in your life some scrubs. They will appreciate you.

I mean. Also, shout out to the fig socks. I ordered a few pairs of socks from them. Very breathable. Very lovely. Good pair of socks are really fine. Doesn't surprise me. Yeah.

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Do you hit on? Would you approach a guy that you were interested in? I'm figuring all of this out because it's not like I don't go anywhere, but I don't have to go anywhere. Like I don't go to a physical school. I don't go to a physical job. If I wanted to, I could just be alone in my apartment and like no one would skip a beat in my career and things like that. So I'm figuring out where the best guys hang out and like how does that work? I don't necessarily want to meet someone on a dating app because I think that they're like, I don't know, that scares me. And also being on social media, it's weird because, not weird, but like someone can look you up. weird because not weird but like someone can look you up and again it's like they can see everything that you're doing but you can't you don't necessarily know everything that they're doing yeah there's a lot of like i know a lot about you already type of energy yeah and then like you get

into like i don't know what their intentions are and classic things like that how do you feel about being set up i feel good about being set up because i think that that's how I'm going to go about it. Where it's like if we have mutual friends, like then that is that's good. That's like a good leeway into something. You know what I mean? Are you going to be like alone for a while? Is this like a period of like singleness for Ellie? Or is it like you're eager to find someone else?

Because even though you just broke up with him, it's been an off and on thing for a while. And you kind of maybe want to start the next chapter of relationships. I think at the beginning, I was very much eager to just forget about it and move on and things like that. And now I'm just leaving it up in the air. If it happens, it happens. But also I'm not going to be like, I'm staying I'm leaving it up in the air you know if it happens it happens but also I'm not yeah I'm not gonna be like I'm staying single for this amount of months because I also feel like when you break up with someone a lot of people are like it's time to work on myself I personally like I work on myself all the time I feel pretty good about myself that like I think

again if it happens, it happens, but I'm not going to like sign up for all these dating apps and like go for it. You know what I mean? That's great. What are ways you work on yourself that you find helpful that you think people would benefit from if they started doing too? Like, is it just a mindfulness? Like, how do you always try to stay present? Because it can be hard for people. Like, you know, I always try to have balance, but balance can be tough. Cause like, if you're like really fix it in a relationship, whether it's going good or bad sometimes we can kind of lose ourselves in those things and not necessarily prioritize like you know aspects of

ourselves we have to work on how are you able to do that because it can be a challenge for people well first I think that that was another reason why I thought to break up with him in the beginning is because I really value like my alone time and my own opinions on things and things like that and I noticed that like I was maybe this is a problem that I might need to work on in therapy and so we could figure that out but it's like getting too close to someone where you can't see yourself being alone you know what i mean does that make sense sure yeah like a little like a codependency sure yeah yeah totally i just kind of like you do like envision like what would i do if i didn't have them here to get through this moment kind of thing yeah yeah exactly i guess the things that i do i mean just basic stuff like i have like my routine

set i try to learn things by myself I do all the things that make me feel good I have like friends and work out and things like that so I mean it's basic but also it works for me so I don't know feels good but also it sounds like just having that mindset like it's a priority for you to do yeah absolutely and then like another I mean of course breaking up with someone there are multiple reasons that go into everything like another reason was that I think that I was neglecting not neglecting but like ever since I was younger I always felt like I only needed I only needed like my family and things and like one or two really close friends

and so I was getting to the point where I only had like I not only but like I'm super, super close with my family. And then I was like super, super close with this guy who's again, my best friend and boyfriend envisioned him moving away and was like, oh, shoot, I need to like start branching out and making more friends. So I'm personally really proud at how much I've like stayed busy and distracted myself I've gotten a lot of advice that like that's the best thing to do but yeah I think that where I struggle is when I'm like not distracting myself and then I'm like sat just alone yeah that's a I think it's a common challenge yeah it's common what a state keep busy yeah that's great well I don't know if Danielle

and Nick are gonna be staying busy from Love is Blind. We had a lot of big Love is Blind breakups this week. It's like, thanks for making me feel better about that. What are your guys' opinions on that? Well, it's just, you know. I mean, they got married and having known each other for weeks. It was a big breakup this past week.

There was Ayanna and Jarrett split and then also Nick and Danielle. Back to back. Yeah. Pretty close. Do you think that, do they have like are contracts up? This just feels like convenient. There's not. I think it's weird that the timing is like so close.

It might be something as simple as once one did, one of them felt like okay to. They had the same divorce attorney and it like just took them a little bit whatever you know like sorry they broke up not shocked you know oh i was rude it was funny when the when ayana and uh garrett with the jared broke up i was talking with natalie my girlfriend and i'm like oh well shocker nick and danielle the only successful couple and then like a day later, they announced their divorce.

Well, it was interesting because in an earlier article or interview that they'd done, they spoke about how, quote, we're trying to take every single day to figure out how to interpret what the other person is saying, because my definition of something could be entirely different to what they think it is. And so I'm curious, like if you said that, who said that? Danielle. And so I'm curious, like if that's something like how in relationships you think you can navigate, like both identifying that points where you might be misinterpreting what the other person is saying and also what you think the primary areas where that can arise is. Yeah. How often did you and your ex while in a relationship like fight or disagree? It seemed like we wouldn't disagree at the beginning of it. And then like at the end,

it was getting to be over everything. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Cause that is a challenge sometimes too. It's tough. Like in your situation, it sounds like the probably correct me if I'm wrong, that the fights or the conflict had to do with maybe some of the changes you guys knew were coming and things like that and that pressure but i think like you know what she was saying too in relationships it's like like when you first fight with someone in a relationship i don't know how it was with you but like you see a different side of of the people or just even conflict where you disagree and then you realize that's the most frustrating part too. It's like you have your first fight.

And then after you resolve that fight, you realize that we probably didn't have to fight for that first 45 minutes, but we weren't seeing like, we weren't like, it took the first 45 minutes to get to the two minutes at the end. That was actually productive. Yeah. Right.

Cause you're just like, you're, you're not listening. You're arguing, you're fighting. And it sounds like that was like a really nice way of her saying we fight a lot and we're trying to figure out how not to right and this is from when they're still trying to make it work i think it's in like the idea of a relationship starting at marriage do you think that incentivizes

them to be a little bit more like to what extent like having been on kind of reality tv and also for them being in the public eye to what extent do you think they have more of an incentive or just more pressure to have a good relationship or a successful there's definitely incentive and pressure to have a successful relationship when your whole social media platform is based off the relationship that started on a show i think the big question is trying to figure out, because even when I was going through it, I knew I was being influenced by the pressures of the show. And I also felt real feelings. And trying to figure out which one's stronger or which one is having more impact in any given moment is the real challenge.

Right. And you also have the commentary from everybody else. And that was something that Harry Styles mentioned in a recent in his interview with Rolling Stone. He spoke a lot about how there's this corner of the Internet that is just going to say atrocious things about the people he dates no matter what. And it made me wonder, you know, the saying, if you marry someone, you marry their family. When you date someone, do you date their fans? Yes. So probably. Yes probably yes was like did you keep did you keep your boyfriend pretty private from your audience or did people know at the beginning I didn't and he was very much like on social media with me and I would show him a lot and then like months and months ago we broke up um for the first time and that was really hard like just deleting everything and everyone's opinions on things.

And so then I kept things even more private. So I don't know what the... Do you think your audience will be critical of like who you choose to date in the future going forward. Because audiences, your fans can be, well fans, but also they have this sense of I know you, I care about you, I want the best for you, even though you didn't ask for any insight or opinions. It's literally like your friends.

Yeah, and you're just like, I don't know. And they get a little judgy about the people that you, including your lives, that do you, is that something that you think about or like are mindful of or is that probably why you, probably because like if you're hairy,

like yeah, it must be. That's such a good like relation where it is just like your family or your friends, you know? Yeah. Also,

it's like if you're dating Harry Styles, like I feel like you should just go into it with that. Like, you know, you're going to get hateful. It's going to be tough. Okay.

It's going to be tough because like, no matter what, eventually it's hard, it's hard not to believe that. It's hard not to let that seep in. Yeah. You know,

so you can tell yourself all the time, like, oh, that's just one, there's only five hateful comments, but like, it feels like 50 or 50 feels like 500.

I also wonder if the fear of being Harry Styles' partner is they're right about me or what if he thinks they're right about me. That's so true. But like Harry fans though, that's just like a different level. Like people would like, there are deep, deep Harry Styles fans where it's just like. Like we're talking the Tumblr generation. Yes. That's what I'm saying is either way it could like.

No matter who he's dating they're gonna like send you death threats because they want to marry him like and they think it's possible because they want to marry oh yes oh yeah hardcore like these people like fierce protection but yeah do you feel like with your fans like do you feel like you can impact to what extent do you feel like you can impact their behavior or kind of guide them in directions that you want? I think that for me, okay, at the beginning, they were like impacting like what I was thinking about. Again, when you like you see something so many times, you start to believe it. And so that's why like I guess my advice on that would just be like be more private about things.

That's why it's like with my next relationship, I don't know if that, I mean, it just completely depends on the person. But like, I don't know if that's going to be something that I want to focus on or not. You know what I mean? No, it's a hurdle. Yeah. It's a whole other conversation. Do you watch Selling Sunset?

I do. Okay. What do you think about Christine leaving? Like, I don't know what the show is gonna be anymore right totally yeah i have no idea what the show is gonna be anymore also have you seen jason's new girlfriend did you see that one i did yep you did yeah this seems like an odd pairing odd pairing yeah here's what i know i don't know how it's going to be but i know i do know how it's going to be and that someone else know how it's going to be.

And that someone else, well, see, Christine's a star. She, villain, whatever you want to call her, but she is a star. And so only people have that star quality, but they will find that from someone else. So while all these women from the show who are speaking negatively about her, they're going to get their drama. They always get their drama. They know, they always get their drama.

They're not going to make a whole season without any villain. I just hope that it's as good as her because she was so good. So the question is, who in the current Selling Sunset cast, I know they're bringing in two people and maybe it will be from those two newbies,

but who do we think can or will, who will they turn on? Well, it goes back to what you were saying earlier ellie about how friendship breakups are so painful and i think part of the reason christine was able to stir the pot in the big way was she had these long-standing relationships with people like her and mary were roommates so it wasn't just oh you're being atrocious in this setting it's like and we have this history before the cameras and before the tv where i really thought we were friends so it's like can you get that same level of drama without the like pre-existing relationship maybe

now with the new cast not maybe not with the new ones but what about like these cast people these well the women the women obviously you have Jason and his brother they've have relationships they're gonna get the drama somehow it's just a matter of who's going to take the bullet. Like we said, is someone going to do it as well as Christine? Because I think she is a mastermind at what she's created on TV, what she's created on social media, the way she interacts with her fans versus her persona on the show. How much do you think that's who she is or it's a mastermind kind of masterclass? I don't know. I i mean every time i've interacted with her she's been nothing but like sweet and nice and over the top friendly and so it's like

hard for me feeling like i somewhat know the person behind the screen to then see but then i also have such doubts because what was at the end of season five when she and mary had that like final kind of like and i was like i don't agree with you in this. You're not making sense. So it was like, it was such this like cognitive dissonance because it's like, I've always like, I don't even know. Like I was like, I don't, I see the questions Mary's asking you and you're not answering them specifically.

And at the end, it just started to be so like such crazy lies that she was telling, like such crazy situations where I was like expecting it to end. You know what I mean? We're like, oh, is it the last episode or the last couple of episodes where she paid someone not to work? Well, but then she goes on Call Her Daddy and says that that whole thing was a lie and she would have never paid someone that. And she was like, they needed a reason for me to leave the brokerage she now has a brokerage with her husband that utilizes cryptocurrency for people to buy houses like she there is a lot of

wheels turning a lot of her own show right that's the thing and there was a statement from her team of she didn't want to be part of an ensemble cast she said from the beginning that she would love to do her own thing and she said she wanted to focus on fashion and yeah the platform yeah but i real open i i well part of what made her star is her ability to interact with the ensemble right yeah the way she was like from the very beginning it was like very blunt and wasn't afraid to show up in a way it was it was how different she was than everyone else yeah totally and also how she treated these like long, as you were saying, like the longstanding relationships where it's like, if she brings random people on a new cast and is mean to them,

then that's just being mean. Like, it's like you just met someone and now you're just like a mean person. She starts her own show and she like brings all these other people to like, you know, kind of peons or whatever. And she just starts like, there's the element of like,

you're a bullet. Yeah. There's the element of like, like, oh wow, this is really like deep-rooted if it's like but the thing is season one she and mary were still close you know what i mean it's like we had all those scenes of the two of them drinking wine and walking their dogs and the issue between her and mary in season one was when chrishell came in and christine said this she's like my idea of loyalty is i kill someone you grab a shovel.

And she didn't feel like Mary was loyal to her. She felt like Mary was more loyal to Chrishell. That's like the crack in the marble or I don't know what I'm trying to say.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then it became this whole thing. But that's why it's like if she were to make a new show, I would be scared to trust it because then it's like, so is she being nice

to these people so she can have like this like long-standing relationship from the first season you're saying if we saw like a different side of Christine

like a sweet and endearing mother figure you'd be like bitch I don't know I don't know about that like we've seen the other side it'll be interesting

it will be but I wonder if selling side sets make a mistake yeah what's juicy about it is like clearly there was like

a falling out, right? Mm-hmm. Because she is the star. I mean, she is a huge part of the show. They claimed it was mutual. Do we believe that?

It's never mutual. Ever. No breakups are mutual. There might be like- I don't think it would have been like 50-50 per se, but I think she could have had concerns,

which she's voiced on media tours and in her book, of how she was being treated by production, by Adam. She might not have been ready to throw in the full towel, but yeah, I wonder if she kind of like stated a deal breaker. Yeah. And they were like, we're not going to do that. Do you think, around the room, we'll start with you,

do you think the show will, who do you think will regret the breakup more like who will who will win this breakup so to speak i think as time passes will will win or regret it i think the show will regret it like already since she hasn't been a part of the cast i feel like on social media she's been thriving so much more and gotten into the fashion industry and made all these new friends. I kind of agree with you. I mean, that's the thing also, too, is your hero is only as ever good as your villain. And so you can't, the Crichels, who I consider a friend, love Crichel.

What made Crichel so likable is the juxtaposition of having Christine. Where's that contrast going to come from? Where's that contrast coming from? What made Chrishell so likable is like the juxtaposition of having Christine. And so like. Where's that contrast going to come from? Where's that contrast coming from? And do we see like Chrishell's like the biggest star in the show now. And could the women turn on Chrishell? Could Chrishell be like to be a villain because, you know. Well, I also think.

I don't know. It's anything's possible. Because that was sometimes a drama. A point of drama was the way that Mary was getting more listings and the romantic history element. And so I feel like that's a really effective mechanism is this idea that romantic relationships are changing the way someone treats you at work. And especially now that Chrishell has dated Jason, If Jason dates another one of the realtors, that's your drama right there. Is this new girlfriend of Jason's

going to be part of the show? I haven't heard anything. We're adding two new agents. I say we. I'm one of the cast members. They're adding two new cast members, one of which actually has been on the show before. She's a long-term friend of Jason and Mary's.

She married Mary and Romaine in the episode. She was at the bachelorette party. The other one is Nick Cannon's baby mama. I'm interested in that. Brie? Yeah, I think her name is. Which one? Those two are being battled. One of. Her name is Brie.

Her name is Brie. Plus the new girl that Christine brought on before. What's her name is Brie. Her name is Brie. Yeah. So either they could be. Plus the new girl that Christine brought on before. What's her name? Chelsea. Yeah. Like, do we think that. Chelsea could be an easy, like, try to shove her in a villain role. Because she and Christine had such similar mannerisms, I thought.

Yeah, me too, me too. I don't know. She will be missed. All right. R.I.P. Well, on to bigger and better, Christine. Oh, 100%. But she will be missed by the Selling Sunset cast. That she will.

All right. It's time for texting office hours. How's it going? Good. My name is Mallory. I'm 27. Hi, Mallory. How can we help? So I need help shooting my shot with this guy. I think I probably have about a 50-50 chance that he's interested. Okay. So we met about a year and a half ago through a mutual friend. And I think she was trying to set us up. She never really like directly said it. I'm not that close to the mutual friend. But we hung out a few times in a group setting and she invited him because she wanted me to meet him.

And then she asked me what I thought of him after a couple of times. And I told her like, I think he's cute. But at the time I was very, I was trying to not focus on dating just because I've been focused on that for so long. And I was like, I'm just happy being single. I don't want to like try to force anything. And she said that he was in a very similar place and that he wasn't really the type to make a move or that he wasn't going to make a move. And I do know that he's kind of a quieter, maybe like more shy guy. So I didn't really think much of it. But if I'm being honest, I think deep down, I was hoping that he would be interested. So we hung out a couple times in a group. And then one night we were at a bar and he invited me over for another drink. So I went over there and we had good conversation. We talked for a couple hours, had a lot in common.

And then I lived close by. So he offered to walk me home and we hugged goodbye. And he said something like, let's hang out again or let's do this again. So I assumed that he would after that, like ask our mutual friend for my number, but he never did. And I never really heard anything else from her. And I wasn't that, I wasn't close enough to our mutual friend to like really ask about it. So we hung out once more after that in a group. And then shortly after that, he followed

me on Instagram and he would like occasionally reply to one of my stories, but didn't really like keep the conversation going. Like he would reply to my story. I would respond to what he said and then he would just like hurt the message or whatever. And the last time we had any communication was maybe like five or six months ago. And since then I've seen him on dating apps. So I know he's still single. And I think that's kind of what triggered like, okay, I should make a move because I'm still like thinking about him after this all this time. So the reason I say I think I have a 50-50 chance is because he had all the opportunity to show interest in me if he wanted to. But I just have this feeling that

because of his personality and because of what she had said that he's not the type to make a move that I possibly have some chance. So I wanted your perspective on number one, if you think I should go for it. And if so, I kind of want to do it like in a natural way. I don't want to just message him out of the blue, like, hey, want to get a drink? So there is a show coming up at the end of October with an artist that I know we both follow. So I thought somehow maybe I could work that in. But I just wanted to get your perspective on it.

I think, why not? There's no reason not to try. I think to your point, you're right. Like, you don't really know. There's a lot of possibilities. And even though like your friend or your mutual friend who said like he's more reserved, like that definitely could end up being, you know, just something that she said and like you're reading into it. But the point is you don't know if you're reading into it. You know, I really don't know much about him at all. And so you have a concert coming up that you want to take them to?

Well, I just thought like that's a potential in since we haven't talked in so many months that like if I said, hey, I just saw that there's a show coming up. I know you also follow this person. Like, would you want to go? I thought that's like maybe one way for it to be a little more natural. Sure. But I also, it also could come across like you've been thinking about them too much in the past five months and like planning concert dates with them.

I think, when is this concert? It's not for like two months, end of October. Perfect. We have plenty of time. So like, that's a good thing to have in your back of your mind,

but like, it was like a goal of the thing you take them to, but I would just kind of set that aside for now. Okay. Why do you, why, why, like,

what's your fear of just like reaching out? Like what's the harm in, in, in that? Cause you're like, you were like saying, I want it to be more organic. Like,

yeah, I get it. Ideally you'd have to run into him at the grocery store and be like, Oh my God, you go out. Like, I think my fear is what you just said that it would be like oh i've been thinking about you and all of a sudden i'm just messaging

you out of the blue like ideally we he would like post something and then i could respond to that but he's like not on instagram that much so if you dm'd him would you not have the confidence that he got it i think he would but I would feel like he was thinking that I was like thinking about him all this time. On some level, you're going to have to like, let him know that you, he was on your mind. Yeah. Like, but there's a difference between like, Hey, like a joke, like, you know, like, like he showed up on your Explorer page or something, or like maybe he did pop into your head and you are compelled to reach out that's that's chill that's fine that's different than being like

i have this concert in two months and i thought we should go point taken so yeah i feel like i think we just dm him go on his instagram right now right now yeah what am i looking for it's like a picture where there's things going on. I'm intrigued where you're going with this. He does like tennis. Okay. So like, I'm just saying you send him, like there's a picture of a tennis, I don't know.

Like you send him the picture in his DMs and then you ask him a question about something in the picture. Wait, also, what if you were like, hey, I want to get into tennis. Yeah. Like, do you want teach me tennis i know and i know it's kind of infantilizing but i still think it could be fun and then you're doing like you know one of my friends who was into this guy who played like basketball or whatever went into all the basketball accounts that he was following and would like put post notifications on

for all of those accounts. So when they would post, she would like like them, like them, like them. And then he would see her liking them. And then he actually reached out and was like, oh, you like this? Like I saw you're liking this. That's a lot of effort.

That is a lot. But it's also- I mean, I'm saying. That's like Jedi mind trick. That's a lot of effort. That is a lot. But it's also- I mean, I'm saying. That's like Jedi mind trick. That's good. What if there's like, rather than sending something from his profile, what if there's like a bar or somewhere

that you want to go if they have an Instagram? Like, couldn't she send like a restaurant or a bar's Instagram to him and be like, hey, do you want to try this place out on Friday? I mean, that's sure she could do that. I just feel like that's a little more direct than like tennis hey, do you want to try this place out on Friday? I mean, sure, she could do that. I just feel like that's a little more direct than tennis. Or what if she sent the concert thing? You know what I mean?

Do you only know that he likes this band because he follows them, or did you guys talk about it? No, it's just because he follows them. And they're kind of obscure. He's the only other one of my followers who follows them. Yeah, so keep that in your back pocket i i think here's like you know you kind of started by saying well i don't really want him to know that i've been thinking about like i want it to be casual and i i feel like like you got to find the balance like you know yeah could you send

him a restaurant and just be like hey let's go out let's grab another drink sure you could totally do that. And probably, you know, if he's interested, it'll probably work. But I just think there's something to be said about, like, you want him to know you're flirting with him, right? Like, it should be assumed. Asking him out for a drink makes that clear, too. No, I know, but you keep it a little coy. It's like he knows, but you don't know.

That's the fun part of dating and chasing and DM is that little game of like, I mean, she wouldn't reach out if she's asking about tennis. Maybe I'm crazy, but I think that kind of game of like, getting a message from a girl you've went on two dates with that you haven't talked to in five months

and she's just like, let's go to Craig's or whatever. Also, I feel like you've already done that already. Like an activity would be great at this point. You know what I mean? Yeah. Showing a different side of yourself. You could make a joke.

Like now it would be a good for a joke, acknowledging that you haven't gone out for five months. Like be like, hey, I know like we really need to like take some time to like figure out how the second date went, but I think we're ready for our third. You know, something like playful. And to to be clear we never went on a date we only hung out in group settings except for that one time when it was like very casual at his house oh so that yeah so maybe a joke about like i think i'm i'm personally i'm ready for our first date i mean

at the end of the day you know you're seeing if he has a sense of humor like you're clearly joking this is one of those things you can always have the confidence that like you can't fuck this up he's either interested or he's not right and if he's not then like wouldn't take it personally he might not be interested for all the wrong reasons but you can't convince him if he's not willing to give you a shot right like yeah and i have nothing to lose i'm never gonna see him again yeah i i vote a kind of a casual dm slide that's not so like we should go here or win here but like maybe make like without being like i've missed you i've been thinking about you you just say what should she say what did you guys like have a notable drink where you could be like hey we gotta get back on the rum and cokes that sounded so lame i said it a lot but like yeah and i know that he's like interested in making drinks like he's into bartending not as his job but just like

for fun oh my god like a little recipe yeah that's such a good idea like it'd be like i found this insane cocktail recipe and thought of you like when can I come over oh I love the thought of you yeah yeah yeah oh I like that so now we're if someone did that to you like what would you think

well it comes down to if he's interested or not yeah so it really doesn't matter but that's true in this particular case there's not like

an ongoing conversation of like how do we respond in this situation yeah it ultimately but if you look up there's gotta be like a cocktail account that's posted recently for sure and then you just send it on instagram for me yeah be like want to try this out this weekend or it could be like to see if

he's interested you could be like you should like saw this and thought you should make it and then if he says together then you're in you know what i mean right you don't want to really leave the door open for him yeah but the question is if do we want to well the question is like that might be a little too casual for someone she hasn't talked to in five months like she is like kind of like trying to resurrect yeah a thing so i think you do you do need to be a little bit more forward especially with a guy who's not you know like i think that would this is a great plan with someone you know is a little charming and kind of you know it doesn't need to be like let's say we send this drink idea do we there's like two options one is a thought out like thought of you

and think we should make this together or just be like send it be like we should make this that's it and this particular one i like the second first because the i thought of you is a little heavy in this scenario yeah i think just sending it we should make like we should make this yeah that's a yeah there's like no harm no foul like and we like that better than like a joke teasing about the fact that like they haven't hung on in five months but she's reaching out yeah i think what could that what could you say with that she could always follow up with a joke afterwards sorry i'm trying to find her a cocktail to send. Allie's doing research. I love it.

But I do think it's good to send it one specifically because the we should make this is so casual. It's not being like, will you do this for me? It's a definitive let's do this together. And you don't think that's too forward after going so long without talking? You might as well be forward it's right it's more random than forward i don't think it's too forward we should do this it's just a little random because he hasn't heard from you but it leaves so much like if he responds in a great way then like you have that date set yeah you know as

opposed to being like oh i i thought of this and blah blah blah and then he it's putting it in his hands you know what i mean that's true she's right yeah you can't there you have you don't have much to lose and at the end of the day he should figure out all we really want and all we really want him to know is that you are interested in going out with him like it should come across as at least like flirtatious especially if we're talking about a guy who's like not picking up on like signals maybe you need to be a little bit more direct with this this guy without being like been thinking about you i could also like wait until the next time he posts and then like try to start because i haven't replied to a lot of his stories it's usually him replying to

me so i could try to like build conversation so wait he's still replying to your stories he was for a while up until like a few months ago okay we don't like our og okay yeah i'm fine with that we should make this do we and i think like no exclamation points no nothing just we should make this definitely no excellent yeah we don't want to be too excited. Yeah. And definitely not a period terrifying. We should make this all capital. Screaming. Flame emoji.

Flaming emoji. Like chef emoji. Oh, chef emoji. That could be good. Should I say hey or just? No, no. We should make this.

We should make this. Throw it out there. I love it. No notes. Hear me out. We just made it perfect. Fine, we can go back to perfect if it's still perfect.

We're going to listen. We're just brainstorming here. There's no bad ideas. And it still might be perfect perfect but my one concern is that it's it is just a little random and i'm wondering if we incorporate both plans like you have a like a soft open followed immediately by we should do this or we should make this and and it would be like a soft open like we're like some sort of like, what prompted you, even if it's total bullshit,

to like think of him? And it could be like this, his most recent picture. And maybe because like Instagram's fucked up, you can be like, I don't know, the algorithm fed it to me today. From three years ago.

That's his last post? It was a while ago. That would be so funny. Post on the stories like every it was a while ago yeah the algorithm showed me this yeah maybe that's what you should say be like i don't know weirdest story i just saw this post must be the algorithm we should make this i think it's hysterical that's unhinged sending Sending multiple. Two posts. So there's no soft open up idea. Not if he doesn't post frequently. She can't be like, how was your vacation? He's like, 2007?

I don't know. Maybe it's like the next message is something that's like, consider this like a five month notice or like something about something. I feel like the follow up message could be. We start random. He responds. Then be like, so crazy. We haven't spoken, but we should do.

You know what I mean? Yeah. Then we address it. Then not dating. Or like if you're like, I know it's been five months, but we should make this. I like that. I like that. Best of both worlds.

Yes. Okay. Okay. I know it's been five months. I like that i like that best of both worlds yes okay okay i know it's been five months i like that wait but you're saying exactly five months like a little weird i know it's been a while it's been a while okay it's been a while more general i like that too months but i've been dying i know and eight hours but we should make this tonight okay i like that plan all right all right let us know how it goes okay i will thank you so much all right all right good luck okay bye-bye how's it going i'm going good i'm i'm casey my name 24. casey how can we help all right so a couple months ago i matched with this girl on Hinge.

She actually matched with me first. And then I matched back. Immediately, like super into her. I'm kind of tall. I'm like 5'9". So it's kind of tall for a girl. And my preference is shorter or not shorter. Like, so it's kind of hard for me to find a girl that's my height or taller.

So immediately, I was like, oh, my God, she's 5'11". I don't know what to do with myself. So basically we were texting like nonstop for like a week straight and it was really good. The conversation flowed really well, which is super important to me when the conversation like flows nicely. And then all of a sudden she just kind of stopped texting. I gave it like five, and she just kind of stopped texting. I gave it like five, six days because I didn't want to seem like too eager. So I gave it some time and then I texted her and I was just kind of like, you know, are you ghosting? Did you just lose interest or are you busy? Like what? I just kind of wanted to know what was going on. And she was just kind of like, oh, yeah, you know, my cousin's in town. I'm busy.

Sometimes she threw at me. Sometimes I just stopped talking to people out of nowhere. I'm like, oh, okay. And congrats. You're one of those people. Right, right. Oopsie. I guess I am.

So I was like, all right, well, that's fine. She didn't say she wasn't interested. So I was like, okay, I guess we're's fine. She didn't say she wasn't interested. So I was like, okay, I guess we're just fine now. But then it started again. She just wasn't answering. So I was like, okay, we're done. Like it's only been a week and a half.

So I was like, you know, I'm not sad. I'm not mad. I'm just disappointed because I was really excited. And then all of a sudden she starts, like a couple of weeks after that, she starts Snapchatting me. We were mainly DMing on Snapchat. You were back on Snapchat. She's Snapchatting me again.

What is she Snapchatting you? Just conversations? She's like, hey? Or are we sending nudes or something? Well, she started Snapchatting normal Snapchat. So it was just pictures of her dog or what she's doing for the day. And I'm like, OK, I guess we're friends now. So I was just confused. Just randomly sending nudes. but I'm also excited because she's talking to me again and I'm like okay well I'll take what I can get so we're just snapchatting um a few weeks go by and I'm just

kind of like it's flirtatious but it's it's it feels more flirtatious on my end than on her than on hers so I'm kind of just like really confused. And I kind of want to send her a text, like kind of getting to the bottom of it, because I guess I should like Hinge, I don't know if you guys know, has this feature now where you can put your relationship goals. So she put hers as figuring out her relationship goals. And I put mine as, you know, looking for long-term, but open to short-term. And she could be one of those people that kind of mine as you know looking for long term but open to short term and she she could be one of those people that kind of just you know scans through really quickly and doesn't really read everything but like if she read then you read like that I'm looking what I'm looking for

so I'm I'm just I guess I'm just really conflicted because I don't I don't want to scare her away why um with this what do you like about her? Well, I like that she's driven. I am getting my master's degree. I have got this weird trajectory that's going up. I kind of want to be with someone who's kind of on a similar path. She's also getting her master's degree. So it's like we have similar goals there and we have this we have a lot

of the same interests like music we have a very similar sense of humor like i said her height is a big deal to me as weird as it sounds like it's really nice to find a girl that's as tall or taller than me so i mean i don't know i just got really excited those are nice for some reason nice things but you can find those yeah with others also just just spitball in here but like well it's nice to like have someone like specifically your career goals like your master's like that's awesome that you have these ambitious goals and it's going to obviously take work you want people to support you and it's nice to be dating work. You want people to support you. And it's nice to be dating someone that you can relate to.

But I would argue that it would be more important to be dating someone who more than anything is just like really in your corner and really supportive of you. Because you could be dating someone who's just as ambitious and have similar goals, but like they're too focused on their ambitions and their goals. And they're too focused on their ambitions and their goals

and they're too into like what they want to do and they don't have like the emotional space or empathy to really give a shit about yours so that's true that's something to consider i don't i don't only care about i guess it's also more about somebody who understands that makes any sense like yeah if i you know know am working and then i have school and like i have this and that like it's something to have somebody who gets that is really nice too i i mean i think i think what you do here is you try to get your your goal should be getting clarity here because like you said a couple times you're confused and i don't know if you should spend too much more time investing in someone who's really only made you feel confused and shorter.

Have you guys ever tried to meet in person or has it only been online? I've tried. We actually had like a date. So we never met her in person yet? No, no. Do we know they're real? Do we know they're real? Yes, yes. Have you faced? She sent me like Snapchat videos of her talking. person yet no no do we know she could be lying about her height do we know they're real yes yes

have you faced she's she sent me like snapchat videos of her talking but i assume you haven't facetimed her no it's just good for you to know that unless you meet someone in person or at least facetime on you know we live in a world that like you just gotta just know that like you could be getting catfished like it's a real thing. I'm not saying this is probably what's going on, but like her behavior is random. Yeah. And like, what does that even mean?

I just stopped talking to people sometimes. That's a weird thing to say. Well, yeah, I know you don't know because none of us know. It's weird. Honestly, I've totally done that. And it's been when I was in kind of like oh like it's been when i was dating it was from a place of kind of like avoidance distraction or like it just i was just like a little little flighty like a little

unfounded where it was like kind of like sometimes i have the capacity to do this and it feels like it would be great and then other times i absolutely don't and like and then i i would feel like a sense of guilt because i knew it was really fucking shitty to like stop talking to someone out of the blue and to be like using them as like only to only be considering when I wanted to talk to them and for me it was just like an indication of like I was just at a very like volatile like a lot of different things going on it wasn't sure like definitely was not dating with intention sure yeah I Yeah. I kind of just, yeah, I kind of just wish that is exactly how this feels, honestly. And like, I don't want to like judge anybody for feeling that way, which is why I kind

of was just like, okay, sure. That's weird. But like, whatever. But at the same time, I gave her like the opportunity to tell me exactly what was going on. And that's all she said to me. So I was like, um, I didn't. Yeah yeah i think you should reach out shoot your shot i don't think you should even try to be all that creative like this is something you've matched with you've invested a

lot of time with they've gone they've come back it's really over snapchat i'm just saying like a one one like i don't think it's i don't think it's a catfish but catfish is often will pull away when you like ask like they there's they're they're very clever on how they like come and go in and out of your lives and it just makes no sense to why is this person who who doesn't know you and you don't know them sending you like random dog pictures about their life i i can see where it's like i'm gonna cut off these people because i'm studying for like i my cousins here blah blah blah and then you know you're sitting alone bored and then you're like oh yeah picture of cup let's get it and like start it up again okay yeah i don't think it's catfish i don't think so i don't think it's a catfish. I'm just saying I think there's more unknowns than knowns, even though you've been trying to get a lot of information.

You've tried to hang out with them. You've put in this effort. So what I'm saying is I think you put out one more last-ditch effort, which is like, hey, let's grab coffee this week. I'd love to finally get to meet you. Or if nothing else, hey, how about we have like a FaceTime date or something that like advances this relationship? Because right now you just have this like mystery pen pal

who like is like, you know, confusing you, like keeps you preoccupied, but it's not going anywhere. And like you shouldn't be investing this much energy with someone you have never met on a dating app. I also, I wonder if in the message you can kind of call out the behavior without being too shady. shouldn't be investing this much energy with someone you have never met on a dating app i also i wonder if in the message you can kind of call out the behavior without being too shady you know because like because that's the thing where it's like i felt very when i was like when i was behaving badly in that way like i was the second someone like acknowledged i was like oh my god i'm

so sorry like i was just distracted and busy and over you know and so i wonder if there's a way to just kind of be like set up like hey do you want to get coffee or like if you can't like okay this is this is a brainstorm this is a starter pitch I don't this is not right but like something like oh but like if you can't offer consistency I totally get it but like if you can't go a week without ghosting someone like no worries let's just stop wasting each other's time I like it but I feel like in this it's like, I don't think we need the passive aggressive. But is there, I guess what I'm saying, is there a way to make it from passive aggressive

to just like kind of just like acknowledging it? I think we can send the original one of making a plan or offering something up. And if she responds with like a shutdown or no, I'm too busy, then maybe a response is, okay, well, let me know if your schedule ever opens up. But in the meantime, like I'm not just looking to Snapchat someone. I mean, yes, you could say that,

but I think it's unnecessary for you to have to say that. I think if you get the, no, I'm too busy, I think you just like block them. And that's not missing something. And that's where you have to be strong. Yeah. I say that because real or not, this person is already, it's like it's someone who is consuming a ton of your thoughts and energy

and you know nothing about them. You don't have a relationship with them. They're just someone you met on a dating app. And you've developed this crush on this person. And I get all the reasons why you've articulated them. And that's a dangerous position to be in to like have just enough information to crush on someone you really don't know. And they dangle these carrots with just a little bit of validation and attention just so you can keep crushing on them. And it's fun. It's fun to have a crush.

I get it. It's fun to just like, but at some point, it just becomes something that, again, just starts frustrating you more. You go from being excited about a crush to just being like annoyed and confused. And then you're like asking your friends and you're at that stage now and you've already asked to like hang out. You haven't gotten that. So like you try one more time and if not, then you just have to look at it as like this person doesn't want, you made it clear you want to hang out. You know, you don't need to like, I think you're wasting your time and it's beneath you at this point to say, well, if you ever want to, let me know. You've already let them know.

Yeah. at her mercy, at her convenience, when she wants to reach out, when she wants to message you. And it's kept you preoccupied because every time you get that snap or that text, it's that like dopamine hit of like excitement and like, you know, like how exciting, you know? And I get it. We've all been there. Like it's fucking fun to like be in the receiving end of the text that you were hoping to get or the Snapchat you were hoping to get. But this is a person who seems to also enjoy doing that with you and having this control or power over you and coming and going when they please and not willing to give you the things that you're asking for. And you're not asking for much. You're just asking to literally meet.

I want to make it clear in the text that i want to meet up but like i have these certain intentions does she have the same intentions you're not even there yet though you're not even there yet but that was gonna be my question is like because i feel like i know a ton of my like like you know when i go on dates with like queer women it's like very easy to just be like okay we're not vibing in a romantic way but like let's be good friends and like it's so I think that is so common and pervasive that I do think it is a little bit more warranted to be like hey like checking in like you interested in like making this like a date yeah date or a friend date or something well how about what if she did this it's less it's less socially normal for me to do that with a guy where it's like, with a girl, it's like, you could be friends.

Totally. So I totally understand that. I guess I'm just still struggling with the fact that she's not friend, girlfriend, whatever the dynamic is. Yeah. You should meet them. Yeah. So whether it's a friend or a romantic partner, this is a lot of energy you're investing in someone who's like very unavailable to you so true so i think correct me and like you let me

know what you ladies think but what if you put yourself out you message them and say hey listen i've really enjoyed talking to you i look forward to it i've had a lot of fun you seem great you seem don't say you are great because you don't know. Let them know that there's more to think. But I would love to get together with you. I'd love to. Let's grab coffee. Let's grab a FaceTime and see what she says to that. Express that you've enjoyed it. Express that you like her, what you know so far, and then see if she's willing to take a next step. And if she's not willing to take a next step, there's definitely a reason why. Yeah.

And it has nothing to do with you. And then you need to put yourself in a power position where it's like, I always like to have someone question, do I even like them? You know what I mean? Like, do I, like, although they're good looking and have all these features that I really like, like when I meet them,

do, do I even like them? Like, that's where you need to get, you know what I mean? Because right now to Ellie's point is like, she, she is making you chase.

And when you're the person who's always waiting, always chasing, always hoping that they tank next to you, those people are often never actually even thinking about if you like them, because you're just, you, you're worried about her validating you. Oh, that's gold. That's so good. So now we need a draft attack.

I think she should say, this is great. I love, hey, I really enjoy talking with you, but I'd love to meet you. Like, I want to see where this can go. Like, I think you have to say, I think need to name that you you want more from this however you want to name that or yeah if you're like like i would love to hang out tricky even if it's just like what friendship can we just treat it like a text do you have her do you have her number but it's like i do have her number so don't snap her text her text. Text her, text her, text her, text her. Yes, yes.

Okay. Great idea. Be like, hey, I've really enjoyed our conversations. I look forward to hearing from you. Or you could even say, I need to meet you to keep doing this, whatever this is. Because if they have excuses,

it's like pay attention to their excuses if they say no. And then ask yourself... I have to meet up with you to keep doing this? Well think you could be more like hey i love what we're doing i'd like to like let's what do you do you know if they're local yeah yeah she's like 20 minutes from me yeah nick you know pick a place i love i love this place i'd love to show you i'd love to take you there okay ask her on a date a date. This is through text, right? Yeah. Yeah.

But they're talking like as if they're in this like, correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like you guys are talking on a regular basis where you've been on four or five great dates and you're like maybe haven't defined the relationship, but they're like talking on the regular. Yeah. And maybe they've hooked up a few. None of that.

They've just met on a dating app and then this weirdly got gotten this like relationship. It's like she's trying to build a relationship with you via Snapchat. And whether you're being catfish or not, that is definitely how catfishes operate. And if she's not a catfish, then she's either in a relationship with someone else. There's a reason why this person who wants to have this ongoing relationship with you via messaging doesn't want to meet you. The point is express interest that you liked her and you've enjoyed it. Be nice, but be direct and assertive and unflexible that you want to meet. Should I say like a specific day or just whenever?

More like, I think you could offer a specific place. Hey, I love this place. I'd love to show you. Maybe she'll be familiar with it. Maybe she won't. Then I'm just going to send this now. Great. Love that.

Let's see how it goes. Cool. What are you sending? Let's do it. Let's draft it. All right. So, hey, I really enjoy talking with you. I'd love to meet you, but I want to see where this could go. I love hanging out, but I need to meet up with you to keep doing talking with you um i'd love to meet you but i want to see where this could go

i love hanging out but i need to meet up with you to keep doing this with you take out the let's see where it goes okay i i think you just say i just the first part you have is great the other stuff she said i love hanging out should you say like i love talking yeah i'd love to hang out okay i said i really and i really enjoy talking with you i'd love to hang out. Okay. I said, I really enjoy talking with you. I'd love to hang out. Perfect. Yeah. But I need... No, no, that's it. Delete the rest.

That's it. How about, what's your favorite restaurant or place or coffee shop that you know of? It's called The Glass Knife. Great. Like I have this cute place called The Glass Knife. How about we go sometime next week when you have some time? Great. Give her like a week's enough window that like she can find some time.

I know this cafe called the glass knife that I love. How about we meet up next week? Perfect. Send. So good. Bada bing, bada boom. There it goes. And then if she responds with some sort of bullshit excuse, then you say, well, I, I

need this for us to keep doing this respectfully. Okay. Okay. So the followup should be, well, I need to meet up. Put it this way. Your follow-up should be you enforcing this boundary. And your boundary is you're not going to keep hanging out with this, investing in this person who's not willing to meet you in person. Okay. And there is no excuse that works. Nothing. Right. You know, I don't care if someone's in the hospital, you know, and if it's a catfish,

they're really good at these excuses. No excuse. Whatever the excuse is, you can calmly say, listen, that's fine. When you're ready to meet in person, let me know. Until then, you don't need to keep doing this. Right. So are we doing that or are we blocking her if she doesn't want to meet? Well, if you can't stop yourself from not replying, you should block her.

If she makes plans with you and then flakes, block her. Okay. All right. Now we just wait. All right. Good luck. Let us know. I'm dying to find out.

Bye. Good luck. Yeah, I'll definitely let you know. All right. Take care. All right. Thank you. Thank you. Bye. Good luck. Yeah, I'll definitely let you know. All right. Take care. All right. Thank you. All right.

Thank you. Bye. Ellie, this was so much fun. So much fun. Thanks for having me. Yeah. Can you please let the people know where they can follow you, enjoy all the fun stuff that you're doing on TikTok, Instagram, anything else you're working on that you want to tease?

Now's the time. You can find me at my name. It's Ellie Zeiler. And yeah, it's pretty much on all your platforms every platform i'm so jealous of people like that oh that get the like i fucked up on on twitter oh yeah like vile nicholas 20 yeah i could never find nick on twitter it's gross it's gross well thank you so much for coming don't forget to send those questions at ask nick at cast media.com cast with a k those questions at asknick at castmedia.com. Cast with

a K for all things Ask Nick, whether it's Mondays, texting office hours, even mediation. Be sure to follow Ellie and then we'll be back next week. Bye. Bye.