The Viall Files - E486 Bachelor In Paradise Recap w/ Bri Springs

Episode Date: October 12, 2022

Welcome back to The Viall Files: Bachelor In Paradise Edition! We’re back with another episode, joined by Bri Springs of Bachelor Nation, to break down the latest episode of this season! We kick things off by getting into some Bach Nation Tea, breaking down the Justin and Kira drama where Justin called out Kira for not seeing her at Stagecoach, Kira’s clapback that they hangout, and breaking down Teddi’s post reflecting on her departure from this season, where she calls this environment cruel and one that crossed her boundaries. We then get into the episode itself, where we get into what could’ve made Teddi stay, Rodney and Justin’s risky pickup lines, Rodney and Lace having an unexpected romance, and Aaron acting like a baby instead of taking accountability. We also talk about Genevieve and Shanae acting like a group of mean girls towards Sally, the missed opportunity to make Brandon the next Bachelor, and Brandon’s authentic emotional approach to dating. We also talk about Sierra and Michael navigating what taking things slow means, how people can tell if you’re interested based on how you phrase things, and the real reason why more guys aren’t courting Brittany. We also talk about the guys being overly concerned about the edit they’ll get, knowing when it’s your turn to leave the show, and Peter having bad role models. We also talk about Jacob using humor as a mask, Ashley and Jared farting in bed, Casey doing nothing on the beach, and exploring who would go on the naked date.  “When you like someone, your wording is different.” Please nominate us for People’s Choice Awards The Pop Podcast of 2022 by going to https://www.votepca.com/pop-culture/the-pop-podcast-of-2022 and typing in “The Viall Files” where you can vote up to 25 times a day!  Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] to be a part of our Monday episodes.  To Order Nick’s Book Go To: http://www.viallfiles.com Support a Local Bookstore: https://bookshop.org/books/don-t-text-your-ex-happy-birthday-and-other-advice-on-love-sex-and-dating-9798212185622/9781419755491 THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: Chime: So start your credit journey with Chime. Sign up takes only two minutes and doesn’t affect your credit score. Get started at http://www.chime.com/viall. Episode Socials:  @viallfiles @nickviall @brisprings @yabutwhocares See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

you're crazy what's going on everybody welcome back to another exciting on the road episode of the vile fowls bachelor in paradise edition and excited to have the one, the only Brie Springs with us in the studio. Give it up for Brie. Woo! We need a cheering. Woo!

Brie, how are you? I'm good. Thank you for having me. It's good to be with you. I'm so excited to see you guys. Always a pleasure. Yeah. Brie's a friend, so we get to,

we like hanging out with her outside of even podcasts. Yes. Just a couple housekeeping things. You want to talk breakfast? What did you have for breakfast? Nellie wants, well, this morning we got in. We were with Ashley and Jared this weekend. We had a lovely weekend of promoting the book, Don't Text Your Ex Happy Birthday.

We went to Boston, you know, thought of you, Amanda, and Boston. Did you have a good time? We had a lovely time. It really reminded me of Chicago. Yeah, it's there. The people. Parallel. Like we went out, like the nightlife of Chicago.

It very much, wherever we were, reminded me of River North. So that was interesting. Interesting. Like, yeah. Okay. And not necessarily the part of Chicago you want to be compared to, but I'll take it. It's just like the people. Even in the fancier parts of the city, it was still very blue collar, which is that's how I think of Chicago, right?

I got a paparazzi photo of Nick at dinner in Boston from my college roommate. parts of the city it was still very blue collar which is that's how i think of chicago right i got a paparazzi photo of nick at dinner in boston from my college roommate and she was like we got paparazzi he she she was like is nick in boston right now and i said yeah i think he is and like feel free to like say hi and you can tell him that you're my college roommate and she was like well he's engaged in conversation with natalie i don't want to interrupt. How did we look? I'll send you a photo. I'll get your POV. So where did you go for dinner? I don't know. Where did we go? Someone, you were spotted

by the paparazzi at dinner in Boston. Yeah. Good for us. And then we were in Rhode Island. We went to Rhode Island. We went to Audrey's in support of Ashley and Jared's wonderful coffee shop.

And I got to meet the baby. The baby. And I got the baby fever. Yeah. Wow. I mean, the baby is really cute. He's very cute. And then we woke up at 5.30 this morning, drove from Rhode Island here,

and then we got here early. And then I was like, let's go get breakfast. And then we're in Midtown, which is basically Times Square. And so we try to walk somewhere. I picked this place, which seemed like that would have a nice, tasty breakfast. Turns out, it's basically like Chuck E. Cheese. It's like we walked into a Chuck E. Cheese. But what kids are there right now?

On the menu, they had Fruity Pebble pancakes. That actually sounds delicious. Mac and cheese pancakes as well. How many times have you walked into a restaurant and sat down, took one look at the menu and got up and left? That happened to me this summer, actually, in Italy. Oh, in Italy? Yeah. Do you ever feel bad doing that? I was mortified. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't want to do it it i was pushed against my will to leave now i think you gotta just power through there's no there is no point in sitting through and being forced to eat but you didn't order anything you didn't order drinks they brought the waters i

looked at the menu natalie looked at me and i was like we can go let's go let's let's go and we just walked out we said sorry and then walked out wait that's. I feel like that's maybe a little bit worse to be like, sorry. We didn't know what to say. I didn't say anything. Natalie said, Natalie and her politeness said, I'm sorry. It's always the girls. And I ran out. So different if it's Natalie. So I don't know. What are you going to do? My book is out. Don't text your ex happy birthday. The number one dating book on Amazon. No big deal. It's been great to hear the responses. I really appreciate all the people who have read it and posted about it and reviewed it. So I can't thank you enough.

I hope that people who haven't looked at it yet still give it a shot and check it out. You can go to vilefiles.com to get it from Amazon or Barnes and Noble or support indie bookstores and get it from there. Barnes and Noble or support indie bookstores and get it from there. It's the same price. If you like listening to books on tape, you can listen to me read it to you. Your voice. It's great. You read it? Yeah, I read it. And I read it last week. And it was literally phenomenal. It's been a great conversation starter. The amount of times

I've been referencing your book and my conversations at dinner and at lunch and with friends, I'm like, so are you guys just going to stand by his behavior while he's being a fuckboy? Like, is anyone going to say anything? Like, it's good. It's really good. I appreciate it. And if you're single also, because I also got a question yesterday and asked me anything and someone was like, how do you be single? I'm 26 and never been in a relationship. I was like, you need to read Nick's book about being comfortable being single because I can't

walk you through why you should not feel bad about being single. There's this great book out there. Read the book. And it's a great read. I love how I feel like it's very conversational. It feels like we're chatting. You're talking to me. That was the hope. I wanted to read it so if it was a woman reading it or if it was a guy reading

it or, you know, gay, straight, doesn't matter. Like I wanted to feel like it was a one-on-one conversation that can apply to, you know, and again, the stuff I talk about is I think very relatable for everyone in terms of how we feel in relationships. So I've been really proud of how it's been received. So I hope you guys check it check it out I really do I promise you won't be disappointed and it's been exciting see now I care before when I wrote it I was like I don't know if it's going to be any good and then people started liking it

and now I feel like it's had some momentum and now it's like now I want it to do well what's the best thing that someone has told you so far about the book reading the book or their excitement for the book anyone who says they're surprised you know that kind of gives me a i really yeah i didn't you know yeah i didn't like uh you know therapists reading it and people like that who have read it

who who kind of were like you know i i doubted its yeah content but i was really surprised and they started recommending it even married people who have read it and and said that they've thought it was really interesting beneficial like certainly the parts of words just like how to slide into a dm or like dealing with fuckboys and situations hopefully won't apply to you but there's other like conceptual parts of the book that i think still it seems like i was really proud that people found that beneficial i felt like even if you're in a relationship it felt very cathartic like it was very much like oh that's what i was doing oh i was definitely in the wrong at that time yeah most of the book is really just about like handling situations and handling disappointment

in the short term and and we get disappointed all the time so it's really just a mindset so i think that's why people might in those situations might like it but anyways can't thank uh people enough all the people who came out to support the book of the book signings i appreciate it's been nice people enough. All the people who came out to support the book of the book signings, I appreciate it. It's been nice meeting you all. Also, and we'll talk about this more this week when I have Kit on for going deeper, but I think we're going to start some local book clubs, some don't text your ex happy birthday book clubs that are more like this lovely gentleman came in in Boston and he kind of joked how he was one of the few guy supporters. But you could tell the people who came in who listened listen to Ask Nick's.

It's like a sense of community of people who want to like interact with other people who are trying to like take these approaches and these mindsets and dating and like how to hold themselves accountable and accountable for the people that they go on dates with. And like kind of like a support group, I suppose. But like he kind of had this idea. So I think we're going to start doing that. If you are, especially in the major cities, if you want to start like a Facebook. I think we're going to start like on Facebook. Facebook group. A Facebook group, like a book club for whatever city you're in.

I'd love to do one for men and women and then have like a co-ed one, you know, because I think it'd be great for men and women to be bouncing ideas off each other and get friends, get the different perspectives, I think. And then it'd be nice for just, you know, women to support women and men to support men. But I think I'd love to have the collaboration as well. We'll talk about more of that on the next episode. So look for that. But if you want to start one, email us at dtyehbbookclub at gmail.com. If you want to start one, email us at dtyehbbookclub at gmail.com if you want to start and manage a Facebook group in your city. And then we'll go from there and we'll talk about more on the next episode. Time to get into The Bachelor. Allie, take it away with the tea.

There's been a little discourse on Twitter in the Twitterverse between one Mr. Justin and one Miss Kira after some Bachelor in Paradise episodes have been airing. Did you see this? I didn't see the Twitter discourse. Okay, they were fighting on Twitter. Yeah, we got a breakdown for you. They were fighting on Twitter. Go ahead, Abby. Yes.

So Kira obviously brought up Stagecoach during her time on the beach, was saying that Justin and Sally had been all over each other. And so she was kind of bringing in, you know, different nuggets from Stagecoach and stirring the pot a little bit with that. And so Justin ended up tweeting, LMFAO, Kira was at Stagecoach. This whole story is news to me. Anything for some screen time, though, I guess. Sigh. And then Kira responded saying, you okay, bro? We had several short conversations while there. Get some glasses and a better attitude. And Justin then goes, I'm sorry, I truly don't think we spoke all weekend. Just odd to speak on and embellish

someone's whereabouts and actions so authoritatively that you don't know. And Kira said, we definitely spoke and I was in the five-person girl group with Sally all weekend, so I know what I saw. Don't really understand why you're coming at me, but it's all good. And then Kira tweeted her own thing, not in that thread, and it's a photo from Stagecoach. It's a group shot of a ton of Bachelor people in a pool, and she put little arrows, one under Justin and one under herself, and she tweeted... There's four people in a pool and she put little arrows one under justin and one under herself and she tweeted there's four people in between them stage coach was fun wasn't it at justin glaze we're friends with justin we like justin he's a sweetheart and also like we can discuss

this later my biggest takeaway i honestly don't know about these people's character on the show i'm always reluctant to to make assumptions on the character from what we see on the show i'm it's open for debate whether kara is a good person or not i don't know i her intentions don't seem there yeah i mean it's like i all i understand having fun and like going for it but like yeah i don't i i question her character there's nothing more annoying than bringing in an entire story and narrative into a show whenever you barely had any interaction with someone yeah so justin made the mistake here in my opinion of of saying kira was that stage coach it's like yeah that's right i mean regardless if she was in your group or not like if you're not familiar with stagecoach there's literally hundreds of thousands of people and you by no means if you don't see someone there it does not mean they weren't right um right so like justin

just kind of over oh my god overreached on the tweet he's really really sassy he's just he's a sensitive soul and and i say that with love and i think we have to stop using uh sensitive especially well men and women is a criticism you know you're sensitive and i think it's a positive thing justin's a sensitive soul yeah but like kira like i don't know what she's it's like yeah i mean i don't think justin's coming at her well he did i'm sorry and he accused her for wanting screen time i love justin but i hope this was a lesson for justin just don't fight on on twitter on twitter with your the internet just don't with your crew mate yeah this is like you want to defend yourself going to podcast i suppose but also you know you can't and i think a lot of these people need to learn

and you know we sit there and recap it yeah stop paying attention to all the critics stop listening to podcasts stop like going on and like googling your name and following on twitter or or stop watching the episode and like i've noticed this. Other people are tweeting and it's like people are just tweeting like, oh, I was, they're just disqualifying themselves constantly on the show. They're like, it just seems like everyone on the show, like no one likes to look bad. I get that. Yeah.

But everyone's going on and it's just, they're so adverse to any criticism whatsoever. I'm just wondering like why they went on bachelor in paradise they panicked or they panic whenever something bad whenever they get criticized for doing something they panic and they're like i have to defend my character my honor because this is like all that they're watching i don't know but yeah this was a funny exchange between justin and kira and it's you know in this picture a lot of the usual suspects at Stagecoach. What a group.

The Bachelor producers should comp everyone's Stagecoach wristband because I feel like it sustains the Paradise drama consistently. They really should. Petition, petition. Put it in the budget. They don't want that credit. You know what I'm saying?

Because then it would like get out that they... They love the raw feel of like, this drama happened in the wild yeah yeah anyway justin we love you kira we're not sure about your true intentions but uh we'll discuss more later in the episode but justin just let this be a lesson don't um don't clap back on twitter don't clap back on twitter just the best thing to do uh on bachelor of any any kind. If you get metaphorically punched by the edit, just take your beatings and just let it roll and laugh at yourself. Have some fun with it. Lean into it sometimes. You know, that's usually the best. Unless you're Brendan and Piper. That is true. Like Brendan and Piper could have been listening. Like, that's what I tried, bro. That's so good.

I know. Yeah. I know. Yeah. So don't lean into it unless it's going to be detrimental. If you go on Bachelor in Paradise, get mic'd up and then like go on a date and then tell your plan about like leading someone else on. Yeah.

Mic'd up. Don't lean into that. Don't lean into it. But short of that, just it's going to be okay. Yeah. Chum, what's the first thing you do when you wake up? Is it checking on your credit card? But short of that, just it's going to be okay. Yeah. Chime! What's the first thing you do when you wake up? Is it checking on your credit score?

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And what else we got, Allie? Well, kind of, I mean, maybe not a clap back. It would depend on how you would look into it. But Teddy posted for the first time after, after you know obviously we saw her leave the beach and she posted a couple photos on instagram and her caption was kind of pointed i would say um it says something i'm proud of learning one leaving environments that are cruel to me and the people around me two sticking to my boundaries no matter how many times people in authority try to cross them and then she said

she's excited for her next chapter so a lot of people are like producers i love call yeah we should have a new game called is this aggressive or passive aggressive game because i feel like people often confuse those two yeah i want to go with aggressive this is very aggressive because i think i feel like this is a very direct. Yeah. Very direct at. Actually, no. Here's. I have two responses. I'm curious what you think. One, I think Teddy is very smart.

And this was a very clever response. And it got a lot of people rallying behind her. I think she knew what she was doing. I think I also, me personally, giant eye roll. If I were to comment, which I'm not going to, but it's just kind of like, okay. Yeah, she was upset. Your boundaries. Yeah, they got crossed.

You put your hand on a reality television show. You went on a reality TV show. What did you expect? Yeah, it was really smart. It was smart. I think she approached it in the best way that she possibly could have and to get people behind you and support you. But at the same time, it's like, yeah, you get what you signed up for. I mean, quite literally in that sense,

you kind of contract that says, we won't respect your boundaries. You can't do anything about it. There are no boundaries. There are no boundaries. Yeah. But brilliant caption on her part. I hope for Teddy's sake, she has decided she truly wants to be done with this show. Because that often happens. That's literally what happens all the time. Immediate reaction. I'm going to go to the internet and I'm going to, because I'm feeling, because, you know,

last After Left episode, like Teddy, I don't know. Again, I think everyone's, you know, obviously wants to be liked. And I think it was mixed reviews on her exit. It was an abrupt exit for Teddy. And so I think she was sensitive to how people saw that. And so she went to her Instagram, posted this, got the reaction she wanted. Again, smart for her.

And if she's done with the show, great. Then this was a great move on her part. But people often claim to be done. 12 months go by, feeling a little more bored. All of a sudden that engagement goes down. People are like, you know, they walk into a bar and people don't notice them and they want to feel that juice. And all of a sudden like, you know, March rolls around and they start picking up the phone and being like, hey, what's up? And Teddy don't fall back into the trap, but we'll see. That happens. If Teddy's done, I hope for her, good for her and be done.

There's a lot more to life for Teddy, I think. She seems like she has a lot going for her. And she said she's excited for this next chapter of what the rest of the year will bring her. So I wonder what that could mean. Good luck, Teddy. Wishing you all the best, Teddy. Wishing you all the best. Should we get into the episode?

Okay. Yeah, great. It opens with Teddy leaving. You all the best. Should we get into the episode? Okay. Yeah, great. Teddy, it opens with Teddy leaving.

I love how Brandon sounded like a great girlfriend to Rodney at the time. Oh my God, how cute was that? He's like listening off all the girls. It's like, oh, you know, it's like all the girls are here for you. She's so smart. Everyone's excited for you. Like just gassing up. Ultimate hype man. Yeah.

Everyone should find them a best friend like Brandon. Yeah. And i feel like women are better at that than men when it comes to like hyping up their friend and dating situations yeah you know that was very cute to watch especially in like a competition like that competitive competitive of an environment he even like went up like went as far as to say like i mean you could have my girl if you want to date the same girl again, which was freaking adorable. I'm obsessed with them. Yeah. And then I, but then, and then the girls were telling Rodney.

The girls were just like, well, you know, it sucks because like Teddy was excited to meet you. And I'm like, no, she wasn't. If she was excited to meet you, she would have met you. Yeah. You know? She would have stayed. Yeah. Well, I mean, you know, I've seen rumors.

I'm like, yeah, that's the thing with the Teddy. It's just like, I heard that she was told to go because they wanted her to be with Andrew. I'm backtracking. But according to Teddy's Twitter, right, we all agree that Teddy is claiming that she took the high road and left on her own. Yes. Yeah. So any. Because they wanted her to be with Andrew. Sure. But she still left. Yeah. Well, she and she don't want to be with andrew and also not rodney so i don't want to be with rodney yeah and i love not rodney but i like how the girl the the women on the beach were just like no he it's like it's that classic no he he likes you he's like he's afraid he's gonna call like you know he wanted to see you and she's like no never calls they never they never call and then out of nowhere lace and rodney became a thing what how did that what that was the... She just staked her claim.

He was bonding with Jill and then decided that he wanted to go to the bar. Lace swooped in at the bar. They had a shot and the rest was history. The magic took off. Yeah, it was just like... Lace was just like, I like you. And her kind of... That was...

Was not expecting that. That came out of left field. Yeah. I think Rodney's too nice of a... Gullible? Not gullible. I think Rodney was going to like whoever... Came up to him and showered him.

Came up to him and said, I pick you. And I think not because Rodney... I think Rodney's very sweet and very nice. And I think a lot of the guys on the show are obviously just very afraid of, you know, again, looking like the bad guy. Yeah. And even to the extent of like, I don't know if I want to go out with you. Yeah. It's really interesting watching how the guys have to let the girls down. So like it has to be this elaborate thing like, OK, listen, like kind of like walk you through their feelings and

be like, let them down really easy. But whenever it comes to the guys, they're like, I'm just going to go for it and then we're just going to see what happens. I'm going to give in and kiss this girl and then we'll probably have to end it later. But instead of saying no, I'm just going to do it and then face three percussions afterwards. Well, not only that, but even when the women are rejecting the men,

it's just kind of like, hey, I'm sorry. This is happening, which is fine. But clearly the guys are a little more nervous of rejecting yeah at the first start yeah yeah at first sight for sure yeah rodney did say when lace asked him what his type was and this could have just been like them flirting um but lace was like what's your type and rodney responded with people who look like you you know kind of so he's a charmer so as much as like that yeah that could be like him being incredibly smooth,

but also maybe this is a pattern that we're not aware of because we've only seen him like date Michelle and maybe in general. I have hesitations when it's like he can't even put into, he wasn't like brunettes. Like it was someone who's like exactly what I'm staring at right here. Anyone that looks like you will know she.

It was a line. And like Rodney's a smooth cat, you know? He's a smooth cat. Is it smooth or is it like really cringe? Well, Natalie made a good point on this episode. When Justin was talking to Genevieve for his birthday and she had just got off to date with Aaron, right? That was my favorite scene.

And Justin, love him. But again, not a closer. Brandon, closer. Michael A., closer. It's just a bunch of closers and non-closers. And Justin kind of goes, well, it's my birthday. Can I get a kiss? And Natalie and I were watching that.

No, no, no. He goes, you're not going to give me a kiss on my birthday? Which is worse than what I said. Yeah. And Natalie and I, when Justin said that, because like, you know, we're rooting for our guy, right? Of course. And it's just like, come on.

And we were like, oh, you know, kind of. And then, but Genevieve gave him a look. She gave him a kiss. And then they kissed. And Nally pointed out, and it's so true. We've talked about this before. I mean, the difference between what comes across as cringe and kind of like cute is when like 99.99999% on the reaction you get. Yeah. You know, because like hadn't had Genevieve been like, no, it would have been like,

bro, why did you beg for a kiss? Like Genevieve made that moment cute for Justin. Yeah, she did. I know Justin was mad at Genevieve, but I honestly think Justin owes Genevieve a big thank you for that moment because, like... Oh, she went in. Yeah, she saved him. Had Genevieve been like, no, I don't know. Yeah. Sorry. We would have been like, bro, Justin, why'd you do that?

I just came off a date kissing someone else. Like, it's just not the right time. Yeah, and like... Then it would have made him look like, okay, you're trying way too hard. Yeah, she made that line almost charming for for Justin Yeah, also, it was like a hot makeout. So yeah Genevieve Aaron nothing makes me happier than seeing Aaron mad or he's just a giant baby

I know I've never had the pleasure of meeting him. A lot of people say nice things about him I'm sure he's a swell guy, but I liked how he handled that conversation. I did. I did well. I did as well. Justin, Aaron? Yeah. I agree with you. I love watching him like get flustered and get heated over watching like women that he likes make out with other guys. But this, but I felt like he redeemed himself in that conversation a little bit. Like he gave her the space and was like, hold on, my feelings are hurt, but this is also a dating show. And I know that like, you know, that was, I know you're confused. I know you were dating him before talking to him before. And he was like, this is all, this is how it made me feel. But I like, I forgive you. And that was

like, nice. That was nice. I don't think he's a jerk at all. I think he's just a giant baby. For sure. And I didn't like, when he accused Justin of being manipulative, I thought that was manipulative on the part of Aaron. You know, like, first of all, he didn't, he wasn't privy to that conversation. He's just going off what Genevieve said. Genevieve wasn't calling him manipulative. No. Natalie wants to know, what's the difference between Justin being sensitive and Aaron being

a big crybaby? Probably nothing. I just, I just. They're both sensitive. It's how Aaron reacts. I just feel like, oh, you could like see his blood boiling, like whenever they were making out on the beach. I'll tell you why. Cause so far when I've seen Justin get up, get mad, he just, you know, he reacts in the moment. He, you know, says how he feels. He's generally polite. Aaron, going back to last season, he's always blaming someone else.

It was always Thomas' fault. It was, you know, it's Justin's fault. It's just like everyone's out to get Aaron as far as Aaron is concerned. And it's just like maybe other people like other people and they're just not into you and that's totally okay. I just don't know. Aaron had a habit of like going after other people

when things didn't go his way. So yes, there you go. And that was a perfect case in point of him going after Justin, not knowing anything about him or the conversation was like, he's manipulative. I think that was a little, maybe not manipulative, but he totally knew what he was doing in that moment. And like, he was like, if I get her to kiss me, like it's all what he was doing in that moment. And he was like, if I get her to kiss me, I win. But yeah. Yeah. I mean, it was interesting with this episode.

Sinead and Genevieve are best friends all of a sudden after being mortal enemies. Loved that. I was like, paradise? The enemy is my friend. They had a common enemy with Sally. Yeah. Yeah. I hated that for Genevieve and Sineanae it looked like mean girls to me that

was chaos i mean like sally kind of looks like a mess it's just like hey do you want to be on rihanna tv or not like i i get that but they did they just decided to go after sally for yeah yeah it was very unbecoming well and it was just like this constant argument or debate of why she missed the flights if it was work or if it had to do with this other guy and i was like this just feels like kind of a pointless argument in that regard because we all know that everyone on that beach probably you know either fooled around or had relationships between their season and going on the beach so why does it really matter well that's the point it doesn't matter and it's just like they decided to bring it up i hated it more like

for all the defending of shanae i've done it was like shanae like you were the outcast you know what it's like to be bullied some you know and this new girl shows up you've now made friends with the in group and now you are people will be so quick joining in experiment yeah and like how about we instead of you know you and geneieve, like going aside and talking shit and like guessing, like they were literally guessing. Yeah. They were storytelling. And then like, you know what?

She's probably fucking lying. And like Genevieve's like, I know she's lying because Wells told us this bullshit story, you know. Making up a whole narrative. It was like, it's both Wells. He's like, you know, God, I'm paradise. So like, you know, Genevieve, what I love about Genevieve, though, is she believes everything she says that comes out of her mouth

or everything that she wants to hear is facts. But how about we just maybe go sit down and grab Sally and just get to know her and make her feel welcome and then be like, what was that story with the suitcase? What's up with the ex? Something like that. But no, they, you know, and I'm harder on Sinead. Like of all the things Sinead did, don't be a hypocrite.

Don't commit the crime of which, you know, you felt like was committed to you. I feel like that happens often in the show. Of course it does. But we have to call it out when we see it. Do you think it's valid, though, to take issue with someone talking to their ex right before coming on paradise like i completely agree that it's like a really rude unwelcoming like hostile way to hand out handle it so i don't like agree with them confronting her but like at the essence of like what they were claiming was there like do you think that's a valid case yeah do i think getting your personal relationships in order

and caring about the mental health of people you clearly have some sort of history with and connection with? Because as we know, like, well, I don't agree with all worse than seeing someone you really cared about go on national television and, you know, pursue love and potentially talk about you. And that can be a lot. So to like check in, like, no, I think it's absurd that we somehow have this like unwritten rule in Bachelor Nation that like once you start talking to producers you have to like join a convent and become a monk for the next you know few months because you have to like you know get your yeah your soul ready for love on the beaches of paradise like what the fuck you know like yeah no i i definitely had to open up that chapter again and make sure i closed it properly to be

like listen like i'm go i'm doing this like. Like if there's anything you need to get off your chest, let's get it off your chest now. Totally. So, and again, we don't really know the details. Obviously with Sally, it was kind of like this relationship has become comical with her like showing up for Clayton season only to leave and showing up for Paradise only to leave. Yes, it is comical.

And clearly Sally is like having a hard time, you know, following through here. Sally could start a cult, though. Like when she was like speaking so emphatically being like, everybody has dirt and like, I don't bring it like her whole like, what did we think of that? I wrote down in her cult. I wrote down Sally's not wrong. You know, like, was it the time for her to share it? No. Was it her best moment? But like, I think in that moment, Sally got attacked.

She just got there. She's getting accused, like, again, and in Bachelor World, kind of like in life these days, like once you're accused, you're guilty. Yeah. You know, especially in Bachelor World, just the accusation and then the mob forms and then people start pointing fingers and you're on, you know, it feels like you're just alone. It can feel really scary, you know, literally feel scary. And so what I meant by Sally's not wrong is, yeah, I think most people on the beach are incredibly insincere. You know, I don't think we're seeing, you know, they just don't make the Ashleys and Jareds anymore, you know, are just like i'm gonna go be myself i'm going to say how i think and feel i do think genevieve and shanae i guess are sincere in the sense that you really get their honest selves but i think a lot of people aren't sincere down there i don't think they go on to just put on a show or like the best version of themselves or yeah i mean yeah you, like I've had conversations with some of the, you know, the people down

there and they, you know, and I'm just always like, you chose the wrong show. If it's like, you know, the guys go down there and it's just like, well, I don't want to look like, you know, I'm just like some pathetic, you know. That can be tough though, because you literally have a mob coming after you. But I mean, by pathetic, no, they don't have a mob coming after you when that happens. Like they don't want to look like the hopeless guy who like, you know, everyone's feeling sorry for them. And like, you know, the charity case. And I'm like, well, that would look like a fuckboy.

You got two choices, you know. So like you don't get to look cool in paradise for like having swag. That's true. And being like, you know what i'm saying the you just look like a fuck boy yeah and there's this it's two extreme choices so you looking like the guy who has no game who can't get the girl is best case why is that though because that's so true for example actually brandon i think he has kept his swag well because he had the benefit of coming off coming on and having he was you know he got there's a little bit of luck that they casted someone he was very

into who also liked him back and that just worked out yeah but if Brandon didn't have Serene right could be a completely different story yeah like Justin for example I always felt like he was coming off his season with a lot of swag. Everyone like was rallying behind him. But this episode gave me kind of... I also think Brandon's

one of a kind though. I really... I mean, I think he's a special person. when he saw her, I was like, he's going to be a mess on his wedding day

if he's crying before a date. Yeah. I think it was such a huge miss for them not to make him the bachelor. Just an absolute incredible miss. Because... He is so... Seems so sincere. Yeah, that think it was such a huge miss for them not to make him the bachelor. Just an absolute incredible miss.

Because he seems so sincere. Yeah, that's the thing. It's just like he's good looking. He's got swag. He's incredibly sincere. He truly wants to find love, but he still holds like his game, right? And he falls fast. Like he loves hard.

So imagine having a bachelor who's all of these things who's going to fall in love with like two or three women like truly fall in love and he's but also have this sincerity of like checking in and like i mean brandon would like get fucked over it and i don't even mean bad but like it would be emotional hell for him but i think you would come out really loving brandon because because he is thoughtful. He is present. He knows like it was such a miss not to have him as a bachelor. Wait, they're so into each other.

Is there something I feel like something is going to come out that they knew each other before they were dating before they were talking before. Like I said, they literally came out on the beach and immediately was like this. Yeah, I'm certain. What I said, episode one is that there's no way they will be able to convince me that they didn't but my guess is they had something similar to like what caitlin and i had which i'm guessing they never met in person but i bet they like started talking someone was in someone's dm and they started facetiming and they had like and by the time they showed up they built this kind of emotional connection and then they met in person we're like okay i also think you're hot yeah you think i'm hot and it's just like they had yeah which how do you how do you feel about that shit yeah that's nice i don't care like there are no rules

like whatever you know like i really don't care yeah they came on the show to actually give it a shot yeah yeah and they're they're here to give us a love story you know the only the only get that only gets you in trouble is when like like, again, Brandon, very sincere guy. Other guys have done what Brandon's done. And listen, the show gave Brandon and Serene the benefit of having them both be early on the beach. Yeah. Other seasons, you bring down, you know, Serene shows up. Brandon comes in week three or vice versa.

And it's kind of up to you to survive. Like, the biggest rule in paradise and that you saw that i think these episodes know when to go home is like what i think is like you know how to be successful in paradise number one know when to go home don't be afraid to go home you know because sometimes like if you if they don't want you to be there you won't be there if who doesn't want you to be there, you won't be there. If who doesn't want you to be there? They. Who's they? They. Your friends who want you to buy a boat. But yeah, I mean, they're making a TV show. Yeah.

And if they don't want you to be on their TV show, you won't be on their TV show. And if you are desperate to stay on their TV show, then they'll start being okay with you sticking around on their TV show. It just will never go well for you. So just be okay. Like read the tea leaves, you know? Good for Romeo at the end. He kind of, he could tell, like Romeo at the end of the episode

when Kira came down, you know, went for Tarzan or whatever his name is. Jacob. Jacob. And then she was like, do you want to get out of here? You could sit, I felt like Romeo was doing a math. They should have had like a little like thought bubble

of him doing an equation because Romeo was just like, all right, I got, all right, this went bad and this went bad. You know what? Let's go. And Romeo had a nice little exit. When you leave gracefully, it's people. Yeah, they're like, he knew when to go. He knew when his time was to go home.

Do you think Justin should have gone home then? Yeah. Immediately whenever things went south. Yeah, Justin needs his out he's this this whole yeah back and forth like i understand genevieve made out with you the night before i get that and the next morning she was all over aaron and i'm sure that's confusing to you justin but in what world should do you think you should try to salvage this relationship yeah no you should not and you should also not demean the other person because you feel like they wronged you yeah i just i thought their fight it was so telling when like

genevieve was trying to express her needs and she was like when we when we were sitting together you only kissed me once and he's like we're counting kisses now and it's like they were just both not on the same page and he like was feeling very attacked when if genevieve had been vague i'm sure he would have been like well well, give me an example. What do you mean you need more affection? I loved their fight because I think their fight was insanely relatable. Yes. I think those types of fights in relationships are so common or even in dating where neither of them are really doing anything wrong.

You just have two people like not compatible or not on the same page. really doing anything wrong. You just have two people like not compatible or not on the same page. I mean, listen, I think this book was made for a Genevieve and a Sine in a sense that like, you know, Genevieve is literally like to her credit, like saying, I want to feel special. I want to feel validated. At least she knows what she wants. Now, my hope for Genevieve is that some days she wants to feel, you know, loved and she wants to feel like happy. Did she say she was like, I like want attention. I want to feel wanted. I mean, listen, like that's, it's not Genevieve's fault. That's literally how society has taught us to think, right? You know, find someone who treats you like a princess. And like, that's,

that's the only notes we get. And we just, and then we watch Disney, you know, and there's like, oh, I guess I'm supposed to, you know, but. But we don't talk about how people should make us feel. And to Justin's credit, he's just like, I want to get to know you. Logan was the same way with Sinead. It's just like they keep, Sinead and Genevieve are like, I need to know that you're obsessed with me. Yeah, immediately. Immediately.

And then it's just like, it's day two. It was so weird whenever she was like, oh, now you want to be touching my leg? But what if her love language is like physical touch? Like what if that's her way of like receiving affection? Totally. But like anyone can touch you, you know? So if that's all it is, I guess that's just,

that's how you trap a fuck boy, right? That's how these fuck boys come into your lives when you have these kind of very oversimplified, you know, versions of validation, you know, because like you want to feel valid in relationships and you certainly want to feel special by the people who love you, but just feeling special and validated by anyone willing to make you feel special and validated, you know, and you give so much priority to those moments of validation. Like that, like that's how the fuck boys get you, you know, it's just like, I, they, fuck boys know how to give the compliments and when to, when to spring on the, the, the,

the gifts or the comp, you know, a little bit of the extra time and things like that, or like, you know, give you eye contact and like capture your gaze, you know, and then you're just like, you know, there were some, this is what I really like about Paradise. I do, I do think they're doing a job of making very relatable real world dating situations. You know, the, the line of, we had such a good date. Like, boy, I get that shit question. I get that question all the time. So we had such a good date. I didn't hear like, it's just a date. You know, you just had one good day. You know, what did you learn about him? Well, I don't know. I was like, we went hang gliding. It was just fun. We had fun. That's all I know. And then we kissed and I thought it was pretty amazing. And I don't know

why we're not married, you know? And I think we just have to pull back a little bit. With Paradise, it's different. Obviously you have the pressure of them sending you home sending you home or telling you like go find love or go home you know like it's a little unfair to the people on the beach of of trying to like have these thoughtful like conversations uh because they're being told there's no time yeah but nevertheless it it is interesting how the show has kind of captured modern dating. It has done a great job at that. Well, to your point earlier, I think there's a point when it crosses over from feeling validated to feeling listened to. And I think with Aaron and Genevieve, one, I'm like, they're both so yappy.

Like, they both love the drama. So I'm like, perfect. Like, I think they very much align on, like, the degree to which they believe one should be involved in other people's stuff or like step in um but then also it just seemed like he wasn't just like being ooey gooey all over her out of the blue like it was because she very specifically like said that yeah yeah so i do think like with the fuck boy thing it's like are they just validating you in a way that's like kind of like one size fits all? Or are they like listening to you and understanding you? And I don't think right now Genevieve or Sinead are considering that when it comes to their dating life. You know, and my guess is even though

they have the pressures of paradise, my guess is they, I mean, like I see this in the real world, like with the people I'm talking to on the daily, it sounds like you're seeing it with some of your friends that you're talking to. It's just like the more we date, you know, and we get older and we have heartbreak and we feel disappointment, you know, we always talk about that word baggage, you know, baggage. And then we start, when we start dating,

we think about what baggage do we have, right? And then we go, you know, and we get in our heads about like, well, I've been broken up with this person or I had this happen or whatever. Like, you know, once like the plan we had for ourselves when we were teenagers, like starts to veer off course and it includes like an ex-boyfriend or an ex-girlfriend or, you know, maybe a failed engagement or, you know, maybe you got married and divorced and had a kid or whatever. Now we go into dating thinking no one's going to like us. We just, you know, we get in our heads about that. We forget that everyone's gross or annoying and like the people you're so worried about liking you are just as scared and we go in there. And so I get why that fear comes in of just

like me, just please, because like I'm afraid no one will. So like I empathize with that, but we just have to try not to. It is an amazing, you know, you look at someone like Genevieve and she acts like if all Genevieve did, you know, Victoria, she's just such a boss. Like Victoria should give classes on the beach. That would be amazing. She should. She's just like, don't care. Yeah.

Yeah. Just sit here. Mind your own business. Act like, just not say it, just act like you don't want to be here. Yeah. And then those come running. So are you advocating for being the cool chick? I think Victoria is just, you know, she's just truly like whatever.

I don't think Victoria is trying to be anything. I think she just is. Right. And so I think there's something to be gained from that. She's not trying to be cool in the sense that like to get people to like her. She's just like, I don't care. Yeah. You know, she just has like i don't care yeah you know she just has that i don't care energy you know we've seen we've seen victoria care and then it goes off

the rails but when she doesn't care yeah she's like she's has so much control like her her charisma kind of pops off the screen she's got good comedic timing but yeah i think she could teach him swag classes makes so much sense that she's with johnny because johnny seems to have a very similar energy so it's kind of like with them game respects game yeah i think they johnny has good game for sure 100 i don't know how johnny's game is maybe in relationships long term but if anyone thinks that johnny doesn't walk into a bar johnny's done very well for himself in college. And spits game. Yeah. Like he's tall, he's good looking, and he doesn't have a ton to say early on, which is honestly all you really need to do.

You just kind of sit back and have people walk up to you and go, why are you so quiet? Why aren't you having fun? And then you're kind of aloof. And then you're like, hey, what's up? And you talk to one person. And then later you show them that you're funny one-on-one. But yeah, Johnny's got some game for sure.

He really does. And he's a closer. I think Johnny's a closer too. I would agree with that. Do we want to talk about Sierra and Michael? Telescope turned into a breakup. I really wanted them to be together. Did you ever think they were going to be?

I thought for a second, I was like, I'm going to walk in here and I'm going to say, please tell me that they end up together. Please tell me Sierra and Michael end up together. But they clearly didn't. I just didn't buy it. I didn't. It seemed really fast. But for a split second, I was like, okay, maybe he's interested.

She seemed really excited. Very excited. He seemed like. Meh. Yeah. I mean, again, you, when you, I think I said this last week, when you like someone, it's just, your wording is very differently. You know, you, when you, like last week, Michael said, well, you know, I just, I take things slow, you know, which is normal. Slow is normal. We like slow. Slow is healthy. It's great. But if Michael liked her, he would say something more to the effect of, I mean, I really like

you and I just know we should take it slow, but I'm just having a hard time doing that. Wow. You know? It's giving me PTSD because it's like whenever I told Matt James on The Bachelor, like, I'm falling in love with you. And he was like, thank you. And I was like, he loves me back. He loves me back.

He just can't say it. He just can't say it. He just can't say it. He just can't say it. He loves me back. But no, I feel like whenever you're in that environment and your emotions are so heightened and if you're just given an inch, again, if you're given an inch, the environment will just put you in a situation where you're ready to take a mile. And I feel like that's what was happening for Sierra.

Totally. Which is really damn. And in fairness to her, she had no reason not to, you know, it's hard to see that when you're in it. Yeah. Yeah. He said he likes to take things slow. I can take things slow, but we're great. But he didn't say he didn't like me. But that's why I feel like, you know, whenever, I mean, I know you don't, you're not a big Love Island person, but people are so indirect on watching the, like watching Bachelor in Paradise. It's just like, if you don't you're not a big love island person but it people are so indirect on watching the like watching bachelor in paradise it's just like if you don't like someone you might as well just

get it out there and say i don't like this person and maybe they grow on you and they grow and you grow to like them but instead it's just everyone's in this weird like environment of like being afraid of stepping on people's toes and trying to like not toy people's emotions so he's very like kind in that way and respectful in that way. But it's just like, just be direct. Just say, you don't know if you're feeling it. You don't know what you're feeling. Yeah, I think. Not, I like to take things slow,

so let's maybe see where this goes. Yeah, I mean, Michael's clearly one of their main characters of this season. Yeah, I love him. And I love him as a person. And so he has to wear the good guy kind of shield and have these like thoughtful talks with Wells and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Yeah. But like when Sierra was just like talking about being a stepmom, Michael A. goes, yeah. You know? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Sure.

In fairness to Sierra, it's paradise. And you have fifth date conversations on day two. You know, I just, I don't fault her for trying to relate to someone. And Michael showed up. He has been very open about having a son. He's been open about the past. I mean, his wife, like this is what everyone knows about him. And he's been vocal about finding

someone who can fit into his life so in fairness to her i i don't know if she was over overstepping because i think she was just dealing with the cards that were dealt i get it it's an awkward conversation it is because you also want i feel like you want to be in a situation where you're like i want him to know that i like him and i also want him to know that this is something that I want. Like this is, I'm letting him, but I mean, I still felt like a little, as soon as kids are involved, I'm just like, it's just best to not. Yeah. I think Sierra handled it pretty well. I think she was dealt with a pretty tough deck of, she went for after what she wanted. Good for that's what you have what you have to do michael certainly validated her like he didn't he wasn't like right away he gave it a shot he gave

it a shot which he has the right to do you know but it can be kind of confusing to want to be nice but at the same time direct because being direct sometimes you get accused of being a dick well that's what i mean we were having this conversation earlier, but it's like, that's why people, it's so hard for people to come on the show and be their authentic self because they're always on the back of their mind, like, okay, I have to tread carefully here. Like, there's a chance in which my good guy,

you know, portrayal or like this character that I've, you know, that I've been portrayed as is, might crumble. Yeah, I mean, anytime a guy gets mad on The Bachelor or Paradise, it can go soft. Yeah. I hate that. But I respect him for bringing it up quicker than,

as soon as he felt it, he was like, no, let's just snip this in the butt. He could not go any further. He was running into Brandon territory. And Sierra, a perfect example of knowing when to go home. Yeah. You know, I would have liked to see her stay. And I think the producers made a mistake by not keeping her around because I think she has some star potential

because she is very open and very expressive. And I feel like she could be excellent television. But however that all went down, she ended up going out, like leaving us wanting more. That's for sure. He was stunning too. Yeah. So, you know, it's, I think she played, played her paradise.

Fit card very well. Pretty, pretty well. Know when to go home. Don't fight it. Do not fight it. Well, let's talk about Brittany for a second. The first episode, there's this, like the whole theme was, there's all these guys, everyone's coupled up, we're waiting for

more women and i'm watching halfway through and i'm just like is britney with anyone like britney seems like an excellent like candidate candidate to dating option for for many men yeah you know like she she's an attractive person she seems grounded she like she listens so like she communicates she seems seems very confident. She seems like a person who's in an adult stage of their life who knows what value they bring to the table. And I'm just shocked that some of the men weren't pursuing that. I don't understand.

They made it seem like Britney wasn't an option. Yeah. I didn't understand that. I guess I was kind of gathering that you have so much, I mean, to your point of it being all about luck, I think a lot of the people who are lucky who come off these newer seasons who are entering Paradise,

they're at the forefront of everyone's mind. Brittany's season was now like, what? Our season was like two years ago and she went home so fast. And so I don't feel like she ever really got the chance for people to be like excited about her and but I think in paradise it's a really good learning lesson that you have to be very direct and very forward and she doesn't strike me as that person from what I've seen so far I hear you like Lace

literally walks up to Rodney and he she's like hi my name is Lace let's go make out on the beach I feel like it's a criticism for the men though that they just lack either either they lack confidence game or they're too wrapped up in their bachelor edit and they're only pursuing known bachelor entities i'm gonna go with that one you know and so it's just like well i don't recognize her and she's not a you know she's not cool or she doesn't have the followers or whatever it is and so it's just like well i don't know what bachelor nation thinks of her and all these bullshit reasons um and i think that definitely plays a role because like it seems like had any of them just like sat down and got to know her yeah it would have been like she seems pretty cool and normal and like mature and holds a conversation and like has a sense of humor. Yeah.

That's all I'm getting from her. That's all. Yeah. I'm just getting very dateable qualities from Brittany. And these other people, not as many. So why aren't guys interested in her? I don't know. That's my question.

I hope it's the fact that she's turning them down. Maybe they're intimidated by her confidence. Yeah. You know, I think that's, if that's true, then I fault the men. Because you should be attracted to that. You should be attracted to confidence and someone who knows what they want. And someone who doesn't have a problem telling you that they're not interested. And also, just pay fucking attention and ask questions. And like, you know, like don't romeo did with her and just talk talk talk and go in for a kiss and like she

that had it happened to her twice i was gonna say victoria's teaching classes of how to not care britney should be teaching classes of how to get around a kiss because the woman's now done it twice and she keeps getting put on day beds and boats with people like romeo and pizza peter and i'm like where's rodney like swoop on in let's go but to her credit she does swerve you know i don't know if a lot of people would it's a good thing i'm saying she is excellent at it she needs to be giving those classes yeah and then when she was talking to andrew and having a little chemistry she just grabbed them at the right moment and And like, and that's what like, like Brittany, she did like teach men this, right? Because like, that was an aggressive move by Brittany, but it landed, right? Because she was listening to

Andrew and she was like having a conversation and like paying attention to what he said. And then she was paying attention to the moment, right? Like I wrote down, everyone's complaining about not having anyone to date. Brittany's right there. And then she's forced to go on a date with Peter. But yeah, Brittany pays attention to moments. That's what I wrote down. Like she sees the moment and then she sees it and it was great. These guys are just like talking, talking, talking. And then they look up and like when peter's like i got something to make this better and it's like oh i also wrote that peter always had wrong role models peter who are your role models because i think peter i honestly think he i see like a soft heart in there yeah i think i don't think he's a bad guy or anything like that

and i don't think he means ill towards anyone. I think he's had really bad role models. That is a lot of men. Yeah. I think either his brother or his dad are just teaching him all the wrong things. And he's getting really bad notes. So Peter, if you're out there, you need better role models. Read this book and get better role models.

What do we think of Brittany and Andrew? Where do we see that going? I mean, I love Andrew. They both live in Chicago. I ship it. I hope it happens. I ship it. I don't see it happening. I don't feel like either of them are each other's type, but I think if they're open, maybe. I think. I'm just really into her redemption arc. Yeah. I just want andrew to is he kind of a fat boy no the opposite he's opposite he's the opposite okay he's the best i mean he's have you met andrew i haven't met andrew he he lights up a room and like i love being around him it's he's so his like when britney was talking about like his energy he does he just makes you happy he's he's yeah he's just great he's funny and he's

he's just like he's very magnetic but like i said he's not closer like he just he's still for whatever reason how does someone want to turn like that that kind of go for what you want again respectfully yeah and and when at the right time but he's not looking always, he's just never looking for that opportunity to really, you know, or just really say how he feels at the risk of, you know, people disagreeing with you, or, you know, it's just that little bit of, you've got to risk it a little bit, you know, and kind of put yourself out there and be bold, that boldness, that's that one part I just would love to see for andrew yeah you know and and i feel like ultimately britney because she's a bold person i think she needs that

reciprocated in a relationship is my guess or maybe they'll balance each other out maybe she dropped that wine glass in the sand i was like wow moment of passion yeah she was trying to place it and now you just watch her just be like it's not worth it like i was like the sand is the only place you can drop a wine glass and it's not a huge issue. I feel like Andrew does that thing that a lot of people do when they're, for whatever reason, not just confident in themselves. They will say things like, I didn't think you would like me. I hate that. You know, stuff like that. These kind of disqualifying things that say, and then at first when you say it, people are just like, it's crazy.

You're great. You have all these qualities and blah, blah blah blah but like after a while they'll keep saying and you're like you know why do i like you you know you're already discrediting yourself bill has been saying that a lot of you know i'm the most single one here and she's even said that to rodney when he appeared on the beach like i have no one i am so single and i'm like girl like tape yourself up a little bit because i feel like sometimes no I mean a lot of people do it yeah and yeah I mean look at lace loose lace loose loose that was so funny loosey goosey um she I mean she is definitely going after going getting after it getting after it yeah I also wrote britney britney is a closer

britney is a closer you can tell she's a closer 100 closer she has swag she's also an amazing friend because like you saw with the jacob jill situation we should totally get into their date quickly but at the end when somebody when uh kira came to pull jacob like britney handled that situation like britney saved that that like Jill spends that night alone before talking to Jacob she's spiraling it's out of control and yes I I Brittany is a capable of being a good friend because she's I don't think Brittany is worried Brittany is like one I think she's one of the more real people on the beach she is she knows what she wants yeah I guess is she won't be afraid to go home at the right time. She will be afraid when she needs to be.

Like she is good. Again, she pays attention to certain moments. I got some sympathy for Jacob because what I think, what I feel like was happening with the Kira conversation is she was just gassing him up. And it was just like, I'll let you like make me feel good about myself for 20 minutes. Like, you know what I'm saying? I don't feel like he was ever really gonna like do anything about it but she was just like saying all these nice things and like you know jacob is a guy who you know he's a good looking guy and he's kind of this

goofball guy and my my guess is is that the the goofiness you know like with jill i think sometimes can be like a mask for like you, like maybe he gets so used to people saying, oh, you're the funny guy or you're the goofy guy and that's great. And then you have someone who's just like, you're this and you're that and you're sexy. And I like, you know, like, yeah, it was like, tell me more. He probably didn't hear that a lot. And I feel like he was just enjoying someone complimenting him. That's kind of the read i had yeah yeah i that would make me so uncomfortable though yeah so i can't really but i yeah i was waiting for him to i just want sometimes people just to go hey can i talk to you and someone to say you know i'm good yeah yeah

why well i don't forever see that happening actually i don't most people won't do it no and i'm not saying it's always appropriate. Because it could be so rude or come off as very rude, right? Sure. Maybe. I don't know. But like sometimes you have to. That's what I'm saying.

You have to know when to. Sometimes you have to pick a side. Yeah. And often in paradise, you see that all the time. No one wants to like make a choice. They just want to like, I don't know. Maybe I'll dip my foot in there. And like they're always doing this like, how is this going to, what's the best thing for me to do to look good?

Yeah. I think that's too many people are down there. Every decision they make, they're thinking, how do I look good here? As opposed to doing what would be the best for the, you know, the person they say they care about or even best for themselves long-term, you know? And yes, sometimes making a choice means someone thinking you're rude or being a jerk. You know, when you are honest with someone,

like, why do you feel the way you do? And you say like, if I can be honest, I just, you seem great, but I'm just not feeling it. Yeah, that's it. And most people, when they hear that, they're gonna think you're a jerk, you know? They're gonna want those like confusing maybes and you're special and maybe someday, because they to hear all the ways that they might have chances

But they're you know, their ego thinks you're a jerk but like sometimes that's life and you have to just you know, have some character and have some conviction and And in that moment when when Kira walked down after he had this really nice date with Jill and they really, they got literally naked with one another. He's sitting next to her. She went home. She's been bouncing around, literally just trying to date anyone who's willing to date her so she could stick around on the beach. And he pulls her and I, if I'm Jacob, I would have just been like, you know what? Honestly, I just had a really nice moment here and maybe later, but like, I just, right now is not the time. Maybe later.

I don't know. Who knows? Or he could have said no. Yeah. Just now, like I'm not interested anymore. But I wouldn't have left Jill. Yeah. To go talk to Kira.

I mean. No. You know, like he saw the drama on the beach with Romeo. It's just don't do it. You just. Yeah. You got it. So I fault him for getting up.

But once he got there, I understand why he stuck around and listened to her gas him up. I mean, Jared and Ashley love him. He's sweet. Wow. You know? That was the sweetest part of the episode. They just don't make him like Jared and Ashley anymore. I also can't believe they aired the footage of Ashley farting in bed.

Oh my God. I think they added sound effects. Do you? Yeah, because if they smell that bad, they probably don't have that much noise. It's an SPD situation, silent but definitely. Typically the loud ones don't smell. It made their relationship seem so relatable though.

Yeah, I mean. I don't fart in front of my significant other, so that was cute to see. I'm more of the, let's not pretend it doesn't happen. Let's not make each other feel it's uncomfortable. I definitely pretend it doesn't happen. Well, I mean, you won't, but you... I'm just saying, like, there's a difference between...

No, you go, baby, that's gross. And I go, what? Let's not pretend that it doesn't happen but like but but like i'm not i sometimes forget or like like what i'm saying is i feel like there's it's fine if it does it happens but then there's ashley and jared who are just like just there's no boundaries there's no yeah i guess love love i guess yeah i'm fine with like just having a couple like let's just keep it you know let's let's try not to be gross that's me yeah that's me i think we try not to be gross we sometimes you know we live together so sometimes well gross yeah but

like i mean i don't attempt not to be gross yeah i can't stand my own like bodily functions and you know so it's like why would I put that on someone else? No, it's not nice. Yeah, what's Casey still doing there? Dude, because he's just kind of making bitchy little comments about people. And I'm like, you are doing nothing, Casey. You had one rose to give out.

Yeah. You would still be here. As much as I didn't love how Peter love, you know, how Peter handled himself, I don't, again, I didn't think Peter had a bad role model. But, like, is Casey going to try to date someone or is he just going to sit there and. Why am I blanking on who Casey is? He's the one with the gray hair?

Yeah, he's Santa Claus. Okay. Santa Claus with abs. Mm-hmm. Yeah. He seemed very attractive in the beginning. He seems like a handsome guy. It's just. I don't know.

You got to know when to go home. Do we think Genevieve and Aaron are going to last? No. No. Definitely not. If I'm the producers, I just want Genevieve to say she's falling in love. And I want Aaron to say he's falling in love. And then have one of them.

With multiple people. Yeah. With multiple people. And every time, make it seem like it's their first time saying multiple people. Yeah. With multiple people. And every time make it seem like it's their first time saying it on the beach. I cannot wait.

And hear them convince themselves how last time was ridiculous and they've learned only to repeat the exact same mistake moments later. That's what I want to see

because that's what they're going to keep doing. They're not going to last. No. Do we like the Aaron and James friendship? Does it still play? Fine. It's not like doing much for me but it's like to keep doing. They're not going to last. No. Do we like the Aaron and James friendship? Does it still play? Fine.

It's not like doing much for me, but it's like to be expected. Yeah. I liked how they were like showering together. That was very bro-y and sweet moment for them. He'd get my body wash, man. He's like, dude, she's outside. She's going to wait for you.

While I'm showering. I feel like Paradise is the friendship love story. Would you guys have done the naked date? Probably not. I don't know. I don't know. Probably not. Depends on who it was with.

I would be so nervous. Yeah. To get, it would be one thing. I don't, I'm not nervous to get naked in front of someone that I like or have a crush on. Do you think the balls were out? I probably think they both were like, all right, let's just do it. And no one, you know. Do you think, do you think his balls were just out?

Or do you think he had some nude short? I mean, you would know better about it like i don't know i just can't imagine people actually like go naked but they they know they're gonna get bleeped out like i get that but you still have to expose yourself and like imagine just yeah i think they were naked or maybe no because that's not fair if a girl has to show her boobs and a guy has to show his balls yeah totally i'm not saying one shouldn't or shouldn't do it i just i know but i'm thinking like yeah definitely because i could see a world in which she was covering up her bottom and he was covering up his bottom and then i was like wait that would actually not be fair to me i i all i could think about too when that happened though and jacob when they're like well what do you think

and then jacob talked first and he was like, well, I'm fine. Yeah. And then, but like, whatever you want to do. I would have loved him to just say, your comfort is my only priority. Miss opportunity. Yeah. I would have loved him to say that.

And then just say, well, whatever you want to do. That's my only priority. That would have been nice. We'll end on that. Brie, thank you for coming. Always a pleasure. Thank you for having me. Do you have any VIP predictions

other than Brandon and Serene getting engaged? I don't feel confident about this, but I definitely ship Andrew and Brittany. And I really hope that Victoria finds a husband because, yeah, I love her. I want Justin to go home for Justin's sake. Justin has to go home. Yeah, he's already, I think he is already, he's failed. He's already, he's lost in my books. But it's fine.

He's a great guy and love is waiting for him outside of the paradise. Definitely. Where can people find you? Find me at Bree Springs. And also listen on Instagram. Find me at Bree Springs.

Could you be more specific? On Instagram and TikTok. And listen to my next episode with Nick where we get into his book. So I'm very excited about that. And do you want to say what that show is? Listen to my next episode with Nick where we get into his book. So I'm very excited about that. And do you want to say what that show is? Listen to my next show.

I just started a podcast, Yeah, But Who Cares? You can find us on Instagram at Yeah, But Who Cares and TikTok and YouTube. And you can listen to it wherever you listen to podcasts. And you can listen to it wherever you listen to podcasts, Spotify, Apple, YouTube. Check it out. Subscribe. Check out Bree's show. Follow her. The podcast. Always good to see you Spotify, Apple. Check it out. You too. Subscribe. Check out Bree's show. Follow her.

The podcast. Always good to see you. I miss you guys so much. Yeah, it's a pleasure. Come here more often, but I'll see you in LA. All right. I'm just reading Genevieve's quote. I'm sorry.

I have expectations you were unable to meet. That was so, yeah. I can't deal with, I can't deal with them. That conversation was just, it was trash. Yeah. What? It wasn't disrespectful. I would have, if I were Justin, I just would have said, okay.

Yeah. Justin's sensitive. It's fine. He's sensitive. Thanks for listening, guys. Tomorrow, Kit Keenan's with us for Going Deeper. We'll be chatting pop culture relationships, catching up with Kit. Topics on the table, Amanda.

We're going to be talking about the continually growing Tom Brady, Giselle Bündchen rumors. We're going to do a quick little update on Adam Levine and Bahadi. We're going to talk about Shakira's Instagram post and maybe a little fun Paris Hilton having a good time with a fan. Wow. Oh, well, thanks for listening guys.

Tune in tomorrow. You won't want to miss it. Go to volfiles.com. Buy my book, Don't Text Your Ex. Happy birthday for anyone who has had any issues at all in any situation with their relationships. I promise you there's a nugget in there for everybody. I really appreciate everyone who's gotten it. And for all of those who have gotten it, if you review it on your social, make a TikTok about it, whatever, tag me. I'll share it. I really appreciate everyone sharing it. Give it to your friends. It's the perfect book as a gift for your struggling friend in the dating space.

Friday. So four episodes this week. You won't want to miss it. I know we appreciate all the feedback. I know you guys loved it. So the second Ask Nick update show, it also have updates, you know, texting office hour stuff as well. So yeah, that's exciting. Until then, have a great day. All right, everyone, if you're hearing this, I need your help right now between October 11th and the 13th. You can vote for the Vow Files for Pop Podcast of 2022 for the People's Choice Awards. This award means a lot to me. I want to be able to share it with all of you. I love you guys. And me, Allie, and Amanda would be super grateful if you take the time to vote for the follow files over the next three days. You can vote 25 times a day. So I know a lot of you listen to the show and talk about the show with your friends. Tell your friends, let's all get together. Let's win this for all of us. I'm super excited. I can't wait to hopefully share this with you. So I hope you guys take the time. Link to register will be

in the show bios. I'll put it on my social as well. I know it takes a few clicks and a little bit of your time. So I really appreciate you guys doing it again, 25 times a day over the next three days. I love you all. I hope we win this together and I can't wait to share it with you. Enjoy.