The Viall Files - E516 Ask Nick - I Want a Tattoo to Memorialize My Ex

Episode Date: December 19, 2022

Welcome back to another episode of The Viall Files: Ask Nick Edition! We’re here again to answer your questions and to take your calls as we navigate the world of situationships. Our first caller is thinking about dating her boss’ brother after meeting him at a work party. With an age-gap, him displaying f-boy tendencies, and some questionable texts, she wonders if he’s worth the pursuit. Our next caller recently got out of a two year relationship and wants to memorialize her ex by possibly getting a tattoo of his initials so that she never forgets how she felt while in the relationship. Our last caller is unhappy being stuck living with her boyfriend at her father’s house after feeling like a temporary situation may be permanent. Feeling like it’s an issue with his worth ethic, she wonders how long she should support her boyfriend’s ambitions to become a Twitch streamer, while her father actively disapproves of this man’s career choice.  “You’re already branded by your first love.”   If you are interested in running a book club in your city, send an email to: [e-mail]  Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] to be a part of our Monday episodes.  To Order Nick’s Book Go To: http://www.viallfiles.com Support a Local Bookstore: https://bookshop.org/books/don-t-text-your-ex-happy-birthday-and-other-advice-on-love-sex-and-dating-9798212185622/9781419755491 Check out our new "Introvert" merch at http://www.viallfiles.com today! If you would like to get some advice on Office Hours send an email to [e-mail] with “Office Hours” in the subject line!  THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: Storyworth: Help your family share their story this holiday season with StoryWorth. Go to http://www.StoryWorth.com/viall today and save $10 on your first purchase! Total Wireless: Total by Verizon is available at http://www.TotalByVerizon.com and at retailers nationwide. Milk Bar: Right now, Milk Bar has a special, limited time offer. Get $15 off any order of $80 or more when you go to http://www.MilkBarStore.com/VIALL. OSEA: For a gift that will impress, check out OSEA’s Bestseller Minis Collection. Right now our listeners get 10% off your first order with promo code VIALL at http://www.OSEAMalibu.com. You’ll even get free samples with every order, and orders over $50 get free shipping.  Quip: Trust me, you’ve got to try it. Go to http://www.GetQuip.com/VIALL, RIGHT NOW, for your first refill FREE. Plus, shop quip’s lowest prices of the year this holiday season! quip, the good habits company. Episode Socials:  @viallfiles @nickviall See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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S-T-O-R-Y-W-O-R-T-H dotcom slash V-I-A-L-L to save $10 on your first purchase. You can listen to The Vile Files ad-free on Amazon Music. What's going on, everybody? Welcome back to another episode of the Vile Files Ask Nick Edition. I'm your host, Nick, joined by Allie and Amanda. What's going on, ladies? What's good? Happy Hanukkah. Festival of Lights.

Does it start today? It starts on the 18th, so yesterday. Yesterday. Happy Hanukkah. Thank you. All the Jewish people listening to this show, and just really just all the Jewish people across this great land, globe, galaxy. Yeah.

If you're a Jewish person in Mars, happy Hanukkah. Nick wishes you a happy Hanukkah. That was a song from Hebrew school. It's wherever you go, there's always someone Jewish. It's like, you're never alone when you say your... Community is very important. Wow. It's like, wherever you go, there's always someone Jewish.

You're never alone when you say you're a Jew. So when you're not home and you're somewhere kind of newish, the odds are don't look far because there'll be a Jew... Or like something like that. I think I rhymed Jew with Jew too many times, but thank you. I didn't know a single Jewish person until I went to college. Same. Oh yeah.

We gotta go. We gotta look deeper. Nick. I, I found like when I was in like on this tiny Island in Panama, there was like a Chabad house, which is like a Jewish organization. So I found it.

You're Jewish. So I feel like you're, you're more inclined to look for the Jewish people. We're, we just Christian Midwest. Yeah. You know, wherever you the Jewish people. We're Catholic. Christian, Midwest. Wherever you go, there's always someone Catholic? Probably.

In St. Paul, Minnesota? Yeah. What's going on? What do we got? I have to say, and it has nothing to do with religion, but Christmas music is, I'm almost at my wits end, I would say. It feels like they started playing it earlier this year. No, they didn't.

It was Thanksgiving. They were playing it at Halloween. Where are you listening? Like the mall. 99.1. Yeah. Kiss FM. But the point is, I love a good Christmas song.

Who doesn't? But they did a poll recently. Did you see that? Where it was like Americans most hated Christmas songs we all have do we want to guess what number one was and also what would you personally answer to that question well

do you want to guess anyway uh hated Christmas songs mine is the one where she's like I don't want to stay and he's like but you must baby it's cold outside I was going to say me too era like that does not hold up it doesn't it doesn't this is not a hot take like people have talked about this sir if it's not a hell yes it's a hell no let her leave coercive yeah yeah call her an uber yeah that makes sense if it's cold outside call her a damn uber amen

amen you know this thing's like yeah i'm not a big fan of the rub-a-bum-bum. I feel like that's a lot of people's. Little drummer boy? Yeah. Drummer boy's kind of stupid. I think that could be a really good remix, though.

I'm sure someone's done it. You know what I mean? Because it starts off so intense with the bells, and there's like a build. Yeah. I always like, I like a chestnut

roasting on an open fire. Did you ever have the, in in church the Silent Night rendition where you usually have men and women and the men come in with the frozen? No, no, no, no. I mean, maybe. But it's different words to the theme of Silent Night and it's like frozen in the snow lie roses sleeping. Oh, I love that shit.

I would have hated that. Only thing better than that is dust and ashes during Lent. Dust and ashes. Put me up. Wow. Wow. Okay. You should release a-

A remix of dust and ashes? Yeah, I think you should release- Allie is Catholic. No need to ask me. Allie is Catholic. Allie is Catholic. It's called Allie is Catholic. And it's like the apostrophe makes it like it's like Allie is Catholic and it's like the apostrophe

makes it like it's like Allie is Catholic and also Allie's Catholic I own it yeah it's possessive too

wow there you go what's the number one most hated song Santa Baby Santa Baby what I find more interesting you know what the ninth

most hated song is Jingle Bells let's just go through the list okay starting us off at nine Jingle Bells there's no 10? Well, no, because we had a three-way tie.

Things got kind of off. Jingle Bells. Little Drummer Boy is at number eight. That was definitely people who could not think of a Christmas song were like, oh, Jingle Bells? Seven is Rudolph. There's nothing really special about Jingle Bell. Yeah. Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer.

Is number seven. Kind of stupid. I don't know Jingle Bells, actually. I the Red-Nosed Reindeer. Is number seven. Kind of stupid. I don't know Jingle Bells, actually. I think, oh, no, I do. I was just, every time I try to think of Jingle Bells, I only think of Jingle Bell Rock. That's a good one. Which is a best, that's by far best Christmas. That will also be on my album.

Jingle Bell Rocks? Yeah. At least Catholic. I think, what's Mariah Carey's song? All I Want for Christmas is You. It's time! That's number one. Not for hated.

No, for loved. For loved. All I Want for Christmas is You. Is that hers? Yeah. Yeah. She's part of the three-way tie for number fifth most hated. Blasphemy.

I'll get up there. Okay. Number six was Mary Did You Know. The three-way tie at five is Baby It's Cold Outside, All I Want for Christmas is You, and Last Christmas. How dare you Mariah. Last Christmas. I always thought it should be

You Tore It Apart. It bothered me so much for the rhyme scheme. What is it? Last Christmas I Gave You My Heart, the very next day you gave it away. I have a distinct memory of being like seven years old and Trader Joe's and being like, that's the wrong rhyme. Okay, so then what else we got? Four was Wonderful Christmas Time.

Three was I Saw Mommy Kissing Santa Claus. Two, Grandma Got Run Over by a Reindeer. And one, Santa Baby. How did the hippopotamus song not make it on here? That is annoying. How was Santa Baby number one? Out of all of these. Nobody likes sexy baby talk.

Nobody. Santa Baby. Ew. Like, that's what the tone is. I guess. I think it's got to be Jingle Bell Rock as most beloved universally. I don't know. Who's to say?

Well, I find Christmas music to be kind of delightful. I was surprised by that. During the weeks of, you know, Christmas. I'm not playing it. I feel like, don't get mad at me. I feel like sometimes you give off Grinch energy. Sure. And so it's very, it's like heartwarming to think of you like being in like the Christmas spirit.

Caring and having a heart. Like in your, no, but like making cookies. And his heart was three sizes too small. Yeah. It's, now I think just like being very emotive. I definitely have some Grinch energy. Yeah. Misunderstood.

Jeff is the little dog. Jeff. Pulling the sleigh. Jeff is my tiny Tim. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So my friend sent a controversial text and actually said, I have a pitch for the vile file. So he knew he was hoping this would stir the pot, start the conversation. Shout out Nolan.

He said- He wants credit for this? Well, I'm shouting him out. Fame hungry. I don't think he does want credit. I think he's a diligent man. So he said, I have this theory that the cultural pendulum on ghosting someone has swung in the other direction and it is actually the most polite thing to do after a bad date. Like being blunt and refusing a date is deaf-rooter in 2022.

I remember when ghosting was the worst thing someone could do, but I think sometimes people are better off like left in the dark. And this came on the heels of like a horrible date he went on I disagree and what was the horrible date he didn't tell me about it I think no one I think he has a point how I think he totally has a point because like like a soft ghost what's a soft ghost the problem with ghosting is that you're not like the to ghost someone is to literally not talk about like expectations and those expectations be around like how are we going to communicate if one of us doesn't like each other which is obviously it doesn't often happen early in dating because you don't really know about each other and it's a first date and you're presuming that the other person wouldn't be better off by like not having to waste any more energy wondering like

are they gonna call are we gonna hang out again blah blah blah blah so many people like who didn't have a good date the other person's out there being like we had such a fun time i think when i say soft ghost i mean not following up like if you leave a date and you're like this is so much fun let's do it again that's not a ghost okay i think it's kind of if you don't have anything nice to say don't say it i agree like i guess it's it's not the best behavior but i do think he has a point of like i i think if you go on a date and maybe you say hey it's nice we should do this again sometime you know kind of your throwaway get me out of this situation in a pleasant. Oftentimes, I think two people are kind of like, we'll never see each other again, you know, kind of thinking internally in their

internal dialogue. But if one person follows up, says, hey, how about that second date? You need to say something. You should say something if you don't want to go on that date. And you don't have to be an asshole about it. I did that literally last night. Say, hey, you know, I really enjoy the time, but like, you know, I'm giving some bullshit excuse if you want to like be nice but like i'm really busy right now and i just don't think it's a good fit but like i think you were great and you know i wish you all the best i guess it's just interesting that like we're encouraging like communicating but like

lying and i get that it's a white lie. I have no problem with someone saying, hey, listen, I just wasn't feeling it, but that can be awkward. You don't have to give more information than they ask. So if someone says, how about that second date? You can just say, hey, listen, I really had a good time, but I just don't think, you know, a second date's in the cards. And if they ask, well, why do you feel that way? Then you can hit them with some more information. But yeah, early on, I don't think't think you need to like dump on them all the reasons why you didn't enjoy their company yeah but you don't have to ghost and like leave them hanging and wondering just because you were too chicken shit to have an awkward conversation nolan also it's a text it's the easiest way out just shoot off a little you

know i'm getting more friend vibes or whatever why do people feel like they have to be a dick just to like let someone off the hook? I think we're not used to confrontation. Sure. Which we're trying to like encourage people to like. Get more comfy with it. Get more comfy with. I hate the word. Confrontation more just like slightly awkward communication.

Yeah. Challenging communication. Challenging communication is fair. You know. I think of someone like Nolan's trying to like do these mental gymnastics to justify behavior

that seems more convenient for him in this situation. He actually said he was going to be blunt instead of ghosting this person because he was like I want this person

to know what they've done. Oh. Well that's petty. Yeah. I don't think Nolan's right. I would I would encourage him to know what they've done. Oh, that's petty. Yeah, I don't think Nolan's right. I would encourage him to not be petty and to not express his anger. Maybe he's just venting.

But yeah, I don't think, I think you can be kind and honest at the same time. And they might not receive it as kindly as you meant it, but I think we should always encourage communication. When it comes to choosing a wireless plan, you're forced to compromise. you mentioned, but I think we should always encourage communication. carrier for you and your family with plans starting at just $30 per month on America's most reliable 5G network. Sacrifice nothing, experience everything. Total by Verizon is available at totalbyverizon.com and at retailers nationwide. Based on first place rankings and RootMetrics first half 2022 5G assessments of 125 metros. Experiences vary, not an endorsement. I am a dessert lover and sometimes snob. And let me just say, Milk Bar passed the dang test.

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We have an exciting, fun week as we close off this holiday season. I have some exciting news for all the people in Chicago, in Milwaukee. I'll be home for the holidays and we're going to do some book signings. So December 21st in Chicago area, Naperville at Anderson's Bookstore. The address is 123 West Jefferson Avenue, Naperville, Illinois. It's at 7 p.m. I'll be signing books, taking some pictures. I think the price of admission is buying a book. So if you already have a book, maybe buy it for a friend. I'll sign it. We'll hang out, do some meet and greet chat with you all. It'll be super fun. That's Wednesday, December 21st. And on Tuesday, December 27th in Milwaukee at Boswell Books.

That's 259 North Downer Avenue. That's downtown Milwaukee. A good old Downer Street on the east side. That'll be fun. Tell your friends in the greater Milwaukee area. I hope to see you all there from all your people in Waukesha, New Berlin, Germantown, all that fun stuff. It will be at 2 p.m. in the afternoon.

So hopefully you're not doing it. Hopefully you have off that week. Come join us 2 p.m. in the afternoon, December 27th. Boswell Books in Milwaukee. That's B-O-S-W-E-L-L Books. And again, December 21st at Anderson's Bookstore in Naperville, just outside of Chicago. So check it out. Look on a Vilefile social for more information. We'll put it up in the upcoming days. Actually, it'll be up already when you guys are listening to this.

So I hope to see you all there. It'll be a ton of fun. Come, bring your friends, and we'll hang out. And I hope to see you all there. This week for Going Deeper, we have Fortune Feimster, friend of show, writer, actress, comedian. Should be a good episode. Yeah.

We will be breaking down the second volume of the Harry and Meghan documentary, episodes four through six. Obviously, we recapped one through three last week. So breaking down everything they have to tell us about their crazy story, crazy lives. Fortune's got a new special on Netflix to talk about. Fortune is a hysterical comedian. She's been on the show a couple of times. We love her.

She's super funny funny has great takes and like ali said we'll be breaking down part two the second installment of harry and megan take america by storm yeah it should be a lot of fun and we have freestyle uh coming up uh we don't know who's going to be joining us for that but it should be wild pop culture bachelor tea everything you've missed yeah it's going to be joining us for that but it should be wild pop culture bachelor tea everything you've missed yeah that's gonna be great thank you so much to everybody who has been submitting breakup songs of the week uh everyone has a spectacular taste in music and if this is inspiring you please dm the vile files uh your favorite breakup song this week we are featuring crying over you by chelsea cutler um the person who submitted this wrote, For the breakup song of the week, Crying Over You by Chelsea Cutler is my favorite, like, slow pre-breakup breakup songs.

The lyric that gets to me is, I keep wasting every night waiting for you to say goodbye. But if you won't, you won't. I'll make the first move. And also the chorus, I choose drinking alone, drowning my tears in my bedroom, because it'll make me happier than you do. I choose crying over you is really a heavy hitter for me too.

And we love breakup songs that speak to all stages of the breakup, the terrible, dreadful lead up, the heat of it, the after the fact. And also something I've been thinking about as I've been listening to music is like maybe after the breakup playlist of the week, we do a situationship playlist of the week because there are some songs that really speak to that experience.

Define it. I feel like we should just call it the breakup playlist of the week. I think, no, because we encourage, if you're in a situationship, to break up. Yeah. Should have got off the bat. We'll call it the enabling playlist. Also, SZA has a new album out.

Have you listened to that? It's incredible. It's a good breakup playlist. SZA has a new album out have you listened to that? it's incredible and like just you probably could it's just a breakup it's a good breakup playlist Kill Bill good song mmm

yeah good movie as well so check out SZA new album it's really phenomenal just in general but you should

we should definitely throw some SZA songs in the absolutely in the playlist be sure to do that should we get to our callers? Let's get to our callers. How's it going? Good. My name is Kate and I'm 27. How can we help, Kate?

I am kind of interested in my boss's brother, but not sure if we should cross that line or how to really approach the situation. Okay. What kind of company size are we talking? Are we talking like large corporate, like big HR, thousands of employees? Are we talking more smaller, more intimate environment? We are talking very small startup company. I think the hardest part with this one is I work out of my boss's house all the time because we live up the road. So I am there all the time.

You're there all the time. I'm assuming his brother works for him. No, so it's she and the brother. He actually just visits town like they have family visit them all the time so he doesn't live here don't even live there do you think she would be more understanding so you know she's made like jokes like oh you should marry my brother blah blah blah okay but i was looking at it more as a fun thing because i don't think he wants to settle down like I think he's living his best bachelor life.

And so it's like, okay, I'm going into it as this could be a fun thing. But then if it's a fun thing, is that risking it? If it doesn't end well, then it's like, I'm still going to see him all the time. Would my boss be okay with that? Yeah. What is your big concern? I guess what if it ended poorly? You have at least some control over that. You have no control over it ending. I don't know how you handle breakups do you think you're a good breaker upper or do you think you're a bad breaker upper truthfully i've never been in a relationship so i wouldn't know okay all right well there you go we also have a really big age gap oh okay and so you're how old again 27 27 how old is and he's 41 okay so i'm like i feel like he would be more mature about it, but I just, he's coming back to town literally the week of Christmas. And I'm just wondering how to go about

pursuing the situation. Where, where are you and him at all? If anything, he was in town kind of like right before Halloween. And he was super aggressively flirting with me and he ended up sleeping over and we didn't sleep together, but you know, there was like cuddling, making out, whatever. And I pretty much had to do the drive of shame to bring him back to my boss's house in the morning. And we texted briefly after that. And I decided to be bold like a week later and be like, okay. And he's like very financially well off. He travels all the time. So I was like, I'm going to be bold and be like, Hey, I'm feeling spontaneous. Like, what are you doing this weekend? Cause he's also talked about like flying me out. And we met,

it seemed like it went well. And then I haven't heard from him since like, I was like, well, let me know when you have a free weekend. And he was like, we'll do and nothing. So when you say you've had no relationships, like, what are we talking here? Like, are, are you, have you been dating? Have you had some short flings? Are you just pretty much like none? Definitely. I go on dates. I've had a lot of stupid situationships where like, I thought they were going to go somewhere and didn't. So it's like, there's definitely been guys and there's been dating and there's been like long-term dating, but nothing ever like boyfriend, girlfriend. Like the age gap, it's a thing. It's something you need to acknowledge and you need to consider

how that would play a role in your relationship. Right. Because it's not like you do need to consider it. The fact that I don't love for you, like, again, I'm only going on the information I have, but I don't love for you. You don't have a ton of relationship experience when considering dating someone who's significantly older than you. when considering dating someone who's significantly older than you. And I only say that because I don't like, you know, when you talk about age differences, you're talking about power dynamics, right? And there's a lot of different ways you can have different power dynamics in a relationship. Certainly age matters, money matters, things like that. But certainly confidence matters.

Power can change in a relationship all the time. Like if he's generally insecure and you're generally confident, you could have more power in that relationship. But experience also matters too. If you don't feel like you have a lot of experience in a certain situation and he does, that might affect the power dynamic a little bit, right? And you would have to, this is something you're going to have to suss out with him is how mindful is he going to be about that? You know?

Like I'm trying to gauge if he just wants a fling then too. Do you know what I mean? Or would it be something more? And I guess I'm not going to know until he's back. Do you know his i'm trying to engage if he just wants a fling then too do you know what i mean or would it be something more and i guess i'm not going to know till he's back do you know his dating history i know that he had a long-term girlfriend but he's never been engaged or married so he's had relationships and why do you think he might be in a fuckboy era because i think you know he's just got money to blow right now and so he's traveling and i don't think he feels the need to settle down like i think if he and i hooked up again it would be like out of convenience like she's here she's present great but i don't think he's like looking to settle down but i asked him i was like okay what's your 10-year plan where we were just like chatting

he's like i want kids eventually so i'm like okay eventually you're gonna have to settle down unless you want to do it like nick cannon style but yeah yeah, I mean, what's your tenure plan is? I think it's kind of a loaded question. You know, like, who knows? You sent some texts in. I did. Is this with him? Yeah.

So the first set of texts was like he had just left and I was like, okay, I'm going to set the bar low. I'm just going to say like, it was great to meet you. Hope you landed safe, blah, blah, blah. And he responded more than I thought he would. And the next day is like, how's my fourth favorite person in the city that I live in? And I'm like, I think I bumped up to at least number two. And it was just like playful banter. And then I sent the bold text of like, let's get together soon.

Amanda, why do you have such a confused look on your face? There's a kissy face. I know. And I was like, wow. You look concerned. It's just like the tone of these text messages. All right, let's read. I haven't read them yet.

For a loop. I haven't read them yet. Okay. Let's dramatic read. Sure. By all means. You can be her. Okay.

Hope you have a safe flight. It was nice meeting you. Dot, dot, dot. Again, LOL. Thank you. Just about to take off from Atlanta. Great meeting you and hanging with you too. How was the rest of your day?

How did you guys meet? I had met him once before a long time ago, like high and by at my boss's house. And then we saw each other again at a charity event. And that was when he was like super flirty with me in person. Gotcha. Okay. All right, go ahead.

It was long. Haha. I definitely snuck a nap in. Did you do anything exciting before you left? I was struggling too. Just got a public sub. Publix. Yeah, I'm familiar now.

I went to the South. I just got a public sub. My fave. Feel of, you know, and honestly, Natalie told me that the public subs were legit when we were there. It's a huge cultural thing. Yeah. And I didn't believe her, but I feel a lot better now.

Thank you. Taking off. Talk to you later. Kiss feel a lot better now. Thank you. Taking off. Talk to you later. Kissy face emoji. Oh, safe travels. And then the next day he wrote, how is my fourth favorite DI resident doing? Who's in his top three? I think his sister, her husband, and his niece. Okay, that's fair. OMG, I think I should have at least moved up to number two, LOL. How's the only person I know who would willingly live in Wisconsin doing? He lives in Wisconsin. Okay, wow.

Midwestern, yeah. I'll give you three winky face emoji. Sorry, LOL. Hey, I love Wisconsin. I'm doing good. Ha ha ha, I'll take it, kissy face. I'm actually at blank with blank and blank my other friend blank. Different one. LOL. How was your day? That's funny. I hope you guys are having fun. Do you have another friends not named blank?

My day was good. Busy catching up from being off. Only a couple, LOL. Yeah, must be a long day showing up and buying everybody lunch for the day. Today I actually had to work, LOL. Which means dot dot dot, handshakes with lunch? LOL. Ha ha, I'm just messing with you. I'm sure it was a the day. Today I actually had to work, LOL. Which means dot dot dot, handshakes with lunch? LOL. Haha, I'm just messing with you. I'm sure it was a long day. A couple of emojis. You sent him a picture of yourself. Did you know your brother is addicted to his phone? So it's a picture for the listeners. You are taking a selfie and then the brother's in the background on his phone. His brother? Yes. Okay. There's another brother involved involved do you like him too no that'd be fun uh

duh look cute he says oh thanks you should have stayed could have been the fourth date winky face oh well very true laughy face emoji hey stranger i'm feeling spontaneous this weekend what are your plans and this is on a Monday. This is on a Monday. So. Hey, I'm currently in Palm Springs, but heading to Vegas for the weekend. We are going to the Raiders game Sunday, then flying out Monday. How are you? That sucks. I was hoping to see you. Have the best time. It would be nice to see you as well. Would you have really come to Wisconsin?

Yes, LOL. Why else would I be texting you? I thought you were messing with me. Not this time, LOL. Winky face. Next time you have a free to Wisconsin? Yes, LOL. Why else would I be texting you? I thought you were messing with me. Not this time, LOL. Winky face. Next time you have a free weekend, let me know. Will do. And that's it. Why are you so concerned about these texts?

You made it sound like we're... No, I think I just have a very sensitive reaction to emoji use. Lots of emojis. Yeah. And there's nothing wrong. I feel like also there's nothing wrong with your text messages. There's no judgment here. I just's nothing wrong. I feel like also there's nothing wrong with your text messages. There's no judgment here. I just get emoji.

Emoji. I think emojis are like, if there's a lot of emojis in this type of situation, I think it speaks to like both people are like, it speaks to a lack of rapport because you're like, you're trying to like, oh, don't sound like a dick.

Have an emoji face, you know, like, and that's where, and when was that? That was a couple weeks ago, like a month ago, a couple weeks ago. That was like a month ago. A couple weeks ago.

So have you heard from him since? No. Okay. Was that good or is it just like, I'm just going to be polite and say sure? I wouldn't pursue this guy. I feel like you put it out there. You said if you have another free weekend,

you said you're feeling spontaneous. You weren't overdramatic. You played it, I feel like, perfectly. Yeah, especially with the age gap. You put yourself overdramatic. You played it, I feel like, perfectly. Yeah, especially with the age gap. You put yourself out there. I would let him pursue you and see how interested he is. You have concerns about where he's at in his dating life, how serious he is about finding a relationship.

And these are all valid questions. He lives out of state. I think you need to know how serious he is about you because I don't want you to feel like you're chasing this older guy who's more financially stable, who also is like brothers with your boss. There's just a lot of complications here. If nothing else, I would like for you to feel confident

about how he feels about you and then go from there. If he was just like maturely reached out and said, hey, we had a great time. I'd love to see you again. And I'd love him to bring up the fact that his sister is your boss. I would love for him to bring up these conversations that you guys would need to have if you explored a relationship. And so that you can have the confidence that you're with someone who's not only older than you, but has the maturity that matches his age as well. And is mindful of the complications that an age gap could bring to a relationship. And would be someone who'd want to make sure that instead of like taking advantage of like a power dynamic, that could be an advantage.

That he would relinquish that and make sure that you guys were equals and on the same page. And have conversations about how you guys would have a successful relationship if you pursued one and how you guys would go about making each other feel like you were each other's equals and things like that. Fair. So if he comes to town and is flirty and wants to hook up, should I hook up with him or no? If you know you want to date him, I guess it depends on what you want. Yeah. or no if you know you want to date him you know i guess it depends on what you want yeah if you just want to like have some good sex and like go have some good sex but if you want to see if he's serious about dating you then i would maybe slow things down you might be able to have your cake and eat it too but it's it's risky you know i know i feel like the hooking up would be risky

it'd be like i kind of would just put myself in that box, I think. Yeah. It would have to be amazing sex. And then he would have to, because if you hooked up right away with some confidence, I can assure you that he would pull away and pull back a little bit. And then based solely on how good he thought the sex was, he would then try to reach out again to see you again, mostly based off the sex. And then over time, you might build a rapport. It would be a slower build towards a relationship. It would delay you potentially being in a relationship.

He has a lot of built-in excuses to not date you. Your boss, the age gap, things like that. I brought up the boss thing. I was like, I just feel weird about it. And he was like, I don't know. They wouldn't care. He has no reservations on that front. Okay. And I haven't really asked him directly, but I think his reservations are more that like he doesn't

live anywhere near here. And I don't know if he's like looking today. Yeah. I would just trust your gut on that. If he reaches back out, I think it's good to show that you're interested in him. But other than that, it'd play a little hard to get. Okay. Cause I think it's convenience. Like I think he's going to reach out when he's here because totally it's convenient so do you want to be his hometown hookup yeah i guess i need to make that choice and if i do then it's fine like go for the hookup but if i don't then don't hook up yeah i would be real i think you kind of like him and i think you would be putting yourself in a vulnerable situation to convince yourself that you just want to hook up.

This is why I called. Yeah. I don't know if he's really worth it. Okay. I think because, you know, like what's going to happen? Like you hook up, you feel even closer to him. He doesn't call. Let's say you like if you had sex with him and then he handled himself the same way he did this time, it's going to feel a little bit more like rejection than it does now. And it's going to bum you out and that could

affect your work. And that's when it could get messy and things like that. I would wait till you find out how serious he is about you and like go out with him, have fun with him. Yeah. But just set a boundary with yourself you don't even have to communicate that with him until the appropriate time i wouldn't even like bring him back to your apartment or vice versa i feel like i'm really enjoying getting to know you and i'd love to keep getting to know you but that's my focus right now really drawing the line yeah if he's serious about dating you and at all it'll work and if he's not probably just it'll be too much of a chase and i'll just walk away i'll just feel like it's not worth it i don't like like yeah i'll go with her if she want to hook up

but i'm not gonna you know the average fuck boy you know they're not they're not machiavellian where they're trying to lie to you and you know there's some like assholes out there but i i'm guessing this 41 year old guy doesn't want to mess and so if you communicate your boundaries my guess is he'll want to respect that, but you do have to communicate them either, you know, right. And that's why he's probably not pushing and he's probably not insisting on you guys hanging out and things like that. Let him show you how serious he is, if at all. And if it's just more of a, Hey, I'm in town, let's get together, hang out with him. But if you have any interest in dating them, I would take it real slow physically.

Keep it PG. Yeah. Super PG. Okay. All right. Well, thank you so much. Keep us posted. We'd love to know if there are any rendezvous.

Yeah. I'll send an update. All right. Take care. Thanks. Bye-bye. Bye-bye. All right.

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That's G-E-T-Q-U-I-P dotcom slash V-I-A-L-L. Quip, the good habits company. How's it going? Hi, I'm Maya and I'm 25. How can I help Maya? I recently got out of a two-year relationship. It's been about a year and I'm getting ready to go on dating naps again. And it's fine. I feel good about it. But I do want to memorialize that relationship that I had in some way. And yeah, because I have a lot of gratitude for him and for that relationship. So you feel guilty about dating again, basically?

I don't feel guilty about dating again, basically? I don't feel guilty about it, but I do feel like he was a really great person. And it was my first relationship. Did you end it? It was mutual-ish. Who really made the decision to say, not only we're broken up, but we're not getting back together? Because I feel like i'm getting the sense someone had to draw the line i think like i said it i said it because i knew it wasn't working

and he was like yes but i i guess i thought he wouldn't say yes sir he you know what do you mean he thought he wouldn't say yes i guess i said i said i I wanted to break up because I knew that's what he wanted, but that's not what I wanted. I just knew it was going down that. Oh, interesting. So you weren't getting what you wanted or needed. I would have worked on it a little bit more, I think, but he needed to be alone. Gotcha. Yeah. And he'd been through breakups before and I think he was less scared of it. Okay.

And so maybe you recognize that you too weren't happy, but you were maybe a little more scared about ending it. Oh yeah, for sure. So you want to memorialize it. What do you mean? Yeah, I mean, I guess I am a little scared about losing that feeling that I had. And I feel like once I start going on dates,

it'll become more clear that I won't feel like that again. Feel like what? How I did in that relationship. Do you feel that way now? Do I feel that way now? Well, it sounds like you're still holding on to a feeling for him. There's a flame that still burns for him, so to speak. Yeah.

We'll call that hope. Yeah. I mean, I don't want to get back together with him. Sure? Yeah. Okay. I am. Like it didn't work and it didn't work for a lot of reasons.

Okay. So then what is this hope or flame that you still, like, what is, what is, what is the, try to describe to me the feeling that you're having a hard time letting go? I think maybe this is because it was my first relationship. But yeah, like even talking about it makes me emotional. But like, I do feel like before him, I thought I couldn't, I thought I would never have that. And like he showed me I could have it. Yeah. Okay. You also mentioned potentially like a tattoo as being an option. Is that still

something you're considering? Yeah. That's like, that's the idea that I had to like memorialize it and move on from it. And I know it's like a tattoo maybe about the relationship or about him. But the idea that I had involved his initials, which I know is a bad idea, maybe. But why is it a bad idea? Why is it a bad idea so I can tell myself like move on from it and not want to do it? I think you're a lovely person, but I do think I'm going to give you a hard time. You failed the first assignment because that first sentence out of your mouth was, I'm thinking about getting my ex's initials tattooed to my body to memorialize the relationship before I start dating again.

Yeah, that's fair. Can you just say that for me? Okay. I'm thinking about getting my ex's initials tattooed on me before I start dating again to memorialize our time together. Okay. All right. Thank you for saying for saying when you say it out loud does it sound as nuts to you as it does to us i mean it sounds nuts when i think about it in one way but then when i think about it in another way it doesn't sound that crazy because it's just for me well everyone's gonna see it unless i get it in a place where like. Like an intimate place that would require someone else to take off their clothes and then go. Nobody's ever going to see my back. No one ever?

But I think the plan is that someone does. Yeah. Fair. Yeah. I think there's a healthier way to do this is I guess my short answer. I was going to say this reminds me something my therapist tells me a lot is like because I think grateful gratitude is such a good emotion. That's something Nick says all the time. It's like the only non-toxic one. And so I think it's one where it's like, I try to feel it very freely. But something my therapist will tell me is like, how much credit are you giving other people? Like, it's yes, it's good to appreciate people and to acknowledge them. But like, a lot of times you can just kind of attribute everything to another person and like frame it as fully like it was him versus like I wonder if there's a way of framing this like yes it was he facilitated it but like what did you access within yourself within the relationship and if maybe there's a tattoo motif

related to like the more you side of things and your experience so that way it wouldn't be as like yeah also it's so easy sometimes and especially I can totally relate of you felt like you would maybe never find this or this relationship was so different than anything else you've ever experienced so it feels like that was it and you want to think back on it I think while that's totally valid and true and certain relationships are deeper or more meaningful than other ones it is also so easy to look back at your most recent relationship especially if you're now single especially if you're trying to get out there and date and it's not quite the same connection to look back and just have such rose colored glasses of, oh, this was the best one because it's your most recent. Well, it's also

her first and only. Yeah. How old are you again? 25. 25. Okay. How long did you date for? Two years. Okay. Yeah. I mean that first love,'s special like it it does brand you in a way you know like you kind of already have a tattoo and a kind of more metaphorical sense of your first love so i think that the actual tattoo is a bit overkill and i think everything ellie and amanda said is great too but yeah i think think what is the feeling other than gratitude of, it sounds like you really appreciate the fact that he made you feel loved for a period of time. Yeah, I mean, and I felt like a sense of belonging. Yeah. Well, love.

You felt loved. Yeah. Yeah. It's an exciting thing to feel love, and it's really sad when you lose it. And it's also very scary breaking up. Hell, you did much better than I did. It took me seven years off and on to get to the place that you are now. At least you can be like, I'm done, and I know I need to move on. I was 25, but I started when I was 18 and it was a roller coaster and it was a mess. So pat yourself on the back. You're doing a good job because it's not easy for

anyone to get over there first. It's just, it's such a, it just fucks with you. And I think part of that is that fear that you'll never find what you had with them. How could you, you know, it was like you waited 23 years to find that and it like, oh, and it felt so good at the time. How could you? It was like you waited 23 years to find that and it felt so good at the time and then you lost it and it's kind of scary. It's just good to remember that it's going to happen again. It just might take some more time, especially when you go out and start dating again. You're going to have some ups and downs. There are going to be some discouraging moments. You're going to meet a lot of dickheads type of thing. But I think you want to try to enjoy that journey too. I don't think you should get a tattoo.

Or maybe just really wait. I just think not of his initials. I think if you get a tattoo, again, something that feels a little bit more focused on your experience and centers the things that you learned about yourself, that you love about yourself, that you're reminded of about yourself within the relationship and something that's like i also think for practicality sake future lovers how would they feel maybe about some tattoos of

your ex on you like you know like i just think there's you don't know how you might feel about this person years and years and years down the line but you always know how you felt about yourself and the feelings you accessed i mean i have i have, I don't know, 20 some tattoos that all started because I got a tattoo that reminded me of each of my siblings. I don't have any initials on my body, but they all tell a story of a sibling, right? I got a couple of bees on here and those remind me of my brothers. So to Amanda's point, it could be a symbol that, you know, reminds you. And again, I want to be less about him and to Amanda's point more about a feeling. I still also think you should wait a little bit too.

I don't think you need to do this so you can date again. Do you know ephemeral tattoos? Have you ever, I get targeted Instagram ads for them all the time. Is that the fading one? Yeah. So it's these tattoos that exist. I think they stay on for like around three years or so and they fade. And so that could also be a good kind of like middle ground of like, if right now you really

are determined and you really want to feel like you'll have this like permanent reminder for at least the next few years, like that could be a good. I'm also just a little, like I understand you're well-intentioned but i want you to just free yourself of this because my fear you know as you start dating is like you're gonna have to as you start dating i don't think you should go into dating comparing every date to the love that you know you had i think you need to be open to finding a new kind of love at the end of the day you want to feel loved by someone. And that person made you feel loved.

And that's going to take some time. And you're going to have to build rapport with people. But I don't want, you know, they always say that comparison is a thief of joy. And I think your mindset is one that you're going to compare it constantly, especially if you tattoo something that, and I see why you almost want to. It's just like, I had this. It was, you know, I know I want this again.

It was great when I had it. And this is my barometer to measure all future interactions against. And on some level, I get it. Like certainly, yes, but like not the person. And I think you need to be open to letting it play out. Because like, also, if we're breaking down the relationship, like, something led you to go to him at the time and say, I think things aren't working out between us. I think maybe we should break up. And what were some of those things?

I mean, I don't think we were compatible. It was really hard to have fun with each other. And bottom line, it was really hard for each of us to be healthy when we were together. I do think we kind of triggered each other, even though we didn't mean to. And yeah. And what did you like about the relationship? I felt really like accepted by him. Okay. What, how, how, I guess how? He never like dismissed what I said or how I felt.

And I felt like I could go to him with everything. And I always felt better when I talked to him about it. That's great. Like those are very replicable feelings. There's a lot of people who can make you feel that way. Yeah. Not to sound like a broken record, but I also think you can frame that as like you were probably accepting yourself more.

Like being with someone where you knew you could bring stuff to the table. Like I think probably some of like the joy and the reason that was so powerful was because it meant that there were all these parts of yourself that you gave yourself permission to embrace because you had a buddy there for you to do it and like yes he was an awesome buddy he facilitated that but like it's again still like something you did and you were able to be like vulnerable and more like welcoming to like all the range of things you were feeling

and to like you know look at head-on of like, push away stuff that made you feel like nervous. And like Nick always frames things of even if things end, like take it as a sign that you can find people you like, like take it as a sign that you can feel this way. There are people out there that can exactly like elicit those feelings, help you feel that way about yourself, have you feel comfortable. It's not a sign that there's no one else out there that can do that. In a a way like you just have to flip it of Oh now I know that's out there. So i'm excited to go find it again with someone who's Going to be you know, hopefully my life partner with me longer term. I'm also just confident that when you meet your next love and I don't know if that's going to be

the one the next time you feel in love or loved by someone, you're just going to have a very different mindset than you have now. I don't know if you're going to want to have a tattoo of the feeling that you're feeling now. Feelings change, as you know, and I think a tattoo is obviously very permanent. I think your idea is well intentions. I just think it has a lot of things that can backfire. And in the short term, I think it can backfire by not by, by causing you to compare more than you should early on in dating. And I'd love for you to just kind of go into dating for the first time, just really open-minded and kind of very adventurous and just taking it kind

of very slow with no expectations that you're going to find your person in the first handful of dates. And if you do going to find your person in the first handful of dates. And if you do like, great, you won the lottery. But like, I would, I would think of this as a beginning of a journey, you know, now that you've had your first love and you've experienced this and now you're going to go back out there and you're really just going to really take the time to find someone that you are not only, you know, connected with and feel safe with, but are compatible with and someone who, you know, you feel like not only accepts you, but you can communicate in a way that doesn't, you know, trigger them or trigger you. And I

want you to be focused on that rather than comparing what you did have with someone, you know what I'm saying? And I just, I think it's really, I think it's hard to do that in general. I think it's even harder if you want to memorialize this. I like, if you want to memorialize it, I would have some sort of like funeral. And maybe that's, you always hear me talking about writing a letter. Maybe you do that through a letter. Maybe you like write a letter, maybe it's to him, maybe it's to yourself, you know, maybe it's, you know, maybe it's just like expressing gratitude in general for what you had and what you hope for yourself in the future. And then burn the letter or something. But you just

kind of have to get it out. I don't want you to keep it inside of you. And I feel like a tattoo is more keeping it attached to you and keeping it on you and keeping it close to you. It is scary to let go of these relationships. It's really scary to completely close the book on a relationship that you once thought you'd have for the rest of your life. And I feel like the tattoo is more of a way to circumvent that rather than accomplish what you're trying to accomplish. That's true. I agree with that. I like the letter writing idea and then agree with that. I like the letter writing idea and then maybe burning it.

Yeah, have a little ceremony with your friends. If you're a sentimental person, there's this thing called wish paper which you can get it on Amazon or wherever else. You write on it and then you light it on fire and it flies up into the air in this beautiful little plume of flame and smoke. And you can write

down specific qualities, memories. There's so many ways to healthily work through the sentimentality you feel because yeah i'm totally down for you having some sort of ceremony around saying goodbye to this before you start going out in the dating world like make a playlist like go all in if you want like make a playlist of songs that remind you of him like really like give yourself full permission to feel it in a way that's like maybe more localized to now than a way that's like making sure you feel this down the line because you know you it's meaningful and good to feel it now but you don't really know how future you is going to like want to need to feel yeah and i promise, future you is going to feel differently. How future you will feel,

I don't know. But I'm 100% certain that future you is going to look back and chuckle about the fact that you once thought of getting a tattoo of his initials. It'll be a fun memory that you have of yourself. I just don't want you to also then have to like look up tattoo removal artist. Yeah. And if you insist, I think I take Amanda's idea of not getting initials, but maybe something that later on you can describe to other people as something completely else. It's like it's a cloud and that could be anything. Temporary tattoo or even like a piece of jewelry or something that isn't, I don't know, in

the wise words of Jimmy Buffett, it's a permanent reminder of a temporary feeling. That was Jimmy Buffett? Yeah. Cheeseburger in paradise, man. Yeah. Take Jimmy's advice. Permanent reminder of a temporary feeling. And it is temporary. And even though it's been going on for a while and you've been dealing with the inbornness loss for two years now you said a year a year okay but it's good that you're ready to get it back out there but i would encourage you to have this little like ceremony write this letter burn it whatever bury it i don't care mail it to no one and then try to really say goodbye to it but i think in that letter or in this ceremony goodbye is a good ending you really want to say goodbye to it.

I think the hard part is saying goodbye to who I was. What do you mean? In a way, also. Because I have so many memories that are tied to that relationship. Yeah, I just think you're going to feel differently about it. I, as someone who truly, truly struggled getting over their first love, I just promise you you're going to feel differently. And when I look back on experiences I shared with her that were very formidable because I was really young, she's just someone who would just happen to be there. I still have that memory. I didn't take away from that experience.

Whatever you were able to... And that's what you should be grateful for. Be grateful for whatever he was there for, to be a catalyst through whatever experience that you got to experience that you thought added value to your life or helped form you as a person you are today. You're not saying about that person. Our lives are our own little movies. We're the main characters in our movies. Sometimes we have to remember that we're not the main about that person. Our lives are our own little movies. We're the main characters in our movies. Sometimes we have to remember that we're not the main character in other people's movies. But, like, we are, like, our own main characters. And this is your movie.

And, like, that was one chapter. And this is another chapter. But, like, when you, like, watch these movies, most movies, like, they're not, like, these individual stories of all these new characters. They're not like these individual stories of all these new characters. Like, you know, the main character, you know, like there's a continuation and like things that the character experienced in the first act, you know, and things like that, like pay off in the second and third act and things like that. They all come together and they all have a benefit. And that's why, you know, in a lot of movies you have these arcs and builds and you have

these low moments and you have these low moments so people can experience the high moments and things like that and so that's you too you don't you're not saying goodbye to that person and quite the opposite you're you're just continuing on your journey it's just it's have it has other characters involved he was a a main character for a period of time and now that character has gone somewhere else, but the residue, like the good and the bad is still who you are today is a big reflection of the role he played, but you are not incapable of being who you are without him. I think you, I want you to give yourself more credit that you, you know, the, the person you are today, he might have played a role, but you were the main, like, catalyst. Like, I think I struggle anyway with, like, giving myself credit and, you know, self-compassion, blah, blah, blah.

So, yeah. You definitely do not have to say goodbye to that person. That person is still who you are. Now that it's over over the horizon seems wider like possibilities are more and i just need to remember that and i don't need something like a tattoo tying me to the past and like holding me on holding on to me from the past yeah and i think that's what you're trying to do without admitting it to yourself. And I'm glad you're able to acknowledge that now because it's, it's, I really empathize with what you're going through. It's, it's very scary to truly, fully move on from that first love. It's something you never thought you would have to do. It sucks. You know, like I remember being broken up with my first girlfriend for a long time and another girlfriend, but still wanting to hold on to those love letters and pictures. And it wasn't because I might appreciate it when I was 90. It was like, what if? There was always that what if we got back

together kind of thing. Even after I said I was done and told all my friends I was done. And just something to remember too, because two months ago I was super hung up on someone and I was talking to my friend and he was saying, that's totally fine. Take your time. You know, you can heal however you want to heal, but just know that at this point you are just continuing to give him so much of your time and power. And he's not even here because I was consumed. Yeah. And he was, and he was like, it's up to you of how you want to give your energy and spend your time and give someone power. But that's what you're doing in this moment. I'm guessing you spent a lot of time in the past year reminiscing about the relationship. Yeah. I mean, I do think about

it a lot. And that's totally normal. But to Allie's point, you need to start challenging yourself to do less of that. And I don't think the tattoo is going to accomplish that. Yeah. And I think you need to really hold yourself accountable and challenge yourself to help control your thoughts. And thoughts are going to, you can't stop thoughts popping in your head, but you can, to a certain degree, stop yourself from ruminating and obsessively keep thinking about it and not let yourself daydream and catch yourself and go, you know what, I'm not going to do it. Let's think about something else. And I think a great way to

do that is to get more active in your community, volunteer, interact with new people. It's a weird thing. When we feel sad in our feelings, we can get a little more selfish and a little more self-centered. And I think the more we do like kind of acts of service and kind of selfless acts and really think about how I can like make other people around me happy, I think is a great way to help ourselves get out of that rut and stop thinking about the things that, you know, we kind of obsessively think about and reflect on the past and things like that. Yeah, that's a good idea. So try that. And maybe you'll a good idea. So try that. And maybe you'll meet someone while you're doing it.

Yeah. And like, other than just dating too, like just get out there, be more active and try to, you know, meet all different types of people. Like you said, kind of the horizon is open and, you know, anything is possible and try to be excited about that, about the unknown. anything is possible and try to be excited about that about the unknown and if you have like any memorabilia of the relationship consider getting rid of that yeah i mean i don't have anything i like deleted i did the deleting of the pictures and whatever but yeah i think like not trying actively trying to not think about it and i I think the part, I'd say like what you said that convinced me to not get the tattoo

is just like, it's just avoiding saying goodbye and avoiding doing something never works. Like it'll always come back. All right. Well, good luck. I'd love an update from you in a couple months of how you're doing and where your mind, where your head sets out. Have your little ceremony, get out there, start dating, be patient with yourself. You're going to have your ups and downs, take breaks and try to have some fun and focus on meeting people rather than finding love right now. And how sentimental you are and connected you feel to people is an amazing quality that shows

up for you in so many positive ways. And it's kind of sounds like it's a bitch to deal with right now. And in this specific context, but it's like, it's related to something that is like so wonderful about you. So if that helps with like giving some grace and compassion, that would be my two cents. Yeah. Thanks. I do want to say like, I think about race a lot and like ethnicity, but like this show, I think showed me that like a lot of these feelings are universal, you know, like it's not,

it's not like a race thing that I'm feeling. So I just want to say thank you for that. Like, yeah, it showed me like these feelings happen to everyone. They really do. Regardless of your ethnicity, your culture,

your gender, you know, like, yeah, we like to be loved and feel loved and we can feel lonely and sad and vulnerable and not enough scared. All that, all those things are very relatable when it comes to love.

Yeah. Okay. Have a good. All right. Good luck. Thanks. It'd be great. Take it easy on yourself and good luck. Yeah. Okay. Have a good day. All right. Good luck. Thanks. You're going to be great. Take it easy on yourself and good luck.

Yeah. Thank you. I love your show. All right. Well, thanks for listening. We love you. Thanks for calling. Okay. You're going to be great. Bye-bye. Bye. Bye.

How's it going? Good. How are you? Good. What's your name? I'm Bella and I am 25 years old. How can we help Bella? I am currently in a little bit over three and a half year relationship and I'm not sure if we should go to four. Why? My boyfriend and I have been living together basically since we started dating. It was very quick and I graduated college around the time we started and we moved across the country together very quickly

okay COVID happened we moved to two different states afterwards we are currently living with my father and it is awful in short sure yeah uh well I mean other than the obvious but like what specifically is awful about it I think a lot of our arguments lately have been surrounding masculinity and maturity. Okay. That's very specific. Yeah. There's a couple of things at play here. I graduated college. I just recently started my MBA program this past semester and I am back living at home, which is what I never wanted. And I work a full-time job. I'm in class until 9.30, a couple of nights a week, and we live an hour away. So I'm not getting home until 10.30 at

night most nights. And he, throughout our relationship, hasn't had the work ethic I might be looking for. I thought maybe it was just circumstances. We just moved across the country. It was very new. And then COVID happened and it was just COVID fatigue. And he basically spent the year streaming FIFA and not trying to find work. And then this happened. And my father is a child of an immigrant. He has that mentality that is very much like, you need to work 40 hours a week. You can't enjoy your job. That's not how things go. And my boyfriend is very different than that. So they are having a lot of tension and it's causing my dad and I have a lot of tension. And then my boyfriend and I, and it's a very small house. So I want everyone to enjoy what they love, but like what exactly is your boyfriend's mentality on, I guess, work ethic?

He doesn't ever want to work for anyone. And when I talk about my future, he always, he doesn't always say, but he has said before, you make it sound like you want to work for anyone. And when I talk about my future, he always, he doesn't always say, but he has said before, you make it sound like you want to work for someone. And it's like, to me, there are steps you have to take to get to where you want to be. And I'm very, I plan, I value education. One of the issues I think we've had is that he didn't go to school. He dropped out, even though he had full tuition. And I think the education thing, it doesn't seem like he respects what I'm doing. He doesn't appreciate authoritative figures. So my dad and him have tension because he doesn't respect that. He's just kind of righteous. So if my dad will tell

him to do something, he'll just be a little bit like, well, it doesn't make sense. And I wouldn't do it that way. And he's like that at work as well. Yeah, I can see how that'd be frustrating. Also, not wanting to work for someone is not a career plan. He makes me think of actually, we were watching Bachelor in Paradise and Johnny said he's very passionate and motivated. It sounded exactly like I've had conversations with him. It's just like I'm motivated. I'm going to do things and he's very business oriented. He's got a lot of good ideas, but it's just execution.

I think this is a potential deal breaker, non-negotiable. I think this is a potential deal breaker, non-negotiable. Yes. So the thing is though, and what I can't stress enough is our chemistry is something I've never had before. We started as friends, we met at work, and the power dynamic was instantly off. I was the bartender, he was just starting as a server. I trained him. And ever since then, I've always been the breadwinner. And I'm not saying that I need someone to make incredible money and take care of me. It's not what I want. I'm in a graduate program because I want to learn how to do things myself. But I want someone that is a partner.

I want someone I can financially trust. And when I think about buying a house with him or making big business ideas... I'm going to an MBA. He wants to start a business. I don't trust that. What's he want to start a business in? So he's a soccer player and he's still trying to go pro. He's on a semi-professional team out here and he is a coach and a personal trainer, though he doesn't actually work at a gym yet and has time on his hands to do things,

but he's streaming because I think a part of him wants to be popular. How old is he? Turning 26 this week. Yeah. It's tough tough because when you say you were talking about masculinity, what exactly? I'm curious. We've had the breakup talk on multiple occasions and we just continue to fight for each other. But this past week, actually around Thanksgiving, we had it basically twice, passionate fighting. He basically made me realize that I maybe don't communicate as well as I should. And I do not pick on him, but I do feel like a bully sometimes when he articulates to me how I make him feel. And he said that I put into question his masculinity when it's not about him, it's

about what I'm looking for and they're separate. But I have a problem being like, I don't like coming home after a long day of work. And he asked me if I'm going to cook and the room's a mess. The bed's not made. He's still streaming. I said, I want to watch a show or whatever. And he thought I meant on my iPad, not the TV. And it's just like these little arguments we get into that. I'm just like, I feel like I'm coming home to a 14 year old boy and my dad just like, oh, he's a dreamer and you know, it's not going to go anywhere. And he's, he's putting pressure on me to break up with him as well. So I'm like trying not to give into that because he is getting in my head, but I'm also, I'm seeing his point. Like, I do want someone that will take up the energy to say,

I want to get us out of here too. You obviously can't take a second job. Let me. Everyone's different in what they want in a partner in terms of what they're looking for. I, yeah, I want, you know, in more modern dating, we're using the word partner a lot more, you know, part of which is that we don't want to offend anyone and shit like that. But like also like, like I also take it literally in a sense, like I want a partner, I want a teammate in a relationship. I want a, I want common goals. Common goals could be a variety of different things. We want to have a certain dream house together or any house, or we want to live in a certain type of city together, or we want to have a family or kids, or we want to take certain types of vacations. These are all

like goals that couples will decide, you know, common interests, you know, and then you, you know, for a lot of people who like have to work towards goals, you know, if you want to take a really crazy trip, you might have to work for that, you know, or if you want a certain type of house, you might have to work for it. And it's nice to have people who are willing, who A, have mutual, the same type of common interests and goals, the same type of passion to want to do what needs to be done. And then as a team, you figure out how can we balance each other out, strengths and weaknesses and things like that. And yeah, it's great to have people willing to step up when you need to, even if they don't necessarily feel like doing that. It would be really tough to date someone who's just, even if they don't necessarily feel like doing that.

It would be really tough to date someone who's just like, if they don't feel, if their justification for not doing anything is simply not feeling like it. It seems like a maturity issue, right? Maturity or not, let's say it has nothing to do with maturity. Let's just say it's a personality trait. Well, that's a tough personality to co-parent with or do anything with. It's their way or the highway. They establish this boundary. My boundary is if it doesn't bring me happiness, I'm not doing it. Yeah, that is a fantastical way of looking at life. I would also say we are both very much like sensation seekers. We enjoy relaxing the same way. We both enjoy the luxuries of life. And I think our goals are the same. What's becoming clear to me over time is that

our execution is very different. The way I see things are very much like we need to do these steps to get where we want to be. And we need to get our finances if we want to get an apartment. You don't just need to find the right apartment. And he just doesn't really think like that. He's not a planner. And it's kind of hard because I'm not really that much of a planner either. Again, it feels like being with him is challenging me to perform a little bit more in certain aspects because we're lacking as a couple. And it seems like I'm the one that's willing to step up to that. Yeah. I mean, at the end of the day, if things don't change drastically, you're just going to resent the shit out of them. Oh, it's here. It's here though. It's I, every day it's a, it's a blessing and a struggle as they say. Yeah. And you say he's like,

like daring you to break up with him, so to speak. No, I wouldn't say he's daring me. It's just, I feel like our arguments, they get, he's very flagrant and I stonewall, I shut down. Especially when he gets, starts to get loud. I stonewall I shut down especially when he gets starts to get loud I feel like I communicate with him and sometimes he'll say things that I'm just like oh you obviously didn't understand what I was saying and it seems to me that like we don't actually have any action points afterwards we just fight we get mad we ignore each other for two days and then we're acting like everything's good and why do you live with dad finances because yeah I have really heavy student loans

and luckily he doesn't because he didn't go to school, but I can't pay my student loans. And I could pay a partial rent, but he's not willing to make it up. And the city we live in is very expensive right now as well. It doesn't bother him that he's living with his girlfriend's dad because he's not willing to get a job?

So he has a job. And every time I talk to him about it, he makes it like I see his goals. I see what he's saying. He's very charismatic and articulate. So I always leave feeling like, okay, at least it sounds like he knows what he's doing. But again, it's just no action. And it's just he likes the flexibility. He wants autonomy.

So he likes that he has a coaching job because he works 3 to 7 p.m. here and there and throughout the week and he can pick up hours. So sometimes he's working 20, sometimes he's working 40. And he blames the flexibility of that on not getting a second job. But if you're a personal trainer, you can be pretty flexible or a bartender. Yeah. He's not really a personal trainer. No, not. No, that is what he's been saying. And it's hard too, because I'm in a program with very successful men that are, you know, men that are approaching me and I'm just like, nope, I had to go home to my boyfriend and make the bed. And, you know, like, and our house is so small that he's streaming in our bedroom. i'll be up i'll be trying to sleep

and it's 1 30 in the morning and he's either making a video or playing with his friend make what videos is he making streaming on fifa so he's recording himself and trying to oh he's he's trying oh he's he's trying to be on uh he's a twitch guy he's trying to be a nick yes but on video games yes he wants to i think he he's got the personality for it. So I think he's just looking to get lucky. But he's very soccer oriented. It's shoes or cleats and video games and training all the time and working out all the time. So he does at least have passion in that department? He's passionate and motivated in that department. Yes. Okay. But then he comes to me and says that one of the part-time jobs he's looking for is

at a restaurant. And I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa. I thought you were in your industry. Let's focus and let's move forward in that industry. And that will also cause conflict because he just doesn't want to hear my opinion sometimes, it seems. Sounds to me like when he brought up you challenging his masculinity, unless you actually said anything specifically, it just sounds like maybe he was questioning his own.

I definitely could be better about it. I think a lot of resentment has built the last couple of years, especially living with family. You've made some comments? I can't even help it. I'm in therapy. I'm talking to my therapist about it. My dad's coming at me. So I'm, I'm hearing a lot of different voices and opinions as well. So not even, it's not even all me, but you know, my therapist will always say, you know, he always sounds like he's trying and it does seem like you see him young, you know? Yeah, no, I mean, that's the thing. So I think you ultimately, I think you just need to make a decision. Yes, I know. The problem is though, this, this weekend was a perfect example. We had like a fight. We said,

we'll put it on pause, have Thanksgiving together. And then we're making up, we're having a great time. And then we're fighting again because nothing was accomplished. And I don't want to lose him. When I think about my day to day, it's hard to imagine without him,

but I can't see a future either. I mean, listen, like my three serious relationships in my twenties and my last, my last serious relationship in my twenties. Great. I mean, listen, like my three serious relationships in my 20s and my last my last serious relationship in my 20s. Great. I mean, she's a great person, you know, like we had great chemistry and we ended up breaking up and we had mutual friends and we have mutual friends and we stayed like we had kind of a long, very extended breakup kind of thing we never got back together she wanted to get back together i didn't and part of which i i'd always remember her saying to me because we'd get together and we'd have so much fun and you know because we have mutual friends it'd be weddings and she'd be like we like we always have so much fun like why aren't we together and i remember like i had some work buddies in who didn't know her because i had met these work buddies after we had broken up and then

she you know we ran into the same bar together. And there my friends were just like, God, you guys, your chemistry, it's off the charts, blah, blah, blah. When it was bad, it was bad. And I always said to her, the bad doesn't make up for the good. And we couldn't figure out how to make it work. And we were always going to have that chemistry. We just were. we had it, you know, and it was very easy for us

to have a lot of fun together. But when you're thinking about a life partner and you're thinking about forever, there's a little more practicality that kind of comes with kind of choosing that life partner. Thankfully, I feel like I found that person. It took me a long time and, you know, I had to wait a lot more years to find it. I took some drastic choices in my life the next few years. But nevertheless, I do have that chemistry now and I feel like we're very compatible and we don't have to make a lot of compromises. Someone asked me on a questions with Nick the other day to define compatibility. So I was talking about it a lot and I was like, I've never tried to define it.

Let me take a stab at it. And I came up with this. The percentage of time spent with each other where compromise and sacrifice isn't required and you both are able to mutually enjoy the moment.

You know, it's just like every relationship requires a ton of compromise and a ton of sacrifice, like every single relationship, even the ones where you're super compatible. And I have found in relationships as someone who used to really prioritize chemistry and think that love can conquer all, and I would dismiss compatibility. It's just like so much more easier to enjoy the chemistry you do have with someone where you don't have to constantly

make sacrifices and you don't have to constantly be like okay fine like i guess you know and things like that and it seems like that's where you guys are now where you're just like constantly to like so that you can enjoy the chemistry you have which feels like fewer and far between because those other moments you're just not on the same page with what you guys want and expect from one another and how you guys, you know, your expectations of how you guys go about solving problems and, and things like that.

And that matters in a relationship and, and just like constantly like fighting about it. And then only to get so exhausted that you just agree to table it for a time being, and then hope that you get to a place where you just kind of ignore it for a while so that you guys can like have the fun that you're used to having when you're not worried about how you're not getting along the amount of time in which you get to enjoy each other becomes fewer and far between you know yes and it's so redundant too i mean he is so sick of hearing it i'm so sick of saying it and again it's like the communication

isn't even going anywhere and he actually said this last time, I don't know what we need to do, but we can't keep doing this every two weeks. So it's really what it feels like. It's like every weekend when we're all at the house together and I have nowhere to study and do anything. Have you done couples therapy? No, we haven't. And I actually was listening to you today talk about couples therapy and I should do it. He did say he would come on here with me if I wanted him to. So we would definitely do that. We would definitely do that if you wanted.

I didn't tell him that I was coming on today by myself though. Oh, okay. Yeah, we'd love to have him on. Yeah, but I think you guys will see the same thing though. You'll see he's very charismatic and articulate and you're going to be like, oh, well, he seems like he's figuring it out and you don't have to stay with him for another two months

to see that nothing actually happens from it. Well, I mean, again, I'm sure he's figuring it out and you know you don't have to stay with him for another two months to see that nothing actually happens from it well i mean again i'm sure he's a swell guy you know like yeah at the end of the day i mean you just might not be a match i know it's just also we've been so isolated since we got together because we moved so many times and with covid that like we are our only friends here like i'm in an environment that is very much, I'm the youngest of my workplace and in my program as well. And he is a coach. He deals with a lot of children. He's probably exposed to it a little bit more than I am, but I don't even know where he would go. I don't know if he'd stay in the city. We've talked about it. He can't afford it with me. So I don't know how he's going to afford it without me. He just says that he'll stay a little bit while at the house while

we figure it out. If you guys broke up, you would just keep living there? just says that like he'll stay a little bit you know well at the house while we figured out like if you guys broke up you would just keep living there yeah i mean he doesn't want to move back in with his family and he doesn't he says that my dad's charging him rent now my dad started charging him rent because he wanted him to work more and he just increased his rent recently because he still wants him to work more so there's like this weird manipulation tactics coming from my dad. He's very controlling. He's, you know, ex-cop. So he's just like that. But I guess I'm going anywhere.

Well, I mean, if you break up, he should. You think? Yeah. But at the same time, I'm very like, I've only had two other boyfriends from high school and college, and they were both very amicable. I'm friends with one of them. Friends loosely. You know, I'd like to stay on good terms,

but especially the way we fight, I don't know what's normal. I don't know what to expect because he's very different than the people I've been with, but it does seem very highs and very low lows. Sure, yeah, which isn't great, right? If you break up, he should move out. How soon though?

How long do you give it? I mean, maybe give him like a week or two to get his shit in order. But like, it's not, you're not, your dad's not a landlord. Well, that's the thing is like, he wouldn't be able to sleep anywhere but the bed. And I've said, okay, well, you sleep on the couch or the floor. And he's like, I'm gonna sleep in the bed because I'm paying rent. He's just saying shit. That's not in the middle of a fight, you know, like whatever.

But practically speaking, if you break up, he needs to figure his shit out. And you know what? It's not going to be your problem because you'll be like, not to sound cold, but like it's just not. He might need to grow up and, you know, he'll figure it out. And maybe that's the best thing for him. He seems to be really good at asking for favors. And charming people are used to getting people to.

We all want to take care of him. You know, his family included. And everyone has the same concerns, it seems. And i think that he feels that i'm just rolling off of what everyone else is thinking but we're all thinking it for a reason and i don't want to hear that oh you're the best thing that happened to him you've been so motivating for him because i want him to inherently have that himself yeah i mean that's all just whatever yeah no i yeah i know at the end of the day we've come to uh an agreement that your current situation isn't sustainable even even your boyfriend agrees with that so as i see you

have two options one you can get couples therapy which unfortunately you'll be paying for that's already a problem uh given why you're going to couples therapy. But whatever, you know, the things we do for love. But at least that's something. And at least it's like, because you're right, you can't do this on your own. Your dad's not a therapist. He's not helping being the mediator. You're welcome to come on a podcast

and I'll give my two thoughts. But like, this is not something I'm going to fix in a 20 minute conversation. So you're going to have to have a therapist figure out how, given your two personalities and your passions and your work ethics, how can you communicate more effectively and get on the same page? To be honest, it sounds like a huge uphill battle, but if you're not ready to move on, that is the only practical step that you can actually do. Because otherwise, you're just going to keep doing this. And it will only get uglier and more toxic. Or you can break

up now. And you can just have the tough conversation and say, I love you. I care about you. But neither of us are happy. That much we can agree on. And I don't see myself changing in terms of the things I want in a relationship. And I have a certain expectation about what I expect from myself and my partner. And I'm not saying I'm right. And I'm not saying you're wrong. I just know this is what I want. I'm not saying you're right or you're wrong,

I just know this is what I want. I'm not saying you're right or you're wrong, but it sounds like you're also pretty dead set on your beliefs and how things are going to go. And we're only building a resentment. And I just think maybe we should just break up. Also, you need to move out. Yeah. It's actually interesting too, because every time we have these breakup conversations, we don't actually say it. We don't actually say we're breaking up. It's very much in the- Well, I mean, he has nowhere to go. So you're going to have to break up with him. And he gets emotional about it. He'll say, he said last time, I'm on the precipice of what I've been going for this past few years. If he were on this call, I would love to ask him, what do you expect from her? What do you expect from her? Like, what do you want from her? How can

she support you while meeting her needs at the same time? And I would want to know, like, you know, I would want to ask him if he empathizes with the frustrations that you have. And I'd want to know, like, what confidence does she have that you're willing and able to step up and do things that you don't normally want to do when it's required? Because that's always going to be needed. And I'm just curious how he's going to try to meet these goals. And if he wants to become a Twitch star, great. But does he have a backup plan for not being one of the 1%? And how many years do you spend on a goal like that? He's like, well, you know, some people just get lucky. I just, you know. Sure. But like, do you, and I'd want to know, like, do you understand why your partner is having a hard time just hoping that you get lucky? And how much, how long do you expect your partner to simply rely on hope to

have her needs met in a relationship? I'd be curious his answers. Ultimately, what you're doing is not sustainable, so you need to do something. That's my biggest advice to you. Thank you. It's actually so funny you say that because I keep saying that too. It's not sustainable. That's the thing I've been clinging to. Yeah. It seems like he agrees with that. But the fact that he lives in your dad's house and he doesn't have money, he's a bit powerless and he doesn't know what to do, but he's just too stubborn to... Yes. He's uncomfortable, but he's not willing to

make the sacrifices that I think are required. And if he were in school, I'd like to think I would want to get a second job to get us out of this situation because none of us are happy. He knows that and he feels shrunk and emasculated in his own way as well. So I get it. I mean, you're living with your girlfriend's dad who obviously doesn't want you there. Yeah. Well, he sounds a little spoiled. Which is why he increases,

my dad increases the rent charge. But I told him we can't ask him, he's showing us who he is. We can't ask him to be more of a man that we need him to be in the traditional sense of what my father expects. Man, woman, whatever.

Like I want my partner to participate. Exactly. You know? Exactly. We participate in different ways. I'm guessing your boyfriend's not doing a bunch of household chores. The bed thing took like a year just to make bed in the morning. You know what I'm saying?

Like, that's the thing. Like, whether it's earning money or whatever, like, it's about participating in the relationship. And right now, if I'm hearing you right, he is focused on his dreams and prioritizing his dreams and expecting everyone around to support his dreams while, and, and, and provide for him and take care of him and pay for him. And like, I'm sorry, dude, that's just like, it's a bit delusional. Yeah. Yeah. It's definitely the, it's not about being a man. exactly that's my

point is just like just meet me where i'm at i feel like i'm on a high level i feel like i have a lot to offer and i feel like when it comes when i say that to him he's like i have a lot to offer to i'm not going to sell myself to you well yeah i don't think you should i don't i don't even know if you need to really say that it's just like i mean when you say it like that i can get why it triggers them yeah yeah well i think i'm certainly not here to say that I'm in the right for everything. I could articulate it better, but again, it's three and a half years of the same stuff. So I'm at my breaking point. Yeah. You're just like, I'm just not willing, me, my dad, whatever. We're just not willing to support this dream. Like if you want to keep dreaming dreaming it that i'm willing to support you to

a certain limit but you're you're not willing to support yourself i just think maybe you guys aren't as aren't compatible yeah that's actually interesting no i appreciate that insight truly even though it's obviously tough to hear yeah and someone needs to bend and neither of you are willing to bend and maybe you and maybe neither of you should you know at your core maybe this is who you guys are he might need to grow up a little bit it sounds like but yeah and he might need a rude awakening to to do that he's not going to do it in his current situation no i don't see it i don't see anything changing and i'm done i'm so tired of it so you might need to like be like hey i think we actually need to break up and he's gonna get real sad and he's gonna beg this is if you break up with them this is almost certainly what's gonna happen he's gonna panic and he's gonna beg you not to because he's going to get real sad and he's going to beg. If you break up with them, this is almost certainly what's going to happen.

He's going to panic and he's going to beg you not to because he's going to realize he's got nowhere to fucking go. And he knows he can't keep living there. And if you don't kick him out, your dad will. I agree. Maybe we'll have the mediation first and then. All right. We're here.

Let us know. Yeah, definitely. Thank you. All right. Well, keep us posted. But yeah, it's a tough situation. but sometimes you just realize you're not compatible no i appreciate it thank you seriously it's good insight all right take care you too all right bye all right thanks for listening guys hope you enjoyed the show be sure to tune in to uh us on wednesday for another

episode of freestyle breaking down all your bachelor tea, pop culture topics, and texting office hours. And Fortune Feimster joins us on Thursday for Going Deeper, and we'll be breaking down the last few episodes of the Harry and Meghan documentary. Also, if you haven't listened to Going Deeper last week, our episode with Tara Schuster, and we get in the first three episodes of the Meghan Harry documentary on Netflix. Be sure to check that out. Other than that, we'll

see you back on Wednesday.