The Viall Files - E541 Bachelor Recap with Julia Cunningham

Episode Date: February 14, 2023

Welcome back to another episode of The Viall Files: Bachelor Recap Edition! We’re back with radio host Julia Cunningham to discuss the fourth episode of Zach’s season. We start out by covering the week’s Bachelor Tea, including how Nick rattled cages with last week’s episode, rumors that Christina flirted with the other women on night one, and Michelle’s comments on Clayton and Nayte. We then dive into this week’s episode and discuss Katherine’s 1:1 date in the Bahamas, the drama between Kylie and Anastasia on their group date, and Brooklyn’s ATV jungle date. Who is a front runner, who could be a dark horse, and who will be going home? And we discuss what drama could unfold based on the ominous trailer for next week.  “Zach’s fiancée is going to be pissed watching him suck face with Ariel.”  If you are interested in running a book club in your city, send an email to: [e-mail]  Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] to be a part of our Monday episodes. Join us for our new LIVE show on Thursdays at 9PM ET/6PM PT on Amp, available in the Apple app store. Android User? Listen here: https://www.onamp.com/ To Order Nick’s Book Go To: http://www.viallfiles.com If you would like to get some texting advice on Office Hours send an email to [e-mail] with “Texting Office Hours” in the subject line! To advertise on the show, contact [e-mail] or visit https://www.advertisecast.com/TheViallFiles THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: Care/Of: For 50% off your first Care/of order, go to https://www.takecareof.com and enter code viall50.  Canva: Collaborate with Canva for Teams! Right now, you can get a FREE 45-day extended trial when you go to Canva.me/viall. Earth Breeze: Go to https://www.earthbreeze.com/viall to subscribe and save 40% off.  Episode Socials: @viallfiles @nickviall @juliacunninghaaam @alison.vandam @liffordthebigreddog

what's going on everybody welcome back to another episode of the vile files bachelor recap edition i'm your host joined by nick yeah well rough morning joined by ally and amanda psyched myself out there i got nervous with julia here yeah that's amazing i'm like i'm with a pro a seasoned pro she's been doing this forever julia cunningham is our guest today welcome how are you it's good to see you nick thank you for having me i feel like the least famous person to ever step foot and like so honored that you would have me on. No, my God. I was like, when you hit me up, I was like, what?

So thank you for having me. I apologize for not having you on sooner. Well, I was going to say you, not to air our dirty laundry, but you DM me like right when you announced this podcast, being like, you have to come on as a guest. And that was like seven years ago like four but yeah so I I just appreciate getting the call are you kidding me I'm a man of my word you know totally I didn't tell you when no exactly I'm I'm just honored uh how are you I'm good thanks for having me I'm I'm excited to be here I um

you know I love The Bachelor and I love The Bachelorette, Bachelor in Paradise. You've been watching for a long time. And you've been recapping the show probably before it was even a thing. You know, I want to say we obsessively would talk about it back on the day within I work at Sirius XM. We had a channel called EW Radios through Entertainment Weekly. And obviously that was a huge brand for Entertainment Weekly. So our entire channel would like obsessively talk about The Bachelor. So much so that Robert Mills, who, you know, is an

executive at ABC Walt Disney, became my co-host. So he would give us a lot of behind the scenes dirt and dish and we've been doing it for a long time. And so, you know, I'm obsessed. That's great. It's good to have you here. I'm excited to talk about the show with you.

You have excellent takes. And I'm sort of curious where you are also within the season. I was listening. I was catching up on your podcast over the weekend. And yeah, I have a lot of, I'm curious where you feel after this most recent episode. Let's do some housekeeping notes before we get into it. Big week this week. The one, the only Raven Ross is with us on Going Deeper.

It's a big one. It's real juicy. She really spills all the tea about her and SK. All the rumors about the cheating and the infidelity. She goes into a lot of detail, like all the details. Yeah. Oh my God. She really covered it all.

Yeah. And we're the only podcast, I believe the only, I'm not sure if she did other like small interviews, but this is the only podcast she's doing. So if you want to hear Raven Ross share her full truth from beginning to end, it's this Thursday I'm going deeper it's a real it's a real juicy one I can tell by your face that this is an

unhinged episode yeah I'm excited it's really good I mean like it's it's good for us and I feel like it was therapeutic for Raven not really good for SK yeah yeah well if the truth isn't good for you that's on you there you go bye yeah

that's true that's true so that's thursday um anything else we're missing yeah if you were listening tuesday morning and you were a caller on the show and you want to send it a little update please do that we might be able to squeeze you in we have better date than, our live dating podcast on AMP that is happening Thursday at 6 p.m. Pacific, 9 p.m. Eastern. And Vile Files is on TikTok now. Are we talking about oral sex this week? Yeah, we are. Yep, we are. For anyone wondering how that theme was selected,

Nick on live radio said, Next week, we're going to talk about oral sex. Well, it just seems like there's a lot of misinformation out there my favorite thing about this show is i try to plan in advance and then just on the live every week nick is like and next week we're talking about blank and i'm like great used to me good to know on the fly also a happy valentine's day for the people if you are in la uh with nothing to do come to to the Grove because I'll be at the Barnes & Noble signing copies of Don't Text Your Ex's Happy Birthday. So come hang out from 5 to 7, I believe.

What a beautiful Valentine's evening that could be. Yeah. I think it'd be fun. Bring your friends. You don't need a date. We'll be with one another. Yeah. I think we might even do some Q&A.

It'll be interactive. So come hang out. And if you have coupled person's guilt and you're in a happy relationship and your friends who are single are going through it, get them a book. It's a great book. Get them a book.

Because I don't want to hear that though. It will happen when you least expect it. That's not helpful. But what is helpful is don't text your ex happy birthday. Yeah, that is helpful. I got told that last night. Someone was like, I believe there is going to be true love in your life and i was like cool thank you so much was this person also like a tarot card reader no i don't know and it's very pandering yeah yeah yeah some some person in line at starbucks it wasn't a rando it was someone

close in my life that told me that so i I believe them, but yeah. They have to say that though. Yeah. All right. Well, those are our housekeeping notes. What you put in your body, it just, it matters so much. Imagine putting like corn oil in your car and expecting it to run efficiently. Well, that's what we do with our bodies. Our bodies are our machines and they take fuel and they burn energy and you want to make sure that fuel is good. And vitamins also play a big role in the nutrients that our body needs to operate effectively. And if you're someone like me, you've tried a vitamin here and you've tried a vitamin there and then like you to stop doing it. Totally. All I'm saying is vitamins can really play a big role into your overall wellness. And that's where Careof comes in. Careof is an amazing company that keeps you on track and allows you to take the vitamins you need and take them on a regular basis and not forget, not get into these kind of like patterns of taking them and not taking them.

Allie, tell us more about Careof. Yes. So I went on the Careof website. I did a whole quiz. They ask you about your diet, you know, like how frequently do you eat vegetables? How much protein are you taking in? How are your energy levels through the day? What are your goals? You know, skin, nails, hair, all that good stuff. And so they ended up curating for me this kind of routine. So it's five pills that I have each day that come in little packages, little packets. They're

really cute. They have my name on them. They have like little motivational things. Like one of them the other day said, go on an unplugged walk, like leave your technology behind and just go on a walk. Or they have little quotes on them. That's the thing about vitamins. No one's gone out of your way to make sure people are taking it.

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Okay. I love Canva. Whether you're planning an engagement or you have a birthday party or some sort of... Let's look at the document we were using to all Bachelor recap. I was able to annotate, add in,

make certain pictures dark, add a rose. This is all Canva Pro? All of this was done on Canva Pro. You put a rose there. Easy peas. This is all Canva Pro? Icon, all of this was done on Canva Pro. You put a rose there. Easy peas. Thank you, Canva. Look at this. I made a whole fake invite for my engagement.

Well, I didn't make it, but my team used Canva Pro. It's amazing what you can do with Canva Pro and design like a pro. And now just your ordinary, and by ordinary, I mean special, ordinary people, just like you and me can look like we hired and paid thousands of dollars to some graphic designer. And you can do it now from the comfort of your home.

It will remove background. Like things that I do. Oh, wow. Thumbnails. Yeah. So for like YouTube, for all of our episodes, I'll take a screenshot of a guest we had or Nick remove the background. I'll get in there like nitty-gritty and take out like remaining little

chunks of the microphone just make it really clean really seamless i would say our thumbnails look pretty good yeah and i think if you're trying to do any kind of like personal branding like whether you plan on using this as like invitations for like a girl's weekend yeah if you're like someone who's trying to create content on social media like canva just makes it so intuitive you can pick the size of your graphic and one of them is instagram story formatted or instagram grid post so it really does like integrate seamlessly with all the potential uses they have like motion options so if you want to make moving graphics or like download them as more of like a video format that's also something that they're capable of so it's really unlimited design like a pro and be the star amongst all your friends and family.

Collaborate with Canva for Teams. Right now, you can get a free 45-day extended trial when you go to canva.me slash V-I-A-L-L. That is C-A-N-V-A dot M-E slash V-I-A-L-L for a free 45-day extended trial. Canva.me slash V-I-A-L-L. I think let's do some tea. Let's check in with our Bachelor Nation. Sure. Nick, I do feel like you may have rattled some cages

over last episode. What does that mean? Is that like ruffle some feathers? I believe so, yeah. I haven't heard that before. I envision like a little kid in a crib. You know, ruffle. Trying to get out.

Yeah, I guess. What do they do? Well, you had your comment saying that no one's liked a Bachelor since you. And I think some people didn't agree. I can imagine my critics. The point still says, I mean, what do you want me to say? My point was. You're like, I'm just telling the truth.

Well, but it's based on the fact that like like name me a bachelor who was as likable leaving their show right they were coming in and it's just like it's and the point is that's a crazy thing for me to say because like clearly i was a polarizing character on the show i don't know it does seem it's just like to all my critics out there yes i know some people don't know. It just seems, it's just like, to all my critics out there, yes, I know some people don't like me. I get it. It's like,

I think it's like- Shut up about it already. We know. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's like if I say something nice about myself on this show,

my critics, they'll be like listening and they think to themselves- Go insane. And they're like, no, I, we hate you.

You're wrong. You're wrong. I think they lose their mind. It's just like, no, we hate you. You're wrong. You're wrong. I think they lose their mind. It's just like, it's okay. You know, it's fine. I don't know. I think some of them, that does please me, I guess, sometimes knowing that. Because I didn't hear any of the comments, but anytime I rattle Cages and Bachelor Nation, I'll get DMs.

You want to be the bell curve. You don't want to be the one that's hated or loved you want the you want the both reaction yeah and so i'll get these comments of people who are like did you see i'm glad someone said this about you and i'm like i and i don't and it's just like knowing that people will invest all this emotional energy to just try to like disagree or or to let me know that other people disagree it's uh i don't know but like don't worry bachelor nation i am aware that some people don't care for me you can rest easy you're like i know i know about it i know well i think it was bachelor dana that did a post about how uh every season there's been articles about how quote boring this Bachelor is all the way back to like Juan Pablo.

Yeah. Even I think Sean Lowe maybe even prior to that. And I feel like if you're watching it and upset about the excitingness or boringness of the Bachelor, you're watching the show wrong. Right. Because the point of it is the women. Do you know what I mean? Like the Bachelor to me, you can inject any person into that role. It's really about how the women, that's what I get excited about watching is the women interacting.

So it's like, yes, of course they're boring. Let them be boring. They're a placeholder. To serve the food. To serve, exactly, all these incredible women that we like fall in love with and become obsessed with. And when they're not boring, you get someone like me and a lot of you didn't care for that. Yeah, which one do you want? Yeah, which one do you want? Make up your mind. Like, fuck, not boring, you get someone like me and a lot of you didn't care for that. So like, you know. Yeah, which one do you want?

Yeah, which one do you want? Make up your mind, like fuck, you know, shit. Yeah, yeah. Thanks for all the kind, kind words over the past week. Uplifting. The love letters. It's supportive, no, it's like,

it's nice to know you care about me, honestly. Yeah, yeah. It's nice to know you're invested in my life. It does mean a lot. Well, and still, you know still that's what I think is impressive it's just like I am say what you want yes exactly

no there's someone listening right now just losing their mind just dying driving off the road what else we got Eric Schwer did his first interview since The Bachelorette since the split driving off the road. Yeah. Yeah. Anyway. What else we got? Eric Schwer did his first interview

since The Bachelorette since the split I guess really with Gabby. And he talked about the relationship. He talked about being on the show.

He said quote I will say that I struggled personally with my mental health during my last relationship and wish I could have coped with them better. I was learning how to navigate the loss of my father

and a new engagement all at once on a public scale, which is definitely, I mean, something that not a lot of people talk about. He does say that he's ready to look for love again, but he's taking it slowly. That's good. We wish Eric the best. I met him once.

Really nice guy. I really felt for him. Went through a lot emotionally. I hope he's doing okay. Yeah. Do we know anything? It kind of seemed like a very like it didn't seem like it was a particularly nasty breakup in terms of the details

we got like i felt like it was like a mutually announced split did you guys get a vibe that i had lunch with him once in the middle of the season it was like kind of a mental health he lives in la and it was just like like wellness check yeah it was like a wellness check took him out for dim sum and he didn't like share any details about the relationship and i don't ask because i don't want to put them in a in a spot but there were like conversations about like well like if you if you're in a relationship and if it doesn't work out you know his ears really perked up for those conversations. I remember, cause I, I remember not knowing for sure, but assuming that he was with Gabby, it's an impossible thing to,

to be in those relationships while it's airing, regardless of what's going through. And he was going through a lot. So I don't know. I don't, I don't, I didn't really get any information from him and I don't really, I've never talked to Gabby about it.

I just think it imploded. Yeah. There wasn't much of a foundation there and it was kind of like, what are we doing? Yeah. You know. She was doing Dancing with the Stars, right?

Like right after. Yeah. That's like your mind's there. Yeah. It's hard. And to make these relationships work, you have to really want it to work. You really have to want it to work

because it's truly- Like everything, every possible thing is stacked against it in terms of a relationship of like watching them hook up with other people, like seeing them fall. And then the public eye all of a sudden. And then this like idea that like you could question whether their choice to like engage, propose to you or get engaged to you is just a product of like. to you is just a product of like just like you know what i thought about this episode is like how pissed zach's uh fiance is going to be all the times he's sucking face with ariel because like i don't think he's going to end up with ariel no i could be wrong i don't think so but he really likes making out with ariel and it's like clear that he is physically attracted to Ariel and we haven't really

seen anything else and I'm watching this and being like she's gonna be so pissed whoever she is well also he says not to jump ahead to the episode

but just as a teaser I guess he also says to a woman that he's about to send home he's like when I saw you get out of the limo he basically was like

I wanted to bang you so bad she like basically stops him and is like shut up calm down it's like his fiance's gonna see him and is like, shut up, calm down. Yeah. It's like, you don't want to see that.

All right, we get it. Yeah. So it's, so it's just a really tough thing to, you know, the bachelors like asked to do these impossible things and said, Hey, this is part of the role.

You got to do this. And then you're engaged and you have to pretend like none of that happened. And you have to have these crazy conversations with the person you're with about like, well, you know, like I didn't mean it, but I meant it. But like because it's like you either none of it was true. It was only you or you're kind of a liar, you know, to all. Yeah, it's it sucks. It's a really shitty situation. So and you can't even go out for like a normal dinner together in public because it's all secret.

Hush hush. Yeah. And you can't even go out for like a normal dinner together in public because it's all secret hush hush. Yeah. Well, I think also, especially in their relationship, like watching Gabby's journey about finding meaning in her own love language, you know, and putting a lot of that on Eric probably. And then him struggling with the loss of his father, going out of the bubble. I mean, it seems like it was going to be doomed. Yeah.

The moment it hit the real world. Yeah, there was a lot of trauma. Yeah, there's a lot of trauma. In that relationship that I don't know if anyone was grounded enough to be. Totally. I mean, that's hard. Yeah, it's tough. Yeah. But they seem to both individually be on the up.

Yeah. We wish Eric well. We wish Gabby well. I think Gabby's already doing. I would be The Bachelorette again. I would watch another season with Gabby. You would. I loved Gabby. I think Gabby's already doing the Bachelorette again I would watch another season with Gabby I loved Gabby oh spectacular yeah I think she's good wow yeah can't wait I hear those cages rattling I'm trying to fight I'm rattling the cages she was really great I just don't know if I need to see another season. All right. I mean, I guess that's fair, but we would.

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should be your new reality tv obsession we are certainly obsessed stream every episode of traders now only on peacock all righty well uh eric isn't the only one talking about previous relationships or exes uh michelle commented on a couple different guys she said that she actually wanted to send clayton home earlier on her season but wasn't allowed to oh so i thought that was interesting kind of no shit right wait she wasn't in and clayton the man who came in eighth who got sent home on his one-on-one, right? I was going to say like in a museum. It was like a boring museum date.

With kids or something. You took them on a date just to send them home. Yeah. We know. All right, anyway. And she also spoke about Nate and their relationship ending.

She said, it was my dream ring. Apparently, that was her dream ring. Wow. She loved the pear shape and she was saying for future engagements, she's going to have to figure out a new ring because she's not going to be doing a repeat. She can't get a dream ring again?

Yeah. Would you want one that looked exactly the same? I'm just surprised. That she got her dream ring through Neil Lane? And they ripped it back out of her hands. Neil Lane ripped it back out. How much control do you have over the rings? Not much.

Oh, okay. She said, I wanted the relationship to work. I was willing to put in the work for the relationship and I had the person take off. That's not something that I bluntly said before because Instagram and there's all these other things you know, but I know what it looks like to work through a relationship and I know how hard relationships can get, but both people have to be capable of doing

that. Those are harsh words. Those are harsh words. But also what everyone was screaming and telling her her entire season with Nate, that he wasn't emotionally mature. He had never been in a relationship before. He didn't know what it meant to be in a difficult place. Yeah, I don't know.

But we had the pleasure of talking with Nate. but we had the pleasure of talking with Nate. I also had the pleasure of talking with Nate offline. Solo, yeah. And on the show, and Nate was very generous with his truth. Right, I remember the headlines coming from that. Yeah. I mean, like, everyone has their, and they didn't work out, so clearly they weren't on the same page.

And they didn't work out. So clearly they weren't on the same page. I think, I know Nate felt like he survived that relationship. Wow. And I don't think I'm, I'm not overselling that. I'm underselling it. Yeah. Jeez.

But does he have anything to compare that to? He was never in a relationship before. I don't think you need to compare it to having- To feel like you survived something. To knowing what happened. Wow. And the shit that went down in that relationship oh my god uh and nate shared some of it but like that was tip of the iceberg type of stuff okay yeah and i think so nate for bachelor now is that what you're saying maybe i i think nate's a a plus person i've gotten to know him i think he's a real genuine down-to-earth him. I think he's a real genuine down to earth guy. And I think he really cared about Michelle.

And I think he was really in love with her. And I think he truly busted his ass to try to make that relationship work. And I think he felt like he had no choice. It was either his like mental health and his well-being or that relationship wow let's get him on paradise so and i do feel like that's the like root of so many relationships ending is the one person being like we can fight through this like don't give up on me and the other person being like no like enough is enough well yeah it was just like it all depends you know if you're again like i if you want to fight for a relationship, that's awesome.

But, like, you can't be the one being the reason why there's so much to fight for, so to speak. Or about. Yeah. Yeah. Anyways, strong words by Michelle. Strong words. Michelle was so polished throughout the entirety of her season.

Yeah, I know more. And well, I think there's a part of her that maybe just wants to be a little bit more raw and honest. And I can totally imagine how from her perspective, it was like these were little things to her that you could survive and she must have felt really like abandoned and walked out on versus from Nate's perspective. He's like, I know this is not a healthy place at all for me. I know too much. and walked out on versus from Nate's perspective. He's like, this is not a healthy place at all for me.

I know too much. There's no way to interpret it as like, well, they could have this interpretation and they can, you know, it's just like. But did you talk to Michelle the same kind of in depth? No, but I saw receipts. Okay. Anyway, I could be wrong. You're right.

I wasn't there. I could be wrong. I want a reunion show after that you should be hosting all of like love is blind like bringing the couples back together oh yeah like mediation yes like a mediation i'm down yeah yeah all of them on one big couch yeah yes after the fact or something yeah nothing to think about abc all right something to think about uh although you might have to fight Tyler Cameron on doing a reunion show like that

because he got asked if he would ever return to Bachelor Nation as a host. And he said- They asked him as a host or they asked him if he ever returned to Bachelor Nation? No, as a host. Oh, okay. And he said, I mean, maybe one day,

I think it's the coolest job in the world, travel around the world and say eight words per episode in peace. Like it sounds fantastic, but maybe one day right now I'm too busy. That's a great answer. Good for him. That's a good, that's a great answer. I just thought it was funny.

It like makes it seem like Bachelor producers are like banging down his door to be the host. When in reality, I feel like then everyone on the season would just be gunning for him. So I don't think that would be an effective manner. Which would watch. We would watch that. Yeah. I want him to be the bachelor because i think it would yeah come on bring out the big guns yeah i just think i oh i don't i want him to be the bachelor for very different reasons other people want to be the bachelor because i just i know that everyone would be disappointed and it says nothing to do with tyler i think he's a swell guy it's just like he wouldn't be able to live up to the outrageous expectations that bachelor nation has of him and he would just he would just look like a fuck boy yeah probably you know he would be too good

looking and too charming he has too much swag and and all these like charming lines he's saying you know like part of the reason zach looks likable is because you're, you, you don't believe he's taking, he's even capable of taking advantage of the fact that he's, has all these women to pick from. And then he's super humble and, and truly believes that like he almost doesn't deserve or belong in this role.

And that, that makes it charming and like okay but like if it was tyler it was completely different it'd be amazing he'd be banging everyone everyone would be fighting i think he'd be like and he'd be like hey girl you know it's just like it's okay and like all we have is one life and it's like fine and he would and then he'd end up with like some model that he met on Instagram anyways just walk away that's what I was gonna say where I feel like

if we ever wanted to do a celebrity bachelor franchise moment I feel like few people could maybe pull out some of the larger names as contestants

on the show like Tyler Cameron like if he were the bachelor I feel like at least pseudo celebrity bachelor or would that be

it's own show I'm down i'm down to watch it i think it would be fun uh finally something i thought was as we transition into the episode our good friend christina you know she went home last week uh an insider has come forward to say that she got very drunk on the first night of the show and flirted with other women. The alcohol led to her becoming handsy with other contestants hitting on them. And the source alleged that she tried to kiss Becca

and grab another girl's hand. Because she was becoming a headache to producers, they were the ones that convinced Zach to take her on the first one-on-one date. I don't believe that last part. Yeah. Can someone explain to me how that makes sense, though, if this person's a huge headache, putting her on a one-on-one so that way she gets yeah that last part is silly these the producers knew who they wanted to go on the one-on-one

before the season started i'm almost sure i mean she's christina mandrell she gets her full name of course she's single mom set the stage you know, like that's not, it wasn't because she was misbehaving and they needed to like prove to Zach. Like if they thought she was that much of a problem, I'm like, you know, you don't need this. Exactly. Like we're just gonna shut her up. Especially they love it.

Yeah. Make her Bachelorette. I'm so bummed. I mean, I believe those, some of those rumors because I was shocked she went home. Yeah, me too. Because she was excellent television. I loved it.

I was devastated she was sent home. I mean, she had it all. She had the personality. She had the kid. She was crying on the stairs. All of it. It's like classic. She was like rude to people and didn't understand why.

She was completely like complete self-awareness. She was a dream. Yeah. Is that a TikTok? I feel like someone should make that a TikTok sound. Being like, help me, help me, help me. Let's do it. It's like me to my dad when I go to the mechanic, you know?

I do feel like that is like a level of desperation that I find in my everyday life. Yeah. No, we should do, once we wrap up here, Amanda and I know what we're doing. She'll definitely be back on Paradise, right? Oh. Oh, yeah.

Bags are packed. There are women on my season that at the time it was like do you really care and i'm like no they're like okay we're gonna send her home because she's just kind of a pain in her ass oh and and that generally pain in the ass is more around to do with like listen it's the bachelor it's great it's a crazy environment weird things are asked of you it's a tv show so like just get on board and go with it cry like everyone else or don't you know because there are people who show up and they'll point out the cameras and they'll like start being like they'll start critiquing all the conversations they're

just a distraction to like people kind of getting in the mindset of like falling in love and yeah it's like listen if you don't want to like get into the bubble and you don't want to like manipulate yourself into falling in love, that's fine. But like, this isn't the world for you, so to speak. And don't ruin it for everyone else. Yeah, you kind of get sent home. But some of those women still ended up in paradise.

Well, because they want to go for fun to paradise. Yeah. They're down for that. And they just kind of get another shot at like not being a Debbie Downer and not raining on other people's praise. But I just don't think you get sent home for misbehaving. No, they love that.

They're like, just do it on camera. I feel like they promote you. Yeah, exactly. No one was more drunk and more inappropriate than Corinne on my season and they made her the star. Yeah, rightfully so. Yeah, and we had a, and they just, that's the difference

between me and Zach. I was like, how do we get her to hometowns? Exactly. Take me shopping. You gotta meet the nanny. I was like,

I gotta meet the nanny. I'm like, I don't care. Like, you know. Anyway. All right. So we,

end of the season. Are we, is that it? Let's head to the Bahamas, baby. All right, Julia, what do you think Are we ready? Is that it? Let's head to the Bahamas, baby. All right, Julia. What do you think so far of this season of Zach? How are you liking everything so far?

Well, you know, again, I, as I say, as like a bachelor franchise apologist outside of all of its like flaws and issues, you know, of course, obviously I'm not a monster. I'm aware of how terrible it is you know but i i also yeah like i watch the show specifically for the women the same way i watch the bachelorette for her like because the men are less exciting kind of you know their drama always feels slightly ham-fisted or something like that with the women you can genuinely tell that bonds form in the house that their they're friends, friendships drop out, that they become jealous of each other, that the insecurities just flare up so quickly. I like seeing people go from zero to 100 within

a confessional. I love it. So I watch it more for them than for Zach. But like, yeah, of course, Zach is boring and dull, but that doesn't even bother me in a way because I like him the way that you described him. Like he he doesn't think he should be there. And he's like taking it very earnestly and like genuinely just wants to find a wife, I think. And like that, I find actually like a breath of fresh air. Like I think he's genuinely trying to date them, which I think is actually sweet. Oh, very much so. He's taking this very seriously.

So seriously. It's like I bet he keeps like a notebook after each date is like keeping things about these women to like refer to later i would i think he's adorable that wouldn't shock me at all yeah no it's like he's you know you watch it and it's like there's certainly plenty of things to tease and we will tease but like i do i think he's a i haven't met him i think he's a high character stand-up guy yeah like i think he's a, I haven't met him. I think he's a high character standup guy. Yeah. I think he and his fiance will like fade into a normal life. Yeah.

It depends on who he picks. Maybe it depends on her. Yeah. But I think if he had his way, they would like live probably in like Anaheim, near his parents. If he had his way, he'd be the next Sean Lowe for sure. Yes, absolutely. And the fact that they keep bringing Sean Lowe back maybe tells me that maybe they believe in this relationship. Yeah.

Because they could have edited Sean out. Oh, easily. Yeah. His casual FaceTimes with Sean. We don't know that. It wasn't really groundbreaking TV, but maybe that- They're like, the tonal comp needs to be there.

Yeah. Yeah. Because maybe they believe in in in this relationship he also has just enough awkward personality where you like root for him because you're like yes you shouldn't be dating all these hot women you're like that nerd who probably bloomed late and like randomly is hot you know what i mean but i don't think his i was thinking about this this episode because i starting this season wasn't like wow He's so hot, but I don't think his promo photos do him justice because on some of these dates like the dinner portions

I'm like, no, he's an attractive Billboards that I see of him do him justice. Well, look when you're in the The Bachelor franchise You're all tens, but the problem is sometimes there's 12s and then when you're standing next to those 12s you look like a seven and also the scale is off because that's the thing i'm always struck by like when people come in studios it's like i like you look up at them and it's like you forget what it means when like this man is like six foot four and like how his presence yeah i know when he was on the boat he had his like hand on her back he's like putting suntan lotion.

I was like, oh my God, his hands are giant. He's got to be like 6'4". Yeah, I heard he's 6'4". Yeah. I heard he's a big dude. He kind of has a Kermit the Frog voice. Yeah. Yeah.

I'm just... Putty doing Kermit the Frog. Yeah, kind of. He's always squinting yeah face and he's kind of always spins his head when he's thinking it's i feel like he's gonna be the dilfiest dilf there ever was like doesn't he just have like really hot dad energy like the like the guy who coaches his daughter's soccer he's gonna coach soccer he's totally gonna yes but i don't know if he's gonna be the dilf when you're retired, he ends up.

I mean, he has no swag like at all. But as a as a kid, you don't like I think he's like who's trying to fuck him. All the moms at the school. I'm saying like. I just mean like. Okay. Okay. Okay, everyone.

All the kids I think would have huge crushes on him. Separate thought. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. He's a swell guy, but he really has no, he's got absolutely no swag. No.

Like none. But I kind of appreciate it. You know what I mean? Because it seems like he's. I'm indifferent but like i think in a way he needs a woman who's like a little bit more outlandish pull his personality out be the fun one in the relationship okay that's i think going to be the ultimate partner for him all right yeah okay and then he's just super proud to be like, yeah, look at my like swag wife. That's true. Yeah. Yeah. Which is generally just a great thing to feel.

Absolutely. Feel like you won. And like that you're proud. Like, yeah. Yeah. Look at my wife. That's what he's going to be like. I know.

It's a lot of that. Because when he went on his one on one date with Rachel and they were doing the fake red carpet thing, he was like gesturing like, oh, my God. He was authentically. Because at first I was like, I don't know you well enough to know if you're just like amazing at playing the game or if that's who you are but now I'm like yes yeah he definitely will be

like the supporting play that supporting role to his main character fiance yeah he'll be like blushing in TikToks six months from now behind her yeah she'll be directing exactly do you like the turn back the clock approach to kind of traditional bachelor that they really are committed to this

season you know i don't mind it because you know even bringing up like sean low like i feel like it has been a solid minute since we've had just like a he's genuinely seems like he's here to want to find a wife and get married and that's kind of refreshing and like yeah it doesn't think like this is like he's not just spitballing and picking dum-dums and whatever you know what i mean and even like right now i'm not 100 sure who i've decided who i think like wins you know how usually like by episode two you're like well it's clearly yeah who he's obsessed with, who he's going to pick. Cause he's an idiot or whatever,

you know, I have some like front runners based on our one-on-ones, but I'm sort of like, I could see him end up with like three different women right now. Yeah. Catherine and Katie for me. Oh yeah. Catherine,

Katie, but I think charity is going to be up there. Charity is going to hometown. Yeah. And I think Ariel, I think it's like, Ariel's making it to fantasyity is going to hometown. Yeah. And I think Ariel. I think it's like Ariel's making it to fantasy. He wants to bang Ariel. He wants to bang Ariel.

I also really like Greer, but she hasn't had a moment yet. I want her to pop. I don't know. She really is. I know. She's cute though. I think she's like naturally. Abigail.

I think Jess is going to be top four. There's something about Jess. I keep thinking there's something about jess but like it's we're kind of we're getting to that point where it's like she was bathed in glitter last night yeah there's a lot of glitter and it was not the first time and jess is wearing glitter too hard yeah no no well let's get into the date with katherine um he seems to really like katherine they go to the bahamas i will always get a kick out of, you know,

the first time they travel and Jesse comes in or, you know, when it was back when it was Chris, it's like, get ready to our international travel. And he's just like, it's like Miami.

You know what I mean? It's like somewhere Southwest Airlines-wise. Well, it was better that when, I mean, Bahamas is a beautiful place and it is world famous but uh when you keep saying international oh yeah yeah but like when

you plan international like i want thailand when we wait on any season our first destination was the mohingan suns in connecticut and chris comes in he's just like, we're going to go where love started in this country, one of the most romantic places, romantic New England. And I was like, amazing. I was like expecting like these little villages. Yeah, take him to like a cutie place in Western Europe. Here's a casino. And we like took this like just very depressing bus ride from Boston Airport.

And then this gloomy day into Connecticut in the middle of nowhere to this like, you know, casino. Also, shout out to Chrissy, who's from Connecticut. But can I just as a New Englander, I think Connecticut should leave. I think they should secede. I don't think we should kick them out, but I think they should secede because I don't think they're loyal enough from sports fans. And I also think I would argue I'm gonna really come for connecticut right here i think it's one of the most loveless states in the country whoa yeah because it has greenwich like think about all those like coke head like wine mom like coke head husband and yeah i just think

like the new thing on their license plate place most loveless I had no affinity to it when I went but uh I would have rather gone to the Bahamas than uh yeah the Mohegan Sun well I'm always like getting everyone in bathing suits why ever go someplace cold like everyone should be yeah looking top tier they should yeah anyway Catherine uh gets her one-on-one he really likes her Kat looks like a model and I've never dated a model I know I was like you're such a loser but I love him you know and he talks like most guys when they are really just physically enamored by someone he's like she's smart and she's funny and she does it and it's just like you think she's hot you're just yeah when they

bury the lead of beautiful when they're like she's smart and beautiful and't and it's just like you think she's hot you're just yeah when they bury the lead of beautiful when they're like she's smart and beautiful and funny like it felt like he was operating like he was reading a thesaurus because the list was like she's goofy and funny and she doesn't take herself too seriously I'm like all the same I just want to see her naked

I just want to get her to fantasy suite so bad fair enough anyway so yeah they swim and stuff and then they go on a date I just want to get her to fantasy suite so bad. Fair enough. Anyway, so yeah, they swim and stuff. And then they go on a date. I didn't really understand what she was saying. I wish we would have gotten some more details about what went down with her mom. They made it sound very serious.

But said nothing. Said absolutely nothing. It's like, yeah, I know. I didn't really get along with my mom. And there was a of time where like i didn't live at home but what does that mean did you live with your dad because they're separated my grandparents go out on your own did you sleep in a car yeah yeah your high school boyfriend when you weren't living at home maybe asked more questions but like and and maybe katherine is a wonderful person but you know as we've learned on this show sometimes listen we all deal with trauma we all have our attachment disorders or

whatever but we need to work through that shit you know and it's kind of like zach was more like thanks for sharing i love you yeah you know he was like, not listening. Just thinking about your body. Not important. What do you think about like clothes? He was like, you're not going to spend time with your family anyways. When you are in a relationship with me, it's about my family. It's his energy. I just was really curious about like, yeah, so like how have you worked through this?

Is it still something you're processing? How does that affect you now in your relationships? Like none of that. Well compared to like Gabby talking like in such detail that yeah, it was like such a blanketed statement where also it brings me back to what I think is becoming like a trope of these contestants going back to Ben Higgins who was the first to kind of be like, I feel unlovable.

And everyone now is like, I just feel like I might be unlovable. It's like, you're hot as your, yeah, exactly. You're a stone cold pen. You're a 10. You're loved.

You're so afraid of not finding love that you auditioned and went through the entire casting process and competed with, you know, literally thousands. To date one person. To date one guy

and get picked to must 30. But you're unlovable. Right. It's like, what are you talking about? Your greatest fear. And it's like, hot people have insecurities too, but I just feel like they're not gonna get as much sympathy about them.

But anyways, I'm a little concerned for Zach. Again, maybe it was all sad, but he, you know, and I've been him before, multiple times, where it's like, it's fine, you know, I'll be your savior, I'm your hero. Exactly, I'll save you. I'll fix you, I'll save you like it's fine you know i'll be your savior i'm your hero exactly i'll save you yeah i'll fix you i'll save you it's fine i was um this was sort of the first time that i was surprised that he didn't have follow-up questions i think because he was so enamored by her that he wasn't really i think the same where he's like i'm not sure exactly what

you're saying so i'm not i don't really know where to go from here because I was surprised that he didn't talk more to her about it. Is it me or are all the women talk and say all the right things about Zach? Right. But none of them look excited. You know, even with Catherine, she was, he would say something and she'd be like, yeah, me too.

You know, like kind of, sure man. Yeah, exactly, like whatever. Whatever man, like do I get the rose or not? You know, is that I'm the only one who kind of feels that a little bit or? We need Christina, bring her back. Yeah, because she really sold it. Yeah.

I think my favorite part of this episode, I think it was on the date with Catherine where he was describing his feelings. I think the fireworks were going on. It was like two mirrors collided to create a star. And I'm like, I haven't been in science class in a while, but I don't think that's how a star is made.

Is that how that works? It's fireworks, fireworks. It's like two watermelons smashing together to make an orange. It was like, what? Two cars colliding and all of a sudden a train came out of nowhere. Well, he definitely tries to play it smart. Like I was expecting with his date with Katie a full week ago when they were in the museum for him to be like, you know, dinosaurs and people were on Earth at the same time.

I mean, he's a little bit of like a... Yeah, he's a little Ross Geller. Yeah, it's a little like, what did you just say? Yeah. Yeah, let me talk to you about some facts. He comes off bookish, but I don't believe he's read books. You know? Interesting.

A star is born when atoms of light elements are squeezed under enough pressure for their nuclei to undergo fusion. So not two rocks colliding in the sky? I don't know. What happens when two meteors collide?

What happens when two asteroids collide? A giant collision creates a thick plume of dust that spreads through the inner solar system. Like a fart. That's not too warm that's not light a galactic fart close enough zach yeah it was good yeah two rocks colliding it's like that tiktok where it's like two whatever string together by a hello wait wait Wait, wait, say more, say more. I'm trying to pick up.

I wish I could. It's like two eggs. What? Two Christmas tree ornaments filled with jingle bells. This is Zach. But it's like two mediums held together I can picture Zach

wearing like a Christmas sweater and pouring eggnog Zach is Clark Griswold yes he's a little Clark Griswold yeah I can see that yeah

just trying to make it work for his family just trying to make it work just loving his family like wants that promotion at work yeah just the simple things

make him happy Jesse Palmer's Uncle Eddie. Cousin Eddie. There you go. Anyway, so he has, Catherine gets a rose. He's super excited. She's super excited.

Everyone's excited. She, I mean, it's been two strong one-on-ones between Katie and Catherine. Those are my finalists. I know, I was gonna say, those are my top two now. Top two, right?

After these one-on-ones, yeah. And similar looks. Yeah. Like, there's top two now. Top two, right? After these one-on-ones. Yeah. And similar looks. Yeah. Like there's a type there. Has a type. Totally. And also the type of like airtime that they're getting is very much like they show reactions to sentimental things.

A lot of Katie helping the other women this episode. Yes. I was going to say she's like the big sister in the house. Yeah. But she's also saying like it's tough. Like she wasn't back at the house during Catherine or Kath's date. I was like,

don't panic too early, Katie. Like you just had an overnight date. Like don't get in your head. Yeah, but I mean, they're constantly being bombarded with like, so you get nervous? I haven't seen them a lot.

I mean like, I don't know. I don't, to me, again, I keep saying there's something about Catherine who I, just seems like she I don't know. I don't, to me, again, I keep saying there's something about Catherine who just seems like she could, you know,

lose it at some point. Maybe. Like Katie seems a little more grounded and secure with, you know, maybe some therapy's gone on there. You know. There's definitely like an emotional maturity with her. Yeah. I feel like Katie could be the therapist.

Sure. I mean, but Catherine, again, lovely, seems wonderful. I require therapy. I don't even know where Catherine is in her emotional journey, but she just, she seems at some point to just like, if you rub her the wrong way, if you push her just enough, I could, you know,

I've nothing to go on, but it just. Well, she also can't put together full sentences clearly cause she couldn't really tell a story about her mom so that's also like a red flag yeah could have been edited because they did edit when Gabby and Eric were on a one-on-one at one point I remember this so clearly because it left a weird taste in my mouth about Eric that was then proven wrong but I think they edited it out because she was Gabby was like really spilling her heart out and I think Eric then responded by saying stuff about his family that they cut because they wanted a dramatic hometown moment. And so I kind of wonder if we're going to get a dramatic hometown moment.

Because people broke that down on TikTok. That was the one where she left the dinner. She stood up and went to producers and people strung it together where like they saw his mouth moving. Like there was more dialogue. That happens all the time. And yeah, there's, you know, these people are, they want to save some of that stuff for later on. Right, for a big reveal.

For a big reveal, especially if they're going to go to hometown. So I, this, to that point, this won't be the last time I think we get into Catherine's family history. She's going to hometowns, right? I think so. Oh, yes.

Well, but that's the thing is, I think it's going to come down to a classic top two almost going back to like chris souls where it's like is it the person you should be with or the person you're infatuated with and she and katie actually reminds me of whitney who we ultimately chose a little bit she does have that vibe and i do think it's something that the show maybe has gotten away from i i think uh i i've told this producers but like and i you know i was very into vanessa when i picked her and i thought rachel was great and raven was great and yada yada yada but i i always thought that if if they casted one other person who i was more into than vanessa that it would have been an amazing season because Vanessa probably would have been my runner up. And maybe wouldn't have had the same protection

as the winner. And I think that would have, they would have had a lot more, like it just would have created more drama. And I think if the lead really likes to, you know, it makes for a great season. Classic Jojo Lauren.

Yeah. So good. Usually the lead is like, by the time it's done, lead really likes to you know it makes for a great season jojo lauren yeah like and usually usually the lead is like by the time it's done they're like they've kind of made up their mind they've already decided it's already boring by time yeah you can kind of sense it but when you when a lead is really torn between two it's it's good it's really good and they don't it's been a while since i think they've had anything like that yeah I think Ben well before Clayton imploded I did think the Susie Rachel like they were kind of neck and neck well either way you're right actually with Clayton you I mean it was more Clayton just not you know what God bless him though because I loved that that was amazing yeah it was incredible TV but that's the point

when when it gets down to the end and the lead still hasn't decided, that's good. That's good TV. Yeah. And I would like to see it with someone other than, because Clayton, it wasn't unless, I think he was just so limited in his emotional experience. Totally. I mean, clearly. And I think Zach, Zach is really grounded and thoughtful.

And you can tell tell despite being too young for rachel uh that he was emotionally you know i think he's he's very he thinks things through like he really and so it'll be interesting i would i'd love to see zach really be torn at the end and see him kind of process that because i think it will be a little i could see it getting really messy for zach which would be kind of fun but i think he will be a little i could see it getting really messy for zach which would be kind of fun but i think he'll ultimately handle it well yeah well and i'll be curious to see what his parents think about his top two and if they sway him in any way because i love even back to like ari with like lauren and becca when his parents were like pick becca and

he was like really and? And then he did. And then it was like, I made a huge mistake. Because I think the parents do weigh heavily. Even going back to Chris Soules, they were like, no, it's not gonna be Becca, pick the nurse. Like, what are you doing? I love when the parents have such like, you know, hold over their sons.

That was definitely- Don't let her go. Yeah, exactly. as soon as yeah exactly as soon as vanessa walked in they're like oh nick's gonna pick vanessa were they oh my god hilarious and like they liked raven but like they were yeah they were like it's it come on they knew nick come on they knew what i was gonna do yeah and it wasn't so much what they wanted me to do they just knew me well oh my gosh and also classic obviously, Peter's insane mother, shout out. That's what I was referencing Barbara.

Yeah, Barbara. Bring her home. Yeah. That was a great season. Like, oh my God, incredible. Her at like the AFR. Yes. Like we need some dramatic parents, hopefully from Zach.

Well, I don't think we're gonna get dramatic parents. I think they're way nice and just chill. I think they're very grounded and very chill. Yeah, because we saw his mom at the birthday and she was just like whipping out her baby book, having the time of her life, being nice.

I think she was mama bear on him and is like, don't pick the hot model. Pick the nurse who loves you. Zach is just, I think, just emotionally too healthy.

I know. He's healed. Damn it. That nice childhood. All right. then we have a group date they basically they went and

sipped cocktails on the beach and did some limbo and a little dance circle we need to have a conch can we have oh that reminded me

that that was a really on him and Catherine's date that dancing sequence they gotta stop doing that I was like was there music playing probably

and what's worse it's true both were bad because if there was music playing? Probably. And what's worse? It's true. Both were bad because if there was music playing and that's how they were choosing to dance. That was the whitest dancing between Catherine and Zach I've ever seen. That belongs on a wedding dance floor. It's like most robotic.

That was white. That was so white. That was really bad. And then he thanked her. He's like, thanks for bringing that out of me. thanked her he's like thanks for bringing that out of me can i kiss you thanks for bringing that happen oh my god but it was more of the awkward dancing happened on the on on the group day and i i think i called it when we said who's gonna be the villain now that christina's gone yeah she did she Anastasia? Yeah. She did. She did. Yeah. Nice. So contrived. So contrived. I'm team Anastasia here. Oh.

Oh. Wow. Even though she said that she was scared for her life from Kylie. Okay. She might have exaggerated a little bit. I think they are both wrong. And it was Kylie? Kylie.

Kylie. Kylie. When Anastasia got sent home, she looks so guilty from that point to the rest of the episode. She was like stone. Yeah. Like she was just like, I just can't believe this happened.

Now here's what happened. At some point while they were traveling, this happens all the time. So when they travel, it's like there's no cameras. It's a totally different energy. You get a little looser. You know, you get a little more comfortable.

It's where the friendships form, I'm sure. Life a little you're literally in the back in the world it feels a little normal and you start like having like real conversations like what life might be like outside the show and at some point these girls started talking about social media or whatever and anastasia said something anastasia cle. Anastasia, Cleopatra, whatever. She does feel very connected to her. She does feel very connected. I didn't remember that. And she made some comment that was more factual.

Like, yeah, this is what's going to happen. I don't know. Unless you're a big dud. I don't know. So like, whatevs. And none of those women probably thought anything of it

all probably were they were probably like tell us more like really 50,000 followers meanwhile Zachary's probably pissed he's like

I only got 60,000 followers you're gonna get what that's probably why he was so offended and Kylie when this all this drama happened

like is it what is this Anastasia Anastasia she overreacted. And then Kylie responded by also overreacting and basically told on her. Because you could tell that Kylie knew that what Anastasia said wasn't that bad.

She did say what she was accused of, but in the context of what she was saying i think kylie knows that she didn't do anything wrong because they mentioned that it was something about her she does her own business stuff like so i think she's already done some like what is her job is it like what i think it's like brand content yeah something literally social media and so i think what she was probably saying marketing like yes so I'm sure she was like so here's when you're at this tier like these are the kinds of brands you want to target and then you know you'll probably all have like 50k going on the show so for you I would recommend like it was definitely within a larger sentence 100 and it was taken like well because

also they couldn't throw anyone under the bus to be like so and so was asking about it they had no names to say anything and it's also just both like bottom of the barrel you know you're not really making an impression i've got to like get in the mix i'm gonna like just grab on to something and yeah and kylie's saying things like you know she looked devastated it was like i always do this and like i don't want like she was outing herself as someone who kind of admitted to getting caught up in drama and then reacting and then feeling bad because it was like, well, you did this to me, so I'm going to do this to you.

Like it was, it was so obvious. She was telling on herself for the rest of the episode that, you know, she, she definitely, she basically won the, the fight of two people fighting over nothing.

Nothing, yeah. Making something up to make themselves feel better. And she won that battle, but she knows it's just a matter of time before she loses the war. And ultimately, because she dragged Charity into it by being like, look, I didn't even hear it myself. This was learned knowledge from Charity. And then afterwards, he didn't even go up to her and be like hey thanks for filling me in he was like charity it means

so much to me that you're so honest and loyal to me so she didn't even win ultimately no she's gonna get sent home in another week yeah totally what did you make of the initial interaction the can I talk to him for a second can Can I just have a few more minutes? Like, which side did you fall just with that bit? Oh, it was awkward. It was awkward. No side. It's just a game of chicken.

That's all it is. Yeah. It was just a matter, like, Kylie won because she was like, I'm not moving. Right. Well, and Zach offered up nothing,

so it means he doesn't care about either one. Do they tell The Bachelor whatever, like, don't get involved when they're deciding whether or not to? It's generally The Bachelor's job to job to like not participate in referee oh because sometimes i feel like they're like can i just have one more minute i'm just wrapping up the conversation or something

you can you know for sure if zach really wanted to i think your point who are these is is what matters more is like he didn't really care yeah about either of them so he's like he was like staring off at either of them. So he's like. He was like staring off at the ocean when they were like having their argument. He could not care less. But I think the job of the bachelor is to not eliminate drama, but to just let it play out.

Just you just let it percolate. You just, yeah, you don't referee unless one of your people is really involved and then you get a little protective or you might ask for more time. Don't fight with my girlfriend. But like Anastasia, they all are interrupting each other. Everyone interrupts someone, you just don't see it.

Like when we watch it, most of the conversations we see starting is after the interrupting has already happened and they're in the middle of the conversation everyone interrupts someone and they just choose to show it sometime so you heard her kind of reference that she's like i'm always getting fucking interrupted i'm always getting people have asked for a few minutes for a few minutes like that is all happening so it's not like you you saw her frustration uh play So it's not like you, you saw her frustration, uh, play out. She's not making it up, you know, things like that. And so Kylie probably got sent in there, uh, and was probably like, Hey, this is going to be your only time and blah, blah, blah. Make it worth it. Like you're not

here to make friends, blah, blah, blah. Um, and so, and she won the game of chicken and it's that simple to create a little bit of nonsense. Do you think producers then went to Anastasia and were like, wow, was she going to fight you? Probably.

And like probably got in her head? Probably. Because it was weird that she went from like zero to, I mean, of course I love it, but like zero to a hundred of, she was going to hit me.

She said she felt attacked. Yeah, I was like, I was attacked. Well, yeah, did she ever say hit me, but it was more like, but it was that energy. Yeah, it was that energy. She's after me now. She's after me. I felt attacked yeah i was like i was attacked well she yeah did she ever say hit me but it was no but it was that energy like energy she's after me now she's after me i felt

attacked like fight who said anything about fight like what i'm just trying to make love like yeah i'm a lover not a fighter um i'm like hit each other oh 100 bachelor bowls bring it back shove her no 100 it was like wow that was that was that was aggressive out of nothing that was yeah like she probably got asked all those questions that was intense like were you man i thought yeah i was i was uncomfortable how i couldn't imagine what it'd like to be for you if i were her i would have walked back to the group and been like look i just got interrupted but zach's now sitting with her on pine needles and at the base of the trunk of a tree. And like, that's not going to last more than a minute. So whatever.

You know what I mean? Meanwhile, she's like blowing something up. Yeah, it does not go well for her. What is the deal with Gabby? I'm so enamored by her character arc. Gabby's a, she's a dark horse. She's like a rising supreme somehow they had that bad encounter they had that

awkward bad encounter and she panicked and then she kind of like I remember it was the following like rose ceremony really rose and I think she's continuing and she was like Greek chorus this whole episode talking the whole time setting up scenarios I was like where did this come from and then she said at the end when she got in the rose ceremony

she said I've never met someone who's just like me or some some version of that and i was like what like i mean people say crazy shit in this world but that seemed like it seemed like it was coming from somewhere yeah and she was like in a male specimen do you remember she said i've never met someone who lives like me in a male specimen i I wonder, are we getting, are we getting, you know, not to bring up Sean Lowe again, but are we getting Catherine Lowe? Right. Like story arc where it's just like.

Rising. You know, she's, and was she getting a one-on-one in the next week's clips? I was going to say, it looks like it. Oh yeah, she was. Yeah. So like, here's this girl who's no attention no attention but they keep airing her they keep airing her commentary her like kind of losing her

kind of like mine but they're not showing why she's losing her mind so I think she's getting time with with Zach that we're not seeing she's building this connection and then they're only showing her you could argue she's getting winner edit yeah because winner edit I was like oh I have to learn her

name now yeah winner edit doesn't always. This episode I was like, oh, I have to learn her name now. Yeah. Winner edit doesn't always get the best edit. They're not the most protected. That's interesting. I mean, I love a Dark Horse narrative where she comes out of nowhere and gets all the way to hometowns or top two. I mean, it seems hard right now to see her at the level of Kat and Catherine, but we'll

have to see after her one-on-one. I should start saying nicer things about Catherine because she could be the next bachelorette for sure. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Totally. I mean, I think she's great. I just think she's,

there's just something. I know there's something. It feels like maybe she reminds you of an ex-girlfriend who yelled at you once. Who? Which one? Catherine? No.

Is that why you said she had crazy eyes? I don't think she has crazy eyes. You've definitely said that before. Crazy eyes? Yes. You're putting words in my mouth. No, I'm not. Play the that before. Crazy eyes? Yes. You're putting words in my mouth. No, I'm not. Play the tape back.

Crazy eyes? Yes. I said, I think she has a bit of crazy in her. I think maybe you said her expressions sometimes got a little. She just looks like she's holding in some anger. I think she's really invested. Sure. To me, I didn't really see this like huge disparity in looks between her and Zach.

I mean, I'm probably projecting with someone I probably would have dated for sure. Well, she's a little raven-y actually, kind of. Catherine? No, no, no, Gabby. Oh, Gabby. Oh. Yeah, for sure. Like, you know, like where she kind of rose through your season.

Yeah. You know what I mean? Like where all of a sudden you're like, oh wait, she's a threat. Yeah, there's always a brunette whose name you need to learn midway through and then becomes a front threat. Yeah. There's always a brunette whose name you need to learn midway through and then becomes a front runner. Totally. But yeah, Gabby is. Yeah.

I think it's, it's a very interesting edit where it's just like, why is it? Cause like you're watching it as this like, well, you're, it's like right now you're, she's almost getting the edit as if like, she's one of the, you know, you're going home in a week. Yeah. We hardly knew you. We hardly knew you. You're constantly there.

You're all, the only airtime you're getting is like, you're just panicked a week. Yeah, we hardly knew you. Yeah, we hardly knew you. You're constantly, the only airtime you're getting is like you're just panicked and insecure. Yeah. You're the decorative lettuce on this crudité plate. And yet they just keep, it's just, they keep hanging around and she's saying these things

where it's just like, I don't know. And Zach validated her in a previous episode in a way that felt really real where he was like, we are connected. And I do think, and they played like the awkward music during that episode where she was like I'm in my head but when they were going back and forth with the whole like can I call you Zachy like oh right I forgot about that yeah and cringe said something well she said something about Gabrielle but there was just one moment where she was like maybe you can call me

that like he was like can I call you that and she was like maybe later and they were playing like the bad soundtrack but were they playing like more like they're like music i think it would have seemed hot like they were flirting yeah it's my analysis sweet gabby yeah front runner and then with with jess he he said to her like, you know, just he gave her the just trust me kind of. Yeah. Which reminded me of like things I would say to like people like Christina in my season, which I knew I wasn't going to end up with her. But I also knew she was going to get a one on one. Right.

So it was like, hey, listen, like. You're going to be good for like a couple more weeks. Yeah. I was always I was trying to find ways. Don't freak out yet. Yeah. It was like, don't. Yeah.

That's kind of. And I felt like Zach was giving Jess that kind of like, you're going to be good for like a couple more weeks. Yeah. I was always, I was trying to find ways to, yeah, it was like, don't, yeah, that's kind of, and I felt like Zach was giving Jess that kind of like, you're good. We're going to make out. I haven't had time for you yet. You haven't had your moment yet, but like definitely not going to pick you, but like,

uh, but I like you. You're cool. Yeah. I definitely want to make out with you. I really like jazz. I want to see more. When Jess was talking about how she wants to split up the rose, I was like, it's

giving Katie Heron at the end of Mean Girls when she breaks up the tiara. Everyone deserves a rose. The glitter was too much. It's a lot. It's too like trying to draw attention. How did you not notice? I was like, you're 23. You're so young. And then no shade. But Ciara used to do body glitter

and I felt like she did it in a much more subtle way to the point where I was always like, shimmering. I don't remember any glitter. And with Jess and I felt like she did it in a much more subtle way. Yeah. Where she was like shimmering. I don't remember any glitter. And with Jess, I was like, fail. Jess was like, I heard stars were here from colliding rocks. Yeah. Jess wears like just tube tops constantly.

So it also looks like she's just naked next to everyone else because it's like shot up, just glitter. Yeah. Like she's naked. Yep. Naked and shiny. Exactly. I think Greer's gonna go home without a one-on-one.

Yeah, she's gonna want her to pop, but I don't think she will. I don't think we're gonna get a two-on-one this season. There's been no real... But I did find it interesting when Anastasia left to go cry, it was Greer that took her and they were holding hands

and she was holding her while she cried. I didn't know they were friends, but but I wonder if they're roommates also I know I need more of the dynamic of of like who's friends in the house yeah we haven't got any yeah like I would love to watch them fight about who gets what room at an Airbnb or a hotel yeah I feel like that's always like the most tense part of any vacation when like Victoria was like sleeping out on the couches during Matt's season yep right was it Victoria like sleeping out on the couches during Matt's season. Yep. Right. Was it Victoria was actually sleeping on the couches when they were getting into fights

in the hotel and she kicks that other girl out of the room or she would like refuse to sleep in the same room as another girl was sleeping on the in the lobby couch of the Mohegan Sun or whatever from Matt James season. The queen. Queen on the couch. Queen on the couch. I forgot about her. Classic.

I know. Never forget about Victoria. And then Davia. Poor Davia. Justice for about her. Classic. I know. Never forget about Victoria. And then Davia. Poor Davia. Justice for Davia. Such a stunning woman. I feel like she's the most stunning one out of everyone. Yeah, she definitely, but I also, a classic where he's like, no, I'm totally noticing

you. We're going to make out. That was almost mean. And then I'm going to send you home. He's just like, yeah. Yeah. He's just like, we had this, when you got out of the window, it was amazing. It was wonderful. And she's like, yeah, but like had. I was wonderful she's like yeah but like had i love that she actually yes yeah i love that

she did that and he's like well things can change any given moment i'm like you you literally know you're sending her home right now just like send her home now like why did he say that to her well he that's also the woman that he basically said started saying to her he's like i'll never forget when you stepped out of the limo and you were in that dress. And he basically was like, I wanted to bang you right there. And she's like, what? What? Yeah. Yeah, she's like, oh my God, wait, you're a loser.

Yeah. It was a little bit of that energy. Yeah, no, it was, Zach definitely kind of led her on in that moment. Yeah. Because I don't think there's a rose ceremony a lead goes into without knowing who they're already sending home.

Oh, sure. They've always made a decision. So all those conversations where it's just like, yeah, well, we can make the most of tonight. It's like, you can't. Yeah, okay. Also, isn't it like 5 a.m.? Aren't you just like, I just want to go to sleep

and send home some women and go to bed. But week four, yeah, they're still pretty late. Ugh. Yeah. And it was also, he was talking to Kat, and I think he, I don't know if he was also talking to ariel i think during the rose ceremony like he was really he was not trying to give everyone time like the the shot of him and cat while they were playing pool reminded me a lot

of there's this one date on or cocktail party on ben higgins season where him and lauren like went for a walk and it felt very like it's you and i want to spend time with you i just want to make out with you yeah once the lead has had their one-on-one with their winner whether they even know it's their winner or not there's definitely the um they they want to be next to that person and they're they get protective and they almost get insecure because that's well now, now when you like someone, you're worried about them liking you back. So it's like, you're trying to, now you're trying to build that relationship or maybe it's two relationships

because you like two, maybe it's him and Katie. And then you're just trying to survive everything else. That's all it is once you've had that one-on-one. So yeah, we'll see. What do we think of Brooklyn? Wow, her story? Yeah. Oh my God. Like an actual story? Once you've had that one-on-one. So yeah, we'll see. What do we think of Brooklyn? Wow. Her story?

Yeah. Oh my God. Like an actual story? Yeah. And with that, it wasn't even... The point that was so shocking to me when she said she got woken up by cops after being knocked out, she didn't even tell that to Zach.

That wasn't an ITM. I felt like she just presented it in a way where it was genuine. It was truthful. She didn't even really go into some of the like awful details, which I feel like is in a way more impressive. It was like, yeah, I mean,

obviously it was a lot and our heart, my heart goes out to her. It's just, I do. I do hate that. It's about the bachelor, right? The trauma card.

I didn't. And it's not Brooklyn's fault. Can you just imagine going on a date, like a first date, and sitting down, and like five minutes in, they're just like... Or also feeling like you have to do that

to make it seem like that's the only way to be vulnerable to someone. Yeah. It's just like you say these very personal and traumatic things that happened to you. And like let alone saying it to a one-on-one, but on camera in an environment where you can't. Like she said this to a guy that she has almost no rapport with or trust or expectation of how he might handle it. It's just like a hope in her prayers.

or trust or expectation of how he might handle it. It's just like a hope and a prayer. It's like, well, I hope he's empathetic and understanding and doesn't make me- Trigger me when I tell him. Or make me feel like I did anything wrong. Or all these things that happen in these very vulnerable conversations. And it's like, why is this happening on a first date?

Yeah, it's intense. I just kind of hate that for everyone involved. Like I hate it more for brooklyn than anyone else i i hate it for zach you know and it's it's just kind of yucky you know yeah i don't know well because it's like usually when you go on a date especially if it's from the apps you might you're aware of the fact they could be dating other people you have no idea but in this scenario you know for a fact you will either get sent home or get a rose that evening. So it's like even that proximity to potential rejection and then having to be that vulnerable is just such a sticky situation. Well, it's just a bummer for her to also have to feel forced. And who knows what she's had on her journey also with therapy, whatever else, of talking talking about this situation as you said like she was very vague when she needed to be about it so

i mean i can only imagine you know opening that can of worms and then also doing it yeah like a guy that she just met yeah yeah the forcing of it on the flip side let's certainly like awareness is great and you know her sharing her story you know hopefully you know as a inspiration to anyone going through that type of of trauma and relationships well and also like the pivot of her being able to say and this one day i woke up and was like i have to get out of this otherwise i'm not going to be here you know it's like yes that should be a representation you know that i'm sure there's women watching with their abusive husbands right now yeah that they're like oh yeah i can leave no because that's yeah and it's like it is so so so common so it's kind of that mixed bag of like on one hand you should not be forced

to like trauma dump or like go that deep but it is also like as much as it's incredibly horrific it's not incredibly rare right do you think there's something about like just being reminded that like these people who are like confident and will say respectfully shut the fuck up you know and like it's not just like meek people who end up in really scary situations no totally i wonder if it's like or if she feels like she has to fully go there and she couldn't say look i was in this really bad abusive relationship and as i get to know you i'll tell you more about it but there is this need of like i might not make it to that time to tell you more about my abusive relationship i gotta i gotta dump it all now i mean there's a good chance that was her only one-on-one her only one-on-one to like tell her story other than that

like brooklyn do we think is there any there like do, do you think she has a shot at hometowns? No. I don't think she'll make it all the way to hometowns. I think she's that week before hometowns. I think she'd be like top six. Yeah. Yeah. Because there's definitely a connection, but it didn't feel the same as when he was on

the date with Katie or even Catherine. It didn't feel like that intense. I feel like top four, Katie and Catherine, I think are locks. Something tells me that Gabby is in top four. And then that fourth spot. Yeah, it's like Jess, Ariel, and Charity. I feel like everyone's gunning for that. Yeah.

But, and not Brooklyn for sure? I don't think so i mean unless there's a real moment in the coming weeks i could picture zach like having a like you know you just want to bang ariel send her home man i could picture him like policing himself like looking himself in the mirror being like there's other ways to get your dick wet you're here for love like in a different world like oh yeah this would have been good but like i feel like the upcoming cuts are going to be very obvious like i'm staring at the list of other people we have and i'm like kylie ally greer mercedes like i'm like it's going to be very i feel like the next couple weeks it's going to be like, yeah, no, no shit. There's just no screen time.

There's not that same level of connection. Yeah. There's some like, I don't even know your names still. It'll be really interesting though with what Zach decides to do with Ariel will truly impact whatever relationship he's in. Yeah. Yeah. Because it's just, and especially if if any if let's say Catherine or Katie or whoever he picks if they were either maybe friends or frenemies or just in any way

intimidated by Ariel and then they go back and watch this back and he's just clearly just wants to bang just wants to like make out and bang if he takes her to fantasy suite and it's just clearly just wants to bang, just wants to like make out and bang. If he takes her to fantasy suite and it's just like Clayton, like Clayton's a person. Clayton is the like peak, like lack of self-awareness. I'm the bachelor. I get to do whatever I want. Cause I'm the bachelor.

And these are the rules of the bachelor without any like foresight about like this show's going to end and you're going to have to deal with your choices, regardless of what the producer said was okay or not and that was like clayton to a t and then i think there you know matt james is another example of someone who like i i believe i think he's since said this like didn't hook up with anyone very much was like i'm not gonna like right this is i'm not gonna like fuck up my whole journey by like banging everybody a little loose and having to to to do stuff like and then you know and there's a lot of decisions in between

that you know whether it's everyone or two or just one or none uh but it'll be interesting to see what zach decides to do in the fantasy suite because it is a thing that I know we talk about and we question who do they sleep with, but sex does happen. It doesn't always happen and often doesn't happen, but when it does happen, especially not with the people they end up picking, whether it's talked about or not, like that is one of the biggest reasons why these relationships don't work out

you know whether directly or indirectly it's just like it's too much for these young you know for the most part fairly conservative minded people you know to like come in and start being okay with like sex in ways that they have never even comprehended and also your friends like they become so close by the end of this. If you're at fantasy suites with this girl, you have spent extended periods of time with her. You've seen her at the airport, et cetera.

So it's not just like he's having sex with another person who he's been growing up. You've seen her at the airport. It's like this is one of my close friends. It is intimate. Seeing someone at the airport. It is intimate to see someone at the airport. Well,

also his relationship completely fell off the rails at fantasy suites with rachel so i'm so curious if that's gonna have anything in the back of his mind of like needing to use that time to suss out the relationship yeah i could picture him doing that too what do we i believe in zach he's gonna make good choices for himself i think so what do we think of the promo clip sorry i was just like i need to say some words to fill in yeah because we saw like a crazy it's gonna be a whole lot of nothing i think it's gonna be that like he got covet or something he's already in his suit yeah and he's on zoom he he went on a date with someone who like tested positive or something so he got exposed and then he was like waiting for the cocktail party

and they're like you can't go because like we have to test you and like you might have gotten exposed and then that's he's like i lose a whole week he's like this whole night has been taken away from me but he's already dressed he's already dressed yeah because the fact that it's on like a screen i was like that seems i think it's gonna end up being nothing yeah it's gonna be something stupid yeah like he had a quarantine for a day or yeah exactly well they waited the results yeah yeah or they send a bunch of nobody's home because they're like oh she has covid Like he had to quarantine for a day or something. Yeah, exactly. Well, they waited. They waited. Results, yeah. Yeah. Or they send a bunch of nobodies home because they're like, oh, she has COVID, quote unquote.

Bye. Get rid of them. Bye, Kylie. Yeah. Sorry. The Logan treatment. Kylie's gone. Mercedes, though.

What is she? She never got screen time. She never got a single moment. Different season, different lead, you know? Like you just never know. I bet she'll go to Paradise, though. Yeah, I'm interested in her. She seems very interesting.

But we saw her in the teaser. She had the yellow dress on, I believe, and the sizzle. So maybe we're going to get some more out of her. Maybe. What I was going to ask is, Gabby the only one-on-one next week won't there be two we're we're like at the halfway point i would think there'd be two it's yeah at this point it's it's

it's pretty much two one-on-ones on one group date right yeah right because like early on they might have two group dates and one one-on-one because there's so many freaking so many people yeah okay so it's it's gonna be gabby and then the big question is is it gonna be ariel is's gonna be Gabby. And then the big question is, is it gonna be Ariel? Is it gonna be Jess? Is it gonna be Charity? They had that really good moment in the pool. Yeah. She popped. Some people can make it,

like Corinne never got a, technically never got a one-on-one. I mean, it's possible that this kind of met people. Tyler with Rachel, he didn't have a one-on-one right until his borderline hometown where he freaked. Oh my gosh. The cinematic gold

of him pouring his heart out to her at the boardwalk and Rachel's just like looking directly into the camera. We just met. Yeah. Yep.

I love a stage five clinger. That'll be interesting. I thought Jess had stage five clinger energy when the season started. Yeah. Well, she can't be.

He'll be covered in glitter. I mean. I didn't pick up any of that glitter. You'll notice it now. You can't unsee it. Yeah. Julia, thank you so much for coming. Thank you so much.

It was an honor. Honor to have you. Come back again. Oh my God, any time. Hopefully much sooner than four years. It's my fault. No. It's my fault.

It's my fault. You know, I didn't want to bother you ever. But Nick, you kindly joined us for like a live Zoom recap, which was very nice of you. I was happy to come back. Are you going to bring back the show when you- Yeah, I'm on maternity right now. And so I'm not allowed to legally recap The Bachelor. So this was such a joy to come in and get my recap on. Oh, well, thank you so much.

And also thanks for getting me out of the house. this is my first time wearing pants since like my third trimester and getting out of the house left my husband with the baby amazing she was crying on the way out i was like bye so you should just like stop somewhere after this do a little shopping little i know i mean like the recap was so long it took It makes a bit long-winded. It's fine. It took forever. Can you please let my audience know where to find you, where to follow you when you'll be back from maternity leave and all the great things you're doing?

I'll be on maternity for a while, but you can always find me at SiriusXM. I'm on Radio Andy and Pop Rocks. I've got a podcast called All Spoiler Recap, which you guys should check out, that I do for fun, where I basically do like a, almost like a book on tape of a movie,

usually low percentage on Rotten Tomatoes or whatever. And I spoil it beat by beat. It's called All Spoiler Recap. It's off right now because I've just had a baby, but it's going to pick back up this coming weekend. That's great. And I don't really do anything on social media, but you can find me there.

I'm at Julia Cunningham. So join me. You can see pictures of my baby. I follow her follows me it's very sweet you know it's not yeah i just post my life no i really i don't use it so you know don't expect much but um yeah it's always photos of my dog and baby yeah exactly it's wonderful it's a wholesome follow it's a wholesome baby i'm like i'm like the zach of social media just like thoughtful and wholesome boring thoughtful nothing yeah nothing exciting yeah yeah they won't let you down exactly yeah I'm like the Zach of social media, just like thoughtful and wholesome. Boring, thoughtful, and wholesome. Nothing exciting.

Yeah. They won't let you down. Exactly. Yeah. So anyways, thank you. Thank you for coming. And thank you guys for listening. Don't forget to send in those questions at asknick at thevilefiles.com for all things Ask Nick, texting office hours, all that fun stuff.

Rate, review, tell your friends. And don't forget on Thursday, the big one, Raven Ross tells all. It's so good. And on Thursday, our live show, our AMP show. It's going to be a big Thursday. Better date than never, 9 p.m. Eastern. And if you are lonely tonight on Valentine's Day in L.A., come check. I was about to say, come check me out.

My address is. Just look at me. Yeah, we'll be hanging out at the Barnes & Noble at the Grove. I'll be signing copies of Don't Text Your Ex. Happy birthday, taking pictures, meeting you all, having conversations, and making the most out of your Valentine's Day. So come say hi. Don't be alone today.

Come hang out with us. It'll be a lot of fun. Bye. don't be alone today come hang out with us it'll be a lot of fun bye